Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - November 09, 2026


Ep 1419 ｜ Speaking in Tongues： What the Bible Actually Says

Ep 1418 ｜ 'My Bible Study Is Affirming a Lesbian in the Group'： How I'd Handle It

Episode Stats


Length

55 minutes

Words per minute

175.21

Word count

9,775

Sentence count

508

Harmful content

Misogyny

3

sentences flagged

Hate speech

25

sentences flagged


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.660 Is the kind of speaking in tongues we see today, especially on social media, actually
00:00:05.680 a curse rather than a gift?
00:00:07.860 I'll explain to you exactly what I mean today as we get into what the Bible actually says
00:00:12.860 about speaking in tongues and how I think we should be thinking about this.
00:00:16.100 We've got all of this and more on today's episode of Relatable.
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00:00:57.020 hey y'all welcome to relatable hope everyone is having a wonderful week a wonderful day so far
00:01:07.700 we are back with another maternity episode this time we are talking about a theological topic
00:01:12.880 that i get a lot of questions about we've talked about it some over the years but i want to take
00:01:18.260 a little bit of a deep dive into it of course we can't talk about every single facet of speaking
00:01:23.040 in tongues, but because there is such a need for clarity on this topic, I want to try to
00:01:29.440 at least give you kind of a rundown on what is going on here, especially if you're a new
00:01:35.000 believer, you're like, wow, this seems like a really big thing for people to disagree
00:01:38.620 on and also maybe a little bit strange.
00:01:41.660 So I'm going to try to give you both perspectives as much as I can.
00:01:45.440 We do consider as Christians speaking in tongues, at least I consider this to be something that
00:01:51.900 we are able to disagree on in good faith, biblically, that this is not something that
00:01:57.940 if we disagree on it, that this is a salvation issue. There are many more, what you call
00:02:02.720 charismatic Christians that I respect, that I really like, that I agree with on lots and lots
00:02:08.480 of things, even if we don't see eye to eye on all of the gifts of the Holy Spirit and the role that
00:02:13.200 they play as a rule today. But I want to show you something that I think that we can probably agree
00:02:19.560 on, whether you are charismatic or a good old Southern Baptist like me. And that is how,
00:02:26.100 if you believe in speaking in tongues, being something that is present as a rule for believers
00:02:31.820 today, it should actually be done. It should actually be carried out. We see in first Corinthians
00:02:37.460 that God through Paul really, really cares about the ordering of the church, how things are done,
00:02:44.000 how things are run, how the local body of believers is led. No matter what, we should
00:02:49.520 be able to agree that church should not be disorganized. It should not be wild. It should
00:02:55.200 not be chaotic. God is a God of peace, not a God of chaos. Satan is the author of confusion and
00:03:02.660 chaos. So whatever we do, speaking in tongues, doing good works, praying to the Lord, worshiping
00:03:09.140 by raising our hands or worshiping with our hands in our pockets, all should be done for the glory
00:03:14.400 of God in the order and in the parameters that he lays out for us in scripture. So what does this
00:03:21.680 look like? What do speaking in tongues look like in popular culture? We've got a few variations of
00:03:30.300 this. We've got this popular clip on Instagram where you see, um, a media team that is apparently
00:03:39.560 they say, believing with you and interceding for your miracles. All right. So that's apparently
00:03:56.580 church media team. They posted that on social media to let you know they are interceding for
00:04:01.680 your miracles using these tones in their voice and these words that they would call speaking in
00:04:08.720 tongues. And then you have another creator, TikTok, Instagram creator, Allie Yost. I think
00:04:13.880 is how you pronounce her last name. I'm sure we agree on lots and lots of things, but she did talk
00:04:18.980 about how she got the gift of tongues. This is different. I'm not saying that this is the same
00:04:23.980 thing as the first clip. This is just another example of how this is talked about in Christian
00:04:28.340 circles online. So I'd say I received the gift of tongues like a little over a year ago. I had this
00:04:33.900 moment in Trader Joe's. I was standing in the frozen food section and I was just like talking
00:04:38.460 to myself about the groceries that I wanted to get. And the word yish came out of my mouth. And 0.99
00:04:43.120 I'm like, that was weird. I was like, what does that mean? It was like bubbling in me, like
00:04:46.800 something was coming up. And so a couple of days later, I was in my quiet time. My roommate had
00:04:52.040 left and i was just worshiping the lord on my living room floor it wasn't like all of a sudden
00:04:56.460 i was possessed and i didn't know what was coming over me i felt the lord gently be like start with
00:05:01.480 that yesh and i was like okay and i just i said yesh it was the holy spirit guiding me but i was
00:05:06.880 like trying different vowels i was just letting it just flow like no pressure i felt him being
00:05:11.880 like don't think too much just try and the next thing i knew i was literally speaking in tongues
00:05:16.660 okay and then we have katherine crick of course we have talked about katherine crick in the past
00:05:23.540 problematic theology problematic connections um and she has her own take on speaking in tongues
00:05:29.740 why can't i speak or pray in tongues is a gift only for some this is a gift for every child of
00:05:36.980 god that god truly wants every child to have because um the bible says that praying in the
00:05:44.920 spirit praying in tongues edifies your spirit man so when you pray in the in a spirit praying
00:05:52.060 in tongues it's it's helping your spirit to rise and be stronger and push your carnal nature down
00:05:59.240 your carnal your flesh down also when you pray in the spirit you are communicating with holy
00:06:04.240 spirit directly you are speaking in a supernatural heavenly language straight to the holy spirit
00:06:11.340 I already have so much to say about all of these, but I'm going to try to go in order and not just
00:06:17.940 immediately react to them. So because there's so much information and there's such a variety
00:06:24.020 of representation of speaking in tongues in popular culture, on social media, the most
00:06:29.800 important question that we should be asking always as Christians, no matter your denomination,
00:06:34.760 is what does the Bible actually say? The Bible is God's supreme authority here on earth. The
00:06:43.140 Bible is his inerrant, infallible word. It is a gift that was given to believers. It's not about
00:06:50.080 us, but it is for us. And it gives us a guidebook of how to live. It tells us about the character
00:06:56.360 of God. It tells us in the new Testament, how we should be conducting ourselves, how we should be
00:07:02.000 conducting ourselves within and even outside of the church among believers and non-believers.
00:07:07.980 And so there's no reason for us to try to come up with our own doctrine when we have the word of
00:07:12.920 God that God has graciously passed down to us. But we're actually going to go all the way back
00:07:19.200 to the beginning when we talk about the gift of tongues, which is not a typical place to start.
00:07:23.880 We typically start in a place like Acts, but we're actually going to go back to the book
00:07:28.120 of Genesis. One thing that is important to note as we're talking about speaking in tongues and
00:07:35.040 what it actually means, and I've used this passage even regarding something like immigration,
00:07:40.900 obviously not something that we're talking about right now, but to make the point that confusion
00:07:46.540 is always a curse. Confusion and chaos on a people, on a country, on a small group is always
00:07:56.080 a detriment to that group advancing, to them being able to connect, to accomplish their purpose.
00:08:03.040 We see this in the story of the Tower of Babel. We see Genesis 11 tells the story about how a
00:08:09.660 large population of people had settled in the land of Shinar. They were attempting to build
00:08:15.320 a tower to heaven. God thwarts their prideful plans by confusing their languages because they 0.99
00:08:20.020 were like, oh, let's build this mighty tower. It reaches all the way up to God so people can
00:08:24.720 look at us and see how awesome we are. And the Lord said this, behold, they are one people and
00:08:30.200 they have all one language. And this is only the beginning of what they will do. And nothing that
00:08:35.260 they propose to do will now be impossible for them. Okay. So because of that unity, because
00:08:40.740 they were of one language, they could also be of one mind. They could be of one plan and they could
00:08:45.940 be of one purpose. That wasn't the problem. The problem is what the plans and the purposes were.
00:08:50.760 So he's saying, look, if they are so unified in all of this, they're going to be able to
00:08:54.740 do anything.
00:08:55.940 So how does God thwart that?
00:08:57.680 He said, come, let us go down.
00:08:59.540 And they're confused their language so that they may not understand one another's speech.
00:09:04.380 So the Lord dispersed them from there over the face of all of the earth, and they left 0.84
00:09:09.280 off building the city. 0.85
00:09:11.180 Therefore, its name was called Babel because there the Lord confused the language of all
00:09:15.920 of the earth. 0.87
00:09:16.600 And from there, the Lord dispersed them over the face of all the earth.
00:09:20.200 that's Genesis 11, six through nine. There's a lot of good lessons to be learned there,
00:09:25.500 especially when it comes to the idea that like diversity is always a strength. Well,
00:09:31.140 actually in many cases, it's a detriment, but I won't go off on an immigration tangent right now. 0.60
00:09:36.080 We'll stick with the principle that applies here. That confusion is a curse, not a gift.
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00:10:52.620 Now, the gift of tongues in the New Testament is supposed to be a reversal of that curse,
00:10:59.620 not a continuation of it. So what does that mean? It means that God who confused the languages of
00:11:07.160 men in the old Testament, when they tried to reach up to heaven on their own is now blessing
00:11:12.480 his people by miraculously on confusing languages. Okay. So they came from different cultures. They
00:11:19.220 came from different backgrounds and he's reaching down to humanity and he uses this particular
00:11:24.900 blessing of the gift of tongues to facilitate the spreading of the gospel and the unity of believers
00:11:30.440 so they can be of one mind and one language and one purpose. After Jesus's resurrection,
00:11:36.040 he foretells the phenomenon of speaking in tongues before even ascending into heaven.
00:11:40.060 In Mark 16, we read this. And he said to them, go into all the world and proclaim the gospel
00:11:45.820 to the whole creation. Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not 0.94
00:11:50.400 believe will be condemned. And these signs will accompany those who believe in my name. They will
00:11:55.120 cast out demons. They will speak in new tongues. They will pick up serpents with their hands. And
00:11:59.800 if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them. They will lay hands on the sick and they
00:12:04.360 will recover. The prophecy is fulfilled in acts two at Pentecost. The early church is gathered
00:12:11.620 together in Jerusalem and the biblical era Jews traveled from all over the world to Jerusalem for
00:12:16.580 Pentecost. And this is significant because as the believers are filled with this Holy Spirit,
00:12:21.960 they begin to speak in the languages of all of these Jews gathered from many different nations.
00:12:26.960 So what we see here is not that it's Babel, is not that it's just random words and just random
00:12:34.160 utterances, but actually that it was to facilitate clarity, not to facilitate or not to advertise
00:12:41.620 some kind of mystery, but to facilitate unity and clarity. We can read this in Acts 2, 4 through
00:12:48.260 11. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit
00:12:53.080 gave them utterance. Now there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation
00:12:58.320 under heaven. And at this sound, the multitude came together and they were bewildered because
00:13:04.340 each one was hearing them speak in his own language. And they were amazed and astonished
00:13:08.880 saying, are not all these who are speaking Galileans? How is it that we hear each of us
00:13:14.360 in his own native language? Parthians and Medes and Elamites and residents of Mesopotamia,
00:13:21.020 Judea, Cappadocia, Pontus, Asia, Phrygia, and Pamphylia, Egypt, parts of Libya, belonging to
00:13:30.400 Cyrene and visitors from Rome, both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians. We hear them
00:13:37.520 telling in our own tongues, the mighty works of God. One of the things always just as an aside
00:13:43.480 that I think is so fascinating about the Bible when people try to dismiss it as, oh, it's just
00:13:47.620 a bunch of stories. It's not a well-written story. If it's fiction, it's only, it only reads like
00:13:53.960 history because of the seemingly mundane details like this that are included. Hard to read. You
00:14:00.080 would think not interesting. You don't need to include all of those specifications. We see that
00:14:04.540 throughout scripture, actually, they would only be included because they're true. You could tell
00:14:10.400 a better and more compelling story than this without all of those details. So anyway, that's
00:14:15.480 why it's important to even read all of those words that are hard to read and are hard to compute.
00:14:19.960 They're included for credibility. So note that the hearers of these tongues in Acts 2 don't hear
00:14:26.940 them as unintelligible babble. The believers are, through the Holy Spirit, supernaturally speaking
00:14:32.520 in languages foreign to them, but familiar to those who have gathered. So what is the purpose
00:14:37.820 of tongues? If we look at how the gift of tongues began in Acts and the subsequent instruction about
00:14:43.460 this gift, it is clear that the one purpose of this gift is to spread the gospel. In his first
00:14:49.440 letter to the Corinthians, Paul gives instructions on speaking in tongues. That's one thing that I 1.00
00:14:53.820 just see a lot. Sometimes, sometimes, um, among those who are charismatic, they will look at
00:15:00.180 someone like me who says, that's actually not what we see in scripture, or that's different
00:15:05.440 than how we see the precedent set for us in the early church. It'll be Pharisee, Pharisee,
00:15:10.660 religious, too many rules. Don't put God in a box. I'm like, this is God's box. He created it.
00:15:17.580 God's not in the box. He created the box for us because we need to be boxed in. Because when we
00:15:23.420 don't have these rules and regulations of religion, which there's nothing wrong with a religion,
00:15:28.760 by the way that is rooted in the truth of Christ. It just means religare, which means to go back.
00:15:34.960 You're repeating these rituals of worship to the Lord. He cares. God cares very much how he is
00:15:41.020 worshiped. He cares very much how he is communicated to. That is not pharisaical.
00:15:47.300 The Pharisees had gotten worship of God all wrong. They weren't worshiping God.
00:15:51.560 It was not that they were following the rules. That wasn't the problem with the Pharisees,
00:15:55.960 is that they had added to the rules and they weren't grounding their obedience to the rules
00:16:01.000 in God's original intent and in his heart. Okay. So we throw around that word pharisaical when we
00:16:08.380 just don't want to obey what the word of God says, but that's just not going to fly here. Okay.
00:16:13.300 We're not nicer than God. We're not more clever or smarter and wiser than him. So let's look at
00:16:18.660 what he says about speaking in tongues and how it should actually be done. First Corinthians 14,
00:16:23.500 9 through 13. So with yourselves, if with your tongue you utter speech that is not intelligible,
00:16:28.520 how will anyone know what is said? For you will be speaking into the air. There are doubtless
00:16:33.720 many different languages in the world and none is without meaning. But if I do not know the meaning
00:16:38.340 of the language, I will be a foreigner to the speaker and the speaker a foreigner to me. So
00:16:42.300 with yourselves, since you are eager for manifestations of the spirit, strive to excel
00:16:47.100 in building up the church. Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may
00:16:52.380 interpret. And then later in the same chapter, he writes, if any speak in a tongue, let there
00:16:56.900 be only two or at most three and each in turn. Okay. Remember, go back to that first,
00:17:04.260 that first video that we played in the media team, all speaking over each other,
00:17:08.060 no one interpreting anything. So first Corinthians 14 says, and each in turn and let
00:17:13.880 someone interpret. So notice that Paul describes these tongues in terms of the many different
00:17:20.260 languages of the world and says that none is without meaning. He stressed that if believers
00:17:24.440 are speaking in tongues, when they come together as a church, there needs to be an interpreter.
00:17:29.080 Now this is very different than what we see in some Pentecostal or charismatic churches. I know
00:17:35.180 there are charismatic Christians who do care a lot about first Corinthians 14. So I'm not trying
00:17:39.960 to dismiss those, but so often the more popular representations of speaking in tongues don't
00:17:45.800 actually align with the ordering that we see in this in this passage the tongues they speak in
00:17:51.880 is least at least in every instance that i've seen are not actual languages they're unintelligible
00:17:58.040 furthermore unlike paul's instructions they're not speaking one at a time they're speaking all
00:18:02.220 at once john macarthur he made this point during his ministry stop for it's so obviously not what
00:18:09.140 it was in the scripture what it was in the scripture was known languages known languages
00:18:14.700 that could be translated miraculously.
00:18:17.660 They would speak a language they didn't know,
00:18:19.800 and then somebody would give a translation
00:18:21.400 of that language they didn't know.
00:18:23.560 That was clearly what was going on in the book of Acts,
00:18:26.300 and that's what subsequently follows up.
00:18:28.520 So the burden of proof is not on us
00:18:30.840 to try to figure out what this is.
00:18:32.820 They don't even know what it is.
00:18:36.020 Right, good point, as always.
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00:19:54.500 not only is the purpose of tongues to spread the gospel but it also acts as a sign to unbelievers
00:20:06.660 so i know some of you when i was reading that one passage in first corinthians 14 you might be
00:20:11.180 thinking okay well what about this other passage over here paul explains to the corinthians thus
00:20:16.800 tongues are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers while prophecy is a sign for not
00:20:22.380 not for unbelievers, but for believers. If therefore the whole church comes together
00:20:26.960 and all speak in tongues and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that 0.98
00:20:32.640 you are out of your minds? So at first this sounds contradictory. And I understand that.
00:20:38.200 I feel like that too. When you're just like cursory reading of the passage, you're like,
00:20:41.420 hang on a second. This is another indication, by the way, I think of the credibility of scripture,
00:20:46.560 the people who have interpreted scripture, who have translated scripture over the years,
00:20:51.260 if they were just trying to bring something, like bring a bunch of ideas together that were
00:20:56.540 cohesive and that were seamless and that were compelling, they would have finagled and changed
00:21:02.680 all of this stuff because they don't want it to seem, you know, they want their ideas to be
00:21:07.240 pushed forward as the conspiracy theory goes. But the fact that difficult passages like this
00:21:12.220 are left in, and we are forced to sit and think and ask questions and cross-reference and all of
00:21:17.820 that to me, that's just another sign of scripture's credibility that of course it's not taken apart
00:21:24.860 and put back together because if you were doing that, you would have taken this part out because
00:21:29.500 it's confusing. So Paul says tongues are for unbelievers, but then says if unbelievers come
00:21:35.160 into the assembly and hear them all speaking in tongues, they'll think Christians are crazy. 0.90
00:21:38.920 But what Paul is saying is that it makes no sense for an assembly of believers who speak the same
00:21:44.480 language to speak to the assembly in languages they can't understand. That would seem nonsensical
00:21:49.400 to an outsider. The purpose of the church gathering together is to build up the church,
00:21:54.240 build up the body of Christ. That's what we read in Ephesians. Since tongues are assigned for
00:21:59.240 unbelievers, they don't accomplish this goal unless they're interpreted. And this is why in 0.99
00:22:03.540 Acts 2, going back to Acts when they're in the public square, there's no need for an interpreter. 0.98
00:22:08.060 The foreign unbelievers understand the gospel preached in their own language. The foreign 1.00
00:22:13.520 believers understand what is being said. It is a miraculous sign to those unbelievers 1.00
00:22:20.120 and encouragement to accept the gospel. Okay. You might be thinking, because we tried to kind of
00:22:27.940 like understand and address all of the possible pushback that we could get, or like, what are
00:22:35.840 the different objections? And I want to make sure that we address all of those. One of them that I
00:22:40.360 hear a lot is, okay, well, what about the, the language of the angels as we hear when we are
00:22:47.560 describing, um, speaking in tongues, Catherine Crick says, he, she says, for example, when you
00:22:54.760 speak in tongues, you're speaking a heavenly language. It is your spirit man praying God's
00:23:00.240 will. That is powerful. Many times we don't know what to pray with words, but when we begin
00:23:05.840 to speak in tongues. We are praying God's will to be done directly to the Holy Spirit. So I can see
00:23:12.460 where she is getting some of these, um, some of these different ideas. For example, in Romans,
00:23:20.000 it's like the Holy Spirit is interceding for us with groans too deep for words. Like we don't
00:23:25.700 have the words sometimes that to pray. And so the Holy Spirit is interceding for us. So she's kind
00:23:31.760 of taking that. And then she is also taking part of first Corinthians and saying, this means
00:23:38.080 speaking in tongues is some heavenly unintelligible language. And first Corinthians, Paul writes,
00:23:43.820 if I speak in the tongues of men and of angels and have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clinging
00:23:50.100 symbol. The problem with this is that Paul is clearly being hyperbolic in this passage. He goes
00:23:55.880 on. And if I have prophetic powers and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have
00:24:01.140 all faith so as to remove mountains, but have not love. I am nothing. So he's really making a point
00:24:07.560 there. People are extracting this. If I speak in the tongues of men and angels, oh my goodness,
00:24:12.480 there is a language of angels that I should be speaking. And if I bring this in with a Romans 0.98
00:24:17.320 passage about the Holy Spirit interceding for me, and I also go to first Corinthians 14 and acts two,
00:24:21.880 and I bring all of that together. Okay. Speaking in tongues is speaking in the language of angels,
00:24:25.980 but that's not actually what is being said here. Paul is not saying that believers should
00:24:30.800 literally be all knowing and literally comprehend all mysteries and all knowledge as part of their
00:24:36.980 everyday spiritual life. He is saying, look, even if you have everything, it's kind of like when
00:24:42.080 Jesus says like, what does it profit a man to gain the world and lose his soul? He's not literally
00:24:48.120 talking about as gaining the entire universe and me becoming queen of the universe. He is making
00:24:53.820 a point with hyperbole, with a literary device or rhetorical device saying, even if you get super
00:25:00.140 rich, even if you get that relationship that you want, even if you get all the material things that
00:25:05.200 you are looking for, but you lose your soul in the process, it's not worth it. It's the same
00:25:09.480 kind of rhetorical or literary device being used here. Even if you have everything, if you have
00:25:16.300 the whole world and you have all faith, but you don't have love, then you don't have anything at
00:25:21.120 all. So he's not saying that believers should be literally moving actual physical mountains in
00:25:28.000 prayer every morning. These are examples that he has given to contrast the idea that even if he did
00:25:33.120 do all of these things, having love would be more important. So when he says, if I speak in the
00:25:38.100 tongues of men and angels, he's like, not only if I'm speaking in tongues that we're talking about
00:25:45.020 in first Corinthians 14, but even if I could talk like angels talk, like even if I could speak like
00:25:50.620 the heavens speak, even if I could do something that crazy and that out there, but I'm not loving
00:25:56.040 my neighbor, I'm not loving the people around me, then it doesn't matter. Another point that people
00:26:03.060 make. Okay. So that's the angelic language argument or part of that argument anyway,
00:26:08.860 that I just don't think holds water. And then we also have the argument of like the baptism
00:26:14.140 of the Holy spirit. Like you saw in that Ali Yost clip where she is saying, okay,
00:26:19.400 she was already a believer. And then she was like, I got, then I got the gift of tongues.
00:26:24.180 and a lot of people, she didn't call it this, but a lot of people will call this the baptism
00:26:28.900 of the Holy spirit, which is after the initial justification that happens with salvation. I
00:26:34.240 think they would say if I'm to be charitable, um, they view this, the baptism of the Holy spirit
00:26:41.060 as a requirement for this kind of second stage of salvation. Kenneth Copeland, big name it and
00:26:49.180 claim it preacher that we've talked about many times, he explains this view this way,
00:26:54.120 Psalm 5. Now, do I have the Holy Spirit? Yes, you do. You haven't been baptized with the Holy
00:27:01.380 Spirit, but He is in there. The greater One is inside you, and He's your teacher. You have the
00:27:09.900 fruit of the Spirit listed in the fifth chapter of the book of Galatians, love, joy, peace,
00:27:14.640 goodness meekness kindness temperance you you have these are in there the baptism with the holy spirit
00:27:23.280 is the fullness being filled with the spirit of god amen speaking with other tongues
00:27:34.560 okay so he draws the distinction there between like having the fruit of the spirit which i would
00:27:39.360 would say yes and amen to, okay, you've got the baptism of the Holy Spirit. So they don't really
00:27:44.500 explain like what's the difference between having the Holy Spirit because you're saved and then
00:27:48.320 being full of the Holy Spirit. Because we also read in scripture that we are indwelt with the
00:27:53.540 Holy Spirit, that our body is a dwelling place for the Holy Spirit. But he and this teaching
00:27:58.860 distinguishes that from being full of the Holy Spirit. And one of the indications of that is
00:28:05.660 speaking in other tongues. And as you can imagine, if you believe this, and if you are
00:28:10.960 someone who believes this, you probably can agree with what I'm about to say is that that's a lot
00:28:16.440 of pressure. That's a lot of pressure. You're like, okay, I, I, I believed, I believe by grace
00:28:24.280 through faith that Jesus died for me. Um, okay. So I'm justified before God. I'm immediately
00:28:30.280 reconciled to him. I, my desires have changed. I don't want to sin anymore. I find myself wanting
00:28:37.020 to do what's right. Even if it's still a struggle, I'm in God's word, trying to learn what that life
00:28:43.100 looks like. And I'm going, I'm also going to church because I want to be in the body of believers
00:28:48.980 and God has changed my life. I've, I've gotten baptized just as a outward representation of
00:28:56.800 the internal transformation and I'm walking with Jesus. Okay. You should have, even after that
00:29:04.140 first moment of justification of just by grace through faith, believing, like you should have
00:29:09.560 all the confidence in the world because your confidence comes from Christ. But if you are
00:29:13.040 waiting, waiting, okay, I got to wait for the other shoe to drop. Like I got to wait for the
00:29:17.520 Holy spirit to decide kind of like capriciously almost to fill me so that I can speak in other
00:29:24.060 tongues until I really, really know, like salvation should not feel insecure. And it's not because of
00:29:32.100 what you have done. It's not because of like how you are proving that, but because of the work that
00:29:38.480 God has done for you through Christ. Should we see fruit of that? Absolutely. But fruit is different
00:29:44.400 than root. Like we believe that good works, baptism, repentance, that's the fruit of salvation.
00:29:51.520 but this teaching is teaching that being filled with the Holy Spirit and being able to speak in
00:29:56.280 tongues, that's kind of like the root of salvation in a way. They would probably say it's like more
00:30:02.660 of the fruit, but you're really saying if you don't have this, you're not saved. So you could
00:30:06.520 see how someone would think, I have to do this to prove my salvation. You know how that gets
00:30:12.080 conflated and gets confusing very quickly? Puts a lot of pressure on you.
00:30:16.080 there are a lot of supplement companies out there all kinds of health companies that promise to be
00:30:26.540 a game changer for your health i've tried probably most of them over my life i've been super
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00:30:37.320 supplement companies and honestly i just never really saw a difference i was just kind of
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00:30:45.460 tired all the time that maybe I'm still doing something. But then I switched to We Heart
00:30:50.220 Nutrition at the beginning of 2024. And I felt such a difference after just a few weeks of taking
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00:31:01.060 I was postpartum with my last baby, magnesium, all of that. And I was like, oh, this is how I
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00:31:11.660 I was getting sick all of the time, it seemed like, during that period.
00:31:15.880 And then I switched to WeHeart Nutrition, hair, skin, nails, better than they've ever
00:31:20.360 been.
00:31:20.660 My immune system, I still get sick, but it seems like I get well so much more quickly
00:31:25.740 than I did previously, even during pregnancy when your immune system is suppressed.
00:31:30.880 And I really have to give credit to WeHeart Nutrition.
00:31:33.340 Jacob and Kristen, who own this company, they're trying to glorify God in what they do through
00:31:38.000 WeHeart Nutrition, and they do that by providing really excellent products for women and for men
00:31:44.280 in their supplements. Go to WeHeartNutrition.com, use code Allie, you'll get 20% off your first
00:31:49.000 order. WeHeartNutrition.com, code Allie. The basic progression these kinds of denominations teach,
00:31:59.940 a person is saved by faith in Christ. We agree on that. After salvation, the believer should
00:32:04.140 seek the baptism of the Holy Spirit, when the Holy Spirit baptizes the believer in this special way,
00:32:09.120 the believer will speak in tongues. Tongues are therefore the outward sign that the baptism
00:32:14.820 has occurred. Again, insecurity, comparison that I just imagine can drive so much division within
00:32:24.260 the church. And also, again, just so many feelings of like, I've got to prove myself. Like,
00:32:30.580 I don't know it just I feel that the person who is walking around in a church like this who's like
00:32:36.380 okay like I am a Christian I do believe in all of these things but they haven't had that moment
00:32:40.740 of experience they probably feel like buddy the elf like when everyone's going around being like
00:32:46.860 how many of these toys did you make today and they're all like 2000 and buddy is like 80 and
00:32:53.220 he knows that it's like okay he's lived his life as an elf but he feels like an imposter I just
00:32:58.920 imagine that this causes a spirit of insecurity where there really should be a spirit of confidence
00:33:04.160 because of what Christ has done for us. Those who believe in the second experience point to Acts 19,
00:33:09.980 where Paul is in Ephesus and some already saved believers receive the Holy Spirit.
00:33:14.400 But if we read closely, this is a really unusual circumstance. This does not seem to be a rule
00:33:20.380 for all believers who come to Christ. He said to them, did you receive the Holy Spirit when you
00:33:24.860 believed. And they said, no, we have not even heard that there is a Holy spirit. And he said,
00:33:28.640 into what then were you baptized? They said into John's baptism. And Paul said, John baptized with
00:33:33.420 the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him.
00:33:37.640 That is Jesus on hearing this. They were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had
00:33:42.080 laid his hands on them, the Holy spirit came on them and they began speaking in tongues and
00:33:45.980 prophesying. There were about 12 men in all that's acts 19 two through seven. These men had received
00:33:53.160 John's baptism, but had not even heard about the Holy Spirit. Once Paul explained the gospel,
00:33:58.180 they were baptized in Jesus's name and received the Holy Spirit. This was a transitional event
00:34:03.480 during the apostolic era, not the normal pattern for Christian conversion. There was obviously
00:34:09.900 some confusion there, not just about the Holy Spirit, but about the role of Jesus in their
00:34:15.380 baptism and like what even really being a Christian meant. He's like, look, you got,
00:34:21.720 you were baptized by the precursor, but let me tell you about Jesus. And let me tell you about
00:34:26.760 his Holy Spirit. Most Baptists and Presbyterians, Reformed Christians, a lot of non-denominational 0.65
00:34:33.900 evangelicals reject this teaching of the baptism of the Holy Spirit that immediately concludes in
00:34:40.260 tongues. They believe every Christian received the Holy Spirit at conversion. And scripture,
00:34:45.600 I believe supports this view. If you read Romans eight, uh, eight, nine, you, however, are not in
00:34:52.120 the flesh, but in the spirit. If in fact, the spirit of God dwells in you, anyone who does not
00:34:55.680 have the spirit of Christ does not belong to him. Okay. Anyone who does not have the spirit of
00:35:01.880 Christ does not belong to him. So there doesn't seem to be as a rule in the lives of believers,
00:35:09.820 like this interim period where, yeah, you're justified in your Christian, but you don't have
00:35:14.280 the Holy spirit in you yet, because we actually see, Oh, if you don't have the spirit, you're
00:35:18.720 not a Christian. You don't belong to him, to the church in Corinth. Paul writes for in one spirit, 0.72
00:35:23.880 we were all baptized into one body. Jews or Greek slaves are free in all were made to drink of one 0.77
00:35:30.140 spirit. Scripture does not teach that speaking in tongues is the universal evidence of receiving 0.91
00:35:35.640 the spirit. There's that one passage that we read that again, does not seem to be the rule.
00:35:40.760 if we read it in context for all of the new Testament for every believer in verse four of
00:35:46.700 first Corinthians 12, he says, now there are varieties of gifts, but the same spirit later
00:35:52.140 in the chapter, he says, do all possess gifts of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all
00:35:57.580 interpret rhetorical questions? The answer is no. This implies that every believer is different.
00:36:04.280 Spiritual gifts varied from person to person, but they all possessed the Holy spirit. Okay. So
00:36:10.120 right away, we can say, whether you are a continuationist, you believe that as a rule,
00:36:14.700 these gifts of the Holy Spirit continue today and are evidence of salvation and the Lord working,
00:36:19.500 or whether you're a cessationist, and you believe that the time of these kinds of gifts
00:36:24.580 ended in the apostolic age, we can agree that there should be a way, there should be a way
00:36:32.060 to speak in tongues, if that is the camp that you are in, that there would be a way to speak
00:36:37.540 tongues, that it would be done in an orderly way, that it is not the automatic indication
00:36:42.860 of someone's salvation, that it is not part of any kind of second baptism that believers are
00:36:49.520 required to have. We do not see that idea supported in scripture. So if you do go to a
00:36:55.960 charismatic church and who are posting videos like this, who are talking about tongues,
00:37:00.840 go to first Corinthians, go to acts, read it for yourself and say, okay, does my church practice
00:37:06.180 this in a way that aligns with God's good ordering for how the church should be doing this.
00:37:11.640 So now we have to ask a question though, or we at least have to explore this question of,
00:37:18.280 should Christians even be speaking in tongues today? Should that be an expectation of Christians?
00:37:23.340 Should this be something that we are looking for at all? Should local churches be practicing this? 0.98
00:37:31.360 And this, again, I would say is a debate that is not salvific in nature. I would say that
00:37:38.540 in the cessationist camp, I would say that again, there are plenty of people who disagree with me
00:37:44.940 on the gifts of the Holy spirit that are believers whose wisdom, like I really like and appreciate a
00:37:51.280 lot, but it is, it is important. The discussion of tongues is part of the larger debate about
00:37:57.940 spiritual gifts in Christianity, are all the gifts of prophecy, healing, speaking in tongues,
00:38:03.020 et cetera, still in effect today in the same way they were in the days of the apostles?
00:38:07.200 Or were those gifts given for a time for a specific purpose and no longer in effect?
00:38:12.560 People get really up in arms when I talk about this. And for some reason, there are people,
00:38:16.660 every time I talk about it, who are shocked when I talk about cessationism and they'll say,
00:38:22.720 oh, well, I'm just disregarding everything else that you've said about this. Well,
00:38:26.020 you shouldn't because it's just the Bible. And you can, by the way, disregard everything I say
00:38:29.680 if you want to, but at least go to the word of God and read it for yourself. That's your final
00:38:33.220 authority, not me anyway. I'm here to give you my perspective also, and to help you help you
00:38:39.340 think through this, because whether you're a cessationist or a continuationist, like we can
00:38:43.600 sharpen each other and help each other think through these things. And at the end of the day,
00:38:47.400 say, well, God's word is final and his, uh, his word is authoritative and inerrant and we aren't,
00:38:54.840 um christians basically fall into these two camps i guess you could say it's a spectrum but
00:39:00.540 it's mostly binary continuationist cessationist cessationism again is the view that certain
00:39:06.220 miraculous spiritual gifts such as prophecy speaking in tongues miraculous healings were
00:39:10.040 given primarily primarily to authenticate the apostles and the founding of the church and
00:39:15.820 therefore ceased or largely ceased after the apostolic age a lot of evangelical christians
00:39:20.820 Reformed Baptists, Southern Baptists, Presbyterians, adhere to this, adhere to this
00:39:25.800 view. And always I get the response from people that you're putting God in a box. You don't
00:39:32.500 believe that God can do things, et cetera. That is so not true. That is not the case at all.
00:39:37.980 No one who is in the cessationist camp is saying what God can do. It's saying what God does. What
00:39:44.540 do we, what do we see? What do we see in scripture? And what do we see today? Neither camp I would
00:39:49.200 say is trying to restrict God. Although I will say there are some people like in the Catherine
00:39:55.300 Crick camp, who of course are continuationists, but a strange variation of that, that do kind of
00:40:01.700 treat God like a genie. Like God's only going to do this if I do this. God can't do this unless you 0.89
00:40:06.960 sow this. And that is a bigger limitation on the power of God than a cessationist who says God can
00:40:15.460 do anything he wants to, but as a rule, he seems to function this way today.
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00:41:58.520 continuationism is the view that all of the spiritual gifts mentioned in the new testament
00:42:08.820 remain available to the church today and may still be exercised according to god's will through
00:42:13.720 though continuationists differ on how frequently and in what manner those gifts operate as we've
00:42:19.180 talked about a lot today both positions affirm that god can still perform miracles but they
00:42:23.620 disagree on whether the specific new Testament sign gifts are intended to continue as a normal.
00:42:29.920 Okay. So it's a normative as a rule, part of church life until Christ return. Some denominations
00:42:36.260 are continuationist in principle, but not all of them place the same emphasis on the public
00:42:41.900 exercise of gifts, such as speaking in tongues and prophecy churches that typically give these
00:42:46.380 gifts are more prominent role in worship, like, um, or as a more prominent role in worship include
00:42:52.160 like the assemblies of God, Pentecostal churches, you've heard Bethel, some of Hillsong, things like
00:42:58.560 that. If we look at church history, it does seem, it does seem to me that tongues ceased after the
00:43:05.740 time of the apostles. Augustine wrote that this is in about 354. He lived 354 and 420 AD. He wrote
00:43:14.260 that in the early times, believers spoke in tongues so that the gospel could spread through
00:43:18.020 the earth, but that this has passed away. So his view was this in the earliest times,
00:43:22.580 the Holy ghost fell upon them that believed and they spake with tongues, which they had not
00:43:27.140 learned as the spirit gave them utterance. That's acts two, four. These were signs adapted to the
00:43:32.140 time for their behoved to be that, uh, to be that betokening of the Holy spirit in all tongues
00:43:39.060 to show that the gospel of God was to run through all tongues over the whole earth.
00:43:43.600 that thing was done for a betokening, but it passed away. It was done for a period of time.
00:43:49.320 It was done for a specific purpose. The Protestant reformers also affirmed mostly a cessationist view
00:43:55.280 in most of their doctrinal confessions, including the Westminster Confession, 1647, and the London
00:44:01.600 Baptist Confession. Both of these confessions affirmed that previous ways of God's revealing
00:44:07.840 himself to mankind, like prophecy or direct revelation, have ceased, meaning the biblical
00:44:13.340 canon has closed. Um, you can look both of those up of the Holy scripture in the Westminster
00:44:19.960 catechism, part one of the Holy scripture, 1689 Baptist confession. If you want to look more into
00:44:26.080 that yourself, thus the reformation tradition has traditionally held that the miraculous gift
00:44:32.720 gets described in the new Testament, such as prophecy, tongues, miraculous healings
00:44:36.760 served a specific purpose to confirm and authenticate the message that God was revealing
00:44:41.980 through the apostles. And there's also some debate, like Pentecostal is just so different
00:44:47.520 than the other Reformed denominations. We're talking Lutheran and Presbyterian and even
00:44:52.160 Methodist and Baptist that kind of came out of the Reformation. There's even a question about
00:44:58.080 whether Pentecostal is considered Protestant. It's certainly not Catholic, but it differs so
00:45:05.060 much in so many of the different fundamental doctrinal beliefs that they have. That revelation
00:45:11.380 has now been preserved for us in scripture. Since God's revealed word has been fully given in the
00:45:17.140 Bible, those extraordinary gifts are no longer needed for their original purpose. So while these
00:45:22.000 gifts were real and active in the early church as recorded in scripture, we believe they have
00:45:26.620 ceased. That is paraphrased from Ligonier Ministries, R.C. Sproul, who also talked about
00:45:31.260 this a lot. John MacArthur explained some of the problems with the continuationist view.
00:45:36.180 Not only is it not in line with church history, he says, but it also clouds the issue of the
00:45:40.380 Word of God being sufficient and complete for us to live by, thought six. If you're saying
00:45:46.420 God is still speaking through prophets, still speaking through apostles, then he's not finished
00:45:53.540 speaking. So that I need my Bible and a prophet or prophets, my Bible and some apostles,
00:46:02.600 that I don't have everything sufficient in the Word of God.
00:46:08.120 And so I need some miraculous gift to get me through,
00:46:11.760 some miraculous word of knowledge, word of wisdom,
00:46:14.600 some miraculous insight, some divine experience,
00:46:19.680 some transcendent kind of thing.
00:46:22.720 Or I can't make it as a Christian.
00:46:25.080 I need that.
00:46:26.140 does this mean the point that he just made and really cessationists make that god does not ever
00:46:34.940 work supernaturally that he never works outside of like normal human physics and function rc
00:46:41.620 sprawl clarifies that if you mean miracle in the strict narrow sense of something used to
00:46:46.000 authenticate scripture then no miracles like that don't need to happen today but he says not all
00:46:51.700 supernatural acts are that. God still answers prayers for healing and works supernaturally,
00:46:59.980 but not in the manner of producing signs to authenticate the apostles because we don't
00:47:04.020 need that anymore. He says this, if it's valid to argue that the Bible is authenticated by
00:47:08.500 miracles, it's agents of revelation, then obviously the sign gifts die with the death
00:47:13.440 of the last apostle. Otherwise the argument wouldn't be sound. All miracles I believe are
00:47:17.280 supernatural acts, but not all supernatural acts, he argues, are miracles in the narrow sense.
00:47:22.180 I believe that God answers prayers for healing and that sort of thing. And in that sense,
00:47:25.620 they're supernatural acts of God's special providence. That doesn't mean that they qualify
00:47:29.160 as a miracle in that very narrow sense that I was explaining, which again, is to authenticate
00:47:35.460 God's word or to authenticate the apostles. Now, I do want to say, you know, I said this
00:47:43.840 sentiment earlier, but I just want to explain a little bit more clearly what I mean by this.
00:47:48.420 Not every continuationist is Catherine Crick or Kenneth Copeland, and not every Christian who
00:47:54.700 believes the gift of tongues continues today believes that every Christian must speak in 0.55
00:47:58.820 tongues, that tongues are proof of salvation, or that chaotic disorderly displays should be
00:48:04.320 accepted as the work of the Holy Spirit. There are conservative continuationist evangelicals
00:48:08.860 that affirm the authority and sufficiency of scripture, reject the abuses and the chaos.
00:48:14.220 They may understand tongues differently than cessationists do, but they would point to Paul's
00:48:19.440 command in 1 Corinthians, do not forbid speaking in tongues, 1 Corinthians 14, 39, while also
00:48:25.240 emphasizing his command that all things should be done decently in order. Of course, the cessationists 1.00
00:48:30.060 would say, yes, but that was the time of the apostles and we don't need to authenticate God's
00:48:34.700 word or use that means to spread the gospel anymore. A continuationist would say,
00:48:39.460 why are we picking apart God's word? Clearly this is a command to the local church. We use
00:48:44.100 other parts of the epistles as commands and ordering for the local church. And so
00:48:49.580 they would say, why would we forbid speaking in tongues? So from their perspective, the abuses
00:48:56.720 or the accesses of a spiritual gift don't necessarily prove that the gift itself has
00:49:00.560 ceased. So the disagreement between careful continuationists and cessationists is not over
00:49:05.340 whether scripture should govern Christian practice, but over how scripture itself teaches us to
00:49:10.080 understand the purpose and the duration of these gifts. I would love to see it, have never seen,
00:49:16.180 but it may exist. And you can tell me if you've experienced this. I have never seen someone
00:49:22.000 speaking in tongues who suddenly can speak in a language that is understood today by someone else
00:49:28.280 for the purpose of sharing the gospel. I have personally never seen that. Now, maybe if you're
00:49:34.020 a continuationist, you're like, yeah, we don't post it on social media because of Jesus's warning
00:49:38.080 to the Pharisees about praying publicly, showing that they're fasting, trying to put on this
00:49:44.140 religious display. Okay, fair enough. I've just never been in a situation. Almost every example
00:49:50.620 that I see on social media is of people babbling in nonsense. And really what it reminds me of
00:49:58.600 the people that we see babbling in nonsense, especially in the new Testament are typically
00:50:04.360 possessed by demons. Like they are speaking in babble because, uh, babbling and because confusion
00:50:14.360 and disorder is a curse. Again, going all the way back to Genesis 11. Now I'm not saying all
00:50:20.360 the people that we talked about in the beginning are possessed by a demon, I'm saying you are not
00:50:26.880 seeking the right sign of being filled with the Holy Spirit if you are just speaking random words
00:50:33.360 that no one can understand. It's just not what we see in scripture. That's not what we see as
00:50:38.740 evidence of the Holy Spirit. And I would say, be careful, be careful. A recent Damish study
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00:51:19.740 best for her mind. And that is choosing life for her baby. When a woman walks into one of
00:51:25.100 Preborn Network's clinics, she is welcomed with open arms. She's introduced to her baby through
00:51:29.380 an ultrasound. She is offered hope and resources like maternity clothes, diapers, counseling,
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00:51:51.780 In the end, the question of speaking in tongues is not about whether
00:51:54.980 or it's not about whether God is powerful enough to work miraculously today. Scripture is clear
00:52:01.220 that God still heals, that he answers prayer and sovereignly intervenes in the lives of his people.
00:52:06.240 and God can do all things, Job 42 too, and no plan of his can be thwarted. The question is whether
00:52:12.580 the specific gift of tongues described in the New Testament continues to function in the church in
00:52:16.540 the same way that it did in the apostolic era. When we examine the biblical evidence, the purpose
00:52:21.360 of tongues appears to have been the miraculous communication of the gospel across language
00:52:26.540 barriers and the authentication of God's revelation through the apostles. This modern
00:52:31.840 practice in many sections of Pentecostalism, not all, of unintelligible speech bears little,
00:52:41.520 if any, resemblance to the gift described in Acts and regulated by Paul in 1 Corinthians.
00:52:46.660 Sincere Christians can disagree on this issue, but believers, all believers, should test every
00:52:51.260 practice by scripture rather than experience, rather than emotion. Certainly don't allow it 0.96
00:52:56.160 to be a social contagion, whether it's in your local body or whether it's social media, that
00:53:00.640 influencer that you love so much saying that she discovered this one day, if it is not an
00:53:06.040 intelligible language, it doesn't seem to me like there is any basis at all, no matter what camp
00:53:11.880 you're in for pursuing that. Our confidence ultimately does not rest in that. It rests
00:53:17.100 not in ongoing signs and wonders, but in this efficient and completed work of God and work of
00:53:23.560 God. These equip us for every good work and points us to Christ. And I want believers to be sure in
00:53:31.180 that. Like I want us to trust in the power and the sovereignty of God, knowing that he is going
00:53:35.860 to work how he is going to work. I want us to look to the word of God for wisdom, for discernment,
00:53:40.880 to tell us everything we need to do for life and godliness, for us to be filled with the Holy
00:53:45.040 Spirit who does intercede for us on a daily basis with groans too deep for words. And I want us to
00:53:51.620 be a bastion of clarity. Y'all, the world is already confusing. The world is already chaotic.
00:53:58.380 The world already says words that don't make sense. The world is already putting forth
00:54:04.600 completely nonsensical and completely illogical ideas that are leaving people in this wake of
00:54:14.300 utter despair because nothing seems to make sense. But y'all, we worship the logos. That's how he's
00:54:20.880 described. That's how Jesus is described in John one, the low ghost. That's where we get the word
00:54:25.400 logic and Greek. It means reason or rationale or word. We worship the low ghost. We worship
00:54:34.380 the order maker. We worship the clarity bringer. We worship the arbiter of truth.
00:54:42.260 Confusion is a curse. Clarity is a gift. It's a gift given to us in the word of God.
00:54:47.480 and by the Holy Spirit, let us be bastions of clarity in this age of confusion. Let us not
00:54:53.800 sow even more confusion. All right. That's all we've got time for today. And we will be back
00:54:59.240 here next time.
00:55:17.480 Thank you.