The Joe Rogan Experience - February 13, 2020


JRE MMA Show #91 with Radio Rahim

Topics
YouTube comments yonder bags Miami culture James Toney and Danny Green fight boxing footage MMA controversies and respect heavyweight division changes Tyson Fury vs Deontay Wilder fight Triple G vs. Canelo Roy Jones Jr.. and his career challenges gym wars Errol Spence fight martial arts passion Julio Cesar Chavez Jr comfort and adversity combat sports standing eight counts Mighty Mouse skillset boxing
Hosted by
Joe Rogan
Mentioned
Deontay Wilder James Brown Canelo KO-Kovalev Manny Pacquiao Dave Chappelle Anthony Joshua Floyd Mayweather Sr. James Toney Errol Spence Jr. Danny Jacobs Jr. Jim Morrison Lomachenko Snoop Dogg Larry Merchant Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. Gerald McClellan Keith Thurman Steven Tyler Mike Garcia Danny Green and 92 more
Joe Rogan Experience #1426 - Justin Martindale Joe Rogan Experience #1427 - Melissa Chen

Episode Stats


Length

2 hours and 22 minutes

Words per minute

180.92

Word count

25,808

Sentence count

2,965

Harmful content

Misogyny

23

sentences flagged

Toxicity

611

sentences flagged

Hate speech

21

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode of the Joe Rogan Experience, we discuss the Jimi Hendrix and Lenny Bruce mug shots, and why they are so iconic. We also talk about how the idea for the podcast came about, and what it means to be a rock and roll hero when you get arrested for a crime you didn't even commit. And we talk about why it s so important to break the rules and do the things that society says you should do, even when you re not supposed to do them. And, of course, we talk a lot about drugs and rock n' roll, which is a weird thing to talk about, but we do it anyway, so why not talk about it? We hope you enjoy this episode, and if you like it, please leave us a rating and review on Apple Podcasts, and we'll read out your comments and thoughts on the next episode! Thank you so much for being a part of the podcast, and supporting the pod! - it means a lot to us and we appreciate you. - Joe and the rest of the crew - Thank you for your support and support the pod - we really do appreciate it. Thanks to our sponsors, we really appreciate it and we're working hard to make this podcast as much as we can. XOXO - Joe Rogans Experience Podcast - The Crew at J.R. Rogan and the J. Rogans Podcast. Thank you, and the people who make it all the best. , and we love you back here at The J.J. Podcasts and we really really, really appreciate you, thank you for supporting us, we appreciate your support, we can't thank you, really really much, really, truly, really much. Love ya, much much, much, Thank you. - Thank You, bye, bye. Thank You. - MRS. - Joe, R.A. - EJ and R. & J.Y. - P.S. - J. & K. & D.B. - A.E. - B. & S. - S.M. - R. and J. - D. & P. (A. ( ) - M. & B. (AY ( ) - E. ( ) ( ) Thank you J. (J. & R. (S. (B. & M. )

Transcript

Transcripts from "The Joe Rogan Experience" are sourced from the Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool. Explore them interactively here.
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:02.000 Yeah, that is a guy named Ross Baines.
00:00:04.000 He painted that.
00:00:05.000 He's also painted this.
00:00:06.000 There's a picture in the green room of me and Daniel Cormier.
00:00:09.000 There's another one.
00:00:11.000 I think he sent me the one of Masvidal.
00:00:13.000 He did an amazing one of Jorge Masvidal when he landed this knee on Ben Askren.
00:00:17.000 He's a great artist, but that's Richard Pryor.
00:00:20.000 He painted that for me.
00:00:21.000 Clearly, my screensaver used to be a collection of mugshots, like Jim Morrison, Frank Sinatra.
00:00:28.000 I have Morrison out there.
00:00:29.000 I have Frank Sinatra in the green room.
00:00:31.000 Okay, so the thing is, I'm not a criminal, right?
00:00:33.000 Me neither.
00:00:33.000 I don't aspire to be a criminal.
00:00:35.000 I don't either.
00:00:36.000 But what are these, like, these mugshots are so iconic.
00:00:38.000 Yeah.
00:00:38.000 What does it mean to you to see, like, your heroes...
00:00:43.000 Essentially charged with crimes and maybe one of the worst nights there alive.
00:00:47.000 Well, it didn't start off that way.
00:00:50.000 This is what happened.
00:00:50.000 I was in Hawaii and I'm a giant Jimi Hendrix fan.
00:00:55.000 That's why I named the podcast Joe Rogan Experience.
00:00:58.000 I ripped off the Jimi Hendrix Experience and I was in Hawaii and I went to this art gallery and they had all this rock and roll art and they had this really dope collaboration of Hendrix, his mugshot was like six,
00:01:14.000 nine.
00:01:15.000 Nine images?
00:01:16.000 Nine square images of Hendrix's mugshot. 0.99
00:01:18.000 I go, that looks cool as fuck. 0.98
00:01:19.000 And so I bought it. 0.98
00:01:20.000 And I also bought the Rosa Parks one, and I also bought the Elvis one.
00:01:25.000 They had three different, just nine squares on one piece of artwork.
00:01:33.000 And I thought it looked cool.
00:01:34.000 So I said, oh, that would be a good backdrop for the podcast.
00:01:37.000 So the old podcast studio, I had those behind me.
00:01:40.000 And then I started picking up other ones.
00:01:41.000 I got Janis Joplin in the bathroom. 0.99
00:01:44.000 I got Johnny Cash.
00:01:45.000 I got James Brown.
00:01:47.000 I got Pryor on the wall here.
00:01:49.000 I got Jim Morrison.
00:01:51.000 I got Steven Tyler on the wall over there.
00:01:53.000 I just started collecting them.
00:01:54.000 And there's no real rhyme or reason to it.
00:01:57.000 I got Lenny Bruce.
00:02:00.000 I just found mug shots and I just started collecting them.
00:02:02.000 Like I said, my screensaver was that for like a year. 0.99
00:02:05.000 And I even had Sinatra in my room Big, you know, a big one on the wall and whatnot, and I'm like, you know, what is this shit about? 0.61
00:02:14.000 It occurred to me, like, everybody that became an icon and became a legend, like, you have to break the rules. 0.89
00:02:19.000 There's nobody who just, like, followed every rule and that's what they're famous for. 0.96
00:02:22.000 Like, hey, this guy never stepped out of line, did everything that everyone said he was supposed to do, did it all the ways that you're within the rules, and that's the fucking legend that you love. 0.97
00:02:30.000 No. 0.96
00:02:31.000 It's almost like it's illegal to be exceptional. 0.97
00:02:35.000 You have You have to fucking break the law to make the imprint on the society that you want to make.
00:02:43.000 Well, particularly in the time where these guys were doing their art. 0.98
00:02:46.000 I mean, we're talking about Morrison and Hendrix.
00:02:49.000 This is the 70s, the 60s.
00:02:51.000 It was wild times. 1.00
00:02:53.000 There's a transitionary period between the 50s where everything was like mom and pop and diners and fucking drive-thru movies and shit. 0.99
00:03:01.000 Or drive-in movies, and then all of a sudden you have drugs, and wild rock and roll, and James Brown, and chaos. 0.98
00:03:08.000 Right, but whatever you're not supposed to do, that's the thing you should be doing.
00:03:12.000 I mean, within reason.
00:03:13.000 We're not talking about harming other people or whatnot, but the society is like, restrictions?
00:03:17.000 Yeah.
00:03:18.000 That's the boundary to keep you as a normal person.
00:03:22.000 I wish I had a better answer.
00:03:24.000 But if I had to really put my finger on it, I would say that those images represent these moments where society tried to contain these wild people.
00:03:35.000 These people that were breaking the rules.
00:03:37.000 These people that were trying to change culture.
00:03:38.000 These people that were just doing their thing.
00:03:40.000 And it wasn't like they weren't popular. 0.99
00:03:44.000 I think Jim Morrison pulled his dick out, right? 1.00
00:03:46.000 Didn't he pull his dick out? 1.00
00:03:47.000 I mean, he was insanely popular when he pulled his dick out. 1.00
00:03:50.000 And they're like, enough! 1.00
00:03:51.000 That way he was insanely popular when he got arrested, finally, for pulling his dick out. 1.00
00:03:55.000 But when you get arrested for pulling your dick out, it's never the first time. 1.00
00:03:58.000 No, he's pulled his dick out. 1.00
00:04:00.000 I know a lot of people have pulled their dick out. 1.00
00:04:02.000 It's a weird thing, like that moment where the society that's trying to contain these artists lashes out and captures them briefly, but they don't even realize they're just making them bigger. 0.99
00:04:18.000 Yeah.
00:04:18.000 And they're making them more accessible.
00:04:21.000 Hey, I got a mugshot.
00:04:22.000 I mean, my criminal. 1.00
00:04:23.000 It turned out the one from Hendrix was a bullshit mugshot. 0.99
00:04:26.000 It wasn't a real mugshot. 0.98
00:04:28.000 He never got arrested? 0.97
00:04:28.000 He did get arrested, but the image that I had, some fucking artist took liberties and they decided, well, this is a cooler picture. 0.97
00:04:34.000 Let's put his mugshot logo under that. 0.91
00:04:37.000 So it was the actual words from Toronto where he got arrested for heroin.
00:04:41.000 Underneath his image, but the image was incorrect.
00:04:43.000 So then I went out and got the real image.
00:04:46.000 So now that big...
00:04:47.000 And I used to have them in the squares, but then I changed the squares to these big metal ones.
00:04:51.000 See, the one I had is the upper right-hand side.
00:04:53.000 That's the wrong one.
00:04:54.000 That's not the real image.
00:04:55.000 That is a cooler one, because if that went down there...
00:04:57.000 Yeah, okay.
00:04:58.000 That's the real mugshot.
00:05:00.000 But don't do the one with the words behind it.
00:05:02.000 The one next to it, Jamie.
00:05:05.000 No, next to it.
00:05:07.000 Right above, above, right above, right there.
00:05:09.000 That's it.
00:05:09.000 That's the actual one.
00:05:11.000 See that one on the right-hand side?
00:05:13.000 That's the actual image of Hendrix.
00:05:15.000 Oh, I didn't know there's a Mick Jagger.
00:05:16.000 Oh, yeah.
00:05:18.000 Well, the Yonkers one is Steven Tyler.
00:05:21.000 I have that one on the wall.
00:05:23.000 That's the side shot.
00:05:25.000 But I didn't know Steven.
00:05:26.000 Did you know that Mick Jagger got arrested, Jamie?
00:05:29.000 Everybody's been arrested. 1.00
00:05:30.000 Ordered that shit. 1.00
00:05:31.000 Hold on to those and start ordering. 1.00
00:05:34.000 We're going to get some new ones.
00:05:35.000 Oh, David Bowie?
00:05:36.000 We got the Janis Joplin in the bathroom. 1.00
00:05:38.000 Fuck, I didn't know David Bowie got arrested. 1.00
00:05:40.000 Excellent. 1.00
00:05:41.000 That's Axl Rose right here. 0.99
00:05:42.000 Axl Rose was a little cutie pie when he was younger.
00:05:44.000 Look at him.
00:05:45.000 The David Bowie one is pretty dope.
00:05:47.000 That actually looks like it could be the cover of an album.
00:05:49.000 Scroll back down again to that, please.
00:05:51.000 Yeah, look at that.
00:05:52.000 Jim Morrison looks like Chris Stapleton.
00:05:54.000 Look how odd he looks there.
00:05:57.000 1976. Yeah, he's guilty.
00:05:58.000 Whatever he got arrested for that night, he was definitely dead.
00:06:01.000 Arrested for being beautiful.
00:06:05.000 So, dude, let's just get into this, man.
00:06:08.000 We had this conversation at the Comedy Store.
00:06:10.000 I'm like, you gotta come on the podcast.
00:06:11.000 We gotta talk about this.
00:06:12.000 Because you are a part of probably the most iconic boxing interview of our day.
00:06:19.000 You with Deontay Wilder. 0.99
00:06:21.000 When Deontay Wilder freaked out on you, it became this huge, huge fucking thing. 0.99
00:06:28.000 To this day. 0.99
00:06:29.000 To this day.
00:06:30.000 To this day.
00:06:31.000 He puts it on his Instagram.
00:06:33.000 He puts it in hashtags.
00:06:34.000 Till this day.
00:06:36.000 He sells sweatshirts with till this day on them.
00:06:40.000 There's a store that's adjacent to the Barclays Center. 1.00
00:06:44.000 It's connected to the Barclays Center and it's full of shit. 1.00
00:06:48.000 It says to this day on it. 1.00
00:06:49.000 He had a grand opening there.
00:06:51.000 I was invited to it.
00:06:54.000 So not just an iconic meme, this is now a major part of my identity.
00:06:58.000 Do people associate you with it though?
00:07:02.000 Do they like automatically or do they just...
00:07:05.000 You see the side of your face, but you see him as... 1.00
00:07:09.000 Angry as fuck. 0.99
00:07:11.000 Arguably the scariest heavyweight of all time. 0.99
00:07:14.000 I mean, Mike Tyson's right up there.
00:07:15.000 See, off ring, outside the ring, Deontay is a sweetheart. 0.99
00:07:20.000 He's a really nice guy.
00:07:22.000 So to see him angry outside the ring is kind of weird.
00:07:26.000 Because I had him on the podcast.
00:07:28.000 He couldn't be a nicer guy.
00:07:30.000 That's true.
00:07:31.000 He's a really nice guy.
00:07:33.000 And so to see him angry at you, to this day!
00:07:36.000 And like, giving you crazy eyes that was like, and when you explained it, it's like, yeah, that's what you do in an interview.
00:07:43.000 You want someone to expand and say, what do you mean by that?
00:07:46.000 And listen, man, this is not like the first day we met.
00:07:49.000 It's not like I just happened upon this heavyweight champion of the world screaming and decided to piss him off.
00:07:56.000 We've had multiple conversations.
00:07:58.000 Sat down for hours at a time.
00:08:00.000 In fact, in Belfast, in Germany, or Ireland, I'm sorry, we sat down for an hour.
00:08:07.000 So I'm going to give you the context of what I was thinking in the moment.
00:08:12.000 He's on stage.
00:08:13.000 Some people might not be aware of exactly what happened, so just try to...
00:08:17.000 There it is right there.
00:08:19.000 In a couple weeks, we're going to see it again.
00:08:21.000 I don't know if we're going to see the exact same thing happen.
00:08:23.000 It comes up.
00:08:24.000 It's seasonal.
00:08:27.000 Deontay Wilder is facing Tyson Fury.
00:08:30.000 Tyson Fury is a British gypsy. 1.00
00:08:33.000 He's a boisterous, very animated showman in boxing.
00:08:38.000 Heavyweights, mind you.
00:08:40.000 These guys are giants.
00:08:41.000 First time they met.
00:08:42.000 This is December 18. So, I travel the world covering boxing.
00:08:49.000 Everywhere.
00:08:50.000 Like I said, I sat down with this guy in Ireland.
00:08:51.000 I've covered Tyson Fury in England.
00:08:54.000 I've covered him in America.
00:08:55.000 I've covered boxing literally everywhere.
00:08:57.000 So I'm familiar with what you also know that fighting, even combat sports, boxing, MMA... There's a regional aspect to it.
00:09:07.000 Everybody's culture brings something to it.
00:09:10.000 The Irish fighter feels like he's got a certain style.
00:09:12.000 He's got a certain history.
00:09:13.000 He's got a claim to the warrior legacy.
00:09:16.000 Same for the British fighter.
00:09:17.000 Of course, the American fighter.
00:09:19.000 But both of these guys come from what's like an underclass of their society.
00:09:25.000 Travelers.
00:09:26.000 Gypsies in England are looked down upon.
00:09:29.000 These people are cultural fighters.
00:09:32.000 And I don't mean necessarily just the oppression of being an underclass, but fighting is part of their tradition, almost like it is to Mexicans in Mexico.
00:09:40.000 It's something that they do that bonds the clan.
00:09:44.000 They believe in the history of it.
00:09:47.000 Obviously, Deontay Wilder is from Alabama. 0.99
00:09:50.000 You know, he's as dark as midnight.
00:09:52.000 He is a descendant of slaves for sure.
00:09:55.000 Okay?
00:09:56.000 He's got a history coming to any fight bringing what he experiences in this country to this element of the face-off one man, one man versus one man.
00:10:06.000 So, When Tyson Fury is on stage during the press conference, it's something that possessed him to say, you know, I'm coming from a fighting people.
00:10:15.000 My people have been fighting for 200 years.
00:10:17.000 Well, in context, he means that the culture of travelers, of gypsies, is one of, we're fighting men. 0.99
00:10:25.000 I'm a fighting man.
00:10:26.000 That's something that they say about themselves and each other.
00:10:28.000 So that's what he's bringing to this argument.
00:10:30.000 That's how he's challenging Wilder.
00:10:32.000 But Wilder takes that and says, 200 years?
00:10:34.000 My people have been fighting for 400 years!
00:10:38.000 Of course he's talking about the black experience in America, slavery, all alike. 0.97
00:10:44.000 But mind you, he's talking to a British fighter.
00:10:47.000 He's talking to a world audience.
00:10:50.000 It's not like he's fighting Dominic Brazile, you understand, where it's two Americans, probably not going to get that much international attention.
00:10:58.000 The world's watching, particularly communities that don't necessarily know when a black man says 400 years, you know, I know, you know, because we grew up in America, you know what we're talking about.
00:11:10.000 The world doesn't know that!
00:11:12.000 I travel the world, they're not just, they're not steeped in black American history.
00:11:16.000 I've had conversations with him.
00:11:19.000 He loves to talk about the plight of the black man in America and how it relates to his career, how he feels, you know, disadvantaged in certain ways and he carries the mantle in other ways.
00:11:30.000 He's a champion of black America in certain ways and he's a victim of white America in other ways. 0.53
00:11:35.000 So, when I see this argument happening, I'm like, oh, okay, well this is definitely a moment.
00:11:41.000 But I'm not a pool reporter, right?
00:11:44.000 So, in this particular instance, it's unusual for me to be part of the scrum, is what they call it.
00:11:51.000 Collection of reporters, everybody's kind of shouting questions out, just trying to evoke responses.
00:11:57.000 Usually I'm a one-on-one guy, I'll wait my turn, right?
00:11:59.000 But on this particular day, I didn't have a haircut, I wasn't really...
00:12:04.000 I just got back from Dubai.
00:12:06.000 I went in Dubai with Dave Chappelle.
00:12:08.000 I'm hanging out.
00:12:09.000 It's after Thanksgiving.
00:12:10.000 I'm just like, you know what?
00:12:11.000 I'm going to kind of mail this one in, to be honest.
00:12:13.000 I'm thinking, let me throw something out because I know what he's talking about and I also know that the audience around us, in the world especially, may not have caught that reference.
00:12:24.000 But he is...
00:12:24.000 It's a high watermark right now.
00:12:27.000 It's Thursday and the fight's Saturday.
00:12:29.000 So he's amped up.
00:12:30.000 Yeah, that's the other thing.
00:12:32.000 Fight week...
00:12:33.000 Fighters are not them.
00:12:34.000 So it's not the guy you were sitting across from doing the experience.
00:12:38.000 You know what I mean?
00:12:39.000 That guy was having a good day.
00:12:40.000 This guy's been waiting to fight for at least three months, if not, you know, ten weeks.
00:12:46.000 Ramped up.
00:12:47.000 Ramped.
00:12:48.000 Right?
00:12:49.000 He comes off stage, he answers a couple of other questions, and then, just to be sure, because I've been doing this a long time, I'm not an idiot, I know he's amped, and I want him to get the question clearly.
00:13:00.000 Deontay, Radio Raheem, I say my name so he knows who it's coming from.
00:13:06.000 Not because he doesn't know me, but because he does!
00:13:09.000 So, Radio Raheem, you just said your people have been fighting for 400 years.
00:13:14.000 Okay, first of all, I'm in the midst of my question.
00:13:17.000 I don't do these things haphazardly.
00:13:21.000 I word my questions very carefully.
00:13:23.000 Yes.
00:13:23.000 But in the ears of Black America later in the story, you'll find out that your people, that part of the question, became incredibly important.
00:13:33.000 And people were very sensitive about that.
00:13:36.000 Because you said your people instead of our people.
00:13:38.000 Because I said your people instead of our people. 0.99
00:13:39.000 But I'm fucking quoting the guy! 0.98
00:13:43.000 I'm not speaking for him. 0.98
00:13:45.000 I'm quoting what he said.
00:13:47.000 He said, my people have been fighting for 400 years.
00:13:50.000 So, if he had said our people, I would have said our people.
00:13:55.000 But I can't take possession of your quote.
00:13:57.000 It's not me saying it.
00:13:58.000 It's you saying it.
00:14:00.000 Your people have been fighting for 400 years.
00:14:02.000 What did you mean by that?
00:14:04.000 So, I mean, laser focus.
00:14:08.000 Turns to me, he's already at 10. Like, there's no ramp up at this time.
00:14:12.000 And he starts, you know, shouting my face.
00:14:15.000 Like, your people too.
00:14:17.000 Like, you know what I'm talking about.
00:14:19.000 He says, don't try to bait.
00:14:21.000 You know what I'm talking about when I say these things.
00:14:23.000 I'm like, well, yeah, I do.
00:14:25.000 Can you tell them what you're talking about?
00:14:28.000 You're trying to get him to explain.
00:14:29.000 I'm trying to get him to explain to the world what he's said to me on numerous occasions in different interviews and off camera.
00:14:38.000 I know exactly what he's talking about, and I know that this is the moment that he finally gets to talk about it to people who have never been listening to him before.
00:14:47.000 Right.
00:14:56.000 But...
00:14:56.000 When he heard your, it was a trigger for him, too.
00:14:59.000 I'm so oblivious, and even looking back, I'm like, man, how did you miss that? 0.99
00:15:04.000 I swear to God, I didn't know what the fuck was the problem. 0.97
00:15:06.000 He starts saying, shouting your people, and I'm like, well, it took me him... 0.99
00:15:12.000 He needed to keep saying it, because I didn't know why he was saying that.
00:15:16.000 Yeah, my people, too.
00:15:18.000 My people, too.
00:15:19.000 Oh.
00:15:20.000 There's a moment I'm like, oh, uh-oh.
00:15:24.000 Oh, no!
00:15:26.000 I thought he's shouting at them!
00:15:28.000 He's shouting at me!
00:15:30.000 Oh, no!
00:15:34.000 You know, our people have been fighting for 400 years.
00:15:37.000 To this day.
00:15:38.000 To this day.
00:15:40.000 And...
00:15:41.000 So, what I wanted...
00:15:44.000 What I thought was happening...
00:15:46.000 Was that...
00:15:47.000 Okay...
00:15:49.000 This moment now has become about him attacking me because he thinks I'm attacking him.
00:15:56.000 He thinks because I do know what he's talking about.
00:15:58.000 He knows we've spoken about it numerous times.
00:16:01.000 He thinks I'm pretending.
00:16:03.000 Not to know, like some, you know, air quotes, Uncle Tom or whatever, you know, the numerous names I've been called on the internet since, as though I'm trying to pretend like, oh, I don't, what 400 years?
00:16:17.000 What does that mean?
00:16:20.000 You know what I mean?
00:16:23.000 I'm like, okay, okay, okay, fine.
00:16:26.000 So...
00:16:28.000 So when he's screaming at you, what is going through your mind when he's hitting you with...
00:16:33.000 Is it to this day or till this day?
00:16:35.000 Because there is a debate on that.
00:16:37.000 First of all...
00:16:37.000 Let's see.
00:16:38.000 Let's play it.
00:16:38.000 Play it.
00:16:39.000 You know what I'm talking about.
00:16:41.000 Y'all all know what I'm talking about, man.
00:16:43.000 Don't sit up here and try to bait and not know what I'm talking about. 0.99
00:16:46.000 Y'all know what the fuck I talk about when I say these things. 0.99
00:16:49.000 You're people too. 0.98
00:16:51.000 Explain it.
00:16:52.000 Not everybody knows what you're talking about.
00:16:54.000 Radio Rahim, I don't have to explain what's understood, man.
00:16:58.000 You know what I mean by that.
00:17:00.000 You know what I said by that.
00:17:01.000 I ain't got to go further.
00:17:02.000 And if anybody don't understand that, then God be with them.
00:17:06.000 Go look up the history.
00:17:08.000 Go look up the history.
00:17:09.000 Don't everybody believe in Google? 1.00
00:17:11.000 Go Google that shit. 1.00
00:17:12.000 See what I'm talking about. 1.00
00:17:13.000 You know what I'm talking about, man.
00:17:15.000 I dare you to sit up there and say, explain.
00:17:17.000 You know what I'm talking about, man.
00:17:20.000 He's fighting people.
00:17:21.000 You know we've been fighting 400 and still fighting to this day!
00:17:25.000 To this day!
00:17:27.000 To this day!
00:17:30.000 You just sit here and you don't know what I'm talking about?
00:17:37.000 Man, I'm out of here, bro.
00:17:38.000 Let's go.
00:17:39.000 Let's go, man.
00:17:44.000 You don't have to keep playing it, but just so you know, there's more to this video.
00:17:49.000 In fact, the last guy says, oh, we know what he's talking about.
00:17:54.000 That's what I just said at the end.
00:17:55.000 But that clip everyone in the world has seen fits very neatly on Instagram in a minute.
00:18:01.000 Oh, no.
00:18:02.000 Right?
00:18:03.000 So you missed the beginning and the end...
00:18:09.000 Welcome to 2020, or 19, or welcome to the new age of clips and things being taken out of context.
00:18:16.000 So listen, this is not the first time I've had an interview that has gotten major attention.
00:18:23.000 It's not the first time a fighter has been pissed off at me.
00:18:25.000 I knew that this was going to be a big thing.
00:18:28.000 I knew people were going to talk about it. 0.96
00:18:30.000 Bro, I had no fucking concept of what was about to happen to my night. 0.91
00:18:38.000 Basically, when you're a reporter like this, you're like, okay, well, that was dramatic. 0.99
00:18:41.000 We got a hot one.
00:18:42.000 That one might get me a few hundred thousand, if not a million views, maybe.
00:18:46.000 Yeah, we got the champ.
00:18:48.000 But also, I'm thinking, it's something of a success.
00:18:52.000 We got him to express, at least in that moment, something that we don't usually see.
00:18:57.000 It's fight week.
00:18:58.000 We talked to this guy a million times.
00:18:59.000 Everyone's had their interviews.
00:19:01.000 He's been on every show.
00:19:03.000 And that was like the realest moment in the whole buildup.
00:19:06.000 So for me, that in and of itself is something of a victory.
00:19:09.000 Like you've created a moment here where you got to see inside the champ's heart.
00:19:13.000 You got to see like his passion.
00:19:15.000 When I get home though, I gotta take a nap.
00:19:17.000 It's been a long day.
00:19:18.000 It's good.
00:19:19.000 So, as these stories tend to go, I'm woken up by chimes on my phone. 0.99
00:19:26.000 What the fuck's going on? 0.99
00:19:27.000 What's going on? 0.99
00:19:28.000 In the interim, he's posted on Instagram just a minute of what is really like a two and a half minute interview.
00:19:35.000 Where it looks so...
00:19:37.000 Bad!
00:19:38.000 And then he's written, like, a paragraph, essentially, about having to, like, you know, teach people, like, basically not to be Uncle Tom, and how you gotta, like, straighten it out, and, like, there's a whole, like, civil rights diatribe, and I'm the pincushion,
00:19:54.000 right?
00:19:55.000 Like, I'm the straw man, I'm the guy.
00:19:59.000 Oh my god.
00:20:01.000 And I start to, of course, read the comments.
00:20:06.000 I'm like, well, maybe, is there any possible way this is good? 1.00
00:20:09.000 Bro, everybody's like, fuck that guy! 1.00
00:20:14.000 Uncle Tom! 1.00
00:20:15.000 Uncle Rug is sallow! 1.00
00:20:16.000 You know, I always hated this motherfucker. 1.00
00:20:19.000 Oh no! 1.00
00:20:20.000 Oh no!
00:20:22.000 I'm also not a stranger to criticism.
00:20:27.000 I'm not a stranger to YouTube comments.
00:20:28.000 I live on YouTube.
00:20:28.000 It's one of the most vicious places on earth.
00:20:31.000 If you ever want to get humbled, if you're ever feeling too big about yourself, post a YouTube video.
00:20:37.000 Let it sit there for about an hour and then start reading the comments.
00:20:38.000 I don't care who you are.
00:20:40.000 It'll bring you down a notch.
00:20:42.000 But this is another element.
00:20:44.000 Bro, Rihanna was upset at me. 0.98
00:20:49.000 I don't want Rihanna mad at me.
00:20:51.000 I don't even know Rihanna.
00:20:52.000 Like, why?
00:20:52.000 How do I want to start our relationship this way?
00:20:54.000 Like, what is going on?
00:21:00.000 Snoop Dogg!
00:21:01.000 Snoop Dogg!
00:21:02.000 Who we all now know can be incredibly vicious when he's upset at somebody over something.
00:21:08.000 Like, nobody.
00:21:09.000 Yo, teach that fella. 1.00
00:21:11.000 Like, yeah, you know, put it inward in his place.
00:21:14.000 Like...
00:21:15.000 Bro, Snoop Dogg's mad at me?
00:21:17.000 How about these things?
00:21:18.000 What are you feeling when this is going on?
00:21:20.000 How many knots are in your stomach?
00:21:21.000 I'm panicking.
00:21:22.000 I'm panicking!
00:21:24.000 I'm way more comfortable with him shouting in my face and having no idea whether or not...
00:21:29.000 This can go any kind of way.
00:21:31.000 But at least I understand the moment.
00:21:33.000 At least I'm in control of half of it.
00:21:35.000 This is a train on fire off the rails.
00:21:39.000 You know what I mean?
00:21:40.000 And of course, the more people respond to it, celebrities and other fighters and the like...
00:21:48.000 The more emboldened he is to double down on it.
00:21:52.000 Like, hell, this is a moment.
00:21:53.000 The fight's not selling well.
00:21:55.000 You know what I mean?
00:21:57.000 They've been giving him stick overseas for not being known anywhere.
00:22:02.000 They're saying you can walk down the street and, you know, Eddie Hearn did this video where he's asking people in New York, like, do they know who Deontay Wilder is?
00:22:09.000 And he made a whole video of them saying no.
00:22:11.000 So at this moment, you also have to give context of what's happening in his career.
00:22:14.000 At this moment, he's knocking everybody out.
00:22:17.000 He's WBC heavyweight champion.
00:22:19.000 He can't get the fight to unify with Joshua.
00:22:22.000 They're saying he's a nobody, essentially.
00:22:24.000 He's not worth the money, because nobody knows who he is.
00:22:27.000 He's fighting, arguably, the toughest fight he could have possibly picked.
00:22:30.000 Tyson Fury is an incredibly technical fighter.
00:22:33.000 No one thinks of Deontay Wilder as a technical technician.
00:22:36.000 Like, they're thinking this guy's gonna get outclassed.
00:22:39.000 He could lose his belts this way and not be making...
00:22:41.000 He's not like made a shit ton of money for that fight.
00:22:43.000 So, now that all his attention is on him, and like I said, it's a subject he loves to talk about, he's a hero.
00:22:52.000 He's like a champion of black America in this moment.
00:22:54.000 The only...
00:22:55.000 I'm just like, you know, collateral damage.
00:22:58.000 It's a casualty.
00:22:59.000 I had to boost the fuck out of that fight, though. 0.86
00:23:02.000 Take itself through the roof.
00:23:03.000 The moment's viral.
00:23:06.000 It's everywhere.
00:23:07.000 People didn't even know the fight was happening until this meme just is in their inboxes.
00:23:13.000 People are like...
00:23:16.000 Look at this.
00:23:17.000 The to this day meme is taking over the internet and it'll speak to your soul.
00:23:21.000 Yeah.
00:23:22.000 Oh my goodness.
00:23:24.000 This became, like, the flagship moment for black woke people to tell, like, you know, the black sellout class. 1.00
00:23:34.000 Look at the meme, too. 0.99
00:23:35.000 It's Kermit with a fucking oxygen mask on, and it says, you still on your parents' phone? 0.99
00:23:41.000 Me, dot, with this. 0.99
00:23:45.000 Right. 1.00
00:23:47.000 The fucking internet! 1.00
00:23:48.000 The internet is so goddamn funny. 1.00
00:23:50.000 It's undefeated. 0.90
00:23:52.000 Oh my god. 1.00
00:23:53.000 At this point, it's kicking my ass. 1.00
00:23:55.000 Oh my god. 1.00
00:23:56.000 Goddamn, dude. 0.99
00:23:58.000 Yeah, so... 0.99
00:24:01.000 As this thing gets bigger and bigger, I start to realize that it's well out of my control.
00:24:06.000 And then I have to start to think about what my role really is.
00:24:12.000 It's not about me.
00:24:14.000 It's not what I do isn't so that people can feel one way or another about me.
00:24:19.000 It's really, again, taking myself back to that initial moment of showing them something about the fighter that they haven't seen.
00:24:26.000 Let's get a look inside this guy and get him to share something.
00:24:29.000 Usually...
00:24:29.000 Just verbally that they didn't know or that he didn't come to the room expecting to share.
00:24:36.000 And I support People understanding the culture from which he, we, come as black Americans.
00:24:46.000 I wanted to give him the stage to do exactly that.
00:24:49.000 Didn't turn out like I expected, but it did become an iconic civil rights, I guess, type of moment.
00:24:56.000 It became one of those things that people identify with.
00:24:59.000 Black power, black information being like, yo, this is what we're experiencing. 0.97
00:25:05.000 And this is how deep it still runs at that time in 2018. Did you think about it, like, in retrospect, how could I have phrased that better?
00:25:14.000 I mean, sure you did, right?
00:25:16.000 What could you have said?
00:25:18.000 Because you wanted to get that out of there.
00:25:20.000 You wanted to get him to expand on it.
00:25:23.000 I think that it was exactly the right thing at the right time.
00:25:28.000 I couldn't have predicted in a million years it would have went that way, but that's the way it was supposed to go.
00:25:34.000 If I had phrased it so-called better, and he had given a more reasoned, thoughtful answer, we wouldn't be sitting here.
00:25:40.000 He would have made less money, too.
00:25:42.000 The fight would have sold less tickets, less pay-per-views.
00:25:45.000 That wouldn't have went viral. 0.98
00:25:47.000 You wouldn't have gave a shit about my side of the story. 0.96
00:25:50.000 Like, the moment doesn't exist! 0.98
00:25:52.000 Right, right.
00:25:54.000 And that's the beauty of it. 1.00
00:25:55.000 When you were telling me in the back of the Comedy Store, I'm like, oh shit, that's you! 0.99
00:25:59.000 Right. 0.99
00:26:00.000 Oh my god!
00:26:02.000 So the blessing and the angle on the camera work, in some regard is, some people don't know it's me.
00:26:09.000 And I'm so happy for that!
00:26:12.000 Oh my god.
00:26:14.000 But the ones who do, there's enough who do, so I'm telling you, Joe, every day since then, it's been over a year now, someone, somewhere, every time I've left my home, and sometimes while I'm still in it, has shouted in my face, TO THIS DAY! That's how they say hello!
00:26:32.000 Some people don't even know my name!
00:26:34.000 To this day!
00:26:35.000 To this day!
00:26:36.000 Oh my god!
00:26:39.000 Oh my god!
00:26:41.000 Yeah.
00:26:41.000 Oh my god.
00:26:42.000 But, you know, hey man, it's a godsend, really.
00:26:45.000 It's something that captured everybody's attention in a moment.
00:26:50.000 And if it had been anything else, I can't imagine how it would have done that.
00:26:54.000 It wouldn't have.
00:26:55.000 No, it had to be that crazy in his eyes because he's so ramped up getting ready for that fight and he's so angry.
00:27:01.000 He takes the glasses off.
00:27:03.000 I'm like, I remember watching.
00:27:04.000 I was nervous.
00:27:05.000 I was nowhere near him.
00:27:06.000 Yeah. 0.99
00:27:06.000 You must have been shitting your pants. 0.99
00:27:08.000 Okay. 0.96
00:27:08.000 But you know him, right? 0.96
00:27:09.000 So you probably weren't shitting your pants, but you're probably like very uncomfortable. 0.91
00:27:13.000 I absolutely was not shitting my pants. 0.57
00:27:16.000 In fact, in the exchange, I'm quite calm.
00:27:20.000 I'm just trying.
00:27:22.000 On the one hand, I'm trying to figure out, What's happening in the beginning?
00:27:26.000 Because I didn't understand the rage being directed at me.
00:27:30.000 I'm telling you, for a minute I thought he was just talking to White America.
00:27:32.000 I was like, yeah, get him.
00:27:33.000 You know what I mean?
00:27:40.000 I'm halfway through this thing.
00:27:42.000 I realize this is my bad.
00:27:45.000 Oh my goodness.
00:27:49.000 Yeah, get him.
00:27:54.000 Once he's like, I'm done.
00:27:57.000 He walks off in disgust.
00:28:00.000 I then find him 20 minutes later, and I interview him again.
00:28:05.000 This time, in much more calm and reasoned fashion, I let him lay out what it was about, what I expected to happen the first time.
00:28:11.000 A lot of people have seen it.
00:28:12.000 Not a fraction of the people who've seen that.
00:28:17.000 I do know the guy, but as you know, these people are warriors, man.
00:28:20.000 And their blood's running high.
00:28:22.000 And he saw red.
00:28:24.000 At that time, we weren't friends.
00:28:26.000 We weren't homies.
00:28:27.000 He didn't remember Belfast.
00:28:29.000 He thought I was coming for him.
00:28:31.000 So even though I know him...
00:28:34.000 I don't know him.
00:28:35.000 You know what I mean?
00:28:36.000 I don't know what's really going to happen in this moment.
00:28:38.000 Right.
00:28:39.000 I'm just doing my job.
00:28:40.000 I can't be afraid to do that.
00:28:41.000 So whatever happens in this moment, this is what it's going to be.
00:28:43.000 You've got a great perspective on it, though.
00:28:45.000 You're so right that without that moment blowing up like that, the fight doesn't become as big as it is.
00:28:51.000 The meme doesn't exist.
00:28:52.000 You don't become more popular.
00:28:54.000 Right.
00:28:55.000 And he even did a segment before a fight on Showtime where he went through a black history segment.
00:29:05.000 Because of that.
00:29:06.000 Because of this!
00:29:07.000 Like, it actually created a moment that put him in position to be the kind of representative of that issue that he wanted to be.
00:29:18.000 And it gave me an opportunity to be seen, even though...
00:29:27.000 We're good to go.
00:29:41.000 They know that I think they know I'm not an idiot, and I like to think they know I'm not a sellout, but they don't really know me because I don't ever make it about me.
00:29:52.000 This interview we're having is a unicorn.
00:29:56.000 I've maybe done three or four or five of these in my entire life where I'm talking about my perspective on anything.
00:30:02.000 I'm entirely showing up at every press conference, every fight, every weigh-in, every media workout, trying to get something out of the fighter to be consumed by the audience in a way that maybe they hadn't seen it before.
00:30:17.000 Not just for the audience's sake, but I want the fighter to get in touch with something. 0.94
00:30:21.000 There's so many of these platitude questions and the same old shit, and nobody's really digging deep. 0.78
00:30:26.000 These aren't one-dimensional characters. 0.99
00:30:28.000 These aren't actual bulls.
00:30:29.000 These aren't just gladiators.
00:30:31.000 They're fathers.
00:30:32.000 They're sons.
00:30:33.000 They have civil rights issues.
00:30:35.000 They have cultural things they're bringing to this thing.
00:30:37.000 They have depression.
00:30:38.000 We know all the things that fighters go through, but they only want to show you one side.
00:30:42.000 Because they don't want to show any vulnerability.
00:30:44.000 And their fans aren't interested in anything other than who's up and who's down if that's all you're feeding them.
00:30:49.000 So I try to get out of the way.
00:30:52.000 I don't want to get in front of the work. 0.98
00:30:53.000 So when people see me in this line, a lot of people are just like, oh, this guy must be a fucking Uncle Tom then. 0.97
00:30:59.000 Wilder, Rihanna, and Snoop Dogg think so. 0.98
00:31:02.000 Clearly, that's who this guy is.
00:31:04.000 Have you talked to Snoop since?
00:31:06.000 No!
00:31:07.000 I didn't talk to Snoop then!
00:31:08.000 He just put it on Instagram!
00:31:10.000 That's what I'm saying!
00:31:11.000 Oh no!
00:31:13.000 But I have talked to Wilder many times since then.
00:31:17.000 And to this guy's credit, even the 20 minutes after...
00:31:22.000 You're right.
00:31:22.000 We did know each other.
00:31:23.000 We do have a history.
00:31:24.000 And he is now knowing the moment that he created and knowing what he did to me in that moment has always been especially gracious.
00:31:33.000 He's always been especially helpful.
00:31:35.000 I can always get access to him.
00:31:36.000 We have a bond now.
00:31:38.000 We share this thing that's inextricable no matter what happens.
00:31:42.000 You know what I mean?
00:31:43.000 Oh my goodness.
00:31:44.000 That's amazing.
00:31:46.000 I don't think there's another boxing interview like that ever.
00:31:51.000 Ever.
00:31:52.000 There's nothing like it.
00:31:53.000 There's nothing like it. 1.00
00:31:54.000 There's one where like, remember when Larry Merchant was talking to Floyd Mayweather, he's like, you were 20 years younger, or if I was 20 years younger, I'd kick your ass. 1.00
00:32:01.000 Right. 0.97
00:32:01.000 To me, with all due respect to Larry Merchant, a legend and an icon on that microphone, shouldn't have said that. 0.97
00:32:07.000 Of course not. 0.98
00:32:08.000 Yeah, that's ridiculous. 0.95
00:32:09.000 It's not always ridiculous. 0.99
00:32:11.000 It's preposterous. 0.78
00:32:13.000 You're talking to the best boxer ever. 1.00
00:32:15.000 You would have kicked his ass when you were younger? 1.00
00:32:17.000 Oh really, Larry? 1.00
00:32:18.000 How old was he going to be at the time?
00:32:20.000 Because when you were 50, he's probably still an embryo. 1.00
00:32:23.000 At that time, you probably could have kicked his ass. 1.00
00:32:26.000 Yeah, when he was four. 1.00
00:32:29.000 Anything after 10, I'm rooting on Floyd.
00:32:31.000 But Larry in the moment made it about him.
00:32:33.000 You know what I mean?
00:32:34.000 Yeah, well he did that a lot.
00:32:40.000 If not made it about him, he insulted fighters.
00:32:43.000 A lot.
00:32:44.000 There was a lot of that.
00:32:46.000 I feel like what Merchant did that people objected to was he had his own standard by which you had to win the fight and by which you had to get his respect even if you won.
00:32:57.000 That everybody doesn't share.
00:32:59.000 And it's like there's no...
00:33:01.000 He existed in a vacuum.
00:33:03.000 This is before the internet.
00:33:05.000 And one of the things I think about internet commentary in the age of the internet is you're accountable.
00:33:10.000 You're accountable in a different way.
00:33:13.000 Back then...
00:33:14.000 If you were Howard Cosell or if you were anyone who was commenting on sports, you really could kind of get away with it other than what radio guys would say about you or journalists would say about you.
00:33:24.000 But the regular person didn't have a say.
00:33:26.000 Didn't have a voice. 0.82
00:33:26.000 Now the regular person has a fuckload to say. 0.82
00:33:30.000 Trust me, as a commentator, I mean, I know when I've made mistakes.
00:33:35.000 I don't have to read the comments.
00:33:37.000 I know if I fuck something up.
00:33:38.000 But they'll let me know.
00:33:40.000 I don't mind.
00:33:41.000 In fact, I encourage a regular person to have something to say. 1.00
00:33:44.000 It's these strange motherfuckers that are like, really should probably pipe down. 0.98
00:33:49.000 If you, and you do, because you're on YouTube and you're on the internet, the amount of comments that are useful or thoughtful or like, eh, okay, interesting. 0.99
00:34:02.000 90%.
00:34:02.000 Maybe 92%.
00:34:04.000 But there's like 8%. 0.99
00:34:06.000 That 8% of really just like vitriolic, racist, sexist, like violent trolls. 0.99
00:34:14.000 Yeah. 1.00
00:34:15.000 Shitposters. 0.95
00:34:16.000 That's a good way to put it. 0.98
00:34:17.000 Yeah, that's the expression. 0.96
00:34:19.000 Shitposting. 0.71
00:34:19.000 You never heard that before? 0.71
00:34:21.000 I haven't heard it, but it's wildly accurate.
00:34:23.000 It's like a Reddit thing.
00:34:24.000 Right?
00:34:25.000 4chan?
00:34:25.000 Reddit?
00:34:26.000 Yeah.
00:34:27.000 They call it shitposting. 0.52
00:34:28.000 Guys do it on purpose. 0.92
00:34:29.000 All they're trying to do is get a rise out of you. 0.98
00:34:30.000 They're trying to say the most fucked up thing to you to make other people laugh and to get a rise out of you. 0.97
00:34:35.000 And if you met them in real life, they'd be like, I'm sorry, I'm just bored at work. 0.98
00:34:38.000 Like a lot of them.
00:34:39.000 Or they're 12. You know Deontay went and beat a guy up that was...
00:34:43.000 Oh, well that guy that he beat up, that guy is fucking crazy. 0.98
00:34:48.000 That guy would fight every... 1.00
00:34:50.000 You know, Floyd Mayweather Sr. beat his ass. 1.00
00:34:52.000 Did you ever see that? 1.00
00:34:53.000 I didn't see that. 0.99
00:34:54.000 Yeah, what the fuck's his name? 0.99
00:34:57.000 Charlie Zelnoff? 1.00
00:35:00.000 Is that his name?
00:35:00.000 Ah, yeah, that is his name.
00:35:01.000 That rings a bell. 1.00
00:35:03.000 When I was watching him box Deontay, I'm like, is this guy out of his fucking mind? 1.00
00:35:07.000 And then Deontay was beating his ass outside the ring. 1.00
00:35:10.000 He wouldn't let him go. 0.99
00:35:11.000 I support that.
00:35:12.000 I support that too. 0.99
00:35:13.000 That guy's a troll. 1.00
00:35:14.000 And he sucker punches people. 1.00
00:35:15.000 He tried to sucker punch Floyd Sr. Floyd Sr. was beating his ass. 1.00
00:35:21.000 And he got tired and he quit. 0.99
00:35:22.000 And Floyd Sr. moved away and he jumped through the ropes and took a wild haymaker swing at him. 0.98
00:35:27.000 But I think he's legitimately mentally deranged.
00:35:30.000 There's something wrong with him. 0.71
00:35:31.000 Mmm, I did see that. 0.98
00:35:33.000 Yeah, Deontay beat the fuck out of him. 0.94
00:35:36.000 But those are the people that are like the loudest in the room.
00:35:39.000 A normal person will post a comment for or against criticism or congratulations and kind of leave it at that.
00:35:46.000 Maybe like a couple other posts. 0.99
00:35:47.000 But that kind of guy, a shit poster, it's going to be every couple of hours. 0.99
00:35:52.000 He's going to be engaging people. 1.00
00:35:53.000 He's going to be all over your threat.
00:35:55.000 You know what I mean?
00:35:56.000 Look at this.
00:35:58.000 Imagine he ate that left hook and just sat down.
00:36:02.000 I mean, he's fortunate he's still alive, but then he still went after him.
00:36:07.000 That was his thing.
00:36:08.000 He would go, no, no, no, I'm done, I'm done, I'm done, and then he would run after him.
00:36:12.000 He basically fights like he comments. 0.99
00:36:14.000 Well, he's just a crazy person. 0.99
00:36:16.000 There's something wrong with him. 0.92
00:36:17.000 I think that the internet now is to a place where you can drag people, you can change their lives, you can actually put them in harm's way by stirring up a fervor around being violent towards them, that everybody should have to be identified on the internet. 0.99
00:36:32.000 I don't believe in this anonymous Posting, shit posters, all this shit. 0.93
00:36:36.000 The problem with that is there's a lot of people that have things to say that are important. 0.99
00:36:39.000 They don't want to suffer consequences at work or their job.
00:36:42.000 They want to be able to whistle blow and say, hey, there's like some safety problems here or there's some sexual harassment here or there's this or that.
00:36:49.000 There's benefits to being anonymous and then there's negative aspects of it.
00:36:53.000 I see both things.
00:36:55.000 I mean, that person, is that in a comment section though?
00:36:57.000 This is what I feel like. 0.99
00:36:59.000 I feel like if someone is saying some horrible shit, then yes. 0.96
00:37:05.000 But if someone is just explaining something that's going down, like, there's people that have talked about, like, unfair labor practices or things that are going down at work, and they literally have to be anonymous in order to leak this information. 0.98
00:37:17.000 Particularly if they're talking about someone from another country and they're doing it through a VPN. Like, they have to do it this way.
00:37:22.000 They have to do it anonymously.
00:37:23.000 Otherwise their life is in danger.
00:37:25.000 And they need to get the word out.
00:37:27.000 There's real crimes taking place.
00:37:28.000 There's a real issue. 1.00
00:37:29.000 I see your perspective that there's a lot of cunts online and they think it's cute and those fuckers should be outed. 1.00
00:37:39.000 I'm not sure that you should be... 1.00
00:37:41.000 There are times in which people are unjustly punished for having reasonable opinions or going against the grain or something like that.
00:37:55.000 But, generally, if you say something publicly, for public consumption, you should be willing to accept the consequences of that.
00:38:05.000 There's no...
00:38:13.000 Right, but who's doing that in YouTube comment sections or on my Instagram and Facebook?
00:38:17.000 No, that's different.
00:38:18.000 But here's the thing. 1.00
00:38:19.000 You shouldn't be reading that shit anyway. 0.99
00:38:20.000 Everyone says that. 1.00
00:38:21.000 I say I don't read it.
00:38:23.000 Everyone says that.
00:38:24.000 You can't not read it.
00:38:26.000 I don't read it. 1.00
00:38:26.000 I don't read shit. 1.00
00:38:27.000 Really? 1.00
00:38:27.000 I don't read a goddamn thing. 1.00
00:38:29.000 Okay, when the show goes up, whatever show it is, the next experience, for the first hour or two, you're not scanning it a little bit? 1.00
00:38:37.000 No fucking chance. 1.00
00:38:38.000 No fucking chance. 1.00
00:38:39.000 No, I have discipline. 0.99
00:38:40.000 I mean, I have in the past, like way long ago, but within the last couple years, I don't...
00:38:49.000 It's a waste of time.
00:38:50.000 It's not good for you.
00:38:52.000 And what are you going to learn?
00:38:53.000 You're awesome?
00:38:54.000 What are you going to learn?
00:38:55.000 What are you going to learn?
00:38:55.000 People love you?
00:38:56.000 If people don't love me by now, like some people don't love me by now, what am I doing wrong? 0.99
00:39:00.000 I've been doing this fucking show for 10 years. 0.97
00:39:02.000 I'm assuming some people enjoy it. 1.00
00:39:05.000 Yeah, that's true.
00:39:06.000 I mean, I enjoy talking to regular folks.
00:39:08.000 Like if you said, hey man, I got a lot out of that episode where that doctor talked about this or something.
00:39:12.000 Oh, okay, cool.
00:39:13.000 That's awesome.
00:39:14.000 I like that.
00:39:14.000 Those are fun conversations.
00:39:15.000 But just throwing yourself into the wolves of the comments, covering yourself up with fucking blood and just leaping into the pen of wolves. 0.98
00:39:24.000 I am willing to throw myself on the fire just to pick out the few little pieces of charcoal that I can use to warm my next interview. 0.98
00:39:33.000 I don't consider myself one of these people who come to an interview with an agenda and I've got a point of view and the fighter has to answer to me.
00:39:44.000 More so, I'm gleaning from the audience what it is that they want to know.
00:39:50.000 Perspectives that I may disagree with personally, but I want to present their perspective to people they can't get at or talk to.
00:39:58.000 So I have to be listening to what they're saying and understand how they're consuming information.
00:40:03.000 You don't have to be listening to what they're saying about you.
00:40:05.000 Say if you were talking about, you know, you're going to interview Canelo or someone through an interpreter, you would, you know, there's plenty of people with perspectives on Canelo.
00:40:14.000 You don't have to listen to anything they have to say about you.
00:40:16.000 Yeah.
00:40:17.000 It's dangerous.
00:40:18.000 It's not good.
00:40:19.000 See this wrestling match that you're doing inside your head?
00:40:22.000 Everybody does this.
00:40:24.000 Everybody does this.
00:40:24.000 The solution is don't read the comments.
00:40:27.000 People saying mean, horrible things about you, don't read it.
00:40:30.000 Don't read it.
00:40:31.000 Look, if people are talking about you right now in a barbershop somewhere, you don't know.
00:40:34.000 Yeah, that's true.
00:40:35.000 Should you go there so you feel bad?
00:40:37.000 Should I listen to every word?
00:40:39.000 That's basically what you're doing if you get it into the comments.
00:40:41.000 At a certain point in time, it becomes untenable.
00:40:44.000 And in my life, it's untenable.
00:40:46.000 The volume is insane.
00:40:48.000 It's not possible.
00:40:49.000 And it's not healthy.
00:40:50.000 And most of it's positive, right?
00:40:52.000 If I go on my Instagram, if I looked at comments, I'm sure most of it's positive.
00:40:58.000 But I just post and go.
00:41:00.000 Post and go.
00:41:00.000 Do people stop you in the streets to give you their opinion?
00:41:03.000 Because you call fights, and everybody's got an opinion.
00:41:06.000 You know what?
00:41:07.000 Political comments more than anything, man. 0.98
00:41:09.000 I had a fucking guy where I was playing pool, and he wanted to talk to me about an Abby Martin interview that I had. 0.99
00:41:14.000 Yeah, you let her off the hook. 0.99
00:41:15.000 And I go...
00:41:17.000 I'm here to play pool. 1.00
00:41:18.000 I'm not here to talk fucking Venezuela with you. 1.00
00:41:20.000 I don't know jack shit about Palestine. 1.00
00:41:22.000 Like, just leave me alone. 0.99
00:41:23.000 I'm here to play pool, bro.
00:41:24.000 I'm like, this is work. 1.00
00:41:25.000 I don't come to your job, right, and then fucking talk to you about some shit. 1.00
00:41:29.000 Like, don't. 1.00
00:41:29.000 Come on. 1.00
00:41:30.000 Or come to you in the street and talk to you about your job.
00:41:33.000 This is, you know, I'm happy to talk to people, but I'm not going to debate whether or not they're right or I'm wrong.
00:41:40.000 You put so much more yourself out there.
00:41:42.000 I'm out there plenty.
00:41:43.000 I don't need to be out there any more than that.
00:41:46.000 Yeah, so they don't know me.
00:41:48.000 I don't put anything out there like that.
00:41:50.000 Well, you put it out now.
00:41:51.000 Now people get you.
00:41:52.000 So here we are.
00:41:53.000 Well, people get that, you know, the way you explained it backstage when we were at the Comedy Store.
00:41:57.000 I was laughing so hard because it was so funny.
00:42:00.000 Like, the emotions of it all.
00:42:02.000 Like, you explaining what it was like. 0.97
00:42:05.000 Like, of course I fucking know what he's saying.
00:42:07.000 I was trying to get him to explain it to people who might not understand his personal perspective. 0.72
00:42:13.000 Yeah, and it's still such a big part now of my identity that it can't be understated how big...
00:42:23.000 One minute!
00:42:24.000 The thing was one minute on Instagram.
00:42:27.000 And it's the way that a lot of people identify me.
00:42:31.000 They say to this day more than they say my name.
00:42:33.000 And it's also his most famous clip.
00:42:38.000 Unquestionably.
00:42:39.000 Knockouts.
00:42:40.000 Yeah, 40 knockouts.
00:42:42.000 Still!
00:42:44.000 They care more about that than those.
00:42:46.000 But you have to look at it this way, I think.
00:42:48.000 I mean, you don't have to, but this is my perspective. 1.00
00:42:50.000 This thing that can abuse us, the internet, with comments and 15-year-old assholes saying mean shit to you. 0.99
00:42:58.000 What it also is, is an avenue for you to put your stuff out there that would not have existed before. 0.99
00:43:05.000 Before, you would have had to been hired by CBS or ABC or whoever, name it.
00:43:10.000 You don't have to be hired by anybody anymore.
00:43:13.000 But the other side of that is the comment section.
00:43:16.000 Now, you could be one of those guys that turns the comment section off, but...
00:43:19.000 Man, I don't think that's a good idea.
00:43:22.000 I don't think that's a good idea either.
00:43:23.000 We accidentally had the comment section turned off back when we used to stream...
00:43:28.000 Because we were streaming live and it wasn't that we turned it off, but we had it off.
00:43:33.000 We had the chat off on the streaming because people would just like say a bunch of rude shit just so that other people had to read it while the podcast was going on. 0.88
00:43:42.000 I'm like, look at these people are just taking advantage of this.
00:43:44.000 But something happened when we flipped it over to live.
00:43:47.000 There was a bug.
00:43:49.000 And for how long was it that it did that, Jamie, where the comments were turned off?
00:43:54.000 It wasn't that long, but it was long enough for people to freak the fuck out.
00:43:57.000 And I'm like, hey, hey, hey, I'm not turning any comments off. 0.99
00:44:00.000 Like, you fucking say whatever you want to say. 1.00
00:44:02.000 I'm not reading it, but you say whatever the fuck you want to say. 1.00
00:44:05.000 Go have fun. 0.97
00:44:07.000 So, this medium, this avenue for putting out content never existed before.
00:44:14.000 It exists now.
00:44:16.000 But also, people's ability to comment exists.
00:44:19.000 And I think most people are rational.
00:44:21.000 Most people, the vast majority, are just commenting on it. 0.99
00:44:25.000 They might disagree with you, they might think you suck, they might tell you why you suck, but they're pretty rational. 0.99
00:44:30.000 They're like, man, he just talks about himself, or he does this, or he has to bring it back to that, or he blah, blah, blah. 0.99
00:44:36.000 You know, there's going to be people having their perspectives, and then they debate those perspectives with other people in the thread.
00:44:41.000 There's nothing wrong with that. 0.98
00:44:42.000 But there's going to be a certain percentage that are out of their fucking mind, or they're 15, and they're angry. 0.98
00:44:48.000 And, you know, like, I was just talking about this in the last podcast with my friend Justin Martindale. 0.98
00:44:51.000 I was like, when I was 15, man, thank God Twitter wasn't a thing. 1.00
00:44:55.000 I would have said the dumbest shit. 1.00
00:44:57.000 I would have found celebrities. 1.00
00:44:59.000 I would have said mean shit to them. 1.00
00:45:01.000 I mean, I was a fucked up kid. 1.00
00:45:03.000 And they'd be digging those tweets up now and, like, canceling you today. 0.98
00:45:07.000 Well, they're doing that to kids now that get gigs.
00:45:09.000 And then they're finding their tweets when they were 17 and 18 years old.
00:45:12.000 And now they're 24. Like, hey, it's a different fucking human being, man. 1.00
00:45:16.000 Like, we need a path to redemption for people. 0.96
00:45:19.000 And Twitter and Facebook and all these comments that are permanently on the record, they make it really difficult for kids. 0.99
00:45:27.000 I would not want to be in high school today with a Twitter account saying the dumbest fucking shit in the world and then having that come back to haunt me when I want a job someday. 0.99
00:45:36.000 You don't know what the world's going to be like in 15 years. 1.00
00:45:39.000 No one knew.
00:45:40.000 Hopefully, you're not the same as you were 15 years ago.
00:45:42.000 If anything, let's commend the person that doesn't look anything like they'd look when they were 15 today.
00:45:48.000 But we don't want that.
00:45:49.000 Nobody wants that.
00:45:50.000 You know, there's a thing with comedy, right?
00:45:52.000 Where you have to leave your town because they won't appreciate you. 0.99
00:45:56.000 They remember you when you sucked. 0.99
00:45:58.000 Like, when I lived in Boston, when I started out as an open mic, I was fucking terrible. 0.99
00:46:02.000 Everybody's terrible when they start. 0.98
00:46:03.000 I was terrible.
00:46:04.000 And so, they thought I was terrible.
00:46:06.000 And then I left.
00:46:07.000 I had to leave.
00:46:07.000 I had to leave.
00:46:09.000 Even though I'd gotten better, they still thought I was terrible.
00:46:11.000 I had to leave, and I had to get TV shows, and then come back.
00:46:15.000 And then they're like, oh, yeah, you got better.
00:46:17.000 He's okay.
00:46:17.000 Yeah, but...
00:46:18.000 The people that you would go to Pittsburgh, they never saw you before.
00:46:21.000 They're like, you're hilarious.
00:46:22.000 I'm like, thank you.
00:46:23.000 Tell the people in Boston, would you?
00:46:24.000 But what about the internet for comedians?
00:46:26.000 The kind of thing that you do developing bits and having to have an opportunity to put them on stage before everybody sees them.
00:46:33.000 And like you say, they see the joke at all different stages.
00:46:36.000 How can you create a bit on the road with as much internet, as many people posting your jokes?
00:46:42.000 Most people don't.
00:46:43.000 Believe it or not, most people are cool about it.
00:46:46.000 Sometimes sets get leaked, like Louis C.K.'s set.
00:46:49.000 That was a big deal.
00:46:50.000 He hadn't done stand-up in 10 months.
00:46:53.000 Most comedy fans don't want to ruin it for everybody else.
00:46:56.000 Most.
00:46:57.000 Most.
00:46:58.000 If you're a real comedy fan, like if you go see Dave and he's working some shit out at the store, you're not going to film it and put it online.
00:47:04.000 Most people are not going to do that. 0.51
00:47:06.000 Yeah, I mean, there's no better example for me than Dave Chappelle on how to do it.
00:47:11.000 I mean, that's how he's met at the Comedy Store, you and I. Obviously, Dave's my best friend.
00:47:18.000 And I've watched him walk through these minefields of all this shit. 0.99
00:47:25.000 And the main thing he likes to say is, you know, live right now. 1.00
00:47:29.000 Live in the moment.
00:47:30.000 Put your phones away and just be present.
00:47:32.000 Yeah.
00:47:33.000 And I've never seen a guy other than him be able to convince an entire room of people.
00:47:39.000 I don't even mean at his own show.
00:47:40.000 He'll pop up somewhere where everybody's already got their phones out.
00:47:44.000 They're filming Mayer or The Roots or whatever it is that they came to see. 1.00
00:47:49.000 They will come out and be like, put those damn phones away. 0.99
00:47:51.000 Let's make a memory and put an entire room of people who can stuff those phones in their pockets. 0.99
00:47:57.000 Even Dave, when Dave and I do gigs on the road, we use those Vero bags.
00:48:01.000 No, what is it called?
00:48:02.000 Yonder.
00:48:03.000 Yonder bags.
00:48:04.000 What is Vero?
00:48:05.000 But he even started that.
00:48:07.000 Yeah, Yonder bags.
00:48:08.000 I've been doing Yonder bags for years.
00:48:10.000 The first time I ever used them, the Denver Comedy Works actually started using them independently.
00:48:17.000 And the first time I had heard about them, It's been a few years, but comics, like Ali Wong, she used them at all her shows.
00:48:26.000 I used them a lot up until my last Netflix special, and then I got tired of using them. 0.87
00:48:30.000 It's just like, I'm like, I don't want to tell people to put their fucking phone away. 0.90
00:48:34.000 You know, the most hilarious thing was Miami, because Miami is such a party town, right? 0.98
00:48:39.000 And half the audience is probably coked up.
00:48:41.000 And it was the only audience when they had the yonder bags where they just kept getting up and going outside because they wanted to use their phone.
00:48:47.000 They didn't just sit down and enjoy the show.
00:48:50.000 Most places, 99.99999%, everybody just sits down.
00:48:54.000 And they go, alright, my phone's in the bag, now let me just enjoy the show.
00:48:56.000 And it makes the show better.
00:48:57.000 In Miami, the whole audience is people getting up and going out and coming back.
00:49:02.000 Getting up, going out, and coming back.
00:49:03.000 They go to the bathroom. 0.99
00:49:04.000 They go to the bathroom to either do coke or to fucking get their phone out of their bag. 1.00
00:49:08.000 Right. 1.00
00:49:09.000 Because they're trying to get pussy or whatever the fuck they're trying to do. 1.00
00:49:12.000 They're just wild people. 1.00
00:49:13.000 If they're coming back, you're doing your job.
00:49:15.000 If Miami keep coming back, you're good.
00:49:17.000 Well, they would definitely keep coming back, but it was just like, it's hilarious what the culture of Miami is so different than anywhere else.
00:49:23.000 They're such wild people.
00:49:25.000 You should have a passport to go to Miami.
00:49:29.000 And I don't mean because people there are from other countries, and some of them are, but it's because the culture is different.
00:49:36.000 The white people there, the Latinos, everyone's different there.
00:49:40.000 Miami is like visiting another country.
00:49:42.000 It really is. 0.96
00:49:43.000 It's a wild-ass place.
00:49:46.000 I was in Miami for the, essentially the first time over Super Bowl.
00:49:49.000 It's like the first time.
00:49:50.000 Oh, it's a wild place, man.
00:49:51.000 I didn't actually spend any time there.
00:49:53.000 Did you go to South Beach?
00:49:54.000 I went to South Beach.
00:49:56.000 I went downtown. 1.00
00:49:57.000 It's a wild fucking place, man. 0.99
00:49:59.000 But it's so cool. 0.99
00:50:00.000 I feel like every, and I didn't do like the party party scene, even though it was Super Bowl.
00:50:05.000 I like went the other way with it.
00:50:06.000 I was so like, kind of drained already.
00:50:08.000 I was like, you know what?
00:50:09.000 I'm just going to relax in Miami while everybody else is turk to like 12. Yeah. 1.00
00:50:15.000 It's one of the coolest places I've ever been.
00:50:18.000 Great food, man.
00:50:19.000 The most fantastic Cuban food you'll ever find.
00:50:22.000 A lot of Caribbean food.
00:50:24.000 And the women are so beautiful, too.
00:50:27.000 It's a crazy place.
00:50:29.000 It's a crazy place.
00:50:30.000 It really does feel like another country.
00:50:32.000 I do love about this phone thing and people sharing so much when I talk about the different cultures in combat sports.
00:50:38.000 That gives me access to everybody being on their phones.
00:50:43.000 The one thing that's everywhere is YouTube.
00:50:46.000 I don't know if you know this, but like you said...
00:50:50.000 There was a time when the only way you could have a voice or certainly comment on boxing or MMA or sports is if you got hired by a major network that had a reach where people could see you.
00:51:00.000 Somebody has to die before you get that job.
00:51:03.000 Right.
00:51:04.000 But Larry March has to retire.
00:51:05.000 Exactly.
00:51:06.000 But I came up in an age at the very beginning of YouTube.
00:51:12.000 I was training at Wild Card Boxing Gym.
00:51:14.000 I'm a teenager training there.
00:51:16.000 The gym is fairly new.
00:51:19.000 It was still like mini DV days.
00:51:22.000 And I had a camera that I would use to shoot sparring sessions.
00:51:26.000 And because Freddie has a gym, Where there are world championship fighters preparing for title fights on television.
00:51:34.000 The class of fighter that's in there on any given day sparring are like main event ticket selling marquee guys.
00:51:41.000 And I'm in there shooting their sparring session, name anybody versus anybody.
00:51:47.000 And I'm using the money I'm making selling the sparring footage back to the fighters to pay my gym dues.
00:51:56.000 That's how I started.
00:51:59.000 So that's what you're going to do.
00:52:00.000 Journalism.
00:52:01.000 Yeah.
00:52:03.000 It's an interesting story.
00:52:05.000 Commentating.
00:52:05.000 Because I was doing broadcasting since 10th grade.
00:52:09.000 I was at a performing arts high school.
00:52:11.000 We had a radio station in the basement. 0.98
00:52:13.000 It's like a coming of age, like 80s movie or some shit. 0.98
00:52:16.000 Christian Slater. 0.98
00:52:17.000 Yeah, exactly.
00:52:18.000 Blow the dust off the equipment.
00:52:20.000 Ask the faculty, can I Do a show. 1.00
00:52:22.000 And so, I'm covering headline news and whatever a fucking 10th grader thinks is important and who won the football game and this kind of shit. 0.99
00:52:29.000 But I always thought that I'm going to be a talk radio guy. 0.99
00:52:33.000 Never sports though.
00:52:34.000 I've been training boxing since 5th grade.
00:52:36.000 But never did I think the two shy would meet.
00:52:39.000 Except that I've moved to LA right after high school.
00:52:43.000 I'm in Freddie Roach's boxing gym.
00:52:45.000 I'm training.
00:52:46.000 I can't barely afford dudes.
00:52:47.000 I've got to come up with a way to do that.
00:52:48.000 I start shooting sparring sessions.
00:52:50.000 And this is like James Toney is still fighting.
00:52:55.000 We're getting the sunset of his career, but he's still the man.
00:52:58.000 And there's a guy named Danny Green, who is an Australian fighter, wildly famous there, but doesn't have a global audience.
00:53:06.000 He wants to fight James.
00:53:08.000 There's no real money in it for James.
00:53:09.000 But if you know James Toney, this is no shrinking violet. 0.99
00:53:12.000 This man is insane. 0.97
00:53:14.000 He was wilder... 0.87
00:53:18.000 If to this day was every day, that was James Toney at Wild Card Boxing Gym, right?
00:53:23.000 So this guy flies from Australia, walks into the gym, and you know what a sacred place those are.
00:53:29.000 The main fighter at any gym, the guy who is the representation of the toughest dude in that- The top dog.
00:53:36.000 Yeah, the top dog. 1.00
00:53:37.000 You don't just walk into that guy's gym and start talking shit. 1.00
00:53:41.000 Especially with James Toney. 1.00
00:53:43.000 Especially with James Toney. 1.00
00:53:44.000 No one talked more shit than James Toney. 1.00
00:53:46.000 He'll talk shit in the middle of a round, right? 1.00
00:53:49.000 Exactly! 1.00
00:53:50.000 Famous for it.
00:53:50.000 All throughout rounds.
00:53:52.000 This guy comes to the James gym, starts talking shit. 0.99
00:53:55.000 James is like, get in the ring right now. 1.00
00:53:57.000 The last 10 rounds, I'll fight you anywhere.
00:53:59.000 You can get the fight. 0.99
00:54:00.000 He takes the challenge, gets in there, gets the shit beat out of him for like 8 rounds. 0.99
00:54:05.000 It's pummeled. 1.00
00:54:06.000 I'm shooting the thing. 0.85
00:54:08.000 Is it right here? 0.96
00:54:09.000 Oh! 0.60
00:54:11.000 Look at this.
00:54:11.000 Okay, first of all, I'm wildly impressed that you came up with this.
00:54:14.000 I don't even know where to find this.
00:54:15.000 Look how good he looks, too.
00:54:16.000 James looks good.
00:54:17.000 I'm shooting this!
00:54:18.000 Oh my goodness.
00:54:19.000 And this is James in his prime. 0.99
00:54:21.000 He looked like he was a fucking heavyweight. 0.99
00:54:23.000 Look at the size of him. 0.99
00:54:25.000 Yeah.
00:54:25.000 Was James heavyweight at this point?
00:54:27.000 Was cruiserweight?
00:54:28.000 I think it was cruiserweight.
00:54:28.000 He was still cruiserweight.
00:54:29.000 Goddamn, he's huge. 0.99
00:54:31.000 Right. 0.99
00:54:32.000 He's on all the Mexican supplements.
00:54:34.000 Look at the size of them.
00:54:35.000 Oh man, that's so funny.
00:54:36.000 I haven't seen this footage in I don't even know how many years. 0.98
00:54:40.000 Dude, James is fucking him up. 0.64
00:54:43.000 Okay, but the point being that at this time there really wasn't any... 0.98
00:54:51.000 Keep that plan.
00:54:52.000 Keep that plan.
00:54:53.000 This is great.
00:54:54.000 ESPN might give you a highlight of De La Hoya.
00:54:58.000 You might get a Mike Tyson knockout clip.
00:55:00.000 But there's nobody sitting around talking boxing.
00:55:02.000 There's no place to see fighters training.
00:55:05.000 There's no websites for fights.
00:55:08.000 And after this thing got done...
00:55:11.000 I'm like, hey, you know, Danny Green doesn't want it.
00:55:14.000 He's got the shipping of him.
00:55:15.000 James Toney doesn't care about it at all.
00:55:16.000 So I'm just going to go home and record over it.
00:55:22.000 Yeah, because this is my side hustle.
00:55:25.000 Listen, man, I'm a very young man at this time.
00:55:28.000 I need every VHS tape I can use.
00:55:30.000 I need every mini DV I can use to keep the money in my pocket.
00:55:35.000 I can't just be stockpiling footage nobody wants.
00:55:38.000 But before I get a chance to tape over it, I get a call from a site called Max Boxing.
00:55:44.000 And at that time, they were pretty much the only boxing website.
00:55:48.000 What year is this?
00:55:51.000 I want to say this is probably close to 2000. Wow.
00:55:56.000 Yeah, 2000. And...
00:55:59.000 They say, hey, we heard Danny Green came down a wild card and they had this brutal sparring session.
00:56:04.000 Look how much bigger James is.
00:56:06.000 Yeah.
00:56:07.000 He looks so much bigger.
00:56:08.000 They don't even look like they're nearly in the same weight class.
00:56:11.000 James looks like he's 20 pounds heavier than him.
00:56:13.000 Doesn't he?
00:56:14.000 Yeah.
00:56:14.000 Well, of course he does.
00:56:15.000 But, you know, I mean, by weigh-in day, he'll get down.
00:56:20.000 But this is how James, like, rocked. 1.00
00:56:23.000 Every day, he'd be just banging guys, talking shit, beating them up, talking shit. 1.00
00:56:30.000 Even though now, looking back, of course, it's amazing footage, but at the time, this could be any given Wednesday. 1.00
00:56:37.000 Right.
00:56:38.000 You know what I mean?
00:56:38.000 Yeah, it happened there all the time.
00:56:40.000 You know, he used to spar with Mickey Rourke.
00:56:43.000 Yeah.
00:56:43.000 And that's one of the reasons why Mickey Rourke had to get his face worked on, apparently.
00:56:47.000 Yeah, Mickey Wark used to come in a wild card, and he used to spar James, which is like, someone needed to talk to him.
00:56:54.000 You're like, what are you thinking?
00:56:55.000 Hey, Mickey, come here.
00:56:56.000 Come here.
00:56:56.000 Look at me.
00:56:56.000 Look at me.
00:56:57.000 Look at me.
00:56:57.000 Oh, there's McAfoli.
00:56:59.000 Geez, man.
00:57:00.000 Wow.
00:57:01.000 God rest his soul.
00:57:02.000 God rest his soul.
00:57:05.000 So, what ultimately ended up happening was I got a little bidding war going for this video.
00:57:10.000 It was such like a hot piece.
00:57:12.000 And I got it up to like... 0.93
00:57:15.000 Looks like Danny's in pretty fucking good shape and James is getting tired.
00:57:18.000 Was there moments in this where James looked really tired? 0.93
00:57:21.000 The thing about James Toney at this time, he always looked really tired.
00:57:24.000 He always seemed like he was being lazy.
00:57:26.000 He's always leaning on fighters.
00:57:28.000 But what you can't hear is the thud of those shots. 0.99
00:57:33.000 Like, he's just turning shit over. 0.97
00:57:35.000 Can we hear some volume, Jamie? 0.98
00:57:36.000 And it's...
00:57:36.000 Come on, Paper Champ.
00:57:40.000 Come on, Paper Champ.
00:57:43.000 Is that James?
00:57:44.000 Yeah.
00:57:57.000 You hear Freddy in the background talking to him.
00:58:10.000 So they went eight rounds like this?
00:58:14.000 Yeah.
00:58:15.000 And then what happened at the end of it?
00:58:18.000 Danny Green still seems like he's kind of in it.
00:58:23.000 No?
00:58:24.000 I mean... 0.99
00:58:25.000 In the beginning, it looked like James was fucking him up. 0.71
00:58:28.000 Yeah, I mean, Danny had spots where he's connecting, but at no point during... 0.96
00:58:33.000 And mind you, his face is getting bloodier.
00:58:34.000 Right.
00:58:35.000 Like, the shots that James was throwing are consistently heavier, and James is just having an easy time with him.
00:58:42.000 It's not like anything that Danny's doing is making an impression.
00:58:47.000 So how did they end it?
00:58:48.000 It was just over.
00:58:50.000 Danny had enough.
00:58:52.000 You know what I mean?
00:58:54.000 And this became Gym Wars.
00:58:57.000 What I did with this footage, ultimately, was I took it and went to an editor named Brian Hardy, who was the editor for Max Boxing at the time, and he got Doug Fisher, who's now the editor-in-chief of Ring Magazine, and I to commentate that footage as though you're watching it on HBO. Oh,
00:59:16.000 wow.
00:59:17.000 Right?
00:59:17.000 So, Doug's doing the color.
00:59:20.000 I'm calling the fight.
00:59:21.000 I'm the Lampley, and he's the Kellerman.
00:59:24.000 And we showed the whole thing.
00:59:26.000 I talked about the context of what had happened, like I told you.
00:59:30.000 And we're calling the fight.
00:59:31.000 And this show, Gym Wars...
00:59:33.000 It blew up.
00:59:34.000 It was like the first big boxing thing on the internet at all.
00:59:39.000 And so I would go around to different gyms and get fighters, and they all started at wildcard, and then I would branch out and get fighters to agree, let me shoot the sessions and turn it into a show called Gym Wars.
00:59:51.000 And so the way...
00:59:54.000 These guys now get their phones and their cameras and they go interview fighters and all this shit.
00:59:59.000 I started that.
01:00:00.000 That wasn't a thing before I started doing it.
01:00:04.000 I'm the one who created this medium by which you now receive boxing news.
01:00:10.000 Wow.
01:00:12.000 So...
01:00:14.000 My entire career and trajectory in life was changed at a boxing gym and never to look back.
01:00:22.000 Were you a fighter at one point, Dom?
01:00:24.000 Never.
01:00:25.000 Never.
01:00:25.000 You just used to train?
01:00:26.000 Always trained.
01:00:27.000 Since fifth grade, always trained.
01:00:29.000 And taken it incredibly seriously.
01:00:30.000 I've heard you talk about this, too.
01:00:32.000 And it couldn't be more true.
01:00:34.000 This was a way for me to release all of those...
01:00:39.000 Young man angst, all that frustration.
01:00:41.000 It's really my therapy.
01:00:43.000 I could barely afford gym dudes.
01:00:44.000 You know I can't afford therapy.
01:00:45.000 Right.
01:00:47.000 Boxing was that.
01:00:48.000 It was like an integral part of my life.
01:00:50.000 I spent hours in the gym to where I had to figure out a way to make some money there so I could continue to eat and pay for it.
01:00:56.000 And that was my way of doing it.
01:00:58.000 Oh.
01:00:58.000 And so interviewing fighters is now my claim to fame because everybody thinks they're reinventing the wheel now.
01:01:05.000 You can't shoot anybody sparring or anything like that.
01:01:07.000 So that show had to go away.
01:01:09.000 But the way that I relate to and understand fighters and what it is that's inside them, that they're experiencing, that's driving them, I think is unique.
01:01:19.000 Because although I would never, ever classify myself as a fighter, that's such a...
01:01:26.000 A unique and cherished banner that you can really hold if that's really what you do.
01:01:31.000 I'm a warrior too.
01:01:33.000 You know what I mean?
01:01:33.000 In my own way, I forged a career.
01:01:37.000 I created something that didn't exist and I had to fight every step along the way to make it a thing.
01:01:43.000 So is this something while you were doing it, you were realizing like, I'm making a career out of talking about boxing.
01:01:50.000 Were you doing that or were you thinking, well, I'm doing this for now and I'm going to do something else?
01:01:55.000 I kept doing what was working.
01:01:58.000 You know what I mean?
01:01:59.000 And at times I thought about doing something else, but never did I spend as much time thinking about or applying myself to anything else.
01:02:10.000 So yeah, other things would come up, but it all would come back to this.
01:02:16.000 I would always go back to the gym.
01:02:17.000 Because Dave is a crazy boxing fan, too.
01:02:19.000 And I remember Dave talked to me at one point in time about the three of us doing something.
01:02:23.000 This is a while back, right?
01:02:25.000 Strap season.
01:02:26.000 Dave and I have a show called Strap Season.
01:02:32.000 And the best way I could describe it is it's like the Anthony Bourdain of boxing, if you will.
01:02:39.000 As I've said, I go all over the world covering fights.
01:02:42.000 Mm-hmm.
01:02:42.000 Every community of combat sports has its own culture.
01:02:46.000 Every fighter's got its own story.
01:02:48.000 Every fight's got its own narrative.
01:02:50.000 That's connected to another fight.
01:02:52.000 That's connected to another fight.
01:02:53.000 That's got a historical point of view.
01:02:56.000 And that's how I see the world of combat sports.
01:02:59.000 That's how I see boxing.
01:03:00.000 It's through that lens that this show exists.
01:03:03.000 And you're right.
01:03:04.000 Dave's a phenomenal boxing fan. 1.00
01:03:06.000 He knows his shit. 1.00
01:03:07.000 He goes to the fights. 1.00
01:03:08.000 He takes his whole crew to the fights.
01:03:11.000 Buys everybody ringside tickets.
01:03:12.000 We talked for hours on the phone about any and every fight that's upcoming.
01:03:17.000 And we met in Macau at Pacquiao Rios.
01:03:25.000 Wow.
01:03:25.000 Brandon Rios.
01:03:26.000 Yeah.
01:03:27.000 That was in Macau.
01:03:28.000 Yeah, that was in Macau.
01:03:29.000 It was Rios and then Algeria. 0.88
01:03:32.000 He fought Algeria as well.
01:03:33.000 That was a mismatch.
01:03:35.000 Yeah.
01:03:35.000 Brandon Rios, he was a good fighter.
01:03:38.000 A tough guy.
01:03:39.000 But man, that's a fight where you really saw how great Pacquiao was.
01:03:42.000 Seven knockdowns.
01:03:43.000 And that's when they let him out of the cage. 1.00
01:03:45.000 Remember that shit? 1.00
01:03:46.000 He just lit him up. 1.00
01:03:47.000 He just lit him up.
01:03:48.000 That was crazy.
01:03:50.000 You know, Pacquiao's been doing it.
01:03:51.000 He just did it recently to Keith Thurman.
01:03:54.000 You keep wanting to run this guy off.
01:03:55.000 40 years old.
01:03:56.000 That's gotta be it.
01:03:56.000 You can't do that again.
01:03:57.000 When he did that step in right hook over the shoulder and drop Thurman, I was like, holy shit. 0.99
01:04:02.000 Bro. 0.99
01:04:03.000 And mind you, that guy...
01:04:06.000 Is why Wild Card Boxing Gym, including Freddie Roach, is the most famous gym, I would say, in the world.
01:04:15.000 I would say more famous in this day than even Gleason's.
01:04:19.000 I think you're right.
01:04:20.000 But the first time I interviewed Manny Pacquiao was at the Vagabond Hotel, which is now torn down because it was condemned, next door to the gym.
01:04:29.000 On an air conditioner, one of those protruding air conditioners from the wall, with seven other guys in his hotel room, all living in the hotel room.
01:04:39.000 It's me and Manny Pacquiao on an air conditioner doing a one-on-one.
01:04:43.000 Doesn't he have that thing where if he has a house out here, he'll have 20 dudes living with him?
01:04:49.000 Yeah.
01:04:49.000 Yeah, this is the most generous guy I've ever known in my life.
01:04:54.000 Manny Pacquiao does things that just defy reason.
01:04:58.000 As nice as it is, you want to shake him.
01:05:00.000 Like, yo!
01:05:01.000 Not a hundred people on the private plane!
01:05:05.000 Buy them normal tickets!
01:05:06.000 He has to keep fighting, probably, just to keep up that payroll.
01:05:10.000 Yeah, I guess he's got to keep fighting.
01:05:12.000 He's got to be a senator.
01:05:13.000 He's got to endorse pistachio nuts.
01:05:16.000 He's got to do everything.
01:05:17.000 Because it's like water.
01:05:19.000 He wants to feed the people.
01:05:21.000 He wants to be that guy.
01:05:22.000 And it's genuine.
01:05:23.000 And he really is an outlet.
01:05:24.000 The money will flow through him if he keeps going.
01:05:27.000 That's right.
01:05:28.000 That's right.
01:05:29.000 So you just got to imagine me meeting, of all people, Dave Chappelle, of all places, in China, in Macau, because he's there for a fight.
01:05:38.000 So Dave flew in for the fight?
01:05:40.000 Flew in.
01:05:41.000 Flew his family in.
01:05:43.000 The Chappelle's were there for the fight.
01:05:47.000 And now that I know him well, that's not unusual at all.
01:05:51.000 He does that.
01:05:52.000 He loves boxing to that degree.
01:05:54.000 So we spent, like I said, hours just talking about boxing on the phone.
01:05:58.000 And when we get together, we have these dinners on fight night.
01:06:01.000 And we're like, you know what?
01:06:02.000 This is something that could be something.
01:06:05.000 And we ended up shooting for like two years of following me around.
01:06:10.000 The dinners we had.
01:06:13.000 Countless people had these dinners.
01:06:15.000 Michael Buffer.
01:06:16.000 We wanted you.
01:06:18.000 We still want you.
01:06:20.000 Like these things that you know and I know about combat sports.
01:06:25.000 About this community of fighters.
01:06:28.000 Is something I don't think anybody else could do.
01:06:30.000 You have to be a part of that conversation because you're really the only one who can talk about it from the perspective that you do.
01:06:37.000 I know a lot of people that comment on MMA, as I'm sure you do.
01:06:44.000 I know a lot of people that comment on boxing.
01:06:46.000 I know people who dedicate themselves to the community, to the sport, to the spirit of it, like you do.
01:06:52.000 Like I do.
01:06:54.000 And that's what makes it unique. 0.99
01:06:55.000 There's a lens through which you can see this shit that really a very, very few people can show you. 0.99
01:07:03.000 You're that guy. 1.00
01:07:04.000 Well, those people, particularly the MMA people, they demand it.
01:07:08.000 You can't be a casual observer of MMA. You can't.
01:07:12.000 They won't allow it.
01:07:32.000 I don't know.
01:07:35.000 Like, people that cover other sports, like, no, no, no, you don't know this sport. 1.00
01:07:39.000 But if you do jump in, god damn, you gotta know what the fuck you're talking about. 0.99
01:07:44.000 Yeah. 1.00
01:07:44.000 You gotta really know what the fuck you're talking about. 1.00
01:07:46.000 And Steven's thing is being entertaining and being dismissive of people and, you know, kind of in an arrogant way and, you know, insulting. 0.99
01:07:55.000 You know, that's his thing.
01:07:56.000 I mean, he creates controversy.
01:07:58.000 That controversy creates a lot of people watching and paying attention.
01:08:02.000 Yeah. 1.00
01:08:02.000 That shit does not fly in MMA. These guys are literally fighting for their life. 1.00
01:08:06.000 I mean, they literally are moments from death several times in certain fights.
01:08:12.000 There's moments where guys are out cold and you see a guy dropping an elbow on their face and smashing their orbital bone before the referee can get to them.
01:08:20.000 You can't make fun of those guys in that way. 0.99
01:08:22.000 You can't talk shit about them. 0.99
01:08:24.000 They're not going to allow it. 0.99
01:08:25.000 That's correct.
01:08:26.000 Nor should they.
01:08:26.000 There's five fighters that we know about that have succumbed to injuries in the ring and died just last year.
01:08:34.000 And you can't bring your shtick to this shit. 0.99
01:08:38.000 And I don't think it's... 1.00
01:08:40.000 Save that for sports with balls.
01:08:42.000 Yeah, exactly.
01:08:43.000 Save that for countdown shows.
01:08:44.000 Well, sports where people hit each other are different, man.
01:08:47.000 They're just different.
01:08:49.000 It's a different thing.
01:08:51.000 The reason why Deontay was so amped up and wild before that fight, you're not going to see a basketball player like that four days before the NBA Finals.
01:09:00.000 They'll be tuned up and ready to go, but they're not ready to go to war. 0.98
01:09:04.000 They're literally putting their fucking health on the line. 0.99
01:09:07.000 It's a different thing. 0.99
01:09:09.000 Of course, we respect all sports, but this kind of...
01:09:15.000 The risk that you're taking and the individuality of it.
01:09:19.000 Even though you got a guy in the ring, got a cut man, you got somebody working your corner, it really is just you out there when that bell rings.
01:09:27.000 And you're not just fighting the guy you're looking at.
01:09:30.000 You're fighting the guy inside you that wants to quit.
01:09:33.000 You're fighting the guy inside you that thinks that last punch really hurt.
01:09:36.000 You're fighting the guy inside you that's like, you know, I probably made enough money. 1.00
01:09:39.000 I don't probably need to do this shit anymore. 1.00
01:09:40.000 Like, Your own demons. 0.99
01:09:43.000 Everything that goes into not just being a successful fighter, but being a respected fighter, a fighter at all.
01:09:51.000 Everyone's seen that clip of the guy climb through the ropes, the bell rang, he climbed out of the ropes and walked back into the locker room.
01:09:57.000 There's a little bit of that in everybody and you're fighting him too.
01:10:01.000 You know what I'm saying?
01:10:03.000 What was that about?
01:10:03.000 Wasn't there like some contract dispute or something though?
01:10:06.000 They felt like they were fucking him over? 0.55
01:10:09.000 From what I understand, he went back there and asked for his money. 0.97
01:10:13.000 Oh, so he thought that because he got in the ring, he could get paid?
01:10:16.000 And he got out, he could still get his money.
01:10:18.000 What?
01:10:19.000 That's what I heard.
01:10:20.000 Oh my god, that's hilarious.
01:10:22.000 But that guy could never fight again.
01:10:24.000 No.
01:10:25.000 You know what I mean?
01:10:26.000 Right.
01:10:26.000 Nobody would ever trust him again.
01:10:28.000 Go through a full camp preparing for that guy?
01:10:30.000 No.
01:10:31.000 I mean, imagine being his opponent, seeing him walk out.
01:10:33.000 You're like, what?
01:10:34.000 Right.
01:10:35.000 What's happening here?
01:10:36.000 And you don't even get paid now. 0.99
01:10:38.000 You can't criticize somebody as though they are just doing what you're doing because, oh, I'm talking, I got a job, I'm an important guy, I'm at this level of shit, so... 0.99
01:10:53.000 No. 0.99
01:10:53.000 Yeah. 0.99
01:10:55.000 We're doing the same thing, essentially.
01:10:57.000 Yeah, we're both on TV. It's not that, man.
01:11:02.000 It's not.
01:11:04.000 So the kind of love that you have for combat sports, the kind of love that you have for what it is that you comment on, it comes through because you do it.
01:11:11.000 But I've been doing it almost half my life now, in terms of commenting on it. 0.95
01:11:15.000 I've been doing martial arts since I was a fucking baby, basically. 0.98
01:11:19.000 And that's it. 0.96
01:11:19.000 But when you see combat sports today, and you see the landscape of boxing, I feel personally that this is an amazing time. 0.96
01:11:29.000 I mean, I feel like the heavyweight division has never been more exciting and more turbulent, because there's so many great fighters now.
01:11:35.000 To have Andrew Ruiz jump out of nowhere and knock out Anthony Joshua, I think was a godsend for the sport. 0.94
01:11:42.000 Because all of a sudden you see, like, look at this chubby Mexican just fucked up, this dude who looks like a god. 1.00
01:11:47.000 Like, this is crazy. 0.98
01:11:48.000 Like, and this is, for the Mexican community, it's huge, having their first Mexican heavyweight champion, but it's also like, wow, this is a crazy division. 0.95
01:11:56.000 Look, you got Deontay just knocks the fuck out of Luis Ortiz with that one punch to the forehead. 0.99
01:12:03.000 You're like, what the fuck? 0.99
01:12:05.000 You got the rematch with Tyson Fury's coming up in two weeks. 0.99
01:12:09.000 Right.
01:12:09.000 Not even, right?
01:12:10.000 Less than two weeks.
01:12:11.000 Yeah, 22nd.
01:12:12.000 Oh my goodness.
01:12:13.000 Now, what you're talking about earlier is exemplified in what happened after the Ruiz fight, where you see, like you say, a chubby guy, that's fair, the guy's chubby! 0.99
01:12:25.000 But, he's a fucking fighter! 0.99
01:12:28.000 Oh my god. 1.00
01:12:28.000 He's a heavyweight for real! 1.00
01:12:30.000 His hand speed's tremendous. 0.99
01:12:32.000 And if you think just because he's chubby, you can take a knock at the guy, especially after he won the title, as though he won the lottery or he won a scratch-off, and this shit just happens, it doesn't. 0.94
01:12:44.000 It reminded people of what the heavyweight division is. 0.94
01:12:47.000 One punch can change the fight.
01:12:48.000 It's a real thing.
01:12:50.000 It is a real thing. 0.98
01:12:51.000 He fucked up, though, in that rematch. 0.99
01:12:52.000 That rematch was a disaster. 1.00
01:12:54.000 He was so clearly unprepared.
01:12:56.000 When he weighed 280, I was like, oh my god.
01:12:59.000 And what was the rumors like?
01:13:00.000 And I fell into them too.
01:13:01.000 Everybody was talking about how he was getting thinner.
01:13:03.000 No, it was one Instagram picture.
01:13:04.000 He did what chubby girls do. 1.00
01:13:06.000 He held that camera up.
01:13:07.000 He did one of these things.
01:13:09.000 He got a good angle.
01:13:10.000 He catfished us.
01:13:10.000 He catfished us.
01:13:12.000 Well, you know, he lost, he wasn't training with his trainer and he was partying a lot.
01:13:17.000 You know, I knew he was partying a lot.
01:13:20.000 I heard from people that knew him.
01:13:21.000 They're like, man, I don't know.
01:13:23.000 I heard whispers of that and didn't believe it. 0.99
01:13:25.000 I was like, no fucking way. 0.98
01:13:25.000 I believed it. 0.98
01:13:26.000 I believed it.
01:13:27.000 You know why I believed it?
01:13:28.000 Because it's so hard not to. 1.00
01:13:31.000 All of a sudden, you're the fucking man out of nowhere. 1.00
01:13:35.000 Yeah. 1.00
01:13:35.000 And maybe he was convinced that he could do it again. 1.00
01:13:38.000 You know, he's hitting the pads, it looked pretty good.
01:13:40.000 Hitting the bag, it looked pretty good. 1.00
01:13:41.000 He's like, I'll fuck that guy up again. 0.99
01:13:43.000 But Anthony Joshua had a totally different game plan this time. 0.98
01:13:45.000 And to see Anthony Joshua stick and move like that was interesting.
01:13:49.000 I was like, wow.
01:13:50.000 That's interesting.
01:13:51.000 It's a cliche, but again, losing might have been the best thing that ever happened to him.
01:13:54.000 I don't know about that.
01:13:56.000 I don't know about that.
01:13:57.000 I think it's great that he got his title back, but I felt like one thing that happened in that fight that disturbed me was even though Ruiz came in out of shape and clearly didn't look like he was prepared correctly,
01:14:14.000 Joshua did never really enforce his will on him. 0.95
01:14:19.000 He never really had a moment where he was beating the fuck out of him.
01:14:22.000 Where he was like, you know, I trained hard for this fight. 0.97
01:14:25.000 I'm gonna dominate you now. 1.00
01:14:27.000 Now I'm gonna take you out the way you took me out. 0.96
01:14:29.000 There was none of that.
01:14:30.000 It was boxing.
01:14:31.000 Just stick and move.
01:14:33.000 Make sure you get the decision.
01:14:34.000 Make sure you get the decision.
01:14:35.000 That is in stark contrast to the way Deontay finishes fights.
01:14:40.000 Which is why that matchup is so intriguing, which is why no matter what happens between the two of them, hopefully they remain undefeated for their own sakes and can make that unification fight.
01:14:52.000 I saw his commitment to discipline, Joshua I'm talking about, as a good thing.
01:14:58.000 Oh, it's definitely a good thing because he won the title back.
01:15:00.000 But when you make the argument who's the best heavyweight in the world, if you have to look at it on paper, I don't think it's him right now.
01:15:08.000 I think it's Tyson Fury or Deontay Wilder, depending on what happens on the 22nd.
01:15:13.000 I lean towards Deontay because he can close the show at any moment. 0.99
01:15:17.000 That 12th round, I was in bed and I was watching the fight and I went, Oh, shit! 0.99
01:15:23.000 I popped up. 1.00
01:15:24.000 Oh, shit! 1.00
01:15:25.000 He knocked him out! 1.00
01:15:26.000 He knocked...
01:15:27.000 And then...
01:15:27.000 Whoop!
01:15:28.000 Tyson Fury rises. 1.00
01:15:30.000 I'm like, what the fuck? 0.99
01:15:31.000 He rises. 1.00
01:15:32.000 He gets through the barrage.
01:15:35.000 And then he wins the remainder of the round.
01:15:37.000 I'm like, this is insane!
01:15:39.000 And he even rocked Deontay at one point in time.
01:15:41.000 I'm like...
01:15:41.000 This is an insane fight.
01:15:43.000 And then it was a draw.
01:15:44.000 And I don't think on paper it's really a draw. 0.98
01:15:47.000 I think that's horseshit.
01:15:48.000 I think on paper Tyson Fury won more rounds. 0.98
01:15:50.000 But I'm not upset with the draw.
01:15:52.000 Because the way Deontay knocked him down and then knocked him down...
01:15:56.000 The way he knocked him down in the 12th round should almost count for three points.
01:16:00.000 It was so crazy.
01:16:02.000 Just about any...
01:16:03.000 This is not a criticism of Jack Reese.
01:16:07.000 The guy did get up.
01:16:08.000 So you can't say he...
01:16:10.000 Did something wrong, but most referees of that would have just waved it off.
01:16:14.000 Most referees.
01:16:14.000 Like, there's no way.
01:16:15.000 His arms were flat.
01:16:17.000 He was laying on his back.
01:16:18.000 It looked like he was in another dimension.
01:16:20.000 Can you think of any other fight in the countless fights that you've covered where the main highlight of the fight is just the guy getting up?
01:16:28.000 Crazy. 0.94
01:16:29.000 Crazy. 0.96
01:16:30.000 Well that punch too. 0.91
01:16:32.000 The right hand and the left hook behind it and then him walking off like this.
01:16:36.000 He thought he had him.
01:16:37.000 He thought it was over.
01:16:39.000 Crazy.
01:16:40.000 Tyson Fury is something special, man, but so is Deontay.
01:16:43.000 And so is Joshua.
01:16:44.000 I think all three of those guys, they're so uniquely different that I can't say...
01:16:49.000 I mean, the argument about who's best can rage for days.
01:16:52.000 But I don't know that for sure this guy beats that guy or that guy beats the other guy.
01:16:57.000 Or if this guy beats that guy, then that guy...
01:16:59.000 You don't.
01:17:00.000 You won't know until they face each other.
01:17:02.000 And what I'm saying is even if Deontay were to lose to Tyson Fury, I still want to see...
01:17:09.000 Joshua Wilder more than...
01:17:10.000 Oh, 100%.
01:17:11.000 100%.
01:17:12.000 That is the fight I want to see.
01:17:13.000 That is the fight I want to see.
01:17:14.000 Well, the rematch is the first fight I want to see.
01:17:17.000 The next fight I want to see, regardless of the outcome, is I want to see...
01:17:21.000 Well, unless Tyson Fury KO's Wilder.
01:17:24.000 If Tyson Fury KO's Wilder and he's like, Anthony Joshua, Anthony Joshua, you dosa... 0.99
01:17:29.000 If he gets on the mic and starts talking that kind of shit, then I want to see that fight. 0.96
01:17:33.000 But my dream matchup right now is the rematch. 0.99
01:17:36.000 That's the dream matchup.
01:17:37.000 The dream matchup is the 22nd.
01:17:39.000 I am so fucking pumped for that rematch. 0.99
01:17:42.000 I'm not doing jack shit. 0.99
01:17:44.000 I'm taking the night off. 1.00
01:17:45.000 I'm sitting right in front of the fucking TV. Sweaty palms. 1.00
01:17:49.000 Now see, for you to say that about a boxing match...
01:17:53.000 That's a huge thing!
01:17:54.000 I love boxing, though.
01:17:55.000 I do.
01:17:55.000 I mean, I call combat sports.
01:17:57.000 You know, I call MMA, but I do love boxing.
01:18:00.000 You know, I love the Canelo-Kovalev fight.
01:18:03.000 I thought that was fascinating. 0.99
01:18:04.000 To watch Canelo KO-Kovalev fight that, I was like, God damn! 0.99
01:18:09.000 What did he have? 0.99
01:18:09.000 Six minutes? 0.99
01:18:10.000 I thought Kovalev was winning that fight.
01:18:12.000 He was winning the fight.
01:18:13.000 If he could have stayed on his feet for six more minutes, he beats Canelo!
01:18:17.000 Canelo looked like he had a plan to do that.
01:18:20.000 It looks like he planned for Kovalev to fade.
01:18:24.000 Because Kovalev...
01:18:27.000 We're good to go.
01:18:42.000 You know, sometimes fighters, they hit this point in their career where they don't have the same level of commitment that they did when they first started fighting. 0.86
01:18:50.000 And when Kovalev, in the early days, man, when he was the crusher, you know, he was fucking everybody up, man.
01:18:55.000 He was a terrifying force. 0.92
01:18:56.000 Fantastic amateur record.
01:18:58.000 You know, amazing technical boxing skills.
01:19:01.000 Vicious right hand.
01:19:02.000 I mean, he was something special.
01:19:03.000 But...
01:19:04.000 But to your point, it's those kind of experiences.
01:19:07.000 Getting stopped by Ward, I think, was more of a mental thing for him.
01:19:14.000 I think that it's a hurdle that he couldn't get over mentally and the physical followed suit.
01:19:20.000 Which is why I say it would have been easy for Joshua...
01:19:24.000 To get bogged down in the disappointment of that moment.
01:19:28.000 Right.
01:19:28.000 And not ever really recover from the lack of invincibility that he found himself in on a fight like everybody thought he was going to win going away.
01:19:37.000 Now you're deep in boxing circles.
01:19:39.000 Had you heard the rumor that Joshua had been knocked out in training?
01:19:42.000 I've heard all the rumors, yeah.
01:19:43.000 But that was apparently from enough people that I was taking it seriously.
01:19:47.000 The two weeks before the fight he had got KO'd really bad in training.
01:19:51.000 Yeah, I heard it.
01:19:52.000 I just don't know.
01:19:53.000 Do you know who supposedly KO'd him?
01:19:54.000 I have no idea.
01:19:55.000 Nor do I know that it's true at all.
01:19:57.000 I don't know if it's true either.
01:19:59.000 Even though that kind of thing is salacious, and I would love to know for sure, I feel like if you turn up on the night, and you get to that first bell ringing, we're in a fight.
01:20:09.000 Everybody's struggling with something.
01:20:11.000 You know, my hand hurts, I pulled a hamstring I'm not telling you about.
01:20:14.000 The other thing they said, and this is even more widely reported, is that Joshua had a bit of a panic attack in the dressing room before the fight.
01:20:22.000 That I find harder to believe.
01:20:23.000 The sparring thing, I think, could happen to anybody, and then it's a question like, do we go on? 0.96
01:20:27.000 But here's the thing, if he was suffering from the residual effects of being KO'd, and then he's like, I really shouldn't be fighting right now, fuck, I can't believe I have to fight right now, and then he's starting to freak out. 0.89
01:20:37.000 Because I know that's happened in MMA. In MMA, that's definitely happened, where guys have been KO'd badly in the training before the fight, and then they get to the fight and they really shouldn't be fighting, and they know it.
01:20:46.000 And they kind of freak out.
01:20:49.000 What do you do, though?
01:20:51.000 Who do you blame?
01:20:53.000 Let's say that all that's true.
01:20:54.000 This is just hypothetical.
01:20:56.000 Let's say that these are true stories.
01:20:58.000 Then it comes down to the date set.
01:21:00.000 You have an opponent that should be easy to beat.
01:21:03.000 Everybody thinks this guy is an easy replacement.
01:21:07.000 Don't forget, this was his American debut.
01:21:10.000 This wasn't just some fight.
01:21:11.000 You know what I mean?
01:21:12.000 Another one at the O2. This is the Garden.
01:21:14.000 His first fight in America.
01:21:16.000 That Wilder fight's still looming.
01:21:19.000 Josh was supposed to take over the world in June.
01:21:23.000 Big Baby Muller tested positive when?
01:21:26.000 Well, what do we have?
01:21:29.000 I think we were like...
01:21:30.000 Three weeks?
01:21:31.000 Three weeks out.
01:21:32.000 Three weeks out.
01:21:33.000 And then it was like officially, okay, like two weeks is what Ruiz had.
01:21:39.000 So he tests positive for steroids, and then Ruiz comes in somewhere two and a half, three weeks in.
01:21:45.000 Yeah.
01:21:46.000 Yeah.
01:21:46.000 Yeah, man.
01:21:49.000 It's just like...
01:21:50.000 Crazy can of worms.
01:21:51.000 What do you do?
01:21:52.000 What do you do?
01:21:53.000 Do you strap the fight?
01:21:54.000 Do you cancel that date?
01:21:55.000 Right.
01:21:55.000 But here's the thing.
01:21:56.000 I mean, I bet he wished he canceled it after it was over.
01:22:00.000 I bet he wished he canceled it.
01:22:01.000 Sure.
01:22:02.000 If that was the case.
01:22:03.000 But we don't even know if that was the case. 0.99
01:22:04.000 So we're just talking shit. 1.00
01:22:08.000 Yeah. 0.99
01:22:09.000 To that point, what does that experience with Joshua do for him against Wilder?
01:22:17.000 The biggest knockout puncher in heavyweight boxing, to be sure.
01:22:20.000 If not history, certainly.
01:22:23.000 40 wins by knockout.
01:22:25.000 One decision, one draw. 1.00
01:22:28.000 What the fuck? 1.00
01:22:30.000 Who the hell does that? 1.00
01:22:31.000 And even that decision...
01:22:33.000 Nobody ever.
01:22:33.000 He avenged.
01:22:34.000 The guy he got, he got a decision with, he ultimately knocked him out.
01:22:38.000 Yeah, it's Tavern.
01:22:39.000 Yeah, but that record is unchallenged.
01:22:43.000 There's no one like that. 0.99
01:22:44.000 I don't think in any fucking division. 0.99
01:22:46.000 Even you go back to the KO punches like Julian Jackson, right? 0.99
01:22:50.000 The old school one-punch destroyers.
01:22:52.000 He beat people by decision and...
01:22:57.000 Deontay knocks everybody out!
01:22:59.000 At heavyweight!
01:23:00.000 It's crazy!
01:23:01.000 And he knocks them out with, like, forehead punches.
01:23:03.000 That forehead punch to Ruiz just...
01:23:05.000 And he just walks away. 0.99
01:23:08.000 Ruiz is laying on the ropes like, what in the fuck just hit me? 0.99
01:23:11.000 He's flouting convention. 0.99
01:23:13.000 Like, you're not supposed to be able to do that! 1.00
01:23:16.000 Everybody talks so much shit about his skills. 0.99
01:23:20.000 Right! 1.00
01:23:20.000 That's what the science is built on! 1.00
01:23:23.000 Yeah, but it's nonsense.
01:23:24.000 Because the way he's built, first of all, 6'9", 209 pounds.
01:23:29.000 That's what he weighed when he fought Tyson Fury.
01:23:31.000 209. I mean, he's probably like 218 when he fought Ruiz.
01:23:35.000 Gained 9 pounds or so.
01:23:36.000 Not that much.
01:23:37.000 He's a very light heavyweight.
01:23:39.000 But also, because of that, doesn't get tired like those bigger guys.
01:23:44.000 He doesn't have as much body mass where his blood is flowing through.
01:23:47.000 But he also has... 1.00
01:23:49.000 Fucking ridiculous power. 1.00
01:23:51.000 And he keeps that power later than any of them. 1.00
01:23:53.000 And to your point, now I think he'll keep that power longer.
01:23:59.000 He does get tired when he chases the knockout.
01:24:01.000 He can get winded.
01:24:03.000 But he recovers.
01:24:04.000 But his patience.
01:24:07.000 He'll tell me.
01:24:08.000 Skills don't pay the bills.
01:24:09.000 I got my own style. 1.00
01:24:10.000 You gotta stop saying that shit. 0.99
01:24:12.000 But what we saw in the Ruiz for the Luis Ortiz fight Was that he started to use the discipline of patience. 0.99
01:24:21.000 He wasn't chasing the knockout anymore.
01:24:23.000 He was relying on it, which is a taboo, but he knew when that moment came, he'd be in position to fire, and he believed when he fired, he'd win.
01:24:32.000 He'd get it.
01:24:33.000 And the patience in not chasing the knockout, that's science too.
01:24:37.000 It is science.
01:24:38.000 That's technique too.
01:24:39.000 Two.
01:24:39.000 Because he knows that he has this preposterous power.
01:24:43.000 I mean, he knows.
01:24:45.000 And he's right. 0.99
01:24:46.000 He's been right 40 fucking times. 0.99
01:24:48.000 He's going to have to get right one more time. 0.99
01:24:49.000 Yeah, he's right.
01:24:50.000 He's right.
01:24:51.000 But the thing is, man, the Tyson Fury fight showed that some people can survive.
01:24:57.000 And that was what was so fascinating about that fight.
01:24:59.000 Because Tyson was the only guy that could survive.
01:25:01.000 And he survived it twice.
01:25:03.000 He got dropped earlier in the fight.
01:25:04.000 Was it like the fifth round or something like that?
01:25:06.000 I don't remember what round it was.
01:25:07.000 It was the ninth.
01:25:08.000 Was it the 9th he got dropped?
01:25:10.000 So he got dropped earlier in the fight and then the big one in the 12th.
01:25:13.000 And still survived.
01:25:14.000 I mean, just crazy.
01:25:16.000 I don't think Wilder thinks he survived.
01:25:18.000 I think Wilder thinks he got jobbed.
01:25:20.000 Well, we talked about it. 0.99
01:25:21.000 He said, look, if you look at the clock, it's like the fucking dude was down for 10 seconds. 1.00
01:25:25.000 The fucking guy was like, if you count to 10. And that has always drive me crazy about boxing. 0.99
01:25:31.000 Why don't they have a goddamn digital clock? 0.98
01:25:34.000 Why are they relying on this guy to go, one, two? 1.00
01:25:37.000 That shit is crazy because they're just counting? 1.00
01:25:41.000 They're just counting? 1.00
01:25:42.000 What are we, in the dark ages? 1.00
01:25:43.000 Throw a fucking digital clock up. 1.00
01:25:45.000 When the guy goes down at 10 seconds, the fight is over. 1.00
01:25:48.000 If that's the case, that fight is over.
01:25:50.000 Tyson Fury is down for like 12 seconds.
01:25:53.000 I don't know why so many things in sports aren't automated at this point. 0.99
01:25:56.000 I don't deal with this nostalgic human error bullshit. 0.93
01:25:59.000 I don't believe in any of it. 0.99
01:26:00.000 Including the judging.
01:26:03.000 What do we do about the judging?
01:26:08.000 What's the solution to that though?
01:26:11.000 I don't know, man. 0.97
01:26:12.000 Well, look, boxing has experienced some fucking significant levels of bribery and corruption. 0.84
01:26:19.000 And, you know, there's been people that have actually been forced out of boxing, right? 0.95
01:26:23.000 They don't judge fights anymore, like Manny Pacquiao.
01:26:26.000 Not enough.
01:26:26.000 Manny Pacquiao, Tim Bradley.
01:26:27.000 Remember that one?
01:26:28.000 Of course. 0.99
01:26:28.000 That one was like, what in the fuck did you people watch? 0.99
01:26:31.000 Like, what is this? 0.99
01:26:33.000 Right.
01:26:33.000 You know, Triple G Canelo, the first fighter.
01:26:35.000 Adelaide Byrne.
01:26:37.000 She's a nice lady. 1.00
01:26:39.000 Yeah.
01:26:39.000 She does MMA too.
01:26:41.000 And DC, Daniel Cormier, one of the fights he looked at, he goes, Oh no!
01:26:45.000 Adelaide Byrd's here!
01:26:48.000 And I'm like, she's a nice lady. 0.97
01:26:50.000 She's a wonderful lady.
01:26:51.000 But to be fair, most of the fights I watch are ringside, right?
01:26:55.000 And I'll be on my phone texting my friends, hey, you know, this fight, I got it this way.
01:27:01.000 People watching it at home will have it in an entirely different way.
01:27:05.000 I'll go home and see what they're talking about.
01:27:07.000 I don't think sitting ringside from one angle all night...
01:27:12.000 Gives you a perspective enough to judge the fight properly.
01:27:17.000 Agreed.
01:27:17.000 And then comparing it to the other guy...
01:27:19.000 Do boxing guys have monitors?
01:27:21.000 Because UFC people have monitors.
01:27:23.000 No, the judges don't.
01:27:24.000 They should.
01:27:25.000 They didn't have it for a long time.
01:27:27.000 We asked for it.
01:27:28.000 We eventually got it.
01:27:30.000 We complained forever.
01:27:31.000 In most commissions, the judges have ringside monitors.
01:27:35.000 But they should have more judges, too. 0.98
01:27:38.000 Three judges is ridiculous.
01:27:40.000 Why are we leaving on three people? 0.94
01:27:41.000 There's four sides of the ring, by the way.
01:27:44.000 Well, there's eight sides of the octagon. 0.99
01:27:45.000 And by the way, there's a fucking million people that would love to judge. 0.98
01:27:49.000 It doesn't make any sense. 0.98
01:27:50.000 It's not like we're short of people that understand it.
01:27:52.000 In MMA, we have an additional problem, is that we go to places like we were in Texas this past weekend, and we had terrible judging.
01:27:58.000 And those people weren't even, some of them weren't even MMA judges.
01:28:02.000 They had backgrounds in boxing, and they transitioned over to MMA. And some of them really didn't understand what was going on, and there was really, really bad decisions.
01:28:10.000 And that's the other thing. 0.99
01:28:12.000 The raging debate, boxing versus UFC and all this shit, it is the silliest debate I've ever heard as far as combat sports goes. 0.98
01:28:21.000 It's just not the same thing. 0.99
01:28:23.000 The idea that you can judge boxing and MMA and think that, well, everybody's hitting everybody.
01:28:29.000 I've got the same skill set here as I do in the other one.
01:28:33.000 Doesn't make any sense.
01:28:34.000 There's a lot of legit MMA judges now.
01:28:37.000 It's much less of a problem than it used to be.
01:28:39.000 But when we travel to places like Texas, where we were this past weekend, and you run into problems where they just don't get world title fights very often.
01:28:46.000 And then the main event was a very controversial decision, but close enough that it wasn't.
01:28:52.000 I don't think it was a robbery.
01:28:53.000 Close enough.
01:28:54.000 Close enough.
01:28:54.000 And you know, I think you give it to the champion.
01:28:56.000 He dominated the last two rounds clearly in my eyes and could have won the third.
01:29:01.000 You know, I watched it again today actually. 0.98
01:29:04.000 But some of the earlier fights were fucking preposterous. 0.97
01:29:07.000 Just watch it. 0.98
01:29:07.000 I don't even need judges ringside. 0.98
01:29:08.000 Just watch the shit on TV. Like, give me an extra two, three minutes if we have to wait for the decision to figure it out properly. 0.99
01:29:15.000 Right.
01:29:16.000 Let's wait. 1.00
01:29:16.000 Better than, like, two or three decades of arguing about the shit. 1.00
01:29:19.000 Well, I really think they need more people choosing. 0.98
01:29:22.000 I think there should be a large group of people.
01:29:25.000 You know, maybe even ten people.
01:29:27.000 Maybe even people at home and there in person.
01:29:29.000 And then you tally up the scorecards.
01:29:32.000 Like, people that are respected.
01:29:34.000 Right.
01:29:34.000 Like, respected world-class trainers, respected fighters, respected experts in martial arts that watch these fights or boxing matches, and then tally it up.
01:29:43.000 Then you would never have a...
01:29:44.000 Triple G vs. 0.54
01:29:45.000 Canelo first fight.
01:29:46.000 Because 90% of the people thought that Triple G won that first fight.
01:29:49.000 Which is interesting that Canelo won the second fight.
01:29:52.000 Because Canelo fought very differently in the second fight.
01:29:54.000 He was a better fighter.
01:29:55.000 He was a better fighter in the second fight.
01:29:57.000 Yeah, and I think the criticism he took in the first fight enraged him.
01:30:01.000 He played it cool.
01:30:03.000 I think that really pissed him off.
01:30:04.000 He's like, okay, well, let me show you what I can do.
01:30:06.000 He came back better.
01:30:07.000 He came back better. 0.95
01:30:09.000 The fact that he went all the way up to fucking light heavyweight and knocked out Sergei Kovalev is amazing.
01:30:15.000 What does he do now? 0.95
01:30:16.000 Does he stay at light heavyweight?
01:30:17.000 Does he go back to super middleweight?
01:30:18.000 I don't know that he makes middleweight again.
01:30:21.000 He probably could if he gave him enough time.
01:30:24.000 But then he might be drained.
01:30:26.000 But he's too small for light heavyweight.
01:30:29.000 It seems like it.
01:30:31.000 Yeah, I mean, obviously 68 might be there.
01:30:33.000 68 is probably the sweet spot for him.
01:30:35.000 But how?
01:30:36.000 I mean, he's not a kid anymore either.
01:30:37.000 It's not like he's 22, like fluctuating in weight like that.
01:30:40.000 But didn't he fight Floyd at 52?
01:30:42.000 Yeah.
01:30:43.000 That's nuts.
01:30:44.000 Yeah.
01:30:44.000 That's nuts.
01:30:45.000 Yeah.
01:30:46.000 75?
01:30:47.000 Now that's crazy.
01:30:48.000 That's so much weight. 1.00
01:30:49.000 That's so much fuck. 1.00
01:30:50.000 23 goddamn pounds? 1.00
01:30:52.000 That's crazy. 1.00
01:30:52.000 And then probably weighed a lot more than that before he cut weight to make the weights. 1.00
01:30:56.000 And given a guy 24 hours between the weigh-in, sometimes more than 24 hours, in fact, most times more than 24 hours.
01:31:04.000 They blow up.
01:31:05.000 What kind of testing are they doing? 1.00
01:31:10.000 That dude's gone through so many weight classes and he's just jacked as fuck. 1.00
01:31:15.000 Yeah. 1.00
01:31:16.000 He's suspicious as fuck. 0.99
01:31:19.000 I'm not a doctor. 1.00
01:31:21.000 You're not a doctor.
01:31:22.000 I'm not a doctor.
01:31:23.000 I'm not a doctor either.
01:31:24.000 At this point it probably seems like I am.
01:31:28.000 I'm suspicious, though.
01:31:30.000 There's so many things about Baltimore sports that could be easily corrected if the motivation was there to even the playing field.
01:31:38.000 Well, the USADA program in the UFC has evened the playing field considerably.
01:31:42.000 A lot of people fell off.
01:31:44.000 A lot of physiques changed.
01:31:45.000 A lot of people just lost all their muscle mass.
01:31:49.000 But only one entity has to make a decision in MMA, essentially.
01:31:52.000 For UFC, particularly.
01:31:54.000 Yeah, right.
01:31:56.000 The decision comes down and then everybody's got to do it.
01:31:58.000 Period.
01:31:59.000 Exactly.
01:31:59.000 Boxing does not enjoy that kind of dictatorship.
01:32:03.000 Right.
01:32:03.000 And there's also been instances in boxing where guys have said, no, I don't want Vata testing.
01:32:08.000 I don't want it.
01:32:09.000 They got to pay for it themselves.
01:32:11.000 Right.
01:32:11.000 Right.
01:32:11.000 Why should they?
01:32:12.000 Why should they?
01:32:13.000 And then imagine if you're the guy who this is his big fight.
01:32:16.000 This is his first time even making any money.
01:32:17.000 Right.
01:32:18.000 Now I gotta spend all this dough on Vata and whatnot?
01:32:21.000 No.
01:32:22.000 What is the status of Adonis Stevenson?
01:32:25.000 Did he recover?
01:32:26.000 Yeah, he's recovered.
01:32:27.000 Is he okay now?
01:32:28.000 I mean, he's not his former self, but he's certainly, I think, living a good life.
01:32:35.000 Because I know that was one of the more recent superstar guys.
01:32:42.000 That wound up having a significant brain injury.
01:32:45.000 Survived and didn't succumb to those injuries, but it's life-changing.
01:32:48.000 Like, this guy will never be the Adion Stevenson he was before the fight.
01:32:52.000 He's always going to now, for the rest of his life, deal with those injuries and have challenges.
01:32:59.000 Have you seen him?
01:33:00.000 Is there videos of him talking about it or anything?
01:33:03.000 Yeah, I mean, I haven't seen him talk about it in depth, but we've seen him, like his motor skills are coming back, he's smiling, he's able to speak.
01:33:12.000 So it's not like Gerald McClellan?
01:33:14.000 No.
01:33:16.000 The Gerald McClellan fight, it's interesting, it kind of in many ways changed Roy Jones Jr.'s thoughts on the sport.
01:33:23.000 You know, and that he never wanted to turn out like that.
01:33:26.000 But then Roy gets older and he's still fighting.
01:33:31.000 Fighting people like deep into his 40s.
01:33:34.000 And you're like, this is crazy.
01:33:36.000 Like, this is the same guy that after Gerald McClellan got hurt said he would never want to go out like that. 0.99
01:33:42.000 And he's fighting like young badasses in Russia and shit. 0.99
01:33:45.000 But you still think you can do it? 1.00
01:33:48.000 It's hard to stop doing it.
01:33:50.000 It's easy for me to say, hey man, that was your last fight.
01:33:53.000 Let's take it easy.
01:33:55.000 Look at Bernard, right?
01:33:56.000 He's the best example.
01:33:58.000 Fought into his 50s.
01:33:59.000 But he had a style that was crafty enough to have some longevity in it without taking that kind of damage.
01:34:06.000 Like, Roy will embarrass you.
01:34:09.000 But he's still there in front of you, which is what's the embarrassing part.
01:34:14.000 So if your motor skills slow down, if your reflexes slow down, you're going to get hit.
01:34:17.000 He ain't knocked out. 0.99
01:34:18.000 He ain't even fucked up. 0.92
01:34:19.000 But what he told me in an interview, and it might be one of those moments when I was talking to a guy and he said something that was like, I thought I should have known until I heard it. 0.98
01:34:29.000 And then I was like, oh, I can't believe I didn't realize that.
01:34:31.000 He said, it's not the fights that destroy you.
01:34:35.000 It's the gym that destroys you.
01:34:37.000 It's the sparring.
01:34:39.000 Oh, yeah.
01:34:40.000 Those are the rounds that destroy fighters.
01:34:43.000 Oh, yeah.
01:34:44.000 And it's like...
01:34:45.000 The hundreds and hundreds of rounds to thousands of rounds that you're fighting that nobody sees, that you're not getting paid for, you're taking that punishment, headgear or not, that's what you're seeing at the end of a fighter's career.
01:34:57.000 Do you remember, was it Danny Jacobs Jr.?
01:35:00.000 Who was it that someone...
01:35:03.000 No.
01:35:06.000 No, it wasn't him.
01:35:07.000 No, it wasn't Danny Jacobs.
01:35:08.000 It was someone else.
01:35:10.000 Someone that said that they stopped sparring.
01:35:13.000 Oh, yeah. 0.99
01:35:14.000 Who the fuck was that? 0.99
01:35:16.000 Well, he was fighting Kovalev, and that was Anthony Yard. 0.99
01:35:19.000 That's right.
01:35:20.000 That's right.
01:35:21.000 Not that he stopped sparring.
01:35:22.000 He said he never sparred.
01:35:23.000 Yeah, yeah.
01:35:24.000 And no one believes him.
01:35:25.000 And then anyone who does is like, well, he probably should have been sparring.
01:35:28.000 Yeah, he looked great in moments in that fight. 0.97
01:35:31.000 It was like the eighth round where he had Kovalev in deep shit. 0.96
01:35:34.000 That was a crazy thing. 0.93
01:35:36.000 His philosophy, if I remember correctly, Yard's philosophy was if you don't get hit at all in training, you will be so much fresher when you get to the ring.
01:35:45.000 So he was doing just ridiculous mitt work and bag work and drills, and he already knew how to box.
01:35:51.000 So his idea was that he will have some sort of an advantage.
01:35:54.000 And he was a really fairly green guy, right?
01:35:56.000 In terms of world-class competition.
01:35:58.000 Yeah, I mean, this was his first really big fight.
01:36:01.000 Yeah, but really physically talented and just built like a brick shithouse.
01:36:04.000 And still is all those things.
01:36:06.000 Yes.
01:36:06.000 But I think the rub is that you do have to spar.
01:36:11.000 Right.
01:36:11.000 You know, you have to feel shots.
01:36:14.000 That no trainer...
01:36:16.000 That I've ever had this discussion with, and right after the fight, plenty of people wanted to talk about it.
01:36:22.000 I didn't hear anybody be like, yeah, that made sense.
01:36:25.000 No, it's just part of it.
01:36:27.000 You find that a little bit in MMA now.
01:36:29.000 Donald Cerrone was doing that for a while.
01:36:30.000 He wasn't sparring at all.
01:36:31.000 He was just doing pad work and just doing wrestling drills and stuff like that, kickboxing drills.
01:36:36.000 Yeah, listen, if pad work and, like, a really good workout could make you world champion, I'd be, like, three-time world champion by now.
01:36:44.000 That's not it.
01:36:45.000 Sparring is a reality check.
01:36:46.000 Yeah, you need it.
01:36:47.000 You need it.
01:36:48.000 Otherwise, you're just, like, doing aerobics.
01:36:51.000 Yeah, you need to be tuned in to movement, to people, and also to danger, to be able to exist and to be able to fire under pressure.
01:36:58.000 You have to take shots.
01:37:00.000 You have to absorb those shots.
01:37:01.000 Keep your eyes open.
01:37:02.000 Like, all of these things.
01:37:04.000 You can't...
01:37:05.000 You can't download them.
01:37:07.000 You can't simulate them.
01:37:08.000 But you can only do that so many times.
01:37:10.000 That's the other thing.
01:37:11.000 There's only so many times you can survive it.
01:37:15.000 And gym wars are real.
01:37:16.000 They take a toll on people.
01:37:19.000 Yeah.
01:37:20.000 And I wish that we could shoot that show still.
01:37:23.000 People wouldn't let you?
01:37:25.000 No, everybody...
01:37:26.000 They hide things now?
01:37:27.000 Yeah, everybody thinks that they've got the secret.
01:37:30.000 Yeah.
01:37:31.000 There's a story that Klitschko knocked out Deontay in training.
01:37:36.000 Dylan Weil was talking about that recently.
01:37:39.000 And I don't make much of that because I think it's unfair.
01:37:42.000 I am one of these guys like, yeah, what happens in the gym stays in there.
01:37:45.000 If I'm in there with a camera and it's a setup thing, well then, okay, we know what's going on.
01:37:48.000 Right. 1.00
01:37:48.000 But the point of sparring is that you're working on shit. 1.00
01:37:51.000 You're trying things. 0.99
01:37:52.000 You know you have weaknesses and you're going to lean on trying to...
01:37:56.000 You're opening up your game.
01:37:58.000 You're opening it up and you're trusting the guy that you're sparring with to help you work on those things and catch you if you're slipping. 1.00
01:38:05.000 So then if the guy catches you when you're slipping, then a month later he's like, yeah, I caught that motherfucker slipping. 0.99
01:38:10.000 It's like, yo, that's what I was paying you to do, man. 0.99
01:38:13.000 What are you talking about?
01:38:14.000 I flew you in.
01:38:15.000 Yeah.
01:38:18.000 So, I try not to make much of that. 0.98
01:38:20.000 You know what's the craziest story in boxing of the year is Errol Spence Jr. surviving that fucking Ferrari crash. 0.98
01:38:26.000 That's the craziest story of the year. 0.97
01:38:28.000 When you see that car flip like that and the fact that he got out of that with like a chipped tooth.
01:38:32.000 I mean...
01:38:34.000 That's bonkers.
01:38:35.000 Thank God he didn't have a seatbelt on.
01:38:36.000 I never say that. 1.00
01:38:37.000 Thank God he didn't have a fucking seatbelt on. 0.99
01:38:39.000 Because if he did... 1.00
01:38:40.000 There's no way.
01:38:41.000 He would be dead.
01:38:42.000 Probably. 1.00
01:38:43.000 Or fucking severely injured. 1.00
01:38:45.000 You know? 1.00
01:38:45.000 Yeah. 1.00
01:38:46.000 Yeah.
01:38:47.000 And, you know, I was in Chicago and it was the Usyk fight that week when that happened.
01:38:55.000 And it was one of those things where it reminded me when I first heard the news of Paul Williams.
01:39:01.000 Yes.
01:39:03.000 And you realize, like, yo, yeah, these guys are warriors.
01:39:06.000 They put their life on the line. 0.99
01:39:07.000 Like, people die in the ring and all that shit. 0.98
01:39:09.000 But there's also real life, too. 0.99
01:39:12.000 Like, there's a whole other life with all its dangers and all the other ways that people can meet tragedy and hurdles you have to overcome.
01:39:20.000 And that's the point.
01:39:22.000 You almost want to...
01:39:24.000 Keep them sheltered in a box between fights so that nothing happens.
01:39:29.000 Nothing can taint what's going to happen in the ring.
01:39:32.000 But these guys are just like everybody else to that degree.
01:39:35.000 You know what I mean?
01:39:36.000 He's young.
01:39:37.000 He's rich.
01:39:38.000 He's in this town where he grew up.
01:39:41.000 And one night you make a bad decision, changes everything.
01:39:45.000 And so now, until we see him in the ring again...
01:39:49.000 We don't know how that affects him.
01:39:51.000 You just can't.
01:39:52.000 You can't know if we'll ever see the Errol Spence that we saw before.
01:39:56.000 Hopefully we do and better.
01:39:58.000 How badly was he injured?
01:39:59.000 From what I understood, and I follow this very closely, not badly at all.
01:40:04.000 You're not wrong.
01:40:05.000 From what I understand, he had issues like teeth being knocked out, lacerations on his face, no broken bones, no concussions.
01:40:14.000 I mean, I don't know if he had no concussion, but he had no serious brain injury.
01:40:19.000 He had no permanent injury whatsoever.
01:40:22.000 That's crazy.
01:40:23.000 But the mental side of it is that to each individual to handle, to be faced with death like that, at that age, whatever the moment was when you were flying through the air, not knowing if you're going to live.
01:40:38.000 Right.
01:40:39.000 You don't know how people adjust to that.
01:40:42.000 It's so bad because him and Crawford. 0.98
01:40:46.000 Goddamn what a fight that would be. 1.00
01:40:48.000 Goddamn. 0.99
01:40:49.000 That is the fight. 0.99
01:40:49.000 It's almost like I wish Lomachenko was taller. 0.99
01:40:52.000 I wish he was a bigger fighter.
01:40:54.000 Because Lomachenko versus Crawford was really the fight that I would want to see.
01:40:59.000 I believe Errol Spence Jr. is right there with them.
01:41:02.000 He's a phenomenal fighter.
01:41:04.000 Particularly what he did with Garcia.
01:41:06.000 But Lomachenko and Terence Crawford are two masters.
01:41:10.000 When I look at them in terms of what they do to their opponents, they're the two.
01:41:14.000 Lomachenko with that crazy movement and footwork, but Terence Crawford just figures people out.
01:41:20.000 He finds a way.
01:41:21.000 He switches stances.
01:41:23.000 He'll start out Southpaw or start out Orthodox, then he'll switch up on you and start boxing you up. 0.92
01:41:28.000 He puts all the data into that computer and then starts finding your weaknesses and then he gets nasty with you.
01:41:34.000 And I love the... 0.98
01:41:35.000 I mean, one of the things I like about him is how fucking mean he is. 0.87
01:41:38.000 And he's another guy who's like a sweetheart. 0.97
01:41:41.000 The nicest guy.
01:41:42.000 I've had him in here.
01:41:42.000 Incredible.
01:41:43.000 I've had him in here.
01:41:43.000 He was great.
01:41:44.000 He was a great podcast guest.
01:41:45.000 But once he starts putting it on dudes, man, there's like a meanness to him, you know?
01:41:49.000 It's like you see he relishes in it.
01:41:51.000 When the dudes go down, he gets a kick out of it.
01:41:54.000 Yeah, there's that killer instinct.
01:41:57.000 But these fights, there's no replacement for them.
01:42:00.000 You can see Terrence in a great fight.
01:42:02.000 You can see Lomachenko in a great fight.
01:42:04.000 Spence in a great fight.
01:42:05.000 But if they're not fighting each other, we just won't know.
01:42:09.000 Because once you get to an elite level, everybody's so good, you can't say you know how this is going to turn out.
01:42:16.000 Right, right.
01:42:17.000 Lomachenko's too small.
01:42:18.000 I mean, I don't think he's ever going to fight Terrence.
01:42:20.000 I mean, there was a time when the Mikey Garcia fight could have happened with Lomachenko at 35. I don't think he should ever fight at 40 or above.
01:42:27.000 I think he'd say the same.
01:42:28.000 But when you see what Mikey Garcia would happen to him when he went up against Errol Spence, you go, oh, Errol's just way bigger and stronger and better.
01:42:35.000 Yeah, I mean, it's a 147 pound division.
01:42:37.000 Yeah, and he's jacked.
01:42:38.000 Errol Spence is just jacked at 47, like ripped and shredded.
01:42:42.000 And at the weigh-in, when I looked at two of them, I was like, wow, that's a difference.
01:42:46.000 Right.
01:42:46.000 That's a difference there.
01:42:47.000 Again, by the time Fight Night's on...
01:42:50.000 He's fighting a middleweight!
01:42:51.000 Yeah, Earl's even bigger.
01:42:53.000 I think him, and hopefully he's okay.
01:42:56.000 Hopefully he's okay.
01:42:57.000 And he said he's getting back to the gym and getting back after it.
01:43:01.000 Him and Terrence is the fight.
01:43:03.000 That is the fight.
01:43:03.000 It's the fight, and it's gotta happen.
01:43:05.000 It's gotta happen.
01:43:06.000 And neither one of them fighting anybody else will tell us more about what's gonna happen when they fight each other.
01:43:13.000 Errol Spence is back in training, right?
01:43:15.000 He's training, isn't he?
01:43:16.000 Yeah, and has been for a while, at least.
01:43:18.000 That's what the reports say.
01:43:19.000 So are they trying to make something happen soon?
01:43:21.000 Is there an idea of a timeline?
01:43:24.000 I believe...
01:43:25.000 I think he's thinking May?
01:43:27.000 Really?
01:43:28.000 Again, this is the talk.
01:43:31.000 Yeah, I know.
01:43:33.000 I'm very excited.
01:43:34.000 And he's the kind of guy that's going to want to jump right back into the deep water.
01:43:38.000 I don't think he's a tune-up fight type of dude.
01:43:41.000 No.
01:43:41.000 Not after the Garcia fight.
01:43:43.000 I'd like to see that one live.
01:43:44.000 That's when I might go see that one live.
01:43:46.000 Yeah.
01:43:47.000 If it's a T-Mobile or something, or MGM, I might fly in to see that one.
01:43:51.000 That's a very, very, very interesting fight to me.
01:43:55.000 Oh! 0.60
01:43:56.000 Oh.
01:43:57.000 Okay, so this morning, I went and floated.
01:44:03.000 Ah, I have a tank here. 1.00
01:44:05.000 Shut the fuck up. 1.00
01:44:06.000 Yeah. 1.00
01:44:07.000 Okay, first of all, I only did it because you suggested it.
01:44:13.000 And I was like, okay, well, you're so adamant about how dope it is that I was like, let me see if this guy's onto something.
01:44:24.000 A phenomenal experience.
01:44:25.000 It's amazing, right?
01:44:27.000 It's amazing.
01:44:29.000 It's therapeutic.
01:44:31.000 I felt like I was meditating and then somehow having a muscle relaxing massage at the same time.
01:44:40.000 Yeah.
01:44:41.000 I couldn't tell at some point whether my eyes were open or closed.
01:44:43.000 I tried to keep my eyes open instead of closing and falling asleep.
01:44:46.000 But I couldn't tell between daydreaming and sleep dreaming.
01:44:50.000 Yeah.
01:44:51.000 It's such a crazy experience.
01:44:55.000 Yeah.
01:44:55.000 Just be like in the pitch back, just like floating.
01:44:58.000 Bro.
01:44:59.000 Yeah, I love it.
01:45:00.000 I mean, I should do this, like, because I'm a guy's guy.
01:45:03.000 Like, you know, even massages sometimes, I'm just like, I don't know.
01:45:06.000 Too manly for massages.
01:45:11.000 Especially because you're in such a macho business, right?
01:45:13.000 Yeah, exactly.
01:45:14.000 Exactly.
01:45:15.000 And this is perfect for guys like, you know, meditating seems a little too, like, you know.
01:45:21.000 It's great for your muscles, too, man.
01:45:23.000 All that Epsom salts.
01:45:24.000 It's really good.
01:45:25.000 It loosens everything up.
01:45:26.000 My bones got to crack in.
01:45:28.000 I felt like I had a massage when I got out.
01:45:31.000 Looses you up.
01:45:32.000 Yeah, so kudos to you for finding that.
01:45:35.000 That's awesome, man.
01:45:36.000 I'm glad.
01:45:37.000 I'm really excited.
01:45:38.000 I try to tell more people about it.
01:45:40.000 Did you go to the float lab?
01:45:41.000 Which place did you go to?
01:45:43.000 I went to Just Float.
01:45:45.000 Where's that at?
01:45:46.000 In Pasadena.
01:45:47.000 That's the biggest place in the world, apparently.
01:45:48.000 Is it?
01:45:49.000 Yes.
01:45:49.000 Because people were talking about how they get claustrophobic and it's like a constricted tube, but this place, It's like a spa.
01:45:56.000 It's a big room.
01:45:57.000 The tub's big.
01:45:59.000 You're not enclosed at all.
01:46:00.000 You've got your own room.
01:46:02.000 They use Float Lab stuff.
01:46:04.000 They use all the Float Lab stuff.
01:46:05.000 I'm pretty sure.
01:46:06.000 Don't they?
01:46:07.000 Pretty sure.
01:46:08.000 Float Lab, my friend Crash, who started and runs the Float Lab, he built my tank.
01:46:15.000 I met him, actually, when I had an old tank, a different tank.
01:46:19.000 There was a friend of mine who was a tank repair guy.
01:46:23.000 He was doing repair on my tank.
01:46:25.000 And I said, you know, these tanks are good, but there's a guy in Venice that makes the best tanks ever.
01:46:30.000 He's like a mad scientist.
01:46:31.000 He goes, you should talk to him.
01:46:33.000 Like, you know, you have some money.
01:46:34.000 Get a better tank.
01:46:35.000 I'm like, really?
01:46:36.000 He's like, yeah, get a better tank.
01:46:38.000 And I'm like, wow.
01:46:39.000 So I contacted this dude. 1.00
01:46:40.000 I went to see his shit. 0.99
01:46:41.000 And I was like, I mean, he makes them, they look like built in, they're like walk-in freezers. 1.00
01:46:46.000 Like, mine is seven feet tall.
01:46:47.000 It's nine feet long.
01:46:48.000 It's huge.
01:46:49.000 Ah.
01:46:50.000 They're giant. 1.00
01:46:51.000 I mean, it's got a big fucking heavy door and shit. 0.99
01:46:53.000 It's fully insulated. 0.99
01:46:54.000 Yeah, he's got like...
01:46:57.000 Commercial water filtration system filters.
01:47:02.000 So you use that for a town's water supply. 0.80
01:47:05.000 It's ridiculous.
01:47:06.000 You see the equipment back there. 1.00
01:47:07.000 It's fucking bonkers. 0.99
01:47:08.000 How often do you do it? 0.99
01:47:09.000 I have been slacking.
01:47:11.000 I haven't been in it lately.
01:47:12.000 I haven't been in it over a month. 0.78
01:47:14.000 But that's just because the last month I've been so fucking busy.
01:47:18.000 But I'm actually planning on getting in there tomorrow. 0.63
01:47:20.000 I'm excited.
01:47:22.000 See, alright, so you are a man of many hats, right?
01:47:25.000 Obviously, you do so many things, but is there an overriding passion?
01:47:31.000 Like, because I only have, like, the one thing.
01:47:32.000 Like, you asked me if I do other stuff, whatever.
01:47:34.000 Yeah, on the margins.
01:47:36.000 But this boxing, this world is my world.
01:47:40.000 Like, everything else is just, should I do in between?
01:47:43.000 Is one of the things you do, like...
01:47:50.000 I don't think I'd get rid of stand-up.
01:47:52.000 If I had to choose one thing, I would keep doing stand-up because it's probably the most challenging.
01:47:56.000 Podcasts are probably the easiest, but they're challenging too, depending upon the guest, especially if it's a really intricate subject.
01:48:04.000 You know, it's about physics or history or something where I have to do some reading and really try to keep up with it.
01:48:11.000 But podcasts are fun because I like talking to people.
01:48:14.000 To me, it's like the easiest job because I've always loved conversations.
01:48:20.000 I've always loved like, tell me how you do that.
01:48:22.000 What are you thinking when you're doing that?
01:48:23.000 Like what's going on?
01:48:24.000 Like I'm always trying to figure out my own mind.
01:48:26.000 What are my own motivations and how do I get better at things?
01:48:29.000 How do I get better at being a person?
01:48:31.000 And one of the best ways is to talk to people that are exceptional and try to figure out, how are you doing that?
01:48:37.000 What is your approach?
01:48:38.000 How do you prepare?
01:48:40.000 What's your thought process?
01:48:41.000 What are you eating?
01:48:42.000 How are you sleeping?
01:48:43.000 That kind of stuff.
01:48:44.000 So to me, I've always been curious.
01:48:46.000 So it almost becomes natural.
01:48:49.000 And then I've been doing it so long, even though it doesn't seem like it should be, conversation does become a skill.
01:48:56.000 It's something you get better at not being annoying.
01:48:59.000 You get better at not talking over people.
01:49:01.000 You get better at formulating sentences and being inquisitive.
01:49:06.000 The UFC is just a massive passion of mine from, you know, the time I've been a martial artist for as long as I can remember.
01:49:16.000 So for me, and like dedicated from the time I was 15 on, like dedicated, like my whole life.
01:49:22.000 I didn't do any partying in high school.
01:49:25.000 All I did was fight.
01:49:26.000 All I did was compete, travel all over the country, and compete in Taekwondo tournaments.
01:49:30.000 That was my whole life.
01:49:31.000 So My life has been deeply enriched by martial arts.
01:49:37.000 So then when the UFC came around and I realized, like, oh, this is the future.
01:49:42.000 This is what martial arts really should be.
01:49:44.000 This is the stuff that really works.
01:49:46.000 We didn't really know before that.
01:49:47.000 Before the UFC came along, there was all speculation.
01:49:49.000 What's better?
01:49:50.000 Is judo better?
01:49:51.000 Is boxing better?
01:49:52.000 Is wrestling better?
01:49:53.000 And then when you see them go after it, you're like, oh, it's a combination of things.
01:49:56.000 And everybody has their own unique way of implementing this combination of things.
01:50:00.000 And then you get to the highest levels of the game and you find some constant variables, but things change and the sport's ever evolving and shifting and the new guys now in 2020 are so much better than the guys in 2010 and way better than the guys in 2000 and way better than the guys in 1993 when the first...
01:50:21.000 UFC was held.
01:50:22.000 So for me, that is like a hobby, I would have to say, or just a thing that is a constant part of my life.
01:50:31.000 But that's one of the easiest jobs, because all I have to do is be interested in it, and I'm already interested in it.
01:50:37.000 So I'm already watching fights.
01:50:38.000 And then before the fights, I'll re-watch certain important championship fights.
01:50:42.000 And I'll re-watch fights where fighters had difficulty and stuff like that.
01:50:47.000 But I do that because I love it.
01:50:48.000 I might do that anyway, even if it wasn't my job.
01:50:51.000 So by the time I get to a John Jones-Dominic Reyes fight this past weekend, I've watched hours of footage of those guys just that week.
01:50:59.000 Just because I'm interested.
01:51:00.000 I just keep watching stuff, and I keep watching difficult fights, and easy fights, and dominant fights, and I watch training footage.
01:51:08.000 But that's like, I probably would do that anyway, if I had the time.
01:51:11.000 Like, if I'm sitting in my computer and, you know, I don't have shit to do, I'll watch some training footage, I'll watch a countdown show, I'll watch, I want to see what's going on.
01:51:19.000 I'm excited for the fight, so I'll get pumped.
01:51:22.000 I'll do that for this Wilder Fury fight. 0.99
01:51:24.000 I'm going to watch all kinds of shit. 0.99
01:51:26.000 I want to hear them talk. 1.00
01:51:27.000 I want to see the training.
01:51:28.000 I want to see them running and hitting the bag.
01:51:30.000 I want to see all that stuff.
01:51:31.000 Yeah, see, I'm the same in that everything that I do somehow informs that single passion that I have.
01:51:38.000 Like, talking to fighters...
01:51:40.000 Looking into a fight and figuring out what the narrative really is, how many things hang in the balance, not just a championship belt or somebody's bragging rights, but all the things that they bring to it personally and the communities that they represent and all the things that are on the line down the line. 0.99
01:51:58.000 I get caught up in that shit. 0.97
01:52:00.000 But when I'm working out my mind, I'm in the gym. 1.00
01:52:04.000 When I'm hitting the bag, when I'm sparring other guys, even conversations can be sparring sessions.
01:52:10.000 I gotta be prepared for that kind of back and forth.
01:52:14.000 And I use that information I collect about myself and how to react and respond to other people.
01:52:21.000 In a boxing gym.
01:52:22.000 Yeah.
01:52:23.000 So I ask this because my other thing as a hobby or a fascination, something I would never do, is I'm a huge stand-up fan.
01:52:32.000 A huge stand-up fan.
01:52:33.000 I will watch stand-up comedy guys I've never heard of.
01:52:38.000 I go to the clubs, all this stuff.
01:52:39.000 How much does the judo, the martial arts, the discipline inform...
01:52:47.000 The craft on the stage for you.
01:52:49.000 I think all three things work together in some strange way.
01:52:56.000 They all work together.
01:52:58.000 Doing live stand-up makes doing podcasts easier.
01:53:03.000 Because live stand-up is, you need a reaction.
01:53:07.000 There's so much preparation.
01:53:09.000 There's writing.
01:53:10.000 There's thinking about subjects.
01:53:12.000 There's listening to recordings.
01:53:13.000 There's going over them.
01:53:14.000 There's multiple reps.
01:53:16.000 You have to do, like, I'm doing two sets tonight.
01:53:18.000 I'll do two sets tomorrow.
01:53:19.000 I got one on Thursday, two Friday, two Saturday, and this is a normal week.
01:53:25.000 That's normal.
01:53:26.000 You have to do those reps.
01:53:27.000 If you don't do those reps, you won't be sharp.
01:53:29.000 You have to be sharp if you want to do shows, especially now I'm doing arenas, like a lot of these arenas. 1.00
01:53:35.000 It's a lot of fucking people, man. 0.99
01:53:36.000 You gotta be ready. 1.00
01:53:38.000 You can't be, I'm pretty ready.
01:53:40.000 You've got to be ready, right?
01:53:42.000 So there's a lot of discipline involved in that.
01:53:44.000 And then the podcast expands my perspective.
01:53:50.000 Just being able to talk to people and see the way people think.
01:53:53.000 Just talking to you about your experience with Deontay Wilder, the way that you framed that in an incredibly positive way, that it helped you and helped everybody.
01:54:02.000 There's a lot of people that would have been tortured by that moment, and it would have fucked them up, but you became empowered by it.
01:54:08.000 And you looked at it as a growing, learning opportunity, but also an opportunity for the growth of, like, you as a broadcaster, for the fight, for everything. 0.97
01:54:19.000 And then it becomes this crazy meme, who's ultimately only positive, although in the moment, you know, you're tied up in knots, reading the comments, like, fucking Beyoncé's mad at me. 0.96
01:54:29.000 All these people are mad at me. 0.98
01:54:30.000 Snoop's mad at me.
01:54:32.000 This whole thing, they all work together, you know?
01:54:36.000 And then the UFC, being able to have the honor of calling these fights live with the greatest fighters in the world and being able to put words to their performance and give a description of the heart and the courage and the skill that these guys exhibit and the discipline involved in getting to this state as a mixed martial artist.
01:54:59.000 Like, how...
01:55:01.000 What an epic commitment you have to have to excellence to become a John Jones.
01:55:07.000 To become a Henry Cejudo or fill in the blank.
01:55:11.000 It's a special type of human.
01:55:14.000 So I think when you're around those special types of humans...
01:55:20.000 We're good to go.
01:55:38.000 It makes me appreciate excellence.
01:55:41.000 And that's why I get pissed off when someone dismisses that kind of excellence with a shtick.
01:55:47.000 Yes, yes, yes.
01:55:48.000 I also think...
01:55:51.000 It has to be your thing. 0.99
01:55:53.000 You can't bullshit. 0.98
01:55:55.000 You can't just go by some stats that you read online or that a producer gives you. 0.98
01:56:01.000 You have to understand the complexities because if you don't, people will know. 0.99
01:56:05.000 It's like if you try to talk shit to someone in French and you only know 20 words... 0.98
01:56:13.000 You can say those 20 words good, but then someone goes, oh, wee-wee. 0.99
01:56:17.000 And they start busting out other words you don't know.
01:56:20.000 You're like, oh, no. 0.99
01:56:22.000 I done fucked up. 0.99
01:56:23.000 Got myself in a quagmire. 0.99
01:56:25.000 That's it. 0.99
01:56:26.000 That's what it's like if you're talking shit about MMA, if you don't really understand the sport. 0.98
01:56:30.000 I've been involved in the sport in one way or another professionally since 1997. That's when I first started working for the UFC. So it's been... 0.99
01:56:41.000 That's a long fucking time, man. 0.99
01:56:43.000 You know, that's a long fucking time. 0.99
01:56:45.000 I keep hearing rumors that Dana White is going to become a boxing promoter. 0.98
01:56:49.000 I've heard for like five years.
01:56:50.000 He is.
01:56:51.000 He is.
01:56:51.000 Yeah, they are.
01:56:53.000 Yeah, they're working on some shit. 1.00
01:56:54.000 I can't really tell you much, but they're definitely working on some shit. 0.99
01:56:57.000 Yeah, they put together the Conor McGregor and Floyd Mayweather Jr. fight, of course, with TME. With Floyd's company, TBE, rather. 0.98
01:57:09.000 What is it called?
01:57:09.000 The Money Team?
01:57:11.000 TMT. That's what his promotion team is called, right?
01:57:14.000 TMT? Mayweather Promotions.
01:57:16.000 His crew, I guess.
01:57:18.000 TMT, yeah.
01:57:19.000 So he and they did this sort of co-promotion for that big fight, and then they're working on some other thing with Floyd.
01:57:26.000 We're good to go.
01:57:45.000 I just wonder how that works because the UFC model just won't exist in the boxing world.
01:57:51.000 You won't have enough control.
01:57:53.000 You don't have to.
01:57:54.000 You just have to schedule a couple big fights.
01:57:56.000 They're not going to do it like they do the UFC. The UFC literally has a fight every week right now.
01:58:04.000 For the next five weeks, there's a fight every weekend.
01:58:06.000 And people are hitting pay-per-view dollars.
01:58:08.000 Well, it's ESPN Plus or ESPN and sometimes pay-per-view dollars.
01:58:12.000 Some of the fights are free.
01:58:13.000 I thought the ESPN, because I have ESPN Plus, and I was like, oh, great, should I get to watch these UFC fights for like $5.99 a month?
01:58:19.000 Nope.
01:58:20.000 Yeah, no.
01:58:20.000 Nope.
01:58:21.000 It's still...
01:58:22.000 It's still like $65.
01:58:23.000 Yeah, I bought it on my TV this morning.
01:58:25.000 I watched it again when I was lifting this morning, and I had to pay $65.
01:58:32.000 You know, but it's...
01:58:35.000 It's a weird thing, right?
01:58:37.000 You can't really do it where it's just $5.99 and don't have pay-per-view because then the big fights won't be big fights.
01:58:44.000 They want...
01:58:46.000 How does DAZN have it?
01:58:48.000 Do you have to pay?
01:58:50.000 No!
01:58:50.000 You don't.
01:58:51.000 That's their whole thing.
01:58:52.000 Oh, so Tyson Fury and Deontay, that's going to be on DAZN. No, no, no.
01:58:56.000 Tyson Fury and Deontay, I think, is a simulcast between Fox, if simulcast is the right word, and ESPN. In other words, they're going to have their own separate pay-per-views that you can watch whichever production you like, which is going to be something like...
01:59:09.000 Really?
01:59:09.000 Yeah, yeah.
01:59:10.000 So who's the commentators?
01:59:12.000 Then it becomes those are the commentators.
01:59:13.000 It depends on where you tune in.
01:59:16.000 If you go to ESPN, you'll hear their people.
01:59:19.000 I think they have their own broadcast.
01:59:21.000 Why don't they use Max Kellerman?
01:59:24.000 I am so confused.
01:59:25.000 I loved his boxing commentary, and he doesn't comment on live fights anymore.
01:59:30.000 I think that's got to be his own choice.
01:59:32.000 I mean, I can't imagine that they don't want it. 0.98
01:59:34.000 How the fuck would he not want to do that? 0.98
01:59:37.000 He was so good at it. 0.99
01:59:39.000 I don't know.
01:59:39.000 He was one of my favorite guys.
01:59:42.000 Andre Ward was also one of my favorite guys.
01:59:45.000 I love Andre Ward for a bunch of reasons, but one, for the fact that that guy, undefeated, gold medalist, two-division world champion, because you know what?
01:59:55.000 We're good.
01:59:56.000 Walked away.
01:59:57.000 Just walked away.
01:59:58.000 And I sense that he will stay away.
02:00:00.000 Oh, yeah.
02:00:01.000 He's going to stay away.
02:00:02.000 You know, they talked to him about Canelo after Canelo knocked out Kovalev.
02:00:05.000 And he made this long statement that he's better off for boxing, even for boxing, outside of fighting.
02:00:15.000 He knows.
02:00:16.000 He's so smart, man.
02:00:17.000 He's so smart and so disciplined.
02:00:19.000 He's just so disciplined.
02:00:20.000 He knows.
02:00:22.000 There's no reason.
02:00:23.000 There's no reason to come back.
02:00:24.000 This is the right way to do it.
02:00:25.000 There's big money in coming back, but there's also big brain damage.
02:00:29.000 The ego after you retire is the biggest fight of your life.
02:00:35.000 You're exactly right.
02:00:36.000 This guy's undefeated.
02:00:38.000 I'm sure if you're going to talk to him off camera, I could beat Canelo.
02:00:42.000 You know what I mean?
02:00:43.000 Of course he must think that just because of who he is.
02:00:47.000 You've got to think that.
02:00:48.000 So to stop yourself from the money, the glory one more time, the possibility, could you imagine coming out of retirement and beating Canelo Alvarez?
02:01:00.000 To be able to be like, you know what, it's better for me and it's better for boxing if I stay retired and keep sitting ringside and talking about these fights in the way I do.
02:01:10.000 That's a special kind of character.
02:01:12.000 He's a special person.
02:01:13.000 But he also has this issue with his right shoulder.
02:01:17.000 You know, his right shoulder was basically broken most of his career, and he got it fixed before the second Kovalev fight, and he actually wound up hurting Kovalev real bad with a right hand.
02:01:27.000 If you watch his career, he was like a left-handed fighter.
02:01:32.000 His super spinatus was ripped off. 0.93
02:01:35.000 Like, it was really fucked up, and he tried to rehab it with bands instead of going through surgery when he was young. 0.78
02:01:41.000 And so most of his career, he beat the best fighters in the world, Carl Frotch, all those guys, one-handed, which is even more insane. 0.98
02:01:49.000 Even more insane.
02:01:50.000 And then, you know, had the surgery, rehabbed it, but he said it's still not 100%.
02:01:55.000 It's never going to be 100%.
02:01:57.000 Right, which is why people are afraid of surgery. 0.64
02:01:59.000 It's like, you know, I'd rather do the bands or anything than take the chance.
02:02:02.000 But it's better than it was before.
02:02:03.000 I think before he had like 40% use of his shoulder, which is crazy.
02:02:07.000 Yeah.
02:02:08.000 He said he never felt like he could throw a good punch.
02:02:10.000 He always felt like it was going to blow out on him.
02:02:12.000 Geez.
02:02:13.000 Isn't that nuts?
02:02:14.000 Yeah. 0.99
02:02:14.000 Fucked everybody up with one hand. 0.99
02:02:19.000 That's how you make yourself a legend. 0.98
02:02:21.000 He's definitely a legend.
02:02:22.000 But maybe an underappreciated legend.
02:02:25.000 In terms of mainstream boxing viewpoint, I don't think the mainstream public really appreciates how great he was.
02:02:34.000 No.
02:02:34.000 In his time or after.
02:02:36.000 It will take people reflecting on history, I think.
02:02:39.000 Unfortunately for him, his kids and their kids might get the benefit of who their dad or grandfather was more so than he's getting it now.
02:02:49.000 Well, there's certain great fighters that for whatever reason, they never really captured the public's imagination, even though they were great.
02:02:58.000 You know, like Marlon Starling, who's a fantastic welterweight, knocked out Mark Breland, who was actually now Deontay Wilder's trainer.
02:03:06.000 But I remember when Mark Breland was coming from the Olympics, and he was this really long, tall welterweight, and he fought Starling, and Starling wasn't really appreciated enough.
02:03:19.000 And Starling put it on them.
02:03:22.000 And you realize that there's guys out there that for whatever reason, people don't appreciate them as much as they should.
02:03:28.000 Yeah, timing's everything.
02:03:30.000 It's unfortunate, but as much as we hate just guys putting on an act or hyping themselves up with these characters they create, that is bankable.
02:03:42.000 We all know guys who don't deserve the shots that they continue to get, but because they bring an audience with their shit-talking or with their antics and all the show that they put on, it's better than the fight!
02:03:57.000 You know who's the most confusing to me? 0.92
02:03:59.000 It's Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. He's confusing to me.
02:04:03.000 Like that last fight, I'm like, what are you doing?
02:04:06.000 Like you're saying, the guy head-butted me, my nose is broken, I'm quitting.
02:04:09.000 I was like, what are you doing?
02:04:11.000 Do you not understand?
02:04:12.000 You're Mexican. 1.00
02:04:14.000 Those are the hardest motherfuckers on earth when it comes to boxing. 1.00
02:04:18.000 You're not just Mexican. 1.00
02:04:20.000 You are the son of the man.
02:04:23.000 You're the son of the guy.
02:04:24.000 He won something like 31 world title fights.
02:04:29.000 Some insane number.
02:04:31.000 He has the record of world title wins.
02:04:33.000 Which is also an unattainable goal.
02:04:37.000 If you decide to go into boxing and your father is Julio Cesar Chavez. 0.55
02:04:43.000 Dude, one of the goats.
02:04:45.000 What do you hope?
02:04:46.000 How far can you hope to get?
02:04:49.000 In legacy.
02:04:51.000 I almost feel bad for the guy because there's got to be so much going on in his head to put him in the place where he's at.
02:05:01.000 But yet he's talented.
02:05:02.000 He's a good fighter.
02:05:05.000 His skills, his ability to put hands on people are very good.
02:05:08.000 But I think also there's something about growing up wealthy.
02:05:12.000 It's just almost impossible. 0.82
02:05:16.000 Like, you kind of have to have some part of your life that was fucked up, and you didn't think it was gonna work out.
02:05:23.000 Where you didn't think there was a future, and there's a burn that never goes out.
02:05:28.000 There's like a little fire that never goes out.
02:05:31.000 Ease is a greater challenge than adversity.
02:05:33.000 Yes, it is, man. 0.98
02:05:35.000 There's something about comfort that just makes bitches out of people. 1.00
02:05:38.000 It's just... 0.99
02:05:40.000 It just does.
02:05:42.000 It's so hard to overcome that.
02:05:44.000 You can't even forcibly remove yourself from that comfort.
02:05:48.000 It's very few human beings are able to really achieve greatness when they grow up with great wealth and privilege.
02:05:57.000 There's something about that, that life of leisure and knowing that everything's going to be okay.
02:06:02.000 You know, like your dad made $50 million.
02:06:05.000 You're going to be fine.
02:06:06.000 There's something about that that just...
02:06:08.000 For whatever reason, it just haunts people.
02:06:12.000 Yeah, I mean, there'd be something burning brightly inside him, almost like a resentment for his father, unfortunately.
02:06:18.000 I don't think love could propel you to even come anywhere near his legacy.
02:06:23.000 You'd actually have to hate the guy just to be fire-burning bright enough to attain anything close to what he did.
02:06:31.000 And I feel bad for his dad, too.
02:06:33.000 You know, his dad watching him quit.
02:06:35.000 I'm like, oh no.
02:06:36.000 But he's a loving father, man.
02:06:39.000 It's not the first time he's been embarrassed.
02:06:41.000 He keeps coming back like, alright, this is the one.
02:06:44.000 This is the time.
02:06:45.000 One more.
02:06:46.000 The Canelo fight was a rough one, too.
02:06:49.000 But Canelo outclassed him, you know?
02:06:51.000 Canelo was just...
02:06:53.000 Just a better fighter.
02:06:54.000 And Chavez is not a quitter.
02:06:56.000 At least this last time, he may have had a point.
02:06:59.000 Maybe he was headbutt, maybe the elbows, but quitting in boxing obviously is the cardinal sin. 0.99
02:07:05.000 He wasn't that fucked up. 0.99
02:07:06.000 It wasn't like his nose was pouring blood and he couldn't breathe out of it anymore and it was from a blatant foul. 0.99
02:07:12.000 He looked okay, right?
02:07:14.000 Yeah.
02:07:14.000 Maybe there was something going on that we couldn't see.
02:07:17.000 But he looked okay.
02:07:17.000 And then he took videos from the hospital the next day with tape on his nose.
02:07:23.000 He was not healthy.
02:07:24.000 Lay low for a while, bro.
02:07:26.000 Yeah.
02:07:27.000 What else is exciting for you on the horizon, boxing-wise?
02:07:30.000 What are you looking at that's interesting?
02:07:33.000 I'm anticipating and eagerly awaiting the return of Manny Pacquiao.
02:07:37.000 Hmm.
02:07:38.000 Listen, we can't not talk about Pacquiao when we talk about the welterweight division.
02:07:44.000 Because he's 40 and he's not in the news all the time, he's not at press conference, and we only talk about him when he's got a fight sign, that sometimes in these conversations we forget, yo, he's a world title holder.
02:07:59.000 He just dominated a guy that there's no way at his age he should have been able to dominate, considering who Keith Thurman was. 0.99
02:08:08.000 Two years prior, before his surgery, Pacquiao could ruin everybody's shit. 0.99
02:08:14.000 Like, you know what I mean? 0.97
02:08:16.000 But what do you think about, do you think that he would ever step up and fight Terrence Crawford at this stage of his career?
02:08:22.000 I don't think that fight happens for multiple reasons.
02:08:25.000 I wouldn't suggest it if I was in his camp.
02:08:28.000 Also, I don't think that any more than they want to make the Spence-Croffer fight, do they want to put Pacquiao in that kind of harm's way and give top-ranking ESPN an opportunity to dethrone him.
02:08:45.000 Like, you know, he's with the Heyman camp now.
02:08:47.000 It's the same with Spence.
02:08:49.000 So...
02:08:51.000 That is going to protect him.
02:08:53.000 He's not going to have to say whether or not he really wants to fight because I don't think he can get it.
02:08:57.000 Manny Pacquiao inks deal with Paradigm Sports Manager who represent Conor McGregor.
02:09:01.000 Oh, Jesus.
02:09:04.000 That's probably what they're going to do.
02:09:06.000 Manny Pacquiao, Conor McGregor.
02:09:08.000 No thanks.
02:09:09.000 That's probably what the UFC wants to try to do.
02:09:12.000 Is that the thing?
02:09:13.000 Maybe they heard you talking about it.
02:09:15.000 Just got posted a half hour ago. 1.00
02:09:17.000 Oh shit. 0.99
02:09:18.000 While we were talking. 1.00
02:09:19.000 Oh shit. 1.00
02:09:21.000 I gotta tell you, if that's the thing, all that anticipation and eagerly awaiting shit just flew out the window. 1.00
02:09:28.000 Well, here it is, an opportunity for Manny Pacquiao to make a fuckload of money. 0.97
02:09:32.000 I mean, that's how I'd look at it.
02:09:34.000 I'd look at it for Manny to make a hundred million bucks.
02:09:38.000 But you'd have to sell the public.
02:09:39.000 I mean, they already watched Floyd Mayweather box circles around them.
02:09:43.000 They're going to sell it.
02:09:44.000 Of course it's going to.
02:09:44.000 That's why it's going to be $100 million.
02:09:46.000 But I'm going to be irritated by every single brown penny that's spent on that fight.
02:09:54.000 It's going to be my nemesis.
02:09:56.000 You know what you're really going to be irritated by?
02:09:58.000 The people that think that Conor has a chance.
02:10:01.000 It's easy.
02:10:03.000 What are you doing?!
02:10:05.000 Come on, guys!
02:10:07.000 What if they give him six months?
02:10:09.000 What if he fights Paulie Malignaggi first?
02:10:17.000 I'll tell you what, I would pay for Manny Pacquiao versus either Errol Spence or Crawford.
02:10:26.000 I would pay for either one of those fights.
02:10:28.000 I would like that.
02:10:30.000 That's what I would like to see.
02:10:31.000 I think while Manny's 40, I mean, after the Keith Thurman fight, he has shown that he's still a legit world beater.
02:10:39.000 And Terrence Crawford is the cream of the crop, in my opinion.
02:10:42.000 I want to see that.
02:10:44.000 You know what would be more exciting?
02:10:45.000 Exciting!
02:10:46.000 Than both of those fights?
02:10:48.000 Sean Porter.
02:10:49.000 Ooh, that's a good fight, too.
02:10:51.000 Manny Pacquiao versus Sean Porter would be a hell of a nine-a-box.
02:10:55.000 Very good fight, too.
02:10:56.000 Very good fight, too.
02:10:58.000 I believe in world champions, although there's way too many of them in every weight division. 0.97
02:11:04.000 This fucking, like, oh, undefeated fighters are the only ones that are worth talking about. 0.99
02:11:11.000 If there's one thing I love about the UFC and MMA culture, period, is that losing a fight doesn't mean losing your whole fucking brand. 0.99
02:11:21.000 If you go out there, comport yourself well, leave it all in the octagon, you live to fight another day and people still respect the effort you put forward.
02:11:29.000 They recognize that if you're fighting guys at your level, you'll win some and you'll lose some and hopefully you'll win more than you lose and that's how you become the man. 0.98
02:11:40.000 But losing some doesn't make you a bitch. 1.00
02:11:42.000 Doesn't make you like a bum. 0.99
02:11:44.000 Well, I think Manny's kind of proven that.
02:11:46.000 I mean, remember when Manuel Marquez put him in an orbit?
02:11:50.000 Yeah.
02:11:50.000 He just put him in an orbit around Jupiter.
02:11:52.000 Took him four times to do it.
02:11:54.000 But I'll tell you what.
02:11:55.000 I said it on the night, too.
02:11:57.000 By the way, that is the most electric...
02:12:00.000 Boxing atmosphere I've ever been a part of.
02:12:03.000 I've been covering fights my entire adult life.
02:12:05.000 They knew, when they were singing the anthem, the Mexicans were singing the Mexican anthem before the fight, and I was sitting there with a friend of mine, also a fellow journalist, Sean Zattel,
02:12:20.000 and we were sitting up in the rafters.
02:12:22.000 We weren't even sitting in the press row.
02:12:24.000 We were sitting like...
02:12:25.000 I didn't want to be bothered with all the yammering that goes on in the press row, so I found seats up above the ring.
02:12:32.000 And when they were singing that anthem, we looked at each other and we're like, uh-oh.
02:12:35.000 Something is about to happen here tonight.
02:12:38.000 We knew it was a special night.
02:12:41.000 And bro, when he knocked out Manny Pacquiao, he should have crowd surfed to Mexico and never ever laced up a pair of boxing gloves again.
02:12:53.000 Right.
02:12:54.000 Yeah.
02:12:55.000 And he never fought him again.
02:12:56.000 That's what's really interesting.
02:12:58.000 I thought they would have had another one.
02:12:59.000 He should have never fought anybody again.
02:13:00.000 It's never going to get ever better than that night in that moment.
02:13:04.000 Yeah, but he'll still always have that forever.
02:13:06.000 And there's something about, especially Latino fighters, it's like they almost kind of have to keep going. 1.00
02:13:12.000 Like, all the greats kept going.
02:13:14.000 All the greats.
02:13:14.000 Chavez kept going way past he should have.
02:13:17.000 You know, and then, you know, I mean, so many of them just keep going.
02:13:24.000 Roberto Duran, you know, kept going forever.
02:13:28.000 Yo, I mean, it's an addiction.
02:13:30.000 It's a lifestyle.
02:13:31.000 And if you still believe you can do it, like, I'm still better than most of those guys, why not keep doing it?
02:13:37.000 One more W? Who doesn't want one more W? Mm-hmm.
02:13:42.000 Yeah.
02:13:42.000 Yeah, so I decided to pick a career with a little bit more longevity in it.
02:13:46.000 And no physical downside.
02:13:49.000 Exactly.
02:13:50.000 We're going to talk everybody right into the grave.
02:13:52.000 That's the thing about what you're doing.
02:13:54.000 You get to see the real consequences that some of these guys face.
02:13:59.000 Yeah.
02:13:59.000 And it is a dark thing to see a fight where you see a guy get beaten down and the referee stops the fight and they see him slump into the corner and collapse.
02:14:10.000 Yeah.
02:14:10.000 You know, and I've seen that only on television.
02:14:14.000 I haven't seen that live.
02:14:15.000 When the stretcher comes out.
02:14:17.000 Yeah.
02:14:17.000 You know what I mean?
02:14:18.000 Because sometimes the knockout doesn't look that vicious.
02:14:22.000 Like, I mean, it's a knockout.
02:14:23.000 But as soon as a guy goes down, you're not gasping.
02:14:26.000 Then the guy's not moving.
02:14:27.000 Right.
02:14:28.000 The guy's not responding.
02:14:29.000 Well, you remember the Gerald McClellan fight?
02:14:30.000 He took a knee.
02:14:31.000 And then people were questioning him, you know?
02:14:34.000 And then he slumped and collapsed in his corner.
02:14:37.000 Yeah, I mean, combat sports are the most brutal of all contests.
02:14:44.000 I mean, football's probably next, but the difference is, with combat sports, there's a guy doing it to you, and you're trying to do it to him.
02:14:55.000 I mean, it's the only thing that's happening there.
02:14:56.000 There's not a ball going across a line. 1.00
02:14:59.000 There's only a guy trying to fuck you up, and you're trying to fuck him up. 0.99
02:15:02.000 And the lack of protective equipment is part of the fight. 1.00
02:15:07.000 You're in your underwear.
02:15:08.000 You're basically in your underwear with shoes on.
02:15:10.000 In an MMA, you don't even have shoes on.
02:15:13.000 Correct.
02:15:13.000 And your fingertips are showing.
02:15:16.000 You're about as naked as you can get legally and compete in something.
02:15:19.000 I mean, thank God, obviously.
02:15:21.000 But I am surprised that there hasn't been more serious injury in MMA. I don't know if that's just because of how long we've been paying attention.
02:15:30.000 I don't know.
02:15:31.000 What do you...
02:15:31.000 I don't know.
02:15:32.000 I think it's good refereeing.
02:15:34.000 You know, MMA has some pretty exceptional referees that are very aware of the dangers of guys taking extra shots.
02:15:40.000 There's also a thing where they don't get a chance to recover like they do in boxing, where a guy gets knocked down and then they give him an eight count. 0.98
02:15:48.000 There's none of that shit. 0.95
02:15:49.000 When you get knocked down in MMA, if the referee thinks it's over, they just wave it off because there's too many weapons. 0.99
02:15:55.000 You're elbowing people in the face.
02:15:57.000 You're kicking them. 0.78
02:15:58.000 If they think you're done, you're done.
02:16:00.000 They don't give you that chance.
02:16:02.000 The standing eight counts.
02:16:05.000 That ten count, there's something about that ten count.
02:16:07.000 It's great because it makes for moments like Tyson Fury rising off the deck to win the rest of the round with Deontay Wilder in that twelfth.
02:16:15.000 But it also gives your brain a false sense of recovery. 1.00
02:16:20.000 Like, you're fucked up, man. 1.00
02:16:21.000 Right. 1.00
02:16:22.000 You really probably shouldn't be going on.
02:16:24.000 In MMA, you really don't get a chance to go on.
02:16:27.000 When they stop it, they stop it.
02:16:28.000 If the referee's in front of you, the fight's over.
02:16:30.000 When I first started watching MMA, there was no UFC, right? 0.97
02:16:34.000 I had the bootleg box in my room, and we'd get the fuzzy channel, and people were getting their fucking arms broken and shit, and head-butted and blood all over it. 0.98
02:16:45.000 Between you and I. Which one did you like better? 0.98
02:16:49.000 Did you like the first iteration of pretty much everything?
02:16:55.000 No.
02:16:55.000 I like skills better now.
02:16:57.000 The guys are way more skillful and that's what's interesting to me.
02:17:00.000 What's interesting to me more than anything is the growth of the understanding of what works and what doesn't work.
02:17:08.000 Of skill, of technique.
02:17:10.000 That's the most important thing to me.
02:17:11.000 Guys like Mighty Mouse. 0.88
02:17:13.000 He was one of my favorite fighters to watch because he would fuck people up and not even get hit. 0.54
02:17:18.000 He'd be moving on people in ways where they didn't even know what was happening until he was doing it. 0.98
02:17:22.000 It was too late.
02:17:23.000 He'd already hit you.
02:17:24.000 He was moving these different angles.
02:17:25.000 He'd catch people with arm bars. 1.00
02:17:27.000 He'd fuck you up with knees in the clinch. 1.00
02:17:29.000 He was, in my opinion, the greatest expression of mixed martial arts talent. 1.00
02:17:33.000 And because he was so next level in terms of his ability to implement his strategy on you, and you couldn't do shit to him.
02:17:40.000 But he didn't get a chance to fight the level of talent as a guy like Jon Jones. 0.56
02:17:45.000 Jon Jones is fascinating to me because he's been able to stay on top for almost a fucking decade, only fighting world-class, top of the food chain, world championship caliber fighters, which is just amazing.
02:17:58.000 No one's been able to do that.
02:17:59.000 Jon's undefeated.
02:18:00.000 He has one loss by disqualification. 0.99
02:18:02.000 It's a bullshit loss that was from a bullshit rule where you're not supposed to elbow like this. 0.99
02:18:07.000 Elbow from 12 to 6. It's supposed to come down at an angle, which makes no sense, and I've described it too many times to go into details. 0.99
02:18:14.000 It's an ignorant rule. 0.93
02:18:15.000 It shouldn't exist. 0.99
02:18:16.000 But he beat the fuck out of Matt Hamill winning that fight.
02:18:19.000 There was no way Matt Hamill was winning that fight. 0.81
02:18:21.000 John dominated him.
02:18:22.000 So John's undefeated, and he's been undefeated, youngest ever world champion, 23 years old, won the world championship in the UFC, and has dominated ever since.
02:18:31.000 I mean, that's insane.
02:18:32.000 That, to me...
02:18:34.000 Is one of the most impressive things in all of sports.
02:18:37.000 Watching that guy achieve a record that might never be achieved again.
02:18:43.000 The thing about boxing that has my imagination and my fascination continually spark is the finite nature of the tools and the weapons that you have to use.
02:19:00.000 Right?
02:19:00.000 Mm-hmm.
02:19:01.000 I respect and appreciate MMA, but it's almost like the antithesis of that in that they have so many things they can use and whatnot.
02:19:09.000 It's an entirely different discipline.
02:19:12.000 But you're coming from a martial arts background.
02:19:15.000 So I grew up on kung fu movies, right? 0.99
02:19:18.000 And so when I started watching this shit, these guys were in geese. 0.99
02:19:22.000 They were like, you know, I said, like, it's the Gracie's breaking arms, whatnot, and that made sense to me. 0.99
02:19:27.000 And I understood why a boxer wouldn't fight a karate man or a judo guy or whatever.
02:19:32.000 Because that's what the science is for me.
02:19:35.000 Like what you can do with these two hands and your two feet are the only way you can evade and all of that.
02:19:38.000 But why can't the karate man?
02:19:40.000 Why isn't there like a Bruce Lee of MMA? As a martial artist, can you still believe in like one discipline after all this MMA is proven it doesn't work?
02:19:51.000 Yeah.
02:19:51.000 There's no real one discipline that will work best in MMA. You have to know everything.
02:19:57.000 But if I was going to say what discipline is the most important, I would say wrestling.
02:20:01.000 Because if you can't keep a guy from taking you down, he's going to be on top of you, he's going to hold you down, he's going to punch you in the face.
02:20:08.000 It's a giant advantage to be able to hold a guy down, be able to punch his face in, and you can't really do much when a guy's on top of you.
02:20:14.000 That said, from there, you have to understand jiu-jitsu.
02:20:17.000 Because if you don't, you could hold a guy down, then all of a sudden he wraps his legs around your neck and you caught a triangle and you go to sleep.
02:20:23.000 And every fight starts standing.
02:20:25.000 So you have to have some understanding of striking.
02:20:27.000 Because you have to be able to close the distance.
02:20:29.000 But There's no one way to do it.
02:20:33.000 That's what's interesting to me.
02:20:35.000 It's like there's Anderson Silva's way to do it, who's the greatest middleweight of all time, and his way to do it was through striking.
02:20:40.000 He would just stay up with guys and just fuck them up with timing and precision and Muay Thai. 0.85
02:20:46.000 But then there's guys like Daniel Cormier who'd take guys down and beat the fuck out of them, choke them, you know? 0.96
02:20:51.000 And there's a bunch of different people with a bunch of different styles in between.
02:20:55.000 But if you look at the majority of world champions, The majority, except maybe a couple weight classes, they're dominated by wrestlers.
02:21:06.000 There's a lot of pictures on the internet, by the way, of me with Anderson Silva's tag They think you're Anderson Silva?
02:21:14.000 You don't look anything like Anderson Silva.
02:21:15.000 You wouldn't believe how many people stop me, especially if I'm in Vegas when there's a UFC event.
02:21:22.000 And they think you're Anderson Silva?
02:21:23.000 They think I'm Anderson Silva. 0.98
02:21:25.000 That's ridiculous. 0.92
02:21:25.000 You don't look like Anderson Silva, man. 0.92
02:21:28.000 I'm telling you.
02:21:28.000 I don't think so either.
02:21:29.000 But I'm telling you, I get it.
02:21:31.000 A lot.
02:21:32.000 Well, people, yeah, people are weird.
02:21:34.000 I mean, I even dressed up for him, like, as him on Halloween, and it went over like gangbusters.
02:21:40.000 That's funny.
02:21:41.000 Oh, did you wear the Bruce Lee outfit?
02:21:43.000 Yeah, of course!
02:21:44.000 I wore the Bruce Lee outfit.
02:21:45.000 I had a beanie, but it was Wu-Tang.
02:21:47.000 I will find that picture and show it to you afterwards.
02:21:50.000 Well, listen, man, I'm glad we had this conversation.
02:21:53.000 It was a lot of fun.
02:21:54.000 It was brilliant. 0.99
02:21:55.000 By the way, I hope at some point every single 30 million people that watch your shit get a chance to stop by the studio personally. 0.99
02:22:02.000 This is the dopest studio I've ever been in. 1.00
02:22:06.000 You must live here.
02:22:07.000 I would just live here.
02:22:08.000 I don't know what is going on, but everything in here feels like the dude I'm talking to, and so kudos to you.
02:22:15.000 Thanks for having me.
02:22:16.000 Thanks, brother.
02:22:17.000 My pleasure.
02:22:18.000 I really appreciate it.
02:22:18.000 I appreciate it.
02:22:18.000 It's a lot of fun talking to you.
02:22:20.000 I'm glad we got a chance to air that story out, too.
02:22:22.000 To this day!
02:22:24.000 Tell people your Instagram and all your jazz.
02:22:26.000 Oh, yeah, my Instagram, Radio Raheem Boxing, R-A-H-I-M, Radio Raheem on Facebook.
02:22:32.000 And on YouTube, you can find my content at Seconds Out TV. Beautiful.
02:22:38.000 Thank you, brother.
02:22:38.000 Bye, everybody.
02:22:39.000 See you.
02:22:39.000 Peace.