The Joe Rogan Experience - November 26, 2019


Joe Rogan Experience #1391- Tulsi Gabbard & Jocko Willink

Topics
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Hosted by
Joe Rogan
Guests
Tulsi Gabbard Jocko Willink
Mentioned
Donald Trump Tulsi Hillary Clinton Bernie Sanders Sam Harris Gaddafi Jocko Elizabeth Warren Pete Buttigieg Jamie Richard Spencer Hickson Gracie Joe Biden Obama Tucker Carlson Andrew Yang Pence Madam Marianne Williamson Mark Zuckerberg and 40 more
Joe Rogan Experience #1390 - Tim Dillon Joe Rogan Experience #1392 - Zach Bitter

Episode Stats


Length

2 hours and 36 minutes

Words per minute

175.09

Word count

27,480

Sentence count

2,216

Harmful content

Misogyny

49

sentences flagged

Toxicity

134

sentences flagged

Hate speech

29

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

On this episode of the podcast, I sit down with Tulsi Gabbard to discuss her campaign for the 2020 Democratic presidential nomination. We talk about why Tulsi is running for president, how she got started in her campaign, and what it's like being a woman running for President of the United States. I also talk about how she feels about being attacked by the media and how she deals with it, and why she thinks it s important to have a woman on the ticket who's a combat veteran and a woman who's running for the White House. I hope you enjoy this episode and that it gives you some insight into who Tulsi really is, what she's all about, and how important it is to have someone like her on the campaign trail. Thank you so much to Tulsi for being on the show, and thank you to J.J. Cole for being a part of this journey with me and my team. I can't wait to do it again next week. Thank you also to my good friend and good friend, Amy Poehler. She's a force to be reckoned with in the Democratic primary field, and I know she's going to do her best to make 2020 the best possible possible for her campaign. I'm looking forward to working with her to make a difference in November 2020! Thanks Amy, Amy, I appreciate you, Amy and I appreciate your support, Amy! - Thank you Amy, thank you, Thank you for being here. - Tom, Tom, and God bless you, God Blessings, Blessings Blessings. - Tom and Jocko, Jockos - Elyssa, Tom and Cheers, Jon Jon and Joe ( ) . - Jon & Taffy , & Joc Tom . . Jon, Jon, Joc & Terence Joc and J.A. (J. ( ) - J.R. ( ) - Jon & J.V. ( ), and Jon ( ) . Joe ( ) & Jon ( , J.E. ( ). John ( ) ( ) Thank you, Jon & John (J) (Josie (J). (A. J. (AJ) & Jon (S.J.) (Tulsi ) (Alyssa) And Jon (A)

Transcript

Transcripts from "The Joe Rogan Experience" are sourced from the Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool. Explore them interactively here.
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:03.000 Alright, here we go.
00:00:04.000 How did this get started?
00:00:05.000 How did we decide to do this?
00:00:07.000 I was trying to think about that, because it's something you and I started interacting on.
00:00:11.000 It was somebody on Twitter.
00:00:13.000 I don't know exactly how it started, but I saw you reply to a tweet from somebody saying, hey, great idea.
00:00:20.000 Why doesn't Jocko and Tulsi go on the Rogan show?
00:00:25.000 And he's like, yeah.
00:00:26.000 Cool.
00:00:27.000 Yeah, you're like, I'm in.
00:00:28.000 Yep, I'm in.
00:00:29.000 But Jocko, he'll say that to anything.
00:00:31.000 Yeah.
00:00:31.000 Want to go to the moon?
00:00:32.000 I'm in.
00:00:33.000 The moon's good.
00:00:34.000 Roger.
00:00:37.000 But it escalated quickly from there, because I didn't know how to get ahold of you.
00:00:40.000 And then next thing I know, you're texting me with Jocko, like, so are you serious?
00:00:45.000 Are we doing this or what?
00:00:47.000 Well, it just seemed like such a good idea.
00:00:48.000 I agree.
00:00:49.000 It's like, whoever it was, salute to whoever you are out there.
00:00:52.000 Thank you.
00:00:52.000 Good job.
00:00:53.000 Just seemed like a wise thing to get together.
00:00:55.000 Because both of you are veterans, and both of you, I'm sure, have things you agree on and disagree on.
00:01:01.000 But you're in a really unique position here.
00:01:04.000 You know, and since you've been on the podcast, a lot of things have happened.
00:01:08.000 The big one is when you rightly called out Kamala Harris on her past and what she's done.
00:01:17.000 And then it seemed like everybody's attacking you.
00:01:20.000 It's like that opened up the floodgates and then there was all these hit pieces.
00:01:23.000 And me as an observer watching from the outside, I was like, wow, look at the machine work.
00:01:28.000 Look at the attack dogs go.
00:01:30.000 Like, look at this.
00:01:31.000 It's very transparent.
00:01:32.000 Ah!
00:01:33.000 If you're paying attention.
00:01:34.000 If you're paying attention.
00:01:35.000 The thing is, if you're on the outside and you watch it all happen, then you go, oh, I see what's going on.
00:01:40.000 But if you just happened upon one of those articles, you go, oh, she's an Assad supporter. 0.81
00:01:45.000 Oh, she's a terrible person. 0.99
00:01:47.000 Oh, she's a this and a that. 0.97
00:01:49.000 It was amazing.
00:01:50.000 It was amazing to watch.
00:01:51.000 I've never met anybody.
00:01:53.000 Like you, that's run for president, like I knew you when people didn't know you that well, and then all of a sudden people know you way more, and now you're kind of a household name.
00:02:02.000 So to watch this process and to watch all the machinery sort of move in your direction, it's very interesting.
00:02:10.000 What's it been like for you?
00:02:12.000 I mean, that literally is our challenge here, is we are up against the most powerful overall political machine.
00:02:21.000 When you look at this machine that's revved up their engines to try to define me as something that casts suspicion or doubts or whatever in people's minds.
00:02:35.000 We're good to go.
00:02:53.000 The status quo that they represent and that they've profited off for a very long time.
00:03:00.000 So my campaign, we don't take any contributions from PACs or lobbyists, fueled completely by contributions from individual people.
00:03:10.000 And they are outspending us by many, many multiples where we need help To challenge their narrative with the truth, telling me, hey, this is who I am.
00:03:21.000 This is why I'm running for president.
00:03:23.000 This is the experience and the background that I bring to this job.
00:03:26.000 We've got to be able to bypass that mainstream corporate media and just go directly to voters.
00:03:35.000 What does the experience of being attacked feel like?
00:03:40.000 God, I feel like I'm used to it.
00:03:44.000 It's nothing that I've ever really taken personally because I understand the situation.
00:03:54.000 I understand that whatever the smears are, however radical they are, it shows me that they feel threatened.
00:04:04.000 And they are concerned about both the unifying message that I'm bringing because we have Democrats, Republicans, Libertarians, Independents who are joining this coalition that is fueling our campaign and it's a campaign of by and for the people and one that's actually speaking the truth.
00:04:24.000 That's calling for an end to these regime change wars, calling for A de-escalation of tensions between the United States and other nuclear-armed countries, an end to this new Cold War, nuclear arms race.
00:04:34.000 Actually, hey, let's focus our limited taxpayer dollars on actually serving the needs of our people.
00:04:41.000 That's really the message that we're bringing, and it scares the hell out of them.
00:04:45.000 What's interesting is, for me, again, as an outsider, it's a clear...
00:04:50.000 Clear recognition that what they want versus what they say they want are two very different things.
00:04:56.000 Exactly.
00:04:57.000 The Democratic Party has always been like, we want a woman.
00:04:59.000 Okay, I got you a woman. 1.00
00:05:00.000 How about a woman that's a veteran? 1.00
00:05:01.000 Check.
00:05:02.000 How about a woman that's a congressman? 1.00
00:05:04.000 How about that?
00:05:05.000 Congresswoman, veteran.
00:05:07.000 Minority. 0.51
00:05:07.000 Minority from Hawaii. 0.51
00:05:09.000 All these positives.
00:05:11.000 They're trying to dig up dirt on you.
00:05:13.000 They don't have anything.
00:05:13.000 They should be behind you.
00:05:14.000 They should have wind in your sails.
00:05:16.000 And the other thing they're saying is that, you know, in order for Democrat to beat Donald Trump in 2020, you're going to have to be able to take Trump voters away from him.
00:05:26.000 You're going to have to win over those independents who stayed home in 2016, or even some of those Democrats who voted for Trump because they feel like our party has left them behind.
00:05:36.000 Guess what?
00:05:37.000 Check, check, check, check.
00:05:39.000 Yeah.
00:05:51.000 Yeah, that's the big one, right?
00:05:53.000 Has there ever been someone in your position that's gotten caught in such a crossfire?
00:05:59.000 Like, to be taking this much heat from the party that you're trying to represent, it seems, I don't remember this happening.
00:06:08.000 Well, they thought Harris had a real shot, and she sunk Harris' ship.
00:06:11.000 That's exactly what happened.
00:06:12.000 I mean, if you look at this, there's a direct correlation between where Harris was standing and where she's at now in that debate.
00:06:18.000 It just, you put holes in her boat. 0.93
00:06:20.000 Which was, you know, I was raising some very important issues related to criminal justice reform, you know, ending the federal marijuana prohibition, and essentially pointing to leadership, because we're all asking to lead this country and bring the experience that each of us has that's very distinct and different.
00:06:41.000 And her whole campaign was based on the premise of being a prosecutor for the people, being the Attorney General here in California, Okay, you've said you're proud of your record.
00:06:53.000 This is what you have done when you were in a position to make a positive change for the people.
00:06:59.000 Instead, you chose to do otherwise.
00:07:01.000 And I think that speaks louder than words.
00:07:03.000 When you had more bullets in the chamber, too, because there was other things you didn't even touch on.
00:07:07.000 You didn't really touch upon her saying to single mothers that she was going to prosecute them and lock them up if they didn't get their kids in school. 1.00
00:07:16.000 And laughing as she did so.
00:07:17.000 Yeah, I mean, I've seen her talk about that as if it's a good idea, that this was a good solution.
00:07:24.000 To scare single moms with a fear of jail if their kid didn't go to school. 0.66
00:07:30.000 That's the challenge of this debate format that's so frustrating.
00:07:35.000 You've got 60 to 75 seconds to get your point across, to be able to talk about, hey, here's my position.
00:07:43.000 Here's what I would do with North Korea. 0.99
00:07:46.000 Here's how I would deal with immigration reform in 60 seconds or less.
00:07:53.000 Jocko, I don't even know how you stand politically, which is hilarious, because you're one of the few guys that's just not defined politically online.
00:07:59.000 Because people think of you as such a savage, they leave all the politics out of it.
00:08:03.000 They just go, I don't know what, he just gets up at 4 o'clock in the morning, leaves a puddle of sweat.
00:08:08.000 He's America.
00:08:09.000 He's Team America.
00:08:09.000 That's what I'm saying.
00:08:11.000 It seems like you don't have this thing with left or right.
00:08:15.000 You don't have this right or left distinction.
00:08:17.000 Yeah, and what's really interesting, if you look at the demographics of the people I meet when I go and speak, it's everyone.
00:08:23.000 It's everyone from every different spectrum.
00:08:25.000 And I'm just talking, my political beliefs are like, hey, I believe in individual freedom.
00:08:33.000 Mm-hmm.
00:08:33.000 Well, that seems to me—it's kind of hard to argue against that, right?
00:08:37.000 I believe in individual freedom, and with that goes some level of individual responsibility.
00:08:42.000 Yep, okay.
00:08:43.000 I don't think the government is a great solution to a lot of our problems, you know?
00:08:49.000 So for me, it's like, you know, smaller government, probably a better thing.
00:08:54.000 And I think probably why you get this impression from me is I actually have a balanced, I believe that the solutions are somewhere balanced.
00:09:03.000 And in America right now, that doesn't really get a lot of traction because everything is broken down into such little tiny sound bites of you're either pro this or you're against it.
00:09:13.000 And there's no gray area.
00:09:14.000 And by the way, If you believe yes, and I believe no, I actually hate you. 0.99
00:09:20.000 And I'm going to attack you.
00:09:22.000 And that's why when I started going back and forth with Tulsi, I kind of get a gist of what she thinks.
00:09:28.000 And I'm like, oh, cool.
00:09:29.000 Guess what I think?
00:09:30.000 She surfs.
00:09:52.000 Yeah.
00:09:53.000 Is our ego, right?
00:09:55.000 Our ego, we pin ourselves into a corner where it's like, I believe this.
00:09:59.000 And now the last thing we can do is say, oh, actually, you know what?
00:10:02.000 That's a good point, Joe.
00:10:03.000 I never thought of it from that perspective before.
00:10:05.000 And also just thinking of what other people's perspectives are.
00:10:09.000 Because, you know, you just talked about single moms. 0.99
00:10:11.000 Well, you've got to take that into perspective.
00:10:12.000 Because it might be easy for me to say, because I've got kids, but I've got a wife, and we can make things happen.
00:10:17.000 But, oh, single moms over here working two, three jobs. 1.00
00:10:19.000 You know, you always talk about me getting up at 4.30 in the morning.
00:10:22.000 And I always say, look, there's single moms out there that are getting up at 3.30 in the morning to go work their first shift at the diner so they can get to their second shift at the grade school or wherever they're working so they can do their third shift at some other restaurant at night. 1.00
00:10:34.000 Like, okay, that's going on.
00:10:36.000 I gotta understand that perspective, and we all have to understand that perspective.
00:10:39.000 And the last thing, when you talk about this 60-second answers, which is insane, and I've been interviewed on TV before a bunch as well, and it's actually crazy.
00:10:49.000 When you compare it to a podcast, it's completely crazy that you have to fit your thoughts into one sentence, maybe two sentences.
00:10:57.000 And the 24-hour news cycle that we're on...
00:11:00.000 Every news story that comes out is the end of the world, right?
00:11:05.000 It's like the end of the world.
00:11:06.000 Everything that happens is, hey, Trump did this or Pelosi did that.
00:11:10.000 This is the end of the world.
00:11:12.000 Just like when if Hillary got elected, it's the end of the world. 0.97
00:11:15.000 If Trump gets elected, it's the end of the world.
00:11:17.000 I had early on, right after Trump got elected, Somebody I was doing a reddit AMA and as soon as I signed on for my reddit AMA up pops this question and it's Clearly the guy had spent a lot of time writing it and it was this this sort of breakdown of the Russians and Trump and all this negativity and And you know I basically took his whole paragraph and I answered it in one sentence.
00:11:41.000 I said America is stronger than one man And that's the truth. 1.00
00:11:46.000 Like, hey, America is stronger than one man.
00:11:48.000 One man is not going to take down this country.
00:11:51.000 That's the way it is, right?
00:11:52.000 It's hardship to turn.
00:11:54.000 Look at what Trump's got accomplished.
00:11:55.000 You know, he's working as hard as he can to get stuff done and he can barely move the needle, right?
00:12:00.000 That's the way it is.
00:12:01.000 And on top of that, look at what happens with our political system.
00:12:05.000 You know, we had Carter.
00:12:06.000 Oh, there's a backlash against Carter.
00:12:07.000 We have Reagan.
00:12:09.000 Oh, you know, these things go back and forth.
00:12:11.000 We end up with Clinton, then we end up with Bush, and then we end up with Obama, and then we end up with Trump.
00:12:17.000 So there's a balance that happens out.
00:12:19.000 So when I think of my political beliefs or where I stand politically, it's like, oh, you're not going to be able to place me very well because I'm going to listen to what different people have to say.
00:12:30.000 I'm going to try and understand what their perspectives are, and then I'm going to say, oh, not what's best for me or what satisfies my ego, but what's good for America.
00:12:38.000 Well, it actually makes sense for America, and that's what I would move forward on. 0.52
00:12:42.000 Tulsi, have you thought at all about doing a podcast of your own?
00:12:46.000 I have.
00:12:47.000 It's been just a function of time and capacity.
00:12:52.000 Almost like you could just have someone record some of your thoughts while you're on tour and just do it, you know, like it doesn't have to be overproduced.
00:13:00.000 Just real simple, release it.
00:13:02.000 But that ability to get those thoughts out there in a way where you can form full sentences, explore ideas, express your concerns, talk about it without the pressure of this buzzer when...
00:13:15.000 When you're in the middle of something, Congresswoman, Congresswoman, Congresswoman.
00:13:19.000 We've got to cut the commercial break.
00:13:21.000 The tide is waiting.
00:13:22.000 Congresswoman, we've got to sell a Toyota truck. 0.99
00:13:24.000 It's so goddamn crazy. 0.95
00:13:26.000 This is how we decide our leaders. 0.98
00:13:28.000 And the idea that, isn't it possible, can't someone step up, can't Apple or fucking Samsung or something step up and say, we are going to advertise at the beginning of this show And then we're going to promote the whole show. 0.73
00:13:41.000 So the whole show, we're going to just let it run with no commercial interruptions. 0.84
00:13:46.000 Let's do a few hours.
00:13:48.000 That's what should happen.
00:13:49.000 Why are we doing an hour?
00:13:50.000 Why is it two hours?
00:13:51.000 It should be as long as it takes.
00:13:54.000 Didn't Lincoln do speeches that were hours long?
00:13:57.000 Yelling, right?
00:13:58.000 No microphone?
00:14:00.000 It's so strange that we have decided that this commercial-oriented, meaning it has to be sandwiched in between commercials, that this is the way we are going to let our potential future leaders discuss the most important thing on Earth.
00:14:17.000 And it's going to be interrupted by, what, gum?
00:14:20.000 No, it's true.
00:14:21.000 Like, what are you selling in between? 1.00
00:14:23.000 It's so dumb! 0.99
00:14:24.000 And people are getting really turned off by it. 1.00
00:14:27.000 Because they have alternatives.
00:14:28.000 They have alternatives, and they're not getting anything of value from the conversation that's happening on these debates that are really like political reality TV. They are completely set up for conflict and confrontation to drive up ratings so that they can make more money.
00:14:45.000 The corporate media can make more money.
00:14:46.000 The first debate...
00:14:48.000 Had something like 22 million viewers.
00:14:50.000 The one that we just did, I think, had 6.6 million viewers.
00:14:55.000 And I meet people almost every single day.
00:14:57.000 They're like, man, I don't got time for that.
00:14:59.000 I don't get anything from it anyway.
00:15:02.000 And rather than...
00:15:05.000 Rather than it being this money-driven, ratings-driven venture, which the media is doing across the board, both its debates and kind of what issues they're choosing to cover, go back to the League of Women Voters, who used to actually host presidential forums that would have real questions about real issues that people care about in a way that's not broken up by commercial breaks in advertising so that people can make money.
00:15:32.000 Yeah, and this is not hard to do.
00:15:35.000 YouTube is available for virtually anyone who wants to set up an account.
00:15:39.000 This all could be done, and it could be done very easily.
00:15:43.000 Where we're showing is the fragility, this antiquity, this ancient system that doesn't make any sense.
00:15:50.000 And we're seeing it evaporate before our eyes.
00:15:52.000 And with a guy like Trump.
00:15:53.000 And then people are using these debates knowing that they're going to get these sound bites.
00:15:59.000 And you can see some of them work, like yours with Kamala Harris, and some of them don't.
00:16:04.000 Like when she was attacking Elizabeth Warren for not wanting Trump to get kicked off of Twitter.
00:16:09.000 Do you read his Twitter?
00:16:10.000 It's fantastic.
00:16:12.000 Keep him on.
00:16:13.000 That's the best way we understand who he really is.
00:16:16.000 I mean, you can get some of that out of speeches, but when he posts a picture of Greenland with a giant Trump Tower in it and says, I promise not to do this, listen, if you're on Team America, you want that guy to keep tweeting.
00:16:28.000 You know what's going on.
00:16:30.000 It's hilarious, too.
00:16:32.000 You called it a while ago when you say, hey, there's no comedians that have that skill, which Trump has, of cracking jokes, making fun of people, letting the other jokes roll off his back because he doesn't care what people say about them, basically.
00:16:46.000 And no one's really had to contend with that until now.
00:16:49.000 Yeah, it's really interesting.
00:16:51.000 Like, no one knows how to handle it.
00:16:53.000 It's really fun.
00:16:54.000 I mean, when you watch the original Republican debates, when he was running for president, and he starts attacking these guys, you see them, Marco Rubio, you see them lock up, you know, Crazy Ted, like, oh, he's going after me!
00:17:06.000 He's ruining my thing!
00:17:08.000 It's just, it's a nutty place to watch.
00:17:12.000 Do you get to hang out with Kamala Harris backstage?
00:17:15.000 No.
00:17:16.000 No.
00:17:16.000 I mean, there's...
00:17:16.000 Oh, is everyone separated?
00:17:18.000 No.
00:17:18.000 There's like a...
00:17:19.000 Just like a little holding area kind of space, like a lot smaller than this room, so...
00:17:25.000 And you're all hanging out in there together?
00:17:27.000 During the commercial breaks, yeah.
00:17:29.000 But do you say anything to you?
00:17:30.000 Do you have eye contact with her?
00:17:31.000 No.
00:17:31.000 No?
00:17:32.000 Maybe every now and then, but I honestly like...
00:17:36.000 Yeah.
00:17:39.000 I'm probably not on the top of her friend list.
00:17:42.000 Yeah.
00:17:43.000 You sang her battleship.
00:17:44.000 And then...
00:17:45.000 I mean, Hillary Clinton.
00:17:47.000 Yeah, that was another one.
00:17:48.000 What's up with that war?
00:17:51.000 Because again, she's the matriarch of the Clinton family, and there she is, the hero to many people of the Democratic Party.
00:18:00.000 And you two are scrapping.
00:18:04.000 Did you supported Bernie in 2016?
00:18:09.000 Is that where it started?
00:18:09.000 Yeah.
00:18:10.000 Okay.
00:18:10.000 And that was something, yeah, back in 2016, I was the vice chair of the Democratic National Committee.
00:18:17.000 Therefore, as an officer, the DNC had to remain neutral in the presidential election, which was my plan to do so.
00:18:24.000 I really made the decision to resign from that seat so that I could endorse Bernie Sanders, largely because of his Yeah, I think.
00:18:54.000 And I saw that in those debates at that time, the conversations that were had, the media was not bringing up this difference between the two of them so that voters could make an informed choice of who they want their commander-in-chief to be, which to me, just as a soldier, as a veteran,
00:19:09.000 as an American, I'm like, how can you not be putting this issue at the forefront?
00:19:14.000 So I resigned from that position, endorsed Bernie Sanders, started going out and just talking about and raising these issues on the campaign trail.
00:19:21.000 But I remember one of the first interviews that I did on MSNBC, the host of the show saying, aren't you afraid of what the Clintons will do to you?
00:19:32.000 I said this on live television.
00:19:35.000 Oh, man.
00:19:38.000 You know, my answer was no, obviously, but it was interesting to see the reaction, like, the days after when I first went back to D.C. after I made that announcement of endorsement.
00:19:51.000 And friends of mine, you know, politicians in Washington, they were like, man, Tulsi, like, go with God, sister.
00:19:59.000 It's a different animal.
00:20:01.000 See, like, if you get into some sort of verbal altercation with Joe Biden, there's no concern for your life.
00:20:08.000 I'm not saying it's real or not, but the rumor is always, there's a thing called the Clinton body count.
00:20:14.000 I don't know if that's real.
00:20:16.000 I don't think it is real.
00:20:17.000 There's probably some of it, most of it, let's say it's all made up.
00:20:20.000 The fact that that's out there, that the thought is out there, that they will whack you.
00:20:25.000 Well, there's, I mean, the people who are saying, hey, look, you know, there are lists that are kept and your political career will be over.
00:20:31.000 That was really the message that I got from people who've been around the block a few times.
00:20:35.000 And I think the most recent thing that came up with what Hillary Clinton said about me is not a spat between two people.
00:20:44.000 It really just shows the complete difference between And the conflict in our foreign policy views of what I call the Bush-Clinton doctrine of interventionism and regime change wars and warmongering versus what I'm putting forward,
00:21:02.000 which is let's stop the regime change war world's police policies. 0.94
00:21:07.000 I work to end this new Cold War and arms race, put the interests of the American people first, always ensuring that we have a strong and capable, ready military to defend our nation and our people, and honoring that service and sacrifice that our troops give by only sending them on missions worthy of their sacrifice, 0.78
00:21:27.000 maximizing diplomacy, engagement with other countries in the world, I think?
00:21:47.000 It's because of this change in foreign policy that I'm bringing about, because when it comes right down to it, you know, whether you're going back to the Cold War, back to Vietnam War, back to, you know, the Iraq War overthrowing Saddam Hussein, Libya, Gaddafi, the media has always kind of been this cheerleading voice for these wars to happen,
00:22:05.000 sending a very clear narrative out to the American people.
00:22:08.000 And I think it comes down to it's good business for them.
00:22:10.000 It's good ratings, make some money.
00:22:12.000 I want to talk to you about that, but I want to talk to you about what she said to you, or about you rather, that she said that you were a Russian asset.
00:22:18.000 That was the insinuation, right?
00:22:21.000 Yeah.
00:22:23.000 What was the base of that?
00:22:24.000 Completely baseless.
00:22:26.000 That's what's weird, right?
00:22:26.000 How does someone who was running for president...
00:22:30.000 And it is one of the most prominent politicians in our country.
00:22:34.000 How do they get away with saying something that's such a huge accusation with no information to back it up?
00:22:44.000 It would be a good question for a normal person, but when you look at the power of the Clinton machine, when you look at the power of the political establishment, which is made up of people who are either part of the...
00:23:03.000 Clinton's so-called family or who are part of this political establishment that is built on the same foundation that she, Hillary Clinton, laid.
00:23:12.000 When you look at the media establishment, who've been pushing a lot of the same narrative and a lot of the same message, then you can see how somebody gets away with calling a sitting member of Congress, a candidate for president, A soldier actively serving the Army National Guard,
00:23:30.000 veteran of two Middle East deployments, basically a traitor to the country that I love and that I'm willing to lay my life down for and to get away with it without any evidence or base whatsoever.
00:23:41.000 Not just that, but no pushback.
00:23:43.000 No.
00:23:43.000 That was the most bizarre thing.
00:23:45.000 No one said, hold on.
00:23:47.000 What are you saying she is?
00:23:48.000 You're saying she's a Russian asset.
00:23:50.000 Define that.
00:23:51.000 What do you mean by that?
00:23:52.000 Do you mean an unwitting Russian asset?
00:23:54.000 Are you saying that Russia's behind her to try to...
00:23:57.000 To do something against Bernie or Elizabeth Warren or whatever the consensus pick is?
00:24:01.000 Like, what are you saying?
00:24:02.000 There was no questions like that.
00:24:04.000 There were no questions like that.
00:24:06.000 And look, even if there were witting or unwitting, so she's basically either saying that I'm a traitor to my nation Welcome to my show!
00:24:34.000 And again, without any base.
00:24:37.000 And I think that's the, like, this is bigger, this is really not about me.
00:24:41.000 The danger here of what she did and how the media responded and how almost every single other candidate for president refused to comment, refused to denounce what she said. 0.83
00:24:56.000 I think Bernie is an exception, Marianne Williamson, Andrew Yang, a couple of them had the courage to say, hey, look, this is ridiculous.
00:25:04.000 The fact that that was the response is really – it has a chilling effect on our freedom of speech in this country.
00:25:14.000 And it sends a message that whether it's Tulsi Gabbard or any other American or any other veteran who dares to stand up and challenge the establishment, challenge this foreign policy narrative, call for peace, call for an end to these senseless,
00:25:30.000 unnecessary regime change wars, then you too – Can be smeared.
00:25:35.000 Your character can be smeared.
00:25:38.000 Do you ever think you could reach a tipping point where this happens enough?
00:25:43.000 This kind of thing happens where you just say, all right, I'm done with, in this case, the Democratic Party.
00:25:48.000 I mean, even after what they did to Bernie in 2016, right?
00:25:53.000 I'm sure that had to be a tipping point for a lot of people that said, wait a second, this is the guy we wanted, and you totally hosed him, and now we got this woman over here, but we didn't want him. 1.00
00:26:02.000 How many times can this happen before people go, oh, you know, I'm done with this?
00:26:08.000 I see this as something that's bigger than just the Democratic Party, because we see how this kind of foreign policy elite and establishment in Washington has crossed both parties over different times.
00:26:23.000 And it's something that I think goes much deeper than that.
00:26:25.000 I'm working to bring about reforms in the Democratic Party to make it so that it is more democratic, more open, more transparent, more inclusive and welcoming of people who may agree on some issues, disagree on others, but one that is actually serving as a platform for the people,
00:26:45.000 fighting for the people, thinking about what's in the best interest of the people.
00:26:48.000 That's the kind of change and reform that I'm working to bring about in the party.
00:26:53.000 But I think the forces that we're challenging here are actually much bigger than that.
00:26:58.000 I mean, you got to give a lot of credit to the Republican Party because the establishment Republicans, the last human being in the world that they wanted to run for president on the Republican ticket was Donald J. Trump.
00:27:12.000 Right.
00:27:12.000 And they tried hard to beat him.
00:27:14.000 They tried.
00:27:14.000 But once he was in, they said, that's our president.
00:27:16.000 And that's a very wise thing to do.
00:27:18.000 And, you know, that's where the fear is with a lot of Democrats that someone is going to go independent.
00:27:25.000 And that someone who is popular, perhaps you, would go independent and suck a lot of the votes away from the Democratic Party.
00:27:32.000 People disagree with the direction it's going.
00:27:34.000 And then that's how the Republicans would win.
00:27:36.000 Yeah, I'm not going to do that.
00:27:38.000 I've been asked that a ton of times since, I don't know, months ago.
00:27:43.000 And every single time I've been asked, I've said the answer is no.
00:27:46.000 I'm running to be the Democratic nominee.
00:27:47.000 I will not run as a third-party candidate.
00:27:50.000 And I think that's something else that's been interesting and, again, very transparent if you're paying attention is...
00:28:09.000 Because she's not playing ball! 1.00
00:28:14.000 No, and they're clearly trafficking in things that aren't true.
00:28:18.000 Again, why?
00:28:19.000 To raise that question in people's minds and to raise that suspicion and to do their best to try to undermine the support that we're getting from people.
00:28:28.000 They did that interview with you on The View.
00:28:32.000 Oh, you saw that.
00:28:33.000 Yeah, and they said something about Richard Spencer, the white supremacist.
00:28:38.000 So this is of all the things they bring up.
00:28:41.000 They say, Richard Spencer, a white supremacist Nazi, said he could vote for you.
00:28:46.000 That's what they decided to bring up.
00:28:48.000 Well, the view is, I mean, we have to really be thankful that it exists, because without that level of discourse on television, without being able to watch those geniuses banter around some of the most important ideas of today, I don't know where we'd be.
00:29:04.000 I think it elevates us as a society, as a civilization, and it also shows the rest of the world how it's done.
00:29:10.000 If you really want to see how the baddest country on Earth deals with political discourse and social issues, watch those gals. 1.00
00:29:18.000 Because they got it down. 1.00
00:29:20.000 Bunch of damn geniuses. 1.00
00:29:21.000 You're good, Joe. 1.00
00:29:22.000 Thank you.
00:29:24.000 He did good.
00:29:25.000 It doesn't get any better.
00:29:26.000 But they throw that out there.
00:29:27.000 They throw that out there.
00:29:28.000 They throw that out there.
00:29:30.000 And once it's out there, hey, it's out there.
00:29:32.000 And all of a sudden, there's someone else somewhere that heard that clip, Richard Spencey, Tulsi, and that's what they're running with.
00:29:39.000 That's today, though.
00:29:40.000 Today, there's so much data, right?
00:29:42.000 And there's so much information that all they need is one little smeary thing to toss your way.
00:29:46.000 And then people would say, oh, she's an Assad supporter.
00:29:49.000 Oh, she's a this.
00:29:50.000 Oh, Richard Spencer's favorite candidate.
00:29:53.000 That one.
00:29:54.000 And then like, oh, I can't vote for her.
00:29:56.000 I don't want to be kicked out of the team.
00:29:57.000 This is what we see on Twitter all the time.
00:29:59.000 That's a giant issue with the left, too.
00:30:01.000 The left eats itself way more than any other party.
00:30:03.000 And I don't know what that is about liberals in general that seem to really truly enjoy calling each other out for not being liberal enough.
00:30:10.000 But it's very strange.
00:30:12.000 It's so obviously destructive, and it shows that there's no good leadership at the top of the heap.
00:30:18.000 Because at the top of the heap, everybody would be like, Hey!
00:30:20.000 We're all in this together!
00:30:21.000 Okay, we can disagree on some stuff, but if we start attacking each other, it makes the other side stronger. 0.99
00:30:26.000 So let's cut the shit publicly, and let's talk this through, and that's pretty much exactly what the Republicans have done for the most part. 0.98
00:30:33.000 Yeah, and from a leadership perspective... 0.99
00:30:37.000 It is almost always best to look at things in a balanced way and say, oh, I got this part of my team over here that wants to do this extreme thing, and the other part of the team wants to do the opposite extreme thing.
00:30:48.000 The answer is going to be somewhere in the middle.
00:30:49.000 Why don't I just find a good kind of solution that's somewhere in the middle?
00:30:54.000 And, of course, the fringes are going to be a little bit mad.
00:30:56.000 Okay, I get that.
00:30:57.000 They're the fringes, but the bulk of people and what's good for the bulk of people is to make this kind of balanced decision and move forward with it.
00:31:05.000 But we don't get that kind of logic inside of these leaders, especially when they're running.
00:31:12.000 Yeah, which is, you know, they run and then as soon as they get in, they're running for re-election.
00:31:16.000 It's so frustrating as a citizen to sit back and watch us going from the debate format to the way things are handled.
00:31:26.000 I don't understand why there haven't been radical improvements.
00:31:31.000 Imagine getting a computer. 1.00
00:31:34.000 From 1990 and trying to do your work on it, you'd be like, this hunk of shit. 0.99
00:31:38.000 Why doesn't somebody do something better? 0.99
00:31:40.000 Well, we have the same exact political system that we had before the internet with the internet.
00:31:46.000 It hasn't been updated at all.
00:31:48.000 And it doesn't make any sense.
00:31:50.000 Yeah.
00:31:51.000 It's so bonkers and we sit around and we wait for this magical day in November where we're going to all fix it and we all know that it's not going to get fixed and it's just a weird place to be in where everyone's aware that there's an issue and no one's fixing it.
00:32:07.000 When I look at this upcoming election, I have no idea.
00:32:12.000 And I had a pretty good idea who was going to win in 2016, just like everyone else.
00:32:16.000 I figured, of course, Hillary Clinton's going to win this thing. 1.00
00:32:19.000 I didn't.
00:32:20.000 You knew?
00:32:21.000 I talked about it in my comedy special.
00:32:23.000 I talked about it and triggered my Netflix special from 2016. I'm like, he's that close!
00:32:28.000 You guys, I go, President Trump could be a real thing.
00:32:31.000 I was going across the country and doing these gigs all over the place.
00:32:36.000 These people are angry.
00:32:37.000 They're angry at liberals.
00:32:39.000 They're angry at people that are forcing policies that they don't agree with, whether it's social policies or economic policies.
00:32:46.000 There's so many people that thought that Bernie Sanders was going to steal all their money.
00:32:51.000 I was seeing it.
00:32:52.000 I was like, he might win! 0.81
00:32:54.000 Every time someone said, oh, if you believe in border security, you're a racist. 0.92
00:33:01.000 Yeah. 1.00
00:33:01.000 Hey, if you believe in border security, you're a racist. 1.00
00:33:04.000 Well, that makes Obama a racist. 0.99
00:33:06.000 Yeah.
00:33:06.000 But all those people that heard that, like, I'm not a racist.
00:33:10.000 What are you talking about?
00:33:11.000 I'm voting for Trump.
00:33:12.000 Right, exactly.
00:33:13.000 And that is what happened.
00:33:13.000 A hundred percent.
00:33:42.000 And update our immigration laws so that they are humane and that they actually serve the interests of our country, our economy, our families, education, and so on and so forth.
00:33:52.000 I mean, this is something that, yeah, Republicans and Democrats, if you just sit down and have the conversation...
00:33:58.000 You say, oh yeah, I actually agree with that.
00:34:00.000 Like you're saying, okay, that's a really good point.
00:34:02.000 Maybe we should do it this way, maybe we should do it that way.
00:34:04.000 But if we can agree on the objective, then we can have the meaningful conversation about how to get there, rather than continuing what we are doing.
00:34:12.000 We have not seen an update to our immigration laws for decades.
00:34:16.000 I think since Reagan, actually.
00:34:17.000 We have not seen a comprehensive immigration reform, which we so desperately need.
00:34:22.000 And it's because...
00:34:23.000 Honestly, both sides are so busy throwing crap at each other and arrows at each other because it's about partisanship and getting the political win rather than actually solving the problem. 0.86
00:34:34.000 That's the difference. 0.97
00:34:36.000 It's easy to cry racism when you look at the difference between the border of Mexico and the border of Canada.
00:34:40.000 Because the border of Canada is like a giant landing strip.
00:34:42.000 They're like, come on through.
00:34:44.000 It's just woods and then there's a huge gap in the woods.
00:34:48.000 It's the opposite of a fence.
00:34:50.000 It's like we're going to make it easier for you to cross.
00:34:52.000 We're going to show you where the line is.
00:34:54.000 Have you seen the border?
00:34:55.000 You've seen the border of Canada?
00:34:56.000 It's hilarious.
00:34:57.000 You put the economy in Canada is not going to force people to try and get to America.
00:35:02.000 It's pretty nice out there.
00:35:03.000 That's the issue, right?
00:35:04.000 The real issue is there's parts of the world, whatever you want to use, third world, whatever phrase you want to use, there's parts of the world economically where if you're born there, you're kind of screwed.
00:35:16.000 It's really hard to get by.
00:35:18.000 It's really hard. 1.00
00:35:18.000 If you're living in a poor community in Mexico that's run by the cartel, what a shit roll of the dice. 1.00
00:35:25.000 You got a bad hand of cards. 1.00
00:35:26.000 That's what it is.
00:35:27.000 And until that gets balanced out, which traditionally takes centuries for close nearby countries for everything to even out, Especially when the politics are so different between Mexico and the United States. 0.97
00:35:42.000 And Mexico is just insanely corrupt. 0.96
00:35:45.000 Sorry, Mexico. 0.98
00:35:45.000 But, I mean, you saw what happened with Chapo's son. 0.98
00:35:49.000 He gets arrested by the Mexican military, and then the cartels force them to release him, and they're like, all right, take him back.
00:35:57.000 Sorry.
00:35:57.000 We'll figure this out later.
00:35:59.000 And that's something that, you know, that's the kind of change and the rooting out of corruption reforms that can only happen...
00:36:08.000 Organically.
00:36:08.000 Yes.
00:36:09.000 Within Mexico.
00:36:10.000 Could you imagine, Jaco, as a military man, a situation like that happening in the United States, where some cartel forces the United States military to release a prisoner?
00:36:22.000 No.
00:36:23.000 No.
00:36:23.000 Could you imagine?
00:36:24.000 No.
00:36:25.000 Could you imagine the backlash?
00:36:27.000 There are so many rednecks that would just be spending all day filling cartridges. 1.00
00:36:32.000 I mean, it would just be madness.
00:36:34.000 The militia will rise up.
00:36:35.000 Oh, my God.
00:36:36.000 Yeah, you want to find out what the Sacramento Amendment's really for?
00:36:39.000 If that ever took place in this country, if there was ever a situation in this country where we felt like we were really overrun by a cartel where they were taking over cities, like what's going on in Mexico, you would understand how rabidly independent this country really is.
00:36:54.000 Yes.
00:36:55.000 Yeah.
00:36:55.000 And even, you know, when you talk about people that are living down in Mexico that wanted to come here, it's like, oh, you feel for them because they got a bad deal.
00:37:02.000 But a lot of the people that are trying to come here are MS-13 gangsters looking to come up here and whatever, do what they're going to do in America where there's even more money to be made off of illegal activities.
00:37:13.000 Yeah, if you could throw the Wonder Woman lasso of truth around them and find out what they're really all about, that would be great.
00:37:18.000 That would be awesome.
00:37:19.000 We can't really do that.
00:37:21.000 If you're just poor and you want to make it, hey, come on in.
00:37:23.000 You're a hard worker?
00:37:24.000 Excellent.
00:37:24.000 So are my grandparents.
00:37:25.000 Come on in.
00:37:26.000 But it's just the idea that we should all have open borders and everybody should be able to go anywhere.
00:37:31.000 Yeah!
00:37:32.000 Boy, there's a lot of people that you don't want coming here, and it probably should be a good idea to check people for criminal history and violent pasts.
00:37:40.000 See if you're a member of the cartel before you sneak into Mexico or Arizona.
00:37:46.000 I think there are practical limitations.
00:37:48.000 Even if you said, okay, well, we want to welcome anybody and everybody in the world who is suffering and who is in need of help or a better life to come to the United States.
00:38:01.000 It's just not realistic.
00:38:02.000 We don't have the resources as a country to be able to do that when, you know, look, here in LA, I was on Skid Row about a month or two ago coming and visiting there.
00:38:14.000 The homeless crisis in Hawaii is the worst per capita of any state in the country.
00:38:20.000 It's something that's affecting both urban cities and rural communities across the country.
00:38:24.000 We have Almost 80 million people who are uninsured and underinsured in this country who can't get the medicine they need and who are literally driving their kid to Mexico to buy insulin because they have diabetes and they can't afford to get the medicine here at home.
00:38:38.000 We got a lot of issues and a lot of challenges that we've got to deal with.
00:38:41.000 And my view is we've got to be pragmatic and practical in how we are seeing the situation, looking at what our objective is and how does that best serve the people of this country, and then figure out, okay, what's the best way for us to get there?
00:38:57.000 And I think that's what's unfortunately lost in this hyper-partisan political atmosphere, whether you're talking about what's going on in Washington and the media or what's going on in Twitter, where you have these extremes, you have this rush to judgment when people aren't taking the time.
00:39:11.000 Both to sit down and first try to understand the problem.
00:39:14.000 Like, you know, this goes back to like military decision-making process 101. First, you got to understand the problem, right?
00:39:21.000 You're trying to solve.
00:39:22.000 Come up with what's the objective.
00:39:23.000 Make sure it's achievable.
00:39:24.000 And then build your plan and then execute.
00:39:27.000 That just doesn't happen these days because it's more about calling the other guys' names or, you know, having this race on this happens all the time.
00:39:34.000 There's like something happens in the news.
00:39:36.000 Yeah.
00:39:36.000 For the political candidates running for president, it's who can get their tweet out the fastest on the issue.
00:39:42.000 We saw this recently with the situation in Syria with the Kurds.
00:39:47.000 And who can get the tweet out the fastest?
00:39:49.000 People are asking me like, hey, what do you have to say?
00:39:51.000 What do you have to say?
00:39:51.000 I'm like, I'm trying to understand the situation first.
00:39:54.000 I'm actually trying to understand what happened and why we are in the situation that we're in.
00:40:00.000 Once I do that, I'll let you know what I think.
00:40:03.000 And that was another one of those end-of-the-world scenarios that unfolded.
00:40:06.000 You know, Trump pulled the troops out of that area, and it was like, oh, the world's going to end.
00:40:13.000 And look, there was some bad stuff that happened.
00:40:15.000 I get it.
00:40:16.000 Some ISIS folks, some ISIS terrorists. 0.89
00:40:22.000 Murderers escaped. 0.97
00:40:23.000 I got that.
00:40:24.000 Some Kurds were killed.
00:40:26.000 Some bad stuff happened, but it wasn't the end of the world.
00:40:30.000 And one thing, my second deployment to Iraq, we started doing counterinsurgency operations instead of counterterrorist operations.
00:40:39.000 So we changed our strategy.
00:40:42.000 And as we did this, we were starting to kill a decent amount of bad guys, of these insurgents.
00:40:49.000 So a few weeks go by.
00:40:54.000 And I got a message from up in my chain of command, and they're like, hey Jocko, we get that you're doing these missions, but right now we're not seeing any changes in the metrics as far as enemy attacks that are happening, right?
00:41:06.000 And luckily, I had read the counterinsurgency manual that was written by General Petraeus, and part of that explains that the average counterinsurgency takes seven years to work itself out, right?
00:41:18.000 And so I said, hey, you know, boss, the average counterinsurgency takes seven years to flush itself out.
00:41:25.000 It's only been three weeks.
00:41:26.000 Can I get some more time here to work through this?
00:41:29.000 And he's like, okay, yeah, you know, makes sense.
00:41:31.000 But my point is, it's the same thing here.
00:41:36.000 That we can fully understand a news event within one hour of it happening.
00:41:40.000 We don't have any understanding.
00:41:42.000 You need to let these things develop and see where the actual long-term effects are.
00:41:47.000 We can't be snapping judgments and making radical decisions or split decisions when we have to actually assess what is really going on.
00:41:56.000 And so the press, for sure, is like, snap decision, snap decision, snap decision.
00:42:00.000 And you can see, it's comical to flip back and forth between the two, the left-wing media and the right-wing media, and one of them's the greatest decision ever, and the other one's the most horrible thing that's ever happened, and there you go.
00:42:10.000 And you know, no one can even make an assessment of what just happened, because it only happened 14 minutes ago.
00:42:15.000 How about we see where it plays out?
00:42:17.000 It's about being first rather than actually being accurate and presenting the American people with, here's what has gone on.
00:42:24.000 You can form your own opinion.
00:42:26.000 You can form your own conclusion.
00:42:28.000 But here's the course of events that took place, A, B, C, D, and E. And that's exactly what we're missing most of the time.
00:42:35.000 Well, I think it's what we were talking about earlier.
00:42:37.000 I think we're poisoned by this desire to have our information fed to us very quickly and the fact that there's so much information coming at us, we don't have enough time to sit back and read a manual on how long it takes counterinsurgency efforts to reach fruition.
00:42:53.000 The fact that that's hitting you in the military, that you would think that the most pragmatic, the most disciplined people that understand the long game, that are playing 3D chess, those are the people that you would want Telling people like you what you can and can't do.
00:43:06.000 The fact that that kind of thinking is even filtering down to special ops groups is crazy.
00:43:13.000 Well, what's nice is we do have decentralized command inside the military.
00:43:15.000 So when I'm telling my boss this is what's going on, my boss isn't like, shut up and do what I told you to do.
00:43:19.000 My boss is like, okay, makes sense.
00:43:21.000 Explain it to me.
00:43:21.000 Okay, got it.
00:43:22.000 Yeah, that makes sense.
00:43:22.000 Cool.
00:43:23.000 Move forward.
00:43:24.000 That's a very positive thing in the military.
00:43:26.000 Everyone thinks that the military is this rigid, structured way where you just obey the chain of command.
00:43:29.000 You don't...
00:43:31.000 Veer from that at all, but if my boss tells me to do something that doesn't make any sense I'm gonna say hey boss.
00:43:37.000 This actually is a bad plan We should do it a different way and if I have a good boss my boss says okay I didn't see that angle and that's another thing that you know when Tulsi's talking about how politicians we come up with a plan and then we start executing the plan and Guess what?
00:43:50.000 Once you start executing a plan, some other things are going to come to light, right?
00:43:54.000 And you as a leader have to say, hey, you know what?
00:43:56.000 We started executing this.
00:43:57.000 It's going pretty good, but I didn't foresee this happening.
00:44:01.000 I'm making an adjustment.
00:44:02.000 Here it is.
00:44:03.000 Here's what we're going to do, and I'm going to wait for that feedback to come to me.
00:44:06.000 The problem is people are so insecure or slash their ego is so big that they will, they'll just, I'm just going to stick with the same plan. 0.99
00:44:13.000 No matter, everyone else is dumb. 0.99
00:44:14.000 No, you just need to see it through. 0.99
00:44:16.000 It's like, no, actually we need to make some changes.
00:44:18.000 Because they, you know, they are afraid of saying, hey, my initial assessment might have been inaccurate or wrong.
00:44:24.000 And I think that also just points to the bigger point for the political leadership, the civilian leadership that sets the policy that the military executes is so often lacks that foresight.
00:44:35.000 And that planning of actually looking, okay, if we pursue course of action A, here will be the second, third, fourth order of effects, right?
00:44:44.000 Here's how the enemy or the opponent is likely to react, or here's how other actors are likely to react to our action.
00:44:52.000 So we can try to anticipate that and then we can, okay, this is how we would respond.
00:44:56.000 This is how they're likely to respond and actually go through this so that we don't end up in the situation that we too often find ourselves in where you're like, all right, here's the mission, guys.
00:45:06.000 Go for it.
00:45:06.000 And then you, whether it's a week or a month or a year later, like, hey, how the hell do we find ourselves here?
00:45:11.000 It's like you failed as leaders.
00:45:13.000 The leaders of our country failed to ask those questions about, you know, what happens, what happens next?
00:45:19.000 After we go in and topple Saddam Hussein and we completely obliterate the entire Iraqi military, what actually happens next?
00:45:26.000 What will be the consequences to this?
00:45:28.000 What will be the cost to our troops, our military?
00:45:31.000 What will be the cost to the Iraqi people?
00:45:33.000 What will be the cost to American taxpayers?
00:45:36.000 Do we know what the objective is?
00:45:39.000 Is it achievable?
00:45:40.000 What's our end state and exit strategy?
00:45:42.000 When you look back, and I've seen this throughout my seven years in Congress, sitting on the Foreign Affairs Committee, sitting on the Armed Services Committee, where we're questioning and providing oversight over the Department of Defense and Department of State, asking leaders these questions.
00:45:57.000 And when we're not given answers or given ambiguous answers or things like I asked Secretary Mattis once in a hearing about how al-Qaeda has gotten so strong in Syria to where,
00:46:13.000 I mean, right now they control an entire city.
00:46:16.000 The entire city of Idlib is controlled by al-Qaeda.
00:46:20.000 And I asked him at that time, I said, why aren't we going after Al-Qaeda in Syria in a very serious and concerted way?
00:46:28.000 And his answer was, well, it's complicated.
00:46:31.000 It's complicated.
00:46:33.000 And it's frustrating to say the least, but I think it's been a very...
00:46:41.000 It's been a very clear window into the lack of foresight and good judgment and just the ability to look at these challenges and situations with that basic understanding in a non-emotional way and understand what's the objective cost and consequences before we launch this action.
00:47:04.000 I want to talk about something you brought up briefly earlier about the media being sort of cheerleaders for a lot of these wars or a lot of these military actions.
00:47:13.000 Do you think that that happens because this ensures that they get access?
00:47:17.000 Do you think it happens because conflict is good for their business?
00:47:20.000 Do you think it happens because if they don't act as cheerleaders, they don't get access to the leaders and to the important politicians and military leaders?
00:47:29.000 I think that the underlying driver is that conflict is good for ratings.
00:47:35.000 That's crazy that that is their decision how to cover things.
00:47:40.000 It's the war machine that they're a part of and that they're a driving force for.
00:47:52.000 I think that there have been reports I think over time, I think you had Matt Taibbi here recently, where you've got, you know, journalists who are more, or even, you know, papers who are more interested in covering for their,
00:48:08.000 you know, CIA relationships, rather than actually bringing forward a story that the American, the truth, you know, that the American people deserve to hear.
00:48:17.000 So I think there are other factors there that drive the media really playing a heavily influential and dangerous force in continuing to push this warmongering narrative that is costly in an immeasurable way.
00:48:39.000 Well, the coverage is so influential, and that influence, it changes the way people accept or don't accept things that are happening internationally.
00:48:49.000 Do you remember when there was a time when Obama had talked about attacking Syria?
00:48:56.000 Yes, that was in 2013. The entire country was like, fuck you. 1.00
00:49:00.000 That was my first year in Congress. 1.00
00:49:03.000 I mean, it was one of the biggest rejections of an idea nationally that I've ever seen.
00:49:09.000 And then he kind of backed off it.
00:49:11.000 It was like, oh, okay.
00:49:12.000 I think that was one of the most brave decisions that he made, to back off from it.
00:49:21.000 Where he actually, you know, he didn't take that position in that example of just kind of being the obstinate, stubborn, like, nope, here's what I said, and he drew this red line, and I'm not going to go back on it no matter what.
00:49:32.000 No, he did.
00:49:33.000 I think he listened to the American people, and ultimately he chose diplomacy.
00:49:38.000 Well, this is an area where people have been critical of you, is your position on Syria and the fact that you had met with Assad, and this is something that gets brought up.
00:49:46.000 And again, it gets brought up in these little soundbite things that are seeking to define you without any nuance or any complexity.
00:49:53.000 Just let this little tiny sentence or two define your position, and then they can repeat that to other people without really knowing what they're talking about.
00:50:03.000 What is your position on Syria and Assad?
00:50:06.000 And how did all this conflict and all this weirdness with you in this subject begin?
00:50:12.000 I think it goes back to, again, the opposition that comes towards me from the political establishment, you know, the corporate media and the military-industrial complex because of the leadership and the voice that I've been bringing calling for an end to regime change wars,
00:50:34.000 whether we're talking about the one in Iraq, Libya, and in Syria.
00:50:42.000 Look, my choice will always be towards diplomacy, because if we lack the courage to meet with both adversaries and friends in the pursuit of our own national security and peace,
00:50:58.000 the only alternative is war.
00:51:01.000 Period.
00:51:02.000 That's the way it is.
00:51:03.000 So I will always choose to maximize all diplomatic means and measures and talks and negotiations To further our interests of peace and national security, recognizing that war should always be the last resort,
00:51:19.000 if necessary.
00:51:21.000 Now, it's very difficult for people to understand that these things are insanely messy, and you saying that you would always lean towards diplomacy does not mean you support dictators.
00:51:36.000 No.
00:51:36.000 But that's exactly the way they frame it.
00:51:38.000 But if you look at the famous Hillary Clinton speech after Gaddafi was killed, we came, we saw, he died, and she was laughing.
00:51:46.000 Libya's a failed state now.
00:51:48.000 They have slaves that they're auctioning off on YouTube.
00:51:52.000 I mean, you could watch slave auctions that someone filmed with their camera on their phone and they uploaded to YouTube.
00:51:59.000 Libya's gone. 0.93
00:52:00.000 I mean, it's a chaotic place right now.
00:52:03.000 It wasn't good when Gaddafi was running Libya, but it wasn't as bad as it is now.
00:52:09.000 So the idea that supporting Gaddafi is supporting a dictatorship and you're a monster for supporting him, like, maybe not, because it's kind of worse now because the world is a very messy place.
00:52:21.000 And it's not even a matter of quote-unquote supporting.
00:52:25.000 It's just saying, hey, we're not going to come in and overthrow you and your government.
00:52:28.000 I think that's the issue here and the contradiction when people are criticizing me for exercising diplomacy and calling for an end to the regime change movement.
00:52:39.000 Thank you.
00:52:44.000 Thank you.
00:53:20.000 I think?
00:53:32.000 You have the leaders of North Korea time and time again have said, hey, look, we're developing nuclear weapons as the only deterrent that'll work against the United States coming in and overthrowing our government.
00:53:44.000 Said it over and over and over again.
00:53:46.000 And they've pointed to examples like Libya.
00:53:49.000 Saying that, well, you guys are saying you want to come in and negotiate with us to get rid of our nuclear weapons.
00:53:55.000 You told Gaddafi the same thing.
00:53:57.000 You said, hey, Gaddafi, get rid of your nuclear weapons program. 0.89
00:54:00.000 We'll leave you alone.
00:54:01.000 And then you went in and overthrew Gaddafi.
00:54:04.000 Why will this be any different with us?
00:54:05.000 And then you've got John Bolton as then the national security director for Trump going on television or giving speeches saying, yeah, you know, we're going to approach North Korea with the Libya model.
00:54:17.000 Right?
00:54:18.000 He said that.
00:54:19.000 And so when we wonder, like, hey, why aren't these...
00:54:21.000 And I think Trump was right, and I've said it publicly, Trump is right to have direct negotiations with Kim Jong-un.
00:54:28.000 But he hasn't gotten anywhere, and you've got to look at why.
00:54:31.000 And this is one of the reasons why.
00:54:33.000 Continuing to say, hey, no, we're not going to overthrow you in your government, Kim Jong-un.
00:54:37.000 But on the other hand, you're continuing the policies that directly undermine your ability...
00:54:43.000 To make that agreement that'll hold and that'll stay.
00:54:49.000 And as a result now, we have North Korea, that's nuclear weapons program is continuing to escalate. 0.82
00:54:58.000 Their capabilities are continuing to grow.
00:55:00.000 And it poses a threat not only to, you know, my folks in Hawaii, the people of Hawaii, given our proximity to North Korea, but their capabilities now, they're extending across the West Coast, they're extending across the country, posing a very direct existential threat to our country and to our people. 0.93
00:55:18.000 So you see how that decision that was made about Libya, these decisions that are ongoing, you see the pulling out of the Iran nuclear agreement, North Korea says, hey, You guys made an agreement with them.
00:55:27.000 You got a different president elected.
00:55:29.000 He tore up that agreement.
00:55:31.000 Why should we think that's going to be any different with us?
00:55:33.000 So these policy decisions that are being made are very directly connected in having the effect, ultimately, of undermining our national security and making the American people less safe.
00:55:46.000 I'll tell you, I think a couple things come up just kind of on what you're saying, and this is kind of my perspective on it.
00:55:53.000 When we talk about, hey, when you go in somewhere, you've got to know what the end state is.
00:56:00.000 You've got to know where you're going and when you're going to leave.
00:56:02.000 You've got to have an exit strategy.
00:56:03.000 What's really hard about that is we don't necessarily know, and war is so unpredictable that you may, you know, there's a chance that you went in and killed Gaddafi, and then all of a sudden some benevolent person steps up, and all of a sudden you've got this flourishing democracy.
00:56:19.000 Okay, what are the chances of that?
00:56:20.000 No, very small, but you don't know that it's going to go into this completely failed state.
00:56:26.000 You have high hopes.
00:56:27.000 Maybe your intel people are saying you this.
00:56:29.000 It's like when we did the Bay of Pigs.
00:56:32.000 All the Cubans in America were like, yep, as soon as you guys hit the beaches, all the Cubans are going to be on our side. 0.99
00:56:36.000 It's going to be good to go.
00:56:37.000 All the Cubans that supported America were in America. 0.98
00:56:40.000 We showed up there and they were like, what are you doing?
00:56:42.000 No, this is our country.
00:56:43.000 So we don't necessarily know where we're going to go, which means you've got to have, once again, like the open mind to say, oh, this isn't going the way we thought it was going to go.
00:56:52.000 How are we going to adjust right now to prevent this from getting worse?
00:56:55.000 Which means what you really have to do Is prior to intervening in other countries, you have to assess what sacrifices you are willing to make to get the result that is positive.
00:57:09.000 And those could be massive.
00:57:11.000 I always talk about if you're gonna go to war, You've got to have the will.
00:57:16.000 And that will comes in two forms. 0.66
00:57:18.000 Number one is the will to kill. 0.99
00:57:20.000 Because when you go to war, you are going to be killing people. 0.99
00:57:24.000 You're going to be killing the enemy, and you're going to be killing civilians.
00:57:27.000 And that's not what we're trying to do.
00:57:29.000 And believe me, the U.S. military goes through great lengths to prevent that from happening.
00:57:33.000 But it is going to happen.
00:57:34.000 It's war. 0.99
00:57:35.000 So you have to be willing to kill. 0.52
00:57:37.000 You have to be willing to have that happen. 1.00
00:57:39.000 And kill. 0.99
00:57:40.000 You have to be willing to die, because when you go to war, there's gonna be American kids that are not gonna come home. 0.99
00:57:47.000 And so you have to have those two wills.
00:57:50.000 That's before you go in.
00:57:52.000 So you can't look at it and say, well, you know, we can go into Libya, we can move this guy, and probably it'll turn out okay, so we don't have to worry about what the sacrifices are gonna be.
00:57:59.000 Another thing to think about, when we went to war, We went to World War II, World War I. Those kids, 18 years old, 17 years old, those kids went to war until the war was over.
00:58:13.000 They went on deployment.
00:58:14.000 Like now, you know, in the Navy, in the Marine Corps, it's a six, seven-month deployment.
00:58:19.000 In the Army, sometimes it's a 14-month deployment.
00:58:20.000 And then they're going to rotate back to the States.
00:58:22.000 In World War II, it was like, oh, cool.
00:58:24.000 Yeah, we're at war.
00:58:25.000 You'll be home when it's over.
00:58:28.000 So five years, four years.
00:58:30.000 If that was our attitude going into the war, this is so important to us that Johnny is gonna get on a ship and he's gonna sail to the Pacific, and if he comes home, it's gonna be in three years, four years, five years.
00:58:42.000 That's what we're talking about.
00:58:43.000 That's the level of commitment we have.
00:58:45.000 So when we start looking at going into other countries, we need to start thinking, okay, what level of commitment do we really have to make this successful?
00:58:53.000 And even when I look at Iraq, I was in Iraq, I fought in Iraq, From a granular perspective, being on the ground, Battle of Ramadi 2006, the citizens of Ramadi, the normal citizens of Ramadi were overjoyed that we were there.
00:59:11.000 And it was like we were angels to go there and help them get rid of these heinous Al-Qaeda insurgents, which eventually became ISIS. Unfortunately, we did a great job Ramadi was the model of counterinsurgency for about seven years, 0.95
00:59:32.000 and it was less violent than many cities in America.
00:59:37.000 And I had great pride and at least understood the sacrifices.
00:59:42.000 My friends that were killed, my friends that never came home, my friends that won't get to have kids, right?
00:59:48.000 They did all that.
00:59:49.000 They gave all that.
00:59:50.000 And I was able to look around and say, you know what?
00:59:51.000 These folks in this foreign country, they have an opportunity for freedom.
00:59:58.000 And unfortunately, because of politics and whatever, we said, okay, you know what?
01:00:03.000 We're not staying there.
01:00:04.000 We're going to leave.
01:00:05.000 As soon as we left, everybody that had been on the ground in Iraq was like, hmm, this is probably not a good idea.
01:00:10.000 This is probably not a good idea to bail out right now.
01:00:12.000 We don't need to leave a massive force there, but if we leave a couple brigades worth of men, then, oh, we'll probably be able to handle any problems that happen.
01:00:23.000 Well, we didn't.
01:00:24.000 We left completely.
01:00:25.000 And those insurgents that were there, they were like little embers and they started to get fired up again.
01:00:31.000 And then the next thing you know, you had ISIS. And by the way, ISIS marched back into Ramadi.
01:00:36.000 And the reports we got from people on the ground that we knew was that ISIS came in and anyone that had worked with coalition forces on any level, they would murder the whole family.
01:00:46.000 There's about 500 families that were completely murdered.
01:00:49.000 So when we talk about these things, We have to be very sure about what we're gonna do.
01:00:57.000 We have to recognize that we can't predict everything, because we can't.
01:01:00.000 I don't care how good you are, I don't care how many analysis you put on something.
01:01:03.000 When you start throwing human nature into a leadership vacuum, all these things are gonna break out, and it can go very, very bad.
01:01:09.000 It can go well, too, but it can go very, very bad.
01:01:13.000 And so what are we willing to sacrifice?
01:01:15.000 What are we willing to spend?
01:01:16.000 How many of our brothers and sisters in uniform are we willing to sacrifice to make this happen?
01:01:21.000 And how does it help our national security?
01:01:24.000 I believe right now, had we stayed there, Iraq would be a pretty strong, positive place right now if we had kind of completed the mission the way that we should have.
01:01:37.000 Again, when we go back and we say, okay, well, what countries is it worth going into?
01:01:42.000 Where are we going to go?
01:01:43.000 How do we draw that line?
01:01:44.000 How do we make that decision?
01:01:46.000 For me, this is what we do as leaders.
01:01:48.000 What we do as leaders, we look at a situation.
01:01:50.000 And sometimes, you know, you've got to ask yourself, do we have a moral obligation to go somewhere?
01:01:55.000 If there's a genocide happening, if there's another Rwanda happening, where 800,000 Tutsis are killed in 100 days with machetes, if that's going on, do we have a moral obligation to try and do something to help that?
01:02:10.000 Hey, that's a decision you have to meet.
01:02:12.000 That's a hard decision to make as a leader, because guess what?
01:02:14.000 You're going to lose 30, 40, 100 Americans that are going in there and trying to shut this thing down.
01:02:20.000 But that's the type of thing we need to think about.
01:02:22.000 And that's why, as a leader, you want to have an open mind.
01:02:26.000 You want to have your ego completely out of it.
01:02:29.000 Because it's really easy to say, oh, we're America.
01:02:31.000 This is what we do.
01:02:32.000 We're going to win.
01:02:33.000 It's like, no, actually, we made a bad decision.
01:02:35.000 We're actually leaving right now because we think the expenditure from here on out is gonna be too high.
01:02:40.000 Unfortunately, I think in Iraq, we paid the upfront expenditure.
01:02:44.000 We had invested lives and treasure to try and get that place stabilized.
01:02:48.000 We had done a decent job.
01:02:49.000 We were almost there and we left early and all of a sudden we look around and go, oof.
01:02:54.000 But that's why these things are important to think about thoroughly as Tulsi said before you go, we don't know what's going to happen.
01:03:04.000 If you're going to get in a street fight, Joe, as capable as you are, as capable as I am at street fighting, that's great. 0.96
01:03:12.000 There's that 10% chance that that guy pulls out a knife and sticks it in your neck. 0.93
01:03:17.000 Are you willing to sacrifice that? 0.92
01:03:19.000 Now, if the guy's doing something to an innocent person and you go, you know what?
01:03:24.000 I've got to take that risk right now.
01:03:25.000 I'm going to go in and I'm going to get this thing handled.
01:03:27.000 Those are hard decisions to make and we have to think through them.
01:03:32.000 Very well said.
01:03:33.000 If there was one thing when I brought you two together that I thought that you might disagree on, it would be this stance on non-interventionalist foreign policy.
01:03:42.000 I don't know if that's even the right word, disagree.
01:03:45.000 But I think there's nuances to these decisions and these things, and I think you would agree with that.
01:03:50.000 And Rwanda, what you talked about, is a great example.
01:03:53.000 Do you have a moral responsibility to go in when you see some atrocities being committed?
01:03:59.000 That's one thing that people either pro or con on is the United States, are we the police force of the world?
01:04:05.000 Are we the moral high ground?
01:04:07.000 Yeah, I don't, just listening to you, Jock, I think that, I don't think that we actually disagree very much.
01:04:15.000 You can tell me if I'm wrong, but I think there are important distinctions to be made.
01:04:20.000 You know, my opposition to regime change wars should not be mistaken for isolationism.
01:04:28.000 I think? 0.98
01:04:50.000 This guy's a monster. 0.98
01:04:52.000 This is this. 0.97
01:04:52.000 When you actually peel back the layers, there are ulterior motives in place that set the pretext to use our military to go and overthrow a regime in another country or topple a dictator that ultimately ends up more often than not resulting in the lives of the suffering, 0.97
01:05:11.000 more suffering for the people in the countries who are supposedly trying to go and help.
01:05:15.000 However, I've been very strong on this.
01:05:18.000 We're talking about Al-Qaeda, ISIS, these other jihadist terrorists who are a threat to our national security. 0.66
01:05:26.000 We need to stay strong in defeating that threat.
01:05:30.000 That is our function as warriors, as service members in the military, is to go and protect and defend the American people and to take out those who seek to do us harm.
01:05:41.000 In the case of a genocide, like Rwanda, Where there is a killing of people at a massive scale.
01:05:49.000 We look to see, hey, is there something that we can do to help end this genocide?
01:05:55.000 Can we work with other countries?
01:05:56.000 Can we bring together a coalition that can effectively stop this genocide?
01:06:01.000 And if the answer to that is yes, then we should do so.
01:06:05.000 But the problem that we've seen a lot more recently is you'll see the word genocide being used very loosely as an excuse to go and say,
01:06:20.000 hey, well, go and topple this dictator who is inflicting a genocide on their own people without...
01:06:28.000 It actually meeting the criteria of a genocide when really there's a conflict within the country, whether it be based on politics or power or whatever, that's a very different thing than like what we saw in Rwanda, for example.
01:06:44.000 As you said, I agree.
01:06:46.000 I think before we go in and make this decision to take military action, we've really got to look very carefully at what is the situation?
01:06:55.000 Where is the information that we're coming from?
01:06:57.000 Is it coming from people who are pushing their own narrative for their own interests, where they're not really caring about the interests of the people in these countries?
01:07:05.000 Or the interests of the American people and our troops.
01:07:08.000 They got their own thing going on.
01:07:10.000 We've got to be able to know that and understand that and approach this decision not based on a knee-jerk emotional reaction.
01:07:19.000 And Jocko, what you were talking about earlier is so important here that when...
01:07:24.000 You are on one side and the other side's doing something, no matter what.
01:07:28.000 You can never say, well, that makes sense.
01:07:30.000 You hate that other side.
01:07:31.000 This is a perfect example.
01:07:33.000 When Trump wanted to pull people out of Syria, people on the left were saying no.
01:07:38.000 People on the left were supporting military action in Syria.
01:07:41.000 And I was like, this is bonkers.
01:07:43.000 Upside down.
01:07:44.000 It's weird.
01:07:45.000 Yes, and it's because they despise They completely hate Trump.
01:07:51.000 And I mean, I know you got friends that hate Trump more than anything in the world.
01:07:56.000 I got friends that hate Trump more than anything in the world.
01:07:59.000 And it doesn't matter what he does.
01:08:02.000 They have such a passionate hatred for him that he could just, you know, cure cancer and people would say, well, he did it for his own good.
01:08:11.000 I have friends that hate him and I have friends that like him and I have friends that love him and that's what's hilarious to me.
01:08:17.000 Whenever he does something, I love to call the friends who hate him and just have them scream and yell and rant about it and go, why are you so worked up, man?
01:08:25.000 This is like this quid pro quo thing. 0.98
01:08:28.000 I've never heard that goddamn expression more in my entire life. 0.98
01:08:31.000 Like, who the hell ever thought that quid pro quo would be like a gigantic talking point on every single major news station, every newspaper? 0.98
01:08:41.000 It's a weird time, conflict-wise, in terms of just people's inability to just look at things with nuance and look at the complexity of these conversations and just say, you're on Team Trump or you're not.
01:08:54.000 You're with us or you're against us.
01:08:55.000 You're pro this or you're anti-democracy. 1.00
01:08:58.000 You know, you talk about how Trump's kind of the guy for the assholes. 1.00
01:09:02.000 He's the king of the assholes. 1.00
01:09:04.000 And at the other end of the spectrum is people that they just can't believe. 1.00
01:09:12.000 It insults their very being that this guy is the President of the United States.
01:09:18.000 It insults their very being.
01:09:20.000 And they're so offended by it that it doesn't matter what he does.
01:09:23.000 It's true, but then there's so many people that are like, you know what?
01:09:26.000 At least I'm not getting robbed of my taxes.
01:09:31.000 At least I'm not getting called a bigot because I don't want 6'6 men who transitioned to being a woman last week to play against my daughter in a basketball game. 0.91
01:09:41.000 You know what I'm saying?
01:09:42.000 Oh, yeah.
01:09:42.000 This is the world we're living in, where people are like, I'm going with Trump!
01:09:46.000 He's talking, look, Kanye West is in the White House, he's not a racist! 0.97
01:09:50.000 And this is where we're living now, this weird society that we have today where there's so much coming at us, and you can't pay attention to all of us, and between all the pop culture and nonsense, and the fucking ice caps are melting, 0.90
01:10:06.000 the ocean's on fire, everyone's scared of everything! 0.51
01:10:09.000 And then on top of that, there's all this political stuff that's going on.
01:10:12.000 You don't have time to pay attention to all of it. 0.99
01:10:15.000 If you tell me you're abreast of all of it, I'll tell you you're a liar. 0.99
01:10:18.000 There's no way. 0.96
01:10:19.000 Let me say something else as well.
01:10:20.000 So I have a consulting company and I go around the country and I talk to every level in the chain of command, including the frontline troops, guys that work construction, guys that work gas oil, guys that are out, linemen that are out, manufacturing everything.
01:10:37.000 Those people, most of them, they're not out on the fringe somewhere.
01:10:41.000 You know what they're thinking about?
01:10:42.000 They're not thinking about what Trump's doing.
01:10:43.000 They're actually thinking about if they're going to get to take a couple days off over Labor Day weekend.
01:10:48.000 They're thinking about, do they save enough money that they can get a new truck?
01:10:51.000 That's what they're concerned about.
01:10:53.000 They're not thinking about this.
01:10:54.000 They're trying to live their normal lives.
01:10:57.000 And when I was on Ben Shapiro's program, and he just came at me like, it's so, all this divisiveness.
01:11:03.000 And I said...
01:11:04.000 Well, you live...
01:11:05.000 I mean, that guy lives at ground zero for political just detonation, right?
01:11:11.000 And I said, that's not normal life.
01:11:13.000 It's not normal for everyone else, Ben.
01:11:14.000 I get it.
01:11:15.000 That's what it's like for you, but that's not what it's like for everyone else.
01:11:18.000 So even as the country seems so divided, you got to remember, the people that we hear that are so divisive are the loudmouths on either end.
01:11:28.000 And most people aren't...
01:11:30.000 Getting in Twitter fights about who, whatever.
01:11:33.000 They're not.
01:11:34.000 They're out trying to make a living.
01:11:35.000 Yeah, and you know what's something that you and I, I think, can relate to is that a lot of these people don't have anything that brings them together.
01:11:40.000 And I think they should all join a jiu-jitsu gym.
01:11:43.000 100%.
01:11:43.000 They all took jiu-jitsu.
01:11:45.000 But politics and all that stuff aside, the people that, as weird as it seems, the people that choke you and you choke and you get armbarred by, those are your brothers and sisters.
01:11:55.000 And you realize, like, the way we look at politics, the way we look at decisions and, you know, what you can agree or disagree on, the direction of the country, there's a lack of community.
01:12:06.000 There's a real lack of understanding that we're supposed to be, as the United States of America, we're supposed to be a giant community.
01:12:11.000 We're supposed to be a family.
01:12:13.000 And this is not how people are viewing it now.
01:12:17.000 We're viewing it like there's this gigantic battleground that the world is in an uprising right now.
01:12:23.000 And I don't necessarily think that's true.
01:12:25.000 You know what else, too?
01:12:26.000 And I hear you say this sometimes, and I get what you're saying, but, you know, you'll say, hey, this person's in a cubicle, and they hate their job, and they hate their life, and that's like, of course...
01:12:36.000 Most people aren't like that.
01:12:37.000 I get it that there's some people that end up in jobs that they don't want to do, and I certainly couldn't see Joe Rogan sitting in a cubicle or on a manufacturing line, but like, I got a factory up in Maine.
01:12:45.000 These people that are up there working, They love it.
01:12:49.000 They're Americans that love hard work and they're building an American product and it's like, oh, okay, this is what I do.
01:12:56.000 They'll stay extra time.
01:12:58.000 They'll do whatever they can.
01:12:59.000 They love it.
01:13:00.000 They're working for you, though.
01:13:01.000 They're excited.
01:13:02.000 Yeah, but they're still working.
01:13:03.000 They're still working 9 hours, 10 hours, 12 hours, you know, working in a factory.
01:13:07.000 That's what they're doing.
01:13:08.000 And they love it.
01:13:09.000 And you know what they want?
01:13:10.000 They want to have a good economy.
01:13:11.000 They don't want the government to mess with them.
01:13:13.000 It's like, okay, that's what they want.
01:13:15.000 So, it's weird how The social media that we complain about is just a, it's an amplification of the extremes.
01:13:25.000 That's what it is.
01:13:25.000 And most people aren't sitting there arguing about what Trump did or what Hillary Clinton did.
01:13:30.000 It's a gigantic, I mean a small, hugely small percentage of the population that is doing all the discourse on Twitter.
01:13:38.000 It's really tiny.
01:13:39.000 It's like 2%.
01:13:40.000 And if you look, there's a few people that I follow that I don't follow.
01:13:43.000 I just have them bookmarked just because they're just bananas.
01:13:46.000 And I'll go to their page and just look.
01:13:47.000 And they're literally arguing with people about politics or whatever, gender studies.
01:13:51.000 And they're doing it 12 hours a day.
01:13:53.000 They're just at it.
01:13:54.000 They're just frothing at the mouth, sweating palms, just phone slipping out of their hand, banging away with their thumb.
01:14:00.000 And they're doing it all day.
01:14:02.000 Do you think that, or I think, that that has something to do with the fact that they're living some kind of a decent life?
01:14:09.000 I mean, as far as they have food, they have an iPhone, right?
01:14:13.000 There's no wolves in the streets.
01:14:14.000 There's no wolves in the streets, and they're not worried about it.
01:14:16.000 And that's why when we talk about worldwide problems...
01:14:20.000 What I think is what you do, the best possible thing that we can do in this country to help all these problems, every single problem that we've talked about, build a strong economy.
01:14:30.000 Yes.
01:14:30.000 Build a strong global economy.
01:14:33.000 That's the best thing you can do.
01:14:34.000 100%.
01:14:34.000 Build a business.
01:14:35.000 Make people have a little bit more money.
01:14:37.000 Yes.
01:14:38.000 That's how you get it done.
01:14:40.000 And that's why, you know, like from my perspective, You know, you get involved in a business, you start a business, you move, you help people, you build a product that people want.
01:14:49.000 You build a business, you help the economy, and that is what equalizes the world more than anything else.
01:14:54.000 Well, that's also argument for Team Trump.
01:14:57.000 I mean, that's Trump's argument.
01:14:58.000 What he's doing is he's boosting up business in the United States, and whether or not you love him or hate him, what he's doing is having a positive net effect on the global economy, particularly the United States economy, and that's going to make us stronger.
01:15:10.000 I mean, this is, whether you love him or hate him, you've got to look at that objectively and go, okay, well, is there any merit to what he's saying?
01:15:16.000 Well, I don't understand economics.
01:15:18.000 I don't I just trust people that study it.
01:15:21.000 I don't have the time.
01:15:22.000 But they're saying, yes, in some ways, he's doing things that benefit business.
01:15:27.000 I think that the trouble with the approach that Trump has taken, you know, he obviously, he's got his shtick and he's got the things that he's got, the talking points, the things that he says.
01:15:37.000 But he is continuing this mentality when we look at the trade war with China and the trade conflict that he started with Canada and now with different European countries.
01:15:52.000 It's the zero-sum mentality that in order for us and our economy and our people to win, then the people or the economies of these other countries will I think?
01:16:30.000 Tremendously because of this trade and tariff war, manufacturers, small business owners, and the danger of this continuing to grow and continuing to escalate, an economic war can very easily turn into a hot war.
01:16:48.000 And again, we're talking about a nuclear-armed country where these ever-escalating tensions push us closer and closer to the brink of nuclear catastrophe, something nuclear strategists are saying that we are closer to now than at least in a generation now.
01:17:04.000 I think this is where the foreign policy that I'm putting forward to the American people that I will lead with is one that is focused on engaging with other countries, being that force for good, focusing on cooperation rather than conflict in every respect,
01:17:20.000 being able to work out, yeah, we do have trade differences with China, there's no question about that, but being able to do so in a way that is not further pushing us closer and closer to the brink of a hot war and potentially disastrous Can you get into that?
01:17:34.000 What is the issue with China?
01:17:37.000 Trump feels like we don't have a fair deal, right?
01:17:42.000 That's what he's stated.
01:17:44.000 I think his diagnosis is correct.
01:17:48.000 I think it's widely accepted.
01:17:49.000 There's the ongoing trade imbalance with China and some of the issues with IP theft.
01:17:55.000 I think those are the top two that come to the forefront.
01:17:59.000 The problem is not with the diagnosis of the issue.
01:18:02.000 It is how he's going about it in a very shoot from the hip kind of way.
01:18:09.000 I mean, he's almost conducting his negotiations via Twitter.
01:18:13.000 He's got negotiators who are sitting across from the Chinese saying, hey, okay, we're getting closer to a deal. 0.90
01:18:17.000 We're going to work this out.
01:18:18.000 Then all of a sudden something goes out on Twitter and they're like, whoa, man, the whole thing just changed.
01:18:24.000 Which, you know, it's maybe funny when Trump is putting out something with Trump Tower in Greenland, but when there are such real consequences to the day-to-day lives of the American people, and when we're pushing us closer and closer to the brink of a nuclear catastrophe,
01:18:42.000 escalating these tensions with countries like China and with Russia, this is, I mean, it's serious.
01:18:47.000 The stakes are very high.
01:18:49.000 And so this is more about how Trump is doing this in such an irresponsible way that's creating destabilization and uncertainty, both with our economy and also in our relationships with other countries.
01:19:00.000 It's everything that made him famous as a businessman.
01:19:03.000 All the brashness, all the shooting from the hip.
01:19:07.000 The idea that everybody thought that he was going to change when he got into the White House is hilarious.
01:19:11.000 The guy's 73. Oh, I actually, you can laugh at me then, because I thought, well, he got elected.
01:19:16.000 I was like, okay, well, this is going to be interesting to see him, you know, kind of become presidential.
01:19:20.000 And then like, whatever, one day into it, he was sending out a tweet about somebody.
01:19:23.000 I was like, okay. 0.99
01:19:24.000 Rosie O'Donnell's a pig. 1.00
01:19:25.000 And he's, yeah, exactly. 1.00
01:19:26.000 He's so crazy. 0.95
01:19:27.000 But what that means is he's unpredictable, right? 0.99
01:19:29.000 And so he's the guy in the bar that you look at and you're like, well, I'm just going to give that guy a little extra clearance because he looks like he's crazy.
01:19:35.000 So I think that might be...
01:19:37.000 What he either thinks he's doing or not.
01:19:41.000 But here's the interesting thing about this, okay?
01:19:43.000 I don't want to quote numbers on these things because I'm not sure what they are right now, but I got a factory up in Maine.
01:19:48.000 We make clothes.
01:19:49.000 We make jeans.
01:19:50.000 We make jujitsu geese, all right?
01:19:51.000 All made in America from the cotton that's grown in America. 0.95
01:19:55.000 It's woven.
01:19:55.000 We weave it in our factory.
01:19:56.000 We're doing everything here.
01:19:58.000 Now, there's things like labor.
01:20:00.000 Labor is more expensive in America because we pay our workers because they're awesome. 0.73
01:20:05.000 And so it costs a little bit more to build the product.
01:20:09.000 If you have a Chinese company that can make a jujitsu gi, and they're paying their workers a dollar a day, literally, and then they can ship that gi over here, well, then they can beat us on the price.
01:20:21.000 Their quality's not as good, but they can beat us on the price, and someone goes, okay, well, I can pay, you know, 70 bucks for this Chinese gi or 100 bucks for this American gi.
01:20:28.000 Okay, I'm going to buy the Chinese one at 70 bucks.
01:20:30.000 So...
01:20:31.000 And this actually, this part happened again, the details I can't quite remember, but they said, hey, we're not going to put a tariff on geese coming into America because they can't be made here.
01:20:44.000 Because they can't be made here.
01:20:45.000 And guess what?
01:20:45.000 This is specific to geese?
01:20:46.000 Specific.
01:20:47.000 Wow.
01:20:47.000 It was like, okay.
01:20:49.000 They can't be made here.
01:20:50.000 They can't be made here.
01:20:50.000 And it was actually pretty true.
01:20:52.000 When was this?
01:20:53.000 I don't know.
01:20:54.000 I don't know.
01:20:54.000 Again, I'm stepping out on a ledge here.
01:20:57.000 I've got to have my buddy Pete come on this podcast.
01:21:00.000 They've been made here forever though.
01:21:01.000 No, they haven't.
01:21:02.000 They've been made in Pakistan and China.
01:21:03.000 And there was one company that was making them down in Brazil.
01:21:06.000 But we said, no, actually they can't be made here and we're making them here.
01:21:10.000 And they put a 7% tariff on geese from overseas.
01:21:14.000 And so now that kind of equalizes the price.
01:21:16.000 Ours is a little bit more expensive, but it's made in American.
01:21:18.000 It's higher quality.
01:21:18.000 So people say, okay, we'll buy them here.
01:21:20.000 Are you the only company in America?
01:21:21.000 The only company in America that is making these.
01:21:24.000 No kidding.
01:21:24.000 So all these companies that are American companies, they're buying them overseas?
01:21:28.000 100%.
01:21:28.000 Yep.
01:21:28.000 Wow.
01:21:29.000 I didn't know that.
01:21:30.000 Yep.
01:21:31.000 Yep.
01:21:31.000 And what's your geek company?
01:21:32.000 Just so everybody knows.
01:21:33.000 It's called OriginMain.com.
01:21:36.000 OriginMain.com.
01:21:37.000 OriginMain.com.
01:21:38.000 M-A-I-N-E. I was talking to my business partner and I was like, I was in the airport and I go, hey man, how many people do you know that train jujitsu?
01:21:45.000 And he's like, I don't know, you know, like 30. And I go, how many people do you know that have a pair of jeans?
01:21:52.000 And he said, everybody.
01:21:53.000 And I said, why don't we make jeans?
01:21:55.000 So we started making jeans.
01:21:57.000 Yeah, yeah.
01:21:58.000 Yeah, see, it's a good call because everybody has jeans.
01:22:01.000 Because I was in the airport and I'm looking around and, you know, it was whatever.
01:22:04.000 98 people out of 100 are wearing jeans because we're Americans.
01:22:07.000 And is there anything more American to make an American company than jeans?
01:22:12.000 Do you make jeans with stretch in them?
01:22:14.000 Yep.
01:22:15.000 That is the important question.
01:22:17.000 Everything!
01:22:18.000 That's everything.
01:22:20.000 It's like, you know, otherwise you're making them out of coal.
01:22:24.000 I didn't know that was your company.
01:22:26.000 I think one of the first podcasts I listened to from your show at the very end, you and Echo Charles were talking about Origin.
01:22:32.000 You're like, I'm wearing Origin jeans and this and that about Origin.
01:22:35.000 I was like, dang, they must be pretty good sponsors.
01:22:39.000 What is that boot company that you're involved with?
01:22:41.000 Origin.
01:22:42.000 We're making boots as well.
01:22:42.000 Same thing as well.
01:22:43.000 And this is the awesome thing about this is you're from New England.
01:22:47.000 Well, in that part of, in Maine, used to be like the textile and clothing capital of America for sure.
01:22:54.000 They made boots.
01:22:54.000 They made bass.
01:22:55.000 They made all these things.
01:22:57.000 Bass boots, bass shoes.
01:22:58.000 They made all these things.
01:22:59.000 Textiles up in Maine and when the trade war started it all went away It all went away in the 70s and the 80s and they literally took those machines and shipped them overseas to India and Pakistan and there was my buddy Pete there was one Loom.
01:23:15.000 You know what a loom is?
01:23:16.000 Yeah.
01:23:17.000 It's this big thing that's got like 8 billion parts to it.
01:23:20.000 He wanted to get a loom because he realized that the only way you could get material for a gi was to weave it yourself.
01:23:25.000 Otherwise you had to buy it from China or Pakistan.
01:23:27.000 So he goes up to Lewiston, Maine.
01:23:30.000 There's a 500,000 square foot abandoned factory.
01:23:34.000 It has one loom in it.
01:23:36.000 Rusty.
01:23:37.000 Hasn't been used in 30 years.
01:23:39.000 And he found this old timer that used to work on the looms.
01:23:43.000 Him and his buddies, they went and dragged this thing out of this factory.
01:23:47.000 They brought it into this little factory that he had built himself out in the middle of the woods and started taking apart this loom and reassembling it.
01:23:54.000 And started weaving material and making geese.
01:23:58.000 Now, that was five years ago.
01:24:01.000 We started working together.
01:24:02.000 We merged together three years ago.
01:24:05.000 He had, whatever, four employees back there.
01:24:07.000 We have 60 now.
01:24:08.000 We're making stuff all the time.
01:24:10.000 But this is when I talk about building the economy, that's what I'm talking about.
01:24:14.000 And so these areas up in New England, up in Maine, that used to be so productive, well, there wasn't jobs up there.
01:24:21.000 And now it's like, oh yeah, we got jobs and we're going to continue to build that company and just bring manufacturing back to America.
01:24:28.000 So these are things that I think help.
01:24:31.000 When I talk about the global economy, you know who's going to want American jeans made at origin in Maine?
01:24:37.000 You know who's going to want those?
01:24:38.000 People in China.
01:24:39.000 People in Japan.
01:24:39.000 They're going to want these jeans because there's...
01:24:42.000 They've got soul, man.
01:24:44.000 They got soul.
01:24:45.000 They're real.
01:24:46.000 That's one of the best commercials I've ever heard.
01:24:48.000 Lewiston, Maine.
01:24:49.000 That's where Muhammad Ali knocked out Sonny Liston.
01:24:51.000 Yeah, there you go.
01:24:51.000 The rematch.
01:24:52.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:24:52.000 That's a great place to start a company like that.
01:24:55.000 That's amazing.
01:24:56.000 I think that's where, as we talk about overall trade policy and where we've gone wrong, you're saying, you know, what happened back in the 70s and 80s, you saw how These massive trade deals that were put in place, really the people who benefited most from them were the multinational corporations who were exporting these jobs and it was those mom and pop,
01:25:17.000 those small business owners and manufacturers who suffered the most.
01:25:21.000 And that's where I think as we look at, you know, trade negotiations with China, as we look at some of these trade deals with countries like India and others, that's where we've got to get back to.
01:25:30.000 Rather than just making sure the largest corporations have a seat at the trade negotiations tables, we've got to have those small business voices, those small manufacturers, and make sure that our policy is actually helping empower and strengthen the back Backbone of our economy that has been before and that we need to bring it back to that helps improve the quality of life for the people who are working in Maine,
01:25:54.000 manufacturing your jeans and your geese.
01:25:57.000 And having such great pride in doing so, knowing like, hey man, yeah, this is made in America.
01:26:04.000 I've seen your packaging.
01:26:04.000 It says, we the people.
01:26:06.000 What more powerful words are there?
01:26:09.000 They're the first words of our Constitution for a reason.
01:26:12.000 That is what should be at the forefront of our policies across the board and all these different issues.
01:26:21.000 If the first interest is not we the people, As it has been for so long, then we see what goes wrong, and then the consequence, we the people suffer.
01:26:31.000 So what's going on right now, the consequences of this issue, this trade war with China, where it's really hitting, you were saying, is there's people in America that are selling things to China?
01:26:44.000 Yeah, well, I give you one example.
01:26:45.000 I mean, you've heard a lot from, like, corn and soybean farmers in Iowa.
01:26:49.000 That's a story that's been in the news a lot.
01:26:51.000 We were at a farmer's market in, I think, yeah, I was in Des Moines recently, and we're kind of walking through and picking up some food and veggies and stuff like that.
01:27:00.000 And we stopped at, like, an apple orchard that had a whole table with all these different beautiful, amazing apples.
01:27:06.000 We started talking to the guy, him and his wife, were on this apple orchard.
01:27:09.000 And he said, you know, the trade and tariff war with China has hit us really hard.
01:27:14.000 I said, wow, that's surprising to me.
01:27:18.000 Tell me more.
01:27:18.000 And he talked about how, I said, do you export your apples to China?
01:27:23.000 And he said, no, not at all.
01:27:24.000 We sell our apples in Iowa and in the Midwest.
01:27:27.000 And that's it, local and regional customers.
01:27:31.000 What happened was the apple farms in Washington State selling Honeycrisp apples that they do export to China.
01:27:38.000 When this trade and tariff war started, they couldn't anymore.
01:27:42.000 That market was completely blocked off to them.
01:27:44.000 And so what they started doing was shipping their apples to the Midwest.
01:27:49.000 I think?
01:28:13.000 On his family farm, essentially.
01:28:35.000 How much should he plan to purchase?
01:28:37.000 Are things going to get better, so you should just do a little bit now and then wait?
01:28:39.000 Or just the level of uncertainty and destabilization it's created, I think, has been the most negative impact on people here at home.
01:28:50.000 There's some legitimate concerns, too, though, right?
01:28:52.000 Like, Huawei's a weird one.
01:28:54.000 There are legitimate concerns, yeah, for sure.
01:28:58.000 Yeah, I'm kind of a tech dork, and I love looking at...
01:29:02.000 One of the things that China does particularly well, particularly Huawei, is innovation with cell phone technology.
01:29:08.000 I mean, they make the most spectacular cameras.
01:29:11.000 They were way ahead of the curve on a lot of different features, and they continue to do that.
01:29:15.000 And they were selling them in America up to a point, and then that cut off.
01:29:19.000 And it cut off with...
01:29:21.000 The first time I've ever heard national security concerns because of a cell phone company.
01:29:26.000 And it just makes you go, whoa, whoa, whoa, is this real?
01:29:29.000 And it's real cloudy.
01:29:30.000 Like, you talk to people on the tech side and they say, this doesn't make any sense.
01:29:33.000 But then you talk to people on the intelligence side and they say, this makes all the sense in the world.
01:29:37.000 Like, this is a shifty company that's inexorably tied to the Chinese government.
01:29:42.000 There's no difference between the government and this company.
01:29:44.000 They are moving.
01:29:46.000 They have a long game, and this long game is provide backdoor access so that data can be stolen, have that built into systems, and they've caught them doing this before.
01:29:57.000 So they're like, you've got a finger in the dam here, and this whole thing can come tumbling down if you don't stop this company.
01:30:04.000 Yeah.
01:30:04.000 I mean, I think some of those concerns are very valid when you're talking about Huawei, but I think also just the issue of building these backdoor entries into our technology is something that we are very concerned about both happening here at home.
01:30:22.000 This has been an issue that we've been dealing with in Congress.
01:30:25.000 Where, because of provisions that were passed in the Patriot Act, there were loopholes that have been exploited by some of our tech companies working with some of our intelligence agencies to build these back doors into their systems,
01:30:42.000 into their programs, or into their hardware, which directly violates the civil liberties and Fourth Amendment rights for us as Americans.
01:30:52.000 And I think that points to the bigger issue of the Civil liberties and privacy and the growing power that the tech industry has that we've got to be very, very, in my opinion, concerned and careful of and actually exercising the kind of oversight and accountability that we should have been doing,
01:31:14.000 frankly, a long time ago.
01:31:15.000 Tech is a really important conversation to have with you right now.
01:31:19.000 You're in the middle of this lawsuit with Google.
01:31:21.000 Explain that.
01:31:23.000 So the first debate that we had in this presidential election, we had hoped that I would do well going into it and that people would go and start their internet search and say, hey, who is Tulsi Gabbard?
01:31:35.000 I've never heard of her before.
01:31:36.000 And so we went and got the Google ads set up, got them approved, everything was ready to rock and roll.
01:31:42.000 I was the most Googled candidate of the night, as I have been for every debate that I've participated in.
01:31:49.000 The issue was during that first debate, while that peak period was happening, our Google ad account was suspended by Google with no explanation whatsoever.
01:32:00.000 No like, hey, you guys...
01:32:01.000 There was nothing like, hey, you guys screwed up, fix this, and then we'll put your account back in.
01:32:07.000 Hey, Google ads, Bill, how are you?
01:32:09.000 Good to hear from y'all.
01:32:11.000 That is so sketchy.
01:32:13.000 It's so sketchy.
01:32:14.000 And so, you know, our tech guys are freaking out.
01:32:16.000 They're like, man, this is what we were waiting for, and now you guys took our account down.
01:32:20.000 Tell us what we got to do to get it back up.
01:32:22.000 And A, we didn't hear back for a while.
01:32:24.000 Once we started hearing back, we heard back from different people with different answers.
01:32:28.000 Nothing clear-cut to say, you did this wrong, fix this, we'll put your account back.
01:32:32.000 Nothing.
01:32:33.000 And then all of a sudden, you know, hours and hours had gone by, and then our account was reinstated without any explanation about what happened.
01:32:40.000 And, you know, this is bigger than just the loss in opportunity that my campaign had because this happened on that night during that peak period.
01:32:52.000 It's a bigger issue about the power that this corporation has in Google in interfering essentially in fair elections and in what kind of information they are willing to put in front of people.
01:33:05.000 Don't they own Boston Dynamics too?
01:33:07.000 Does Google own Boston Dynamics?
01:33:08.000 They did and they sold it back like a year ago or something.
01:33:12.000 Bring it.
01:33:13.000 Yeah.
01:33:15.000 Jocko's ready for the robot war.
01:33:17.000 I watched Black Mirror.
01:33:18.000 I'm not in.
01:33:19.000 I'll tell you what.
01:33:20.000 You get extra double bonus credit from me right now, Tulsi, because that right there is so crazy.
01:33:26.000 And for you to be like, yeah, it's bad for me, but it's also bad for the American people.
01:33:29.000 I would have been stuck at bad for me if that were you.
01:33:31.000 That is gnarly.
01:33:33.000 It is.
01:33:33.000 It's so gnarly that they did that.
01:33:35.000 And it's so transparent.
01:33:36.000 And very few people talked about it and very few people know about it.
01:33:39.000 Exactly.
01:33:40.000 That's what was so stunning about it.
01:33:41.000 It's like there's people pulling strings.
01:33:44.000 Who?
01:33:44.000 Why?
01:33:46.000 Undefined and no investigation into it.
01:33:48.000 Until you put out this lawsuit, there's really no way to find out.
01:33:52.000 Yeah, it started to force that conversation that we're continuing to push to the forefront about how, particularly with Google and Facebook, the inordinate amount of power that they have...
01:34:04.000 To, as we sit and type in a Google search for whatever, or, you know, what's popping up on our Facebook feed, they control that.
01:34:12.000 I think that we have a real issue in this country with advertising in those things, in Google and Facebook, a real issue that it's never really been fully discussed, because those things just sort of came up out of nowhere.
01:34:22.000 You know, we had social networks, we had MySpace, and we had, you know, we didn't think anything of it.
01:34:28.000 And then all of a sudden, not only are they here, but they have this extraordinary amount of influence.
01:34:33.000 Yeah.
01:34:34.000 So it's not just they're putting out what people put out.
01:34:36.000 They have algorithms that figure out what you're into and then show you that.
01:34:41.000 So if you're just really in a conflict, which most people are, they're just showing you conflict all day long and it's getting everybody riled up.
01:34:47.000 So it's having a direct effect, whether it's planned and coordinated or not, it's having a direct effect on discourse in this country.
01:34:55.000 It is.
01:34:55.000 And I think it's one of the reasons why what you were talking about before, where you're either with us or you're against us, and it's never been more hard-line than it has been right now.
01:35:04.000 And all of this is because of advertising money.
01:35:07.000 And advertising what?
01:35:08.000 Like, what are you even selling?
01:35:10.000 You're just a portal to connect people with each other, and through that, you're gaining an insane amount of influence, and an extraordinary amount of money is being generated.
01:35:19.000 And we never agreed to it.
01:35:20.000 We just looked down and we saw the ad.
01:35:23.000 Oh, what are they selling?
01:35:24.000 Oh, yeah, okay, that looks like a nice watch.
01:35:26.000 And then everybody's just getting bought and sold.
01:35:30.000 And it's happening to a point now where that is one of the main...
01:35:37.000 Town halls, one of the main places where people discuss ideas in the world, is these social media networks.
01:35:44.000 And they're not getting smaller, they're only getting bigger, so they keep growing and they keep stacking up.
01:35:48.000 And whether it's Google or Facebook or Twitter, any of these...
01:35:52.000 The amount of influence they have is insane.
01:35:54.000 And they're just people.
01:35:55.000 They're just people.
01:35:56.000 These are just regular folks.
01:35:57.000 I know Jack Dorsey.
01:35:59.000 He's a nice guy. 1.00
01:35:59.000 He's a regular fucking person. 1.00
01:36:01.000 The fact that this guy has so much power, this company has so much power, that any of these companies have so much power. 1.00
01:36:07.000 We are not ready for this.
01:36:08.000 And this is happening right under our noses, and it's happening so quickly. 0.97
01:36:12.000 And then, when something like your Google situation happens, where it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, not only are you profiting, but now you're fucking pulling strings? 0.80
01:36:21.000 You're showing us you're pulling strings?
01:36:23.000 And everybody's like, what's going on?
01:36:26.000 Nothing.
01:36:26.000 It's so dangerous.
01:36:28.000 Whatever.
01:36:29.000 They're interfering with democracy in this weird sort of semi-legal way.
01:36:35.000 You could just say they violated policy.
01:36:37.000 What policy?
01:36:38.000 What policy did you violate?
01:36:39.000 Did they just cancel your act?
01:36:41.000 They still have not told us that.
01:36:43.000 That's insane.
01:36:44.000 The policy you violated was being a viable candidate for President of the United States of America.
01:36:48.000 It has to be.
01:36:48.000 It has to be.
01:36:49.000 Not only a viable candidate, but one that's saying, hey, You guys are too fucking big.
01:36:54.000 I'm going to break up these monopolies and provide the kinds of oversight and accountability that will protect the consumer, that will protect the American people, protect fair and honest discourse, protect freedom of speech.
01:37:08.000 That's the issue.
01:37:09.000 And frankly, that's the difference between me and somebody like Mayor Pete, for example.
01:37:16.000 Other candidates, and he's not the only one, but other candidates who refuse to take a strong position in recognizing the threat to our public discourse and our democracy that these tech giants have really within the hands of just a few people.
01:37:35.000 You have, I think this just broke in the news recently, Mark Zuckerberg who, you know, people were taught he's like wanted to run for president not that long ago and was seriously considering it and, you know, he's trying to start his own cryptocurrency,
01:37:51.000 wants to have his own currency that he controls.
01:37:53.000 Like the amount of power this guy has and that he wants to continue to grow is so dangerous.
01:37:58.000 He decided not to run for president but he and his wife started emailing Mayor Pete's Never mind if he gets elected when he's got two people that are inside track at Facebook.
01:38:24.000 Yep.
01:38:25.000 That show up there.
01:38:26.000 I don't know if you've ever done anything with Facebook as far as advertising, but people that understand how all that stuff works, I've talked to them before.
01:38:33.000 It's a whole science behind it.
01:38:35.000 So now that they're in there, he should get a big bump across the board.
01:38:39.000 I don't know Mark Zuckerberg, but I don't like the way he drinks water.
01:39:01.000 Show me how he did it.
01:39:04.000 I'll show you.
01:39:05.000 We'll play the video.
01:39:06.000 It's like this.
01:39:06.000 He puts this glass up to his mouth and touches the lips with the water.
01:39:11.000 Here we go.
01:39:12.000 Watch this.
01:39:13.000 Look at this.
01:39:13.000 He's a robot pretending to drink.
01:39:15.000 Watch this. 1.00
01:39:16.000 What the fuck is happening here? 1.00
01:39:19.000 What is happening here? 0.99
01:39:20.000 The water didn't move.
01:39:21.000 I never noticed this before.
01:39:23.000 It barely moved.
01:39:24.000 It barely, like, slid.
01:39:26.000 I love that Jamie was able to find that so fast.
01:39:28.000 Jamie's a master.
01:39:29.000 Jamie's a master.
01:39:30.000 So, Tulsi, let me ask you this.
01:39:32.000 From a strategic perspective, all right, do you feel like these moves, like you coming out strong against Google, Facebook, saying that you could break up those types of monopolies, Strategically are you thinking right now?
01:39:45.000 Well, maybe that wasn't the best call because You know you could have not been so strong against them and and played along with them a little bit Maybe they look at you and go through the list that that Joe went through earlier, which is you're a veteran You're a woman.
01:39:58.000 You're a woman of color.
01:39:59.000 You're from Hawaii.
01:40:00.000 You've got this experience Congresswoman.
01:40:02.000 Yeah, Congresswoman.
01:40:03.000 You got all this stuff.
01:40:04.000 They could look at you go.
01:40:05.000 Wow.
01:40:05.000 Yeah, she's good We can get her on our side And then maybe, you know, increase your chances of getting elected, then you get elected, then you go, okay, you know what, I've thought about this, and guess what?
01:40:15.000 We're not doing it that way, and I'm going to break you guys up.
01:40:17.000 Do you think strategically, or is that just the type of person you are is like, you know what, I'm just going to tell the truth from the get-go?
01:40:24.000 Is that basically what we're doing?
01:40:25.000 I'm going to tell the truth and call it straight, no matter what, and...
01:40:30.000 No matter who I'm dealing with, because A, that's who I am, and B, people are sick and tired of politicians who play this game and do this political dance as they're trying to get people elected and be like, okay, well,
01:40:45.000 if I just say this or if I just kind of cozy up to these people or these interests, they can help me get elected.
01:40:51.000 And then when I win, then I'm going to do the right thing.
01:40:55.000 Well, guess what?
01:40:56.000 When you win, okay, you've got to win the next re-election.
01:40:58.000 That means I need more money from Wall Street.
01:41:00.000 I need more money from Google.
01:41:02.000 I need more money from these guys, so I can't say anything to piss them off just yet.
01:41:06.000 I'm going to wait until I get re-elected.
01:41:08.000 Then that's when I'm really going to start to do the right thing.
01:41:10.000 And I think people across party lines are sick and tired of the same old politicians who say one thing and do another and instead are looking for real leadership.
01:41:22.000 It just seems like there's a tipping point that we'll have to reach before that actually happens.
01:41:27.000 I don't know if we're there yet.
01:41:29.000 It's kind of like when I was on your podcast for the first time, Joe, and you told me to start a podcast.
01:41:34.000 At that time, I don't know if you know this or not, it was 2015. The stats were that 17% of America were listening to podcasts.
01:41:44.000 Now it's something like 78% in four years.
01:41:47.000 Just totally different.
01:41:49.000 But when you talk about Tulsi having a podcast, which you absolutely should, and by the way, all you need to do is go and do a question and answer town hall with people, have somebody record it, splice it up to the good stuff, and put that out 20 minutes long, people start to learn how you are.
01:41:59.000 Yes, but my point is that that change happened, and right now, Joe Rogan has the most powerful voice in media in a very short period of time, but Five years ago, he didn't.
01:42:13.000 You know, five years ago, it'd be like, oh, you want to sell a book, you better go on the big network.
01:42:17.000 Nowadays, oh, you want to sell a book, you try and get on Joe Rogan and he can peddle some book for you or get your product out there or help your campaign.
01:42:24.000 We're like at that tipping point politically, it seems right now.
01:42:28.000 And yeah, just what is it going to take to push people over the edge?
01:42:31.000 That's the question.
01:42:32.000 I think that...
01:42:33.000 What we saw happen in 2016, I think, pointed to that tipping point.
01:42:40.000 And I believe that we are here because, you know, these are conversations that we're having in town hall meetings in different parts of the country.
01:42:50.000 Again, we're building this coalition of Americans who are most interested in putting our country first, who are willing to disagree without being disagreeable, but understand we got to treat each other with respect and stand united around the principles and freedoms.
01:43:07.000 That bring us together, focusing on we, the people, putting the interests of the people first and foremost.
01:43:15.000 And I would say that the vast majority of Americans have put up with the same old, same old for so long and are sick and tired of this pay-to-play culture in Washington, of the political corruption that exists, of the big-money special interests who influence the decisions that leaders are making that benefit them instead of the people.
01:43:34.000 That they're looking for a leader that says what they mean and mean what they say and who will back that up with action.
01:43:42.000 I think that's where we're seeing support growing for my campaign.
01:43:48.000 The more people hear about who I am, the background and experience that I bring to this job is And that I am willing to take a stand to speak the truth for the people, even against some of the most powerful interests.
01:44:03.000 Honestly, our biggest challenge is getting in front of people, because most people in the country still don't know who I am.
01:44:09.000 Or you have people who maybe have heard about me, but they've gotten the corporate media narrative.
01:44:16.000 But they're Tulsi curious.
01:44:17.000 They're Tulsi curious.
01:44:18.000 And really, that's a good way to put it.
01:44:21.000 So that's really where our effort is focused now.
01:44:24.000 New Hampshire is voting in less than 100 days.
01:44:27.000 And so, you know, we're asking for support from people to make contribution to my campaign.
01:44:34.000 Tulsi2020.com.
01:44:36.000 Literally getting this support will make the difference for us to be able to bypass this corporate media narrative and actually communicate directly to voters, directly to people.
01:44:49.000 No one better than you knows that these tech companies have this extraordinary amount of power and that no one anticipated it.
01:44:56.000 It came out of nowhere.
01:44:57.000 What do you think could be done to ensure that people have a voice and that this voice is not being manipulated because of financial interests or political interests?
01:45:07.000 And this is where we're at today, that this...
01:45:09.000 These companies, like it or not, they don't have to abide by the First Amendment.
01:45:14.000 That's not what they do.
01:45:15.000 They can decide, we're going to ban you based on your political leanings. 0.98
01:45:20.000 There's a famous case out of Canada where a woman was having an... 0.95
01:45:23.000 You know what a TERF is?
01:45:26.000 It's a trans-exclusionary radical feminist. 1.00
01:45:29.000 I've never heard that before.
01:45:31.000 Radical feminists who don't believe that transgender women should be involved in women's issues and that they shouldn't be able to vote on women's issues. 1.00
01:45:38.000 And she was in an argument on Twitter.
01:45:40.000 Her name is Megan Murphy.
01:45:41.000 And she said, a man is never a woman.
01:45:44.000 Twitter told her, you've got to take that down. 0.93
01:45:46.000 So she's a bit feisty. 1.00
01:45:48.000 She took it down, took a screenshot, put it back up with the screenshot.
01:45:51.000 She's like, okay, I took it down.
01:45:52.000 There it is again, though.
01:45:53.000 And they banned her for life. 0.98
01:45:55.000 Wow.
01:45:56.000 For life.
01:45:56.000 So, it's something like that where you can't even have opinions on things that are controversial without being removed from the discourse.
01:46:05.000 We have a real problem with that.
01:46:06.000 Yeah.
01:46:07.000 That's a giant problem.
01:46:08.000 This is just one social thing.
01:46:10.000 It's a hot-button issue right now.
01:46:12.000 Whether it's just a fad or it'll go away or it'll be normalized, we don't know.
01:46:18.000 But the fact that...
01:46:19.000 You don't have the First Amendment protecting people from a legitimate opinion that's actually based on, you know, whether you like it or not, biological science.
01:46:29.000 We're in a very strange time that a company, and I just use this as an example because you're talking about something where it's biologically clear that she's correct.
01:46:39.000 Whether or not you socially think that people should be treated how they want to be treated and use the pronouns, I agree with that. 0.96
01:46:47.000 Yeah.
01:47:07.000 Yes.
01:47:07.000 That you can participate in.
01:47:08.000 And that's just one example of the thousands and thousands of examples of people that are removed from conversations based on their political leanings, their ideologies.
01:47:19.000 And meanwhile, there's just unlimited hardcore pornography.
01:47:24.000 On Twitter, which is perfectly okay, but we can't say that about whatever that situation is, which I don't really understand, but it sounds good.
01:47:31.000 And O.J. Simpson as well.
01:47:32.000 O.J. Simpson's on Twitter.
01:47:34.000 It's just hilarious as well.
01:47:35.000 And also, I think that kind of thing is the kind of thing that gets a backlash from moderate people.
01:47:40.000 Absolutely.
01:47:40.000 Where a moderate person sitting in Nebraska is like, well, who am I voting for?
01:47:44.000 Well, these people are bad.
01:47:45.000 They're against this whole idea.
01:47:47.000 Okay, looks like Trump is on my side.
01:47:49.000 Here we go.
01:47:50.000 100%.
01:47:50.000 And this idea that you can de-platform people and somehow or another it weakens the position that you don't agree with, it's the opposite.
01:47:58.000 The opposite happens.
01:47:59.000 You pump up the only hope that they have of getting their side of the story out there.
01:48:04.000 Their side of the story is going to be represented by Trump and Trump supporters.
01:48:07.000 And I don't know what the president can or can't do to sort of enforce some sort of...
01:48:12.000 I mean, we obviously have a new situation when it comes to communication in this country with social media and tech companies.
01:48:17.000 It's very new.
01:48:18.000 And it's only the last couple of decades.
01:48:20.000 It's even been a thing.
01:48:21.000 And now it's one of the biggest things.
01:48:24.000 In terms of discourse and how people communicate and how people form opinions about things, that's a tremendous influence on our culture.
01:48:33.000 And the fact that this isn't protected by the First Amendment, we have a very strange new force in our country when it comes to discourse.
01:48:42.000 And I think laws need to be formed.
01:48:44.000 We need to have some sort of parameters.
01:48:47.000 I mean, there's laws on virtually everything.
01:48:51.000 And virtually everything that has massive influence over the way it affects our country.
01:48:56.000 And that's one where there isn't, really.
01:48:58.000 No, there's not.
01:48:59.000 They're independent companies.
01:49:00.000 And they can do whatever they want, essentially.
01:49:04.000 Yeah.
01:49:05.000 No, it's limitless.
01:49:06.000 I agree with you.
01:49:08.000 I agree with you both with regards to the tech companies, but also this bigger kind of culture war that's happening in our country.
01:49:17.000 Yes.
01:49:21.000 I mean, it does.
01:49:23.000 It threatens the kind of freedom of speech and discourse that I think we've celebrated in this country for so long, where this is the country, where you can stand up and say what you believe, no matter how...
01:49:35.000 How terrible I may think it is or how strongly I may disagree with it, you know, people like us are willing to lay our life down for your right to do that.
01:49:45.000 I think that's what is at risk here with this culture, this cancel culture that's having such a chilling effect where people are maybe afraid to say something that may be seen as controversial or offensive to some because they will get canceled.
01:49:59.000 And in some cases, you've seen how people's, especially if you're a public figure, your whole career can be just like, Gone.
01:50:06.000 Finished.
01:50:07.000 Cancel culture is real simple.
01:50:08.000 Everyone now has a rock and there's a big window. 0.92
01:50:11.000 Someone throws a rock at that window and you're like, well, I'll fucking throw my rock too. 0.77
01:50:14.000 And that's what happens.
01:50:15.000 People just, whether or not they have a strong opinion on something or not, they just decide that's the spot we're throwing the rocks.
01:50:21.000 Right.
01:50:21.000 And they just chuck the rocks.
01:50:22.000 And then they feel like they have some sort of a, you know, if a politician gets taken down, they're like, look, I helped.
01:50:28.000 Look at my Twitter feed. 1.00
01:50:30.000 My Twitter feed's filled with calling that guy a piece of shit. 1.00
01:50:32.000 I was the first one. 1.00
01:50:32.000 Yeah. 1.00
01:50:33.000 I was the first one that did it.
01:50:33.000 I think that, you know, you mentioned What does it happen in the debate?
01:50:38.000 Kamala Harris, she launched a petition or publicly was calling for Twitter to delete President Trump's account.
01:50:46.000 And she really, really made a big deal out of this.
01:50:48.000 Did a whole media tour.
01:50:50.000 Called out Elizabeth Warren. 0.99
01:50:51.000 All this stuff.
01:50:52.000 I was asked about it by a reporter shortly after she had made this announcement.
01:50:56.000 I had not even heard of it.
01:50:58.000 Like, oh, what do you think about Kamala Harris calling on Twitter to cancel Trump's Twitter account? 0.98
01:51:02.000 I said, well, you know, I disagree with Not everything, but a lot of what Trump says, but freedom of speech.
01:51:11.000 Freedom of speech.
01:51:12.000 So no, I completely disagree with her.
01:51:14.000 And the response from her campaign spokesperson, no kidding.
01:51:20.000 Tulsi Gabbard echoes Fox News talking points.
01:51:26.000 Freedom of Fox News is saying, oh, well, what about freedom of speech?
01:51:30.000 By the way, Richard Spencer loves her.
01:51:33.000 But that's like, this is where we're at.
01:51:36.000 Like just saying, hey, freedom of speech.
01:51:39.000 Whether you're the President of the United States or you're the guy sweeping the floor in the White House, I will stand up and fight for your freedom of speech.
01:51:47.000 I may disagree and I may disagree publicly and strongly, but we've got to draw the line here for freedom of speech and being able to have this dialogue and discourse where we can, and I think that we should debate strongly and maybe passionately about some of these issues,
01:52:02.000 not seeing that as a bad thing.
01:52:06.000 That's been the strength of our country.
01:52:08.000 It'll be interesting, you know, from a free market perspective, if at some point somebody comes out with a social media platform that is really, truly free speech.
01:52:17.000 They have done that.
01:52:18.000 They have done that, but they get taken over by trolls.
01:52:20.000 There's ThinkSpot getting run around right now.
01:52:22.000 Gab.
01:52:22.000 Gab's one.
01:52:23.000 Yeah, it'll just be...
01:52:24.000 Yeah, but people have told me, tech friends of mine that say, they say that immediately turns into, what is it, 4chan and 8chan?
01:52:31.000 It just immediately goes into the gutter.
01:52:33.000 It's an open sewer.
01:52:34.000 Yeah.
01:52:35.000 I mean, it's just like, have you ever seen those pipes that pump sewage into the ocean?
01:52:40.000 It's just green and disgusting.
01:52:41.000 I mean, and it's not the fault of the social media companies.
01:52:45.000 The companies like Gab, they're committed to free speech, and what they're trying to do is just let it all work itself out and abide by the Constitution.
01:52:51.000 Don't dox anybody, don't give up anybody's address, don't threaten anybody or do any harm, and just talk crazy and do it anonymously, and that's what a lot of people are doing.
01:53:00.000 But it's very difficult for even the people that felt like they were deplatformed or their voice wasn't being able to be heard. 0.95
01:53:07.000 They don't want to join in to this crazy shit because of 4chan and all those savages. 0.97
01:53:13.000 They're just trying to post pictures of their dinner, right? 1.00
01:53:16.000 Exactly.
01:53:16.000 They can't.
01:53:18.000 It's so nuts.
01:53:20.000 Even posting pictures of your dinner, you do that on Instagram, and if it's a dead deer or something like that, you're at risk of getting your picture taken down.
01:53:30.000 It's the amount of power that's being exhibited by these social media companies.
01:53:35.000 Again, no one anticipated this.
01:53:37.000 What could be done?
01:53:38.000 What do you think could be done?
01:53:39.000 Say you become president, what would you do?
01:53:44.000 So, I think there's two things here.
01:53:46.000 We've talked about the freedom of speech, the control over information.
01:53:49.000 I think part and parcel to that that we didn't really talk much about is how much of our private information these tech companies have and what they're doing with it, maybe without us even knowing about how that's helping to drive up their profits.
01:54:02.000 I think it's both of those components you've got to be concerned about.
01:54:07.000 I think we're good to go.
01:54:28.000 I think that is the definition of a monopoly across platforms that many of us use because there isn't really a legitimate alternative option available to us.
01:54:40.000 So I think that's the first thing in looking at breaking up these monopolies.
01:54:45.000 I think Facebook's co-founder, Chris Hayes I think is his name, he wrote I think a very compelling argument against Facebook monopoly saying they have gotten way too powerful.
01:54:57.000 They should not have been able to buy these other companies.
01:55:00.000 And the second thing is Congress actually digging down and passing laws that provide actual oversight and a level of accountability To ensure that our freedom of speech and our freedom to access information is not impeded by these tech giants,
01:55:24.000 whether it's for their own profits or to pursue their own political interests.
01:55:33.000 There's people inside of Twitter that, like Jack Dorsey believes, at least according to what he's told me, that Twitter should be like a town hall where everyone should be able to have access.
01:55:44.000 But he faces resistance to that inside the actual company that he's the CEO of.
01:55:49.000 There's so many people that don't think that that's the way it should be, and they think that they have a political or a social obligation to limit certain voices because those voices radicalize young people.
01:56:01.000 Like, what do you say to those people?
01:56:05.000 I mean, without knowing examples of what they're citing, here's the thing, is what they may view as radicalizing young people because of the ideology that they as individuals may hold onto may be seen in the opposite way by people who hold a different political ideology.
01:56:24.000 I think this is something that we're seeing happening offline as well.
01:56:29.000 Whether it's in college campuses or in other places where both sides view the other side as indoctrinating young people or indoctrinating people with their ideology.
01:56:41.000 Look at Fox News and MSNBC. They are both pushing opposing narratives on news happenings of the day or whatever's happening in Washington.
01:56:54.000 You watch the exact same thing happen, you know, the killing of Baghdadi.
01:57:00.000 You saw a very different bias in the news that was being presented by these stories.
01:57:04.000 How about the Washington Post?
01:57:04.000 Did you see the Washington Post?
01:57:06.000 Explain, tell people what they said.
01:57:08.000 They put a story up that said, I forget what the quote was, but they called him like a cleric, religious cleric, something like that.
01:57:16.000 Wow.
01:57:17.000 Astur.
01:57:18.000 What's that word?
01:57:18.000 Astur?
01:57:19.000 What is that word?
01:57:20.000 Astute?
01:57:21.000 No.
01:57:21.000 Religious scholar.
01:57:22.000 I forget what word they use to describe him.
01:57:26.000 Just try to find out what this...
01:57:28.000 I think it's astur.
01:57:31.000 Religious scholar.
01:57:32.000 I was like, what?
01:57:35.000 That guy?
01:57:38.000 That's just insanity.
01:57:40.000 But how does that get through?
01:57:44.000 How does someone in the Washington Post go, Wow.
01:58:11.000 Religious scholar. 0.97
01:58:12.000 Well, at least when you zoom in on his eyes there, you can tell he's completely insane. 0.97
01:58:15.000 Yeah.
01:58:16.000 Zoom in on that, Jamie.
01:58:18.000 Let me get a zoom.
01:58:19.000 What?
01:58:19.000 Yeah.
01:58:20.000 Whoa.
01:58:21.000 Jesus Christ.
01:58:22.000 Yeah.
01:58:23.000 He got a hold of Trump Sudafed.
01:58:24.000 Look at him.
01:58:28.000 That title is so bananas.
01:58:31.000 It is.
01:58:31.000 It's crazy.
01:58:32.000 That's, as Tulsi just pointed out, that's someone driving a narrative, right?
01:58:36.000 That's someone driving a narrative.
01:58:37.000 Because somebody that doesn't understand this, that's their first glimpse of this reality, and their glimpse of this reality is that this guy was an austere religious leader.
01:58:46.000 What is the actual definition of austere?
01:58:49.000 Let's pull that up, because I want to find out how hilarious this really is, because I think it's really hilarious.
01:58:57.000 Which, by the way, as Jamie's doing that, Washington Post owned by, oh, here we go.
01:59:02.000 Severe or strict in manner, attitude, or appearance, an austere man with a rigidly puritanical outlook.
01:59:11.000 Too nice.
01:59:12.000 This guy was a Puritan as far as they're concerned. 1.00
01:59:14.000 Yeah, Puritan piece of shit. 1.00
01:59:16.000 Having an extremely plain and simple style or appearance, unadorned. 1.00
01:59:20.000 Okay, he's dressed like a genie.
01:59:22.000 He's living in a hole in the ground.
01:59:24.000 And he's running ISIS. You people are...
01:59:27.000 Out of your mind. 0.97
01:59:28.000 It's offensive.
01:59:29.000 It's so strange.
01:59:30.000 I mean, there's real monsters in this world.
01:59:32.000 And when you add a bunch of words to a description of a real monster that make that person seem like they're a contributor to culture, it's just, and that's what it seems, religious scholar. 0.53
01:59:46.000 Oh, he's a religious scholar.
01:59:48.000 Must be a good guy.
01:59:49.000 He's helping people out with religion. 0.56
01:59:50.000 Meanwhile, he's sawing people's heads off. 1.00
01:59:52.000 He's throwing gay people off the top of buildings. 1.00
01:59:54.000 Right. 0.99
01:59:55.000 Because they don't agree with his quote-unquote religious scholarly beliefs.
02:00:01.000 Such a strange choice, the fact that that's a mainstream publication.
02:00:06.000 A huge newspaper.
02:00:08.000 And that somehow or another slipped through the net.
02:00:12.000 Like, what?
02:00:13.000 The headline like that, front page, that's not slipping through the net.
02:00:17.000 You know what I mean?
02:00:18.000 That's planned.
02:00:19.000 But to someone like you, who's actually had to go over there and risk your life to fight guys like that, how sick does that make you to just read that?
02:00:40.000 Yeah.
02:00:42.000 Yeah.
02:00:46.000 There's someone that has a position of influence in the world that wrote that headline and said, yeah, this guy's an austere religious leader, scholar.
02:00:55.000 There's a guy, I forget his name.
02:00:57.000 He's a famous Muslim commentator. 0.99
02:01:03.000 Who's online, but he attacked that so viciously and talked about what a piece of garbage that guy actually was, and how awful he is, and how this goes against everything that a modern Muslim feels and thinks, and that this, 0.99
02:01:18.000 have this person represent, and to say, a religious scholar is so deeply offensive. 0.99
02:01:26.000 And that's fantastic.
02:01:27.000 I wish I could remember that guy's name.
02:01:29.000 Who did it?
02:01:30.000 Mehdi?
02:01:31.000 Mehdi?
02:01:32.000 Mehdi?
02:01:32.000 Mehdi?
02:01:32.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi?
02:01:33.000 Mehdi But this is the Washington Post.
02:01:37.000 I mean, this isn't like someone's blog on Tinder or something or wherever you have blogs these days.
02:01:43.000 This is a huge mainstream publication.
02:01:45.000 And it just – the distorting of narratives is such a strange – Factor in today's culture.
02:01:54.000 We don't have a Walter Cronkite giving us the straightforward news every day on the air with no lean or slant and just give you the facts.
02:02:04.000 We don't have that.
02:02:05.000 We don't have what we thought of as a top-level newspaper from 1980 or whatever, where they were doing real journalism, trying to break down a story in a way that you could understand why you're drinking your coffee.
02:02:19.000 Hey, is the world blowing up?
02:02:20.000 Let me see what's going on here.
02:02:21.000 Yeah, my dad pointed out to me, you know, you were talking about there's nothing that unifies us anymore.
02:02:25.000 And you're like, hey, everyone change jujitsu.
02:02:27.000 I obviously agree with that.
02:02:29.000 But what my dad was telling me that in the 60s and the 70s, there was one unifying thing that everybody did, which is watch Walter Cronkite on the news.
02:02:38.000 And so when you showed up to work the next day, everyone had heard the same narrative.
02:02:43.000 And they could have disagreed on it, but they all had kind of the same basic fundamental facts.
02:02:48.000 And so now we...
02:02:50.000 Actually have people going home and I'm gonna jump into my bubble over here and watch Fox News and you're gonna get jumped in your bubble over there and watch MSNBC and Like how do you even communicate with each other?
02:03:03.000 Yeah, yeah, we don't we have so many choices, but so few paths I was what I was I was I caught some Rachel Maddow one time and I'd never watched her before So I was like, okay, I'm gonna watch her and I was like wow Just completely different, completely different than what I would see on Fox News.
02:03:21.000 Completely different.
02:03:21.000 And I'm thinking to myself, wow, this is hard to imagine.
02:03:26.000 And you've seen the clips of when Trump won, of all the compilation of everyone's reaction, all the liberal reaction.
02:03:33.000 But on the news.
02:03:35.000 I mean, does MSNBC, they don't claim to be like...
02:03:40.000 You know, nonpartisan at all, do they?
02:03:42.000 Or news, for that matter?
02:03:43.000 I think they don't have to.
02:03:45.000 It's just they are MSNBC. They don't have to have a directive.
02:03:49.000 They just say, everyone knows.
02:03:51.000 It's like there's an understanding when you're going there. 0.95
02:03:54.000 You're either going to hate view, like you're either a Republican who's going there to see what these silly liberals are up to, or you're one of the converted, and she's preaching to the choir.
02:04:03.000 I think one interesting proof point of this is I think a poll came out yesterday on where the American people stand on impeachment and something like 75-80% of Fox viewers oppose impeachment and 75-80% of MSNBC viewers support impeachment.
02:04:25.000 And they're covering the very same impeachment inquiry and hearings and witness testimony and all of that.
02:04:31.000 I don't think people even understand what that all means and whether or not it even has a chance of happening.
02:04:36.000 No, I don't think people do either.
02:04:38.000 They don't.
02:04:39.000 It seems like some fun talking point, some gotcha thing where they've got them.
02:04:44.000 Ukraine, got them.
02:04:45.000 We got them.
02:04:45.000 We got them this time.
02:04:46.000 Stormy Daniels didn't stick.
02:04:48.000 But this one, this one's going to sink.
02:04:50.000 Yeah.
02:04:50.000 Hey, you know, you think to yourself, if Stormy Daniels didn't stick, I mean, come on.
02:04:54.000 What else are you going to do?
02:04:56.000 He might as well, he just might as well just backed off and just try and work with the guy at that point.
02:05:00.000 I would have been like, okay, you know what?
02:05:01.000 He's Teflon.
02:05:02.000 We just need to move on, move forward.
02:05:03.000 There's a hilarious girl. 1.00
02:05:05.000 I don't know who she is.
02:05:06.000 Did I send you that video where the girl is getting people to get pumped up about impeachment? 1.00
02:05:11.000 And she's got like...
02:05:15.000 I think she even has one of those pink kitty cat hats on. 1.00
02:05:20.000 And she gets them.
02:05:21.000 She's like pro-impeachment. 1.00
02:05:22.000 They're like, yeah, impeach him, fucking impeachment. 1.00
02:05:24.000 She goes, yay, President Pence, yay! 1.00
02:05:27.000 And they're like, what?
02:05:28.000 And she's like, President Pence.
02:05:29.000 So if he gets impeached, then we get President Pence.
02:05:32.000 And they're like, hmm.
02:05:32.000 And she's like, maybe we should just let this play out.
02:05:35.000 Yeah, hold what you got.
02:05:36.000 Probably.
02:05:37.000 Probably just let him finish his term.
02:05:39.000 But it is hilarious.
02:05:42.000 It's hilarious because it's a sport.
02:05:45.000 It's basically replacing – it's a sport for people who don't like football.
02:05:49.000 It's like their idea of who's winning or losing this game is very personal. 0.99
02:05:54.000 And they feel like their team got killed in 2016 and they're going to come back and kick ass in 2020. And that's what's going on. 0.99
02:06:02.000 And everything they can get at them.
02:06:03.000 Well, not only that.
02:06:05.000 I mean, it's that, but then you've got some folks who, some Democrat leaders in Washington who are saying, well, you know, we need to get rid of Trump through impeachment to protect ourselves from possibly losing the election in 2020. Right.
02:06:20.000 Which I think is just like an open admittal of, well, we don't think that we can actually beat him at the ballot box, so we're trying to use this political maneuver in order to get rid of him, even though it's highly unlikely that even if the House does vote to impeach Which isn't fully clear at this point,
02:06:40.000 but even if that were to happen, the Senate is not going to convince 20, it's highly unlikely the Senate's going to convince 20 Republicans to vote with every Democrat to actually physically kick Trump out.
02:06:55.000 Out of office.
02:06:56.000 And this is why, I mean, I've always maintained that, you know, look, I look forward to beating Donald Trump at the ballot box where the American people can unequivocally let their voices be heard saying, nope, we're done with the leadership and all that Trump brought to office and we're choosing to go in a new direction.
02:07:15.000 Have you thought about what kind of nickname he'll have for you?
02:07:18.000 Because you know he's going to come up with a nickname.
02:07:20.000 Did you see how they played you on Saturday Night Live?
02:07:22.000 I did.
02:07:24.000 I went on there because I said, oh, I've got to see what they did to her.
02:07:26.000 And I was really curious about what they were going to do, how they were going to make you out.
02:07:30.000 And they made you out to be like this super evil person.
02:07:34.000 I got a kick out of it.
02:07:35.000 What did they do?
02:07:37.000 You didn't see it?
02:07:37.000 No!
02:07:38.000 Oh, it's funny.
02:07:39.000 It's a super short clip, but basically they're like, there is a villain amongst all of these candidates.
02:07:47.000 And that villain is Tulsi Gabbard.
02:07:49.000 Oh, God.
02:07:50.000 Who strikes fear into the heart of every other person up here.
02:07:53.000 Something like that.
02:07:54.000 Like a Despicable Me type cartoon villain?
02:07:56.000 They portrayed me as like a Cruella de Vil.
02:07:59.000 Yeah.
02:08:02.000 The thing is, I was thinking as it was playing out, they don't show you for a while, and I go, they're not even going to put her in here.
02:08:08.000 I was like, they're not even going to put her in here.
02:08:11.000 Clinton got to her and said, I don't want this girl getting any airtime at all. 1.00
02:08:14.000 Lock her down. 0.96
02:08:15.000 It's just so interesting to me that they...
02:08:18.000 It's so clear that you're a vibrant candidate, but that they don't want to get behind you.
02:08:23.000 But yet they do want to get behind Joe Biden, who can barely get through a sentence.
02:08:27.000 That poor guy is falling apart.
02:08:29.000 Someone needs to give that guy growth hormones, steroids, kale shakes, fat steaks. 1.00
02:08:34.000 Bro, you need to take some time off.
02:08:36.000 We need to get you in a hyperbaric chamber.
02:08:38.000 You don't have any energy.
02:08:40.000 Yeah, especially because Donald Trump has energy, and he goes on stage for an hour and a half at a rally with no teleprompter, no drink, no bathroom break.
02:08:53.000 He's just up there going.
02:08:55.000 He's like an animal up there, and it fuels him.
02:08:58.000 And then meanwhile, you're looking at Biden, and you're like, how is this even going to work out?
02:09:02.000 His teeth are literally falling out in the middle of the campaign.
02:09:04.000 He's falling asleep.
02:09:05.000 He's getting people's names wrong.
02:09:07.000 Do they want to win or don't they?
02:09:09.000 They do.
02:09:09.000 That is the question.
02:09:10.000 But they don't want to win with someone they can't control.
02:09:12.000 Exactly.
02:09:13.000 You know, it's like the first UFC. Do you know they had Hoist fight in the first UFC because they couldn't control Hickson?
02:09:18.000 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
02:09:19.000 Hickson's the family champion. 0.99
02:09:20.000 But Hickson was like, Hickson's going to do whatever the fuck Hickson wants to do. 0.99
02:09:23.000 And they had no control out of him. 0.98
02:09:25.000 So Horian was like, well, if Hoist loses, then we'll go with Hickson.
02:09:28.000 For now, let's get Hoist in there. 0.99
02:09:29.000 Because he couldn't control Hickson.
02:09:31.000 Everybody knew.
02:09:32.000 That's literally what they're afraid of.
02:09:33.000 If you wanted to show what jiu-jitsu could do, everyone on earth that knew jiu-jitsu knew Hickson Gracie was the baddest man on the planet.
02:09:40.000 How do you navigate this, Tulsi?
02:09:42.000 It seems like, okay, if you want to get the Democratic nomination, you've got to be pretty far to the left, right?
02:09:50.000 Right.
02:09:53.000 I think?
02:10:13.000 I think what's proving to be true is more about who is the establishment candidate versus who is anti-establishment.
02:10:26.000 I don't fit into any one of those boxes because I look at every issue based on its merits.
02:10:33.000 I'll look at the substance of the issue, look at the arguments for and against, and go with the approach that I think This is a radical idea right here.
02:10:40.000 It's radical to be reasonable.
02:10:43.000 Exactly.
02:10:43.000 And that's the thing.
02:10:44.000 These people, they're like, oh my god, we can't figure her out because she doesn't have any of these labels.
02:10:49.000 But that is where the vast majority of the American people are.
02:10:53.000 You have these extremes on the fringes who are all about these...
02:10:57.000 You know, purity tests where you are either with me on every single issue or you're done.
02:11:03.000 You're finished.
02:11:04.000 You're unacceptable.
02:11:05.000 But the vast majority of Americans, again, they're looking at what is real leadership.
02:11:10.000 Real leadership, whether you're talking about the guy who's working in the manufacturing warehouse or you're talking about a blue-collar worker, you're looking at, okay, here's the issues that keep most people up at night.
02:11:21.000 You want to make sure that if your kid is sick, they're going to be able to get the health care they need.
02:11:25.000 You want to make sure you have a roof over your family's head.
02:11:28.000 There are basic things.
02:11:31.000 Approaching them in a way that is pragmatical, pragmatic, common sense, and solutions-oriented.
02:11:41.000 Is not only the right thing to do, I think it's the thing that makes it so you don't have to say, well in the primary I'm only going to talk to Democrats and the most radical and extreme among them, and then I'm totally going to flip the script and then speak to the whole country after I win the primary election.
02:11:57.000 That's ridiculous.
02:11:59.000 This is why, you know, I'll go on Fox News, MSNBC, CNN, and I'm delivering the exact same message to people. 0.91
02:12:07.000 And we're building and growing support in people who watch those three different channels, who are actually listening like, hey, she makes sense.
02:12:16.000 She's not crazy.
02:12:17.000 She's not spouting some party talking point.
02:12:19.000 She's not going down a radical path just to appeal to the Twitter wins that are blowing one way or the other.
02:12:26.000 It's just about, hey, let's do what's best.
02:12:29.000 Let's do what's best for the people and for the country.
02:12:31.000 I'm stunned by the blowback, too, for you going on Fox News, that people are actually upset, that they do not think that you should grace the Fox News screens, that you're doing a disservice to your party.
02:12:44.000 Yeah.
02:12:45.000 Which is interesting.
02:12:46.000 Well, I get the same stuff because I go on Fox News.
02:12:49.000 And why do I go on Fox News?
02:12:50.000 Fox News invites me on to Fox News.
02:12:51.000 You know who's never invited me on?
02:12:53.000 Ever.
02:12:53.000 SMBC. SMBC. And again, as you pointed out earlier, it's pretty hard to pin me down politically.
02:12:58.000 Right.
02:12:59.000 And I'm not one to sit there and try and make radical statements to try and get more likes on a Twitter thing.
02:13:04.000 You don't do that?
02:13:06.000 Yeah, I don't.
02:13:07.000 It's like, oh, I'm here trying to...
02:13:09.000 Make some points about the way...
02:13:11.000 Most of what I talk about is about leadership.
02:13:13.000 It's like, oh, because what we're doing as human beings is we're leading other people, whether it's just your family or whether it's your business or whatever, or it's troops out in the field.
02:13:21.000 So yeah, it's weird that you would get...
02:13:25.000 Attacked for going on Fox News when actually anybody that looks at that from a strategic view would think, oh, she's actually accepted by this right-wing news organization. 0.86
02:13:38.000 Maybe she could get some other, you know, moderate conservative votes.
02:13:42.000 Maybe we should think about bringing her as a candidate because she could win. 1.00
02:13:46.000 Well, not only that, what's wrong with going on stage or going on camera with someone that you oppose?
02:13:52.000 Someone you disagree with and having a dialogue about what you disagree with.
02:13:56.000 Right.
02:13:56.000 That's the weird thing about this cancel culture, this strange time we're living in.
02:14:00.000 You're not even supposed to communicate with people about ideas that you disagree on.
02:14:03.000 Yeah.
02:14:04.000 I saw people criticizing you for being on Tucker Carlson's show in particular.
02:14:08.000 Yeah, and that's what I was going to say.
02:14:10.000 Yeah, it's one thing to say, okay, you're going to go on Fox News and tussle with Sean Hannity about things you disagree on, but I think what they see as more dangerous is finding areas where you actually do agree.
02:14:21.000 Right.
02:14:22.000 And that's, you know, on Tucker Carlson.
02:14:25.000 I have a platform to be able to speak to millions of people across the country about the kind of leadership that I bring in the area of foreign policy, what I would do here in this country, what I would do there in that country if I were president today.
02:14:40.000 And I have the opportunity to deliver that message directly to people's living rooms or offices or wherever they are.
02:14:46.000 And, you know, I think in some of these areas, Tucker and I will disagree on a whole host of things, but on some of these issues of foreign policy, he'll say, yeah, I agree with you.
02:14:56.000 And I think when you look at this cancel culture, you know, I was attacked on the debate stage for going on Fox News.
02:15:04.000 How do you think you're going to lead this country?
02:15:08.000 All Americans, if you're completely not only shutting out and not willing to talk to half the country that watches Fox News, but you're in fact disrespecting and dismissing them just because they may disagree with you or they watch a different news channel than you do.
02:15:27.000 I think that's the bigger issue here is, yeah, you know, there's a political consequence. 0.84
02:15:30.000 You're never going to be able to have a dialogue with What to speak of win support from people who you treat like garbage, who you disrespect, who you call names, who you call deplorables.
02:15:43.000 But how do you expect to lead as the president of every single American in this country when you've thrown half of them away and saying, you know what, I actually don't care about you.
02:15:54.000 I only care about people who I agree with.
02:15:55.000 That's to me the worst part about all of this.
02:16:00.000 I couldn't agree more.
02:16:01.000 That deplorable thing was a big hit.
02:16:04.000 And then you also remember when Mitt Romney said, hey, there's 47% of the country that there's no way of voting for him, so we just need to forget about him.
02:16:11.000 Those two things completely divided and sent people to vote for the opposing candidate.
02:16:18.000 Like, you're going to call me deplorable?
02:16:19.000 Oh, really?
02:16:20.000 Watch this.
02:16:21.000 I'm voting for Donald Trump.
02:16:21.000 Or you're going to ignore me, or you're just going to dismiss me.
02:16:23.000 Or my vote doesn't matter.
02:16:24.000 I think also it speaks to what both people have that is distasteful, that they're calculated.
02:16:30.000 And one of the things that I do appreciate about you is that I think you're not.
02:16:34.000 I think the way you view things is you would far rather speak your mind and be truthful and have real legitimate opinions on things rather than have some weird, slimy, sort of shifty take that's been created by a bunch of people that think that this is going to be the right thing that you could say,
02:16:55.000 that's going to, you know, And get you a little closer in the polls and move you this way and move the needle that way.
02:17:02.000 That shifty style of politics I really feel is dead.
02:17:07.000 I just don't think you can do it that way anymore.
02:17:10.000 I think people, because of the open access to information that people have today and the way that people can communicate and find out information, I just don't think we want to buy that shifty politician talk anymore.
02:17:23.000 I think we're done with it.
02:17:24.000 I think we realize it's antiquated.
02:17:26.000 It's never served us. 0.99
02:17:28.000 It sucks. 0.99
02:17:29.000 And it just gives you the same thing every time. 0.99
02:17:31.000 You get someone who gets into office and they do completely different things than what they said they were going to do before they got in.
02:17:37.000 Yeah, that's even...
02:17:39.000 I thought about, oh, the people are, they heard deplorables, they heard 47%, and that's bad, but yeah, you're right.
02:17:44.000 What it really made people think is, oh, behind the scenes, you're totally different than you are when you're standing on stage.
02:17:51.000 Yeah, you're shifty.
02:17:52.000 I know what you're like, and I'm not voting for you. 1.00
02:17:54.000 Yeah, you're manipulative.
02:17:55.000 You're following whether it's polls or you're following these groups that are going out and trying to figure out which way the tide is turning on social media.
02:18:08.000 I mean, there's so many groups now and so many companies that are just...
02:18:12.000 Just looking at data online and opinions and then they give this data to people that are trying to influence folks and they lean one way or another and they try to manipulate their message in order to have a more favorable rating.
02:18:27.000 And it's so slimy.
02:18:29.000 And it's also the kind of hypocrisy of this whole thing is these are people who are asking to lead the most powerful nation in the world.
02:18:38.000 Yes.
02:18:39.000 And yet they are not leaders at all.
02:18:44.000 They're followers.
02:18:45.000 Have you given any consideration to the fact that this is basically an impossible job?
02:18:50.000 That everybody who gets in there ages 150 years, except Trump.
02:18:53.000 He doesn't seem to age at all.
02:18:55.000 He looks great. 0.99
02:18:56.000 I mean, he looked like shit when he got in, but he looks exactly the same now. 0.99
02:18:59.000 I mean, you would think he'd look like a skeleton by now. 0.99
02:19:02.000 He'd be a corpse.
02:19:02.000 But no, looks like it's not even...
02:19:04.000 He eats a lot of fast food, I hear.
02:19:07.000 It's rolling off his back, whatever it is.
02:19:09.000 There's a lesson to be learned. 0.99
02:19:11.000 He really should give a class on not giving a fuck and how it affects you personally. 0.99
02:19:17.000 He's got a master's degree in that, without a doubt. 1.00
02:19:19.000 You could say you don't give a fuck, but that's when the whole world is angry at you. 0.99
02:19:24.000 Like half the world, maybe more than half the world, because it's half of America, and then who knows what percentage of the rest of the world is upset at you. 0.99
02:19:30.000 Not a lot of supporters internationally.
02:19:33.000 Right?
02:19:33.000 Yeah.
02:19:33.000 And that guy's like...
02:19:35.000 Shakes it off like a duck.
02:19:37.000 It just keeps moving.
02:19:40.000 But have you given any consideration to that this is a job that almost no one really nails?
02:19:47.000 No one gets out after four years or eight years and is like, boom! 0.98
02:19:50.000 Fucking nailed it. 0.99
02:19:51.000 No one. 0.99
02:19:53.000 No one nails it.
02:19:55.000 You're just creating all these visual images in my mind.
02:19:57.000 But you know what I mean?
02:19:58.000 Nobody gets out and they're like, Obama, you did it, bro!
02:20:01.000 Yeah.
02:20:01.000 Half the people are going to hate you no matter what.
02:20:06.000 There's a legit argument that it's a ridiculous position. 0.82
02:20:09.000 That to have one alpha chimp dominate the entire clan in 2019 when there's 320 million of us, it seems insane. 1.00
02:20:18.000 It doesn't seem like...
02:20:19.000 You really can pay attention to everything, whether it's the economy or the environment or foreign policy or all the social issues.
02:20:25.000 There's so much going on.
02:20:28.000 How can one person really have that job?
02:20:33.000 So the first thing I'll say is that if you're going into this to be popular or to have everybody love you, then you should not be president at all.
02:20:46.000 That's why I'm never going to be president.
02:20:48.000 That's all I want.
02:20:49.000 Well, there you go.
02:20:51.000 You can come over and have dinner with me in the White House when we get there.
02:20:55.000 I'm excited.
02:20:56.000 So I think that's the most important thing, and that's the problem that we see in a lot of our politics.
02:21:01.000 And what we're seeing on Twitter is people are putting stuff out for what they think will get the most likes or will get the most retweets rather than putting out what they believe in or what's true or what's actually really, really important.
02:21:14.000 So I think that's the first thing about how I would govern and lead as president about continuing what I've always done, which is actually just focusing on, hey, let's do the best job we can do to deliver the best result for the American people.
02:21:27.000 None of us are perfect and won't always get it perfectly right all the time.
02:21:34.000 I think understanding that we have often forgotten these days, we have three co-equal branches of government.
02:21:42.000 So the president alone in the executive branch does not have absolute or ultimate power over our government or over making decisions that impact the lives of Americans across this country.
02:21:58.000 I think our founders set up our government with this in mind, that we left the monarchy for a reason, so that we don't have one person with absolute power, but instead we have a president, a commander-in-chief who is leading our country.
02:22:14.000 Working with the United States Congress, the House and the Senate, which is made up of people who are elected from their communities and from their states to be able to form and shape the policies that do impact the lives of people in this country.
02:22:30.000 So that these decisions are not being made within a vacuum by one single individual, but instead by a representative form of government with the judiciary branches, the check and balance to say, hey, this one does not fall in line with the Constitution of the United States.
02:22:46.000 We're going to throw that one out, making sure that these elected leaders are doing the right thing for the people.
02:22:53.000 So I think the opportunity that's here and I think what's necessary is having a president who leads with the best interests of the people in mind, takes seriously the principles enshrined within our constitution, does not abuse that executive power,
02:23:09.000 which is something that we've seen growing in one consecutive administration after another, crossing both party lines.
02:23:16.000 But instead, really take seriously that oath that we all take, that we took as a member of Congress, that we took in the military, that the President takes to uphold and defend our Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic.
02:23:30.000 Well said.
02:23:32.000 Yeah, and I think, you know, Tulsi's a military person as well, and when you go and you do the best you can, and you make the decisions for the right reasons, which aren't necessarily going to turn out right, sometimes you make decisions and they don't turn out okay,
02:23:48.000 but you had the right intentions, you tried to do the right thing, it didn't go the way you wanted it to, you don't point your fingers or blame anybody else, you say, okay, here's the mistake I made, here's what we're going to do to fix it, And at the end of the day, you can walk away and say, okay, well, I know that I did the best I could with the right intentions.
02:24:05.000 And generally, just like you were talking about people being able to see through when someone's lying behind stage, people see, you know what?
02:24:12.000 They're trying to do the best job.
02:24:13.000 They had the right intentions in mind.
02:24:15.000 And I think you actually could walk away...
02:24:18.000 From the job, not saying I did a great job, nailed it, as Joe Rogan would say, but to walk away with your head held high and be able to say, yeah, I did the best I could do.
02:24:29.000 I made some good decisions.
02:24:30.000 I made some bad decisions.
02:24:31.000 I tried to get us on the right path.
02:24:32.000 I tried to support the principles that I believe this country is based on, and you move forward.
02:24:37.000 I think that's completely doable.
02:24:39.000 Yeah.
02:24:40.000 Do you have a long-term idea?
02:24:43.000 If you don't win in 2020, are you going to stick around for 2024?
02:24:49.000 What are your thoughts on that?
02:24:52.000 I'm focused on 2024. And then once that passes, whether you win or not, then you think about the future.
02:25:00.000 Assess.
02:25:00.000 But you're only 38, right?
02:25:01.000 Yeah.
02:25:02.000 I don't buy that gray hair either.
02:25:03.000 I think it's fake.
02:25:04.000 I think you decided that you look too young.
02:25:07.000 What about my gray hair?
02:25:08.000 I believe it.
02:25:09.000 You and me are close to the same age.
02:25:10.000 Mine's real, too.
02:25:11.000 But with you, I don't buy it.
02:25:12.000 I think you just said, like, we just need a streak, just a cool-looking streak.
02:25:15.000 No?
02:25:16.000 It's real?
02:25:16.000 No, yeah.
02:25:17.000 Are you going to keep it if the whole thing goes gray?
02:25:20.000 So far.
02:25:21.000 I don't want to hold you to that.
02:25:22.000 Yeah, no, no, no.
02:25:25.000 I started to go gray during my first deployment.
02:25:28.000 And so I decided to keep it just as a physical reminder of those we lost and the price that so many people paid.
02:25:42.000 Right.
02:25:42.000 If you win, will you be the youngest person ever to be president?
02:25:45.000 Or were there some weirdos in the 1700s?
02:25:48.000 No.
02:25:48.000 I will be.
02:25:49.000 Actually, I believe I'll be the youngest.
02:25:52.000 Wow.
02:25:53.000 Yeah.
02:25:54.000 Youngest and a woman.
02:25:55.000 Pretty badass.
02:25:55.000 Yeah.
02:25:56.000 Double first.
02:25:56.000 I agree.
02:25:57.000 You would think that a lot of people would be really excited about that.
02:26:00.000 Yeah.
02:26:00.000 Instead of just attacking you.
02:26:01.000 Well, again, it just shows you how people are so committed to the machine.
02:26:07.000 And you're one of the best examples of that, I think, because there's so much exciting about what you're saying.
02:26:13.000 There's so much that resonates as being honest and straightforward and well thought out and nuanced and balanced, and yet still so much resistance.
02:26:21.000 But I think the machine is strong and the machine knows that it doesn't really have a grip on you.
02:26:27.000 Yeah, they don't.
02:26:27.000 And they never will.
02:26:29.000 And I think that's, you mentioned earlier, I think that's creating fear and concern.
02:26:37.000 I just think it's important to point out the difference when we talk about the people who are concerned about this.
02:26:44.000 It is the people whose power is built off of, you know, they've built this foundation of power based on the status quo, based on continuing this narrative that benefits the very few The most rich, the most powerful, the people who can purchase this influence in Washington,
02:27:00.000 as opposed to the vast majority of people in this country, unfortunately, whose voices are not being heard in Washington, whose concerns are not being met, by and large.
02:27:13.000 And who exist outside of this bubble of corruption within Washington and who are looking for a leader who's going to hear their voices and amplify them and serve their interests.
02:27:24.000 And I think that's where, again, we've got great opportunity and responsibility to reach those people all across this country.
02:27:35.000 And let them know who I am and to hear my message so they know that there is a choice, that they do have a choice between more of the same old, same old, more of the pay-to-play corruption that exists in Washington, more of the perpetuation of the same foreign policy of Of interventionism,
02:27:53.000 regime change that's failed us and cost us so much versus fresh leadership with a new approach that puts the interests of our country and peace and security at the forefront of the decisions that are being made.
02:28:09.000 I think this is an interesting time, too, because it's one of the first times that I can remember where politicians that are running for president are pushing back against the media machine.
02:28:19.000 Like Andrew Yang recently said, I'm not going to go on MSNBC unless they apologize publicly for a lack of representation.
02:28:28.000 I mean, they didn't give him a chance to talk.
02:28:31.000 Meanwhile, there's a giant well of support behind him as well.
02:28:34.000 Yeah.
02:28:35.000 Yeah.
02:28:35.000 People are seeing through the facade that is presented by the corporate media.
02:28:45.000 And I think finding the power in our voices through alternative media, new media, social media, and I think that's what we're seeing with people.
02:28:55.000 Hey, they're giving my campaign $5 or $10 a month.
02:28:59.000 There's so much power that I think people are discovering within their own voices that really is the only thing that can overcome the obstacles that the political and media establishment are placing before us and before the people in having their voices heard.
02:29:19.000 Who is in the lead now?
02:29:20.000 It's still Biden, right?
02:29:21.000 And behind Biden is Elizabeth Warren. 0.79
02:29:23.000 Is that what the idea is?
02:29:24.000 It seems like it.
02:29:25.000 It seems like it.
02:29:26.000 I think when you look at some of these polls, I think that's the other thing is they most often represent who is most well-known in the country, who's most famous, rather than who actually has the most support.
02:29:38.000 And Elizabeth Warren, wasn't she a Republican for a long time?
02:29:41.000 Yeah.
02:29:42.000 When did she become a Democrat? 0.98
02:29:44.000 Yeah.
02:29:44.000 I may be wrong, but I want to say she was in her 40s, maybe?
02:29:50.000 Early 50s?
02:29:51.000 Something like that.
02:29:52.000 Do you get a chance to talk to these people?
02:29:55.000 Briefly.
02:29:55.000 I mean, it's usually in passing at different campaign events or before the debate or something like that.
02:30:01.000 I know Bernie Sanders best, obviously.
02:30:04.000 Know a few of the others who I've worked with in the Senate, in Congress on different issues.
02:30:09.000 Andrew Yang, I've enjoyed getting to know.
02:30:11.000 I like him a lot.
02:30:12.000 Marianne as well.
02:30:13.000 I like Bernie a lot, too.
02:30:14.000 I like him a lot more than I thought I would.
02:30:16.000 Like, sitting down and talking to him for three hours on a podcast, it's just like, oh, you're a person.
02:30:21.000 You're not some crazy old dude who screams out.
02:30:24.000 I mean, because that's, when you give a man 30 seconds.
02:30:27.000 That's what you get.
02:30:28.000 Yeah, that's all you can do.
02:30:29.000 One minute soundbite, 30 second soundbite, that's who he is.
02:30:33.000 So, what's next?
02:30:34.000 Like, where are you at right now?
02:30:37.000 I think our initial challenge, the initial goal that we're seeking to meet here is to get on.
02:30:45.000 I have not qualified yet for the next debate in December.
02:30:47.000 What do you have to do to qualify?
02:30:49.000 We need to do two things.
02:30:51.000 One is we've got to surpass 200,000 individual donors.
02:30:56.000 That's hilarious.
02:30:56.000 You need money.
02:30:57.000 Where are you at right now?
02:30:58.000 We are at, I think, at about $199,000.
02:31:02.000 Oh, we got that.
02:31:03.000 We're close.
02:31:04.000 Joe Rogan's got you covered.
02:31:06.000 We'll take care of that.
02:31:07.000 Help, guys.
02:31:07.000 If you're listening, help.
02:31:08.000 Tulsi2020.com.
02:31:09.000 They'll jump on that like a grenade. 0.62
02:31:11.000 And then the second thing is, I think, require a certain number of polls, and I think I need one more poll to meet that requirement, which is, again, is directly linked.
02:31:20.000 You look at a guy like, I think, Pete Buttigieg.
02:31:23.000 He spent...
02:31:24.000 $9 million on social media ads in order to get like a 4% bump in the polls.
02:31:31.000 You look at what some of these other guys have spent, some of the billionaires, I think Steyer spent $37 million in order to qualify in the polls, on the debate.
02:31:40.000 And so our challenge is we just need to get out and get in front of people in order to make sure that we're bypassing the corporate media and we're actually talking directly to folks at home.
02:31:51.000 Is there a real possibility that sometime in our lifetime they can take money out of politics like that?
02:31:57.000 Yes, there has to be.
02:31:59.000 There has to be.
02:32:00.000 The more people learn about how completely lopsided our campaign finance system is I think?
02:32:35.000 Yeah, I mean, look, the second thing is that you're seeing how corrupting that influence is on the politicians and the influence that they have over people, and how much it's disproportionately helping strengthen the power of a two-party system.
02:32:53.000 I think?
02:33:17.000 The party has a hell of a lot of power that they can leverage over individual members of Congress, elected leaders, to say, if you don't play ball, if you don't vote the way we want you to vote, we're not going to be there to help you out in your election.
02:33:30.000 We're not going to run TV ads for you.
02:33:32.000 We're not going to help you out when you're getting attacked by the other guy, which just makes the problem that we already have worse, where instead of leaders voting based on what they believe is right— For their constituents or right for the country or based on their conscience,
02:33:48.000 instead they're being goaded into voting for the interests of the political party, putting party ahead of the interests of the country.
02:33:55.000 And so I think the more people are learning about the consequence of our existing campaign finance system, the more they're demanding change and reform so that we are electing leaders who are accountable only to the people.
02:34:11.000 Have you ever had a conversation with someone where they have tried to influence your vote in one way or another that you just described?
02:34:18.000 I have met with lobbyists who will say, hey, here's why I want you to vote this way, and by the way, we'll be there at your next fundraising dinner or something like that.
02:34:34.000 Those vampires.
02:34:36.000 When you ask that question, I was like, Joe, come on, man.
02:34:40.000 That's the deal right there.
02:34:42.000 And by the way, years ago when I stopped taking PAC money, I got no calls from any lobbyists.
02:34:51.000 None.
02:34:51.000 When I said no PAC money, no lobbyist money, automatically they're like, well, obviously we can't talk to her if we're not giving her money.
02:34:57.000 This crazy lady's not playing games. 1.00
02:34:59.000 Yeah, exactly. 0.69
02:35:01.000 And then I haven't seen it, you know, I established very quickly in Congress that I don't play political games and that I'm not going to be bullied into taking anybody else's position if I don't think it's the right one to take.
02:35:12.000 So I have not experienced that kind of, like the party has never helped me in any of my elections, ever.
02:35:20.000 For city council, for state legislature, for Congress.
02:35:23.000 So them coming in and saying, well, we're not going to be like, dude, you were never there for me ever anyway.
02:35:27.000 But I've seen it happen with some of my friends who maybe represent swing districts or who are Democrats who got elected in a Republican district.
02:35:35.000 They're always going to have a really tough race.
02:35:38.000 I have seen it happen in real time where those bully tactics come into play.
02:35:42.000 Speaking of tactics.
02:35:44.000 Speaking of tactics.
02:35:45.000 Leadership strategy and tactics from Jocko Willink.
02:35:47.000 Available right now.
02:35:49.000 You're going to need this when you're Madam President. 0.58
02:35:52.000 Do I have to call you Madam President?
02:35:53.000 How's that work?
02:35:54.000 Is that the word?
02:35:55.000 Madam President?
02:35:56.000 I think that's what they use.
02:35:56.000 Is it not Mrs. President?
02:35:57.000 No.
02:35:58.000 Because it's Mr. President and Madam President.
02:36:00.000 Yeah.
02:36:00.000 That's a weird thing, right?
02:36:02.000 Yeah.
02:36:02.000 We're about to find out.
02:36:04.000 Because Mrs. President would be your last name as president. 0.99
02:36:07.000 Yeah.
02:36:07.000 Which is weird.
02:36:08.000 And Mrs. generally means you're married.
02:36:10.000 Yeah.
02:36:10.000 Right?
02:36:10.000 So, yeah.
02:36:11.000 Madam President is what I've seen. 1.00
02:36:13.000 Yeah, it has to be.
02:36:14.000 It's just never been done before.
02:36:16.000 You should always call me Tulsi.
02:36:18.000 No matter what.
02:36:19.000 Madam Tulsi? 0.99
02:36:19.000 Yeah. 0.99
02:36:20.000 Well, whatever.
02:36:20.000 That seems like a dominatrix.
02:36:24.000 Madam Tulsi seems like that could be a real issue. 1.00
02:36:27.000 Yeah.
02:36:29.000 Jocko, your book's available right now.
02:36:31.000 OriginMaine, the website, if you want to get...
02:36:33.000 OriginMaine.com?
02:36:34.000 Yep, OriginMaine.com.
02:36:36.000 MainTheState.com if you want to get some badass geese and jeans straight out of Jocko. 0.99
02:36:40.000 Thank you so much for being here.
02:36:41.000 Tulsi2020.com.
02:36:42.000 We need your help.
02:36:43.000 We do.
02:36:44.000 Tulsi2020.com.
02:36:45.000 Go there.
02:36:45.000 Donate.
02:36:46.000 Let's move the needle. 0.99
02:36:47.000 Thank you, guys.
02:36:48.000 Thank you.
02:36:48.000 This is awesome.
02:36:49.000 Thank you for having us here.
02:36:50.000 My pleasure.
02:36:50.000 Thank you, Jocko.
02:36:51.000 Bye.
02:36:51.000 Thank you.
02:36:52.000 Aloha.
02:36:56.000 Mayhem.
02:36:57.000 Mayhem.