00:00:00.000What comes next in the United States if the Democrats were to take over?
00:00:04.000Now, what we're seeing in some other countries is an indicator of what happens when you have essentially constitutional gridlock and then left wing government.
00:00:12.000So, constitutional gridlock is a feature of pretty much every constitutional system.
00:00:15.000Constitutional systems are built to force large scale agreement before you can do things.
00:00:22.000It's why we have checks and balances in the United States, it's why we have enshrined rights under the Constitution.
00:00:28.000The goal is to inhibit The flippant change of policy that happens every time there's an election.
00:00:36.000But it seems that there is a trend across the world of left wing governments when they run up against the difficulty of checks and balances, just overrunning those checks and balances, and then the entire left wing ecosystem cheering and saying this is an aspect of freedom.
00:01:46.000It's like the U.S. House of Representatives.
00:01:48.000And in Poland, the parliament elects judges to the constitutional court.
00:01:52.000The constitutional tribunal is like the Supreme Court in the United States.
00:01:56.000So imagine if a Democratic Congress picked a whole new slate of Supreme Court justices to replace the conservative ones that were already there.
00:02:04.000And then the president, who has the power to veto, Refused to swear them in, and the Chief Justice wouldn't let them sit because they hadn't been sworn in.
00:02:12.000And then one of the newer justices told the Chief Justice that he was suspended while the police and the Democratic Party, backed by the Prime Minister, surrounded the building.
00:02:21.000Meanwhile, an outside body, in Poland's case, the European Court of Human Rights, ordered the Supreme Court to accept all the new judges.
00:02:33.000It's sort of unclear in the sense that normally the president doesn't just sort of reject.
00:02:38.000People being appointed to the Supreme Court on the basis of them being part of an opposition party.
00:02:42.000But he does have the constitutional power to do that.
00:02:45.000So abusing your constitutional power or misusing it or using it in a relatively unprecedented way doesn't mean the use of power is itself a violation of the Constitution.
00:02:56.000This is what happens when you have total breakdown of trust in a society.
00:02:59.000So last Thursday, the conservative Hungarian outlet reported on a leaked police order that put units in Poland on high alert.
00:03:06.000On Friday, the judge ordered a suspension of the Chief Justice. of the Supreme Court, claiming it was needed to restore the court's functions.
00:03:13.000They wanted to kind of throw him out because he refused to seat any of the people selected by the prime minister and rejected by the president.
00:03:21.000So the police then showed up and they stopped the chief justice from entering the court.
00:03:25.000He and his supporters had showed up and used a power tool to cut through the fence.
00:03:29.000Then the chief justice accused Donald Tusk, the prime minister, of staging a coup.
00:03:35.000And then the president, again, who's a member of PIS, which is the right wing party, and Tusk is a member of the pro EU party, He turned his plane around.
00:03:43.000He was on his way to Senegal, and he was physically blocked from going inside the court by one of the justices, and he sort of pushed her aside.
00:03:51.000So, the prime minister of Poland, Donald Tusk, who unseated the PIS in the last election, he said, After years of PIS lawlessness, there is no other way.
00:04:03.000So, the no other way would be to essentially violate the law in order to preserve the law, is the case that he is making.
00:04:09.000And the EU Commission, unsurprisingly, because Tusk is pro EU, whereas the PIS is anti EU, the EU Commission then turned around and backed Tusk.
00:04:18.000Quote The European Commission has reiterated that Poland's parliament must have the right to appoint new judges, lending support to the Polish prime minister in an escalating confrontation over the country's constitutional tribunal.
00:04:31.000So, the former prime minister, Matuze Morawiecki, a former PIS member whose Rojwosz Plus coalition is positioning itself as an alternative to Tusk's government, denounced the forceful takeover of the constitutional tribunal.
00:04:45.000And Morawiecki gave us an exclusive statement here at the Ben Shapiro show.
00:04:49.000He said, The European Commission, who used to be so vocal about Polish constitutional tribunal and the rule of law, stays silent.
00:05:14.000Tomorrow, these pseudo judges want to meet to sanction the takeover of power in the tribunal, but this meeting will be fake and illegitimate.
00:05:21.000To make it look legal, the government is just making up new rules as they go.
00:05:24.000They don't even have enough judges for a proper quorum, so they're simply pretending that illegally suspending judges don't exist just to make the numbers work.
00:05:32.000Once you break the law for the first time, you have to break it even more to cover it up.
00:05:36.000I have a proposed constitutional reset.
00:05:38.000Our plan would replace the current bench through a constitutional amendment and introduce 12 judges elected by a parliamentary majority of three fifths with staggered terms and a four year waiting period after holding political office.
00:05:48.000The tribunal would publish its own judgments, preventing the government from blocking their publication.
00:05:52.000We want rules that require political agreement.
00:05:54.000And protect the institutions and independence, whoever holds power.
00:05:56.000I've also proposed replacing Donald Tusk's government through a parliamentary vote and forming a caretaker administration.
00:06:01.000So, obviously, we'll see if any of that is taken up.
00:06:05.000Now, remember again, this sort of constitutional unworkability is the result of people who believe that essentially, if you don't like how the systems work, you can just overrun them.
00:06:14.000We've seen this from both right and left in the United States, but Barack Obama is a big advocate of this sort of stuff.
00:06:19.000This is why I say that if Democrats take, let's say Democrats take power in the Congress and in the Senate and the presidency, and let's say the Supreme Court obstructs what they're trying to do.
00:07:47.000Remember, according to the left, if you do things that violate the rules, that is anti authoritarianism.
00:07:52.000If your opponents do things that violate the rules, that's authoritarianism.
00:07:55.000I think that we probably all should just oppose the authoritarianism, generally speaking, no matter whether it is of the right or of the left.
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00:08:48.000He's a Polish politician, member of the European Parliament since 2019, where he leads the European Conservatives and Reformist Group since 2024.
00:08:54.000He's also served as vice president of the Law and Justice Party.
00:09:03.000So, obviously, this situation is sort of confusing to a lot of Americans because our institutions work differently than your institutions work over there.
00:09:13.000Tell me if I'm breaking this down wrongly.
00:09:14.000It seems like basically the Polish president and the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court.
00:09:19.000Have the constitutional ability to either veto people being appointed to the Supreme Court or to refuse to seat them, they're exercising that constitutional authority.
00:09:27.000And then the prime minister and other members of the Supreme Court are saying that they're not allowed to exercise that authority.
00:09:32.000So they're basically going to oust the chief justice of the Supreme Court and put in place somebody that they like better.
00:09:38.000And somehow this is considered anti authoritarian.
00:09:44.000But what is, but above all, the standard feature of the Western civilization is to have a system of separation of powers.
00:09:55.000It means that you have an executive branch, a legislative branch, and a judicial branch, and all of these branches are equal to each other.
00:10:03.000And the most important representatives in the Polish system of this judicial branch is the constitutional tribunal.
00:10:09.000And the executive power, so left liberal wing government leading by Tusk, he decided to take over the constitutional tribunal using 3,000.
00:10:23.000Police officers to put his judges into this court and after that guard the court from the legal judges.
00:10:31.000Try to imagine that something like this is happening in America.
00:10:35.000Like, for instance, President Trump ordered to take over, to cease the Supreme Court building and after that guard this building from legal judges and appoint in this building his ministers.
00:10:50.000So, this is exactly the same situation.
00:10:56.000Nothing like this is happening in Europe since decades.
00:11:03.000Now, the European Union, of course, has come out in favor of Tusk's action, suggesting that he's doing something within his authority because of the obstructionism of the Chief Justice and by the President.
00:11:15.000Is there any truth to the idea that the President is somehow obstructing the legal working order or the Chief Justice is obstructing the legal working order by refusing to seat justices who've been selected by the Prime Minister?
00:11:27.000No, because in our system, there is two steps to appoint the judge in the constitutional tribunal.
00:11:34.000First step is this appointment in parliament.
00:11:39.000And the judge from Tusk, he has this appointment.
00:11:43.000But after that, it's the second step taking the oath from the president of the republic.
00:11:49.000And they have one step, but they didn't have the second step.
00:11:54.000President of the republic of Poland, according to our constitution, is a guard of the constitution.
00:11:59.000So he can say if someone doesn't fulfill a requirement, He cannot be a judge of the Constitutional Tribunal.
00:12:09.000And this is exactly the case of this Mr. Berek.
00:12:14.000So, the judge who Donald Tusk tried to appoint in the Constitutional Tribunal, because first of all, the requirement to be a constitutional court judge, you need to fulfill a requirement like this.
00:13:16.000That is the reason why President Navrovsky asked the court whether he should appoint them, whether not.
00:13:24.000But the most important thing is that, according to our law system, without taking the oath from the president, they cannot be judges in constitutional tribunals.
00:13:41.000I mean, obviously, you have a constitutional standoff right now where you have the president and the chief justice versus the prime minister and some of the other justices.
00:13:48.000So, what exactly happens next, or does everybody just sort of stare at each other and whoever has the guns wins?
00:13:55.000Unfortunately, I think that the most possible scenario is that Tusk introduces more violence.
00:14:05.000But the most important question is why he is doing this.
00:14:08.000And the Constitutional Tribunal is the court which can decide to interpret our Constitution in the most important issue, which is a part of the public debate in Poland.
00:14:25.000We have one of the most protected in the world strong definition of family in our constitution, meaning that the marriage is only between men and women.
00:14:38.000And Tusk would like to change this definition using constitutional court to all genders.
00:14:44.000Secondly, he would like to cease this constitutional court because there is a big debate between us and them.
00:14:54.000The Constitutional Court decided that all this climate green ideology was introduced without legal ground.
00:15:04.000And Tus decided that he will not publish this ruling.
00:15:10.000And they would like to change this ruling because they are afraid of the European Union.
00:15:16.000And the third thing is, of course, that they would like to limit the competence of the President of the Republic using the Constitutional Court.
00:15:24.000Even though we have elections a year ago.
00:15:29.000And the Polish people said explicitly that they don't would like to give all power to the leftist government leading by Tusk.
00:15:40.000So the reason behind those coup is to change the system in Poland.
00:17:02.000Hope and pray that the next elections go not his way despite domination of the law.
00:17:07.000Of course, it's difficult to predict, but I think that they can use more violence.
00:17:15.000So, what we can do, we can appeal to Polish citizens to defend the independence of the courts.
00:17:24.000Secondly, there is another reason why they are doing this and why the EU is allowing us to do so, because there is, you know, Leftists see that among Europe they are losing power, they are losing support.
00:17:40.000So they would like to transfer powers from the executive and legislative power to the judicial power because this is their idea to keep power even though if they lose election.
00:17:54.000Because we know that the construction of the judicial system among Europe is the leftist construction.
00:18:01.000So this is the idea how they can keep power and Do not be held accountable from the people's perspective.
00:18:11.000And this is an anti democratic system, but we can predict violence.
00:18:15.000So that's why we appeal to the whole people of common sense to see what is really happening in Poland, because of course, the EU is cheering Tusk to use more forces because they understand that they have a very difficult election next year in Spain, in Poland, in Italy, in France.
00:19:11.000Well, you know, if you think so, head on over to dailywire.comslash subscribe to watch the full show ad free or check out this crazy story here.