The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #567 - Cameron Hanes

00:00:14.000 Pumped up with caffeine, straight off the plane and in traffic.

00:00:19.000 Cameron Haynes, ladies and gentlemen.

00:00:21.000 Good to see you, buddy.

00:00:22.000 What's up, man? 0.98

00:00:23.000 You fucking literally pushed through all night. 0.99

00:00:26.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:00:27.000 Yeah, it was a grind.

00:00:29.000 And then the L.A. traffic.

00:00:31.000 Oh, dude.

00:00:33.000 There's something about L.A. traffic that's so frustrating.

00:00:36.000 More frustrating than even no sleep.

00:00:39.000 Oh, yeah.

00:00:40.000 No sleep is fine.

00:00:41.000 I mean...

00:00:42.000 That's gravy.

00:00:43.000 I do that all the time.

00:00:44.000 But even today, I want to get here.

00:00:47.000 I want to get here on time.

00:00:48.000 I hate being late anywhere.

00:00:50.000 I'm a pretty punctual person.

00:00:52.000 And just the traffic.

00:00:54.000 I was honking to the guy ahead of me just to go 50 feet further because he was texting.

00:00:59.000 He was letting that gap get too big.

00:01:00.000 And I'm like, okay, I'm not going to go anywhere, but I'm going to be 50 feet ahead of where we're at.

00:01:05.000 Yeah, there's something going on here. 1.00

00:01:07.000 There's too many goddamn people. 1.00

00:01:09.000 I don't know what the fuck LA is going to be like in 10 years. 1.00

00:01:12.000 I came here in 94, so I've been here for 20 years now. 0.97

00:01:15.000 And when I first came here, it was nothing like this.

00:01:18.000 Traffic sucked, but it didn't suck to the point where you're like, this doesn't make sense.

00:01:18.000 Nothing like this.

00:01:24.000 This is just unmanageable. 1.00

00:01:25.000 There's too many goddamn people. 0.99

00:01:27.000 Yeah, it's tough. 1.00

00:01:29.000 And you live in Oregon, which is like way more relaxed.

00:01:31.000 You spend all this time in the woods shooting arrows at elk.

00:01:35.000 The way quieter, way less people.

00:01:35.000 Yeah.

00:01:38.000 The good life. 0.99

00:01:39.000 Now we're forcing you to get on that fucking goofy 101 and get jammed up in the boxes of metal and fucking breed that carbon dioxide. 1.00

00:01:39.000 The good life. 1.00

00:01:48.000 It's worth it to be here.

00:01:49.000 Of course it is.

00:01:50.000 Of course it is, my friend.

00:01:52.000 Good to see you again, buddy.

00:01:53.000 Great seeing you.

00:01:54.000 So what are you doing?

00:01:54.000 You hanging out with Luke Bryan?

00:01:56.000 Listening to country music songs?

00:01:56.000 Yeah.

00:01:58.000 This motherfucker got me hooked on some country music pop songs. 1.00

00:02:03.000 I know. 1.00

00:02:04.000 I told him.

00:02:05.000 We're bear hunting and watching music videos.

00:02:08.000 Country music videos.

00:02:09.000 And you're like, what are we watching?

00:02:12.000 Well, our friends John and Jen, let's give them a plug.

00:02:16.000 Live in the Dream.

00:02:17.000 What is their website?

00:02:19.000 Is it liveinthedream?

00:02:20.000 Probably liveinthedream.com.

00:02:22.000 Hold on.

00:02:23.000 I don't actually have to remember anything anymore.

00:02:26.000 I Google everything.

00:02:27.000 I know, right?

00:02:27.000 Isn't that amazing?

00:02:28.000 Living the dream with John and Jen, right?

00:02:30.000 Something like that, yeah.

00:02:33.000 We'll find it.

00:02:35.000 But anyway, yeah, Livin' the Dream Productions.

00:02:40.000 That's what it is.

00:02:43.000 Livinthedreamproductions.com.

00:02:44.000 And those are our friends in Canada, up in Alberta.

00:02:49.000 And that's where we went bear hunting. 1.00

00:02:51.000 And these motherfuckers, all they listen to is country music. 1.00

00:02:54.000 And all they watch is country music television. 1.00

00:02:56.000 That's all you need.

00:02:57.000 Yeah.

00:02:59.000 So every day there was me mocking it.

00:03:02.000 Some of it is really good.

00:03:04.000 I like a lot of country music.

00:03:06.000 I really do.

00:03:06.000 We had Sturgill Simpson on this week.

00:03:08.000 I fucking love that guy. 0.98

00:03:09.000 I don't know if you ever heard Sturgill Simpson. 0.99

00:03:10.000 No.

00:03:11.000 I saw your plug though and I was thinking I'm going to check him out.

00:03:14.000 Oh, he's good, man.

00:03:15.000 He's real old school, like Merle Haggard style country music.

00:03:20.000 He's legit.

00:03:21.000 I'll play you some later.

00:03:22.000 Okay.

00:03:23.000 You guys just won't let it go.

00:03:25.000 There was no breakups.

00:03:27.000 It was just every day. 0.99

00:03:29.000 It didn't like every now and then, let's watch Yo MTV raps or whatever the fuck. 0.99

00:03:33.000 It was just country music, television, over and over again, being surrounded by deer heads. 0.98

00:03:39.000 You would think that you were in Alabama somewhere, but no, we're two hours north of Edmonton.

00:03:44.000 Yeah, but what happened?

00:03:46.000 What's the moral to the story?

00:03:48.000 I don't know.

00:03:49.000 Oh, they got me. 1.00

00:03:50.000 They got me singing that fucking Luke Bryan song, man. 1.00

00:03:52.000 Play it again. 1.00

00:03:53.000 Shit! 1.00

00:03:55.000 I was somewhere, I forget where it was, and it started coming out and I knew the fucking words. 1.00

00:04:00.000 And I started humming it along and I'm like, fucking Cam Haynes, he got me. 0.99

00:04:04.000 Yeah, so we were listening to Luke Bryan skinning out your bear. 0.99

00:04:08.000 Yeah.

00:04:08.000 And that's just...

00:04:09.000 I don't know.

00:04:10.000 It works.

00:04:12.000 It's etched in your memory.

00:04:13.000 What is it about country music and outdoors people, though?

00:04:17.000 Because I always associated country music with the South, but it's a big Canada thing, too, especially northern Canada.

00:04:25.000 I don't know.

00:04:26.000 I think it's just grassroots people, hard-working people, and they identify with country music.

00:04:33.000 Hard-working people can't like ACDC? No.

00:04:36.000 That's not true.

00:04:37.000 That doesn't make any sense.

00:04:38.000 That's for head-banging paw smokers. 1.00

00:04:41.000 Oh, my people.

00:04:43.000 I've got a bunch of my people in various walks of life.

00:04:45.000 My people are confused.

00:04:46.000 They don't know where to go.

00:04:48.000 Yeah, you appeal to a wide range.

00:04:51.000 Now bow hunters.

00:04:52.000 Yeah, I'm mixing it up.

00:04:53.000 I always say that I'm the bridge between the meatheads and the potheads.

00:04:56.000 I'm the bridge.

00:04:57.000 I bring them all together.

00:04:59.000 I'm an island.

00:05:00.000 Just bow hunters.

00:05:01.000 Cam Haines Island.

00:05:03.000 So, you've had a bunch of hunts since I saw you.

00:05:06.000 You killed two elk, one in Colorado, one in Utah.

00:05:10.000 I saw the pictures.

00:05:11.000 And you did an Africa hunt.

00:05:13.000 Yeah, Tanzania.

00:05:14.000 But you did a real Africa hunt. 0.99

00:05:15.000 Not one of those pussy-ass, high-fence, hunting in a backyard scenarios. 0.99

00:05:21.000 You were out in the wilds of Africa. 0.99

00:05:23.000 Yeah, definitely the wilds of Africa. 0.98

00:05:25.000 I was with Greenleaf Tanzania.

00:05:27.000 And it's, you know, planes don't even fly over there.

00:05:32.000 Where we were hunting...

00:05:34.000 No rows, no anything.

00:05:36.000 I mean, to bounce around in a Jeep, it'd take you eight hours to cross the, I guess, the piece of property we were hunting.

00:05:43.000 And it's very expansive, wild.

00:05:45.000 And when you bow hunt in these areas, how often are people bow hunting in these areas?

00:05:50.000 Or is it mostly rifle hunting and you just come in and bow hunt?

00:05:53.000 Right.

00:05:55.000 Where I had been, there had never been a bow hunter there.

00:05:58.000 So bow hunting in Tanzania has only been legal, I think, for seven years.

00:06:02.000 And so it's new.

00:06:05.000 And when people go there, it's expensive to get there.

00:06:08.000 It's time consuming.

00:06:09.000 The animals are very tough, very tough to kill.

00:06:13.000 Nobody really wants to screw around making it even harder with a bow, but that's where I come in.

00:06:20.000 I was our first bow hunter there ever.

00:06:22.000 A lot of people know about the controversy that's going on right now.

00:06:27.000 Steve Rinello wrote an excellent piece on this about what's going on in Africa.

00:06:32.000 With these high fence operations where people are...

00:06:35.000 A lot of it is people seeing a pretty girl with a dead animal and then freaking out and going off.

00:06:42.000 The most recent one wasn't even Africa.

00:06:45.000 Did you see this kid that shot an albino deer?

00:06:48.000 Yeah.

00:06:49.000 And he's getting death threats.

00:06:50.000 Yeah.

00:06:51.000 And it was a nice buck.

00:06:52.000 Yeah, it's a deer. 1.00

00:06:53.000 It's a fucking deer. 1.00

00:06:54.000 It happens to be white. 1.00

00:06:55.000 Who wouldn't shoot it? 0.98

00:06:56.000 Yeah, they're like, you can't let it go.

00:06:57.000 You can't let it live.

00:06:58.000 Yeah.

00:06:59.000 So it can become a wood fairy and cure cancer.

00:07:02.000 A unicorn.

00:07:03.000 And invent 6G cellular.

00:07:05.000 No, it's just a deer.

00:07:06.000 It's a deer that has a rare disorder.

00:07:06.000 It's just a deer.

00:07:09.000 One out of every 20,000 deer turn out to be albino.

00:07:12.000 I guarantee those coyotes or anything else that would like to kill and eat a deer could care less what color it was. 0.63

00:07:18.000 Yeah, or it would have frozen to death, or it would have starved.

00:07:23.000 There's a lot of folks out there who just have this idealistic view of what nature is.

00:07:28.000 They have this view of nature being this... 0.96

00:07:31.000 Place of peace and harmony and it's a fucking brutal horrible environment where no one gets out alive All those animals die and they die they don't live past like seven or eight years if they're really really lucky exactly And the idea that there's something wrong with someone stepping in there and killing one of them and getting the meat off of it, 0.96

00:07:54.000 as opposed to going to a supermarket and getting some corralled up, penned up animal that's lived its life in hell, it just shows you how goofy we are today. 0.94

00:08:04.000 I know we're talking about Tanzania and now we're talking about meat, but the other day I put up a picture of me and you with your bear.

00:08:04.000 Yeah.

00:08:13.000 And just the comments I had from Facebook, one of them that just stuck out to me was, why would you kill a bear?

00:08:20.000 I thought bears were endangered.

00:08:22.000 They're definitely endangered in cities.

00:08:25.000 They're endangered if I'm around.

00:08:28.000 But no, there's...

00:08:31.000 How many bears are there?

00:08:33.000 Where we were, it's unbelievable how many bears are.

00:08:37.000 To your point, people are just so lost.

00:08:41.000 They just don't get it.

00:08:43.000 The bear numbers have never been higher than they are right now.

00:08:46.000 They need to be managed.

00:08:47.000 They need to be hunted.

00:08:48.000 And people still think they're endangered because I guess they don't see them down here at Starbucks.

00:08:52.000 Well, there's also the anthropomorphizing. 0.97

00:08:54.000 That's that expression where you connect human characteristics to animals like Yogi Bear and Donald Duck and shit like that. 1.00

00:09:04.000 These animals are so fucking ruthless. 0.99

00:09:07.000 The idea that people love bears is so beyond crazy. 0.99

00:09:12.000 While we were there, John's son, John, right?

00:09:15.000 Yeah.

00:09:16.000 John's son is John too, right?

00:09:18.000 What's John's name?

00:09:18.000 Yeah, Jonathan.

00:09:19.000 Jonathan, yeah.

00:09:19.000 Jonathan.

00:09:20.000 Jonathan watched a bear kill a cub, like, attack this female, killed a cub, ate half of it, then took off.

00:09:31.000 The female came back and finished off her own cub. 1.00

00:09:34.000 She ate it.

00:09:35.000 Right.

00:09:36.000 Like, these are the animals you're talking about.

00:09:38.000 These are the animals where, when spring rolls around, the bears wake up and they go out looking for cubs.

00:09:44.000 That's what they do.

00:09:45.000 They go out looking to eat cubs.

00:09:46.000 I had Sue Aiken.

00:09:54.000 I don't know if you've ever seen that show.

00:09:59.000 I haven't, no.

00:10:08.000 A young male bear attacked her and basically...

00:10:12.000 Yeah.

00:10:12.000 Is it a grizzly?

00:10:12.000 Basically, it wasn't...

00:10:14.000 She was like, if it was older, it would have eaten me. 1.00

00:10:16.000 But it just basically kicked my ass and took my territory. 1.00

00:10:20.000 Like, decided it took her territory. 1.00

00:10:22.000 So she went back and shot it and killed it. 1.00

00:10:23.000 Perfect. 1.00

00:10:24.000 She's a badass bitch. 1.00

00:10:24.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:10:26.000 She lives by herself in the middle of nowhere. 0.87

00:10:28.000 She's as gangster as they come. 1.00

00:10:30.000 But...

00:10:32.000 This idea that people have in their head about bears is that bears are these peaceful creatures of the forest.

00:10:39.000 They're like some of the most brutal predators and cannibals that we know of in nature. 1.00

00:10:44.000 And delicious.

00:10:45.000 Oh, yeah.

00:10:46.000 They're very delicious.

00:10:47.000 That's the other thing that I got from our trip.

00:10:50.000 People are like, why would you eat bear?

00:10:51.000 Why would you eat bear?

00:10:52.000 Bears are gross.

00:10:53.000 People don't even eat bear.

00:10:55.000 That's so not true.

00:10:56.000 Yeah.

00:10:57.000 No, we had some amazing meals up there off the bear we killed.

00:11:00.000 Yeah.

00:11:01.000 The gin just cooked up.

00:11:02.000 I mean, I remember sitting out there in that plastic table with all of us and just eating this food bite after bite thinking, this is some of the best meat I've ever had.

00:11:13.000 It's really good.

00:11:14.000 Yeah.

00:11:15.000 And people have this conception that you can't eat bear or bear meat isn't good.

00:11:19.000 It's just like amazing.

00:11:21.000 Yeah.

00:11:21.000 Well, any meat, if you don't prepare it right, if you don't take care of it after you kill it, you can get cow meat that rots if you don't take care of it, if you don't prep it, if you don't properly cool it and put it on ice or whatever you have to do, but Jen knows how to cook it.

00:11:37.000 She did a great job with it. 1.00

00:11:38.000 Oh yeah, it was good.

00:11:40.000 Yeah, like what you were talking about with those boars, they come out and they kill the cubs, you know, all a big male dominant boar cares about is his genetics being passed on.

00:11:49.000 So when he sees those cubs out there that aren't his, he's like, well, those aren't my genes, so he wants to kill them so that female comes back in heat, and then he can breed her, and that's the whole thing.

00:12:00.000 And then, as you said, once that cub, even that female's cub was dead, it went from being her cub When it was dead, then it was just, okay, it's just more food.

00:12:10.000 That was a transition.

00:12:12.000 There is no emotion involved in anything.

00:12:15.000 It's purely survival and purely passing on genes.

00:12:20.000 That's it.

00:12:21.000 And the numbers are stunning.

00:12:23.000 When we were up there, we saw so many bears.

00:12:26.000 We got to see a bear UFC bout.

00:12:28.000 Remember those two bears that were going at it?

00:12:30.000 Yeah.

00:12:30.000 Because the male kept coming back in and the female was trying to chase him off.

00:12:34.000 I mean, Cam and I were on the ground and we're probably like 20 yards from these bears duking it out.

00:12:41.000 Yeah.

00:12:41.000 And they were going, this one male bear kept sneaking back in.

00:12:44.000 He kept wanting to get to where the bait was, and the female was trying to chase him off because her cubs were there. 0.95

00:12:50.000 Her cubs ran up a tree, and she chased him off, and he came back, and she chased him off, and he came back, and then she took off, and then she's like, fuck this, and she came back in again, and then they started duking it out. 0.98

00:13:00.000 And when they're duking it out, they're like... 0.98

00:13:04.000 Primal.

00:13:05.000 Oh, it's so wild!

00:13:06.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:13:06.000 Because, I mean, this wasn't in a zoo.

00:13:09.000 I mean, they could have just said, you know what, fuck this, let's go eat those people. 1.00

00:13:13.000 They're right there! 1.00

00:13:14.000 And they just could have made a mad run for us. 1.00

00:13:16.000 We would have been fucked. 1.00

00:13:17.000 Oh, yeah. 0.99

00:13:18.000 Well, and you know, you mentioned the bait there, and that's another thing people don't really understand, because baiting gets a black eye sometimes for hunting.

00:13:28.000 But up there...

00:13:30.000 It's really the only way to control those bear numbers. 1.00

00:13:33.000 There's so many bear.

00:13:34.000 They kill so many moose.

00:13:35.000 The country is so thick. 0.99

00:13:37.000 If you're going to hunt them, you have to bring them to you somehow and be able to kill them. 0.56

00:13:43.000 If you didn't bait, you would probably never kill a bear up there.

00:13:47.000 The only time you would get one is maybe you would get the fall bears that were eating the berries on the hills where you could see them.

00:13:53.000 But the thickness of the forest, I compare it to like a box of Q-tips.

00:13:58.000 It's like you're not seeing anything. 0.99

00:14:01.000 30, 40 yards in, you're not seeing shit. 0.98

00:14:03.000 It's just all trees. 0.98

00:14:04.000 It's so dense.

00:14:06.000 And another key to baiting and seeing those bear up close is identifying what you're killing.

00:14:12.000 Because you want to take out those dominant males that have already bred...

00:14:16.000 That are older past their prime and that's what we're trying to kill up there.

00:14:19.000 We're not taking sows with cubs.

00:14:22.000 We're not taking young males that haven't reached John and Jen.

00:14:26.000 They like to kill seven foot plus black bear. 1.00

00:14:29.000 So to do that, people look at bear and all bear look the same to the uneducated eye.

00:14:34.000 Well, when you can see them up close, how we were hunting them on the ground, you get a real good idea of what you're shooting, what you're hunting, what you're going to pass up.

00:14:44.000 And that's a key, too.

00:14:45.000 So it's just wildlife management at its best, really.

00:14:50.000 Yeah, that's the best way to put it, wildlife management. 0.87

00:14:53.000 And the number of people that even hunt other animals are kind of a bit ignorant to it.

00:14:59.000 Like, there was folks that Jen was telling us that some local moose hunters were giving her a hard time. 0.81

00:15:05.000 And she was like, do you understand that the majority of these moose calves are getting killed by bears?

00:15:11.000 Right.

00:15:12.000 Like, the majority.

00:15:13.000 Right.

00:15:13.000 Like, when they're out of their mother, like, that bear smells that and starts looking for them.

00:15:18.000 It's like...

00:15:18.000 Yeah.

00:15:19.000 I mean, and that's nature.

00:15:20.000 That's what happens out there.

00:15:23.000 You can't blame the bear.

00:15:24.000 The bear's just being a bear.

00:15:24.000 No.

00:15:25.000 But you can control their numbers and help the moose.

00:15:28.000 Yeah, I couldn't help think about Grizzly Man, though, when we were out there.

00:15:32.000 I'm like, maybe...

00:15:32.000 Timothy Treadwell.

00:15:34.000 I'm like, how fucking... 0.98

00:15:35.000 I'm making fun of this Timothy Treadwell guy, like, on a daily basis. 0.99

00:15:39.000 Here I am, on the ground, standing next to this bow-hunting maniac who only hunts on the ground. 0.99

00:15:44.000 He doesn't want to go up in tree stands, because that's for pussies. 1.00

00:15:50.000 I just like being... 0.99

00:15:52.000 I don't know.

00:15:53.000 I like that connection with the animal on the ground.

00:15:56.000 Yeah, it's a connection.

00:15:57.000 Yeah.

00:15:57.000 I mean, it can be real and it can be very intense as you experience, but there's nothing like it for me.

00:16:05.000 It's very wild.

00:16:06.000 It's very wild.

00:16:08.000 It's a totally different kind of hunting because...

00:16:12.000 Just the sheer numbers.

00:16:13.000 You just really do see a lot of bear.

00:16:15.000 And John was saying that he thinks in his area where he hunts, there is somewhere between three and eight bear per square mile, which is a lot.

00:16:24.000 I mean, that is a lot of animals.

00:16:26.000 Yeah.

00:16:27.000 You know, people are used to seeing quite a few deer, quite a few elk, maybe if they live in the right country.

00:16:34.000 You know, white-tailed deer especially.

00:16:36.000 That's how bear are back there.

00:16:38.000 It's just amazing.

00:16:40.000 Yeah, it's a really wild place.

00:16:42.000 Alberta's amazing.

00:16:43.000 It's so beautiful.

00:16:44.000 It's just so thick with wilderness and trees, and there's just so much wildlife up there. 0.99

00:16:49.000 So much cool shit to see. 0.97

00:16:50.000 Yeah, and to me, that's the big... 0.98

00:16:54.000 I mean, that's one more draw for hunting, is when you're just driving through a country and you're just kind of in the cities and you're driving around maybe in a car, you don't get to experience what that country is.

00:17:06.000 I mean, to be out there, to live it, to, you know, when I go to all these places, Tanzania, Alberta, Australia...

00:17:13.000 And I live out there and sit on the ground and see the animals and hunt them one-on-one, that's when you really get to experience everything that country has to offer.

00:17:26.000 And that's so valuable.

00:17:28.000 I mean, people, that connection has made me who I am, whether I'm killing anything or not, just being there and just being part of the country.

00:17:38.000 I don't know.

00:17:39.000 It's amazing.

00:17:40.000 Yeah, it's definitely something that we're completely disconnected to by standing in the 101 traffic over and over and over again and just grinding out every week sort of the same way.

00:17:51.000 This becomes life.

00:17:52.000 It becomes life.

00:17:53.000 This is life.

00:17:54.000 Life is you get up, your alarm clock goes off, you got an hour commute, and it really should be about a three-minute commute, but you're going to get stuck in traffic.

00:18:02.000 Yeah.

00:18:02.000 And when you go to a place like Alberta and you're out there and just this unbelievably beautiful, dense forest and you're out there and you're out there doing something that requires a tremendous amount of discipline too.

00:18:16.000 One of the things that I really enjoy about archery and about bow hunting is it's not as easy as like set up...

00:18:24.000 I'm not saying that rifle hunting is easy because none of it is easy.

00:18:29.000 But it's not, if you have a good rest for your rifle, you know, and the animal's no more than, you know, 100 yards away, it's a pretty good likelihood that you're going to shoot that animal. 0.98

00:18:40.000 100 yards away with a bow and arrow, good fucking luck. 0.99

00:18:43.000 Yeah, just started. 0.99

00:18:44.000 Yeah, you're, you know, most likely you're not going to hit that thing. 0.90

00:18:48.000 That's really fucking far.

00:18:49.000 No, that's, you know, because I rifle hunted for three years before I started bow hunting, and, uh, I started rifle hunting. 0.94

00:18:58.000 I loved it.

00:18:58.000 I loved the challenge.

00:18:59.000 I still love going out on rifle hunts.

00:19:01.000 I haven't rifle hunted for 26 years, but I just like the hunting atmosphere and environment and working together.

00:19:10.000 But what I noticed when I transitioned from rifle hunting to bow hunting is where the rifle hunt Ended, like as you said, 100 yards, 200 yards, where it ended, it was over.

00:19:20.000 If you made the shot, game over.

00:19:22.000 That's where the bow hunt really begins.

00:19:24.000 So you're 100 yards or 200 yards, and now you've got to be on your A game.

00:19:30.000 Getting from there to the red zone or bow range of an animal, that's where it's difficult.

00:19:37.000 For you, comfortable is like 60 yards in?

00:19:40.000 Is that where it's comfortable for you?

00:19:42.000 I like them at 8 yards if I can.

00:19:45.000 I practice a lot.

00:19:47.000 I'm very comfortable.

00:19:49.000 I can make the shot at 60, yeah.

00:19:51.000 It's just a different discipline, archery is.

00:19:54.000 And one of the things that I've talked about with some of my friends that have really gotten into archery is about how the world sort of goes away when you're focusing on that bullseye.

00:20:03.000 It's a weird zen state.

00:20:05.000 And it really, in that sense, the practice, for someone who has no interest in hunting, maybe you're a vegetarian, I totally respect that, if that's what you want to do.

00:20:14.000 But archery in and of itself is an amazing pursuit just like for the meditative aspects of it.

00:20:21.000 There's something about archery.

00:20:23.000 I would go...

00:20:24.000 I screwed my shoulder up, man.

00:20:25.000 Shooting too much. 0.79

00:20:26.000 Shooting too much.

00:20:27.000 I was doing 100, 150 arrows a day.

00:20:30.000 After the bear hunt... 0.99

00:20:32.000 I got a little fucking crazy. 0.98

00:20:33.000 And I developed a little tendinitis in my shoulder. 1.00

00:20:35.000 You were a little crazy on the bear hunt.

00:20:38.000 If you recall, I don't know how many bowhunters we had.

00:20:41.000 We had maybe six bowhunters up there.

00:20:44.000 But you shot at least double more than anybody else did.

00:20:47.000 I mean, so...

00:20:49.000 You like shooting the bow, obviously, but then you ramped it up after that?

00:20:53.000 Yeah, or I ramped it up hard.

00:20:55.000 I was doing more than anybody because, first of all, I felt like a real obligation to make an accurate shot.

00:21:05.000 And I wanted to be 100% prepared.

00:21:07.000 And I'm...

00:21:08.000 I'm a big stickler on preparation, no matter what I do. 0.92

00:21:12.000 If it's martial arts, if it's comedy, anything I do, I prepare the shit out of things. 0.66

00:21:18.000 I'm obsessive compulsive in that way.

00:21:22.000 Everybody was hanging around, joking and laughing.

00:21:26.000 I was like, I could be shooting more arrows.

00:21:27.000 So I would just go off and start shooting arrows while everybody else was goofing off.

00:21:31.000 I just had to.

00:21:33.000 You know, maybe people could even misconstrued as being antisocial, but I just had to do it. 1.00

00:21:38.000 I had to get those arrows in.

00:21:40.000 Yeah, the way I perceived it was, that was it.

00:21:44.000 That was your first ever bow hunt, and you just wanted to do everything you could to make...

00:21:50.000 Really, we're trying to kill an animal ethically and quickly.

00:21:54.000 And so, I know you took and take a lot of responsibility in that.

00:21:59.000 Our role as a steward of the land and the animals.

00:22:02.000 And so, got to make that shot.

00:22:04.000 You know?

00:22:05.000 It happens so fast.

00:22:06.000 Even if you're hunting bear in a controlled environment, with a bow, that is still tough.

00:22:13.000 It's still tough.

00:22:14.000 So, I mean, I salute you for your commitment there in practicing.

00:22:18.000 And you made a great shot on your bear.

00:22:20.000 Yeah, it was perfect.

00:22:21.000 It died in seconds.

00:22:22.000 And that's what I wanted.

00:22:23.000 I wanted it to just be...

00:22:25.000 And also, It's beautiful having a friend like you who could talk me through all that stuff, who can talk me through the right way to prepare and all the right equipment, having the right bow.

00:22:36.000 You know, people give you a hard time because you shoot really powerful bows, and they're like, you don't need to shoot a bow that powerful.

00:22:43.000 You don't. 0.98

00:22:43.000 I'm just retarded. 0.98

00:22:45.000 Why would I shoot that? 1.00

00:22:46.000 That's stupid. 1.00

00:22:47.000 Well, the idea being that the more powerful the bow, the more... 1.00

00:22:53.000 The more impact the arrow has and the more it can penetrate into an animal.

00:22:57.000 It just makes sense.

00:22:58.000 But not everybody has Cam Haynes guns.

00:23:01.000 That's what's up.

00:23:03.000 I feel bad sometimes because sometimes I'll talk about my bow and then out of the blue somebody says, why do you need to shoot 80 or 90 pounds?

00:23:14.000 And I've heard it for years and Probably thousands of times and I just feel like lashing out at that one person who maybe that was the first time they've ever even been on my Facebook page or whatever.

00:23:26.000 That's what's happened the other day and I didn't lash out because I try to respect everybody.

00:23:32.000 I don't Whatever.

00:23:34.000 I just try to be respectful.

00:23:36.000 And so all I said to that guy was, you know, he says he's killed all these animals and got pastures of 62 pounds.

00:23:44.000 I said, all right, well, what about the guys who shoot 50 pounds?

00:23:48.000 They'd probably say to you, why do you shoot 62 pounds? 0.94

00:23:51.000 I shoot 50 and kill my animals.

00:23:53.000 So they would say you're doing too much. 0.99

00:23:55.000 And my whole thing is, I hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

00:24:01.000 And so, the worst is on a big bull elk, you catch a shoulder blade, or you drill a big heavy rib, or if I'm hunting Cape Buffalo, I hit a rib, which is like a 2x4.

00:24:13.000 So I'm preparing for the worst, I hope for the best.

00:24:16.000 You know, if you think...

00:24:17.000 Almost any bow with a razor-sharp broadhead, if it's just hitting soft flesh between the ribs, is going to kill it.

00:24:23.000 You could probably do that with 40 pounds, maybe even 30-some pounds.

00:24:28.000 But you're hoping for the very best situation.

00:24:34.000 It's not going to happen every time.

00:24:35.000 It's probably going to be rare.

00:24:37.000 So, that's my whole thing.

00:24:38.000 Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.

00:24:40.000 Well, what's interesting is that you've got a whole group of people that are sort of following your philosophy now.

00:24:43.000 Like this whole, you know, your catchphrase, keep hammering.

00:24:48.000 I see all this hashtag, keep hammering people in the gym, preparing for bowhunts.

00:24:53.000 It's like people prepare for bowhunts now like they're preparing for an athletic event.

00:24:57.000 I see these dudes doing all these rows and lifts and chin-ups and pulling their back muscles and getting everything in order and then running up hills and all following your lead and treating this as like an athletic endeavor.

00:25:10.000 If you've ever seen it, actually, we didn't play your Under Armour commercial the first time, did we?

00:25:16.000 Did we play it?

00:25:17.000 The Wolf.

00:25:17.000 Did we play that commercial?

00:25:18.000 The Wolf Cup.

00:25:19.000 See if we did.

00:25:20.000 We probably did. 1.00

00:25:21.000 I love that fucking commercial. 1.00

00:25:22.000 But that commercial's the perfect... 1.00

00:25:25.000 It's like it shows you preparing, you know, running up hills.

00:25:28.000 And that's also part of this bow hunting thing, is that you're preparing for an event.

00:25:35.000 As much of an event as a marathon, as much of an event, and maybe even more so, because it's this...

00:25:42.000 People don't like the term spiritual when it's connected to hunting, but there is something that's very spiritual about taking an animal, respecting its life, taking out that meat, and then eating it, and this feeling that you have of being connected to this cycle of life.

00:26:02.000 It's a very, very different thing than anything I've ever done before.

00:26:06.000 Anything I've ever done...

00:26:08.000 We're good to go.

00:26:23.000 It's like one more step closer.

00:26:25.000 It's like there's the rifle thing, but then the bow hunting thing is one more step.

00:26:25.000 Yeah.

00:26:30.000 Yeah.

00:26:30.000 This isn't the Under Armour one, though.

00:26:32.000 No, this is, uh, Bramland Shockey did this one.

00:26:35.000 This is, but this, that's the training part, definitely.

00:26:38.000 It's a different one.

00:26:39.000 Yeah, there is a different one.

00:26:41.000 There's an Under Armour commercial, but that one's cool to watch too.

00:26:43.000 But you could see the amount of preparation that's involved in this.

00:26:48.000 And so, you know, there's a lot of people out there that are really into CrossFit, and they're really into working out.

00:26:54.000 And you are, and I am.

00:26:56.000 And I had this dude who was on Fear Factor once, him and his girlfriend.

00:27:00.000 They were CrossFit people.

00:27:00.000 Nice folks.

00:27:01.000 And I was like, well, what do you do with all that...

00:27:05.000 Exercise.

00:27:06.000 You're just exercising for exercise.

00:27:08.000 It's good to be in shape and everything.

00:27:10.000 Why don't you take up jiu-jitsu or something like that?

00:27:12.000 Go put it to use.

00:27:14.000 See progress in an athletic endeavor.

00:27:16.000 Well, one of the best and ultimate ways is hunting because you're putting that progress, you're putting that athleticism and that training and all that hard work, you're putting it into this really primal situation where you're going uphill,

00:27:33.000 especially like the elk hunting.

00:27:35.000 Which I can't wait to get a part of.

00:27:38.000 Next year.

00:27:39.000 Yeah, we're going to go bow hunting for elk next year.

00:27:41.000 That seems to me like probably the ultimate of those.

00:27:45.000 Yeah, I think the thing with elk, for me that's been, we've probably mentioned that before because if anybody who's going to talk to me about bow hunting, elk's going to come up.

00:27:57.000 That was always the biggest dream was killing a big bull elk with my bow.

00:28:02.000 And it's so hard.

00:28:03.000 It is so difficult.

00:28:06.000 I killed a bull elk my very first year of bow hunting.

00:28:09.000 I think I was 19. I killed a spike bull.

00:28:13.000 It took a long time to do it. 0.75

00:28:16.000 But when I said, okay, I want to kill now a mature, big bull, six by six, in the wilderness, by myself, that took eight years to do.

00:28:25.000 Eight years of bow hunting to ever...

00:28:27.000 I killed other bulls.

00:28:28.000 I killed some five points, a few five points, another spike, a six by five, but...

00:28:35.000 It took me eight years to get that, quote, dream bull.

00:28:38.000 And to anybody, I guess, a seasoned, I don't know, trophy hunter, they probably wouldn't even have shot it.

00:28:46.000 But it was a nice 6x6, scored about 275 inches, Pope and Young.

00:28:50.000 And it was a wilderness on my own, and that took eight years.

00:28:54.000 So it's a tough deal.

00:28:55.000 When you have a wilderness hunt on your own, and you shoot this animal, you're miles away from civilization.

00:29:00.000 Yeah.

00:29:01.000 You just hike it back in steps one at a time?

00:29:16.000 But they can pack 60 pounds.

00:29:18.000 So four of them, you got 240 pounds of meat.

00:29:21.000 You can haul out or gear or whatever else.

00:29:23.000 So on that hunt, I had four llamas available.

00:29:26.000 The problem was, I killed that bull opening day of the season.

00:29:30.000 We had just walked in with those llamas with...

00:29:33.000 Me and these other guys, I was by myself about 10 miles away because I like to be by myself.

00:29:39.000 I mean, right now, I just kind of tolerate the cameraman if I'm with somebody, but really what I'm drawn to is solo hunting on my own just because I just like the test of that.

00:29:55.000 So anyway, I was by myself.

00:29:57.000 I killed those bulls. 0.75

00:29:58.000 Opening day, I skinned it out, got it hung up, and In that high country I killed it is probably about over 7,000 feet.

00:30:08.000 So even though it was September and it was warm, in the evenings at 7,000 feet or at night it gets cool.

00:30:27.000 Wow.

00:30:42.000 What I did with that is I broke that all down, and I'm like, well, I'll go see how the llamas are doing.

00:30:46.000 I packed all the way back.

00:30:47.000 The llamas, because we just came in the day before, were too tired.

00:30:51.000 They're only about 300 pounds, so it's not like they got a ton of muscle.

00:30:56.000 They'd walked 12 miles in with gear, and I knew they couldn't get that bull out, so I waited for these other guys who were hunting 10 miles away from me that night to come back to camp, and I'm like, guys, I said, I killed a bull.

00:31:10.000 If you guys help me get it out, We'll go down to Le Grand.

00:31:14.000 I'll get us a hotel room.

00:31:16.000 I'll buy us pizza.

00:31:17.000 Do this whole thing.

00:31:18.000 I was like, we'd do anything.

00:31:20.000 And so me and three other guys packed that whole bull out 12 miles.

00:31:25.000 Took it to the meat locker there and then packed back in.

00:31:29.000 12 miles.

00:31:30.000 How big was the bull?

00:31:31.000 It was that first 6x6 bull I killed.

00:31:34.000 So we probably had...

00:31:37.000 I don't know.

00:31:37.000 There's probably 240 pounds of meat, 250 pounds of meat split up.

00:31:44.000 That's an enormous animal.

00:31:46.000 So you're talking about 1,200 pounds on the hoof, something like that?

00:31:48.000 No, that one was probably 800. 800?

00:31:52.000 What's the biggest one you've ever seen?

00:31:54.000 The biggest bull I've ever killed was in 2010. It was a Roosevelt bull in Oregon.

00:31:59.000 I was with my buddy, Jody Sear.

00:32:02.000 He called that.

00:32:03.000 No, he was filming, and then Kevin Akers was calling.

00:32:07.000 We all grew up bowhunting there in Oregon.

00:32:09.000 Just kind of bowhunting rednecks from, I guess, the bush of Oregon. 1.00

00:32:14.000 And so we got this bull in, and I ended up killing it.

00:32:17.000 And it was...

00:32:19.000 You know, we're thinking 1,100 pounds.

00:32:22.000 It was just a giant 6x6 old 12 or 13 year old bull.

00:32:28.000 And that's the biggest bodied bull I've ever seen.

00:32:32.000 Elk is interesting too because the old animals still taste delicious.

00:32:36.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:32:37.000 And I'm not sure why.

00:32:39.000 Yeah, because like deer, you can get like a ruddy old buck that's like an eight, nine-year-old buck and it's like, oof, whoa, we might need to throw this one in the steam cooker in a crock pot or something, you know?

00:32:50.000 That was like those, you know, that water buffalo or a couple of them I killed in Australia.

00:32:55.000 They can get old.

00:32:57.000 The Cape buffalo I killed in Tanzania, dude, that meat.

00:33:01.000 I mean, in Tanzania with that Cape buffalo, we use that for lion bait.

00:33:06.000 I mean, it's just not good meat because those bulls are so old and so tough.

00:33:11.000 And it's just, you know, if you had to eat it, I guess you could.

00:33:14.000 I'm sure the natives there would definitely eat it.

00:33:16.000 Yeah, we just make carpaccio out of it and then chew it like jerky, I guess.

00:33:20.000 Yeah, I don't know.

00:33:21.000 Be like a Cape Buffalo steak.

00:33:23.000 Good luck, right?

00:33:24.000 Yeah. 0.97

00:33:25.000 Dense-ass animal. 0.99

00:33:27.000 No, but, you know, so I killed a kudu. 1.00

00:33:29.000 That was excellent meat.

00:33:31.000 Sable there.

00:33:32.000 Beautiful meat.

00:33:34.000 Kudu's supposed to be one of the best, right?

00:33:35.000 Yeah, I mean, and sable, too.

00:33:37.000 Yeah?

00:33:38.000 Just, yeah, there's a lot of those animals, a lot of good eating animals there.

00:33:43.000 Not, just not buffalo.

00:33:45.000 The controversy about African animals is, I mean, you get what I call Facebook controversy, which is very sort of cursory controversy.

00:33:55.000 It's not people that are really investigating it and trying to figure out what is going on here.

00:33:55.000 Controversy.

00:33:59.000 They just see a picture of a pretty girl from Texas with an animal on the ground and they go, oh, that bitch. 1.00

00:34:06.000 And Ranella wrote this article, which is really interesting, where he was saying that a lot of what you're dealing with is just straight up sexism. 0.94

00:34:13.000 You're dealing with people that don't want to see a pretty girl in that environment, and for whatever reason they either decide it's not her place, or especially because she's pretty, they have some certain amount of resentment about her anyway because she carries around a certain amount of privilege and easy access to life because she's so pretty. 0.54

00:34:32.000 The doors just open up for her, which is true, right?

00:34:34.000 Yeah.

00:34:35.000 But what people, what they fail to do is really sort of investigate what's going on in Africa in that these people that live in these communities, if it wasn't for these high fence hunting operations, their resources would be severely diminished. 0.98

00:34:51.000 Yeah.

00:34:52.000 They're making so much more money because of the money that comes in from tags, from hunters, and there's an industry there now. 0.96

00:34:58.000 And it's kind of a fucked up thing to say to a lot of people, like, hey, there's an industry in killing animals. 0.87

00:35:03.000 But that industry has served two purposes. 0.96

00:35:06.000 One, those animals are in gigantic healthy populations now where they're on the verge of extinction just a couple decades ago.

00:35:13.000 Right, yeah.

00:35:15.000 And it's, yeah, hunting there...

00:35:18.000 I mean, especially, you know, the high fence thing, that's a whole other thing.

00:35:21.000 That's basically, I guess you could, it's close to farming.

00:35:26.000 It is really close to farming.

00:35:28.000 It's farming animals.

00:35:29.000 But it is industry there.

00:35:31.000 It is a way for locals to make money and be involved and generate income for their families.

00:35:36.000 So, I mean, how do you, who am I to judge that?

00:35:39.000 I can't.

00:35:42.000 In Tanzania, there's even less.

00:35:45.000 So most of the high fence hunting is in South Africa.

00:35:48.000 In Tanzania, in the bush way back there, there is even less opportunity for those people.

00:35:54.000 There's no food.

00:35:55.000 I mean, there's limited food, but no power, no water, grass, shacks, or huts.

00:36:03.000 It's, you know...

00:36:06.000 It's real poverty.

00:36:08.000 It's, yeah.

00:36:09.000 Poverty on an intense scale that I think us as Americans, we, you know, you dip your toes in, you go visit for a little bit, and you're still not really grasping the idea of being born there.

00:36:20.000 No.

00:36:20.000 With no opportunity to get out.

00:36:22.000 I don't see how you ever could, you know, but what's weird, and so I was wrestling with this whole time, because when I go to these places, I love the culture, I love the people, um, Even there I was trying to learn Swahili with some of the trackers that were working with me.

00:36:40.000 Rashidi, awesome guy, speaks only Swahili.

00:36:45.000 So I really invest myself into the culture and I just want to learn.

00:36:50.000 I want to see things through their eyes.

00:36:56.000 I saw these grass shacks and all these people and you know every grass shack had six little kids running around it and it's just like I'm thinking this is awful I mean it's no hope for six kids at every grass shack that seems I don't know it just seemed very sad to me but we were there getting ready to cross this river in the truck and the river was high so we were kind of out Ryan Shalom,

00:37:21.000 he owns Greenleaf Tanzania.

00:37:25.000 And so we're there and we're kind of seeing what's going on and There was a village about a quarter mile away.

00:37:32.000 And as we're looking at the river and trying to make a game plan, there was music and just people singing.

00:37:39.000 And I'm like, is it happy hour over here?

00:37:43.000 What is going on?

00:37:44.000 And that really just hit home.

00:37:46.000 It's like, you know, I see them and I think there's no hope and they must be miserable.

00:37:51.000 But they're laughing and singing and dancing.

00:37:54.000 It's...

00:37:55.000 Maybe they're okay.

00:37:57.000 I don't know.

00:37:58.000 Are they happy?

00:37:59.000 They seemed happy to me.

00:38:02.000 It's weird.

00:38:04.000 I don't know.

00:38:05.000 I can look at it from the outside and judge and say, you must be so depressed.

00:38:13.000 Maybe they're not.

00:38:14.000 I don't know.

00:38:15.000 Yeah, I think people are incredibly adaptable.

00:38:17.000 And when people grow up in an environment, that's just what they're used to.

00:38:22.000 You get used to it, and that's how you live.

00:38:25.000 If that's all you know, you don't know what it's like to stay at the Four Seasons and eat at the buffet in the morning and have the valet pull your car around. 0.98

00:38:34.000 All the shit that some people think is the good life. 0.98

00:38:37.000 But those people that are living like that... 1.00

00:38:40.000 At the Four Seasons, you know, checking their Rolex, where is this goddamn valet? 1.00

00:38:44.000 You know, those people might be on fucking antidepressants. 1.00

00:38:47.000 The people in Africa are singing and playing the bongo drums and having a great old time. 1.00

00:38:51.000 You know what would cause the people at the Four Seasons the most heartache?

00:38:54.000 What?

00:38:54.000 If the frickin' Wi-Fi wasn't working.

00:38:56.000 Yes. 1.00

00:38:57.000 Goddamn Wi-Fi is bullshit. 1.00

00:38:59.000 You know? 1.00

00:39:00.000 I tried to get a kudu steak this morning.

00:39:02.000 Yeah.

00:39:02.000 They don't even have kudu.

00:39:04.000 Yeah.

00:39:06.000 We think that this is the only way to live.

00:39:08.000 I mean, look, life is about friendship, experience, having fun, and staying healthy.

00:39:15.000 And whatever those people can do to make that happen, and whatever is in their environment that they can take advantage of as far as nutrition and being able to...

00:39:28.000 Take care of their family.

00:39:29.000 They do what they can with what they've got.

00:39:32.000 And that's also something where the hunters help out.

00:39:35.000 And this has often been criticized as just like, oh, people are just using that as an excuse.

00:39:40.000 And that a lot of the meat goes to these families and these villages.

00:39:44.000 And it is a huge, huge benefit to them to get fresh protein.

00:39:50.000 Like Brian Stevens that we were talking to when we were on that hunt was talking to me about an elephant kill that they had.

00:39:57.000 They killed an elephant.

00:39:58.000 And you talk about killing an elephant and everybody goes, oh my god, you killed an elephant. 1.00

00:40:02.000 How the fuck could you kill an elephant? 1.00

00:40:04.000 I don't have any desire to kill an elephant. 1.00

00:40:06.000 But...

00:40:07.000 I wanted to listen to his perspective and see what he had to say about it.

00:40:10.000 One of the things that he was saying was that when you kill an elephant, the village, they all pile in to get a piece of that elephant. 0.95

00:40:18.000 It's so welcome.

00:40:20.000 There's these photos of these people.

00:40:22.000 With these just great baskets filled with elephant meat.

00:40:26.000 And there's dozens and dozens of people taking this meat away.

00:40:30.000 And this is protein that they wouldn't ordinarily not have been able to get.

00:40:34.000 Then you're dealing with the money that this guy had to pay to harvest this elephant, which is a substantial amount of money.

00:40:40.000 I think it's like $30,000 or $50,000.

00:40:42.000 It can be, yeah.

00:40:43.000 And then you're dealing with the reality that in these certain circumstances in some of these places, they have a population problem.

00:40:49.000 People don't want to think that.

00:40:50.000 They think that elephants are endangered.

00:40:52.000 Mm-hmm.

00:40:52.000 They are in some places.

00:40:54.000 But Africa is fucking huge! 0.99

00:40:57.000 It is a huge, huge, huge continent. 0.99

00:41:00.000 So if they have an issue in one area where they don't have very many elephants, it doesn't mean the entire place has a lack of animals.

00:41:10.000 And one thing, I was fascinated with...

00:41:10.000 No, no.

00:41:15.000 We had to deal with poachers when I was back there in Tanzania.

00:41:18.000 And most of the poachers we dealt with were simply what they call after protein.

00:41:24.000 They're up there.

00:41:25.000 They're killing buffalo.

00:41:27.000 So I say we wouldn't want to eat a buffalo.

00:41:29.000 They will gladly take a buffalo.

00:41:31.000 So they go up there and we ran across three poachers at one time.

00:41:35.000 Usually there's a shooter and two packers. 0.99

00:41:38.000 And what they do is they kill an animal.

00:41:40.000 They live up there.

00:41:42.000 They cut it up.

00:41:43.000 They dry it out.

00:41:44.000 And then all they're packing out all this meat with is a burlap sack with like wire straps.

00:41:50.000 So wire through the burlap and then they load that up with this dried out meat, which I don't even know what it would weigh at that time.

00:41:57.000 But that's how they get it out.

00:41:59.000 And they're not selling that.

00:42:01.000 They might sell the protein when they get out, but it's just meat.

00:42:05.000 It's not like this high-level poaching operation.

00:42:09.000 Right, where they're selling ivory or something.

00:42:11.000 And they're willing to get that meat. 0.99

00:42:14.000 They're willing to shoot you. 1.00

00:42:17.000 And the game scout who we were with is willing to shoot them. 0.98

00:42:21.000 A lot of times it's whoever can shoot first.

00:42:24.000 And that was an eye-opening experience.

00:42:29.000 I mean, you know, we have somebody, you just don't do that here.

00:42:32.000 It's just difference.

00:42:33.000 To there, it's just like, whoever can shoot first.

00:42:36.000 And that one, the first guy that we saw didn't shoot at us because He didn't have any ammo.

00:42:42.000 He had to basically load his gun like a muzzleloader, as a rifle, but he had I found their camp and we investigated everything they had in their camp.

00:42:50.000 And so he had like ball bearings and pieces of lead and things.

00:42:53.000 He would shove down the barrel and he had wadding and he had a firing pin, match heads to ignite it, gunpowder.

00:43:02.000 And so basically he would get one shot.

00:43:04.000 And to get that one shot he had to be close.

00:43:06.000 So that's why he didn't shoot at us.

00:43:08.000 We were at about a hundred and some yards.

00:43:09.000 He ended up circling around getting to 50 yards and was just standing there.

00:43:13.000 But he knew he only had one shot.

00:43:15.000 So, anyway, the whole point is they're willing to risk their lives to get protein.

00:43:22.000 Now, we did find a dead elephant.

00:43:25.000 There's an elephant skull there and so just had me, you know, curious as to how that works.

00:43:30.000 I said, so, obviously somebody came in here and poached this elephant.

00:43:35.000 How much are they getting for that ivory?

00:43:38.000 And so we figured maybe a 20 or 30 year old elephant is, they say with 50 pounds of ivory, just roughly, could have more, could have less.

00:43:48.000 50 pounds of ivory.

00:43:50.000 So for 50 pounds of ivory, a poacher will get $250.

00:43:55.000 Wow.

00:43:56.000 Wow.

00:43:57.000 $250.

00:43:58.000 I was thinking maybe they're going to get thousands of dollars.

00:44:01.000 $250.

00:44:02.000 Whereas, you know, you mentioned Brian Stevens and the elephant hunt that Americans would go on or, you know, a hunter that would pay for it and they're paying upward maybe $50,000.

00:44:14.000 So you're trading the life of an animal if it's poached for $250 or if a hunter goes over there to hunt it and the meat is utilized by the whole village, $50,000.

00:44:24.000 Now, what helps a community more?

00:44:26.000 Well, it certainly helps the community more if a hunter pays.

00:44:29.000 But the real question that people have is, why does a hunter want to do that?

00:44:32.000 Why would someone want to go over and shoot an elephant?

00:44:35.000 And I kind of see their point of view.

00:44:37.000 Like, what is it about an elephant?

00:44:39.000 Why would you want to go over there and shoot this big, magnificent animal?

00:44:42.000 Why couldn't you just go over there and enjoy looking at it?

00:44:46.000 Right.

00:44:47.000 Good question.

00:44:48.000 You know, I guess for me, I can't relate to an elephant.

00:44:52.000 I've never... 0.85

00:44:53.000 I've never really thought about killing an elephant or even pursued the opportunity, but I want to kill a lion. 0.99

00:45:00.000 I went over there to kill an African lion with my bow. 0.97

00:45:04.000 And people, same question, why? 0.84

00:45:06.000 And to me...

00:45:10.000 To me, the reason why I do what I do every day is a test.

00:45:15.000 And I feel like if I'm going after the king of the jungle, so to speak, or Simba, with my bow, that's the ultimate test.

00:45:25.000 And I mean, if you're not testing yourself, or for me, if I'm not testing myself, what's the point?

00:45:31.000 But then, okay, so here's the argument. 1.00

00:45:33.000 People would be like, you fucking asshole. 1.00

00:45:34.000 Why do you want to go over there and shoot a lion? 1.00

00:45:36.000 Lion's a beautiful, majestic animal.

00:45:38.000 It's the king of the jungle.

00:45:39.000 Why would you want to shoot it?

00:45:40.000 You're not even going to eat it. 0.64

00:45:42.000 But you are going to eat it.

00:45:43.000 Yeah, no.

00:45:44.000 And you should see, it's such, I don't know, there's a connection with the natives, the Tanzanians over there where we were.

00:45:54.000 If any cat is killed, and when I was there, one of the guys I was with, Richard Baca, he killed a leopard.

00:46:00.000 And when any cat is killed or an elephant, the whole village or all the guys that were there working, you basically stop in the jeep up on the hill.

00:46:10.000 They get the jeep all, put brush all over it, and they have this chant.

00:46:15.000 And they sing this chant as you drive down.

00:46:18.000 They shoot the gun twice to announce to the hunting camp that, We're coming in, and we got a special animal.

00:46:26.000 And, you know, Ryan explained this whole thing to me.

00:46:29.000 But we got a special animal, and so it's either a cat or an elephant, and they come in, and it's just, it's the biggest celebration.

00:46:35.000 When Richard killed that leopard, they, all the guys there, the Tanzanians there, were singing this chant, and it was just, it was so powerful.

00:46:47.000 And they had him, he sat in this chair, and they lifted him up in this chair, and we're carrying him around The camp.

00:46:53.000 Whoa.

00:46:54.000 And that was to honor the life of the leopard.

00:46:59.000 And lions are even one step above.

00:47:03.000 For them, Simba is...

00:47:06.000 They have so much reverence and respect for a lion.

00:47:12.000 It's...

00:47:13.000 I couldn't even really understand it.

00:47:15.000 Only they could probably explain it.

00:47:18.000 When that animal dies, you're just killing an animal just to kill an animal.

00:47:23.000 There's a connection that goes into it.

00:47:27.000 The animal is valuable.

00:47:29.000 The animal is just revered.

00:47:33.000 I assume they also have to keep the populations down.

00:47:36.000 Yeah, that's, you know, lion hunting is, I mean, a lot of people look at lions and judge the hunting for them, saying, and there might be a time when there is no more lion hunting, just because of public outcry,

00:47:52.000 basically.

00:47:53.000 But as it is now, Ryan Shlom, where I was hunting with the green leaf, I had the opportunity, we could have killed, we had in it bait, Four-year-old lions. 0.94

00:48:06.000 Male, legal, big manes, by themself, definitely could kill them.

00:48:13.000 He wants to let those four-year-olds age to six or greater. 0.99

00:48:18.000 He only wants to kill six-year-old lions or greater because then they're past their breeding prime. 0.95

00:48:23.000 They've done their job for the population, so to speak, and that's when he'll take them out.

00:48:28.000 Not before, even though it's legal.

00:48:30.000 But just to build that pride up.

00:48:32.000 And then another thing that he does is if a male lion is with a pride, meaning there's females there and there's cubs there, if he's there with them, they're his cubs.

00:48:43.000 Otherwise, he'd kill them, just like the bear.

00:48:45.000 Same type of deal.

00:48:47.000 But he would never kill a male lion that had a pride or was even close to a pride.

00:48:54.000 Because what that would do If you killed a male, even though it's legal, what that would do is another male would come in.

00:49:03.000 So the male you killed is dead.

00:49:05.000 Another male would come in.

00:49:06.000 Those wouldn't be his cubs. 1.00

00:49:08.000 So he would kill them. 0.98

00:49:09.000 So you'd have two generations of lions gone. 0.95

00:49:13.000 Part of his management practice there is only old lions, only old lone lions, male lions, and that's it.

00:49:23.000 So you're basically catching a lion at the end of his run.

00:49:25.000 That's it.

00:49:26.000 They're not breeding anymore.

00:49:29.000 They've done their job.

00:49:30.000 Basically, the only value they have now is for a hunter.

00:49:35.000 The only value, but they're a life.

00:49:39.000 They're a life.

00:49:39.000 They're a living creature, a majestic living creature.

00:49:42.000 Oh, definitely.

00:49:43.000 But that's where people have the issue, right?

00:49:45.000 Do you try to look at it from their point of view ever?

00:49:48.000 Do you ever see the anti-hunting people?

00:49:51.000 Anti-hunting people fall into a bunch of different categories.

00:49:54.000 There's people who don't think you should eat any meat at all.

00:49:57.000 That's the super extreme.

00:49:58.000 Then there's people who can respect you eating animals that were raised in an ethical way.

00:50:05.000 Free range cows, free range chickens is the only way I would do it.

00:50:08.000 That's some group.

00:50:09.000 And then there's people that say, well I really respect people who go out and hunt their own meat.

00:50:14.000 But as you get deeper and deeper into the categories of people that have problems with hunting, at the very top of that list, which is the most hated, is people that hunt only for the trophy.

00:50:30.000 Trophy, yeah.

00:50:31.000 And that's what a lot of people think of when they think of elephant.

00:50:34.000 A lot of people think of when they think of lion.

00:50:36.000 And I have no desire to shoot anything I'm not going to eat.

00:50:40.000 I never will.

00:50:42.000 My goal with getting into hunting was to connect with the food that I eat, to try to figure out... 0.98

00:50:48.000 When I first hunted with Rinella, I was wondering, I was like, what if I shoot this deer and say, fuck it, I'm a vegetarian now. 0.97

00:50:54.000 I'm never doing this again. 0.98

00:50:56.000 It was the exact opposite.

00:50:57.000 I felt an immediate incredible connection to it.

00:51:01.000 It was very exciting and thrilling.

00:51:03.000 People don't want to hear you say that.

00:51:05.000 They want to hear a very somber moment.

00:51:07.000 Yeah.

00:51:08.000 I mean, look, HBO Real Sports aired it the other night.

00:51:11.000 There's this thing where they did this whole piece on hunting and this whole eat what you kill movement, what they called it, and they had the clip of me shooting my first deer, and I kind of forgot how I was pretty emotional when it happened.

00:51:28.000 So there's definitely a sense of loss when something like that happens, but it's not sad.

00:51:35.000 That's an animal that I wanted to eat.

00:51:39.000 But there's a difference between that and just going after some animal just to shoot it.

00:51:44.000 I need to get this on my list.

00:51:46.000 I have a basketball court in my house filled with dead animals, and this is my next one.

00:51:52.000 Right.

00:51:53.000 Yeah.

00:51:54.000 That's true.

00:51:55.000 And I guess when I'm thinking about it...

00:51:59.000 We even got judged when you killed your bear because we had a picture of us smiling with a dead bear.

00:52:07.000 I have a hard time...

00:52:09.000 The people on the fence who need to be convinced or could go either way, those are the people I can appeal to and maybe make an argument that how hard I work and how much hunting means to me and how much I respect these animals.

00:52:23.000 Those people, the extreme people...

00:52:26.000 I don't think you're ever going to win those guys over.

00:52:28.000 No, I don't think so either.

00:52:29.000 So whatever, that's just a lost cause.

00:52:31.000 But the other ones, that's why, you know, and I've posted this before, when I kill an animal, I don't want a bunch of blood.

00:52:40.000 And hunters have said, blood's part of it.

00:52:42.000 Why are you worried about showing blood?

00:52:44.000 Well, because I don't want to offend the people who might be in the middle.

00:52:49.000 You know what I mean?

00:52:50.000 But when you get judged, we got judged for smiling with your dead bear.

00:52:56.000 The reason why I'm, you know, yeah, when animals, I guess it's not, I don't feel sad, but I respect when an animal dies.

00:53:06.000 But the smiling part is I'm proud of everything that went into how much work is involved and how much sacrifice, you know, when you killed yours, you made.

00:53:16.000 And that's just, it's a celebration. 0.98

00:53:19.000 You killed an animal. 1.00

00:53:21.000 We're going to eat it. 0.89

00:53:22.000 All that months and months of work paid off.

00:53:25.000 That should feel good.

00:53:27.000 There's nothing wrong with, hey, we're celebrating this moment.

00:53:31.000 It's such a special, cherished moment.

00:53:34.000 Let's smile.

00:53:35.000 Well, the weirdness of modern civilization is that no one has a problem with you smiling when you're eating a cheeseburger. 0.99

00:53:41.000 If you look at any Burger King ad, any McDonald's ad, when someone's eating, a big smile on their face, I mean, you're eating a fucking animal that lived its life in torture. 0.96

00:53:52.000 I mean, there's very little possibility that that animal was a free-range animal. 0.99

00:54:06.000 Right. 1.00

00:54:18.000 I wrote a blog post that I still haven't put up yet because I dealt with so many fucking idiots getting mad at me after I shot that bear. 0.99

00:54:26.000 But one of them was this guy at the airport who had seen a picture of us. 1.00

00:54:31.000 Oh, when you were arrogant?

00:54:32.000 Remember that? 0.87

00:54:33.000 Oh yeah, that was a lady! 1.00

00:54:36.000 This is a good story, actually.

00:54:38.000 Cam and I were on the plane, and there was a gentleman who was the flight attendant that was a little bit light in the loafers.

00:54:44.000 He was perhaps a gay man. 0.68

00:54:46.000 Let's just say 100% he was a gay man. 0.88

00:54:48.000 A very nice gay man.

00:54:50.000 He was very friendly, and he was really cool, and we were having fun with the guy.

00:54:53.000 He was just being a friendly guy, but he kept complimenting Cam's arms.

00:54:59.000 Cam's a very athletic and muscular man.

00:55:02.000 He works out a lot.

00:55:03.000 He's got a lot of veins in his arms and stuff.

00:55:05.000 And this guy kept calling him muscles.

00:55:08.000 And he's like, you know...

00:55:09.000 How would he say it, though?

00:55:10.000 He's like, oh, muscles?

00:55:12.000 He was so flamboyant.

00:55:14.000 I mean, he was a great guy.

00:55:15.000 He was just a super, super nice guy.

00:55:17.000 Don't get me wrong.

00:55:18.000 So anyway...

00:55:19.000 He just kept complimenting Cam and, what do you do?

00:55:22.000 What do you do?

00:55:23.000 He's like, well, you know, work out and stuff.

00:55:25.000 I bet you do.

00:55:26.000 I bet you do.

00:55:27.000 I mean, it was fun.

00:55:28.000 It was fun.

00:55:29.000 Totally lighthearted. 0.99

00:55:30.000 So as we're leaving, I said to Cam, I go, if that guy doesn't at least smack you on the ass on the way out, I'm going to be very disappointed. 0.99

00:55:39.000 That's all I said. 0.99

00:55:40.000 And so we're waiting for our luggage and this woman came up to me. 1.00

00:55:44.000 He didn't, by the way.

00:55:45.000 He didn't.

00:55:46.000 I was really sad.

00:55:48.000 I mean, I felt like you guys had a connection.

00:55:51.000 I kind of tensed up when I walked by because I was getting ready.

00:55:55.000 So it was just me and Cam having fun.

00:55:57.000 And it wasn't mean-spirited at all.

00:55:59.000 We were sitting by each other, talking to each other.

00:56:03.000 Yeah, and talking at this level. 1.00

00:56:04.000 It wasn't like we were yelling out, That guy doesn't slap you in the ass! 1.00

00:56:07.000 I'm going to be disappointed! 1.00

00:56:09.000 I think he's gay! 1.00

00:56:11.000 It was us having a private conversation. 0.98

00:56:14.000 Behind us happened to be a lesbian. 1.00

00:56:17.000 I'm assuming a lesbian. 1.00

00:56:18.000 And her girlfriend.

00:56:19.000 And when we were waiting for the luggage, the woman started giving me a hard time. 1.00

00:56:24.000 She called me arrogant. 0.98

00:56:25.000 You're so arrogant. 0.98

00:56:26.000 I go, how am I arrogant? 0.94

00:56:28.000 She goes, that man was a nice man.

00:56:30.000 I go, he's a very nice man. 1.00

00:56:32.000 And she goes, I heard what you said about him slapping your friend in the ass. 1.00

00:56:36.000 I go, he was flirting with my friend. 0.99

00:56:37.000 I go, first of all, it's not arrogant.

00:56:39.000 My friend is a handsome man.

00:56:40.000 It was one way flirting. 0.94

00:56:42.000 Let's not, I don't want this.

00:56:43.000 One way.

00:56:45.000 Absolutely one way.

00:56:46.000 We weren't flirting.

00:56:47.000 You were being very, very friendly to him in an I am not gay way.

00:56:54.000 But let's be honest. 0.99

00:56:55.000 We look like we could be a couple like brutish gay guys. 1.00

00:56:59.000 I mean, there's a lot of those... 0.94

00:57:01.000 If you go to West Hollywood, and I presume you don't when you're in town, but if you go down Santa Monica Boulevard, there's several clubs that have a lot of men that are built very similar to us.

00:57:12.000 They also might have beards like we do.

00:57:14.000 Is this about bowhunting? 1.00

00:57:15.000 No, it's about gay sex. 0.99

00:57:18.000 So, you know, he could have gotten, you know, he was testing the waters. 1.00

00:57:22.000 The guy, that's, if you're gay, you never know. 0.83

00:57:24.000 Look, you gotta think, if you're gay, what is it?

00:57:27.000 They say it's like 10% of people are gay?

00:57:29.000 But I don't even think it's that.

00:57:30.000 I think that's their wishful thinking.

00:57:32.000 I think it's probably like, probably like 1 out of 20, let's say 5%. 0.76

00:57:37.000 Whatever the number is that people are gay. 0.52

00:57:38.000 I keep looking at Jamie, I don't know why. 1.00

00:57:40.000 He's straight as fuck. 1.00

00:57:43.000 But, whatever the number is, you know, how does a gay guy know whether another guy's gay? 1.00

00:57:46.000 You gotta ask him.

00:57:47.000 So if he says to you, look at you, muscles, and you're like, look at you, BAM! It's on!

00:57:52.000 You know, you landed in Edmonton, you exchanged numbers...

00:57:56.000 Things get popping.

00:57:57.000 How does the guy find out?

00:57:58.000 He doesn't find out unless he talks to you, right?

00:58:00.000 But there was nothing inappropriate the way he was communicating with you.

00:58:04.000 It was just fun.

00:58:05.000 There was nothing inappropriate the way we were joking around about it. 0.99

00:58:08.000 I lightheartedly said, if he doesn't smack you on the ass on the way out, I'm going to be very disappointed. 0.99

00:58:14.000 We were just laughing. 1.00

00:58:15.000 And this woman read me the fucking riot act. 1.00

00:58:20.000 You're being arrogant. 1.00

00:58:21.000 Yeah, she was saying I was arrogant.

00:58:22.000 And I go, how was that arrogant?

00:58:23.000 I go, my friend's very good looking.

00:58:24.000 I go, look at him.

00:58:25.000 He's a handsome guy.

00:58:26.000 And she goes, that flight attendant was very nice.

00:58:28.000 He was very friendly.

00:58:29.000 I go, he was very nice. 0.99

00:58:31.000 I just think you're very arrogant. 0.83

00:58:32.000 I go, how am I arrogant?

00:58:34.000 I go, I just, I don't understand how that's arrogant.

00:58:36.000 That I think my friend's good looking?

00:58:38.000 That I'm upset that the guy didn't hit on him?

00:58:41.000 I don't understand. 0.99

00:58:42.000 Neil, the whole fucking flight! 1.00

00:58:43.000 The whole flight! 1.00

00:58:45.000 He's flirting with you.

00:58:46.000 The whole flight!

00:58:47.000 One way.

00:58:48.000 There's one way flirting. 0.99

00:58:49.000 Thank you.

00:58:50.000 It was just, the woman was upset that I made, like, that I was having fun.

00:58:56.000 She wanted to make an issue, I think, in front of her partner. 0.98

00:59:00.000 Yeah.

00:59:00.000 Exactly.

00:59:00.000 I guess.

00:59:01.000 Just to put you in your place.

00:59:02.000 It backfired.

00:59:03.000 Horribly.

00:59:04.000 It did.

00:59:04.000 Because I was mocking her.

00:59:05.000 I was smiling and mocking her.

00:59:07.000 And I never got upset. 1.00

00:59:09.000 Like, I never said, fuck off, dummy. 1.00

00:59:11.000 You know, which is, we're getting close to fuck off, dummy, though. 1.00

00:59:14.000 Because she kept saying arrogant. 1.00

00:59:15.000 I'm like, look. 0.69

00:59:16.000 I'm probably the least homophobic person that looks like me you're ever going to meet. 0.89

00:59:20.000 I'm just not.

00:59:23.000 I don't care.

00:59:23.000 I lived in San Francisco from the time I was 7 to 11. My neighbors were gay.

00:59:28.000 And that formative period of my life, I just was around gay people all the time. 1.00

00:59:32.000 And then being in show business, I know so many fucking gay people. 0.99

00:59:35.000 I have a lot of gay friends. 1.00

00:59:36.000 Just gay comedians. 0.74

00:59:38.000 I don't know that dude.

00:59:39.000 But if...

00:59:40.000 I'd be friends with him just to find out about Scientology.

00:59:43.000 I really would.

00:59:44.000 So...

00:59:45.000 Anyway.

00:59:46.000 How do we take that hard turn into being arrogant?

00:59:49.000 You're talking about somebody in the airport.

00:59:51.000 Oh, yeah.

00:59:52.000 So this is a totally different time in the airport. 0.97

00:59:55.000 When you posted that picture up on Facebook, I got this fucking barrage of people that were angry at me. 0.95

01:00:01.000 First of all, you said... 0.98

01:00:03.000 I think you put up a clip...

01:00:05.000 The first time I was up there with Luke Bryan, and I shot this bear...

01:00:09.000 Yes, that's right.

01:00:10.000 Hunter Jobes filmed it, and we had the arrow coming out.

01:00:13.000 Amazing video.

01:00:14.000 We should show that one.

01:00:15.000 Yeah, yeah, it's a crazy video, man. 0.99

01:00:17.000 It's a big fucking bear, too. 0.99

01:00:19.000 So anyway, this arrow comes out. 0.99

01:00:21.000 You...

01:00:30.000 I don't want any pictures.

01:00:32.000 I don't want any video.

01:00:33.000 I can't deal with this negativity and this hate.

01:00:36.000 That's all I've been dealing with for two or three days.

01:00:41.000 Then we kind of...

01:00:42.000 I rethought it.

01:00:43.000 Yeah.

01:00:43.000 Yeah, I thought it and I was like, wait a minute.

01:00:45.000 What do I believe?

01:00:46.000 Yeah.

01:00:47.000 What do I believe?

01:00:48.000 And am I changing what I'm putting out there?

01:00:51.000 And a lot of people do do that.

01:00:52.000 You change what you put out there because you're worried about the negative impact of something that you actually believe in. 0.99

01:00:58.000 And I thought about it and I was like, no, fuck that, man. 0.99

01:01:00.000 I don't not believe in hunting. 1.00

01:01:03.000 I don't not believe that you should be killing this bear and eating it.

01:01:07.000 There's nothing wrong with it. 1.00

01:01:08.000 So fuck it. 1.00

01:01:08.000 So you put the picture up and then whoo! 1.00

01:01:11.000 The tidal wave of hate just came my way.

01:01:15.000 So I wrote this blog entry that I will eventually put up.

01:01:18.000 And I want to put it up to promote John and Jen, too, because I think they're just awesome folks and I'd love to pump up their business. 0.98

01:01:27.000 This guy came up to me at the fucking airport. 1.00

01:01:29.000 Fucking disgusting meatheads. 1.00

01:01:30.000 Oh, that was actually the one... 1.00

01:01:32.000 That was on the blaze.

01:01:33.000 Yeah, that was actually in support of me.

01:01:37.000 Because I put up a whole series of tweets explaining my position.

01:01:40.000 Yeah, they had that on there.

01:01:41.000 Yeah, that was very cool of them to do that.

01:01:43.000 And that had...

01:01:44.000 Did you see that number there?

01:01:45.000 That had 16,000 shares.

01:01:49.000 Yeah.

01:01:50.000 I mean, that got...

01:01:51.000 To me...

01:01:52.000 The whole thing, this whole thing gets the hunting message out.

01:01:56.000 Yes.

01:01:56.000 You know, the right type of hunting message out there.

01:02:00.000 And that's...

01:02:01.000 That's what I'm trying to do.

01:02:03.000 Love it.

01:02:04.000 But anyway, the guy at the airport comes up to me and he goes, Hey, I can't believe you killed a bear. 0.99

01:02:10.000 That's just so beyond fucked up. 0.98

01:02:12.000 And I just look down and I go, Dude, you're wearing leather shoes. 1.00

01:02:15.000 You're wearing leather shoes.

01:02:16.000 And he goes, a cow is not a bear.

01:02:19.000 I go, yeah, you're right.

01:02:20.000 When we were there, a bear ate a cub, and then the mother came by and finished the cub off.

01:02:26.000 I told that story that we talked about earlier.

01:02:28.000 I go, so I've never heard of a cow doing that.

01:02:30.000 So yeah, you're right.

01:02:31.000 Cows and bears are different. 1.00

01:02:33.000 The fuck are you talking? 1.00

01:02:33.000 This hierarchy of animals that you're allowed to eat. 1.00

01:02:36.000 I'm not saying you should eat your neighbor's fucking dog, okay? 1.00

01:02:39.000 You know, don't eat pets. 1.00

01:02:40.000 You know, I love my cats.

01:02:42.000 I love my dogs.

01:02:43.000 I love animals.

01:02:44.000 I'm not an animal hater.

01:02:46.000 But this idea that there's, like, an animal that is sacred, you know, like some magical phoenix beast.

01:02:52.000 I always hear, that's what they're raised for. 1.00

01:02:55.000 Yeah, that's so stupid. 1.00

01:02:57.000 That argument is so stupid. 1.00

01:02:59.000 That's worse. 1.00

01:03:00.000 It's worse that an animal is imprisoned its entire life.

01:03:04.000 Its only existence is to be slaughtered.

01:03:07.000 When you shoot a deer, and that deer is wandering around eating acorns, and then boom! 0.96

01:03:12.000 Or with you, the arrow hits him.

01:03:17.000 His life is over in seconds, and his life was 100% wild until the moment it ended.

01:03:24.000 Right.

01:03:25.000 That's a far better existence.

01:03:26.000 Far better.

01:03:27.000 The moment my arrow passed through that bear, that bear was dead inside of 30 seconds.

01:03:34.000 We heard...

01:03:34.000 Oh, yeah.

01:03:35.000 Because it's kind of creepy.

01:03:36.000 Bears do a death moan. 0.94

01:03:39.000 Especially when you shoot them through the lungs, right? 0.99

01:03:41.000 They do. 0.98

01:03:42.000 And so within...

01:03:43.000 15 seconds we heard and you know John and you so that's it you got it it was perfect and it was done yeah within 30 seconds of that arrow hitting it that animals dead yeah lived its entire life how many years it was alive and then one moment and it's dead and then we're skinning it and then we ate it that night and the idea that someone can come up to you and be wearing leather shoes And in some way,

01:04:13.000 judge you for killing and eating an animal.

01:04:15.000 And I'm having the hide tanned, or the skin is being treated, so I'm going to have a rug made out of it. 0.98

01:04:23.000 I'm still eating the animal.

01:04:25.000 I feed it to my family.

01:04:27.000 I'm taking advantage of every single aspect of this animal. 0.79

01:04:31.000 When you pass by a restaurant, when you pass by a supermarket, every road you drive down in America, pretty much, when you go by a gas station and you see a fucking package of Slim Jims, every animal that has been involved in making those products lived a life A horrifying existence that is of unimaginable suffering in comparison to an animal that you hunt. 0.76

01:04:59.000 Not turkey jerky, though. 0.86

01:04:59.000 Yeah. 0.86

01:05:01.000 No.

01:05:02.000 That was painful.

01:05:03.000 They lived a perfect life, right?

01:05:04.000 Turkey. 0.96

01:05:05.000 They don't even feel it when you kill them. 0.98

01:05:06.000 Don't even know. 0.83

01:05:08.000 And then, I guess on the polar opposite of that, or I don't even know, this whole trying to figure out what the heck these people think.

01:05:18.000 I get people, when you killed your bear and I had that up there, people were posting messages on my Facebook saying they were going to kill my daughter and put her head on the wall. 0.84

01:05:28.000 Whoa. 0.90

01:05:29.000 Is that...

01:05:30.000 How do people get there?

01:05:34.000 They get there, well, there's a lot of people involved in what's called the animal liberation movement, and it's so intense that there are folks that break into restaurants and steal lobsters and let them lose back in the ocean.

01:05:34.000 Yeah.

01:05:47.000 Oh, God. 1.00

01:05:49.000 These motherfuckers don't understand that the reason why people are here today is because your ancestors ate animals. 1.00

01:05:55.000 If we were all just eating grass and fucking berries, we would still be jumping out of trees because leopards are attacking us. 1.00

01:06:01.000 We literally wouldn't be here. 0.99

01:06:03.000 Human beings, one of the main contributing factors to the growth and development of the human brain was the fact that we changed our diet from a plant-based diet to a meat-based diet.

01:06:13.000 So the human intestines changed.

01:06:15.000 Our whole...

01:06:17.000 Digestive process changed, and it freed up resources that allowed the brain to grow and develop.

01:06:23.000 This is like accepted scientific fact. 0.99

01:06:26.000 Obviously, I'm a fucking idiot, so when I'm telling you this, it's not based on anything I truly understand. 0.99

01:06:31.000 I'm basically repeating things that smart people have figured out. 1.00

01:06:34.000 But that is what they figured out.

01:06:35.000 I mean, that's a main scientific point when it comes to the development of the human brain.

01:06:40.000 So that's why we're here, dummy.

01:06:42.000 We're not here for tofu.

01:06:44.000 And by the way, they've also been proving over the last decade or so that plants have much more understanding of their environment than we ever gave them credit for.

01:06:57.000 And just because they don't have the ability to communicate with us, they don't scream when you pull them out of the ground, or they don't try to get away when you go reaching for a turnip, Doesn't mean that they're not a life form that reacts to its environment the same way an animal does.

01:07:12.000 When an animal, you know, turns its ears up and looks around because it thinks a predator is coming, that's a natural reaction.

01:07:19.000 Plants have natural reactions too.

01:07:21.000 Plants develop toxins in order to discourage predation.

01:07:25.000 They have literally things that they develop over time to keep things from eating them. 0.99

01:07:30.000 They don't want to be fucking eaten, okay? 0.96

01:07:32.000 When you're eating cauliflower, I have to feel sorry for plants now? 0.99

01:07:35.000 You have to feel sorry for plants.

01:07:36.000 Well, you know, plants can scream. 1.00

01:07:39.000 People couldn't be so self-righteous.

01:07:41.000 Right, that's true. 0.98

01:07:42.000 It's a really foolish notion that life eats life. 0.96

01:07:46.000 It's always eaten life. 0.97

01:07:47.000 That's what happens.

01:07:48.000 That's how humans get by.

01:07:50.000 That's how plants get by.

01:07:51.000 Everything eats some form of life.

01:07:53.000 There's a cycle.

01:07:54.000 And we, somehow or another, want to disconnect ourselves from that or disconnect ourselves from the concept of things that are sentient, things that are aware of their environment, things they can see and hear.

01:08:06.000 They're similar to us.

01:08:07.000 But, you know, not everybody wants to be disconnected because after the last podcast I was on with you, Do you know how many new bow hunters listened to what we talked about, listened to the connection we talked about, and never had thought about bow hunting, never had shot a bow,

01:08:24.000 and all of a sudden they were at their pro shop, or they wanted to learn more.

01:08:27.000 I mean, I've had guys who said, I think it was yesterday, this guy sent me some messages, he goes, I hadn't heard of you before Joe's podcast.

01:08:36.000 He goes, and I sat one night and watched every one of your videos.

01:08:39.000 Wow.

01:08:40.000 That's awesome.

01:08:41.000 So there are people who are disconnected, but there are people who, I guess, have been inspired by talking about this and talking about, you know...

01:08:51.000 The type of hunting and the connection we have and want that same thing.

01:08:56.000 And want to have something to train for and want to have a purpose.

01:09:00.000 Like you said, why are you in shape?

01:09:03.000 Are you competing?

01:09:04.000 Well, my purpose is to be the ultimate predator and be the very best at what I do.

01:09:10.000 And other people are interested in that too and finding out what that's about. 0.98

01:09:14.000 Yeah, and I think that this disconnection that people have in society is a main cause of people just feeling like shit all the time. 0.98

01:09:22.000 They don't feel rewarded by life. 0.90

01:09:25.000 When your day-to-day existence is just doing something that you don't enjoy and then coming home and resting and getting ready to do it again...

01:09:42.000 We're good to go.

01:09:51.000 That is above that is this sacrifice, work for something, achieve the results, and you actually live off those results.

01:09:59.000 You're eating it.

01:10:00.000 And that's a very primal thing, man.

01:10:03.000 It's powerful.

01:10:03.000 But it doesn't mean we're less evolved.

01:10:05.000 This is what people have to get into their mind. 0.57

01:10:09.000 Release all your preconceived notions of what a hunter is, these rednecks just out there torturing animals, these psychopaths. 1.00

01:10:16.000 Release all those preconceived notions and take in the concept of wild, of what wild is. 0.88

01:10:24.000 Just to be out in nature and watch all these things run around, watch animals chase after each other, watch Watch this natural process that gives zero fucks if you're there or not there.

01:10:39.000 And then realize that this can be your source of sustenance.

01:10:43.000 You can live in that world for brief moments in time, train for it, prepare for it, bring back that protein, and live.

01:10:51.000 And live a healthier life, too.

01:10:54.000 I think that fact right there, what you just explained, affects every minute of my life.

01:11:01.000 Every day.

01:11:02.000 I mean, because that's basically...

01:11:04.000 I'm known as a bowhunter, the bowhunter, whoever, this guy who does whatever.

01:11:10.000 So that's had such a powerful impact on me.

01:11:14.000 That's...

01:11:14.000 I mean, it's not all I am, but it's a big part of what I am.

01:11:19.000 And that's what I always say.

01:11:21.000 I always say, well, bowhunting's changed my life.

01:11:22.000 And I see these people who message me because of your podcast, and they want that same...

01:11:31.000 Could it impact my life that same way?

01:11:33.000 Could it give my life that type of meaning?

01:11:36.000 I do want to address one thing.

01:11:39.000 People talk about hunters being rednecks or barbarians or heartless or this or that.

01:11:46.000 My buddy Rick Carone is battling cancer right now.

01:11:51.000 When I do...

01:11:53.000 I'm going to sell something like I've sold bows, highest bidder type thing.

01:11:57.000 Hunters are the most generous, heartfelt people.

01:12:00.000 I mean, that's basically all my followers are hunters.

01:12:03.000 And they are so giving and so caring and loving of somebody they've never met.

01:12:11.000 They've just learned about maybe, you know...

01:12:13.000 From my website or from whatever else and I don't know I just I have a heart I mean it's just amazing to me just the heart hunters have and people are so far so wrong on I guess what what moves us what's important to us because I see people giving thousands of dollars to help somebody they've never met.

01:12:36.000 Well, the amount of negativity that you get from non-hunters in comparison to the amount of negativity and hate you get from hunters, it's hugely disproportionate. 0.99

01:12:46.000 What you talked about, about being respectful, about how when you disagree with someone on Twitter, you don't say, fuck off, you fucking dummy, and you don't get involved in any of these negative exchanges. 0.98

01:12:58.000 Because of that you attract this very positive following and I've been to your Facebook page and I've read the comments when you put something up on Instagram and it's an incredibly positive group of people. 0.99

01:13:12.000 Incredibly positive and also people that recognize the rewards of this lifestyle and recognize the negative impact or the negative opinion that a lot of people who don't understand it have and so they feel connected with each other in sort of solidarity Against what they perceive to be these ignorant people that judge them.

01:13:31.000 I know, and that's the thing.

01:13:34.000 I do get negative every once in a while, and all I do, I block them and delete it.

01:13:39.000 Just because I don't want that one person skewing...

01:13:43.000 One person can skew the whole...

01:13:46.000 Comment train, basically.

01:13:48.000 And then just takes away from the whole point.

01:13:50.000 Maybe I'm living or created this fantasy land of positivity by doing that, but that's fine because it helps me.

01:13:58.000 I see other people at Impacts, and I guess the closest thing to negativity that I've done lately is just this slogan I have on my new shirt.

01:14:08.000 Nobody cares.

01:14:09.000 Work harder.

01:14:09.000 Yeah, and that's how we say because everything else is all positive and nobody cares.

01:14:14.000 It's tough love.

01:14:16.000 It's a little bit of tough love.

01:14:17.000 It's like everybody has issues.

01:14:19.000 Everybody has hurdles.

01:14:20.000 Everybody has challenges.

01:14:21.000 But at the end of the day, they'll listen to you.

01:14:24.000 They don't really care that much.

01:14:26.000 If you don't have what you want, you need to work harder.

01:14:28.000 So that's all I've done.

01:14:31.000 I'm not looking for sympathy on anything.

01:14:33.000 I just hope other people take that from this.

01:14:37.000 I still love you and care about you guys.

01:14:40.000 We just need to work harder if we don't have what we want.

01:14:42.000 Well, that's you, dude.

01:14:43.000 You're that guy.

01:14:44.000 Every time we were in camp, you were out there running. 1.00

01:14:46.000 You went running basically every day in fucking Alberta. 0.99

01:14:49.000 You put in the work, man, and that's why you become successful at what you do. 0.99

01:14:53.000 I like people that work hard and push through things because it inspires me to do the same thing.

01:14:58.000 Even that shirt might be perceived as negative.

01:15:02.000 I don't think it's negative.

01:15:03.000 It's inspirational. 1.00

01:15:05.000 It's like, people need to hear that shit. 1.00

01:15:06.000 Just get your fucking ass out of bed. 1.00

01:15:08.000 People love to find an excuse. 1.00

01:15:11.000 Oh, my fucking hangnail's really bugging me, man. 0.99

01:15:13.000 I can't lift. 0.99

01:15:14.000 Just get out and do something.

01:15:17.000 And that's why that Just Do It campaign was so powerful for Nike.

01:15:20.000 Because Just Do It is really what you need to hear sometimes. 0.99

01:15:24.000 Just shut the fuck up and go to work. 0.99

01:15:27.000 Get it done. 1.00

01:15:27.000 I read The Rock's tweets in his Instagrams. 1.00

01:15:30.000 Oh, yeah.

01:15:31.000 Because that guy will fly into somewhere at 4 o'clock in the morning, and he's at the gym at 5. And he takes pictures, and he's fucking killing it every day. 0.98

01:15:40.000 Just done. 0.98

01:15:41.000 Yeah, and that's why he looks that way.

01:15:42.000 Yeah.

01:15:42.000 I mean, you see him in that movie, Hercules?

01:15:45.000 I haven't seen it.

01:15:46.000 You don't get that way by taking the day off because you have a hangnail.

01:15:50.000 You get to look like that, possibly because of some artificial enhanced supplements.

01:15:55.000 I'm not saying.

01:15:57.000 But there's also a lot of hard work involved. 0.99

01:16:00.000 No doubt of fucking about it. 0.99

01:16:02.000 You could take all the steroids in the world. 1.00

01:16:03.000 Your body doesn't grow like that.

01:16:05.000 It grows like that from hard work, period.

01:16:09.000 Inalienable steroids.

01:16:10.000 and hard work is a magical ingredient if you can if you could apply that magical ingredient to almost everything in life and hard work also comes with hard thinking hard work everybody likes to think of as being like oh you just grunt and put in the effort no hard work is also preparation thought process understanding and that is a big part of hunting as well It's not just about,

01:16:35.000 you know, oh, it's really hard to get up that hill, get to that 7,000 feet elevation where those elk are.

01:16:41.000 No, you've got to understand the wind.

01:16:43.000 You've got to understand the behavior of these animals.

01:16:45.000 You've got to understand what's going on in the rut.

01:16:48.000 What does this bull elk attract to? 0.90

01:16:50.000 Are you going to attract a bull by pretending to be a cow, which he wants to have sex with, or are you going to be a bull, which he wants to challenge? 0.89

01:16:59.000 And you've got to know what to do what and what to do when.

01:17:03.000 I'm amazed at how much knowledge is involved in hunting and how much information. 0.98

01:17:09.000 Steve Rinella is a goddamn encyclopedia. 0.97

01:17:13.000 I need to get you two together. 1.00

01:17:16.000 He's a lot smarter than me.

01:17:18.000 Well, he's a very educated man.

01:17:19.000 I'm mostly just a bowhunter.

01:17:21.000 We're good to go.

01:17:43.000 He's really opened my eyes to how much information is involved in hunting.

01:17:47.000 I mean, how much knowledge, how much you have to know, especially, you know, he's doing it all year round, so he's constantly aware of the cycles, the breeding, mating, food patterns, all the different things that you have to pay attention to about each individual animal.

01:18:02.000 There's just a lot going on there, man.

01:18:04.000 There is.

01:18:04.000 It's a rich, intense world.

01:18:07.000 Yeah.

01:18:07.000 No, it's so far removed from, you know, the...

01:18:11.000 We probably addressed it the last time, but the bubba hunting stereotype of driving around, drinking beer, shooting from the truck.

01:18:17.000 That's still out there, right?

01:18:19.000 But that's out there with everything.

01:18:20.000 I mean, I get that with the UFC. You know, people are like, oh yeah, UFC, great.

01:18:24.000 What are you doing, man? 1.00

01:18:25.000 You're fucking hanging around with a bunch of assholes, beating the shit out of each other. 1.00

01:18:28.000 Look, come to jiu-jitsu class with me. 1.00

01:18:30.000 You'll meet some of the nicest, friendliest people, and a lot of them are nerds, okay?

01:18:34.000 A lot of my friends from jiu-jitsu, if you looked at them, you would say, oh, that guy's like a nerd.

01:18:38.000 He's like a nerdy guy. 1.00

01:18:39.000 That nerd will fucking strangle you with his legs, you know? 1.00

01:18:43.000 Like, it's... 1.00

01:18:44.000 What it is, is people that really get into something that is ultimately very rewarding.

01:18:49.000 And I think it's ultimately very rewarding to accomplish something that's difficult to do.

01:18:54.000 And it's something that's missing from a lot of people's lives. 0.95

01:18:57.000 A lot of people are doing something that's easy to do, and they're looking to take coffee breaks, and they're looking to take a nice long lunch break, and they're looking to take a newspaper into the john when they take a shit because nobody can say anything.

01:19:07.000 Hey, I've got to go to the bathroom, man. 0.95

01:19:08.000 What do you want?

01:19:09.000 There's a lot of people that are looking...

01:19:10.000 A newspaper?

01:19:11.000 People take newspapers into the bathroom.

01:19:12.000 Their phones.

01:19:13.000 That's true too, right? 0.99

01:19:14.000 They fucking run out of batteries on the toilet. 0.99

01:19:17.000 Nobody reads papers. 1.00

01:19:18.000 Some people do, man.

01:19:18.000 That's true.

01:19:20.000 Brian Callen still reads the newspaper. 1.00

01:19:21.000 Every time I'm with them motherfuckers, you got the New York Times. 0.99

01:19:23.000 Especially if someone's looking. 1.00

01:19:26.000 I like having a paper breakfast.

01:19:27.000 I'll say that.

01:19:29.000 Hey, so this is one thing I forgot to ask last time.

01:19:33.000 So my kids are big, typical, regular sports fans, like NFL. Of course, I like MMA. I like UFC. So they're like, Dad, do you think a UFC fighter, say somebody like Chad Mendes,

01:19:48.000 who's fighting tomorrow for the title, Love Chad.

01:19:53.000 He's a bow hunter, by the way.

01:19:55.000 Awesome.

01:19:55.000 Killed his first elk this year.

01:19:56.000 I know.

01:19:57.000 He's a stud.

01:19:59.000 So, say, Patrick Willis, who's this huge 240-pound linebacker, who would win in a fight?

01:20:04.000 Chad.

01:20:05.000 Totally.

01:20:06.000 100%.

01:20:07.000 And so that's hard to explain because what people, or my kids, anyway, see is this huge, jacked, giant guy, NFL guy.

01:20:18.000 And then, Chad, who's, what is he, 155?

01:20:21.000 He walks around probably 160, fights at 145. Okay, so, why would he beat him?

01:20:28.000 Well, he definitely doesn't have to win.

01:20:33.000 Like, it is possible that the NFL guy could pick him up and smash him.

01:20:36.000 Just drop him on a rock or something like that.

01:20:38.000 Because you're dealing with 100 extra pounds of alpha male testosterone and bone and aggression and Mexican supplements.

01:20:47.000 Is that him right there?

01:20:48.000 That's the guy? 1.00

01:20:48.000 Why am I looking at his dick, bro? 1.00

01:20:50.000 What the fuck kind of gay porn shit? 1.00

01:20:52.000 That's the first one that comes up. 1.00

01:20:54.000 Tell that dude to pull his pants up. 1.00

01:20:55.000 I don't need to see those fuck muscles at the top of your hips. 1.00

01:20:58.000 Listen to me, boys. 1.00

01:20:59.000 If you're trying to attract the gals, I understand it. 1.00

01:21:02.000 But when you're around other men, pull your pants up so I don't see your fuck muscles. 1.00

01:21:05.000 Those weird upper hip muscles, you know what I mean? 0.99

01:21:08.000 That dudes try to be sexy. 1.00

01:21:09.000 The V part? 1.00

01:21:10.000 This shit. 1.00

01:21:11.000 These things right in there. 1.00

01:21:11.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:21:13.000 See it up there?

01:21:13.000 See it?

01:21:14.000 No, I'm not going to show you.

01:21:15.000 But I'm just standing up.

01:21:17.000 Look at that. 1.00

01:21:18.000 I'm seeing way too much dick. 1.00

01:21:20.000 Anyway, that's Patrick. 1.00

01:21:21.000 His only hope is...

01:21:23.000 Well, there's two possibilities. 1.00

01:21:24.000 If he has martial arts training, Chad's fucked. 1.00

01:21:26.000 He probably doesn't. 1.00

01:21:28.000 If he's like a brown belt in jiu-jitsu and he knows how to kickbox, Chad's fucked. 1.00

01:21:31.000 Because he's just too big. 0.99

01:21:32.000 But if he's just a regular dude with no martial arts training at all, Chad's gonna get his back.

01:21:32.000 Right.

01:21:37.000 Oh, okay. 0.94

01:21:38.000 Yeah, he'll have to choke him out. 0.99

01:21:38.000 Choke him out. 0.99

01:21:41.000 He might knock him out. 0.99

01:21:42.000 Chad hits pretty fucking hard, but he's gonna have to hit him perfect. 0.99

01:21:45.000 You're dealing with a much larger skull than Chad's. 0.99

01:21:48.000 Right. 0.99

01:21:48.000 And you're dealing with Chad's size hands compared to his hands, which are probably as big as my fucking laptop. 0.99

01:21:53.000 Right. 0.99

01:21:54.000 Size is very important, though. 0.93

01:21:57.000 The idea that size doesn't mean anything, that's ridiculous.

01:22:00.000 Size means a lot.

01:22:01.000 It just doesn't mean as much as technique.

01:22:03.000 Technique means the most.

01:22:05.000 But there's a lot of factors involved in who would win in a fight.

01:22:08.000 The most important factor is knowledge and technique.

01:22:12.000 There was a dude...

01:22:14.000 That I used to roll with at 10th Planet.

01:22:16.000 It was a really nice guy who was a former football player.

01:22:18.000 He was 250 pounds.

01:22:19.000 And whenever I used to roll with him, I used to call it riding the bull.

01:22:22.000 Because I'm like, alright, gotta go ride the bull.

01:22:24.000 Because every time I'd get on top of him, well, any time we'd scramble, I would have to initially let him get on top, because he's just too goddamn big for me to take him down.

01:22:34.000 So I'd let him get on top, and then I'd have to sweep him, and then I'd eventually ride him, and then I'd eventually catch him.

01:22:39.000 But it would take me a while. 0.99

01:22:40.000 I'd have to wear his big ass out. 0.99

01:22:42.000 But... 1.00

01:22:43.000 I was just better than him.

01:22:44.000 I'd been doing jujitsu for 15 years, and he had only been doing jujitsu for like six months.

01:22:48.000 So it was just a matter of riding the bull. 1.00

01:22:51.000 I would just hang on to him, but god damn, he was fucking strong as shit. 1.00

01:22:55.000 And I always think, if this motherfucker knew half of what I knew, I'd be doomed. 1.00

01:22:59.000 I'd just be... 0.99

01:23:00.000 There's a huge advantage of being bigger and stronger.

01:23:03.000 It's just not as much of an...

01:23:05.000 Excuse me.

01:23:08.000 Not as much as an advantage as being technical and understanding what's going on inside a fight.

01:23:15.000 One thing I was going to ask, too, about, you know, I get a lot of questions on diet and putting on muscle and this and that.

01:23:22.000 How many, I think, you said eating meat has evolved the brain, basically.

01:23:29.000 Mm-hmm.

01:23:30.000 I think eating meat is how I've been able to retain muscle and still run as much as I do, just all the protein I take.

01:23:37.000 So I was wondering, of fighters.

01:23:40.000 We're good to go.

01:24:00.000 But Jake, although Jake is fairly elite, he was cut from the UFC. Now he's fighting in a small organization because he couldn't beat the best of the best guys.

01:24:10.000 He just lost recently to Hector Lombard.

01:24:12.000 Who knows how much better Jake would be if he existed on a diet of black bear and elk?

01:24:18.000 I don't know, man.

01:24:19.000 Probably a lot better.

01:24:20.000 Who knows?

01:24:20.000 So if you want to make the UFC, you better eat meat.

01:24:23.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:24:23.000 Jake is really fucking good. 0.99

01:24:24.000 He's a really, really good grappler. 0.99

01:24:27.000 But he's also just tough as nails.

01:24:29.000 I think that every edge counts.

01:24:33.000 There's a reason why people take vitamin supplements.

01:24:35.000 There's a reason why people take protein supplements, amino acids, all the things that are legal that people take.

01:24:41.000 They take it because it gives you an edge.

01:24:43.000 It might be a small edge, but that small edge could be the difference between Escaping a submission and tapping out.

01:24:50.000 It could be the difference between cinching up a submission and the guy gets away.

01:24:55.000 It could be the difference between getting that final push to make a takedown and not.

01:25:00.000 Those small edges all add up.

01:25:03.000 Massage therapy, yoga, every little edge, meditation, isolation tanks.

01:25:09.000 Guys are doing everything to get every little edge.

01:25:13.000 And the idea that you would do all these different things, but you wouldn't eat meat.

01:25:17.000 The science is all there. 0.99

01:25:20.000 This idea that vegan athletes are superior is fucking preposterous. 0.98

01:25:25.000 It's so difficult to get B12. It's so difficult to get all of the amino acids. 0.99

01:25:32.000 It's so difficult to get a full, complete, balanced protein without eating meat. 0.98

01:25:38.000 It's really fucking hard. 0.97

01:25:40.000 And that brings me back to bow hunting. 0.98

01:25:43.000 You talk about all those little edges added up to give...

01:25:46.000 Or those little things add up to give you an edge, that's bow hunting.

01:25:50.000 Bow hunting because people will say, well, you don't need to do this, you don't need to do that, that's overkill, that's too much.

01:25:56.000 To me, I'm thinking, I'm just adding one more little positive edge to my arsenal, and then that's how, you know, killed...

01:26:07.000 13 bulls in the last five years.

01:26:10.000 They all haven't been just perfect.

01:26:12.000 I've needed little edges to make it happen.

01:26:15.000 To me, fighting is a lot like...

01:26:19.000 Something as difficult as bow hunting.

01:26:21.000 I think there's a lot of ego involved.

01:26:23.000 You know, there's a lot of people that don't...

01:26:24.000 They don't want to think that they're not putting in as much work as you.

01:26:28.000 So they're like, you know, oh, this guy's meathead.

01:26:31.000 You don't need to pull that much weight.

01:26:33.000 But what's that much weight to you and what's that much weight to me?

01:26:36.000 You know, my question is, okay, how much weight do you lift when you, like, go to the gym?

01:26:42.000 If you can only, like, do a curl with, like, 25 pounds and I can do it with 100...

01:26:46.000 How much stronger am I than you, and what is the difference between a 50-pound bow to you and an 80-pound bow to me? 0.95

01:26:52.000 Because I fuck my shoulder up by pulling a 90-pound bow 100 times a day, 150 times. 0.99

01:26:52.000 Exactly. 0.99

01:26:57.000 It's not bad.

01:26:58.000 I actually am just finishing this Regenicane treatment.

01:27:01.000 It's the tendons.

01:27:02.000 The tendons are restrained.

01:27:04.000 Just repetitive...

01:27:04.000 You're giving all those guys...

01:27:06.000 Ammunition now for why you shouldn't shoot a heavy bow.

01:27:08.000 Well, you know what?

01:27:09.000 If I worried about injuries, I would have never done anything.

01:27:12.000 I've had three knee surgeries.

01:27:14.000 I had my nose fixed. 1.00

01:27:15.000 I'm full of fucking surgeries. 0.99

01:27:18.000 That's what guys say to me because, you know, I run, basically I do The same thing every single day, my training. 0.99

01:27:23.000 And they say, you know, what are you going to do in 40 years when you still want to hunt but you won't be able to hunt because you've been running every day and wearing out your joints?

01:27:31.000 I'm like, I don't know if I'm going to be alive tomorrow, let alone 40 years from now.

01:27:36.000 I'm going to worry about tomorrow, tomorrow, and today I'm going to get my best.

01:27:40.000 Well, people are always looking for some negative, man.

01:27:42.000 They're always looking for something they could point at you that makes you less than them or makes you less than you think you are.

01:27:49.000 People look to diminish.

01:27:50.000 Look, I look to diminish. 1.00

01:27:52.000 I'm a fucking comedian. 1.00

01:27:52.000 That's what I do. 1.00

01:27:53.000 I point holes at things. 1.00

01:27:54.000 I look at shit and I go, look at this stupid bitch. 1.00

01:27:56.000 Don't do that right now, please. 1.00

01:27:57.000 That's my thing.

01:27:59.000 But that is what I do.

01:28:00.000 So I understand the mindset, but it's a very disempowering mindset to instead not be inspired.

01:28:07.000 To not be inspired.

01:28:08.000 To just poke holes at things.

01:28:09.000 Like, you don't need 80 pounds.

01:28:11.000 How about you just be inspired to go...

01:28:13.000 How about you doing a little bit of exercise?

01:28:15.000 How about you not worry about a guy who is obviously far physically stronger than you, who only pulls an extra 20 pounds of weight? 0.98

01:28:23.000 It's really not that big of a goddamn deal. 0.98

01:28:25.000 Yeah. 0.98

01:28:25.000 Right. 0.98

01:28:26.000 It's an ego thing, I think, in a lot of guys.

01:28:29.000 The crabs in a bucket was one of our most popular stories from the last time.

01:28:33.000 Yeah.

01:28:34.000 But, yeah, so that's still, I guess, always going to be out there.

01:28:37.000 It is.

01:28:38.000 It's always going to be out there.

01:28:39.000 I'm fascinated by the technology involved in bow hunting, too.

01:28:45.000 I mean, in the back here, we have one of those radar things.

01:28:50.000 You shoot an arrow through it.

01:28:51.000 The chronograph.

01:28:52.000 The chronograph tells you the exact speed of the arrow.

01:28:54.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:28:55.000 And that was another thing that I had to learn that I thought was really interesting.

01:28:59.000 The spine of the arrow, how stiff the arrow is, how many grains the arrow weighs in relationship to the bow, in relationship to the speed of the arrow.

01:29:08.000 Then you have to calculate all that and put out a sight tape.

01:29:11.000 And that's how you figure out...

01:29:14.000 The guys at the bow rack... 0.98

01:29:16.000 Made me a sight tape for the carbon spider and it's fucking amazing. 0.97

01:29:19.000 It's so dead on because mine was all goofy. 0.94

01:29:22.000 The last one that I printed up myself.

01:29:23.000 It's like a lot involved in learning how to do this right.

01:29:26.000 You basically have to be a scientist.

01:29:30.000 We do have to give a plug to the bow rack. 0.99

01:29:34.000 Springfield, Oregon.

01:29:36.000 We have such an advantage having bows set up by professionals.

01:29:40.000 Guys who do it every single day.

01:29:42.000 There's a lot of guys in small towns throughout We're good to go.

01:29:47.000 Can buy the same bow, buy the same arrows, buy the same everything.

01:29:50.000 The bow is not set up correctly.

01:29:52.000 It's not tuned.

01:29:53.000 And it's just not going to perform.

01:29:56.000 So we know when we go out, especially because I'm at the bow rack, I paper tune my bows.

01:30:02.000 We put it in the hooter shooter, which is a machine that shoots your bow for you to tell you whether the bow is set up correctly or there's some human error involved.

01:30:11.000 So basically at the end of the day, when we go hunting, we know the bow is at...

01:30:16.000 The top of its capability and any error is us.

01:30:20.000 So then, if I can control my errors, the error is going to go right where it's supposed to go.

01:30:25.000 And that's also with using Hoyt bows.

01:30:30.000 Yeah.

01:30:31.000 Best bows out there as far as I'm concerned.

01:30:33.000 And you're right.

01:30:34.000 The technology is just fascinating.

01:30:37.000 Yeah, these Hoyt bows are just incredible, man.

01:30:39.000 The carbon spider turbo that we used when we were in Canada.

01:30:44.000 You're talking about a bear.

01:30:45.000 I mean, 250-plus pound animal.

01:30:48.000 This arrow went straight through its body and went so deep into a log that I had to break it off because I couldn't get the broadhead out.

01:30:55.000 Right.

01:30:55.000 That arrow is sitting up on the wall in my office.

01:30:57.000 I mean, it passed clean through this animal like that.

01:31:01.000 Like butter. 0.69

01:31:01.000 And there's a giant difference between that and what you think of as a bow and arrow that, like from the Boy Scout days, you know, when you would shoot those little shitty recurve bows, like 20-pound pull or whatever it was. 0.69

01:31:12.000 They just don't have the kind of impact that these bows have with the cams and the technology and the way they engineer these risers.

01:31:20.000 I mean, these things are incredible pieces of work and engineering.

01:31:24.000 Well, and I, let's see, what did I just get?

01:31:27.000 I just got the brand new Nitrum.

01:31:28.000 And actually, I brought it sitting over there.

01:31:30.000 And you just asked when I walked in, you're like, why'd you bring your bow?

01:31:33.000 I'm like, because I take my bow everywhere.

01:31:35.000 Why wouldn't I bring it?

01:31:36.000 I need to keep that thing in my sight.

01:31:39.000 So, yeah.

01:31:40.000 You bring that when you go on the road and you set up targets places?

01:31:43.000 Yeah.

01:31:43.000 Like here, people say, no, I'm going to be in LA, so they want to shoot and Where are you going to shoot today?

01:31:49.000 Are you going to shoot somewhere today?

01:31:50.000 Yeah, yeah. 0.87

01:31:51.000 Where are you going to go?

01:31:52.000 Well, there's three people here who have places that they shoot.

01:31:57.000 So I don't know if it's a range or if it's their house, but they've all invited me to meet up.

01:32:01.000 I'm going to meet up with at least one of them. 0.94

01:32:03.000 Maybe they'll all be there, and we're going to shoot both. 1.00

01:32:06.000 And one of them is going to be that flight attendant. 1.00

01:32:08.000 He's going to be waiting for you.

01:32:09.000 He's going to be wearing Velcro underwear.

01:32:16.000 Japanese...

01:32:16.000 He probably is from here.

01:32:18.000 Chances are he is from California somewhere.

01:32:21.000 What are you trying to say?

01:32:21.000 Everyone's gay in California?

01:32:22.000 Is that what you're trying to say? 0.94

01:32:23.000 How dare you?

01:32:25.000 That's cool, though, that you have this sort of connection with fans.

01:32:27.000 I know you do a lot of those Cabela's openings or Bass Pro Shops, whatever it is.

01:32:32.000 Which one is it?

01:32:33.000 Both.

01:32:33.000 Both of them?

01:32:34.000 Yeah, I do appearances at both.

01:32:34.000 You do both of them?

01:32:36.000 And when I go, I just, like I said, I like the positive atmosphere.

01:32:41.000 I like the camaraderie.

01:32:42.000 I like to see people working, so I'll say, hey, I went to Alaska, you know, and I said, I did the Bass Pro Shop Grand Opening in Anchorage, and I said, let's go run some mountains up there.

01:32:53.000 So I met up with a couple guys, did two different runs, and we hammered out some tough mountain runs, and it's just...

01:33:01.000 It was soaking wet, freezing, and never felt more alive.

01:33:05.000 That's so awesome.

01:33:06.000 It's cool, too, that you connect with people like that because that's also what I saw when we were in camp in Alberta.

01:33:11.000 All those guys had come into that camp that week because they knew that you were going to be there.

01:33:15.000 They wanted to hunt up during that week.

01:33:17.000 And what a positive group of people.

01:33:19.000 Oh, best guys ever.

01:33:20.000 All those guys.

01:33:21.000 I'd never met any of them before.

01:33:22.000 Yeah.

01:33:23.000 They hadn't met each other before.

01:33:25.000 That was what was crazy.

01:33:26.000 When we got there, it was almost like they were all old buddies that were hanging out together, and then slowly I started piecing together.

01:33:33.000 I'm like, when did you guys meet?

01:33:34.000 Yesterday? 0.99

01:33:35.000 You guys don't even fucking know each other? 0.99

01:33:37.000 Yeah. 0.98

01:33:38.000 Grand party of like really friendly guys.

01:33:40.000 I thought it was just a bunch of old high school buddies who got together.

01:33:45.000 But no, just super positive, super friendly, and we had a great time.

01:33:51.000 I don't know what type of group of people you could bring together in that short of time and have that type of connection.

01:34:00.000 I don't know.

01:34:01.000 Hunting just seems to do that to people.

01:34:03.000 I mean, I don't know about you, but when I'm somewhere, I don't care where, here, whatever town I'm in, when I see somebody in camo, I'm like looking at them, wondering if, you know, hey, do you want to talk about hunting?

01:34:17.000 Do you hunt?

01:34:18.000 Why are you wearing camo?

01:34:20.000 But it's just like that brotherhood.

01:34:21.000 It's weird.

01:34:22.000 I had a Hoyt hat on, and I was at the airport, and this old dude sat next to me, and he just plopped down right next to me, and he goes, how long you been bow hunting?

01:34:31.000 He's an old dude from Texas.

01:34:32.000 He had a Lone Star belt buckle on, and he started just telling me stories about hunting for elk and hunting for this and that and bow hunting.

01:34:40.000 He does all kinds of hunting, but he does a lot of bow hunting, too.

01:34:43.000 But that was the green light.

01:34:44.000 He just plopped down next to me and just started talking, and we had like a half an hour conversation.

01:34:48.000 Well, nowadays, that old school dude, that's awesome.

01:34:53.000 Nowadays, the young guys or the guys that seem, I don't know, I'm in communication with, They're so passionate about new bows and technology, like you mentioned.

01:35:03.000 The unveiling of a new bow...

01:35:06.000 So if you have a Hoyt, people are like, what year is it?

01:35:10.000 It's like, 2014?

01:35:13.000 Oh, yeah.

01:35:14.000 So you don't have a 2015 Nitrum Turbo yet, huh?

01:35:17.000 It's just like, it's crazy.

01:35:20.000 And so Hoyt and all these other companies, Bowtech, they have this...

01:35:25.000 It's going to come out on the 15th, and they'll give teasers, and people are just on all these forums trying to guess what's going to be different, what the new technology is going to be.

01:35:35.000 And it's just so fun, and people are so passionate about it.

01:35:41.000 I don't know.

01:35:42.000 It's like the release of a new iPhone.

01:35:43.000 Oh, totally.

01:35:44.000 It's really similar.

01:35:45.000 Totally.

01:35:45.000 It's really similar.

01:35:46.000 And you find out, oh, look at this.

01:35:47.000 They've got this new anti-torquing technology.

01:35:49.000 What is the new anti-torquing technology?

01:35:49.000 Yeah.

01:35:51.000 What is that all about?

01:35:52.000 The cable roller, how that's set up is it's going to help you tune your bow because there's no torque in that one.

01:36:02.000 Normally when you pull your string back and that cable, there's a lot of tension, a lot of torque right there typically.

01:36:09.000 Back in the old school days, that would just kind of slide on a bar.

01:36:13.000 Hoyt has come up with this system, the anti-torquing technology, where there's no torque on that.

01:36:19.000 And how they've designed the riser, it just helps all the tuning issues, the performance of the bow, the anti-torquing is one part of it, the riser design is another part of it.

01:36:30.000 All the little tweaks they make, it's just making a...

01:36:35.000 It's a sweeter, smoother shooting bow that tunes up quicker.

01:36:38.000 And what that does is, you talked about your bear, how that arrow flew straight, blew right through there.

01:36:45.000 For that to happen, that arrow has to be just flying perfect.

01:36:53.000 All that plays into that.

01:36:54.000 And that's how you get those clean, quick kills.

01:36:57.000 And if you're shooting targets, that's how you get every arrow in the X. And so it's all those little things.

01:37:02.000 People will say, actually, I shot the bow, and speed-wise, it was a little bit slower than the Carbon Spider Turbo.

01:37:12.000 It was three feet per second slower.

01:37:14.000 But...

01:37:15.000 You look at the brace height, which is a big part of why a bow is fast and why it's not.

01:37:21.000 The brace height is the distance between the string and the actual riser.

01:37:25.000 Right.

01:37:25.000 So the taller that is, the quicker the arrow is off the string.

01:37:31.000 So that means you as a shooter have less impact on it being imperfect.

01:37:35.000 The shorter it is, it's going to be on that string longer, longer, longer, and then it finally comes off right when it gets close to your hand and that riser there.

01:37:43.000 And so because it's propelled for longer, it's going to be faster.

01:37:47.000 But you also have more time to drop your bow arm.

01:37:51.000 or do or flinch or do whatever wrist torque this or that and so it's generally a less accurate arrow so my my new bow is a little slower but it's got a taller brace height so meaning it's more forgiving Three feet is pretty nominal.

01:38:08.000 Not that big a deal.

01:38:09.000 But it's so sweet shooting.

01:38:11.000 I mean, I went down there and tuning a bow used to be this whole elongated process.

01:38:17.000 And it would take sometimes days to get that thing shooting through paper right and get that arrow flying right.

01:38:24.000 And it's like, is the arrow underspined?

01:38:26.000 Am I... Am I torquing my wrist?

01:38:28.000 Is having my thumb behind my neck affecting all this stuff?

01:38:33.000 Now, I go down there, it was like two shots, perfect.

01:38:37.000 And you knew it was ready?

01:38:38.000 Perfect.

01:38:39.000 Well, you're an expert archer, so one of the things I've learned from watching your videos is I've seen your old...

01:38:45.000 Spider turbo, and then you went from that to the carbon spider turbo, and see the difference in the amount of feet per second, how smooth it feels.

01:38:53.000 You could see in your own videos the progression of the technology, which is really kind of cool.

01:38:59.000 Yeah, what I've noticed, even those old bows, those would kill.

01:39:04.000 Those would probably get the job done probably 90% of the time, but it's those little things.

01:39:11.000 It's that 10% that's going to Make the difference.

01:39:14.000 You know, is it going to be a lethal shot or is it going to be just a wound, a flesh wound?

01:39:20.000 And so those little things.

01:39:22.000 So yeah, before, I've killed for 26 years.

01:39:27.000 And the bows that I started with are night and day different than the bows now.

01:39:31.000 But still, it's a primitive sport.

01:39:33.000 Still, it's very difficult.

01:39:35.000 Still, there's a lot of human...

01:39:39.000 We're good to go.

01:39:42.000 We're good to go.

01:40:03.000 At that slam dunk range or what I would consider slam dunk, 30, 40 yards, I'm going to be able to make that shot because technique-wise, I know I'm dialed in.

01:40:12.000 I know my Hoyt's shooting money because it's tuned perfectly, and so that's what's happened.

01:40:18.000 I mean, I killed those bulls this year. 0.88

01:40:21.000 One arrow...

01:40:22.000 They were down in seconds, those big 800 pound animals, and it's just perfect.

01:40:28.000 And that's, you know, that's what it's all about.

01:40:31.000 And the discipline involved is so fascinating because it seems like such a straightforward thing.

01:40:36.000 Your arm is out straight, you pull the string back, you aim through the sight, and you let the arrow go. 0.97

01:40:40.000 But meanwhile, we're in camp, there's fucking 10 dudes in camp, all of them bow hunters. 0.99

01:40:44.000 You are... 0.99

01:40:46.000 Consistently outperforming all of us.

01:40:48.000 Consistently nailing bullseyes over and over again.

01:40:50.000 And everybody's perplexed and puzzled. 0.99

01:40:52.000 What the fuck am I doing wrong? 0.97

01:40:54.000 And the difference is just inches. 0.98

01:40:56.000 Inches here, left, right.

01:40:57.000 But it's just the amount of time you put in and the focus and the discipline and just the knowledge that you've accumulated after all these years.

01:41:06.000 And that's one of the things that's so attractive about it is that it's not something that's easy.

01:41:10.000 I thought you were going to say attractive about me.

01:41:12.000 Go right back to it.

01:41:15.000 The fact that it's not easy is exciting.

01:41:19.000 The fact that, man, when you shoot a bullseye at 40 yards and it just sits right in there, it's so satisfying.

01:41:27.000 Oh, it feels so good.

01:41:28.000 Yeah, it's weird.

01:41:29.000 It's like you would think.

01:41:30.000 I watch videos online now of archery competitions where guys are just shooting at a piece of paper 40 yards away, and when it goes in that bullseye, everybody cheers, and there's something really satisfying about it.

01:41:42.000 Dude, you watch...

01:41:44.000 So on my YouTube channel, I don't know, there's...

01:41:48.000 Almost 3 million views on there, which isn't that big a deal for Katy Perry.

01:41:53.000 For bow hunting, it's quite a few views.

01:41:56.000 So I have 150 videos.

01:41:59.000 So if you go on there and you say, most viewed.

01:42:03.000 Out of all those videos, and I've got some cool stuff on there.

01:42:06.000 I've got bears dying, water buffalo dying, and elk dying, and sheep on cliffs.

01:42:15.000 The most viewed are all shooting a bow.

01:42:18.000 Just targets.

01:42:19.000 Standing there shooting a bow.

01:42:20.000 Because people who bow hunt, or even just people who do archery, they want to see someone who's better at it than them doing it.

01:42:28.000 So they could go, okay, what's he doing here?

01:42:30.000 What's going on there?

01:42:31.000 Yeah, I enjoy watching you shoot it.

01:42:31.000 Maybe so.

01:42:34.000 I have my own fucking bow, but I like watching you do it. 1.00

01:42:34.000 It's just ridiculous. 1.00

01:42:38.000 Because I go, what's he doing right here? 0.83

01:42:40.000 What's different?

01:42:41.000 Well, and I get a lot... 0.99

01:42:42.000 I had to turn the comments off a lot of the videos because so many stupid comments that drove me crazy. 0.98

01:42:48.000 So I'm like, I'll just turn off the comments. 0.94

01:42:51.000 On the comments that I've left on with the equipment, it's people just, they watch everything I do and they're like, what sight is that?

01:42:58.000 What rest is that?

01:42:59.000 Why is he moving his hand like that?

01:43:01.000 I mean, it's just, like you said, studying and studying and studying.

01:43:05.000 And it's just, to me, it's just awesome that people care that much.

01:43:10.000 And this is like, we go back to, this is what archery can do.

01:43:13.000 It can impact people, give them something to think about and not obsess about Weird, negative stuff.

01:43:23.000 They're thinking in their minds, working about bow hunting and archery and how they can be better, and that's...

01:43:29.000 I like that.

01:43:29.000 And again, there is some sort of a zen meditative aspect to just shooting a bow into a target.

01:43:36.000 I recommend it really highly to people that have zero desire to hunt.

01:43:41.000 Just find an archery range, and if you can take a lesson, take a lesson, and get a bow, figure out how to set it up.

01:43:49.000 If there's a pro shop near you that's really good, someone could help you.

01:43:52.000 Man, just a fun, fun way to spend time.

01:43:56.000 I have my kids do it, man.

01:43:58.000 I've got a six-year-old and a four-year-old that shoot bows and arrows.

01:43:58.000 Yeah.

01:44:00.000 Yeah.

01:44:01.000 Kids love...

01:44:02.000 My daughter will go out there and...

01:44:04.000 Here's what's funny about shooting far.

01:44:07.000 You know, like the popular ones are like me shooting at 140 or...

01:44:10.000 I think I shot a balloon at like...

01:44:14.000 227 yards or something like that.

01:44:16.000 But I take my daughter out there.

01:44:17.000 She's 10. She's got this little Hoyt Reed curve.

01:44:19.000 And so she's shooting.

01:44:20.000 We had this...

01:44:21.000 She's shooting at 20 yards, this big bag. 1.00

01:44:23.000 And she's like, Dad, how far is that bear?

01:44:26.000 I'm like...

01:44:27.000 I don't know, it's like 70 yards.

01:44:29.000 She's like, could I shoot at it?

01:44:30.000 I mean, she wants to shoot far too. 0.97

01:44:33.000 You just want to know if you can hit it.

01:44:36.000 And that's just, she's not thinking about hunting or doing anything.

01:44:39.000 She's just thinking about, she wants to see if that arrow will hit that where she wants it to.

01:44:43.000 Well, people who shoot a free throw want to know if they can shoot a three-pointer.

01:44:47.000 You want to know.

01:44:48.000 You want to back up a little.

01:44:49.000 All right, let's try it from back here.

01:44:50.000 Can you hit it back here?

01:44:52.000 That's what people are all about.

01:44:54.000 I mean, that's part of what's wrong with us.

01:44:57.000 We constantly push the boundaries.

01:44:59.000 More is better.

01:45:01.000 Yeah.

01:45:01.000 What are your thoughts on crossbows?

01:45:03.000 What do you think about crossbows?

01:45:05.000 To me, I mean, I've never even shot a crossbow.

01:45:08.000 But what I know about them is you don't need to practice at all.

01:45:13.000 Basically, once it's sighted in, it's like a rifle.

01:45:18.000 Yeah.

01:45:19.000 I don't like crossbows during bow season.

01:45:23.000 If people want to use a crossbow, that's fine.

01:45:25.000 I have nothing against crossbows.

01:45:27.000 I don't think they should be allowed in bow season because it's different.

01:45:30.000 We talked about the discipline and the commitment and everything you need to be proficient with a bow.

01:45:35.000 You don't need that with a crossbow.

01:45:38.000 Walking Dead's got everybody crossbow happy. 0.96

01:45:40.000 Yeah. 0.96

01:45:41.000 That dude on the Walking Dead fucks everything up with that crossbow. 0.84

01:45:44.000 Dude, Daryl, Daryl, imagine what he'd do with a Hoyt. 0.95

01:45:48.000 I mean, are you kidding me?

01:45:50.000 He shoots that crossbow and it goes six inches in some rotten zombie. 0.59

01:45:55.000 Right. 0.60

01:45:56.000 A Hoyt would go through ten rotten zombies.

01:45:59.000 Well, do they have a lighter arrow?

01:46:00.000 Is that what it is?

01:46:01.000 A bolt?

01:46:02.000 Yeah, because it's shorter.

01:46:04.000 The arrow, the shaft is similar, but it's half the length.

01:46:08.000 I don't know what it is, but that's lighter, so it's not carrying that energy, that momentum.

01:46:14.000 So they have a problem with pass-throughs and stuff like that?

01:46:17.000 Like passing through an animal, is it more difficult with a crossbow because it's a lighter projectile?

01:46:23.000 Yeah, I mean, the whole thing with an arrow, the lighter the arrow, the less kinetic energy you're going to have.

01:46:29.000 So, and people will talk about, well, that's not momentum, da-da-da-da-da.

01:46:33.000 But usually, the higher kinetic energy your arrow possesses, the more penetration it's going to get.

01:46:41.000 To increase kinetic energy, all you do is add weight.

01:46:45.000 So, your bow could be slower, but if the arrow's heavier, more kinetic energy.

01:46:51.000 So it's a heavier arrow going slower, but there's more behind it.

01:46:54.000 Right.

01:46:54.000 So it's almost more important to have weight than it is to have, but there's a point of diminishing returns, right?

01:47:00.000 Yeah, that's way up at like 800 and some grains.

01:47:02.000 Oh, really?

01:47:03.000 Which is a very, I've never even shot an arrow that heavy.

01:47:05.000 What I used for the water buffalo in Australia was a 650-grain arrow, and that's heavy.

01:47:12.000 You know, what we use for bear is 450. Yeah.

01:47:14.000 So the diminishing return point is over 800 grains.

01:47:19.000 And at 450 grains, still shooting 288 feet a second.

01:47:24.000 Which is, for folks who don't know what that looks like, you barely see the arrow.

01:47:29.000 Yeah, so for kinetic energy, that's probably, I know I did it, it's like 80 some foot pounds of kinetic energy.

01:47:39.000 And that doesn't mean anything to anybody other than It hits hard. 1.00

01:47:43.000 Shit's lethal. 1.00

01:47:44.000 It's very lethal. 1.00

01:47:45.000 Especially you put a Montech, you know, the heads we use were Montech broadheads, razor-sharp heads.

01:47:52.000 Yeah, it's gonna it's gonna blow through there.

01:47:54.000 And like I said, I mean went through the animal and then so deep into a log that I couldn't get it out.

01:48:00.000 I had to break off the tip.

01:48:01.000 You know what was shooting a bow like we talked about just that the fascination behind it is when I was in Tanzania those guys You know, the natives, they had who knows what type of bows they've seen.

01:48:13.000 So we're setting up a lion bait there and had like half a buffalo hanging.

01:48:18.000 And I'd put a little yellow leaf there and I'd get back 40 yards.

01:48:22.000 I want to see, you know, if a lion was here, where would my arrow hit?

01:48:27.000 So they'd be standing there.

01:48:29.000 I'd be standing back.

01:48:30.000 We'd have the bait there with the leaf on it.

01:48:32.000 And I'd stand, everybody ready?

01:48:34.000 Yeah, everybody's ready.

01:48:34.000 So I'd draw back, shoot, You know, hit the leaf, and they would just be like, big smiles on their face, just watching that arrow, just like, couldn't believe that arrow, just whack!

01:48:45.000 And it just, it was, they just wanted to look at it, and I'd give them the arrow and the bow, and they'd just be holding it, thinking, like it was some, like, witchcraft.

01:48:54.000 It was so awesome.

01:48:55.000 Did they have traditional bows?

01:48:57.000 Did they make their own bows?

01:48:58.000 No.

01:48:58.000 They may.

01:48:59.000 I didn't see any.

01:49:00.000 Did they hunt themselves?

01:49:01.000 Or did they...

01:49:02.000 What did they do for food?

01:49:07.000 Yeah, they've...

01:49:08.000 Let's see.

01:49:10.000 Let me think.

01:49:11.000 Well, you're talking about the one guy, the poacher, that had really made his own sort of muzzleloader out of a regular rifle.

01:49:17.000 Yeah, those guys obviously hunt.

01:49:20.000 The guys in camp, they would eat what?

01:49:23.000 What the hunters killed, basically.

01:49:26.000 But they've all hunted.

01:49:27.000 Some of them are, like Rashidi, who I mentioned, he's what they call a tracker.

01:49:33.000 And so what they do is they look at the tracks of the animals, and they can look at them, and they can tell you whether that track was from a few hours ago, this morning, last night, or two days ago.

01:49:48.000 Just by the track.

01:49:49.000 And I've hunted a lot.

01:49:51.000 I've seen a lot of tracks.

01:49:52.000 But when I look, I'm like, that's pretty fresh.

01:49:55.000 That's it.

01:49:56.000 That's it.

01:49:56.000 Right.

01:49:57.000 I'm a full clock.

01:50:00.000 They're aging that thing by the hour, essentially.

01:50:03.000 So that's what a tracker can do.

01:50:05.000 And then when you hit an animal, if there's a blood trail, I learned so much from those guys.

01:50:12.000 And I would ask, What are you looking at?

01:50:16.000 What's telling you that that's, you know, this age, you know, and it's just grains of sand that has fallen in off the edge, just things like that.

01:50:23.000 So, you know, I think they've probably killed a lot less than they've hunted, if that makes sense.

01:50:29.000 And they eat lions?

01:50:32.000 Yeah, they'll eat.

01:50:34.000 What they won't eat?

01:50:36.000 Hyenas.

01:50:37.000 Basically, the buffalo, I'm sure they'll eat, but they'd rather use them for bait because they're just nasty.

01:50:44.000 But definitely, there's animals that they won't eat.

01:50:47.000 I'm not sure.

01:50:49.000 I couldn't tell you honestly how they feel about lions because, like I said, they're so revered over there.

01:50:57.000 It's just like all anybody could think of is, you know, we were hunting a lot of different things, but Simba was always the topic.

01:51:06.000 It was, we're Simba.

01:51:07.000 And so that was what we were after.

01:51:09.000 And I don't really...

01:51:11.000 We never killed one, so I don't really know what they would do.

01:51:14.000 Is that because they fear of those lions?

01:51:17.000 Because those lions will take people out, and they do on a regular basis there, right?

01:51:20.000 They will.

01:51:21.000 It's just like there's...

01:51:22.000 I heard stories from them over there about the lions would come into villages, and if you didn't act afraid of them, they wouldn't hurt you.

01:51:34.000 They told stories like this.

01:51:36.000 They would just walk through the village?

01:51:37.000 Yeah.

01:51:38.000 And the kids wouldn't act afraid of them, so the kids could be around them.

01:51:44.000 What?

01:51:45.000 Yeah.

01:51:46.000 Kids, go play with the lions.

01:51:47.000 You gotta wash the dishes.

01:51:49.000 Yeah.

01:51:50.000 It's...

01:51:50.000 Wow.

01:51:51.000 I don't know.

01:51:52.000 And lions are different.

01:51:53.000 Lions are so dominant.

01:51:56.000 I mean...

01:51:57.000 I... Let's see.

01:52:00.000 I stalked to within...

01:52:03.000 He was 68 or 69 yards, and I had a big male lion, a shooter, and it was quartering to me.

01:52:09.000 Obviously, I just had my bow.

01:52:11.000 With the rifle, it would have been done deal. 0.85

01:52:13.000 He was a six-year-old, mature, the kind of lion we wanted to kill, as I mentioned.

01:52:18.000 And I didn't have the right angle on the shot, so I wasn't going to take it.

01:52:21.000 So I ended up, I didn't shoot.

01:52:23.000 He got in the brush.

01:52:24.000 I got 50 yards from him.

01:52:25.000 But he knew I was there the whole time.

01:52:29.000 So, they're not like a deer or an elk that's just going to take off.

01:52:33.000 They're like, the thing about it is, if you get too close and you make that shot with an arrow, he's probably going to get you before he's dead.

01:52:45.000 You know what I mean?

01:52:46.000 You can look at all the videos you want.

01:52:50.000 Wounded, they'll come hard a lot of times at you.

01:52:55.000 At whatever wounded him.

01:52:57.000 So what was your plan for that?

01:52:59.000 No plan.

01:53:00.000 I don't know.

01:53:03.000 That seems like...

01:53:05.000 flawed.

01:53:07.000 Yeah, I know.

01:53:09.000 You know, Ryan, he was there behind me, and he had a 416, which is a big gun, and I trust him.

01:53:20.000 So that's the plan?

01:53:21.000 I didn't ever care about the plan.

01:53:25.000 To me, I was never like, okay, you got it?

01:53:27.000 I never would look one time at what the plan was or verify there was a plan.

01:53:36.000 I don't even want to say what my mindset is because people just probably just call BS. No, say it.

01:53:41.000 No, I'm not going to say it.

01:53:41.000 Come on.

01:53:42.000 But anyway. 0.98

01:53:43.000 That's ridiculous. 0.97

01:53:44.000 You can't say you're not going to say it and then not say it. 0.99

01:53:46.000 No, that's what little kids do.

01:53:48.000 They try to trick other kids to tell them.

01:53:50.000 No, what little kids do is they say, I'm not going to tell you.

01:53:53.000 And then they don't.

01:53:54.000 Then they tell you.

01:53:55.000 No, then they tell you though.

01:53:56.000 When they get called out, they'll be like, okay, but don't tell anybody.

01:53:59.000 I'm telling you, man.

01:53:59.000 No.

01:54:00.000 You can't say I'm not going to tell you because you've called BS. People won't call BS. Just speak your mind.

01:54:05.000 You won't tell anybody?

01:54:06.000 I won't tell anybody.

01:54:08.000 I won't even repeat it.

01:54:09.000 It'll never leave this room.

01:54:11.000 Okay. 0.99

01:54:12.000 My stupid thought process is if I go there, I'm not worried about the backup plan or being covered or anything like that. 1.00

01:54:23.000 If I try to kill the lion but instead it kills me, that's just the way it goes. 1.00

01:54:28.000 So you have this mindset, like this is just your accepted reality of life.

01:54:34.000 That's it. 1.00

01:54:34.000 I mean, I'm trying to kill it. 1.00

01:54:36.000 If I lose and I'm on the other end of that, it's just the way it goes. 1.00

01:54:42.000 That's like some intense Native American talking to Outlaw Josie Wales type shit. 0.99

01:54:46.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:54:46.000 These are my words of life. 0.99

01:54:48.000 People will probably just say, oh, he's full of crap. 1.00

01:54:53.000 I believe you. 1.00

01:54:54.000 I believe you're crazy enough to actually have that mindset. 0.95

01:54:58.000 You sort of saw it in bear hunting, I guess, a little bit. 0.96

01:55:00.000 Yeah, I did.

01:55:01.000 I did a couple times.

01:55:02.000 He walked down some bears and scared them off.

01:55:05.000 Yeah, you definitely...

01:55:06.000 That's the whole thing about the hunting on the ground.

01:55:09.000 Nobody's doing that.

01:55:09.000 Very few people are hunting bears on the ground.

01:55:12.000 But you had that whole camp doing it.

01:55:13.000 There's a lot of guys that were doing it there.

01:55:15.000 Well, the thing with the bears, and you saw it, is there's like this line...

01:55:21.000 And so what they do is they'll stay out there at 15 yards or whatever and we're there and they know we're there and there's like...

01:55:28.000 But then they sort of come a little closer and then they'll go back and then they sort of come a little closer.

01:55:33.000 And then pretty soon there's this line that I'm thinking once they get there...

01:55:42.000 We're good to go.

01:56:03.000 The video, we'll play the video of you shooting this bear, the one that caused all the controversy.

01:56:09.000 But one of the things that's as shocking about it is not just the arrow going through the bear, it's how fast the bear runs once it gets hit. 0.99

01:56:19.000 It's like, jeez, that's like some Usain Bolt shit. 0.99

01:56:22.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:56:22.000 It's just... 0.99

01:56:23.000 No.

01:56:24.000 Whoa, they can move, man.

01:56:26.000 If they want to come...

01:56:28.000 We're in trouble.

01:56:47.000 And people don't have any problem with people going trophy fish hunting.

01:56:50.000 I caught a marlin.

01:56:51.000 How many people eat marlins?

01:56:53.000 A few Hawaiian folks, they'll eat them. 1.00

01:56:55.000 Apparently, marlin's not that bad.

01:56:57.000 It's just people think it's bad.

01:56:59.000 Yeah.

01:56:59.000 I don't think I've had it.

01:57:00.000 I killed a marlin. 0.95

01:57:02.000 I caught a marlin a long time ago, and they said they were going to smoke it, the guys who own the boat.

01:57:07.000 They have a weird thing in Hawaii.

01:57:08.000 They give you some of the fish, but they take most of the fish.

01:57:12.000 Oh, I see.

01:57:17.000 It's very valuable to them, you know?

01:57:17.000 Yeah.

01:57:19.000 Okay.

01:57:20.000 But, you know, like a marlin.

01:57:22.000 Marlin was about 70 pounds.

01:57:23.000 Wasn't a big one.

01:57:24.000 But a 70 pound marlin is probably worth quite a bit of money.

01:57:26.000 And it's a lot of meat, you know?

01:57:28.000 They smoke it.

01:57:29.000 But nobody has a problem with that.

01:57:31.000 But if you go and...

01:57:34.000 Take some sort of an animal.

01:57:35.000 We differentiate between a fish and an animal.

01:57:38.000 If you take a trip to Africa because you want to catch some exotic fish and eat it on the boat, nobody has any problem with that.

01:57:45.000 Like, oh, did you eat it?

01:57:46.000 Yeah, it was delicious. 1.00

01:57:47.000 But if you go and you say, we went to Africa and shot a kudu and ate it, why the fuck would you go there and shoot a kudu? 1.00

01:57:52.000 You're not doing that for food. 1.00

01:57:54.000 You're not bringing it home to feed your family.

01:57:56.000 They have very rigid ideas about what you should and shouldn't do with a mammal as opposed to what you should and shouldn't do with a fish. 0.98

01:58:05.000 Look at these swamp people shows where they go and they're shooting 500 fucking alligator a season. 0.95

01:58:13.000 They don't eat one of them. 0.99

01:58:15.000 They're not eating any of them.

01:58:17.000 They're just purely using the skins.

01:58:20.000 It's not a mammal, so it's fine.

01:58:21.000 Yeah, for whatever reason, because it's a dinosaur. 0.99

01:58:24.000 Nobody gives a shit. 0.98

01:58:25.000 Meanwhile, alligator is like some of the highest protein, lowest fat, lowest cholesterol meat you can get. 0.99

01:58:32.000 Like, it's really good for you, and it's just wasting.

01:58:34.000 Just boats full of alligator.

01:58:36.000 I mean, I don't know, maybe some of them eat them.

01:58:39.000 Yeah, probably, but, you know, and it's...

01:58:43.000 I guess when you talk about baiting, when deer are coming into an agricultural type setting...

01:58:48.000 That's bait. 0.93

01:58:49.000 That's bait because you're setting up on a trail they like to use to get there.

01:58:53.000 Or if a lot of people hunt antelope and they're coming to water, you're setting up.

01:58:59.000 Basically, water is the bait.

01:59:01.000 So, not everything fits in a perfect box.

01:59:07.000 I'm not saying I'm not guilty of it either, but with hunting especially...

01:59:13.000 Well, I can tell you when I first started hunting, one of the things that I said I wouldn't do is I would never bait.

01:59:17.000 I wouldn't do that.

01:59:19.000 And I didn't want to shoot a bear either.

01:59:20.000 Those are two things I didn't want to do.

01:59:21.000 Now I have no problem with it because I became educated.

01:59:23.000 You sold yourself to the devil.

01:59:24.000 That too.

01:59:25.000 I became educated.

01:59:26.000 We'll show the video now so people will get a...

01:59:28.000 This is the video that got everybody mad at me.

01:59:31.000 The website is Living the Dream Promotions.

01:59:31.000 And this is...

01:59:35.000 And this is our friends John and Jen up there in Canada.

01:59:39.000 Was this on my YouTube?

01:59:41.000 Yeah.

01:59:50.000 It's like a Godzilla movie.

01:59:51.000 My mouth isn't matched.

01:59:53.000 Oh, is it off?

01:59:56.000 A little bit.

01:59:57.000 A little bit.

02:00:00.000 See that bear crack back there?

02:00:02.000 Yeah, bear crack is this mixture of marshmallows and gelatin and all sorts of smelly things that cam heats up so that the bears smell it.

02:00:12.000 So that target I'm shooting at is seven yards, six or seven yards, like I said.

02:00:17.000 I just want to have that confidence that when a bear comes in, I'm going to make that shot.

02:00:21.000 So even though it's a slam dunk chip shot, with bow hunting, there's no such thing.

02:00:27.000 And even though you've been doing this your whole life. 0.99

02:00:29.000 So look at the size of this fucking bear. 0.99

02:00:31.000 Yeah, so that's me back there in the back. 0.99

02:00:34.000 Watch the arrow go through it.

02:00:36.000 This is where it's crazy.

02:00:41.000 Ooh.

02:00:42.000 Look how fast that thing moves. 1.00

02:00:44.000 And that sound.

02:00:45.000 Yeah, so if it would have just veered to the...

02:00:48.000 Veered to the right instead of to the left, then it...

02:00:48.000 There I am.

02:00:52.000 Would have ran you over. 0.74

02:00:53.000 Yeah.

02:00:53.000 Yeah, it didn't even know you were there.

02:00:55.000 Or, well, if it did know you were there, it wouldn't have cared.

02:00:57.000 It was running full sprint.

02:00:59.000 Yeah, it's...

02:01:00.000 No, at that time, it was just...

02:01:03.000 You know, that was a lethal arrow.

02:01:05.000 It was just going to, it was basically going to die.

02:01:08.000 You know, so what happens when an arrow hits like that is blood pressure is dropping quickly.

02:01:12.000 It's just like your bears, you can be dead in seconds.

02:01:16.000 They are affected immediately.

02:01:19.000 And I mean, even, you know, you hear about people who they cut their femoral artery.

02:01:23.000 So they do something, cut something in their leg, 30 seconds.

02:01:28.000 Yeah, crazy.

02:01:28.000 But when that happens is their blood pressure just drops.

02:01:31.000 And so that barrier, at that point, it's not thinking about, oh, I'm going to identify what did that and attack it.

02:01:38.000 It's just like, it's over, basically.

02:01:40.000 It's that fast.

02:01:41.000 In a death sprint.

02:01:42.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:01:44.000 I heard a guy recently got killed by a beaver.

02:01:47.000 A beaver bit his thigh and severed his femoral artery.

02:01:50.000 Isn't that nuts?

02:01:51.000 That can happen. 1.00

02:01:52.000 Fucking beaver took a dude out. 0.99

02:01:54.000 Yeah, you know, that's a thing with archery as opposed to guns. 0.99

02:02:00.000 And I had a little video the other day on my website.

02:02:03.000 Or, I mean, on YouTube.

02:02:05.000 And it was just, you know, an arrow kills by hemorrhage, just by cutting flesh and organs.

02:02:12.000 And a rifle kills by shock, generally.

02:02:15.000 And generally, if you hit them good with the rifle and break them down, you hit bone or whatever else.

02:02:19.000 It's a pretty grisly type thing, but it's effective.

02:02:23.000 They're down.

02:02:24.000 An arrow going through is more like...

02:02:27.000 They're not sure what happened.

02:02:29.000 Blood pressure dropping.

02:02:30.000 They don't necessarily feel that pain, so to speak.

02:02:33.000 And they're dead quickly.

02:02:36.000 But two totally different things.

02:02:38.000 And what that was is I had shot a bull elk in Utah.

02:02:42.000 And I wasn't 100% certain of the shot.

02:02:45.000 I was hoping it was in the heart.

02:02:46.000 It was a little lower than I had wanted.

02:02:48.000 I wanted to shoot for the lungs, which is a little higher up on the body.

02:02:52.000 I hit low.

02:02:54.000 I made an error, hit a little lower than I wanted, and I was hoping for the heart, and it was just kind of that process.

02:03:00.000 But in that video, I explained the difference between bow and rifle, and you see it right there.

02:03:07.000 One thing, when I was hunting Cape Buffalo in Tanzania, I shot the biggest bull in the herd that other animals did nothing.

02:03:16.000 He did nothing.

02:03:18.000 You couldn't tell anything happened other than he was dead pretty soon.

02:03:23.000 Nobody ran.

02:03:24.000 Nobody...

02:03:25.000 No excitement.

02:03:26.000 And Ryan, who was with me at that time, he's like, I like bowling a lot better because a rifle goes off and you got a stampede.

02:03:33.000 And then that bull that you had just shot, it's just like, it's...

02:03:37.000 It knows something serious is going on.

02:03:39.000 And those bulls are... 0.99

02:03:41.000 You know, they call them black death. 0.98

02:03:43.000 They're very dangerous. 0.99

02:03:44.000 So once they're injured...

02:03:45.000 Even with rifles, they shoot them multiple times.

02:03:49.000 I mean, those things are so tough and so full of testosterone.

02:03:54.000 1,800 pounds of just solid muscle.

02:03:57.000 But what they do is they go in what they call the tall grass, which is about 10 foot high grass.

02:04:02.000 And so you're on blood, and those buffalo will go in there, do a little button hook, and as you're blood trailing them, if they're not mortally wounded, like dead-dead, You'll be trailing that blood trail, and because they did that button hook, they're sitting there waiting,

02:04:18.000 they'll just pound you. 1.00

02:04:20.000 And so they kill people every year in Africa, Cape Buffalo do. 1.00

02:04:26.000 And it's tough animals, but with the bow, I'm not saying it was an easy kill because they're very tough, but it was way less dramatic, way...

02:04:42.000 Everything was calm.

02:04:43.000 It was just, I don't know, much different than a rifle.

02:04:46.000 Did you bring both of your bows over there?

02:04:47.000 Did you bring the 90-pound and the 80-pound one?

02:04:49.000 I did, yeah.

02:04:50.000 Did you shoot the buffalo with the 90? 0.99

02:04:52.000 I actually shot it with the 80. Really?

02:04:54.000 Because I did a penetration test on a hippo.

02:04:58.000 One of the guys I was with killed a hippo there.

02:05:01.000 So I'm like, hey, how often do you ever get a chance to shoot an arrow into a hippo?

02:05:05.000 5,000-pound hippo.

02:05:06.000 So I shot both those Bows into the hippo.

02:05:10.000 And actually, the 80-pound carbon spider arrow penetrated.

02:05:15.000 Neither one of them did a good job.

02:05:17.000 Such a big animal.

02:05:19.000 The setup wasn't conducive to hunting a 5,000-pound animal.

02:05:24.000 I would need a cutting-tip broadhead.

02:05:26.000 Like on the Muzzy Trocar, it has a chiseled tip. 1.00

02:05:30.000 And so that has to push through until you get to the blades.

02:05:33.000 And you need a 1,000-grain arrow with...

02:05:35.000 With a two-blade broadhead that doesn't have to open that hole before it gets in.

02:05:41.000 So, the point is, neither one was conducive to killing a hippo, but I measured penetration, and the carbon spider with the smaller diameter injection shaft that we shoot from Easton penetrated as much as the heavier full metal jacket dangerous game shaft.

02:05:58.000 And so, I decided, well, I'm just going to go with the carbon spider because I had more confidence in it Longer range.

02:06:05.000 And those animals were so difficult to get up on because they're living amongst hyenas and lions and they're hunted every single day.

02:06:14.000 And lots of lions there.

02:06:15.000 I mean, we saw, we probably saw, I'm trying to think, at least 10 lions, I would think.

02:06:22.000 And so it was like those, and you don't see all the lions.

02:06:25.000 So I mean, they're hunting a lot.

02:06:27.000 So I was having a hard time getting close.

02:06:29.000 So I ended up killing that, my buffalo at 62 yards with the carbon spiders, 80 pound bow.

02:06:34.000 So the thinner diameter made a difference in the thinner diameter of the arrow.

02:06:39.000 So that plays a part as well as the weight.

02:06:42.000 Yeah, because the thinner diameter as opposed to a thicker diameter shaft, that's just less surface area.

02:06:48.000 So the less surface area dragging through the wound channel, you're going to penetrate more.

02:06:54.000 What was your favorite animal to hunt in Africa?

02:07:00.000 Was it the kudu because you ate it?

02:07:02.000 No.

02:07:03.000 No, that was cool.

02:07:04.000 I mean, it was a big bull, 54-inch bull.

02:07:07.000 They had never killed a kudu. 0.98

02:07:09.000 And the fact, most people kill anything over there with a bow is at water.

02:07:13.000 When you're talking 54 inches, you're talking about the length of the horns?

02:07:16.000 The antlers?

02:07:16.000 Yeah.

02:07:17.000 The spiral horns.

02:07:18.000 So you measure that spiral horn and it's 54 inches.

02:07:21.000 But if anybody's killing anything with a bow, it's usually at water.

02:07:25.000 And so I didn't kill anything at water.

02:07:27.000 I spot and stalked.

02:07:29.000 In Kudu, they call them the gray ghost over there.

02:07:32.000 They're vision.

02:07:33.000 They're antelope.

02:07:34.000 So they're like antelope here in regard to vision.

02:07:36.000 But they're tall so they can see over everything.

02:07:39.000 They're as tall as an elk.

02:07:40.000 And they can see very well.

02:07:43.000 People just don't kill them spot and stalk with a bow. 0.99

02:07:46.000 This is a special kill. 0.98

02:07:47.000 It's 64 yards.

02:07:49.000 But I think my favorite probably...

02:07:52.000 I mean, I wanted a lion.

02:07:53.000 I didn't get one.

02:07:54.000 The pursuit of the lion was memorable.

02:07:57.000 Probably the Cape Buffalo, just because the notoriety it has as being Black Death.

02:08:03.000 It's one of what people term the Big Five of Africa, which is the five most dangerous animals of Africa. 1.00

02:08:10.000 An elephant, Cape Buffalo is in there, lion, leopard, and rhino.

02:08:15.000 And so that's the Big Five. 0.80

02:08:17.000 So to kill one of the Big Five with a bow, spot and stalk, in a place that It had never been done. 0.99

02:08:25.000 Very special. 0.99

02:08:26.000 What's your goals right now?

02:08:28.000 Do you have any other places that you really want to go and hunt?

02:08:31.000 Like Africa? 0.97

02:08:33.000 I want to get a lion.

02:08:34.000 I still want to get a lion.

02:08:35.000 So this is just some weird thing you got in the back of your head about a lion.

02:08:38.000 Yeah.

02:08:39.000 Just the test.

02:08:39.000 I don't know why.

02:08:41.000 I don't know why.

02:08:42.000 I just want to.

02:08:43.000 I never even thought about it up until...

02:08:46.000 I've just been traveling and doing more and I don't know.

02:08:51.000 So then I got it in my head and once I get something in my head, it's just What I want to do.

02:08:56.000 But really, and I've said this before, I don't long to hunt anything.

02:09:03.000 I don't need to hunt.

02:09:04.000 If I could hunt elk every year, I'm going to be satisfied.

02:09:08.000 I love being in the mountains.

02:09:09.000 I love bull elk.

02:09:11.000 I love the challenge of trying to get in close on a big bull and make a perfect shot.

02:09:15.000 And if that's all I ever did, that's enough for me.

02:09:19.000 But you've got weird things, like you won't hunt turkey.

02:09:22.000 No.

02:09:23.000 Is that weird?

02:09:24.000 Yeah, it's weird.

02:09:25.000 Steve Rinella loves turkey hunting.

02:09:27.000 Yeah.

02:09:28.000 It's funny to hear you, like, the last thing I want to do is go turkey hunting.

02:09:32.000 Well, you know, I've never killed a turkey, and then, you know, out west, turkey hunting just has never had...

02:09:41.000 The draw that it has in the south and the east, it's just people live for turkey hunting back there.

02:09:47.000 Out west, it's just like nobody even ever hunted them because we had deer, elk, bear.

02:09:52.000 We have all this big cool stuff, predators, big game animals to hunt.

02:09:58.000 And so turkey was like, why would you waste your time turkey hunting?

02:10:00.000 So that's sort of still my mindset just from that, I guess.

02:10:03.000 Turkey's delicious though.

02:10:05.000 Yeah, it's fine.

02:10:06.000 It's just fine?

02:10:07.000 It's fine.

02:10:08.000 Wild turkey is supposed to be better, right, than domestic turkey?

02:10:11.000 It's a more darker meat?

02:10:13.000 It might be healthier.

02:10:14.000 It's probably not...

02:10:15.000 I like white meat, personally.

02:10:17.000 Do you really?

02:10:18.000 Yeah, and it's probably not going to be...

02:10:19.000 It's going to be, I would assume, tougher.

02:10:22.000 Yeah, for sure.

02:10:23.000 I don't even know if I've eaten wild turkey.

02:10:25.000 But, you know, back east, where basically all they...

02:10:29.000 Or in the south, all they have is deer in the fall and turkey in the spring.

02:10:33.000 Yeah, people are...

02:10:34.000 They want to hunt, so that's what they're going to do.

02:10:36.000 You don't think it's just because they enjoy turkey?

02:10:39.000 No.

02:10:40.000 No.

02:10:41.000 I'm telling you.

02:10:42.000 You need to get with Ranella.

02:10:43.000 He loves turkey hunting.

02:10:44.000 That dude loves it.

02:10:45.000 I think they, and they always say that, you know, turkey hunting is just like elk hunting.

02:10:49.000 It's just like elk hunting.

02:10:51.000 I'm You're calling them in, you come in, and it's just like a bull coming in.

02:10:56.000 I'm like, well, yeah, it's just like elk hunting, except you can't kill a bull.

02:11:01.000 So it's not like elk hunting.

02:11:03.000 Yeah, well, it can't be like elk hunting.

02:11:05.000 You're dealing with a little skittish bird.

02:11:06.000 They say the only difference, they say elk or a bull elk is like a 700-pound turkey.

02:11:12.000 Well, a turkey's like, what's a big turkey?

02:11:14.000 Like 30 pounds or something?

02:11:15.000 Yeah.

02:11:17.000 So, what I say, you know, turkey hunters out there, like, hey, if you're passionate about it, it's awesome.

02:11:23.000 But what I always have said is, you know, the best thing that's going to happen on a turkey hunt is you'll kill a turkey, and that's not that good.

02:11:30.000 What about, like, bird hunting, like duck hunting and pheasant hunting, that kind of stuff?

02:11:33.000 I've killed one pheasant.

02:11:35.000 Yeah?

02:11:35.000 Yeah, that's the only bird I've ever killed.

02:11:37.000 You just saw about big animals.

02:11:38.000 Mm-hmm.

02:11:39.000 Yeah, and like I said, I'm not judging anybody.

02:11:42.000 That's just me.

02:11:43.000 But of course you're judging people when you're not on the air.

02:11:45.000 We're going to talk off air, folks. 1.00

02:11:47.000 He's going to judge the shit out of turkey and duck and pheasant hunting assholes and quail. 0.99

02:11:54.000 If those guys in the spring, if they can't go hunting bear like I do... 0.99

02:11:58.000 Hunt turkey.

02:11:59.000 It's awesome.

02:11:59.000 Good job.

02:12:00.000 The thing about bird hunting that seems fun is the whole dog thing.

02:12:04.000 Like the dogs like flush them out like when a dog points and then the pheasants fly in the air and they blast them out of the sky.

02:12:10.000 That looks like it would be exciting.

02:12:11.000 Yeah, I bet it would be.

02:12:12.000 I know people, you know, that's a whole thing.

02:12:15.000 Just like hunting bear with dogs is they have that connection, the training with the dog.

02:12:21.000 And that's the same thing with the bird.

02:12:23.000 I know people who have bird dogs, and it's just like those dogs are their partners.

02:12:27.000 I did one dog hunt for bear, and the hounds are amazing.

02:12:36.000 And then the houndsmen are just, that's an art.

02:12:39.000 Yeah, it's a totally different experience.

02:12:41.000 It's like you have, like you said, partners.

02:12:44.000 Those are your buddies.

02:12:44.000 Yeah.

02:12:45.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:12:46.000 Yeah, there's a lot of mountain lion hunting that they did with dogs.

02:12:48.000 Right, yeah.

02:12:49.000 I haven't done that either, but I'd like to.

02:12:51.000 Well, in California, we've got some crazy laws when it comes to hunting.

02:12:55.000 And when I say crazy, it's because they're not designed by people who are wildlife specialists.

02:13:02.000 They're designed by people who are more animal rights people.

02:13:06.000 It's like...

02:13:07.000 Instead of the Department of Fish and Game, they call it the Department of Fish and Wildlife.

02:13:11.000 And their regulations about hunting, they've completely removed hunting for mountain lions and hunting for bears.

02:13:19.000 The bear hunting now you can't do with dogs.

02:13:21.000 And if you can't do it with dogs and you can't do it with bait, good luck.

02:13:25.000 You essentially have banned hunting.

02:13:28.000 This idea of baiting is offensive to some people because of what we talked about earlier.

02:13:36.000 And the idea of using dogs is equally offensive to some people because you're using an animal and sicking it on an animal.

02:13:43.000 It seems sort of like a barbaric thing.

02:13:44.000 But that is really the only way to effectively hunt these animals in the type of terrain that we have here in California.

02:13:50.000 So because of that...

02:13:52.000 It's a ton of bear and a ton of mountain lion.

02:13:54.000 And especially the mountain lion.

02:13:56.000 There's a kid who was just attacked in Cupertino. 0.99

02:13:57.000 That's where the fucking Apple campus is. 0.99

02:14:00.000 A six-year-old kid was attacked by a mountain lion in front of his parents. 0.99

02:14:03.000 I mean, they're out there.

02:14:05.000 There's a lot of them out there in California.

02:14:07.000 Definitely.

02:14:08.000 Tohono Ranch.

02:14:09.000 I've said it before, but there's a guy up there.

02:14:11.000 Cody Banks said that he has a trail camera that's over a pond.

02:14:16.000 They have 16 different mountain lions they've caught on this trail camera.

02:14:20.000 That's crazy.

02:14:21.000 Yeah.

02:14:21.000 No, I mean, yeah, lions haven't been hunted here in, what, 40 years?

02:14:25.000 It's been a long time.

02:14:26.000 30-some years.

02:14:27.000 But, yeah, it's, I don't know.

02:14:30.000 They, you know, a lion kills, they say, every three days.

02:14:34.000 Kills something.

02:14:36.000 Deer, elk. 0.99

02:14:38.000 Hopefully not kids, but they're gonna kill.

02:14:40.000 I just don't know why people would want more lions than deer.

02:14:43.000 Why you would want more predators than game animals.

02:14:47.000 You gotta balance that.

02:14:48.000 Well, it's balanced everywhere else.

02:14:51.000 Everywhere else.

02:14:52.000 Except California.

02:14:52.000 Yeah.

02:14:53.000 I mean, California's just so goofy with some of their laws.

02:14:56.000 And again, this is not like a rational approach that's based on Real fish and game people that have been doing this and calculating numbers and taking accurate assessments and audits of the area.

02:15:09.000 This is all done by people who really don't want anybody hunting at all.

02:15:13.000 Yeah.

02:15:14.000 They reluctantly grant a few licenses.

02:15:17.000 And look, if you keep a lot of mountain lions around, you don't have to grant as many deer tags.

02:15:22.000 Right.

02:15:22.000 Because guess what?

02:15:23.000 There's no fucking deer. 0.99

02:15:24.000 And that's a whole... 0.99

02:15:24.000 No. 0.99

02:15:26.000 Thought process behind hunting and the antis with hunting is they want to take away...

02:15:31.000 Look at that thing. 0.92

02:15:32.000 Whoa.

02:15:33.000 There's four of them on Glendora.

02:15:33.000 What is that?

02:15:36.000 Oh, Jesus Christ.

02:15:37.000 Back that up.

02:15:37.000 I want to see that thing again.

02:15:39.000 What a creepy goddamn animal. 0.99

02:15:41.000 There's four of them, I think. 1.00

02:15:43.000 Oh, my God.

02:15:45.000 Yeah, there's...

02:15:46.000 Four of them just wandering around on a trail camera.

02:15:49.000 Oh, my God.

02:15:50.000 Say that again?

02:15:53.000 That's going to cause some problems for deer. 0.99

02:15:55.000 That's going to cause some problems for fucking anybody. 1.00

02:15:57.000 Yeah. 0.99

02:15:58.000 Can you imagine if you're out there camping and you go to take a leak and you see eight eyeballs staring back at you like that?

02:16:03.000 Not good.

02:16:05.000 It's a big animal, too.

02:16:06.000 Yeah, that's what people have said, you know, the antibodies.

02:16:08.000 They want to take away small chunks of our hunting rights.

02:16:12.000 So they'll say, well, this is just lions.

02:16:13.000 And then it's just...

02:16:15.000 This is baiting for bear, and then it's just this, and then pretty soon it's all gone.

02:16:19.000 So that's why, you know, as hunters, I think we just need to protect our lifestyle and just keep preaching the positive aspects of it.

02:16:27.000 But I want to say before I get hate from the turkey hunters...

02:16:30.000 I will.

02:16:31.000 I will.

02:16:34.000 Somebody, does somebody want to take me turkey hunting?

02:16:36.000 I'll go, I'll kill one, and then I'll judge whether it's like elk hunting. 0.93

02:16:39.000 You wouldn't use a shotgun either. 0.99

02:16:41.000 You'd use a bow.

02:16:42.000 Only bow.

02:16:42.000 But I can't really say it's not like elk hunting if I haven't done it.

02:16:46.000 That's true.

02:16:47.000 That's not fair.

02:16:47.000 Well, they do call them in.

02:16:49.000 They're like...

02:16:51.000 That sounds like a good call.

02:16:54.000 I should make a call, just a little recording.

02:16:57.000 The Joe Rogan turkey slater?

02:16:59.000 Yeah, play it on your iPhone. 0.97

02:17:00.000 So, I gotta kill one, then I'll make the judgment on how much I like it, I guess. 0.98

02:17:06.000 Yeah, I would imagine. 0.98

02:17:07.000 What other animals are there that are sort of underrated hunting animals?

02:17:12.000 Well, they always say the blacktail deer back home in Oregon, those are because a lot of the country, you know, blacktail are only in western Oregon, western Washington up in British Columbia a little bit, and then down, they're down here in California.

02:17:26.000 Columbia blacktails, right?

02:17:27.000 Yeah, Columbia blacktail.

02:17:28.000 But in Oregon, it's like more rainforest, so it's very dense, very dark.

02:17:33.000 Those big bucks, basically they're nocturnal all year, except for when they start breeding, and even during the rut, still very tough to, They don't pattern like a whitetail, so to speak.

02:17:46.000 A lot of guys kill them because they see these bucks on trail cameras, and they know they're coming, and they wait for the wind to be right, the prevailing winds, and then they set in their tree stand, and then that buck hopefully comes by, and it's patternable.

02:17:59.000 With blacktail, the legend is they're not as patternable, and I would buy into that.

02:18:07.000 And so killing a big blacktail isn't on top of anybody's bucket list really or very many people, but it's a very difficult, very tough trophy.

02:18:14.000 You know, all this hunting talk that we've had in the two podcasts, it always leads to people getting excited about it, but beginning the hunting process is extremely difficult.

02:18:26.000 Yeah, where to start?

02:18:27.000 Yeah, I think that that's something, that's a gap that we would really, a lot of people would be really well served if we could figure out how to bridge it.

02:18:35.000 And I've talked to Ranella about this, and we've talked about possibly setting up a first-timers camp where you would take people to a game-rich environment, like maybe, say, a white-tailed deer place where you know there's a lot of white...

02:18:49.000 He won't have anything to do with high fence hunting, which is very admirable.

02:18:54.000 So it wouldn't be that, but...

02:18:56.000 Something along those lines where you're going to a very game-rich environment and he'll set it up for you, bring it to a range first, really get you to understand rifle safety, gun safety, make sure you really truly understand how to squeeze a trigger,

02:19:12.000 how to stay down on a shot, and then We're good to go.

02:19:46.000 What you were explaining.

02:19:48.000 It's a target-rich environment.

02:19:49.000 It's a more controlled setting than if you're up in the mountains after mule deer.

02:19:54.000 And then, you know, we processed the bear.

02:19:57.000 You skinned out your bear.

02:19:58.000 We cut the meat off.

02:20:00.000 So that's exactly what we did.

02:20:01.000 You know, your first bow hunt was exactly like what you described.

02:20:05.000 And, you know, most of those guys up there that were there, they were seasoned hunters.

02:20:09.000 They hadn't bear hunted.

02:20:13.000 How much did you learn on that hunt?

02:20:15.000 Quite a bit.

02:20:16.000 Yeah, you learned a ton.

02:20:19.000 If you're on a high country mule deer hunt that is so difficult, you're probably not going to kill one for a number of years.

02:20:28.000 A lot of guys get frustrated by that.

02:20:30.000 They're like, I wasted all this time, I wasted all this money, I just...

02:20:35.000 Can't get it done.

02:20:36.000 So I like hunts like the bear hunt to get the hunting embers heated up and burning hot.

02:20:43.000 And that's what you're describing is perfect.

02:20:46.000 We should consider doing something like that, like a camp.

02:20:50.000 For a first-timer camp.

02:20:52.000 Figuring out some way to set something up.

02:20:54.000 Because I've had so many people email me.

02:20:56.000 I've had a lot of people tweet me and send me Facebook messages saying that they got into hunting because of our podcast, because of the podcast with Rinella, which is great.

02:21:04.000 I don't know how they did it, though.

02:21:06.000 I got into it because of Rinella.

02:21:06.000 I don't know how they got into it.

02:21:08.000 If it wasn't for him taking me and Brian Callen out into Montana, I don't know how I would have started.

02:21:12.000 I don't know how to start.

02:21:13.000 And I think that that is the really difficult thing for people.

02:21:16.000 Like you said, as a seasoned hunter, what you really like to do is go out by yourself.

02:21:21.000 But you're a guy with years and years, decades of experience hunting.

02:21:25.000 For a person just starting out, going off by themselves, they're going to make so many mistakes.

02:21:29.000 Well, just you and I sitting on the bear bait.

02:21:32.000 I mean, remember the talks we had about movement?

02:21:35.000 Yeah.

02:21:36.000 Edge detection.

02:21:38.000 Any movement they see.

02:21:38.000 Right.

02:21:40.000 Right.

02:21:41.000 And like I said, we were sitting there and so you'd see what time it was.

02:21:44.000 Or you'd want to take a photo.

02:21:47.000 And I said, you can do all that just slower.

02:21:52.000 You just got to move like you're not a predator.

02:21:54.000 But when you don't have somebody there with you, You make all those mistakes.

02:21:59.000 Right.

02:21:59.000 And then it just elongates that learning curve.

02:22:01.000 So I would love to take some first-time hunter and sit there with them just like with you and just, you know, I know, you know, I'm not saying I have all the answers or whatever.

02:22:13.000 I've just made a lot of mistakes.

02:22:14.000 Right, right.

02:22:15.000 So I've learned I don't want people to have to make all the mistakes I did.

02:22:19.000 Right.

02:22:20.000 I practiced for a long time, but it wasn't really that long.

02:22:24.000 It was only like six months between the time we met and the time we started that camp.

02:22:29.000 But through that six months, I was steady shooting arrows, basically on a daily basis.

02:22:35.000 Diligent.

02:22:35.000 How much time do you think someone would need from being introduced to archery to going in a controlled environment bear hunt like that?

02:22:46.000 The thing is, there's so much more to bow hunting than just shooting paper.

02:22:53.000 It's just that mindset and the respect thing, but it's so hard to learn that when you haven't done it.

02:22:59.000 It's like, how do you measure all that?

02:23:02.000 With a bow, killing an animal with a bow, The biggest thing for a new guy is just what you did.

02:23:08.000 It's just being proficient with your weapon.

02:23:11.000 You know, being proficient with your weapon, knowing where you're going to hit, and having the confidence to make that shot.

02:23:18.000 Because even though it is close range, I mean, you saw me take a practice shot at seven yards.

02:23:24.000 Even though I've done it probably millions of times and killed many, many bear.

02:23:29.000 Still, I'm still...

02:23:32.000 I'm diligent in my process.

02:23:35.000 Well, we actually talked about that because the day after we went hunting and I got that bear, we went again.

02:23:40.000 And you actually put it in my head that it's easy to, once you've done it, then take it for granted.

02:23:46.000 So you have to maintain that same mindset that you had the very first day when you made the perfect shot.

02:23:50.000 And I thought that was a very important point that you said to me because I know that people do go, ah, I've done this before.

02:23:56.000 And then you could screw up and wound a bear.

02:23:58.000 And that's another thing.

02:24:01.000 Another thing I remember sharing with you was the bear you killed, we needed to get a good look at it.

02:24:07.000 So it had been in.

02:24:08.000 We wanted to make sure it was a boar, a big boar like we wanted to kill.

02:24:12.000 And so it had been in and been in and I said, I go, Right.

02:24:34.000 And that's with binoculars.

02:24:35.000 So once, I said, once we decide, or once you decide that's going to be a bear you're going to shoot, your emotions are probably going to get going.

02:24:42.000 Because it'd been from just being, just kind of enjoying it, being close, or just kind of that moment, to all of a sudden, now I'm going to kill an animal.

02:24:53.000 That changes everything.

02:24:54.000 It did, too.

02:24:55.000 Your body just is like, okay, this is a real deal now.

02:24:59.000 And so that's, yeah, just that type of thing, having somebody there, or Having that conversation...

02:24:59.000 Yeah.

02:25:05.000 It allows people to process it on their own.

02:25:09.000 In my book, Backcountry Bowhunting, that was one of the most popular chapters that I've had.

02:25:14.000 I wrote a chapter on fear.

02:25:16.000 No guy ever wants to talk about being afraid or being afraid of the dark or scared of being attacked by whatever.

02:25:23.000 So I talked about that and I said, hey, when I was first in the mountains by myself, I was afraid.

02:25:28.000 And so when people read that and they think about it and then they're in that position, they're just like, this is normal.

02:25:34.000 This is normal.

02:25:35.000 And so when we can talk about things like the experience of, okay, now I'm going to kill the bear, now it's time to get it done, and you can kind of anticipate what that's going to feel like, you're just going to be that much more deadly, more lethal.

02:25:54.000 One thing is, I was in the gym the other day, and this guy was telling me, he's like, he has one of my old bows, just from years ago.

02:26:03.000 And he's like, he goes, Cam, he goes, I almost got a bull.

02:26:07.000 And I'm like, what happened, buddy?

02:26:09.000 He's like, 35 yards, he come in, he's bugling, and I had your bow, and I'm standing there watching him, he's 35 yards, and he's right there, and he goes, and I was shaking so bad, he goes, I don't even know how I could have shot it.

02:26:19.000 And I'm like...

02:26:21.000 That's normal.

02:26:22.000 That's how everybody is.

02:26:25.000 So that's where it is, is in that moment, shaking, but still, okay, I need to be in control and I need to do everything that I practice and make that shot.

02:26:35.000 A lot of people get that shaking and then they never get to the other part.

02:26:40.000 The precision part.

02:26:42.000 That's difficult.

02:26:43.000 Well, controlling emotions is very difficult, and almost anything you do that's important to you is going to come with a surge of adrenaline or a surge of nerves, of anxiety.

02:26:54.000 And it's just about maintaining your breathing and staying calm.

02:26:58.000 And there was definitely, for me, a big difference between, like, that's the bear.

02:27:02.000 Like, okay, woo!

02:27:04.000 But it helped that you had already prepared me for that.

02:27:08.000 Right, right.

02:27:09.000 Well, I'm glad you did great.

02:27:10.000 Listen, brother, it's great being your friend.

02:27:12.000 It's great learning from you.

02:27:14.000 I appreciate it very much.

02:27:15.000 And it's great that we can expose so many people to this.

02:27:17.000 Well, thanks for giving me the platform.

02:27:20.000 I feel lucky to be in LA in this mess of a city and talking to you guys for sure.

02:27:26.000 So for John and Jen's website, it's Livin, L-I-V-I-N, The Dream Productions.

02:27:34.000 That's their website, L-I-V-I-N, The Dream.

02:27:37.000 And that's the place we went to.

02:27:39.000 If you want to go and if you want to experience bear hunting in that environment, you can do no better than John and Jen.

02:27:45.000 They're great folks, and they have an incredibly bear-rich environment. 1.00

02:27:49.000 And if you're a first-time bowhunter, it's the way to go.

02:27:52.000 It really is.

02:27:53.000 And you can follow Cam.

02:27:55.000 You can follow him on Twitter, even though he doesn't know his Twitter password.

02:27:58.000 All of his Facebook stuff goes to his Twitter.

02:28:00.000 And your Facebook page is Cameron Haynes, too, right?

02:28:03.000 Cameron Haynes?

02:28:03.000 Yeah.

02:28:04.000 Cameron Haynes on Twitter.

02:28:05.000 Cameron Haynes on Facebook.

02:28:07.000 Thanks, brother.

02:28:07.000 Really appreciate it.

02:28:08.000 Thank you, Joe.

02:28:08.000 Keep hammering!

02:28:09.000 I'll do it.

02:28:10.000 I get to tell you.

02:28:11.000 All right, my friends.

02:28:12.000 We'll be back next week.

02:28:13.000 Until then, much love.

02:28:14.000 See you soon.

The Joe Rogan Experience - October 24, 2014

Joe Rogan Experience #567 - Cameron Hanes

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