The Michael Knowles Show - Gay Church？ HEATED Religion Debate With Michael Knowles

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00:00:30.760 My understanding of gender and sexuality

00:00:33.760 is a little more complex than I'm afraid you're coming from.

00:00:38.920 It is complex, I'll grant you that.

00:00:40.740 Jesus already taught us how to pray.

00:00:42.300 He taught us to pray our father.

00:00:43.820 If you're going to teach people to pray a different way

00:00:45.700 than Jesus taught his disciples to pray,

00:00:47.500 that would be the epitome of pride.

00:00:49.160 So I guess my question is, why would you not respect God's pronouns?

00:00:52.520 Well, because clearly there are other places in scripture

00:00:54.440 where God uses other pronouns.

00:00:56.040 I think your view of what the Bible is is inaccurate.

00:01:00.040 The Bible is not the inerrant word of God quite clearly.

00:01:05.840 The morning after President Trump's inauguration,

00:01:08.920 an Episcopalian bishopress lectured him

00:01:11.280 on the supposed Christian duty to embrace LGBT identity.

00:01:17.140 There are gay, lesbian, and transgender children

00:01:20.780 in Democratic, Republican, and independent families.

00:01:26.980 Some who fear for their lives.

00:01:29.120 Our country will be woke no longer.

00:01:35.460 They signed an order making it the official policy

00:01:39.620 of the United States government

00:01:41.160 that there are only two genders, male and female.

00:01:45.520 So, is LGBT part of Christianity?

00:01:51.000 Here to discuss is Reverend Brandon Robertson

00:01:54.020 of Sunnyside Reform Church in New York City,

00:01:56.620 Reverend Alexandra De Silva Soto,

00:01:58.760 who describes himself as an undomesticated queer reverend,

00:02:02.360 writer, liturgical artist, yogi, social justice advocate,

00:02:05.780 and Johnny Artevanis, pastor at Stonebridge Bible Church

00:02:10.440 in Franklin, Tennessee.

00:02:11.740 And I suppose I will be the lone layman

00:02:13.920 and the only Catholic gentleman.

00:02:16.540 Thank you for coming on the show.

00:02:19.780 Thanks for having us.

00:02:21.020 Thanks for having us.

00:02:22.260 Brandon, I'll start with you

00:02:23.500 because you're nearest to me on the screen right now.

00:02:26.300 What's your take?

00:02:27.160 I think I know the answer,

00:02:28.140 but maybe you can flesh out your position

00:02:29.500 of whether or not LGBT is a part of Christianity

00:02:33.200 and if that identity is condemned by Christianity

00:02:37.700 or if it is actually a constitutive part of it.

00:02:41.780 Totally, yeah.

00:02:42.480 I mean, I would take the stance

00:02:43.860 that the Bible does not condemn

00:02:45.440 loving, consensual, same-sex relationships

00:02:47.660 in any of the passages

00:02:48.860 that are traditionally used against LGBT people.

00:02:51.660 And LGBT people have always been a part

00:02:53.820 of the Christian church

00:02:54.680 and today are leading the Christian church.

00:02:57.640 I lead a church, others on this panel lead in churches.

00:03:00.740 So it's quite clear that LGBT people

00:03:02.380 are a part of the Christian church.

00:03:04.780 Okay, so there are plenty of verses

00:03:07.200 that one typically cites against homosexuality.

00:03:09.600 Probably the most obvious one

00:03:12.080 is Genesis chapter 19, Sodom and Gomorrah.

00:03:15.900 Your take that this does not, in fact,

00:03:18.300 condemn any LGBT behaviors?

00:03:21.760 Yeah, I mean, Ezekiel makes it pretty clear

00:03:23.360 that the sin of Sodom was that they were unhospitable

00:03:26.400 to foreigners and strangers,

00:03:28.140 not that it was engaging in same-sex sex.

00:03:31.080 And if you actually read the story literally,

00:03:32.880 what was happening is sex between men and angels,

00:03:35.400 which is not exactly homosexuality.

00:03:38.520 Male angels, though.

00:03:39.500 So the argument being that when Ezekiel

00:03:42.120 is describing these as abominable acts,

00:03:44.180 it's really talking about inhospitality.

00:03:47.000 What do you make then of the epistle of St. Jude?

00:03:49.640 You know, Jude 7 says that just as Sodom and Gomorrah

00:03:53.680 and the surrounding cities, which likewise acted immorally

00:03:56.360 and indulged in unnatural lust, so on and so forth.

00:04:01.540 Doesn't that inclusion of unnatural lust clarify

00:04:04.980 that the issue really is the fellas?

00:04:07.320 No, definitely.

00:04:09.600 Another translation of that is strange flesh.

00:04:12.800 And I think it's quite clear that what Jude is condemning

00:04:14.600 is sex between angels,

00:04:15.900 which is a surprising thing that you find in Genesis

00:04:19.300 a couple of times of the sons of God,

00:04:21.720 the angels, having sex with the daughters of men

00:04:23.940 and creating these unholy group of people.

00:04:28.500 And I think that's exactly what Jude is condemning.

00:04:30.740 I think that's what Sodom and Gomorrah is condemning as well.

00:04:33.180 Okay, Johnny, is that your take?

00:04:34.420 No, it's not my take.

00:04:38.240 I think probably one thing maybe preface, Michael, would be,

00:04:40.760 you know, the conversation would be framed a little bit different

00:04:42.540 if I was talking with someone that was struggling

00:04:44.020 with homosexual attraction

00:04:45.260 than maybe debating a pastor that's coming

00:04:47.900 or propagating a biblical conviction

00:04:50.520 that you don't see in the Scripture,

00:04:52.740 in my view, very clearly.

00:04:54.740 The Bible, without hesitation, equivocation,

00:04:57.300 or really any ambiguity,

00:05:00.020 forbids homosexuality,

00:05:01.100 but also promises forgiveness and cleansing

00:05:04.220 to those who repent and turn from their sin

00:05:06.300 like any other sexual sin.

00:05:08.540 And so you could use Genesis 19,

00:05:10.840 you know, even he mentioned Ezekiel 16, 46 through 50,

00:05:14.500 that it outlaws hospitality,

00:05:16.560 but then it also goes from there to say,

00:05:18.260 and what they were doing was committing an abomination,

00:05:20.200 which routinely in the Scripture,

00:05:21.960 when that word is yud toibah,

00:05:24.200 it refers to something that is egregious to God

00:05:26.800 and it's routinely linked to sexual sin.

00:05:29.720 So Genesis 19 is one passage.

00:05:31.780 There are other passages that I'm sure we'll explore,

00:05:35.220 but the Bible is very clear

00:05:37.160 because the meta-narrative of Scripture

00:05:38.740 begins with the marriage between a man and a woman.

00:05:41.720 It ends with a marriage.

00:05:42.760 So marriage is the central metaphor of Scripture,

00:05:45.300 which speaks to the unique fittedness

00:05:47.680 and complementary nature of a man and a woman

00:05:50.200 in the covenant of marriage.

00:05:51.500 So we could be talking about any sexual activity

00:05:53.600 outside of a man and a woman in marriage,

00:05:55.500 and it would be sin according to the Bible.

00:05:57.520 You know, I really like this point that you're making here,

00:05:59.780 which is that we should even frame it differently

00:06:02.780 than the modern discussion of homosexuality,

00:06:05.500 whatever that means, you know, that could be so broad,

00:06:07.760 but that someone might be either born

00:06:10.440 with a certain inclination,

00:06:11.740 or if, you know, if the genetic evidence

00:06:14.140 is a little scant on that,

00:06:15.400 might have developed early on some kind of inclination

00:06:17.840 toward acts that are traditionally considered immoral.

00:06:20.740 But having an inclination

00:06:22.460 doesn't necessarily constitute a sin.

00:06:24.640 It would be indulging the desire

00:06:27.040 or the behavior that would be different.

00:06:28.560 So just as one might be born

00:06:30.540 with a predisposition toward alcoholism,

00:06:32.980 you know, you're not actually committing

00:06:34.360 the sin of drunkenness until you actually do it.

00:06:36.900 So too, it's not like you're condemning

00:06:38.260 a whole group of people.

00:06:39.740 Reverend Alexander, I want to bring you back in.

00:06:41.180 Thank you for returning to the show.

00:06:43.120 On this point here,

00:06:45.700 I suspect I know which side you're going to come out on

00:06:48.340 over whether or not Christianity condemns

00:06:50.420 homosexual behavior.

00:06:51.820 So I'd love to hear your position, first of all.

00:06:54.880 But then second of all,

00:06:55.820 because people are coming from

00:06:56.800 such different traditions here,

00:06:58.380 I'd be curious as to on what authority

00:07:01.340 you ground the legitimacy of your position.

00:07:05.460 So I'm sorry, first point,

00:07:07.820 I'm not a gentleman.

00:07:10.080 I'm a non-binary person.

00:07:11.820 A gentleman.

00:07:13.100 Yeah, no, I'm a gentle person,

00:07:14.840 not a gentleman.

00:07:15.640 I'm not a male.

00:07:18.220 And my pronouns are they and theirs.

00:07:22.600 And I actually debated the questions

00:07:27.700 you have been posing for over a decade

00:07:31.360 and wrestle with those questions

00:07:34.280 for my entire childhood and adolescence

00:07:38.580 into my adulthood,

00:07:40.600 trying to reconcile that

00:07:42.520 with precisely the second part of the question,

00:07:45.260 my call into ordained ministry.

00:07:48.180 And I used to believe

00:07:52.400 in those handful of passages

00:07:55.740 that get twisted from the Bible

00:07:58.560 to convince that it is about homosexuality,

00:08:03.140 which is, by the way,

00:08:04.220 a terminology that did not exist

00:08:06.320 until King James Bible was translated,

00:08:09.800 because in the actual Greek,

00:08:11.960 the terminology there is really about abuse.

00:08:16.880 It's about sexual abuse.

00:08:18.580 It's about enslavement of males

00:08:21.200 for sexual pleasure.

00:08:23.260 So we're not talking about the same things.

00:08:27.020 And I'm actually not interested

00:08:30.240 in convincing anybody,

00:08:31.860 because if by now,

00:08:34.140 after most of the mainline denominations,

00:08:38.660 Christian denominations,

00:08:40.020 and our Jewish siblings as well,

00:08:42.520 and, you know, Buddhist communities,

00:08:45.000 after all these world religions

00:08:47.580 have come to their senses

00:08:50.140 that queer people are human

00:08:55.880 and sacred...

00:08:57.860 Did anyone ever dispute that?

00:08:59.360 And sacred, yeah.

00:09:01.440 And sacred.

00:09:02.320 If you're criminalizing the ability of a person

00:09:05.380 to love another person,

00:09:07.220 if you keep telling them

00:09:08.720 that they're going to end up in hell for eternity,

00:09:12.580 you're dehumanizing those individuals.

00:09:15.480 You're actually terrorizing individuals

00:09:17.380 because so many queer folk

00:09:20.060 end up in very self-destructive lives

00:09:24.740 and behaviors,

00:09:25.880 not because homosexuality pushes them

00:09:28.960 to be in that behavior,

00:09:30.120 because their loved ones

00:09:32.200 and their communities of faith

00:09:33.800 that's supposed to love them

00:09:35.060 and care for them

00:09:35.840 keeps pointing fingers

00:09:37.260 and telling them,

00:09:38.280 well, based on our understanding

00:09:40.240 of these six passages

00:09:41.500 in the Bible

00:09:42.760 that we are not properly translating,

00:09:45.260 you are evil.

00:09:46.720 And what you do is evil.

00:09:48.940 And I get to...

00:09:49.400 I don't say you are evil.

00:09:50.080 I'd say what you're doing is evil.

00:09:51.520 I'll wrap it up.

00:09:52.300 Well, there's the point

00:09:53.740 because I was baptized Catholic as a child.

00:09:56.840 My partner was Catholic as well.

00:10:00.600 So I'm very familiar with the idea of,

00:10:03.060 you know, love the sinner,

00:10:05.680 hate the sin,

00:10:06.860 which is an impossibility.

00:10:08.480 I'm not even going to get into it.

00:10:09.820 But I'm also very familiar with the idea of,

00:10:12.180 well, you can have those feelings,

00:10:13.800 but you cannot practice.

00:10:15.360 So let me turn the question back to you.

00:10:17.460 You love your wife.

00:10:18.900 I do.

00:10:19.440 You have me and your wife.

00:10:20.900 I have, you know,

00:10:21.980 learned how much you care for her.

00:10:24.040 Now imagine somebody from a pulpit

00:10:26.900 telling you,

00:10:28.100 you cannot express this love you have for her.

00:10:31.920 You can feel it,

00:10:33.440 but you cannot really act on it.

00:10:36.820 Because my interpretation is

00:10:39.140 that if you consummate

00:10:41.940 that love you have for her,

00:10:44.180 you're going to go to hell.

00:10:45.320 Imagine that.

00:10:46.580 Try to conceive that.

00:10:48.200 Yes.

00:10:50.520 It's certainly the case

00:10:51.800 that if a preacher got up

00:10:53.360 and attacked the ordinary

00:10:56.260 and natural relations

00:10:57.360 between a man and a woman,

00:10:58.500 that would be different

00:10:59.560 from a preacher condemning

00:11:01.100 some other action.

00:11:02.220 I suppose my question for you,

00:11:03.860 Reverend Alexander,

00:11:04.480 and I'm pleased to hear

00:11:05.360 that both you and your partner

00:11:06.900 were raised and baptized Catholic,

00:11:08.860 and hopefully we can pull you

00:11:09.740 across the Tiber again soon enough.

00:11:11.380 But when you say that,

00:11:13.460 you know,

00:11:14.100 to oppose LGBT identity

00:11:17.020 is to criminalize

00:11:18.040 certain types of love.

00:11:18.940 We do criminalize

00:11:19.680 certain types of love.

00:11:20.480 We have ages of consent.

00:11:21.900 We have laws,

00:11:22.460 obviously,

00:11:22.700 against rape.

00:11:23.780 So there are other aspects

00:11:24.980 to sexual relations

00:11:27.120 than just love,

00:11:28.500 you know,

00:11:28.920 contrary to popular slogans,

00:11:30.820 love is love.

00:11:31.920 But then furthermore,

00:11:34.080 when you're talking about,

00:11:36.000 well, okay,

00:11:36.540 before I go off on a diatribe,

00:11:38.540 let's bring in Johnny

00:11:39.240 because I saw you were

00:11:39.820 raising your hand before.

00:11:40.580 Johnny?

00:11:41.000 But if I may,

00:11:42.100 because this is a very

00:11:42.860 important question,

00:11:44.100 right?

00:11:44.380 Because in your statement,

00:11:46.580 you equated the love

00:11:49.100 of one person for another

00:11:50.560 that happened to be

00:11:51.740 of the same gender,

00:11:52.660 of a different gender.

00:11:54.140 You equated that to rape.

00:11:57.120 No, I didn't equate it to rape.

00:11:58.580 I just,

00:11:59.220 I...

00:11:59.700 You're putting it

00:11:59.980 at the same level.

00:12:00.980 No, I didn't do that,

00:12:02.220 though.

00:12:02.340 Perhaps you misheard me.

00:12:03.580 So you were

00:12:04.280 correcting that.

00:12:05.000 Okay, great.

00:12:05.300 I proved that your assertion

00:12:07.400 was wrong

00:12:08.500 that to criminalize

00:12:10.520 certain types of love

00:12:11.760 could never be

00:12:12.620 morally acceptable

00:12:13.380 because certain people

00:12:14.540 might have a love

00:12:15.160 for someone

00:12:15.580 who is under

00:12:15.960 the age of consent.

00:12:16.940 Certain people

00:12:17.360 might have a love

00:12:18.200 for someone

00:12:18.540 who does not consent

00:12:19.240 to be loved

00:12:19.780 by that person.

00:12:20.720 And we obviously

00:12:21.420 have laws against

00:12:21.980 those things,

00:12:22.440 and I don't think

00:12:22.840 anyone on this panel

00:12:23.640 would disagree with that.

00:12:25.480 So I take it

00:12:27.860 that you have laws

00:12:28.780 against same gender relations

00:12:31.500 or against other forms

00:12:33.980 of union

00:12:35.100 outside the male and female?

00:12:37.480 Do we have laws

00:12:39.280 against same gender relations?

00:12:41.500 We don't presently

00:12:42.340 because of the

00:12:43.600 Lawrence v. Texas decision.

00:12:45.660 And that's the point, right?

00:12:47.980 Are there protections

00:12:49.260 being taken back

00:12:50.660 after decades

00:12:52.200 of trans women,

00:12:53.960 of lesbians,

00:12:55.480 of queer people,

00:12:56.900 of all gender shapes

00:12:58.520 and forms

00:12:59.120 fought to get those rights

00:13:01.720 in place

00:13:02.160 so we could get married,

00:13:03.560 so we could have

00:13:04.520 our children,

00:13:05.220 so we could have

00:13:05.940 spousal's rights

00:13:07.300 that you do have

00:13:08.380 because if your wife

00:13:09.420 ends up...

00:13:10.300 How can two men

00:13:11.640 produce a child?

00:13:12.240 You can go visit her.

00:13:13.420 I'm sorry?

00:13:13.620 What do you mean

00:13:13.880 to have our children?

00:13:14.640 How can two men

00:13:15.180 produce a child?

00:13:16.720 Oh, oh,

00:13:17.600 there's incredible ways

00:13:20.260 for that to happen.

00:13:21.660 I bet they are incredible.

00:13:23.280 Oh, yeah, yeah.

00:13:24.120 They're, you know,

00:13:24.660 artificial insemination.

00:13:26.840 They're men.

00:13:29.360 There's...

00:13:29.840 Artificial...

00:13:30.760 Well, the man

00:13:31.780 doesn't need

00:13:32.220 the artificial...

00:13:32.820 Oh, you're saying

00:13:33.420 of a woman,

00:13:34.600 of another woman.

00:13:35.900 No, no, yeah.

00:13:37.280 My understanding

00:13:38.360 of gender

00:13:39.040 and sexuality

00:13:40.360 is a little more complex

00:13:43.280 than I'm afraid

00:13:44.500 you're coming from,

00:13:46.040 so...

00:13:46.540 It is complex,

00:13:47.500 I'll grant you that.

00:13:48.460 But what you're saying,

00:13:49.120 when you're saying

00:13:49.620 two men can produce a child,

00:13:51.480 what you've said

00:13:52.340 by bringing up

00:13:52.960 artificial insemination

00:13:53.740 is that the two men

00:13:54.680 can bring a woman

00:13:55.800 into the picture,

00:13:57.080 either to purchase her eggs

00:13:59.300 or to rent out her womb

00:14:00.400 or to...

00:14:01.140 And then to create a child

00:14:02.080 and deprive the child

00:14:02.740 of his natural mother.

00:14:03.880 But that isn't

00:14:04.740 between two men.

00:14:05.580 That's two men

00:14:06.160 and another woman,

00:14:07.080 or really,

00:14:07.600 a man and a woman

00:14:08.160 and then there's

00:14:08.520 another guy on the side.

00:14:09.900 No, no, no.

00:14:10.560 There can be two men,

00:14:12.380 two male,

00:14:13.120 like two people

00:14:13.880 that identify as males

00:14:15.340 and one of them

00:14:16.300 could have

00:14:16.700 reproductive organs.

00:14:18.220 They both have

00:14:18.960 reproductive organs,

00:14:19.840 presumably.

00:14:21.000 One of them could,

00:14:22.540 right?

00:14:22.800 They're male,

00:14:24.120 they're males,

00:14:25.300 they're men,

00:14:26.180 they're men out there

00:14:27.580 that have

00:14:28.120 reproductive organs.

00:14:29.460 We all have,

00:14:30.000 all men have

00:14:30.640 reproductive organs.

00:14:31.320 Well,

00:14:32.620 and apart from that,

00:14:34.220 right,

00:14:34.600 two people,

00:14:35.300 like,

00:14:35.560 let's say,

00:14:36.240 if you want to stick

00:14:36.900 to that configuration,

00:14:38.620 two males,

00:14:39.360 two men

00:14:39.840 can adopt a child.

00:14:41.660 But, you know,

00:14:42.220 we can say,

00:14:42.680 well,

00:14:42.760 they could try to do it.

00:14:44.100 But, you know,

00:14:44.900 if there are no

00:14:45.640 legal protections

00:14:48.520 for those two men

00:14:50.660 to adopt a child,

00:14:52.140 which, by the way...

00:14:53.240 Okay, so they could adopt

00:14:53.840 a child,

00:14:54.140 but they couldn't

00:14:54.480 produce a child

00:14:55.080 between themselves.

00:14:55.740 All right, Johnny,

00:14:57.500 what's your take?

00:14:59.700 You know,

00:15:00.040 I think probably

00:15:00.480 just going back

00:15:01.160 to a couple things

00:15:01.780 that he said

00:15:02.260 regarding the nature

00:15:03.100 of the translation

00:15:03.900 of the word

00:15:04.620 for homosexuality.

00:15:07.380 They said,

00:15:08.500 or, oh...

00:15:09.480 You're not multiple people,

00:15:10.660 Reverend Alexander.

00:15:11.660 Just as I respect

00:15:13.260 your right to self-identity,

00:15:14.720 you can't force me

00:15:15.720 to lie through my pronouns.

00:15:17.640 No, singular day.

00:15:18.880 If you look into

00:15:19.940 the roots

00:15:20.700 of the English language,

00:15:21.780 you would see that day

00:15:23.240 is used singularly as well.

00:15:25.620 Well, the singular day

00:15:26.420 is scriptural, too.

00:15:27.480 Like, my name is legion

00:15:28.900 for we are many.

00:15:29.860 Johnny, your point?

00:15:30.900 Oh, wow.

00:15:31.700 Yeah, just from the use

00:15:33.740 of the word

00:15:34.660 for homosexuality

00:15:35.700 that's often used

00:15:36.640 in the New Testament,

00:15:37.680 arsenokoitai,

00:15:38.980 it doesn't refer

00:15:39.660 to pederasty

00:15:40.620 or gang rape.

00:15:41.760 Sometimes the rebuttal

00:15:42.760 would be that Paul's

00:15:43.460 not referring to

00:15:44.080 monogamous, committed,

00:15:45.140 loving sexual union

00:15:46.540 between a man

00:15:47.220 that loves a man,

00:15:47.960 but a Roman centurion

00:15:49.420 that's raping a slave.

00:15:51.280 But the word just means

00:15:52.180 literally men who bed men.

00:15:54.280 And Paul did

00:15:54.980 come up with that term

00:15:56.500 through the Septuagint

00:15:57.740 translation of Leviticus,

00:15:59.120 which he is carrying on.

00:16:00.920 So even if you're going

00:16:01.500 to say, hey,

00:16:01.920 Leviticus is expired,

00:16:02.980 no, actually,

00:16:03.400 Jesus says that he came

00:16:04.560 to fulfill the law.

00:16:06.480 And when Paul is outlying

00:16:08.160 and when the Scripture

00:16:08.840 is outlying,

00:16:10.100 and I'm using,

00:16:10.900 even when we say,

00:16:11.460 and when the Scripture,

00:16:12.180 this is an argument

00:16:12.800 about what the Bible

00:16:13.640 says about homosexuality.

00:16:15.400 So whenever we're

00:16:16.100 using the Scripture,

00:16:17.500 you have to make sure

00:16:18.060 you're using it

00:16:18.640 with a level of clarity.

00:16:20.260 When in Romans 1,

00:16:21.340 probably the other

00:16:21.900 popular passage

00:16:22.680 that they both be familiar

00:16:23.840 with about homosexuality,

00:16:25.760 it doesn't outlaw pederasty,

00:16:27.960 which there was

00:16:28.540 a perfectly good word

00:16:29.840 to use.

00:16:30.660 It says men and women

00:16:31.780 who burn with passion

00:16:33.220 for one another.

00:16:34.400 That's not a young boy

00:16:36.860 or a centurion.

00:16:38.700 Furthermore,

00:16:39.400 I would just say

00:16:40.320 from when you have Jesus

00:16:42.340 who solidifies

00:16:44.140 and cements

00:16:45.060 the biblical narrative,

00:16:46.520 he created the male

00:16:47.320 and female

00:16:47.880 for this reason,

00:16:48.900 a man.

00:16:49.180 And so it really comes down

00:16:50.580 to what did Jesus believe?

00:16:52.100 If you believe

00:16:52.580 in the resurrection,

00:16:53.320 you believe that Jesus Christ

00:16:54.260 is God.

00:16:55.180 You would have to make

00:16:56.260 an argument from silence

00:16:57.660 to be able to say

00:16:58.920 that Jesus approves

00:16:59.740 of homosexual behavior.

00:17:01.840 Furthermore,

00:17:02.500 when Paul says

00:17:03.140 in 1 Corinthians 6,

00:17:04.260 the homosexual,

00:17:05.140 the adulterer,

00:17:06.200 the effeminate

00:17:06.880 does not inherit

00:17:08.320 the kingdom of God,

00:17:09.720 I always want to close here

00:17:11.020 with if someone is listening,

00:17:12.700 the call in the Scripture

00:17:13.760 for someone who is engaging

00:17:15.360 in homosexual behavior

00:17:16.400 is to confess,

00:17:17.860 repent,

00:17:18.300 and turn to Jesus Christ.

00:17:19.480 Paul says,

00:17:19.880 such were some of you,

00:17:20.740 but you were washed.

00:17:22.400 And so that's,

00:17:23.100 I always want to end there

00:17:24.040 because this is a sin

00:17:25.120 that God forgives of.

00:17:26.340 Right,

00:17:26.680 as with all the sins,

00:17:27.860 you know,

00:17:28.100 and it's such an important point

00:17:29.560 because it's lost

00:17:30.200 both in on the right

00:17:32.020 and on the left

00:17:32.800 and in tradition

00:17:33.860 and modernity.

00:17:34.620 And that's why

00:17:35.100 I wanted to frame it by,

00:17:37.080 hey,

00:17:37.160 if I'm having a conversation

00:17:38.240 with someone at a coffee shop

00:17:39.300 regarding the subject,

00:17:40.540 it would be with a level

00:17:41.640 of conviction

00:17:42.400 and compassion.

00:17:44.080 It's a little bit different

00:17:44.760 when we're lobbying

00:17:45.580 one text of Scripture

00:17:46.580 against each other.

00:17:47.600 So I want to necessarily

00:17:49.380 include some compassion

00:17:50.580 and go,

00:17:51.080 okay,

00:17:51.240 this is a sin

00:17:52.300 that needs to be repented of,

00:17:53.420 but it's also not like

00:17:54.520 just any other sin.

00:17:55.740 Like,

00:17:56.240 if the common argument was,

00:17:57.500 well,

00:17:57.600 the Bible also outlaws gluttony,

00:18:00.340 you would be able to say,

00:18:02.220 well,

00:18:02.360 1 Corinthians 6 says,

00:18:03.960 every other sin

00:18:04.720 is committed outside the body,

00:18:05.820 but the immoral man

00:18:06.500 sins against himself.

00:18:07.960 And this is also becoming

00:18:09.020 a part of the modern identity.

00:18:10.620 So this isn't just

00:18:11.900 like all other sin.

00:18:13.120 All sin separates us from God,

00:18:14.360 but not all sin is the same.

00:18:15.920 That's why,

00:18:16.580 even if you trace

00:18:17.360 first century Rome,

00:18:19.180 the argument too

00:18:19.980 that what they were engaging

00:18:21.240 in there is not true,

00:18:23.380 even from many gay scholars.

00:18:26.700 Pim Prong would be able to say,

00:18:28.280 you would never be able

00:18:28.880 to arrive at this position

00:18:29.940 from the Bible.

00:18:30.800 If you want to say

00:18:31.600 homosexuality is not wrong,

00:18:33.200 you may get there,

00:18:33.980 but you can't use the Scripture.

00:18:35.780 And a number,

00:18:36.460 like Lewis Crompton,

00:18:37.180 would also say the same thing.

00:18:38.600 You can't arrive at that position

00:18:40.100 by using the Scripture

00:18:41.400 unless you're banking

00:18:42.900 your entire life

00:18:44.040 off of an argument

00:18:45.120 from silence,

00:18:45.780 which is really dangerous,

00:18:46.940 especially when there are

00:18:47.760 so many passages

00:18:48.540 in the Scripture

00:18:49.120 which make this very clear.

00:18:50.960 Right now,

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00:20:03.000 today.

00:20:04.280 Well, to your point

00:20:05.100 on gluttony,

00:20:06.180 you know,

00:20:06.460 being of Italian extraction,

00:20:07.880 that's a great example

00:20:08.940 of a sin,

00:20:10.060 an inclination

00:20:11.100 that is naturally

00:20:12.040 in our DNA,

00:20:13.460 but we try to resist.

00:20:15.480 Brandon, you've been

00:20:16.120 waiting patiently,

00:20:17.260 shaking your head

00:20:17.920 now and again.

00:20:19.220 So, to bring it back

00:20:22.200 to the question

00:20:23.440 that I first asked

00:20:24.160 Reverend Alexander,

00:20:25.080 I said, you know,

00:20:25.440 on what authority

00:20:26.280 do you get this?

00:20:27.480 And based on what

00:20:28.560 Johnny said, you know,

00:20:29.540 I think we've gone

00:20:30.200 through most of the verses

00:20:31.200 that appear to condemn

00:20:32.580 homosexual behavior,

00:20:33.320 though we've actually

00:20:34.240 danced around

00:20:34.920 the most obvious ones,

00:20:36.040 which come from

00:20:36.640 the book of Leviticus 18

00:20:38.020 and chapter 20.

00:20:40.020 For those who are

00:20:40.940 unfamiliar,

00:20:41.900 you shall not lie

00:20:42.500 with a man as with a woman,

00:20:43.540 it is an abomination.

00:20:44.700 And then in Leviticus

00:20:45.320 chapter 20, verse 13,

00:20:46.800 if a man lies

00:20:47.580 with a male as with a woman,

00:20:48.960 both of them have

00:20:49.720 committed an abomination.

00:20:51.420 So, traditionally speaking,

00:20:53.280 also to Reverend

00:20:54.180 Alexander's point,

00:20:55.460 the mainline Protestants

00:20:56.660 have largely accepted LGBT.

00:20:59.320 The evangelical Christians

00:21:00.320 are kind of split on it.

00:21:01.680 The Catholic Church

00:21:02.360 has remained pretty firm

00:21:03.980 in its view of sexual morality.

00:21:06.520 Eastern Orthodoxy

00:21:07.420 has remained pretty firm.

00:21:09.140 So, I guess, one,

00:21:11.620 how do you get around

00:21:13.000 Leviticus 18 and Leviticus 20?

00:21:15.300 And then two,

00:21:16.540 maybe even more interesting to me,

00:21:20.260 on what grounds do you depart

00:21:23.440 in your interpretation

00:21:24.800 from what has,

00:21:26.140 at the very least,

00:21:26.900 been the traditional understanding

00:21:28.620 of these and other verses?

00:21:30.980 Totally.

00:21:32.040 I mean, I agree

00:21:33.060 that Paul creates

00:21:34.060 this word arsenokoitai

00:21:35.160 and that Paul is thinking

00:21:35.940 of the Levitical passages

00:21:37.160 when he creates it,

00:21:38.220 but the context

00:21:39.200 of Leviticus 18,

00:21:40.200 for instance,

00:21:40.680 is quite clear.

00:21:42.100 Leviticus 18,

00:21:42.840 verses 1 through 3,

00:21:43.820 it says,

00:21:44.180 do not do as they do

00:21:45.160 in the land of Egypt

00:21:45.940 where I am bringing you from

00:21:47.100 and do not do

00:21:47.740 in the land of Canaan

00:21:48.820 as they do in the land of Canaan

00:21:50.640 where I am bringing you to.

00:21:51.700 So the question you have to ask

00:21:53.040 is where in Egypt or Canaan

00:21:54.800 was same-sex sex a common practice?

00:21:58.180 And the answer pretty universally

00:21:59.820 is it wasn't.

00:22:01.360 What was common in ancient Canaan

00:22:03.220 and ancient Egypt

00:22:04.020 was exploitative

00:22:05.840 and abusive sexual relationships.

00:22:08.480 And that is precisely what-

00:22:09.600 On what grounds, Brandon,

00:22:10.600 on what grounds do you say

00:22:11.600 that it was not a common practice?

00:22:14.860 Egyptologists.

00:22:16.220 Carol Graves, I believe is her name,

00:22:18.100 has a beautiful book

00:22:19.340 about sexuality in ancient Egypt,

00:22:21.300 for instance.

00:22:21.980 And there are a few examples

00:22:23.380 of like a sarcophagus

00:22:25.540 that was found

00:22:26.060 that appears to have

00:22:26.700 two men facing each other

00:22:27.780 that people have speculated.

00:22:29.500 Actually, LGBT people have speculated

00:22:31.180 that this is a same-sex relationship.

00:22:34.040 But I think-

00:22:34.480 So you're saying

00:22:34.800 it was commonly practiced?

00:22:36.500 No, it wasn't.

00:22:37.380 I think the historical evidence

00:22:38.900 is pretty universally clear.

00:22:39.840 But the sarcophagus you just cited

00:22:41.500 would suggest a same-sex relationship

00:22:43.660 open and sanctioned.

00:22:45.000 So doesn't that undercut

00:22:45.900 the point you were just making?

00:22:47.500 No, the point is

00:22:48.340 we don't understand

00:22:49.140 what exactly is happening

00:22:50.040 in the sarcophagus.

00:22:51.460 And some people have posited

00:22:52.640 that this means

00:22:53.640 it was a same-sex relationship.

00:22:55.140 But the overwhelming evidence

00:22:57.220 is that Egypt was not a place

00:22:59.620 where gay couples

00:23:00.740 were running around

00:23:01.420 left and right

00:23:01.980 in the ancient world.

00:23:03.180 What was happening

00:23:04.180 in the ancient construction

00:23:05.560 of sexuality

00:23:06.200 in the ancient Near East

00:23:07.320 was that men

00:23:08.480 who were citizens of a nation

00:23:09.820 were permitted to have sex

00:23:10.840 with anyone they wanted

00:23:12.020 to have sex with,

00:23:13.120 which often included male slaves.

00:23:15.220 It often included

00:23:15.920 any women they wanted.

00:23:17.500 This is certainly

00:23:18.040 what was happening in Rome.

00:23:19.140 And this is certainly

00:23:20.100 what Paul was condemning.

00:23:21.420 And I condemn it too.

00:23:23.140 Excessive lust

00:23:23.900 and exploitation,

00:23:25.180 I think that's a sin

00:23:25.900 according to the Bible.

00:23:27.100 But to make it about

00:23:27.920 loving consensual

00:23:28.640 same-sex relationships

00:23:29.720 misses the point.

00:23:31.040 And there is an overwhelming

00:23:32.080 body of biblical scholarship

00:23:33.400 that supports this perspective.

00:23:34.980 So when you say

00:23:36.420 this is certainly

00:23:37.600 what St. Paul meant

00:23:38.900 and this is certainly

00:23:40.100 what Leviticus means

00:23:40.880 and this is certainly

00:23:41.380 what Ezekiel means

00:23:42.100 and this is certainly

00:23:42.460 what Genesis means

00:23:43.160 and it's so certain

00:23:44.340 that it has nothing to do

00:23:45.420 with any modern notion

00:23:46.780 of LGBT behavior.

00:23:48.320 I guess I just have to ask

00:23:49.740 how are you so certain?

00:23:52.380 Because the church

00:23:53.920 for at the very least

00:23:55.000 we would all agree

00:23:55.620 many, many centuries

00:23:56.620 was quite certain

00:23:57.960 in the opposite direction.

00:23:59.780 And we have many,

00:24:01.120 well, the writings

00:24:02.320 of many popes

00:24:04.320 and theologians,

00:24:05.540 doctors of the church,

00:24:06.600 ecumenical councils.

00:24:09.320 How come your certainty

00:24:11.260 is so much more correct

00:24:12.260 than all of those certainties?

00:24:14.080 Yeah, I believe

00:24:14.900 in progressive revelation.

00:24:16.260 Jesus said

00:24:16.700 before he ascended into heaven,

00:24:18.100 I'm sending you the spirit

00:24:19.100 who will continue

00:24:19.740 to lead you

00:24:20.420 into all the truth.

00:24:21.580 But the Catholic church

00:24:22.380 believes that too.

00:24:23.360 The Catholic church

00:24:23.860 believes that the Holy Ghost

00:24:25.320 is with the church

00:24:26.720 and expresses herself

00:24:28.240 through infallible statements,

00:24:30.760 through the magisterium,

00:24:32.080 through the ecumenical councils.

00:24:33.280 But what I'm saying

00:24:33.800 is all of those statements

00:24:34.960 and councils

00:24:36.040 and doctors of the church

00:24:37.480 contradicted your view of things.

00:24:39.960 So is it the Holy Spirit

00:24:41.780 only speaks to Pastor Brandon?

00:24:44.060 No, two things I'll say here.

00:24:45.540 One, I don't think

00:24:46.220 your understanding

00:24:46.980 of the Catholic church

00:24:47.680 is actually as black and white

00:24:50.020 as you're making it seem.

00:24:51.000 Here in New York City,

00:24:51.820 there are a number

00:24:52.980 of large Roman Catholic parishes

00:24:55.240 that have vibrant LGBT ministries

00:24:57.100 and outreaches.

00:24:58.240 And fully affirm

00:24:59.540 and accept those LGBT members

00:25:01.520 of their parishes.

00:25:02.460 It's got to be the Jesuits,

00:25:03.600 I bet.

00:25:04.000 To your point,

00:25:04.640 I know there are great ministries

00:25:06.780 from the Catholic church,

00:25:07.620 notably Courage,

00:25:08.760 to reach out,

00:25:09.440 though not to affirm LGBT identity,

00:25:12.320 though some wayward priests

00:25:14.000 sometimes get a little wild.

00:25:15.680 But you've got to remember

00:25:16.460 in the Catholic church,

00:25:17.800 we don't just kind of go individually.

00:25:19.920 We do have magisterial teachings

00:25:21.640 which have remained consistent

00:25:23.020 on LGBT identity,

00:25:24.840 such as it was

00:25:25.380 in antiquity to the present,

00:25:26.380 through things even recently

00:25:28.240 like Humanae Vitae,

00:25:29.740 the teaching of Pope Paul VI,

00:25:31.220 the theology of the body.

00:25:33.300 And really,

00:25:34.380 there hasn't been a lot

00:25:35.480 of ambiguity on it,

00:25:36.460 at least in our...

00:25:37.840 Well, the current Pope

00:25:41.060 has been a bit ambiguous,

00:25:44.960 or actually not ambiguous.

00:25:46.240 He has been quite Christian

00:25:48.000 and faithful

00:25:49.600 in his understanding

00:25:51.200 of the practice of love.

00:25:54.180 Well, you know,

00:25:54.840 Reverend Alexander,

00:25:55.420 just before you make your point,

00:25:57.260 the Holy Father,

00:25:58.560 Pope Francis,

00:25:59.520 has said that

00:26:00.360 same-sex marriage,

00:26:02.000 such as it is,

00:26:02.680 is no mere political movement,

00:26:06.540 but a machination

00:26:07.200 of the father of lies

00:26:08.060 that seeks to deceive

00:26:08.820 and confuse the children of God.

00:26:10.080 And asked about same-sex unions

00:26:11.640 and same-sex marriage,

00:26:12.860 he said that God cannot bless sin.

00:26:14.480 So I agree Pope Francis

00:26:15.800 is sometimes ambiguous,

00:26:17.580 but he's been pretty traditional

00:26:19.640 on that point,

00:26:20.620 wouldn't you say?

00:26:22.260 Yeah, in terms of marriage,

00:26:24.000 right,

00:26:24.220 the institution of marriage,

00:26:25.700 marriage as a sacrament,

00:26:27.020 which is within

00:26:28.520 the Catholic tradition.

00:26:30.180 Now, the point that I really

00:26:32.680 want to make

00:26:33.560 is because Leviticus

00:26:35.040 was lift up

00:26:35.820 and Sodoma was lift up

00:26:37.380 and there was the point

00:26:38.260 of angels being male.

00:26:40.500 As far as we can tell,

00:26:41.640 angels have no gender.

00:26:43.420 They, I think,

00:26:44.500 may be non-binary.

00:26:47.080 Who knows?

00:26:48.040 Suogenaries, right?

00:26:48.900 Individual species.

00:26:50.100 I don't know.

00:26:51.300 Anyhow,

00:26:52.220 and thank you,

00:26:53.840 Pastor Brennan,

00:26:54.620 for the point about Sodoma.

00:26:57.200 It gets lift up so often.

00:26:59.120 It's about rape.

00:27:01.100 It's about being inhospitable,

00:27:03.560 right?

00:27:04.080 Now,

00:27:04.900 the biggest,

00:27:06.000 the most important point

00:27:07.080 I would say

00:27:07.820 in conversation

00:27:09.200 about theology

00:27:10.960 with Christian siblings

00:27:12.860 is

00:27:13.440 Jesus

00:27:14.840 never said

00:27:16.420 a word

00:27:17.480 about

00:27:18.720 what is being

00:27:20.120 framed

00:27:20.860 as homosexuality.

00:27:22.260 Not a single word

00:27:23.680 about it.

00:27:24.600 And

00:27:24.880 there

00:27:25.440 are

00:27:26.000 quite a few

00:27:27.120 theories

00:27:27.800 or interpretations

00:27:28.780 about the compassion

00:27:30.280 Jesus

00:27:30.740 had

00:27:31.820 towards those

00:27:32.820 that

00:27:33.100 in our lenses

00:27:34.320 of today

00:27:35.080 perceived as

00:27:36.640 of the same gender.

00:27:38.240 The centurion,

00:27:39.300 for instance,

00:27:39.980 right?

00:27:40.520 Brief reference there.

00:27:41.960 But the most,

00:27:42.520 you know,

00:27:42.920 the most important thing

00:27:44.380 is that

00:27:44.580 Jesus spoke

00:27:45.480 36 times,

00:27:48.060 36 times

00:27:49.440 against

00:27:51.080 divorce.

00:27:51.940 and I don't

00:27:53.080 understand

00:27:53.900 why

00:27:55.160 the boogeyman

00:27:58.360 of homosexuality

00:28:00.360 is

00:28:01.260 taking up

00:28:02.560 so much

00:28:03.740 airspace

00:28:04.840 and so much

00:28:05.940 preoccupation

00:28:06.980 of Christians

00:28:07.860 of going after,

00:28:09.880 right,

00:28:10.460 queer community

00:28:11.600 when Jesus

00:28:13.140 said nothing

00:28:14.240 about it,

00:28:15.460 when two people

00:28:17.060 of the same gender

00:28:17.980 or different genders

00:28:18.840 being together

00:28:19.580 does nothing

00:28:20.660 to harm

00:28:21.680 anybody else

00:28:22.660 or the community.

00:28:24.020 So if there's

00:28:24.500 any problem there,

00:28:25.860 it's between them

00:28:26.760 and God.

00:28:27.720 So let God

00:28:28.420 do whatever

00:28:29.560 God may do

00:28:31.040 or do not

00:28:31.980 because

00:28:32.720 we also

00:28:33.880 being called

00:28:34.860 in Jesus

00:28:35.720 specifically

00:28:36.740 over and over

00:28:38.040 again

00:28:38.460 said,

00:28:39.240 do not pick up

00:28:39.780 a stone

00:28:40.460 unless

00:28:41.480 so,

00:28:42.800 so much

00:28:43.980 scapegoating

00:28:45.460 happens.

00:28:46.740 Can I maybe

00:28:47.200 jump in there?

00:28:47.860 Let me just

00:28:50.420 close my point.

00:28:51.260 So much

00:28:51.760 scapegoating

00:28:52.880 about maybe

00:28:54.080 six verses

00:28:55.160 of the Bible

00:28:56.020 and an entire

00:28:57.400 group of people

00:28:58.260 being,

00:28:58.840 you know,

00:28:59.380 being

00:28:59.720 You know,

00:29:00.520 the Bible

00:29:00.760 doesn't say

00:29:01.220 a lot about

00:29:01.700 bestiality either.

00:29:03.340 So you can't

00:29:03.940 build your entire

00:29:05.020 theology

00:29:05.640 based off of

00:29:06.560 maybe the rarity

00:29:07.460 of the occurrences.

00:29:09.020 Johnny,

00:29:09.720 you're equating

00:29:10.940 two people

00:29:11.960 being in love

00:29:12.840 with each other

00:29:13.720 and caring

00:29:14.420 for each other

00:29:15.200 with a human

00:29:16.600 No,

00:29:17.380 he's just

00:29:17.700 pointing out

00:29:18.180 that scarcity

00:29:18.860 or paucity

00:29:19.460 versus

00:29:19.880 You're building

00:29:20.100 an argument

00:29:20.600 based off of

00:29:21.620 not that much

00:29:22.480 according to

00:29:23.000 Kevin DeYoung.

00:29:23.940 He would say

00:29:24.260 if you use

00:29:24.840 that not too

00:29:25.680 much argument

00:29:26.320 basically you're

00:29:27.440 just building

00:29:27.920 you know

00:29:28.640 and I'm even

00:29:29.000 going to go

00:29:29.260 back to Sodom

00:29:29.780 when you say

00:29:30.140 it was

00:29:30.560 gang rape

00:29:31.760 or

00:29:32.660 a lack

00:29:34.060 of hospitality

00:29:34.560 if you just

00:29:35.440 read the Bible

00:29:36.160 you know

00:29:36.680 and I'm saying

00:29:37.080 this is pretty

00:29:37.600 it says

00:29:38.440 bring out

00:29:39.060 those men

00:29:39.780 they don't even

00:29:40.400 know that they're

00:29:41.000 angels

00:29:41.380 it says

00:29:42.200 bring out

00:29:42.620 those men

00:29:43.200 and Lot responds

00:29:44.600 please my brothers

00:29:45.760 do not act

00:29:46.760 wickedly

00:29:47.360 they don't know

00:29:48.380 it's angels

00:29:48.780 so even that

00:29:49.360 argument is refuted

00:29:50.380 one other thing

00:29:51.620 regarding Jesus

00:29:52.380 Jesus affirms

00:29:53.880 the biblical

00:29:54.340 sexual ethic

00:29:55.160 very clearly

00:29:55.980 in Matthew 19

00:29:57.060 one man

00:29:58.060 one woman

00:29:58.620 in the covenant

00:29:59.220 of marriage

00:29:59.780 if you want

00:30:00.480 to rewrite that

00:30:01.520 you would have

00:30:02.160 to have a different

00:30:02.800 creation narrative

00:30:03.800 because the Bible

00:30:04.860 starts off

00:30:05.420 with the story

00:30:06.180 of Adam and Eve

00:30:07.280 the Isha

00:30:08.720 from the Isha

00:30:10.140 complimented

00:30:10.900 made for each other

00:30:12.000 and then the Bible

00:30:12.740 concludes

00:30:13.340 with the marriage

00:30:13.840 supper of the Lamb

00:30:14.580 so you have to

00:30:15.520 rewrite the entirety

00:30:16.620 of the scripture

00:30:17.300 Pastor Johnny

00:30:18.400 if anybody is

00:30:19.100 rewriting it

00:30:20.100 are folks

00:30:20.860 who want to

00:30:21.420 criminalize

00:30:22.140 an entire group

00:30:22.880 of people

00:30:23.340 and this is

00:30:24.180 scapegoating

00:30:24.860 it is to

00:30:25.660 target

00:30:26.320 a group

00:30:27.180 that is

00:30:27.620 maybe 10%

00:30:28.720 of the human

00:30:29.640 population

00:30:30.280 identifies

00:30:31.320 or understands

00:30:33.060 themselves

00:30:33.640 30% of Gen Z

00:30:34.800 though

00:30:35.060 apparently something's

00:30:35.900 in the water

00:30:36.360 those are two

00:30:37.040 recent reports

00:30:37.960 you know why

00:30:38.760 it's not a

00:30:40.060 fad

00:30:41.120 it's not a fad

00:30:42.520 it's because

00:30:44.220 finally

00:30:45.340 it's existed

00:30:46.100 for a long time

00:30:47.040 even according

00:30:48.440 to Thomas Hubbard

00:30:49.120 going back to

00:30:49.660 your argument

00:30:50.260 Thomas Hubbard

00:30:51.780 said that

00:30:52.280 every form

00:30:53.080 of homosexuality

00:30:54.100 hold on

00:30:54.460 let's get a little

00:30:55.740 hold of the panel

00:30:56.360 here

00:30:56.520 I've noticed

00:30:56.960 Johnny's sat

00:30:57.820 very patiently

00:30:59.580 and he hasn't

00:31:00.700 interrupted anybody

00:31:01.540 so Johnny

00:31:02.240 if you want to

00:31:02.900 finish your point

00:31:03.400 and I don't like

00:31:05.020 interrupting

00:31:05.440 I think

00:31:05.940 the producer told me

00:31:07.280 I might have to

00:31:07.780 jump in

00:31:08.140 so I feel like

00:31:08.760 I'm looking at my

00:31:09.340 watch going

00:31:09.780 I might have to

00:31:10.320 jump in

00:31:10.780 so in that

00:31:12.100 regard

00:31:12.480 and again

00:31:13.240 if this is at a

00:31:13.920 coffee shop

00:31:14.600 the flavor of the

00:31:16.220 conversation would

00:31:16.940 look different

00:31:17.500 right

00:31:17.800 and so I'd want

00:31:18.780 to do that

00:31:19.180 with love

00:31:19.560 and conviction

00:31:20.200 the Bible

00:31:21.960 is very clear

00:31:23.160 that marriage

00:31:23.840 is for a man

00:31:24.340 and a woman

00:31:24.700 in marriage

00:31:25.180 you would have

00:31:25.840 to rewrite

00:31:26.300 the story

00:31:26.760 of a real

00:31:27.220 historical account

00:31:28.200 right

00:31:28.580 so if you

00:31:29.340 make it

00:31:29.800 let's just say

00:31:30.420 you take

00:31:30.820 the creation

00:31:31.420 narrative

00:31:31.780 as an

00:31:32.860 allegory

00:31:33.400 well then

00:31:33.740 you'd have

00:31:34.000 to explain

00:31:34.440 why in

00:31:34.780 Genesis 5

00:31:35.460 Genesis 10

00:31:36.260 Matthew 1

00:31:37.040 it uses

00:31:37.620 Adam and Eve

00:31:38.240 as our earliest

00:31:39.280 ancestors

00:31:39.940 so you have

00:31:40.840 that reality

00:31:41.540 let's just even

00:31:43.080 go back

00:31:43.480 to what you said

00:31:46.700 regarding the

00:31:47.340 love of Jesus

00:31:48.000 because praise

00:31:48.840 the Lord

00:31:49.300 our God

00:31:50.040 is a God

00:31:50.440 of love

00:31:50.860 but love

00:31:52.180 is never

00:31:52.540 licensed for

00:31:53.380 sin

00:31:53.780 or to

00:31:54.960 refute

00:31:55.700 what the

00:31:56.020 scripture

00:31:56.240 teaches

00:31:56.680 even when

00:31:57.320 you're saying

00:31:57.700 you know

00:31:58.060 I looked at

00:31:59.060 just the

00:31:59.540 bio of your

00:32:00.360 book

00:32:00.680 that's coming

00:32:01.880 out I think

00:32:02.360 in May

00:32:02.800 Brandon

00:32:03.440 and it

00:32:04.080 talks

00:32:04.280 I think

00:32:04.620 you speak

00:32:05.120 of the term

00:32:05.740 radical inclusion

00:32:06.840 and I would

00:32:07.460 say that

00:32:07.740 Jesus

00:32:08.000 did

00:32:08.440 Luke 15

00:32:09.300 dying

00:32:09.560 with

00:32:09.760 sinners

00:32:10.160 prostitutes

00:32:11.480 tax collectors

00:32:12.420 but in

00:32:13.560 the end

00:32:13.960 no one

00:32:14.500 called

00:32:14.780 Jesus

00:32:15.200 friend

00:32:16.580 that didn't

00:32:16.980 call him

00:32:17.400 master

00:32:17.840 and so

00:32:18.540 when Jesus

00:32:18.960 even when

00:32:19.400 confronted

00:32:19.740 in John 8

00:32:20.300 with a woman

00:32:20.660 caught in

00:32:20.960 adultery

00:32:21.340 he says

00:32:21.720 go and

00:32:22.100 sin no

00:32:22.400 more

00:32:22.700 yes

00:32:23.620 Jesus

00:32:23.980 is love

00:32:24.620 but he's

00:32:24.980 also

00:32:25.240 holy

00:32:25.660 you cannot

00:32:26.120 separate

00:32:26.520 one attribute

00:32:27.060 of God

00:32:27.400 from the

00:32:27.700 other

00:32:27.840 he's not

00:32:28.180 pieces

00:32:28.480 of a pie

00:32:28.960 we call

00:32:29.260 that

00:32:29.460 divine

00:32:30.080 simplicity

00:32:30.680 God

00:32:31.440 does not

00:32:31.940 possess

00:32:32.260 attributes

00:32:32.800 he's

00:32:33.040 all of

00:32:33.260 his

00:32:33.380 attributes

00:32:33.700 all of

00:32:34.060 the

00:32:34.180 time

00:32:34.400 in full

00:32:34.720 measure

00:32:35.080 and so

00:32:35.700 you can

00:32:35.920 never

00:32:36.160 separate

00:32:36.740 the love

00:32:37.820 of God

00:32:38.100 from the

00:32:38.400 holiness

00:32:38.680 of God

00:32:39.240 and so

00:32:39.660 you would

00:32:40.040 be building

00:32:40.480 an argument

00:32:41.480 on silence

00:32:43.060 especially when

00:32:43.900 Jesus affirms

00:32:45.040 what's taught

00:32:45.860 in Leviticus

00:32:46.960 when he says

00:32:47.500 I've come to

00:32:47.960 fulfill the

00:32:48.580 law

00:32:48.800 let's just

00:32:49.640 take

00:32:49.800 and then

00:32:50.180 just final

00:32:50.920 thought

00:32:51.160 here

00:32:51.380 if you're

00:32:51.980 going to

00:32:52.140 make the

00:32:52.380 argument

00:32:52.640 well

00:32:53.000 what about

00:32:55.060 the feast

00:32:55.540 and the

00:32:56.040 festivals

00:32:56.440 well

00:32:56.860 Colossians

00:32:57.480 says

00:32:57.720 those

00:32:57.900 are

00:32:58.020 no

00:32:58.160 more

00:32:58.420 what

00:32:58.700 about

00:32:58.960 the

00:32:59.300 holidays

00:32:59.840 that

00:33:00.180 they

00:33:00.320 celebrated

00:33:00.760 the

00:33:01.460 New

00:33:01.600 Testament

00:33:01.840 says

00:33:02.100 those

00:33:02.300 are

00:33:02.420 no

00:33:02.600 more

00:33:02.940 you know

00:33:04.040 you could

00:33:04.300 do

00:33:04.420 different

00:33:04.680 things

00:33:04.940 to say

00:33:05.160 well

00:33:05.320 hey

00:33:05.500 we

00:33:05.660 don't

00:33:05.860 we

00:33:06.140 no

00:33:06.280 longer

00:33:06.500 practice

00:33:06.860 this

00:33:07.060 in

00:33:07.160 the

00:33:07.280 Old

00:33:07.420 Testament

00:33:07.740 so

00:33:07.980 it's

00:33:08.840 homosexuality

00:33:09.840 in

00:33:09.960 that

00:33:10.100 same

00:33:10.320 camp

00:33:10.660 but

00:33:11.160 Jesus

00:33:11.560 arrives

00:33:12.160 and he

00:33:12.540 affirms

00:33:13.100 the sexual

00:33:13.620 ethic

00:33:13.920 of

00:33:14.100 Leviticus

00:33:14.580 so

00:33:15.160 does

00:33:15.360 Paul

00:33:15.680 so

00:33:16.320 does

00:33:16.600 Peter

00:33:17.020 and

00:33:17.640 so

00:33:17.860 do

00:33:18.040 many

00:33:18.560 LGBTQ

00:33:19.800 plus

00:33:20.580 scholars

00:33:21.220 about

00:33:21.920 the

00:33:22.180 scripture

00:33:22.500 so

00:33:23.000 even

00:33:23.260 I

00:33:23.800 mentioned

00:33:24.060 those

00:33:24.300 names

00:33:24.560 and I'm

00:33:24.940 going to

00:33:25.100 repeat

00:33:25.640 those

00:33:25.980 names

00:33:26.200 because

00:33:26.500 those

00:33:26.720 are

00:33:26.820 some

00:33:26.940 of

00:33:27.020 the

00:33:27.100 most

00:33:27.280 respected

00:33:28.160 gay

00:33:28.800 scholars

00:33:29.440 that

00:33:29.740 exist

00:33:30.100 today

00:33:30.440 who

00:33:30.840 say

00:33:31.000 you

00:33:31.140 cannot

00:33:31.540 arrive

00:33:31.900 at

00:33:32.000 this

00:33:32.160 position

00:33:32.520 from

00:33:32.760 a

00:33:32.900 scriptural

00:33:33.200 perspective

00:33:33.520 this

00:33:33.680 is

00:33:33.760 an

00:33:33.860 important

00:33:34.180 point

00:33:34.500 too

00:33:34.700 Johnny

00:33:35.040 that

00:33:35.340 sometimes

00:33:35.700 people

00:33:36.080 say

00:33:36.380 well

00:33:36.960 you

00:33:37.220 know

00:33:37.380 if

00:33:37.580 the

00:33:37.720 old

00:33:43.620 distinction

00:33:43.980 that

00:33:44.140 Brandon

00:33:44.340 talked

00:33:44.620 about

00:33:44.840 which

00:33:45.320 is

00:33:45.480 between

00:33:45.860 ceremonial

00:33:46.800 law

00:33:47.160 and

00:33:47.900 juridical

00:33:48.460 law

00:33:48.880 and

00:33:49.440 moral

00:33:49.740 law

00:33:50.060 and

00:33:50.400 the

00:33:50.540 ceremonial

00:33:51.040 law

00:33:51.280 can

00:33:51.460 be

00:33:51.640 fulfilled

00:33:52.120 and

00:33:52.820 transformed

00:33:53.340 in

00:33:53.660 the

00:33:53.760 new

00:33:53.880 covenant

00:33:54.180 the

00:33:54.740 juridical

00:33:55.180 law

00:33:55.380 will

00:33:55.560 obviously

00:33:55.880 be

00:33:56.080 changed

00:33:56.380 with

00:33:57.020 the

00:33:57.140 changing

00:33:57.360 of

00:33:57.500 the

00:33:57.600 polity

00:33:57.960 or

00:33:58.480 it

00:33:58.600 will

00:33:58.700 be

00:33:59.020 fulfilled

00:33:59.840 in

00:34:00.120 the

00:34:00.340 spiritual

00:34:00.800 Israel

00:34:01.180 but

00:34:01.700 the

00:34:01.920 moral

00:34:02.180 law

00:34:02.460 is

00:34:02.700 eternal

00:34:03.100 and

00:34:03.560 it's

00:34:04.000 also

00:34:04.180 inscribed

00:34:04.560 in

00:34:04.820 every

00:34:05.020 human

00:34:05.260 heart

00:34:05.520 so

00:34:05.800 if

00:34:06.400 an

00:34:06.920 aspect

00:34:07.180 of

00:34:07.340 the

00:34:07.440 law

00:34:07.580 pertains

00:34:08.060 to

00:34:08.220 the

00:34:08.340 moral

00:34:08.520 law

00:34:08.820 then

00:34:09.360 nothing

00:34:10.320 about

00:34:10.740 it

00:34:10.880 would

00:34:11.080 transform

00:34:11.860 really

00:34:12.200 at

00:34:12.620 all

00:34:12.940 now

00:34:13.660 I

00:34:14.020 want

00:34:14.740 to

00:34:14.920 move

00:34:15.140 even

00:34:15.440 a little

00:34:15.680 further

00:34:16.120 than

00:34:16.400 just

00:34:16.660 the

00:34:16.820 L

00:34:17.040 and

00:34:17.160 the

00:34:17.280 G

00:34:17.440 and

00:34:17.580 the

00:34:17.680 B

00:34:17.880 into

00:34:18.500 the

00:34:18.760 T

00:34:19.040 because

00:34:19.720 Brandon

00:34:20.060 I

00:34:20.240 know

00:34:20.380 you've

00:34:20.800 you posted

00:34:21.620 something

00:34:22.440 to social

00:34:22.960 media

00:34:23.280 on

00:34:24.260 trans

00:34:24.660 day

00:34:24.860 of

00:34:25.020 visibility

00:34:25.560 that

00:34:26.040 got a

00:34:26.280 lot

00:34:26.380 of

00:34:26.500 traction

00:34:26.940 you said

00:34:27.760 on

00:34:27.880 this

00:34:28.040 trans

00:34:28.440 day

00:34:28.640 of

00:34:28.780 visibility

00:34:29.320 important

00:34:29.920 reminder

00:34:30.340 God

00:34:30.920 is

00:34:31.100 transgender

00:34:31.740 this

00:34:32.440 is

00:34:32.580 not

00:34:32.760 meant

00:34:32.940 to

00:34:33.060 be

00:34:33.180 a

00:34:33.280 provocative

00:34:33.660 statement

00:34:34.180 I

00:34:34.520 wanted

00:34:34.700 just

00:34:34.880 a

00:34:35.000 fact

00:34:35.200 check

00:34:35.380 there

00:34:35.560 it

00:34:35.720 obviously

00:34:36.240 was

00:34:36.660 it's

00:34:36.880 social

00:34:37.140 media

00:34:37.480 and

00:34:37.880 you

00:34:37.980 called

00:34:38.180 God

00:34:38.400 transgender

00:34:38.920 I'm

00:34:39.280 not

00:34:39.420 buying

00:34:39.620 that

00:34:39.740 for

00:34:39.840 a

00:34:39.960 second

00:34:40.160 and

00:34:40.600 he

00:34:40.760 said

00:34:40.960 rather

00:34:41.480 it's

00:34:41.660 a

00:34:41.780 statement

00:34:41.940 of

00:34:42.080 obvious

00:34:42.360 fact

00:34:42.720 Christians

00:34:43.320 believe

00:34:43.860 that

00:34:44.040 everyone

00:34:44.300 that

00:34:44.480 exists

00:34:44.780 bears

00:34:45.020 the

00:34:45.140 image

00:34:45.260 and

00:34:45.360 likeness

00:34:45.600 of

00:34:45.760 God

00:34:46.080 that

00:34:46.920 means

00:34:47.180 all

00:34:47.520 human

00:34:47.800 diversity

00:34:48.240 including

00:34:48.580 gender

00:34:48.920 diversity

00:34:49.400 is a

00:34:49.660 reflection

00:34:49.900 of God's

00:34:50.340 expansive

00:34:50.720 creativity

00:34:51.140 it

00:34:51.640 goes

00:34:51.800 on

00:34:51.940 for a

00:34:52.120 while

00:34:52.220 but

00:34:52.340 just

00:34:52.460 one

00:34:52.720 key

00:34:53.000 line

00:34:53.220 here

00:34:53.440 God

00:34:54.000 cannot

00:34:54.220 be

00:34:54.500 confined

00:34:55.160 to

00:34:55.480 any

00:34:55.680 gender

00:34:56.120 binaries

00:34:56.840 within

00:34:57.420 God

00:34:57.700 all

00:34:57.860 gender

00:34:58.100 identities

00:34:58.480 and

00:34:58.660 expressions

00:34:59.100 exist

00:35:00.000 and thus

00:35:00.740 God

00:35:01.020 both

00:35:01.280 transcends

00:35:01.720 and includes

00:35:02.180 all of

00:35:02.500 our

00:35:02.620 diverse

00:35:03.100 gender

00:35:03.720 identities

00:35:04.100 now

00:35:04.480 of

00:35:04.640 course

00:35:04.860 I

00:35:05.100 don't

00:35:05.240 know

00:35:05.440 anyone

00:35:06.020 who

00:35:06.900 would

00:35:07.080 attempt

00:35:07.320 to

00:35:07.520 reduce

00:35:08.240 God

00:35:08.780 to

00:35:09.200 some

00:35:09.420 human

00:35:09.780 conception

00:35:10.300 of

00:35:10.660 gender

00:35:10.940 however

00:35:11.640 God

00:35:12.660 does

00:35:12.900 reveal

00:35:13.300 himself

00:35:13.620 to

00:35:13.940 us

00:35:14.160 as

00:35:14.500 the

00:35:14.820 Father

00:35:15.260 and

00:35:15.960 the

00:35:16.180 Son

00:35:16.560 and

00:35:17.200 the

00:35:17.340 Holy

00:35:17.540 Ghost

00:35:18.040 God

00:35:18.660 chooses

00:35:19.080 if you

00:35:19.540 will

00:35:19.860 his

00:35:20.360 preferred

00:35:20.940 pronouns

00:35:21.500 and

00:35:21.960 they

00:35:22.100 are

00:35:22.300 he

00:35:22.740 him

00:35:23.580 and

00:35:23.900 his

00:35:24.400 so

00:35:24.900 I

00:35:25.040 guess

00:35:25.200 my

00:35:25.400 question

00:35:25.680 is

00:35:25.820 why

00:35:25.980 would

00:35:26.160 you

00:35:26.240 not

00:35:26.400 respect

00:35:26.820 God's

00:35:27.440 pronouns

00:35:27.740 well

00:35:28.940 because

00:35:29.200 clearly

00:35:29.540 there

00:35:29.760 are

00:35:29.860 other

00:35:30.000 places

00:35:30.280 in

00:35:30.500 scripture

00:35:30.720 where

00:35:30.980 God

00:35:31.260 uses

00:35:31.540 other

00:35:31.860 pronouns

00:35:32.320 God

00:35:32.620 uses

00:35:32.840 other

00:35:33.100 images

00:35:33.460 to

00:35:33.900 describe

00:35:34.240 God's

00:35:34.620 self

00:35:34.840 sure

00:35:37.560 yes

00:35:38.080 I think

00:35:38.440 in

00:35:38.600 Genesis

00:35:38.880 the

00:35:39.240 royal

00:35:39.480 we

00:35:39.620 is

00:35:39.740 quite

00:35:39.960 interesting

00:35:40.360 but

00:35:41.120 the

00:35:41.680 point

00:35:41.960 is

00:35:42.260 that

00:35:42.440 in

00:35:42.680 scripture

00:35:42.920 itself

00:35:43.280 God

00:35:43.640 refers

00:35:43.960 to

00:35:44.440 God's

00:35:45.340 self

00:35:45.600 in

00:35:45.980 one

00:35:46.420 specific

00:35:47.020 gender

00:35:47.640 identity

00:35:48.040 the

00:35:48.680 most

00:35:49.060 but

00:35:49.480 that

00:35:49.580 doesn't

00:35:49.800 mean

00:35:49.940 that

00:35:50.180 there

00:35:50.540 are

00:35:50.620 not

00:35:50.760 other

00:35:50.960 ways

00:35:51.200 that

00:35:51.340 God

00:35:51.480 identifies

00:35:52.000 before

00:35:52.400 you

00:35:52.560 finish

00:35:53.340 your

00:35:53.560 point

00:35:53.780 I

00:35:54.040 can't

00:35:55.480 let

00:35:55.620 that

00:35:55.760 pass

00:35:56.040 when

00:35:58.980 you

00:35:59.640 are

00:35:59.900 describing

00:36:01.000 what I

00:36:01.960 would

00:36:02.080 say

00:36:02.220 God

00:36:02.720 refers

00:36:03.140 to

00:36:03.340 himself

00:36:03.960 you

00:36:04.560 don't

00:36:04.820 say

00:36:05.060 himself

00:36:05.620 for

00:36:05.880 God

00:36:06.160 you

00:36:06.300 say

00:36:06.440 God

00:36:06.700 self

00:36:07.060 I

00:36:07.920 use

00:36:08.120 different

00:36:08.460 depending

00:36:08.780 on

00:36:08.960 who

00:36:09.160 I'm

00:36:09.420 speaking

00:36:09.800 to

00:36:10.100 and

00:36:10.360 how

00:36:10.720 to

00:36:10.960 communicate

00:36:11.360 this

00:36:11.620 message

00:36:11.920 I

00:36:12.120 think

00:36:12.340 using

00:36:13.080 any

00:36:13.400 pronoun

00:36:13.740 is

00:36:13.960 good

00:36:14.480 for

00:36:14.720 God

00:36:15.260 because

00:36:15.920 that's

00:36:16.140 how

00:36:16.240 God

00:36:16.460 describes

00:36:16.860 God

00:36:17.080 self

00:36:17.360 him

00:36:17.940 her

00:36:18.380 they

00:36:18.880 we

00:36:19.320 not

00:36:19.780 she

00:36:20.060 yeah

00:36:21.860 she

00:36:22.320 mother

00:36:22.660 hen

00:36:22.980 well

00:36:24.580 one

00:36:24.940 can

00:36:25.320 make

00:36:25.520 an

00:36:25.660 analogy

00:36:26.100 but

00:36:26.460 one

00:36:26.700 can

00:36:27.060 even

00:36:27.320 speak

00:36:28.140 quite

00:36:29.500 bluntly

00:36:30.440 about

00:36:30.800 God

00:36:31.260 transcending

00:36:32.060 mere

00:36:34.460 human

00:36:34.780 gender

00:36:35.080 or

00:36:35.220 something

00:36:35.480 without

00:36:36.560 ignoring

00:36:37.020 the

00:36:37.240 fact

00:36:37.540 that

00:36:37.980 God

00:36:38.900 presents

00:36:40.320 himself

00:36:40.620 to us

00:36:41.000 as

00:36:41.300 the

00:36:41.520 father

00:36:41.900 and

00:36:42.540 the

00:36:42.740 son

00:36:43.040 and

00:36:43.260 fathers

00:36:43.520 and

00:36:43.740 sons

00:36:43.900 are

00:36:44.020 not

00:36:44.240 she's

00:36:44.960 and

00:36:45.080 hers

00:36:45.500 but

00:36:46.200 even

00:36:46.380 in

00:36:46.560 your

00:36:46.700 own

00:36:46.840 tradition

00:36:47.160 there

00:36:47.920 are

00:36:48.280 mystic

00:36:48.740 catholics

00:36:49.200 that

00:36:49.400 write

00:36:49.620 about

00:36:49.920 God

00:36:50.180 the

00:36:50.340 mother

00:36:50.600 we

00:36:51.540 have

00:36:51.720 tons

00:36:52.100 of

00:36:52.320 mystic

00:36:52.600 writings

00:36:52.900 throughout

00:36:53.140 the

00:36:53.320 Catholic

00:36:53.640 church's

00:36:54.660 history

00:36:55.020 that

00:36:55.500 refer to

00:36:55.880 God

00:36:56.060 in a

00:36:56.360 multiplicity

00:36:57.060 of

00:36:57.360 genders

00:36:57.700 and so

00:36:58.380 I

00:36:58.560 think

00:36:58.740 it's

00:36:58.960 because

00:36:59.180 it's

00:36:59.360 a

00:36:59.460 political

00:36:59.900 fire

00:37:00.860 storm

00:37:01.600 around

00:37:01.920 this

00:37:02.160 particular

00:37:02.500 topic

00:37:02.880 that

00:37:03.140 we

00:37:03.340 are

00:37:03.800 parsing

00:37:04.200 this

00:37:04.380 out

00:37:04.600 and

00:37:04.800 really

00:37:05.040 insisting

00:37:05.540 that

00:37:05.660 God

00:37:05.840 must

00:37:06.040 be

00:37:06.240 he

00:37:06.440 him

00:37:06.640 his

00:37:06.940 I

00:37:07.780 think

00:37:08.040 we

00:37:08.200 need

00:37:08.360 to

00:37:08.640 your

00:37:09.420 very

00:37:09.640 point

00:37:09.880 refer

00:37:10.100 to

00:37:10.240 God

00:37:10.400 as

00:37:10.540 God

00:37:10.720 likes

00:37:10.960 to

00:37:11.100 be

00:37:11.220 referred

00:37:11.480 to

00:37:11.700 which

00:37:11.920 is

00:37:12.140 all

00:37:12.780 genders

00:37:13.180 which

00:37:13.440 is

00:37:13.560 why

00:37:13.760 I

00:37:13.920 say

00:37:14.120 God

00:37:14.440 transcends

00:37:15.300 gender

00:37:15.720 and

00:37:16.060 is

00:37:16.260 transgender

00:37:16.860 all of

00:37:17.500 that

00:37:17.700 is

00:37:18.000 within

00:37:18.360 God

00:37:18.780 and

00:37:20.620 if

00:37:20.800 one

00:37:21.020 is

00:37:21.240 Trinitarian

00:37:21.880 which

00:37:22.620 I

00:37:22.880 still

00:37:23.240 am

00:37:23.600 despite

00:37:24.480 the

00:37:24.700 fact

00:37:24.920 of

00:37:25.100 being

00:37:25.280 a

00:37:25.440 minister

00:37:25.740 in

00:37:25.940 a

00:37:26.060 Unitarian

00:37:26.440 Rercalist

00:37:26.920 congregation

00:37:27.400 we're

00:37:28.080 not

00:37:28.220 going

00:37:28.340 to

00:37:28.400 get

00:37:28.520 into

00:37:28.700 the

00:37:28.880 weeds

00:37:29.120 of

00:37:29.320 that

00:37:29.640 but

00:37:30.140 I'm

00:37:30.380 still

00:37:30.660 very

00:37:31.020 much

00:37:31.260 it

00:37:33.780 is

00:37:34.060 a

00:37:34.580 delightful

00:37:35.020 aspect

00:37:35.600 of

00:37:35.860 your

00:37:35.980 personality

00:37:36.640 given

00:37:37.260 the

00:37:37.620 many

00:37:38.020 complex

00:37:40.080 statements

00:37:40.560 that you

00:37:41.020 regularly

00:37:41.480 make

00:37:41.780 that you

00:37:42.300 would

00:37:42.460 be

00:37:42.660 a

00:37:42.880 Trinitarian

00:37:43.440 Unitarian

00:37:44.160 as well

00:37:45.280 yes

00:37:45.560 absolutely

00:37:46.480 convictedly

00:37:47.640 and

00:37:48.220 there's

00:37:49.240 the

00:37:49.480 third

00:37:50.600 person

00:37:51.140 who's

00:37:51.980 the

00:37:52.100 third

00:37:52.320 person

00:37:52.740 the

00:37:54.240 Holy

00:37:54.460 Spirit

00:37:54.780 the

00:37:55.160 bond

00:37:55.320 of

00:37:55.440 love

00:37:55.560 between

00:37:55.780 the

00:37:55.940 Son

00:37:56.420 how

00:37:57.280 has

00:37:57.460 the

00:37:57.600 Holy

00:37:57.800 Ghost

00:37:58.020 been

00:37:58.220 understood

00:37:58.740 traditionally

00:37:59.640 in

00:38:00.120 many

00:38:01.320 schools

00:38:01.980 of

00:38:02.200 thought

00:38:02.520 in

00:38:02.700 many

00:38:02.900 traditions

00:38:03.380 as

00:38:03.740 the

00:38:03.880 bond

00:38:04.040 of

00:38:04.180 love

00:38:04.320 between

00:38:04.580 the

00:38:04.680 Father

00:38:04.820 and

00:38:04.960 Son

00:38:05.140 Sophia

00:38:06.600 Lady

00:38:07.180 Wisdom

00:38:07.920 right

00:38:08.420 so

00:38:08.700 there's

00:38:08.960 an

00:38:09.160 element

00:38:09.560 of

00:38:09.800 femininity

00:38:10.560 of

00:38:11.100 femaleness

00:38:12.380 of

00:38:12.820 queerness

00:38:13.500 that

00:38:14.140 is

00:38:14.420 there

00:38:14.780 that

00:38:15.000 is

00:38:15.220 you

00:38:15.580 know

00:38:15.720 it's

00:38:16.040 it's

00:38:16.280 not

00:38:16.500 he

00:38:16.940 because

00:38:17.640 the

00:38:18.420 understanding

00:38:20.100 of

00:38:20.880 God

00:38:21.500 as

00:38:22.020 this

00:38:22.340 guy

00:38:22.800 up

00:38:23.100 in

00:38:23.220 the

00:38:23.380 sky

00:38:23.960 has

00:38:24.620 been

00:38:24.920 what

00:38:25.120 it

00:38:25.240 has

00:38:25.460 been

00:38:25.800 because

00:38:26.360 gender

00:38:27.200 had

00:38:27.740 been

00:38:27.960 understood

00:38:28.580 as

00:38:29.440 unilateral

00:38:30.940 there

00:38:31.480 was

00:38:31.680 just

00:38:32.060 male

00:38:32.680 let's

00:38:33.380 be

00:38:33.580 frank

00:38:33.980 there

00:38:34.300 was

00:38:34.480 no

00:38:34.760 not

00:38:35.000 even

00:38:35.200 female

00:38:35.840 I

00:38:36.320 think

00:38:36.500 there

00:38:36.600 was

00:38:36.760 female

00:38:37.100 like

00:38:37.540 before

00:38:37.900 our

00:38:38.660 Lord

00:38:39.060 tells us

00:38:40.620 to pray

00:38:41.080 our

00:38:41.500 father

00:38:42.000 he

00:38:42.580 is

00:38:42.780 born

00:38:43.200 of

00:38:43.640 a

00:38:43.820 woman

00:38:44.120 named

00:38:44.600 Mary

00:38:45.020 his

00:38:45.420 holy

00:38:45.620 mother

00:38:45.880 so I

00:38:46.380 think

00:38:46.520 people

00:38:46.740 knew

00:38:46.920 what

00:38:47.120 women

00:38:47.460 were

00:38:47.740 okay

00:38:48.040 if

00:38:48.400 you

00:38:48.560 open

00:38:49.140 a

00:38:49.660 new

00:38:50.240 revised

00:38:50.660 standard

00:38:51.000 version

00:38:51.380 bible

00:38:51.820 the

00:38:52.280 largest

00:38:52.760 print

00:38:53.200 there

00:38:53.580 is

00:38:54.240 dean

00:38:54.760 altridge

00:38:55.400 and

00:38:55.980 was

00:38:56.540 he

00:38:57.240 was

00:38:57.400 my

00:38:57.580 professor

00:38:58.060 in

00:38:58.880 in

00:38:59.280 you

00:38:59.620 know

00:38:59.760 in

00:39:01.800 my

00:39:02.140 bible

00:39:02.520 studies

00:39:03.080 right

00:39:03.480 so

00:39:04.580 it's

00:39:05.380 not

00:39:05.540 my

00:39:05.740 point

00:39:06.020 I'm

00:39:06.260 just

00:39:06.460 advancing

00:39:07.060 it

00:39:07.220 you

00:39:07.400 don't

00:39:07.560 have

00:39:07.720 to

00:39:07.880 buy

00:39:08.180 it

00:39:08.520 right

00:39:08.860 you

00:39:09.000 don't

00:39:09.120 have

00:39:09.280 to

00:39:09.440 buy

00:39:09.620 it

00:39:09.820 but

00:39:10.300 the

00:39:11.600 point

00:39:12.140 being

00:39:12.560 in

00:39:13.900 antiquity

00:39:14.720 there

00:39:15.120 was

00:39:15.320 male

00:39:15.780 and

00:39:16.340 there

00:39:16.540 was

00:39:16.740 failed

00:39:17.960 males

00:39:18.680 because

00:39:19.260 those

00:39:19.640 were

00:39:19.820 the

00:39:20.020 individuals

00:39:20.520 with

00:39:21.180 extra

00:39:21.620 parts

00:39:22.120 or

00:39:22.540 places

00:39:24.400 for

00:39:25.300 penetration

00:39:26.160 and

00:39:26.960 children

00:39:27.560 weren't

00:39:29.520 even

00:39:29.960 male

00:39:30.620 or

00:39:30.780 female

00:39:31.160 so

00:39:31.680 our

00:39:32.520 understanding

00:39:33.760 of

00:39:34.140 gender

00:39:34.640 is

00:39:35.600 still

00:39:36.020 so

00:39:37.160 rudimentary

00:39:38.760 that

00:39:40.080 it's

00:39:41.340 becoming

00:39:41.640 more

00:39:41.940 rudimentary

00:39:42.560 I think

00:39:43.020 no

00:39:43.260 no

00:39:43.640 we're

00:39:44.680 finally

00:39:45.260 understanding

00:39:46.240 that

00:39:46.880 there

00:39:47.160 there's

00:39:47.600 more

00:39:47.960 than

00:39:48.460 one

00:39:48.720 gender

00:39:49.040 male

00:39:49.480 that

00:39:50.340 there's

00:39:50.780 female

00:39:51.520 because

00:39:51.920 women

00:39:52.680 are

00:39:53.000 finally

00:39:53.420 getting

00:39:53.800 a little

00:39:54.260 bit

00:39:54.520 of

00:39:54.740 space

00:39:55.720 in

00:39:56.580 in

00:39:57.060 this

00:39:57.340 world

00:39:57.860 right

00:39:58.540 and

00:39:58.920 we're

00:39:59.280 understanding

00:40:00.160 that

00:40:00.500 even

00:40:00.780 between

00:40:01.180 male

00:40:01.480 and

00:40:01.600 female

00:40:01.820 there

00:40:02.040 are

00:40:02.260 other

00:40:02.620 expressions

00:40:03.100 biologically

00:40:04.120 science

00:40:04.720 is helping

00:40:05.540 us

00:40:05.760 understand

00:40:06.220 that

00:40:06.580 and

00:40:07.120 you know

00:40:07.760 academicians

00:40:08.480 professors

00:40:08.980 scholars

00:40:09.800 religious

00:40:10.420 leaders

00:40:10.900 and the

00:40:11.420 community

00:40:11.860 is helping

00:40:12.740 us

00:40:12.940 understand

00:40:13.300 it

00:40:13.780 was

00:40:14.260 mentioned

00:40:14.700 earlier

00:40:15.200 about

00:40:15.880 Gen Z's

00:40:16.860 the number

00:40:17.540 of non-binary

00:40:18.260 and queer

00:40:18.800 Gen Z's

00:40:19.460 and trans

00:40:19.900 Gen Z's

00:40:20.300 it's not

00:40:20.780 because it's

00:40:21.280 a fashionable

00:40:22.000 thing

00:40:22.620 because these

00:40:23.420 children

00:40:24.080 are still

00:40:25.460 being

00:40:25.860 terrorized

00:40:27.060 it's because

00:40:27.680 they're seeing

00:40:28.580 elders

00:40:29.360 they're finally

00:40:30.640 having the

00:40:31.840 language

00:40:32.440 it took me

00:40:33.120 47 years

00:40:34.440 to understand

00:40:35.680 that I was

00:40:36.800 not that

00:40:37.620 which I was

00:40:38.860 terrorized

00:40:39.640 for not being

00:40:40.660 so when

00:40:41.100 so when

00:40:41.120 they see

00:40:41.540 teachers

00:40:42.040 and people

00:40:42.800 in their

00:40:43.060 community

00:40:43.320 older

00:40:43.680 people

00:40:44.180 who are

00:40:44.860 expressing

00:40:45.460 LGBT

00:40:46.040 identities

00:40:46.660 that

00:40:47.320 persuades

00:40:48.060 them

00:40:48.480 to be

00:40:49.040 more likely

00:40:49.640 to identify

00:40:50.380 that way

00:40:50.740 you sound

00:40:51.860 like a

00:40:52.080 right-wing

00:40:52.400 conservative

00:40:52.920 Reverend

00:40:53.340 Alexander

00:40:53.760 that's

00:40:54.040 exactly

00:40:54.320 what we've

00:40:54.760 been saying

00:40:54.980 that's the twist

00:40:56.920 of the argument

00:40:57.500 it doesn't

00:40:58.240 persuade them

00:40:59.060 it helps

00:40:59.860 them to

00:41:00.360 see

00:41:00.900 what they

00:41:01.580 are

00:41:02.640 because

00:41:03.480 there's

00:41:03.820 language

00:41:04.280 for it

00:41:04.820 and there's

00:41:05.460 representation

00:41:06.040 for it

00:41:06.680 it's like

00:41:07.140 seeing a

00:41:07.660 woman

00:41:07.940 in a place

00:41:08.740 of power

00:41:09.500 helps

00:41:10.160 young girls

00:41:11.260 think

00:41:11.920 oh

00:41:12.300 I could

00:41:13.160 be a

00:41:13.500 president

00:41:13.960 I could

00:41:14.840 be a

00:41:15.200 CEO

00:41:15.540 I could

00:41:16.340 be a

00:41:16.660 teacher

00:41:16.940 because

00:41:17.300 we have

00:41:17.900 teachers

00:41:18.380 that are

00:41:19.340 women

00:41:20.500 like me

00:41:21.680 so it's

00:41:22.180 not because

00:41:23.240 they're

00:41:24.320 following a

00:41:25.000 trend

00:41:25.500 or they're

00:41:26.280 being groomed

00:41:27.400 which is

00:41:27.780 a terrible

00:41:28.660 argument

00:41:29.240 because if

00:41:29.740 we're really

00:41:30.240 concerned

00:41:30.680 about grooming

00:41:31.960 we would

00:41:34.720 address

00:41:35.440 the

00:41:36.060 you know

00:41:36.520 in 2006

00:41:38.720 there was

00:41:39.180 a study

00:41:39.620 that

00:41:40.260 450,000

00:41:45.060 children

00:41:46.340 would be

00:41:46.980 molested

00:41:47.520 before they

00:41:48.100 were graduated

00:41:49.000 and this

00:41:50.360 is not by

00:41:51.000 trans people

00:41:52.060 or queer

00:41:53.140 people

00:41:53.580 it's because

00:41:54.300 you know

00:41:54.680 it's staff

00:41:55.460 within those

00:41:56.380 schools

00:41:56.800 but we're

00:41:57.420 not paying

00:41:57.960 attention

00:41:58.220 public schools

00:41:58.700 so they're

00:41:59.440 disproportionately

00:41:59.980 liberal

00:42:00.400 I want to

00:42:01.040 bring in

00:42:01.340 Johnny here

00:42:01.860 on this

00:42:02.300 because

00:42:02.780 Johnny

00:42:03.540 I'll let

00:42:04.200 you weigh

00:42:04.780 in on

00:42:05.440 Reverend

00:42:05.760 Alexander's

00:42:06.520 claim

00:42:06.880 that

00:42:07.540 the

00:42:08.040 Holy

00:42:08.240 Spirit

00:42:08.660 is

00:42:09.000 queer

00:42:09.340 and

00:42:10.240 that

00:42:11.120 you know

00:42:12.100 children

00:42:12.480 are

00:42:13.160 now

00:42:14.160 identifying

00:42:14.700 30%

00:42:15.260 as

00:42:15.440 LGBT

00:42:15.820 because

00:42:16.660 of

00:42:16.980 who

00:42:17.100 they

00:42:17.220 really

00:42:17.500 are

00:42:18.000 and

00:42:18.300 even

00:42:18.820 I'd like

00:42:20.120 you to

00:42:20.380 get to

00:42:21.000 what

00:42:21.620 the

00:42:21.960 bishop

00:42:22.320 from

00:42:22.880 the

00:42:23.020 National

00:42:23.220 Cathedral

00:42:23.540 mentioned

00:42:23.960 about

00:42:24.180 trans

00:42:25.000 kids

00:42:25.400 and how

00:42:25.620 to love

00:42:25.860 trans

00:42:26.160 kids

00:42:26.320 the one

00:42:26.960 correction

00:42:27.640 I want

00:42:27.940 to make

00:42:28.240 because I'm

00:42:28.640 the only

00:42:28.880 Catholic

00:42:29.220 on the

00:42:29.540 panel

00:42:29.760 Reverend

00:42:30.100 is you

00:42:30.620 said

00:42:30.780 women

00:42:31.160 now

00:42:31.380 finally

00:42:31.660 have a

00:42:31.900 place

00:42:32.320 and they're

00:42:32.560 being

00:42:32.760 recognized

00:42:33.380 and kind

00:42:33.720 of honored

00:42:34.100 but as

00:42:34.640 a

00:42:34.780 Catholic

00:42:35.100 you know

00:42:35.540 we

00:42:36.060 really

00:42:36.640 like

00:42:37.160 the

00:42:37.340 Holy

00:42:37.520 Mother

00:42:37.780 a lot

00:42:38.380 and we

00:42:38.700 recognize

00:42:39.100 her

00:42:39.500 as

00:42:39.800 the

00:42:39.960 Queen

00:42:40.120 of

00:42:40.260 Heaven

00:42:40.580 you know

00:42:40.920 we say

00:42:41.200 hail

00:42:41.780 full of

00:42:42.200 grace

00:42:42.580 Lord

00:42:42.820 is

00:42:42.940 with

00:42:43.140 thee

00:42:43.340 so

00:42:43.560 listen

00:42:44.260 I

00:42:44.460 would

00:42:44.600 not

00:42:44.780 I

00:42:45.000 don't

00:42:45.120 know

00:42:45.260 how

00:42:45.400 the

00:42:45.560 Trinitarian

00:42:46.040 Unitarians

00:42:46.760 deal

00:42:46.960 with

00:42:47.120 women

00:42:47.380 but

00:42:47.820 we

00:42:48.020 Catholics

00:42:48.380 are

00:42:48.820 we're

00:42:49.060 very

00:42:49.360 pro

00:42:49.720 women

00:42:50.240 and

00:42:50.440 one

00:42:50.600 woman

00:42:50.840 in

00:42:50.980 particular

00:42:51.380 Johnny

00:42:52.060 your

00:42:52.500 take

00:42:52.800 yeah

00:42:54.540 I

00:42:54.680 think

00:42:54.840 probably

00:42:55.200 just

00:42:55.560 to

00:42:56.000 wed

00:42:56.240 together

00:42:56.620 what's

00:42:56.980 been

00:42:57.140 said

00:42:57.340 so far

00:42:57.780 regarding

00:42:58.200 the

00:42:58.400 nature

00:42:58.780 and

00:42:59.960 identity

00:43:00.380 of

00:43:00.660 God

00:43:01.020 it

00:43:01.680 really

00:43:01.900 just

00:43:02.100 has

00:43:02.240 to

00:43:02.340 be

00:43:02.460 answered

00:43:02.800 very

00:43:03.060 simply

00:43:03.500 when

00:43:03.900 God

00:43:04.180 chose

00:43:04.480 to

00:43:04.680 reveal

00:43:05.020 himself

00:43:05.480 he

00:43:06.180 did

00:43:06.400 so

00:43:06.600 in

00:43:06.720 the

00:43:06.840 person

00:43:07.160 and

00:43:07.320 work

00:43:07.540 of

00:43:07.700 Jesus

00:43:08.000 Christ

00:43:08.520 a

00:43:08.940 man

00:43:09.300 and

00:43:09.580 the

00:43:09.700 word

00:43:09.880 became

00:43:10.220 flesh

00:43:10.560 John

00:43:10.780 114

00:43:11.300 and

00:43:11.980 dwelt

00:43:12.260 amongst

00:43:12.620 us

00:43:13.020 multiple

00:43:13.640 times

00:43:14.060 throughout

00:43:14.260 the

00:43:14.420 gospel

00:43:14.780 then

00:43:15.220 Jesus

00:43:15.540 is

00:43:15.760 going

00:43:15.900 to

00:43:16.060 say

00:43:16.260 I

00:43:16.580 and

00:43:16.700 the

00:43:16.860 father

00:43:17.180 are

00:43:17.580 one

00:43:17.920 if

00:43:18.400 you've

00:43:18.640 seen

00:43:18.920 me

00:43:19.280 you've

00:43:19.860 seen

00:43:20.140 the

00:43:20.360 father

00:43:20.720 Thomas

00:43:21.540 have

00:43:21.740 I

00:43:21.840 been

00:43:22.000 with

00:43:22.160 you

00:43:22.260 so

00:43:22.480 long

00:43:22.760 don't

00:43:23.000 you

00:43:23.120 understand

00:43:23.540 this

00:43:23.960 John

00:43:24.560 17

00:43:25.020 Jesus

00:43:25.480 high

00:43:25.760 priestly

00:43:26.040 prayer

00:43:26.440 he

00:43:27.100 says

00:43:27.480 father

00:43:28.040 return

00:43:28.440 to

00:43:28.540 me

00:43:28.600 the

00:43:28.720 glory

00:43:28.880 that

00:43:29.040 I

00:43:29.140 had

00:43:29.280 when

00:43:29.400 I

00:43:29.500 was

00:43:29.620 with

00:43:29.860 you

00:43:30.000 before

00:43:30.220 the

00:43:30.360 foundation

00:43:30.740 of

00:43:30.980 the

00:43:31.100 world

00:43:31.380 and

00:43:32.100 when

00:43:33.020 Jesus

00:43:33.360 comes

00:43:33.760 back

00:43:34.220 he's

00:43:34.880 coming

00:43:35.120 back

00:43:35.400 as

00:43:36.400 Jesus

00:43:36.820 as

00:43:37.400 a

00:43:37.560 real

00:43:37.900 man

00:43:38.300 with

00:43:38.500 king

00:43:38.740 of

00:43:38.920 kings

00:43:39.160 and

00:43:39.340 lord

00:43:39.520 of

00:43:39.660 lords

00:43:39.940 tattooed

00:43:40.680 on

00:43:40.840 his

00:43:41.000 thigh

00:43:41.360 and

00:43:42.040 so

00:43:42.200 I

00:43:42.360 think

00:43:42.580 in

00:43:42.740 regards

00:43:43.040 to

00:43:43.240 the

00:43:43.360 gender

00:43:43.620 you

00:43:43.820 have

00:43:43.980 to

00:43:44.100 understand

00:43:44.520 that

00:43:44.720 right

00:43:44.940 now

00:43:45.240 in

00:43:45.860 glory

00:43:46.300 Jesus

00:43:47.540 is

00:43:48.040 a

00:43:48.400 man

00:43:48.700 we're

00:43:49.320 going

00:43:49.420 to

00:43:49.540 worship

00:43:49.820 Jesus

00:43:50.180 Christ

00:43:50.520 Christians

00:43:50.900 are

00:43:51.180 for

00:43:51.780 all

00:43:51.920 of

00:43:52.020 eternity

00:43:52.380 as

00:43:53.220 the

00:43:53.540 crucified

00:43:53.940 king

00:43:54.460 of

00:43:54.820 the

00:43:54.980 universe

00:43:55.280 so

00:43:55.540 I

00:43:55.680 think

00:43:55.820 just

00:43:56.000 in

00:43:56.120 that

00:43:56.280 regard

00:43:56.600 Jesus

00:43:57.180 already

00:43:57.460 taught

00:43:57.700 us

00:43:57.840 how

00:43:57.940 to

00:43:58.060 pray

00:43:58.260 he

00:43:58.700 taught

00:43:58.880 us

00:43:59.000 to

00:43:59.120 pray

00:43:59.260 our

00:43:59.420 father

00:43:59.760 if

00:44:00.220 you're

00:44:00.340 going

00:44:00.440 to

00:44:00.520 teach

00:44:00.680 people

00:44:00.960 to

00:44:01.120 pray

00:44:01.300 a

00:44:01.460 different

00:44:01.720 way

00:44:01.900 than

00:44:02.060 Jesus

00:44:02.360 taught

00:44:02.620 his

00:44:02.760 disciples

00:44:03.140 to

00:44:03.360 pray

00:44:03.540 that

00:44:04.120 would

00:44:04.280 be

00:44:04.420 the

00:44:04.620 epitome

00:44:04.960 of

00:44:05.160 pride

00:44:05.480 regarding

00:44:06.980 the

00:44:07.860 transgender

00:44:08.500 maybe

00:44:09.120 you know

00:44:10.660 the

00:44:10.900 students

00:44:11.480 that are

00:44:11.820 struggling

00:44:12.100 with

00:44:12.280 their

00:44:12.400 identity

00:44:12.700 and

00:44:13.040 you

00:44:13.400 can

00:44:13.500 look

00:44:13.600 at

00:44:13.680 the

00:44:13.780 American

00:44:14.140 Psychiatric

00:44:14.780 Association

00:44:15.300 stats

00:44:16.380 on

00:44:16.700 that

00:44:16.920 but

00:44:17.100 90%

00:44:17.960 or

00:44:18.600 98%

00:44:19.420 of

00:44:19.820 people

00:44:20.040 that

00:44:20.240 identify

00:44:20.660 as

00:44:20.880 another

00:44:21.120 gender

00:44:21.400 before

00:44:21.700 I

00:44:21.860 think

00:44:22.040 it's

00:44:22.320 age

00:44:22.480 12

00:44:22.740 you'd

00:44:22.920 have

00:44:23.000 to

00:44:23.100 check

00:44:23.280 me

00:44:23.400 on

00:44:23.500 this

00:44:23.660 Nancy

00:44:23.900 Piercy

00:44:24.220 writes

00:44:24.460 about

00:44:24.680 it

00:44:24.840 at

00:44:25.320 great

00:44:25.600 length

00:44:25.960 and

00:44:26.160 with

00:44:26.320 great

00:44:26.560 clarity

00:44:27.000 in

00:44:27.180 her

00:44:33.360 and

00:44:33.800 so

00:44:34.100 first

00:44:34.620 of

00:44:34.720 all

00:44:34.780 they

00:44:34.920 should

00:44:35.080 be

00:44:35.380 talked

00:44:35.940 to

00:44:36.320 from

00:44:36.620 a

00:44:36.760 biblical

00:44:36.980 perspective

00:44:37.500 they

00:44:37.740 should

00:44:37.880 be

00:44:38.040 loved

00:44:38.400 as

00:44:38.940 a

00:44:39.120 pastor

00:44:39.540 as

00:44:39.820 a

00:44:39.980 Christian

00:44:40.380 I

00:44:40.900 want

00:44:41.020 to

00:44:41.140 love

00:44:41.380 people

00:44:41.820 and

00:44:42.280 again

00:44:42.640 when

00:44:42.960 I

00:44:43.100 say

00:44:43.260 I

00:44:43.360 want

00:44:43.460 to

00:44:43.560 love

00:44:43.720 people

00:44:43.980 the

00:44:44.140 most

00:44:44.300 loving

00:44:44.560 thing

00:44:44.860 that

00:44:45.300 I

00:44:45.440 could

00:44:45.580 do

00:44:45.720 as

00:44:45.840 a

00:44:45.960 pastor

00:44:46.300 is

00:44:46.680 teach

00:44:46.940 them

00:44:47.100 the

00:44:47.260 truth

00:44:47.540 that's

00:44:47.800 so

00:44:47.940 clear

00:44:48.220 within

00:44:48.480 God's

00:44:48.860 word

00:44:49.100 it

00:44:49.540 doesn't

00:44:49.820 mean

00:44:50.060 hammer

00:44:50.820 smash

00:44:51.280 that's

00:44:51.560 why

00:44:51.660 even

00:44:51.880 on my

00:44:52.220 tone

00:44:52.520 as

00:44:52.880 communicate

00:44:53.380 the

00:44:53.600 truth

00:44:53.800 I

00:44:53.940 don't

00:44:56.520 want

00:44:56.680 to

00:44:56.740 be

00:44:56.840 argumentative

00:44:57.600 I

00:44:58.180 do

00:44:58.400 want

00:44:58.620 to

00:44:58.720 love

00:44:58.900 people

00:44:59.180 enough

00:44:59.440 to

00:44:59.580 tell

00:44:59.760 them

00:44:59.880 the

00:45:00.080 truth

00:45:00.420 and

00:45:00.780 even

00:45:01.420 if

00:45:01.860 I

00:45:01.960 could

00:45:02.080 go

00:45:02.200 back

00:45:02.400 to

00:45:02.520 one

00:45:02.700 thing

00:45:02.880 Brandon

00:45:03.160 said

00:45:03.400 as

00:45:03.540 a

00:45:03.660 progressive

00:45:04.060 revelationist

00:45:05.140 that

00:45:06.780 is

00:45:07.120 you're

00:45:07.600 basically

00:45:08.020 making

00:45:08.420 the

00:45:08.640 assumption

00:45:09.040 that

00:45:09.500 however

00:45:10.300 God

00:45:10.640 is

00:45:10.800 guiding

00:45:11.120 you

00:45:11.360 today

00:45:11.740 so

00:45:12.300 called

00:45:12.820 it's

00:45:13.900 doing

00:45:14.420 it

00:45:14.640 in a

00:45:14.920 contradictory

00:45:15.400 way

00:45:15.800 to

00:45:16.060 thousands

00:45:16.440 of

00:45:16.640 years

00:45:16.780 of

00:45:16.920 revelation

00:45:17.240 and

00:45:17.460 thousands

00:45:17.700 of

00:45:17.940 years

00:45:18.120 of

00:45:18.280 church

00:45:18.480 history

00:45:22.880 that

00:45:23.100 you're

00:45:23.240 making

00:45:23.560 is

00:45:23.780 that

00:45:23.960 now

00:45:24.540 what

00:45:25.680 he's

00:45:26.080 revealing

00:45:26.760 is

00:45:27.740 contradicting

00:45:28.720 what

00:45:28.940 he's

00:45:29.180 already

00:45:29.580 revealed

00:45:30.040 and

00:45:30.420 he

00:45:30.640 says

00:45:30.960 in

00:45:31.080 revelation

00:45:31.460 whoever

00:45:31.760 adds

00:45:32.100 to

00:45:32.220 these

00:45:32.400 words

00:45:32.680 let

00:45:32.900 him

00:45:32.980 be

00:45:33.100 accursed

00:45:33.620 and

00:45:34.200 so

00:45:34.340 when

00:45:34.500 God

00:45:34.720 does

00:45:34.980 reveal

00:45:35.240 himself

00:45:35.540 through

00:45:35.700 the

00:45:35.840 person

00:45:36.100 and

00:45:36.220 work

00:45:36.360 of

00:45:36.460 the

00:45:36.580 Holy

00:45:36.760 Spirit

00:45:37.100 it

00:45:37.720 never

00:45:38.280 ever

00:45:38.920 contradicts

00:45:40.000 his

00:45:40.220 signature

00:45:40.700 as

00:45:41.180 he

00:45:41.340 has

00:45:41.520 written

00:45:41.860 in

00:45:42.160 his

00:45:42.380 word

00:45:42.640 once

00:45:42.920 and

00:45:43.020 for

00:45:43.140 all

00:45:43.280 time

00:45:43.620 Brandon

00:45:44.200 that's

00:45:45.800 just

00:45:45.920 simply

00:45:46.180 not

00:45:46.380 true

00:45:46.620 I

00:45:46.800 think

00:45:47.020 your

00:45:47.260 view

00:45:47.940 of

00:45:48.200 what

00:45:48.400 the

00:45:48.660 Bible

00:45:48.880 is

00:45:49.280 is

00:45:49.720 inaccurate

00:45:50.340 the

00:45:50.620 Bible

00:45:50.800 is

00:45:51.000 not

00:45:51.220 the

00:45:51.500 inerrant

00:45:51.900 word

00:45:52.080 of

00:45:52.200 God

00:45:52.380 quite

00:45:52.620 clearly

00:45:52.980 and

00:45:53.480 the

00:45:53.560 way

00:45:53.680 Jesus

00:45:54.000 interprets

00:45:54.760 the

00:45:54.960 Bible

00:45:55.260 is

00:45:55.800 by

00:45:56.320 revising

00:45:57.560 commandments

00:45:58.020 from

00:45:58.340 the

00:45:58.500 Hebrew

00:45:58.700 Bible

00:45:59.000 and

00:45:59.160 offering

00:45:59.480 new

00:45:59.740 more

00:46:00.000 ethical

00:46:00.280 commandments

00:46:00.800 hold on

00:46:01.220 Brandon

00:46:01.560 just

00:46:01.760 before

00:46:02.060 before

00:46:02.360 you

00:46:02.520 move

00:46:02.740 on

00:46:02.880 with

00:46:03.000 your

00:46:03.120 point

00:46:03.400 should

00:46:04.680 be

00:46:04.840 clear

00:46:05.080 to

00:46:05.240 viewers

00:46:05.560 that's

00:46:06.080 a

00:46:06.200 rather

00:46:06.600 radical

00:46:07.080 departure

00:46:07.560 from

00:46:07.920 the

00:46:08.160 traditional

00:46:08.600 understanding

00:46:09.060 of

00:46:09.200 the

00:46:09.320 church

00:46:09.500 that

00:46:09.700 scripture

00:46:09.940 is

00:46:17.020 the

00:46:17.460 modern

00:46:17.740 evangelical

00:46:18.100 understanding

00:46:18.680 of

00:46:18.840 what

00:46:18.980 inerrancy

00:46:19.400 is

00:46:19.680 meaning

00:46:19.900 that

00:46:20.100 every

00:46:20.340 single

00:46:20.620 word

00:46:21.000 is

00:46:21.320 directly

00:46:21.660 from

00:46:21.860 God

00:46:22.120 and

00:46:22.320 true

00:46:22.520 in

00:46:22.660 every

00:46:22.920 way

00:46:23.280 for

00:46:23.540 all

00:46:23.780 time

00:46:24.180 is

00:46:24.560 just

00:46:24.840 not

00:46:25.140 how

00:46:25.360 the

00:46:25.540 church

00:46:25.740 throughout

00:46:26.000 history

00:46:26.320 has

00:46:26.460 What about

00:46:26.720 the

00:46:26.860 old

00:46:27.040 Catholic

00:46:27.340 view

00:46:27.580 of

00:46:27.920 inerrancy?

00:46:29.640 I think

00:46:29.940 I mean

00:46:30.240 honestly

00:46:30.620 the Catholic

00:46:31.020 view

00:46:31.240 on most

00:46:31.660 things

00:46:32.020 is

00:46:32.340 more

00:46:32.560 nuanced

00:46:32.960 and

00:46:33.380 I'm

00:46:34.020 more

00:46:34.180 conversant

00:46:34.640 with

00:46:34.800 that

00:46:34.980 view

00:46:35.140 I'm

00:46:35.820 getting

00:46:36.340 you

00:46:36.600 and

00:46:36.860 Alexander

00:46:37.320 to

00:46:37.500 come

00:46:37.640 over

00:46:37.840 Johnny

00:46:38.900 maybe

00:46:39.280 we'll

00:46:39.540 bring

00:46:39.780 you

00:46:39.900 over

00:46:40.020 across

00:46:40.260 the

00:46:40.380 time

00:46:40.540 or

00:46:40.640 two

00:46:40.760 sorry

00:46:41.120 to

00:46:41.220 interrupt

00:46:41.440 keep

00:46:41.620 going

00:46:41.860 yeah

00:46:42.820 but

00:46:43.020 the point

00:46:43.700 is

00:46:43.980 Jesus

00:46:44.380 often

00:46:44.940 would

00:46:45.220 go

00:46:45.400 to

00:46:45.540 the

00:46:45.660 Hebrew

00:46:45.880 Bible

00:46:46.220 he

00:46:46.500 would

00:46:46.640 take

00:46:46.800 a

00:46:46.920 command

00:46:47.120 from

00:46:47.280 the

00:46:47.380 Hebrew

00:46:47.580 Bible

00:46:47.820 you

00:46:47.980 have

00:46:48.120 heard

00:46:48.240 it

00:46:48.380 said

00:46:48.600 an

00:46:48.760 eye

00:46:48.900 for

00:46:49.040 an

00:46:49.120 eye

00:46:49.220 and a

00:46:49.380 tooth

00:46:49.540 for

00:46:49.680 a

00:46:49.780 tooth

00:46:49.960 but

00:46:50.560 I

00:46:50.760 say

00:46:51.020 unto

00:46:51.200 you

00:46:51.440 turn

00:46:52.200 the

00:46:52.340 other

00:46:52.520 cheek

00:46:52.780 love

00:46:53.060 your

00:46:53.220 neighbor

00:46:53.480 bless

00:46:53.840 those

00:46:54.060 who

00:46:54.220 persecute

00:46:54.640 you

00:46:54.840 that's

00:46:55.500 not

00:46:55.800 a

00:46:56.520 reinterpretation

00:46:57.660 of

00:46:57.800 a

00:46:57.900 command

00:46:58.120 Jesus

00:46:58.480 is

00:46:58.680 giving

00:46:58.860 a

00:46:59.060 new

00:46:59.320 significantly

00:46:59.860 better

00:47:00.360 command

00:47:00.760 Jesus

00:47:01.520 did

00:47:01.760 not

00:47:01.920 view

00:47:02.060 the

00:47:02.220 Bible

00:47:02.440 as

00:47:02.700 this

00:47:02.860 inerrant

00:47:03.180 static

00:47:03.500 book

00:47:03.820 that

00:47:04.140 all

00:47:04.680 of

00:47:04.820 it

00:47:04.980 is

00:47:05.380 binding

00:47:06.280 for

00:47:06.600 all

00:47:06.660 time

00:47:06.900 then what about

00:47:07.000 when

00:47:07.200 St. Paul

00:47:07.720 in the letter

00:47:08.100 to the

00:47:08.400 Romans

00:47:08.640 says

00:47:08.940 the civil

00:47:09.300 authority

00:47:09.640 does not

00:47:10.040 carry

00:47:10.280 the sword

00:47:10.660 in vain

00:47:11.100 is it

00:47:11.480 the case

00:47:12.600 as you

00:47:12.880 seem

00:47:13.060 to be

00:47:13.300 suggesting

00:47:13.680 that

00:47:13.960 our

00:47:14.420 Lord

00:47:14.760 rather

00:47:15.160 than

00:47:15.440 fulfilling

00:47:15.880 scripture

00:47:16.960 is

00:47:17.680 contradicting

00:47:18.540 the Old

00:47:18.980 Testament

00:47:19.300 and then

00:47:19.720 St. Paul

00:47:20.100 is

00:47:20.280 contradicting

00:47:20.800 our

00:47:21.060 Lord

00:47:21.300 when

00:47:21.480 he

00:47:21.580 said

00:47:21.780 that

00:47:21.900 the

00:47:22.040 civil

00:47:22.200 authority

00:47:22.620 can

00:47:23.060 execute

00:47:23.560 judgments

00:47:24.020 according

00:47:24.300 to

00:47:24.480 justice

00:47:24.860 or

00:47:25.460 no

00:47:25.800 is

00:47:25.940 something

00:47:26.080 else

00:47:26.240 going

00:47:26.440 on

00:47:26.600 well

00:47:27.400 when

00:47:27.600 Jesus

00:47:27.840 says

00:47:28.140 I've

00:47:28.320 not

00:47:28.460 come

00:47:28.680 to

00:47:29.040 abolish

00:47:29.580 the law

00:47:29.800 but

00:47:29.980 fulfill

00:47:30.320 it

00:47:30.460 another way

00:47:31.020 to

00:47:31.920 translate

00:47:32.280 the Greek

00:47:32.600 word

00:47:32.760 that's

00:47:33.000 translated

00:47:33.280 fulfillment

00:47:33.660 is

00:47:33.980 complete

00:47:34.440 so I

00:47:35.040 would

00:47:35.160 say

00:47:35.340 some

00:47:35.540 of

00:47:35.660 the

00:47:35.780 revelation

00:47:36.280 throughout

00:47:36.720 scripture

00:47:37.040 is

00:47:37.340 incomplete

00:47:38.020 and

00:47:38.400 Jesus

00:47:38.700 in many

00:47:39.240 instances

00:47:39.780 completed

00:47:40.400 the

00:47:40.620 revelation

00:47:41.000 but I

00:47:41.760 don't

00:47:41.920 think

00:47:42.200 that

00:47:42.480 God

00:47:42.760 stopped

00:47:43.040 speaking

00:47:43.340 when

00:47:43.560 the

00:47:43.700 canon

00:47:43.880 was

00:47:44.080 closed

00:47:44.500 and

00:47:44.900 I

00:47:45.040 think

00:47:45.180 the

00:47:45.340 church

00:47:45.560 has

00:47:45.800 evolved

00:47:46.240 on

00:47:46.500 many

00:47:46.780 different

00:47:47.160 perspectives

00:47:47.580 you

00:47:47.800 can

00:47:47.940 read

00:47:48.160 evangelical

00:47:48.820 William

00:47:49.200 Webb's

00:47:49.520 books

00:47:49.780 slaves

00:47:50.440 women

00:47:50.740 and

00:47:50.940 homosexual

00:47:51.380 where

00:47:51.700 he

00:47:51.900 charts

00:47:52.280 a

00:47:52.480 redemptive

00:47:52.900 trajectory

00:47:53.380 in the

00:47:54.140 scripture

00:47:54.420 beyond

00:47:55.140 the

00:47:55.380 scripture

00:47:55.660 that

00:47:56.040 caused

00:47:56.320 the

00:47:56.480 church

00:47:56.660 to

00:47:56.860 change

00:47:57.180 its

00:47:57.340 perspective

00:47:57.780 after

00:47:58.120 thousands

00:47:58.520 of

00:47:58.720 years

00:47:58.880 of

00:47:59.040 teaching

00:47:59.300 to

00:47:59.860 adopt

00:48:00.240 a

00:48:00.480 more

00:48:00.780 Christ

00:48:01.400 like

00:48:01.700 ethic

00:48:02.160 so

00:48:02.780 no

00:48:03.640 ethics

00:48:04.140 don't

00:48:04.360 rise

00:48:04.600 and fall

00:48:04.980 on

00:48:05.360 the

00:48:05.660 Bible

00:48:06.320 the

00:48:06.520 Bible

00:48:06.700 points

00:48:07.160 us

00:48:07.320 in

00:48:13.560 welcome

00:48:13.860 and

00:48:14.000 include

00:48:14.240 LGBT

00:48:14.560 people

00:48:14.960 in

00:48:15.140 this

00:48:15.280 day

00:48:15.460 okay

00:48:15.760 well

00:48:15.920 I'm

00:48:16.040 glad

00:48:16.200 you

00:48:16.360 brought

00:48:16.560 up

00:48:16.700 ethics

00:48:17.000 in

00:48:17.140 this

00:48:17.280 regard

00:48:17.520 because

00:48:17.920 before

00:48:18.500 I

00:48:18.680 let

00:48:18.820 you

00:48:18.940 all

00:48:19.080 go

00:48:19.200 there

00:48:19.380 is

00:48:19.540 one

00:48:20.260 point

00:48:20.560 that

00:48:20.680 we

00:48:20.800 haven't

00:48:21.080 touched

00:48:21.320 on

00:48:21.520 that

00:48:21.620 I

00:48:21.700 think

00:48:21.840 is

00:48:21.940 important

00:48:22.340 and

00:48:22.800 kind

00:48:23.020 of

00:48:23.160 the

00:48:23.360 background

00:48:24.260 of

00:48:24.920 what

00:48:25.080 we're

00:48:25.260 discussing

00:48:25.680 here

00:48:25.980 which

00:48:26.460 is

00:48:26.800 the

00:48:27.380 natural

00:48:27.720 law

00:48:28.160 it

00:48:28.660 was

00:48:28.820 brought

00:48:29.060 up

00:48:29.240 earlier

00:48:29.680 that

00:48:30.180 today

00:48:31.100 the

00:48:31.540 reason

00:48:31.860 that

00:48:32.080 LGBT

00:48:32.580 identifying

00:48:33.280 people

00:48:33.820 and

00:48:34.180 especially

00:48:34.600 the

00:48:35.080 T

00:48:35.280 identifying

00:48:43.560 or

00:48:43.920 in

00:48:44.020 the

00:48:44.120 identity

00:48:44.520 but

00:48:45.000 rather

00:48:45.320 because

00:48:45.840 of

00:48:46.060 social

00:48:46.700 stigmas

00:48:47.280 I'm

00:48:47.940 a little

00:48:48.220 skeptical

00:48:48.580 of

00:48:48.800 that

00:48:48.960 because

00:48:49.280 we're

00:48:49.580 as

00:48:49.800 pro

00:48:50.100 LGBT

00:48:50.560 now

00:48:51.160 as

00:48:51.480 any

00:48:51.740 society

00:48:52.260 has

00:48:52.620 ever

00:48:52.860 been

00:48:53.140 and

00:48:53.500 we've

00:48:53.660 redefined

00:48:54.080 marriage

00:48:54.440 and

00:48:54.900 even

00:48:55.360 redefined

00:48:56.180 gender

00:48:56.960 in the

00:48:57.320 civil

00:48:57.480 rights

00:48:57.740 law

00:48:57.920 and

00:48:57.980 the

00:48:58.060 Bostock

00:48:58.400 decision

00:48:58.760 it

00:48:59.100 was

00:48:59.180 a

00:48:59.280 conservative

00:48:59.640 judge

00:48:59.960 who

00:49:00.100 did

00:49:00.260 it

00:49:00.380 judge

00:49:00.620 Neil

00:49:00.800 Gorsuch

00:49:01.240 so

00:49:01.740 it

00:49:02.280 would

00:49:02.620 seem

00:49:02.880 to

00:49:03.060 me

00:49:03.240 that

00:49:03.460 as

00:49:03.940 LGBT

00:49:04.860 has

00:49:05.880 made

00:49:06.120 such

00:49:06.420 advancements

00:49:07.300 in

00:49:07.500 recent

00:49:07.800 decades

00:49:08.220 that

00:49:08.640 the

00:49:08.800 rates

00:49:09.000 of

00:49:09.120 anxiety

00:49:09.540 and

00:49:09.740 depression

00:49:10.100 and

00:49:10.460 suicidality

00:49:11.200 for

00:49:11.780 the

00:49:12.020 whole

00:49:12.200 spectrum

00:49:12.620 of

00:49:12.800 the

00:49:12.920 alphabet

00:49:13.200 but

00:49:13.500 certainly

00:49:14.560 for

00:49:14.740 the

00:49:14.880 T

00:49:15.080 which

00:49:15.340 has

00:49:15.480 a lot

00:49:15.660 of

00:49:15.760 focus

00:49:16.000 on

00:49:16.160 it

00:49:16.240 now

00:49:16.420 would

00:49:16.940 decrease

00:49:17.540 and

00:49:17.820 yet

00:49:17.980 what

00:49:18.160 we've

00:49:18.460 found

00:49:18.780 repeatedly

00:49:19.500 and

00:49:20.160 consistently

00:49:20.700 is

00:49:21.380 that

00:49:21.520 those

00:49:21.740 rates

00:49:22.060 of

00:49:22.200 anxiety

00:49:22.520 depression

00:49:22.860 suicidality

00:49:23.480 don't

00:49:24.000 even

00:49:24.460 for

00:49:24.740 guys

00:49:25.120 who

00:49:25.240 identify

00:49:25.560 as

00:49:25.760 gay

00:49:25.940 women

00:49:26.220 who

00:49:26.380 identify

00:49:26.760 as

00:49:27.060 lesbians

00:49:27.460 they

00:49:27.820 have

00:49:27.940 significantly

00:49:28.500 increased

00:49:28.980 rates

00:49:29.320 of

00:49:29.820 depression

00:49:30.260 and

00:49:30.640 anxiety

00:49:31.080 and

00:49:37.800 recently

00:49:38.040 one

00:49:38.600 from

00:49:38.760 the

00:49:38.880 American

00:49:39.120 Journal

00:49:39.480 of

00:49:39.640 Psychiatry

00:49:40.300 largest

00:49:40.960 data set

00:49:41.440 ever

00:49:41.700 on

00:49:41.900 trans

00:49:42.300 procedures

00:49:42.820 and

00:49:43.420 then

00:49:43.660 just

00:49:44.340 within

00:49:45.080 a week

00:49:45.340 or two

00:49:45.740 out

00:49:46.720 of

00:49:46.840 Oxford

00:49:47.140 University

00:49:47.700 showing

00:49:48.360 that

00:49:48.760 the

00:49:48.900 suicide

00:49:49.140 rates

00:49:49.500 remain

00:49:49.820 very

00:49:50.440 very

00:49:50.700 high

00:49:51.100 and

00:49:51.420 in

00:49:51.620 fact

00:49:51.820 rates

00:49:52.320 of

00:49:52.440 anxiety

00:49:52.860 and

00:49:53.240 even

00:49:53.480 suicide

00:49:53.840 can

00:49:54.100 increase

00:49:54.740 after

00:49:55.620 affirming

00:49:56.320 the

00:49:56.460 transgender

00:49:56.820 identity

00:49:57.260 so

00:49:57.520 the

00:49:59.120 pro

00:50:00.000 LGBT

00:50:00.440 argument

00:50:01.180 seems

00:50:01.460 to be

00:50:01.720 that

00:50:01.860 this

00:50:02.000 is

00:50:02.120 all

00:50:02.280 because

00:50:02.540 of

00:50:02.700 social

00:50:02.980 stigma

00:50:03.400 and

00:50:03.680 ostracism

00:50:04.320 my

00:50:05.400 argument

00:50:05.840 would

00:50:06.080 be

00:50:06.340 that

00:50:07.800 these

00:50:08.540 behaviors

00:50:08.920 have

00:50:09.120 high

00:50:09.340 rates

00:50:09.580 of

00:50:09.680 anxiety

00:50:10.060 and

00:50:10.220 depression

00:50:10.520 and

00:50:10.700 all

00:50:10.800 the

00:50:10.920 rest

00:50:11.180 because

00:50:11.840 they

00:50:12.480 understand

00:50:12.960 that

00:50:13.400 it

00:50:13.500 is

00:50:13.660 contrary

00:50:14.120 to

00:50:14.860 nature

00:50:15.200 and

00:50:15.400 it's

00:50:15.540 not

00:50:15.720 conducive

00:50:16.180 with

00:50:16.340 happiness

00:50:16.820 which

00:50:17.380 Aristotle

00:50:17.860 defines

00:50:18.380 as

00:50:18.580 a

00:50:18.920 rational

00:50:19.280 activity

00:50:19.780 done

00:50:19.980 with

00:50:20.160 excellence

00:50:20.640 in

00:50:20.780 accord

00:50:21.000 with

00:50:21.180 virtue

00:50:21.580 and

00:50:22.060 that

00:50:22.180 maybe

00:50:22.400 as

00:50:22.540 St.

00:50:22.740 Paul

00:50:22.840 tells

00:50:23.140 us

00:50:23.300 the

00:50:23.600 natural

00:50:23.920 law

00:50:24.200 is

00:50:24.300 inscribed

00:50:24.640 on

00:50:24.800 every

00:50:25.080 human

00:50:25.420 heart

00:50:25.740 isn't

00:50:26.340 that

00:50:26.760 the

00:50:27.280 traditional

00:50:27.840 Christian

00:50:28.700 view

00:50:29.040 Reverend

00:50:29.360 Alexander

00:50:29.840 trans

00:50:36.260 people

00:50:36.680 non-binary

00:50:37.300 people

00:50:37.740 queer

00:50:38.680 people

00:50:39.160 are

00:50:39.640 still

00:50:40.740 experiencing

00:50:42.640 the

00:50:43.480 community

00:50:43.960 still

00:50:44.620 plagued

00:50:46.180 with

00:50:47.520 suicidal

00:50:50.820 ideation

00:50:51.620 with

00:50:51.920 depression

00:50:52.560 with

00:50:53.440 self

00:50:54.280 destructive

00:50:56.000 behaviors

00:50:56.540 because

00:50:57.180 even

00:50:57.760 though

00:50:58.240 there's

00:50:58.880 some

00:50:59.080 laws

00:50:59.540 that

00:50:59.740 were

00:50:59.880 passed

00:51:00.320 and

00:51:00.500 some

00:51:00.680 protections

00:51:01.120 that

00:51:01.420 were

00:51:01.560 promised

00:51:02.080 they

00:51:02.600 have

00:51:02.860 not

00:51:03.140 been

00:51:03.340 fulfilled

00:51:03.920 men

00:51:05.720 play

00:51:06.120 in

00:51:06.240 women's

00:51:06.500 sports

00:51:06.800 they

00:51:07.000 use

00:51:07.260 women's

00:51:07.700 bathrooms

00:51:08.300 civil

00:51:08.780 rights

00:51:09.040 law

00:51:09.200 was

00:51:09.380 changed

00:51:09.860 employment

00:51:10.400 law

00:51:10.680 was

00:51:10.820 changed

00:51:11.080 that

00:51:11.680 is

00:51:12.200 not

00:51:12.440 true

00:51:12.760 there's

00:51:13.480 10

00:51:14.540 athletes

00:51:15.620 in the

00:51:16.240 whole

00:51:16.420 country

00:51:16.880 competing

00:51:17.720 in

00:51:18.420 sports

00:51:19.000 10

00:51:19.800 in

00:51:20.580 the

00:51:20.660 whole

00:51:20.800 country

00:51:21.160 there

00:51:21.780 was

00:51:21.980 one

00:51:22.520 trans

00:51:23.520 athlete

00:51:24.140 out

00:51:25.060 of

00:51:25.360 was it

00:51:25.920 five

00:51:26.480 540

00:51:28.200 something

00:51:28.720 592

00:51:30.140 athletes

00:51:30.860 took to

00:51:32.200 the

00:51:32.400 olympics

00:51:33.100 well

00:51:33.580 according

00:51:33.940 to the

00:51:34.260 according

00:51:34.540 to the

00:51:34.800 united

00:51:35.080 nations

00:51:35.420 890

00:51:36.540 medals

00:51:36.900 and trophies

00:51:37.380 have been

00:51:37.620 taken away

00:51:38.060 from girls

00:51:38.540 because

00:51:38.860 and women

00:51:39.340 because

00:51:39.720 that's

00:51:42.360 not true

00:51:43.000 it's

00:51:43.240 0.004

00:51:45.580 one

00:51:46.340 four

00:51:47.100 percent

00:51:47.920 the

00:51:48.160 un

00:51:48.320 says

00:51:48.680 it was

00:51:48.980 it was

00:51:49.260 some

00:51:49.540 600

00:51:50.340 29

00:51:51.160 different

00:51:51.580 sports

00:51:51.960 some

00:51:52.180 600

00:51:52.600 athletes

00:51:53.440 across

00:51:53.680 400

00:51:54.000 competitions

00:51:54.500 i don't

00:51:54.800 know

00:51:54.920 it's

00:51:55.260 either

00:51:55.440 reverend

00:51:55.720 alexander

00:51:56.120 the

00:51:56.280 un

00:51:56.440 report

00:51:56.760 but

00:51:57.020 i

00:51:57.260 digress

00:51:57.620 keep

00:51:58.080 going

00:51:58.300 no

00:51:59.080 i

00:51:59.300 love

00:51:59.920 the

00:52:00.100 un

00:52:00.300 actually

00:52:00.640 we

00:52:00.860 need

00:52:01.040 to

00:52:01.180 protect

00:52:01.880 the

00:52:02.100 un

00:52:02.360 and

00:52:02.720 shore

00:52:03.820 it

00:52:04.020 up

00:52:04.260 not

00:52:04.540 not to

00:52:04.960 dismantle

00:52:05.520 it

00:52:05.740 my

00:52:06.680 point

00:52:07.040 being

00:52:07.400 trans

00:52:08.640 people

00:52:09.200 are a

00:52:10.160 minority

00:52:10.720 of a

00:52:11.060 minority

00:52:11.520 of a

00:52:12.020 minority

00:52:12.600 and the

00:52:13.440 focus

00:52:14.020 that has

00:52:14.580 been

00:52:14.900 that has

00:52:15.640 been

00:52:16.060 sure

00:52:17.540 i

00:52:17.820 understand

00:52:18.400 your

00:52:18.620 point

00:52:18.800 we're

00:52:18.980 talking

00:52:19.160 about

00:52:19.620 the

00:52:19.740 lgbt

00:52:20.240 too

00:52:20.500 much

00:52:20.680 we

00:52:20.820 shouldn't

00:52:21.020 talk

00:52:21.180 about

00:52:21.300 them

00:52:21.380 but

00:52:21.520 what

00:52:21.700 do

00:52:21.940 you

00:52:22.000 make

00:52:22.160 of

00:52:25.720 free

00:52:25.840 to

00:52:26.000 nature

00:52:26.180 and

00:52:26.320 that's

00:52:26.500 what's

00:52:26.660 making

00:52:26.900 them

00:52:27.080 sad

00:52:27.360 not

00:52:27.800 just

00:52:27.980 mean

00:52:28.200 old

00:52:28.380 guys

00:52:28.640 like

00:52:28.840 johnny

00:52:29.100 and

00:52:29.200 michael

00:52:29.400 knowles

00:52:30.140 my

00:52:30.500 point

00:52:30.900 is that

00:52:31.360 trans

00:52:31.840 people

00:52:32.140 are still

00:52:33.380 unable

00:52:34.180 to find

00:52:34.600 jobs

00:52:35.020 still

00:52:35.780 unable

00:52:36.300 to

00:52:36.540 find

00:52:36.780 housing

00:52:37.180 still

00:52:37.780 unable

00:52:38.280 to

00:52:38.860 be

00:52:39.180 fully

00:52:40.080 welcomed

00:52:41.780 let alone

00:52:42.480 celebrated

00:52:43.400 in

00:52:44.540 society

00:52:45.180 but

00:52:45.440 as

00:52:46.160 they're

00:52:46.380 being

00:52:46.660 more

00:52:47.180 clearly

00:52:48.340 embraced

00:52:48.820 by our

00:52:49.200 law

00:52:49.400 and our

00:52:49.680 culture

00:52:49.960 wouldn't

00:52:50.280 you

00:52:50.400 expect

00:52:50.720 the rates

00:52:51.020 of

00:52:51.100 anxiety

00:52:51.420 depression

00:52:51.780 and

00:52:51.920 suicide

00:52:52.120 to go

00:52:52.440 down

00:52:52.920 not

00:52:53.400 to

00:52:53.560 remain

00:52:53.760 the

00:52:53.940 same

00:52:54.120 or

00:52:54.240 even

00:52:54.420 increase

00:52:54.880 but

00:52:55.740 that's

00:52:55.980 not

00:52:56.200 true

00:52:56.500 because

00:52:56.780 for

00:52:57.040 trans

00:52:57.360 people

00:52:57.600 in

00:52:57.820 particular

00:52:58.300 some

00:52:58.860 laws

00:52:59.160 have

00:52:59.380 been

00:52:59.580 passed

00:53:00.060 but

00:53:00.580 immediately

00:53:01.240 after

00:53:01.740 they

00:53:02.340 have

00:53:02.620 been

00:53:02.860 targeted

00:53:03.280 we

00:53:03.640 have

00:53:04.020 been

00:53:04.240 because

00:53:04.520 I'm

00:53:04.780 within

00:53:05.040 the

00:53:05.240 trans

00:53:05.540 community

00:53:05.900 as a

00:53:06.260 non-binary

00:53:06.580 person

00:53:07.040 we

00:53:07.560 have

00:53:07.880 been

00:53:08.160 systematically

00:53:08.920 targeted

00:53:10.400 it's

00:53:10.720 kind of like

00:53:11.060 cheating

00:53:11.340 a little

00:53:11.560 well

00:53:13.220 you know

00:53:13.840 I know

00:53:14.640 myself

00:53:15.200 and I

00:53:15.520 try to

00:53:15.880 know

00:53:16.140 myself

00:53:16.640 know

00:53:17.120 thyself

00:53:17.740 and I

00:53:18.300 won't

00:53:18.480 make

00:53:18.700 any

00:53:18.880 judgment

00:53:19.180 about

00:53:19.500 your

00:53:19.780 gender

00:53:20.140 or

00:53:20.400 your

00:53:20.660 life

00:53:21.560 you can

00:53:22.200 please

00:53:22.540 judge

00:53:22.860 my

00:53:23.060 gender

00:53:23.380 I'm

00:53:23.740 a big

00:53:24.020 strong

00:53:24.420 tough

00:53:24.660 guy

00:53:24.880 I'm

00:53:25.160 a

00:53:25.700 he

00:53:26.000 man

00:53:26.300 but

00:53:26.480 if I

00:53:26.820 start

00:53:27.140 referring

00:53:27.560 to you

00:53:28.020 as she

00:53:28.640 don't

00:53:29.940 do that

00:53:30.180 Michaela

00:53:31.260 you

00:53:31.780 won't

00:53:32.720 enjoy

00:53:33.480 that

00:53:34.060 that

00:53:34.300 won't

00:53:34.480 be

00:53:34.640 comfortable

00:53:35.020 for you

00:53:35.480 that

00:53:35.860 would

00:53:36.080 be

00:53:36.280 true

00:53:36.480 signifying

00:53:37.260 and

00:53:37.420 respectful

00:53:37.960 right

00:53:38.360 but

00:53:38.740 that's

00:53:39.120 what

00:53:39.340 is

00:53:39.620 done

00:53:39.900 to

00:53:40.120 trans

00:53:40.480 people

00:53:40.860 right

00:53:41.400 they

00:53:41.820 we

00:53:43.820 have

00:53:45.040 we

00:53:45.480 have

00:53:46.100 our

00:53:46.280 identities

00:53:46.760 we

00:53:47.100 have

00:53:47.320 our

00:53:47.480 self

00:53:47.800 understanding

00:53:48.400 but

00:53:48.880 people

00:53:49.200 they're

00:53:49.480 not

00:53:49.740 us

00:53:50.200 keep

00:53:50.660 pointing

00:53:51.040 their

00:53:51.580 finger

00:53:52.080 at

00:53:52.340 us

00:53:52.540 and

00:53:52.680 saying

00:53:52.860 no

00:53:53.500 you're

00:53:54.180 not

00:53:54.500 who

00:53:54.700 you are

00:53:55.100 pointing

00:53:55.400 your

00:53:55.620 finger

00:53:55.900 I know

00:53:56.180 we've

00:53:56.380 got to

00:53:56.560 let

00:53:56.700 you

00:53:56.820 go

00:53:57.000 very

00:53:57.240 shortly

00:53:57.480 I have

00:53:57.660 to let

00:53:57.820 all of

00:53:58.160 you

00:53:58.280 gentlemen

00:53:58.480 go

00:53:58.700 so

00:53:59.040 maybe

00:53:59.200 just a

00:53:59.500 little

00:53:59.600 rapid

00:53:59.960 fire

00:54:00.320 here

00:54:00.540 before

00:54:00.840 the

00:54:01.080 end

00:54:01.520 we

00:54:02.860 began

00:54:03.360 with

00:54:03.860 revelation

00:54:04.700 and

00:54:05.380 dictates

00:54:06.020 from the

00:54:06.320 pulpit

00:54:06.640 from the

00:54:06.960 Episcopalian

00:54:07.580 bishop

00:54:07.840 lady

00:54:08.120 we can

00:54:08.940 end

00:54:09.240 on

00:54:09.520 natural

00:54:09.920 law

00:54:10.320 what's

00:54:10.620 your

00:54:10.820 take

00:54:11.620 as

00:54:11.900 you

00:54:12.000 wag

00:54:12.160 your

00:54:12.300 finger

00:54:12.480 I

00:54:13.000 was

00:54:13.420 just scratching

00:54:13.840 my

00:54:14.040 head

00:54:14.240 I

00:54:14.480 think

00:54:15.580 maybe

00:54:15.780 just a

00:54:16.060 couple

00:54:16.200 things

00:54:16.460 to

00:54:16.660 respond

00:54:17.180 to

00:54:17.460 the

00:54:17.780 first

00:54:18.000 from

00:54:18.140 Brandon

00:54:18.440 saying

00:54:18.780 that

00:54:18.980 Jesus

00:54:19.260 said

00:54:20.080 you've

00:54:20.280 heard

00:54:20.380 it

00:54:20.500 said

00:54:20.720 but

00:54:20.920 I

00:54:21.200 tell

00:54:21.380 you

00:54:22.320 you've

00:54:23.060 heard

00:54:23.240 not

00:54:23.620 to

00:54:23.720 commit

00:54:23.860 adultery

00:54:24.200 but

00:54:24.380 I

00:54:24.500 say

00:54:24.620 to

00:54:24.700 you

00:54:24.820 that

00:54:24.940 everyone

00:54:25.220 who

00:54:25.520 looks at

00:54:26.180 a

00:54:26.240 woman

00:54:26.380 lustfully

00:54:27.080 in her

00:54:27.420 heart

00:54:27.660 has

00:54:27.780 committed

00:54:28.000 adultery

00:54:28.500 what

00:54:29.140 Jesus

00:54:29.400 is

00:54:29.620 getting

00:54:29.840 at

00:54:30.100 is

00:54:30.200 that

00:54:30.320 the

00:54:30.440 Old

00:54:30.580 Testament

00:54:30.900 system

00:54:31.360 pointed

00:54:31.720 to

00:54:31.900 the

00:54:32.080 insufficiency

00:54:32.760 of

00:54:33.420 ever

00:54:33.680 trying

00:54:33.900 to

00:54:34.040 earn

00:54:34.240 your

00:54:34.400 way

00:54:34.580 to

00:54:34.740 God

00:54:35.020 which

00:54:35.260 makes

00:54:35.680 us

00:54:35.820 dependent

00:54:36.140 upon

00:54:36.460 grace

00:54:36.920 so

00:54:37.460 the

00:54:37.580 whole

00:54:37.720 point

00:54:37.960 of

00:54:38.060 the

00:54:38.160 law

00:54:38.380 in

00:54:38.560 Galatians

00:54:38.920 3

00:54:39.120 is

00:54:39.300 to

00:54:39.420 be

00:54:39.540 our

00:54:39.720 tutor

00:54:40.040 to

00:54:40.220 point

00:54:40.500 us

00:54:40.660 to

00:54:40.800 Jesus

00:54:41.120 Christ

00:54:41.620 because

00:54:41.940 we're

00:54:42.140 saved

00:54:42.460 by faith

00:54:43.420 through

00:54:44.120 grace

00:54:44.420 in

00:54:44.620 Jesus

00:54:44.840 Christ

00:54:45.120 so

00:54:45.360 I

00:54:45.760 think

00:54:45.900 just

00:54:46.080 to

00:54:46.180 respond

00:54:46.480 to

00:54:46.600 that

00:54:46.740 regarding

00:54:47.080 the

00:54:47.280 trans

00:54:47.700 conversation

00:54:58.500 it

00:54:58.720 should

00:54:58.880 probably

00:54:59.200 be

00:54:59.360 the

00:54:59.540 words

00:54:59.800 of

00:54:59.900 the

00:55:00.020 resurrected

00:55:00.480 Jesus

00:55:00.880 Christ

00:55:01.300 who

00:55:01.520 says

00:55:01.760 in

00:55:01.980 Matthew

00:55:02.360 19

00:55:03.020 4

00:55:03.400 from

00:55:04.040 the

00:55:04.240 beginning

00:55:04.640 he

00:55:04.900 made

00:55:05.160 them

00:55:05.340 male

00:55:05.620 and

00:55:05.800 female

00:55:06.160 why

00:55:07.640 is

00:55:07.840 there

00:55:08.000 a

00:55:08.260 greater

00:55:08.460 degree

00:55:08.800 of

00:55:08.960 depression

00:55:09.360 well

00:55:09.720 I

00:55:09.840 think

00:55:10.060 it

00:55:10.300 in

00:55:10.700 many

00:55:11.080 cases

00:55:11.400 is

00:55:11.600 because

00:55:11.880 of

00:55:12.580 a

00:55:14.100 departure

00:55:15.700 from

00:55:16.180 what's

00:55:16.620 natural

00:55:17.040 I

00:55:17.580 think

00:55:17.780 on

00:55:17.960 many

00:55:18.220 cases

00:55:18.520 it's

00:55:18.740 being

00:55:18.920 pushed

00:55:19.200 upon

00:55:19.560 them

00:55:19.800 you

00:55:20.520 can

00:55:20.700 read

00:55:20.880 Nancy

00:55:21.140 Piercy

00:55:21.500 studies

00:55:21.900 which

00:55:22.160 are

00:55:22.280 very

00:55:22.600 insightful

00:55:23.080 and

00:55:23.360 love

00:55:23.520 thy

00:55:23.660 body

00:55:28.500 you

00:55:28.840 would

00:55:29.040 be

00:55:29.320 reading

00:55:29.720 a

00:55:29.900 different

00:55:30.160 Bible

00:55:30.540 to

00:55:30.980 come

00:55:31.200 up

00:55:31.340 with

00:55:31.460 any

00:55:31.780 other

00:55:32.020 conclusion

00:55:32.600 that

00:55:33.360 Jesus

00:55:33.700 affirms

00:55:34.340 a

00:55:34.500 gender

00:55:34.740 binary

00:55:35.240 that's

00:55:36.000 the

00:55:36.120 creation

00:55:36.580 narrative

00:55:37.000 it's

00:55:37.340 affirmed

00:55:37.720 by

00:55:37.940 Jesus

00:55:38.340 it's

00:55:39.100 the

00:55:39.280 only

00:55:39.480 complementary

00:55:40.180 isha

00:55:41.040 anatomically

00:55:42.780 physiologically

00:55:43.920 physically

00:55:44.860 and

00:55:45.460 biologically

00:55:47.400 male and

00:55:49.020 female are

00:55:49.540 counterparts to

00:55:50.280 each other

00:55:50.700 and so

00:55:51.540 that's not

00:55:52.140 just a

00:55:52.480 biblical

00:55:52.740 reality

00:55:53.340 that's

00:55:54.260 a

00:55:54.820 scientific

00:55:55.340 reality

00:55:56.020 and so

00:55:56.580 I would

00:55:57.660 just

00:55:57.960 argue

00:55:58.840 from both

00:55:59.520 the

00:56:00.800 scientific

00:56:01.540 perspective

00:56:01.960 there

00:56:02.180 and

00:56:02.420 a

00:56:02.740 biblical

00:56:02.960 one

00:56:03.300 a

00:56:03.520 good

00:56:03.700 point

00:56:03.980 too

00:56:04.160 that

00:56:04.320 faith

00:56:04.560 and

00:56:04.680 reason

00:56:04.920 are

00:56:05.060 not

00:56:05.220 opposed

00:56:05.620 but

00:56:05.880 actually

00:56:06.240 go

00:56:06.460 together

00:56:06.900 and that

00:56:07.420 grace

00:56:08.000 does not

00:56:08.480 contradict

00:56:08.820 nature

00:56:09.180 but

00:56:09.360 actually

00:56:09.700 perfects

00:56:10.200 nature

00:56:10.460 so

00:56:10.940 Brandon

00:56:11.380 before I

00:56:12.200 let all

00:56:12.580 of you

00:56:12.800 go

00:56:13.000 in our

00:56:13.220 remaining

00:56:13.480 15

00:56:13.960 seconds

00:56:14.480 any

00:56:15.440 thoughts

00:56:15.820 on just

00:56:16.220 the

00:56:16.560 natural

00:56:17.220 aspect

00:56:17.640 of it

00:56:18.020 you know

00:56:18.300 I mean

00:56:18.620 it's

00:56:18.820 like

00:56:19.000 we all

00:56:19.300 kind

00:56:19.520 of

00:56:19.580 know

00:56:19.720 what

00:56:19.860 a

00:56:19.980 fella

00:56:20.180 and

00:56:20.340 lady

00:56:20.560 is

00:56:20.900 and

00:56:21.100 we

00:56:21.500 all

00:56:21.680 kind

00:56:21.940 of

00:56:22.060 can

00:56:22.240 deduce

00:56:22.700 the

00:56:23.380 telos

00:56:23.980 and

00:56:24.300 natural

00:56:24.800 desires

00:56:25.240 and

00:56:25.400 maybe

00:56:25.540 that's

00:56:26.080 why

00:56:26.260 so

00:56:26.480 many

00:56:26.640 people

00:56:27.040 who

00:56:27.900 are

00:56:27.980 living

00:56:28.260 in

00:56:28.640 perhaps

00:56:29.240 aberrant

00:56:29.920 ways

00:56:30.340 are

00:56:30.680 kind

00:56:31.080 of

00:56:31.160 upset

00:56:31.460 and

00:56:31.700 sad

00:56:31.920 no

00:56:33.080 I

00:56:33.220 think

00:56:33.420 as

00:56:33.700 a

00:56:34.120 pastor

00:56:34.460 of

00:56:34.800 LGBT

00:56:35.140 people

00:56:35.440 who

00:56:35.600 sits

00:56:36.080 with

00:56:36.280 LGBT

00:56:36.600 people

00:56:36.900 all

00:56:37.060 the

00:56:37.160 time

00:56:37.420 most

00:56:37.860 of

00:56:38.220 the

00:56:38.420 trauma

00:56:38.800 most

00:56:39.160 of

00:56:39.500 the

00:56:39.780 trauma

00:56:40.140 responses

00:56:40.700 that

00:56:40.920 I

00:56:41.040 see

00:56:41.200 in

00:56:41.320 LGBT

00:56:41.600 people

00:56:41.900 is

00:56:42.080 because

00:56:42.340 they

00:56:42.560 come

00:56:42.760 from

00:56:42.960 families

00:56:43.380 or

00:56:43.600 churches

00:56:43.940 that

00:56:44.520 have

00:56:44.660 rejected

00:56:45.080 them

00:56:45.440 and

00:56:45.800 called

00:56:46.180 them

00:56:46.560 the

00:56:47.060 black

00:56:47.320 sheep

00:56:47.520 of

00:56:47.660 the

00:56:47.760 family

00:56:48.000 that

00:56:48.180 is

00:56:48.300 no

00:56:48.440 longer

00:56:48.700 welcome

00:56:49.060 because

00:56:49.540 of

00:56:49.880 how

00:56:50.000 they

00:56:50.160 identify

00:56:50.580 that

00:56:51.280 is

00:56:51.460 going

00:56:51.640 to

00:56:51.820 affect

00:56:52.080 people's

00:56:52.420 mental

00:56:52.620 health

00:56:52.960 and

00:56:53.420 now

00:56:53.580 we

00:56:53.700 live

00:56:53.880 in

00:56:53.980 this

00:56:54.140 Trump

00:56:54.380 era

00:56:54.720 where

00:56:55.100 from

00:56:55.360 the

00:56:55.540 highest

00:56:55.820 bully

00:56:56.140 pulpit

00:56:56.500 in

00:56:56.740 the

00:56:56.860 world

00:56:57.120 we

00:56:57.300 have

00:56:57.500 people

00:56:57.880 spouting

00:56:58.560 off

00:56:58.760 things

00:56:58.940 that

00:56:59.060 are

00:56:59.140 objectively

00:56:59.580 false

00:57:00.000 like

00:57:00.220 there

00:57:00.380 are

00:57:00.520 two

00:57:00.740 genders

00:57:01.080 there

00:57:01.460 are

00:57:01.560 sexes

00:57:02.200 not

00:57:02.400 two

00:57:02.580 genders

00:57:02.920 and

00:57:03.260 you

00:57:03.460 think

00:57:03.740 somebody

00:57:04.040 would

00:57:04.180 have

00:57:04.280 told

00:57:15.440 I would

00:57:16.220 say

00:57:16.340 there

00:57:16.500 were

00:57:16.620 thought

00:57:16.780 throughout

00:57:17.000 history

00:57:17.340 like

00:57:17.600 everyone

00:57:17.900 no

00:57:18.800 I mean

00:57:19.380 not in

00:57:19.640 the

00:57:19.740 mission

00:57:19.960 where

00:57:21.040 there

00:57:21.200 are

00:57:21.300 12

00:57:21.520 different

00:57:21.800 genders

00:57:22.160 understood

00:57:22.580 from

00:57:22.840 the

00:57:22.960 bible

00:57:23.180 itself

00:57:23.640 but

00:57:24.740 gender

00:57:26.080 is

00:57:26.280 obviously

00:57:26.640 a very

00:57:26.920 complex

00:57:27.300 category

00:57:27.720 and I

00:57:27.980 don't

00:57:28.200 understand

00:57:28.660 why

00:57:28.840 the

00:57:29.000 right

00:57:29.200 wants

00:57:29.420 to

00:57:29.600 collapse

00:57:30.000 sex

00:57:30.280 and

00:57:30.440 gender

00:57:30.640 so

00:57:30.880 much

00:57:31.100 other

00:57:31.640 than

00:57:31.840 the

00:57:31.980 fact

00:57:32.180 that

00:57:32.380 they

00:57:32.660 despise

00:57:34.040 the

00:57:34.200 trans

00:57:34.420 community

00:57:34.740 no

00:57:35.100 it

00:57:35.260 might

00:57:35.440 be

00:57:35.600 because

00:57:36.000 we

00:57:36.200 have

00:57:36.320 an

00:57:36.420 incarnational

00:57:37.080 theology

00:57:37.660 in

00:57:38.180 our

00:57:39.420 religion

00:57:40.360 and we

00:57:40.640 recognize

00:57:41.240 that

00:57:41.820 there

00:57:42.040 is

00:57:42.840 a

00:57:43.500 material

00:57:44.240 aspect

00:57:44.680 of

00:57:44.880 the

00:57:44.980 human

00:57:45.180 person

00:57:45.560 but

00:57:45.980 there

00:57:46.120 is

00:57:46.240 also

00:57:46.680 an

00:57:47.180 immaterial

00:57:47.660 aspect

00:57:48.100 of

00:57:48.320 the

00:57:48.440 human

00:57:48.660 person

00:57:49.080 that

00:57:49.820 the

00:57:50.000 soul

00:57:50.380 to

00:57:50.720 use

00:57:50.920 classical

00:57:51.300 language

00:57:51.620 would

00:57:51.800 be

00:57:51.960 the

00:57:52.260 substantial

00:57:52.700 form

00:57:53.200 of

00:57:53.340 the

00:57:53.460 body

00:57:53.740 and

00:57:54.180 so

00:57:54.400 the

00:57:54.620 soul

00:57:55.020 would

00:57:55.500 not

00:57:55.700 be

00:57:55.940 contrary

00:57:56.440 to

00:57:56.920 the

00:57:57.120 physical

00:57:57.400 form

00:57:57.840 but

00:57:58.320 would

00:57:58.540 go

00:58:00.460 together

00:58:00.800 with

00:58:01.000 it

00:58:01.100 and

00:58:01.180 would

00:58:01.280 actually

00:58:01.540 give

00:58:01.760 it

00:58:01.880 its

00:58:02.120 form

00:58:02.440 and

00:58:02.620 so

00:58:02.800 I

00:58:03.380 think

00:58:03.640 I

00:58:03.900 see

00:58:04.100 in

00:58:04.240 the

00:58:04.420 trans

00:58:05.060 identity

00:58:05.620 a

00:58:06.220 kind

00:58:06.400 of

00:58:06.500 Gnosticism

00:58:07.120 that

00:58:07.300 says

00:58:07.500 that

00:58:07.640 one's

00:58:07.840 true

00:58:08.040 self

00:58:08.320 is

00:58:08.460 actually

00:58:08.740 contrary

00:58:09.280 to

00:58:09.800 the

00:58:09.920 material

00:58:10.300 of

00:58:10.520 one's

00:58:10.760 body

00:58:11.060 which

00:58:11.300 is

00:58:11.780 contrary

00:58:12.380 to

00:58:12.780 not

00:58:13.180 only

00:58:13.360 the

00:58:13.500 Christian

00:58:13.780 tradition

00:58:14.180 but

00:58:14.600 also

00:58:14.960 contrary

00:58:15.500 to

00:58:15.980 a

00:58:16.720 lot

00:58:17.160 of

00:58:17.340 philosophy

00:58:17.940 and

00:58:18.160 so

00:58:18.300 I

00:58:18.400 think

00:58:18.500 that's

00:58:18.900 where

00:58:19.020 Trump

00:58:19.220 gets

00:58:19.400 it

00:58:19.500 from

00:58:19.680 to

00:58:20.120 defend

00:58:20.440 Trump

00:58:20.720 on

00:58:20.860 the

00:58:20.960 point

00:58:21.140 of

00:58:21.260 being

00:58:21.540 unsophisticated

00:58:23.100 or

00:58:23.220 something

00:58:23.420 like

00:58:23.620 that

00:58:23.800 I

00:58:24.100 think

00:58:24.260 he's

00:58:24.420 being

00:58:24.620 downright

00:58:25.220 Aristotelian

00:58:26.360 the

00:58:26.800 last

00:58:27.180 question

00:58:27.560 I

00:58:27.820 want

00:58:28.020 to

00:58:28.080 ask

00:58:28.320 you

00:58:28.420 though

00:58:28.560 on

00:58:28.840 your

00:58:28.980 point

00:58:29.300 is

00:58:29.520 you

00:58:29.840 say

00:58:30.000 look

00:58:30.280 LGBT

00:58:30.960 people

00:58:31.540 still

00:58:31.840 get

00:58:32.000 a lot

00:58:32.200 of

00:58:32.300 hate

00:58:32.520 from

00:58:32.700 their

00:58:32.840 families

00:58:33.200 and

00:58:33.400 communities

00:58:33.800 and

00:58:34.040 sure

00:58:34.380 there's

00:58:34.600 some

00:58:34.720 of

00:58:34.780 that

00:58:34.880 I'm

00:58:34.980 not

00:58:35.140 denying

00:58:35.620 that

00:58:35.820 at

00:58:35.900 all

00:58:36.060 but

00:58:36.420 I guess

00:58:36.740 Will and

00:58:37.440 Grace

00:58:37.600 comes out

00:58:38.040 in

00:58:38.140 1998

00:58:38.720 Barack

00:58:39.820 Obama

00:58:40.240 lights

00:58:40.560 the

00:58:40.720 White

00:58:40.900 House

00:58:41.100 up

00:58:41.340 in

00:58:41.520 a

00:58:41.780 rainbow

00:58:42.020 flag

00:58:42.480 Joe

00:58:43.000 Biden

00:58:43.340 hangs

00:58:43.820 a

00:58:44.060 big

00:58:44.220 rainbow

00:58:44.560 flag

00:58:45.060 on

00:58:45.540 the

00:58:45.680 portico

00:58:46.000 of

00:58:46.120 the

00:58:46.220 White

00:58:46.420 House

00:58:46.660 you

00:58:47.940 got

00:58:48.140 the

00:58:48.300 conservative

00:58:48.740 on

00:58:48.980 the

00:58:49.120 Supreme

00:58:49.440 Court

00:58:49.800 who's

00:58:50.280 coming

00:58:50.520 out

00:58:50.820 and

00:58:51.240 you

00:58:51.980 know

00:58:52.200 redefining

00:58:53.340 Title

00:58:53.860 7

00:58:54.180 to

00:58:54.380 include

00:58:54.660 transgenderism

00:58:55.440 this

00:58:55.980 is

00:58:56.200 definitely

00:58:57.160 a lot

00:58:57.600 more

00:58:57.820 pro

00:58:58.140 LGBT

00:58:58.600 today

00:58:59.180 than

00:58:59.420 we

00:58:59.580 were

00:58:59.780 30

00:59:00.080 years

00:59:00.380 ago

00:59:00.660 so

00:59:01.040 I guess

00:59:01.280 even

00:59:01.940 if

00:59:02.080 you

00:59:02.200 couldn't

00:59:02.460 eradicate

00:59:03.380 unhappiness

00:59:04.180 among

00:59:04.440 LGBT

00:59:04.920 identifying

00:59:05.420 people

00:59:05.840 just

00:59:06.380 wouldn't

00:59:07.080 you

00:59:07.200 expect

00:59:07.580 the

00:59:07.800 rates

00:59:08.120 to

00:59:08.520 have

00:59:08.960 declined

00:59:09.380 precipitously

00:59:10.160 or

00:59:10.760 even

00:59:11.000 to

00:59:11.180 have

00:59:11.300 declined

00:59:11.680 at

00:59:12.000 all

00:59:12.340 and

00:59:12.720 isn't

00:59:12.980 the

00:59:13.100 fact

00:59:13.240 that

00:59:13.360 they

00:59:13.500 haven't

00:59:13.900 declined

00:59:14.200 and

00:59:14.360 in

00:59:18.740 about

00:59:18.980 the

00:59:19.120 identity

00:59:19.520 itself

00:59:20.100 and

00:59:20.360 not

00:59:20.600 just

00:59:21.040 the

00:59:21.520 mean

00:59:21.660 old

00:59:21.800 people

00:59:21.980 like

00:59:22.140 Johnny

00:59:22.360 here

00:59:22.540 no

00:59:23.620 what

00:59:23.800 I

00:59:23.860 would

00:59:23.980 say

00:59:24.160 here

00:59:24.380 is

00:59:24.520 this

00:59:24.740 definitely

00:59:25.160 think

00:59:25.480 the

00:59:25.680 cultural

00:59:26.040 changes

00:59:26.420 have

00:59:26.640 been

00:59:26.880 good

00:59:27.260 and

00:59:27.480 I

00:59:27.580 would

00:59:27.680 love

00:59:27.800 to

00:59:27.940 see

00:59:28.060 more

00:59:28.340 but

00:59:28.740 I

00:59:28.840 do

00:59:28.960 think

00:59:29.120 this

00:59:29.280 is

00:59:29.380 probably

00:59:29.680 one

00:59:29.900 of

00:59:30.000 the

00:59:30.080 areas

00:59:30.400 the

00:59:30.700 left

00:59:31.040 has

00:59:31.240 gotten

00:59:31.460 this

00:59:31.640 wrong

00:59:31.920 that

00:59:32.100 we

00:59:32.200 think

00:59:32.440 that

00:59:32.600 just

00:59:32.840 by

00:59:33.100 having

00:59:33.480 culture

00:59:34.140 change

00:59:34.680 for

00:59:34.920 LGBT

00:59:35.240 inclusion

00:59:35.640 that

00:59:35.840 that

00:59:35.860 is

00:59:36.100 going

00:59:36.260 to

00:59:36.500 all

00:59:37.040 of

00:59:37.140 make

00:59:48.740 being

00:59:49.040 an

00:59:49.200 LGBT

00:59:49.500 person

00:59:49.940 I

00:59:50.160 have

00:59:50.300 seen

00:59:50.540 that

00:59:50.700 when

00:59:50.840 I

00:59:50.940 traveled

00:59:51.280 in

00:59:51.480 the

00:59:51.580 South

00:59:51.780 and

00:59:52.540 the

00:59:52.900 levels

00:59:53.180 of

00:59:53.360 homophobia

00:59:53.760 and

00:59:53.940 transphobia

00:59:54.400 are

00:59:54.620 still

00:59:54.960 remarkably

00:59:55.480 high

00:59:55.800 so

00:59:56.340 you

00:59:56.500 can't

00:59:56.760 just

00:59:56.940 change

00:59:57.340 culture

00:59:57.760 by

00:59:58.180 lighting

00:59:58.700 up

00:59:58.920 the

00:59:59.120 white

00:59:59.360 house

00:59:59.680 in

01:00:00.060 a

01:00:00.160 rainbow

01:00:00.360 flag

01:00:00.680 it

01:00:00.860 takes

01:00:01.120 a lot

01:00:01.840 more

01:00:02.040 than

01:00:02.200 that

01:00:03.040 yeah

01:00:03.560 but

01:00:03.680 what

01:00:03.800 about

01:00:03.940 the

01:00:04.060 ones

01:00:04.240 in

01:00:04.360 the

01:00:04.480 north

01:00:04.760 I

01:00:04.980 guess

01:00:05.200 I

01:00:05.600 don't

01:00:05.720 mean

01:00:05.840 to

01:00:05.960 belabor

01:00:06.240 the

01:00:06.400 point

01:00:06.560 I'm

01:00:06.700 not

01:00:07.040 saying

01:00:07.260 that

01:00:07.600 depression

01:00:09.000 would

01:00:09.260 be

01:00:09.720 obliterated

01:00:11.120 I'm

01:00:11.260 just

01:00:11.380 saying

01:00:11.560 shouldn't

01:00:12.740 they

01:00:13.540 be

01:00:13.720 happier

01:00:14.060 if it

01:00:14.440 was

01:00:14.520 all

01:00:14.680 social

01:00:14.980 shouldn't

01:00:15.240 they

01:00:15.340 be

01:00:15.420 but

01:00:15.580 they're

01:00:15.700 not

01:00:15.860 happier

01:00:16.200 so

01:00:16.600 happy

01:00:19.000 queer

01:00:19.280 people

01:00:19.600 yeah

01:00:19.900 I

01:00:20.360 see a lot

01:00:20.760 listen

01:00:21.100 I'm a

01:00:21.380 New Yorker

01:00:21.820 Brandon

01:00:22.120 and I've

01:00:22.460 seen

01:00:22.740 they're not

01:00:24.740 the happiest

01:00:25.160 people up

01:00:25.700 there

01:00:25.840 I don't

01:00:26.080 know

01:00:26.180 we have

01:00:28.560 to let

01:00:28.940 all of

01:00:29.800 you go

01:00:30.140 I very

01:00:30.840 much want

01:00:31.280 to have

01:00:31.540 you all

01:00:31.820 back

01:00:32.080 to debate

01:00:32.480 this

01:00:32.660 some

01:00:32.800 more

01:00:33.000 Johnny

01:00:34.600 Brandon

01:00:35.240 and Reverend

01:00:35.880 Alexander

01:00:36.260 I want

01:00:36.900 to say

01:00:37.120 thank you

01:00:37.580 gentlemen

01:00:38.020 but I'm

01:00:38.700 also going

01:00:39.140 to include

01:00:39.640 thank you

01:00:40.540 gentle

01:00:40.980 they

01:00:41.220 them

01:00:41.600 for

01:00:42.120 Alexander

01:00:43.960 I really

01:00:44.840 appreciate

01:00:45.280 your coming

01:00:45.740 on for

01:00:46.120 this

01:00:46.300 conversation

01:00:46.920 look forward

01:00:47.740 to seeing

01:00:48.060 you all

01:00:48.440 for the

01:00:48.760 next

01:00:48.940 one

01:00:49.200 thank you

01:00:50.680 so much

01:00:51.040 thank you

01:00:51.700 so much

01:00:52.100 thank you

01:00:52.960 did you

01:01:00.120 know that

01:01:00.380 over 85%

01:01:01.160 of grass

01:01:01.560 fed beef

01:01:01.980 sold in

01:01:02.400 U.S.

01:01:02.760 grocery

01:01:03.000 stores

01:01:03.360 is imported

01:01:04.040 that's why

01:01:05.140 I buy

01:01:05.460 all my

01:01:05.940 meat

01:01:06.160 from

01:01:06.340 goodranchers

01:01:06.960 dot com

01:01:07.500 instead

01:01:07.880 goodranchers

01:01:08.860 products

01:01:09.180 are 100%

01:01:09.900 born

01:01:10.300 raised

01:01:10.760 and harvested

01:01:11.300 right here

01:01:11.920 in the

01:01:12.100 USA

01:01:12.400 from local

01:01:13.060 family farms

01:01:13.760 plus there's

01:01:14.600 no antibiotics

01:01:15.440 ever

01:01:15.900 no added

01:01:16.560 hormones

01:01:16.940 and no

01:01:17.600 seed oils

01:01:18.080 just one

01:01:18.820 simple

01:01:19.120 ingredient

01:01:19.560 that's

01:01:20.100 meat

01:01:20.380 best of

01:01:21.140 all

01:01:21.320 goodranchers

01:01:21.880 deliver

01:01:22.120 straight to

01:01:22.560 your door

01:01:22.900 for added

01:01:23.320 convenience

01:01:23.900 so lock

01:01:24.660 in a

01:01:24.860 secure

01:01:25.100 supply

01:01:25.480 of

01:01:25.640 American

01:01:25.960 meat

01:01:26.200 today

01:01:26.520 subscribe

01:01:27.080 now

01:01:27.440 at

01:01:27.580 goodranchers

01:01:28.080 dot com

01:01:28.520 and get

01:01:28.720 free

01:01:28.920 meat

01:01:29.080 for

01:01:29.200 life

01:01:29.480 and

01:01:29.900 $40

01:01:30.200 off

01:01:30.640 with

01:01:30.800 code

01:01:31.080 daily

01:01:31.420 wire

01:01:31.700 that's

01:01:32.140 $40

01:01:32.380 off

01:01:32.880 and free

01:01:33.220 meat

01:01:33.380 for

01:01:33.500 life

The Michael Knowles Show - March 16, 2025

Gay Church？ HEATED Religion Debate With Michael Knowles

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