The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #1327 - Mike Baker

00:00:01.000 Boom, boom, boom What's happening, brother?

00:00:04.000 How are you?

00:00:05.000 How you doing, man?

00:00:05.000 What's cracking?

00:00:06.000 It's good to be back.

00:00:07.000 Good to be back.

00:00:07.000 Good to see you.

00:00:08.000 This place is always amazing.

00:00:09.000 It's like a little...

00:00:10.000 It's a bit of an amusement park almost now.

00:00:13.000 Yeah.

00:00:13.000 With stuff to see and the gym equipment and everything.

00:00:16.000 I keep thinking I should just bring my gear over and work out before the show or after the show, but...

00:00:20.000 Get loose. 0.72

00:00:20.000 I don't want to embarrass myself. 0.72

00:00:22.000 He wouldn't embarrass yourself.

00:00:23.000 I'm not going to watch.

00:00:24.000 You want to watch you work out?

00:00:26.000 He would.

00:00:27.000 He would.

00:00:27.000 Jamie's that kind of guy.

00:00:28.000 Yeah, I've seen him give me side eye.

00:00:30.000 He would give you side eye.

00:00:32.000 But no, thank you.

00:00:33.000 Yeah, it's all good.

00:00:34.000 Everything's good.

00:00:35.000 I've been traveling a lot.

00:00:36.000 We just talked before we started about Idaho.

00:00:38.000 I haven't had a chance to get back there.

00:00:40.000 But yeah, all good.

00:00:42.000 All good.

00:00:42.000 So you're around for a television show?

00:00:44.000 Is that what you're doing?

00:00:45.000 Yeah, there's several meetings going on here, but we just finished...

00:00:51.000 It's a filming show, a reality show, for, can I say the network?

00:00:57.000 They're kind of hinky until we get closer to the air date, which is October, but it's for the Discovery Network, and it's going to be a great show that I'm hosting.

00:01:07.000 Why do they not want you to say the name?

00:01:07.000 Well, you know what?

00:01:08.000 That's what I always thought.

00:01:09.000 I always thought free publicity is a good thing.

00:01:11.000 But they're very tight on the marketing protocols.

00:01:15.000 And so they want to make sure they've got it all buttoned up.

00:01:17.000 And I get that, right?

00:01:18.000 They spend a lot of money on these things. 1.00

00:01:20.000 Fucking control freaks. 1.00

00:01:21.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:01:22.000 And so anyway, but it's going to be a great show.

00:01:24.000 We spent the past three or four months filming it around the country.

00:01:30.000 Really good production team.

00:01:31.000 And the stories are fantastic.

00:01:33.000 It's basically looking at...

00:01:35.000 I guess I'm talking about it.

00:01:36.000 I'm not supposed to.

00:01:37.000 But we're looking at military government organizations that are typically in the shadows.

00:01:44.000 We're not releasing any sources and methods.

00:01:46.000 We're not disclosing any classified secrets.

00:01:48.000 We're talking about elements and units, operational activity, events that before now have pretty much been in the shadows and some incredible people.

00:01:58.000 That's one of the best parts about this thing. 0.95

00:01:59.000 It's been going out there and meeting some of these guys that are doing some of this high-speed shit. 0.98

00:02:02.000 And it's pretty amazing.

00:02:05.000 When they do release things, like, long, long after, like, I was reading something, I forget what the case was about, but it was something about how the files won't be released under the Freedom of Information Act until 2080. How do you...

00:02:21.000 Yeah, I know.

00:02:22.000 How do they make that?

00:02:24.000 That was the thing with the Kennedy assassination, right?

00:02:26.000 And sometimes they roll it over and it's not even then, right?

00:02:28.000 So sometimes they extend that.

00:02:31.000 Other times they don't.

00:02:32.000 And so some information comes to light periodically.

00:02:36.000 And so this does look at, this show will be looking at some historic, but a lot of current things that are going on and where the money goes.

00:02:43.000 What are we spending our money on when it comes to this high-speed operations that the Special Forces and others are involved in?

00:02:48.000 Yeah.

00:02:49.000 So it'll be very good.

00:02:51.000 I was lucky to be able to work with, again, some really great people on the production side, but just also going out there and meeting some of these cats. 0.99

00:02:59.000 The shit that they do, even after being around a while, as I have... 0.99

00:03:06.000 It just amazes me. 1.00

00:03:07.000 Well, it's got to be constantly accelerating, too, right?

00:03:10.000 They're constantly coming up with new and spectacular things that nobody knows about until they employ them.

00:03:16.000 Right. 1.00

00:03:16.000 And sometimes that shit stays on the shelf, right? 1.00

00:03:19.000 It was like the running joke at the agency at the CIA was, you know, we have a fantastic S&T group, a science and technology group. 1.00

00:03:26.000 And they're the ones responsible, like Q from Bond, right?

00:03:29.000 They're the ones responsible for developing all the gear.

00:03:33.000 Responding to specific operational requirements.

00:03:35.000 How are we going to do this particular thing?

00:03:36.000 Well, let's develop a piece of kit that's going to allow us to do it. 0.94

00:03:39.000 But the running joke is always that, you know, they'll develop it and they'll show it to you before an operation, but then they'll put it back on the shelf because they don't want that shit getting out there, right, and people finding out that they've got it.

00:03:49.000 So they'll give you like a 20-year-old piece of kit to use instead, and you'll be walking around with like a phone the size of a brick. 0.56

00:03:56.000 Knowing that they've got something high speed on the shelf.

00:03:58.000 Well, that's what everybody always thinks.

00:04:00.000 Like, when you talk to the average Joe on the street about technology and the government, there was like, dude, the stuff they have that they probably don't tell us about.

00:04:08.000 How much of that is real?

00:04:09.000 Yeah, it's pretty real. 0.99

00:04:12.000 Have you seen some stuff that made you go, holy shit, they can do that? 0.99

00:04:16.000 Yes. 0.99

00:04:17.000 Really?

00:04:17.000 Yeah.

00:04:18.000 How much can you tell us?

00:04:20.000 Well, you know what?

00:04:21.000 One thing that they're doing, and this is actually something I wanted to talk about today, because it's going to affect everybody.

00:04:27.000 It's not just something that's going to affect people in the military or in the intelligence community.

00:04:33.000 But one of the things that they've been working on is, imagine you've got a...

00:04:37.000 You've got to rock up on a target.

00:04:39.000 But before you do that, before you get the customers on site and you're going to hopefully obtain some high-value targets there at that location, before you do that, you've got to...

00:04:49.000 Why are you talking like euphemisms?

00:04:50.000 Oh, I'm sorry.

00:04:51.000 Before you're going to nuke people.

00:04:52.000 Yeah, before you're going to go in there.

00:04:53.000 You're going to blow terrorists into another dimension.

00:04:56.000 Well, sometimes, you know, you...

00:04:57.000 Okay, actually, I was going to say, sometimes you want to actually capture them and get their intelligence.

00:05:00.000 We've gone past that, right?

00:05:01.000 Because the years where we were getting our ass kicked for holding on to people in detention facilities, you know what that did? 0.97

00:05:08.000 That pretty much convinced everybody that was involved in this to just whack them, right? 0.95

00:05:13.000 Because then you don't have to deal with the aftermath.

00:05:14.000 You don't have to worry about, are you going to get in trouble for interrogating somebody?

00:05:18.000 Right, exactly.

00:05:19.000 So that actually increased the lethality of operations. 0.68

00:05:22.000 You started painting targets and just blowing the shit out of there rather than trying to grab the target and get their intel.

00:05:27.000 That's a problem because then the pipeline dries up for the intel. 0.91

00:05:30.000 But anyway, so imagine you've got this site.

00:05:33.000 The first thing you've got to do is determine if your target's there.

00:05:36.000 And it's not like the Tom Clancy movies where... 0.97

00:05:39.000 You're looking through walls and all this shit. 0.90

00:05:41.000 That technology, night vision devices and that ability in low light conditions to monitor and to identify specific individuals. 0.97

00:05:52.000 It has always been a problem.

00:05:54.000 They've made great strides on it to the point now where in no light conditions, with the right stack database, with the right information in that database, meaning the right amount of information about individuals.

00:06:07.000 You're constantly populating this database with new faces or with new photographs of individuals that you're going after.

00:06:14.000 With enough of that to sift through, They're getting to the point now with no light conditions that they can identify positively the targets in that room or the targets in that facility or in that building, whatever it might be.

00:06:27.000 And that's pretty incredible.

00:06:29.000 I read that they can identify people by their heart rate.

00:06:33.000 Well, not just their heart rate, but other bio data, right?

00:06:38.000 But they can literally, with video, somehow or another, they can zoom in on you with some scanner and recognize that this is a particular individual because of their heart rate.

00:06:49.000 There was an article that was written about it, and I know that there's a company...

00:06:53.000 Do you know what HEX is?

00:06:54.000 H-E-C-S? It's a company that's been used pretty extensively by the scuba diving community and now by the hunting community as well because it blocks the electrical signal that your body gives off.

00:07:14.000 Okay, yeah, that makes sense.

00:07:16.000 And I think they're doing work with the military as well to develop suits that will somehow or another stop someone from being able to recognize your particular heart rate.

00:07:26.000 Right, and it does a lot of work on what they call sort of the universal soldier.

00:07:30.000 Yeah, there it is.

00:07:30.000 Pentagon has a laser that can identify people from a distance by their heartbeat.

00:07:34.000 It's a fucking laser. 0.99

00:07:35.000 It helps if you have other data points, right? 0.99

00:07:38.000 But this is all part of, to some degree, what they refer to as the universal soldier, right?

00:07:44.000 The fighter of tomorrow.

00:07:47.000 Jean-Claude Van Damme. 1.00

00:07:48.000 Remember that shit? 1.00

00:07:49.000 That's right. 1.00

00:07:50.000 Remember that?

00:07:50.000 Yeah.

00:07:52.000 Who doesn't remember Sean?

00:07:53.000 Dolph Lundgren.

00:07:54.000 He's doing, like, chip commercials now.

00:07:56.000 Is he?

00:07:56.000 Sure.

00:07:57.000 You haven't seen him at Doritos or whatever.

00:07:59.000 Dude, 70. He's still doing the splits.

00:08:02.000 Props.

00:08:03.000 I don't know when that becomes useful, though, really.

00:08:05.000 The splits?

00:08:05.000 The splits.

00:08:06.000 I mean, I've never actually felt that that was something I needed to accomplish in any given moment from an operational perspective.

00:08:12.000 If you're doing karate movies where you have to do the splits, it's very important.

00:08:15.000 It's true.

00:08:16.000 So the Universal Soldier thing where you're...

00:08:22.000 You know, it's an exoskeleton.

00:08:24.000 It's a soft suit.

00:08:25.000 It's all the data that you can acquire for that warfighter.

00:08:29.000 How do you create the perfect environment on that individual as he's moving through an environment to, you know, be a more efficient, effective, lethal fighter?

00:08:38.000 And, you know, things like that, identifying target, whether it's with a laser, whether it's with low light or no light conditions where you can, as you're rocking up on the target, you can do that.

00:08:48.000 All these things, you know, the ability to carry more gear, right?

00:08:53.000 Hump it another extra, you know, 10 kilometers, whatever it might be.

00:08:57.000 It's pretty incredible what they're doing.

00:08:59.000 And it's a joint.

00:09:00.000 It's not just the military.

00:09:01.000 They're working with, you know, companies like HECS or they're working with the commercial sector and academics too.

00:09:09.000 But anyway, I don't know.

00:09:11.000 I'm disappearing down a rabbit hole.

00:09:13.000 The idea of this universal soldier thing.

00:09:16.000 Have you been paying attention to this Elon Musk Neuralink thing that he's coming out with?

00:09:21.000 Where they're going to somehow or another insert fibers into your brain and then have a Bluetooth enabled device that you wear that's going to allow you to somehow or another interface with data at a much higher bandwidth. 0.97

00:09:34.000 I don't know what the fuck any of those words mean I just said. 0.96

00:09:37.000 But that was good though. 0.99

00:09:38.000 It sounded like you understood it.

00:09:40.000 That's my trick.

00:09:42.000 I'll repeat words.

00:09:43.000 Yeah, you know, there comes a point.

00:09:46.000 If you're talking about, I mean, that's going into a different area.

00:09:49.000 That's going into civilian applications.

00:09:52.000 But I think the military application would be great for that, too.

00:09:55.000 Everyone could synchronize data.

00:09:56.000 You could give them...

00:09:57.000 Navigation in their head, like if there's some sort of augmented reality where you could literally see the targets in front of you.

00:10:04.000 If you had a map, say if the Pentagon really does have this laser beam, they could identify specific individuals, and you have a map of a building that's in your head.

00:10:13.000 Right.

00:10:29.000 Right.

00:10:29.000 But there does become a problem then.

00:10:31.000 There becomes a problem of information overload.

00:10:34.000 And when you get into that situation, right, everything starts to close down a little bit, right?

00:10:39.000 Sure.

00:10:40.000 And so you've got to start pushing some of that away.

00:10:43.000 And now what you end up doing is you get the offsite command center relaying some of that information as needed.

00:10:50.000 But that guy that's about to breach that door, he doesn't want a lot of data points anymore.

00:10:55.000 Now, having said that, knowing where the hostiles are on the other side of that door, that is key information.

00:11:01.000 That's not rocket science.

00:11:02.000 But there's a lot that's going on.

00:11:04.000 There's also the ability to monitor health of the individual soldiers that are out there through the gear that they would then be wearing.

00:11:12.000 It's an incredible effort that has been going on.

00:11:15.000 And so to answer your point, a long rambling answer, yeah, I've seen some things that are pretty amazing.

00:11:20.000 You can't talk about it, though.

00:11:22.000 No, no. 0.92

00:11:23.000 Some of this shit actually we'll get into with the new show that's coming up sometime in fall. 0.95

00:11:28.000 I don't have a release date, and again, I'm prescribed from talking about it, so I won't do that because I pay attention. 0.84

00:11:33.000 So some of the things that you saw, you'll be able to talk about.

00:11:36.000 Yes.

00:11:37.000 So how does the government do that?

00:11:38.000 They just decide, well, listen, it's not a bad thing if you tell people about this.

00:11:42.000 I think that's right.

00:11:43.000 Yeah.

00:11:43.000 Well, I think there's an element of – some of it's not what you would refer to as classified.

00:11:49.000 It's just not readily available public information, and it's not out there in the domain because people aren't aware of it or searching for it.

00:11:56.000 Some of it does – I think you're right.

00:11:57.000 Some of it is – look, the military wants to say at times – Look what we're able to do.

00:12:02.000 We're doing this – and oftentimes it's because it's in a sort of a private-public cooperation.

00:12:09.000 And so that encourages other companies with innovative technologies to step forward and get involved in some of this.

00:12:17.000 And I guess that opens up all sorts of other – some people are out there saying, well, they shouldn't be working with the military. 0.99

00:12:21.000 Well, fuck that. 0.99

00:12:23.000 Well, that's a question that I had. 0.99

00:12:24.000 This brings me to a point that I think is kind of important where people – We always talk about the military budget and how high the military budget is.

00:12:34.000 We need to take some of that money and put it in other places.

00:12:37.000 Maybe some of that military money is not being used for the best good of the human race.

00:12:44.000 Maybe.

00:12:45.000 Maybe some of it.

00:12:45.000 But in order to be able to develop stuff that keeps people safer, in order to develop all the stuff that you're talking about that could potentially save the lives of Soldiers and even innocent civilians because you're going to be able to target the correct people.

00:13:02.000 All this stuff seems pretty critical, right?

00:13:05.000 Right.

00:13:05.000 And it's also, there's an upside if you want to get moralistic about the whole thing to developing advanced technologies.

00:13:13.000 You can be more surgical, right?

00:13:15.000 The drone capability, as an example, gives you a much better understanding of your target.

00:13:20.000 You can avoid the collateral damage, you know, the deaths of civilians on site.

00:13:38.000 Like what?

00:13:42.000 Battery technology, anybody walking around with a pacemaker or a defibrillator, you know, in part can thank the agency because what were they doing?

00:13:49.000 They were working, they continue to work on battery technology, shrinking those batteries as a power source, what, initially operational purposes so you could, you know, put a transmitter out some site, you know, and, you know, so what are you doing?

00:14:03.000 You're eavesdropping on a hostile target or, you know, gathering intelligence.

00:14:08.000 But then that effort, all that work that was done, then that later on benefits the general public.

00:14:15.000 Drone technology, same thing, right?

00:14:16.000 I mean, the agency was front and center on developing drone capability.

00:14:20.000 Now what are you doing?

00:14:21.000 You're doing that for environmental concerns, for mining?

00:14:27.000 I'm a little concerned about drone technology. 0.97

00:14:29.000 My old house that I used to live at, this motherfucker that lived down the street from me used to hover a drone over my house and film. 1.00

00:14:37.000 I know he's looking at me. 0.99

00:14:39.000 What are you doing? 1.00

00:14:39.000 Do you watch me swimming, you fucking weirdo? 1.00

00:14:41.000 Did you ever go over and talk to him? 1.00

00:14:42.000 No.

00:14:43.000 No.

00:14:44.000 Should have sent a drone over his house.

00:14:46.000 Yeah.

00:14:46.000 I was thinking of shooting it down, but it's hard to aim up.

00:14:52.000 Nowadays?

00:14:53.000 With a bow and arrow.

00:14:54.000 That'd be a hell of a shot.

00:14:55.000 If you have a good bow, like, see, the way you calculate accuracy with archery is you have a rangefinder, and that rangefinder has built-in adjustments for angle.

00:15:10.000 There's angle compensation for up or for down.

00:15:12.000 But I don't know if it has it for straight up in the air.

00:15:14.000 Because you've got to think, you're judging how much an arrow is going to drop over the course of the flight.

00:15:21.000 Right.

00:15:22.000 Same with the bullet.

00:15:24.000 But with the bullet, obviously, there's less compensation because it's much faster.

00:15:29.000 But there's a video that's hilarious of this guy who got tired of this block party in Brazil.

00:15:36.000 So he loaded up a drone filled with fireworks, and he hovered it over the block party and started launching bottle rockets down on these guys that are making too much noise.

00:15:49.000 What?

00:15:49.000 That's excellent, though.

00:15:50.000 I mean, if you think, but that sounds like something one of my boys would do.

00:15:52.000 Right.

00:15:53.000 And I'm sure they'll be listening to this at some point, so they're going to do this.

00:15:57.000 Yeah, Scooter, Sluggo, and Mugsy.

00:15:59.000 When you have a kid named Sluggo or Mugsy or Scooter, guaranteed they're going to do something like that.

00:16:03.000 They're going to do something like that, yeah.

00:16:04.000 Did you think of that when you were naming your kids?

00:16:07.000 I didn't.

00:16:07.000 No, it didn't occur to me.

00:16:09.000 It didn't occur to me, although I wanted to give them...

00:16:11.000 You should have named him Eugene or something.

00:16:11.000 I wanted to give him...

00:16:12.000 Eugene?

00:16:13.000 Eugene.

00:16:14.000 Eugene.

00:16:14.000 I wanted to give them flat tops, right?

00:16:16.000 Every summer I have the same discussion with my wife, who's the world's greatest person.

00:16:20.000 I wanted to give them flat tops.

00:16:22.000 And she always says, look, with names like Scooter, Slug, or Mugsy, you give them a flat top as well, then that's it.

00:16:28.000 They're on a database.

00:16:29.000 Exactly.

00:16:30.000 They're going somewhere.

00:16:31.000 But the best way to take down a drone is just blanket it, jam it, and drop it.

00:16:37.000 How do you do that?

00:16:37.000 Well, it's like...

00:16:40.000 You know, it's like the old days of jamming a radio signal basically, right?

00:16:43.000 You're interrupting, you're blanketing it, you're interrupting the data communication from the controller to the drone.

00:16:49.000 And like the drone that was taken down in the Iranian drone that we took down.

00:16:55.000 I think it was the USS Boxer was involved in that out there in the strait.

00:17:01.000 That's how they do it.

00:17:02.000 They don't fire a missile at it anymore.

00:17:03.000 It's much more effective.

00:17:05.000 They just shoot something at it that disrupts the signal?

00:17:07.000 Right.

00:17:07.000 It's essentially, again, not to oversimplify, it's just jamming.

00:17:11.000 But is that jamming technology available to civilians?

00:17:16.000 To really, really smart civilians, I guess.

00:17:19.000 It could be.

00:17:19.000 Really smart civilians would probably be able to figure that stuff out.

00:17:22.000 Jamie?

00:17:22.000 Know anybody?

00:17:24.000 Let's work on that.

00:17:25.000 I'm looking.

00:17:26.000 I'm going to find something real quick.

00:17:28.000 So, yeah, Scooter was just out at West Point.

00:17:33.000 He wants to go to West Point when he's old enough.

00:17:36.000 And so he went out there for a lacrosse program.

00:17:38.000 And I'd forgotten.

00:17:39.000 Have you been to West Point?

00:17:40.000 No.

00:17:41.000 You've got to go.

00:17:42.000 I know it's a ways away from here.

00:17:44.000 It's not a day trip.

00:17:45.000 But it's a beautiful campus.

00:17:48.000 And I'd forgotten about that.

00:17:49.000 Obviously, it's got to...

00:17:50.000 Is that where Jody Foster was in Silence of the Lambs?

00:17:53.000 Was she?

00:17:54.000 West Point?

00:17:55.000 I don't know.

00:17:55.000 That didn't sound right.

00:17:57.000 I don't think so.

00:17:59.000 Drone Kill Gun.

00:18:01.000 Wow.

00:18:02.000 That's crazy.

00:18:03.000 Mark III. Yes, of course.

00:18:05.000 The Mark III. Lightweight, compact, drone countermeasure.

00:18:08.000 Drone Gun 3000. Jamie, order me one of those immediately on Amazon, please.

00:18:13.000 Yeah, that would have taken care of this guy.

00:18:17.000 Yeah, but the problem is it's not as satisfying as a bow and arrow.

00:18:20.000 Yes, that's a good point.

00:18:22.000 That's a good point.

00:18:23.000 So one of the things I want to – I don't know how we – it's not a smooth segue, but we were talking a bit about technology.

00:18:30.000 Technology is – particularly with the 2020 election coming up is this idea of deep fakes.

00:18:38.000 Fantastic stuff.

00:18:40.000 And – The technology to create this nowadays, to create a deepfake, which essentially just means you're doctoring a photo or video and making it do what you want it to do to try to convince people of whatever it is.

00:18:56.000 Technology is advancing and it's stunning what can be done.

00:19:01.000 Do you know who Kyle Dunnigan is?

00:19:02.000 Kyle Dunnigan?

00:19:03.000 I should know.

00:19:03.000 Hilarious stand-up comedian, but he shines in doing deepfakes.

00:19:09.000 And he's working with this other guy.

00:19:10.000 I think the guy's called Dr. Fakenstein or the Fakening.

00:19:13.000 Is it the Fakening?

00:19:14.000 Yeah, two separate guys, but yeah.

00:19:15.000 Yeah, one of those guys.

00:19:16.000 But go to his Instagram and see the new one that he did with Elon Musk.

00:19:20.000 He was doing them really kind of crudely with like face, you know...

00:19:24.000 Face swap or face...

00:19:25.000 Yeah, it's like a little filter that you get for Snapchat or something like that or Instagram.

00:19:29.000 But now he's moved from that to doing this really high-end stuff.

00:19:33.000 Go to the Elon Musk one.

00:19:34.000 Look at this.

00:19:36.000 Play this.

00:19:36.000 Dr. Fakenstein did this.

00:19:52.000 Pretty soon you will become a baby again and be sucked back into your mother's vagina. 1.00

00:19:58.000 Okay, now pause. 1.00

00:19:59.000 Now go to another Kyle Donegan video so he can tell what Kyle really looks like.

00:20:04.000 That's him to the right of that. 0.99

00:20:05.000 This is what he really looks like, which is fucking madness. 0.98

00:20:10.000 The guy's hilarious, by the way. 0.97

00:20:12.000 He's an awesome guy, too.

00:20:13.000 And he's got a great Instagram page, but his Instagram page is mostly him, like the Goldboom.

00:20:19.000 So the Goldboom one is... 0.66

00:20:20.000 Click on that, because that's a normal one.

00:20:22.000 This is one he did with the filters without Dr. Fakenstein.

00:20:25.000 Look at that.

00:20:25.000 See how it's kind of creepy, fake?

00:20:26.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:20:27.000 But play that. 0.89

00:20:28.000 So...

00:20:29.000 Ellen DeGenosaurus seems friendly, but don't get too close to her. 1.00

00:20:35.000 She'll bite your fucking head off. 1.00

00:20:37.000 Just ask the Porsche Raptor. 1.00

00:20:41.000 Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

00:20:43.000 And that's Ray Liotta.

00:20:47.000 Ray Liot is always smoking.

00:20:49.000 Yeah.

00:20:50.000 Although he gave it up.

00:20:51.000 I remember.

00:20:52.000 But in the videos, he's always smoking.

00:20:54.000 But look, it's bad enough that it's extra hilarious because it's bad.

00:20:58.000 But the new one that he did with Elon Musk is not bad.

00:21:02.000 It's too good.

00:21:03.000 It's not bad.

00:21:03.000 Look at the Caitlyn Jenner one.

00:21:04.000 Go to that Caitlyn Jenner one on the far right. 1.00

00:21:06.000 That's fucking genius. 0.99

00:21:07.000 Click on this one. 1.00

00:21:09.000 I have something serious to tell you.

00:21:11.000 When you had your surgery years ago, I buried your old face in a pet cemetery by accident, and I'm sorry to say it's back!

00:21:20.000 Yum yum!

00:21:21.000 Ah, there it is!

00:21:22.000 Get down, Kylie! 1.00

00:21:25.000 Okay.

00:21:26.000 See, but those are my favorites.

00:21:29.000 He has the Kardashians, the only way they talk, they just say yum yum.

00:21:34.000 Yeah.

00:21:34.000 And then he knows what they're saying, sort of like Groot in Guardians of the Galaxy.

00:21:39.000 Oh, God.

00:21:40.000 I don't know how I miss these things. 0.99

00:21:42.000 I'm clearly watching the wrong shit on the internet. 0.95

00:21:45.000 Well, you're a former CIA guy. 0.99

00:21:47.000 I should know this stuff.

00:21:48.000 You're doing important things.

00:21:49.000 You don't have time for Kyle Duncan.

00:21:51.000 Well, but this...

00:21:52.000 But what you just shown, I mean, people look at that and they go, okay.

00:21:56.000 But you're right, the Elon Musk thing is getting closer to the bone.

00:21:59.000 That one's creepy.

00:21:59.000 That could be a real guy.

00:22:00.000 But you could have someone like that say, give me a million dollars or I'll bull your house up. 1.00

00:22:05.000 Or just come on.

00:22:06.000 And imagine if he gave some off-the-cuff financial data on Tesla.

00:22:13.000 Talked about it as if he'd just come out of a shareholder call and now he was releasing some information.

00:22:17.000 I mean, think about what that means to all of a sudden the stock price of a company if that happens.

00:22:23.000 The quality is so far beyond even that now that it can be done by, and we're talking mostly state actors like Russia, and so the problem we're facing now is it's not just, everybody's kind of aware of, you know, sort of the tweeter-verse or whatever,

00:22:39.000 Twitter, and the trolls that exist on there and the bots and all of that, but it's the video, the ability to do the video.

00:22:46.000 They released one, one was done not too long ago with Nancy Pelosi, And all it did was slow down her speech, just slightly, but just enough to make it sound as if she was slurring her words.

00:22:59.000 Maybe she'd had a couple of drinks.

00:23:00.000 And that thing was blasted all over social media.

00:23:03.000 And people to this day still think, and they still talk about it, like, you know, she's kind of losing it a little bit.

00:23:07.000 Right.

00:23:08.000 I'd like her more, by the way, if she did that.

00:23:10.000 Yeah, I think she might make a little more sense.

00:23:12.000 Yeah, just get a little lightened up, lady. 1.00

00:23:14.000 You're worth $100 million and no one knows why.

00:23:17.000 You should be out there partying.

00:23:19.000 I'm sure it was all...

00:23:20.000 Oh, so legit.

00:23:21.000 She earned that $100 million. 0.99

00:23:24.000 For sure.

00:23:25.000 There's definitely no shenanigans, no legal shenanigans.

00:23:29.000 No, there's nothing like that happening up on Capitol Hill.

00:23:34.000 It's something that people should watch.

00:23:36.000 It's something that people should read up on a little bit, look at it, because the technology is advancing so quickly that the effort to combat it, the effort to detect it, and there are some companies out there, and certainly the government, Is working to do that.

00:23:48.000 DARPA and some others are working.

00:23:50.000 But the effort to try to identify doctored videos, right, particularly when you're talking about elections, campaigns, it's going to be an increasing problem that we're not really discussing that much.

00:24:05.000 Congress is paying a little bit of attention to it right now, but it's really problematic.

00:24:11.000 And there's things that...

00:24:17.000 We're good to go.

00:24:37.000 You know, at such a pace that they're getting ahead of that.

00:24:40.000 So, I mean, it's fascinating.

00:24:42.000 Anyway, they're coming up with ways to try to counter it, but I guess the biggest point is, it sounds like a public service announcement, is people need to be aware of it.

00:24:50.000 And they need to be smart about, of course they won't be.

00:24:54.000 Everybody goes to the internet and they lose their minds and they believe whatever it is that they read that agrees with their opinion.

00:24:59.000 And there's no bothering of checking, you know, whether anything is actually legit anymore or not.

00:25:06.000 But that would be my one piece of advice.

00:25:09.000 Going into 2020, starting now, pay attention.

00:25:12.000 Don't believe anything you see until you prove it.

00:25:14.000 And that's part of the problem, too, right?

00:25:15.000 We stop believing anything we see.

00:25:17.000 Right, but if I was a skeptical person...

00:25:19.000 Right.

00:25:20.000 If I was a conspiracy-minded individual, I'd say, hmm, this guy, who used to work for the CIA, is telling us not to believe the news.

00:25:28.000 Wait!

00:25:28.000 I see what you're saying.

00:25:29.000 What I'm saying is, you're setting us up.

00:25:32.000 Okay, well, it's time for me to go.

00:25:35.000 Look at that.

00:25:36.000 Wouldn't a normal, skeptical person want to think, like, why is he telling us that?

00:25:40.000 I guess I'm saying it wrong, because you're right.

00:25:43.000 I don't mean to imply...

00:25:46.000 I guess what I'm saying is trust but verify, right?

00:25:49.000 When you're looking at video of a candidate or you're looking at anything really on the internet now, just be aware of the capabilities.

00:25:57.000 Maybe that's a better way of putting all of this because you're right.

00:26:00.000 Part of the problem and one of the things that Russia does and others who are involved in this whole propaganda effort One of the things they do want to do is undermine our confidence, obviously, in media.

00:26:10.000 So by me saying, don't believe what you see, I'm kind of feeding into that.

00:26:13.000 So you're right.

00:26:14.000 I shouldn't go that route.

00:26:16.000 Be aware of what the capabilities are.

00:26:18.000 Pay attention.

00:26:19.000 Everybody should just be a little bit smarter about what they're doing.

00:26:22.000 That's all I'm saying.

00:26:23.000 So, and also, what we're looking at now is so much more powerful than what we had three or four years ago.

00:26:31.000 I mean, three or four years ago, this technology was not available for the consumer, but now it is.

00:26:35.000 Well, there was – I mean, to think about it – not to get too deep, but if you think about the – Photography.

00:26:43.000 How long has photography been around?

00:26:44.000 There have been efforts to manipulate photography, right?

00:26:47.000 Sure.

00:26:47.000 So altering photographs has been around almost as long as the medium itself.

00:26:52.000 You go to Photoshop, that kind of put it all in the hands of the consumer, you know.

00:27:01.000 What you were talking about, FaceSwap, the new Face app to age people.

00:27:06.000 All these things make it easier for whoever's got a smartphone to try to do this.

00:27:10.000 And that's a problem as well.

00:27:12.000 But one of the things you really have to worry about is, again, sort of the state actors, like a Russia.

00:27:17.000 Well, Russia was behind the FaceSwap thing. 0.66

00:27:20.000 Yeah, and that's a good point.

00:27:22.000 There are Russian companies that are pushing this technology out there.

00:27:27.000 And what are they doing?

00:27:28.000 Every time you do that, it's recording data about you.

00:27:31.000 Well, not only that, you have to give your name and your email to get that application.

00:27:37.000 And then they have a photo of your face that correlates with your name and your email.

00:27:41.000 So what they've done is they've gathered up more than 150 million emails.

00:27:46.000 Yeah.

00:28:03.000 Well, Russia managed to do that with 150 million people in a very, very short amount of time just by making something cute.

00:28:10.000 Oh, let's see what I look like when I'm 100. Now, what do you think they're doing with that data?

00:28:14.000 They're slicing and dicing this, trying to understand the American electorate, right?

00:28:18.000 They're not going to stop doing what they did.

00:28:20.000 And they've been doing this forever.

00:28:21.000 We talked about this before.

00:28:22.000 They've been doing this since the 1940s, right?

00:28:24.000 Busy trying to keep the U.S. out of World War II before they broke up with the Nazis. 0.55

00:28:29.000 It was a serious breakup.

00:28:31.000 But when they were still aligned, they were busy paying off journalists and buying trade unions and all the rest of it.

00:28:37.000 So they're never going to stop what they do because it's worked for them and it's just kind of in their DNA. But isn't that also what the United States does as well?

00:28:45.000 There's got to be some sort of...

00:28:47.000 Counterintelligence stuff that we do that is sort of shady.

00:28:51.000 Well, I don't know about shady, but...

00:28:53.000 Justifiably shady.

00:28:55.000 How about that?

00:28:56.000 I like that.

00:28:56.000 Okay, that's a good term.

00:28:58.000 Yeah, of course there is.

00:28:58.000 And people always do that.

00:29:00.000 When I'm talking about...

00:29:01.000 If I'm giving a talk about...

00:29:03.000 The Chinese government's constant theft of intellectual property.

00:29:07.000 Somebody inevitably will come up afterwards and they will kind of roll their eyes and go, well, we do it.

00:29:12.000 It's not like it's just them.

00:29:14.000 The U.S. is guilty of it, too.

00:29:15.000 Well, you damn well better hope we are, right? 0.99

00:29:17.000 Because if we backed off and said, you know what, just for the sake of being a righteous individual, we're not going to do any of this shit. 1.00

00:29:25.000 You would have to be willfully ignorant and naive or just fucking stupid to think that Russia, China, these other actors out there are going to stop also. 1.00

00:29:33.000 We're all going to hold hands and unicorns are going to be flying out of our ass. 1.00

00:29:36.000 It's not going to happen. 0.97

00:29:36.000 So, yeah, I mean, I guess the answer to that is always the same, which is, yeah, you better hope we do it, and you better hope we do it well. 0.97

00:29:43.000 Yeah, but people are nervous about that, right?

00:29:45.000 This is my point about the military budget. 0.99

00:29:47.000 If you just cut the military entirely, well, we're all going to start speaking Chinese because some shit's going to go down. 0.99

00:29:53.000 You can't just cut the military budget. 0.99

00:29:56.000 You can't.

00:29:57.000 I mean, just cut it out.

00:29:59.000 No military at all.

00:30:01.000 We're going to focus on ourselves. 0.99

00:30:03.000 Well, good fucking luck with that. 0.99

00:30:04.000 That doesn't work. 0.98

00:30:05.000 So the question is, like, how much money should you spend on the military?

00:30:08.000 How much money should you spend on counterintelligence?

00:30:10.000 How much money should you spend on propaganda?

00:30:13.000 I mean, there should be some money spent on propaganda overseas, right?

00:30:17.000 Because we're trying to manipulate them the way they're trying to manipulate us.

00:30:20.000 The idea, though, is that...

00:30:22.000 We're America.

00:30:23.000 We're nice.

00:30:24.000 We're the good guys.

00:30:25.000 We're doing it the right way, supposedly.

00:30:27.000 Yeah, well, there is that.

00:30:29.000 Right, there is that, and you know what?

00:30:30.000 Honestly, I'll be honest with you, I've always, you know, maybe I'm naive or whatever, but that was always my thought process.

00:30:37.000 Me too.

00:30:38.000 You know, when we're out there in the operational world, and you think, you know what?

00:30:40.000 Okay, we're doing this, but we're doing it for the right reason.

00:30:43.000 And people laugh at that or whatever, but, you know...

00:30:46.000 This is my phone.

00:30:48.000 I'll look at that.

00:30:48.000 See that flag?

00:30:49.000 Long male wave.

00:30:50.000 That's how I... When I open up my phone, the flag waves at me.

00:30:54.000 Yeah.

00:30:54.000 I got a flag behind me.

00:30:55.000 I'm 100% pro-America.

00:30:56.000 I got...

00:30:57.000 I open up my phone and...

00:30:58.000 We like to think...

00:30:59.000 You know what I got?

00:30:59.000 I got nothing.

00:31:00.000 I got nothing.

00:31:01.000 I got icons or whatever.

00:31:02.000 You got an old phone, too.

00:31:03.000 Is that some sort of, like, hack-free...

00:31:05.000 iPhone from the 60s?

00:31:06.000 This is actually a wind-up phone.

00:31:09.000 I'm surprised you don't have a flip phone.

00:31:11.000 I do have a flip phone.

00:31:12.000 Oh, there you go.

00:31:13.000 Do you?

00:31:14.000 I've got a collection of phones going all the way back to the cinder block phone.

00:31:20.000 Remember that one? 0.99

00:31:21.000 I bet you have phones with Saudi Arabian numbers on them and shit. 1.00

00:31:25.000 Letters. 0.99

00:31:26.000 I assumed everybody does.

00:31:30.000 Do they give you phones that are hack-proof?

00:31:34.000 Or do they tell you there's phones that you can't use?

00:31:36.000 Well, yeah.

00:31:37.000 You certainly know that from an operational perspective, phones are not a good idea.

00:31:43.000 Now, the problem is they're ubiquitous and everybody uses them and it's made life very easy.

00:31:49.000 It's also made life a little bit less secure, obviously.

00:31:53.000 I know a guy that has, let's just say, done some very unusual journalism.

00:31:59.000 And he still has a phone that you can take the batteries out.

00:32:02.000 Because he said there's some places where you go where they will not let you in the room if you have a phone.

00:32:08.000 And so the workaround is he has an older Samsung phone where you can pop the back off and remove the battery.

00:32:16.000 And that's the only way...

00:32:18.000 Yeah, I mean, that's, you know, I would still argue there's workarounds on that one.

00:32:23.000 I would imagine.

00:32:24.000 So, yeah.

00:32:24.000 But, yeah, you know, that's why when you go into a government facility, you know, they go at a skiff, you know, you got to leave your phones outside.

00:32:32.000 Yeah, in a lead box, right?

00:32:33.000 Yeah, right.

00:32:33.000 So you don't carry your phones in, you know, unless you're, what was her name that was doing that, walking into...

00:32:39.000 Oh, the fucking chick from The Apprentice. 1.00

00:32:41.000 Yeah, that's... 1.00

00:32:41.000 Omarosa, that's right. 1.00

00:32:43.000 How hilarious is that?

00:32:44.000 By the way, I know her.

00:32:46.000 I did Fear Factor with her.

00:32:47.000 Oh, okay.

00:32:48.000 She was on Fear Factor.

00:32:49.000 She told me I was drunk because I was making fun of her.

00:32:51.000 She's like, you're drunk.

00:32:52.000 I'm like, no, I'm not drunk.

00:32:53.000 I'm just making fun of you.

00:32:55.000 Yeah, why wouldn't you?

00:32:56.000 But she's an unusual person.

00:32:58.000 The fact that she thought it was okay to do what is basically treasonous.

00:33:04.000 She was recording these conversations inside the White House and then releasing them to the press.

00:33:11.000 How is she not in jail?

00:33:13.000 How does that work?

00:33:14.000 Yeah, I'm not quite sure.

00:33:14.000 I didn't quite understand how you get around that, right?

00:33:17.000 Because you've got obligations, you've signed paperwork, you do all these things that say, I'm going to do the right thing.

00:33:21.000 And if you run foul of that, then you're supposed to suffer the consequences.

00:33:25.000 And occasionally it seems like people aren't.

00:33:28.000 I had a guess.

00:33:29.000 Want to know what I think?

00:33:30.000 What? 0.99

00:33:30.000 I think she saw some shit, and they pulled her aside, and they said, listen, I'm real sorry. 0.99

00:33:33.000 I know that you're some sort of a social climber or whatever you're trying to do here. 0.99

00:33:38.000 But listen, what you did will literally get you locked in jail for the rest of your life.

00:33:43.000 So how about this? 0.91

00:33:45.000 How about you just shut your pie hole and we'll just let this slide.

00:33:50.000 Yeah, I don't know that she's—I don't think anybody would—I mean, from an intelligence perspective, she'd be one of the last people you would trust to actually keep her mouth shut over any period of time. 0.92

00:33:58.000 That's what I'm saying.

00:33:59.000 Yeah, that's a tough one.

00:34:01.000 But that was—that's also part of the issue of leaks, as an example, right?

00:34:07.000 It's the issue of choices that you make for your cabinet as well, right?

00:34:11.000 Yeah.

00:34:11.000 Well, that's true.

00:34:12.000 Yeah.

00:34:12.000 Or the close circle around you.

00:34:15.000 And that's, you know, again, you can argue, I mean, I don't want to get into a political discussion.

00:34:19.000 Trump is an unusual character.

00:34:21.000 You think?

00:34:22.000 Yeah, I know.

00:34:23.000 Wow.

00:34:23.000 Wow, that's going to be, that'll be headlines.

00:34:26.000 How about that fellow that's from England that looks like the British?

00:34:28.000 Yeah, Boris Johnson.

00:34:29.000 Yeah, Boris Johnson.

00:34:31.000 I was just there last week when he went over to Buckingham Palace and, you know, was asked by the Queen to form the new government and he accepted.

00:34:39.000 He's an interesting character.

00:34:41.000 He went to Eaton.

00:34:41.000 He went to Oxford.

00:34:43.000 He's proven himself to be extremely adept at getting elected.

00:34:50.000 Most importantly, he looks like Trump's baby brother.

00:34:53.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:34:54.000 He looks like his fucked up brother. 1.00

00:34:55.000 Like Trump's dad went over to England and banged some waitress and bam. 1.00

00:35:01.000 Next thing you know, look at the two of them together. 1.00

00:35:03.000 Get the fuck out of here. 0.99

00:35:05.000 A buddy of mine sent me this one. 0.99

00:35:10.000 It's a South Park one.

00:35:11.000 It's him with a bike helmet on.

00:35:14.000 That's the best side-by-side I've seen so far.

00:35:16.000 That's good, but this one's better.

00:35:16.000 This one's better.

00:35:17.000 Oh, yeah, yeah.

00:35:18.000 I mean, it literally looks like a young...

00:35:22.000 Trump cousin or brother or something like that.

00:35:24.000 But he's promised they're out as far as Brexit goes by Halloween, by 31 October.

00:35:30.000 They're done.

00:35:31.000 So they're done with the whole European Union.

00:35:34.000 Well, that's what they're saying.

00:35:35.000 Basically, now what they're concerned about, of course, is it's a hard exit, right?

00:35:40.000 No deal.

00:35:41.000 But he's saying it doesn't matter.

00:35:42.000 If that's the case, then that's what we've got to do.

00:35:44.000 And there's a lot of people.

00:35:45.000 It's interesting.

00:35:46.000 The dynamic is a little bit like here in the U.S. If you're in the Northeast Corridor, Washington, New York, whatever, Boston, or you're out here on the West Coast, you tend to view the world differently than everything else, the rest of the mass of the country, which is why people lost their minds and they thought,

00:36:03.000 how could Trump possibly get elected?

00:36:06.000 The UK is a little bit like that.

00:36:08.000 That Brexit vote came around, and everybody in London was convinced that it's going to be 95%, we're not leaving.

00:36:14.000 And so when it came time and they voted to leave in 2016, the people in London lost their minds. 0.99

00:36:21.000 They couldn't believe it, and they still to this day think everybody else is just an idiot, right? 0.99

00:36:25.000 So there's similarities there, which is I think why in part Trump feels sort of this kinship with Boris Johnson. 0.99

00:36:31.000 But yeah, so he's – Boris Johnson has said, that's it.

00:36:34.000 We're out of here.

00:36:35.000 Maybe we can get a deal.

00:36:36.000 If we can't, it doesn't matter.

00:36:37.000 We're still leaving.

00:36:38.000 And it'll be interesting to see what happens.

00:36:40.000 But he's not unpopular.

00:36:45.000 What's the argument for them leaving?

00:36:47.000 What's the pro-Brexit argument?

00:36:50.000 Do you really want to have your country, your sovereign nation, run by a bunch of faceless technocrats living in Brussels who have really zero interest in your sovereign nation?

00:37:01.000 That's at the heart of it.

00:37:02.000 It's not an economic decision.

00:37:03.000 People always make that problem with Brexit.

00:37:06.000 They always say, well, from an economic perspective, this is not a good thing.

00:37:08.000 Well, the deal at heart isn't an economic concern.

00:37:12.000 It's the issue of sovereignty.

00:37:15.000 It's the issue of being run, again, by Brussels.

00:37:18.000 And sort of this morass of regulations that they've imposed, the inability for the UK to make their own decisions about trade.

00:37:27.000 And so there's a good argument in that regard.

00:37:32.000 Is it going to be a financial problem for them?

00:37:34.000 It's not going to be a disaster like some people throw out there and say, oh my god, this is going to – The UK is going down the toilet fast.

00:37:41.000 That won't happen, but there'll be an upheaval if they leave without a deal.

00:37:46.000 But they'll adjust, because people want to do deals, right?

00:37:49.000 They want to do trade.

00:37:50.000 It's not like Germany and France, which are the only two partners in the EU that really matter.

00:37:55.000 How dare you?

00:37:56.000 I know.

00:37:56.000 I can't believe I just said that.

00:37:57.000 So what's the staying in the European Union argument?

00:38:03.000 Show everybody not racist?

00:38:05.000 Yeah, global, globalism.

00:38:08.000 We're all working together, and isn't this a wonderful thing?

00:38:11.000 And look at all the benefits of it, free movement.

00:38:14.000 And that free movement didn't really work that well from France and Germany's perspective.

00:38:19.000 They don't like to talk about that anymore.

00:38:21.000 Free movement is basically what we enjoy in the United States, though, isn't it?

00:38:24.000 I mean, if you look at the United States in relative size in comparison to Europe, we're basically commensurate, right?

00:38:30.000 In terms of the contiguous United States.

00:38:33.000 Exactly.

00:38:34.000 The size of it.

00:38:34.000 And then we all speak the same language, but...

00:38:37.000 I'm talking about immigration policies.

00:38:39.000 I'm not talking about movement within the EU. No, no, I understand.

00:38:41.000 But I mean, even in immigration, right?

00:38:44.000 Like the size of these countries in comparison to the size of states. 0.98

00:38:47.000 Like Texas is basically bigger than a lot of fucking European nations, right? 0.98

00:38:51.000 Yeah, yeah. 0.99

00:38:52.000 It is...

00:38:55.000 That argument, sort of the immigration argument, much like some of the other arguments, comes down from the UK's perspective on...

00:39:02.000 Don't tell us what to do.

00:39:04.000 And maybe there's still an element of, look, we were an empire that controlled most of the planet for a while.

00:39:10.000 We'd like to have a little bit more say in what we're doing.

00:39:14.000 So there's an independent streak.

00:39:15.000 The problem is, from EU's perspective, is if they do leave and it's not a disaster, then other countries are going to line up.

00:39:22.000 And Italy, maybe, would be the next one.

00:39:25.000 So it'll be interesting to see what happens.

00:39:27.000 But yeah, Bojo, as they call him, is an interesting cat, not unlike Our president.

00:39:33.000 Well, in this country, we don't pay attention to other countries.

00:39:36.000 So when we see that guy, like, who's that guy?

00:39:39.000 This new guy?

00:39:41.000 Where did he come from?

00:39:42.000 Like, is this real?

00:39:43.000 It's like a new character on a show that you don't watch.

00:39:45.000 Right, right.

00:39:46.000 You know?

00:39:46.000 What season did he come in?

00:39:48.000 Better Call Saul, season four. 1.00

00:39:50.000 Like, who the fuck is that guy? 0.99

00:39:51.000 Oh, that's the new bad guy. 1.00

00:39:52.000 Ah, I didn't watch.

00:39:54.000 I have been watching.

00:39:55.000 I just finished re-watching.

00:39:56.000 I do that.

00:39:57.000 Instead of watching new shows, I end up re-watching shows that I really liked, that I've watched before, and it's been a while, so I re-watched the first season of Breaking Bad again. 0.97

00:40:04.000 Goddamn, a good show. 0.99

00:40:05.000 Holy shit, that was so well done. 1.00

00:40:07.000 And just that first season, if that's all people watch and they haven't seen it before, it's so good. 0.99

00:40:12.000 And then I just binge-watched the first season of The Sopranos again.

00:40:16.000 That's a great show.

00:40:17.000 That was the first show that really, in my mind, it created the first real anti-hero that everybody actually appreciated on television.

00:40:26.000 Everybody loved Tony Soprano. 1.00

00:40:28.000 He's a fucking murderer, constantly cheated on his wife, strangled his best friend. 1.00

00:40:31.000 He's like, I'd like him. 1.00

00:40:33.000 Yeah, he's an interesting cat.

00:40:35.000 Well, it was that dynamic with his mother, right?

00:40:38.000 That's what the hook was.

00:40:39.000 And certainly that first season was just that...

00:40:41.000 That was fascinating to people.

00:40:43.000 And still is.

00:40:44.000 Speaking of deep fakes, remember when they tried to bring the mom back after she died? 0.95

00:40:48.000 Like the shitty CGI? Yeah. 0.95

00:40:50.000 Yeah.

00:40:50.000 That's what shows you, like, 2005 CGI. It was goddamn terrible.

00:40:54.000 Yeah. 0.97

00:40:55.000 Well, if you think about when Photoshop – Photoshop was out in, what, the early 90s, I guess.

00:40:59.000 Late 80s, early 90s.

00:41:01.000 Think about where we've come since then.

00:41:06.000 Again, not to go back into sort of this whole thing with deepfakes. 1.00

00:41:11.000 But it is – when people talk about Russia collusion and they talk about – we kind of lost our way, right?

00:41:18.000 And everybody's kind of guilty of it, whether it's Mueller and his investigative team or whether it's Congress or whether it's just the general public.

00:41:24.000 We all kind of lost our way over the past couple of years, imagining somehow that the big story here was – Trump's collusion, right?

00:41:32.000 Well, that was a political dodge, right?

00:41:34.000 That was a shell game that was being played on us.

00:41:37.000 It was the big story is what did Russia specifically do, right?

00:41:42.000 What exactly did they do?

00:41:44.000 How did they do it?

00:41:45.000 How successful were they?

00:41:46.000 Show us some case studies of specific examples.

00:41:49.000 That's what an investigative team should have been doing for two years.

00:41:52.000 And then deliver that information and keep throwing it out at the public and keep talking to the public about it.

00:41:59.000 I guarantee you, the GRU and others, the FSU and the Intel services in Russia, they're happy that we didn't do that, right?

00:42:09.000 Because, again, they've been advancing.

00:42:11.000 They've been improving their capabilities.

00:42:13.000 They're going to do it again. 0.99

00:42:14.000 So I guess that's why I keep beating on this is that I don't think we really focused our attention where we needed to because we all get lost in this political bullshit. 0.97

00:42:22.000 Well, I feel like this is the most easily manipulated we've ever been as a culture. 0.96

00:42:29.000 I think it's so easy to spin these narratives and to get people upset about anything.

00:42:35.000 I feel like a lot of these are test cases.

00:42:39.000 They're trying to see what happens when we spin up this story.

00:42:42.000 How outraged do they get at that story?

00:42:45.000 Well, look at the issue of racism.

00:42:48.000 I mean, that thing gets thrown out there now to the point where it's, you know, I hate to say it, but it's almost losing its meaning in a sense, right?

00:42:56.000 They just keep hammering away. 0.88

00:42:58.000 Anybody they disagree with, and I'm talking about the hard left progressives, You're a racist, right?

00:43:04.000 It's not possible you could possibly disagree on policy, right?

00:43:07.000 Like the, whatever, that's a squad, you know, AOC and her compadres. 1.00

00:43:12.000 I don't give a shit about, you know, where they're from. 0.99

00:43:15.000 I care about the fact that their policies, from my perspective, other people I'm sure love them, you know, are screwed up. 0.99

00:43:20.000 What's screwed up about their policies? 0.84

00:43:22.000 Well...

00:43:24.000 I'm not a democratic socialist, right?

00:43:27.000 So I have a problem with everything from you look at the Green New Deal, right? 1.00

00:43:34.000 And this idea that we're going to roll this out and fuck the economic impact. 0.94

00:43:39.000 I don't think you've even thought about the economic impact. 0.97

00:43:42.000 I think what they're doing is they're playing to a base, and they're doing it successfully.

00:43:48.000 And people hear about it, and everybody wants to be righteous.

00:43:51.000 Everybody wants to think, sure, I care about the environment.

00:43:53.000 Yeah, let's get rid of emissions.

00:43:55.000 That'll be a great idea.

00:43:56.000 And whether it's that or open borders, and the idea that somehow we're, you know, do I think we're running concentration camps down south?

00:44:05.000 No, I don't think. 0.99

00:44:06.000 That's fucked up. 0.98

00:44:09.000 That's the terminology that we would have. 0.99

00:44:11.000 Right?

00:44:12.000 For detainment centers.

00:44:15.000 And you know what?

00:44:15.000 You want to make it better?

00:44:17.000 Well, great.

00:44:18.000 Let's actually do what your job is.

00:44:20.000 Let's make some changes to the immigration rules and to asylum laws.

00:44:25.000 Let's...

00:44:25.000 Put some more money down there and make conditions a little bit better.

00:44:31.000 There's things that we could – in terms of concrete steps, but we don't seem to want to do that. 0.98

00:44:36.000 We seem to want to just throw shit around at each other. 0.93

00:44:40.000 But the open borders thing is worrisome. 0.99

00:44:44.000 There's a guy named John Norris who was just on – My friend Steve Rinell's podcast.

00:44:49.000 It's called the Meat Eater podcast.

00:44:51.000 And he's a warden.

00:44:53.000 He's a game warden.

00:44:54.000 And one of the things that they had to deal with somewhere along the line was they had to become enforcers for illegal drug marijuana growing.

00:45:13.000 We're good to go.

00:45:25.000 That gets sold illegally in this country, in the Midwest and all these different places where it's illegal, is coming out of these grow-ups.

00:45:31.000 And a lot of it is tainted with dangerous pesticides because these guys are trying to...

00:45:36.000 They're actually using poisons to keep animals from eating the marijuana.

00:45:40.000 And so these kids that are... 1.00

00:45:42.000 Who the fuck is buying it? 1.00

00:45:43.000 They're buying this pot from these illegal places. 1.00

00:45:46.000 No one's testing this stuff. 1.00

00:45:47.000 You don't know what the fuck you're getting. 1.00

00:45:48.000 And you very well could be smoking pot that's poisoning you. 1.00

00:45:51.000 Yeah, a guy that I know, a really good guy, he's a huge landowner here in California, to the point where you can spend all day on an ATV and still not get to the end of one of his plots of land.

00:46:04.000 I don't know if you call it a plot of land.

00:46:06.000 And anyway, he's had those incidents, right?

00:46:09.000 He's had where it's such a massive piece of property.

00:46:14.000 That a small element from a cartel will set up a grow spot there, and they'll camouflage it.

00:46:21.000 It's very well done.

00:46:22.000 They bring in the piping for the water, because pot uses a huge amount of water.

00:46:27.000 This guy was talking about water that they brought in.

00:46:29.000 They had a pipe that went for three miles.

00:46:31.000 These kids carried it in on their back.

00:46:32.000 Yeah, that's what these guys do.

00:46:34.000 And then eventually, you know, you got to go in there and bust it up.

00:46:38.000 But it's people that stumble across it that, you know, they're just out there doing their regular ranching job.

00:46:43.000 And it is fascinating.

00:46:45.000 Look, I... I feel like we should take those guys and reprogram them.

00:46:50.000 You get a guy who's willing to carry a hundred pounds of piping on his back and walk eight miles into the backwoods, that's a fucking industrious individual. 0.98

00:46:57.000 You gotta lure him away from the cartel with a better deal. 0.96

00:47:01.000 If that guy worked for a competing corporation, he'd be like, look, I like the way you do business.

00:47:07.000 Right, give him a job on the ranch. 0.85

00:47:08.000 If I found this guy and he was working for Verizon, they'd be like, hey, come on over here, man. 0.99

00:47:13.000 You're fucking putting in the time. 0.98

00:47:15.000 This guy's carrying three miles of hose on his back. 1.00

00:47:18.000 That's work.

00:47:19.000 That's what we call work. 0.99

00:47:20.000 That's fucking real work. 0.98

00:47:21.000 Yeah, so use your power for good, not evil. 0.99

00:47:23.000 That's what I tell my boys.

00:47:25.000 It's hard, though, because evil's fun, I think.

00:47:28.000 In the short term, it could be more lucrative.

00:47:30.000 Yeah, from their perspective, there is that. 0.87

00:47:32.000 And they have a record and probably murderers. 0.60

00:47:34.000 All right.

00:47:36.000 So maybe we're not talking about somebody you're going to hire as a landscaper.

00:47:39.000 They're your home.

00:47:40.000 But your point is...

00:47:41.000 Open borders are not a good idea.

00:47:43.000 Open borders are not a good idea.

00:47:44.000 There's a lot of bad people that are getting in already.

00:47:48.000 And it's not a stretch.

00:47:49.000 This is not – if anybody imagines this to be a stretch or is going to take offense at this, every nation maintains borders.

00:47:56.000 Every nation maintains some element of immigration controls and borders protection.

00:48:02.000 The idea that we shouldn't or that we should somehow feel exceptionally bad about it is – I don't quite understand that mentality.

00:48:10.000 Well, we should feel bad when we see someone who's just a poor mother who's trying to come over to America to get a better job because she's stuck in Guatemala and it sucks over there and there's no opportunity whatsoever for her to excel. 1.00

00:48:22.000 That's a different animal than someone who is a member of some fucking terrible cartel gang that comes over here. 0.95

00:48:30.000 The question is, how do we differentiate and how do we make it so that that woman who's a mom can come over here? 0.98

00:48:35.000 How do we make it so it's legal?

00:48:37.000 That's the real question.

00:48:38.000 It's But that's not what they're addressing, right?

00:48:41.000 How many decades now have we heard about immigration controls and immigration process and regulations and policy?

00:48:47.000 And nothing ever gets done.

00:48:49.000 And so maybe, and again, I think one of the things that's interesting about Trump...

00:48:57.000 Is... 0.96

00:48:57.000 As strange as it is, the environment, I mean, maybe the fact that he is disruptive and sometimes doesn't seem to give a shit, maybe that's a good thing because it gets us talking and gets us talking in areas that we haven't before and in ways that we haven't before. 0.96

00:49:11.000 So maybe that results in something. 0.85

00:49:13.000 Maybe, like the Chinese, the public's just going to wait for him to go and then we'll get back to business as usual. 1.00

00:49:19.000 That may happen.

00:49:20.000 But even business as usual, the concern is like...

00:49:23.000 How do you differentiate between someone who's coming in illegally because they want a better life versus someone who's coming in illegally because they're literally going to commit murder and sell fentanyl and deal incredible harm to whatever community they wind up in,

00:49:40.000 and they're a member of MS-13.

00:49:42.000 There's both things that are going on at the same time, and you're a heartless person if you don't want that lady with a child from Guatemala. 1.00

00:49:47.000 To come over here and do better.

00:49:49.000 And she's probably going to work as hard, if not harder, than any good, old-fashioned, red-blooded American that's over here trying to make their way through this world. 1.00

00:49:56.000 And why should we be able to have this opportunity when they can't?

00:49:59.000 One of the beautiful things about America, right, is that if you're a poor person and you live in Baltimore, you can get your shit together and get out, and you can move to maybe Silicon Valley.

00:50:08.000 You can move somewhere where there's more prosperity, there's more opportunity, and you can get something... 0.95

00:50:12.000 I'm sorry, are there poor people in Baltimore?

00:50:14.000 I heard there are.

00:50:15.000 I've got to pay attention.

00:50:18.000 There's a word...

00:50:19.000 What is the word he used?

00:50:21.000 Infestation?

00:50:21.000 Infestation of rats.

00:50:23.000 Infestation.

00:50:23.000 Yeah.

00:50:24.000 You can't use infestation when you're talking about certain neighborhoods.

00:50:26.000 People get mad.

00:50:27.000 Even though he said infested with crime and rats... 0.99

00:50:29.000 He's still, you're racist. 0.98

00:50:31.000 It doesn't matter.

00:50:31.000 The key here is, and it's a democratic talking point, right?

00:50:35.000 I mean, this is a strategy.

00:50:36.000 And that's fine.

00:50:37.000 Both parties use different strategies.

00:50:40.000 But the Dems have obviously decided in this period of time, because it's so intense, There was clearly discussions within wherever, the DNC or elsewhere, that this is our policy.

00:50:50.000 We are going to push this.

00:50:51.000 And you just keep hammering that word, racist, racist, racist, no matter what. 0.97

00:50:56.000 And it's going to stick, and it does, because you get hit by that hammer, and you kind of – We're good to go.

00:51:32.000 Look at the issue of border security and enhance your ability to understand who's coming across the border.

00:51:40.000 It costs money and it requires effort, but you can do both.

00:51:45.000 I think you can do both, but I think the real big picture, the real big picture, if you had to look at the solution objectively, the real problem is Mexico has... 0.50

00:51:56.000 Like, real economic situations that we don't have here in America.

00:51:59.000 They're far worse off in a lot of the areas.

00:52:02.000 And as is Guatemala, as is El Salvador.

00:52:06.000 Neighboring countries are economically devastated.

00:52:09.000 Until they are not, until they come up, until they experience prosperity, you're always going to have people that are committing crime because they want to try to get by, and you're always going to have people that are going to want to try to get to America because it's a place where there's more opportunity.

00:52:23.000 That's the real issue.

00:52:24.000 The real issue is that it's so much better over here.

00:52:26.000 Right.

00:52:27.000 And that makes sense.

00:52:28.000 And you get the same thing with immigration and movement of people over in Europe coming up from wherever.

00:52:34.000 Which is the Brexit argument, right?

00:52:36.000 Which is the Brexit argument in part.

00:52:37.000 I mean it's not just based around immigration, but it's more control of your own nation's security and destiny, etc.

00:52:43.000 But I think that that's – you could argue that national security from a U.S. perspective – Would warrant improving your ability to impact nations like Guatemala, El Salvador, wherever, and working with Mexico to not just improve sort of the security,

00:53:02.000 the liaison that goes on and improving that, but you're right.

00:53:05.000 I mean, working conditions, criminal, you know, or crime and instability, that's in our national security.

00:53:12.000 I know people get, you know, they get very upset.

00:53:13.000 They say, why should we give countries money?

00:53:15.000 Right.

00:53:15.000 Well, in part, you're right.

00:53:16.000 I mean, sometimes you give them money and it just goes down some shithole.

00:53:18.000 And I'm not talking about the country. 0.84

00:53:20.000 I'm just talking literally.

00:53:21.000 It goes into a hole and it never comes back.

00:53:23.000 A bad person gets in corruption and they absorb it at the highest levels of government.

00:53:26.000 Yeah.

00:53:27.000 And so there's no controls over how that money is spent.

00:53:30.000 There's no metrics to say whether it's spent wisely at the end of the day.

00:53:34.000 But I would argue that, yeah, I agree.

00:53:36.000 I mean, it's in our national security interest when we're talking about...

00:53:47.000 Well, like you said, they're on the move because they want a better life because where they're at ain't good.

00:53:56.000 How do you work with them?

00:53:59.000 I think people sometimes look at that and think, well, that's pushing a rock up a hill.

00:54:02.000 It's never going to happen.

00:54:03.000 And so maybe they just stop.

00:54:06.000 We've ignored Latin America, Central America, South America for decades, which is how we ended up in part with Chavez and Maduro to follow and some of the horseshit that went on down there because we ignored it.

00:54:20.000 We didn't give it the resources.

00:54:21.000 We didn't give it the attention.

00:54:22.000 We didn't treat it seriously as a national security concern.

00:54:26.000 We were all focused on wherever, improving relations in Southeast Asia or elsewhere.

00:54:32.000 So, yeah, we need to refocus.

00:54:34.000 And I think, ultimately, do we see it immediately?

00:54:36.000 No.

00:54:36.000 But I think you're...

00:54:36.000 So, anyway, it's, you know...

00:54:38.000 I think for people that are really...

00:54:40.000 This is like a foreign policy hour.

00:54:41.000 It is.

00:54:41.000 Yeah.

00:54:42.000 With at least one dude who doesn't know jack shit about foreign policy. 0.97

00:54:45.000 That would be me. 0.97

00:54:46.000 That'd be a good show, though.

00:54:47.000 But I... Yeah.

00:54:48.000 Maybe.

00:54:49.000 But I really think, in the interest of national security, legalizing marijuana federally would stop the profitability of these gang members, because you'd be able to have legal marijuana.

00:54:59.000 You wouldn't need to buy it in these other places. 0.98

00:55:02.000 You'd be able to grow it yourself, and the price would drop through the fucking floor. 0.97

00:55:08.000 And it would be not profitable for these guys to haul three miles of pipe on their back and into the backcountry and use someone else's land to make these grow-ups. 0.94

00:55:16.000 And one of the reasons why they're doing this, particularly in California, I found out, is that when marijuana became legal in California, these illegal grow-ups became a misdemeanor rather than a felony.

00:55:25.000 So they do them over here.

00:55:27.000 Instead of doing it in Ohio or somewhere else where it's illegal, and also you could basically grow year-round here. 1.00

00:55:34.000 I was going to say, from a logistical point of view, But if they just made it legal federally, just cut the shit. 1.00

00:55:39.000 We're all grown-ups. 0.98

00:55:40.000 And there's a tremendous number of issues related to the fact that the state and the federal laws don't match up.

00:55:46.000 Right.

00:55:46.000 And from a law enforcement perspective, it's a nightmare.

00:55:48.000 Nightmare.

00:55:49.000 Nightmare.

00:55:50.000 Yeah, I agree.

00:55:51.000 What will happen is I don't imagine that it makes the cartel activity any different.

00:55:57.000 That sucking sound that is the revenues from weed leaving their accounts will be replaced by something else.

00:56:04.000 For sure.

00:56:05.000 Or get into the weeds.

00:56:06.000 We need business.

00:56:09.000 These pharmaceutical companies that are fighting against it, as well as these prison guard unions, which is really crazy.

00:56:14.000 That's the darkest one to me.

00:56:16.000 The pharmaceutical companies, look, I get it.

00:56:18.000 They're just creeps that are looking at their bottom line.

00:56:20.000 Every business wants to constantly have new growth every year.

00:56:24.000 They want to constantly be making more money.

00:56:26.000 I get it.

00:56:27.000 It's like this universal, eternal growth model that they operate under.

00:56:31.000 But the prison guard unions, when you find out that they lobby against the legalization of marijuana, is so insane.

00:56:37.000 What does that mean?

00:56:38.000 I didn't know.

00:56:38.000 They just want more people in jail so that they have jobs.

00:56:42.000 That's the idea behind it.

00:56:43.000 It's the most un-American thing possible. 0.53

00:56:45.000 You want more people in jail so that you could have a job looking over those people. 0.86

00:56:50.000 Basically, it's sickening.

00:56:52.000 Yeah, that's a new one to me.

00:56:54.000 I had no idea.

00:56:56.000 The guard unions.

00:56:57.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:56:59.000 Well, private prisons in a nutshell are pretty fucking gross. 0.94

00:57:02.000 Yeah, private prisons is something that, you know, and there have been, I mean, again, with this current administration, you know, there's been some prison reform issues that have been making their way through, right? 0.97

00:57:12.000 They've been actually focused on it to some degree.

00:57:14.000 Thanks to Kim Kardashian.

00:57:15.000 Yeah.

00:57:16.000 How crazy is that?

00:57:17.000 Who we were just looking at. 1.00

00:57:18.000 She's a fucking champion. 1.00

00:57:19.000 She's a champion of people that are wrongly incarcerated. 1.00

00:57:23.000 She really is.

00:57:24.000 I want to show you something.

00:57:25.000 Shout out to Kim K. I'm like a crazy grandpa that clips newspaper articles out.

00:57:31.000 But in preparation for the show, I know most people think I do no preparation whatsoever.

00:57:36.000 I know.

00:57:36.000 You're one of those guys.

00:57:37.000 I still do too.

00:57:38.000 I love the newspaper.

00:57:39.000 I do as well.

00:57:39.000 Thank you.

00:57:40.000 Look at this.

00:57:41.000 Colleges offer degree and courses in the pot business.

00:57:43.000 Ah, good move.

00:57:44.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:57:45.000 So this is really interesting.

00:57:46.000 It teaches podcasting too now.

00:57:47.000 Did you know that?

00:57:47.000 College is a teaching podcasting.

00:57:49.000 I know two people that have gone back to school for that.

00:57:51.000 For podcasting?

00:57:52.000 No, no.

00:57:52.000 For pot?

00:57:53.000 For growing pot. 0.67

00:57:54.000 Really?

00:57:54.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:57:54.000 It's crazy.

00:57:55.000 University of Maryland and Cornell, that's the two that this article talks about.

00:57:59.000 Well, the biggest sponsorship that the UFC has ever gotten, ever, is this Aurora company in Canada that grows weed.

00:58:06.000 CBD and marijuana.

00:58:08.000 They have football fields.

00:58:11.000 Filled with weed. 0.98

00:58:12.000 And, you know, the highest possible standards, the best quality, no pesticides, herbicides, no bullshit, super pure.

00:58:19.000 And the CBD, which is fantastic for everybody's health.

00:58:22.000 And I just, back when I first started working for the UFC, there were people that worked for the organization that didn't like it that I smoked pot.

00:58:29.000 They were like, why is he smoking pot?

00:58:30.000 What is he doing?

00:58:32.000 But now they work with a pot company.

00:58:34.000 Yeah.

00:58:34.000 Well, I mean, I will tell you this, apropos of nothing.

00:58:38.000 I've gotten calls, a couple of calls, from people in the industry who are saying, and the only reason they're calling me is they're saying, can you hook me up with Joe?

00:58:47.000 It's like we hang out together all the time, of course, right?

00:58:49.000 Because we're always hanging out in the pool together, Joe and I. So I said, no, look, dude, that's not my job.

00:58:56.000 What do they want from me?

00:58:57.000 You know what?

00:58:58.000 I think they just want to pitch you on business. 0.99

00:59:00.000 They want to bring some spooks in here and fucking case the joint. 0.98

00:59:04.000 That's what they want to do. 0.99

00:59:05.000 No, they're people in the pot business.

00:59:06.000 Oh, the pot business.

00:59:09.000 I thought you meant CIA spooks.

00:59:11.000 That's a great word.

00:59:12.000 Spooks.

00:59:13.000 You've got to be careful using that word, though, because people think you're racist.

00:59:16.000 That was a racist term in the 70s for black folks. 0.99

00:59:19.000 I worked on a show in the UK, an espionage drama show that ran for eight or nine seasons.

00:59:26.000 In the UK, it was called Spooks.

00:59:27.000 It was about their intel operation.

00:59:30.000 It ran for a long time.

00:59:32.000 But then they sold it.

00:59:33.000 They brought it over here to the States.

00:59:34.000 And I think it was on, I don't know, some channel.

00:59:37.000 But they had to change the name.

00:59:39.000 They changed it to MI5, which is the name for the Domestic Security Service.

00:59:42.000 Because they were worried about the term.

00:59:43.000 Exactly.

00:59:44.000 But CIA spooks has always been around. 0.99

00:59:46.000 I mean, it's a fucking... 0.99

00:59:46.000 It's always been around. 0.99

00:59:47.000 The idea is that there's sneaky people that are doing creepy shit. 0.99

00:59:53.000 There is no creepy shit being done. 0.99

00:59:56.000 I hear you. 0.99

00:59:56.000 You say whatever you need to say. 0.99

00:59:57.000 Go ahead.

00:59:57.000 I'm here to tell you right now, and you can write this down.

01:00:00.000 I'm going to write it down.

01:00:01.000 Write it down.

01:00:02.000 Nothing creepy. 0.99

01:00:03.000 There is no creepy shit going on. 0.99

01:00:04.000 Speaking of creepy, what's going on with Iran caught a bunch of people that they are claiming are CIA informants and they may execute them? 0.99

01:00:12.000 Yeah.

01:00:13.000 Yeah, they've done this before.

01:00:14.000 They've made this claim before.

01:00:17.000 And...

01:00:18.000 Look, Iran is – hey, a couple of parts of this.

01:00:22.000 That's one of the heaviest lifts in the business has been intel collection on Iran over the years.

01:00:26.000 I'm not talking about just recently, but over the years it's been very difficult.

01:00:30.000 They are extremely buttoned up over there, and they have an incredible level of control over their population, which is – at some point you would think, well, maybe the population is going to object to this, but it hasn't happened yet.

01:00:46.000 So part of it is they came out with this, I think, 17 individuals that they claim were cooperating with the CIA in some fashion or another.

01:00:54.000 And they claimed that they were fairly high-level individuals.

01:01:00.000 IFA, I don't believe anything that comes out of their mouths.

01:01:03.000 I don't believe them at all.

01:01:04.000 I think they've got a long, long track record of lying about a variety of things.

01:01:09.000 And so, you know, why would they come out with this?

01:01:13.000 You know, perhaps they're cracking down and it doesn't hurt to come out and if you're going after some of these individuals anyway, why not?

01:01:20.000 Put the paintbrush on them that they're working for the CIA and that will appease some of the population there.

01:01:26.000 So I don't know.

01:01:28.000 Again, I'm not buying it.

01:01:30.000 It has been a difficult intel task, and collecting intelligence on their efforts with their ballistic missiles, their nuke program as well, has always been problematic. 0.85

01:01:41.000 But again, they've done this before where they've talked about how we've wrapped up a CIA spying network, and it's kind of horseshit.

01:01:48.000 But it's just their propaganda. 0.54

01:01:50.000 Well, yeah.

01:01:50.000 In some ways.

01:01:52.000 Yeah, that would be my take on it.

01:01:54.000 I don't know.

01:01:55.000 I mean, I'm not internal.

01:01:56.000 I'm not inside.

01:01:58.000 Is it possible?

01:01:59.000 Sure.

01:01:59.000 We've had networks wrapped up before by other countries.

01:02:03.000 Cuba, the Cuban Intel Service years ago, which was completely built by the Russians, by the way, by the old KGB. They owned and operated the Cuban Intel Service for a long time, still do.

01:02:15.000 They, at one point, wrapped up pretty much everybody we had on island and elsewhere.

01:02:21.000 So how many people did we have over there?

01:02:24.000 Three.

01:02:25.000 No, we had, you know, I don't remember the numbers, but it was a few.

01:02:29.000 Yeah, let's just say it was not good.

01:02:31.000 And they had done a very good, it was from a counterintelligence perspective, it was a pretty impressive effort.

01:02:38.000 So it's happened.

01:02:39.000 Russia's, you know, done the same when we've, usually when, with Russia, usually when we've got a traitor or a mole, you know, somebody like Robert Hansen, Jim Nicholson, Ed Lee Howard.

01:02:51.000 I've never seen that show, The Americans...

01:02:52.000 Oh, yeah.

01:02:52.000 From what I understand, it's a good show.

01:02:54.000 It was a show based on the idea that at one point in time there was a Russian family that had come over here and infiltrated and became American citizens and seemed like, you know, Joe and Mary next door.

01:03:05.000 Right.

01:03:05.000 But really they were Russian spies.

01:03:07.000 You don't have an aunt and uncle named Joe and Mary.

01:03:08.000 It's weird that you would say that.

01:03:09.000 I literally had an aunt named Joe and Mary.

01:03:11.000 Maybe I've done some intel on you, buddy.

01:03:14.000 Look at that.

01:03:15.000 Time to go.

01:03:16.000 Yeah.

01:03:19.000 Yeah.

01:03:19.000 There was a story.

01:03:21.000 The reason The Americans was created was written, as do a lot of things do, based on some smart writer who sees an opportunity because he reads a newspaper article.

01:03:29.000 Years back, 2011, I think it was, we had a sleeper cell that we wrapped up in Jersey.

01:03:37.000 Yeah, that's where this takes place.

01:03:39.000 Right.

01:03:39.000 And there was that one, the hot one, remember?

01:03:41.000 Oh, that's right.

01:03:42.000 The hot broad that's banging everybody and getting information. 1.00

01:03:45.000 The hot Russian broad. 0.99

01:03:46.000 Bring them over.

01:03:47.000 And then you look at her and you think, man, that hot.

01:03:49.000 Something hot?

01:03:50.000 Well, I mean, I think she's, I'm forgetting what her name was. 0.74

01:03:53.000 If you're a fat dude that's watering your lawn and she's next door, she's got high heels on. 1.00

01:03:59.000 Yeah, wearing nothing, but that's her. 0.98

01:04:01.000 Oh, she's hot, bro.

01:04:02.000 You don't think she's hot? 1.00

01:04:03.000 Not so much.

01:04:04.000 There's something about her look.

01:04:06.000 I don't know.

01:04:07.000 There's something about her nose.

01:04:08.000 The configuration of her nose.

01:04:10.000 She's hot, man. 1.00

01:04:11.000 You don't think that lady looks hot? 1.00

01:04:13.000 Not there, no.

01:04:14.000 That's not a good picture for her.

01:04:14.000 That's not a good picture.

01:04:15.000 But the mugshot one up there?

01:04:17.000 And she's not even wearing any makeup.

01:04:18.000 No, that's true.

01:04:19.000 That's a good point.

01:04:20.000 Come on, man.

01:04:20.000 You doll her up.

01:04:20.000 Yeah, put a little East European blue eyeliner on her.

01:04:24.000 If that chick catches you with a couple of Jack Daniels in you, you've got trouble. 1.00

01:04:27.000 I like how she walks across when you're mowing the lawn. 0.72

01:04:29.000 You're right.

01:04:30.000 So she and a bunch of other people lived in Jersey in the suburbs.

01:04:34.000 And their whole reason for being was just to spot people.

01:04:38.000 They were not...

01:04:40.000 These were not the heads of the organization, right?

01:04:43.000 So their job is spot people, live there, be social, meet people that might be of interest.

01:04:49.000 Maybe it turns out that somebody in the PTA where your kids go to school, maybe somebody's working for Raytheon or they're working for some interesting company.

01:04:56.000 So that's what they do?

01:04:57.000 So that's their job.

01:04:57.000 Their job was basically to spot.

01:04:59.000 And then you've got other people in that chain of events who are a little bit higher up the food chain who then assess, right?

01:05:06.000 And will look at that person and go, yeah, maybe there's something there.

01:05:10.000 This person works for whatever company.

01:05:12.000 It doesn't matter what the company is, by the way.

01:05:14.000 It could be Qualcomm.

01:05:15.000 It could be...

01:05:16.000 Think of one that, because the application could be Corning, could be anything.

01:05:19.000 I mean, there's all sorts of companies out there that have applications that may be of interest from an Intel perspective for a hostile state.

01:05:25.000 So then, you know, they do a little assessment, and maybe they come away and go, yeah, yeah, that person's interesting job.

01:05:30.000 Let's develop a little relationship there.

01:05:32.000 Now, maybe one of those individuals will work on that relationship, or maybe somebody else will come in within this group, and they'll develop a relationship.

01:05:43.000 And then maybe they'll task the person.

01:05:45.000 So maybe – say the guy works at a tech company, and you're going to think, okay, I want to see if this person has any weaknesses.

01:05:52.000 How – You know, can I leverage anything here?

01:05:55.000 And so what you'll say is, you know, my kid, you know, is doing this school paper and it's on, you know, something and I can't, you know, they're just not getting in it or they're not doing the research or whatever.

01:06:08.000 Do you have anything, you know, and you're not asking for anything classified. 0.91

01:06:11.000 You're just saying, look, you work in a tech company, you know, don't you have Something that would be of interest, you know, my kid's got to write this stupid paper, and you're not looking for anything of intel value.

01:06:21.000 You're looking to see whether they'll accommodate you, right?

01:06:24.000 Will they actually come back and go, yeah, well, you know what, we got this, and it's kind of interesting, and it's this research paper that's been out in the press for a long time, but yeah, it's interesting, hey, you know.

01:06:32.000 Hands it over.

01:06:33.000 Well, now maybe you got something, right?

01:06:35.000 Now you got something that you can see that they responded to a little task.

01:06:39.000 And then, so you set the hook a little bit, and then you just keep on working on that.

01:06:42.000 So in the meantime, they're calling back to the KGB and saying, we have got it.

01:06:46.000 We work with Ritheon.

01:06:47.000 Right.

01:06:48.000 It knows information.

01:06:49.000 And they say it just like that.

01:06:51.000 With that very accent.

01:06:52.000 And they keep jobs and everything, so they work, they go to work every day.

01:06:55.000 Maybe they go to work, maybe they don't, maybe they're a spouse, you know, a stay-at-home spouse.

01:06:59.000 Well, what do they do?

01:07:00.000 They hang out with other stay-at-home spouses and create friendships because of kids, and the next thing you know, you're all having dinners with each other. 0.89

01:07:05.000 Well, like that Russian broad, she's banging everybody, right? 1.00

01:07:09.000 No, you wouldn't do that.

01:07:10.000 That would be a very disruptive thing to do in that community, right?

01:07:12.000 Isn't that the premise of the Americans?

01:07:14.000 I haven't seen the show, but I think the hot one bangs people. 0.97

01:07:17.000 I watched...

01:07:19.000 I watched about half an hour of the first episode.

01:07:22.000 Did you get angry?

01:07:23.000 No, I just sit there and I'm a very hard person to watch shows like that with.

01:07:26.000 And so my wife was like, I just can't, no, you can't sit here. 1.00

01:07:30.000 Oh, because it's like Intel.

01:07:31.000 I'm going like, eh, nonsense.

01:07:34.000 But it was good.

01:07:35.000 That's how I am.

01:07:36.000 It was a good show.

01:07:36.000 With a show where people play pool.

01:07:39.000 No.

01:07:39.000 People can't really play pool?

01:07:41.000 I'm like, get the fuck out of here. 0.99

01:07:42.000 Yeah, yeah. 0.90

01:07:43.000 I was just in the UK, and boy, I tell you what, I turn on the TV and there's a snooker match on.

01:07:48.000 Yeah, snooker.

01:07:48.000 I'm in there.

01:07:49.000 Snooker, I'm in there, right?

01:07:50.000 I'll just sit and watch snooker.

01:07:52.000 It's huge over there.

01:07:53.000 Oh, my God.

01:07:54.000 But it's also, it's one of those things where either you can sit and watch it, or like golf, or you can't.

01:07:58.000 And I just haven't, for some reason, I've got some defect that allows me to sit and watch a billiard match.

01:08:02.000 Have you ever played?

01:08:03.000 Snooker?

01:08:04.000 It's tough.

01:08:05.000 It's hard.

01:08:06.000 Real hard.

01:08:06.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:08:07.000 We have a pool table at home that the boys have become pretty damn good at, which is a skill, a life skill.

01:08:14.000 But, yeah, billiards is a...

01:08:17.000 Well, pool is hard.

01:08:18.000 Snooker is way harder.

01:08:19.000 Yeah.

01:08:20.000 It's way harder.

01:08:20.000 They excel in American pool.

01:08:22.000 I don't think any American player has ever gone over there and excelled in snooker.

01:08:27.000 I don't think so.

01:08:28.000 I don't believe so.

01:08:29.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:08:30.000 That'd be something for looking up.

01:08:31.000 I know guys have tried...

01:08:33.000 But I don't think anybody's succeeded, but there's been a ton of guys from England that have come over here, and they do very well on the American pool tour.

01:08:42.000 Yeah, but you know what we do better on is bowling.

01:08:44.000 We do. 0.99

01:08:45.000 We kick the shit out of them when it comes to bowling, yeah. 1.00

01:08:48.000 But that's an American thing. 1.00

01:08:49.000 Well, yeah, there you go.

01:08:50.000 Do they bowl, come over here and bowl?

01:08:51.000 No, I don't think so.

01:08:52.000 No?

01:08:53.000 I don't think so.

01:08:54.000 It's been that migration. 1.00

01:08:55.000 Bowling's a uniquely stupid sport. 1.00

01:08:57.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:08:58.000 And they get really mad when I say that.

01:08:59.000 I get all these texts. 1.00

01:09:00.000 You fucking ignorant. 1.00

01:09:02.000 No, I'm not. 1.00

01:09:03.000 You're rolling a ball at these things and you have to pick them back up again.

01:09:06.000 Have you ever bowled sober?

01:09:07.000 I don't think I've ever bowled sober.

01:09:08.000 Yeah, I bowl with my kids.

01:09:09.000 I'm always sober.

01:09:10.000 My kids love bowling.

01:09:11.000 And they put up the little bumper thing so it doesn't go in the gutter so you're cheating. 0.99

01:09:15.000 So you can just basically whip that fucking thing down there 100 miles an hour. 0.98

01:09:20.000 That's what I do. 0.99

01:09:21.000 My thrill is to hear the loudest smash ball.

01:09:25.000 If it's up for them, it's up for me.

01:09:28.000 You're not going to give them an edge.

01:09:31.000 Don't let them win.

01:09:31.000 Dance on the floor.

01:09:33.000 Do you let your kids win?

01:09:34.000 Yes, all the time.

01:09:36.000 But I did get a hamstring injury because I didn't let my kid beat me in a race.

01:09:41.000 How old?

01:09:41.000 She's 11. Okay.

01:09:43.000 I was running.

01:09:44.000 I knew something was going on.

01:09:45.000 I'm like, who cares?

01:09:45.000 Push through.

01:09:46.000 She's not winning. 1.00

01:09:48.000 My fucking hamstring's hurting. 1.00

01:09:50.000 My middle boy, Sluggo, plays basketball. 1.00

01:09:53.000 That's all he wants to do, day and night.

01:09:55.000 And he's a bit like the rain man of basketball, too, in terms of facts, figures, characters.

01:10:00.000 He can go back to Jerry West and...

01:10:02.000 And he'll tell you about Bill Russell's career and everything, but he loves basketball.

01:10:05.000 Does he want to play professionally?

01:10:06.000 Yes, he does.

01:10:07.000 Really?

01:10:08.000 Well, how tall are you?

01:10:09.000 You know, it doesn't look like it, but in a deepfake video, I look about 6'10".

01:10:14.000 But what are you, like 6'1"?

01:10:15.000 6'1", not quite 6'1".

01:10:17.000 You're going to have to get that kid on growth hormone. 1.00

01:10:19.000 Yeah, well, he already is.

01:10:21.000 Shoot him up with some stuff.

01:10:22.000 Stretch him out too at night.

01:10:23.000 I put in his burgers.

01:10:24.000 Hang him out by his ankles.

01:10:25.000 But that's all he does.

01:10:27.000 He plays, and he just constantly—all he wants to do is play.

01:10:30.000 And so we've got to the point where, you know, for a long time, we'd go out, we'd go to court at home, and I'd play, and I'd kind of let him—and then it gets to the point where I can't really beat him.

01:10:41.000 I've got height on him, right?

01:10:43.000 Right.

01:10:44.000 His handles are extremely good now.

01:10:46.000 And I'm not the fastest kid on the block anymore.

01:10:49.000 And so it's gotten to the point now where he's legitimately beat me a handful of times.

01:10:53.000 And it's very embarrassing because he doesn't really have an edit button. 0.99

01:10:57.000 So he just rubs that shit in, right? 0.99

01:11:00.000 And it's like the Lion King when Scar wants to take over, right? 1.00

01:11:04.000 And he's just like, that was pretty good, wasn't it?

01:11:06.000 The Lion King reference.

01:11:07.000 It's a good reference.

01:11:07.000 Yeah.

01:11:08.000 So anyway, yeah.

01:11:09.000 But you gotta let him do that, though.

01:11:10.000 It's an exercise for you and patience. 0.99

01:11:11.000 So when he's talking shit, that's how I look at it. 1.00

01:11:14.000 My kids talk shit if they beat me. 1.00

01:11:15.000 I just go, okay, go ahead, talk some shit. 1.00

01:11:18.000 Yeah, yeah. 0.99

01:11:18.000 And that's like, you can't let it be personal. 0.99

01:11:21.000 No, no.

01:11:22.000 So you gotta treat it almost like an internet heckler.

01:11:24.000 Yeah.

01:11:25.000 My kids are allowed to hit me full blast. 1.00

01:11:27.000 So my kids take martial arts and I let them, not the oldest one, the oldest one's 22, she'll fuck me up. 1.00

01:11:33.000 But the young ones, I let them tee off on me. 0.99

01:11:37.000 They're allowed to full blast leg kick me. 0.50

01:11:40.000 They can hurt me. 0.99

01:11:41.000 They'll hurt you.

01:11:42.000 But I want them to be able to feel what it feels like to actually hit a person.

01:11:46.000 Because when you're sparring in martial arts class, you're not allowed to hit people full blast.

01:11:50.000 You just kind of touch them. 0.99

01:11:52.000 So I let them just fucking slam shins into my thighs. 1.00

01:11:56.000 And I teach them how to turn it over and really dig that bone into the soft spark. 0.99

01:12:01.000 But that's good.

01:12:02.000 That's actually really good. 0.99

01:12:04.000 It fucking hurts sometimes, though. 0.99

01:12:06.000 We have the same problem with my boys because they're fairly competitive and they're aggressive. 0.99

01:12:12.000 And, you know, I keep telling them, I said, look, getting punched in the face isn't good.

01:12:17.000 And, you know, until you actually do, well, you know, they've gotten into some, I was going to say fisticuffs.

01:12:23.000 I don't know if you can say that.

01:12:24.000 You okay?

01:12:25.000 You're allowed to say fisticuffs.

01:12:26.000 I guess fisticuffs.

01:12:28.000 We're continuing to talk over there.

01:12:30.000 He's dying.

01:12:32.000 He has a hard time with water.

01:12:34.000 But yeah, it's hard to teach your kids what that's like.

01:12:40.000 And at some point, maybe they go through that.

01:12:43.000 The youngest one broke his nose, courtesy of the oldest one.

01:12:48.000 So Muggsy got his nose broke in a contest with the oldest one, Scooter. 0.81

01:12:53.000 And he found out that's no fun.

01:12:56.000 The thing is, though, that kid's going to be the tough one.

01:12:58.000 Yeah.

01:12:59.000 It's always the youngest ones.

01:13:01.000 You see it in the UFC. When there's older brothers and younger brothers, the older brothers generally pick on the younger brothers, and the younger brothers, once they reach adulthood, almost always can fuck up the older brothers. 0.97

01:13:12.000 It's really weird.

01:13:13.000 Yeah.

01:13:13.000 I took a lot of beatings when I was younger, because I'm the youngest of four boys.

01:13:18.000 Oh, that makes sense.

01:13:18.000 Makes sense.

01:13:18.000 And so, yeah.

01:13:20.000 But it's, yeah, it's good stuff.

01:13:23.000 And, oh my God, it's constant entertainment, all right?

01:13:26.000 I mean, you know what it's like with kids.

01:13:28.000 There's always something.

01:13:29.000 And I'm sure right now people are going, oh my God, he's going to start talking about his kids again at length.

01:13:32.000 And I'm not going to do that.

01:13:34.000 Because the kids' names are so cartoonish.

01:13:36.000 Yeah, I know.

01:13:36.000 That's part of the reason why they get mad.

01:13:38.000 Yeah, as they are.

01:13:39.000 But...

01:13:40.000 Anyway, so, what were we talking about?

01:13:42.000 Russians.

01:13:43.000 Yeah, look at it.

01:13:44.000 I'm like Uncle Joe here. 0.99

01:13:46.000 I've cut out some shit to talk about. 0.99

01:13:48.000 Deep fakes, we talked about that. 0.99

01:13:50.000 Okay.

01:13:51.000 Okay, what else are you doing?

01:13:52.000 I wrote down some notes, too.

01:13:54.000 My God, I was prepared for this thing.

01:13:55.000 You are prepared.

01:13:56.000 I've never been prepared for your show before, and you know what?

01:13:58.000 Why did you decide to get prepared this time?

01:13:59.000 You know why?

01:14:00.000 Because...

01:14:01.000 Because you've got some really great...

01:14:05.000 Guests?

01:14:07.000 Well, no, not really, but viewers, listeners, I mean.

01:14:11.000 The people that follow this show, I find to be really fascinating.

01:14:17.000 I get a lot of feedback, and I feel like, you know, yeah, I should pay attention, and I should prepare a little bit, because...

01:14:27.000 There's a lot of interest, right, in some of these things that we talk about. 0.97

01:14:31.000 And, you know, so, well, sometimes I go out and I wing it, you know, and to be fair, on news segments, I just make shit up. 0.98

01:14:38.000 No, I don't. 0.97

01:14:39.000 I don't do that.

01:14:40.000 I know you wanted to talk about Huawei.

01:14:42.000 Huawei.

01:14:43.000 Huawei.

01:14:44.000 Which I think is a really fascinating subject to me, and a lot of people that are tech-inclined, because...

01:14:50.000 They are at the tip of the spear when it comes to technological innovation in the cell phone space.

01:14:56.000 Yeah.

01:14:56.000 And I know that they're doing that in regards to modems and a bunch of other things as well, but it appears at least, and a lot of companies are exclusively using their 5G modems as 5G rolls out.

01:15:07.000 Oh, yeah.

01:15:07.000 Yeah.

01:15:07.000 But it appears they are involved in some serious shenanigans and they have deep roots with the Chinese government.

01:15:12.000 They do.

01:15:13.000 They claim they don't.

01:15:14.000 They claim, look, we're independent.

01:15:15.000 We would never do whatever the Chinese authorities say.

01:15:18.000 Think about that sentence.

01:15:19.000 Think about a company.

01:15:21.000 With the global reach of Huawei, of that importance to the Chinese state, and think about them saying, trying to say with a straight face, we wouldn't do things that the Chinese government might ask us to do. 1.00

01:15:34.000 What a load of shit. 0.99

01:15:34.000 If you were a real Chinese company and you said that and you meant it, they would shut you down. 0.99

01:15:38.000 Yeah, exactly.

01:15:39.000 They'd be like, you won't?

01:15:39.000 Yeah, you would not be in business for that long, or there would be a change in the senior management of the business.

01:15:47.000 And Huawei's been called out.

01:15:48.000 They've been called out in Europe to the degree where, at a certain point, you think, Germany and others that are deeply involved with Huawei now in terms of the 5G infrastructure, where they've just made this decision.

01:16:03.000 Look, it's financially better for us to work with Huawei, and we can set aside the security risks.

01:16:09.000 They literally made that decision.

01:16:11.000 I was reading an article about that very recently, that they've just decided to have some sort of a risk risk.

01:16:18.000 To reward conversation and the risk is worth the reward.

01:16:23.000 Right, right.

01:16:23.000 And so that's their calculation from a U.S. perspective because we are – look, there's two – essentially two superpowers now, right?

01:16:32.000 I mean China's advancing and we're not the lone superpower on the stage anymore.

01:16:39.000 And so we are the number one target.

01:16:42.000 And, you know, our calculation has to be different.

01:16:45.000 So we've been going at it, and I think it's been pretty well covered.

01:16:49.000 It didn't used to be covered very well, but it's been pretty well covered over the past couple of months.

01:16:53.000 And now what's happening is we've been in these trade negotiations with China, and I think...

01:16:59.000 Unfortunately, I think the current administration, the Trump administration, is going to blink.

01:17:04.000 And I think that because Huawei is such a huge issue for the Chinese, and the idea that we would prevent our companies from selling into or purchasing from or dealing with, and that we would have sanctions on other countries that do,

01:17:19.000 they view that as such a threat to their own interests and their own future that Huawei is front and center with any trade deal.

01:17:31.000 So they're looking.

01:17:32.000 They're not doing any trade deal unless we make concessions on Huawei.

01:17:34.000 And I have a feeling the Trump administration is going to make those concessions because, from a political perspective, they want a trade deal.

01:17:40.000 Right.

01:17:40.000 And so far they've actually said to Google that Google's going to stop using the Android operating system for the Chinese phones, for Huawei's phones at least.

01:17:49.000 They're going to not let them license out the...

01:17:51.000 So Huawei's actually been...

01:17:54.000 At least rumored to be in production of their own operating system, which would mean they would have to have their own, not just operating system, but they'd have to have their own ecosystem.

01:18:03.000 So they'd have to have an app store, they'd have to have all the jazz that we have today.

01:18:08.000 If you buy an Android phone, you have access to the Google Play market, which is this huge resource of applications.

01:18:15.000 And as soon as you take that away, you've got to kind of rebuild that whole thing from scratch.

01:18:20.000 Right, right.

01:18:21.000 Well, Huawei doesn't lack anything in resources.

01:18:24.000 You know, they'll be fine, you know, because the state will provide and ensure that they have the resources they need.

01:18:29.000 They also, you know, we're the outlier here, right?

01:18:33.000 I mean, we've been working with New Zealand and Canada and, you know, the UK to some degree, but the UK has been, you know, they've been kind of pushing back a little bit on this idea that we're going to isolate Huawei.

01:18:40.000 I don't think that's going to happen.

01:18:42.000 So they're using Huawei devices?

01:18:44.000 To some degree, yes.

01:18:46.000 They've been slower to adopt and kind of mesh their infrastructure with Huawei's gear.

01:18:52.000 For people who don't know what we're talking about, could you please just lay out what's the concern?

01:18:57.000 What do they think that Huawei's doing?

01:19:01.000 Huawei is essentially...

01:19:06.000 The way to put this would be, imagine a communications network that spans the globe.

01:19:12.000 And Huawei builds and provides gear, and certainly going into 5G, they're a leading provider, and then financially they can offer countries much better deals than other providers.

01:19:29.000 But they are an intricate part of that communications web.

01:19:35.000 So if you imagine that Huawei is a state-sponsored entity and will respond to Chinese authorities' requests for information or intelligence that's passing through this communications web around the globe, our business communications,

01:19:52.000 our military communications, intelligence communications that all kind of go through at some point this interconnected system, That's the problem, because they're essentially building backdoors into that system that allow them to suck communications out of that network and use it for their own purposes.

01:20:12.000 It's a great intelligence tool, right?

01:20:15.000 So if you think about it in a way, basically it's a...

01:20:20.000 It's an advancement on the idea that you are wiretapping somebody or, you know, you've created an ability to intercept some communications, right?

01:20:28.000 They link themselves with the EU. Well, what happens?

01:20:30.000 We've got military communications, right, with the EU. Our military talks to the EU military and we've got NATO concerns and everything.

01:20:37.000 So if there's an element in that infrastructure that touches in and has a door that opens to some Huawei gear, right, then the danger here is, and they've We've had backdoors discovered in the past and then Huawei puts their hands up and go, oh, well, we didn't know that was there.

01:20:52.000 We'll correct it.

01:20:52.000 And then it turns out they don't correct it.

01:20:54.000 And then, you know, oh, sorry about that. 0.99

01:20:57.000 They honestly don't give a shit. 0.99

01:20:58.000 When I say how aggressive they are in terms of sucking up information, I can't overstate it, right? 0.99

01:21:05.000 And so that's why it's a problem for us is because – You know, if we convince Australia and, you know, the Five Eyes nations, New Zealanders, and others, not to work with Huawei, and then, say, Canada,

01:21:21.000 you know, which is willing to do a deal, well, we've got seamless communications infrastructure with Canada.

01:21:26.000 So, all of a sudden, the fact that they're doing business with Huawei, but we're not, we're still at risk.

01:21:32.000 We're still in jeopardy, because that information is still flowing to some degree where it's accessible to Huawei.

01:21:39.000 And I know people listen to that and they go, why is that of any concern?

01:21:45.000 Well, it's a concern because it used to be in the old days it was us and the Russians, Soviet Union.

01:21:53.000 Russia's, you know, they got the GDP of a small EU nation.

01:21:58.000 China is on the march. 0.96

01:22:01.000 They view themselves in a certain fashion.

01:22:03.000 That's why they're pushing out in the South China Sea.

01:22:05.000 They've been building up their military.

01:22:06.000 They've been doing deals all over the world for rare earth minerals, to labor deals, access to naval ports.

01:22:14.000 It doesn't matter what it is.

01:22:15.000 They've been busy doing that because they view themselves at the top of the food chain.

01:22:20.000 Now, I guess we could say, well, okay, fine.

01:22:22.000 Maybe it's their turn or something.

01:22:24.000 But that's not how I view the world, right?

01:22:26.000 I mean, we can either be on top or we can, you know, be sucking wind.

01:22:30.000 And so it goes back to that one of those early questions you asked is how much do we spend on defense?

01:22:34.000 How much do we spend on defense?

01:22:36.000 On Intel, how much do we spend on whatever it may be?

01:22:38.000 And I think the answer is that's where intelligence comes in.

01:22:41.000 You have to know what the hostile nation is doing.

01:22:44.000 You have to know what the competitor is doing.

01:22:45.000 It's like in business.

01:22:46.000 And you have to spend enough to stay ahead of that, right?

01:22:49.000 Even if it's a small amount, you've got to stay ahead.

01:22:51.000 And it behooves us not to fall behind.

01:22:56.000 That's never a good thing.

01:22:57.000 I know we don't always do things right, but as a nation...

01:23:02.000 The world is much better off with us sort of at – and this is going to sound wrong to a lot of people.

01:23:09.000 They're going to think, oh my god, that's terrible.

01:23:11.000 But with us at the top, we're more altruistic.

01:23:15.000 Maybe that is – I don't know if that's the word or not, but I think – It's a good word.

01:23:19.000 Yeah.

01:23:19.000 So anyway, so that's my view.

01:23:22.000 A lot of people say bullshit, but everyone has got different experiences. 0.94

01:23:27.000 Well, is there a way to detect, like when they release, say if they release a Huawei phone, which is really interesting that just a few years ago, Huawei was not even a major player by any stretch of the imagination. 0.98

01:23:40.000 Now it's the number two cell phone provider in the world, past Apple.

01:23:46.000 Which is incredible when you consider the fact that they barely have a foothold in the American market.

01:23:51.000 Very few people buy their phones, and if they do buy their phones, they buy unlocked phones from overseas.

01:23:56.000 It's really kind of crazy.

01:23:58.000 But is there a way where they could detect whether or not there is a backdoor in these phones?

01:24:03.000 Or is it something where they could develop it to the point where you really would have no idea?

01:24:09.000 No, we stay pretty well...

01:24:15.000 Yeah, it's a good question, but I would say that as long as we continue what we're doing in terms of counterintelligence and tech advances and efforts in cyberspace and elsewhere and certainly in communications hardware...

01:24:34.000 I think we're okay.

01:24:37.000 We're good at detecting problems.

01:24:39.000 We're good at identifying weaknesses in these systems.

01:24:44.000 The problem is, again, it's a global community.

01:24:47.000 We can't isolate ourselves in terms of communications infrastructure.

01:24:50.000 It just doesn't work.

01:24:51.000 So, you know, it's like a chain and a weak link.

01:24:56.000 Yeah, see?

01:24:57.000 I gave that analogy.

01:24:58.000 That's pretty good.

01:24:58.000 Yeah, thank you.

01:24:59.000 I made that up.

01:25:00.000 You are the weakest link.

01:25:01.000 Goodbye.

01:25:04.000 So, yeah, I mean, anyway, but that's Huawei, and I do think that the interesting part will be what does the administration do in their desire to get...

01:25:13.000 Are they willing to blink on this?

01:25:15.000 Because they put their foot down, right?

01:25:17.000 And now, because we're so dysfunctional here in the States from a political perspective, now you've got people like Chuck Schumer going, well, Trump better not blink on this.

01:25:25.000 This is important.

01:25:25.000 So suddenly Chuck Schumer is a hawk on...

01:25:28.000 You know, protecting us from Chinese espionage, right?

01:25:31.000 But simply because, you know, he sees there's a political opening here.

01:25:34.000 You know, if Trump backtracks on Huawei now, hey, good from the Democrat perspective, they can use that to bang on him, you know?

01:25:40.000 Right, right.

01:25:41.000 It all comes down to politics, but...

01:25:44.000 But this is something that people didn't even understand was an issue, like, nationally.

01:25:49.000 This is something that no one was even aware of until a few months ago, and when I started reading about it, one of the first things that I was reading about was, you know, I'm kind of a technology nerd, and so I was fascinated by some of their newest phones, which were really far advanced to what you're getting offered in the United States.

01:26:06.000 Yeah, and a lot of that ability to create in record time comes from theft of intellectual property.

01:26:16.000 Yeah, and that's how they, over the years, again, that was a collective decision by the authorities there, that this is how we're going to advance, right?

01:26:24.000 They looked and they'd make a calculation that says we can't afford to wait decades while we do our own research and development.

01:26:32.000 Let's just take it.

01:26:33.000 And Huawei is not the only Chinese phone manufacturer.

01:26:37.000 There's quite a few different ones over there, but they're the only one that seems to be banned.

01:26:41.000 What's that other one?

01:26:42.000 Zombie?

01:26:43.000 There's quite a few.

01:26:44.000 There are, but Huawei has been, because of their size and their connection to the government, and because of the resources that the government's been willing to provide to them, the advantage that they have, And the speed with which they were able to kind of embed themselves into other nations' telecommunications infrastructure,

01:27:05.000 that's why they're so important, right?

01:27:06.000 But the general – yeah.

01:27:08.000 Are there other companies we – well, of course, yeah.

01:27:10.000 I mean there's a variety of companies we should be worried about from that perspective.

01:27:13.000 And it's not – look, to be fair, I spent some time on China because it's just – they're the number one state-sponsored perpetrator of theft of intellectual property. 0.60

01:27:21.000 But there's other countries involved in it.

01:27:23.000 They copy entire cities.

01:27:25.000 Yeah.

01:27:25.000 Which is really insane.

01:27:26.000 Have you seen that?

01:27:27.000 They have a fake Paris over there?

01:27:29.000 Yeah.

01:27:29.000 Yeah, I know.

01:27:30.000 Well, you know, they've got, you go some of these places, and look, Chinese history culture is fantastic, right?

01:27:36.000 And I've been over there in times, and I've just, like, marveled at how, you know, how interesting the people are, how friendly they are.

01:27:42.000 I mean, look, there's a lot of wonderful things about China, but I'm just saying the authorities, right?

01:27:47.000 The government policy of China.

01:27:50.000 No rule of law, of no protection when it comes to intellectual property, all these things and their aggressiveness and stealing information.

01:27:57.000 That's the problem.

01:27:59.000 But China as a country is a fascinating place.

01:28:02.000 So that was – I don't know why I said that.

01:28:04.000 That's just my – It is a fascinating place.

01:28:07.000 It's very, very, very, very, very old, which is something that we don't totally understand.

01:28:13.000 That was like five varies.

01:28:15.000 When you look at the history of China, it's really amazing.

01:28:20.000 It goes back so far.

01:28:21.000 When you look at this country, it's a couple hundred years and that's it.

01:28:23.000 Oh, I know.

01:28:24.000 We come across a house that's 100 years old and someone slaps a historic thing on there and you suddenly can't do anything to it.

01:28:29.000 We've faced that in the past.

01:28:31.000 Well, I know a guy's got a house that was built in the 20s and they have a historic thing on it.

01:28:35.000 The 1920s.

01:28:36.000 Soon it'll be the architecture of the 60s that we want to protect.

01:28:40.000 Yeah, probably.

01:28:41.000 Plastic over couches.

01:28:42.000 Remember that?

01:28:42.000 Oh, that was a good thing, right?

01:28:44.000 And nobody wanted to sit on those in the summer.

01:28:46.000 So what do you think is going to happen?

01:28:49.000 Do you really think the government's going to cave and they're going to give in to Huawei?

01:28:53.000 Yeah, I think so because I think they definitely want a trade deal in some capacity.

01:28:58.000 And China's not going to blink on this.

01:29:01.000 They'll figure out how to bear the burden of the tariffs and make things work for them.

01:29:07.000 So much gets built over there, too.

01:29:10.000 All the Apple stuff's getting built over there now.

01:29:12.000 There was just a recent story where Tim Cook was trying to get Trump to back down off of some tariffs because they're going to have a 25% tariff on some Apple products that they're building in China.

01:29:23.000 The idea that you can...

01:29:27.000 Huawei revenue jumps 23% despite US crackdown.

01:29:32.000 Because, look, overseas, their phones are gigantic.

01:29:36.000 They figured out...

01:29:37.000 Samsung made a huge disastrous mistake with their Galaxy Fold.

01:29:42.000 I don't know if you know, but they have the foldable phone.

01:29:44.000 Well, they have a Mate X that apparently is way better than the Galaxy Fold.

01:29:49.000 It's a better design, and it's It's viable.

01:29:51.000 It works.

01:29:52.000 Yeah, Samsung's an incredible company, and you've got an amazing history of innovation and technology.

01:29:56.000 But you're right, they've had a couple of missteps.

01:29:59.000 The Fold wasn't the only one that they had a misstep on.

01:30:01.000 The Note 7 that blow up.

01:30:02.000 Right, that's a problem.

01:30:03.000 When you've got a phone that explodes, that's not necessarily what you want in a communications device.

01:30:08.000 What, James?

01:30:08.000 What are you pointing at me?

01:30:09.000 The Huawei Mate X is not as good as...

01:30:13.000 What it says, the design changed just a few weeks before the release.

01:30:17.000 Well, what's wrong with it?

01:30:18.000 It hasn't even come out yet.

01:30:19.000 It's not changed the...

01:30:21.000 I don't know.

01:30:22.000 Yeah, but it doesn't mean it's not better.

01:30:24.000 Why are you saying it means it's not better?

01:30:26.000 The people that have tried it have said it's better.

01:30:28.000 He's just saying his last minute tweaks have been made to the device ahead of the anticipated release in September.

01:30:32.000 An additional sensor appears to have been added to the phone's camera module.

01:30:35.000 That's to find out where you live.

01:30:37.000 Exactly.

01:30:39.000 That doesn't mean it's not better, Jamie.

01:30:42.000 It's not out yet, so how would anybody know?

01:30:43.000 The people that have reviewed it.

01:30:45.000 There's people that have reviewed it.

01:30:46.000 All the tech sites have reviewed it.

01:30:47.000 But then they just changed it.

01:30:48.000 You just don't like it.

01:30:49.000 Yeah, well, they just tweet the censor. 1.00

01:30:50.000 You're just talking shit over there, buddy. 1.00

01:30:52.000 Why don't you go back to coughing on water? 1.00

01:30:53.000 Are you anti-Hawaii?

01:30:54.000 Is that what it is?

01:30:55.000 No, no.

01:30:57.000 What is your problem?

01:30:58.000 They did use the Leica name, too.

01:31:01.000 I licensed it for their camera.

01:31:03.000 I don't think that they're using Leica cameras in their camera.

01:31:05.000 Oh, they're not?

01:31:07.000 I've used it.

01:31:07.000 I used it at CES like three years ago.

01:31:09.000 I thought they used Leica cameras for the Pro or whatever it is.

01:31:13.000 They use the name, but I don't believe that it's not...

01:31:16.000 I mean, it might be a Leica sensor, but it's a microchip compared to the one I have in this camera that's very expensive.

01:31:23.000 Of course, it's very different between a camera, but I think they use Leica lenses, right?

01:31:28.000 Or Leica something like that.

01:31:30.000 Good God.

01:31:30.000 Can we get to the bottom of this?

01:31:32.000 When I was there, I was super interested in it.

01:31:34.000 I was trying to tell, what are they using about this name?

01:31:36.000 There's a photographer I follow that was promoting it.

01:31:39.000 And I was like, it just seems like they're using the name is all.

01:31:42.000 I couldn't tell that it was a better photo.

01:31:43.000 I couldn't tell.

01:31:44.000 They don't even have authorization.

01:31:45.000 They just use the name.

01:31:46.000 But that's all I couldn't tell at all.

01:31:47.000 But you don't know they're not, right?

01:31:49.000 Again, that's what I'm just saying.

01:31:50.000 I couldn't tell.

01:31:51.000 But as a photographer, all you're using is the name.

01:31:54.000 This isn't a better photo.

01:31:56.000 It doesn't have the value of the likeness.

01:31:58.000 That's what I was getting at.

01:31:59.000 They have some pretty spectacular cameras, though, Jamie.

01:32:01.000 I mean, they had the very best ever night vision camera.

01:32:05.000 Not night vision, but night sight.

01:32:07.000 Like, the ability to take photographs at night, and it looks like...

01:32:11.000 Pull up Huawei night photograph examples, because Google Pixel 3 is the second best one, but the best one is supposedly the Huawei one. 0.82

01:32:21.000 That Zoom came out a couple months ago, and people were saying that that was bullshit. 0.50

01:32:25.000 What is that? 0.95

01:32:26.000 It was like it had a super zoom technology lens that someone was zooming in real far.

01:32:30.000 There's no way that that's real.

01:32:32.000 But who said it's no way that that's real?

01:32:34.000 Photographers.

01:32:35.000 Photographers.

01:32:35.000 Reviewers.

01:32:36.000 People that are using this stuff.

01:32:37.000 But they weren't using this, though.

01:32:40.000 One thing has been proven.

01:32:41.000 One thing has been proven.

01:32:43.000 That Huawei has taken some photographs and said they were taken on a Huawei phone and they were actually taken on a very high-end camera.

01:32:53.000 Also, Huawei posted some stuff on Instagram from iPhones.

01:32:58.000 They got caught a couple times doing that, which is also quite hilarious.

01:33:04.000 But yeah, it's a sneaky business.

01:33:07.000 And if that's how they're going to do it, they're going to get in through the back door and get information through phones and modems and...

01:33:14.000 And it may not be something that they worry about now in terms of access.

01:33:19.000 I mean, people say, well, why do they want the access now?

01:33:20.000 They just want to know that they can.

01:33:22.000 I mean, imagine a conflict in the future where they have that ability, right, either to real-time monitor communications through this network that they've been able to build trapdoors into, you know, or to impact the flow of communication more aggressively, more proactively to do things.

01:33:38.000 You know, it's like mapping out our infrastructure, right?

01:33:43.000 The testing, the probing that goes on of our electrical grid is an example.

01:33:48.000 I mean, that's just planning for the future in the event that something bad is going to happen.

01:33:52.000 If there's going to be a conflict, you know, they want to know, as do we.

01:33:56.000 I mean, again, to your point that, you know, hopefully we're doing the same stuff.

01:34:00.000 Right.

01:34:02.000 So, yeah.

01:34:04.000 It's something else interesting when you're talking about China, though, and you think about, okay, what should we be watching?

01:34:10.000 We touched on Russia a little bit.

01:34:12.000 It's the possible alliance between Russia and China, and it's an interesting dynamic.

01:34:18.000 Traditionally, Russia and China haven't been together.

01:34:21.000 There have always been some areas of concern, you know, distrust.

01:34:28.000 But there are signs, there are things happening that appear as if China and Russia have made a strategic decision to align themselves closer.

01:34:37.000 And that would be because they've made that determination that somehow it's in their best interests.

01:34:42.000 You know, and not necessarily that it's going to be that way for any long period of time, but right now in the current environment, you see Russia Acting as if what they want is a stronger alliance, military alliance and political alliance, economic alliance with China.

01:34:59.000 And it's an interesting dynamic that we need to be watching, we need to be aware of.

01:35:06.000 And part of that is...

01:35:08.000 Again, this idea that there was this Russia-Trump collusion and thinking, okay, well, that's good, except our relations with Russia haven't been this bad in a long time.

01:35:19.000 So maybe it's all a very clever mind game that they're playing because they're closely aligned, but I don't think so.

01:35:27.000 So we've actually laid on more significant sanctions on Russia We've attacked them from an energy perspective in terms of our ability to create our independence, particularly from natural gas.

01:35:43.000 That has damaged Russia's abilities. 0.56

01:35:46.000 So I think there's reasons why they're gravitating towards China right now. 0.97

01:35:50.000 But this idea that somehow Trump is super friendly and is a useful idiot of Putin, it doesn't play out when you look at the reality of the relationship between the two countries. 0.56

01:36:00.000 The whole Russian collusion thing is a very confusing narrative because on one hand you have the Democrats who are saying without doubt there's Russian collusion and then the other side you have the Republicans who say the Mueller report essentially exonerated Trump. 0.93

01:36:17.000 From being a part of any sort of Russian collusion.

01:36:19.000 I don't think either one is totally accurate.

01:36:21.000 I think there's a lot of weird gray in both narratives.

01:36:25.000 I think the Democrat narrative is easier to understand.

01:36:29.000 It just makes sense from their perspective.

01:36:31.000 That's how we won.

01:36:32.000 Why wouldn't we push that?

01:36:35.000 To this day, they're just still amazed that they lost, and so there must be some grander reason why, because clearly we couldn't lose to this guy. 0.97

01:36:43.000 And it was also a talking point, much less, you know, let's hit everybody with the racist hammer.

01:36:49.000 It's a talking point, and it's worked for them over at least the first couple of years.

01:36:53.000 On the Republican side, Look, the Russians knew what they were doing, right? 0.99

01:37:01.000 They were fucking with the election on several different levels. 0.98

01:37:04.000 It wasn't just trolling through the internet. 0.98

01:37:06.000 It wasn't, you know, just placing stories that they could.

01:37:09.000 It wasn't just trying to foment, you know, divisiveness and discontent.

01:37:13.000 It was also doing these little dangle things, you know, where they're looking to see, are they going to bite?

01:37:17.000 What are they going to do?

01:37:18.000 I mean, you think about that Christopher Steele dossier. 1.00

01:37:21.000 That was a piece of shit. 1.00

01:37:22.000 I mean, if we saw that In the commercial side of things, you know, I've got a business in global intelligence and research and security, that thing was just, there was nothing, it was shot full of holes, right? 1.00

01:37:34.000 And so you think, well, what's, somebody should have asked, tell me about your sources, you know, why are your sources talking?

01:37:41.000 What was, you know, you've got to, anytime you've got a piece of intelligence, right, you've got to do a few basic things, you know, where'd it come from?

01:37:47.000 Can you explain to people what the Steele dossier was all about?

01:37:50.000 Yeah, it was basically just – look, they were going after opposition research, political opposition research, right?

01:37:55.000 So Christopher Steele, who was a paid, hired consultant, used to be with British intelligence, not a James Bond type, but a decent enough by all accounts, a decent enough guy.

01:38:08.000 But he entered the world of private sector information gathering, right?

01:38:13.000 And I've got a company that's what we do all around the world.

01:38:16.000 And you can't relax your standards just because you're now in the commercial sector, right?

01:38:23.000 When you get a piece of information, you need to test that piece of information.

01:38:27.000 And one of the first things you need to do is understand what's the sourcing for it?

01:38:31.000 And why did they have access?

01:38:33.000 You know, how credible are they?

01:38:34.000 What's their track record?

01:38:35.000 And why, by the way, are they providing this information?

01:38:38.000 And how did it eventually make its way to this report?

01:38:41.000 And those are the sort of simple things that whether you're a corporation that's gathering intelligence about a market that you may enter with an investment, Or whether you're still in the business and you're an intel officer and you're talking to a source that works in some foreign ministry somewhere,

01:38:58.000 you've got to be able to stress test the intelligence. 0.99

01:39:01.000 And shit wasn't done. 0.99

01:39:03.000 People liked what they saw. 1.00

01:39:05.000 They saw negative information about the candidate and just run with that shit. 1.00

01:39:11.000 And the more times you... 0.99

01:39:12.000 It's like the old WMD reporting that came out of the early days in Iraq. 0.99

01:39:15.000 The more you repeat it, Even if it's one source and that source is a piece of shit, when you repeat it, people are going to buy it. 0.99

01:39:21.000 Right. 1.00

01:39:22.000 Russian collusion.

01:39:23.000 Russian collusion.

01:39:24.000 Russian collusion.

01:39:24.000 You just keep repeating that and it's going to happen.

01:39:26.000 At some point it'll happen.

01:39:28.000 But anyway, so...

01:39:30.000 But it seems like Russia definitely likes to disrupt our democracy. 0.75

01:39:34.000 Absolutely.

01:39:35.000 What's the benefit of that?

01:39:37.000 Well, part of it is...

01:39:40.000 In the old days, it was sort of a struggle for supremacy in the world, right?

01:39:44.000 I mean, that's kind of at its core.

01:39:47.000 That's what it was, right? 0.99

01:39:49.000 And their ability to chip away in faith in democratic institutions was at the core of a lot of the crap that they pulled. 0.99

01:39:57.000 And it still is. 0.96

01:39:59.000 I mean, so that's all the...

01:40:00.000 When you're talking about a propaganda effort like the screwing with the last election, what's their goal?

01:40:06.000 Well, their goal isn't necessarily...

01:40:08.000 That's where they...

01:40:09.000 Do they care whether one candidate or another wins?

01:40:12.000 Well, maybe they do, right?

01:40:14.000 But you'd be hard-pressed to argue that they were working against Hillary Clinton, who had said, you know, we want to have a reset and have a new relationship with Russia and work with them.

01:40:26.000 I mean...

01:40:26.000 Maybe they looked at Trump and thought, yeah, that's the guy we want to work with.

01:40:29.000 But over that, the more important issue was in just chipping away at Americans' belief in democratic institutions.

01:40:37.000 Get us all so that we question the credibility of a democracy.

01:40:41.000 And that's been the fundamental belief for propaganda efforts within the old KGB and now the FSU. So it's as simple as that in a way.

01:40:53.000 And it worked.

01:40:55.000 Look at this.

01:40:56.000 We've spent years now just bitching at each other and yelling and screaming and complaining and we bought into it because we all, like we talked about before, we all were easily duped.

01:41:06.000 And I don't know how you get around that.

01:41:08.000 I don't know how we walk that back.

01:41:10.000 Maybe we don't, but I think it's an informed public that helps to battle this.

01:41:14.000 But we haven't, we lost sight of what was important here.

01:41:18.000 And so I think the public needs, it's their responsibility.

01:41:21.000 You like this?

01:41:22.000 You know, you like where you live?

01:41:24.000 Then you gotta make an effort to try to keep it, right?

01:41:27.000 And part of that is being an informed public and understanding what hostile elements may be out there, you know, without being paranoid, but just understand why they're doing things in the way that the world operates. 0.74

01:41:37.000 And you'll always have that group of people that don't buy into any of that bullshit and think we should all be holding hands.

01:41:44.000 Yeah, that's a fun one. 0.97

01:41:48.000 That's a fun narrative.

01:41:50.000 It's a good narrative.

01:41:51.000 It's a happy narrative, right?

01:41:53.000 When you've talked to people that have seen terrible things that take place all around the world, that narrative is hard to swallow. 0.92

01:42:00.000 When you read about these gang members that are coming in and growing pot and fucking shooting at people, they've got these high-level task force just to deal with these cartel members that are growing weed. 0.87

01:42:12.000 And that's just one part of what they're doing, right? 0.97

01:42:14.000 That's just human trafficking and everything else that they get involved in, extortion.

01:42:18.000 Ventanile, which is probably the scariest.

01:42:20.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:42:21.000 And that's it.

01:42:22.000 And that's what you have to worry about.

01:42:23.000 If you push them out of the market because you legalize everything, which I'd assume that's kind of the direction we're going, then do they fill that gap, again, from a revenue perspective with fentanyl or something else, whatever the next choice is?

01:42:36.000 How do you stop the infiltration?

01:42:39.000 How do you stop the gang members from coming in here?

01:42:42.000 I mean, how do you do that, other than eliminating them, other than having some sort of a tactical operation?

01:42:47.000 Well, there is that.

01:42:48.000 Well, that seems like the only operation that would make any sense in my mind.

01:42:52.000 Yeah.

01:42:53.000 Well, it's like jihadism. 0.61

01:42:54.000 You can't kill your way out of it, right?

01:42:55.000 It doesn't mean you shouldn't make a good-faith effort.

01:42:57.000 But for the drug control, for the narcotics, counter-narcotics...

01:43:04.000 Part of it is what we talked about also about working with the other governments, right?

01:43:08.000 We've had some success in doing that, where you work with the Mexican authorities, you work with Colombians or out in Southeast Asia, you know, to try to, you know, push back on the heroin trade.

01:43:20.000 And so you work...

01:43:21.000 Through them to some degree.

01:43:23.000 But that's tough, right?

01:43:24.000 There's so much corruption over there.

01:43:25.000 Yeah, there's so much corruption.

01:43:26.000 And that's the problem.

01:43:28.000 And it's unsatisfying because you don't see an immediate return sometimes.

01:43:33.000 And it's also, it sometimes seems like it's just a big, you know, bottomless pit where you're tossing money, right, and effort and resources.

01:43:41.000 But it's something that has to be done.

01:43:43.000 It doesn't mean you shouldn't still do it.

01:43:46.000 But it is.

01:43:47.000 I mean, corruption in a place like Mexico, where the people just don't have any faith in the institutions because they've lived in this system for so long where all the officials, in their minds anyway, are corrupt.

01:44:00.000 The police are corrupt. 0.61

01:44:02.000 The federales are corrupt. 0.83

01:44:04.000 You know, the marines down in Mexico are probably the most trusted institution because they're not viewed in the same vein.

01:44:10.000 They're not viewed as corrupt.

01:44:12.000 Only the Marines?

01:44:13.000 Well, yeah, pretty much.

01:44:14.000 I mean, it's odd, but that's a large organization, and they've been able to kind of stay above the fray to some degree, which is interesting.

01:44:22.000 I have no idea, but it's been the perception, and for the most part, it's true. 1.00

01:44:28.000 When you work down there, often enough, you do get that impression, but it's how do you get rid of that endemic corruption in that society and turn that public perception around?

01:44:40.000 You know, because that will impact.

01:44:42.000 I mean, look what happened in the previous administration when they seriously went after cartel members.

01:44:47.000 Remember that spree of violence that they kicked off?

01:44:50.000 It was in part because the Mexican authorities were going after cartels in a more serious manner, right?

01:44:56.000 Previous to that, they were managing the problem.

01:44:58.000 So they said, okay, look, let's manage down the violence, and we'll let you keep doing your business.

01:45:03.000 It's going to happen, so you guys do your business, but just, you know, let's keep sort of public order, you know, as something that we want to demonstrate that we're capable of.

01:45:12.000 And when they went after the cartels in a more serious manner, that's when that real harsh spree of violence kicked off.

01:45:20.000 And, you know, there was more headroom, so these various members were, you know, they were combating each other, and they were going after the public.

01:45:27.000 They understood that they had to, you know, basically wear down the public, which is what happened. 0.99

01:45:32.000 The public said, after a while, they said, fuck it, we can't deal with this. 0.99

01:45:34.000 The violence is too much. 1.00

01:45:35.000 It's awful.

01:45:36.000 And so...

01:45:38.000 Government, you know, eventually went back to managing the problem.

01:45:41.000 Drug trade didn't go away, of course.

01:45:42.000 They just went back to the old ways of doing things.

01:45:45.000 But the violence is just so intense.

01:45:47.000 The public eventually just said, we can't, no.

01:45:49.000 And I think the cartels knew that.

01:45:51.000 They understood that, right?

01:45:52.000 And so they were willing to do it.

01:45:56.000 Well, the most ridiculous aspect was that Fast and the Furious deal where they were literally selling drugs to the cartels so they could track them.

01:46:05.000 And those drugs were used to eventually kill some U.S. officers.

01:46:08.000 Right, right.

01:46:09.000 Yeah, I mean, it was...

01:46:11.000 Did I say drugs?

01:46:12.000 I said drugs.

01:46:13.000 I meant guns.

01:46:14.000 I did say drugs.

01:46:15.000 I'm conflating things.

01:46:16.000 Those guns that they used, they did kill officers, right?

01:46:20.000 Yeah, there was an officer in particular that was killed, and the Fast and Furious, anytime you talk about as part of an intelligence collection effort, right, or a law enforcement effort, that you're going to supply the hostile element with weapons or whatever it may be,

01:46:40.000 it's probably going to go sideways, right?

01:46:44.000 But that seems like a great way to cover the fact that you were selling guns.

01:46:49.000 I mean, if I was really skeptical, I would say, well, what are you going to do?

01:46:53.000 We're going to sell them guns. 0.99

01:46:54.000 How the fuck are you going to sell them guns? 0.99

01:46:55.000 Well, we're going to say that it's an intelligence gathering thing. 0.99

01:46:59.000 We're going to sell them guns. 0.91

01:47:01.000 Yeah.

01:47:01.000 I mean, if you're really cynical, which a lot of people are.

01:47:04.000 A lot of people are, yeah.

01:47:04.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:47:05.000 No, I think it was a fucked up operation. 0.99

01:47:08.000 There's no doubt about it. 0.99

01:47:09.000 And I'm not a fan of, you know, it's sort of like the same in the gray arms marketing, you know, sort of on a global basis.

01:47:14.000 When you talk about, you know, like...

01:47:16.000 You know, because again, what are you looking to do?

01:47:18.000 You're looking to create movement, track, you know, movement of gear or money or resources or personnel or whatever.

01:47:24.000 There's ways you can do that, you know, without creating potential for a complete goat rope, and unfortunately Fast and Furious did that.

01:47:31.000 Well, it had to be a goat rope.

01:47:33.000 You're giving people the ability to kill people. 0.93

01:47:35.000 Yeah. 0.96

01:47:35.000 You're giving them guns. 0.96

01:47:36.000 Yeah.

01:47:37.000 And do they have chips on the guns? 1.00

01:47:39.000 Like, how are they even tracking these goddamn guns? 0.99

01:47:41.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:47:41.000 Yeah, that source is method shit, but it's, going back to Mexico, and how do you resolve that? 0.99

01:47:52.000 Because that impacts, again, that impacts us, it impacts our national security, right? 0.99

01:47:55.000 Well, they're literally connected to us.

01:47:58.000 We're so concerned with Afghanistan and Iraq, they're nowhere near us, and we've got this thing connected to us that's literally filling this country with illegal drugs. 1.00

01:48:07.000 They sell meth, they sell fentanyl.

01:48:10.000 Afghanistan.

01:48:11.000 In fact, they're coming up on another election, presidential election in mid, I think mid-September.

01:48:16.000 Are you going to run?

01:48:17.000 You know, I'm thinking about it.

01:48:18.000 I'm thinking about it.

01:48:19.000 Moving the family over there.

01:48:20.000 You could do it.

01:48:21.000 You could be the king of Afghanistan.

01:48:22.000 Yeah, me and Boris Johnson and Trump would get together.

01:48:26.000 But, yeah, they've had an increase in bombings, you know, Taliban stepping it back up.

01:48:31.000 Sure.

01:48:31.000 And, I mean, we don't think about it.

01:48:34.000 Nobody wants to think about that shit anymore. 0.99

01:48:35.000 You think about how many years, you know, we've been... 1.00

01:48:37.000 We're good to go.

01:48:57.000 So you're right in a sense.

01:48:59.000 Did we take our eye off the ball?

01:49:01.000 Yeah, we did.

01:49:03.000 And were there other issues that we should have been more focused on?

01:49:07.000 Yeah, sure.

01:49:08.000 But then you're conflicted because you think of all those people that fought and died over there and the effort that other people came back with horrible wounds and the trauma of all of that.

01:49:20.000 You know, I feel somewhat conflicted because then you talk about, you know, you don't want to minimize what they did, right, for the country.

01:49:31.000 But you also have an obligation, I think, to look at policy and what did we do and what was the purpose of it?

01:49:37.000 What was the point of that exercise?

01:49:39.000 And I don't think we still to this day know, right?

01:49:41.000 I mean, what are we going to create some pseudo-state federal government there that's going to be a bastion of democracy?

01:49:47.000 It's not going to happen.

01:49:48.000 So anyway, I don't want to disappear down the Afghanistan rabbit hole. 1.00

01:49:51.000 But we'd like to think that we could turn that into another America.

01:49:54.000 That's what we like to think.

01:49:55.000 When we think about nation building, we think that we can go in there and establish democracy and these people are going to be better and they're going to be able to go to school and it's going to change the whole environment.

01:50:05.000 Yeah, I guess.

01:50:06.000 And that is true.

01:50:07.000 And we talked about Iraq that way.

01:50:08.000 If we just make Iraq a bastion of democracy, then maybe it'll help to turn the tide in the Middle East and suddenly everyone will have more of a respect for individual liberties and rights and all the rest of that. 0.96

01:50:18.000 How'd that work out?

01:50:19.000 You know, I'm still looking into it.

01:50:21.000 I'll come back again and I'll give you my report.

01:50:23.000 I think it's going to be negative.

01:50:25.000 I think a million people have died.

01:50:26.000 Yeah.

01:50:27.000 That's not good, right?

01:50:29.000 That's typically never good when you get to those numbers.

01:50:32.000 It's a large number.

01:50:33.000 Yeah.

01:50:34.000 But again, look at it. 0.99

01:50:35.000 I mean, the shit that we don't want to talk about. 0.99

01:50:37.000 Look, we don't want to talk about Syria. 1.00

01:50:39.000 Nobody wants to talk about Syria.

01:50:41.000 And, you know, Assad, you know, his butcher, he's still in charge.

01:50:45.000 Why is he in charge?

01:50:45.000 Well, because Russia propped him up.

01:50:47.000 We want a Russia problem, along with Iran. 0.99

01:50:49.000 There's a nasty piece of work there, as an axis goes.

01:50:55.000 Russia had no intention of letting Assad go.

01:50:58.000 We should have been able to figure that one out.

01:51:00.000 But we didn't, and in part because we have these impulses that say, well, we're going to do better, and because we're going to create this ability for people to create their own democracy.

01:51:13.000 So, yeah, so anyway, Syria is, again, one of those places that nobody really wants to discuss or talk about.

01:51:21.000 We've got attention deficit disorder.

01:51:24.000 Nobody talks about North Korea anymore.

01:51:25.000 Remember, we're all going to get blown up by Kim Jong-un.

01:51:27.000 Yeah.

01:51:28.000 Eh, let's move on.

01:51:29.000 Well, there's pictures of Trump shaking his hand, so we're buddies now.

01:51:32.000 We're good.

01:51:32.000 We're homies.

01:51:32.000 Yeah, we're all good.

01:51:33.000 We're all good.

01:51:35.000 Yeah, I mean, the last article I read about North Korea was about how did Kim Jong-un get his Mercedes, since there's some sort of a boycott or an embargo.

01:51:45.000 Yeah, well, and that's another part of it, is...

01:51:50.000 Although we've been more successful, I will say this, we've been more successful than in the past, and part of that is a technology issue.

01:51:57.000 We've gotten better at imposing and enforcing sanctions than we used to be, and part of that is because our abilities to understand the movement of money Tracking transactions is better than it used to be.

01:52:12.000 So the sanctions, as an example, we put on Iran.

01:52:16.000 This is the most difficult time that this regime has faced in Iran since the fall of the Shah.

01:52:24.000 And it's because we've gotten better at looking at Russia, China in particular, that traditionally always kind of circumvented the sanctions.

01:52:33.000 We're better at enforcing that.

01:52:36.000 And we're better at working with the EU and pressuring them, right?

01:52:39.000 I mean, so that's a good thing, but I don't know where that's going, you know?

01:52:45.000 I mean, Iran is kind of flailing about a little bit.

01:52:48.000 They seized a tanker, you know, a British tanker.

01:52:50.000 They actually seized a couple, but they're holding on to one.

01:52:53.000 In response to – they were trying to ship a bunch of oil over to Syria against sanctions that exist, right?

01:53:00.000 So they had a tanker that was taking 2 million barrels or whatever of oil over to Syria and the British in the territorial waters of Gibraltar intercepted that ship.

01:53:11.000 That was the beginning of July.

01:53:13.000 And in response, the Iranians have done a number of things, right?

01:53:17.000 But the most recent thing that they've done was they seized a British flag tanker and they're still holding the crew.

01:53:23.000 And that's sort of an example of – I don't want to say they're desperate, right?

01:53:29.000 Because they've got an ability, I think, to withstand and their control over the population is so strong.

01:53:35.000 But it's an example, I think, to some degree of them flailing a bit and trying to figure out what are they going to do?

01:53:41.000 What's their next move?

01:53:42.000 And I know people say, well, we shouldn't have gotten out of the deal and we shouldn't have this issue anyway because it's Trump's fault for getting out of the deal.

01:53:51.000 But again, I don't have a lot of confidence in them sticking to the terms and agreements of any deal because they've never done it in the past.

01:54:00.000 There's always been effort and they've always broken it.

01:54:02.000 The agreement.

01:54:03.000 So I don't know why suddenly they would change their tune.

01:54:06.000 If we can keep the sanctions on hard enough and force them to the table, the only thing they care about is staying in power.

01:54:11.000 If they think they're going to lose that grip on power, they'll come to the table and they'll make a better deal.

01:54:15.000 And that deal would include us being able to access their military facilities for inspections.

01:54:20.000 We had no access to any other military sites in that country because we didn't make it a condition of the deal.

01:54:27.000 So we basically said, sure, we want verification that you're following the agreements. 1.00

01:54:31.000 They said, well, fuck you. 0.99

01:54:32.000 These are the places that we agree to let you look at. 1.00

01:54:36.000 I don't want to oversimplify, but that was the terms of the deal.

01:54:39.000 And so any deal that we do with them in the future needs to be able to say, no, we want 100% verification.

01:54:45.000 Because as John Kerry said, that's what you want.

01:54:47.000 You want to be able to verify.

01:54:48.000 So when we heard about it, what we're hearing in the news from the people that are opposed to the deal is that Trump broke this deal and he was foolhardy to do so, that Obama had put in place this deal and that Trump had broke it and it sort of leaves us in this terrible quagmire.

01:55:03.000 But what you're saying is that the deal was terrible.

01:55:06.000 And that it didn't really give us access to understand exactly what their nuclear program was, what their military program was.

01:55:13.000 So it wasn't a good deal.

01:55:14.000 It wasn't wise to keep it.

01:55:16.000 If the way that you judge the value of a deal, and this is what the previous administration, the Obama administration did, was to talk about how it's important that we verify and we've got verification.

01:55:28.000 Well, yeah, you've got verification of the sites that the Iranians agreed to let us look at.

01:55:33.000 And so, yeah, it was a deal.

01:55:36.000 Was it a good deal?

01:55:37.000 No.

01:55:37.000 They wanted to sign this deal and the Iranians knew it.

01:55:41.000 And so, yeah, I think that That justified saying, no, we're going to redraw this.

01:55:49.000 And even the EU, which has been clinging to the old agreement, even the EU says, well, yeah, we could improve it.

01:55:56.000 We could make it better.

01:55:57.000 But there's no – if you just keep things as they were, there's no incentive for the Iranian regime to make any concessions or improve it.

01:56:04.000 So the point being is we're trying to force them back to the negotiating table.

01:56:08.000 And again, given that their self-interest is to stay in power – And remain in charge, then, you know, with the economy and the condition that it's in currently, if it gets much worse and they feel as if they're losing a grip on the population, then I suspect they will come.

01:56:25.000 They're not going to lash out.

01:56:26.000 Iran doesn't want a—nobody wants a military conflict.

01:56:29.000 We don't want it.

01:56:29.000 They don't want it.

01:56:30.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:56:31.000 Can they close the Strait of Hormuz, you know, where, depending on who you're talking to, a fifth of the world's oil passes through?

01:56:38.000 Yeah, they could close it temporarily or cause some friction, but they don't have the ability to shut it down for any real period of time.

01:56:46.000 We've just got too much in terms of leverage over there and our assets.

01:56:51.000 So, yeah, who knows?

01:56:53.000 But I'm one of those people that says, you know, we...

01:56:56.000 We shouldn't have done that deal until we got it right.

01:56:58.000 And just saying that we got a deal for the sake of it because you had partial verification doesn't give you anything.

01:57:05.000 We've had partial verification of their programs for decades and they just keep advancing their program.

01:57:11.000 So do you think this criticism of backing out of the deal that you're hearing from Democrats is basically just a criticism of Trump?

01:57:17.000 Sure.

01:57:17.000 Just an opportunity to...

01:57:18.000 Yeah, everything's a criticism.

01:57:19.000 I think everything is a criticism of Trump.

01:57:21.000 Is that a problem?

01:57:23.000 Because Trump is such a...

01:57:25.000 Polemic figure because he's – so many people just hate him that any opportunity to have some sort of political talking point against him sort of confuses what the actual issue is itself.

01:57:40.000 Yeah.

01:57:41.000 I mean I think it's no doubt he's – yeah.

01:57:43.000 I think what happens is both sides – We lose in this one because the Democrats just sort of blindly, you know, accuse him of everything's bad, right?

01:57:55.000 And no matter what he's doing, no matter what policy is, it's all bad, right?

01:57:58.000 And so that's not where you want to be.

01:58:00.000 And on the Republican side, you know, you tend to think that that's the case.

01:58:06.000 You know, you don't have an honest, intelligent discussion about policy.

01:58:13.000 You have an honest map of the landscape.

01:58:14.000 Right.

01:58:14.000 And so, again, we're sitting in trenches throwing hand grenades at each other.

01:58:18.000 It's like World War I, right?

01:58:19.000 Right.

01:58:19.000 And nobody's going to get out and venture into no man's land in the center.

01:58:23.000 Nobody's living in the center anymore.

01:58:25.000 So I just think everybody...

01:58:27.000 It's a disservice to everybody.

01:58:29.000 But yes, I think most things that come out of Capitol Hill right now is based on...

01:58:34.000 Look, here's an example.

01:58:38.000 My daughter went...

01:58:39.000 She just got out of grad school.

01:58:40.000 And she's done a number of internships.

01:58:43.000 She's worked over in Asia.

01:58:43.000 She's been in China on internships.

01:58:46.000 And she's... 0.98

01:58:47.000 Smart kid.

01:58:48.000 I'm subjective.

01:58:49.000 Smart kid.

01:58:49.000 But she went for a job up in Capitol Hill.

01:58:52.000 And it was not a direct hire, meaning the office had to go through the other offices to get approval to hire an individual to fill this position.

01:59:01.000 And because the House is controlled by Democrats now, she was – everybody looked and said, yeah, she's a top candidate. 0.99

01:59:11.000 We want to offer the job.

01:59:13.000 Well, what happened was they submitted her details that we want to hire this person to this office within Capitol Hill controlled by the Democrats now because it's a House majority.

01:59:26.000 And they came back and said, no, because you know why?

01:59:29.000 Because she did an internship in the current administration, right?

01:59:33.000 So a young person wanting to work in D.C. in policy and security studies and elsewhere, Doing a variety of internships around the globe, does an internship at the White House.

01:59:46.000 Normally you would think that's a good thing, right?

01:59:47.000 So they said, no, because she did this internship at the White House, we're not going to approve the hiring. 1.00

01:59:53.000 And then it turns – well, she did an internship in Bill de Blasio's office too, right?

01:59:57.000 And so they said that.

01:59:58.000 And the response was, well, we don't like him either.

02:00:01.000 Which I think was – that actually provided some humor, right, to the whole situation.

02:00:05.000 But it shows you – I mean that's a little tiny thing and it's a personal issue.

02:00:08.000 But it shows you – Washington, D.C. is possibly the most dysfunctional location in all of North America.

02:00:17.000 That's terrible.

02:00:18.000 Yeah.

02:00:18.000 And it's not the way it should be.

02:00:21.000 We should be able to have policy discussions.

02:00:23.000 We should be able to make decisions.

02:00:25.000 You may not like Trump.

02:00:26.000 You may not have liked the previous president. 1.00

02:00:28.000 But, you know, again, we've got to stop this bullshit where everybody's a racist. 1.00

02:00:34.000 Everybody's a sexist. 1.00

02:00:36.000 It's not the way this country is supposed to work.

02:00:39.000 And people, you know, you can't even get away from, okay, who's at fault?

02:00:42.000 Everybody's at fault.

02:00:43.000 The right and the left are all guilty of creating this divisiveness.

02:00:47.000 What is the cure to outrage culture?

02:00:49.000 I mean, how do you get past this?

02:00:51.000 That's the real question, right?

02:00:52.000 I mean, what is the...

02:00:53.000 I don't see a map.

02:00:54.000 And I was going to ask you this about foreign policy, because as a guy who has been involved in the CIA for as long as you have and has seen all the inner workings of government and all the conflict, and do you ever feel like you just...

02:01:09.000 We're just running up a 70 degree sand dune that you're never going to get to the top of.

02:01:15.000 You know what I mean?

02:01:16.000 It just seems like it never ends.

02:01:17.000 I mean, you're just basically trying to like, oh, there's another hole in the dike.

02:01:21.000 Let me put my finger in this one.

02:01:22.000 Oh, water's coming out of this one.

02:01:24.000 Let me get my finger in this one.

02:01:25.000 And it never ends.

02:01:26.000 Yeah.

02:01:27.000 Running up the sand dune, that's a good analogy.

02:01:30.000 That's what it seems like.

02:01:31.000 It's like a million mile high sand dune.

02:01:34.000 Yeah.

02:01:34.000 Like this.

02:01:36.000 Look, D.C. has always been divisive.

02:01:38.000 Politics have always created division.

02:01:40.000 The press has always been biased in one way or another.

02:01:42.000 These things aren't new.

02:01:44.000 And we always tend to think it's the worst we've ever seen.

02:01:46.000 Look, the Civil War was pretty bad.

02:01:48.000 That was pretty divisive.

02:01:50.000 So when you have a politician, like I think it was Joe Biden, right? 0.87

02:01:53.000 That said that the president is the most racist president we've ever had.

02:02:00.000 And you think, well... 0.91

02:02:01.000 I don't know.

02:02:02.000 We've had presidents that own slaves, bro.

02:02:04.000 Exactly.

02:02:04.000 Twelve presidents that own slaves.

02:02:06.000 I think that might have been a problem.

02:02:09.000 Or the race relations are the worst they've ever been.

02:02:12.000 And you think, how about the 60s?

02:02:13.000 That was pretty bad.

02:02:15.000 And the Civil War.

02:02:18.000 Doesn't do anybody good to say that.

02:02:20.000 I know.

02:02:21.000 But I guess my point being is that you can fall into that trap where you think it's as bad as it's ever been.

02:02:28.000 I think it's fair to say that it is more polarizing now than in recent times.

02:02:33.000 And how do we walk it back?

02:02:35.000 How do we dial it down a little bit?

02:02:37.000 And how do we actually focus on what's important for the general population?

02:02:40.000 There's a lot of big issues we should be solving, right?

02:02:42.000 I mean, but look at the insanity of when we talk about health care, right?

02:02:46.000 It's like, oh, it's got to be all this or it's got to be all that.

02:02:49.000 Nobody's over in the middle saying, well, you know, you could take a little bit of this and that.

02:02:52.000 And again, how do you walk that back?

02:02:54.000 It's way above my pay grade.

02:02:56.000 I hunker down in Idaho and I go fishing and I don't think about it.

02:03:00.000 Well, that's a good way to do it, but I don't see any solution that anybody has that makes any sense.

02:03:05.000 And that's one of the things that terrifies me.

02:03:07.000 And I don't want to just step away. 0.98

02:03:09.000 I don't want to be that guy that moves to fucking... 0.99

02:03:12.000 Idaho. 0.99

02:03:13.000 I wasn't even going to say I know.

02:03:15.000 I was going to say Alberta.

02:03:16.000 Oh, there you go.

02:03:17.000 Alberta.

02:03:17.000 Farther north.

02:03:19.000 Saskatoon.

02:03:19.000 Yeah.

02:03:20.000 Edmonton.

02:03:21.000 New Zealand, maybe.

02:03:22.000 Great people.

02:03:23.000 Oh, yeah.

02:03:24.000 I love Edmonton.

02:03:25.000 Yeah.

02:03:25.000 But, I mean, it's like...

02:03:26.000 What are we doing in Edmonton?

02:03:27.000 UFC. Oh, okay.

02:03:28.000 And a show.

02:03:29.000 Oh, you did?

02:03:30.000 River Creek Casino.

02:03:31.000 Yeah, it's...

02:03:33.000 I just feel like there's no real general solution.

02:03:37.000 Nor is there a map of a potential solution.

02:03:41.000 And if we get a Democrat in the White House, it's not going to end.

02:03:45.000 Do you remember when Obama was in office?

02:03:47.000 They were mad that he wore a gray suit or a tan suit.

02:03:50.000 It was a tan suit.

02:03:51.000 They were making fun of his suit. 1.00

02:03:51.000 What the fuck do you care? 1.00

02:03:53.000 This is all you care about. 1.00

02:03:55.000 It's like...

02:03:55.000 This polarization, the Fox News versus MSNBC polarization, that doesn't help anybody.

02:04:02.000 And it's so bananas that if you have a podcast like mine and I have a left-wing person on, I'm a sellout.

02:04:09.000 If I have a right-wing person on, I'm a Nazi.

02:04:12.000 And it just goes back and forth.

02:04:14.000 You can't even talk to people anymore, which is...

02:04:16.000 No.

02:04:17.000 It comes down to you can't have policy differences anymore, right?

02:04:20.000 It's got to be some personal animus that you've got towards that other individual, which is... 0.99

02:04:28.000 Again, it's horseshit. 0.87

02:04:29.000 You can have policy differences with people. 0.98

02:04:34.000 And that doesn't make you a bad person.

02:04:38.000 It doesn't make you – sure, there's other racists out there. 0.98

02:04:40.000 Of course there are frigging racists out there, right? 0.94

02:04:42.000 But that's – we've lost the meaning of the term when you just start hurling that around at anybody you disagree with, right? 0.99

02:04:48.000 Or when people say, well, if you like Trump, you're a racist, right?

02:04:51.000 Well, congratulations.

02:04:52.000 You're probably driving those people to definitely vote for them in 2020. That is absolutely a fact.

02:04:58.000 That's one thing that I completely agree with you on, that I think that this idea that...

02:05:03.000 Everybody who supports Trump is racist. 1.00

02:05:06.000 It makes those people so angry that they just want to go, okay, well, you're obviously nuts. 1.00

02:05:11.000 I can't be on your side. 1.00

02:05:13.000 You people are crazy. 1.00

02:05:13.000 You want to open up the borders, and you want to take all the money from everybody that's a hard-working American and give it to all the poor people and fuck you. 1.00

02:05:21.000 And it's like the arguments just get so confused. 0.99

02:05:23.000 Yeah, I don't know where it's...

02:05:25.000 I mean, if you think about who might win, I don't think Joe Biden's going to last.

02:05:29.000 I think they're going to eat him alive.

02:05:30.000 It's not going to make...

02:05:32.000 It's going to be, I think, Bernie and Kamala Harris and Tulsi Gabbard.

02:05:37.000 Those are the only ones that makes...

02:05:38.000 Tulsi makes sense to me.

02:05:39.000 She's a veteran.

02:05:41.000 She's a congresswoman for six years. 1.00

02:05:42.000 She seems incredibly honest, and her morals and her ethics are on point.

02:05:47.000 I like her.

02:05:48.000 She's my favorite.

02:05:49.000 But if the left is going to have someone, they're going to have to be able to deal with Trump's insults.

02:05:56.000 They're going to be able to debate him.

02:05:58.000 And that's where they all fall apart because they're trying to use that old model of politics.

02:06:03.000 And he's not doing that.

02:06:05.000 He's a showman.

02:06:06.000 And I think what's happening is the people that count in the primary, that's a completely different bag than what goes on in the general.

02:06:18.000 I think the people that are in the primary right now, all those people that are going to be voting in the primary, they're watching these debates, as an example, or they're just watching the daily Twitter feed from these people, the candidates, and they're thinking, can I see this person debating Trump, right?

02:06:32.000 Right.

02:06:34.000 But not only are the policies that these candidates are spouting are moving further and further to the left, which is going to make it harder when the general election comes to shift to the center.

02:06:44.000 They're not going to be able to do it, right?

02:06:45.000 That center is now shifted further to the left if they even make the effort to get back there.

02:06:50.000 But...

02:06:51.000 You know, you're getting sort of like the worst instincts coming out from these candidates because they think, well, I got to show that I can throw a firebomb here because they're looking at me as, you know, can I debate Trump, right?

02:07:02.000 And so you're going to get somebody who's not – so I don't think Tulsi Gabbard is going to make it because I think they're going to make that calculation.

02:07:08.000 I think that you're probably going to look in there.

02:07:10.000 You're going to end up with Harris or maybe Warren.

02:07:13.000 Warren is not going to make it.

02:07:14.000 Yeah, I don't know.

02:07:15.000 That Native American thing is going to sink. 1.00

02:07:17.000 You would think so, right?

02:07:18.000 You would think so.

02:07:19.000 Harvard actually touted her in some of their literature when they were talking about their diversity efforts over the years.

02:07:25.000 There's actually documents where Harvard was saying, you know, and we hired the first Native American professor.

02:07:31.000 Here's a statistic.

02:07:32.000 I'm 200 times more African than she is Native American.

02:07:36.000 How about that?

02:07:38.000 I'm basically African.

02:07:39.000 Are you?

02:07:40.000 Yeah.

02:07:40.000 I didn't know that.

02:07:41.000 1.6%.

02:07:43.000 1.6%?

02:07:44.000 Yeah.

02:07:44.000 From where?

02:07:45.000 I don't know.

02:07:46.000 Africa?

02:07:47.000 Well, you know.

02:07:48.000 23andMe.

02:07:49.000 That's a big place.

02:07:50.000 It's a whole continent.

02:07:51.000 Yeah, it's a whole continent. 0.99

02:07:52.000 Someone from that continent fucked one of my ancestors. 0.99

02:07:55.000 What if you find out it's South Africa, though? 0.99

02:07:57.000 Then it's not quite as interesting.

02:07:58.000 Yeah, it's not quite as interesting.

02:07:59.000 Well, that's Dutch, right? 0.78

02:08:01.000 You get Dutch genes.

02:08:02.000 Yeah, boar.

02:08:03.000 Yeah.

02:08:04.000 Yeah, I haven't done that.

02:08:05.000 My daughter did it, and I have not done that.

02:08:09.000 I actually had a conversation the other day about this whole thing, about the desire to know your ancestry and everything.

02:08:13.000 And my dad came over, never talked about his background, never talked about his family.

02:08:21.000 He's a CIA dad.

02:08:22.000 Yeah, there you go.

02:08:24.000 Knows how to keep his mouth shut.

02:08:26.000 And so he never demonstrated that interest, right?

02:08:29.000 And so therefore, I don't think I've ever been, I've never just been that focused on it. 0.96

02:08:33.000 Everything was in there that I knew was in there, mostly Italian, a little bit of Irish, but some weird shit, like 1% Asian. 0.97

02:08:40.000 I thought that was odd, too. 0.98

02:08:41.000 Any Scottish?

02:08:42.000 No.

02:08:42.000 There's always a lot of Scottish floating around out there.

02:08:44.000 Like the fuck? 1.00

02:08:45.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:08:46.000 Wear kilts.

02:08:47.000 That's right.

02:08:48.000 They get out.

02:08:48.000 They get out and about.

02:08:51.000 Yeah.

02:08:52.000 Yeah, I don't know.

02:08:53.000 I don't know where it's all going, but I do think that Warren could be Viewed.

02:08:58.000 I don't like her.

02:08:59.000 Trouble crusher.

02:09:00.000 But I think the base looks at her and thinks, yeah, she could be a firebrand. 0.99

02:09:04.000 But how could they after that whole Native American thing? 1.00

02:09:07.000 She built her career on a lot.

02:09:08.000 They don't care.

02:09:09.000 But America does care.

02:09:11.000 That's the problem.

02:09:12.000 America cares. 0.99

02:09:13.000 You can't look past that the same way you couldn't look past Hillary being a liar. 0.97

02:09:17.000 Hillary tried to say that her name came from Edmund Hillary, the guy who climbed Mount Everest.

02:09:23.000 Meanwhile, he climbed Mount Everest three years after she was born.

02:09:27.000 But you know what?

02:09:28.000 He was still quite the character before.

02:09:30.000 So, you know, they were still throwing that name around.

02:09:33.000 That's amazing.

02:09:33.000 Yeah.

02:09:35.000 More than three years, isn't it?

02:09:36.000 Yeah.

02:09:37.000 After she was born.

02:09:38.000 Might have been seven years.

02:09:39.000 Yeah.

02:09:39.000 But you think, it won't be, I don't think it'll be Bernie.

02:09:42.000 I don't think, you know.

02:09:43.000 Why not?

02:09:44.000 Come on! 0.61

02:09:45.000 Democratic Socialism!

02:09:47.000 Someone should go up to Vermont and look around Vermont and see what kind of job Bernie's done in Vermont.

02:09:52.000 How about Pete Buttigieg?

02:09:53.000 Buttigieg. 0.99

02:09:54.000 They fucking hate him in his own city. 0.99

02:09:56.000 Mayor Pete, they're pissed at him in South Bend. 0.99

02:09:59.000 He could form a ticket with de Blasio.

02:10:00.000 That'd be a powerful mayoral ticket right there. 0.71

02:10:03.000 There's no one person that stands out.

02:10:05.000 There's no one person that stands out as someone who's going to win.

02:10:09.000 You know, everyone's like, ooh, could this person make it?

02:10:11.000 Could that person make it?

02:10:13.000 And then there's people that want to challenge Trump, which is hilarious.

02:10:15.000 Well, I think there's going to be—we're going to lose a lot of these folks after this next round of debates, which I guess tonight, tomorrow night.

02:10:20.000 Is it?

02:10:21.000 I think there's a—it's not an A and a B card, but there's two nights of debates because there's so many of them.

02:10:26.000 There's bouts.

02:10:27.000 There's bouts.

02:10:28.000 Did you see the Pacquiao fight?

02:10:29.000 Yes.

02:10:30.000 Yeah.

02:10:30.000 Fucking great, man.

02:10:31.000 He still got it. 0.99

02:10:33.000 40 years old, drops Thurman in the first round.

02:10:35.000 I know.

02:10:35.000 Thurman's a beast, too, man.

02:10:37.000 That's crazy.

02:10:37.000 That was a great moment, and then it was an interesting fight.

02:10:41.000 And I thought, I wasn't quite sure at the end where it was going to go, but I liked, I've watched Pacquiao over the years, and it's kind of that typical, you know, you get older and you're kind of rooting for the old guy, right?

02:10:52.000 He's incredible.

02:10:53.000 At 40 years old, he is the oldest man to ever capture the welterweight title.

02:10:57.000 Yeah.

02:10:57.000 And particularly when you consider those lighter weight classes, like Foreman won the heavyweight title at 46, which was crazy.

02:11:03.000 But Pacquiao winning the welterweight title at 40 is fucking bananas. 0.99

02:11:07.000 Working their ass off. 0.98

02:11:08.000 It was a good, good fight.

02:11:11.000 I really enjoyed that.

02:11:12.000 That was the first time I really watched a fight that I really enjoyed, beginning to end.

02:11:17.000 And I was with some folks who were not for Pacquiao, and I kept looking at them thinking...

02:11:22.000 How do you not like that?

02:11:23.000 He's the old guy.

02:11:24.000 He's been doing this forever.

02:11:25.000 He's a senator.

02:11:26.000 Think about that.

02:11:27.000 That's crazy.

02:11:27.000 He was going back to work on the budget issues in the Philippines after the fight.

02:11:30.000 That's crazy.

02:11:32.000 I think he made $10 million on that, I think.

02:11:34.000 Yeah, he did.

02:11:35.000 Good for him.

02:11:37.000 Good for Keith Thurman, too.

02:11:38.000 He made $2.5 million.

02:11:39.000 Did he?

02:11:40.000 Got some cheddar now, Keith.

02:11:42.000 Holla at your boy. 0.81

02:11:43.000 I love it.

02:11:44.000 Mayweather was in the audience.

02:11:45.000 Yeah.

02:11:46.000 Well, that would be fantastic.

02:11:47.000 I mean, now's the time to do it if Mayweather really wants to do it.

02:11:50.000 But Mayweather might watch that fight and go, yeah.

02:11:52.000 Because the first time they fought, Pacquiao had a blown out shoulder.

02:11:55.000 And a lot of people were angry.

02:11:57.000 There was actually even talk of a class action lawsuit against Pacquiao after the fight because people had bet on him. 0.99

02:12:04.000 And he knew his shoulder was fucked up. 0.98

02:12:06.000 He'd heard it in training. 0.99

02:12:08.000 I think he got a cortisone shot and said, I'm just going to try to fight on.

02:12:11.000 And then he wound up getting shoulder surgery.

02:12:13.000 And then from then on, after rehab, looks fantastic.

02:12:17.000 That's really interesting, though, the concept of could you push through a class action lawsuit with an athlete who is in that position, right?

02:12:24.000 I mean...

02:12:25.000 Yeah.

02:12:26.000 Where does that go?

02:12:27.000 I mean, then if you're playing hurt, I mean, you're in the NFL and you're playing hurt, right?

02:12:30.000 Right.

02:12:31.000 Do you have any obligation?

02:12:32.000 No.

02:12:33.000 I mean, it's interesting.

02:12:34.000 Well, UFC fighters fight hurt all the time.

02:12:36.000 I know for a fact.

02:12:37.000 Guys fight with blown-out ACLs and torn hamstrings, and they just...

02:12:41.000 Listen, they get to that point, they think, I can still win, and some of them still win.

02:12:44.000 Kamaru Usman won the title with a broken foot.

02:12:47.000 He broke his foot in training, and he was literally on crutches the week of the fight. 0.96

02:12:53.000 And then the guy gets to the fight, and he's such a fucking animal and so tough that he fought like there was nothing wrong with him. 0.97

02:13:01.000 And then afterwards revealed that he had broken his foot. 0.99

02:13:04.000 Fucking bananas. 0.99

02:13:05.000 The mental toughness that you have to have to be able to do that for a living. 0.99

02:13:09.000 And when you lose to somebody with a broken foot.

02:13:12.000 Yeah.

02:13:13.000 Yeah.

02:13:14.000 It was dominated.

02:13:16.000 He dominated Tyron Woodley, which is even crazier.

02:13:18.000 But then Woodley went into that fight injured as well.

02:13:20.000 I mean, it's just the nature of the beast.

02:13:22.000 If your job is to hurt people and break their bodies, you're going to have to practice breaking bodies along the way, and you're going to have to practice it with people that are trying to break your body, and occasionally they succeed.

02:13:32.000 Yeah.

02:13:33.000 Yeah.

02:13:33.000 Rough business.

02:13:35.000 You've got to come.

02:13:35.000 Come to an event.

02:13:36.000 Actually, I would like to do that.

02:13:38.000 There's one in Anaheim in a couple of weeks.

02:13:39.000 You should come to that one.

02:13:40.000 It's a big one.

02:13:41.000 Daniel Cormier is fighting Stipe Miocic for the heavyweight title.

02:13:44.000 In a couple of weeks?

02:13:45.000 Yep.

02:13:45.000 Nate Diaz is fighting Anthony Pettis.

02:13:48.000 That's a crazy fight.

02:13:49.000 And Paulo Costa is fighting Yoel Romero.

02:13:52.000 Two, or three rather, epic fights.

02:13:55.000 I'm just praying in Anaheim.

02:13:57.000 Praying no one gets injured.

02:13:58.000 Maybe Jesus.

02:14:00.000 Yeah, you know what?

02:14:00.000 I bring Scooter.

02:14:01.000 Scooter likes it.

02:14:02.000 Bring Scooter! 1.00

02:14:03.000 Yeah, he likes that.

02:14:03.000 Come on down, man.

02:14:04.000 Set it up.

02:14:05.000 You know what?

02:14:06.000 I'll follow up on that.

02:14:07.000 I will do that.

02:14:07.000 All right, and tell me when your show comes out so I can let the people know.

02:14:10.000 Maybe you can come back on again whenever it actually...

02:14:12.000 If you wouldn't mind, once they give me the go-ahead, because apparently I'm prescribed from talking about it, but when they give me the go-ahead, you won't be able to get it to shut up.

02:14:19.000 All right.

02:14:19.000 Or just keep talking.

02:14:20.000 Thank you, Joe.

02:14:20.000 We'll do that.

02:14:21.000 Thank you, sir.

02:14:21.000 Thank you, man.

02:14:22.000 Good times.

02:14:22.000 All right, bye, everybody.

02:14:29.000 Fun times, man.

02:14:30.000 That was a good one.

02:14:31.000 Yeah, thank you, man.

The Joe Rogan Experience - July 30, 2019

Joe Rogan Experience #1327 - Mike Baker

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