The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #1591 - Jordan Burroughs

00:00:12.000 Jordan, pleasure to meet you, man.

00:00:15.000 Yeah, good to meet you, bro.

00:00:16.000 Really, really pleasure to meet you.

00:00:17.000 I'm a big fan.

00:00:18.000 I think what you're doing...

00:00:20.000 First of all, I think it's amazing that no one's talked you into doing MMA. It's incredible.

00:00:23.000 I've been close.

00:00:24.000 How close?

00:00:25.000 Mostly the lady outside, my wife Lauren. 0.52

00:00:27.000 Really?

00:00:28.000 Is the one that's talking me out of it.

00:00:29.000 Really?

00:00:30.000 Yeah, bro.

00:00:31.000 When I graduated from college in 2011, University of Nebraska, wrestling was still on the brink of, it was in its infancy of marketing and branding and really making it a professional career.

00:00:43.000 So MMA was the new kid on the block and it was growing and expanding and we had a lot of our guys transitioning in.

00:00:50.000 Henry Cejudo, Ben Askren, Daniel Cormier.

00:00:53.000 And so I really thought about it.

00:00:55.000 I was like, okay, I'm going to wrestle in the Olympics in London 2012, win the gold, and then I'm going to make the transition to MMA. I'll be 25 years old.

00:01:02.000 I'll have plenty of time.

00:01:03.000 And then I met Lauren.

00:01:05.000 And she's like, listen, you're doing well in the sport.

00:01:07.000 Stay here.

00:01:08.000 You're comfortable.

00:01:09.000 It's just a different sport, MMA, in comparison to wrestling.

00:01:13.000 But it's a good thing.

00:01:14.000 It is a different sport, and it also has a lot more head trauma.

00:01:19.000 There's a lot of things to consider.

00:01:21.000 100%.

00:01:21.000 That's what I think about all the time.

00:01:24.000 Listen, I think about going to MMA until I see a guy like Platinum Mike Perry get his whole thing split, nose crooked.

00:01:32.000 I'm like, eh, I'm good.

00:01:34.000 In wrestling, you lose.

00:01:35.000 You get taken down, pushed out.

00:01:38.000 You get pinned.

00:01:39.000 In fighting, you lose.

00:01:40.000 You get something broken, choked out, tapped.

00:01:43.000 It's unconscious.

00:01:45.000 It's a very, very different sport.

00:01:46.000 Wrestling, you score as many points as possible, doing the least damage as possible.

00:01:53.000 In MMA, I feel like it's different.

00:01:55.000 It's a shame that there's not more attention put on the professional...

00:02:01.000 At one point in time, professional wrestling was actual wrestling.

00:02:05.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:02:06.000 It wasn't like WWE Entertainment.

00:02:08.000 It was professional wrestling.

00:02:10.000 And it was done for...

00:02:12.000 Why can't they do that?

00:02:13.000 I know they tried to do that a few years back.

00:02:15.000 There was an organization, I think, was it Kevin Jackson that was doing it?

00:02:20.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:02:20.000 Yeah, he was doing something where he was doing a professional wrestling organization, but it just didn't catch on for some reason.

00:02:27.000 But yet, golf is on TV. For sure.

00:02:29.000 Baseball and all these things.

00:02:31.000 Bags, bro.

00:02:32.000 Cornhole.

00:02:33.000 I was watching the Cornhole Championships on ESPN the other day.

00:02:37.000 I'm like, bro, this is wild.

00:02:39.000 Like, Cornhole is on ESPN more often than wrestling.

00:02:43.000 But isn't that just now because there's no crowds and COVID and there's all the weirdness and there's a lot of shit that's on.

00:02:49.000 Like if you follow SportsCenter on Instagram, like half the shit they do is like people in their backyard like doing crazy dunks and stuff.

00:02:56.000 I think the invention of the internet has definitely changed the game for our sport.

00:03:02.000 We are in an epic time where anyone can be famous.

00:03:07.000 All you need is an iPhone, cell phone, period.

00:03:09.000 If you can film footage and upload it and it's funny, it's inventive, it's disruptive, you have an audience and people are going to follow.

00:03:18.000 So people that are going viral now, becoming superstars, aren't even the most particularly talented people.

00:03:24.000 In society, they just have a niche and they know how to stay consistent with it.

00:03:28.000 Well, sometimes it doesn't even make sense.

00:03:30.000 Like, something just catches.

00:03:31.000 Like, remember the dude that was on the skateboard doing Fleetwood Mac?

00:03:35.000 With the cranberry juice.

00:03:36.000 Yeah.

00:03:36.000 Like, just for whatever reason, everybody's like, that guy looks like he's having fun.

00:03:40.000 Get this man a truck.

00:03:41.000 Get him more cranberry juice.

00:03:42.000 And now he's on, I look, he's always on podcasts.

00:03:44.000 He's all over the place.

00:03:46.000 He's a man.

00:03:46.000 He bought a house.

00:03:47.000 He bought a car.

00:03:48.000 I mean, it's really incredible.

00:03:49.000 But that's the beauty of it.

00:03:50.000 Yeah.

00:03:50.000 That's the beauty of it is it gives people an opportunity.

00:03:52.000 There it is right there.

00:03:53.000 Yeah.

00:03:54.000 It was a professional wrestling league that they established.

00:03:57.000 When people reference what we do, I call it Olympic wrestling.

00:04:01.000 Honestly, I don't even call it professional wrestling because that is kind of an ode to the WWE and old-time WWF. So it's a unique thing that we had at this time.

00:04:11.000 This is Tommy Rollins, Daniel Cormier, both...

00:04:14.000 Extremely competitive.

00:04:15.000 Both great wrestlers.

00:04:17.000 Oklahoma State, Ohio State.

00:04:18.000 This probably was around 2004, 2005-ish.

00:04:22.000 So I was still in high school.

00:04:24.000 Real pro wrestling, that's right.

00:04:26.000 So they had different cities across the country that had their own teams.

00:04:30.000 It was almost like XFL-esque.

00:04:32.000 It kind of had that vibe.

00:04:34.000 So it's Rulon Gardner.

00:04:35.000 Yeah, Rulon Gardner.

00:04:36.000 And who's the...

00:04:37.000 Tim Johnson in the middle.

00:04:38.000 He works for the Big Ten Network and also for ESPN. He does commentary for the NCAA Championships yearly.

00:04:45.000 And then the last guy is Nate Carr, who was a NCAA champ, world medalist.

00:04:51.000 And Rulon is another guy that made the transition.

00:04:53.000 He made the transition in MMA. Did he?

00:04:55.000 I didn't know that.

00:04:56.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:04:56.000 He fought a bunch of times over in Japan.

00:04:58.000 That's crazy.

00:04:59.000 And actually, I think what stopped him was he lost a toe in a frostbite accident.

00:05:04.000 He's a former Cornhusker.

00:05:05.000 Is he?

00:05:06.000 So we went to the same university, and I got a chance to kind of spend some time with Rulon, but he was out when I was kind of transitioning in.

00:05:12.000 And so he's an interesting cat, and he is one of those guys that's, like, shrouded in this mystery, but there's so many, like...

00:05:20.000 Epic stories about who he was, what he's done, how much he's eaten.

00:05:25.000 He's a gorilla, dude.

00:05:26.000 Massive, massive man.

00:05:28.000 The size of that guy?

00:05:29.000 Massive man.

00:05:30.000 And then, obviously, him beating Corellin, which is pretty much considered the most legendary victory in wrestling history.

00:05:37.000 That's a weird victory, right?

00:05:39.000 Because it's like Corellin, all he did was get Corellin to break his grip.

00:05:43.000 Yeah.

00:05:43.000 And it was a new rule, right?

00:05:45.000 Yep.

00:05:45.000 The rules are evolving all the time in wrestling.

00:05:48.000 So it's...

00:05:49.000 One of those rule changes that year in particular, which wasn't, it didn't translate well to the average fan.

00:05:56.000 So like the toughest thing about wrestling is that the rules change so often that a non-traditional wrestling fan can't really keep up.

00:06:04.000 You watch a football game, you know, listen, you put the ball into the end zone, it's six points, extra point, a point, field goal, three points, right?

00:06:10.000 Safety, two.

00:06:11.000 We're good to go.

00:06:35.000 And even if you're within it, sometimes you have to address what the rule set is before you even compete in a tournament.

00:06:41.000 There are times where we're meeting with administration and referees before we compete at the Olympics World Championships just so we can stay current on the rule set for that year because it's always evolving.

00:06:53.000 Is that something that plays in your head while you're actually competing?

00:06:57.000 Do you have to think like, oh wait a minute, what's the rule for this place?

00:07:01.000 You know, that's a good question.

00:07:02.000 I think in the heat of the moment, sometimes I imagine you've seen it a lot in MMA, whether it's a guy, you know, hitting someone in the back of the head or, you know, kicking them when they're down on a knee, like all these little things that when you're in the battle, and you're fired up, and you're trying to put this man out, like you don't even think about the ruleset,

00:07:19.000 you just, you know, it has to be programmed.

00:07:22.000 I think experience, just a Multiple times within this position, there's a certain level of savviness and mental toughness that you have to have to get there.

00:07:31.000 They've had a hard time getting people to watch any kind of grappling that don't grapple.

00:07:35.000 I think that's a problem with jujitsu.

00:07:38.000 And one of the things they did with jujitsu, they've come up with this new thing called combat jujitsu.

00:07:42.000 Eddie Bravo came up with it.

00:07:43.000 It's basically jujitsu with slapping.

00:07:46.000 It's kind of fucking crazy.

00:07:47.000 What?

00:07:48.000 Yeah, man.

00:07:49.000 It's crazy.

00:07:49.000 I haven't seen it.

00:07:50.000 It's crazy.

00:07:50.000 Like in the face?

00:07:51.000 Yeah.

00:07:52.000 Or elsewhere?

00:07:54.000 The thing is, you can punch to the body and you slap to the face.

00:07:59.000 The thing is, with jujitsu positions, there's a lot of unrealistic positions when it comes to MMA. Yeah.

00:08:04.000 Where, like, guys are hanging on an ankle and the guy's right over him and he could just start blasting him in the face.

00:08:10.000 There's a thing about leg lockers are much more sophisticated now than they were back in the day.

00:08:14.000 But early in the UFC, you saw some cases where guys would go for leg locks.

00:08:18.000 And see, this is combat jiu-jitsu.

00:08:21.000 Is that the...

00:08:22.000 Come on, bro!

00:08:23.000 Yeah!

00:08:25.000 Stop.

00:08:26.000 But it works.

00:08:27.000 Two siblings fighting over the last Rice Krispie Treat.

00:08:31.000 That's kind of a crazy...

00:08:32.000 That's Wagner Rocha, who's fought MMA before, and he's a beast.

00:08:37.000 Is he tough?

00:08:37.000 Yeah, he's a bad motherfucker.

00:08:39.000 He's a bad motherfucker.

00:08:40.000 And he wound up winning the...

00:08:41.000 I think he won the whole tournament, because he's got so much experience with strikes and jiu-jitsu as it is, and he's an elite black belt.

00:08:50.000 Would that really make you release your locks?

00:08:53.000 To have your arm potentially broken is getting slapped in the face.

00:08:57.000 Like if I have my hands locked and I'm preventing the arm bar, like with a slap in the face really make me like, ooh, I gotta unlock, protect my face, bam, you're done.

00:09:04.000 It's a good question.

00:09:06.000 You never know where a person's brain is at, right?

00:09:09.000 You know, sometimes dudes just give their arm up.

00:09:11.000 Yeah.

00:09:12.000 There's situations where guys give their arm up.

00:09:14.000 And sometimes guys give their arm up in MMA too.

00:09:16.000 When they're getting pounded on, you'll see guys reach up when someone's in the mount and you know that they're giving their arm up.

00:09:23.000 That's right.

00:09:23.000 And then they get tapped.

00:09:24.000 And, you know, I've talked to guys who actually told me that they did it.

00:09:27.000 They just said, I just let him take my neck or I let him take my arm.

00:09:30.000 Right.

00:09:30.000 But Wagner stopped guys.

00:09:32.000 He stopped like really good guys.

00:09:33.000 He's got like a palm technique too.

00:09:36.000 Exactly.

00:09:36.000 It's not just like an open-handed, wow.

00:09:38.000 Yeah.

00:09:38.000 He's just kind of going palm to the face.

00:09:40.000 Yeah.

00:09:41.000 Like I said, he's a real MMA fighter.

00:09:43.000 He's an elite MMA fighter.

00:09:46.000 Does this guy look funny to you?

00:09:49.000 It does look a little funny.

00:09:50.000 I respect these dudes.

00:09:52.000 This dude looks like an absolute monster, but the slapping just reminds me of my sister and I. Back in middle school when my mom and dad were at work and we had a snow day.

00:10:03.000 Yeah.

00:10:03.000 And we'd be fighting over the last sip of the two liter Pepsi in the fridge.

00:10:07.000 That was it right there.

00:10:09.000 That's us slapping each other.

00:10:10.000 If you use gloves, the thing about gloves is if they put the MMA gloves, gloves change a lot of positions.

00:10:16.000 Yeah.

00:10:16.000 It's harder to get certain chokes because the gloves are thick and they get in the way.

00:10:20.000 You can't get them under the chin as easy.

00:10:22.000 Yeah.

00:10:22.000 But that would probably be the most realistic.

00:10:25.000 But the reason why they use slaps, it actually, there's a history that goes back to the original MMA, like when they were first starting to do MMA tournaments.

00:10:33.000 One of the really early ones was called Pancrase.

00:10:37.000 It was in Japan.

00:10:38.000 And Bas Rutten was the master at Pancrase.

00:10:41.000 And what Bas Rutten would do, he's got crazy flexible hands, and he's an elite striker.

00:10:46.000 So he would pull his hands...

00:10:48.000 Like, I don't know how the fuck he does it.

00:10:50.000 But he can get his hands way back.

00:10:51.000 He's pulling back himself, huh?

00:10:52.000 And he was basically throwing punches.

00:10:54.000 He was basically going, boom, boom!

00:10:56.000 And instead of everybody else was slapping, he was smashing dudes and KOing dudes with palm strikes.

00:11:02.000 See if you can find some Boss Rootin. 0.83

00:11:04.000 Like, Boss Rootin versus Funaki. 0.94

00:11:06.000 He KO'd him with an uppercut. 0.99

00:11:08.000 A palm strike uppercut.

00:11:09.000 A palm strike uppercut.

00:11:10.000 Yeah, because the thing about Celia... 1.00

00:11:12.000 Oh, yeah, that's it.

00:11:13.000 There you go.

00:11:13.000 Give me a rewind on that so you can see...

00:11:16.000 Is this a Boss Root and Highlight?

00:11:17.000 Yeah.

00:11:18.000 Boss was smashing people over there.

00:11:19.000 But again, he's an elite striker.

00:11:22.000 So he's a guy who came from Holland.

00:11:24.000 In the kickboxing world, Holland is like...

00:11:27.000 So this was...

00:11:29.000 This is like early, early 90s.

00:11:31.000 I'm interested in the apparel here, right?

00:11:34.000 Because it's got like a...

00:11:36.000 Professional wrestling vibe.

00:11:37.000 Right.

00:11:38.000 That was a bit of the problem because there was some rigged fights.

00:11:45.000 See, Japan is famous for having rigged fights. 0.67

00:11:49.000 They would do weird shit in the early days in particular.

00:11:53.000 They would do weird shit where you would see like...

00:11:56.000 I don't want to name names, but some elite fighters were paid off to take dives, and they'll admit it now.

00:12:04.000 Like, you see them, like, literally, like, pro wrestling.

00:12:06.000 A guy's going for a heel hook, and like, oh, no! 1.00

00:12:09.000 Okay, I'm gonna tap.

00:12:10.000 Of course, bro.

00:12:11.000 But you can tell that it's fake.

00:12:12.000 So there was real fights, and then there was also some bullshit.

00:12:16.000 And there was always a question about pancreas, because some of them, like, when Boss Rutten's KOing people, well, that's 100% real.

00:12:23.000 Well, that's real.

00:12:24.000 That's real as fuck.

00:12:24.000 He's in pain right there.

00:12:25.000 Yeah, yeah, that was tight.

00:12:26.000 That hamstring was...

00:12:27.000 Yeah, he got his knee blown out.

00:12:29.000 I think it was locked out.

00:12:29.000 You know what's interesting?

00:12:30.000 I feel like...

00:12:33.000 Man, that's crazy.

00:12:34.000 I feel like the Japanese love combat. 1.00

00:12:37.000 Yes.

00:12:38.000 Love combat.

00:12:39.000 Yeah.

00:12:39.000 And so that's what makes us excited for the postponed Olympic Games, right, this summer, Tokyo 2021, is wrestling is going to be one of the premier sports because of their love for combat sports there.

00:12:51.000 So whether it's MMA, kickboxing, boxing itself, wrestling, judo, sumo, they love the sport.

00:12:58.000 And so we're really excited about that opportunity.

00:13:00.000 So that's going to be this summer.

00:13:02.000 Are they going to do it with crowds?

00:13:04.000 That's a good question.

00:13:05.000 I don't know yet.

00:13:06.000 So the Japanese Prime Minister made an announcement, public statement, saying, hey, listen, we're going to host the Olympics this summer no matter what.

00:13:12.000 One of the interesting things about it is although it's happening in 21, they're still calling it Tokyo 2020. I think.

00:13:19.000 We're good to go.

00:13:37.000 There's 10,000 coaches and athletes from every country on the face of the planet, all put into a one-mile radius on this Olympic campus.

00:13:47.000 And there's just so much interaction, engagement.

00:13:50.000 I'm talking the cafeteria at the Olympic Games is five football fields long.

00:13:56.000 They've got a McDonald's.

00:13:58.000 Like a full-size McDonald's in the cafeteria in the Olympic Village.

00:14:04.000 They've got foods from all different parts of the country.

00:14:07.000 You've got an Italian station, a Japanese station, American station, and a Pan-African station.

00:14:13.000 It's insane.

00:14:14.000 You have literally thousands of people swirling in at all times.

00:14:17.000 It's 24 hours.

00:14:18.000 How many people are in line at the McDonald's station?

00:14:23.000 If you're coming from America, you can go down the street. 0.55

00:14:26.000 There's a McDonald's within a mile of anybody while you're here stateside.

00:14:30.000 But if you're coming from one of these smaller countries, you're coming from Guinea-Bissau, or you're coming from, I don't know, Qatar, you're like, damn, McDonald's sounds pretty good.

00:14:38.000 I don't get this at the crib.

00:14:39.000 Let me go ahead, grab me a little quick couple of McChickens, couple of double cheeseburgers, put them in the room.

00:14:44.000 But you would think that someone competing in the Olympics would want to fuel their body with the best possible food available.

00:14:51.000 Some of them know they can't win.

00:14:53.000 Everyone going to the Olympics isn't expecting to win a medal.

00:14:57.000 I say 90%, very large percentage of the competitors at the Olympic Games, it's a long shot for them to get on the podium.

00:15:05.000 They're going with the expectation like, hey, listen, I'm representing my home country with pride.

00:15:10.000 I am going to a country that I've never been before.

00:15:14.000 Hopefully I can be on TV. My family will be watching me back home.

00:15:17.000 The opening ceremonies is the best experience for them because they get to be in a full-packed arena around all the athletes that they've seen on TV. But they know that realistically they're not going to win.

00:15:28.000 So when that McDonald's is open 24 hours, they're like, let's go, bro.

00:15:33.000 We're going here.

00:15:33.000 Do they have to pay for it?

00:15:34.000 Free.

00:15:35.000 Everything's free.

00:15:36.000 That's good.

00:15:37.000 So it's an interesting perspective being in the Olympic Village.

00:15:41.000 It's a cool spot.

00:15:43.000 It's got to be a wild experience to be there.

00:15:45.000 It must feel surreal.

00:15:46.000 It's wild.

00:15:47.000 So they're really strict with the way that they administer athletes and people to get in.

00:15:53.000 You have to have a guest list if you want to bring anyone in.

00:15:55.000 They have to be approved seven days in advance.

00:15:58.000 So let's say my wife.

00:15:59.000 I'm like, hey, I want my wife to come into the Olympic Village, check out our living space. 1.00

00:16:02.000 Check out the free McDonald's.

00:16:04.000 Then I have to put her on the list seven days in advance and it has to be approved by the USOPC and then also, you know, the IOC. Wow.

00:16:13.000 And so it's a very...

00:16:15.000 They're not playing, dog.

00:16:19.000 I'm telling you.

00:16:20.000 I'm telling you, Joe.

00:16:21.000 Like, they get it.

00:16:22.000 They get it in.

00:16:23.000 After he's done.

00:16:24.000 Oh, after he was done?

00:16:25.000 Well, that makes sense.

00:16:26.000 He's taking that home with him.

00:16:28.000 He's putting that all in his suitcase.

00:16:30.000 He's going to go start a little McDonald's of his own when he gets back to the crib.

00:16:35.000 So when you get in the village...

00:16:39.000 It's almost like going through TSA at an airport.

00:16:41.000 You gotta show them your badge.

00:16:42.000 They scan it.

00:16:43.000 You gotta get all your bags checked and make sure that you're good to go.

00:16:47.000 You don't have anything lethal in your bags.

00:16:50.000 You get inside and it's literally like an apartment complex.

00:16:53.000 Huge apartment complex.

00:16:55.000 Look at that.

00:16:56.000 McDonald's is the most popular restaurant.

00:16:58.000 That's crazy.

00:17:00.000 Listen, they're not getting salads and chicken selects.

00:17:06.000 They're getting cheeseburgers and McChickens. 0.61

00:17:10.000 Listen, hey, whatever you need to do to be the fastest man in the world, do your thing.

00:17:17.000 Well, I guess also when you're done, you probably just want to treat yourself.

00:17:21.000 You've probably been eating very strict for a long period of time.

00:17:24.000 Yeah, crazy.

00:17:25.000 When I won the gold in 2012, my first meal afterwards was McDonald's.

00:17:30.000 Very first meal.

00:17:30.000 Good job, good job.

00:17:31.000 I had a double cheeseburger with a high C orange to drink and a large fry.

00:17:36.000 So crazy story.

00:17:36.000 I'll tell you the story.

00:17:38.000 So I win the Olympic gold.

00:17:40.000 Right after you win, they take you back to what they have, like a media house.

00:17:44.000 So it's got all of the publications from all over the world.

00:17:47.000 You've got AP, Sports Illustrated, NBC, you know, just pretty much everything.

00:17:52.000 And so you go back and you just bounce from room to room.

00:17:55.000 It's like, okay, we got Al Michaels here.

00:17:57.000 We got Bob Costas here.

00:17:58.000 We got, you know, Joe Rogan here.

00:18:00.000 And so you go, you show your medal, you tell them about your experience, where you're from, who you are, what you're going to do with all this money and fame that you've just won.

00:18:07.000 And then so as soon as you're ushered out of there, you competed at eight o'clock and you don't get out of there to close to midnight.

00:18:13.000 So by the time it's midnight in London, really the only thing open is McDonald's, right?

00:18:19.000 So I'm still in my podium outfit.

00:18:21.000 Like literally what I wore on the podium, I'm still in it at midnight.

00:18:25.000 And so we go down to like Piccadilly in London.

00:18:28.000 And only things open is at McDonald's.

00:18:30.000 And so we went to like a club for a little bit.

00:18:32.000 One of my sponsors at the time had like bottle service.

00:18:35.000 They wanted to celebrate me.

00:18:36.000 So we leave there.

00:18:36.000 We go to McDonald's.

00:18:38.000 I get inside and packed.

00:18:41.000 Clubs just let out.

00:18:42.000 Everyone's like hungry.

00:18:44.000 They're hungover.

00:18:45.000 They just got done for the night full of drinking.

00:18:47.000 They're all in line lines crazy.

00:18:49.000 I go into the McDonald's.

00:18:51.000 I'm like, damn, it's a long day.

00:18:52.000 I wrestled all day long.

00:18:53.000 I do not want to stand in line.

00:18:55.000 I just want to see if I can work my way to the front.

00:18:57.000 So I go and ask the guy.

00:18:58.000 I'm like, bro, listen, I just wrestled all day at the Excel Center.

00:19:02.000 I just won an Olympic gold.

00:19:04.000 You think I can get in front of you? 0.90

00:19:05.000 And he's like, you didn't win an Olympic.

00:19:07.000 What?

00:19:07.000 Stop.

00:19:08.000 And I'm like, bro, I won the Olympics.

00:19:10.000 He's like, no, you didn't.

00:19:12.000 And so I had my medal in my pocket.

00:19:14.000 I had my gold medal in my pocket, so I pulled my gold medal out and showed this guy.

00:19:18.000 He's like...

00:19:19.000 Starts going nuts.

00:19:20.000 Oh my god!

00:19:22.000 So he's yelling.

00:19:23.000 He's pushing people out of the way in this McDonald's.

00:19:27.000 He's like, this guy just won Olympic gold medal.

00:19:29.000 Let him to the front of the line.

00:19:30.000 Let him to the front of the line.

00:19:31.000 And so he's pushing people out of the way.

00:19:35.000 Literally escorts me to the front of the line to get me my quarter pounder and my large fry.

00:19:41.000 It was wild.

00:19:43.000 That's the craziest cheeseburger fry story ever.

00:19:45.000 It was dope.

00:19:46.000 It was awesome.

00:19:47.000 That ought to be very memorable.

00:19:49.000 Yeah, it was fun.

00:19:49.000 Wow.

00:19:50.000 It was fun.

00:19:51.000 Winning the gold medal.

00:19:52.000 I know you've won the world championship, what, four times?

00:19:56.000 Four worlds, one Olympics.

00:19:57.000 But how much difference?

00:19:59.000 Nothing like it.

00:20:00.000 Olympics are the best.

00:20:01.000 It's rare.

00:20:03.000 It only happens every four years.

00:20:05.000 It's a single day event, so you have to be your best on that single day.

00:20:08.000 You only get one event.

00:20:10.000 Cycle to prepare for.

00:20:11.000 So we think of our careers like cyclically, where if you're an MMA fighter, you're like, okay, I can get an opportunity to fight for the belt as long as I continue to compete at a high level, keep my brand awareness at a good place.

00:20:26.000 But in wrestling...

00:20:28.000 The pinnacle is the Olympic Games.

00:20:30.000 So no matter how many world championships you win, you want that Olympic gold.

00:20:33.000 And the crazy thing is the worlds are harder than the Olympics.

00:20:37.000 So the Olympics are a little more condensed in terms of the qualification process.

00:20:43.000 So at Worlds, it's much easier to qualify.

00:20:45.000 So you have 42 guys in your weight class or in your bracket at Worlds.

00:20:49.000 You only have 16 at the Olympics.

00:20:51.000 So in the World Championships, I won in 2015. I wrestled six matches.

00:20:55.000 The Olympics, I won in 2012. I only had four matches.

00:20:58.000 And it's a random draw, too.

00:21:02.000 So you could wrestle Russia first round, which would suck.

00:21:06.000 Or you could wrestle Puerto Rico first round, which would suck less.

00:21:11.000 LAUGHTER And so it's a really interesting experience the way these brackets are drawn.

00:21:17.000 And I think that the Olympic Games has become so special because of everything surrounding it.

00:21:22.000 You get more money, more notoriety, more recognition moving forward.

00:21:31.000 It's catapulted me to where I am right now.

00:21:33.000 When I'm recognized or announced at an event, it's always affiliated with that Olympic gold.

00:21:39.000 Olympic gold medalist Jordan Burroughs.

00:21:41.000 They always tell you, whenever you step off the podium, you will forever be an Olympic gold medalist.

00:21:46.000 You can't lose that.

00:21:47.000 You can lose your belt.

00:21:48.000 You can never lose your gold.

00:21:50.000 It always comes home with me at the end of the day, no matter what I do moving forward.

00:21:54.000 So that's pretty cool.

00:21:55.000 That is an interesting perspective, right?

00:21:57.000 Because if you're a fighter, you win the title, and then you lose the title in your next fight.

00:22:01.000 You're a former world champion.

00:22:02.000 Former world champion.

00:22:03.000 But an Olympic gold medalist from 2012 is an Olympic gold medalist.

00:22:06.000 They don't put the former before it.

00:22:07.000 They just say Olympic.

00:22:08.000 Yeah.

00:22:08.000 So it's dope.

00:22:10.000 Yeah, you made it through, you did it, and that's it.

00:22:12.000 But then there's another guy who does it four years later.

00:22:15.000 Yeah.

00:22:15.000 So it's interesting.

00:22:17.000 It's gotta be a crazy experience, but the World Championships being more difficult, is the World Championships held in a two-day?

00:22:25.000 Is it a two-day event?

00:22:26.000 Yeah, so they changed the format in 2018. Wrestling used to be a single day.

00:22:31.000 You weigh in the day before, and then you'd wrestle all day.

00:22:35.000 You start in the preliminaries, and then you wrestle all the way through to the finals.

00:22:39.000 By the end of the day, five, six matches, you knew if you were a World Champion, Olympic Champion or not.

00:22:43.000 Now, They've made a transition where you weigh in same day, competition starts two hours after weigh-ins, and then it's a two-day event.

00:22:51.000 You wrestle through the semifinals, and then finals and medal matches are the second day.

00:22:55.000 Now, if you weigh in the same day, do you cut any weight?

00:22:57.000 A ton.

00:22:58.000 So, I wrestle at 74 kilos or 163. And this morning, I weigh 183. So, that kind of gives you perspective as to where we are in terms of what my walking around weight is when I'm just chilling and getting ready for competition or if I'm actually wrestling at my competition weight.

00:23:16.000 So, when you were supposed to be wrestling in town, this wrestling match...

00:23:19.000 I'm going up a weight class.

00:23:21.000 What would that be?

00:23:23.000 That is 189, which I can't even get to.

00:23:25.000 Oh, okay.

00:23:26.000 So I'm wrestling.

00:23:28.000 The guy that I'm wrestling is David Taylor.

00:23:30.000 Wrestled at Penn State.

00:23:32.000 He is a two-time NCAA champion.

00:23:34.000 World champion at the weight class above me, 86 kilos or 189 pounds in 2018. So I'm the world champ at 163. He's the world champ at 189. That's a big gap.

00:23:46.000 It's a big gap.

00:23:47.000 And so there are only six Olympic weights.

00:23:50.000 Wow.

00:23:51.000 At the Olympic Games.

00:23:52.000 Only six, right?

00:23:53.000 That's crazy.

00:23:54.000 So you've got 57 kilos or like 125, 143, 163, 189, 213, and then heavyweight.

00:24:04.000 And so only six weight classes.

00:24:07.000 And then, in a world championship year, you have 10 weights.

00:24:10.000 So they give you a little more flexibility.

00:24:12.000 But in the Olympic Games, they try to condense them.

00:24:14.000 They're adding so many sports.

00:24:16.000 Every single cycle, you've got golf and breakdancing.

00:24:19.000 They're adding breakdancing to the Olympic Games in Paris, 2024. That's pretty crazy.

00:24:24.000 But if they have rhythmic gymnastics, I don't see why they shouldn't have breakdancing.

00:24:28.000 But at the expense of...

00:24:30.000 Other sports like wrestling where you only have six weights and a single athlete or a single representative from each country per weight class.

00:24:38.000 Do me a favor.

00:24:39.000 Go to stanceelements on Instagram.

00:24:41.000 I want to show you this dude that I just saw there yesterday.

00:24:44.000 Breakdancing?

00:24:46.000 Is he sick?

00:24:47.000 They're on another level.

00:24:48.000 It's pretty dope, bro.

00:24:50.000 It's like elite gymnast now.

00:24:51.000 I'm just a hater because it has kind of affected wrestling a little bit.

00:24:55.000 It shouldn't affect wrestling.

00:24:56.000 But I do agree with it.

00:24:58.000 Not this gentleman.

00:24:59.000 There's a guy in a red sweatsuit.

00:25:01.000 See if you can find him down there.

00:25:03.000 There he is.

00:25:03.000 That's it.

00:25:04.000 Watch this guy.

00:25:05.000 I mean, watch this.

00:25:07.000 This dude is crazy.

00:25:11.000 Damn.

00:25:12.000 Look at this.

00:25:15.000 I mean, he might as well be an elite gymnast.

00:25:17.000 I mean, the way he's doing those back handsprings and shit, I mean, this guy's incredible.

00:25:23.000 Look at this shit.

00:25:24.000 Look at that!

00:25:25.000 Up one hand!

00:25:27.000 I mean, he's incredible.

00:25:28.000 And then stopping perfect all to music.

00:25:30.000 What is this dude's name, Jamie?

00:25:32.000 That's the one thing I can't deny.

00:25:35.000 It looks like B-Boy Tata.

00:25:38.000 Yeah.

00:25:39.000 Yeah, he's nice with it.

00:25:41.000 B-Boy Tata.

00:25:42.000 Looks like he's from Jersey.

00:25:44.000 Shout out to B-Boy Tata.

00:25:46.000 Oh, that's right.

00:25:46.000 You're from Camden, right?

00:25:47.000 Yeah, so I grew up South Jersey, Sicklerville, New Jersey, right outside of Philly.

00:25:52.000 My hometown's 20 miles from Philadelphia.

00:25:53.000 That's nuts, bro.

00:25:55.000 Look at that.

00:25:55.000 I have some friends that started out in breakdancing and then got into Jiu Jitsu.

00:26:00.000 My friend Richie Martinez and his brother Gio.

00:26:02.000 They probably transition well.

00:26:04.000 Amazingly well.

00:26:05.000 They're so fucking strong and so athletic.

00:26:07.000 They can move so well.

00:26:08.000 It's like gymnasts.

00:26:09.000 Gymnasts do well transitioning to Jiu Jitsu as well.

00:26:13.000 I guess if you have that perspective, it's very similar to gymnastics, just a lot more stylish.

00:26:20.000 There's some goofy shit in the Olympics, man.

00:26:23.000 But you can't get rid of wrestling.

00:26:24.000 Wrestling is one of the original sports.

00:26:27.000 It's literally one of the original Olympic sports.

00:26:29.000 And that's what I love about wrestling.

00:26:31.000 And here's been my comparison to MMA for a long time.

00:26:36.000 I'm always weighing the pros and cons.

00:26:37.000 Okay, wrestling is here.

00:26:39.000 MMA is here.

00:26:41.000 MMA has so many amazing things.

00:26:43.000 I love the toughness aspect.

00:26:46.000 My favorite sport outside of wrestling is boxing.

00:26:48.000 I'm a big boxing fan.

00:26:49.000 I love just the warrior element.

00:26:51.000 I love how you come from the gutter, from the mud, and these dudes are just like gritty warriors, precision.

00:26:58.000 It's an art form.

00:26:59.000 I look at MMA as...

00:27:05.000 An alternative to wrestling, right?

00:27:07.000 And one of the things that I've seen, I've seen so many guys that I've trained alongside that have gone on to have immense success in MMA. So that's what always kind of pulls me.

00:27:17.000 I'm like, damn.

00:27:17.000 Like what guys?

00:27:18.000 I've trained with, I've trained, been alongside Daniel.

00:27:23.000 I've been alongside Marty or Kamaru Usman.

00:27:26.000 I've been alongside Henry Cejudo.

00:27:28.000 I've wrestled Justin Gaethy on numerous occasions.

00:27:32.000 Mike Chandler, Lance Palmer, like all these guys.

00:27:35.000 I've wrestled these guys and I've seen...

00:27:38.000 But it's different, right?

00:27:40.000 Just because you're a great wrestler doesn't mean you're going to be a great fighter.

00:27:43.000 And just because you're an average wrestler doesn't mean you're going to be an average fighter.

00:27:47.000 I've seen guys who I thought were average wrestlers become great fighters and guys who I thought were tremendous wrestlers can't fight their way out of a wet paper bag.

00:27:55.000 So it's interesting.

00:27:57.000 Adapt quickly to the striking aspects.

00:27:59.000 Some guys really struggle.

00:28:00.000 There's some really strong grapplers that for whatever reason, they have terrible hand speed.

00:28:05.000 Their hand speed's terrible.

00:28:06.000 They don't have any power.

00:28:07.000 It's very strange.

00:28:09.000 Power's a weird thing.

00:28:10.000 You either have it or you don't.

00:28:13.000 One of the interesting things that I think about the transition is in wrestling, if you're a righty, usually you lead right leg.

00:28:20.000 But in fighting, if you're a righty, you're going to lead left.

00:28:22.000 Yeah.

00:28:23.000 That's true, but in boxing, they're actually training a lot of people opposite now.

00:28:28.000 Really?

00:28:28.000 Yeah, like Oscar De La Hoya.

00:28:29.000 He fought Southpaw, but he's a right-handed fighter.

00:28:32.000 Was it opposite?

00:28:34.000 Yeah, I think he was a left-handed fighter and he fought Orthodox.

00:28:38.000 Do De La Hoya fight Southpaw or Orthodox?

00:28:40.000 I can't even remember now.

00:28:42.000 But he let...

00:28:43.000 Like, Emanuel Stewart started having guys do that.

00:28:46.000 Because the idea would be...

00:28:47.000 One of the most important punches in boxing is your jab.

00:28:50.000 And you should use the most dominant hand for jabs. 0.98

00:28:53.000 So there's a few fighters...

00:28:55.000 So the...

00:28:55.000 Yeah...

00:28:57.000 He's a converted southpaw, that's right.

00:28:59.000 So he was a left-handed fighter, and they had him use his left hand forward, and that way his power hand was his most dominant hand, which was his front hand.

00:29:10.000 40 jabs a round. 0.64

00:29:11.000 That's a lot of work.

00:29:12.000 Well, it's the most important punch in boxing, and so there's a lot, like Bruce Lee believed in that as well.

00:29:17.000 There's a lot of people that think that maybe if a wrestler does fight that way with that right leg forward, or wrestle that way rather, they should fight that way as well.

00:29:25.000 Yeah, and I think...

00:29:26.000 I think the transition would be different.

00:29:30.000 There'd be a lot to learn.

00:29:31.000 And that's part of the reason.

00:29:31.000 I mean, there's so many reasons amongst others, but I'm the best in my field at wrestling.

00:29:36.000 I'm one of the best wrestlers in the world.

00:29:39.000 It is a completely different transition and learning curve to getting to MMA, right?

00:29:44.000 You've got to start from the bottom.

00:29:46.000 So you go from this heralded space where you're a legend, an icon, to just another guy.

00:29:51.000 And yes, you have the pedigree.

00:29:53.000 You've got the chops to go on and kind of excel here, but it takes time, bro.

00:29:58.000 Well, you have the most important skill set, in my opinion.

00:30:00.000 That's true.

00:30:01.000 But it took Henry a decade, bro.

00:30:03.000 It did, but Henry didn't dedicate himself the same way.

00:30:07.000 In the beginning.

00:30:08.000 Henry turned a corner somewhere in the UFC. Well, he wasn't seeing the fruit.

00:30:12.000 It's hard to turn the corner when you don't see the fruit.

00:30:14.000 When you start to see celebrities sitting ringside, you got Holly Berry here, Matt McConaughey here, and then you see those payouts.

00:30:21.000 You're like, damn, let me get my stuff together.

00:30:23.000 Let me get right.

00:30:24.000 Well, he also got really good at marketing and talking shit.

00:30:27.000 The cringe king.

00:30:30.000 But also undeniably good as a fighter.

00:30:34.000 The last half of his career when he became super dedicated, he was crushing people.

00:30:40.000 Crushing people with stand-up.

00:30:42.000 Do you think he's done?

00:30:43.000 I don't think so.

00:30:44.000 I think he's so competitive.

00:30:47.000 How old is he now?

00:30:48.000 33?

00:30:49.000 32?

00:30:49.000 Yeah, he's still young.

00:30:50.000 How old is Henry Cejudo?

00:30:51.000 I think 33. 34. Okay.

00:30:55.000 So he's still got years ahead of him in his prime, his athletic prime.

00:30:59.000 And I think he's just a guy like that who's a conqueror.

00:31:02.000 He's just so good.

00:31:03.000 Let me ask you this.

00:31:04.000 Why do you think that MMA fighters have a much later prime than pretty much any other sport?

00:31:13.000 If you look at the champions in MMA, it's very hard to find someone below the age of 30. Why is that?

00:31:21.000 I think it's hard to put everything together.

00:31:23.000 Because if you're a specialist in one aspect of MMA, someone generally, the person that's going to figure out a way to beat you, is a person who's a specialist in the thing you're not good at.

00:31:34.000 Like say if you're a wrestler, and you're really good at wrestling, and then you'll come into a guy, you come into a fight with a guy who's a really good striker, who's got excellent takedown defense, and then you're kind of fucked.

00:31:45.000 Like that happened when Brock Lesnar fought Alistair Overeem.

00:31:49.000 Because Brock Lesnar couldn't get Alistair down, and Alistair is a K-1 Grand Prix champion.

00:31:53.000 And just a fucking beast.

00:31:54.000 And also an enormous man, too.

00:31:56.000 Of course.

00:31:56.000 And Brock couldn't get him down, and he was just getting torn apart standing up.

00:32:00.000 So that was the guy who solved his puzzle.

00:32:03.000 It was a guy who was as big as him, but a much better striker.

00:32:08.000 What's interesting, because I think that's why wrestlers translate well, is because I started wrestling at six years old.

00:32:14.000 Most guys start the sport of wrestling...

00:32:16.000 Yeah.

00:32:34.000 I think wrestling, actually wrestling is, I'm sure wrestling is the only sanctioned sport collegiately of all combat sports.

00:32:43.000 So we have a very high level of pedigree in comparison to other places.

00:32:48.000 So, you know, I started wrestling at six years old, wrestled through middle school, high school, went to the University of Nebraska, earned my degree there, training twice a day for five years, took the medical red shirt, To get better and then got to this place where I started to continue to sharpen my chops at the Olympic Training Center in Colorado Springs.

00:33:06.000 If I made that transition, I would be so regimented in what I had done for such a long period of time.

00:33:13.000 I don't think that any other sport can compare with that.

00:33:16.000 And I don't really follow a ton, so I don't really know the dynamics of what it's like on a scholastic level in, let's say, jujitsu.

00:33:24.000 But I have to imagine that wrestling has the strongest...

00:33:27.000 Pedigree in the highest level of preparation for MMA because of its ability to be popular within the contents of an actual school, university, that type of thing.

00:33:42.000 For sure.

00:33:43.000 And wrestlers that dedicate themselves to jiu-jitsu transition very easily.

00:33:47.000 Wrestlers that figure out choke holds and arm bars and stuff like that, they already know how to control bodies. 0.81

00:33:53.000 Get those elbows in. 0.86

00:33:54.000 Protect your neck.

00:33:55.000 And they already have discipline, like crazy discipline.

00:33:58.000 One of the things that I think separates wrestlers from other sports is mental toughness.

00:34:01.000 That's right.

00:34:01.000 Because it is a badge of courage.

00:34:04.000 There's a thing that wrestlers all have is they embrace the suck. 0.56

00:34:07.000 They all do.

00:34:08.000 They all know how to push.

00:34:10.000 There's no prima donnas that are successful wrestlers. 1.00

00:34:13.000 They don't exist.

00:34:14.000 I mean, you could say that about other sports.

00:34:16.000 There's prima donnas in basketball. 1.00

00:34:17.000 There's guys that, you know, they'll fake injuries in other sports.

00:34:20.000 In soccer, they fall down.

00:34:21.000 That shit is never going to happen in wrestling. 0.60

00:34:24.000 Because it's free.

00:34:25.000 Yeah.

00:34:25.000 And it's not sexy.

00:34:26.000 You don't make any money.

00:34:27.000 Exactly.

00:34:28.000 So we've done it for nothing for so long that when you get to this level, it's just all about pride.

00:34:34.000 Yeah, I mean, it's not saying there's no mentally tough people in soccer.

00:34:37.000 I'm sure there are.

00:34:38.000 Of course.

00:34:38.000 But there's no flopping in wrestling.

00:34:40.000 There's no one in wrestling that's successful that's not mentally tough.

00:34:43.000 Yeah.

00:34:44.000 It's a universal standard.

00:34:46.000 Yeah.

00:34:46.000 And when they transition rather than MMA, you see it immediately.

00:34:51.000 You see it in the training room.

00:34:52.000 You see it in the way they fight.

00:34:54.000 Yeah, on a scale you see it.

00:34:55.000 They know how to cut that weight.

00:34:57.000 I wanted to ask you about that too.

00:34:58.000 When you're cutting weight for something, like a world championships, and you have to compete two hours later...

00:35:04.000 How do you do that?

00:35:05.000 You've got to be dialed in for a long period of time.

00:35:09.000 So I've dabbled in a lot of diets, right?

00:35:12.000 I see you're on the carnivore diet.

00:35:13.000 Yeah.

00:35:13.000 How is that going, actually?

00:35:14.000 It's great.

00:35:15.000 Is it good?

00:35:15.000 The last time I did it, I did it last year.

00:35:17.000 Only meat.

00:35:18.000 Yeah, only meat.

00:35:19.000 Like, only meat.

00:35:20.000 Well, I eat eggs and fish.

00:35:22.000 Like, last time I had lobster.

00:35:23.000 Only animal products.

00:35:25.000 So eggs, any type of meat.

00:35:27.000 Yeah, any type of meat.

00:35:29.000 That's it.

00:35:29.000 No vegetables.

00:35:30.000 No carbs, no veggies.

00:35:31.000 Some people eat like a little piece of fruit here and there, you know, if you really feel like you need it before a workout, but I'm telling you, man, it's crazy.

00:35:39.000 You feel good.

00:35:39.000 You feel fucking great.

00:35:40.000 Your energy level with no carbs is like this.

00:35:43.000 It's flat all day.

00:35:44.000 It stays the same.

00:35:45.000 So it's essentially sugar-free.

00:35:46.000 Yes, exactly.

00:35:47.000 Exactly.

00:35:48.000 So that's why your energy, you don't have those crashes.

00:35:50.000 No insulin crash, no weirdness.

00:35:53.000 Bro, your belly's got to be feeling awful.

00:35:56.000 No!

00:35:57.000 How are you digesting all of this stuff?

00:35:59.000 I feel like I'd be bogged down, like, ugh, I couldn't train.

00:36:02.000 No, I'm telling you, it's pretty easy.

00:36:04.000 It seems like it wouldn't be, but it really is.

00:36:07.000 That's crazy.

00:36:07.000 Rafael dos Andres, I think, went on this kind of a diet for his last fight when he fought Paul Felder, and I think that's how he wound up making 155 again.

00:36:16.000 But some guys have tried it in MMA. I know it's similar to like a ketogenic diet.

00:36:22.000 A lot of ketogenic diets, guys are mostly eating meats and fats and getting their fuel from fat or from glucogenesis, gluconeogenesis, which is like when your body, I think that's how you say it,

00:36:37.000 when your body processes protein and turns that protein into glucose, your body can do that.

00:36:42.000 But the thing about it is there's no crashing after eating.

00:36:46.000 It's real interesting.

00:36:47.000 And I think that's the...

00:36:48.000 I try to eliminate sugar.

00:36:50.000 That's number one.

00:36:51.000 I always try to eliminate sugar because I like sweets.

00:36:53.000 I'm a sweets guy.

00:36:54.000 Who doesn't?

00:36:55.000 So I want the pastries and I love bread.

00:36:59.000 So those are the first things I cut out.

00:37:01.000 I cut out all the extras, number one.

00:37:03.000 So any sort of, let's say, juice, bread, potato chips, cereal.

00:37:09.000 Cereal is like my thing, right?

00:37:11.000 Late at night, 9 o'clock before I go to bed.

00:37:13.000 What is it?

00:37:14.000 Now or when I was growing up?

00:37:17.000 If you want to go off the rails.

00:37:18.000 Now, I just do granola.

00:37:20.000 I'm a granola guy.

00:37:22.000 When I was a kid, it was Fruity Pebbles and Cinnamon Toast Crunch.

00:37:26.000 I'm a Captain Crunch guy.

00:37:27.000 You're a Captain Crunch guy.

00:37:28.000 Bro, I want to see the roof of your mouth if you're a Captain Crunch guy.

00:37:32.000 Because listen, bro, it's like chewing on straight up...

00:37:35.000 Fiberglass, bro.

00:37:37.000 Come on, man.

00:37:38.000 You might as well smash up this mug and throw it in a bowl.

00:37:40.000 Pour some milk on it.

00:37:42.000 That's hilarious.

00:37:43.000 I dabbled in Cap'n Crunch a little bit when I was a kid.

00:37:46.000 All Berries.

00:37:47.000 You ever had an Oops All Berries?

00:37:48.000 I don't think I did.

00:37:49.000 No.

00:37:49.000 Listen, you ain't lived until you had the Oops All Berries.

00:37:52.000 So none of the little yellow boys, whatever those are. 0.98

00:37:55.000 What was the peanut butter one?

00:37:56.000 There was a peanut butter breakfast cereal.

00:37:59.000 I'm trying to remember what that was.

00:38:01.000 I don't know.

00:38:02.000 Fruit Loose was always a good one too.

00:38:04.000 Can't go wrong.

00:38:05.000 Lucky Charms.

00:38:05.000 Yeah, can't go wrong.

00:38:06.000 If I'm going to go completely off the rails, like I had some friends of ours who live actually in Texas and Dallas.

00:38:12.000 The Ribbon family, they sent me, after I made the world team last year, a huge box of all the little tiny cereals. 1.00

00:38:19.000 And it had Apple Jacks, Fruit Loops, Frosted Flakes, you know, Fruity Pebbles, Cocoa, everything.

00:38:25.000 Like, literally everything that you ate as a kid.

00:38:27.000 And so we only do our shopping at Whole Foods now.

00:38:29.000 So we have a pretty much organic, all-natural diet.

00:38:33.000 So that's why I'm kind of into, you know, the Kashi. 0.99

00:38:36.000 Like, as far as we go now, it's like Honey Nut Cheerios.

00:38:39.000 That's like as far as we'll...

00:38:40.000 That's a big splurge.

00:38:42.000 That's going crazy.

00:38:43.000 That's a splurge, right?

00:38:44.000 Like, damn, you're getting wild tonight.

00:38:46.000 JV's going with the Honey Nut Cheerios.

00:38:48.000 Going off the rails.

00:38:48.000 So I try to cut out the bad stuff first, and then it really is about portion sizing.

00:38:55.000 So I dabble in intermittent fasting.

00:38:58.000 I cut down the portion sizes of my meals and I go sugar-free.

00:39:01.000 So typically I wake up in the morning, let's say 7 a.m.

00:39:04.000 I have a smoothie.

00:39:05.000 In my smoothie I put plant protein, collagen protein.

00:39:08.000 I'll do maybe like some chia seeds, almond milk, spinach, and peanut butter.

00:39:14.000 And that'll be my breakfast.

00:39:15.000 And this is pre-training?

00:39:17.000 That's pre-training.

00:39:17.000 So you do this at 7?

00:39:19.000 And what time is your first training session?

00:39:20.000 And my first training session is at 8.30.

00:39:23.000 And how many training sessions do you generally have in a day?

00:39:25.000 Two.

00:39:26.000 Just two.

00:39:26.000 And how do you break them up?

00:39:27.000 Do you choose how you train and what you do?

00:39:31.000 It depends.

00:39:31.000 Now, yes, a little bit more so than I had in the past.

00:39:34.000 So at this age, I'm 32 years old.

00:39:37.000 I've been in it for a while.

00:39:39.000 I have a connection with my coaches that is more of a partnership as opposed to like a coach-athlete relationship.

00:39:47.000 So I'm like, okay, here's what I need.

00:39:49.000 Here's what I want to work on.

00:39:50.000 And then they give me kind of the autonomy to figure out what my schedule is going to look like.

00:39:54.000 Because I've got three kids at home, a wife. 0.97

00:39:57.000 My schedule is a little more busy than the average college guy that we're training with.

00:40:00.000 So I still train at the University of Nebraska.

00:40:02.000 We have an RTC there, which is a regional training center, in conjunction with the college program.

00:40:07.000 So I'm wrestling with those guys often in their room out in Lincoln.

00:40:13.000 Yeah, so I have my smoothie at usually like 7.30.

00:40:17.000 I'm in the wrestling room by 8.30 to train.

00:40:19.000 We're usually on the mat in the morning, so we'll get like a light drill in, just get our bodies moving, get feeling good, or we'll lift in the morning.

00:40:27.000 So I typically lift three times a week.

00:40:29.000 Then in the afternoon, I'll have, depending upon how close I am to my weight cut itself, like if I'm trying to stay light and I'm getting close, like week of, I'll skip lunch, period.

00:40:40.000 I won't even have lunch.

00:40:41.000 Or I'll do like a handful of cashews or something relatively small.

00:40:45.000 And then I'll go back to practice at 2 and we'll do either live wrestling or we'll do some sort of conditioning.

00:40:52.000 Is that hard to do with just like a handful of cashews?

00:40:55.000 It sucks, bro.

00:40:55.000 But you have to shrink your body a little bit because if you want to compete two hours, unlike boxing, MMA, where you have an entire day to rehydrate, replenish your body, and get ready for competition, two hours is a different beast, bro.

00:41:09.000 If you step on the scale and you just sat in the sauna for an hour and you've been in a hot tub with a sauna suit and a beanie, You're finished.

00:41:17.000 You're finished.

00:41:18.000 You can't recover.

00:41:19.000 It's impossible.

00:41:20.000 Because if you think about that two hours, that two hours encompasses multiple things.

00:41:24.000 One, it's you have to eat.

00:41:26.000 And two, you've got to get warmed up.

00:41:29.000 And then three, you've got to get your mind right and prepare to compete.

00:41:34.000 So you never know.

00:41:35.000 You could be an hour in or you could be the first match on Matt A. It really just depends on how the brackets shake out.

00:41:41.000 So you're shrinking your body no matter what.

00:41:43.000 No matter what.

00:41:44.000 You have to.

00:41:45.000 Or at least that's what I feel.

00:41:46.000 So the most I ever want to lose in the day, the 24 hours before competition is 6 pounds, 6-7 pounds.

00:41:54.000 So that's doable for you?

00:41:55.000 That's manageable.

00:41:57.000 And then so when you get off the scale, what's the first thing you take into your body?

00:42:01.000 Liquids.

00:42:02.000 Liquids, yeah.

00:42:02.000 Do you do it with electrolytes?

00:42:04.000 Yeah, electrolytes.

00:42:05.000 Aminos, liquid aminos.

00:42:07.000 I'll do...

00:42:07.000 And is there like a protocol?

00:42:09.000 Do you do it slowly?

00:42:10.000 Like how do you get rehydrated?

00:42:13.000 I don't.

00:42:14.000 I don't do it slowly.

00:42:14.000 I mean, I don't slam it, but I think I do it with moderation because my weight cut is not really hard because I don't do 15, 20 pounds.

00:42:23.000 So it's not like my body is so shocked that any input nutritionally is going to throw me off.

00:42:29.000 Okay, so it's mild dehydration.

00:42:30.000 Yeah, it's relatively mild because I still want to be able to recover.

00:42:34.000 You've got your electrolytes and your fluids and then fruits.

00:42:37.000 So I try to slam.

00:42:39.000 Then...

00:42:40.000 We're good to go.

00:42:57.000 Between each match, you're going to have about an hour.

00:42:59.000 So you know that the longer the day goes, the more you win, the more recovery time you get.

00:43:05.000 So where you might start the day, I weigh in at 163, and then by the time I compete my first match, let's say I'm 169-ish, 170. Drank maybe a gallon of water, had a smoothie, ate some fruit,

00:43:20.000 maybe some honey and some peanut butter.

00:43:22.000 And then I'm wrestling about 6-7 pounds over.

00:43:26.000 And so then as the day progresses, you're eating a little bit between each match.

00:43:28.000 But then you also have to remember, you've got to make scratch weight again for day two.

00:43:33.000 Oh my god, did you?

00:43:34.000 So you've got to be back down to 163.0 for day two of the finals.

00:43:39.000 Oh, yeah.

00:43:39.000 But that's a different beast because then the finals are in the evening.

00:43:42.000 So if you can just make it down, weigh in at 8.30, you don't have to wrestle until 6 p.m.

00:43:45.000 But that's got to beat you up to do that two days in a row.

00:43:48.000 So when you step off the mat after the semifinals, you wrestled four matches that day.

00:43:53.000 And then you go step on the scale.

00:43:55.000 So like, for example, this year, World Championships made weight Saturday morning, wrestled four matches.

00:44:02.000 After the semifinals, you're like, okay, I gotta make weight tomorrow since I'm a medalist.

00:44:05.000 You go step on the scale, I'm seven pounds over.

00:44:08.000 So now, I gotta get ready for tomorrow.

00:44:11.000 I can't eat dinner after wrestling four matches.

00:44:13.000 I've gotta go straight to the gym, get on the bike, get in the sauna, get on the treadmill, get the seven pounds off, and then go to sleep hungry and then weigh in again the next morning.

00:44:26.000 It's rough.

00:44:27.000 I hope wrestling will change it.

00:44:29.000 So if you do that, say, and then you don't have to wrestle into the evening, you wane in the morning, you don't have to wrestle into the evening, then what do you do?

00:44:36.000 Do you immediately start eating?

00:44:39.000 It is the same thing?

00:44:41.000 Fluids first?

00:44:42.000 Yeah, you do some fluids first.

00:44:43.000 You do a relatively similar protocol to the day before, but then you train at some point during the day.

00:44:50.000 If I have a match at night, I always like to get my body moving at some point during the day.

00:44:55.000 So maybe I'll have breakfast and then around noon, 1 o'clock, I'll come and get a light drill in.

00:44:59.000 Just get my body moving.

00:45:00.000 Taking a couple shots.

00:45:02.000 Maybe do a couple sprints.

00:45:03.000 Ride the bike for a little bit.

00:45:04.000 Just to make sure that I'm on point when it is go time.

00:45:07.000 That I'm not just sitting around all day accumulating all this weight.

00:45:11.000 Now all of a sudden I'm 10-12 pounds heavier than I was 8 hours ago.

00:45:15.000 And I gotta be ready to go out and compete.

00:45:17.000 I can't believe you have to wrestle.

00:45:18.000 There's a balance.

00:45:19.000 There's a balance there.

00:45:20.000 I don't know how the guys do it in MMA bro.

00:45:22.000 Like you're 15, 20 pounds heavier than you were the day before.

00:45:26.000 How can you even be ideal in terms of your movement?

00:45:30.000 I feel like I'm being weighed down.

00:45:32.000 Well, I feel like there's guys that are getting away from that now, and a lot of guys are trying to just do what you were just saying, get to about 6 pounds and cut that, and then it's the day before, and they perform better that way.

00:45:43.000 The real concern is against elite grapplers, like someone who's really bigger than you and stronger than you and to take you down.

00:45:49.000 But I'm just thinking, I can't believe that you have to wrestle all those matches in a day and then train afterwards to cut weight that night.

00:45:57.000 You gotta cut again.

00:45:58.000 And then don't eat.

00:45:59.000 So if the UFC has a tournament...

00:46:02.000 McGregor's wrestling Cerrone on Saturday night, or fighting Cerrone Saturday night, and then he's got to fight Gathe Sunday.

00:46:10.000 He's going to make weight on Saturday morning before the fight, and he's going to make weight again on Sunday before the fight.

00:46:16.000 Because you've got to rehydrate.

00:46:19.000 You're not thinking about weigh-ins tomorrow.

00:46:21.000 You're thinking about the day.

00:46:22.000 Why do they make him weigh in twice?

00:46:24.000 Because they want to stop guys from cutting too much weight.

00:46:26.000 Like, you've seen it.

00:46:27.000 Guys have almost died trying to get down to weight.

00:46:30.000 Like, crazy stuff.

00:46:31.000 You had Day Before Weigh-Ins, people were like, I can cut anything because I can be ready in 24 hours.

00:46:36.000 Right.

00:46:37.000 So you got guys literally getting carried to the scale.

00:46:40.000 Oh, I've seen it.

00:46:40.000 They can't even walk.

00:46:42.000 They're...

00:46:43.000 They're discombobulated.

00:46:44.000 They're all over the place.

00:46:45.000 Their coaches carry them, sit them on the scale, make weight, and then all of a sudden they just lay them out.

00:46:50.000 They're pouring fluids into their mouth, chewing their food for them.

00:46:54.000 It's nuts.

00:46:55.000 They're on death's door.

00:46:56.000 I think that's what they're trying to avoid.

00:46:58.000 They don't want to be liable for someone killing themselves.

00:47:09.000 I don't like that.

00:47:12.000 I don't.

00:47:13.000 How come?

00:47:23.000 Right.

00:47:26.000 Right.

00:47:41.000 So the only weight class I can make is 163. So now, not only are you trying to beat the scale and beat your opponent, but now you're also trying to beat the hydration test.

00:47:49.000 It's just another way for people to cheat and then, you know, potentially suspensions.

00:47:54.000 Well, fighting has a couple more weight classes, but it's still pretty limited.

00:47:58.000 But what they're doing is they're just telling guys, like, if you fight at 170 and you're cutting 10, 15 pounds...

00:48:03.000 Just go up to 185. And they're making sure that these guys fight and compete healthy.

00:48:09.000 So they're trying to eliminate weight cutting.

00:48:12.000 Is that possible, though?

00:48:13.000 It's hard.

00:48:14.000 If you tell someone, hey, listen, I know this is a struggle for you, Joe.

00:48:16.000 I know you really want to fight at 170. Your BMI says that you can, but you cannot get hydrated and fight at 170. You've got to go up to 185. And you weigh 185. And you're like, I can't compete here.

00:48:29.000 But the other guys would be 185 as well.

00:48:31.000 They would be doing the same thing as well.

00:48:33.000 The whole idea is to eliminate weight cutting across the board.

00:48:35.000 But some guys have better teams.

00:48:37.000 Some guys have science behind them.

00:48:39.000 That's true.

00:48:39.000 You look at Conor.

00:48:40.000 Now that Conor's made this insane amount of money, he's got an entire team behind what he does.

00:48:47.000 And so most guys that are trying to compete with him don't have those type of resources.

00:48:52.000 Where he has science and they're going to make sure he's on point, you're just...

00:48:58.000 You got your water bottle.

00:49:01.000 You're just drinking as much as possible and trying to manage it.

00:49:04.000 But if you're not cutting weight, that would kind of eliminate the significance of having this big team behind you.

00:49:10.000 In terms of like the science of weight cutting and preparing, getting yourself ready.

00:49:14.000 If no one's cutting weight, then you're just dealing with skill.

00:49:17.000 That's the idea.

00:49:18.000 Yeah, but that'd be like the whole steroids argument.

00:49:21.000 If everyone's on steroids, then no one's on steroids.

00:49:23.000 So it's like, is that possible?

00:49:26.000 It's the opposite of that argument.

00:49:27.000 That would be the argument for weight cutting. 0.99

00:49:29.000 Saying, look, everyone's on steroids, so just take steroids. 0.99

00:49:33.000 Everyone cuts weight, so just cut weight.

00:49:34.000 But if you can't cut weight, that's like saying you can't do steroids.

00:49:38.000 Yeah, yeah, I got you.

00:49:39.000 So it's like the opposite of that argument.

00:49:41.000 But I'm curious as to how you would prevent everyone from doing...

00:49:47.000 Hydration tests.

00:49:48.000 I know, but...

00:49:50.000 There's certain ways.

00:49:51.000 Everyone's not going to cheat.

00:49:53.000 You would get a guy, measure his body mass, measure his body fat composition, do a hydration test on him, say, look, at 170, you're sitting here, you have 10% body fat.

00:50:06.000 So you have to be certified.

00:50:06.000 Yeah, and then just have your body weight and your mass tracked.

00:50:10.000 So you're capable of competing at 170 pounds, and this is how we know.

00:50:15.000 You really can't make 155, and that's the weight classes in MMA, 155 to 170. I think the tough thing for us is we have eating disorders.

00:50:24.000 Combat athletes have eating disorders, bro.

00:50:26.000 Yeah.

00:50:28.000 For us, we have an unhealthy relationship with food where we kill ourselves to get down to weight so we can compete at a high level and then we trash our bodies with all the things that we've been missing out on for such a long period of time.

00:50:44.000 So if you look at the average fighter...

00:50:46.000 Where they are in the off-season is much higher than where they typically are when they're training.

00:50:53.000 If you look at a guy with his shirt off when he's getting prepared for a fight, like, damn, that dude looks good.

00:50:56.000 You look at him on a beach with his family in the summertime, you're like, damn, that dude looks fat.

00:51:00.000 And so...

00:51:02.000 We have to have a better relationship with food where it's more of a lifestyle because at this point, this is why you see most guys after their careers are done, they've gained an excessive amount of weight, they look unhealthy.

00:51:13.000 You're like, bro, what did you do to yourself?

00:51:16.000 It's true.

00:51:16.000 It's a good point.

00:51:17.000 I feel it personally.

00:51:18.000 There are days where I'm like, I'm not even hungry.

00:51:20.000 But I haven't eaten what I want in two months.

00:51:23.000 I'm having this French toast.

00:51:24.000 You know what I mean?

00:51:25.000 And so it's a very, very different aspect of life that we have never really tapped into because we've been able to make it.

00:51:33.000 But just because you're making it doesn't mean it's healthy.

00:51:35.000 So, you know, it's almost like one of those things that until we start to register it and track it over a long period of time, we'll never really know the effects mentally, psychologically and physically.

00:51:45.000 Well, I think for MMA, one of the solutions is more weight classes.

00:51:49.000 I don't think there's nearly enough weight classes.

00:51:51.000 I think the jumps like 85 to 205, that's 20 pounds.

00:51:54.000 That's a big jump.

00:51:55.000 And then 205 to 265 is heavyweight.

00:51:58.000 That's too big.

00:51:59.000 That's a giant jump.

00:52:00.000 That's a big jump.

00:52:01.000 I think they should have weight classes basically every 10 pounds.

00:52:04.000 I think that'd be good.

00:52:05.000 That might get me interested.

00:52:07.000 Would it really?

00:52:08.000 I wrestle at 163. Right.

00:52:10.000 So I'm literally smack dab in between two weight classes.

00:52:14.000 Yeah.

00:52:14.000 Between 55 and 70, then you have me.

00:52:16.000 So I feel like I'm too big for 55. So you're still considering this?

00:52:21.000 My wife's watching, so I'll tell you later.

00:52:25.000 When they cut the cameras off, I'll tell you.

00:52:28.000 How much training have you done with striking?

00:52:30.000 Never.

00:52:31.000 Never?

00:52:31.000 Never.

00:52:32.000 Never even been in a fight.

00:52:33.000 But never hit pads or anything?

00:52:34.000 Nothing.

00:52:37.000 Whoa! 0.71

00:52:38.000 Nothing.

00:52:39.000 But I think I just...

00:52:41.000 I'm just confident.

00:52:43.000 Well, you should be.

00:52:43.000 You're one of the best wrestlers ever.

00:52:45.000 Absurdly confident.

00:52:46.000 So you're a fucking Olympic gold medalist.

00:52:47.000 You have to be confident.

00:52:49.000 But striking is a different animal.

00:52:51.000 I just want to roll with a couple of guys.

00:52:54.000 Well, that would be easy to set up.

00:52:56.000 Yeah, I want to roll with Connor.

00:52:57.000 It's probably my dream guy that just, like, get my hands on and just feel a little bit.

00:53:03.000 I think it would be fun.

00:53:06.000 GSP. What was it like doing that thing with Askren?

00:53:09.000 That you guys did that crazy wrestling match?

00:53:12.000 It was interesting.

00:53:13.000 I respect Ben a ton.

00:53:15.000 I do too.

00:53:16.000 Try this.

00:53:17.000 You ever have a kill clip?

00:53:18.000 No, it's good.

00:53:19.000 CBD. My own drink.

00:53:20.000 Oh, I can't drink it, bro.

00:53:22.000 Can't?

00:53:22.000 Bad for you?

00:53:23.000 No, I'm USADA. This is CBD. It doesn't have any THC in it.

00:53:26.000 I'm good.

00:53:27.000 I understand.

00:53:28.000 But thank you.

00:53:29.000 I appreciate it.

00:53:30.000 Hey, make sure you guys are drinking Kill Cliff.

00:53:33.000 Drink whatever you want.

00:53:34.000 I don't give a fuck.

00:53:34.000 I just want you to try it.

00:53:35.000 No, you're good, bro.

00:53:36.000 Pineapple and jalapeno.

00:53:37.000 This looks good.

00:53:38.000 Kill Cliff. 0.99

00:53:38.000 You're with Kill Cliff? 0.99

00:53:39.000 Mm-hmm.

00:53:41.000 It's crazy.

00:53:42.000 They sent me a package of their stuff years ago.

00:53:45.000 Were you in their inception?

00:53:47.000 Nope.

00:53:47.000 Or did you just get recently on board?

00:53:48.000 Within the last year or so.

00:53:49.000 That's dope, bro.

00:53:50.000 Congratulations.

00:53:51.000 Yeah, we started...

00:53:52.000 I came up with this idea for a pineapple jalapeno drink.

00:53:56.000 They're growing.

00:53:57.000 Yeah.

00:53:58.000 It's great.

00:53:59.000 It's all sugar-free.

00:54:00.000 They were relatively small companies.

00:54:01.000 It's got 25 milligrams of CBD in it.

00:54:03.000 Are they still in the CrossFit space?

00:54:07.000 Yeah, they do a lot of different stuff like that.

00:54:09.000 That's awesome, bro.

00:54:11.000 So, at Wrestling Askren, it was, when I got, I was in college in 2008. He was on the Olympic team, going to Beijing.

00:54:20.000 I was on the Junior World team.

00:54:22.000 I was 20 years old at the time.

00:54:24.000 He was on the Olympian, so I'm like, damn, that's been Askren.

00:54:27.000 Yeah.

00:54:29.000 And so, super cool for me to kind of have that experience.

00:54:31.000 I remember he took me for a ride to Walmart in his Prius.

00:54:34.000 And he let me sit shotgun.

00:54:36.000 And so, like, from that day on, I, like, idolized him.

00:54:39.000 And then, you know, you get to this point where idols become rivals.

00:54:41.000 And I'm like, well, this guy is doing extremely well in the MMA world.

00:54:45.000 He's a former wrestler, but he still has his hand in wrestling.

00:54:49.000 And he's still a competitor.

00:54:50.000 So, you know, for him, he's like, why not?

00:54:52.000 I'm going to do my best to elevate wrestling's profile.

00:54:55.000 But I knew I could beat him.

00:54:56.000 So, you know, it wasn't really, like, a risky matchup for me.

00:55:00.000 But it was a lot of fun, bro.

00:55:01.000 We drew a ton of fans.

00:55:03.000 We sold out the Hulu Theater in Times Square.

00:55:07.000 This place was rocking, bro.

00:55:09.000 Like, crazy arena.

00:55:12.000 And it was a ton of fun.

00:55:14.000 It was a ton of fun.

00:55:15.000 It's interesting that for someone to compete in MMA, you have to do so many different things.

00:55:20.000 You have to strike, you have to do jiu-jitsu, you have to work on all these different aspects.

00:55:25.000 You're wrestling.

00:55:26.000 You're just wrestling.

00:55:27.000 That's what you do.

00:55:28.000 You're an expert at it.

00:55:29.000 With Ben, he was really elite at it, but at a certain period, oh shit!

00:55:35.000 There goes Ben.

00:55:36.000 He's got a fucked up hip, too. 0.51

00:55:37.000 And I'm sure he still had a fucked up hip.

00:55:39.000 He was all smiles, though.

00:55:41.000 Oh, he loved it.

00:55:42.000 There was one point later in the match where I took him down and he was like, bro, I thought you said you were going to let me score.

00:55:48.000 Or actually give me a chance.

00:55:50.000 I was like, no, I'm not the guy.

00:55:53.000 Listen, if you want to build your confidence or if you want to get prepared for an event by letting someone throw you a bone, I'm not that guy.

00:56:03.000 But it was fun.

00:56:04.000 You know what?

00:56:04.000 I love Ben for allowing me to compete in this match.

00:56:08.000 You know what's crazy?

00:56:10.000 Is this was my most viewed match in my entire career.

00:56:17.000 Wow.

00:56:18.000 Wrestling Ben Askren.

00:56:19.000 Who hadn't wrestled competitively in almost a decade.

00:56:21.000 It's pretty wild.

00:56:22.000 Wild.

00:56:23.000 He's an interesting guy in MMA too because he...

00:56:27.000 It's a bummer that he made it to the UFC when he did.

00:56:30.000 Because he had really taken a long time off the sport and decided to come back and fight in the UFC. And I just don't think he was the same Ben Askren that was the Bellator champion or when he went over to 1FC. He was...

00:56:45.000 He was manhandling motherfuckers.

00:56:47.000 And the best part about it is you got to see a guy who is elite at wrestling and really not elite at anything else.

00:56:54.000 Just dominating with pure wrestling.

00:56:58.000 He's a great wrestler.

00:56:59.000 He's one of those guys, if he gets attached to you, he's dangerous.

00:57:04.000 If you get your head underneath of him, front headlock position, forget about it.

00:57:08.000 He's ridiculously strong, despite what he looks like.

00:57:11.000 Deceptively strong, right?

00:57:12.000 Shaped like a pear, rustled like a bear.

00:57:16.000 That's a good way to describe it.

00:57:18.000 So he's, man, he's got the ultimate dad bod, but I tell you what, you don't want to let that dude in on your leg.

00:57:24.000 For years, but when he was undefeated before he went to fight in the UFC, for years, he would get ahold of guys.

00:57:29.000 You could see this surprised look in their face.

00:57:32.000 Like, they were confused.

00:57:32.000 Yeah.

00:57:33.000 When he fought, like, Korshkov, when he fought Douglas Lima, these fucking murderers over in Bellator, those guys were killing people.

00:57:40.000 But he just got ahold of them, like, not today.

00:57:43.000 Boom, on your back.

00:57:44.000 Yeah.

00:57:44.000 Take these noogies.

00:57:45.000 Yeah, it was wild.

00:57:47.000 And maybe it worked out perfectly for him because he got to establish himself here in these lesser leagues.

00:57:55.000 And then made the transition at a good time where he was knocking on...

00:58:06.000 I just wish that we could have seen him when he was in his athletic prime compete against the guys that he competed against.

00:58:13.000 Guys like Robbie Lawler, guys like Masvidal.

00:58:18.000 He was a guy that there was...

00:58:19.000 He had dwelled here for so long that when he finally got to the UFC, they gave him such a competition that he never really had a chance to even get his feet wet in the UFC. It was like, alright, Lawler.

00:58:30.000 Well, he won that fight.

00:58:32.000 Here you go.

00:58:33.000 But the Masvidal fight was crazy.

00:58:35.000 Yeah, but Lawler fight was crazy too, bro.

00:58:36.000 Like that first 45 seconds.

00:58:38.000 It's not looking good for him.

00:58:40.000 I know, he got hit with some big shots.

00:58:41.000 It was a crazy fight.

00:58:43.000 But it was, you know...

00:58:45.000 Ben has made a lot of money and he's done very well for himself and he's still well respected in both spaces.

00:58:52.000 So, I mean, I really guess that's all you can ask for from his perspective.

00:58:56.000 He's done extremely well.

00:58:57.000 He has multiple wrestling clubs back up in Wisconsin and He works for Flow Wrestling down here in Austin, who he dabbles in commentary and is an analyst for our sport.

00:59:10.000 He's well respected in the MMA community.

00:59:12.000 He's been a champion in 1FC and Bellator and fought in the UFC. He's done well.

00:59:19.000 And he's also a fun guy.

00:59:21.000 He took that loss against Masvidal better than anybody.

00:59:26.000 He immediately gets on Twitter, well that sucked.

00:59:29.000 Bro, I was scared.

00:59:30.000 I was legit scared.

00:59:32.000 We were at Buffalo Wild Wings watching that fight.

00:59:34.000 And we were sitting down like, alright, let's go.

00:59:37.000 Let's go, Ben.

00:59:38.000 Because it was only a couple weeks after I had wrestled him.

00:59:42.000 So I wanted to see him win.

00:59:46.000 Of course.

00:59:48.000 I just wanted to see him win.

00:59:50.000 Because I was affiliated with him.

00:59:52.000 So I always want to see the wrestlers win.

00:59:53.000 It's kind of crazy that he took a wrestling match a couple of weeks before a big MMA fight like that.

00:59:58.000 I threw him off the stage.

00:59:59.000 That was a bad idea.

01:00:00.000 That was bad.

01:00:01.000 I'm an idiot, bro.

01:00:02.000 Like, I would almost cost this man a lot of money just because, you know, I was being stupid.

01:00:07.000 Yeah.

01:00:07.000 So it was, yeah, we're good.

01:00:10.000 Well, it worked out okay.

01:00:11.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:00:12.000 He survived.

01:00:13.000 But the shot that Masvidal landed on him was horrific.

01:00:17.000 And that's why I still wrestle.

01:00:20.000 Yeah.

01:00:22.000 Well, if you've done no striking at all, I think you've made a good choice.

01:00:27.000 Yeah, bro.

01:00:27.000 It's different.

01:00:28.000 And I think, you know, it's funny.

01:00:31.000 I took a shot the other day in practice right into someone's knee.

01:00:34.000 Bam! 0.98

01:00:35.000 And I was like, maybe that's what a punch feels like.

01:00:38.000 And I'm like, if I can take that shot from a knee to the face, shooting at full speed, I can take a punch.

01:00:42.000 I can take a punch.

01:00:44.000 I don't know.

01:00:44.000 Maybe it's just a little ego, right?

01:00:47.000 It's like a little ego where I'm like, I want to see what I'm made of.

01:00:49.000 I've never fought.

01:00:50.000 I know I'm tough.

01:00:51.000 I'm gritty.

01:00:52.000 I'm mentally tough.

01:00:53.000 I can do this.

01:00:55.000 But again, I don't feel like I have anything to prove.

01:00:58.000 I've got to kind of step back into this spiritual sense of contentment.

01:01:02.000 I've done plenty.

01:01:03.000 God has me where He wants me.

01:01:05.000 And I've done so much to elevate the profile of the sport of wrestling.

01:01:10.000 I don't have to make this transition.

01:01:12.000 Like, yes, it would be great.

01:01:13.000 It'd be glamorous.

01:01:14.000 I'd have celebrities ringside.

01:01:15.000 I'd get a big purse and all this cool stuff.

01:01:17.000 I have you calling my fight.

01:01:19.000 But would it be true to what I really believe in?

01:01:24.000 Who I really want to be and desire for myself?

01:01:27.000 Or would it just be a cash grab and...

01:01:30.000 This futile pursuit of something that is not meant for me, bro.

01:01:35.000 If you go into anything without a spirit of contentment and true purpose, it's always going to be a futile pursuit.

01:01:43.000 For me, I'm like, is it really worth it?

01:01:46.000 Do I really want to be in here?

01:01:47.000 When they lock that gate behind me, am I going to be like...

01:01:50.000 This is what I wanted?

01:01:51.000 Or am I like, what am I doing here?

01:01:53.000 You know what I mean?

01:01:54.000 Like, you got raging fans at the bar like, yeah, kill him, kick his ass, bro.

01:01:59.000 So it's just a different vibe.

01:02:03.000 I'm thankful for where I'm at.

01:02:04.000 It's a good place.

01:02:05.000 Well, that's beautiful.

01:02:06.000 That's perfect, man.

01:02:07.000 You don't need to make any other decisions then.

01:02:09.000 Listen, and you also have a very unique opportunity to bring a lot of attention to wrestling.

01:02:13.000 Yeah, bro.

01:02:14.000 Actual, real, elite wrestling, post-college, post-Olympics, and to let people know there's still people competing.

01:02:21.000 There's viable options to compete.

01:02:22.000 No one knows.

01:02:23.000 No one knows what happens in wrestling.

01:02:25.000 They're like, well, what are you doing between the Olympics?

01:02:27.000 I'm like, well, there's still wrestling.

01:02:29.000 There's world championships.

01:02:30.000 Everyone's like...

01:02:31.000 Do you still wrestle?

01:02:32.000 I'm like, bro, I just...

01:02:33.000 I have one of the biggest matches of the year coming up.

01:02:35.000 I just wrestled in one of the biggest matches of the year.

01:02:37.000 You're like, yes.

01:02:38.000 I still compete, but people don't really follow.

01:02:40.000 Wrestlers follow.

01:02:42.000 Yeah, that's it.

01:02:42.000 Just wrestlers.

01:02:43.000 We're such a niche sport where the UFC's brand has exploded because you guys were in this...

01:02:49.000 We're good to go.

01:03:09.000 And so within a tournament, it can be hard to market the best matchups because there's upsets and a lot of things happen.

01:03:16.000 Injuries.

01:03:17.000 Things just might not happen, right?

01:03:19.000 So if you've got all the best 170-pounders in the entire world, how do you know that GSP and Kamaru Usman are going to meet up?

01:03:28.000 Because they're one and two seed?

01:03:29.000 You never know.

01:03:30.000 Anything could happen.

01:03:31.000 And so I think that you guys have done a really good job with marketing the sport.

01:03:36.000 You've brought in brand sponsors and It has gone from this red-headed stepchild to boxing where it's brutal and barbarian to this sport that it's seen as more of an art form.

01:03:48.000 And there are a lot of guys that are responsible for that.

01:03:51.000 And it's been cool to see.

01:03:53.000 We're trying to replicate it, but it's much harder because...

01:03:59.000 Yeah.

01:04:01.000 Yeah.

01:04:07.000 Yeah.

01:04:18.000 Sort of a different jujitsu format.

01:04:20.000 But combat jujitsu, people understand people getting hit.

01:04:24.000 And that's the thing about the UFC. When people understand the striking, it's simple.

01:04:30.000 A guy punches a guy, you get it.

01:04:31.000 A guy kicks a guy, you get it.

01:04:33.000 But when fights go to the ground and people start going for submissions, to people that have never grappled, they have no idea what's happening.

01:04:40.000 Yeah, they want that.

01:04:41.000 That's what they want.

01:04:41.000 They don't understand it.

01:04:42.000 So it's just a scramble, tangle of limbs.

01:04:45.000 They don't really understand what's happening.

01:04:46.000 But we live in a bloodthirsty society.

01:04:48.000 So people want to see...

01:04:50.000 Even if you watch a boxing fight.

01:04:52.000 If you watch, let's say, Bud Crawford versus Earl Spence, you're like, these dudes are the very best in the entire world at their craft.

01:05:00.000 If there's not a knockout and there's a draw unanimous decision after 12 rounds, you're going to be like, that sucked.

01:05:07.000 I want to see someone get knocked out.

01:05:09.000 But the chances are when you have two high-level guys like that, they're not going to knock each other out.

01:05:13.000 They're just going to be...

01:05:15.000 We're good to go.

01:05:24.000 It's the same thing.

01:05:25.000 You have to be a wrestler to truly appreciate the craft.

01:05:28.000 You know what it takes to be the best, but you can't really respect it unless you're within it.

01:05:35.000 Plus, it's not just a recreational sport.

01:05:37.000 Wrestling is taboo, right?

01:05:39.000 It's kind of weird a little bit.

01:05:40.000 You wear singlets and you just roll around with each other.

01:05:45.000 Jiu-jitsu, I feel like you can go to a gym as a 40-year-old man that hasn't competed in 20 years, put on your gi, and roll around with your co-worker, and it can be completely normal.

01:05:55.000 But you wouldn't do that.

01:05:57.000 You wouldn't wrestle your co-worker.

01:05:58.000 It's true.

01:05:59.000 Like, get off me, dawg. 0.99

01:06:01.000 What are you doing?

01:06:02.000 And so it's...

01:06:04.000 It's different.

01:06:05.000 I feel like wrestling is one of the few sports that you can't just do.

01:06:10.000 Recreationally.

01:06:10.000 Yeah, you can't just go to the local gym.

01:06:12.000 Yeah, you have to have gone through high school or college.

01:06:15.000 You want to watch it, but you don't really want to be in it.

01:06:19.000 Yeah, for MMA fighters that have never competed in wrestling at all, and they want to learn how to wrestle, it's uncomfortable for them.

01:06:28.000 That's what I want to do.

01:06:29.000 Yeah.

01:06:29.000 I want to have, when I finish up my career, I'm going to make a high-performance training center, and I'm going to invite all the best UFC fighters, all fighters, but I like the UFC's brand, to come train with me and help them sharpen up their skills and preparation for their big fights.

01:06:44.000 Where would you do that?

01:06:45.000 That's a good question.

01:06:46.000 I'm from Jersey.

01:06:48.000 I'm actually moving to Philadelphia next year with my family, but I want to be somewhere where the sun shines all year round.

01:06:54.000 I want to be somewhere warm with There's no salt on my car.

01:06:58.000 I can just sit outside and grill and hang out with the fam.

01:07:01.000 So I don't know.

01:07:02.000 That's a good question.

01:07:03.000 It's got to be a desirable destination if you're going to get the best guys in the world to come.

01:07:07.000 But I've got some invitations from some UFC fighters to come and train with them.

01:07:10.000 I've got some invitations from Jiu Jitsu guys to come train with them.

01:07:14.000 You know, Rory McDonald to, you know, Tyron Woodley.

01:07:18.000 I've spent some time with GSP from Vitor Belfort.

01:07:22.000 I've gotten invitations from, like, Gordon Ryan and, you know, Johnny Torres and all these guys.

01:07:27.000 Oh, some jiu-jitsu guys as well.

01:07:28.000 Yeah, some jiu-jitsu guys as well.

01:07:30.000 And I'm just always wrestling.

01:07:32.000 You know, wrestling takes up so much of my time, and I've got little ones at home, so it's really hard to do, but...

01:07:36.000 When I transition out of the sport, which I'm kind of in that phase now, I've got one more Olympic cycle in me.

01:07:42.000 And then moving on to, I'd really like to help fighters because I feel like, although I don't strike, and I don't really, I'm not familiar with my striking, it's something I'll pick up later just so I can know kind of how to incorporate your striking into your wrestling offense and defense.

01:07:58.000 But I think I can be a really good asset for a lot of fighters is to try to help them make that transition.

01:08:03.000 Oh, for sure.

01:08:04.000 I mean, they would jump at the chance.

01:08:06.000 Yeah, it'd be fun, bro.

01:08:07.000 It'd be fun.

01:08:08.000 Plus, it's my wheelhouse.

01:08:09.000 So it'll be cool to kind of rough them up a little bit there.

01:08:14.000 So 2021 is Japan.

01:08:17.000 That's your next cycle.

01:08:20.000 And so that is August?

01:08:23.000 August, yeah.

01:08:23.000 So I still got to make the team.

01:08:24.000 I still got to make the team.

01:08:26.000 So basically, our Olympic trials are in April.

01:08:29.000 I was a world medalist in 2019. They'll have a tournament for like 10 competitors.

01:08:34.000 They'll wrestle.

01:08:35.000 Whoever wins out of those 10 will wrestle me in the finals best two out of three.

01:08:39.000 So I've got to wrestle one guy, beat him best two out of three to make the Olympic team at 163 pounds.

01:08:45.000 So it's a big task.

01:08:47.000 It's a big task.

01:08:48.000 It's fun.

01:08:49.000 I'm excited.

01:08:49.000 2021 in Japan is going to be very fascinating.

01:08:52.000 It's going to be interesting to see if they have any kind of a...

01:08:54.000 They had a pretty good record with COVID for a while, but lately they've had a big surge.

01:08:59.000 It's wild, bro.

01:09:00.000 I think...

01:09:01.000 I don't know if there's going to be fans.

01:09:04.000 And if there aren't fans, then it kind of eliminates what the games are all about.

01:09:08.000 There's a certain spirit in the village and...

01:09:12.000 On the buses and the railways and the train stations, people bustling in and out of the Olympic Stadium that just makes it special.

01:09:20.000 You've got your flag draped over your shoulders and your country scarf.

01:09:23.000 It's a pretty cool experience when you're at the Olympic Games.

01:09:27.000 That's what I love about it, man.

01:09:28.000 Where else can so many countries come together despite the political turmoil and whatever may be happening within your own country?

01:09:36.000 When you get together at the Olympic Games, it transcends everything.

01:09:40.000 Yeah.

01:09:41.000 Politics, race, gender, religion.

01:09:43.000 It's nothing like it in the world, man.

01:09:46.000 It's epic.

01:09:47.000 There was a picture I had back in 2012 where In the gold medal match, I beat a guy named Sadia Ghadarzi from the Islamic Republic of Iran.

01:09:56.000 And I've got my arm around him on the top of the podium and on the back of our warm-ups said United States of America and Islamic Republic of Iran.

01:10:04.000 So we're like arm in arm.

01:10:06.000 And it was just like a super special photo because our governments hate each other.

01:10:10.000 And I've been to Iran on multiple occasions.

01:10:13.000 And they love us.

01:10:14.000 Like literally rock star status when we're in Iran.

01:10:18.000 They're following us at the airport.

01:10:20.000 They're waiting for us outside of the arena.

01:10:21.000 They're trying to give you kisses, like hugs.

01:10:24.000 Here's the picture.

01:10:25.000 Epic.

01:10:26.000 Like, epic photo, bro.

01:10:27.000 Because what you see that's personified in the media and what you experience when your boots are on the ground in a particular country like Iran is much different than the perception.

01:10:40.000 And so the Iranian people, man, they're the best wrestling fans in the world outside of Iran, right?

01:10:44.000 I'm partial because I'm an American, but...

01:10:46.000 Best wrestling fans in the world.

01:10:48.000 Super knowledgeable.

01:10:49.000 Love the sport.

01:10:50.000 They want the heroes to win.

01:10:51.000 In America, we build up our heroes just so we can see if they can get knocked off.

01:10:54.000 In Iran, they always want the hero to win. 0.70

01:10:57.000 Everybody.

01:10:59.000 They wait for us at the airport, Joe.

01:11:01.000 So when we land on the tarmac, we walk out to the airport, they've got media there, they've got wrestling fans, they're giving us flowers, and they are coming to our hotel room.

01:11:10.000 We've got armed guards on the floor of our hotel just to make sure nobody gets to our floor because they are waiting for us in the lobby just to take photos.

01:11:20.000 It's absolute insanity.

01:11:23.000 Are they the most rabid fans?

01:11:25.000 In terms of like...

01:11:26.000 The most.

01:11:26.000 There's no question about it.

01:11:27.000 They've got chant leaders that come with bells and whistles and drums and like...

01:11:34.000 They got their wisp, bro.

01:11:39.000 And you know what's even crazier, Joe?

01:11:41.000 Is because of their strict Islamic religion, they don't allow women into the arenas. 1.00

01:11:47.000 So if you look in this picture, this is a sold out stadium.

01:11:50.000 8,500 men.

01:11:51.000 Men and boys only.

01:11:53.000 No women. 1.00

01:11:54.000 Wow.

01:12:00.000 Wow.

01:12:13.000 That's got to be a trip.

01:12:15.000 I mean, one of the things about your career that's probably one of the most educational parts of it is this travel aspect.

01:12:24.000 Yeah.

01:12:24.000 I mean, how many different countries have you been to?

01:12:26.000 I've been to, I believe, last time I counted was 22. Wow.

01:12:30.000 22. That's wild.

01:12:32.000 You've wrestled at 22 different countries.

01:12:34.000 22 different countries.

01:12:35.000 And so I didn't get my passport until I was 20. So, crazy.

01:12:41.000 You have kids?

01:12:41.000 Yeah.

01:12:42.000 How many?

01:12:42.000 Three.

01:12:43.000 Very nice.

01:12:44.000 How old?

01:12:45.000 24, 12, and 10. How old are you?

01:12:48.000 53. Get the hell out of here. 0.92

01:12:51.000 I never would expect that.

01:12:52.000 You look young.

01:12:54.000 Thank you very much.

01:12:54.000 You look young.

01:12:55.000 You look good, man.

01:12:56.000 Thank you.

01:12:56.000 Appreciate it.

01:12:57.000 So, I've got three little ones.

01:12:59.000 My oldest is a little boy named Beacon.

01:13:01.000 He's six.

01:13:02.000 My middle child, Aura, is a girl.

01:13:04.000 And then our baby, Rise.

01:13:05.000 She just turned one yesterday, actually.

01:13:07.000 Congratulations.

01:13:07.000 Thanks, man.

01:13:08.000 And so...

01:13:10.000 Yeah.

01:13:28.000 My kids have all had passports before their first birthdays.

01:13:31.000 My son, we counted before he was one, he was on 42 flights.

01:13:35.000 42 flights before his first birthday.

01:13:37.000 That's crazy.

01:13:38.000 Traveled the world.

01:13:38.000 They've been to Rio.

01:13:39.000 They've been to, you know, Canada.

01:13:41.000 They've been to the World Championships, to the Olympic Games.

01:13:44.000 They've been to Pan Am Games.

01:13:46.000 Like, everything.

01:13:47.000 All over the world.

01:13:48.000 So, it's wild to me to kind of experience that because I'm like, man, I never had this.

01:13:55.000 I grew up in a small town in South Jersey.

01:13:58.000 So whenever people are like, man, how do you maintain this certain level of sustainability and excellence over a long time?

01:14:05.000 I was like, because I never expected it.

01:14:07.000 So when I arrived here, I wanted to cling to it to see how long I could maintain it.

01:14:12.000 Because I never grew up desiring to be an Olympian.

01:14:14.000 I hear a lot of Olympians like, man, I watch...

01:14:16.000 The summer games in Atlanta in 1996 on my grandma's couch.

01:14:20.000 And I knew from that day forward that I wanted to win an Olympic gold medal.

01:14:23.000 And I'm like, bro, that wasn't my story.

01:14:25.000 I didn't know I could make the Olympic team until I was damn near on the team.

01:14:28.000 And I was like, man, I'm pretty good.

01:14:30.000 I'm going to wrestle at the Olympic trials.

01:14:33.000 I'm going to see if I can do this.

01:14:34.000 And so my kids have kind of had the direct benefit of all of the work that I've put in through this sport.

01:14:41.000 And so it's been a tremendous blessing for me to kind of just see it rub off on them.

01:14:45.000 My oldest beacon, my middle aura, they just started wrestling three weeks ago.

01:14:50.000 And so I'm trying not to be the crazy dad, the crazy wrestling dad.

01:14:54.000 It's gotta be hard.

01:14:54.000 I'm sending them to their training facility and they've got great coaches.

01:14:59.000 But when they're on the mat, there's 14 other kids there.

01:15:02.000 So coaches are focused on everyone in the room.

01:15:05.000 They can't show special attention to my kids just because I am who I am.

01:15:08.000 And so I'm trying not to be the dad.

01:15:10.000 I want to get on the mat.

01:15:11.000 I'm like, bro, B, you're not doing that right, dude.

01:15:14.000 Your head needs to go here.

01:15:15.000 Your hands need to be locked here.

01:15:16.000 But then I need to kind of back off.

01:15:19.000 Like, you know what?

01:15:20.000 If he's going to love it, he's got to love it on his own.

01:15:23.000 Yeah, that's a tricky bouncing act, right?

01:15:25.000 You don't want to push him too hard because then you might push him away from the sport or make him resent it.

01:15:29.000 Because when you grow up and your dad is Jordan Pearls and you're wrestling.

01:15:34.000 There's a lot of pressure.

01:15:34.000 Yes!

01:15:35.000 I mean, I remember when Marvis Frazier fought Mike Tyson and Joe Frazier was in the corner and I'm like, imagine growing up with Joe Frazier as your dad and you gotta become a boxer too.

01:15:45.000 And you gotta fight Mike Tyson.

01:15:47.000 You gotta fight Mike Tyson when he was on his way to the title.

01:15:52.000 He didn't want that fight.

01:15:54.000 It was a terrible fight.

01:15:55.000 Did you ever see that fight?

01:15:56.000 I did.

01:15:56.000 It was one of the most frightening Mike Tyson performances of all time and that's saying a lot.

01:16:00.000 You know what?

01:16:01.000 I think...

01:16:03.000 There's two ways I look at it.

01:16:05.000 There's a guy that I know.

01:16:08.000 His name is Ilias Diakamahalis.

01:16:11.000 And he told me...

01:16:11.000 His sons are great wrestlers.

01:16:13.000 They wrestle at Cornell.

01:16:14.000 And he's like...

01:16:16.000 My boys wanted to wrestle.

01:16:17.000 I wrestled.

01:16:18.000 And I wanted to teach them what I knew best.

01:16:22.000 Imagine you being the best in the world at something and you letting your kids escape your home at 18 without you ever telling them or teaching them about what you were the best in the world at.

01:16:33.000 That would be a travesty.

01:16:34.000 You let your kids escape your home without teaching them something that you were the absolute best in the world at.

01:16:40.000 So you don't have to push them or pressure them to do something.

01:16:43.000 You allow the love to grow on their own.

01:16:45.000 But if there's something that you are particularly great at, you have to give that knowledge and that information to the world.

01:16:53.000 And so you become a man of the people, a man of your family.

01:16:56.000 You're the best in the world at the sport of wrestling.

01:16:59.000 Give that to them.

01:17:00.000 Then let the decision be their own to decide if they want to take it further and, you know, I don't know, wrestle the Olympics.

01:17:08.000 It's so hard, man.

01:17:09.000 Everyone's like, oh, your son, next Olympic champ.

01:17:11.000 I'm like, yo, bro, chill.

01:17:14.000 Because then I feel the pressure.

01:17:15.000 Because I'm like, not only is my boy, everywhere he goes is like, damn, you're wrestling now?

01:17:19.000 You better be good.

01:17:21.000 And he's feeling the pressure.

01:17:22.000 And then I'm feeling pressure.

01:17:23.000 It's like, oh, your son's wrestling now?

01:17:25.000 Damn, I can't wait to see how great he's going to be.

01:17:27.000 Because now I'm like, well, there's an expectation.

01:17:30.000 Like, let's go.

01:17:31.000 Six years old, push-ups.

01:17:33.000 No dinner until you do five rope climbs.

01:17:35.000 You know what I mean?

01:17:36.000 So it's like you have to always manage expectations, particularly with kids, because you want them to be so much, but also you have to prepare for normalcy.

01:17:46.000 The hardest thing, you have resources, Joe.

01:17:48.000 Like, you've done so much.

01:17:50.000 You've been successful at your craft.

01:17:52.000 You've got so much exposure, so many more resources than I imagine you had growing up.

01:17:57.000 How do you not allow that to trickle down to your kids to give them more opportunity but also accompany that with expectations?

01:18:03.000 Like, look what I've become with nothing.

01:18:06.000 So now look what you have the access to.

01:18:09.000 Sky's the limit.

01:18:10.000 How do you balance that?

01:18:12.000 It's very tricky.

01:18:12.000 And it's also tricky because the most interesting people that I know have come from nothing.

01:18:17.000 They've all come from struggle because I think struggle builds character.

01:18:21.000 Having to overcome adversity is one of the cornerstones of becoming like a An actualized person.

01:18:28.000 You have to get through something to realize what you're capable of and it gives you confidence to be able to get through other things.

01:18:35.000 And when your life is kind of easy, but you don't want your kids to go through hardship either.

01:18:39.000 So it's like this weird bouncing act.

01:18:41.000 But you can if you facilitate it.

01:18:44.000 But how do you do that?

01:18:46.000 It's hard.

01:18:47.000 Because you want it easy too.

01:18:51.000 I'm thinking about this from my perspective as a kid.

01:18:54.000 The hardest moments that I had were associated with sport.

01:18:58.000 It was very rare that I had a difficult time in my life from 1 to 18 that wasn't because I had to train hard or had to wrestle hard or I cried because I got beat or choked out or slammed on my head.

01:19:11.000 It wasn't hard.

01:19:12.000 I didn't grow up on a farm.

01:19:14.000 I grew up in a middle class family in South Jersey in a suburban town.

01:19:17.000 So my lifestyle was different and my parents both Yeah.

01:19:26.000 Yeah.

01:19:28.000 Yeah.

01:19:36.000 You know, there was a certain amount of grit that I had to develop just because of the contents of where we were.

01:19:41.000 Like, it was suburban, but it was still kind of edgy.

01:19:45.000 But now I want to, I kind of want to chill a little bit too, right?

01:19:48.000 I'm like, I've done well.

01:19:50.000 Like, I want to send my kids to the best school.

01:19:51.000 I think, though, you will lead by example.

01:19:54.000 Because one of the things that your kids will undeniably understand is how hard you work to get to where you are.

01:19:59.000 And that rubs off on your children.

01:20:01.000 There's one thing where you teach them things, you know, you show them, you tell them, and you give them advice and talk to them.

01:20:08.000 But another thing is they learn just from seeing what you do.

01:20:13.000 When you have a dad who does what you do, which, to be an elite wrestler, maybe people don't understand this, it is one of the most physically demanding pursuits in the world.

01:20:24.000 Period.

01:20:25.000 It's a fact.

01:20:26.000 In terms of athletics, there's very few things that are as difficult and as grueling as wrestling.

01:20:33.000 And to be elite at it, I mean, it's not like it's an insurmountable sport.

01:20:40.000 It's not like something that takes a ton of equipment.

01:20:43.000 It's not like Formula One race car driving when you need a million dollars to get a car.

01:20:48.000 No, it's something that just requires a mindset.

01:20:50.000 And also, what you were saying before, there's no real money in it.

01:20:53.000 So it's not like it's something like basketball where there's this gigantic pot of gold waiting at the end of the rainbow.

01:20:59.000 No, it's just toughness and grit.

01:21:02.000 And your kids are going to understand that.

01:21:04.000 There's no way they're not going to.

01:21:06.000 They will understand that there's a level of discipline and focus that you have that maybe they're going to see their friends' parents don't have.

01:21:15.000 So let me ask you this then.

01:21:17.000 It's easy for them to see what I do because it's tangible, right?

01:21:21.000 It's visible.

01:21:22.000 You see that lift weights, wrestle, cut weight.

01:21:25.000 How in a guy like your position, someone extremely successful, But there's no physical grueling activity that's associated with it.

01:21:34.000 So they may not be able to visibly see what it is that you are thinking about aspiring to be what you're doing, right?

01:21:41.000 They're long hours away from home, maybe long hours at night and in the morning.

01:21:44.000 But how do they see what you do and how are they able to associate that with how they need to live?

01:21:51.000 What are the ways that you've been able to teach your kids?

01:21:54.000 Well, they do see me work out, which helps too.

01:21:57.000 Because I don't have to.

01:21:59.000 It's not like I'm doing it for a job, but I do it just...

01:22:02.000 You see you're eating only steak.

01:22:05.000 They're like, let's go.

01:22:06.000 This is the life I want, Dad.

01:22:07.000 I want steak and lobster every night, carnivore diet.

01:22:11.000 But I think, I say this, and I live this, that I think you need to struggle physically in life because it makes life easier.

01:22:20.000 Because I think there's a lot of struggles that people go through psychologically, mentally, with work, with just relationships, with civilization.

01:22:28.000 I think when you struggle physically, I mean like really struggle physically, I think it makes those things easier.

01:22:35.000 Because you're putting yourself through something you don't really have to do.

01:22:39.000 It's not part of your job.

01:22:41.000 But if you put yourself through grueling workout routines, I think it makes things easier.

01:22:45.000 And my kids see that.

01:22:47.000 Because we have a gym in the house.

01:22:48.000 They see me work out.

01:22:49.000 Do they work out?

01:22:49.000 Yeah, they work out.

01:22:50.000 And one of my daughters is really into gymnastics and the other one is really into basketball.

01:22:54.000 But...

01:22:55.000 When they were young, they also were into martial arts.

01:22:57.000 And, you know, I would take them to, when they were younger, they're so young, but I would take them to martial arts gym, and I would even demonstrate some things with the teacher and do some stuff.

01:23:07.000 And, you know, they got into jiu-jitsu, they got into a little bit of kickboxing.

01:23:11.000 So they got to see that I'm very, I do a lot of shit, you know, and so, and I've reached a high level of proficiency at those things that I do.

01:23:19.000 And so they get to see that.

01:23:20.000 That's good.

01:23:21.000 It's not even a part of my job, necessarily, other than, like, calling MMA fights.

01:23:25.000 But they get to see, oh, well, you could be lazy.

01:23:28.000 You could just sit back and just count your money and just eat food all day, but I don't.

01:23:32.000 Eat steaks.

01:23:32.000 I get after it.

01:23:33.000 You know what's funny is my kids don't even realize that what I do is what makes a living for us.

01:23:40.000 They're just like, oh, yeah, Dad wrestles.

01:23:41.000 Because, like, for them, they wrestle.

01:23:43.000 Right.

01:23:43.000 So, like, what's the difference between what you do and what I do?

01:23:46.000 Like, I go to practice and get coached.

01:23:47.000 You go to practice and get coached.

01:23:49.000 So where do they think the money's coming from?

01:23:50.000 It just exists, bro.

01:23:54.000 We just have a roof over our head and a cabinet full of snacks.

01:23:58.000 I'm a happy man.

01:23:59.000 Do you get paid to win tournaments?

01:24:02.000 We do, yeah.

01:24:03.000 Here's the bulk of a wrestler's income or Olympian's income.

01:24:07.000 One for us is we built what we call RTCs, Regional Training Centers, that are in conjunction with collegiate programs.

01:24:12.000 We get paid pretty much to train there because they use our name and likeness to kind of elevate their programs to help with recruiting, but also we're in the room with their guys daily, so we kind of teach the college guys.

01:24:24.000 We're sharpening them, helping them develop.

01:24:28.000 So that's number one.

01:24:29.000 Number two, sponsors.

01:24:31.000 So primary sponsors.

01:24:32.000 I'm sponsored by Asics, Ralph Lauren, Bridgestone, Comcast, and Xfinity.

01:24:37.000 So you have corporate sponsors that align with you during Olympic years, non-Olympic years to provide you with product.

01:24:44.000 They'll pay you to create digital marketing campaigns and really just align with what it is that you're doing.

01:24:49.000 If your brand kind of fits their spectrum of what they're trying to create.

01:24:54.000 And then lastly, that is if you win.

01:24:56.000 They have what they call the Living the Dream Fund.

01:24:58.000 So you get money for World Championship medals, Olympic medals, going to like all these tournaments.

01:25:04.000 And then what we're doing Saturday night.

01:25:06.000 So if you go to these cards for like Flow Wrestling, it's pretty much like the UFC. Like you have deals where it's like, okay, this guy is this level of opponent.

01:25:15.000 It's going to be watched by these many viewers.

01:25:17.000 You're going to get this number of subscribers.

01:25:18.000 Here's what we feel like we can pay you.

01:25:21.000 So yeah, I mean there are numerous ways that you can get paid, but it's definitely changed.

01:25:25.000 I was talking to Daniel the other day.

01:25:26.000 He said that when he was with Adidas, when he was an Olympian back in 2004 and 2008, he was getting $12,000 a year.

01:25:35.000 $12,000 a year.

01:25:37.000 $1,000 a month he was getting to wrestle.

01:25:40.000 And he was like, I just had to retire from the UFC because my back was just killing me.

01:25:44.000 Had to have back surgery.

01:25:45.000 He was like, you know why my back hurts?

01:25:47.000 From wrestling for 25 years shooting at all guys legs and being stuck underneath of them.

01:25:52.000 And I was like, damn.

01:25:54.000 And he's like, man, there's so much money in UFC. He's had two lives.

01:25:58.000 Literally two lives.

01:25:59.000 Two careers.

01:26:00.000 And he's become amazing at this and he always had this character and personality but You just were unable to utilize it financially.

01:26:10.000 You could monetize that in wrestling.

01:26:11.000 It just didn't work.

01:26:12.000 So we're in the precipice of doing something extremely cool.

01:26:16.000 Wrestlers are now actually earning a living by doing this.

01:26:19.000 You don't have to transition to MMA. And that's why I think that a lot of guys have stayed in the wrestling sport.

01:26:25.000 We have some really great athletes.

01:26:27.000 Myself, Kyle Snyder, Kyle Dake, David Taylor, Jaden Cox, James Green.

01:26:32.000 All these amazing athletes.

01:26:34.000 I think we'll be great fighters, but wrestling now, you can earn a living.

01:26:39.000 And it's not a lot, but it's decent.

01:26:42.000 Daniel's such an unusual human being, because not only does he have two careers, like he had the wrestling career, then an MMA career, but he also has a commentator career, because he's so fun.

01:26:51.000 He's great!

01:26:52.000 He's fun, man.

01:26:54.000 He's fun.

01:26:55.000 He's the best.

01:26:55.000 He's so fun to do it with.

01:26:57.000 Me and him, and John Anik, we have so much fun together.

01:27:00.000 Yeah, when I called him the other day, and...

01:27:03.000 You know, Daniel's the man, right?

01:27:05.000 He's done so well in his UFC career, and although he knew me within wrestling, now that he's made this transition, you kind of, you're weary.

01:27:12.000 Like, you don't just cold call people and, like, have expectations for what it is that they can provide for you, but I'm like, bro, like...

01:27:19.000 I would like to call you.

01:27:21.000 Like, is this okay?

01:27:21.000 My wife's just like, call him, call him.

01:27:23.000 Like, he'll answer your call.

01:27:25.000 And I'm like, I'm not just calling this man.

01:27:26.000 This man's a big deal.

01:27:28.000 And so she's like, just call him.

01:27:29.000 So I text him and he's like, yeah, just call me tomorrow.

01:27:31.000 So I call him and like, I thought it was just going to be like a quick, really short conversation.

01:27:35.000 And he's like, we're on the phone for like 30, 45 minutes.

01:27:38.000 Just kind of shooting the breeze and chopping it up.

01:27:40.000 And I'm just like, damn.

01:27:41.000 Like, I felt like a lot of joy after that call because...

01:27:45.000 We're good to go.

01:28:13.000 The people want so much of you because they're essentially who pays your bills.

01:28:16.000 Not technically, but they watch your show and elevate your ratings.

01:28:20.000 They buy my wrestling shoes and watch my wrestling matches.

01:28:23.000 It's just a different vibe.

01:28:25.000 I always try to feel a certain level of obligation and responsibility to the people while still maintaining a certain level of privacy.

01:28:33.000 For myself and my family, but it can be hard.

01:28:36.000 So sometimes you're like, yo, Joe, what's up, bro?

01:28:38.000 Let me get a picture.

01:28:39.000 I love you.

01:28:40.000 You're a big fan.

01:28:41.000 The problem is when I'm with my family.

01:28:43.000 Or when you're eating.

01:28:46.000 Here, give your kids, excuse me, kids. 0.98

01:28:48.000 I need to take a picture with your dad.

01:28:50.000 I have people hand their phones to my wife. 1.00

01:28:53.000 My daughter was sitting on my lap and we were at a restaurant and this guy came over and he was trying to get a picture.

01:28:59.000 Yeah.

01:28:59.000 He's on his knees right here while my daughter's on my lap.

01:29:04.000 I'm like, you don't think this is kind of fucked up?

01:29:07.000 What was his response?

01:29:08.000 He goes, yeah, it is.

01:29:09.000 I go, this is not the way to do this, man.

01:29:11.000 We're all sitting here eating.

01:29:12.000 How do you balance that, though?

01:29:15.000 It's hard.

01:29:16.000 It's tricky.

01:29:17.000 Sometimes you have to take a certain level of privacy for yourself.

01:29:20.000 Yeah, for sure.

01:29:21.000 You've got to just say, I cannot.

01:29:23.000 Not right now.

01:29:24.000 Yeah.

01:29:25.000 I usually say when I'm done eating, when I get up, I say I'll be happy to take a picture with you.

01:29:29.000 Hang tight.

01:29:30.000 If you let everybody interrupt your meal, then you can't go out.

01:29:34.000 Now I can't go out because then you can't sit down and just eat.

01:29:36.000 Do you just go out and about like in the city?

01:29:39.000 Yeah, I go out.

01:29:40.000 I always have got out.

01:29:40.000 Is it a daily occurrence where you're like, yo, Joe!

01:29:43.000 Yeah.

01:29:45.000 Everybody's friendly.

01:29:46.000 It's mostly just a bunch of people saying hi.

01:29:48.000 That's mostly what it is.

01:29:49.000 It's mostly like, what's up?

01:29:51.000 Hey, what's up?

01:29:52.000 I say hi too.

01:29:52.000 It's all good.

01:29:53.000 It's 99.99999% good.

01:29:57.000 And every now and then you run into a drunk.

01:30:00.000 Sometimes that's a pain in the ass.

01:30:02.000 But even there, they're usually pretty good.

01:30:04.000 Sometimes people just don't understand privacy.

01:30:08.000 They don't understand personal space.

01:30:10.000 They just get weird.

01:30:12.000 Also, if someone's a gigantic wrestling fan and they meet you, they're probably bugged out.

01:30:18.000 They don't understand how to behave.

01:30:19.000 They're all nervous and weirded out.

01:30:21.000 The intangibles of being really good at what you do.

01:30:23.000 Especially if you're aspiring to be a great wrestler as well.

01:30:28.000 And you have these guys all in your head, and you watch matches on YouTube, and you idolize these certain wrestlers, and then all of a sudden you're in front of one of them, and you didn't expect it.

01:30:37.000 I mean, you might just babble out something stupid.

01:30:39.000 One day I'm gonna pin you, man!

01:30:40.000 Like, shit, what the fuck did I say?

01:30:43.000 I told Jordan Burrow I was gonna pin him!

01:30:44.000 Fuck!

01:30:44.000 I didn't mean that, I just really wanted a picture, bro.

01:30:46.000 Yeah, they just, sometimes people just get nervous.

01:30:50.000 They don't know how to behave.

01:30:51.000 They don't know what to say.

01:30:53.000 And they make you uncomfortable even though they don't want to.

01:30:55.000 They invade your space when they just want to show admiration.

01:30:58.000 That's a good perspective.

01:30:59.000 You've got to kind of exhibit a certain amount of grace when dealing with the public, especially in your position.

01:31:05.000 But I imagine that some days it's a little tough.

01:31:08.000 It's just, most of the time, it's easy.

01:31:12.000 The vast majority of the time.

01:31:14.000 But occasionally, you'll have a bite of food in your mouth, and someone's like, hey man, can I get a picture?

01:31:19.000 And you're like, come on, dude.

01:31:21.000 That's a blessing, though, that you have that perspective, because there are a lot of people who don't, and by the time that they realize it, it's too late, and they've already burned so many bridges and had so many bad encounters with the people, that it's just not good for...

01:31:36.000 It's not good for PR. It's not good for how people look at you.

01:31:39.000 It's not good for you either.

01:31:41.000 It's not good for how you feel about yourself.

01:31:43.000 If I have a bad encounter with somebody, I don't feel good about it.

01:31:46.000 It makes me feel bad too.

01:31:48.000 I want all encounters with all humans that I encounter to be fun.

01:31:53.000 I'm a fun person.

01:31:54.000 I'm friendly.

01:31:55.000 I like to be friendly to everybody.

01:31:56.000 That's what I want.

01:31:57.000 And making people feel good is a cool experience.

01:32:00.000 It is.

01:32:02.000 It means the world.

01:32:04.000 For you, it's just like, hey, what's up, bro?

01:32:06.000 Good to meet you, man.

01:32:07.000 Let me take a photo with you.

01:32:08.000 Tell your friend I said what's up.

01:32:10.000 And they're like, oh my gosh, you'll never believe what happened to me today.

01:32:14.000 And for you, you're like, oh yeah, saw a guy at Chipotle.

01:32:17.000 He was good.

01:32:18.000 Yeah, there's a responsibility, and I'm sure you experience that as well, right?

01:32:21.000 There's a responsibility of being someone that people look up to.

01:32:25.000 You're not just a regular person.

01:32:27.000 You're a person that a lot of people are aware of, and they're following what your career is.

01:32:31.000 They're following what you do.

01:32:32.000 They follow you at the Olympics.

01:32:33.000 They follow you at the World Championships.

01:32:35.000 They pay attention online when they're not watching it.

01:32:37.000 They're trying to figure out how you're doing what you're doing, and they want to emulate you.

01:32:41.000 That's why I'm asking about your training routines and what you're eating and things like that.

01:32:45.000 Because I'm sure people are listening like, how often does he train?

01:32:47.000 How does he approach his mornings?

01:32:49.000 Like, what does he eat first?

01:32:50.000 That's good.

01:32:51.000 Yeah, I mean, that's how they look at it.

01:32:52.000 That's funny.

01:32:53.000 That's one of the things that I kind of want to discuss.

01:32:55.000 I hope I'm not taking too much of your time.

01:32:57.000 No, man.

01:32:57.000 Come on, it's what I do.

01:32:58.000 It's mindset.

01:33:00.000 Yeah.

01:33:00.000 It's mindset.

01:33:03.000 Now I've transitioned to follow sustainable success.

01:33:07.000 Like guys who have been able to do it for a really long time.

01:33:10.000 Tom Brady, LeBron James, Rafael Nadal, Roger Federer, Serena Williams, you know, I don't know, Sue Bird.

01:33:18.000 Like so many athletes that...

01:33:20.000 It's easy to do it early on in your career, hard to do it over a long period of time, especially with all of the distractions.

01:33:27.000 You get bread, you get fame, you get this recognition, you start winning championships, easy to become complacent.

01:33:34.000 How do you maintain a certain level of success for a long period of time?

01:33:39.000 That's something like people ask me that daily.

01:33:42.000 Particularly because I'm in this fatherhood element, too.

01:33:46.000 So this adds an extra layer of depth.

01:33:49.000 Because in wrestling, I'm considered the old guy.

01:33:51.000 I'm the oldest guy on the team now.

01:33:53.000 No one else has three kids.

01:33:55.000 So it's a very different avenue and lane that I'm within.

01:34:00.000 So I'm trying to balance these things all together.

01:34:03.000 But I really have now transitioned from this young, upstart, Trying to be this hotshot guy, get my name out, to now I'm like this old wise yogi where I'm like, hey, listen, you can be successful at multiple things, my friend.

01:34:16.000 And so it's been a really cool transition for me is going from this place where, you know, you're young, you're just trying to get your name out to now you're balancing multiple principles and parts of your life where it's like, okay, can I be a great husband, great father and be driven?

01:34:34.000 You know what I think you could do too?

01:34:35.000 What's that?

01:34:35.000 Corporate speaking.

01:34:37.000 I appreciate that.

01:34:37.000 I think you'd be fantastic at that.

01:34:39.000 Yeah, I've dabbled in it a little bit.

01:34:40.000 You know what?

01:34:41.000 My wife's going to kill me for saying this, but we're considering a fourth.

01:34:45.000 Uh-oh.

01:34:45.000 So we're in that position now where we're like...

01:34:49.000 Do we attempt to have a fourth?

01:34:52.000 Blessings, beautiful, bring joy to us every day we see them, except when it's bedtime.

01:34:58.000 No one's thirstier or hungrier than a toddler at bedtime.

01:35:02.000 I'm hungry.

01:35:03.000 I'm thirsty.

01:35:03.000 I gotta go to the bathroom.

01:35:05.000 I want to give you a hug.

01:35:06.000 But we're in that realm now where we're like, do we have another?

01:35:09.000 Can we balance this?

01:35:10.000 Can we maintain it?

01:35:11.000 And can I still do what I do at a high level?

01:35:13.000 There's a certain responsibility I feel to my family where They need me.

01:35:18.000 And I want to have a really special relationship with all of them.

01:35:22.000 And I want to be integral in each of their development.

01:35:24.000 But can I do that with an additional slice of the pie, a fourth child, and also still being ambitious?

01:35:31.000 And that's a tough balance.

01:35:33.000 And so we're trying to figure that out.

01:35:34.000 It's like, is the joy weighed against kind of the lifestyle that we have now?

01:35:40.000 Can we maintain this certain level that we've become comfortable with?

01:35:44.000 And it's good.

01:35:45.000 So, you know, I'm always trying to figure those things out on the fly.

01:35:49.000 And so kind of watching you and hearing that you have three kids and you're still moving and shaking and from LA to Austin to, you know, doing the UFC and flying all over the world.

01:35:59.000 It's a really interesting perspective.

01:36:01.000 How do you manage the things that you have on your plate in regards to being successful in so many different realms and still also having healthy relationships?

01:36:12.000 Well, I've been really, really lucky.

01:36:15.000 First of all, everything I do, I like doing.

01:36:18.000 It's easy.

01:36:19.000 Married?

01:36:19.000 Yeah.

01:36:20.000 How long?

01:36:21.000 10, 11 years now?

01:36:22.000 Very nice.

01:36:23.000 But it's easy.

01:36:24.000 Like, it's easy.

01:36:25.000 Doing this is easy.

01:36:27.000 Yeah.

01:36:27.000 Doing stand-up, it's not easy.

01:36:29.000 It requires work, but it's enjoyable.

01:36:31.000 I love it.

01:36:32.000 I love doing it.

01:36:33.000 I love doing UFC commentary.

01:36:34.000 I wouldn't say it's easy, but it's enjoyable.

01:36:38.000 Easy is the wrong word.

01:36:39.000 Even podcasting, it requires focus and thought and preparation.

01:36:43.000 Not everybody can do it.

01:36:44.000 A lot of people could do it if they put the effort into it, but it's just a matter of is it something that you enjoy doing and is it something you look forward to even after all?

01:36:53.000 I've been doing this podcast for 11 years now.

01:36:56.000 I still love doing it.

01:36:57.000 It's still fun.

01:36:58.000 It's fun.

01:36:58.000 I enjoy it.

01:36:59.000 So it makes it easy.

01:37:01.000 It makes it easier.

01:37:02.000 So in that regard, It's not something that's a labor to me.

01:37:07.000 All these things are not something that's a labor.

01:37:09.000 So I'm very fortunate in that regard.

01:37:11.000 But I think that's one of the keys to success is finding the thing that excites you always.

01:37:19.000 Finding a thing that's challenging always.

01:37:21.000 A thing that you really enjoy doing.

01:37:22.000 A thing that works for your personality.

01:37:24.000 Clearly you've got that with wrestling and I feel like with a guy like you what you have is like this this Incredible vehicle meaning your mind your focus your discipline and all what you've done with wrestling You could do with anything you just have to find a track.

01:37:41.000 That's good The thing is like some people don't find a track some people they get really good at fighting or whatever it is and they They become this bad motherfucker, but they that's their identity and And they can't figure out a way to focus that.

01:37:56.000 Like Miyamoto Musashi, he's a famous samurai, wrote this book, The Book of Five Rings.

01:38:00.000 It's a great book on strategy.

01:38:02.000 And he has this great quote that I remember.

01:38:04.000 I read this when I was a little kid, when I first got into martial arts.

01:38:08.000 It said, once you know the way broadly, you can see it in all things.

01:38:13.000 And I think that once you find excellence in something like you have in wrestling, you can be excellent in anything, especially wrestling, because it's so fucking hard to do.

01:38:24.000 Or there's a level of excellence that you have to have to kind of weed yourself out, right?

01:38:29.000 There's a certain level where you can be successful with just talent and hard work, whatever, but Then there gets to a place where you have to maintain a multifaceted balanced lifestyle.

01:38:39.000 Yes.

01:38:39.000 Discipline, mental endurance, freaking structure, and a great team.

01:38:44.000 Diet, focus.

01:38:46.000 Everything has to be on point.

01:38:47.000 And to be at your level, to be at a world championship level, there can be no holes in your game.

01:38:52.000 Yeah.

01:38:52.000 You don't have the luxury of slacking off.

01:38:55.000 Small margin of error.

01:38:57.000 Between victory and silver medal.

01:38:59.000 Or no metal.

01:39:00.000 No metal.

01:39:01.000 Yeah, I mean, these margins...

01:39:02.000 Between gold and going home with a towel over your head.

01:39:05.000 Yeah.

01:39:06.000 And that can translate into anything.

01:39:09.000 You can do that with any business that you start, anything that you pursue, whatever you want to do.

01:39:14.000 That's good.

01:39:15.000 Because, you know, one of the things for me that for a long time...

01:39:18.000 Made me nervous about the transition out of sport.

01:39:22.000 Most people at 30, 34 are settling into what they're going to do forever.

01:39:27.000 Or at least until retirement, long term.

01:39:30.000 So you spend your 20s having a good time after college.

01:39:32.000 You're making a little bit of money.

01:39:33.000 You move to a new city.

01:39:35.000 Meet new people.

01:39:35.000 You start to settle down.

01:39:37.000 You finally get that job.

01:39:38.000 You get that promotion.

01:39:38.000 And now you have this path that you're going to go through until you're 59 and a half.

01:39:43.000 But most athletes, you're phasing out.

01:39:47.000 Of what you've done for your entire life at the same time that most people are transitioning into what they're gonna do for the next 30 years.

01:39:54.000 So it's a very difficult proposition that we are experiencing where I've wrestled since I was six.

01:40:00.000 My first weight class was 45 pounds.

01:40:02.000 Now all of a sudden, here I am and my wrestling career is over.

01:40:05.000 I hang my shoes up and I'm like, what now?

01:40:08.000 You're in the prime of your life.

01:40:10.000 What now?

01:40:10.000 Because you have to find something that you're passionate about.

01:40:14.000 And my fear is that there may be nothing that I ever experienced that I'm as passionate about as I am the sport of wrestling.

01:40:20.000 I am a competitor naturally.

01:40:22.000 That's just by nature.

01:40:24.000 And I have to kind of broaden my horizons where I'm going to enter with this certain level of excellence into everything that I do.

01:40:32.000 Which I know if I enter something and I'm going to do it wholeheartedly, I'm going to be successful at it.

01:40:36.000 But the question is, do I really love it?

01:40:40.000 Right.

01:40:40.000 So you're trying to find what you love...

01:40:42.000 When most people have just found it.

01:40:44.000 So the athletic experience is much different than the average Joe experience.

01:40:49.000 And so I've seen so many athletes post-career spend all their money, get depressed, go into addicting substances.

01:40:57.000 And it's a very difficult place that you arrive in when you don't know who you are.

01:41:04.000 For so long, our identities have been tied to our success.

01:41:07.000 Everywhere I go, people call me champ.

01:41:09.000 Like, I'm not Jordan.

01:41:10.000 I'm not Burroughs.

01:41:11.000 I'm not JB. I'm champ.

01:41:13.000 And so...

01:41:14.000 When I go out of this phase and I'm no longer looked upon as this iconic wrestling guy who is going to beat the hell out of you every time I deem I need to and I'm just a normal human being, how do I make that transition and find what else it is that I am passionate about?

01:41:32.000 And so I think now, for a long time, I've been afraid to think of other things because people are like, no, no, no.

01:41:38.000 You'll have time.

01:41:39.000 Keep the main thing the main thing.

01:41:41.000 Just focus on winning.

01:41:41.000 The more you win, the more opportunities you'll have.

01:41:44.000 But then that's how you have the guy that won't retire, overstays his welcome, diminishes and tarnishes the legacy that he's built for himself because they just won't leave.

01:41:54.000 I don't think you have to worry about that.

01:41:55.000 I don't.

01:41:56.000 Fortunately.

01:41:57.000 But just listening to what you're saying right now, you've already laid out all the pitfalls.

01:42:01.000 I've got a great team.

01:42:02.000 I'm a man of faith.

01:42:04.000 I've got a great wife who keeps me level-headed.

01:42:07.000 But yeah, so I'm always thinking about these things as we're making this transition.

01:42:11.000 So I see athletes and I also see the ones who've done it for a long time.

01:42:14.000 But not only that, the ones who go on to success after their careers.

01:42:18.000 That's what I'm most impressed about.

01:42:20.000 How can you elevate your profile when no one's watching you shoot hoops anymore, fight, play?

01:42:26.000 Like Kobe and Magic Johnson and Michael Jordan, all these athletes that have parlayed Their success as athletes into corporate success elsewhere.

01:42:38.000 That's what I love to see.

01:42:40.000 That's dope. 0.93

01:42:40.000 Well, you just have to find the thing. 0.93

01:42:42.000 That's the difficult thing.

01:42:44.000 And you can't look too hard right now because right now you have to focus on wrestling and your family and all the other obligations that you have already.

01:42:51.000 But how do you find it?

01:42:53.000 It's hard.

01:42:53.000 You have to dabble simultaneously because you can't just wait until it's over.

01:42:59.000 Right.

01:43:01.000 And even if you have been successfully enough financially where you can buy yourself times.

01:43:07.000 Like, listen, I'm good.

01:43:07.000 I made a couple million bucks.

01:43:08.000 My house is paid for.

01:43:09.000 My cars are good.

01:43:10.000 Kids are in good schools.

01:43:12.000 I'm fine for five years.

01:43:14.000 And you'll find alternative ways to make money and still do what you love.

01:43:18.000 The one thing I don't want to do is do stuff for money or do things that I don't believe in.

01:43:25.000 I want to do things that are truly honorable and that I really find are noble pursuits.

01:43:31.000 This is what I want to do because I want to do it.

01:43:34.000 And so trying to find that thing, I've had to kind of dabble in these other...

01:43:40.000 Kind of perspectives because as wrestlers, like, you have this generalized idea of what a wrestler is, right?

01:43:46.000 It's like, okay, it's kind of like a meathead guy from the Midwest that grew up on a farm, right?

01:43:53.000 And freaking eats T-bone steaks, even he eats the bones too.

01:43:57.000 And so it's a...

01:43:59.000 Trying to kind of step outside of wrestling.

01:44:02.000 One of the things that I've always tried to do is transcend sport, or at least transcend wrestling.

01:44:06.000 It's how can I broaden our audience and bring it all back to wrestling so everyone wins?

01:44:11.000 We all elevate our profiles simultaneously.

01:44:13.000 It's a difficult thing to do, but it's almost been a responsibility that was early on just placed upon me because I was just winning.

01:44:20.000 And now, like, I've taken on the responsibility because I want to do it.

01:44:25.000 But now I'm like, okay, well, I have to also be the first guy to move on and have success outside of the wrestling forum that's not a coach.

01:44:36.000 If you look at the college landscape and college wrestling, the head coaches, most of them are Olympic champions.

01:44:42.000 Tom Brands, Cale Sanderson, John Smith, you know, you've got all these guys that wrestled at Iowa, wrestled at, you know, some of the best universities in the country and world.

01:44:52.000 Most head coaches were either Division I national champions or Olympic and world medalists.

01:44:56.000 It's just a natural progression.

01:44:58.000 You were a good wrestler, you go on and coach and take over university and build this program up.

01:45:03.000 But very few people want to kind of explore outside of the realm of just coaching itself.

01:45:11.000 And so I'm trying to get to a place where I feel comfortable with being countercultural and doing something different that's almost opposed to where I am as a wrestler because most Olympic champions just coach.

01:45:27.000 What kind of things are you considering?

01:45:29.000 That's a good question.

01:45:30.000 I told you about my high performance training center I'd like to dabble in.

01:45:35.000 That seems like it's right in your wheelhouse.

01:45:37.000 That's in my wheelhouse.

01:45:38.000 That's something I want to create.

01:45:39.000 This is the mothership for all things.

01:45:43.000 And it will be multi-faceted.

01:45:46.000 In capturing all areas of human identity from, you know, nutrition to spirituality to self-developing.

01:45:54.000 All these things because I want...

01:45:56.000 You have to create good men and women in order for them to be good athletes.

01:46:02.000 I think...

01:46:02.000 And we're still at the highest level.

01:46:04.000 You can find it sometimes.

01:46:05.000 But I feel like they're weeding themselves out.

01:46:07.000 The best athletes that have sustained success are...

01:46:10.000 Men and women of integrity, at least to some degree.

01:46:14.000 You might see some individuals that have a bad rap or are engaged in controversy regularly, but they eventually start to lose whatever zest it was that they had for their sport and they can't win for a long period of time.

01:46:29.000 But the best, they're not embroiled on controversy.

01:46:32.000 Look at LeBron and Tom Brady.

01:46:34.000 When have you ever seen them in the news for something crazy they did at home?

01:46:38.000 True.

01:46:50.000 I'm going to teach you how to be accountable.

01:46:53.000 I'm going to teach you how to be disciplined.

01:46:55.000 And then we're going to learn athletics, how to be great wrestlers afterward.

01:46:59.000 Because if I can create men and women of character and integrity, then essentially they'll become champions naturally because the people I respect most weren't the best athletes.

01:47:08.000 I've wrestled with hundreds of wrestlers in my lifetime, and the ones that had the best leadership qualities weren't the ones that were the best wrestlers.

01:47:16.000 It was the ones that were low maintenance, that did the right things, came to practice on time, they were good teammates, they did well in school, they were good leaders, they were guys that you just trusted.

01:47:26.000 All these things you're saying to me, I feel like what I was saying earlier about you doing corporate speaking engagements, I think you would be really good at that.

01:47:34.000 Thanks.

01:47:35.000 Any corporations out there that are looking for somebody to come speak to your company.

01:47:37.000 Think about what you've accomplished.

01:47:39.000 Let's go.

01:47:39.000 And again, I don't want to belabor this, but to become a world champion wrestler, to win four world championships, to win an Olympic gold medal, you have a mindset that very few people will ever be able to understand without hearing it come out of your voice.

01:47:55.000 They don't...

01:47:55.000 We're good to go.

01:48:16.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:48:26.000 These are key components for success.

01:48:30.000 It's not just wrestling, right?

01:48:32.000 What you've achieved in wrestling is because of all these other things.

01:48:37.000 Because of the hard work, because of the discipline, because of the focus and the intelligence and all these other aspects of what makes you you.

01:48:43.000 But those things you could teach to people.

01:48:47.000 And you teach clearly by example because of your achievements, but also because of the way you're able to express yourself.

01:48:53.000 Yeah.

01:48:53.000 And for you to be able to do something like that, to have a training center, like you envisioned, it would be dope.

01:49:00.000 But also, I really think you could be very valuable speaking to corporations.

01:49:05.000 I appreciate that.

01:49:06.000 And all these things that we're talking about today, you could structure this in some sort of a plan where you get in front of these people and give them real tools that they can apply to their life that can improve them.

01:49:21.000 Yeah.

01:49:22.000 In everything they do.

01:49:23.000 That'd be fun, man.

01:49:24.000 I'd love it.

01:49:24.000 I think that's your thing, man.

01:49:25.000 I'd love it.

01:49:26.000 I really do.

01:49:27.000 You have to...

01:49:28.000 I've been taught for so long because I'm an athlete.

01:49:33.000 I've never worked.

01:49:34.000 I had one job when I was 19 years old.

01:49:37.000 Really?

01:49:38.000 Ever?

01:49:38.000 Your whole life?

01:49:39.000 One job.

01:49:41.000 For one summer, two months, I worked at a beer distribution factory back in South Jersey.

01:49:45.000 We'd go around on big trucks every day.

01:49:47.000 And we'd go to all the liquor stores and bars in the town.

01:49:50.000 And we would drop off kegs and spike them off the truck and bring them and set up displays inside liquor stores.

01:49:56.000 That was what I did for one summer.

01:49:58.000 And I made $13 an hour.

01:50:00.000 And so each week I'd make about $550.

01:50:03.000 And I remember at the time, I thought I was a rich man, bro.

01:50:05.000 I was like, let's go!

01:50:07.000 I would go to...

01:50:08.000 I'd take my girlfriend to the mall.

01:50:09.000 We'd go to Aeropostale.

01:50:11.000 At the time, that's what we were wearing, Abercrombie& Fitch.

01:50:14.000 And we would buy a bunch of clothes and we'd go to the movies and we'd hang out and I would spend all $500 in a single week living life.

01:50:21.000 And so I have to see myself as this person that can implement Different levels of advice and ideas to people that aren't necessarily peers.

01:50:37.000 It's easy to talk to a peer.

01:50:38.000 It's easy to talk to someone who's younger than you that admires you, but it's hard for you.

01:50:43.000 I have like this inferiority complex where it's like, okay, if this person is successful, then they already have the tools.

01:50:49.000 They don't need me.

01:50:50.000 Like they know what they're doing.

01:50:51.000 So I think that for me, finding that niche into where I'm like, okay, listen, you've done well, you know things, you've experienced them, you've lived them firsthand.

01:51:01.000 How can you use all of the knowledge that you've gained on your journey to actually help other people?

01:51:07.000 They will be willing to listen.

01:51:08.000 If you teach it, they will listen.

01:51:11.000 This is how you do it.

01:51:12.000 You teach what you learned.

01:51:14.000 What you learned in your life that helped you.

01:51:17.000 And just say, you don't have to teach them like, you need to do this.

01:51:20.000 You don't have to do that.

01:51:21.000 You say, I did this.

01:51:22.000 If they ask.

01:51:23.000 Yeah.

01:51:23.000 I'm really scared of unsolicited advice.

01:51:26.000 That is one thing that I'm always, like, really weary of.

01:51:29.000 Because, bro, like, who wants to hear from someone that you didn't ask for?

01:51:33.000 Right.

01:51:34.000 You know, it's like, I didn't send for you, bro.

01:51:35.000 Like, why are you giving me advice?

01:51:36.000 I don't want it.

01:51:37.000 Right.

01:51:37.000 So I'm always trying to be like.

01:51:39.000 Oh, giving unsolicited advice.

01:51:40.000 Where I'm like, I'm the guy that I have a hard time with telling people what they need to do or what they should do, what I think will help improve their lives.

01:51:48.000 Because that would insinuate that I have a better life and I know more.

01:51:51.000 Well, it's also a tricky thing because when you're doing that, the type of person that needs that information, that's really going to use it, they're going to ask you.

01:52:02.000 They're going to say, hey, man, I really respect you.

01:52:05.000 What you've done is amazing.

01:52:07.000 How do you do this?

01:52:08.000 What are you doing?

01:52:09.000 What is your day like?

01:52:11.000 How do you start?

01:52:11.000 Because they want to know, because they want to do it.

01:52:18.000 If someone doesn't have the desire, if they don't want to seek out the information, you don't want to give it to them.

01:52:25.000 Because they're not going to do anything with it anyway.

01:52:27.000 You're not going to get into someone's head unless they want to let you in.

01:52:32.000 And the people that want to let you in, they're the people that are going to want to ask.

01:52:36.000 They're the people who are going to want to listen to you talk on this podcast.

01:52:39.000 If you did have some sort of a seminar that you did for corporations or for anybody that wants to be motivated and you can explain what you've done in your life and what led you through discipline, what gave you the focus, how you kept that fire alive.

01:52:56.000 Those things are inspirational to people.

01:52:58.000 Inspiration is fuel.

01:53:00.000 Fuel.

01:53:00.000 It's one of the greatest things that I personally use.

01:53:04.000 I'm inspired by so many different people.

01:53:07.000 I'm inspired by people's discipline and people's achievements.

01:53:10.000 Discipline's a big thing, man.

01:53:11.000 It's everything.

01:53:12.000 It's everything.

01:53:13.000 I tell my kids all the time.

01:53:15.000 Be disciplined or be disciplined.

01:53:18.000 So I'm like, hey, listen, I have to teach you, son.

01:53:22.000 If you decide to do this, you will choose discipline.

01:53:27.000 I got that from our pastor, Love Church in West Omaha, Todd Doxon.

01:53:31.000 So he says, be disciplined or be disciplined.

01:53:34.000 Because I have to teach my son, hey, bro, this world is hard.

01:53:40.000 It's hard, Dad.

01:53:41.000 That fig bar that you just ate for a snack before bed, I had to work hard to get that.

01:53:45.000 You know how many double legs I had to shoot to get this house?

01:53:48.000 But no, honestly, I always want to give him perspective because as kids, they don't really understand.

01:53:54.000 I read a book by Dr. Meg Meeker called Raising...

01:53:58.000 Ungrateful kids in an entitled world.

01:54:02.000 Or raising grateful kids in an entitled world.

01:54:05.000 So basically the premise behind the book was how can we provide for our kids a life in which we're creating character but also give them more than we had.

01:54:15.000 There's just so much expectation.

01:54:17.000 My kids sometimes they're like just because I exist this should be afforded to me.

01:54:23.000 I'm like bro, no that's not how things work here.

01:54:26.000 Like First of all, if you treated any one of your friends the way you treat mom and dad and your sister sometime at home, they would beat you up.

01:54:35.000 They wouldn't want to spend time with you.

01:54:39.000 It's just the bottom line.

01:54:40.000 And so I'm always under this mindset and this premise, and I try to do a greater job every day at being a better father.

01:54:49.000 I don't think people are born good.

01:54:51.000 I think people are born bad, and then they are constructed to be people of integrity.

01:54:58.000 You see the videos and the cute little anecdotes of kids hugging and smiling with each other.

01:55:03.000 It's like, oh, see, kids love each other from jump.

01:55:05.000 It's like, if you think people are inherently good, you've never had One Rice Krispie treat left in your cabinet with two hungry kids.

01:55:13.000 Because when there's one treat that comes out, they're scrapping.

01:55:17.000 They're scrapping, bro.

01:55:19.000 It's a fight.

01:55:19.000 It's a straight up fight.

01:55:20.000 And so I have to continuously always try to sharpen and refine them because in our human profile, we're just innate.

01:55:28.000 We're within the flesh.

01:55:30.000 We're always going to want to please ourselves.

01:55:32.000 And so there are so many times where I'm like, bro, listen, if you just give her the bigger piece now, I promise you that you'll be rewarded for it later.

01:55:39.000 If you can just treat your mom with character and respect now, I promise you that I will reward you later.

01:55:44.000 But it's so hard because in their flesh, they're like, I don't want that.

01:55:47.000 She doesn't have the bigger piece.

01:55:48.000 You know, I don't want to go to bed.

01:55:50.000 Why does she get two Christmas presents and I got one? 1.00

01:55:52.000 So I'm just always trying to figure out ways in which that I can implement the things that I've learned.

01:55:57.000 But it's hard because no one gives you an instruction manual for parenting.

01:56:01.000 I had my son at I think I was 25, 26 and I was fresh out of college and I left home at 18 and everything that I learned After 18 was learned in an environment where I was just trying to figure things out on the fly.

01:56:15.000 Isn't it crazy?

01:56:16.000 So you leave the hospital and you're like, here you go.

01:56:18.000 No one trains you.

01:56:19.000 I'm like, wait, we got to leave?

01:56:21.000 We got to take this thing with us?

01:56:22.000 They're like, sir, you got to bring the car seat up, put the baby in the car seat, and then you got to walk him down.

01:56:27.000 And you're 25. That's it.

01:56:28.000 And I was still a baby.

01:56:30.000 I was still a baby.

01:56:32.000 And I was growing and developing myself.

01:56:34.000 So I think you get better with each kid.

01:56:38.000 Each kid gets a better life than the original.

01:56:41.000 The first one's the hardest.

01:56:43.000 That's the test.

01:56:44.000 The baby of your family is always going to be the one that gets the best version of you.

01:56:52.000 The oldest is going to get The rough draft of yourself, and then you're just kind of working from there.

01:57:00.000 Sometimes the youngest kids are the ones that achieve the most, though.

01:57:03.000 That's what's interesting.

01:57:04.000 Yeah.

01:57:04.000 It's because it's a more casual way of raising the kids.

01:57:08.000 You're not as worried about them.

01:57:09.000 Because the first one, you're like, don't touch that.

01:57:11.000 What did he eat?

01:57:12.000 Get this, so we got to wash his mouth out.

01:57:14.000 But the third one, you're like, yeah, you can do a backflip.

01:57:15.000 Go ahead, do a backflip.

01:57:16.000 Go for it, bro.

01:57:18.000 Listen, sometimes all we tell them is, we don't want to go to the urgent care this weekend.

01:57:22.000 Please.

01:57:23.000 Dad just doesn't want to go to the hospital.

01:57:25.000 As long as there's no blood, you can play The Floor is Lava and jump from couch to couch.

01:57:29.000 Just please, no one get hurt.

01:57:31.000 Don't get cut up.

01:57:32.000 Yeah, it's hard and no one teaches you how to do it and it's the most important thing in the world.

01:57:36.000 And that's the weirdest thing about being a parent.

01:57:39.000 It's so easy to get someone pregnant. 1.00

01:57:41.000 So harder marriage or parenthood?

01:57:45.000 Well, parenthood is more complicated because you're taking a person who is a tiny little baby and you're teaching them about life and you're talking to them and you're explaining things and you're experiencing all the little troubles that they go through and try to talk them through it and try to discipline them and keep them from doing things.

01:58:07.000 But I got very lucky with my wife.

01:58:10.000 And she's a great person.

01:58:13.000 And she's a nice person.

01:58:15.000 Just one of the best things about her.

01:58:17.000 She's so nice.

01:58:18.000 She's just so nice.

01:58:19.000 She's this nice person.

01:58:21.000 And I get along with her.

01:58:22.000 You're so nice.

01:58:23.000 She's a sweetheart.

01:58:25.000 She really is.

01:58:26.000 But she's also really funny and really smart.

01:58:28.000 I got lucky.

01:58:29.000 And I have friends that are not lucky.

01:58:31.000 That's a blessing, bro.

01:58:32.000 It's a blessing.

01:58:33.000 I have friends that are in a bad marriage.

01:58:36.000 You know what?

01:58:36.000 I was talking about this with my wife.

01:58:39.000 And this is twofold.

01:58:40.000 I don't want to blame this completely on the women because men are the one that decide to court and pursue women. 0.99

01:58:46.000 But could you imagine how much further or how much lower the divorce rate would be if women said no during the proposal? 0.99

01:58:55.000 How much lower would divorce rate be if women said, nah, too many red flags. 1.00

01:59:02.000 Nah.

01:59:03.000 Like, I'm good.

01:59:04.000 Like, I saw what you did the other day.

01:59:06.000 Or I went through your phone.

01:59:07.000 This won't make things better.

01:59:09.000 This won't improve our relationship.

01:59:10.000 I'm pregnant, but I don't want to get married.

01:59:13.000 And if men, you know, consciously thought about the proposal process.

01:59:18.000 But I think that...

01:59:20.000 This has become such a heralded event that when you get proposed to, naturally you're like, yes, we'll figure it out later.

01:59:30.000 Where if you just said no now, and then you'll figure it out from there.

01:59:35.000 There's a Christian author, Jefferson Bethke, who says, always say no first, and then convince yourself otherwise.

01:59:41.000 But don't say yes, and then convince yourself not to do it.

01:59:45.000 Because once you say yes, you're already...

01:59:48.000 So much of the world's problems come from people saying yes when they don't really want to.

01:59:52.000 With everything.

01:59:53.000 With everything.

01:59:54.000 With everything.

01:59:55.000 There's so many responsibilities we take on and we don't really want to do it, but we feel like we should.

02:00:00.000 There are things that people romanticize, right?

02:00:02.000 Marriage is definitely one of them.

02:00:04.000 And then certain jobs are one of them.

02:00:06.000 You know, like certain jobs, like...

02:00:07.000 Becoming successful at a job that's not interesting to you, but everybody's telling you, hey, it's a good job, you should do it, and you wind up doing it, and then you're stuck, and you don't know how to get out of it, and now your life is out of your hands.

02:00:18.000 Yeah, but you've got a great wife, and that was a blessing for you because you see firsthand your buddies that are going through struggles and difficulties at home...

02:00:28.000 Yeah, and it's not necessarily just because of their wives either.

02:00:31.000 It's because of them too.

02:00:32.000 No, it's not the wives. 1.00

02:00:33.000 It's the men.

02:00:35.000 But we overburden the women when we should be the lead. 0.99

02:00:39.000 So it's like, hey, I want to marry you because I promise to change and do better and reflect on the red flags and eliminate them.

02:00:48.000 But the women, we put them in a position where there's so much pressure that they can't say no. 1.00

02:00:53.000 So you're like, we know that this is something that they desire to have.

02:00:57.000 So we present it to them and say, here, I'm going to dangle this carrot out in front of you, Joe, because I know this is what you really want.

02:01:06.000 So please forget everything that I've done in the past.

02:01:08.000 I'm a man.

02:01:09.000 Before I was married, I came with a lot of baggage.

02:01:12.000 But because of the excellence that I wanted to kind of characterize and have, I wanted to change because I wanted to be a good husband.

02:01:21.000 I wanted to be a good father.

02:01:23.000 I think you're going to do that with everything, though.

02:01:25.000 I think a person like yourself that has this sort of integrity and focus, you're going to do this with everything you do.

02:01:32.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:01:32.000 That's what makes a champion.

02:01:33.000 I mean, really what you want to be is a champion in everything, right?

02:01:38.000 A champion in life.

02:01:39.000 A champion as a father.

02:01:40.000 A champion as a parent.

02:01:41.000 A champion as a husband.

02:01:43.000 A champion as a neighbor.

02:01:44.000 A champion as a friend.

02:01:46.000 I mean, what you're doing is like you're just operating at the highest standards.

02:01:49.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:01:50.000 That's why I think you'd be amazing at public speaking.

02:01:53.000 I appreciate that.

02:01:54.000 I really do.

02:01:54.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:01:55.000 Because you really do embody that.

02:01:58.000 I'm going to take a video like, hey, listen, Joe Rogan endorsed me.

02:02:01.000 He said that you have to have me at your next corporate event.

02:02:03.000 Look at this conversation we're having.

02:02:05.000 You're so good at this.

02:02:06.000 At your next corporate event.

02:02:07.000 How many podcasts have you done before?

02:02:10.000 Not many.

02:02:11.000 You're fucking great at it, man.

02:02:12.000 Look how great you are expressing yourself.

02:02:15.000 Yeah, it's fun.

02:02:15.000 It's fun, right?

02:02:16.000 It's fun, yeah.

02:02:16.000 But you're great at it.

02:02:18.000 You're great at expressing yourself.

02:02:19.000 And you really do live the life that you're talking about.

02:02:22.000 And you have the achievements.

02:02:23.000 Authenticity.

02:02:24.000 Yes!

02:02:24.000 It's important.

02:02:25.000 You gotta be authentic, bro.

02:02:27.000 Authenticity is everything.

02:02:28.000 People can see through the facade.

02:02:30.000 They can see through the bullshit.

02:02:31.000 Yeah.

02:02:31.000 Because they see you, right?

02:02:33.000 They see you.

02:02:33.000 I want to talk to you about this.

02:02:34.000 When you're talking about authenticity.

02:02:36.000 I want to talk to you about...

02:02:37.000 Have you ever seen the movie Icarus?

02:02:40.000 I have dabbled.

02:02:42.000 Honestly, I don't want to watch it entirely because I would be so angry afterwards.

02:02:48.000 It's crazy.

02:02:49.000 Because I've lost to Russians in some of the biggest matches of my career. 1.00

02:02:55.000 And I know if I saw that, I would be so pissed off because they have changed my life in terms of being an Olympic champion, winning more world titles, more golds.

02:03:09.000 They've taken money out of my pocket, notoriety and fame away from me, and it'll really upset me.

02:03:17.000 So that's why I've decided not to.

02:03:19.000 It's a good thing to watch just to understand the sophistication involved.

02:03:22.000 Just to be upset.

02:03:22.000 Let me explain to people that don't know what we're talking about.

02:03:25.000 Icarus is a documentary by Brian Fogle, and Brian was a cyclist, and what he did was he decided to do a race for the documentary.

02:03:34.000 He did a race Completely natural.

02:03:37.000 Recorded his results.

02:03:38.000 And then he hired this Russian gentleman who was a part of the Russian, supposedly their anti-doping association.

02:03:47.000 Which meant, drop the anti.

02:03:49.000 Eventually, as time went on, it got exposed.

02:03:52.000 But he just completely lucked into this situation.

02:03:56.000 Where he hired this guy to tell him, what should I do?

02:03:59.000 His name was Grigory...

02:04:01.000 Rychenkov.

02:04:02.000 Rychenkov.

02:04:02.000 Thank you, Jamie.

02:04:03.000 You're the man, Jamie.

02:04:04.000 He is the man.

02:04:07.000 And Gregory told him exactly what he should take and when he should take it and do this and do that.

02:04:15.000 And then he was going to do the same race again the following year but juiced up and see what the difference in performance was.

02:04:22.000 Along the way the Sochi Olympics gets exposed that the Russians had cheated and what they had done was it was a super sophisticated Scandal where they cut a hole in the wall and they were like transferring the dirty piss through one hole and and giving them the the clean sample to replace So they had found that there was microscopic scratches in these supposedly impossible to open bottles So the Russians had figured out a way to open these bottles Which, 0.91

02:04:51.000 have you seen the real ones?

02:04:52.000 Have you ever seen one of the real bottles?

02:04:53.000 No, I haven't seen them in the flesh.

02:04:54.000 You cannot open them.

02:04:55.000 Yeah.

02:04:56.000 You will break them if you open them.

02:04:58.000 Impossible.

02:04:58.000 They have this sophisticated system in there where it's locked into the interlocks with the glass.

02:05:03.000 So once you close it as tightly as possible, you cannot reopen it.

02:05:07.000 Well, they somehow or another figured a workaround to get in there and open it.

02:05:11.000 And when they did that, they achieved an unprecedented number of gold medals.

02:05:16.000 I mean, they dominated the Sochi Olympics in Russia.

02:05:19.000 I'm pissed, bro.

02:05:20.000 I'm hot because...

02:05:23.000 I'm hot.

02:05:24.000 And we know it.

02:05:26.000 Like, we know it.

02:05:27.000 Pull up...

02:05:28.000 I don't even want to get into this.

02:05:29.000 Please!

02:05:30.000 Get into it.

02:05:30.000 So, pull up...

02:05:31.000 I lost in the quarterfinals of the Olympic Games in 2016. There's a guy named Anwar Godoyev.

02:05:37.000 I just want you to see a picture of this guy.

02:05:39.000 You tell me.

02:05:40.000 Was this in Rio?

02:05:41.000 If he's clean.

02:05:41.000 This was in Rio.

02:05:42.000 In Rio, weren't a lot of the Russians...

02:05:44.000 They were kicked out of Rio because of Sochi.

02:05:47.000 So, they did the most Russian... 0.90

02:05:50.000 The most failed test...

02:05:55.000 We're good to go.

02:06:00.000 We're good to go.

02:06:14.000 All these samples, so they're popping guys from 2008, 2012, and they're saying, you know what?

02:06:22.000 This guy was on a substance.

02:06:24.000 He was on some sort of performance-enhancing drug, so we're going to strip him of his medal, and we're going to give the guy that took fifth place the bronze medal instead.

02:06:36.000 At that point, it's such a different experience.

02:06:39.000 You never got to stand on the podium.

02:06:41.000 You never got to travel the world and tell everyone about your medal.

02:06:44.000 You never got to get that check that was associated with whatever success that you had, that sponsor that you missed out on.

02:06:50.000 And also someone taking away someone's gold medal and then giving it to you is not the same.

02:06:53.000 Bro, it's not the same.

02:06:54.000 It's not the same.

02:06:55.000 So it's life-changing experience that you miss out on because these guys are being unhealthy and just straight-up cheaters.

02:07:02.000 So like...

02:07:06.000 There's a certain amount of disdain that I have for Russia.

02:07:10.000 I respect them because they're tremendous wrestlers.

02:07:12.000 Not everyone cheats.

02:07:13.000 Not everyone cheats.

02:07:15.000 But there are those who do.

02:07:17.000 And it's well known in the wrestling community.

02:07:19.000 And so at this point, we have had to just accept it and try to beat them.

02:07:25.000 You just like...

02:07:26.000 You just gotta beat them.

02:07:28.000 Because it doesn't matter.

02:07:29.000 They are so powerful.

02:07:31.000 The IOC is so powerful that...

02:07:34.000 Regardless of what they do, Thomas Bach and the IOC will never make a stance in which they will completely ban Russia.

02:07:42.000 So they've banned Russia from the Olympic Games, but the athletes that test cleanly can still compete under a different flag.

02:07:49.000 So ultimately, it'd be like the independent republic of Russia.

02:07:53.000 True.

02:07:54.000 That they can still compete in, but the Russian flag will not be visible in Tokyo or in Paris in 2024. Really?

02:08:02.000 You cannot compete under the Russian national flag.

02:08:06.000 Really?

02:08:07.000 Done.

02:08:07.000 Wow!

02:08:08.000 I didn't know that.

02:08:09.000 So they've been banned from the Olympic Games, their governing body, Russia itself.

02:08:13.000 So all Russian athletes will have to go through a testing process, and then they will be able to compete as independent athletes under a different flag, but not the Russian flag.

02:08:24.000 And that's how far we've come, bro.

02:08:27.000 I've seen so many athletes in track and field and weightlifting and wrestling that have seen other athletes get stripped and then have been given their medals years later, and all they get is an Instagram post.

02:08:38.000 Yeah, it's not...

02:08:39.000 You didn't get a chance to win.

02:08:40.000 It's not cool.

02:08:41.000 It's not the same.

02:08:42.000 And it's sad because it's the butterfly effect, right?

02:08:46.000 Because it messes up the ripple of the entire bracket, right?

02:08:51.000 So it's like you beat this guy and then he loses here and this guy goes here and this guy retires or he changes weight classes.

02:08:57.000 There's just so many things that just happen because of this.

02:09:01.000 It doesn't make me happy.

02:09:03.000 It doesn't sit well with me, but at this point, what do you do?

02:09:05.000 You blow the whistle enough times, but you've just got to do what you can to avoid it.

02:09:10.000 The only way to do it is beat them.

02:09:12.000 I think in wrestling, we have the biggest margin of error.

02:09:16.000 Just because someone's in great shape doesn't mean you can't beat them in wrestling.

02:09:19.000 There's so much precision and technical skill that's associated with it that you can still overcome that steep hill.

02:09:26.000 But that's the problem with the Russians as well, because they're very proficient. 0.98

02:09:29.000 They're freaking good.

02:09:30.000 They're very good.

02:09:31.000 They're freaking good.

02:09:31.000 So technical.

02:09:32.000 The wrestlers in these provinces and caucuses are insane.

02:09:37.000 Insane at the sport.

02:09:40.000 From birth, they are competing and training at the highest level.

02:09:43.000 It's unlike...

02:09:44.000 Here, you got youth sports, and you play games, and you play freeze tag with your buddies at practice, and you do a couple of rope climbs, you're done.

02:09:52.000 These guys are training like Olympians at eight years old.

02:09:56.000 They're doing backbridge kickovers, and they're learning five-point throws, and they're just technically savvy at a much earlier age because they're bred for this.

02:10:05.000 We think we have it hard here.

02:10:06.000 Poverty here is nothing like poverty in other countries, especially in Ossetia or Chechnya and all these places.

02:10:14.000 It's just a different vibe there.

02:10:16.000 They have some amazing wrestlers.

02:10:19.000 And amazing motivation too with that poverty.

02:10:21.000 It's life changing.

02:10:23.000 They're tied into the government.

02:10:24.000 The US is the only country that their Olympic team is not government funded.

02:10:29.000 The only country in the world where our Olympic team is funded privately by donations, corporate sponsors.

02:10:37.000 That's it.

02:10:38.000 We're the only country in the entire world.

02:10:39.000 Every country in the world has the government funding the way that they operate and making sure that they are competing at a high level.

02:10:48.000 That's got to be an incredible disgrace for Russia to be eliminated from the 2020 and 2024 Olympics.

02:10:55.000 Yeah, well, when you stand on top of the podium, bro, there's a certain amount of pride that comes with seeing your flag raised above all else.

02:11:01.000 That is a special moment.

02:11:03.000 And so for them...

02:11:05.000 I don't know.

02:11:06.000 Is it pride or is it financial incentive?

02:11:11.000 Is it just being an Olympic champion?

02:11:13.000 Let me ask you this.

02:11:14.000 What if a guy wins in 2008 and pops?

02:11:19.000 They retroactively test the samples.

02:11:22.000 Is he still capable of competing in the future or is he eliminated forever?

02:11:29.000 Well, it depends.

02:11:31.000 I mean, if you pop from a few years ago, then maybe, I don't know, maybe they pro-date your suspension and say, okay, let's say if you got suspended on that day for two years post that day, all your results in that period of time will probably be eliminated.

02:11:46.000 I've heard that argument, but I've also heard the argument that if you're cheating, you should be eliminated for life.

02:11:51.000 For life.

02:11:52.000 And that's the only way to stop cheaters.

02:11:54.000 If you want to stop someone from doing something, it's prestigious as the Olympic gold medal.

02:11:59.000 That's a death sentence.

02:12:00.000 I don't know.

02:12:01.000 I know it's death sentence, but you're cheating.

02:12:05.000 Yeah.

02:12:05.000 You're cheating.

02:12:06.000 You're cheating.

02:12:06.000 It's a thing.

02:12:07.000 The whole reason to win the Olympics is for glory and for the opportunity for sponsorships for Americans.

02:12:13.000 But that's why, though.

02:12:14.000 That's why they're doing it, man.

02:12:15.000 Yeah.

02:12:16.000 Well, it's political glory.

02:12:18.000 When Russia had it in the Sochi Olympics, it's not like a coincidence.

02:12:22.000 They're following that medal count closely, bro.

02:12:24.000 Don't let anybody fool you.

02:12:25.000 That medal count every year at every Olympic Games is something that us in the village as athletes and the presidents of each particular respective country, they're following that.

02:12:36.000 Of course.

02:12:36.000 They want to win.

02:12:37.000 They want to be the best.

02:12:38.000 Of course.

02:12:39.000 That's big to them.

02:12:41.000 Above all else, some people are willing to take some crazy chances to be successful because they know the incentives that will follow them getting their hand raised.

02:12:54.000 But some people operate with character and they're like, you know what?

02:12:57.000 Win or lose, I'm not doing these things.

02:12:59.000 I think though with Russia, and this was pretty clear because of this documentary.

02:13:02.000 They don't have a choice.

02:13:03.000 They don't have a choice.

02:13:05.000 What was this wrestler that you wanted to say?

02:13:06.000 What was the video?

02:13:07.000 It was Anwar Godoyev.

02:13:09.000 Just pull up a photo.

02:13:10.000 There's a photo of him.

02:13:12.000 He's like super vascular.

02:13:14.000 How about Corellin?

02:13:15.000 I mean, Karelin's one of the craziest examples ever. 0.99

02:13:18.000 His parents were tiny little folks.

02:13:20.000 They were like 5'5", and he was built like a human panther.

02:13:24.000 That's a big fella.

02:13:26.000 That's a guy.

02:13:26.000 That's achievable naturally with superior genetics.

02:13:29.000 I mean, it is possible.

02:13:31.000 But if you look at all the other Russians that I've wrestled over the last decade, none of them have that level of stature.

02:13:41.000 But it is whatever, man.

02:13:42.000 We've exchanged matches.

02:13:43.000 He's beaten me.

02:13:44.000 I've beaten him.

02:13:46.000 But he beat me when it counted at the Olympic Games.

02:13:50.000 He does look pretty stacked.

02:13:52.000 He's tough, man.

02:13:53.000 He's a stud.

02:13:54.000 And this was in Rio?

02:13:55.000 This was in Rio.

02:13:56.000 This is a game changer.

02:13:59.000 And you are suspicious.

02:14:02.000 Yeah, I am.

02:14:03.000 I'm going to be honest.

02:14:04.000 I'm a little suspicious.

02:14:05.000 I probably get a lot of heat for it and Russians probably won't be happy with it.

02:14:09.000 But even if he didn't test positive then, the odds of him using steroids up before then or using some sort of performance, whether it's EPO, for training, to get to where he got to physically.

02:14:22.000 You keep a lot of the gains, no matter what.

02:14:26.000 That's the hard part about it is...

02:14:28.000 Within that space, if you don't have a choice, fine.

02:14:32.000 You know, Joe, listen, if you want to be on a podcast, you have to do this.

02:14:37.000 If the government tells you, hey, you want to compete for the Russian team, you have to take this.

02:14:41.000 Or you can go be a construction worker for the rest of your life, making minimum wage.

02:14:45.000 You're like, I'll take that podcast.

02:14:47.000 Give me that.

02:14:48.000 So I think it's a very different vibe there.

02:14:51.000 They don't have opportunity outside.

02:14:53.000 They can't go to university.

02:14:54.000 They don't go to school.

02:15:06.000 Yeah.

02:15:08.000 Yeah.

02:15:19.000 But, you know, that's the way they operate there.

02:15:22.000 It's got to be infuriating for you, though, to see the results, like the Sochi Olympics.

02:15:26.000 And I understand why you wouldn't want to watch that documentary, but I encourage you to watch it.

02:15:31.000 I got to watch it.

02:15:31.000 Yeah.

02:15:32.000 It's so intense, man.

02:15:33.000 It makes me uncomfortable because it's hard to...

02:15:37.000 I'm not a guy that, like, is going to accuse someone of something that I can't prove.

02:15:42.000 Right.

02:15:42.000 And that's not proven, right?

02:15:43.000 It's like this whole election fraud thing.

02:15:45.000 It's like...

02:15:46.000 No, I'm telling you it happened.

02:15:47.000 I'm like, okay.

02:15:48.000 So, you know, for me to claim that this guy is on steroids just because he's vascular and muscular is a difficult thing for me to do.

02:15:54.000 But I've heard so many grumblings for such a long period of time that I'm like, bro, like, come on.

02:16:00.000 Like, at this point...

02:16:01.000 After all of the conversations that happened after Icarus and after them being suspended and WADA and USADA covering up all these tests and all this crazy, crazy happening in all sorts of sports, I'm like, bro,

02:16:17.000 this state-sponsored doping is a real thing.

02:16:20.000 They're killing people that are blowing the whistle in Russia.

02:16:24.000 Yep.

02:16:24.000 Like, killing people.

02:16:26.000 So I'm like...

02:16:27.000 Well, this Grigory guy is in witness protection in America. 0.89

02:16:30.000 He's hiding.

02:16:31.000 They took all his money away.

02:16:33.000 They took his family's home away in Russia.

02:16:36.000 He can't see his family again for the rest of his life.

02:16:39.000 Like, it's terrible.

02:16:40.000 The situation's terrible.

02:16:42.000 Yeah, man.

02:16:42.000 It's wild.

02:16:45.000 It's funny because I know this is going to cause a stir within the Russian wrestling community, so I'm anticipating the backlash that's going to happen immediately after this goes on.

02:16:57.000 Well, you are acknowledging their skill, too, though.

02:17:00.000 You're doing both.

02:17:02.000 Listen, they're tremendous wrestlers, but I stand by what I said.

02:17:05.000 That's how I feel, and it is what it is.

02:17:08.000 Otherwise, there wouldn't be so many people that have been accused of it.

02:17:13.000 If enough people say bad things about you, chances are it might be happening.

02:17:17.000 It's like, you're always the common denominator.

02:17:20.000 Like, how is that possible?

02:17:22.000 So, I'm a guy that...

02:17:23.000 I'm a purist.

02:17:25.000 I always want to operate with integrity because it's just what I do.

02:17:27.000 Number one, I love my body, so I'm not going to just put nonsense in it.

02:17:30.000 Number two, I want to protect the integrity of the sport, right?

02:17:34.000 Like, it's the spirit of the sport.

02:17:35.000 We compete to see who really has trained the hardest, who's done the most, sacrificed the most, and been disciplined.

02:17:40.000 That's why we do what we do.

02:17:42.000 Like, if you're bringing...

02:17:44.000 PEDs within the sports world, it is very difficult to really judge who the best competitor is.

02:17:51.000 And that's what we're trying to do.

02:17:53.000 So it's like playing a video game.

02:17:54.000 If I'm playing Madden and I got a cheat code and all my guys' stats and attributes are up to 99s, and I'm trying to play you with an average roster, how can you win?

02:18:05.000 How can you win?

02:18:06.000 You can't win.

02:18:07.000 You can't win, bro.

02:18:09.000 So it's really hard to experience because...

02:18:13.000 I've sacrificed all my life to be great at this.

02:18:15.000 And so when someone does it the improper way, and I don't know what they're doing.

02:18:20.000 I don't know how hard they're training, but I know what I do personally.

02:18:23.000 So yeah, it bothers me.

02:18:25.000 Have you ever had a conversation with a Russian that spoke English about any of this?

02:18:29.000 No, I have not.

02:18:30.000 But I probably will soon.

02:18:35.000 Honestly, I invite someone from the Russian delegation to have this conversation with me.

02:18:42.000 But an understandable one, not one of denial.

02:18:45.000 Not one of denial.

02:18:47.000 One like, hey, listen, we have had some guys, they have dabbled in it.

02:18:51.000 I'm not going to be like, see, told you, go get them.

02:18:54.000 You know what I mean?

02:18:55.000 I want a conversation where we're like, damn, okay, I understand.

02:18:58.000 But why?

02:18:59.000 But how?

02:19:01.000 Okay, now...

02:19:03.000 Is it possible that you guys have guys that are not doing this?

02:19:06.000 Are they just amazing wrestlers?

02:19:08.000 Do they just have the technical superiority and that's why they've been so successful for a long period of time?

02:19:14.000 Is that what you have or is this a large part of what you do?

02:19:18.000 And are they forced into it?

02:19:20.000 And, you know, their backs are against the wall and, you know, their hands are tied.

02:19:24.000 There's nothing they can do about it.

02:19:26.000 So I'm willing to have an open conversation to understand it.

02:19:29.000 I'm not just out here accusing them for the sake of making them look bad because I've seen them train.

02:19:35.000 They work hard.

02:19:36.000 I've seen them learn technique and I've seen the structure and the system and systematic approach they have to their sport.

02:19:43.000 They're great at their craft.

02:19:45.000 But I also have seen guys that have been jacked up, and then I've seen them post-career, and they look puny.

02:19:52.000 And I'm like, man, how's that possible?

02:19:55.000 So I'm trying to navigate the different dynamics of this whole experience without being this jerk that's like, hey, you guys are no good, because they're good wrestlers.

02:20:08.000 Right.

02:20:09.000 Well, they're great wrestlers and they're very technical, but they're also a part of a program that has been proven to be corrupt.

02:20:16.000 Yeah.

02:20:16.000 I mean, I don't think that's an unfair thing to say.

02:20:18.000 Yeah, that's the bottom line.

02:20:19.000 Particularly when you pay attention to what happened at the Sochi Olympics and pay attention to the fact, what you just said, that in 2020 and 2024 they can't fly the Russian flag.

02:20:27.000 That's not discrimination.

02:20:29.000 That's not.

02:20:29.000 That's a punishment.

02:20:30.000 It's a punishment.

02:20:31.000 It's a punishment from mass...

02:20:34.000 It's mass state-sponsored doping.

02:20:36.000 It's happening.

02:20:38.000 Yeah, it's real.

02:20:39.000 It's real.

02:20:39.000 It's 100% real.

02:20:40.000 It's real, bro.

02:20:41.000 Yeah, I mean, the documentary I'm telling you, man, please watch it.

02:20:43.000 It's bonkers.

02:20:44.000 I watched it like this the whole time.

02:20:47.000 My mouth was wide open like, what?

02:20:50.000 And the guy just stepped in shit.

02:20:52.000 The guy making the doc, Brian Fogle, just lucked into the craziest story.

02:20:56.000 Well, you know what's wild, though?

02:20:57.000 That state sponsor here, USADA, they don't care about us.

02:21:00.000 They don't care about the athletes.

02:21:02.000 So whoever pays WADA there, whoever is taking the test, they either are so fearful or they're just in cahoots and they're getting...

02:21:14.000 Well, the IOC and WADA, they switch executives back and forth.

02:21:18.000 That was also part of the thing that they discussed.

02:21:20.000 It's like people from WADA go to work for the IOC. IOC people go to work for WADA. I've never gotten any breaks here.

02:21:25.000 And I've never seen anyone in the wrestling community, at least American wrestling, get any breaks from USADA. They are always at our heads.

02:21:34.000 Same with UFC. USADA tests UFC fighters.

02:21:38.000 I've never seen a break.

02:21:39.000 So when I see that, I'm jealous, bro.

02:21:42.000 Because I'm like, this dude probably has to train less.

02:21:45.000 He probably doesn't have to update his whereabouts.

02:21:48.000 You know what I mean?

02:21:49.000 He doesn't have someone following him around.

02:21:51.000 Doesn't have to have a phlebotomist take blood and collect urine samples all the time.

02:21:57.000 And there's one day, one week, I got tested like four times in the same weekend.

02:22:01.000 Why?

02:22:01.000 And I'm like, I'm asking the same thing, bro.

02:22:03.000 I'm like, why?

02:22:04.000 I tested yesterday.

02:22:07.000 Yesterday.

02:22:08.000 What could I have taken between yesterday and today that would have enhanced me so much that I could have won today?

02:22:12.000 I'm sure there's some things.

02:22:13.000 Yeah, but the fact that we want to take that risk.

02:22:16.000 So they're probably thinking like, oh, let's see if someone does it right after we test them.

02:22:21.000 We'll test them again the next day just in case.

02:22:23.000 Just in case.

02:22:24.000 But still, that's crazy.

02:22:25.000 They're not doing that in Russia.

02:22:27.000 So I'm like, I guarantee that whoever I have to compete against is not up at 5 a.m.

02:22:34.000 with a dude banging on their door That's a problem too, though.

02:22:38.000 Why the fuck do they think that that's okay to interrupt your sleep?

02:22:42.000 I actually do that purposely.

02:22:44.000 So I put them early because at any other time of the day, you have to let them know where you are.

02:22:48.000 So let's just say you tell them, I'm going to be at the crib today.

02:22:53.000 Then all of a sudden you're like, shoot, I ran out of batteries.

02:22:56.000 I got to run to Target real quick.

02:22:57.000 And then they show up at your house as soon as you pull off your block.

02:23:00.000 And now they're waiting for you and you're gone and there's traffic and the line's long and all of a sudden you...

02:23:05.000 It takes you an hour and a half what you thought was going to be a 20 minute ride.

02:23:09.000 And they only give you an hour window.

02:23:11.000 So now you get back and they're gone.

02:23:13.000 You have to report all of your whereabouts?

02:23:14.000 Not just what city you're in?

02:23:16.000 All of your whereabouts.

02:23:18.000 Oh, that's so crazy.

02:23:18.000 So you have to give them an hour time that you're at home every day.

02:23:23.000 So there's an hour window every single day.

02:23:26.000 And you test quarterly.

02:23:28.000 Or you update your whereabouts quarterly.

02:23:30.000 So every three months you do your whereabout update.

02:23:33.000 You give them an hour slot.

02:23:34.000 I try to put it as early as possible because I'm like, I'm going to be in bed.

02:23:37.000 There's no way I'm going to be out of my house between 5 and 6 a.m.

02:23:40.000 I'm always going to be in bed.

02:23:41.000 Oh my God.

02:23:41.000 But then they interrupt your sleep.

02:23:42.000 They do.

02:23:43.000 And they knock like the police.

02:23:44.000 Shout out Dave Carl.

02:23:46.000 You saw that.

02:23:48.000 Boom, boom, boom.

02:23:49.000 Doorbell, doorbell.

02:23:50.000 Boom, boom, boom.

02:23:50.000 Oh my God.

02:23:51.000 Kids are up.

02:23:52.000 They're crying.

02:23:52.000 They're in our bed.

02:23:53.000 They're downstairs.

02:23:54.000 But I try to do it early.

02:23:55.000 So two things.

02:23:56.000 I know I'm home and I know I'll have to pee.

02:23:58.000 If they wake me up out of my sleep, I haven't taken my first pee in the morning.

02:24:01.000 Is it a blood test in the morning as well?

02:24:03.000 Sometimes.

02:24:04.000 It depends.

02:24:05.000 They've just recently started doing blood tests over the last year or so.

02:24:08.000 That's even more annoying.

02:24:10.000 There have been a lot of people that have been suspended just because they didn't update their whereabouts.

02:24:14.000 So you'll go somewhere and you'll be like, right here.

02:24:18.000 I'm like, I'll be home today.

02:24:20.000 And then all of a sudden our podcast runs long.

02:24:21.000 I'm here for three, four hours.

02:24:23.000 And they're at the crib waiting and no one's home.

02:24:26.000 Well, I've talked to fighters that when they had to choose between UFC and Bellator, there was two decisions, two things that led them towards Bellator.

02:24:34.000 One, sponsors.

02:24:35.000 They could have their own sponsors, whatever sponsors they like.

02:24:37.000 They don't have to be tied to Reebok.

02:24:39.000 And two, no USADA. So they don't have anybody banging on their door.

02:24:42.000 They just get normal drug tests.

02:24:44.000 Normal drug tests.

02:24:44.000 Normal drug tests when they have weigh-ins and that.

02:24:48.000 So, crazy story.

02:24:49.000 One time I got tested...

02:24:51.000 I was just graduating from college.

02:24:53.000 I was living in an apartment on my own.

02:24:54.000 I was still single.

02:24:56.000 And I went out the night before.

02:24:59.000 I was like out with some friends at the bar having a few beers.

02:25:03.000 And I left my keys in the bar, lost my keys.

02:25:08.000 So I had to sleep in our locker room.

02:25:10.000 I slept in our locker room at the university.

02:25:13.000 And so I remember waking up the next morning It was a guy from USADA, Dave, like, hey, JB, I'm at your house and you have an hour to get here.

02:25:22.000 And I'm like, I don't have my keys.

02:25:24.000 I can't even get into my house.

02:25:26.000 And so I call Dave.

02:25:28.000 I'm like, Dave, I lost my keys last night.

02:25:30.000 I really don't know where they are.

02:25:31.000 Is there any way else we can get tested?

02:25:33.000 And he was like, yeah, if you can just find a bathroom somewhere else, you can get tested.

02:25:36.000 So there's a Panera Bread right down the street from my house.

02:25:39.000 So I'm like, all right, Panera.

02:25:40.000 We go to Panera Bread.

02:25:41.000 We get there.

02:25:42.000 So if you know anything about USADA testing, they have to watch you pee.

02:25:47.000 And so, bro, super random.

02:25:50.000 I'm in Panera Bread down the street from my house with two dudes.

02:25:54.000 This guy's behind me.

02:25:56.000 It's like, all right, I need you to wash your hands.

02:25:57.000 Put your cup up here.

02:25:58.000 All right, pull your pants down to your knees. 0.92

02:26:00.000 I got my pants down to my knees.

02:26:01.000 Down to your knees?

02:26:02.000 Yeah, because they have to make...

02:26:03.000 You can't just, like, fly.

02:26:05.000 Like, it's got to be...

02:26:07.000 And they need to see you actively pee in this cup. 0.74

02:26:10.000 That's hilarious.

02:26:11.000 So I'm in Panera Bread with this guy behind me, pants down to my knees, like down the street from my crib, like super embarrassed.

02:26:16.000 I'm like, please, God, no one will walk in here.

02:26:19.000 Are you in a stall at least?

02:26:20.000 In a stall, yeah, yeah.

02:26:21.000 In a stall.

02:26:22.000 Because if you were in front of the urinal, everybody would be like, what are these guys doing?

02:26:25.000 Sir, are you okay?

02:26:25.000 Yeah.

02:26:27.000 Do you need help?

02:26:28.000 I'm like, I'm good.

02:26:29.000 I know this guy.

02:26:31.000 Do you still need help?

02:26:32.000 He's just checking to make me pee.

02:26:35.000 Yeah, it was interesting times, bro.

02:26:37.000 But yeah, I pride myself on what I put into my body, taking care of what I do.

02:26:43.000 And that's why I'm always weary out of respect to Kill Cliff and what you guys provide.

02:26:48.000 Oh, I get it.

02:26:48.000 I'm always just like, if I don't know it and it's not my own...

02:26:51.000 I don't eat it.

02:26:52.000 You should be wary.

02:26:53.000 Look, a lot of UFC fighters have been popped for accidental...

02:26:56.000 Crazy stuff.

02:26:57.000 Eye drops.

02:26:58.000 Motion.

02:26:59.000 Dick pills.

02:27:01.000 A lot of things happen.

02:27:02.000 I'm okay in that department.

02:27:07.000 I'm really concerned about gene therapy.

02:27:11.000 I'm really concerned about what we're ready for soon because there's things like CRISPR and these gene editing tools.

02:27:19.000 I'm concerned with super athletes that are going to be produced by other countries.

02:27:23.000 Before we get a chance to do that in the next 20 years or so.

02:27:26.000 Yeah, I really think that.

02:27:27.000 I think the kids that they're developing right now, there's all sorts of different genes that they could alter.

02:27:34.000 Switch on, switch off.

02:27:35.000 Myostatin inhibitors, all these different things can enhance.

02:27:38.000 Is it that serious, though?

02:27:40.000 What do you mean?

02:27:42.000 Like, is...

02:27:45.000 I mean, there's billions of dollars in athletics.

02:27:47.000 There's so much money.

02:27:48.000 Well, think about it this way.

02:27:49.000 How about this way?

02:27:50.000 Put it this way.

02:27:51.000 Think about how much money they earn in the Olympics and how little they give to you.

02:27:55.000 Just think of that.

02:27:56.000 Think of the athletes.

02:27:57.000 Who the fuck?

02:27:59.000 Who's making money in the Olympics?

02:28:01.000 I'll tell you who should be making the money.

02:28:04.000 The IOC and the networks.

02:28:04.000 The athletes should be making most of the money, but they're making none of it.

02:28:09.000 It's crazy.

02:28:11.000 It's the biggest scam in all of athletics.

02:28:14.000 You get a medal, though.

02:28:15.000 Oh, nice!

02:28:16.000 You get a beautiful medal.

02:28:17.000 How much does that cost?

02:28:18.000 You've got to think about how much attention...

02:28:21.000 If you have the Olympics, you have a guaranteed audience.

02:28:24.000 People want to see it.

02:28:26.000 There's nationalism and pride.

02:28:27.000 And everybody wants to see all these different sports that maybe they enjoy.

02:28:31.000 Maybe it's gymnastics.

02:28:32.000 Maybe they used to swim.

02:28:33.000 They want to watch wrestling.

02:28:35.000 And no one's getting paid!

02:28:36.000 And they're just raking in all the cash.

02:28:39.000 They got fucking commercial after commercial.

02:28:41.000 It's sponsored by this company.

02:28:42.000 And their banners are here.

02:28:44.000 And there's so much money.

02:28:46.000 And the athletes don't get any of it.

02:28:48.000 It's crazy.

02:28:49.000 I get it.

02:28:50.000 So when you have all this nationalism, all this national pride from Russia and China and all these different countries, you don't think they're going to do some gene editing?

02:28:59.000 You don't think they're going to take...

02:29:00.000 Look, let me tell you a story about Yoel Romero.

02:29:03.000 You know Yoel Romero, right?

02:29:04.000 Yoel Romero is tested by USADA all the time, right?

02:29:07.000 He's clean.

02:29:08.000 And no one believes he's clean because he is one legitimate freak of nature.

02:29:13.000 If you look at him, Yoel Romero went to a doctor once because the UFC, he had fractured his orbital in a fight.

02:29:20.000 Yoel Romero, they brought him to his doctor.

02:29:23.000 The doctor examines him and then calls the UFC and goes, where did you get this guy?

02:29:27.000 And they go, what do you mean?

02:29:28.000 And he goes, he is a specimen.

02:29:31.000 And they go, yeah, he's amazing, right?

02:29:33.000 He goes, no, no, no, you don't understand.

02:29:34.000 I've never seen a human like him.

02:29:36.000 The guy's like, I've been working on people for decades.

02:29:39.000 He goes, the tendons in his eye are three times larger than a normal person's.

02:29:45.000 Like, everything about him is freakish.

02:29:47.000 But that's just genetics.

02:29:49.000 That's wild.

02:29:49.000 Some women are born with giant tits.

02:29:51.000 Some people have crazy big noses, right?

02:29:53.000 Yeah.

02:29:53.000 Yoel Romero's just a freak.

02:29:55.000 What if you developed a whole army of Yoel Romero's?

02:30:00.000 Yeah.

02:30:00.000 I mean, it's possible.

02:30:01.000 Yeah.

02:30:01.000 What if you figured out how to turn on all these genes?

02:30:03.000 What if you looked at what he does?

02:30:05.000 I mean, he's a perfect physical specimen.

02:30:07.000 What if you took that perfect physical specimen and you recreated it?

02:30:09.000 What if you took Shaq and Serena Williams?

02:30:11.000 Yes!

02:30:11.000 Or Kobe or LeBron James.

02:30:15.000 LeBron James is a giant super athlete.

02:30:17.000 What if you took that and just made thousands of them and you populated your whole team?

02:30:23.000 And put them all on Fight Island.

02:30:26.000 Made your own country. 0.54

02:30:28.000 Like a Bruce Lee movie.

02:30:29.000 I mean, I don't think that's outside of the realm of possibility.

02:30:34.000 And that's what I'm concerned with.

02:30:35.000 What I'm concerned with is that over here, we're using USADA and knocking on doors at 5 o'clock in the morning.

02:30:41.000 And there's countries that have less morals and ethics.

02:30:45.000 They're like 2040 already.

02:30:46.000 They're not even thinking about right now.

02:30:48.000 Yeah.

02:30:48.000 Our country is trying to bust our athletes.

02:30:51.000 Their country is trying to help them cheat.

02:30:53.000 I mean, how crazy is that balancing act?

02:30:56.000 Yeah.

02:30:56.000 That's a crazy balancing act.

02:30:58.000 And even though the United States is obviously very competitive in the Olympics and does amazing and wins a shitload of gold medals and has amazing athletes, you gotta think that these countries that are using these new tools, if they get ahead of us with this kind of shit, I mean, it could be real weird.

02:31:13.000 I don't think we'll ever lose, though, bro.

02:31:15.000 Like, we have...

02:31:16.000 I mean...

02:31:17.000 That's because you got that championship mindset.

02:31:19.000 You don't give a fuck.

02:31:21.000 I mean, listen, we're gonna...

02:31:22.000 We're going to get it.

02:31:23.000 And that's what America stands for.

02:31:27.000 What we have is we are always in great shape and we're tough.

02:31:31.000 Tough as nails.

02:31:32.000 We're going to fight to the death every single time.

02:31:34.000 So no matter how savvy you are, technically skilled, how much access to resources you have, it's always going to be a fight whenever you wrestle an American. 0.98

02:31:42.000 Right.

02:31:43.000 But remember how you feel about that Russian. 0.96

02:31:47.000 Right.

02:31:47.000 That might have been on some shit.

02:31:49.000 And if he was, in your head when you lay in bed and you think you lost that guy, and you look at how he looked, and you look at how muscular and vascular he was, maybe he's a Yoel Romero.

02:32:01.000 Or maybe he's a test.

02:32:03.000 Maybe he's a science project.

02:32:05.000 Yeah, that's true.

02:32:07.000 That's true.

02:32:09.000 We have so much access here.

02:32:11.000 That I can't ever imagine a country being better than us at anything just because we have so much structure, we have such great coaching, and we just have such a melting pot of individuals that are making freakish babies all the time.

02:32:28.000 So it's like if you go to Russia, you go to any of these countries, they're not melting pots like we have.

02:32:34.000 So there's...

02:32:35.000 The athleticism and the genetics have not been broadened so much so because there's just a small pool of small gene pools that have kind of interbreeded with each other for thousands of years.

02:32:49.000 But here in America, we have people from everywhere that have interbred and created such amazing athletes.

02:32:57.000 That's a very good point.

02:32:58.000 The smallest athlete in the world, like Simone Biles, who's considered one of the best athletes in the world, to the biggest, like LeBron James.

02:33:05.000 You know, it's amazing what we've been able to create here domestically because no other country has that sort of interracial breeding that we have.

02:33:15.000 And we have such a profound focus on sport, too.

02:33:19.000 Like, everyone plays sports.

02:33:21.000 Like, who?

02:33:21.000 Very few people that you'll ever meet that never played a sport in their entire lives.

02:33:26.000 That's true.

02:33:26.000 I mean, you're making real good points.

02:33:28.000 And listen, no one is more pro-America than me.

02:33:32.000 People love to say that.

02:33:33.000 America.

02:33:48.000 People coming from all other parts of the world trying to seek opportunity and trying to do better for their life and their families.

02:33:56.000 That's the best part of what America is.

02:33:58.000 But I'm just saying when it comes to competitive international sports, I'm really worried about gene doping.

02:34:04.000 I'm really worried about that shit.

02:34:06.000 I'm going to come see you 20 years from now.

02:34:07.000 We'll see.

02:34:08.000 When they finally unleash their army of genetically modified...

02:34:13.000 A fucking team full of Corellans. 1.00

02:34:15.000 It's like iRobot, right?

02:34:16.000 They just come off the assembly line.

02:34:19.000 I really think it's inevitable.

02:34:20.000 With this technology, I think it's inevitable.

02:34:22.000 Whether it's 20 years from now or 30 years from now or whatever it is, I think it's going to be inevitable for the public, for people too.

02:34:30.000 I think, you know, like right now...

02:34:32.000 Because how would you do that here?

02:34:34.000 Sounds expensive.

02:34:35.000 Well, I think it's expensive in the beginning, but I think like cell phones when they first came out were expensive.

02:34:40.000 Yeah, and now everybody has one.

02:34:41.000 You know, I remember the old, did you ever see that movie Wall Street with Gordon Gekko?

02:34:46.000 Of course, he had the big John and the purse.

02:34:48.000 He had the big brick and everybody was like, look at him.

02:34:50.000 He's talking.

02:34:51.000 It doesn't even have a cord.

02:34:52.000 He's out on the beach.

02:34:53.000 This is amazing.

02:34:55.000 Now everyone has a little phone and it's way more powerful.

02:34:59.000 Technology always improves and then eventually trickles down to everybody else.

02:35:04.000 The problem is the advantages the people who are the initial early adopters will have will allow them to accumulate so much wealth and so much success that by the time it trickles down, the game will already be rigged.

02:35:17.000 That's a real worry.

02:35:18.000 It's a real concern when it comes to the haves and the have-nots, when it's implementing technology that changes your biology.

02:35:25.000 And I think that's coming, man.

02:35:27.000 I really do.

02:35:28.000 The thing is, what's the alternative, right?

02:35:30.000 Let's say you are...

02:35:31.000 Because there's so many things that you can't...

02:35:42.000 We're good to go.

02:35:52.000 You have some, for example, right?

02:35:54.000 The Mannings and the Gronkowskis and the Joneses. 0.70

02:35:57.000 But there are a lot of families that have a tremendous athlete and then they have an average athlete.

02:36:04.000 Or no athlete, period.

02:36:05.000 My parents didn't even play sports in high school.

02:36:08.000 My parents didn't play sports in high school.

02:36:10.000 Really?

02:36:11.000 No.

02:36:11.000 That's crazy.

02:36:12.000 Now, given my dad had a tall...

02:36:15.000 My dad's 6'2".

02:36:16.000 He had a tall frame, long arms.

02:36:19.000 My mom's short, but... 0.98

02:36:21.000 What they created was me and my sister.

02:36:25.000 So I have three older siblings.

02:36:27.000 I came from a nontraditional household, kind of like a fragmented family.

02:36:31.000 My dad had two.

02:36:32.000 My mom had one.

02:36:33.000 They were married.

02:36:33.000 They had me.

02:36:34.000 And so I have no full-blooded relatives, only halves, only half siblings.

02:36:40.000 But all of us vary in athletic degree.

02:36:44.000 My sister and I, who were raised in the same household, she dabbled in basketball a little bit, was decent.

02:36:50.000 My brother, he was always the better athlete of the two of us.

02:36:54.000 He was solid, he played football, ran track.

02:36:57.000 And then my oldest sister never really played sports at all.

02:37:01.000 She grew up in the city.

02:37:02.000 But anyway, for me, growing up, I was the runt.

02:37:07.000 I was always small.

02:37:08.000 I never was really strong.

02:37:09.000 Never was a physical specimen.

02:37:12.000 I'm still not a physical specimen, but in relation to wrestling, I am.

02:37:17.000 So if you saw me play basketball, you'd be like, this dude is terrible.

02:37:20.000 He's not an athlete.

02:37:21.000 But if you see me wrestle, you're like, damn!

02:37:23.000 You know what I mean?

02:37:24.000 So it's like, in relation to what you do, You would consider yourself an athlete.

02:37:32.000 I always wonder, what pulls help someone gravitate to a particular sport?

02:37:39.000 Am I great at wrestling because I just had the frame for it?

02:37:44.000 Or did wrestling for so long help me to establish these certain dynamics of my athleticism that were unleashed and unfolded once I actually committed to the sport of wrestling?

02:37:57.000 I think you're great at wrestling because of your mind.

02:38:00.000 There are some physical attributes.

02:38:03.000 Sure.

02:38:04.000 But a lot of people have those.

02:38:06.000 That's true.

02:38:06.000 And they never get anywhere.

02:38:07.000 That's true, too.

02:38:08.000 It's your mind.

02:38:10.000 The mind.

02:38:10.000 The mind is strong.

02:38:12.000 At the elite level, and this is the same with MMA, you have to have everything.

02:38:16.000 You can't get by.

02:38:17.000 You can't beat a Jon Jones unless you have everything.

02:38:19.000 You have to have everything.

02:38:21.000 Consistently.

02:38:21.000 Yes, consistently.

02:38:22.000 You can't just be a good physical specimen.

02:38:25.000 You have to have the mind.

02:38:27.000 There are a lot of specimens.

02:38:28.000 A lot of specimens.

02:38:28.000 A lot of specimens, not a lot of legends.

02:38:30.000 When you get to a real world-class level, everybody's a fucking specimen.

02:38:34.000 They're all specimens.

02:38:35.000 So you can't just attribute it to your body, which obviously you're gifted athletically.

02:38:40.000 But it's the mind.

02:38:41.000 And I think because I didn't grow up as a specimen helped me to develop my mind.

02:38:45.000 Because I was never the biggest.

02:38:47.000 I always had to play catch up with my older siblings.

02:38:51.000 Always wanted to prove myself to my dad.

02:38:53.000 And so it was always a different level of experience that I had in comparison to my teammates where I would see them Skip runs.

02:39:01.000 I see them hide in the hallways during, you know, mile runs inside of our high school.

02:39:06.000 I would see them, you know, hang out in the locker room long when we were doing conditioning after practice.

02:39:12.000 And I was like, I didn't have that luxury because I thought in order for me to win, I had to outwork everyone because I was small.

02:39:19.000 Right.

02:39:19.000 I was small.

02:39:20.000 So it took me a long time to be the best.

02:39:23.000 I only won one state title in high school, and it was my senior year.

02:39:27.000 I didn't win a state championship until I was a senior.

02:39:28.000 I've won more world championships than I did state championships.

02:39:31.000 That's crazy.

02:39:32.000 Crazy because how I got to this level, I wasn't the best.

02:39:39.000 I was never the best.

02:39:40.000 So I had to develop mentally, and it was just something that through years and years of concerted effort, It was never like this aha moment.

02:39:51.000 Like, damn, I'm really good now.

02:39:52.000 Well, that is a thing you see with really, really talented people.

02:39:55.000 Yeah.

02:39:55.000 That sometimes really talented people that are just natural, they never go far.

02:40:00.000 Yeah.

02:40:00.000 And sometimes...

02:40:01.000 You always have that.

02:40:02.000 Yeah.

02:40:02.000 And it comes too easy.

02:40:04.000 That's when you hear the gamers.

02:40:05.000 Like, oh, this guy's a gamer.

02:40:06.000 Don't worry about him.

02:40:07.000 He'll be ready.

02:40:07.000 He'll be on when the lights arrive and you lock the cage behind him.

02:40:11.000 But how often can you do that?

02:40:13.000 Well, the problem is, other people are gamers, and they're also disciplined.

02:40:18.000 And that guy's gonna fuck you up.

02:40:20.000 You got the disciplined gamer.

02:40:21.000 When you get a guy like Michael Jordan, what creates a guy like Michael Jordan?

02:40:26.000 Extreme competitiveness, plus physical gifts, plus discipline, plus the mind.

02:40:34.000 The intelligence to figure out the correct path to get to the hoop.

02:40:37.000 The intelligence to figure out what's the right strategy to trick someone and go this way when you want to go that way.

02:40:44.000 What's the right tactics to implement in a fight?

02:40:47.000 What's the right move to use at the right time?

02:40:49.000 There's so much!

02:40:50.000 So much, bro.

02:40:51.000 So these gamers?

02:40:52.000 Well, this guy's a fucking gamer too, but he's been working and you've been slacking.

02:40:57.000 You know, you've been doing things you shouldn't have done, you've been partying, you've been doing whatever, and you thought you can get by because you think you're the fucking man.

02:41:03.000 Well, he thinks he's a fucking man too, but he's been sleeping, he's been eating right.

02:41:07.000 But there's certain prerequisites that you have to possess in order to be great.

02:41:13.000 Yeah.

02:41:13.000 So let's say you have a guy that is those things, all of those things.

02:41:19.000 Tremendous success.

02:41:19.000 You have a guy who's just a gamer, super talented, doesn't really want to work hard, has moderate success, can become a champion, loses his belt the very next defense.

02:41:28.000 And then you have a guy who works significantly hard, but he's not a specimen.

02:41:34.000 He just doesn't have the athleticism.

02:41:36.000 So I've seen some of the hardest working guys ever do everything that I do.

02:41:41.000 But they just can't win.

02:41:43.000 They can't do it, yeah.

02:41:44.000 They just can't win.

02:41:44.000 Life is not fair.

02:41:45.000 It's not fair.

02:41:46.000 It's not fair.

02:41:47.000 And that's what's scary for me with my boy because I'm like, I'm an Olympic champ.

02:41:53.000 Expectations are for him to be an Olympic champ.

02:41:55.000 There's no father-son Olympic gold medalist combinations.

02:41:57.000 It's impossible.

02:41:58.000 But I want him to be great at something.

02:42:01.000 What that's going to be, I don't know.

02:42:02.000 He plays soccer.

02:42:03.000 I never play soccer.

02:42:03.000 He plays a violin.

02:42:04.000 I never played an instrument.

02:42:05.000 So there's some things that he's fine-tuning that I never got a chance to have access to.

02:42:11.000 So I'm hoping that we can find something that he'll be great at, but he loves wrestling.

02:42:14.000 Well, I think the best gift that you can give him is just encourage him to find his path.

02:42:19.000 The problem isn't even the shadow of a great man.

02:42:22.000 It's a quote.

02:42:24.000 I forget who said it, but find me a great man who's the son of a great man.

02:42:30.000 It's very hard.

02:42:32.000 That's hard.

02:42:33.000 It's very hard.

02:42:34.000 But wouldn't you say that success begets success?

02:42:38.000 You want to be who you are and you have so many inspirational people sit in this chair daily.

02:42:44.000 Yeah, but that's a different animal.

02:42:46.000 They're not my dad.

02:42:47.000 I know, but...

02:42:48.000 The thing is growing up, developing, your developmental cycle with a great man.

02:42:53.000 It's very hard for me, because men want to be the lion, right?

02:42:56.000 That's why the lion kicks the young lions out of the fucking den. 1.00

02:42:59.000 Like, get out of here, bitch. 1.00

02:43:01.000 Because you can't be the king.

02:43:02.000 I'm the king.

02:43:03.000 You can't be the king.

02:43:04.000 Well, this is a part of growing up as a man.

02:43:07.000 And some men know how to navigate that with their children, and they figure it out.

02:43:12.000 They figure out a way to let their son...

02:43:14.000 Damn, that's deep.

02:43:14.000 It is deep.

02:43:15.000 That's deep, man.

02:43:15.000 You gotta know when to back off.

02:43:17.000 That's a heavy burden to carry.

02:43:18.000 But you also have to have the respect of your son, too.

02:43:21.000 They have to respect you.

02:43:22.000 They can't disrespect you.

02:43:23.000 And there's an instinct to disrespect the man to prove that you're the man.

02:43:27.000 So it's tricky.

02:43:28.000 That's right.

02:43:29.000 They're not even being a bad person.

02:43:31.000 It's a genetic instinct.

02:43:33.000 My wife's got to kind of curb me a lot too because she's like, listen, do you want your son to be a great athlete?

02:43:38.000 Do you want to have a great relationship with him?

02:43:41.000 And she's like, you have to...

02:43:42.000 That's deep.

02:43:43.000 You have to treat him with respect.

02:43:45.000 So the thing that we're on now is don't humiliate him, especially in front of people.

02:43:50.000 You talk to him the way that you want him to be addressed by other men.

02:43:53.000 Would you want another man talking to your son that way?

02:43:55.000 And so she always challenges me that way.

02:43:58.000 It's like, hey listen.

02:43:58.000 That's very wise.

02:43:59.000 If you want him to be a leader someday, he can't have this subservient attitude and bow to authority because you've always been at his head for so long.

02:44:11.000 You have to allow him to grow up and for him to operate as a man.

02:44:16.000 And you have to treat him with respect.

02:44:18.000 You can't humiliate him in front of people.

02:44:20.000 You can't belittle him.

02:44:22.000 You have to treat him like a man.

02:44:24.000 I know it's hard.

02:44:24.000 I know he's frustrating and hard to raise, but he's six.

02:44:29.000 Yeah.

02:44:31.000 He's not doing this to spite you.

02:44:33.000 He's just six.

02:44:34.000 He doesn't understand.

02:44:35.000 So at some point, you know, do you want him to love and hug you as an old man?

02:44:41.000 Or do you want him to say, what's up, dad?

02:44:44.000 You know, I want hugs.

02:44:45.000 I want an intimate relationship with my son.

02:44:48.000 I hope that...

02:44:48.000 Your wife is very wise.

02:44:49.000 Yeah, she's a good woman. 0.97

02:44:50.000 That's a great perspective, too.

02:44:52.000 She's a good woman.

02:44:52.000 Sometimes it's hard when you're in the middle, like, you know, I have children, I know what it's like when you're in the middle of raising kids, like there's chaos, and this one wants attention while you're upset with this one, and then there's another one behind you breaking glasses.

02:45:04.000 Kids are crazy!

02:45:05.000 They're wild!

02:45:06.000 They're little people, and they have their own little challenges, and they have their own...

02:45:09.000 I mean, every little child is the master of their own little world, and it's very difficult to manage all of those simultaneously.

02:45:16.000 But what she said about your kid, that's very wise.

02:45:20.000 And I think that's...

02:45:22.000 Whatever your kid does, he's gonna understand, like I said, about what you do, that there's a certain requirement for excellence.

02:45:30.000 Yeah.

02:45:31.000 And who you are as a man, not just as an athlete, but who you are as a man is going to reflect.

02:45:38.000 Yeah, that's real.

02:45:39.000 That's real.

02:45:39.000 That's the hardest part about this is not only how do I want to present myself to the world, how do I want to present my kids to the world?

02:45:46.000 I put some pressure on my boy.

02:45:47.000 I'm like, hey, listen, when you leave this house, you represent the bro's name.

02:45:51.000 And that's big shoes to fill.

02:45:53.000 But bro, listen, people do either one of two things.

02:45:56.000 They either fold because of pressure or they rise to expectations.

02:46:00.000 You have the ability to be great.

02:46:02.000 I'm gonna put you in position to be great.

02:46:03.000 I promise you, if you listen to your mom and dad, you will have a great life.

02:46:08.000 Because I'm going to do my due diligence with my faith, with my reading, with the things that I learned to make sure that I put you in position to be successful.

02:46:15.000 All I ask is that you work hard and that you treat people with respect and that you listen to mom and dad.

02:46:21.000 You listen to us, your life will be great.

02:46:24.000 And so I'm trying to teach him that, but he's still, you know, he's sick.

02:46:27.000 So he's combative a little bit and he's trying to figure things out.

02:46:30.000 Every six-year-old is.

02:46:31.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:46:32.000 I know, right?

02:46:33.000 You take it personal sometimes, though.

02:46:35.000 You're like, no, there's no other six-year-old kid.

02:46:37.000 He did that on purpose.

02:46:38.000 He spilled the milk on the floor because he knew I had a long practice last night and I'm tired.

02:46:42.000 And sometimes there's a little of that, too.

02:46:43.000 Sometimes they cause a little trouble just to get some extra attention.

02:46:46.000 Yeah, that's it, bro.

02:46:47.000 That's it.

02:46:48.000 And it's It's rewarding too though, man.

02:46:50.000 I mean, when your kids hug you, I'm sure.

02:46:52.000 Like for me, when I come home and they run to me and hug me, it's the greatest feeling on earth.

02:46:57.000 It's these little people that you created and they love you.

02:47:01.000 Little people. 0.82

02:47:01.000 They love you so much. 0.82

02:47:02.000 They just can't wait to hug you.

02:47:03.000 I know.

02:47:04.000 And you have fun with them.

02:47:05.000 It's like, it's a beautiful thing, man.

02:47:07.000 And a lot of people, you know, they're going through it with varying degrees of stress in their life and bad relationships and You and I are both very lucky that we have good relationships.

02:47:18.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:47:18.000 You need them, bro.

02:47:19.000 Yeah, you need that, man.

02:47:20.000 That helps you more than anything in life to achieve.

02:47:23.000 And I remind my wife of that all the time, that she's one of the reasons why I can be successful.

02:47:29.000 Yeah, you should.

02:47:29.000 Because I don't have this other conflict that I have to deal with all the time.

02:47:33.000 Like I say, I have friends that are in bad relationships, and it hampers other things they do in their life.

02:47:40.000 Are they successful?

02:47:41.000 Some of them are and some of them aren't.

02:47:42.000 And some of them probably should be more successful than they are.

02:47:46.000 And I think that bad relationship thing, that extra conflict, if you have a certain amount of bandwidth for your resources.

02:47:54.000 I use this point all the time, but I'll say it again.

02:47:58.000 Say if the amount of resources you have in your mind and put it in a number, like 100 units.

02:48:04.000 Well, if you have a shit relationship, that's just eating up 30 units no matter what you do.

02:48:09.000 You only have 70 units.

02:48:11.000 You're starting down every day.

02:48:11.000 And then the guy down the street who has a great relationship with his family and his wife, that guy's got a hundred units.

02:48:16.000 And that guy has an advantage.

02:48:18.000 If you're both doing the same things, he has more resources to apply to his thing.

02:48:22.000 Because he doesn't have this constant throbbing distraction and angst in this thing.

02:48:26.000 He doesn't want to go home.

02:48:28.000 His fucking wife's home. 0.96

02:48:29.000 He wants to go to the bar and pound shots.

02:48:31.000 What the fuck am I doing, man?

02:48:33.000 Why did I do this?

02:48:34.000 That's a lot of people, man.

02:48:35.000 You know what's crazy, though, is like...

02:48:37.000 You need a wife that understands your ambition, understands that you're driven.

02:48:44.000 And that's why my wife's been such a blessing because I was an Olympic champion before we were married.

02:48:49.000 And so initially when I was courting her, we're like, okay, where are we going to live?

02:48:53.000 What are we going to do?

02:48:54.000 Am I going to be able to continue to pursue my career?

02:48:56.000 And for a while it was a battle because, you know, she extremely smart, master's degree from Columbia in journalism, wrote for the Buffalo newspaper.

02:49:05.000 And she had to make this transition where she had built this reputation for herself to now all of a sudden she leaves her home of Buffalo, New York, comes to live with me in Lincoln, Nebraska, and no one knows her.

02:49:15.000 And so there was times where we would conflict and battle because people would be like, man, you're so lucky, like you married JB. And she'd be like, well, I had a life of my own.

02:49:25.000 I was an individual that was driven and I had people that recognized me and I've won awards and done tremendous things.

02:49:34.000 We're good to go.

02:49:48.000 I love what we're able to do and provide as the breadwinners and make sure our families are taken care of.

02:49:54.000 But women lose so much, bro, of their identity. 0.51

02:49:56.000 They lose their name.

02:49:57.000 They lose their families.

02:49:58.000 And whatever dreams it was that they possessed before they married us, a lot of times they lose that because now they're at home with the kids, taking care of them while we're out pursuing our aspirations.

02:50:07.000 And so for me, it was important to bring my wife alongside me.

02:50:10.000 It was like, this isn't just my thing.

02:50:11.000 This is our thing.

02:50:12.000 When I wrestle, we all wrestle.

02:50:14.000 When I win, we all win.

02:50:15.000 As opposed to, hey, I got to go to practice.

02:50:17.000 See you later.

02:50:18.000 That's why wherever I go, my family comes with me.

02:50:20.000 All competitions, most training camps, because it's easy to have that conflict where When I'm in the wrestling room, I feel like I need to be with my fam.

02:50:28.000 When I'm with my fam, I feel like I need to be in the wrestling room training.

02:50:32.000 So I think the great thing about having a great wife is she understands that this is what I love to do.

02:50:37.000 This is what makes me feel purposeful and passionate.

02:50:40.000 And so she allows me to do that because she knows that when I return home, I'm going to give my best effort because I'm whole.

02:50:47.000 Because I've been able to do what I love.

02:50:49.000 And there's no resentment built up.

02:50:51.000 But if she's taking me away from that, she's going to be... 0.97

02:50:54.000 I'll be half of myself and it'd be really hard for me to co-exist.

02:50:57.000 There.

02:50:58.000 You know what I mean?

02:50:59.000 I totally understand.

02:51:00.000 And I think it points to what we were saying earlier, that you are a champion in life.

02:51:05.000 Yeah.

02:51:05.000 And you apply the same principles that led you to become a champion wrestler to become a human being that does the right thing.

02:51:13.000 A human being that behaves their best, that thinks their best, that does the right things.

02:51:18.000 And that is why I think you should go into public speaking.

02:51:22.000 Public speaking.

02:51:22.000 Because I think you can teach that shit.

02:51:23.000 There it is again.

02:51:24.000 That's three times.

02:51:24.000 Gotta go now.

02:51:25.000 I think you can.

02:51:26.000 Man, man!

02:51:27.000 Listen, I always think of athletes in terms of what they're going to do when it's over because I've seen a lot of bad stories.

02:51:35.000 It's particularly with fighters.

02:51:36.000 It's scary.

02:51:37.000 Well, particularly with fighters that nobody wants to talk about, a lot of them are mentally compromised after their career is over.

02:51:42.000 They're dealing with depression.

02:51:43.000 They're dealing with headaches.

02:51:44.000 They're dealing with traumatic brain injury.

02:51:46.000 Some of them get treatment.

02:51:47.000 Some of them don't.

02:51:48.000 Some of them start drinking.

02:51:49.000 So you think CTE exists?

02:51:51.000 It's 100% real.

02:51:52.000 And the UFC? 100%.

02:51:53.000 There's no doubt about it.

02:51:55.000 If you're getting hit in the head, you're getting traumatic brain injuries.

02:51:59.000 There's no doubt about it.

02:52:00.000 I mean, you watch some of these fights that are so exciting.

02:52:02.000 Look, for the majority, they're going to be fine and they'll know when to get out.

02:52:08.000 And there's modalities, there's different recovery methods, there's different things you could do to try to help yourself and to achieve a healthy life.

02:52:16.000 And it can be done.

02:52:17.000 But there's guys who don't do that, and there's guys who stay in too long, and there's guys who take those extra shots to the head when they shouldn't, and there's guys who they have bad training methods where they slug it out in training.

02:52:29.000 That's real common as well.

02:52:30.000 So they're going into fights already concussed.

02:52:33.000 They're going into fights with already taking too many shots.

02:52:36.000 Some guys lose their career in the training room because in the training room they're going to war.

02:52:43.000 They're beating the shit out of each other.

02:52:45.000 They're going full blast.

02:52:46.000 And then there's other guys that are training and fighting intelligently, and they have much longer careers.

02:52:51.000 That's why I love what Connor's doing right now.

02:52:54.000 And I just follow him on social, so I don't really know personally, but it seems like he's very strategic about what he does now.

02:53:03.000 Because he's got a lot of money, right?

02:53:04.000 When you get money, you start to think about things differently.

02:53:06.000 You don't have to grind like you used to.

02:53:08.000 But you also can bring a certain level of professionalism around what it is that you do.

02:53:13.000 You know, wrestling is kind of a primitive sport where you just get in the room, bang it out for a couple hours, do a bunch of sprints on the bike, and you go home.

02:53:22.000 Where I feel like guys like Conor now, they're starting to have a nutritionist or a dietitian.

02:53:28.000 They've got wrestling coach, boxing coach, jiu-jitsu coach.

02:53:31.000 And then the camp is surrounded around him.

02:53:36.000 He's not in a room with 12, 15 other guys that are just rolling around with a single coach.

02:53:43.000 He's like, I need one training partner for each discipline and that's it.

02:53:48.000 And I think that's how it goes and that's how it should go.

02:53:51.000 You shouldn't have to take reps.

02:53:53.000 You shouldn't have to have people punching you.

02:53:55.000 You shouldn't have to have people double-legging you into the wall and putting you down.

02:54:00.000 You should be doing all of the reps.

02:54:02.000 Well, they're going to have to do that, too, though.

02:54:04.000 You need MMA sparring. 1.00

02:54:05.000 You need something that puts it together.

02:54:07.000 Sparring, but control sparring, because you need someone who's going to come into the room and say, listen, this is Conor, bro.

02:54:13.000 You're not here to film this and become a star on the internet.

02:54:18.000 That's true, but let me tell you something.

02:54:19.000 Firas Zahabi, who's one of the greatest MMA coaches of all time.

02:54:22.000 Firas used to pay people to try to knock George St. Pierre out.

02:54:26.000 He said, you have to put George in danger.

02:54:28.000 He goes, you can't just let him think that he's going to be okay and let him coast.

02:54:32.000 He goes, I want you to put George in danger.

02:54:34.000 He's like, I will give you more money if you can knock him out.

02:54:38.000 Yeah, I will give you a reward if you can knock him out.

02:54:40.000 I don't know if he told George.

02:54:42.000 If George didn't know, I think that would be...

02:54:44.000 He might have told him.

02:54:45.000 That would be pretty cool, actually.

02:54:46.000 I think he might have told him.

02:54:47.000 I'm not sure, but I know that George is aware of it now, and I know that it made George one of the greatest MMA fighters of all time, but not always.

02:54:55.000 They don't always spar like that.

02:54:57.000 He's like, George, all right, it's going to be easy, light spar, just have a good time, make sure he's sharp.

02:55:01.000 He wouldn't lie to him.

02:55:02.000 And then he'd go to the guy like, kill him.

02:55:07.000 No, he wouldn't lie to him, but Feras is very intelligent, and Feras' perspective was you have to simulate danger.

02:55:17.000 You have to produce danger.

02:55:19.000 You're going to experience danger inside that octagon, and it can't be a unique thing.

02:55:24.000 It can't be a foreign thing that you're not accustomed to.

02:55:27.000 So you have to reproduce real danger in sparring, so that when they get into the octagon, their instincts are already honed.

02:55:35.000 I like that.

02:55:35.000 They're already razor sharp.

02:55:36.000 I like that.

02:55:37.000 But you can't do it too much because you don't want to get brain damage.

02:55:40.000 But you look at George now at 30, I think he's 37, 38 years old.

02:55:44.000 He's lucid.

02:55:46.000 He speaks well.

02:55:47.000 He's great.

02:55:47.000 He's super healthy.

02:55:48.000 Well, he got out early too, though.

02:55:50.000 Well, he did the right thing.

02:55:51.000 He felt his enthusiasm waning because he was overworked.

02:55:56.000 He was tired.

02:55:56.000 He fought so many times.

02:55:57.000 He just squawked by with a real close decision to Johnny Hendricks.

02:56:01.000 What's he doing now?

02:56:02.000 Well, he's thinking about fighting again.

02:56:03.000 He's not sure if he wants to.

02:56:05.000 I think they were talking about trying to set up a fight with him and Khabib Nurmagomedov.

02:56:10.000 And if they could do that, I think George would come back.

02:56:13.000 But I don't think George would come back.

02:56:14.000 That's big, big, big money.

02:56:15.000 Woo! 0.99

02:56:16.000 Crazy.

02:56:16.000 That might be the biggest fight in the history of the sport.

02:56:18.000 The biggest, bro.

02:56:20.000 If you're not even a fight fan, everyone knows GSP. GSP was the original superstar.

02:56:25.000 And he stays in shape.

02:56:28.000 GSP never gets fat.

02:56:29.000 He's rich.

02:56:30.000 He's a professional, man.

02:56:30.000 He just posted a picture just a few days ago of him after a three-day fast.

02:56:34.000 He's fucking shredded.

02:56:36.000 What's he done in the last five, six years?

02:56:39.000 Works his martial arts.

02:56:40.000 He's constantly training.

02:56:41.000 He's constantly doing jiu-jitsu.

02:56:42.000 Always.

02:56:43.000 He's like, I'm waiting for the right offer.

02:56:45.000 Look at him.

02:56:45.000 That's him.

02:56:46.000 The right guy.

02:56:46.000 Just a couple days ago.

02:56:48.000 Bro.

02:56:48.000 He shredded!

02:56:50.000 He always trains.

02:56:52.000 So, when he fought Michael Bisping and won the middleweight title...

02:56:55.000 Someone said, three days of no water, what's the benefit?

02:56:58.000 No, no, no, that's not what it is.

02:56:59.000 It's a water fast.

02:57:00.000 He just drinks water.

02:57:01.000 Yeah, just water.

02:57:02.000 For three days, but they said three days, no water.

02:57:04.000 No, no, that's ridiculous.

02:57:05.000 That's an idiot.

02:57:06.000 That's some dummy. 0.98

02:57:08.000 Bro, look at him.

02:57:09.000 He's, what, 38?

02:57:10.000 I think so.

02:57:10.000 I think he's 37 or 38. Damn, I want to look like that in five, six years.

02:57:14.000 Well, you know, he's dedicated to health and wellness, and he's also dedicated to martial arts.

02:57:19.000 Like, he trains because he wants— He's been lurking.

02:57:22.000 Yes.

02:57:22.000 He's been lurking, waiting for the right opportunity to present itself.

02:57:25.000 Well, that's what he did with Michael Bisping.

02:57:26.000 So why didn't he fight Conor?

02:57:28.000 Well, he's too big.

02:57:30.000 George is too big?

02:57:30.000 Yeah, George is big.

02:57:31.000 How big is Conor?

02:57:32.000 Conor legitimately should be fighting at 155 pounds.

02:57:35.000 He won the title at 145. There's no fucking way in hell George St. Pierre is ever making 145 pounds.

02:57:41.000 He's much bigger than that.

02:57:43.000 He's tall, right?

02:57:44.000 He's wide.

02:57:45.000 He's a thick dude.

02:57:46.000 I mean, Conor has fought at 170. He fought Cowboy at 170, but Cowboy's not really a 170. He fought Nate Diaz at 170, and Nate Diaz is not really a 170 either.

02:57:55.000 These guys are capable of making 155. I mean, obviously they weighed 170 when they fought, but But you got a guy like Kamaru Usman.

02:58:02.000 You're like, you ain't messing with him.

02:58:03.000 That's a different monster.

02:58:05.000 Exactly.

02:58:06.000 Exactly.

02:58:06.000 The big 170s.

02:58:08.000 The real, strong, powerful wrestlers.

02:58:12.000 They're too big.

02:58:13.000 And I think George is there.

02:58:14.000 George is at that 170. I mean, look, maybe...

02:58:17.000 If Kamaru wins against Gilbert Burns, that would be a crazy fight too.

02:58:22.000 But I think the real big money is in Khabib because it's a super fight.

02:58:28.000 Khabib is undefeated.

02:58:29.000 I think he's 29-0.

02:58:31.000 He's dominated everybody.

02:58:33.000 He's the most spectacular example of a champion we've ever seen.

02:58:36.000 Yeah.

02:58:37.000 I mean, he just dominates.

02:58:39.000 That fucking guy just dominates.

02:58:41.000 It's workman-like.

02:58:41.000 He's a monster.

02:58:42.000 That's what I appreciate about Khabib is that he is very intentional and deliberate with his precision, like almost surgical in the ring.

02:58:54.000 He just walks you down, punch, psh, alright, I'm good.

02:58:57.000 Well, the Gaethje fight really showed what he was made of because Gaethje has been able to chop everyone's legs apart and he was landing shots on Khabib. 0.54

02:59:04.000 He was lost.

02:59:05.000 And Khabib just kept chasing him down, chasing him down. 0.99

02:59:07.000 Which is crazy because I drank the Kool-Aid.

02:59:10.000 I'm like, well, damn, maybe Khabib is in trouble here.

02:59:13.000 Maybe this is going to be his toughest test.

02:59:15.000 Well, he was in danger, but he wasn't in trouble.

02:59:17.000 He was in a dangerous situation.

02:59:18.000 Yes, his leg was in trouble.

02:59:20.000 His left leg was getting kicked.

02:59:21.000 Have you ever been kicked in the calf?

02:59:23.000 It's a crazy feeling.

02:59:24.000 I have not.

02:59:24.000 I don't desire to be.

02:59:25.000 Don't do it.

02:59:26.000 It's It's horrible.

02:59:27.000 It's horrible, man.

02:59:28.000 It's like a jolt.

02:59:30.000 The nerves.

02:59:32.000 It's such a sore area.

02:59:34.000 When you get hit there, you get hit there once or twice, and you lose a lot of your ability to move correctly.

02:59:40.000 A lot of times, your feet go numb.

02:59:42.000 That happened to Michael Chandler in a fight once.

02:59:44.000 He got kicked low.

02:59:45.000 It happened to Henry Cejudo against Mighty Mouse.

02:59:47.000 That's right, Michael Chandler.

02:59:48.000 He couldn't even get his footing back.

02:59:49.000 I remember that.

02:59:50.000 Your nerves stop working and your foot drops.

02:59:53.000 It's just like you can't get it to work.

02:59:55.000 And you try to step on it, it just gives out on you.

02:59:57.000 It's crazy.

02:59:57.000 I remember that.

02:59:58.000 It happened to Henry.

02:59:58.000 When Henry Cejudo fought Mighty Mouse in the second fight, in the first round, Mighty Mouse kicked him with a low calf kick and Henry's leg went numb.

03:00:06.000 There's nothing you can do about it.

03:00:07.000 It's a crazy kick.

03:00:09.000 Justin Gage is the best at that.

03:00:11.000 He's the best at that.

03:00:12.000 And Khabib was chasing him down and Justin kept chopping at that leg.

03:00:15.000 And it was in a bad place.

03:00:18.000 I mean, he'd hurt him.

03:00:19.000 But Khabib is such a fucking monster. 1.00

03:00:22.000 Turned out, after the fight, Khabib was fighting with a broken foot.

03:00:25.000 So he was doing all that with a broken foot.

03:00:27.000 They x-rayed his foot as a cracked bone.

03:00:30.000 So that's why, and I agree with you, but mindset is the most important part of being a champion.

03:00:37.000 Because Khabib, obviously, he's got a great body physically. 0.57

03:00:40.000 He's physically very strong.

03:00:41.000 He's very athletic.

03:00:42.000 But there's a lot of guys that have that.

03:00:45.000 It's the mind.

03:00:46.000 The mind.

03:00:46.000 The mind's everything.

03:00:47.000 The mind's a powerful thing.

03:00:48.000 So that's why if you're building the perfect fighter, You have to build their mind first.

03:00:54.000 That's everything.

03:00:55.000 That's what Custom Model used to hypnotize Mike Tyson. 1.00

03:00:58.000 He used to tell Mike Tyson that you don't exist.

03:01:02.000 The task exists.

03:01:03.000 And he used to tell him this when he was 13 years old.

03:01:06.000 I like that.

03:01:06.000 Teach him how to break people down.

03:01:07.000 It's not about you.

03:01:08.000 You don't exist.

03:01:09.000 That's just nonsense.

03:01:10.000 It's going to get in the way.

03:01:11.000 The task exists.

03:01:12.000 You have to break this man.

03:01:13.000 I like that.

03:01:14.000 I'm going to use that.

03:01:16.000 It's heavy.

03:01:17.000 You don't exist.

03:01:18.000 The task exists.

03:01:20.000 Jordan Burroughs, we just did three hours.

03:01:22.000 Flew by.

03:01:22.000 This is dope, bro.

03:01:23.000 Hey, my pleasure.

03:01:24.000 Let me give a shout out to the Buffalo Bills, though.

03:01:27.000 Playing well.

03:01:28.000 Are you a football fan?

03:01:29.000 Nope.

03:01:29.000 No?

03:01:29.000 You don't watch?

03:01:30.000 I don't watch any sports.

03:01:31.000 My wife's from Buffalo.

03:01:32.000 So I grew up in South Jersey, so everyone where I'm from are Eagles fans.

03:01:36.000 And when I got married, met my wife in Buffalo, I'm like, damn, I want to be affiliated with that team.

03:01:40.000 Her uncle Thurman Thomas played for the Bills.

03:01:42.000 Is that a Bills Mafia t-shirt?

03:01:44.000 Bills Mafia.

03:01:45.000 So I'm sure you've seen the Bills Mafia.

03:01:46.000 There you go.

03:01:48.000 New York State, Buffalo Bills, old school, new school.

03:01:51.000 Great, great year in the playoffs.

03:01:53.000 Won the AFCs for the first time in like 25 years.

03:01:56.000 Something crazy.

03:01:57.000 Something crazy.

03:01:58.000 And they're playing soon.

03:01:59.000 Beautiful.

03:02:00.000 They're playing Saturday.

03:02:00.000 Well, listen.

03:02:01.000 Good luck in your match.

03:02:02.000 It's either this week or next week.

03:02:04.000 Whatever it is.

03:02:04.000 Yeah, we're going to make it happen.

03:02:05.000 We're going to try to figure it out.

03:02:06.000 Make it happen.

03:02:08.000 It's difficult during these COVID times, right?

03:02:10.000 It's wild.

03:02:11.000 It's a wild time.

03:02:12.000 It is.

03:02:13.000 From tracing to...

03:02:14.000 It's wild.

03:02:15.000 All of it.

03:02:15.000 I'm ready for it to be over.

03:02:17.000 Well, thank you, brother.

03:02:17.000 It's been an honor.

03:02:18.000 I really appreciate it.

03:02:19.000 Thanks, bro.

03:02:19.000 Appreciate you being here.

03:02:20.000 Appreciate you.

03:02:20.000 Good luck with everything you do.

03:02:21.000 And seriously, think about what I'm saying.

03:02:24.000 Yeah, man.

03:02:25.000 I got you.

03:02:25.000 You could do great things.

03:02:28.000 Listen, I'm coming for your recommendation.

03:02:30.000 Do it.

03:02:30.000 Please do it.

03:02:31.000 Wherever I go, I'm like, listen, Joe told me that I should.

03:02:33.000 Jordan Burroughs, ladies and gentlemen.

03:02:34.000 Thanks, bro.

03:02:34.000 Bye, everybody.

The Joe Rogan Experience - January 08, 2021

Joe Rogan Experience #1591 - Jordan Burroughs

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Transcript