The Charlie Kirk Show - November 29, 2024


Is the Electoral College DEI? + Other Questions at the University of Pittsburgh with Vivek Ramaswamy


Episode Stats


Length

36 minutes

Words per minute

209.98613

Word count

7,570

Sentence count

657

Harmful content

Misogyny

2

sentences flagged

Hate speech

13

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode of The Charlie Kirk Show, host Charlie talks about why the Electoral College should be abolished and why a constitutional republic is better than a direct democracy. Charlie is joined by presidential candidate J.D. Deutch and former Vice President Joe Biden to discuss their views on the matter.

Transcript

Transcripts from "The Charlie Kirk Show" are sourced from the Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool. Explore them interactively here.
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 Hey everybody enjoy this episode become a member members.charliekirk.com that is members.charliekirk.com email us as always freedom at charliekirk.com and become a member to support this program buckle up everybody here we go Charlie what you've done is incredible here maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk Charlie Kirk's running the White House folks I want to thank Charlie.
00:00:25.000 He's an incredible guy.
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00:00:43.000 That's why we are here.
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00:01:12.000 Hello.
00:01:13.000 I have a disagreement with you guys.
00:01:16.000 I believe that the Electoral College is unjust and should be abolished.
00:01:21.000 And, Mr. Ramaswamy, I believe, since you ran for president, I would like to hear from you first.
00:01:26.000 Sure.
00:01:27.000 So, I think this is a common...
00:01:29.000 I know this is near and dear to Charlie's heart.
00:01:32.000 Oh, okay.
00:01:34.000 Let's start with that.
00:01:37.000 I think that is a great question, Esther.
00:01:38.000 I like that.
00:01:39.000 Let's start with that so I make sure I'm responding to the question.
00:01:41.000 What is the definition of justice?
00:01:42.000 Okay, so we talk a lot about like DEI programs and that sort of thing and people being, you know, unjustly put into these like positions.
00:01:50.000 I believe that the Electoral College is DEI for the Republican Party where Hillary Clinton won the popular vote but lost the presidency because of the Electoral College because it empowers rural states more by giving them the electoral votes.
00:02:06.000 Do you believe that the Senate is unjust?
00:02:09.000 I believe the Senate needs to exist.
00:02:14.000 Okay, so because that's the whole principle is that we don't just live in a direct democracy.
00:02:19.000 We live in a constitutional republic.
00:02:21.000 And that means a few things.
00:02:23.000 First is it means that we are really a union of states.
00:02:26.000 We're not just a random assemblage of geographic land masses called states that we call a union.
00:02:31.000 That means something where part of it is direct representative democracy.
00:02:35.000 But part of it is also making sure that states actually have a relative say in the process.
00:02:40.000 That's how you get the Senate versus the House to balance it out. 0.86
00:02:43.000 Same thing with respect to the history of the Electoral College.
00:02:46.000 This is about making sure that we're being thoughtful about the step of who's actually the U.S. president while channeling the Democratic will through the manner enshrined in our Constitution.
00:02:55.000 And here's the biggest difference between a republic and a democracy.
00:02:58.000 This is relevant to a lot of young people.
00:03:01.000 In a constitutional republic, it's not just about what you get.
00:03:03.000 In a democracy, you get a vote.
00:03:05.000 You think about what does it mean to be a citizen about what you get.
00:03:08.000 In a constitutional republic, it's also about what you give.
00:03:12.000 It's about your civic duty to your country.
00:03:14.000 And I think that part of what our founding fathers envisioned is we had voters who actually knew something about their country.
00:03:21.000 You know, every legal immigrant who comes to this country has to pass a civics test before they can vote. 0.96
00:03:27.000 Well, frankly, the sad truth is most voters would fail that if they took it today.
00:03:31.000 That would make our founding fathers roll over in their graves.
00:03:34.000 And so I think that we've got to get beyond this idea that we're some kind of direct democracy.
00:03:38.000 We're actually a republic where people have responsibilities and states actually have some level of distributed say to make sure that two cities in New York and California don't govern who actually leads the entire United States of America.
00:03:49.000 And I will push back.
00:03:51.000 Look at the current battleground states.
00:03:54.000 The blackest state in the country is getting a lot of attention because of the Electoral College, Georgia.
00:03:59.000 One of the most black states in the country, North Carolina, is getting a lot of attention.
00:04:02.000 Atlanta is one of the biggest metro areas in the country.
00:04:05.000 It would get attention whether or not they had the 16 electoral college votes.
00:04:10.000 The Republican Party has a cushion.
00:04:14.000 They have states like Wyoming that nobody lives in.
00:04:17.000 Well, let's be consistent.
00:04:18.000 It's three electoral votes.
00:04:19.000 First of all, 700,000 Americans live there, so let's not talk down to our fellow citizens.
00:04:23.000 Okay, but why does their vote, right?
00:04:25.000 Why does their vote go farther than mine, who's from Texas?
00:04:29.000 Hold on a second.
00:04:31.000 Rhode Island and Hawaii are small, and that helps Democrats, right?
00:04:37.000 Yeah, I think that's bad too.
00:04:39.000 Okay, got it.
00:04:40.000 But it doesn't just help Republicans.
00:04:41.000 What it does is it requires candidates, as Vivek aptly put it, to have a preference on states.
00:04:49.000 We are not a national project first and foremost.
00:04:51.000 We are a collection of sovereign states that come together as a national project.
00:04:56.000 And the founders wanted a decentralized way of doing elections.
00:04:59.000 And I think it's actually a really good thing that this state, which is incredibly diverse, Very difficult to be able to win will determine the entire election. 1.00
00:05:09.000 I think Pennsylvania is a great picture of the country, and you guys get a lot of attention because of it.
00:05:15.000 Now, you say, in Texas, well, in Texas, it actually might become a battleground state one day.
00:05:21.000 The thing about the Electoral College is that certain battleground states rise and certain fall.
00:05:25.000 Ohio used to be a battleground state.
00:05:26.000 Now Arizona's a battleground state.
00:05:28.000 Georgia never used to be a battleground state.
00:05:30.000 Now it is.
00:05:30.000 Florida used to be.
00:05:31.000 And so what the Electoral College does is it forces candidates to go into places outside of the coastal corridor and win over voters of the people that actually make the country work, such as Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Georgia, and Michigan.
00:05:48.000 It doesn't answer the question, though, why somebody's vote in somewhere like Wyoming, which has three votes for 70,000 people versus Texas's- 700,000.
00:05:56.000 700,000 versus Texas's 38 for 30 million.
00:06:00.000 That doesn't make any sense.
00:06:01.000 Well, that's actually proportional, though, because- No, it's not.
00:06:04.000 It is proportional because, okay, then would you get rid of Wyoming as statehood?
00:06:08.000 To be consistent, should Wyoming exist as a state?
00:06:10.000 Absolutely.
00:06:12.000 But their vote should be the same as mine.
00:06:14.000 So I got a solution to this.
00:06:17.000 Apology Electoral College.
00:06:18.000 Well, it's not the one that I made.
00:06:20.000 It's the solution that our founding fathers made, which is that if we don't like that in the United States of America, we got a way to change it.
00:06:26.000 It's a constitutional amendment.
00:06:28.000 So you agree with me?
00:06:29.000 I don't agree with you because I wouldn't vote for it.
00:06:31.000 But if your view is that this is anti-democratic, there's a way to change it.
00:06:36.000 If three quarters of people in this country wanted to change it, that would change in an instant.
00:06:40.000 And so there's a mechanism to go through it.
00:06:42.000 So just like the gentleman earlier who was founding a movement, there could be a movement that says we want a constitutional amendment to abolish the electoral college, but they haven't managed to convince enough people in this country that it's worth it.
00:06:52.000 And the reason why is there was actually a justification for it.
00:06:55.000 It turns out that most people, when they think about it, actually do land where Charlie and I do on a popular vote basis across the country.
00:07:01.000 That wouldn't be a weighted vote, by the way.
00:07:03.000 So you're talking about actually overturning it through the constitutional amendment.
00:07:06.000 Then Wyoming doesn't actually get more votes.
00:07:08.000 You're talking about just three quarters of the overall states and three quarters of the vote in Congress, which is proportional representation.
00:07:15.000 So there's a way to fix it that our founding fathers...
00:07:17.000 I mean, these guys were geniuses.
00:07:19.000 They had built that into the system.
00:07:20.000 I agree.
00:07:20.000 I love my country.
00:07:21.000 I'm a patriot.
00:07:22.000 Yeah, if you convince your citizens, then maybe that will be true 50 years from now.
00:07:25.000 But we don't believe that majoritarian ways of doing elections is the best way.
00:07:30.000 Why not?
00:07:31.000 Well, because we're not an up-or-down majoritarian democracy.
00:07:34.000 We're a decentralized country of states first.
00:07:37.000 And I'll keep on saying that.
00:07:38.000 That sovereign states matter.
00:07:40.000 That's what makes us different than France and Germany and Belgium and the United Kingdom.
00:07:43.000 Is that we're a bottom-up form of government, not a top-down form of government.
00:07:47.000 Germany also has strong state governments.
00:07:49.000 Not as much.
00:07:49.000 Actually, during COVID, when edicts were done in Germany, it was straight from the centralized government.
00:07:54.000 No, it's like they did not have provinces.
00:07:56.000 Like, Bavaria did not have a different COVID policy than, you know, Berlin.
00:08:01.000 They didn't have...
00:08:02.000 In America, COVID was a great example of why we have decentralized states.
00:08:08.000 States were able to make different decisions.
00:08:10.000 California lost their mind.
00:08:11.000 I don't disagree with you on this.
00:08:12.000 I love our country.
00:08:13.000 What I'm saying is...
00:08:14.000 You haven't addressed why somebody in Wyoming should matter more on the electoral college basis than me in Texas.
00:08:21.000 It makes no sense.
00:08:22.000 I reject the framing.
00:08:23.000 One person, one vote.
00:08:24.000 No, it's never been that way, though.
00:08:26.000 Not in presidential elections.
00:08:28.000 Okay.
00:08:28.000 No, it's not.
00:08:29.000 One person, one vote is a majoritarian democracy.
00:08:31.000 Okay.
00:08:32.000 Instead, it's the states get appropriated.
00:08:35.000 But you haven't told me why that's better.
00:08:36.000 You've told me that- I'm attempting to.
00:08:39.000 As I said, we're a bottom-up government, not a top-down government.
00:08:41.000 It decentralizes power.
00:08:43.000 It also requires leaders, as I've said, to hear the needs, wants, and concerns.
00:08:47.000 We're not going to agree here, and that's fine.
00:08:49.000 So I'll give you an image.
00:08:51.000 Unfortunately, I can't show you the image right now, but you can look it up.
00:08:54.000 Somebody made this image of what the electoral map could look like if the Electoral College was abolished.
00:09:01.000 You would have two blue dots, one around New York, And one around the west coast of California.
00:09:06.000 The entire rest of the map of the United States of America...
00:09:09.000 I'm from Texas.
00:09:10.000 I can assure you there would be several blue blots there.
00:09:12.000 But I'm saying that in theory, you could have an election where it would just be those two blue blots and the rest of the entire map is red, and you would still have an outcome where you would have a blue president of the United States.
00:09:23.000 Yes.
00:09:23.000 And it could be in reverse too.
00:09:25.000 And so the answer is that would feel unjust for a lot of those other states that deserve to actually be respected as states in the union.
00:09:31.000 We have the Senate and the House for the same reason that we have the Electoral College.
00:09:35.000 We need to balance the way in which those sovereign states are still a part of the union.
00:09:38.000 I know you may not find that persuasive.
00:09:40.000 That's the reason.
00:09:41.000 But if you convince other people across the country, you'd be able to overturn it in a constitutional amendment.
00:09:45.000 It's just that that hasn't happened in the first 240 years of our constitutional founding.
00:09:49.000 Thank you very much.
00:09:50.000 Hi, Mr. Rumswami.
00:09:51.000 Hi, Mr. Kirk.
00:09:53.000 So, my name is Brandon.
00:09:56.000 Oh, boy.
00:09:58.000 There's a lot of folk back there.
00:09:59.000 They don't like you very much.
00:10:01.000 We'll find out.
00:10:03.000 My main disagreement with you guys, at least in my opinion, would be I think you guys are a bit of isolationists.
00:10:09.000 Would you call yourselves isolationists?
00:10:11.000 I would not.
00:10:11.000 Would you, Charlie?
00:10:12.000 We're America first, not America only.
00:10:14.000 So, could you elaborate on that position?
00:10:15.000 I was about to.
00:10:16.000 Okay, sorry.
00:10:16.000 We're America first, but not America only.
00:10:19.000 And here's what that means.
00:10:20.000 I'm not an interventionist.
00:10:22.000 I think our foreign policy should reflect whatever best advances America's interests.
00:10:27.000 Now, I'll just summarize this in a punchline because we've got a lot of questions to get to.
00:10:30.000 Is it in America's interest to provide protection and security guarantees to allies?
00:10:37.000 It often is.
00:10:38.000 But I have one rule of thumb.
00:10:40.000 You've got to ask them to pay for it.
00:10:41.000 At least their fair share.
00:10:43.000 I'm against the nanny state domestically, but I've got to be consistent. 0.99
00:10:46.000 I'm against the nanny state internationally, too.
00:10:49.000 And I'll give you NATO as one example of that, all right?
00:10:52.000 Most of the countries in NATO do not pay for the minimum amount they've already agreed to pay in the Treaty of NATO, 2% of their GDP on military expense for their own national defense.
00:11:03.000 They're not doing it today.
00:11:05.000 Germany is arbitraging the United States of America. 0.69
00:11:07.000 And I think that's wrong.
00:11:08.000 And I think that Uncle Sam has become Uncle Sucker.
00:11:11.000 Uncle Sucker no more.
00:11:13.000 And you know what?
00:11:13.000 That's not just for the money.
00:11:15.000 People think I say this for the money.
00:11:16.000 The money matters.
00:11:17.000 We have $34 trillion in national debt.
00:11:19.000 It's going to fall on your generation's shoulder, heavier than that backpack you're wearing by the time you grow up.
00:11:23.000 I appreciate that.
00:11:23.000 So it's already heavy.
00:11:24.000 You're feeling the burden of it.
00:11:25.000 But it's not just for the money.
00:11:28.000 Other nations are more likely to start wars when they don't bear the full cost of those wars.
00:11:34.000 It's a concept that you call moral hazard in economics where you don't bear the full burden of the risks that you take.
00:11:41.000 So it's not just your taxpayer money.
00:11:43.000 It's not even me and Charlie would be long gone before most of you, okay?
00:11:45.000 It's your future money and your future national debt, but it's not just that.
00:11:49.000 It's more likely to drag you into a war because some other country doesn't have the incentive to bear the cost if the United States is subsidizing it.
00:11:56.000 That's my answer.
00:11:57.000 I'm America first.
00:11:59.000 I'm not an isolationist, but I do think that those who we support should pay their fair share, and that's not too much to ask.
00:12:06.000 Okay, so I would say it's very interesting that you say that because I am personally an interventionist.
00:12:11.000 I believe in the idea that we are the city on the hill, we're the beacon, we're also the world police, and in that role we should maintain a world that has Here's what I'll
00:12:42.000 say, a lot of Republicans Might agree with you, Charlie, and I don't.
00:12:49.000 I understand.
00:12:49.000 I understand, yeah.
00:12:50.000 Dick Cheney definitely agrees with you.
00:12:52.000 No, but really, I'm just curious.
00:12:54.000 Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, parts of Syria, Ukraine, do you think those are successes?
00:13:01.000 So I would say it would depend on how you grade a success, but I would say particularly Afghanistan.
00:13:08.000 Afghanistan is the key failing point. 1.00
00:13:10.000 Although Iraq is somewhat stable, it's kind of a moderate case.
00:13:14.000 It's controlled by Iraq.
00:13:14.000 Yeah, so it's moderate, right?
00:13:16.000 But for Afghanistan, that's the real failure. 0.53
00:13:19.000 And that's where I think the Biden administration really failed, and that that exit strategy was not operated poorly.
00:13:24.000 We shouldn't have left in the first place.
00:13:25.000 We should have made sure that the government was ready and willing to actually be able to take care of the people.
00:13:30.000 Let's see if we can agree on something.
00:13:31.000 If you had to choose, and you don't, but if you had to choose, should the American border matter more than wars abroad?
00:13:37.000 I would say it should matter as equal.
00:13:41.000 It should equal.
00:13:41.000 Really?
00:13:42.000 Yeah.
00:13:42.000 You think that our border should matter as much as something happening overseas?
00:13:45.000 I think our status as a world power, as the superpower of the world, is not just that we have borders here domestically, but we have borders abroad that are, I guess you could say, more ephemeral or whatever.
00:14:00.000 They are still—our border with Russia, for example, with NATO, that is still a border that we should be paying attention— We are.
00:14:09.000 I just believe that Germany needs to be paying more.
00:14:12.000 100%.
00:14:12.000 Yes, yes, yes.
00:14:13.000 So that's where I agree.
00:14:14.000 We probably want to go to the next question.
00:14:15.000 We could go all day on this.
00:14:16.000 We're pulling in.
00:14:17.000 We love this topic.
00:14:17.000 But I love you.
00:14:18.000 I mean, I had hope for you, Vivek.
00:14:20.000 But, like, I'm a Democrat personally, but, like, and I'm sorry, you know, whatever.
00:14:25.000 But I'm Catholic, and, you know, it's whatever.
00:14:27.000 But basically, I just think that you were so good.
00:14:30.000 Your foreign policy is what turned me off.
00:14:32.000 But I will say, as someone who is an interventionist, you have found your home.
00:14:36.000 The Democrat Party is the party of reckless war and invading foreign lands.
00:14:41.000 Hey, you know what?
00:14:41.000 And turning the back on the American people.
00:14:43.000 So you're right.
00:14:43.000 Hey, look, I'll take it.
00:14:45.000 He's a lot more honest than a lot of politicians.
00:14:46.000 No, no, no.
00:14:46.000 I'm not saying it sarcastically.
00:14:48.000 I mean, you're at home.
00:14:50.000 It's honest.
00:14:51.000 I'll be realistic.
00:14:53.000 I'm not going to lie.
00:14:54.000 Our party thinks Iraq was a mistake, Libya was a mistake, Syria was a mistake, Afghanistan was a mistake. 0.96
00:14:58.000 We're able to have a serious conversation because you're actually honest about it.
00:15:00.000 A lot of Republicans and Democrats try to pretend otherwise, and I appreciate the honesty.
00:15:03.000 Yeah, I think that's the main problem with politics.
00:15:05.000 Lack of honesty.
00:15:06.000 Thank you.
00:15:09.000 We love you guys.
00:15:10.000 We love you guys.
00:15:10.000 Thank you, man.
00:15:13.000 Hey, you said you disagree or you think the climate change agenda is a hoax.
00:15:17.000 I'd like to hear more about that and why.
00:15:19.000 Yeah, so there's...
00:15:20.000 Let me give you several different questions to answer because sometimes the media just mix them all up into one.
00:15:25.000 Question number one, are global surface temperatures going up?
00:15:27.000 Answer, yes.
00:15:28.000 Yes.
00:15:29.000 Number two, is that due to man-made causes less clear?
00:15:32.000 Which man-made causes is due to carbon dioxide?
00:15:35.000 Far from certain.
00:15:36.000 I can explain why.
00:15:37.000 It's only.04% of the atmosphere.
00:15:39.000 There's actually stronger arguments for H2O having more of a greenhouse effect than carbon dioxide.
00:15:43.000 But the most important question is the one that nobody's talking about.
00:15:47.000 Are we sure or do we have any evidence that those rising temperatures are bad for human beings?
00:15:53.000 Yes.
00:15:53.000 And the answer to that is no.
00:15:55.000 Dry areas are getting dry.
00:15:56.000 Wet areas are getting wet.
00:15:57.000 Let me ask you a quick question about the polar ice caps melting.
00:16:01.000 True or false?
00:16:04.000 The Antarctic ice coverage has gone up in the last hundred years.
00:16:08.000 False.
00:16:09.000 It's just a blatant factual.
00:16:11.000 I wrote an entire book about this coming out next week.
00:16:14.000 Antarctic ice coverage.
00:16:15.000 As you've seen polar ice caps melting in the Arctic, you've actually seen expansion of Antarctic ice coverage.
00:16:21.000 Now, here's a further fact.
00:16:22.000 Do more people die of cold temperatures or warm ones?
00:16:25.000 Cold temperatures.
00:16:26.000 Okay, how many more people die of cold temperatures than warm ones?
00:16:28.000 I can't tell you, but I know it's more cold temperatures.
00:16:30.000 It's about eight times as many people.
00:16:31.000 So for every one person who dies of a warm temperature, eight times as many people die of a cold temperature.
00:16:36.000 Is there more green surface area covering the earth today than there was a hundred years ago?
00:16:40.000 More or less today?
00:16:42.000 Less.
00:16:43.000 False.
00:16:43.000 There's actually more green surface area.
00:16:45.000 It's not even close.
00:16:46.000 I don't expect you to know all this because I write a book.
00:16:48.000 It's coming out next week.
00:16:49.000 I've researched this stuff.
00:16:50.000 I don't expect you to know this off the top of your head.
00:16:52.000 But the reason why is it was actually predictable.
00:16:55.000 Carbon dioxide is plant food.
00:16:58.000 And plants tend to grow in warmer atmospheres than in cooler ones.
00:17:02.000 So 40 years ago we used to teach kids in the country that deforestation was a main problem.
00:17:06.000 The reason that's disappeared is that we're not seeing deforestation as a problem.
00:17:09.000 We're seeing a greening effect from the planet.
00:17:12.000 And the thing they used to worry about 50 years ago back then was that we were actually going to die of an ice age because more human beings have died of ice ages than they've died from warm temperatures ever.
00:17:21.000 We're currently in an ice age.
00:17:23.000 Well, the reality is more people are dying as a consequence of that, so why on earth are we worried if global surface temperatures go up one degree over the next century?
00:17:31.000 That's really where the climate change agenda ends up being a hoax.
00:17:34.000 Here's another reason it's a hoax.
00:17:35.000 The very people who are most opposed to fossil fuels in the United States are also among those who are the biggest opponents to nuclear energy, the greatest form of carbon-free energy production known to mankind.
00:17:46.000 The very people who, like BlackRock, who have called for emissions caps in the United States at companies like Chevron are perfectly fine supporting greater emissions in places like China at companies like PetroChina.
00:17:58.000 When you're talking about actual global warming, it has no net effect if you burn it in the United States versus China.
00:18:05.000 China has burned more coal last year than they ever have in their history.
00:18:09.000 Well, we burned less coal than we ever did in our history.
00:18:12.000 So that's a hoax.
00:18:13.000 And who benefits from this hoax?
00:18:14.000 It's the CCP. China's laughing at us at every step of the way. 1.00
00:18:18.000 So you're saying we're not running out of fossil fuels?
00:18:19.000 I'm saying that we're not running out of fossil fuels.
00:18:21.000 Not even close.
00:18:21.000 We only discovered like 10% of fossil fuels.
00:18:25.000 And that's why the argument against fossil fuels in the 80s used to be that we're running out.
00:18:29.000 Now you don't actually hear that from popular science anymore because they realize they're actually finding more fossil fuels.
00:18:34.000 Now it's actually global warming has become the justification.
00:18:36.000 Let me just say a word about this.
00:18:37.000 We've got two questions on this.
00:18:38.000 So what's going on?
00:18:39.000 If they say it was ice age, now it's warming.
00:18:41.000 Before they said it's running out.
00:18:42.000 Now it's not that we're running out.
00:18:43.000 It's climate change.
00:18:43.000 What the heck's going on?
00:18:45.000 I think this has become a substitute for a modern religion. 0.64
00:18:48.000 I think at a moment where we stop believing in our country and believing in God, we start believing in this new climate God instead.
00:18:55.000 And, you know, every religion has this tradition of wearing a hair shirt or flogging yourself.
00:19:00.000 This is the modern secular version of flogging ourselves and apologizing for our success in the West while China's laughing at us every at every step of the way, catching up. 0.90
00:19:11.000 They have a word for this in China.
00:19:12.000 It's called baitsuo.
00:19:15.000 It doesn't apply to you and I, but it refers to literally progressive left white people in the United States.
00:19:20.000 And they use it to laugh at us.
00:19:22.000 And I do think that that's exactly what this climate change agenda is all about.
00:19:25.000 Thank you, my man.
00:19:26.000 I appreciate it.
00:19:27.000 Thank you.
00:19:28.000 Hey, guys.
00:19:30.000 So I'm a grad student here getting my master's in security intelligence to work in DC and finance and stuff like that.
00:19:35.000 So I have a question for you guys.
00:19:37.000 So across many of the sectors, I've noticed a lot of an increase in cyber attacks from nation states and other groups responsible of transnational crime.
00:19:44.000 How can the Trump administration help assist with that?
00:19:47.000 Because it's attacking our infrastructure of our hospitals, it's attacking our banking system, our ATM machines.
00:19:52.000 So I'd like to know, what do you think the good strategy is in mind for that and your guys personal thoughts on that?
00:19:57.000 I'll go quick on this so we can get another question.
00:19:59.000 Yeah, so we're really good at offensive cyber.
00:20:02.000 We're really bad at defensive cyber protection.
00:20:04.000 So the answer is actually we need greater training in the United States of America of people who actually have the talents required to power greater cybersecurity.
00:20:11.000 We're not doing that today.
00:20:13.000 When it relates to AI, so much focus on investing in new algorithms, not enough in actually applying AI. More of that focus in college education.
00:20:20.000 You've got to do a master's program.
00:20:21.000 Hopefully that's part of it right here at UPIT. It's a talent gap in the United States, and I think we can fix it.
00:20:26.000 Thank you, man.
00:20:26.000 Cool.
00:20:27.000 Yep.
00:20:28.000 Hi, guys.
00:20:28.000 I hope you guys are doing well.
00:20:29.000 So, yeah.
00:20:31.000 My question is that in today's political climate, do you guys believe that anyone can actually be truly centrist today?
00:20:37.000 In today's – centrist, like exactly like 50-50.
00:20:41.000 See, I don't like the word centrist.
00:20:42.000 I'll tell you why.
00:20:43.000 It assumes that there's two poles, that there's a left over here, there's a right over here, it's one axis, and then there's some middle.
00:20:48.000 I just don't think the political spectrum works that way, actually.
00:20:52.000 Just think about the things we talked about.
00:20:53.000 Foreign wars.
00:20:54.000 There's a bipartisan consensus in favor of him.
00:20:56.000 There's a bipartisan consensus against him.
00:20:57.000 Effects of mega money in politics.
00:20:59.000 There's one way.
00:20:59.000 There's the other way.
00:21:00.000 So I don't think it's just this, like, left, right, and then there's centrist.
00:21:03.000 I also think that centrism can be a fake kind of siren song where I don't want to unite just the people in front of the 30-yard line on each side and bring them in the middle, hold hands, and sing Kumbaya.
00:21:13.000 We want to unite.
00:21:14.000 I know Donald Trump wants this.
00:21:15.000 He wants to unite the whole country.
00:21:17.000 And I think that includes people who we deeply disagree with.
00:21:21.000 So I think what we have to embrace more of in the country is not pretending like we all agree on this narrow band of questions and ignore everybody else.
00:21:27.000 We disagree like hell, but we're still citizens of the same nation at the end of it.
00:21:31.000 What if they're not agreeing on one thing, but it's like you have the same amount of viewpoints that are economically left and economically right, and the same thing with social views.
00:21:39.000 You have just the same amount, like 50-50 amount.
00:21:42.000 What would you classify yourself then as, like, if you were having those viewpoints?
00:21:46.000 You know, I'm independent-minded, pro-American, free-thinking.
00:21:49.000 I mean, that's what our founding fathers were.
00:21:51.000 And I'm fine.
00:21:52.000 I mean, I think it's kind of cool.
00:21:53.000 If you're 18 or 19 or 20 years old and don't want to call yourself a Republican or Democrat, that's great.
00:21:58.000 Use your time to be unshackled.
00:22:00.000 I voted Libertarian in my first election when I was about 19 years old.
00:22:03.000 I was, you know, back in 2004. So do you think it's worth voting for a third-party candidate, then?
00:22:06.000 So I've...
00:22:08.000 I believe in pragmatism at this point in time.
00:22:10.000 If you're voting to make a point for yourself, that's one thing.
00:22:13.000 If you're voting to actually make for a better country, make the choice between the two candidates on the ballot.
00:22:18.000 Pick the one who you think is going to be better at sealing the border, growing the economy, staying out of World War III, and reviving national pride in this country.
00:22:25.000 Whoever you think that's going to be, vote for them and have a good sense of who that's going to be.
00:22:28.000 Thank you.
00:22:29.000 Thank you.
00:22:30.000 Okay.
00:22:31.000 Jeez Louise.
00:22:32.000 Try to talk right into the mic, please.
00:22:34.000 All righty.
00:22:36.000 Hey, Charlie.
00:22:37.000 How's your tea, first of all?
00:22:40.000 My tea?
00:22:40.000 Yes.
00:22:41.000 That's good.
00:22:41.000 Thank you.
00:22:42.000 All right.
00:22:42.000 So, first of all, I'd like to ask why you're spending your time debating college students instead of people who have similar media training or experience to you.
00:22:53.000 I mean...
00:22:53.000 It's already been asked.
00:22:54.000 Are you a voter?
00:22:55.000 I am.
00:22:56.000 Yeah.
00:22:56.000 We're talking to voters in the key state of Pennsylvania.
00:22:59.000 Should we not do that?
00:23:02.000 I mean, I'm fine with you doing that.
00:23:04.000 It just seems a little bit asymmetric.
00:23:05.000 Well, we want to win the election, right?
00:23:08.000 So do a lot of conservatives come to this campus?
00:23:11.000 Not really.
00:23:12.000 Well, that's why we're here.
00:23:13.000 Okay?
00:23:14.000 All right.
00:23:15.000 So if you want to talk about something else, you've both had conspiracy theorist Alex Jones on your podcast.
00:23:21.000 Charlie, you've had him at Turning Point Action.
00:23:23.000 Alex is great.
00:23:24.000 Yeah, Alex is great.
00:23:25.000 Okay.
00:23:25.000 So I have a couple of things that Alex has explicitly stated that he's believed.
00:23:29.000 That's going to be a waste of our time.
00:23:31.000 I'm not going to agree with everything he's ever said.
00:23:32.000 Okay, I'd like you to at least hear some of these.
00:23:35.000 He's a divinely inspired prophet in a battle against the literal devil, the evidence for which is that he knows when he wakes up on time.
00:23:41.000 I don't agree with that.
00:23:42.000 Can I just ask you a question?
00:23:43.000 Do you believe in talking to people who disagree with you or not?
00:23:47.000 I believe in talking to people who disagree with you.
00:23:49.000 You seem to think that he's enough of a, you know, paragon for the conservative cause to have him at your conference.
00:23:53.000 Hold on a second.
00:23:54.000 Alex Jones has been right about major issues for the last 20 years.
00:23:58.000 Jeffrey Epstein being number one.
00:24:00.000 For ten years, Alex Jones was saying that there is a child sex trafficking ring being run to an island in the Caribbean with very shady actors and people call them a conspiracy theorist.
00:24:12.000 Was Jeffrey Epstein a correct story that Alex Jones broke?
00:24:15.000 He didn't break it first.
00:24:17.000 Well, no.
00:24:17.000 He was way ahead of the curve.
00:24:19.000 Alex Jones was on the Jeffrey Epstein story for a decade.
00:24:22.000 Was he ahead of the curve with Sandy Hook?
00:24:24.000 No, I think that was the worst mistake of his career.
00:24:26.000 He also said so, by the way.
00:24:28.000 By the way, I'm not a defender of everything he's ever done.
00:24:30.000 Vivek, you've said that you've been sympathetic towards him about the Sandy Hook lawsuit and that he was being, quote, set up.
00:24:34.000 I actually challenged him on it.
00:24:36.000 The first time we sat down, I never met the guy who was in Texas.
00:24:39.000 I've listened to your debate.
00:24:40.000 You do not challenge him.
00:24:41.000 Actually, people should listen to the podcast I held with him.
00:24:43.000 The first time I ever met him, we're in Texas.
00:24:45.000 I said, what was going on with that?
00:24:46.000 He actually was surprised.
00:24:47.000 I expected him to be defensive.
00:24:48.000 He said, that was a big mistake I made.
00:24:50.000 Have you listened to his show after?
00:24:51.000 Because he's gone back on that.
00:24:52.000 He's still to this day claiming that it was a false flag.
00:24:55.000 When he visits Pittsburgh, ask him a question.
00:24:58.000 Yeah.
00:24:59.000 Okay?
00:24:59.000 All right.
00:25:00.000 I just believe, and I just think this is so important in our country right now more than ever.
00:25:03.000 If we have a chance of having a country left, we can't be a country that says, okay, here's people who have views that are far outside of what I disagree with, so I'm not going to talk to them.
00:25:12.000 It's part of what your first question was also, why is Charlie here?
00:25:14.000 We believe in open dialogue and open discourse.
00:25:17.000 I think that's how we're going to save the country.
00:25:18.000 And back when I was 18, this used to be a country where we could disagree like hell and still get together at the dinner table at the end of it.
00:25:26.000 That's America.
00:25:27.000 That's the essence of this country.
00:25:28.000 And I think I speak for all of us here when I say we hope to bring that back.
00:25:32.000 So bring that spirit back.
00:25:33.000 Disagree with us.
00:25:34.000 We'll take the next question.
00:25:36.000 I just got a quick question.
00:25:38.000 What are both of your stances on the legalization of marijuana and psychedelics?
00:25:43.000 I'm against it.
00:25:44.000 I don't know, Vivek's.
00:25:46.000 Yeah, so look, I think that right now, I think the federal drug enforcement agenda, I think, has been far overreaching.
00:25:54.000 And they've used it as a vehicle to advance other agendas.
00:25:57.000 Here's the next step I think we need.
00:25:59.000 Veterans access.
00:26:00.000 Let's just start with this as a next step.
00:26:02.000 Veterans who suffer from PTSD, I believe, do need access to ketamine, psilocybin, and ayahuasca, which should be reclassified in their scheduling for veterans with PTSD. I think that's a great next step to take.
00:26:16.000 I think that that is far better than the outcomes that we otherwise allow for veterans to suffer from addiction to fentanyl and worse, and I think that's a good next step in this conversation.
00:26:25.000 That's where I land.
00:26:26.000 Why are you so against the recreational use of it, though?
00:26:29.000 I mean, I haven't made that my top issue, right?
00:26:31.000 I mean, so against it.
00:26:32.000 But do I think that it has demonstrably poor effects in places like you could look at Seattle, you could look at Portland, even look at a city like Portland, thought this was a great idea?
00:26:40.000 Well, tried and practiced, didn't turn out to be such a great idea because there's deep structural issues for why actually people are turning to drugs that correlate with, I think, a lot of other behaviors that even cities like Portland have realized haven't gone well for them.
00:26:52.000 Okay.
00:26:52.000 So that's where I land on it.
00:26:53.000 Thank you.
00:26:54.000 Thank you.
00:26:55.000 Hi, nice meeting you guys.
00:26:57.000 I'm, like, not a Democrat.
00:26:58.000 I'm Green Party.
00:26:59.000 But anyways, do you support what Donald Trump says?
00:27:04.000 Or do you support what Israel is doing in Gaza right now?
00:27:08.000 Yes.
00:27:09.000 But they're killing a bunch of people and they're not going to achieve their goals.
00:27:14.000 By doing what they're doing in Gaza, they will be turning more people towards Hamas.
00:27:18.000 They're essentially making the Gazans hate them even more.
00:27:21.000 Well, they're engaged in a war because what happened on October 7th?
00:27:26.000 Yes, but Hamas was an organization that was brought up by Netanyahu.
00:27:31.000 Netanyahu personally funded Hamas.
00:27:33.000 No, it's not.
00:27:35.000 Hamas is a terrorist organization voted by the people of Gaza.
00:27:38.000 Gaza was controlled by Israel until, I think, 2004 or 2005?
00:27:42.000 2005. Yeah, okay, thank you.
00:27:44.000 2005. And so Hamas was not funded by Netanyahu.
00:27:48.000 I see no evidence.
00:27:49.000 If that's correct, I'll...
00:27:50.000 I mean, New York Times even has, like, stuff on it, but...
00:27:53.000 Yeah, I'm sure they're right.
00:27:55.000 Netanyahu has said that he funds Hamas as, like, a counterbalance against...
00:27:59.000 Let's try to find a common ground here.
00:28:01.000 Do you agree that the Jewish people have a right to a homeland?
00:28:04.000 Oh, yes, of course.
00:28:05.000 Okay, great.
00:28:05.000 No, that's a big deal.
00:28:06.000 Because Hamas doesn't believe that.
00:28:08.000 Yeah, but I don't agree with Hamas.
00:28:10.000 I'm just...
00:28:10.000 No, no, no, I know, but what I'm saying though is that we must start from first principles on the Israel question.
00:28:15.000 Number one, that the Jewish people have a right to a homeland.
00:28:18.000 Yes.
00:28:18.000 Number two, what is Israel?
00:28:22.000 I mean, it's a country.
00:28:24.000 I know, but that's important.
00:28:26.000 Does it include Judea-Samaria?
00:28:28.000 Does it include the Golan Heights?
00:28:30.000 Does it include Gaza?
00:28:32.000 I'm not putting you on the spot here because I don't expect you to know the geopolitics of it.
00:28:35.000 Those are the two first principle questions.
00:28:37.000 Do the Jews have a right to their ancestral homeland, yes or no? 0.76
00:28:40.000 And then number two, what is that homeland and what are the borders that define it?
00:28:44.000 Those are the only two important questions that explain the Israel conflict.
00:28:48.000 Vivek, do you want to chip in?
00:28:49.000 Yeah, look, I think that...
00:28:52.000 I look at this from an American perspective.
00:28:54.000 And if what happened on October 7th happened in our country, I think we would defend, I would not want any other country telling us in the United States of America what we can or cannot do.
00:29:05.000 It's not been consistent.
00:29:06.000 I think Israel is a sovereign nation that has a right and a responsibility to defend its sovereignty to the fullest.
00:29:13.000 One of the beauties of Israel is they actually have diverse debates.
00:29:16.000 You look at their own government, they have a lot of divisions just like we do here.
00:29:19.000 But it's up to us to allow Israel to self-determine its own right course of action without meddling.
00:29:26.000 That's what we're seeing happen there through open debate in a democratic country, and that's what I support.
00:29:30.000 I mean, we're responding to both points.
00:29:31.000 Like, the Jews have a right to their own country, but when they create Israel, they should not have driven out the Palestinians who were originally living there.
00:29:39.000 They should have made a nation living side-by-side with them.
00:29:41.000 I'm responding to the point about October 7th.
00:29:44.000 Like, it was bad, and Hamas is a terrorist organization, but Israel, what they're doing to the Palestinians is what made Hamas so powerful. 0.61
00:29:53.000 And Netanyahu personally have...
00:29:55.000 He has supported Hamas against the Palestinian Authority as a counterbalance.
00:30:00.000 Yeah, we're not going to agree.
00:30:01.000 Thank you very much.
00:30:02.000 Yep.
00:30:03.000 I mean, free Palestine.
00:30:05.000 Okay.
00:30:05.000 Yeah.
00:30:06.000 So I agree with you all that, like, we have a lack of open discourse and debate in our society.
00:30:10.000 That's a real big problem, especially with, like, misinformation plaguing our social media, right?
00:30:15.000 Sorry about that.
00:30:17.000 So my question is, do you really believe, right, like, that the best way to have this open discourse with voters, like you said, in response to one else's question, is in a format like this, you know, where, you know, us college students don't have the time to be prepared or have as much time to prepare on these topics.
00:30:31.000 Therefore, we aren't able to have, like, rigorous intellectual discussion with you, especially when, in the end, when you aren't defending your arguments against the best versions of your opposition's arguments, we have no reason to, like, believe that your case is true.
00:30:43.000 So I'll tell you, it's all of the above.
00:30:46.000 I'm having a debate with John Bolton at another college campus, and he's a Republican but has different views than me on foreign policy.
00:30:53.000 We do rallies with—these guys fill up audiences of tens of thousands of people who talk to people who agree with us.
00:30:58.000 I went to places like Harvard and Yale, not exactly bastions of conservatism.
00:31:02.000 I'll tell you, I got a better education because I was surrounded by people who challenged my own views.
00:31:08.000 And I think that's missing on college campuses today.
00:31:10.000 And so our hope, I know Charlie's hope, he's doing a great job of it traveling the country, is to make sure college is too expensive already.
00:31:17.000 But you might as well at least get your money's worth by having your views challenged.
00:31:20.000 And so is that good for the country?
00:31:21.000 You're darn right it is, especially ahead of an election.
00:31:23.000 We need to talk to each other more in the country.
00:31:26.000 And you know what?
00:31:27.000 I'm not letting you off the hook so easily.
00:31:29.000 We're also here because we expect more of you.
00:31:31.000 We expect more.
00:31:32.000 We should expect more of each other.
00:31:33.000 It's not that, oh, I'm this college student.
00:31:35.000 I don't really understand everything.
00:31:37.000 No.
00:31:37.000 You actually have your parents.
00:31:39.000 Can I ask a follow-up, please?
00:31:40.000 And so that I think is a good thing, and we want to challenge each other to be the best version of ourselves.
00:31:44.000 Yeah.
00:31:44.000 So yeah, basically, my stance is that, like, in order to engage with you in a fruitful discussion, which I think is important, right, for our society, that I should at least be given, like, for example, not me personally, but, like, me as in college students, should be given, like, an equal amount of time to prepare and be, like, prepared for this engagement, right?
00:31:59.000 Like, your whole job is, like, knowing about these things and researching them.
00:32:02.000 We have classes to study for, right?
00:32:04.000 So for example, why don't you – to engage with voters.
00:32:07.000 I agree that you maybe engage with intellectual experts somewhere else, but engage with college students on a more even playing field.
00:32:14.000 Reach out to, for example, colleges debate teams.
00:32:17.000 They're political organizations because I was never reached out to personally, and I'm the captain of the Seumers debate team.
00:32:22.000 And I believe that we do have responsibility to know better, right?
00:32:25.000 And I would have liked the opportunity to engage with you in a more deeper, meaningful way and maybe a more structured debate format.
00:32:32.000 So I think like in the future, it would be more fruitful for everyone if you reach out to those organizations.
00:32:36.000 It's a good point, but would you agree at least having this is better than not speaking at all?
00:32:39.000 Yeah, but I don't think those are the two options.
00:32:41.000 You have many more options, and you have many more resources.
00:32:43.000 You can do a lot more, and I think the only reason you do stuff like this is for the soundboard.
00:32:48.000 Thanks so much.
00:32:49.000 Last question coming up.
00:32:50.000 Make it a disagreement and make it good.
00:32:53.000 Disagreement and make it good.
00:32:56.000 Hi guys, thank you for coming today.
00:32:58.000 So my question is, you know, I feel like a lot of topics that are discussed today are very tired.
00:33:02.000 Not that they're unimportant, but a lot of key issues go neglected, especially in politics.
00:33:06.000 So my question is regarding the health of the nation.
00:33:10.000 RFK's slogan recently is make America healthy again.
00:33:13.000 We have poisoned essentially our population with processed foods and seed oils in the rise.
00:33:17.000 Cancer cases are on the rise.
00:33:18.000 This is no secret.
00:33:20.000 But the issue is that starvation was an issue decades ago, and now it's not an issue, but at what cost?
00:33:25.000 So processed foods, and we can grow food very rapidly, but at what cost?
00:33:28.000 We're poisoning our nation.
00:33:29.000 My question is, how do you sustainably make the country healthy again?
00:33:35.000 Yes, I agree.
00:33:36.000 We're going to end in a disagreement.
00:33:37.000 End the lobbying.
00:33:38.000 That's the number one answer.
00:33:40.000 If you've been an elected official, you should not be able to be a lobbyist for at least 10 years after you've left elected office.
00:33:45.000 We're going to help the health of this country.
00:33:46.000 Thank you.
00:33:47.000 Thank you.
00:33:47.000 I will say, I will direct you last evening, actually, before I took a red-eye flight.
00:33:52.000 We had RFK for an hour and a half event.
00:33:54.000 I encourage you to watch that.
00:33:55.000 All about the Maha agenda. 0.74
00:33:57.000 So, thank you.
00:33:59.000 Let's take a solid disagreement and then we've got to roll.
00:34:02.000 Is this a disagreement?
00:34:03.000 Yes, sir.
00:34:03.000 So the state of Alaska has had since 1976 its Alaska Permanent Fund.
00:34:08.000 Yeah, which is essentially a UBI.
00:34:10.000 Since Alaska's UBI has been so progressive and so able to provide over $1,800 to every Alaskan citizen annually, as well as providing extra funding for roads, for education, for infrastructure around the state, would you be in support of a measure similar to that using the United States' advanced economic resources to would you be in support of a measure similar to that using the United States' advanced economic resources to provide the No, and you know that's a natural resource-based UBI. I do, yeah.
00:34:37.000 It's oil-based.
00:34:38.000 Got it.
00:34:38.000 So, which I always find interesting.
00:34:40.000 No, no, I principally am against UBI. What are your thoughts about that?
00:34:43.000 I'm against it, too.
00:34:44.000 I think it's—what I find interesting about it is at least it's outside of the box.
00:34:47.000 It forces people to think.
00:34:48.000 It hasn't— America First-like character to it.
00:34:52.000 And it's been widely supported by the Alaskan people.
00:34:54.000 To say that actually, you'd rather give it to Americans than give it to some Ukrainian bureaucrat or something like that. 0.69
00:34:59.000 But I think part of the reason I'm against it is we need to revive a culture of self-determination and hard work in this country.
00:35:06.000 Right, and oil production in Alaska is based on Alaskan citizens' work.
00:35:09.000 It's returning some of their money back to them.
00:35:11.000 Which is very different from a national context of universal basic income.
00:35:14.000 It's not, because we've been using the same United States' domestic national resources and returning some of that profit to its citizens.
00:35:20.000 Here's what I'll say in closing, and that wasn't really even a disagreement.
00:35:23.000 It was an idea.
00:35:23.000 We're going to stay for one more disagreement, then we've got to go.
00:35:27.000 It is an interesting idea, but it increases dependence on the state, and I do think that that dependence is something that has actually been bad for the psychology of countless workers across the country.
00:35:36.000 It moves people's tax money back to them.
00:35:37.000 Wouldn't you agree that's a benefit?
00:35:39.000 Well, no, it's not a refund.
00:35:43.000 It's extracting value from a separate pool and giving it to citizens.
00:35:47.000 Right.
00:35:48.000 You're right.
00:35:48.000 It is popular.
00:35:48.000 A separate pool that the people fund through their labor.
00:35:51.000 Well, not everybody in Alaska works in the oil rigs.
00:35:54.000 That's true.
00:35:55.000 Right.
00:35:55.000 Reward the people who do.
00:35:57.000 Exactly.
00:35:58.000 Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
00:35:59.000 Email us, as always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
00:36:01.000 Thanks so much for listening, and God bless.