The Megyn Kelly Show - Arrested For Posts, Epstein Victims Speak, and Sick Trump Health Reactions, with Batya Ungar-Sargon and Greg Lukianoff

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00:01:01.420 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:03.300 Live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.

00:01:13.080 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly.

00:01:14.780 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:16.240 We have alleged Jeffrey Epstein victims

00:01:18.420 speaking out in D.C. this morning

00:01:20.160 along with a bipartisan group of legislators

00:01:22.260 including Ro Khanna and MTG.

00:01:25.740 This comes as the House Oversight Committee

00:01:28.180 releases tens of thousands of documents

00:01:30.460 related to the case.

00:01:31.760 But is there anything new in these documents

00:01:34.920 that they receive from the DOJ?

00:01:36.960 Let me just start by saying this.

00:01:38.040 I've got my doubts.

00:01:39.540 This is the House Oversight Committee

00:01:41.060 subpoenaing the DOJ

00:01:42.980 and neither of these groups

00:01:46.180 has any motivation,

00:01:49.320 any real interest

00:01:50.360 in doing anything to upset Donald Trump

00:01:52.640 who wants this thing over.

00:01:54.960 So to me, I've got to be honest,

00:01:56.720 it seems like fig leaf-a-mania

00:01:58.860 by everyone

00:02:00.620 other than that Massey-Roh Khanna effort,

00:02:03.600 which is a separate thing.

00:02:05.200 So you've got the House Oversight Committee

00:02:06.380 subpoenaing the DOJ

00:02:08.480 for all of its Epstein documents

00:02:09.800 and they do a 30,000 document dump,

00:02:13.080 which so far looks like

00:02:14.340 there's some stuff

00:02:15.260 that may be mildly interesting,

00:02:16.740 but people who know the case really well

00:02:18.440 are saying this is all old,

00:02:20.600 which seems like what the DOJ would do

00:02:22.700 because they're not going to give anything

00:02:23.980 to House Oversight

00:02:24.960 that they actually think is probative

00:02:27.400 since they've already told us

00:02:28.700 that allegedly there isn't anything

00:02:30.640 and they're not interested

00:02:31.460 in producing anything.

00:02:33.200 So let me tell you,

00:02:34.020 as a lawyer involved in many litigations

00:02:36.060 over the course of my professional life,

00:02:37.820 it's easy to generate thousands of documents

00:02:40.060 that are technically responsive to a subpoena

00:02:42.420 while withholding the ones

00:02:44.380 you don't want to produce,

00:02:46.160 especially when it's a friendly,

00:02:48.980 it's a Republican-controlled committee.

00:02:51.060 They're not actually going to go after

00:02:52.960 Bondi or Team Trump

00:02:54.780 for not giving the goods.

00:02:56.460 So I have very low expectations on this.

00:02:58.620 A couple of things have come out

00:02:59.500 that were like,

00:02:59.840 oh, that's kind of interesting,

00:03:00.800 but mild, mild.

00:03:03.320 I don't have high hopes.

00:03:05.120 But then you got this separate effort

00:03:06.560 by Massey,

00:03:07.480 who has become a Trump antagonist,

00:03:09.680 and Ro Khanna,

00:03:10.700 who's a dem,

00:03:11.880 who are trying to actually get,

00:03:14.140 you know,

00:03:14.900 real documents,

00:03:16.220 and MTG,

00:03:17.160 who she loves Trump,

00:03:18.300 but she's not a sycophant.

00:03:19.860 As you know,

00:03:20.400 you saw her here.

00:03:21.220 She'll criticize the administration.

00:03:23.520 Trying to actually speak

00:03:24.860 with Epstein victims

00:03:26.420 and what they're saying now this morning

00:03:28.940 at a presser

00:03:29.840 that Massey held.

00:03:31.300 So that lane is kind of interesting to me,

00:03:34.020 and we'll continue to watch both

00:03:35.520 and bring you whatever news is coming,

00:03:37.180 but just setting realistic expectations.

00:03:40.660 All right,

00:03:40.840 but we are going to begin today

00:03:42.060 with a case from across the pond

00:03:44.440 that shows just how dangerous

00:03:46.040 the battle over free speech has become.

00:03:49.040 And by the way,

00:03:50.140 you do need to pay attention

00:03:51.460 to what's happening in the UK

00:03:52.680 because it does affect Americans now,

00:03:56.060 and I'll explain in a minute how.

00:03:57.520 So, all right,

00:03:58.860 over in the UK,

00:04:00.520 comedy writer,

00:04:01.400 I mean,

00:04:01.580 this guy's like the god

00:04:02.880 of comedy writers over there.

00:04:04.120 He's written some of,

00:04:05.640 if not their most popular comedy shows

00:04:08.860 in the UK.

00:04:11.020 His name is Graham Linehan,

00:04:13.200 and he was arrested

00:04:14.480 at Heathrow Airport,

00:04:17.180 met by five,

00:04:18.280 count them,

00:04:18.680 five armed officers.

00:04:20.660 And as you may know,

00:04:21.400 in the UK,

00:04:22.380 most of the officers

00:04:22.960 are not armed with firearms,

00:04:25.060 but these guys were.

00:04:27.100 Why?

00:04:27.660 Because they had to take down

00:04:28.860 this comedian

00:04:29.440 who sent out three mean tweets.

00:04:32.100 I am not kidding.

00:04:34.300 Three mean tweets

00:04:35.720 got him arrested

00:04:37.260 by five armed guards

00:04:39.100 before he barely stepped

00:04:41.040 onto British ground,

00:04:44.520 getting off of the plane

00:04:45.900 from America.

00:04:47.740 He's,

00:04:48.640 I actually don't know his citizenship.

00:04:50.100 I think he's a British citizen,

00:04:51.500 but he was over here,

00:04:52.720 and he had to go back there

00:04:54.620 because he was already

00:04:57.360 on trial

00:04:58.960 for allegedly taking the phone

00:05:01.460 of this tranny activist

00:05:03.200 who was harassing women

00:05:04.740 speaking up for their own rights.

00:05:06.360 He allegedly took the phone.

00:05:08.860 So he got,

00:05:09.520 he got criminally charged.

00:05:11.300 The tranny didn't get charged

00:05:12.420 with criminal harassment,

00:05:13.620 just he did.

00:05:14.560 And he had to go back over there

00:05:16.060 to stand trial.

00:05:16.840 When his plane landed,

00:05:18.320 he got off the plane.

00:05:19.140 he got arrested

00:05:20.820 for three mean tweets.

00:05:24.100 In the wake of his arrest,

00:05:26.220 he was slapped

00:05:27.000 with what he calls

00:05:28.080 a legal gag order

00:05:30.080 in the UK,

00:05:31.440 a country where critics

00:05:32.340 say sweeping speech laws

00:05:33.680 punish everything

00:05:34.300 from online jokes

00:05:35.300 to private prayer.

00:05:36.960 That gag order

00:05:38.580 said he wasn't even allowed

00:05:40.340 to speak

00:05:41.180 about the charges

00:05:43.120 slapped against him.

00:05:44.800 Can you believe this?

00:05:45.860 Now he has a court date

00:05:48.120 later this week

00:05:49.520 and after that court date,

00:05:52.260 his first on-camera interview

00:05:54.240 will be right here

00:05:55.320 with the Megyn Kelly show

00:05:56.620 and we look forward

00:05:57.260 to bringing that

00:05:57.840 to you exclusively.

00:05:59.880 So I want to talk

00:06:00.800 about this case

00:06:01.500 and then I want to talk

00:06:02.980 about what's happening

00:06:03.680 not just in the UK

00:06:04.760 but in the European Union

00:06:06.100 because they've just passed

00:06:08.320 this sweeping law

00:06:09.400 that's going to affect

00:06:10.780 all of our social media companies

00:06:12.420 and all of us.

00:06:13.800 Have you been noticing

00:06:14.580 more and more

00:06:15.660 when you're on your iPhone

00:06:16.520 you have to accept cookies

00:06:19.080 or deny cookies?

00:06:21.120 That's in large part

00:06:22.700 due to what they're doing

00:06:23.740 in the EU.

00:06:24.840 What they do online

00:06:26.480 with their sweeping

00:06:27.460 anti-free speech laws

00:06:29.140 will affect your life.

00:06:31.680 So listen up

00:06:32.940 because as goes

00:06:34.940 the life of, you know,

00:06:36.380 the Graham Linemans

00:06:37.480 in the world,

00:06:38.520 so goes your life potentially

00:06:40.040 and we need to,

00:06:40.940 sorry, Linahan,

00:06:41.960 need to pay attention.

00:06:42.900 All right,

00:06:44.600 joining me now

00:06:45.020 to talk more about it

00:06:45.960 is Greg Lukianoff.

00:06:48.080 He's president

00:06:48.940 and CEO of FIRE,

00:06:50.860 the Foundation

00:06:51.400 for Individual Rights

00:06:52.660 and Expression.

00:06:54.300 He's also the co-author

00:06:55.240 of the new book

00:06:56.520 War on Words,

00:06:58.160 10 Arguments

00:06:58.780 Against Free Speech

00:07:00.240 and Why They Fail.

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00:08:01.800 Greg, welcome back.

00:08:02.800 Great to have you.

00:08:03.880 Great to see you again, Megan.

00:08:05.300 This is getting crazy.

00:08:06.780 I realize there's

00:08:07.360 no First Amendment

00:08:08.060 in the UK,

00:08:09.520 but, you know,

00:08:10.740 we're kind of

00:08:11.340 of them.

00:08:12.600 You know,

00:08:12.800 we've got like a toe

00:08:14.180 still that connects

00:08:15.120 us very much to them.

00:08:16.120 We're all supposed

00:08:16.800 to be part of

00:08:17.360 the modern West

00:08:18.280 and have like

00:08:19.640 shared values.

00:08:21.320 And literally

00:08:22.880 all Graham did

00:08:24.540 was send out

00:08:25.640 three tweets.

00:08:27.200 I'm going to tell you

00:08:27.860 what they are.

00:08:28.400 You probably already know,

00:08:29.480 but we'll bring

00:08:29.980 this audience

00:08:30.520 up to speed

00:08:31.080 that just got him

00:08:32.360 arrested

00:08:33.060 for offensive speech

00:08:35.480 in the UK.

00:08:36.720 One,

00:08:37.280 April 19th,

00:08:38.300 showed a picture

00:08:39.440 of a trans rights rally

00:08:41.220 and captioned it,

00:08:42.580 a photo you can smell.

00:08:44.780 Two,

00:08:45.660 April 19th,

00:08:46.920 in a reply

00:08:47.900 to the picture

00:08:48.580 and a follow-up,

00:08:49.340 he writes,

00:08:50.100 I hate them.

00:08:51.540 Misogynists

00:08:52.060 and homophobes.

00:08:53.800 F them.

00:08:55.060 And number three,

00:08:55.880 on April 20th,

00:08:56.940 he writes,

00:08:58.460 if a trans-identified male

00:08:59.960 is in a female-only space,

00:09:02.280 he is committing

00:09:03.040 a violent,

00:09:03.940 abusive act.

00:09:05.280 Make a scene,

00:09:06.420 call the cops,

00:09:07.360 and if all else fails,

00:09:09.160 punch him in the balls.

00:09:11.020 That's it.

00:09:13.300 And this,

00:09:14.500 in the UK,

00:09:14.980 can get you arrested

00:09:15.840 with five-armed guards,

00:09:16.940 and God only knows

00:09:17.880 what the potential

00:09:18.560 punishment will be

00:09:19.540 if Graham does not prevail

00:09:21.340 in this case.

00:09:21.980 Your thoughts on it all, Greg?

00:09:24.120 Well, I think,

00:09:24.840 I'm going to say something

00:09:25.600 that might surprise you.

00:09:26.500 Actually,

00:09:26.900 it's good that they arrested him

00:09:28.380 because it's making people aware

00:09:30.000 of how insane

00:09:31.300 the law has gotten

00:09:32.960 in the UK

00:09:33.760 and honestly,

00:09:34.740 the rest of the,

00:09:35.660 you know,

00:09:36.060 so-called free world

00:09:37.140 at this point.

00:09:38.240 America,

00:09:38.800 at this point,

00:09:39.380 is truly alone

00:09:41.040 in protecting free speech

00:09:42.880 as passionately

00:09:44.980 as we do.

00:09:46.220 And thank goodness

00:09:46.780 we have the First Amendment

00:09:47.880 because, of course,

00:09:48.740 the unfree world

00:09:49.640 is a nightmare.

00:09:50.640 You know,

00:09:50.860 they've been using AI

00:09:52.260 in Iran and China

00:09:53.980 to bring a whole new level

00:09:56.180 of dystopia.

00:09:57.120 But in the European Union,

00:09:58.800 in the UK,

00:09:59.660 in Canada,

00:10:00.440 in Australia,

00:10:01.880 the situation for free speech

00:10:03.600 is getting more

00:10:04.260 and more desperate.

00:10:05.280 I mean,

00:10:05.520 just to put this

00:10:06.080 in perspective,

00:10:07.580 about 2,000 people

00:10:08.920 were arrested per year

00:10:10.180 in the first Red Scare,

00:10:11.480 which was 1919 and 1920.

00:10:14.260 12,000 people,

00:10:16.560 approximately,

00:10:17.220 have been arrested

00:10:18.440 this year

00:10:19.120 in the UK alone.

00:10:21.200 And they're half our population

00:10:22.240 at the time

00:10:23.160 of the Red Scare.

00:10:24.100 So we're talking about

00:10:25.380 a genuine

00:10:26.200 free speech crisis

00:10:27.940 that when you go

00:10:29.120 to Britain still,

00:10:29.840 and my mom's British,

00:10:30.640 so this was literally

00:10:31.820 very close to home.

00:10:33.200 They used to laugh at us

00:10:34.260 about our political correctness

00:10:35.520 in the United States.

00:10:36.840 But now,

00:10:37.740 they'll be like,

00:10:38.300 oh, well, yeah,

00:10:38.880 it was rude.

00:10:40.160 It's like,

00:10:40.460 are you insane?

00:10:42.320 And the funny thing

00:10:43.240 is they're doing this

00:10:44.000 to route out fascism

00:10:45.260 in their own minds.

00:10:46.820 It's kind of like,

00:10:47.460 hmm.

00:10:50.060 Yeah,

00:10:50.580 they're dangerous.

00:10:54.340 They're genuinely dangerous.

00:10:56.520 I'm not sure

00:10:57.300 where this goes,

00:10:58.200 how much more radical

00:10:59.180 they can get.

00:11:00.340 They're arresting

00:11:01.440 people who are silently

00:11:02.840 praying outside

00:11:03.780 of abortion clinics.

00:11:05.700 They're really hot

00:11:06.920 on the trans issue.

00:11:07.700 You cannot say anything

00:11:09.800 about trans activism,

00:11:12.080 trans activists,

00:11:13.460 the gender issue.

00:11:14.960 You have to be

00:11:15.620 completely woke

00:11:16.300 and politically correct on it,

00:11:17.540 or you can wind up

00:11:18.660 like Graham.

00:11:19.440 Graham,

00:11:20.120 I mean,

00:11:20.820 this is a celebrity.

00:11:21.900 He is a celebrity over there

00:11:23.420 who is very well known

00:11:24.800 for these hits.

00:11:26.000 And, of course,

00:11:26.920 our comics,

00:11:28.020 he's a comedy writer,

00:11:29.340 tend to be,

00:11:30.180 in many cases,

00:11:30.900 amongst the greatest geniuses.

00:11:32.580 Really,

00:11:32.900 they see the scenes

00:11:33.820 in the story.

00:11:34.860 They're our most important

00:11:35.540 cultural commentators.

00:11:36.620 They come to these issues

00:11:37.860 before many of us do,

00:11:39.020 and they're important

00:11:39.820 for that reason alone.

00:11:41.100 He actually gave an interview

00:11:42.080 to Jordan Peterson

00:11:42.880 a year ago or so.

00:11:44.900 It was December of 2024

00:11:45.840 and spoke about being canceled

00:11:48.000 because he's been very hot

00:11:49.080 on the trans issue.

00:11:49.880 Here's a bit of that

00:11:50.540 in Sat One.

00:11:51.760 I always think of that

00:11:53.080 Muhammad Ali line

00:11:54.420 where he said,

00:11:55.120 you know,

00:11:55.560 the Vietnamese

00:11:57.260 never called me

00:11:58.200 no N-word.

00:11:59.620 And I feel the same way

00:12:00.520 about the left.

00:12:01.220 You know,

00:12:01.440 the right never called me

00:12:02.520 a bigot.

00:12:03.360 Right, right, right, right.

00:12:03.820 And they called me a bigot

00:12:04.900 for basic things

00:12:07.540 like saying,

00:12:08.220 hey,

00:12:08.360 you shouldn't be

00:12:08.840 cutting the breasts

00:12:09.440 off little girls.

00:12:11.420 You shouldn't be...

00:12:12.100 Yep,

00:12:12.340 there's one non-hate crime incident.

00:12:14.220 Yep.

00:12:14.600 We can keep piling them up.

00:12:16.320 There shouldn't be men

00:12:17.160 in women's prisons.

00:12:18.420 It's actually,

00:12:18.860 it's actually against

00:12:19.920 the Geneva Convention

00:12:21.160 to put men

00:12:21.720 in women's prisons.

00:12:23.420 Okay,

00:12:23.900 so he's speaking

00:12:24.540 complete sense,

00:12:26.100 Greg,

00:12:26.400 complete sense.

00:12:27.260 It's not even like,

00:12:28.120 here in America,

00:12:28.680 we always talk about

00:12:29.320 how you have to find

00:12:29.940 the least popular speech,

00:12:31.160 the most provocative

00:12:31.940 and unpopular

00:12:32.720 and that's the stuff

00:12:33.880 we need to zero in

00:12:34.940 on protecting.

00:12:36.320 What he's saying

00:12:37.300 over there

00:12:37.700 is actually

00:12:38.180 factual statements.

00:12:40.580 Now,

00:12:40.700 the one statement

00:12:41.280 about kick them

00:12:42.520 in the balls,

00:12:43.620 okay,

00:12:44.260 that's a little bit

00:12:44.920 more provocative

00:12:45.580 than his other statements,

00:12:46.580 but I mean,

00:12:47.060 that wouldn't even come close

00:12:48.340 to being censorable speech

00:12:50.100 here in America.

00:12:51.420 No,

00:12:52.020 that's nowhere near the line

00:12:53.380 when it comes to

00:12:54.240 First Amendment.

00:12:54.920 I mean,

00:12:55.080 basically the argument

00:12:55.920 is that it's incitement,

00:12:57.460 you know,

00:12:57.960 and that's literally

00:12:59.280 like when you're standing

00:13:00.120 outside the mayor's office

00:13:01.180 with a torch-wielding mob

00:13:03.400 and being like,

00:13:03.940 let's go burn down

00:13:04.520 the mayor's office.

00:13:05.460 Like the idea of like

00:13:06.280 theoretically in this circumstance

00:13:07.920 if there's a man

00:13:08.740 in a woman's dressing room

00:13:10.420 that you should,

00:13:11.160 if all else fails,

00:13:12.300 punch him in the balls,

00:13:13.500 is rightfully protected

00:13:14.840 in the United States.

00:13:17.340 And this has been going on.

00:13:18.680 I mean,

00:13:18.880 the scale of this

00:13:19.760 is just absolutely astounding

00:13:22.440 and it's been hard

00:13:23.760 to get people

00:13:24.180 to really pay attention

00:13:25.400 to how bad

00:13:25.920 it's gotten

00:13:26.200 in the United States

00:13:26.920 or for that matter,

00:13:28.220 sorry,

00:13:28.520 not in the United States,

00:13:29.360 in the UK.

00:13:31.180 And we were done

00:13:33.020 a real favor

00:13:33.660 actually by 60 Minutes

00:13:35.060 because they did actually

00:13:36.040 a piece

00:13:36.800 on how bad

00:13:37.400 it's gotten

00:13:37.660 in Germany as well.

00:13:39.000 We showed that.

00:13:40.580 60 Minutes loves it.

00:13:42.600 Yeah.

00:13:43.200 Oh,

00:13:43.440 the host did seem

00:13:45.140 to kind of be like,

00:13:45.980 oh,

00:13:46.100 this makes sense.

00:13:47.320 And they show

00:13:48.340 morning raids

00:13:49.720 of these,

00:13:51.460 you know,

00:13:51.960 speakers

00:13:52.500 and they gave

00:13:53.720 one example

00:13:54.320 of like a German

00:13:56.000 called a politician

00:13:57.440 a penis

00:13:58.340 and that got

00:14:00.100 him arrested.

00:14:01.740 It's like,

00:14:02.420 okay,

00:14:02.620 so you can't insult

00:14:03.800 politicians anymore

00:14:05.720 and they actually said

00:14:06.860 that that's even worse.

00:14:08.060 That's a day ending in Y

00:14:08.540 in the United States

00:14:09.820 of America.

00:14:10.560 I mean,

00:14:10.800 you know,

00:14:11.160 everybody would be under arrest

00:14:12.660 if you couldn't say

00:14:13.200 negative insulting things.

00:14:13.500 It's part of being

00:14:13.820 a free person

00:14:14.540 is you can pick

00:14:15.140 on your politicians.

00:14:16.760 Well,

00:14:17.020 speaking of politicians

00:14:17.760 in the UK,

00:14:18.380 J.D. Vance

00:14:18.900 went over there

00:14:19.600 and spoke

00:14:20.660 at the Munich Security Conference

00:14:22.180 in February

00:14:22.920 and really was

00:14:24.560 very frank

00:14:25.340 with our European friends

00:14:26.440 about where things

00:14:27.160 are going there.

00:14:28.220 And there was

00:14:29.020 very negative

00:14:30.180 leftist reaction

00:14:31.080 at home

00:14:31.460 to what he was saying.

00:14:32.500 Like,

00:14:32.940 oh,

00:14:33.080 how dare he lecture them?

00:14:34.360 Who does he think he is?

00:14:35.580 He was spot on.

00:14:37.760 And I'm going to show

00:14:38.440 this soundbite,

00:14:39.080 but I hope people

00:14:39.960 will listen to this

00:14:40.800 thinking about

00:14:41.420 what just happened

00:14:42.180 to Graham

00:14:43.200 and to many others.

00:14:45.620 I'm going to get into

00:14:46.160 what's happening

00:14:46.760 beyond Graham,

00:14:47.400 but watch this.

00:14:49.260 The Scottish government

00:14:50.280 began distributing

00:14:51.100 letters to citizens

00:14:52.160 whose houses

00:14:53.280 lay within

00:14:53.920 so-called

00:14:54.540 safe access zones,

00:14:56.800 warning them

00:14:57.400 that even private prayer

00:14:58.660 within their own homes

00:15:00.200 may amount

00:15:01.480 to breaking the law.

00:15:03.900 Naturally,

00:15:04.800 the government

00:15:05.160 urged readers

00:15:05.940 to report

00:15:06.480 any fellow citizens

00:15:07.640 suspected

00:15:08.220 guilty of thought crime.

00:15:10.800 In Britain

00:15:11.200 and across Europe,

00:15:13.480 free speech,

00:15:14.200 I fear,

00:15:14.840 is in retreat.

00:15:16.700 I mean,

00:15:17.720 that,

00:15:18.280 to put it mildly,

00:15:19.500 you've got

00:15:20.080 Adam Smith-Connor,

00:15:21.460 he's an army vet

00:15:22.100 who was fined

00:15:22.580 nearly $13,000

00:15:23.780 for silently praying

00:15:25.060 near an abortion

00:15:26.160 clinic over there.

00:15:27.380 Lucy Connelly

00:15:28.100 is one many have

00:15:28.920 cited over there.

00:15:29.620 She was sentenced

00:15:30.060 to 31 months

00:15:30.880 in prison

00:15:31.360 for calling

00:15:32.540 for deportations

00:15:33.880 of illegal immigrants

00:15:35.480 on X.

00:15:37.060 It's getting

00:15:37.660 genuinely scary,

00:15:39.340 and now you have

00:15:39.900 Nigel Farage,

00:15:41.060 who formed

00:15:41.700 his own party

00:15:42.280 over there,

00:15:42.700 which is on the rise

00:15:43.780 because of issues

00:15:44.780 like this,

00:15:45.480 who testified

00:15:46.220 in front of

00:15:47.200 the House,

00:15:48.160 the U.S.

00:15:48.560 House Judiciary Committee

00:15:49.480 this morning,

00:15:51.120 a couple of hours ago,

00:15:52.820 in the wake of

00:15:53.840 Graham Lineham's arrest

00:15:55.800 and had the following

00:15:57.140 warning,

00:15:57.800 sought for.

00:15:59.280 He's not even

00:16:00.300 a British citizen.

00:16:02.120 He's an Irish citizen.

00:16:04.260 This could happen

00:16:04.940 to any American man

00:16:06.620 or woman

00:16:07.160 that goes to Heathrow.

00:16:08.640 It is a potentially

00:16:09.640 big threat

00:16:10.440 to tech bosses,

00:16:12.740 to many,

00:16:13.400 many others.

00:16:13.880 This legislation

00:16:15.260 we've got

00:16:15.720 will damage

00:16:16.460 trade

00:16:17.620 between

00:16:18.400 our countries,

00:16:20.160 threaten free speech.

00:16:21.200 I've come today

00:16:21.960 as well

00:16:23.140 to be

00:16:23.880 a klaxon

00:16:24.680 to say to you,

00:16:26.560 don't allow

00:16:27.360 piece by piece

00:16:28.660 this to happen

00:16:29.680 here in America.

00:16:31.640 And you will be doing

00:16:32.560 us

00:16:33.440 and yourselves

00:16:34.800 and all freedom-loving

00:16:36.560 people a favour

00:16:37.440 if your politicians

00:16:39.040 and your businesses

00:16:40.380 said to the British

00:16:41.480 government,

00:16:42.140 you've simply

00:16:42.920 got this wrong.

00:16:44.420 At what point

00:16:45.260 did we become

00:16:45.960 North Korea?

00:16:47.000 Well, I think

00:16:47.520 the Irish comedy writer

00:16:49.060 found that out

00:16:50.080 two days ago

00:16:51.220 at Heathrow Airport.

00:16:53.880 Good for him.

00:16:58.260 Agreed.

00:17:00.240 Here's the,

00:17:01.100 I think,

00:17:02.460 what in part

00:17:02.840 he was referring to.

00:17:03.960 It goes beyond Graham

00:17:05.180 because you and I

00:17:06.060 are swept up

00:17:06.660 into this weird web

00:17:07.560 of censorship

00:17:08.120 that they're casting

00:17:08.960 not just in the UK

00:17:09.760 but in Europe

00:17:10.520 thanks to the EU

00:17:12.040 Digital Services Act

00:17:13.820 which is this law

00:17:16.100 that has been passed

00:17:18.140 that could cripple

00:17:19.800 free speech

00:17:20.560 not just over there

00:17:22.340 but over here.

00:17:23.280 It governs all of our

00:17:24.260 social media companies

00:17:25.260 which is now

00:17:25.820 the new public square

00:17:26.760 and it basically

00:17:29.180 bans speech

00:17:30.600 that is offensive.

00:17:32.920 Not basically.

00:17:34.200 I mean,

00:17:34.520 it does.

00:17:36.160 And what can,

00:17:37.700 it's relatively new

00:17:38.920 in terms of taking effect.

00:17:40.240 It was passed

00:17:40.680 a couple years ago

00:17:41.240 but in terms of

00:17:42.260 when it took effect

00:17:42.920 it's relatively new

00:17:43.800 and it says

00:17:45.640 that you can silence

00:17:47.680 or censor

00:17:48.900 voices that you find

00:17:50.600 offensive.

00:17:51.440 It gives super broad

00:17:52.260 powers to the

00:17:52.960 European Commission

00:17:53.800 to regulate content

00:17:55.660 deemed harmful.

00:17:57.560 Harmful.

00:17:58.340 It took effect

00:17:59.060 in 2024

00:17:59.660 and this is

00:18:01.020 by using

00:18:01.900 the biggest

00:18:02.700 and most expansive

00:18:03.660 definition of so-called

00:18:04.760 hate speech

00:18:05.740 one can imagine.

00:18:06.420 So Megyn Kelly

00:18:07.480 can get on

00:18:08.300 X

00:18:09.180 or

00:18:09.940 Facebook

00:18:11.140 and say

00:18:11.800 there are only

00:18:12.480 two sexes

00:18:13.880 male and female

00:18:14.940 and a man

00:18:15.820 cannot become a woman

00:18:16.900 and

00:18:17.700 Elon Musk

00:18:19.020 is fine with that

00:18:19.720 as the owner of X

00:18:20.560 and Mark Zuckerberg

00:18:21.760 at this point

00:18:22.180 would allow that

00:18:22.780 as the owner of Facebook

00:18:23.900 but they both

00:18:25.180 operate in Europe

00:18:26.380 and

00:18:27.420 this European

00:18:28.400 Commission

00:18:29.820 can look at

00:18:31.020 Megyn Kelly's

00:18:31.940 tweet

00:18:32.440 and say

00:18:33.040 no

00:18:33.820 that's hate

00:18:34.500 speech

00:18:34.840 and go to

00:18:35.780 those platforms

00:18:36.740 and insist

00:18:37.840 that they

00:18:38.380 shut down

00:18:39.360 the tweet

00:18:39.800 or even

00:18:40.500 potentially

00:18:40.940 take down

00:18:41.840 the account

00:18:42.440 Greg.

00:18:43.500 Yeah.

00:18:44.620 And there is

00:18:45.540 actually a lawsuit

00:18:46.240 I think that was

00:18:47.420 launched last week

00:18:48.460 with 4chan

00:18:49.400 trying to defend

00:18:50.300 findings

00:18:51.740 against it

00:18:53.140 under the

00:18:53.520 DSA

00:18:54.280 or actually

00:18:54.920 the findings

00:18:56.280 against it

00:18:56.680 are in Britain.

00:18:57.720 So one thing

00:18:58.340 I wanted to tell

00:18:58.900 your entire audience

00:18:59.900 is that

00:19:01.040 I would love

00:19:02.140 to have a case

00:19:03.160 that FIRE could

00:19:03.780 bring

00:19:04.120 that would

00:19:04.660 defend

00:19:05.100 American

00:19:05.700 free speech

00:19:06.320 rights

00:19:07.080 and the

00:19:07.400 rights

00:19:07.900 of American

00:19:08.360 companies

00:19:08.820 from

00:19:09.260 encroachment

00:19:09.880 from European

00:19:11.620 laws

00:19:12.480 or laws

00:19:13.500 from the UK

00:19:14.060 because this

00:19:14.780 could sink

00:19:16.300 our free speech

00:19:16.980 here.

00:19:17.420 Actually

00:19:17.580 we just

00:19:18.500 wrote a book

00:19:19.020 on this

00:19:19.420 called

00:19:19.620 Authoritarians

00:19:20.300 in the Academy

00:19:20.900 Sarah McLaughlin

00:19:21.720 at FIRE

00:19:22.020 wrote it

00:19:22.440 and it's

00:19:23.040 about how

00:19:23.760 China

00:19:24.200 and Qatar

00:19:24.780 are actually

00:19:25.860 using their

00:19:26.420 power and

00:19:26.780 influence

00:19:27.160 to limit

00:19:27.680 free speech

00:19:28.260 on campuses

00:19:28.900 in the United

00:19:29.400 States

00:19:29.860 but what

00:19:30.520 the European

00:19:30.880 Union

00:19:31.360 is doing

00:19:32.460 and what

00:19:32.640 the UK

00:19:32.940 is doing

00:19:33.620 could reach

00:19:34.720 just as far.

00:19:37.320 How?

00:19:37.460 How is China

00:19:38.540 using its

00:19:39.260 influence

00:19:39.640 to silence

00:19:40.600 free speech

00:19:41.240 on American

00:19:41.680 university

00:19:42.080 campuses?

00:19:43.560 Pressuring

00:19:44.240 different

00:19:44.780 administrations

00:19:45.500 to punish

00:19:46.860 Chinese national

00:19:48.000 students

00:19:48.480 who are

00:19:48.900 critical

00:19:50.180 of China

00:19:51.120 to shut

00:19:51.900 down events

00:19:52.480 to report

00:19:53.340 back

00:19:54.420 situations

00:19:55.300 where

00:19:55.840 Chinese

00:19:56.440 nationals

00:19:56.960 are

00:19:57.360 saying

00:19:59.540 things

00:19:59.800 that are

00:20:00.200 critical

00:20:00.460 of

00:20:00.920 the

00:20:01.100 crackdown

00:20:01.440 in Hong

00:20:01.700 Kong

00:20:01.960 for

00:20:02.160 example

00:20:02.580 or

00:20:03.560 for

00:20:03.720 that

00:20:03.880 matter

00:20:04.200 when they

00:20:04.920 try to

00:20:05.160 have events

00:20:05.680 that feature

00:20:06.100 the Dalai Lama

00:20:06.860 or express

00:20:07.740 support for

00:20:08.300 Tibet

00:20:08.660 they're figuring

00:20:09.300 all sorts

00:20:09.860 of ways

00:20:10.240 to exert

00:20:10.800 pressure

00:20:11.220 on various

00:20:11.820 campuses

00:20:12.220 to get

00:20:12.580 that punished

00:20:13.140 or shut

00:20:13.520 down.

00:20:14.860 So it's

00:20:14.980 basically

00:20:15.280 what they're

00:20:15.620 doing to

00:20:15.880 the film

00:20:16.200 industry

00:20:16.480 here in

00:20:17.340 America.

00:20:17.900 Exactly

00:20:18.380 what they're

00:20:18.800 doing to

00:20:19.100 the film

00:20:19.360 industry.

00:20:20.180 It's

00:20:20.340 amazing.

00:20:20.840 You know

00:20:21.300 it's like

00:20:21.720 this is the

00:20:22.760 same reason

00:20:23.360 why you don't

00:20:23.840 let Pfizer

00:20:24.540 advertise

00:20:25.120 on your

00:20:25.760 show

00:20:26.160 because

00:20:26.900 once they

00:20:27.600 control

00:20:28.060 your salary

00:20:29.000 they control

00:20:29.960 your speech

00:20:30.780 and what's

00:20:31.660 happening is

00:20:32.100 we're so

00:20:32.640 beholden to

00:20:33.300 China and

00:20:33.960 its dollars

00:20:34.660 or you know

00:20:35.540 it's yen

00:20:36.000 whatever

00:20:36.360 that we

00:20:37.460 bend the knee

00:20:38.260 when they

00:20:38.660 call us up

00:20:39.180 and say

00:20:39.460 don't put

00:20:39.980 that in

00:20:40.260 your movie

00:20:40.680 we don't

00:20:41.280 want to

00:20:41.520 see that

00:20:41.900 patch

00:20:42.320 or that

00:20:42.580 poster

00:20:42.960 or that

00:20:43.300 messaging

00:20:43.780 and Hollywood

00:20:44.780 has bent

00:20:45.200 the knee

00:20:45.580 and now

00:20:46.020 you're

00:20:46.220 saying

00:20:46.460 this is

00:20:46.760 happening

00:20:47.080 when it

00:20:47.660 comes to

00:20:47.940 speech

00:20:48.220 on

00:20:48.360 university

00:20:48.780 campuses

00:20:49.320 and

00:20:50.000 instead

00:20:50.320 of having

00:20:50.760 a very

00:20:51.200 strong

00:20:51.600 instinct

00:20:52.120 of saying

00:20:52.720 forgive me

00:20:53.460 but fuck

00:20:54.840 off

00:20:55.560 this is

00:20:56.520 the United

00:20:56.920 States

00:20:57.320 of America

00:20:57.960 we're

00:20:58.840 doing it

00:20:59.500 we're going

00:20:59.940 along with

00:21:00.460 it

00:21:00.740 yeah

00:21:01.700 no

00:21:02.040 and that's

00:21:02.600 one of the

00:21:02.880 reasons why

00:21:03.360 I think

00:21:03.580 we should

00:21:03.820 all be

00:21:04.100 concerned

00:21:04.480 about this

00:21:05.140 unreviewable

00:21:05.940 power

00:21:06.260 that the

00:21:06.640 secretary

00:21:06.980 of state

00:21:07.420 has

00:21:07.760 to kick

00:21:08.620 out

00:21:08.820 anyone

00:21:09.200 who

00:21:09.800 in the

00:21:10.660 sole

00:21:10.840 opinion

00:21:11.120 of the

00:21:11.300 secretary

00:21:11.580 of state

00:21:11.940 is adverse

00:21:12.560 to foreign

00:21:13.040 policy

00:21:13.560 let's talk

00:21:14.400 about that

00:21:14.840 because I've

00:21:15.240 defended that

00:21:15.780 I've

00:21:15.960 defended that

00:21:16.420 and I know

00:21:16.720 we're in

00:21:18.160 disagreement

00:21:18.540 a bit

00:21:18.880 on this

00:21:19.160 but I

00:21:19.400 really want

00:21:19.800 to hear

00:21:19.980 your

00:21:20.120 argument

00:21:20.360 well

00:21:21.360 let's

00:21:21.860 take the

00:21:22.100 Graham

00:21:22.260 Linehan

00:21:22.540 case

00:21:22.960 you know

00:21:23.420 Graham

00:21:23.740 Linehan

00:21:24.320 you know

00:21:24.720 like he said

00:21:25.760 some anti-trans

00:21:27.040 activist things

00:21:27.860 and you can

00:21:28.420 imagine under

00:21:29.220 a future

00:21:29.760 AOC

00:21:30.300 you know

00:21:31.200 administration

00:21:32.260 there would

00:21:33.220 be people

00:21:33.600 in her

00:21:33.860 administration

00:21:34.300 like we

00:21:34.860 should

00:21:35.020 return

00:21:35.320 this

00:21:35.520 person

00:21:35.820 to be

00:21:36.060 prosecuted

00:21:36.620 in the

00:21:36.920 UK

00:21:37.140 for his

00:21:38.000 transphobic

00:21:39.100 things

00:21:39.440 that he

00:21:39.960 said

00:21:40.300 and under

00:21:41.480 the laws

00:21:42.040 it currently

00:21:42.540 stands

00:21:43.060 the secretary

00:21:43.700 of state

00:21:44.100 under that

00:21:44.600 administration

00:21:45.160 could kick

00:21:45.720 that person

00:21:46.180 out of

00:21:46.980 the country

00:21:47.600 without any

00:21:49.120 review

00:21:49.780 whatsoever

00:21:50.560 it's the

00:21:51.020 reason why

00:21:51.640 Trump's

00:21:52.180 own

00:21:52.500 sister

00:21:53.040 when

00:21:53.740 asked to

00:21:54.960 review

00:21:55.280 that portion

00:21:55.980 of

00:21:56.400 regulations

00:21:57.060 that gives

00:21:57.540 that power

00:21:57.980 to secretary

00:21:58.520 of state

00:21:59.020 said it

00:21:59.800 was

00:22:00.040 unconstitutionally

00:22:00.920 vague

00:22:01.380 and broad

00:22:02.540 so but

00:22:04.420 I mean

00:22:04.960 I guess

00:22:05.640 I don't

00:22:05.920 totally

00:22:06.360 understand

00:22:06.800 the analogy

00:22:07.600 because

00:22:08.120 Marco Rubio

00:22:09.380 is looking

00:22:09.900 at these

00:22:11.140 Hamas

00:22:11.880 loving

00:22:12.300 college

00:22:12.920 campus

00:22:13.380 students

00:22:13.860 saying

00:22:14.480 when you

00:22:15.320 say things

00:22:16.140 like

00:22:16.500 globalize

00:22:17.160 the

00:22:17.320 intifada

00:22:17.860 that is

00:22:18.720 not consistent

00:22:19.340 with the

00:22:19.640 foreign policy

00:22:20.280 of the United

00:22:20.680 States

00:22:21.100 which recognizes

00:22:22.120 Hamas

00:22:22.580 as a

00:22:22.880 terrorist

00:22:23.120 group

00:22:23.500 and you're

00:22:24.480 only here

00:22:25.080 on a

00:22:25.540 visitor's

00:22:26.000 pass

00:22:26.360 and so

00:22:27.240 it's like

00:22:27.620 having somebody

00:22:28.220 over for

00:22:28.720 dinner

00:22:29.000 you came

00:22:29.800 over

00:22:30.080 you got

00:22:30.500 drunk

00:22:30.960 you barfed

00:22:32.020 on my

00:22:32.380 brand new

00:22:32.800 living room

00:22:33.360 carpet

00:22:33.740 so you're

00:22:34.240 out

00:22:34.440 your visitor's

00:22:35.180 pass

00:22:35.560 is revoked

00:22:36.900 like why

00:22:38.340 why is that

00:22:39.540 not okay

00:22:40.000 when they're

00:22:40.380 just here

00:22:40.960 as visitors

00:22:41.900 and he

00:22:42.580 should be

00:22:43.160 wary of

00:22:44.080 visitors

00:22:44.760 coming over

00:22:45.340 here and

00:22:45.860 antagonizing

00:22:46.860 americans

00:22:48.400 and others

00:22:48.860 with speech

00:22:49.540 that goes

00:22:50.300 against

00:22:50.600 what we've

00:22:51.440 stated as a

00:22:51.960 policy that

00:22:52.460 we we

00:22:53.000 support which

00:22:53.560 is keeping

00:22:54.160 terrorists out

00:22:54.820 and opposing

00:22:55.380 terrorism

00:22:55.920 but when it

00:22:57.320 comes it's the

00:22:58.280 exact same

00:22:58.720 principle of the

00:22:59.280 grand linehan

00:22:59.840 case like

00:23:00.340 essentially he

00:23:01.320 came to the

00:23:02.100 united states

00:23:02.660 because he

00:23:02.940 was afraid he

00:23:03.560 was going to

00:23:03.900 get arrested

00:23:04.620 in the uk

00:23:05.360 for his

00:23:06.260 for his

00:23:07.480 trans critical

00:23:08.140 speech and

00:23:08.980 future

00:23:09.460 administrations

00:23:10.180 are probably

00:23:11.060 you know going

00:23:11.920 to say things

00:23:12.580 like it is the

00:23:13.580 policy of this

00:23:14.420 administration that

00:23:15.260 we support

00:23:15.880 trans rights

00:23:16.620 and and

00:23:17.500 well that's a

00:23:17.920 domestic policy

00:23:18.780 don't you think

00:23:19.560 foreign policy is

00:23:20.500 something that's

00:23:21.000 uniquely within the

00:23:21.800 control of the

00:23:22.360 executive branch

00:23:23.180 but but once you

00:23:24.740 actually have a

00:23:25.560 policy that's as

00:23:26.240 vague and broad as

00:23:26.940 the one the

00:23:27.280 secretary of state

00:23:28.100 has uh its

00:23:29.240 potential for

00:23:29.840 abuse is right

00:23:30.560 and once again

00:23:31.200 like so much so

00:23:32.040 that the one

00:23:32.600 person who's

00:23:33.120 reviewed it

00:23:33.680 trump's own

00:23:34.260 sister thought

00:23:34.940 thought it

00:23:35.340 went too far

00:23:36.380 so i'm saying

00:23:37.300 this is not a

00:23:37.960 power you want

00:23:38.500 to hand off

00:23:39.360 to anybody else

00:23:40.040 and when it

00:23:40.720 comes to the

00:23:41.120 way it's

00:23:41.380 actually been

00:23:41.800 used i mean

00:23:42.800 even even joe

00:23:43.840 rogan noticed

00:23:44.620 this case

00:23:45.160 the remesa

00:23:46.200 ozturk case

00:23:47.040 this is the

00:23:47.740 um she's a

00:23:48.440 muslim student

00:23:49.000 she was here

00:23:49.480 on her student

00:23:49.840 visa

00:23:50.140 she wrote an

00:23:51.240 op-ed saying

00:23:52.280 the tough

00:23:52.680 should divest

00:23:53.240 from israel

00:23:53.740 something i

00:23:54.220 disagree with

00:23:54.860 to be clear

00:23:55.440 but it wasn't

00:23:56.840 crazy it wasn't

00:23:58.040 bomb throwing

00:23:58.840 and and she

00:24:00.240 was uh

00:24:00.840 she she was

00:24:02.040 basically stuffed

00:24:03.040 into a van by

00:24:03.800 immigration people

00:24:04.580 like flown to

00:24:06.480 louisiana and

00:24:08.100 held more or less

00:24:08.860 in jail for weeks

00:24:09.860 until a judge said

00:24:10.880 no no no no

00:24:11.500 and and and

00:24:12.760 since you're a

00:24:13.440 fellow lawyer

00:24:13.960 megan there

00:24:14.800 is a supreme

00:24:15.720 court case um

00:24:16.760 on the books

00:24:17.360 called bridges v

00:24:18.100 wixen that of

00:24:19.060 course you can

00:24:19.620 consider things

00:24:20.300 like opinion um

00:24:21.560 and whether or not

00:24:22.420 someone's suitable

00:24:23.000 to get a visa in

00:24:23.880 the first place

00:24:24.620 but once they're

00:24:25.660 here people who

00:24:27.020 are here on a

00:24:27.600 visa are supposed

00:24:28.300 to have rights

00:24:29.300 that are similar

00:24:29.820 to ours under

00:24:30.820 the first amendment

00:24:31.500 under this 1945

00:24:32.420 case called

00:24:33.120 bridges v wixen

00:24:33.860 mm-hmm uh i guess

00:24:36.360 i just think when

00:24:37.080 it comes to foreign

00:24:37.860 policy and you're

00:24:39.020 in the midst of

00:24:39.720 supporting an ally

00:24:40.680 who's admits

00:24:41.280 themselves are in

00:24:42.640 the midst of a war

00:24:43.540 it does seem like

00:24:45.000 the secretary of

00:24:45.700 state should have

00:24:46.420 some power to say

00:24:47.740 yay or nay on

00:24:48.600 these visas that

00:24:49.840 have been granted

00:24:50.460 and if it's based

00:24:52.360 on ideology i guess

00:24:53.760 i'm fine with that

00:24:54.480 i i see it as a

00:24:55.940 much bigger deal

00:24:57.280 if you go after

00:24:58.220 an american city

00:24:59.020 american citizen

00:25:00.000 if american citizen

00:25:00.840 tomorrow comes out

00:25:01.940 and says i support

00:25:02.740 hamas i actually

00:25:03.560 think hamas is

00:25:04.240 right israel sucks

00:25:05.700 that's fair game

00:25:07.300 you can say that

00:25:08.000 even if it's a

00:25:08.860 terrorist organization

00:25:09.620 marco rubio cannot

00:25:10.480 throw you out he

00:25:11.200 cannot do anything

00:25:11.760 to you it's just

00:25:12.960 you're on much

00:25:13.500 shakier ground when

00:25:14.460 you really don't

00:25:15.320 have a right to be

00:25:16.120 here in the first

00:25:16.740 place well i think

00:25:18.540 i think of jordan

00:25:19.160 peterson you know

00:25:20.100 like who came to

00:25:21.820 the u.s partially

00:25:22.600 because of his

00:25:23.240 horrible treatment on

00:25:24.060 this very same issue

00:25:25.140 by the way um in

00:25:26.940 canada uh and the

00:25:28.260 idea that we could

00:25:29.280 just kick him out

00:25:30.060 at any time um

00:25:31.700 even though he's on

00:25:33.320 a visa because of

00:25:34.140 speech that any

00:25:34.940 other american

00:25:35.640 could actually say

00:25:36.460 doesn't sit well

00:25:37.440 with your civil

00:25:37.920 libertarian

00:25:38.440 again it's only

00:25:41.500 with respect to

00:25:42.180 foreign policy

00:25:43.040 speech that goes

00:25:43.960 against the foreign

00:25:44.820 policy of the

00:25:45.700 administration so

00:25:46.540 it's not some

00:25:47.200 blanket you can

00:25:48.520 throw anybody out

00:25:49.520 for any speech

00:25:50.280 they make it's a

00:25:51.620 limited provision

00:25:52.360 and it isn't clear

00:25:53.740 whether it's going

00:25:54.360 to be upheld i

00:25:55.080 mean it's it's

00:25:55.860 been challenged

00:25:56.480 it's working its

00:25:57.340 way through the

00:25:57.900 system on whether

00:25:58.660 that permission

00:26:00.820 slip to the

00:26:01.560 secretary of state

00:26:02.420 is consistent

00:26:03.180 with our first

00:26:03.860 amendment and a

00:26:04.700 lawyer smarter

00:26:05.560 than yours truly

00:26:06.320 will ultimately

00:26:07.000 have to say on

00:26:08.180 that specifically

00:26:09.060 nine of them

00:26:09.620 sitting in black

00:26:10.960 robes though i i

00:26:12.580 take it back

00:26:13.000 because not each

00:26:13.520 one of them is

00:26:14.040 smarter than

00:26:14.900 yours truly a

00:26:16.740 couple couple

00:26:17.580 of them definitely

00:26:18.140 are though okay

00:26:19.300 well i'm horrified

00:26:20.260 by this graham

00:26:21.120 case i can't wait

00:26:21.800 to talk to him

00:26:22.380 about it and i

00:26:23.860 like i'm still

00:26:25.080 kind of shocked

00:26:25.800 that it's even

00:26:26.360 happening um i

00:26:27.480 want to talk to

00:26:27.980 you about though

00:26:28.420 about that the

00:26:29.020 trans thing because

00:26:29.760 this has become

00:26:30.540 you know when we

00:26:32.560 start to bully and

00:26:33.440 self-censor ourselves

00:26:34.620 the outside censors

00:26:35.960 have really gotten

00:26:36.760 it right they've

00:26:37.820 done their job you

00:26:38.940 know they've really

00:26:39.520 won and there was

00:26:41.000 an extraordinary

00:26:41.460 admission by malcolm

00:26:42.760 gladwell famed

00:26:44.220 author he's written

00:26:45.180 so many great books

00:26:46.100 he's been on this

00:26:47.020 show before i like

00:26:48.780 malcolm he he

00:26:49.860 definitely struck me

00:26:50.920 as a bit woke when

00:26:52.640 he came on the show

00:26:53.300 in 2022 and um i'm

00:26:56.040 not one of the things

00:26:57.080 i hate about the

00:26:57.740 woke is how

00:26:58.220 censorious they

00:26:58.940 are um and he

00:27:01.560 had like at the

00:27:02.160 time he was like

00:27:02.920 sponsoring a podcast

00:27:03.760 by ibram x kendi

00:27:04.940 which i was like

00:27:05.420 why what he's too

00:27:07.000 smart for this and

00:27:08.380 he was also saying

00:27:09.340 some strange stuff

00:27:10.900 in the gender lane

00:27:11.740 uh you know very

00:27:12.940 open-minded and this

00:27:13.940 is 2022 look by this

00:27:15.620 point we understood

00:27:17.180 that boys should not

00:27:17.960 be in girls sports

00:27:18.740 but malcolm was a

00:27:19.560 little later to come

00:27:20.220 along but he has

00:27:20.860 come along to his

00:27:21.500 credit in any event

00:27:22.300 he hosted he

00:27:25.160 moderated a panel

00:27:26.500 with a bunch of

00:27:28.280 uh people who are

00:27:29.580 active on the

00:27:30.140 trans issue in

00:27:31.280 march of 2022 and

00:27:32.780 it was over leah

00:27:33.740 thomas among other

00:27:34.720 cases it was at

00:27:35.700 mit and the people

00:27:37.200 who are on his

00:27:37.940 panel included

00:27:39.380 russ tucker and

00:27:40.960 our audience may

00:27:41.660 remember russ

00:27:42.280 tucker he hosts

00:27:43.320 this um sports

00:27:44.620 podcast the real

00:27:45.720 science of sport

00:27:46.500 uh and he came on

00:27:47.840 to talk to us about

00:27:48.560 imein khalif over the

00:27:50.520 summer of 2024 and

00:27:53.120 was very fact-based

00:27:54.380 real no-nonsense and

00:27:56.300 laid it all out that

00:27:57.800 you know imein

00:27:58.300 khalif likely has

00:27:59.320 male testicles and

00:28:02.240 undescended and all

00:28:03.500 the stuff like this

00:28:04.360 guy knows what he's

00:28:04.920 talking about he's a

00:28:05.480 fact-based guy then

00:28:06.540 there's joanna harper

00:28:07.480 who's a more of a

00:28:09.280 trans activist um

00:28:10.740 she's joanna is i

00:28:12.820 that joanna's been on

00:28:15.320 this program as well

00:28:15.960 um and then a third

00:28:17.740 panelist so malcolm

00:28:18.780 moderates the panel

00:28:20.020 and here's a moment

00:28:22.660 that happened on the

00:28:24.340 panel this is joanna

00:28:25.240 harper in 7c i would

00:28:29.480 say thank you that if

00:28:30.840 we let trans women

00:28:32.400 compete in women's

00:28:34.000 sport then we have to

00:28:35.000 let them win not win

00:28:36.460 disproportionately but

00:28:38.200 win at least some of

00:28:39.360 the time okay so

00:28:42.600 joanna's saying we

00:28:43.780 have to let trans

00:28:44.860 athletes win we must

00:28:46.440 uh if they're going

00:28:47.540 to participate in the

00:28:48.280 women's sports we have

00:28:48.900 to let them win and

00:28:49.860 now malcolm was

00:28:51.160 there and he just

00:28:53.420 gave an interview to

00:28:55.060 ross tucker that same

00:28:56.700 guy i just mentioned

00:28:57.560 and he talks about

00:28:59.360 that moment with the

00:29:00.900 benefit of hindsight

00:29:01.880 in sat 7b and at one

00:29:05.420 point they turned to

00:29:06.380 you ross and they

00:29:08.000 said ross you have to

00:29:11.100 let us win and it was

00:29:13.200 at that moment that i

00:29:14.660 realized this position

00:29:17.040 has gone this argument

00:29:19.640 has gone to the

00:29:20.520 furthest extreme what

00:29:22.780 the trans movement is

00:29:24.500 not asking for it uh

00:29:26.300 they're not asking for

00:29:27.300 you know a place at the

00:29:28.940 table they're not asking

00:29:30.040 for to be treated with

00:29:32.500 respect and dignity what

00:29:34.540 they're asking is for no

00:29:36.040 one to question the

00:29:37.500 considerable physical

00:29:38.680 physiological advantage they

00:29:39.960 bring to the sport and no

00:29:41.280 one to question if

00:29:42.660 they're going to win

00:29:43.180 these races by five

00:29:44.840 seconds suck it up

00:29:46.740 very good point and very

00:29:50.240 true and here's what

00:29:51.520 brings me to you on it

00:29:52.740 greg you can comment on

00:29:53.820 that too but uh now

00:29:55.820 here's malcolm saying

00:29:57.720 he's seen the error of his

00:30:00.180 ways and how embarrassed

00:30:02.080 he is about the way he

00:30:03.860 moderated that panel just

00:30:06.120 three years ago sat 7

00:30:07.540 if we did a replay of

00:30:10.260 that exact panel at the

00:30:12.320 sloan conference this

00:30:13.940 coming march it runs in

00:30:16.900 exactly the opposite

00:30:17.980 direction and it would

00:30:20.220 be i suspect near

00:30:22.440 unanimity in the room

00:30:24.100 that trans athletes have

00:30:26.980 no place in uh in the

00:30:29.720 female category i don't

00:30:31.740 think there's any question

00:30:32.680 i just think it was a

00:30:33.600 strange i mean i felt i

00:30:35.300 mean i was the reason

00:30:37.580 i'm ashamed of my

00:30:38.720 performance of that

00:30:39.640 panel because i share

00:30:41.800 your position a hundred

00:30:43.120 percent and i was

00:30:44.960 cowed i was cowed an

00:30:48.540 extraordinary mission good

00:30:49.520 for him for making it

00:30:50.480 glad he's no longer

00:30:51.360 feeling that way but

00:30:52.780 that's what happens when

00:30:53.680 the bullies get in your

00:30:54.780 head and it's one of main

00:30:56.860 goals of yes the woke and

00:30:59.140 certainly the transgender

00:31:00.160 movement activists your

00:31:01.960 thoughts on it greg

00:31:02.560 yeah i mean we all saw

00:31:05.340 it happen um and the

00:31:07.380 intensity with which over

00:31:08.840 the course of about 10

00:31:09.760 years we went from well

00:31:12.340 no of course biological men

00:31:14.400 and women are different

00:31:15.400 um and uh and also like in

00:31:19.780 first amendment circles uh

00:31:21.540 how like how quickly people

00:31:22.800 started making the argument

00:31:23.820 that yes it could be

00:31:25.180 potentially harassment if

00:31:26.560 you don't call someone um

00:31:28.800 by their chosen pronoun or

00:31:31.000 if even there was a law

00:31:32.740 in colorado that we

00:31:33.560 opposed for example that

00:31:34.740 was saying that you

00:31:35.920 could potentially have

00:31:36.460 your kids taken away if

00:31:37.560 you don't use their new

00:31:39.020 chosen name and i'm like

00:31:40.100 so what you're telling me

00:31:41.320 here is you're saying that

00:31:42.340 someone could lose their

00:31:43.420 kids if they call them

00:31:44.920 their legal name and there

00:31:47.840 was so much pressure around

00:31:49.100 this issue and i'm i'm

00:31:49.980 honestly to this day still

00:31:51.420 kind of uh embarrassed on

00:31:52.820 behalf of a lot of first

00:31:54.020 amendment activists who

00:31:55.420 actually during this time

00:31:57.300 were were were more or

00:31:59.080 less saying it's like well

00:31:59.880 yeah no i mean like not

00:32:01.000 calling someone who is

00:32:02.160 biologically male her could

00:32:04.360 actually by itself be

00:32:06.000 harassment um you know

00:32:07.680 fire was very clear that

00:32:08.980 can never be harassment by

00:32:11.580 itself um and i feel like

00:32:14.400 but i feel like what people

00:32:15.980 were just afraid to admit was

00:32:17.580 that they were and it's good

00:32:19.220 that malcolm put it this way

00:32:20.340 is people were just terrified

00:32:21.420 of the trans rights activists

00:32:22.600 but then started rationalizing

00:32:24.100 why they agreed with them and

00:32:25.200 why they weren't actually

00:32:26.060 being cowed um and i think

00:32:28.580 we're waking up from this

00:32:29.400 to a degree but what we're

00:32:30.700 seeing in england you know

00:32:31.900 with the graham linihan case

00:32:32.840 to bring it back to that

00:32:33.620 again you know is the fact

00:32:35.300 that this is far from over

00:32:36.920 mm-hmm i so what what is

00:32:40.520 your advice as somebody who's

00:32:42.300 spent the vast majority of

00:32:43.560 your adult life fighting for

00:32:46.060 free speech rights on college

00:32:47.380 campuses and other campuses

00:32:49.520 for students who get chastised

00:32:52.780 and punished by these

00:32:54.420 university professors virtually

00:32:55.940 all of whom are radical

00:32:57.760 leftists who don't want to

00:32:59.360 hear conservative thought or

00:33:01.000 just the questioning of their

00:33:03.000 liberal orthodoxy what is your

00:33:05.500 advice for young conservatives

00:33:06.900 going off to college now and

00:33:08.280 feeling a little more empowered

00:33:10.540 certainly gravitating a bit more

00:33:13.400 to the trump movement the maga

00:33:14.840 movement and not being woke

00:33:16.760 rejecting wokeism wholesale but

00:33:18.980 still under the same pressure by

00:33:21.120 those in charge to say the right

00:33:24.360 thing on the exam to speak the

00:33:26.500 right way in class to have the

00:33:28.440 proper opinions in mixed company

00:33:31.080 oh megan i could i could do like a

00:33:34.520 couple days on what my advice would

00:33:36.620 be here but but but the most basic

00:33:39.280 part of it is if someone's saying

00:33:41.360 that you have that you have to say

00:33:43.440 something that you do not believe

00:33:44.680 is true that you have to call

00:33:46.040 someone by a name that you don't

00:33:47.620 believe that is theirs or by a

00:33:49.980 pronoun that you don't believe

00:33:51.680 that actually applies to them

00:33:52.800 that's compelled speech

00:33:54.480 compelled speech is worse than

00:33:56.080 telling someone that what they

00:33:58.140 can't say it's telling someone

00:33:59.480 what they must say that's

00:34:01.660 totalitarian and if that case

00:34:04.000 comes up if you have actually that

00:34:05.540 situation contact fire because

00:34:07.500 there's a long string of cases that

00:34:09.600 indicate you know compelled speech

00:34:11.800 is the heart of darkness and you

00:34:14.040 have rights under those

00:34:15.160 circumstances how about just the

00:34:17.920 pronoun game in general because

00:34:19.900 it's very annoying i'll tell you

00:34:22.380 what this is the first week of

00:34:23.340 school where we go and and we

00:34:25.320 intentionally chose non-woke schools

00:34:26.900 and our son's school is definitely

00:34:29.540 non-woke and very reasonable they're

00:34:31.380 not they're not maga you know

00:34:33.360 they're just non-woke they're old

00:34:34.740 school traditionalists the way like

00:34:36.360 we used to be where they keep this

00:34:38.140 ideology out of the classroom but our

00:34:40.720 girls school our daughter school is

00:34:42.460 woke more woke than i'd like and

00:34:45.000 first day of school all the forms

00:34:47.300 are given to my daughter in her

00:34:48.940 classes asking her to say her

00:34:50.620 pronouns it's an all-girls school

00:34:53.260 they all have the same damn

00:34:55.340 pronouns stop asking this i really

00:34:58.660 wanted her to say i'm not going to i

00:35:01.220 don't play that game i'm not playing

00:35:02.920 the pronoun game but you couldn't

00:35:04.660 because the forms were electronic and

00:35:06.560 they had to click something in order

00:35:08.600 to go to the next box and the forms

00:35:11.240 were mandatory it's infuriating but

00:35:13.900 it's another it's that too is a

00:35:15.640 forced a compelled speech in its own

00:35:18.180 way yeah well we've definitely seen

00:35:20.600 cases where uh like when it's in a

00:35:22.540 live context where people have said

00:35:24.440 i'm not i'm not playing with this i'm

00:35:26.720 not i'm not going to give you my

00:35:28.000 pronouns pronouns and increasingly i have

00:35:30.640 seen a lot of examples where someone

00:35:32.160 says like i'm not doing this like

00:35:33.800 when they go around the class and ask

00:35:35.480 for people trying to like no i'm opting

00:35:37.160 out where that's become increasingly

00:35:39.480 kind of acceptable um yeah where

00:35:41.980 people are like yep so so there is

00:35:43.820 some sanity returning to that um but i

00:35:46.460 but i do think that you know like this

00:35:48.700 is an ideology that there's been a lot

00:35:50.740 of celebration of like wokeness sort of

00:35:52.300 like going away i actually kind of like

00:35:53.980 my preferred term for wokeness is um

00:35:56.640 social justice fundamentalism it's tim

00:35:58.460 urban's term because i think it's like

00:35:59.700 i like it's kind of like it's kind of

00:36:01.660 like it's simply it's just this radical

00:36:03.400 kind of like belief that everybody must

00:36:05.460 comply with my essentially secular

00:36:07.680 religion and there's this idea that

00:36:09.960 it's gone away and it's like in some

00:36:12.060 circles and it's like no it hasn't um

00:36:14.040 it's it's still there nothing has

00:36:16.020 happened like uh that that's massively

00:36:18.240 changed this and it's going to come

00:36:19.900 back just as ferociously as the

00:36:21.960 political correctness of the mid 1980s

00:36:24.540 early 1990s came back with a vengeance

00:36:27.500 around 2014 this is all going to come

00:36:30.240 back unless people really stand up for

00:36:32.460 it and also frankly megan if people

00:36:34.200 start deciding people start to need to

00:36:36.520 to start deciding to go to entirely

00:36:38.140 different institutions to figure out

00:36:40.520 ways to do their k through phd

00:36:42.660 educations in different ways favoring

00:36:45.060 different ways that can't actually

00:36:46.640 coerce ideology out of them or won't

00:36:50.220 want to at least i really like that

00:36:51.920 social justice fundamentalism that's

00:36:54.020 exactly what it is well i'll be making

00:36:56.140 a phone call uh to my daughter's school

00:36:57.920 today i just think this is insane

00:36:59.300 everybody knows what the pronouns are

00:37:01.920 of these girls if you've got somebody

00:37:03.840 who's confused that's her issue my

00:37:06.680 daughter should not be forced to be

00:37:08.020 questioning pronouns at all because

00:37:10.180 some random unknown person in the

00:37:11.960 school may or may not be having gender

00:37:13.460 issues i just i completely reject the

00:37:16.560 entire discussion it's offensive it's

00:37:18.960 objectionable and it actually can cause

00:37:20.880 harm you do not inject confusion around

00:37:24.380 gender where it doesn't exist uh in any

00:37:28.140 event look this is why you've devoted

00:37:29.440 your whole life to things like war on

00:37:32.760 words 10 arguments against free speech

00:37:34.440 and why they fail your book the war on

00:37:36.900 words is well worth your time greg will

00:37:38.560 give you all the arguments you need to

00:37:40.880 stand up for free speech in america which

00:37:43.040 is under threat perhaps not quite as

00:37:44.960 badly as it is in the uk and in the eu but

00:37:48.280 hey it's it could be a harbinger of

00:37:50.680 things to come thanks for being here

00:37:51.860 absolutely thanks megan take care all

00:37:54.520 right coming up next bacha unger sargon

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00:38:57.640 what are the new technologies that will

00:39:02.800 change aviation well hydrogen would be one

00:39:05.320 for sure if we got there i mean hydrogen

00:39:07.280 it's not just a alternative fuel i mean

00:39:10.080 hydrogen would change would change it

00:39:12.080 significantly if we ever managed to break

00:39:14.080 the back of that today i'm speaking with

00:39:16.220 kalen rovinescu the former president of

00:39:19.480 air canada and a trailblazer in global

00:39:22.740 aviation join me chris hadfield on the on

00:39:26.520 energy podcast listen wherever you get

00:39:28.960 your podcasts

00:39:29.820 welcome back to the megan kelly show we've

00:39:36.400 got a lot of other big news to get to

00:39:37.700 today including president trump fighting

00:39:39.100 crime in democrat-run cities and fighting

00:39:41.000 the democratic politicians in the process

00:39:43.060 updates in the ebstein story and more want

00:39:45.700 to be joined now by batya angersargan whose

00:39:48.760 new show on news nation is called batya and

00:39:52.440 it debuts september 20th congrats batya

00:39:54.980 that's awesome

00:39:55.560 thank you so much megan i have to say you

00:39:58.960 have been such a role model for me for such

00:40:01.880 a long time i know so many journalists men and

00:40:05.540 women who aspire to be more like you every

00:40:07.600 single day so thank you so much for that for

00:40:10.400 the role modeling for the example you set that

00:40:13.700 you can be fiercely independent and never

00:40:16.340 bought by anybody and for everything you do

00:40:19.460 for this country thank you so much megan and

00:40:21.620 for having you you're so sweet you're so

00:40:23.400 sweet this is your moment this is not my

00:40:24.900 moment and god bless the folks over at news

00:40:26.800 nation because i know the folks who run that

00:40:28.520 joint they're very smart they're very talented

00:40:31.260 and it surprises me not at all that they took

00:40:33.560 a look at you and said why are why aren't we

00:40:36.240 hiring her we'll get her over here so congrats to

00:40:39.180 both of you you both have a wonderful future

00:40:41.540 ahead and i'm sure the show will be a big

00:40:42.960 success um okay let's talk about epstein

00:40:45.200 because that's what's happening right now on

00:40:46.600 capitol hill as i explained to the audience at

00:40:48.200 the top of the hour you kind of have the house

00:40:50.200 committee that subpoena oversight is subpoenaing

00:40:52.660 doj and been underwhelmed with what they've produced

00:40:56.440 and i expect to remain underwhelmed but then you

00:40:59.500 have the massey rokhana tandem pairing where

00:41:03.720 they're kind of going around everybody they are

00:41:05.540 trying to go through congress to like mandate

00:41:07.720 that virtually all documents real documents be

00:41:11.320 released we'll see we'll see how that goes

00:41:14.700 but they did have a presser this morning with a

00:41:17.360 bunch of epstein victims or women who say they

00:41:19.620 were his victims and i'll give you an example

00:41:22.240 here's lisa phillips who says she's committed to

00:41:25.780 sort of working outside of this process and making

00:41:28.240 sure the truth comes out her name is lisa phillips

00:41:30.620 again and it's not 50 several of us epstein

00:41:34.620 survivors have been discussing creating our own

00:41:36.820 list of names

00:41:37.620 we know the names

00:41:45.240 many of us were abused by them

00:41:50.360 now together as survivors we will confidentially compile the names we all know we're regularly

00:41:56.800 in the epstein world and it will be done by survivors and for survivors

00:42:02.340 no one else is involved

00:42:06.880 stay tuned for more details on that

00:42:09.340 because history is washing and so are the women

00:42:14.600 women who will come after us thank you

00:42:17.580 okay so i say good for them this is like

00:42:22.060 the actual men who are in epstein's circle this is their worst nightmare because

00:42:26.420 not all of them are pedophiles some of them just knew epstein i mean i think trump is in that

00:42:31.580 category i think alan dershowitz is in that category

00:42:34.260 um eventually steve bannon was kind of in that category because he was

00:42:38.260 advising epstein to some extent after he you know got in trouble i don't think these people did

00:42:43.520 anything wrong morally you know in terms of the girls but you know if the list is now up to the

00:42:49.860 survivors of like who was in his orbit a lot because the real officials won't tell us the names

00:42:55.780 of those who have been actually accused of bad actions you know i'm not surprised the women are

00:43:02.060 taking control of the situation and i think this is going to be an even worse outcome for men who

00:43:07.500 are potentially innocent of wrongdoing but your thoughts on it

00:43:11.020 it's very interesting because one of the journalists asked them well can you give us a preview of some

00:43:16.600 of the names on the list and they declined to do so because they're worried about getting sued which

00:43:22.280 i think is a good thing right you don't want people randomly naming people who haven't done anything

00:43:27.580 wrong i will say i thought the most interesting thing that happened was that the lawyer seemed to

00:43:33.860 dispel the myth that there was a big pedophile ring and what i mean by that is he was very clear and he

00:43:42.580 said at one point to one of the in the q a portion of the press conference he said let me be very clear

00:43:49.380 jeffrey epstein personally abused all of these women for his personal gratification and then and here's

00:43:57.100 the key point megan he said when they reached a certain age he then did farm some of them out

00:44:06.640 to some of his friends which to me i don't know if you agree with me but it does seem to suggest

00:44:12.300 that he was interested in them when they were underage and then when they reached a certain age one of

00:44:18.040 them even said when she got too old for him he kind of kicked her out and at that point he would

00:44:23.640 introduce them to his friends which does seem to suggest that those friends are not actually

00:44:30.140 implicated in pedophilia and possibly not even in anything criminal now the the the alan dershowitz

00:44:37.460 thing i think is very important because he's kind of for me the reason that i don't think that releasing

00:44:43.520 a full list is a good idea i think that he he he managed to to to prove that he had been falsely

00:44:51.920 accused but i have to say i don't think his reputation ever recovered from having been

00:44:57.200 associated with the scandal and i personally think that's kind of an unfair thing to do to a lot of

00:45:04.700 people the other thing i will just say is i do think that the women themselves are on kind of a

00:45:10.960 different page than ro Khanna and thomas massey they did not seem to want the same things to be released

00:45:18.760 i don't think they want everything released they kept saying is their footage of what happened to me

00:45:24.900 in the hands of the government as if the last thing they want is for that to be god forbid released right

00:45:30.760 so i do think they are being manipulated a little bit and used in this kind of gross titillating way

00:45:37.800 to hurt trump by people who see him as a political adversary see i think it's interesting what you said

00:45:43.840 about dershowitz i disagree that his reputation didn't recover i think what happened was dershowitz

00:45:48.940 never recovered from defending trump in the first impeachment trial that's what quote ruined his

00:45:54.100 reputation not that you use that word but with the left they they looked at him very differently after

00:45:59.600 that they couldn't forgive him his stories of being ignored and you know ostracized and martha's

00:46:03.940 vineyard go on that's really what did it it wasn't the epstein thing i think the left used that as an

00:46:09.220 excuse to say oh it's that i'm moral i i just have an objection they didn't care about epstein

00:46:13.960 the left couldn't give two shits about epstein until trump and recently told they saw it was like

00:46:19.240 an achilles heel potentially for trump um so i i don't think that these men will have trouble

00:46:25.220 rehabilitating themselves they will have to work for it though and the irony of what you said though

00:46:29.400 is alan dershowitz does think that the name should be released and he thinks men should have to defend

00:46:34.440 themselves same as he had to he's like you know what it shouldn't be that hard if he didn't do

00:46:39.400 anything it should be very easy to say this is bullshit i never went to the island or i went to

00:46:43.980 the island and i never met with any women or girls or what have you and the final point i was going to

00:46:48.280 make on epstein is i've told the audience this before i do know somebody who's very nice very close

00:46:53.940 to the epstein case and this person's never misled me everything they've told me has been true as far

00:46:59.900 as i can tell and uh this person has been saying from the beginning that this person doesn't view

00:47:05.520 epstein as a pedophile but that he was into the quote barely legal type that you know i don't know

00:47:13.640 if that's true i think if epstein could have an interlude with a 14 year old he he would have done

00:47:17.740 it and he probably did do it and that is a pedophile it's not the same as a six-year-old i accept that

00:47:23.840 there's a distinction you know between those two you know morally it's not i'm not justifying one

00:47:30.140 just to be clear um but i think that's probably right because i think if you looked 14 or were 14

00:47:35.160 he would probably spend time with you but if you looked 24 or were 24 he was over you um so anyway

00:47:43.240 the whole the whole case is very complicated and i'm interested in hearing these women's stories as i

00:47:48.120 have been in every woman's me too story to see what it's whether it's true what it tells us about power

00:47:52.700 what it tells us about women uh and all of it and i think more sunlight more more more sunlight

00:47:59.160 trump feels differently here's what he said stop 54

00:48:02.000 so this is a democrat hoax that never ends you know it reminds me a little of the uh kennedy

00:48:12.180 situation we gave him everything over and over again more and more and more and nobody's ever

00:48:17.680 satisfied from what i understand i could check but from what i understand

00:48:22.020 thousands of pages of documents have been given but it's really a democrat hoax because they're

00:48:28.480 trying to get people to talk about something that's totally irrelevant to the success that

00:48:33.760 we've had as a nation since i've been president uh even if you look at dc right now thoughts on that

00:48:40.860 one i gotta say megan i i think we may not agree on this but i just think trump knows his base

00:48:49.520 better than anybody and when he keeps saying this is a hoax he's not trying to convince them to drop

00:48:56.280 something he thinks will hurt him i think he feels like no one cares about this they care about really

00:49:04.400 important things like kitchen table issues what he's doing to get the country back on track why

00:49:10.620 inflation is not going down faster like people have real concerns and they don't hold him personally

00:49:17.380 responsible for this i keep having like you know totally normie people ask me like why do i keep

00:49:24.580 hearing about this epstein thing like they don't quite understand why it's such a big topic so i'm kind of

00:49:32.300 with the president on this i don't think you get very far betting against trump's understanding of

00:49:37.760 where like the average american is at on an issue and i think he's really clocked it that this is

00:49:43.620 something that really preoccupies kind of elites on both sides but like average americans i think just

00:49:50.720 don't care that much about every jeff jeffrey epstein what do you think well i don't think it's elites on

00:49:56.060 the right who are interested in epstein i think it's like you know the damn bongino is not an elite

00:50:00.920 now he's you know part of government but like when he was talking about this on his show it wasn't

00:50:05.400 because he had some privilege position you know that he was going to exploit to the contrary it's

00:50:11.400 been people like cash like dan um podcasters on the right who have been saying what the hell we smell

00:50:18.780 a rat we think that these people in power protect their own and we're not being given the straight story

00:50:24.660 and we want the straight story because we do believe that powerful elites get away with this

00:50:30.060 shit when the rest of us don't like nobody else would and that we have a right to know what these

00:50:36.520 elites were doing and why they're covering for each other because everybody within epstein circle was

00:50:40.220 pretty much well off connected or rich you know in one way shape or form so i just don't see this as

00:50:46.460 an elites issue um not this one i have interest in this case from a legal standpoint and i also think

00:50:53.780 trump's very first instinct it'd be one thing if after you know all these months trump was like get

00:50:58.620 over it we've done some releases i'm sick of talking about this shit but on day one he was like

00:51:04.200 jeffrey epstein who is interested in that story are we still talking about jeffrey epstein and it was

00:51:11.880 like what what are you saying your doj just released this ridiculous two-page memo trying

00:51:17.560 to declare it over that's why we're talking about it why are you acting like we just brought this up

00:51:23.400 out of the blue so that's really one of the things that set off the firestorm having said all that

00:51:28.400 it's not my top issue by far it's not one of my top 50 issues i just think the ongoing saga of it

00:51:36.060 is interesting so anyway okay um we're gonna pick it up on the back end of this break quick break more

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00:53:56.920 i'm megan kelly host of the megan kelly show on sirius xm it's your home for open honest and

00:54:04.780 provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political legal and cultural figures

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00:54:56.280 welcome back to the megan kelly show back with us now batia angersargan host of the brand new show

00:55:06.980 on news nation it'll be easy for you to search and find because it's called batia um okay so

00:55:13.600 trump's alive thank god alive and well happy to report we need to report it because for some

00:55:20.340 reason the loons on the left spent the entire weekend speculating that he might be dead based

00:55:26.320 on what some errant report that he had suffered a heart attack or something no based on the fact that

00:55:31.940 they hadn't actually seen him on camera for three days three days he had a presser he was out in the

00:55:41.700 news and then for three days he wasn't actually on camera holding a press event and they went into

00:55:47.260 meltdown speculating that he might be dead it led to people like george conway of the lincoln project

00:55:54.800 formerly married to kellyanne conway saying things like shh don't jinx it like if you talk about it

00:56:01.920 he might wind up alive they're like the fervor for this man's death was in full flower over the weekend

00:56:09.520 um there's one great example we have here which is jen saki now she of course i'm sure hope trump was dead

00:56:18.680 and she was one of the chief cover uppers cover ups or uppers uh for joe biden's mental infirmity

00:56:27.420 she worked for joe biden for the first half of his presidency and said nothing nothing about the

00:56:33.440 fact that the auto pen was really president and now she wants to be the authority on trump's

00:56:38.920 possible health problems his status as an alive or a dead president something she really should keep

00:56:46.180 quiet about given that she covered for joe biden and here's what she said after trump oh miraculously

00:56:52.500 resurfaced playing golf very much alive here she is in sat 26 we went from trump saying he hadn't

00:57:01.200 heard about the rumors of his death to trump saying he did hear about them from reports really can't

00:57:05.760 make this stuff up sometimes and look we may never know why donald trump suddenly spent a week hiding

00:57:11.980 entirely from the american public but you don't actually need baseless online conspiracies to explain

00:57:17.480 why he might not want to show his face in public right now a newly released wall street journal

00:57:22.160 poll finds that the percentage of americans who think they have a good chance of improving their

00:57:26.620 standard of living has fallen to just 25 percent okay badya the man had a presser last tuesday

00:57:36.540 he was seen on sunday golfing she's very very upset that she had to go i guess wednesday through

00:57:43.280 saturday so okay four days not see we may never know we you know we we may never know why he spent a

00:57:50.340 week hiding the nerve it's so insane because think of what they're telling on themselves that trump is so

00:58:01.660 active so efficient so accomplished so constantly working for the american people in the public eye

00:58:13.060 that if you go for 12 hours without seeing him he might be dead right like just think about what

00:58:20.760 that means for what they are actually admitting they're just telling on themselves of course the

00:58:28.160 real reason they wish he was dead is because they cannot compete against him and the reason they

00:58:34.540 can't compete against him is that despite the fact that the left portrays donald trump as some sort

00:58:40.880 of 21st century george wallace what he actually is is a 21st century fdr he stole all of the best parts

00:58:49.140 of their agenda he's anti-war he's pro-worker and he's socially moderate this is the nature of the

00:58:56.060 american people and they know that they have nothing to offer the american people to convince them to come

00:59:04.840 back to the democratic party and so they are left to simply wish that he dies i mean this is such a

00:59:12.520 capitulation megan this is what defeat looks like yes it's so true it's so that's their only way out

00:59:21.600 is to hope for an early demise which is just so vile um you've got tim waltz okay jen saki she's a

00:59:31.420 talking head whatever but tim waltz was recently the vice presidential candidate on the democratic

00:59:36.160 ticket maybe you would expect a little better a little higher uh in terms of the rhetoric you

00:59:42.900 would be disappointed here is uh sought 27 you get up in the morning and you doom scroll through things

00:59:49.920 and although i will say this the last few days you woke up thinking there might be news um just saying

00:59:57.700 just saying there will be news sometime just so you know there will be news

01:00:02.820 look at him so chipper don't and don't worry there will be news in other words trump will die

01:00:10.140 something to look forward to the absolute nerve especially with a president who was subjected to

01:00:16.240 at least two assassination attempts and just dodged death in recent history to the great relief of

01:00:23.720 every sane person in the nation now to be openly you know talking about what a delicious day it's

01:00:29.660 going to be it's totally irresponsible i mean it's godless is what it is it is truly truly godless and

01:00:37.400 i remember the first time somebody an over-credentialed leftist elite said to me no i wish that the shooter

01:00:45.040 had succeeded and i was just in disbelief what has donald trump ever done to you i mean talk about

01:00:54.520 the american dream jen saki says americans don't believe they have access to the american dream

01:00:58.900 that's thanks to democrat policy amen like nafta you know like shipping five million really good

01:01:06.980 middle-class jobs overseas to build up china's middle class for some reason defunding vocational

01:01:12.940 training thank you president obama cutting off another avenue that working-class americans had

01:01:18.120 to the american dream since the 70s democrats democrats built an economy that was an upward

01:01:25.420 funnel of wealth from the pockets of working-class americans into the top 10 percent the over-credentialed

01:01:32.220 leftist progressive college elites it was wage theft of their working-class neighbors and then now these

01:01:40.000 same rich people who got rich off of the mass immigration that resulted in the downward mobility

01:01:45.960 of working-class americans sit there saying oh wow i wonder why working-class people don't think they

01:01:50.840 have access to the american dream huh do you think it's because you welcomed in millions and millions of

01:01:55.880 illegal immigrants to replace them in the job market and drive down the wages and live off of the

01:02:01.120 government and you know take their welfare like it's so obvious it's so obvious the nerve of her to use that

01:02:09.260 wall street journal poll which i i do want to discuss with you but on the decrease in believing

01:02:14.340 in the american dream that it's possible for me or my children that came out this week and the nerve of

01:02:20.300 somebody who not only is a democrat but worked for the previous democrat administration a guy who was vice

01:02:26.340 president for eight years under barack obama and jen saki's been tied to them all to be like it's all

01:02:32.920 trump's fault it's the it's the first seven eight months of trump that have led to the these poll

01:02:40.160 numbers it's all on donald trump not a democrat creation at all it's so frustrating and you catch

01:02:47.860 them in these catch-22s because on the one hand they hate the tariffs you know the democrats have

01:02:53.480 secretly quietly become the party of free trade i don't know if you noticed because whatever trump is

01:02:57.920 they have to be the opposite so trump said you know this trade's not fair to american workers

01:03:02.720 suddenly they're rushing to defend trickle-down economics and free trade okay let's set that

01:03:06.680 aside so they hate the tariffs like all rich people which is who the democrats base is now

01:03:11.780 hate tariffs right they want free trade they want cheap stuff um but then they will say but trump

01:03:17.500 everything he does is for the rich and for the elites if that's true why do the rich and the elites

01:03:22.500 hate him if that's true why did for every billionaire who backed trump kamala harris get

01:03:28.600 two why did 95 percent of donations to politics coming out of the top three management consulting

01:03:35.400 firms go to kamala harris and not donald trump why did wall street pick kamala harris and not donald

01:03:41.180 trump i mean they know it's not true even as they say it but you know data coming out of treasury right now

01:03:47.160 shows there's been a 1.4 wage increase for blue collar workers just in the last eight months thanks

01:03:54.220 to donald trump's uh administration megan 1.5 million illegals have exited the workforce and they have been

01:04:03.800 replaced by 1.8 million american workers this is like an astonishing feat and despite the fact that many of

01:04:15.460 those americans who replaced illegals are working in things like meatpacking you haven't seen a huge

01:04:22.560 increase in prices there's a very small increase in prices in consumer prices it's less than one percent

01:04:29.180 despite the fact that we're replacing people who will work for five dollars an hour with americans who

01:04:35.460 expect health care i mean what donald trump has done with our economy is staggering he's he's reduced

01:04:44.920 the income gap reduced the wage gap he's literally bringing back the american dream for the bottom

01:04:51.900 and all you hear when you turn on cable news is millionaires bemoaning the fact you know that this

01:05:01.240 economy is bad for them it's just the chutzpah here the chutzpah and them blaming him for everything

01:05:09.320 that went wrong under successive democrat administrations it's disgusting the nerve so i'll i want to give a

01:05:15.680 couple stats on that poll one second but i do have to play the trump response he spoke with peter

01:05:21.140 docey at the white house about the alleged rumors you know the rumors of my demise have been greatly

01:05:26.060 exaggerated and peter docey raised it with him and sought 25 here's how that went how did you find out

01:05:33.220 over the weekend that you were dead you see that no people didn't see you for a couple days 1.3 million

01:05:40.760 user engagements as of saturday morning about your demise really i didn't see that you know i have

01:05:47.220 heard it's sort of crazy but last week i did numerous news conferences all successful they went

01:05:53.140 very well like this is going very well and then i didn't do any for two days and they said there must

01:05:59.420 be something wrong with him biden wouldn't do him for months you wouldn't see him and nobody ever said

01:06:05.080 there was ever anything wrong with him and we know he wasn't in the greatest of shape no i heard that i

01:06:10.260 get reports i did numerous uh shows and also did a number of truths long truths i think pretty

01:06:17.680 poignant truths no i was very active over the weekend i didn't hear that one that's pretty serious

01:06:22.600 well it's fake news you know it's just so it's so fake that's why the the media has so little

01:06:29.840 credibility so now you had jen socking and others out there saying i don't believe him that he didn't

01:06:36.520 hear it and you know as if trump ever lies about that crap like trump would be like yeah i heard it

01:06:42.100 it was ridiculous screw them he said i heard reports that i wasn't doing well allegedly i wasn't doing

01:06:47.320 too well meanwhile you know it was the other guy who wasn't doing well i sent out all these truths

01:06:51.780 great truths true truths um and he had done that throughout the days and i misspoke before he was

01:06:58.400 seen playing golf on saturday so they got eyes on him on tuesday at a robust presser they got eyes on

01:07:04.420 him on saturday playing golf but we had to go wednesday thursday friday which led to these lunatic

01:07:10.440 conspiracy theorists on the left saying he died and then when he says no i didn't hear that but that's

01:07:17.040 insane i'm fine it's fake news then they say oh he's lying he did hear like what's wrong with them

01:07:23.400 these are the same people who look at our side and say we're the conspiracy theorists we're the people

01:07:29.620 who don't believe science and truth when it's staring us in the face you know it's like i know

01:07:34.920 people have called them out for russiagate and these other conspiracies but truly they cannot see the

01:07:39.820 truth when it's before their eyes if it has anything to do with donald trump yeah they're

01:07:45.860 they're completely blinded by this and they think we're still in 2016 which actually is one of the

01:07:53.320 president's president's superpowers they think they still matter and they don't matter megan i mean

01:08:00.740 you matter they don't matter but they haven't realized it yet and so they're sitting there thinking

01:08:08.120 that they're controlling the narrative and when trump just looks at them and is like what are you

01:08:13.900 even talking about and makes a mockery of it it's so powerful i mean when you think about the extent to

01:08:21.900 which he is operating on so many levels whether it's domestic policy the economy immigration foreign

01:08:29.440 policy navigating these conflicts bringing you know an end to these conflicts to wars but also you know

01:08:35.640 navigating india navigating china navigating russia ukraine um and to have the media the smithsonian

01:08:42.580 and they're literally um if you watch channels like cnn they take the opposite side literally will root

01:08:51.900 for our enemies i was watching the other day i forget which liberal channel and they were trying to talk

01:08:57.940 up china's military during the parade and say that china's military is stronger than ours they were like

01:09:05.900 well we don't have that and we don't have that are you freaking kidding me is that what it has come to

01:09:11.400 you are literally rooting for china's military because you know that trump is fighting china it's so

01:09:20.580 absurd and thank god it's 2025 and the american people can see it for what it is 100 which is going to bring me in

01:09:29.480 one second by the way it was cnn um to the blowing up of the drug cartel boat which was amazing and suddenly

01:09:38.620 has leftists supporting drug cartel boats full of drugs on their way to the united states uh but before we get to

01:09:45.640 that this wall street journal poll is right up your alley the headline was americans lose faith that

01:09:50.780 hard work leads to economic gains um it's a rather large survey 1500 plus adults done in july mid july

01:09:58.920 uh the share of people who say they have a good chance of improving their own standard of living

01:10:04.400 fell to 25 just 25 of americans believe they have a good chance of improving their standard of living

01:10:10.700 it's a record low in surveys dating back to 1987 42 percent say they strongly or somewhat disagree

01:10:18.760 that they can improve it um more than three quarters of those polled say they lack confidence that life

01:10:25.520 for the next generation will be better than their own life i mean that's amazing 78 percent nearly 80

01:10:32.780 percent of americans do not feel confident that life for our children's generation will be better

01:10:37.720 than it was for us that is just depressing and then 70 percent of americans believe that the american

01:10:44.900 dream that if you work hard you will get ahead no longer holds true or never did the highest level in

01:10:51.620 nearly 15 years of surveys my god but yeah this is just so dark i do think a lot of it comes down to

01:11:01.120 home ownership and what you talked about in terms of middle class jobs um and i think ai too is

01:11:09.060 potentially in there because you hear about it a lot how ai is going to be stealing all the jobs and

01:11:14.820 our children aren't going to be able to find work at all thanks to rampant ai that has no master

01:11:20.980 reeling it in but what are your thoughts on these numbers so i think for a long time we saw the american

01:11:27.980 dream become basically a privilege for the college educated the working class was really cut out of

01:11:35.740 it thanks to democratic policies what we're seeing now is a lot of these over credentialed college elites

01:11:44.380 who would have 10 years ago been assured of making it into the top 10 but now because of ai are struggling

01:11:52.900 because of a lot of the entry-level white collar jobs are being destroyed by ai and these people

01:11:59.820 are unbelievably unbelievably resentful a lot of them have college debt they were told they were very

01:12:07.240 special and at university and college they were taught to have contempt for people who don't have a

01:12:13.140 college degree and now they come out of college and are being forced to work in industries that don't

01:12:19.260 require that degree and so they're very resentful this is the mom donnie base this is what's fueling

01:12:25.640 the rise of socialism because in their view you know the ideal situation would be that you have illegal

01:12:33.400 immigrants doing all of the actual work everybody else living on some sort of welfare and subsidized

01:12:39.260 housing you know and then they can just kind of become podcasters right like that's their you know

01:12:44.080 fantasy of the way that the economy works heaven forbid labor exactly is is beneath them it's really

01:12:50.960 about you know it's a hatred of america but also a hatred of labor they've been taught to have immense

01:12:55.900 contempt for work that requires labor um so those are the people i think who are losing um trust that

01:13:04.300 they're going to be better off than their parents but i think a much bigger thing is exactly what you

01:13:08.980 pointed out megan it's home ownership this has to become a major concern for the gop going forward

01:13:17.660 this is what gen z is thinking about all the time they're really not thinking as much about the

01:13:23.720 cultural battles and the cultural issues they're thinking about why or epstein they're thinking about

01:13:29.820 why they can't afford a home which brings me to this lisa cook this oh i'm in love with this story

01:13:35.940 lied as you've been covering it so well on her mortgage applications bought three homes said each

01:13:44.320 was her primary residence okay a lot of people do kind of fudge that exact point in mortgage applications

01:13:51.260 but what makes it utterly unforgivable in this case is that she is sitting on the board of the

01:13:58.720 organization that is preventing young people from being able to afford a home because they are insisting

01:14:05.600 at the fed at keeping interest rates high so while this woman gathered for herself acquired home

01:14:13.320 after home after home with a little bit of you know trickery in her paperwork she sits there and says

01:14:20.160 but not you i'll have three homes and you will have none and that is what makes this the epitome of the

01:14:29.420 democratic party megan i always say the democratic party is kind of like a plane and the base are in first class

01:14:37.220 they're rich okay they're the top 10 percent you know we know that 65 70 of americans who make over

01:14:44.140 five hundred thousand dollars a year now are democrats okay this is just like nine of the ten richest counties

01:14:48.640 in america democrats they're in first class okay and they're basically saying to the rest of the country

01:14:54.340 we'll pay for your tickets you can sit and coach you know smush together like sardines right in the

01:15:00.720 back you can ride for free you know we'll give you welfare we'll give you a housing voucher we'll give

01:15:07.100 you snap benefits but don't you dare think that you can touch that little screen and come and sit in first

01:15:14.540 class or have anything to say about where this use our bathroom or use our bathroom we will decide all of

01:15:22.340 that for you that is the democratic party and it is so epitomized by this lisa cook oh my god there was

01:15:29.480 actually a great piece of tape that we had i wasn't sure if we'd get to it today but might as well play

01:15:33.500 it but this reporter he used to work for the new york times this guy actually went and tracked down one

01:15:39.980 of her many houses um you recall there were three there was one in ann arbor michigan which is very

01:15:46.660 confusing because i think ann arbor she worked at michigan state and arbor is where university of michigan

01:15:52.020 is i think it's at least an hour away from michigan state so i'm not sure why she was buying in ann arbor

01:15:57.160 she said it would be her primary residence it does not look like it was and two weeks later she bought

01:16:02.360 her residence in atlanta georgia and said that was going to be her primary residence but we don't think

01:16:07.160 that was the case either and then she also bought a house in cambridge massachusetts which she said was

01:16:14.340 going to be a secondary residence but it appears she rented it out as a rental property to bring in

01:16:20.300 income all of those were lies you call it trickery i say it's fraud it's criminal fraud lisa lisa

01:16:27.120 that's not legal okay that's how it looks to me and uh this journalist charlie leduff went to the ann

01:16:34.660 arbor home listed as her primary residence and guess who wasn't there lisa was not there watch what he found

01:16:43.760 the door's dirty there's a key lockbox right there

01:16:49.780 there's a white man at the dining room table it's weird i don't think she's married

01:16:57.080 how you doing okay how are you i'm good my name's charlie i'm a reporter i was uh this house is in the

01:17:07.420 news i was wondering if lisa cook lives here or do you rent no we're just renting

01:17:12.140 i'm sorry we're just renting okay you just live in here okay just renting

01:17:19.280 i'm sorry no comment you have to talk to the owner okay the owner would you have a contact

01:17:27.120 number oh so the person inside before he realizes says quote we're just renting talk to the owner

01:17:38.680 then says no comment oh my dear in any event he didn't do anything wrong but she appears to have

01:17:44.480 so i mean and by the way bill pulte god bless bill pulte he's the federal housing authority guy who

01:17:50.980 keeps finding all these cases from tish james to adam schiff to now lisa cook is holding a presser

01:17:58.680 tomorrow morning at 10 so on the show tomorrow we will have everything covered for you we will give

01:18:03.240 you all the latest on lisa cook and the others and possibly there's a new person we have no idea why

01:18:07.720 he's holding a presser but we'll find out but yeah amazing that it doesn't even appear it's a

01:18:13.340 secondary residence the thing she said was her primary it appears it's a rental property like her

01:18:18.280 place in cambridge which she said was a secondary and you're right as she sits there by the way

01:18:23.340 why did she feel the need to commit mortgage fraud if that's what she did because the interest rates

01:18:27.820 are too high because she didn't think she wanted to pay or could pay right the high interest rates

01:18:33.820 those are too high i've got to game the system then she gets in a position where she could do

01:18:37.600 something about it and she pulls up the ladder behind her like f all of you like you say i'm in a

01:18:43.620 first class cabin don't touch my bathroom so right megan i hadn't even thought about that

01:18:51.620 she's my favorite character in the news right right now by far okay let's go back to um the the left

01:19:00.560 being turned against we don't like children with cancer and we won't applaud them at the state of

01:19:05.440 the union um we don't like criminals being arrested and locked up so we will oppose federal troops in

01:19:11.500 la and washington dc and elsewhere and we don't like crackdowns on trend aragua terrorist groups

01:19:20.980 drug cartel terrorist groups bringing drugs into the united states which are a poison that is killing

01:19:30.820 our young people it's the number one killer of young americans fentanyl a hundred thousand plus

01:19:39.020 dead the year before last and almost that last year and keep going back several years it's taking

01:19:46.140 out millions of our young people so trump actually did something about it and declared these drug

01:19:51.780 cartels terrorist organizations which changes the abilities that he has to deal with them as they try

01:19:59.780 to bring that poison into the united states of america yesterday during the pressure that he held

01:20:03.940 he called attention to the fact that he dropped a bomb on one of these drug boats he says was

01:20:10.220 bringing these drugs into the united states and here is the video

01:20:13.160 okay so for listening audience you see the boat you see some people on the boat it's got three engines

01:20:22.760 on the back it's plowing through the waters it's kind of a rough ride yours truly would be wearing my

01:20:29.740 life jacket and have a life preserver around me in the moment because i'm not a good boater

01:20:34.500 specifically when it's wavy as it would turn out my life jacket wouldn't do anything for me because i'd

01:20:39.880 be blown up like these drug cartel members were and i have zero sympathy for them none whatsoever

01:20:47.800 and yet the left i mean they're they're upset okay we're already hearing like what what did he think

01:20:55.460 he was doing why is it why did he do it let me find it um i'm gonna get you some examples here's

01:21:01.220 the guy from human rights watch the annoying group that keeps scoring all of our corporations and

01:21:05.500 if they if they're not woke they get a bad grade from human rights watch trump admits he ordered a

01:21:11.240 summary execution the crime of murder drug traffickers are not combatants who can be shot on site they are

01:21:19.060 criminal suspects who must be arrested and prosecuted here's the former latin america advisor to

01:21:24.720 bernie sanders why didn't we just track and interdict the vessel in u.s waters arrest the

01:21:31.920 crew and seize the drugs as the u.s coast guard routinely does i cannot imagine the timing of the

01:21:37.660 venezuela boat strike has anything to do with this and then posted a link to the epstein story what an

01:21:45.300 idiot then there's this guy ed krasenstein these krasenstein brothers are ridiculous personalities of

01:21:51.360 the left online all i can say is that i hope trump is using actual evidence that these are actual drug

01:21:57.800 traffickers and gang members in venezuela unlike what he did with the 280 plus immigrants whom he sent to

01:22:04.060 the c cop prison for being gang members without any legitimate evidence in many cases taking human lives

01:22:10.340 is a major thing does drug trafficking warrant death bacha i can't with these people okay like

01:22:19.600 do they not understand what's actually happening in our country to your point about the elites like

01:22:25.520 although drug you know fentanyl and all that this it's affecting everybody across classes you know

01:22:31.380 the the susan wojeki the ceo of youtube which is owned by google i mean this is a very rich company

01:22:37.720 her son unfortunately died from a fentanyl laced pill i mean it's happened across classes but these

01:22:44.420 people don't seem to understand i pulled this sound by just to make the point okay because that like

01:22:48.480 does drug trafficking warrant death why didn't we just track and interdict the vessel the vessel

01:22:55.160 tell it to the parents who have lost their 19 year olds to what they thought was a xanax and turned out to

01:23:04.120 be deadly fentanyl like god forgive me but the son of my dear friend eric bowling eric chase and that's

01:23:12.780 exactly what happened to him he came on this show when we were just born and we were still an audio only

01:23:19.460 podcast so you won't see his face but you'll hear him talking to me this is not long after it happened

01:23:24.960 okay tell it to him watch come home from a restaurant

01:23:29.060 i'm sorry love i can feel it

01:23:36.120 that's right um so we get the call uh that he had uh he had uh taken what he felt was a

01:23:48.060 xanax that he bought on campus and it was laced with fentanyl that he didn't know he passed

01:23:56.860 it's so awful badya as a parent i look at these people and i say yes the answer to your question

01:24:06.460 does drug trafficking warrant death the answer is yes yes it does the answer to why didn't we just

01:24:14.240 track and interdict the vessel in u.s waters is because we had the right to take them out they

01:24:19.000 were here to poison our children they were literally coming on shore to poison our children to death i

01:24:25.660 don't understand how the left doesn't see that they don't care what happened to eric's son they don't

01:24:30.860 care about this problem at all because they don't think it's going to affect them or they don't think

01:24:35.820 it's a limousine liberal issue like paying off student loan debt and the reason i know that is because

01:24:41.600 they haven't done anything about it and they're having anything other than the reaction of applause

01:24:48.180 in response to trump's move

01:24:50.020 watching that boat blow up i felt the way i feel when the same european leaders who mocked

01:24:59.060 donald trump and mocked the united states and laughed at us come to the white house now on bended knee

01:25:05.480 and beg him for things it just made me feel so proud and safe to be an american and it's amazing

01:25:14.880 to me that the left is literally coming out and saying it like hands off our trend aragua right

01:25:23.900 yes right it wasn't actually a mistake with kilmar garcia obrego that he was a wife beater human

01:25:32.460 trafficker ms 13 member like they didn't make a mistake no if you are all of those things and you are

01:25:39.240 donald trump's enemy they will back you you are their friend you have the democratic party in your

01:25:46.940 corner you know we are all kilmar as aoc put it you know the same people who are you know out in

01:25:56.680 pussy hats and you know doing me too movement you know turning flirting in the office into like

01:26:03.620 the civil rights issue of our time are now out here saying hands off our wife beater right and it's the

01:26:11.840 same thing here how dare you kill these gangbangers coming to murder american citizens and with this

01:26:21.100 kind of moral authority they're high on their own supply they think that they have the moral high

01:26:27.280 ground here it's so disgusting and this truly is one of donald trump's geniuses it's not just that

01:26:37.180 he's actually making the country better and safer and more prosperous and lifting up the hardest working

01:26:43.600 americans into the american dream it's that he manages to bring out the lowest worst qualities

01:26:52.440 in his opponents there is no depth to which they will not sink if they think they are opposing him

01:27:00.380 and they just keep getting shown up again and again and again there is not a single value the democrats

01:27:07.960 hold dear that they will not turn on on a dime if they think that they can use that to hurt trump

01:27:16.660 and it's astonishing i can't imagine i genuinely can't imagine watching a president biden or president

01:27:25.720 west moore do this to a drug cartel bringing drugs into our country and having anything other than the

01:27:32.720 reaction of good for him good for him there are certain things where you don't get partisan you just say

01:27:37.640 you know what that's a defense of our borders and our children and it's about time we've been

01:27:42.580 seeding this battle for far too long and he's done everything he possibly can to stop down to crack down

01:27:50.320 on these people from the tariffs which even the new york times admitted uh were changing the way these drug

01:27:57.080 labs were popping up all over mexico uh because he said to claudia schombaum you will crack down on these

01:28:03.200 fentanyl labs or your tariffs will go up and guess what she started doing cracking down on the

01:28:07.560 fentanyl labs so they started to evaporate so much so that the new york times had to acknowledge it

01:28:12.760 he's closed the border which makes it a lot harder it's not that they're giving up they're now trying

01:28:17.640 to do the east coast and the west coast and in from canada and so on but he's fighting them

01:28:21.260 everywhere and now he's doing this not because that one boat had all the drugs and all the fentanyl

01:28:27.460 you know i mean there's just endless supplies of it but to send a message deterrence here he is

01:28:32.840 explaining it it's at 28a on the boat you had massive amounts of drugs we have tapes of them

01:28:39.920 speaking it was massive amounts of drugs coming into our country to kill a lot of people and uh

01:28:46.060 everybody fully understands that in fact you see it you see the bags of drugs all over the boat

01:28:50.420 and they were hit obviously they won't be doing it again and i think a lot of other people won't be

01:28:55.340 doing it again when they watch that tape they're going to say let's not do this we have to protect

01:29:00.380 our country and we're going to venezuela has been a very bad actor they've been as you know they

01:29:05.360 they've been sending millions of people into our country many of them trend de aragua some of the

01:29:12.680 worst gangs some of the worst people anywhere in the world in terms of gangs and we had some in

01:29:18.820 washington dc we took care of them very quickly but they're out of here they're gone but venezuela has

01:29:24.380 been very bad both in terms of drugs and sending some of the worst criminals anywhere in the world

01:29:29.320 into our country can i just say something about you that jumped out at me in that soundbite

01:29:34.820 there's he's sitting in the white house and you can see some of the like decoration on the fireplace

01:29:42.060 behind him is now gilded you know trump's big on gilding his entire penthouse is gilded he's gilding

01:29:47.760 the inside of the white house in many areas it's getting very gold and okay it's not my personal

01:29:54.400 taste for the white house i don't care it's like this is the left can't stand this but to me

01:29:59.480 his need to gild the white house is born of his need to clean up washington dc and born of his need

01:30:07.480 to close the border and to bomb the drug cartel it's all part of the same package you know he wants

01:30:14.040 a pristine beautiful safe white house your house my house the houses on the south side of chicago and

01:30:24.220 south washington dc it's all born of the same thing it's a perfectionism it's a commitment to

01:30:30.280 excellence it's an inability to settle for less or this is good enough and i always thought people

01:30:36.800 criticize his narcissism everyone who runs for president has a touch of narcissism some more than

01:30:41.380 you don't think obama's a narcissist good lot good lord bill clinton you don't think he's a

01:30:45.080 narcissist wake up um trump's narcissism is such that it you you could always sense that if it could

01:30:51.220 be unleashed on our behalf it could really make a difference and that's what i see when i see the

01:30:57.960 gilding and when i see washington dc now with almost no crime and when i see that drug ship get blown out

01:31:04.940 of the water i think it's a little gaudy but i love it i mean it's gaudy and big and tasteless in

01:31:12.620 the way that america is we're not here to imitate europe we're not here to try to pretend that we

01:31:18.940 have class and that you know we want to be like you guys no we have our own thing going we like gaudy

01:31:25.240 stuff we like big stuff we like to make a statement you know we're not out here trying to like you know

01:31:30.620 win magazine fashion awards or whatever you know we wear the flowered pants we're the flowered shorts

01:31:36.360 when we go over to europe exactly we're in our flip-flops you know we're not trying to blend in

01:31:42.440 exactly um so i think it's great i totally agree with you um and i think of course the tariffs is

01:31:49.820 really the proof in the pudding the tariffs said to wall street i don't work for you i work for the

01:31:56.600 american people and that split screen with president obama who in the 2008 financial crisis

01:32:02.980 he came into office right after and gave 700 700 billion dollars to the the very crooks who resulted

01:32:10.900 in 10 million americans losing their home including 30 billion dollars in bonuses imagine being an american

01:32:18.820 who lost their home in 2008 saw the crooks who did that to you get 30 billion dollars in bonuses

01:32:25.940 and now you're standing here and watching donald trump tell the entire global elite screw you

01:32:32.660 i don't work for you i work for that guy who lost his home and i'm going to get a factory back into his

01:32:38.780 town so that he can get a job again and buy a new home that's what we're seeing here really like yeah

01:32:45.020 of course he's trump right he's got a very healthy sense of himself but he's not just a president right

01:32:50.740 now he's a leader he really does see what is good for this country as the only thing that matters and

01:32:59.280 he has a theory of the case about what went wrong and how to fix it and there's nothing he won't do

01:33:05.700 in order to do that and i think for a lot of people even ones who don't agree with how he's doing it

01:33:11.400 they see him willing to take on the elites in the media in finance the economists the experts and say

01:33:20.220 i don't care what you think and i don't care if you call me names i am here to serve and that idea

01:33:27.680 of service is just so totally foreign to the left there's this real kind of theater kid mentality to

01:33:34.880 everything that's going on there you know even in the attempts to fight trump from newsom and pritzker

01:33:39.960 and whatever again it's like hands off our crime right they just want the press conference they

01:33:46.060 don't actually have any policy to offer the american people to make their lives better hands off our

01:33:52.260 crime right exactly we're watching this happen with pritzker uh in uh illinois where trump is saber

01:33:59.640 rattling about sending troops next saying quote it's going to happen that'll be interesting i mean it's

01:34:05.440 it's going to be a legal battle because he's very limited in what he can do outside of washington dc

01:34:11.660 he got away with sending them to la sort of he just got his hand slapped by a judge the judge said you

01:34:16.820 can leave the troops there but they're more limited in what they can do you can't use american troops for

01:34:20.440 law enforcement um and so the judge found you you did use them for some law enforcement so you can't do

01:34:25.800 that but you can leave the mayor and you can do all the things that you said on paper you were going to

01:34:29.740 use them for uh which is more in a supportive role of the ice officers who you sent so it's kind of a

01:34:36.040 split the baby um ruling for trump out there but he you can't just send them into random cities

01:34:41.540 in support of just fighting crime like that you really can't do without the invitation of a governor

01:34:48.860 so we're heading for an uncomfortable showdown with governor pritzker in um illinois and here's

01:34:55.620 what governor pritzker saying about it in sat 17. hi everyone governor jb pritzker here i'm here in

01:35:04.080 little village a beautiful part of the city was able to just walk down the street and say hello to

01:35:09.200 some of the small business owners and patrons in those small businesses uh just a lovely day here

01:35:16.420 no emergency so donald trump understands no emergency in the city of chicago to send troops in but

01:35:22.740 i know people are very afraid because ice officials uh ice officers are planning to come

01:35:28.480 here to little village and i just want people to know that we're doing everything we can in the state

01:35:33.940 and in the city to keep you safe uh we'll make sure and protect your rights but you need to know your

01:35:39.380 rights and make sure that you understand uh that the ice officials don't have a right to knock down

01:35:45.440 doors and to take people away but but make sure you stay safe all right we're thinking of you

01:35:50.440 and doing everything we can to protect you okay chicago is a big city he's clearly not in the

01:35:57.900 worst area because over labor day weekend alone 58 people were shot in 37 incidents around the city

01:36:03.860 including eight homicides so we've got 58 people who were shot eight of them dead from 6 p.m friday to

01:36:11.260 noon on monday so it's not all uh unicorns and rainbows as the governor would have you believe he doesn't

01:36:18.560 want trump's help and trump is kind of saying well you're getting it it's coming here he is

01:36:26.840 in sat 20a these both these sound bites were from tuesday well we're going in i didn't say when we're

01:36:33.580 going in when you lose look i have an obligation this isn't a political thing uh i have an obligation

01:36:39.820 when we lose when 20 people are killed over the last two and a half weeks

01:36:44.220 and 75 are shot with bullets so let me tell you a little story about a place called dc

01:36:52.240 district of columbia right here where we are it's now a safe zone we have no crime we have it's in

01:37:00.500 such great shape you can go and actually walk with your children your wife your husband you can walk

01:37:06.240 right down the middle of the street you're not going to be shot peter you're safe okay so

01:37:13.100 we can't have trump going in without the invitation of this governor i'm sorry but we can't have it he

01:37:20.560 does not have the constitutional permission to do it and i think and uh and i hope i'm sorry for the

01:37:27.600 people of chicago because i wish their governor would be better and ask for help but i think trump

01:37:33.400 knows that i think it was just a saber rattle because here's what he just said on it today 20c

01:37:39.060 so we're making a determination now do we go to chicago or we do we go to a place like new orleans

01:37:46.700 where we have a great governor jeff landry who wants us to come in and straighten out a very nice

01:37:54.120 section of this country that's become quite you know quite tough quite bad so we're going to be going

01:38:02.840 to uh maybe louisiana and you have new orleans which has a crime problem we'll straighten that

01:38:08.600 out in about two weeks it'll take us two weeks easier than dc but we could straighten out chicago

01:38:14.060 all they have to do is ask us uh to go into chicago if we don't have the support of some of these

01:38:20.060 politicians but i'll tell you who is supporting us the people of chicago and i sort of want them

01:38:26.340 to let it be known they have incompetent people so he didn't finish the sentence to go into chicago

01:38:33.980 without the support of the local politicians and i think the end of that sentence would have been

01:38:39.180 is not constitutionally permissible it very clearly is not constitutionally permissible he cannot do it

01:38:44.660 i really hope he doesn't do it um because i don't want a world in which i'm siding with governor

01:38:49.600 pritzker over president trump um but i will if he does it because he can't do it legally however i

01:38:56.260 think that's what he's saying batia that he's realized that and that he's going to send the

01:39:00.160 help to cities and states that want it and what a great way of shaming the governor pritzker's of the

01:39:07.360 world trump has promised to abide by the constitution and all of the court rulings and so far he has

01:39:14.920 something that of course the media refuses to cover um one of his most undercovered strengths

01:39:22.040 is his nimbleness he will pivot if he sees something is not working or if somebody shows him a better

01:39:28.900 option i totally agree with you i think going to new orleans which is extremely violent would be a great

01:39:34.940 alternative um my heart really breaks for specifically the black citizens of chicago who make up 80 percent of

01:39:42.360 the homicide victims just totally disproportionately represented in the crime statistics i'll just

01:39:48.560 give you a few a black chicagoan is 20 times more likely to be killed a black child is five times more

01:39:59.160 likely there's literally a crime apartheid in chicago yes driven by the false pieties and disgusting

01:40:08.360 leaders like jb pritzker and mayor brandon johnson it's appalling and there's an incredible book

01:40:16.000 called there are no children here was written in the 90s about caprini green and the public housing and

01:40:21.280 how dangerous it was in the opening chapter it's about a child who just turned eight years old and

01:40:28.080 was given a bunch of change from his mother and his uncles and his grandmother and he's taking the

01:40:34.380 change and it's in his pockets and he's so excited he's going to go to the store and he's going to buy

01:40:39.000 something he's been really really wanting and never had any money for and he's so excited and he walks

01:40:44.480 outside and the shooting starts and he has to hit the floor and all the change goes flying everywhere

01:40:52.860 and he loses it all trying to save his life and i was thinking about that scene when i saw footage

01:41:01.500 from a soccer game in the south side of chicago from over the weekend where children had to drop to

01:41:09.120 the grass because they were shooting at them it's just nonsense what pritzker is saying the city is not

01:41:17.620 safe for the most vulnerable residents it is so unacceptable exactly so you have rich white progressives

01:41:26.920 from their gated communities you know this is just a reprisal of the defund the police where the most

01:41:34.600 safe and secure and privileged americans are sentencing black children to get shot at on the

01:41:41.980 way to school it is horrifying and it is so amazing that donald trump wants to do something about this he

01:41:50.260 knows he got you know 15 of the black vote he doesn't care he feels responsible for every child

01:41:57.200 in this country it's truly amazing there's no way if this were happening in evanston illinois just north

01:42:04.400 of chicago they'd be putting up with this he governor pritzker puts up with it because he's banking on people

01:42:10.840 not giving a damn that it's blacks killing other blacks or hispanics killing other hispanics here he is

01:42:18.560 speaking to a local reporter nbc5 chicago marianne ahearn listen here sot 19 you're going to hear

01:42:26.340 people especially this past weekend 54 shot seven dead yeah they're going to say the city's not safe

01:42:33.860 would you ask your friends to ride the l after midnight or after you know nine o'clock at night

01:42:38.740 even to come down to the city from o'hare look big cities have crime there's no doubt about it

01:42:45.640 unbelievable let's just pay attention to what president trump is doing targeting chicago he's

01:42:50.920 overlooking trump red states that have much higher crime rates trump he just dodges he doesn't care

01:42:57.900 he takes no responsibility for his state unfortunately i have to leave it there because i'm out of time

01:43:03.040 but batia well said on all points today you're especially good you're always good you're you're

01:43:08.280 gearing up for your big show and i can't wait to hear more on it looking forward to seeing you

01:43:12.080 over there my friend god bless you megan thank you for everything you too girlfriend see you soon

01:43:18.320 okay and we're back tomorrow with our friend glenn greenwald looking forward to that as well

01:43:21.940 thanks for listening to the megan kelly show no bs no agenda and no fear

01:43:29.320 you

01:43:35.180 you

01:43:37.180 you

01:43:39.180 you

01:43:41.180 you

01:43:45.180 you

01:43:47.180 you

The Megyn Kelly Show - September 03, 2025

Arrested For Posts, Epstein Victims Speak, and Sick Trump Health Reactions, with Batya Ungar-Sargon and Greg Lukianoff

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