The Megyn Kelly Show - September 24, 2026


Dem Candidate's WILD Texts Exposed, Lesbian Bar Drama, and Kamala's New Accent, with Glenn Greenwald | Ep. 1405

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Guests
Mentioned
Trump's Newsy UN Address, Panettiere Death Linked to Fentanyl, Clavicular Charges: AM Update 9⧸23 The TRUTH About Nolan Wells' Alcohol Consumption, Bruises, and Deleted Messages, and the Shock Pastor Murder Trial | Ep. 1406

Episode Stats


Length

1 hour and 45 minutes

Words per minute

181.47

Word count

19,131

Sentence count

856


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
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00:01:00.980 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.
00:01:12.660 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Thursday.
00:01:16.660 We've got a lot to get to today, including the full trailer for that documentary about Elizabeth Holmes that everyone is talking about.
00:01:22.840 I cannot wait to go see this.
00:01:24.860 Plus, we've got a Katie Porter out in Alaska.
00:01:27.480 Yes, a brand new Katie Porter. That's not her name, but she's another Katie Porter.
00:01:32.060 She's a Democrat, and she is in contention to win this Republican seat as young, woke staffers for her are now leaking texts to The New York Times to try to make her look bad.
00:01:45.020 Why are they doing that? I'm not going to lie.
00:01:49.080 Like part of this woman, I'm like, is this my spirit animal?
00:01:52.660 She might secretly be a Republican.
00:01:54.760 I'll tell you why I think that. Joining me now to react to this and so much more is the very first
00:02:00.840 guest in the history of the MK show, our pod father, Glenn Greenwald. He is a Pulitzer Prize
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00:03:19.440 Use my link and get a free seven-day trial with no credit card and $10 off your first month if
00:03:25.240 you join. Check it out. Glenn, it's such a pleasure to have you back. How are you?
00:03:30.440 Always great to see you, Megan. I'm doing well. Hope you are as well.
00:03:33.540 Yeah, so well. Okay. So I'm into this woman out in Alaska. Her name is Mary Peltola.
00:03:41.140 and she's in contention against incumbent Dan Sullivan.
00:03:46.860 Cook Political reports that the race is a toss up.
00:03:50.560 She could actually win this seat.
00:03:52.560 He's got a couple of things going against him,
00:03:54.260 including that there are two other Republicans
00:03:56.660 besides Dan Sullivan on the ballot.
00:03:59.020 And one of them is also named Dan Sullivan.
00:04:02.660 So this actually could flip
00:04:04.960 and be part of the Democrats scheme
00:04:07.120 to take over control of the Senate.
00:04:09.880 Democrats, according to The New York Times, are bullish about her chances.
00:04:14.160 She's a former House representative to flip this seat.
00:04:17.780 She's running on fish, family and freedom.
00:04:21.800 And she also seems to be a fan of a fourth F word that is spelled F-A-G-G-O-T, according to the staffers, though she denies that one, Glenn.
00:04:33.880 And she admits apparently using retard, but she denies, forgive me, faggot.
00:04:41.260 Interesting where the lines get drawn.
00:04:43.080 But OK, so here's the story.
00:04:45.340 A New York Times investigative report finds that she has a history of angry outbursts,
00:04:52.000 high staff turnover and alleged mistreatment of AIDS dating back to her time in Congress
00:04:56.160 and continuing into her current campaign.
00:04:59.020 They deny a pattern of abuse, the campaign did when asked,
00:05:02.160 and attribute some incidents to grief after the deaths of her mother and husband in 2023.
00:05:08.480 Multiple former staffers described frequent angry, sometimes profane, blow-ups.
00:05:13.580 One incident involved Peltola allegedly shoving an aide in the chest.
00:05:18.320 What I love the most is the campaign's responses to the allegations.
00:05:23.480 Okay, there's a bunch of them.
00:05:25.240 I'll give you the first one here.
00:05:27.000 Frustrated that she could not find a memo for a meeting,
00:05:30.220 Ms. Peltola shoved a male employee in the chest with one hand, causing him to stumble backward,
00:05:36.020 according to a person who was there and two others who heard about the incident soon after.
00:05:40.720 The aide departed her team not too long after the alleged incident.
00:05:44.560 How does the campaign respond?
00:05:46.180 They deny that it was a shove.
00:05:48.200 They say that Ms. Peltola had bumped the aide accidentally,
00:05:54.040 and it was her husband's first birthday after his death, saying she was unfocused, Glenn.
00:05:59.200 She was unfocused and riddled with grief. And it was a bump, not a shove. And this just, you know, thin skinned employee departed, I guess, for no reason. And he didn't understand her immense grief. Then she disparaged Planned Parenthood. This is where she and I are aligned.
00:06:18.740 She was frustrated about the organization's scrutiny of her deliberations on how to vote on a defense bill that included anti-abortion policies.
00:06:27.340 She writes, quote, I hope Planned Parenthood knows that if we don't win, it's more their loss than ours.
00:06:33.100 Fuck those bitches.
00:06:35.120 She wrote a text message in January of 2024.
00:06:42.440 Later that year, appearing to refer to a woman on the board of the local Planned Parenthood chapter, she wrote in another text, I hope she dies of a botched abortion.
00:06:52.900 She's got an anger problem, this lady.
00:06:55.800 Planned Parenthood, whose political arm had endorsed Ms. Peltola's previous campaigns, did not endorse her this year.
00:07:02.900 So what a shock.
00:07:06.320 Sometimes she jumped up and down and stomped her feet, three of her former aides said.
00:07:11.920 two of the aides described one instance in 2024 when she was so frustrated that she swept
00:07:16.740 stacks of papers on her desk into the air in a way two people said look like a scene at a veep
00:07:23.100 now here's the campaign's denial there they dispute the description they said she had
00:07:29.440 shuffled papers off her desk in frustration she did not sweep stacks into the air she shuffled
00:07:40.420 in frustration, Glenn. So it was not, let's see if I, can we zoom out here? Let me, let's,
00:07:45.000 we can do, we can try a demonstration. Hello. Let's zoom out. Can we? Okay, here we go. You
00:07:51.420 can see me. So this is the closest thing I have to a stack. It was not a, this, it was not a,
00:07:58.460 a sweeping. It was just a shuffling. It was a shuffling. And one of the papers inadvertently
00:08:04.100 fell down off the desk is a totally different situation glenn hello just like it was a bump
00:08:11.100 it wasn't a shove i don't know what's wrong with these thin-skinned staffers who are trying to make
00:08:16.580 her into our old pal sat 30 that we're gonna lose more than half a million californians dying
00:08:26.040 prematurely to air pollution and other problems and the state could lose
00:08:30.540 get out of my fucking shot i wanted to tell you that that's actually incorrect it's not that it's
00:08:37.660 electric vehicles it's that if we don't need the commitments under the paris climate accord
00:08:42.280 okay it does okay you also were in my shot before that stay out of my shot okay i'm gonna start
00:08:51.180 again with um electric vehicle saving us money perfect okay
00:08:55.040 katie porter but this is not katie porter this is a different gal named mary peltola remember
00:09:05.380 the name because i have a feeling we're gonna get a lot more about this lady in the coming
00:09:10.400 month your thoughts well first of all it's not just katie porter who had this kind of
00:09:16.080 uh discussion around her but also before that in 2020 amy klobuchar and a lot of her stories
00:09:22.920 were actually the worst among the three she was like throwing staplers at the heads of
00:09:27.560 her age and things i don't know what's going on with these like white liberal democratic women
00:09:31.780 in politics but it seems to be like a trend now um you know i i have i want to like separate these
00:09:39.720 two things out because one is what a lot of people are reacting to which are the use of like
00:09:45.460 naughty words in private you know the word faggot the word retard like in general it's not great
00:09:51.920 to use these words in public she didn't really use them in public let's face it we all say things
00:09:56.680 in private that with our friends with our colleagues that we wouldn't say in public and
00:10:01.480 i think that's how it should be those don't really bother me at all uh but you know then there's
00:10:06.440 things like hey i hope she dies of a botched abortion that's a little harsh even in private
00:10:10.200 but you know this kind of like yeah like that's pretty that i don't know where that comes from
00:10:16.080 but that's some dark dark place that produces a thought like that but you know uh so you have
00:10:21.880 the kind of like private comment i do think that you know as a matter of fact this is what i teach
00:10:27.720 my kids like almost more than anything else is like the measure of your character is how you
00:10:32.580 treat not people who can do things for you because everybody treats people well who can do things for
00:10:36.560 them like bosses or people with money or power or whatever but how you treat people who don't have
00:10:41.780 any power over you and not just how you treat them in public like everybody goes and does charity in
00:10:46.980 public but how you treat them when nobody's looking and so if you're abusing your staffers
00:10:51.500 And look, I know losing your husband or your spouse or whatever kinds of things in your
00:10:56.320 family can affect your behavior.
00:10:58.300 I don't think that's an excuse, however, for like using other people.
00:11:02.560 It's an excuse for like missing.
00:11:04.020 I've had massive loss in the past few years.
00:11:06.780 My family didn't cause me to abuse my staff.
00:11:09.300 Exactly.
00:11:09.880 Or start maltreating people like I'm sorry that I understand that can affect behavior,
00:11:14.740 but you're an adult.
00:11:16.080 You still have a responsibility to treat others respectfully.
00:11:18.420 and i do think that is a major character flaw if you are treating people over whom you have power
00:11:24.440 in these very abusive ways especially if it turns physical like even you can't go around just
00:11:30.480 pushing people because they're dependent on you or they work for you it was a bump no i do want
00:11:36.000 to congratulate you on your re-enaction skills however the the difference between throwing papers
00:11:41.320 off the table and just that little shuffle that causes one accidentally gently to fall on the
00:11:46.160 forth exactly shuffle um but yeah the staff keeps getting things confused you know i do want to say
00:11:53.420 one interesting thing though is mary mary patrola is uh she ran for statewide house seat uh in
00:12:00.480 alaska which has always been a red state in the last few decades but it's becoming less and less
00:12:04.900 so um and you know even when they have republicans like lisa murkowski they're they they tend to be
00:12:09.480 the more like susan collins type republicans that they like to enact elect but uh this woman when
00:12:15.340 she was running for the democratic house he was running against sarah palin and even during the
00:12:19.240 election sarah palin was like this is a great woman i've known her forever she's a wonderful
00:12:24.620 character you know typically she's been these people have been a person who gets very praised
00:12:30.380 but again i do think a lot of people treat like peers and people in power differently than they
00:12:37.540 treat people who don't have power or a similar position and this i find to be an extremely
00:12:42.460 sinister character trait like really reflects poorly on yes she has an anger management problem
00:12:49.920 and you're exactly right why why is this such a trend with these liberal democratic women like
00:12:55.740 what are they so angry about calm down on like i got my theory i really think they they need to get
00:13:01.500 some and then they'd be happier i just that's that's my back of the envelope take on it especially
00:13:08.420 Katie Porter. I need to know Mary Peltola better, but okay. There's more. So she, uh, let's see.
00:13:16.420 Yeah. Shuffle. It was a shuffle. It was not a sweep. Okay. She also sometimes cut people out.
00:13:22.600 Now this is ridiculous. She cut people out altogether. If she concluded they had wronged
00:13:27.420 her. Now I like this piece. I have to say, this is something I've always admired about Scientology.
00:13:32.260 I've told the audience this before that if you if you are determined by one of these Scientologists to be what they considered a suppressive person, you're out.
00:13:42.300 They they will make sure no one around them even ever mentions your name.
00:13:48.880 And like I've had this done to me by a Scientologist.
00:13:52.760 And I actually kind of thought it's kind of a good idea.
00:13:56.320 Like, I don't I don't have an issue.
00:13:57.840 You know who's also good about that is Trump.
00:14:00.700 Trump likes to get vengeance against somebody, but in general, one wrong act against Trump, disloyal act, and you are gone, as you know.
00:14:09.240 Yeah, yeah.
00:14:09.960 But with the Scientologists, and I guess maybe with Mary, it's not just that you're gone, like they won't take your calls or call you.
00:14:18.160 No one can mention your name to them.
00:14:20.800 Yeah, you're a non-person.
00:14:21.080 So like it. Yes. So this person might be like the show at 9 p.m. ran a soundbite from Anna Nicole Smith. Do we want that? But the the answer would be no, we don't want that because nothing having to do with the person who shall not be named shall come anywhere near. Right.
00:14:43.040 So it's like, it's just, I think it's a good idea.
00:14:46.100 I'm not criticizing it.
00:14:47.320 But this woman's not a Scientologist as far as I know, but she's got a similar policy,
00:14:51.160 which the New York Times is painting as bad.
00:14:54.580 Now, she cut people out altogether if she concluded they had wronged her.
00:14:58.260 They say that she would quote nothing them, according to three former staff members,
00:15:04.060 and a text message viewed by the Times using a phrase of dismissal popularized on the TV
00:15:09.040 show scrubs where she would say about somebody, I don't like them, honestly, I nothing him. Okay,
00:15:15.980 this is a ridiculous avenue of attack. But then here in here, they say that she's, if she doesn't
00:15:23.160 like you, she might also say of you, fuck that retard. And that she also used the F word,
00:15:31.340 derogatory term against gays. I have to say, it's not a nice, neither of those is nice,
00:15:37.560 but I do make a bit of a distinction between the two because I think that the R word is like,
00:15:43.860 when we grew up, it actually was totally fine. You were not trying to disparage
00:15:48.680 actually mentally slow people. It was kind of accepted as a word that just generally meant
00:15:54.140 you were slow. It wasn't like meant to make fun of people who were genuinely slow.
00:15:58.960 And then of course we got really like picky about people's language. And then the word retard when,
00:16:03.280 you know suddenly you were you were you hate the disabled the f word i think has been sufficiently
00:16:09.160 tied to like disdain for gay people that i i i see that as like particularly nasty but those are my
00:16:18.080 standards glenn i don't behind closed doors are we really not supposed to vote for her because
00:16:22.740 she talks like a gen x person around 1988 exactly you know by the way louis ck has a very hilarious
00:16:30.940 uh little take on this where he talks about how he doesn't understand why the word retarded has
00:16:37.100 become like a prohibited taboo word because when he said when he was growing up in the 70s this
00:16:41.500 was definitely the case for me too you know teachers would just be like ah stop it he's
00:16:45.960 retarded and he says like you know why they called him retarded because he was retarded
00:16:50.600 like it was just it was never really like a word that was intended to offend it was like a just
00:16:55.860 descriptive word of an actual cognitive disability, like an impairment. And it is
00:17:01.760 strange. But yeah, you know, I think I don't think there's anything wrong with like having
00:17:06.080 language evolve and certain words is becoming like, rude, you know, like, it's not like you
00:17:10.800 should go to jail for using them. It's kind of like a question of etiquette. It's fine.
00:17:15.240 But I really would like to know, like, who among us doesn't use words in private that we wouldn't
00:17:20.960 use in public. I certainly do, especially in the context, like, you're talking to a good friend,
00:17:25.380 you know sometimes you use it ironically as a joke they understand your intention
00:17:29.380 um you know who among us well that's and i think that the r word the r word is becoming a more
00:17:36.980 subversive thing to say now anyway it's kind of back in vogue as like f you i'm not abiding by
00:17:43.200 your woke language police i'm gonna call you a retard and it doesn't mean i don't like disabled
00:17:48.560 people or i think they're disgusting or i want them to be put down it's like by the way it's
00:17:53.160 It's weird because if memory serves, there's like three categories of people who have issues
00:18:02.380 when it comes to like how well their brain works.
00:18:06.820 There's retarded, there's a moron.
00:18:10.220 You can be like literally, this used to be a term used in psychiatry, I think.
00:18:14.040 Retard, moron, and imbecile.
00:18:16.480 I think these are like gradations that used to be totally accepted within like the medical
00:18:21.880 community.
00:18:22.340 I'll check on this, but I'm pretty sure I was told this by a psychiatrist once.
00:18:26.780 You can still call somebody a moron.
00:18:28.700 You can call them an imbecile.
00:18:30.320 Like, I'm not sure what happened to that, to the word retard, whatever.
00:18:33.660 It's not something that's important to me.
00:18:35.060 I'm just saying, like, they're making it sound like she used the N word in private.
00:18:39.720 And like, come on, she didn't.
00:18:42.380 Not that we know of anyway.
00:18:44.340 Yeah.
00:18:44.620 And also, again, like, I do think context and intent matter so much in terms of how
00:18:49.100 you're using this word.
00:18:49.840 like i see people online all the time using the word faggot not even to refer to people who are
00:18:55.000 gay and it's kind of like i understand the intent of it it doesn't even bother me because it's not
00:18:59.280 intended to be like this malicious attack on a certain group of people it's just a word that
00:19:03.400 got prohibited and now it's back in vogue because we refuse to prohibit it even when i was growing
00:19:07.400 up that was a word that was used obviously it had these anti-gay connotations but it was much
00:19:11.340 it was used much more broadly i think it's unfortunate the new york totally mixes these
00:19:15.100 two things together you know these two like one which is a real character issue and the other
00:19:19.120 which is like kind of just woke PC language patrolling.
00:19:24.100 But, you know, this is one of the problems
00:19:25.720 in being in Democratic Party politics
00:19:27.240 is that you subject yourself and she, I'm sure if you look,
00:19:30.340 you can find her enforcing a lot of these kind of woke laws
00:19:34.880 on other people and eventually it comes for you as well.
00:19:37.460 That's a big problem in left liberal politics.
00:19:40.040 I want to ask you just one quick thing.
00:19:41.740 Like, I'm the last person to find like gendered,
00:19:46.280 you know, kind of analysis or apply it
00:19:48.820 where it doesn't belong but you know high stress workplaces often have like pretty aggressive
00:19:56.560 abusive bosses who like may react in a stressful situation in a very aggressive way and then
00:20:02.160 outside of that stressful situation they're just you know they're kind of normal they're perfectly
00:20:06.340 polite but with stress they just get you know throw things demand things like in wall street
00:20:10.500 hollywood politics you hear this all the time and i do wonder especially in liberal politics
00:20:15.940 whether people take that from men,
00:20:19.160 whereas with women,
00:20:19.940 there's an expectation
00:20:21.260 that they're supposed to be
00:20:22.240 kind of more demure
00:20:23.140 and it just comes off
00:20:24.320 as more alienating somehow.
00:20:27.480 I do think there's a component of that.
00:20:29.620 I just wonder what you think about that.
00:20:31.080 One hundred percent.
00:20:32.320 Well, I'm sure.
00:20:33.300 I mean, like if we really scoured our minds,
00:20:35.480 I'm sure we could come up
00:20:36.460 with an example of some male bully
00:20:39.380 who'd been outed like this in a race.
00:20:42.320 Nothing's coming to mind
00:20:43.320 off the top of my head.
00:20:44.500 Well, like, yeah,
00:20:45.160 Yeah, Rahm Emanuel's brother now has his new book out, Ari Emanuel, who's the big super
00:20:50.700 agent in Hollywood, and he's notorious for the most vile, foul, vulgar attacks on employees.
00:20:58.560 He has engaged in physical, and everyone's kind of treating it as like a funny character
00:21:03.320 fall, like a little quirk that's key to his success.
00:21:06.740 And that's what I'm saying.
00:21:07.780 Well, I think it also depends how powerful you are.
00:21:12.460 I mean, Ari Emanuel has power, a lot of it.
00:21:14.600 And so people might kind of respect it and admire it.
00:21:17.820 You know, it's like, how did he do it?
00:21:19.080 Oh, this volatile combination.
00:21:21.360 And maybe if these women were higher up the food chain, I don't know.
00:21:25.520 I mean, Senator didn't do it for Amy Klobuchar, but she doesn't project powerful either.
00:21:30.040 You know, I don't know.
00:21:30.800 I think maybe you could get away with it if you if you did.
00:21:33.460 Well, I mean, she's probably going to be elected mayor, governor of Minnesota.
00:21:37.600 So it doesn't really seem to have had like she's almost certain to be elected.
00:21:41.080 It doesn't seem to have really harmed her in the long run.
00:21:44.300 I mean, I think most of us have forgotten the stuff about Amy Klobuchar.
00:21:47.160 The one I remember was she was she was eating her salad on a plane with a with a hair pic.
00:21:53.220 Like a comb.
00:21:54.680 Yeah, a comb.
00:21:55.660 And then and then didn't she like whip it at somebody?
00:21:58.840 I can't remember.
00:21:59.540 She was a stapler and an AIDS head and a ballet head like an actual stapler, like which is pretty heavy.
00:22:04.740 She like just chucked it in anger.
00:22:07.100 Physical abuse. We all need to be clear that the line is definitely on the on this side of physical abuse.
00:22:15.440 It's a no. That's why it's it wasn't a shove. It was a bump.
00:22:18.460 But wait, there's more. There's more. I haven't even gotten my favorite part now.
00:22:23.680 Oh, by the way, she regrets using the R word, but denies the F word.
00:22:27.580 OK, during her brief house tenure, Peltola had one of the just I just need to hear from this woman before we go further.
00:22:34.600 We played a Katie Porter bite, but we didn't play a Mary Peltola bite.
00:22:39.280 Nobody knows who she is.
00:22:40.520 Here she is denying, well, at least responding to the New York Times report via Fox News.
00:22:46.420 Watch this.
00:22:48.340 Mary, do you have a response to the New York Times?
00:22:51.900 Hey, guys, we can get you a statement.
00:22:54.740 We're happy to chat later.
00:22:55.800 OK, any response to the allegations that she called multiple staffers homophobic slurs?
00:23:00.360 We can get you a statement on this later.
00:23:01.900 I have a statement that's in the Times.
00:23:03.400 Okay. I haven't read the piece myself. Okay. But appreciate you guys coming out. Thank you.
00:23:09.420 We'll get you something. You have my number. I mean, is there any credence to the claims that
00:23:13.500 she pushed the staffer hearing? There's a statement in the time. It was a bump. Okay.
00:23:20.340 That was a staffer. That wasn't her, but here's her. Here she is. She, in all of her public
00:23:24.060 appearances, so far as we can find, she's extremely boring, extremely boring. So there
00:23:28.220 is it is like oh who is she who is this person for real here watch alaska really is at the end
00:23:35.400 of the supply chain the logistics supply chain and we are often paying much more than hawaii is
00:23:41.400 for their commodities um as another good example um and this is a price from two years ago so i'll
00:23:47.680 be interested to see how the price has gone up but in kaktovik a community outside of utkiarvik
00:23:53.300 in the North Slope, a 60-tablet container of Advil was $68. So every single thing that we buy
00:24:02.860 is impacted by the price of fuel. So it is kind of hard to picture. All right, wait,
00:24:10.100 let me get to the next thing about her. I've got to get your reaction to this. It's the best part
00:24:14.300 of the piece. They point out during her house tenure, she had one of the highest staff turnover
00:24:18.180 rates on Capitol Hill. What a shock. Aides cite her volatility as a major factor.
00:24:24.520 Staff were required to feed live crickets, Glenn, to her family's pet chameleon, Meatball,
00:24:32.400 both at her apartment and then later at the congressional office. Meatball was hungry,
00:24:42.200 Glenn. His preferred diet consisted of live crickets, according to three staff members.
00:24:47.620 I love that the New York Times is calling multiple staff members like, can we can we talk about meatball?
00:24:54.420 Confirm or deny the diet was live crickets.
00:24:57.240 His preferred diet was live crickets, said three, including two who fed the chameleon.
00:25:02.580 Peltola instructed AIDS to purchase the insects at a pet store and then feed them to meatball.
00:25:07.980 Abigail, fine and see how lucky you are.
00:25:10.240 How could you possibly leave me?
00:25:12.080 She's going home to be with her new baby.
00:25:14.500 Anywho, aides initially went to Ms. Peltola's apartment in Washington to feed Meatball,
00:25:20.980 but the congresswoman later brought the reptile into her office on Capitol Hill.
00:25:25.140 Probably because her staff were complaining they didn't want to go to her house.
00:25:27.820 On at least one occasion, the crickets escaped Glenn in the office and had to be recaptured,
00:25:34.440 according to two former aides who witnessed it,
00:25:37.100 as well as a photo viewed by the Times that showed aides in the office trying to trap the crickets
00:25:42.440 using manila folders and small paper cups okay there's more but that's really these are the
00:25:53.800 these are the best highlights you know it's funny first of all when i was watching that
00:25:57.780 interview she did with lawrence o'donnell i honestly was thinking you can earn not only my
00:26:03.080 vote i can't vote in alaska i guess but you can earn my campaign contribution if you just do one
00:26:07.920 thing like let lawrence o'donnell ask you a question and look at him with like disdain and
00:26:11.380 be like what are you retarded I would like max out to her campaign immediately I was hoping that
00:26:17.120 was going to happen in that clip then the other thing is um I'm so angry that the New York Times
00:26:22.360 has a photo I wish they had video which I would also pay to see but how do they not show us the
00:26:27.680 photo of her aides being forced to like crawl around on the ground with manila folders and
00:26:33.720 plastic cups trying to capture the live crickets that she made them buy to feed to her her daughter's
00:26:38.500 chameleon meatball if they have that that is something we have the right to see i agree it's
00:26:45.180 a dereliction of journalistic duty uh this is very very wrong how did they miss that opportunity and
00:26:50.340 i'm not sure about the manila folder to get the cricket paper cup i can see yeah and you know in
00:26:55.800 their defense it would be very annoying to have live crickets also not everybody loves to like
00:27:02.340 take live animals and just feed them into the mouth of some other animal that's like a thing
00:27:07.080 that i know a lot of people do but not everybody's well equipped or wanting to do that but it sounds
00:27:11.320 like they were petrified of saying look i'd prefer not to do this because they would get pushed or
00:27:15.400 like provoke some kind of like dangerous temper tantrum
00:27:19.120 exactly they could be the next one assaulted by mary well here's my question for you why is it
00:27:26.600 why is the new york times doing this story because mary peltoll is doing well now she was not always
00:27:32.940 Before she won the primary, which was just in August, she wasn't doing as well in a hypothetical matchup against Sullivan.
00:27:41.880 It was back in June, according to the New York Times-Siena poll, Sullivan up by 47.
00:27:47.460 She had 45, not a huge lead on his part, but he was up over her.
00:27:52.760 Now she's leading him, and the race has narrowed quite a bit since she won the primary.
00:28:01.820 with her. I'm trying to find the exact percentage she's up, but it's not huge. Oh, yeah. Oh,
00:28:07.040 Kalshi, by the way, which is not a betting site or which is not a polling site, but a betting
00:28:11.000 site. They currently give the Democrat 72 percent to 28 percent for the Republican chance to win.
00:28:18.320 That's and by the way, back in December of 2024, it was exactly the opposite. He had 72 percent
00:28:24.280 uh to win so why would the new york times be doing this to her you know i mean first of all
00:28:33.440 everyone knows the new york times institutionally is more aligned with the democratic party they
00:28:37.720 hate trump that's obvious and everything they've done and said over the last decade
00:28:41.560 but at the same time like they you know you will get reporters in there who aren't so much
00:28:46.800 motivated by ideology but by careerism and they want you know scoops they want stories they want
00:28:52.100 to get invited on cable news and if they get handed to them which they probably did you know
00:28:56.660 disgruntled a's probably came to the new york times reporters and started saying this stuff
00:29:01.400 they smell a story that helps their career i think they're going to publish it especially
00:29:05.480 if they know that if they don't political will or you know axios or the washington post or whatever
00:29:10.440 so a lot of it is just more like careerism over over ideology but the other thing is like the
00:29:15.480 new york times does have reporters who are decent reporters even though the institution is so biased
00:29:20.100 I mean, I think it's important to remember that basically the entire Hunter Biden story of what he did in Ukraine with Burisma, all of the stuff in China that was done by principally by a New York Times reporter, Ken Vogel, who who is great, you know.
00:29:33.540 So so you kind of like get even in these institutions that are very politically biased and motivated, you do sometimes slip through good journalism, because whether it's because people have a conscience about their their work or because they just have a career interest in breaking stories, they don't care which, you know, will get through occasionally.
00:29:53.940 It's not like it's absolute. So I think that's probably what happened here is once you get these kind of people spreading the story around, if The New York Times doesn't publish it, someone else is going to.
00:30:04.600 Hmm. Well, good luck to her. I actually look forward to covering her if she winds up winning this Senate seat.
00:30:10.420 She sounds like she's going to be a real laugh riot. She and Meatball may be ascending to higher office.
00:30:16.240 OK, let's keep going. A couple of other stories that have been in the news.
00:30:19.280 we've been covering a lot here, like the holdout Clancy juror. The holdout Clancy juror is now
00:30:25.500 fighting back because Kevin Reddington, the lawyer for Lindsay Clancy, has, as I've been saying on
00:30:31.780 the show this week, tried to give this guy a legal colonoscopy. He wants the holdout juror's
00:30:37.020 cell phone, the actual physical cell phone. He wants all of his cell phone records to see exactly
00:30:43.760 who he was texting and when and calling and when in the course of deliberations. He wants
00:30:48.520 surveillance tape from the courthouse hallways around the deliberation room so he can see
00:30:55.860 whether this guy was on his phone, etc. And he's accusing him of lying under oath to the judge
00:31:02.120 when he said that he could be fair and follow the law because he didn't vote not guilty by
00:31:07.800 reason of mental insanity. I mean, this is like the craziest harassment of a juror I've ever seen.
00:31:13.320 And now the attorney for the Clancy holdout juror, Michael, has come out and spoken to this.
00:31:22.940 He spoke with our pal over at Fugitive TV, who came on this program to update us.
00:31:27.920 He's been in touch with the holdout juror, Michael.
00:31:30.340 So now this Michael's attorney goes on with Fugitive TV and says the following in SOT 12.
00:31:35.340 Very disturbed by what I've seen from Kevin Reddington this week.
00:31:39.540 obviously he filed a motion to investigate michael this is setting a horrible precedent
00:31:48.740 it's an attack on the sixth amendment it's attack on the right to trial by jury and if we follow
00:31:56.680 kevin reddington's proposal to its logical conclusion pretty soon we're not going to have
00:32:02.540 a justice system anymore because our right to trial by jury is the foundation of our criminal
00:32:08.980 justice system. I mean, where is he wrong? That's attorney Andrew Paltzik. He's the attorney for
00:32:16.300 Michael Desronville, the holdout juror, again, on Fugitive TV's podcast. Fugitive TV is hosted
00:32:22.940 by Ray Marcel, who was on the program, this program, not just a few days ago. So just one
00:32:28.680 follow up for you, Glenn, because I'm sure you agree with what he's saying, just how dangerous
00:32:32.100 this is. But now there is a new twist because Ray Marcel, Fugitive TV, who's again, in touch
00:32:38.200 with michael had a little update on what the other jurors were doing when he spoke with brian
00:32:46.020 enton stop 15 he thinks that it's in his favor because once again kevin is singling out michael
00:32:52.400 as in in his filing he's only asking for michael's cell phone records but what about the other jury
00:32:57.100 members right i mean do you think what do you think will end up happening do you think they'll
00:33:02.260 end up asking for all of them or well that's probably going to be the fight is either ask
00:33:06.660 for all of them if you want to ask for one then ask for all of them because my impression um or
00:33:11.840 what michael told me is almost i think he said everybody had their phone on them it wasn't like
00:33:17.240 they took their phones away and locked them away i mean there were juror members which i'm not going
00:33:21.900 to say names they were posting on social media allegedly you know wild deliberations going on
00:33:27.240 um so either take everybody's phone or no phones at all right on so where is this going
00:33:36.200 i'm actually i'm actually shocked and horrified that this is being done i mean
00:33:43.540 there is no requirement when you're a juror other than just to do what you think is the best there's
00:33:50.160 no proving that somebody refused to follow the judge's instructions and like from the beginning
00:33:55.160 of the republic the idea of a jury trial was we used to have jury nullification all the time and
00:33:59.000 and it was considered to be a good thing but here it's just like here just two quick things i have
00:34:05.500 a lot to say on this, but just two quick things that are about what you just showed me. One is
00:34:09.140 before the identity of this holdout juror was known, I found it so interesting because they
00:34:14.520 were interviewing mostly the women on the jury who were demanding an acquittal or not guilty
00:34:21.580 by reason of insanity verdict. And I did notice that they were speaking about the holdout juror
00:34:26.500 in a very peculiar way. They were describing him as arrogant and aggressive and threatening,
00:34:32.680 almost like uppity and then suddenly like the identity of this holdout juror is known and he's
00:34:38.220 this black man and i it was like so obvious in retrospect that the adjectives they were using
00:34:44.340 and the way they were speaking about him but then also i i this is what i'm perplexed by like
00:34:51.860 i'm a believer in the insanity defense it's been you know foundational to our to western justice
00:34:57.540 and the Enlightenment and Anglo-Saxon law.
00:35:00.400 So I understand, I really do believe in that.
00:35:03.240 But what I don't get is that
00:35:05.140 if there were one holdout juror
00:35:07.400 who refused to find her guilty,
00:35:10.280 I could understand the public hating this holdout juror
00:35:12.840 because the insanity defense is kind of counterintuitive.
00:35:16.920 And if you see a crime as primarily horrific
00:35:18.920 as suffocating three young children,
00:35:21.480 most of society is going to be like,
00:35:22.760 we demand the person's head on a pike.
00:35:24.780 Here it's reversed.
00:35:26.000 like people were craving that she get acquitted or that she get found non-guilty and somehow the
00:35:33.240 villain is the one who wanted to hold responsible a woman who suffocated her kids that's the thing
00:35:38.780 that's most mystifying to me like where did this inversion of value usually you have to fight
00:35:43.720 against society saying no the the insanity defense actually is it matters having a criminal intent is
00:35:49.340 crucial but here it's like you don't have to do that people are angry that he he he wanted to
00:35:55.220 convict a woman who strangled her three young children how did that become aberrational or
00:35:59.240 worthy of abuse let alone investigation of a juror which is something that is so taboo
00:36:04.620 it's so wrong exactly right this is like deeply deeply wrong what they're doing to this man
00:36:11.260 and it's very obvious i mean even joy reed and sunny hostin are defending this man you can guess
00:36:20.960 why. I don't think they would be if this were a white conservative woman. But whatever, they see
00:36:28.160 it. They see what we see, which is this is abuse and harassment, yes, of a man who happens to be
00:36:36.200 black and was the holdout juror. And then there's the famous, infamous Gayle King, like, I've just
00:36:41.520 got to sit with that. The holdout juror is a black man. I've got to sit with that. Here's what he
00:36:45.860 said, Michael Desronville, the holdout juror, in a written statement, I didn't have any doubts.
00:36:52.780 I didn't have any, he's saying. As I tried to explain different possible theories during
00:36:57.740 deliberation, I kept getting cut off as if I had doubts based on the evidence present. Based on
00:37:04.320 all the physical evidence, key witnesses, and what the prosecution presents, I thought it was
00:37:09.460 enough proof that she, Clancy, knew exactly what she was doing and planned. Okay, that's his take.
00:37:17.880 We're both lawyers. How on earth does Kevin Reddington prove otherwise to a judge? And then
00:37:26.160 let's say he does. Somehow, you know, Michael takes the stand and says, judge, I had no doubts.
00:37:32.560 But other jurors say he had doubts. He said them. Here's what he said. Then the judge says he had
00:37:38.160 doubts and somehow gets to the, and didn't apply the reasonable doubt standard, because you're
00:37:43.980 allowed to have doubts. The question is, is it a reasonable doubt? You know, beyond whatever.
00:37:48.440 So in this hypothetical, the judge says he had doubts. I disagree with what he's saying now.
00:37:53.780 I disavow it. I don't, I reject it. And also I am finding that the doubts were great enough to rise
00:38:00.700 to reasonable. And then I'm finding that he perjured himself to me under oath when I asked
00:38:06.040 him if he could follow the law and be fair. And as a result, I'm finding her not guilty by reason.
00:38:12.340 No, the jury never got there. There was never a verdict. They never actually voted, Glenn.
00:38:20.380 And as you know, when a jury is still compiled, it's still deliberating. They're having troubles,
00:38:26.200 but they have not yet been dismissed. If a juror gets bounced, the remedy is you get a new juror.
00:38:33.640 one of the alternates gets called up placed as the 12th man or woman and they start all over
00:38:39.600 again so what is this even about yeah honestly i'm i'm a little bit mystified and because also
00:38:47.860 you know you saw the public reaction was incredibly paralyzed you know polarized i mean there were
00:38:54.240 huge sectors of society that were like this is not even a question she needs to be found guilty
00:38:59.020 and go to jail for the rest of her life if not executed the crime she committed was the worst
00:39:02.480 and most horrible thing you can do. And then you had a huge sector of society that was like, no,
00:39:06.760 we need to understand that people have mental health problems and they lack requisite criminal
00:39:10.700 guilt. So that is a debate that is like a real debate that has polarized people a long time.
00:39:16.040 Why wouldn't you expect that same polarization and different way of looking at things to be
00:39:21.560 president in a jury of 12 people reflective of the community? And yet they're treating him like
00:39:26.440 he's some kind of criminal because he didn't see it the way the other 11 have seen it. This is not
00:39:31.920 unusual in a in a justice system where you have one or two holdouts who see things differently
00:39:37.500 from the majority but that's why you need unanimity in most jurisdictions to convict
00:39:41.920 somebody of a very uh serious crime and yet this that's what i'm saying i could understand it
00:39:49.080 if the holdout was the person who uh didn't want to convict and and a lot of people like
00:39:55.980 you prevented this woman this murderer of her own babies from going to prison and this anger toward
00:40:01.260 him he was the one who was saying no i think this person actually deserves to be in prison i'm not
00:40:05.340 buying the the the the the mental illness thing this happens all the time there's just a trial
00:40:10.000 this guy walked up to three uh young palestinian students of vermont and he shot all three of them
00:40:15.400 you know 21 21 year old kids who went to college and one of them is paralyzed from the the chest
00:40:20.140 down and he tried the the the the incentive defense and the jury after two hours rejected
00:40:25.140 it and said we don't believe he's insane we believe he acted with criminal intent this
00:40:28.160 happens all the time it's not like what he did is so aberrational there's something about her
00:40:32.880 and the story that has resonated so deeply in almost a disturbing way with a large part of
00:40:39.280 the population like an identification with her that anybody who questions her or
00:40:45.640 interjects her defense is seen as like an evil villain and i'm finding this extremely disturbing
00:40:52.240 me too same and it's it's going to go on and on we're not we're nowhere near done with this
00:40:57.820 Listen to this. So the women of The View took a shot at this case. And, you know, this guy, Patrick Clancy, who was married to Lindsay Clancy, who is her victim as well. I mean, he's the father of the three children who were murdered. And he goes on 60 Minutes with his new wife on Sunday.
00:41:20.260 I found the whole thing bizarre.
00:41:21.920 I mean, I've said to the audience, like, I don't,
00:41:23.940 Patrick Clancy didn't kill these children,
00:41:25.840 but I just, I don't understand a father
00:41:27.220 who is told by the spouse,
00:41:28.600 I'm thinking about hurting our children,
00:41:30.800 who then leaves that spouse alone with the children.
00:41:32.960 I just, she was having a good day.
00:41:35.360 Well, that's terrific,
00:41:36.240 but that's not reason to risk your children's lives.
00:41:40.340 It's a very strange decision, I think, on his part.
00:41:43.820 Again, it's not his fault,
00:41:46.260 but I also just, I'm kind of done hearing from him.
00:41:49.100 I'm like, whatever.
00:41:50.620 I don't want to be thinking about the Clancy's much anymore.
00:41:53.240 So that wasn't the take of Sarah Haynes.
00:41:57.240 Again, this is supposed to be the resident conservative over there.
00:42:00.200 Listen to what she had to say in response to the 60 interview.
00:42:03.960 Saddle Evan.
00:42:05.140 What bothers me is he talks about forgiving her, which I love, but he focuses on that
00:42:11.060 and never jumps to what so many people struggle with.
00:42:13.520 How did the marital love in so quickly when you admit openly your wife got sick?
00:42:19.100 She got sick. It doesn't mean you can be with him and it doesn't mean it doesn't remind you
00:42:22.620 of the worst day of your life. But I would hope and like in sickness and in healthy,
00:42:27.140 I would hope that my husband wouldn't sit there and just move right along.
00:42:32.400 Oh, my God. After you murdered your three children, what what kind of a person would stay
00:42:40.980 with the spouse after that? I mean, there aren't many things that shocked me, but I actually saw
00:42:46.980 that yesterday i think i i'm a big believer in like loyalty to your spouse to like marital vows
00:42:56.140 you know to like death do us part in sickness and health but like you have to put that into a human
00:43:02.960 context and if anybody including your spouse murders your three young children it was like
00:43:11.680 eight months three years old and five years old imagine if he had stayed with her and been like
00:43:17.500 yeah i forgive her i understand she was sick i would think he would be looked at as some kind
00:43:22.080 of like freak he would be like vilified like who would stay with the woman who just murdered your
00:43:26.380 three young children and that's her take like he has a responsibility to to stay with her and she's
00:43:32.300 disappointed because he like the love broke and probably the love didn't even break you know but
00:43:38.000 Like, who could wake up every day and look at somebody who murdered your three children?
00:43:42.140 That is monstrous to judge him that way.
00:43:44.560 Even if you want to judge him in other ways, like what you said, like, not that.
00:43:49.360 What?
00:43:49.880 Like, it's so weird.
00:43:51.000 It's it's it's from the same field of thought is like, well, he's he's beating the shit out of me every night.
00:43:56.860 But I said in sickness and in health and good times and in bad.
00:43:59.980 So I've got to stay.
00:44:01.320 This is not this is not the covenant at all.
00:44:05.100 You are allowed to leave your spouse if your spouse murders anyone, never mind your three children.
00:44:12.720 This is an absurd take.
00:44:14.100 That seems fair.
00:44:16.940 We've been talking about this case of this woman in Maine years ago, back in the 1950s or 60s, who she murdered her three kids.
00:44:25.780 She killed her three kids.
00:44:26.760 She drowned them.
00:44:27.860 She was sent away.
00:44:28.780 She was found not guilty by reason of mental defect.
00:44:31.420 And she went back to the same husband.
00:44:33.680 That husband did take her back.
00:44:35.860 They had another three children, and she drowned them too.
00:44:40.840 Like, note to Sarah Haynes, that's why.
00:44:44.760 He has no desire to be with this woman again.
00:44:49.100 He realizes she is a danger to, yes, anybody around her.
00:44:55.120 And he probably wants to have children.
00:44:57.220 His new wife is pregnant.
00:44:58.240 And he certainly doesn't want to endanger his future children to this woman.
00:45:03.680 Also, you know, I just have a strong objection to, like, judging people who you don't know who have gone through something you can't possibly understand.
00:45:13.760 You know, like, again, we've all gone through things that are very difficult.
00:45:16.500 We lose people.
00:45:17.180 That's part of life.
00:45:18.360 But something like this, where your own wife and the mother of your three young babies suffocates them, I don't think you can even remotely understand what that must be like to go through.
00:45:29.800 Probably different people.
00:45:30.640 like the fact that he got away from her remarried wanted to start a new family like i don't judge
00:45:36.580 begrudge him any of that you know like who would who would sit in judgment of him and how he moves
00:45:43.700 on from this incomprehensibly horrific experience like where i make it where do you i don't even
00:45:51.220 know where that comes from in a person's brain like he had the responsibility to forgive her
00:45:54.540 and stay with her well what that's like that's that is i don't i don't even i don't i i can't
00:46:00.440 begin to comprehend that this is the wisdom that the viewers conservative wisdom on the view in
00:46:06.520 the mornings you go on the view and you're like iq shrinks to like seven i'm telling you i have
00:46:13.040 more in common with that fuck planned parenthood lady than i do with this so-called conservative
00:46:19.080 of sitting on The View wondering why Patrick Clancy did not stay with Lindsay. Okay, Elizabeth
00:46:26.500 Holmes, I'm so into this. There's going to be this amazing documentary. It's coming out, I think,
00:46:31.340 October 15th, only in theaters. Now they've released the, everybody's talking about this
00:46:36.380 movie and no one's seen it except for at its premiere at like whatever, some festival.
00:46:41.400 Here's the full trailer. Watch.
00:46:43.720 You really feel you did nothing wrong?
00:46:46.120 I did not.
00:46:47.640 So where did things get lost?
00:46:50.080 Like, how are you where you are right now?
00:46:53.660 I wish I knew, you know?
00:46:56.880 I don't know.
00:46:58.440 I don't feel like I understand that.
00:47:05.100 So I know you guys invited me to stay here.
00:47:09.940 Does any part of you worry about me being here 24-7?
00:47:14.240 I don't think so.
00:47:16.780 i fell in love in that first conversation before or after that she revealed she was the founder
00:47:23.420 of theranos probably before i mean weren't you worried she was uh sort of scamming you
00:47:29.260 100 but what did she have to gain from me well isn't your family rich yeah i think
00:47:34.860 that there's like a lot of different levels of wealth you've never been suspicious that
00:47:39.980 she's ever lied to you no never i still have this weird feeling that there's some things that
00:47:47.600 i'm not seeing because i don't have anything to hide
00:47:51.740 okay it was not the full trailer it was most of the full trailer it they have little captions on
00:47:58.760 the screen like if you think you know everything think again and quotes from people who have seen
00:48:03.320 it like my mind is blown i've never seen anything like this there's supposedly some massive twist
00:48:09.180 that comes in the middle of this film
00:48:11.260 involving some celebrity,
00:48:13.020 some female celebrity not named Elizabeth Holmes,
00:48:16.240 and nobody has revealed the secret, which is good.
00:48:19.200 It's hard to keep things a secret.
00:48:21.280 I want it revealed to me
00:48:22.240 in the course of watching the movie.
00:48:23.940 But we get this news about her,
00:48:26.420 some shocking documentary about her
00:48:28.860 before she went to prison.
00:48:29.720 Just as we get the news,
00:48:31.060 she's being moved out of prison.
00:48:32.580 She was sentenced to 11 years.
00:48:34.620 Well before the 11 years are up,
00:48:36.600 they're now moving her to a halfway house,
00:48:38.940 which is it's not really jail. It's like, I don't know, like a camp that you're not allowed to
00:48:45.780 leave. And, you know, she's a nonviolent offender, Glenn. But like, that's a pretty sweet move for
00:48:54.080 somebody who, by my count, is I think five years into her sentence, if that. Yeah, I mean, it's
00:49:00.800 nonviolent, but it's not victimless. Like you do a massive fraud like this and you prune people's
00:49:06.760 lives you destroy their financial security for themselves and their family it's like not a joke
00:49:11.700 to to perpetrate a fraud on on on this kind of a level um you know i do i do think but like in
00:49:20.280 general i think our our system of justice doesn't treat what we call white collar crimes with the
00:49:24.840 gravity that they deserve um for a lot of different reasons but you know i think elizabeth holmes is
00:49:31.580 like an interesting person only because of what it reveals about the people who she actually
00:49:35.620 deceived i mean she deceived not just like the market at large but like george schultz and
00:49:42.100 like huge numbers of like very respected names opposed to like the wisest people
00:49:47.520 henry kissinger yeah henry kissinger they were all on the board they were all big
00:49:51.160 boosters of her and the whole thing was general mattis exactly former defense secretary under
00:49:56.560 trump one right i think it it is interesting about how con con men or con women like what they
00:50:03.860 tap into and and what people respond to how silicon valley just like the things they think
00:50:09.500 are interesting but i do think at least speaking for myself and i think speaking for a lot of
00:50:13.000 people the reason there's so much interest in this film is because the director and the person
00:50:16.840 who's in the film nathan fielder is an absolute like i don't use this word lightly genius like
00:50:22.380 the stuff he's done he seems it yeah i mean the rehearsal which is on hbo and hbo max is one of
00:50:28.300 the most complex subversive things i've ever seen one of the most genius works of of art he did a
00:50:33.620 thing with them a stone called the curse which like really viciously satirized like woke kind
00:50:38.600 of white upper middle class suburban couples so he and he he just like he he just mind ups you
00:50:45.920 and i think that's why this is not going to be just a ordinary documentary about somebody we
00:50:50.660 already know a lot about i'm sure it's going to be something that is genuinely mind-blowing in
00:50:55.140 a documentary unlike what you've seen i can't i really can't wait to see it i i should correct
00:51:00.780 myself, she's been in prison for three years. She was sentenced to 11, not five. So after three,
00:51:05.800 she's getting moved to the camp, the prison camp, the halfway house situation. No, he looks like a
00:51:12.140 genius. And like, it's, I await one word of negativity from people who have seen it. Everybody
00:51:19.120 seems floored. So I'm dying to watch this because I did cover this case, you know, very carefully.
00:51:25.640 I know, I know a fair amount about Elizabeth Holmes. I've met Elizabeth Holmes. I actually
00:51:28.940 really liked her and found her kind of charming. I guess I'm just like George Schultz. I didn't
00:51:32.680 give her any money and I certainly didn't vouch for her with other people. But by the way, that
00:51:37.080 guy who she married is worth hundreds of millions. So it wasn't a small amount. Okay. Well, there's
00:51:41.200 much more to discuss. We'll do it on the back end of this break. Glenn Greenwald is my guest for the
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00:54:42.840 back with our pal glenn greenwald he is the host of system update on substack we've been doing a
00:54:52.040 lot of work during the break glenn we have found out that it goes idiot imbecile moron morons the
00:55:01.980 worst thing you could be but then according to the new york times so that was it the new york
00:55:07.080 Times, Steve? A psychology website. According to a psychology website, eventually the psychiatric
00:55:13.460 world exchanged all of those for the nicer term retard. Like they decided retarded would include
00:55:24.140 all those terms. But why is it absolutely fine to say he's an idiot? He's an imbecile. He's a moron,
00:55:31.820 but she can't say the allegedly nicer retard than the New York Times in 2016 had a whole article on
00:55:38.240 how the scale is idiot, imbecile, cretin, feeble minded, moron. And I guess retard was at the top
00:55:46.980 of that scale. The point is there's a double standard going on here. Yeah, I personally,
00:55:53.240 in case anyone's listening and cares about my preferences, would prefer to be called retard
00:55:56.940 than idiot moron or imbecile i just think it's like a little less harsh you know by the way
00:56:02.780 we see this now slow we're yeah it's just yeah it just means a little slow sometimes you like up
00:56:08.140 and you are a little slow um but you know actually uh we're seeing this now with the word autism too
00:56:13.980 like very shortly that word is going to be prohibited as being too derogatory somehow
00:56:18.660 even though it's always been very descriptive and objective and neutral because now you know
00:56:24.180 the left has created this, uh, nicer term, uh, neurodivergent. Um, and then there's like
00:56:29.660 neuroconvergent. So like it's supposed to be even more value neutral. Like, let's just,
00:56:34.400 you're just diverged a little bit from neuronormality. Of course, nothing, nothing
00:56:41.360 works. Nothing is good as it is. Now. Um, I also wanted to tell you that I've been texting with
00:56:47.400 Abigail Finan. I'm very sad because my Abby after 17 years is leaving me. She's having a third baby.
00:56:54.180 And somebody needs her more than I do, Glenn.
00:56:57.080 So she's leaving me, and the baby's due pretty soon.
00:57:01.680 So there's been a lot of tears around here.
00:57:03.940 I have the wonderful Kayla, who's going to be her replacement.
00:57:06.940 But there's no replacing Abby.
00:57:09.420 Kayla's wonderful.
00:57:10.040 She's going to fill a whole new role.
00:57:12.180 But Abby is like a little sister to me.
00:57:13.820 I heard it was because you were throwing staplers at her head and calling her retard in private.
00:57:16.780 I hope that's not true, though.
00:57:17.980 I don't even think she would flinch if I did.
00:57:21.000 So this is what I wanted to read to you.
00:57:22.960 I said, she's telling me an update on something she was getting for me.
00:57:28.160 And then I said, great.
00:57:29.060 I said, now go buy me a chameleon named Meatball and please feed it live crickets.
00:57:33.920 And she writes back, the closest I've gotten is maybe my role as animal control when the
00:57:38.660 studio was in the other house and we had a crow in the studio, still makes me LOL.
00:57:43.500 Then she writes, I'm not even impressed by feeding crickets to a chameleon.
00:57:46.640 That takes just two seconds.
00:57:47.880 Just simply do it.
00:57:48.740 that's why you can tell she's a valuable person to your team so yeah i'm sorry that she's going
00:57:55.960 circumstances yeah exactly that's what you need yeah i know and she'll she'll never be gone from
00:58:02.420 my heart um here is that moment by the way it was halloween a couple years ago and we were doing like
00:58:07.180 a spooky show and we were talking to a guy who you know calls up spirits in old haunted houses
00:58:12.960 on tv and like sees if he can feel anything so it's kind of eerie and at that moment
00:58:19.420 something flew through the studio and it was just the two of us in there abby and i and we
00:58:25.780 freaked out watch this and we heard something and we're like she's making the big eyes at me
00:58:31.020 and i'm making the big eyes at her and she went down to investigate and there's a bird it's in
00:58:35.600 this situation a crow i believe that's usually a crow well that's uh that's holy as long as it's
00:58:42.480 not like a raven i mean bring our dad this is his job but we've had we've had situations like that
00:58:50.980 oh my god jason what should we do well hopefully catch it but uh i mean we've had situations where
00:58:56.580 owls have been in buildings with us and bats landed on our hats i mean yeah uh right now i
00:59:02.480 just say duck he's going what do i do what do i do i don't know oh god no you can't close the door
00:59:09.620 what it's caught in what thing wait wait wait let me take a picture of you hold on i want the
00:59:13.520 audience to be able to see it's caught in what thing it's like in that um white panel thing
00:59:20.940 what panel thing the door it must have come into that window it's in the side you know how you can
00:59:25.040 sit over there oh my god i'm so pumped here it comes it's coming what do you mean
00:59:30.020 i love how jason kept trying to do the interview like wait a minute no and it was it was an actual
00:59:41.600 crow it was a right wasn't it a crow it was a it was a crow it was a large large bird we did catch
00:59:47.480 it and it lived it was set free but it was in the studio and it was kind of like a ham uh hamper
00:59:54.220 cover that she had picked up like no it was like one of those trays you put on a coffee table you
00:59:59.540 know to like she was using it like a shield in case the crow attacked her she had like a shield
01:00:04.020 i think it was her weapon i don't know if it was a sword or a shield in her mind but
01:00:08.240 she got it done glenn as she always does that's the kind of gal she is um okay so anyway back to
01:00:15.740 the news we've got to talk about the lesbian bar do we not i would be super angry if we left without
01:00:21.220 that yeah we we got i mean there's left i'm putting the actually hard news behind the lesbian
01:00:26.960 bar we actually do have some politics to get to but it can wait the lesbian bar is the best story
01:00:32.220 of the week bar none it's very clear and here's the story so um our friends over at the blocked
01:00:39.900 and reported podcast are the ones who broke this story then the boston globe caught onto it and
01:00:46.500 wrote it up and everybody's giving the boston globe credit but that's bullshit because they
01:00:50.960 are not actually the ones who broke the story. It's Jesse Signal and Katie Herzog over at
01:00:58.500 Blockton Reported who broke it. And here is the story. A small lesbian bar, this is from the
01:01:05.200 Boston Globe I'm reading, a lesbian bar in Greenfield, Massachusetts called Last Ditch
01:01:11.000 sparked intense controversy within parts of the local queer community after announcing it would
01:01:15.420 make Saturday nights mask optional. This is current. This is not from 2020. This is current,
01:01:22.640 almost 2027 America. Last Ditch, which opened last year as a bar for, quote,
01:01:27.820 dykes, transsexuals, gender freaks, workers, and their friends is, you'll be shocked to hear,
01:01:35.320 struggling and was hoping a policy change might help revive foot traffic. The three housemates
01:01:43.920 mates in their mid-20s opened it together, hoping to fill the void left by two similar
01:01:48.200 bars that had shuttered. One of the founders, Asa Rosario, a drag performer who uses it,
01:01:56.300 its pronouns, envisioned a venue where it and its friends could perform. No one would be turned
01:02:03.600 away from the space for lack of funds. Poor and unhoused people are welcome in the space.
01:02:09.940 The police were not shocked this didn't do well.
01:02:12.700 Our mission is to create systems of care and action and aid, says Jackie Mattelian, one of the founders.
01:02:20.160 Last Ditch, which had required well-fitted KN95 masks or better, I don't even know what that means, like a full hazmat suit, at all times, announced the change to their mask policy on Instagram.
01:02:32.660 It is with love that we inform our immunocompromised disabled divas that we will be opening Saturday nights as mask optional, wrote Last Ditch.
01:02:44.680 The post was definitely not received with love, writes the Boston Globe.
01:02:49.660 The post triggered hundreds of angry comments accusing the bar of being ableist, eugenicist and endangering immunocompromised people.
01:02:59.720 Quote, just say you're being complicit in a mass disabling event and get it over with, wrote one.
01:03:05.600 Quote, people like you kill disabled people in the name of your own leisure and convenience, posted another.
01:03:11.720 Here was the third.
01:03:12.820 I hope your venue gets firebombed for robbing my fellow immunocompromised people of their Saturday plans just to escape, just to scrape extra revenue from ableists.
01:03:24.120 The thread grew to 442 comments, some supportive, but many furious.
01:03:28.920 Then the comments were turned off.
01:03:31.740 The people running the bar were accused of being ableist, as you heard, eugenicist, etc.
01:03:35.720 Commenters consider, oh, in the face of what commentators consider an ongoing pandemic.
01:03:44.140 Then came the apology.
01:03:46.300 Posted by the bar on Instagram, it seemed to just add fuel to the fire.
01:03:50.440 To no one's surprise, they write, accessibility update.
01:03:54.720 We are sorry to disappoint valued community members with access changes by a casual announcement.
01:04:00.740 Our diverse, disabled, immunocompromised team make decisions by multiple open community meetings, feedback, forum review, etc.
01:04:07.820 Vast feedback over almost two years pushed for varied accessibility, not one size fits all.
01:04:12.060 People consent to varying risks every day to be in community, though we generally try to follow universal design.
01:04:18.240 All 99% of us marginalized deserve to be welcome.
01:04:21.040 Accessibility is a pillar of our mission.
01:04:22.660 We prioritize solidarity amongst groups with different needs, connecting us all in this revolution with the rainbow behind it.
01:04:29.400 I don't even know what that means.
01:04:30.460 I don't know what any word of that means other than they're sorry, but it doesn't seem like anything is changing.
01:04:36.940 We are passive, they write in an accompanying post.
01:04:39.980 We are sorry for our passive and dismissive tone of our change to the norms and schedule impacting the most intersectional of us.
01:04:49.120 Keep an eye on this Instagram for an update.
01:04:51.800 The apology set off a fresh round of accusations of ableism.
01:04:54.500 This is not an accessible post, wrote one user.
01:04:58.260 It indicates the lack of care or interest in disability intersectionality.
01:05:02.660 That's a thing.
01:05:03.800 In the same post, the bar announced a community feedback and volunteer meetup.
01:05:07.780 That's not a good idea.
01:05:09.200 By the time of last-ditch monthly community meeting on September 11th of this month,
01:05:13.740 only one of the original founders, Mattillion, is still involved.
01:05:18.020 The two others stepped back from the daily operations months beforehand, one citing pressures and health issues.
01:05:23.780 The other had enrolled in clown school.
01:05:28.000 The meeting was something.
01:05:30.420 It began with a calming breathing exercise before devolving into chaos.
01:05:34.080 There are some 10 people seated in a circle on the dance floor all wearing masks.
01:05:37.900 Another 10 to 15 people joined via Zoom.
01:05:40.380 Mattelian, a handful of volunteers, some bar regulars, and two designated mediators are there to facilitate conversations between parties who disagree.
01:05:46.900 One of Last Ditch's most vocal critics, the head of another queer COVID-conscious collective in Western Mass, a performer and artist who goes by Zoe Noir, joins via Zoom.
01:05:58.720 He and other critics begin to flood the Zoom chat with irate messages, which are dutifully read aloud to the group.
01:06:04.280 When it is Matillion's turn, she says she had never envisioned running Last Ditch alone.
01:06:09.180 It was not my passion project, she says.
01:06:11.680 Matillion tells the group her credit score is trashed for six months.
01:06:15.320 She lived in her truck because she was pouring money into the bar, which, of course, nobody wanted to go to for all the obvious reasons.
01:06:21.040 She is working four different jobs.
01:06:22.660 She is responsible for paying off the $50,000 loan the three took out to launch the business.
01:06:27.100 The online critics are unmoved.
01:06:29.660 You chose to use your time to spill tears and center your feelings.
01:06:33.220 Noir posts in the chat.
01:06:36.320 This is incredibly racist and deflecting behavior.
01:06:40.000 Of course we had to get to the racist accusation.
01:06:44.280 After the meeting, Noir spends the hours posting furious Instagram stories about Mattelian and Last Ditch.
01:06:50.980 According to Noir, Mattelian, who uses she, they pronouns, had been shedding white they, them tears.
01:06:58.920 He writes, the bar was not a safe environment nor interested in revolutionary praxis.
01:07:06.240 P-R-A-X-S, X-I-S.
01:07:08.240 When asked if he had any sympathy for the bar, given the financial strain, he said,
01:07:13.700 I'm not going to give grace when someone is, quote, spreading rhetoric that can and will get people hurt in reference to the mask optional policy on Saturdays only.
01:07:23.220 Noir went on these ableist ideas that disabled people, immunocompromised people should either risk their health or just be pushed out of spaces.
01:07:30.520 The Globe recalls a comment on Last Ditch's original announcement after the pylon had begun at Scream Guy was up, asked,
01:07:37.720 I'm sorry, all 400 of these crazy people live in Greenfield, Massachusetts.
01:07:42.260 I ask whether the people behind the angriest posts have genuine connections to the bar.
01:07:46.740 Are they real customers?
01:07:48.620 Volunteer Melody Young and owner Jackie Metallian say yes, they know many of the detractors.
01:07:56.840 Connecticut Representative Rosa DeLaro on X posted Wednesday,
01:08:00.340 getting a group together to visit the weird lesbian bar in Western Mass.
01:08:04.480 DM if interested, can't talk here.
01:08:07.020 About three hours later, she followed up. Trip canceled. No one wanted to mask. That's even with a rainbow Democrat from Connecticut. So that's where things stand, Glenn. They are the most vicious against their own.
01:08:25.520 the super woke immunocompromised intersectional non-ableist whatever that you
01:08:33.660 one toe out of line and they will crucify you yeah i have i mean i have so many reactions to
01:08:42.880 this like of course it's super fun and easy to just mock this in the funniest way for all of
01:08:47.980 eternity and i'm sure i'll do that at some point but honestly like my overriding reaction the more
01:08:53.500 right listen of course i've read this before it's like kind of anger and sadness every it's funny
01:08:59.320 every time i've ever talked about uh trans issues and like the whole trans movement and gotten in
01:09:04.800 trouble for it it's almost always because of the uh corrupting influence of katie herzog who's you
01:09:10.080 know a lesbian she's a friend of mine she's a little younger than me but she you know grew up
01:09:13.940 in the the kind of generation where like lesbian culture was very important to her and she's written
01:09:18.540 before about you know starting years ago and before she was had this podcast when she was just
01:09:22.900 at an independent left-wing newspaper in seattle called the stranger she was starting to write
01:09:27.360 about how trans issues were starting to kind of change and even degrade like what had been
01:09:33.620 gay and lesbian culture and she got viciously ostracized i mean all over seattle you would see
01:09:39.680 stickers saying katie herzog is a nazi she was physically threatened all the time this is like a
01:09:44.720 very left-wing lesbian who became like this symbol of nazism and fascism because it was just the
01:09:51.000 slightest like analytical curiosity about how these cultures were mixing and so the fact that
01:09:56.480 she broke the story is no uh surprise because i'm probably going to get in trouble again for
01:10:01.260 what i'm about to say but like like first of all it's what you said like just take out the lesbian
01:10:06.320 part of it for a second everybody knows that the hardest thing that you can do in in american
01:10:11.340 in the american economy is be a small business owner and being a bar owner is like even harder
01:10:17.080 The chances that you're going to succeed is quite small.
01:10:20.500 You work day and night.
01:10:21.920 You're constantly struggling over profit margins and how to keep the bar open and running.
01:10:26.360 Every bar owner you've ever known will tell you this.
01:10:28.880 And here's a woman whose bar is failing.
01:10:31.120 Who knows why?
01:10:32.020 I'm sure it does have to do with the fact that in 2026, you can't go in without a mask,
01:10:36.060 just for that reason alone.
01:10:37.620 So they're like, this woman is in debt.
01:10:39.940 She's in debt.
01:10:40.860 The other owners have left.
01:10:42.380 One decided, you know what?
01:10:43.300 i think it's better to go to clown school and become a clown and continue with this like you
01:10:48.260 know this effort she's she lived in her car for six months she can't play her employees
01:10:53.200 and so she just tried she's like i just need one night to try and get people who will only come if
01:10:59.180 they don't have to wear a mask which is like the vast majority of people in 2026 and that's what
01:11:03.600 led to this vicious attempt to destroy her and they and these are supposed to be people on the
01:11:08.220 left who like identify with working people who identify with people being crushed by capitalism
01:11:12.740 and they're like we don't give the sight also we we believe in love and tolerance right that
01:11:18.680 with the lawn sign yeah and like here's the thing like when i went to college actually when i went
01:11:24.940 to law school it was like the early 90s i went to nyu and this was at a time when like that group
01:11:29.680 act up the activist group act up was was really starting to become powerful and these were like
01:11:34.460 very serious activists you know like gay and lesbian activism was very serious they weren't
01:11:38.540 just screaming and yelling they had like learned the science a lot of the lesbians who led it were
01:11:42.180 like nurses and scientists and they developed this expertise and at the time the villain was
01:11:47.120 anthony fauci he was the head of infectious diseases and they felt like they weren't doing
01:11:50.760 enough to push big big pharma to get you know so i was so impressed with like gay and lesbian
01:11:55.640 politics it was serious it was confronting power centers for like noble causes they played a big
01:12:01.200 role in getting experimental this is like good politics now like lgbt politics is about attacking
01:12:08.820 like the most marginalized powerless people like impoverished bar owners over this and like calling
01:12:16.100 them right genus and this like it relates to the story we're talking about with those democratic
01:12:20.200 women who end up getting like you know attacked for using retard or faggot or whatever this bar
01:12:25.820 you could tell like in fact the owner is like a day them that's why that guy was like she's crying
01:12:29.580 white they them tears it's all like the other one's an it yeah exactly these are not like you
01:12:35.280 know this is not like the wall street barons or like silicon valley oh like the tucker carlson
01:12:41.600 saloon no exactly these are like as woke and left-wing as it gets which is why they had the
01:12:46.740 mask mandate until 2026 why it's like genderqueer and all those other things that don't even make
01:12:51.500 sense but eventually that's what i hate most about left-wing politics is they never direct
01:12:57.220 themselves or really direct themselves to anything that actually matters to anything powerful they'll
01:13:01.540 always pick the person right next to them and you i can list almost every left wing organization
01:13:06.500 that over the past 10 years has basically imploded starting from like me too and woke and george
01:13:11.740 floyd and black lives matter and all the new jargon they always just like wage war on themselves it's
01:13:18.200 the most miserable place to be even if you have like ideological alignment with them on certain
01:13:24.300 issues all you want to do is run in the opposite direction because they're the most miserable
01:13:28.580 sadistic people imagine saying i don't have any concern it's sick it's like sadism is where they
01:13:35.580 get the word from you nailed it this is reminding me of noah rothman's great book new puritans
01:13:42.780 which is so excellent i urge everybody to read it it's just he's very smart and he turned his
01:13:49.080 powers on the woke who he called new puritans and that's that's exactly the right term for them
01:13:55.620 Like the Puritans who were so scolding and unforgiving and hated joy of any kind or laughter or dancing or, God forbid, a drink.
01:14:05.440 Everything was absolutely not.
01:14:07.660 And one step out of line and you would be made an example of.
01:14:11.020 And that's how the woke are.
01:14:12.720 And his book had all these examples of left-on-left violence.
01:14:16.120 You know, like the two ladies who tried to do like a taco truck to bring other cultures to a neighborhood so that they could experience something beyond meatloaf and were killed for it because they weren't actually Mexican and they were, you know, culturally appropriating and then ruined them.
01:14:34.640 example after example of how the left ruined a fellow leftist for not being appropriately
01:14:42.720 intersectional or self-flagellating over the fact that they were white, you name it,
01:14:48.540 like there's a long list. There is, we have a little sound here, which we should play.
01:14:53.280 Here is from blocked and reported, mediators attempting, attempting to end the meeting.
01:15:00.620 and we get a look at this person, Noir, the one who is calling everybody racist now
01:15:05.420 and who would not give forgiveness.
01:15:07.960 Let's watch some of this.
01:15:08.880 Top three.
01:15:10.100 As a trans person, there's a lot of emotion.
01:15:16.940 There's a lot of emotional and physical labor that goes into this.
01:15:19.580 So for you as a white person that asked me to stay another meeting for free,
01:15:24.360 to vomit the same harm that Jackie has, everyone has access to see,
01:15:30.080 is incredibly disingenuous and racist i'm not doing that okay so yeah he's got to play that
01:15:39.180 the race card i guess that's why he goes by noir i don't know what that's about
01:15:43.600 here's thought four another another sneak peek via blocked and reported of what happened at the
01:15:48.260 meeting this is community talking to community that's number one it's going to be uncomfortable
01:15:55.320 That's number two. Nobody is owed comfort on land in which rape and pillage has happened.
01:16:04.180 We all know what's happening on a societal level. We all have shit that is happening on a personal level.
01:16:12.100 Nobody is owed and prioritized. People are prioritized comfort. Let me walk that back.
01:16:18.360 It's people who are prioritized comfort, but nobody is above discomfort.
01:16:23.420 okay so we're on indigenous land and therefore nobody has the right to object to anything
01:16:31.940 there'll be no sympathy extended to any you can never be comfortable because right 400 years ago
01:16:38.840 this land had rape and pillage so who are you to comply also don't they have very white group by
01:16:43.400 the way which is just ironic because they found the way to squeeze in the racism thing and by the
01:16:47.260 way the the racism claim was like you made me come to a meeting for free and now want me to come to
01:16:52.100 another one i don't do unpaid labor and as a white person it's race okay but let me just say
01:16:57.660 too can we just stop and pause for one second making please like having heard that unless
01:17:01.380 remind ourselves that all of this happened because this bar in 2026 which has a mask requirement to
01:17:09.460 enter said we're just going to have one night just to try and save ourselves economically we're just
01:17:15.220 one night out of the seven we're going to let people in and it's mask optional you can still
01:17:19.560 wear a mask you're totally free we just it's one night when we don't have a mask to see if we can
01:17:23.340 attract other people and save ourselves look at all that it led to like the grimness the dreariness
01:17:28.540 the anger the like and and the other thing that i hate and i'm sure noah rothman wrote about this
01:17:32.780 in his book i remember that book that the other big part of it that's so repellent is that there's
01:17:38.500 no redemption possible there's no like christianity all forms christianity like judaism islam like
01:17:44.900 repentance is critical like that's the human redemption possible and without that there's
01:17:50.260 nothing to the human condition you err once and you're forever destroyed the bar owner went and
01:17:55.420 profusely apologized for nothing and that just made them angrier because there is no such thing
01:18:01.280 as apology once you've committed some kind of crime that you're done especially if you're white
01:18:06.600 yeah yeah or especially if you're white right or if she were like only a lesbian but like latina
01:18:12.860 she would still be lower on the oppression level than like the the trans people who were like white
01:18:18.460 or whatever so she would just be like you're you're a lesbian you have lesbian privilege you
01:18:22.480 don't know what it's like to be non-binary trans like everything is just like oppression ladder
01:18:25.920 that determines everything i unfortunately know this world too well here's this noir who is
01:18:34.080 coming after this jackie the owner the last woman standing um and listen to your point
01:18:41.020 what Noir is mad about in this particular exchange sought to via blocked and reported.
01:18:46.100 I do want to name that since that we are now apparently only doing one round,
01:18:50.700 that the one round that I do think it's interesting that now that there's only one round,
01:18:56.560 I publicly asked Jackie to respond to what I said and the harm that they did.
01:19:01.620 And they chose to use their time to not acknowledge what I said and instead go over time and cry for three minutes.
01:19:11.020 Jackie went over Jackie's time and cried for three minutes.
01:19:18.040 It's a no, I will be acknowledged or you're a racist, ableist whore.
01:19:24.520 That's really where it ended.
01:19:25.960 But it does remind me, like, just whenever anybody, whenever anybody attempts to give these people one inch, the flagellation, like they smell blood in the water.
01:19:39.020 It will only increase.
01:19:40.380 it never decreases they they you know you show them your belly they will cut it open or rip your
01:19:46.560 intestines out and enjoy dancing on them publicly yeah you know i i do blame these people more than
01:19:53.480 anybody for the like backlash and the backsliding on these issues that has happened we were talking
01:19:59.120 before about like people using the word faggot just because they can't because it's a taboo term
01:20:03.280 they use it for all kinds of things they just use it to use it like not because they're told that
01:20:07.000 you can't, this is very human. Like someone tells you to do, you can't do something. You're going
01:20:10.760 to be like, I'm going to do it. And the, and what happened was these are the people who taught
01:20:16.040 everybody that if you feel like, okay, you did something that you, even though you don't think
01:20:20.800 it's wrong, you can understand how other people might've be offended. Just trying to be like,
01:20:24.880 typically considerate to other people. It doesn't do you any good because if you ever apologize,
01:20:30.860 if you ever like take one step back, just out of like kind of deference to other people's
01:20:36.180 sensibilities that's when they will destroy you even further because they take that not as an
01:20:40.960 attempt to like diffuse the situation but as an attempt to basically as an admission of wrongdoing
01:20:46.360 and then they'll condemn you even further and so they have trained people never back down never do
01:20:52.280 anything out of consideration or out of thought for other people because it doesn't work with
01:20:56.340 these people they get more vicious and they train people almost like enjoy it yeah they they're the
01:21:02.600 ones who have like degraded and made much more crude our public discourse through this like
01:21:07.520 constant attack and constant effort to shame and destroy people simply so that they can get some
01:21:12.880 sort of like satisfaction in their miserable lives that's really what it's about it's just
01:21:16.760 like they want power and this is how they exert power it makes me sick to my core you could be on
01:21:22.700 the floor writhing in pain and they would take off their fake stiletto and shove it into your eye
01:21:28.660 That's who we're dealing with here. Here is an example from Noah's book, New Puritans. It's about some restaurant called Fat Rice. The controversy happened in 2018 in Chicago. The chef and owner was Abe Kanyan.
01:21:44.340 The restaurant had been a local favorite since it opened its doors in 2012.
01:21:48.980 In the summer of 2020, which was a tumultuous time, the restaurant's proprietors sought to convey their support for the anti-police protests that had erupted across the country with some Instagram activism.
01:22:01.140 What could possibly go wrong?
01:22:02.920 The restaurant posted a few anodyne images of protests and a message, quote,
01:22:07.340 We remain dedicated to our values. We oppose all forms of racism, and we stand with those fighting for justice and equality in our communities in Chicago and across the world.
01:22:19.100 It's a no. A former employee savaged the restaurant for what he deemed its insufficient gesture of support for racial justice.
01:22:27.200 You're not going to say hashtag Black Lives Matter, even though you take from black culture all the time, he wrote.
01:22:34.680 With that, the dam burst. A handful of former restaurant employees took to social media to
01:22:40.000 allege that Conlon was abusive and his business practice were racist. What did he do? Quote,
01:22:47.460 they don't give any cultural context to the origins of their ingredients,
01:22:53.140 wrote the former employee. That's the level of absurdity. Like it's back to the war games.
01:23:00.780 the only winning move is not to play no exactly and that's the problem is like you know if you
01:23:08.800 want to say hey like there are cultural origins to different foods and it's good to like i don't
01:23:15.320 know for whatever reason like you can just acknowledge it to show like the diversity of food
01:23:19.480 like your restaurant owner yeah that's kind of interesting maybe give more information okay so
01:23:23.220 like that's a reasonable conversation but they don't do that they instantly turn it into like
01:23:27.900 a moral crime if not even if you are asked to do it and don't but like if you've never done it
01:23:33.420 before suddenly you're like the kkk lynching black people because you didn't point out like
01:23:37.680 the specific region of mexico from which you're like sauce comes from and again this is the menu
01:23:44.160 is gonna be 200 pages yeah but like think of how many things in the world there are to focus on
01:23:51.060 and this is the thing that they think needs to be attacked this like popular lefty restaurant and
01:23:56.940 that is what 2020 and like i said i think most people are decent people most people don't like
01:24:02.620 to offend others they don't like to gratuitously anger others so it's like someone comes to you
01:24:07.060 and says hey like this word this practice kind of offends me you're like open to like saying oh
01:24:10.920 well i don't want to offend anybody i'm not here like make anybody angry but they have people don't
01:24:15.860 do that used to be they yeah no but i but that's what i'm saying they have taught people don't do
01:24:21.240 that because there's no benefit these people don't deserve that kind of consideration because
01:24:25.940 they're not actually trying to find common ground they're just trying to to prosecute you and
01:24:31.460 condemn you and destroy you for their own cheap and trivial enjoyment and once you understand that
01:24:36.640 why would you ever think twice about who how these people react who cares in fact you'd go out of
01:24:41.900 your way to do the things they don't want you to do and i think that's what they've trained people
01:24:45.080 to do that's the only proper response i mean it was like it reminds me of the time bernie goldberg
01:24:50.600 was on my show at Fox News and he he used the word midget. And I said, oh, I don't think you're
01:24:56.200 allowed to say that anymore. It's now little people. And he goes, what? Mike, you're not
01:25:00.920 allowed to say midget anymore. And he goes, midget, midget, midget, midget. That's the only
01:25:06.880 proper response. That's it. Like every time you tell me I can't, I'm going to double, triple,
01:25:11.240 quadruple down on saying and I'm going to make it my mission to say it as much as possible
01:25:14.720 just to send you a message that you don't control me or my speech and I'm not playing your very
01:25:21.980 twisted games. Maybe now they them and it it's which by the way in in the post I saw online two
01:25:30.240 of the original owners the two who fled the coop um have facial hair now have full male facial hair
01:25:37.380 they're women I think who now have full male facial okay good luck with that in clown school
01:25:42.560 um that after that maybe they'll learn maybe they will have i think it's a benefit in clown
01:25:47.580 school isn't it like don't you have to wear i can take a red model mcdonald beer or something
01:25:51.020 what do you mean in clown school you should be clean shaven so that you can put you know all
01:25:54.720 the makeup on your face that's true yeah it's weird to have a beard mustache that's true all
01:25:59.160 right we we have other stories we're going to get to first we're going to take a break and we will
01:26:03.360 be back with the pod father of the mk show glenn greenwald right after this we need to talk about
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01:29:42.540 Glenn, there's an update today in the death of Presley Gerber, which we've been covering.
01:29:48.580 It's just so awful.
01:29:49.420 27 years old.
01:29:50.480 And now the Daily Mail is reporting that in the weeks prior to his death, he was, quote, slowly losing his grip as he fell further into a spiral these past three months, actually, before his sudden death on Sunday.
01:30:04.700 the Daily Mail has learned, said to be, quote, really thin, gaunt, did not even sound like his
01:30:12.660 normal self, according to a source close to his mother, Cindy Crawford, who added that Presley
01:30:17.800 sometimes failed to make complete sense. He was getting high before he went to rehab. That's why
01:30:24.360 he went, because he could not kick the habit. He looked terrible before he checked in. He was
01:30:29.840 really thin and really pale. His face was gaunt. He was depressed in the weeks before his death,
01:30:36.360 also jittery, and again, did not make sense. He looked, says the source, like he was on meth.
01:30:41.740 He had that meth look. He was far from the cover boy he used to be. He had been in rehab many times.
01:30:49.920 He did not like it. He said rehab does not work. Rehab had a 98% failure rate, he said, so he was
01:30:58.700 not a fan. Both Crawford and her husband, Randy Gerber, were desperate for their son to get help.
01:31:05.560 They made him go to rehab because they knew he was using. They were not going to give up on him.
01:31:10.860 They tried another rehab center. They had so much hope, but in the end, he was in and out of rehab
01:31:17.000 all the time. They spent a fortune and it just didn't work. We've reported yesterday,
01:31:23.900 citing sources that there's not going to be an investigation into who was giving him ketamine
01:31:31.160 because there's a report that he was taking ketamine regularly, allegedly prescribed by a
01:31:36.020 doctor. And this was something that he was having an addiction problem with. So there will be
01:31:40.900 questions. And we understand LA police are investigating it right now. Who gave it to him
01:31:45.600 and did that drug play any role in his premature death? But what do you make of this case and the
01:31:53.580 awful death of cindy gerber's or cindy crawford gerber's son uh i think that it's so important
01:32:02.780 to remember that nothing in this world is free and so here you have somebody who's born into a
01:32:09.920 situation that most people who aren't born into that situation would think is so perfect that
01:32:15.280 nothing possibly could go wrong right like you're born to parents who are extremely wealthy i mean
01:32:22.140 Sidney Crawford obviously is her husband even more so because of her fame every door opens you
01:32:28.640 have access to everything from the time you're born you have every privilege every single
01:32:33.620 conceivable thing that you want it ends up opening the door for your own modeling career you have a
01:32:38.460 sister who's very successful in her own right doing modeling and acting and yet obviously
01:32:43.960 there's something extremely dark and sad and missing in his soul like in his psyche and his
01:32:50.980 mental life that led him to need drugs as a substitute for whatever he was missing and then
01:32:56.780 that developed into an addiction who knows sometimes mental health precedes addiction
01:33:00.440 sometimes addiction causes mental health and not only that he of course has access to every single
01:33:06.360 conceivable treatment and yet it's not enough to save him and he tragically dies at the age of 27
01:33:10.660 i know you've been covering a lot of similar cases of hayden penned here i think there was another
01:33:14.360 case very recently of suicide by somebody these are people who had all kinds of wealth and fame
01:33:19.840 basically from the beginning of their lives and how many times have we seen that they end up on
01:33:24.540 on an extremely dark road and i think it it obviously it's very sad but i also think it's
01:33:29.080 a kind of lesson to think about what actually matters in life and what makes you happy and
01:33:33.920 what doesn't make you happy in life it's it i was looking around online um just for information
01:33:41.340 about them and there was cindy crawford sat down with vogue didn't sit down but walked around her
01:33:45.520 malibu home with vogue and answered their 73 questions where it's i it's so awkward do not
01:33:52.260 say yes to this if they ever ask you it's like very bad acting they've clearly both rehearsed
01:33:57.980 the question and the answer but they try to make it look organic it doesn't but here's a bit of
01:34:03.920 that she featured both children and a lot of her malibu oceanfront home in the piece watch you
01:34:11.700 want to see around? Let's do it. Now, you're stuck on a deserted island, and you only have one book.
01:34:15.980 What are you reading? Anything by Jodi Picoult. You're trapped in a movie theater and can only
01:34:20.220 see one movie for the rest of your life. What are you watching? Anything with Meryl Streep.
01:34:24.340 This is a little self-portrait by Kaya, and this is Presley's surf photography, Shaka.
01:34:29.820 So, Cindy, do you have any nicknames for your kids? She calls me Kiki and my brother P.
01:34:35.240 Do your kids have any nicknames for you? Not that we can say in front of her.
01:34:39.980 What's your favorite thing about your kids?
01:34:41.900 That we're amazing.
01:34:43.260 Uh, Kaya, whose interview is this anyway?
01:34:45.220 Sorry.
01:34:46.140 Ask her about her sense of humor.
01:34:48.160 So, Cindy, what's up with your sense of humor?
01:34:50.620 Um, well, I mean, everyone in my family, they think I have a very inappropriate sense of humor at times.
01:34:55.580 What's your spirit animal?
01:34:57.200 Oh, Mama Bear.
01:34:58.360 You were valedictorian of your class.
01:35:01.060 That wasn't a question either. I just think that's great.
01:35:04.980 Oh, excuse me.
01:35:07.620 Hi, Prez.
01:35:08.300 hey mom i'm here for my cameo wait what was i supposed to do again um ask me a question all
01:35:14.360 right what's your favorite part about being a mom oh unconditional love well i hope that was
01:35:20.760 i gotta run bye
01:35:23.660 you know glenn i watched this and i can't help but think of her family dear friend he was said
01:35:32.040 to be like an uncle to her children george clooney who i really can't stand he and i have
01:35:37.920 attacked each other publicly many times. However, I do respect that he and his wife Amal Clooney
01:35:44.940 have kept their children out of the public eye. They don't want people swarming them
01:35:52.660 because they're Clooney's or because of who their parents are. And I do think these celebrities who
01:35:58.740 continuously put their kids on camera, whether it's to model or to act or to sing or whatever,
01:36:03.640 when they're you know because these kids have been on camera since they were little
01:36:06.920 are taking a very serious risk well i mean we all know the the history of what happens to
01:36:15.080 child actors who become very famous i actually think like probably the most tragic is michael
01:36:19.560 jackson who you know despite his unparalleled success and talent you know ended up dead at 50
01:36:26.580 kind of predictably and had a lot of obvious like roadblocks along the way despite you know or
01:36:31.760 because of the fact that he missed his childhood and was exposed to the public, which is hard in
01:36:35.800 every case, let alone when you're a child and you're defenseless. You know, just on those lines,
01:36:39.700 like there was a lot of, I presume you covered it, like a lot of that, the controversy over that
01:36:44.020 article by Nicole Hannah-Jones, the New York Times reporter about her decision to send her
01:36:48.420 kid to a public school as kind of a sociological experiment. And of course, there's a lot of
01:36:53.000 things to say. The worst one possible. Yeah. Yeah. Just to like prove her ideology and risk
01:36:57.120 her own kid's future but which ended up being really bad for her child surprise um but one of
01:37:03.080 the things that really bothered me about it that didn't get a lot of attention was okay she wrote
01:37:06.880 about this whole thing her kid is now 16 so maybe you can say she's kind of at the age where maybe
01:37:11.180 she can participate in that decision but 10 years earlier when she first announced her noble decision
01:37:16.380 she did it as part of a cover story for the new york times magazine and put her six-year-old
01:37:21.340 daughter a photograph of her on the cover of the new york times magazine and spilled in this like
01:37:27.240 10 000 word article all of the internal deliberations about her family about what this
01:37:31.840 kid's future should be and what should guide it and how what she's like i mean to me that's almost
01:37:36.900 like criminal like exposing your kids to this kind of excruciating intensive public spotlight
01:37:42.860 and scrutiny before they're even old enough to know what it is let alone to consent to it or
01:37:47.240 not consent to it and so i i don't know this family obviously so i don't want to like be too
01:37:52.820 didactic but there's enough of a pattern of seeing the very poor outcomes for kids who are subjected
01:38:01.000 to two-month wealth and celebrity and fame and public exposure from the time they're basically
01:38:06.260 young it is not how kids are supposed to be raised and as parents you're supposed to want
01:38:10.240 to protect your kids i mean i can just tell you you know in brazil because my husband was a member
01:38:14.180 of Congress and I did a lot of like very uh polarizing reporting you know we had to really
01:38:18.860 protect our kids all the time from any kind of public scrutiny because we wanted them to just
01:38:22.720 be kids and have like a normal you know life and not be attacked or talked about or or known for
01:38:28.080 anything that we were doing and I just that was such an easy decision for me I don't like if
01:38:32.400 you're Cindy Crawford you already have an uphill battle in keeping your kids private and she's
01:38:35.800 just dragging them as teenagers onto a screen with with Vogue or whatever it is at that age
01:38:40.960 And, of course, they ended up in Hollywood.
01:38:42.560 They ended up with the same career she had.
01:38:44.620 And it just obviously is not a healthy way to be raised as kids.
01:38:49.560 Yeah, it's really not.
01:38:50.860 And like this article I was reading from points out, oh, they were helicopter parents.
01:38:53.900 They were very involved.
01:38:55.020 I'm sure they were.
01:38:56.020 I'm sure they loved their children.
01:38:57.560 I just you have to question the decision to thrust a 14 year old, in his case, into the modeling world.
01:39:04.960 world. And repeatedly, even when he was much younger than that, put him on camera publicly,
01:39:11.500 take him to the events, make sure he gets photographed on the red rope line. It's just,
01:39:15.540 this is a very dangerous thing to do. You are playing with fire. This is not a harmless act.
01:39:22.140 This, you know, maybe you have a kid who takes to it. From what I know, both kids wound up in
01:39:26.700 therapy. And in Presley's case, it didn't work. It was too late for him. So it's very sad.
01:39:32.060 But OK, we've got to end on something not sad, which is Kamala Harris.
01:39:37.520 She's back and she has tried out a new accent or it might be the revival of one of her old.
01:39:44.660 It's kind of like a black scent.
01:39:46.080 I mean, you tell me, but she is out there making the rounds and she has decided to drop the following little bit.
01:39:54.080 Do we have it? Hold on. Yeah, I'll let you. Yeah, yeah.
01:39:56.760 Let's listen to it.
01:39:57.820 Shirley Chisholm talked about it.
01:39:59.860 If you're not at the table, bring a folding chair, otherwise you might be on the menu.
01:40:08.740 I'm conflating two people.
01:40:10.100 I think she's drunk again.
01:40:14.400 It's okay to not be in love with a candidate.
01:40:19.020 It's okay to vote and ask everybody else to vote because this choice is better than that one.
01:40:25.360 it's okay because this choice is better than that one it's okay okay like this is so fake
01:40:35.100 and affected it's cringy glenn greenwald but she's the gift that keeps on giving
01:40:41.260 unfortunately the latest news this week is that it looks like she might not be running at least
01:40:46.320 if you believe the five out of eight campaign aides that i think it was politico tracked down
01:40:52.060 and asked who don't believe she's getting ready to run they don't see the outward signs of somebody
01:40:56.160 building a campaign i'm holding on hope but what do you make of her new it's okay accent
01:41:02.820 you know what is amazing about kamala harris given how far she rose
01:41:07.600 is she is probably the least politically talented person i've ever seen in fact she has like
01:41:14.140 negative political talent there's nothing that she does that doesn't you don't find repellent
01:41:19.120 it's like always just like nails on a chalkboard everything she tries everything she says everything
01:41:24.880 she does and the amazing thing is she disappeared for 18 months so you know just like doing speeches
01:41:30.740 or like real estate corporations in australia for cash so you would think when she comes back
01:41:35.000 after that on people like okay we haven't seen her in a while i'm willing to give her another
01:41:38.020 but for me at least it was like barely gone like i found her as repellent as as i ever have
01:41:43.540 and you know this kind of like ability to use different forms of of speaking to different
01:41:49.660 audiences she was speaking to the NAACP she was obviously trying to be as black as possible with
01:41:53.320 a black accent as possible it's something that like some people can do you know like some southern
01:41:58.100 politicians can like speak in a more southern accent when they're speaking to some audiences
01:42:01.580 modulate a little bit when they're speaking to you know like national media or people in the
01:42:05.540 northeast or whatever the banking centers and some like obama was good at it he could kind of put on
01:42:10.420 incredible like but it was very subtle like his black accent versus like the harvard east coast
01:42:14.700 accent that he also had subtlety is good yeah bill clinton did it hillary i don't know if you
01:42:19.020 remember but hillary clinton in like the 90s the first time she did that 60 interview 60 minutes
01:42:22.820 interview about paula jones she was like i'm not just someone standing by my man it's like hillary
01:42:27.540 you grew up in illinois you went to yale law school what is this but come on like it's so
01:42:33.920 everything she does is so poorly executed that i i yes when you said like hey let's start talking
01:42:39.840 about something that's not sad Kamala Harris my first reaction was what do you mean she's that's
01:42:42.760 a very sad topic but you're right it's actually funnier than anything else because because of how
01:42:47.080 untalented she is she's so unthreatening so you can really just laugh at her yes and this will
01:42:52.140 end with this clip where she's next to El Saeed in Michigan uh the the senate candidate and he
01:42:57.560 looks like he would rather be anywhere on earth than next to her watch here's another fact the
01:43:04.180 The attack on DEI is an attack on maternal care.
01:43:10.640 An attack on DEI to recognize diversity, equity, and inclusion is an attack by definition on
01:43:20.600 maternal care, including the need to protect black women in connection with their pregnancy,
01:43:30.800 childbirth, and postpartum care.
01:43:33.880 If he had an eject button, he would have pressed it.
01:43:36.180 Well, it's so ironic because he's supposed to be the left wing candidate, but he's trying
01:43:39.480 to like be a normie Democrat and she's like the establishment Democrat, but she floats
01:43:43.300 in sounding like she just got out of a Black Lives Matter George Floyd march from like
01:43:46.600 2020.
01:43:47.540 She sounds like the people in that lesbian bar and always off the drift bar.
01:43:53.400 Yeah.
01:43:53.860 Like she's just always off note, you know, and you're right.
01:43:56.360 He's just like he's trying so hard to just be like, you know, he had her there because
01:43:59.920 she supposedly is going to help him with black voters, even though I don't remember that
01:44:03.200 cnn uh segment they went into a black uh barbershop in philadelphia and they're like do you think
01:44:07.380 camel hair is a black and all the black guys that were like not really it was so embarrassed
01:44:12.240 she's she's a mess she has no political value at all i can't i can't wait to find out what she
01:44:19.200 actually decides to do one way or the other we're either getting kamala or we're getting gavin newsom
01:44:23.760 because he says he's not going to run if she runs and so well i mean either way we're going to have
01:44:28.000 a good time glenn things are about to heat up in the political lane look forward to many episodes
01:44:33.100 with you discussing it all.
01:44:34.960 Great to see you, my friend.
01:44:35.780 Always good to see you.
01:44:36.480 Thanks, Megan.
01:44:37.860 Ah, the one and only Glenn Greenwald.
01:44:39.900 We will see you guys all tomorrow.
01:44:41.720 It'll be Friday.
01:44:43.200 Here's to that.
01:44:44.000 See you then.
01:44:45.220 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show.
01:44:47.080 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.
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