The Tucker Carlson Show - Ex-CIA Agent Speaks Out： JFK, 9-11, UAPs, MLK, MKUltra & Everything Trump Is Hiding

00:00:00.000 thanks a lot for doing this how long were you at cia i joined the cia in 2013 i was in the

00:00:11.120 state department before that private sector i served as second ranger battalion before that

00:00:14.880 second ranger battalion state department cia when did you leave cia i retired on 30 june

00:00:20.760 so real recently month ago yep yep um last year you became a whistleblower

00:00:29.300 It was before last year, but yes.

00:00:31.420 I think it started long before last year

00:00:34.140 and had to do with vaccine mandates,

00:00:35.580 which is a separate topic from COVID origins, but yes.

00:00:40.860 You first came to my attention anyway,

00:00:43.400 and thank you for fighting vaccine mandates,

00:00:45.640 one of the most evil things this country's ever done.

00:00:49.220 But COVID origins, you went very public,

00:00:52.100 you testified in the Congress.

00:00:54.220 Why did you decide to do that?

00:00:56.420 Well, there's a subpoena.

00:00:57.300 That helps make a decision process.

00:01:00.520 So, no, but in all honesty, I came forward and I had done a transcribed interview for six hours and 40 minutes behind closed doors with the Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee.

00:01:13.040 when it looked like that the cia was obstructing our investigation when it looked like um

00:01:20.840 every obstacle was being put in place um when the subpoena came i was frankly i was happy to go

00:01:27.500 i was happy to to speak publicly but then you become i mean you're in a different category

00:01:33.220 once you do that i think um that's a big decision isn't it it is it is you know i i had i hate to

00:01:42.160 said, I had some practice with the COVID vaccine mandates. And frankly, you know, maybe we'll be

00:01:47.560 touching on this earlier, but that story that came out publicly on May 13th in front of Senator

00:01:55.140 Rand Paul's committee, I had passed that story to the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence

00:02:01.840 in April of 2024. I'd also given it to the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence,

00:02:09.080 two oversight bodies in 2023.

00:02:11.960 And the first time I came

00:02:13.180 and spoke to the House Permanent Select Committee

00:02:15.740 on Intelligence on COVID Origins

00:02:18.760 was actually in November of 2021.

00:02:21.360 Now the story was a little different then,

00:02:23.260 but I came forward multiple times

00:02:24.940 trying to let them know that we were being lied to.

00:02:30.400 So those two committees,

00:02:32.420 you pronounced their,

00:02:33.400 I mean, you spelled out their formal names,

00:02:35.640 but just the House and Senate Intel Committees,

00:02:37.220 the Oversight Committees.

00:02:37.860 Oversight Committees.

00:02:38.460 This is the legislative branch's oversight of the most powerful, arguably the most powerful agencies in the government, which have very little civilian control, particularly CIA.

00:02:47.560 I think there are only, what, three appointees at CIA?

00:02:49.980 I believe three appointees, which is, in my opinion, not enough.

00:02:53.520 Oh, well, it's totally crazy because it means whoever's elected by the public doesn't have any control over this agency, which I think is proven true.

00:03:01.280 But anyway, the control is supposed to come from the Congress in the form of these two committees.

00:03:07.300 so when you tell them something really rotten is happening in cia where you work

00:03:12.880 you expect they're going to do something about it i did and i think covid opened my eyes um i was

00:03:19.780 naive i was uh i was an operations officer so i didn't i most of the time i spent most of my time

00:03:26.100 out in the field uh collecting intelligence recruiting spies that was my job i was not an

00:03:31.500 analyst i was not collecting other people's intelligence and turning it into finished

00:03:35.860 intelligence. And I was a bit naive about the process. You're doing the traditional work. When

00:03:40.520 people hear the term CIA, they think of what you were doing for a living. Yes. Which is not what

00:03:45.100 most people there do. Correct. Correct. Um, you know, the director of operations does the,

00:03:50.600 conducts the operations for the agency. We collect the intelligence and, and this is why this whole

00:03:55.500 living in foreign countries. Correct. You know, I, I was gifted many things, uh, from the agency. 1.00

00:04:01.040 I was gifted Mandarin language training, Arabic language training.

00:04:05.820 I could use some brush up on Arabic, but my Mandarin is still pretty good.

00:04:11.160 And they give us a lot of authority to live and work overseas.

00:04:14.960 I love the job.

00:04:15.840 I love the job.

00:04:16.540 And despite everything that's happened, I actually still think if you're a motivated,

00:04:23.420 critical thinker, you should try and get into the director of operations.

00:04:29.020 It is a fun job.

00:04:30.240 It's a good job.

00:04:31.040 I tried to get in for that exact reason.

00:04:33.240 Probably never should have admitted that

00:04:34.480 because I've been accused of being a tool to CIA ever since,

00:04:36.520 which I'm not.

00:04:38.420 I think this interview will make it clear I'm not.

00:04:40.280 But for that reason,

00:04:41.360 I thought it sounded like a very interesting job.

00:04:43.500 It's great.

00:04:44.340 You don't think about the politics.

00:04:45.780 There's no politics in the field.

00:04:47.640 It's about,

00:04:48.620 it's such a small group of people

00:04:50.500 that you get to come back and talk to

00:04:52.080 about what you're doing.

00:04:52.980 So if you're in the office,

00:04:53.800 you come back and you're like,

00:04:54.680 hey, I collected this intelligence.

00:04:56.220 I recruited this spy.

00:04:57.420 I did this operational act.

00:04:59.220 um the only people who can cheer you on are this is that small fraternity right of people and so

00:05:05.560 it's it's a special it's it was a blessing and a gift everything good in my life was touched by

00:05:11.940 working at the CIA which is why COVID woke me up to sort of the mess I mean we're supposed to be

00:05:18.360 and people laugh when I say you're not living in McLean Virginia at headquarters near our

00:05:21.940 headquarter you're like abroad right for a lot of this time oh most of my career yeah it was abroad

00:05:26.020 was abroad and um i loved it i finally came back to headquarters uh in 2019 uh right before covet

00:05:34.820 and being a cia case officer or even any intelligence officer your job and people

00:05:43.060 are gonna laugh especially when you say cia our job is truth so we go out we we go into this sea

00:05:51.080 of misinformation, lies, different types of motives. And we're supposed to pull out that

00:05:58.000 little tiny nugget of truth, write it up and present it to policymakers so that they can make

00:06:02.720 wise decisions in the most altruistic way. That is what we're supposed to do. And what COVID revealed

00:06:09.080 was most of us don't. Most of the agency, they lost their sense of discernment. They gave up on

00:06:18.040 taking a hard look at what was happening all around them and i i i could not believe i mean

00:06:24.500 i was running um work on financial intelligence against strategic rivals and i had an office i

00:06:32.920 was running two big branches and um i had like seven people who'd come to my office every day

00:06:39.240 and like we're not crazy this we're not crazy this this masking this thing where they want to

00:06:44.800 test us all the time like this shot we're not crazy this doesn't seem right um and that was

00:06:51.600 that's what started me down the road um there's a few other things before that it was a you know

00:06:56.340 a few other things before that that uh opened my eyes but um i'm also a slow learner i mean i spent

00:07:01.760 some time in the middle east looking at dumpster fires saying well you know i know we didn't

00:07:07.600 actually get this done but thank god we're here for democracy so i mean i i own that you believe

00:07:12.680 that i did i did for a long time i i no longer um i think that we probably should take a good

00:07:18.560 hard look at the decisions we're making on foreign policy and i think um that whole thing about no

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00:08:43.840 So you come out in this,

00:08:46.840 let's just start with your testimony

00:08:48.920 before Rand Paul's committee about COVID origins.

00:08:52.160 So just point blank, where did COVID come from,

00:08:54.320 do you believe?

00:08:55.240 It was a lab incident.

00:08:56.480 It was a lab incident in Wuhan.

00:08:59.240 And it spread from, it was already,

00:09:02.500 the cat was already out of the bag.

00:09:04.580 I think if I, you know,

00:09:06.020 people look at my public testimony,

00:09:07.520 I'm convinced that the intelligence community could have made a pretty sound assessment by mid-2020 that there was a significant chance that this was some variety of lab incident that occurred that caused this pandemic.

00:09:26.300 And a lab incident changes how we view public health, public health policy.

00:09:33.700 So if it's a natural incident, I have a feeling, you know, if Americans, and I said this during

00:09:41.140 the testimony, if Americans knew that the basis for the vaccines, for example, came

00:09:48.260 from a nucleotide sequence that was given to us by the Chinese government, and we just

00:09:53.100 took it, put it into a computer model and said, well, here's our, here's our vaccine.

00:09:57.740 And people are like, but didn't you just say it came from some lab in China and Wuhan?

00:10:02.800 they probably would be a little more hesitant

00:10:04.980 to put that in their body.

00:10:06.840 I personally think any new technology is unwise to...

00:10:10.640 That's confirmed.

00:10:12.560 Yeah, yeah.

00:10:14.020 Oh, yeah.

00:10:14.700 We got, I think it was, I forget the exact date.

00:10:17.260 It was early January.

00:10:18.200 The nucleotide sequence was sent from the Chinese CDC

00:10:22.180 over to, I believe it was our CDC,

00:10:24.240 but it was sent over to the health establishment

00:10:26.380 here in the United States.

00:10:27.300 We took that and it was put into a computer modeling.

00:10:30.520 I mean, my guess is there was probably a lot of previous work done on COVID.

00:10:38.000 So, sorry, on coronavirus research.

00:10:41.600 I should be precise on that.

00:10:43.700 There's all sorts of coronaviruses that we've been looking at over the years.

00:10:47.580 There was a famous outbreak, of course, in Asia.

00:10:51.600 So, do you believe that the virus just escaped from the lab, the famous lab in Wuhan?

00:10:58.880 Do you think it was an accident?

00:11:00.520 I think that we need more data from the CIA to actually fill out what Director Gabbard was doing.

00:11:09.300 But yes, I think that it escaped from a lab in Wuhan, and it spread everywhere.

00:11:17.440 Inadvertently.

00:11:18.360 Inadvertently, I think. I think.

00:11:20.400 There's no direct evidence right now that says, yes, they did it deliberately.

00:11:27.800 Well, that's quite a hedged answer.

00:11:29.480 There's no direct evidence right now that they did it deliberately.

00:11:32.360 So the possibility exists.

00:11:34.300 Possibility exists because, I mean, I'd love to give you a direct answer.

00:11:38.080 Right.

00:11:38.280 But the CIA would have had to have given the information that was requested from Director Gabbard's Directors Initiatives Group.

00:11:45.520 That probably could have cleared everything up.

00:11:47.460 We, when I conduct an investigation, actually an intelligence operation, if I'm going after a target, first thing I do is put together a timeline.

00:11:56.060 Okay, a timeline of events, known things about the target that we're investigating.

00:12:01.740 If I don't have everything that goes in that timeline, I can't give you a full answer.

00:12:08.020 And, well, CIA simply refused to provide the information.

00:12:12.420 And it was obvious early in the outbreak that this was from the lab.

00:12:18.240 I mean, there were Chinese researchers who said it and then subsequently, as you know, disappeared.

00:12:23.260 but people were saying this from february of 2020 yeah and um and it always seemed likely to me

00:12:31.140 but the u.s government from the very beginning went along with this pangolin lie

00:12:36.280 yeah and then subsequent to that even when it became obvious that it was a lie

00:12:41.180 we were describing continued the cover-up why

00:12:44.960 well um part of the reason i mean fauci is part of that reason and you know i'm going

00:12:53.240 going to be very blunt about it. And since I'm going to be blunt and also give my opinion,

00:12:58.260 you know, when I was sitting in front of the Senate, I want to make sure I was very accurate

00:13:02.940 in everything I said. I don't want to give some supposition, but I will give a little supposition

00:13:06.720 here as well. Because, you know, I have a brain, I think, you know, I've got synapses that fire off.

00:13:13.420 And occasionally when I see data, I don't, you know, if it looked, yeah, quacks like a duck. 0.99

00:13:19.820 right so um i think anthony fauci was fully aware that um the funding that had gone on for various

00:13:28.800 types of dangerous research dangerous gain-of-function research had been going on for a

00:13:33.240 very long time okay different viruses different bacteria and um you know there are i see connections

00:13:41.980 to for for good good reasons as well biodefense i see connections to to to research that goes on

00:13:48.660 but um i think they understood that a house of cards was going to fall down if this if this got

00:13:55.520 out too quickly that that there was a distinct possibility that american know-how american

00:14:01.720 expertise i mean we really do i mean i take a look at some of the scientists that the

00:14:08.820 the ic relies on for for expert advice these people are really really impressive people okay

00:14:16.240 um you know they they uh they receive funding to go do research they're involved in health

00:14:26.240 they're involved in biodefense all of a sudden you've got a virus that looks boy sure there's

00:14:33.100 there's a couple ties that tie the financing over to wuhan china he had to know he had to know what

00:14:41.220 that looks like at the end of the day so instead based on everything that's out there he gets the

00:14:47.700 proximal origins of SARS-CoV-2 written with his buddies that paper gets waved around the IC as the

00:14:54.320 end-all be-all as the paper to prove that yes it's it's a zoonotic origin and he had to know

00:15:02.280 when he's pushing these type of experts a variety of experts that he pushed towards the IC

00:15:07.380 once in February of 2020 and again in June of 2021,

00:15:13.000 he pushes those experts in.

00:15:15.840 He wants to ensure that narrative is pushed at the IC level.

00:15:21.140 And unfortunately, I'm going back to the comment I made before,

00:15:26.260 some people just appeared to swallow hook, line, and sinker.

00:15:30.940 There was actually, I read an email where a very senior person,

00:15:34.540 And I, I wish I could name names, but a very senior person waved that, basically waved that paper around and said, well, we've got our answer. That was somebody who was in a position to, to sort of influence, not sort of, in a position to influence how the IC looked at SARS-CoV-2.

00:15:53.180 Why are they covering it up now? Fauci's gone, new administration.

00:15:56.600 i think that um there's an embarrassment piece again i think you know you don't want to be caught

00:16:03.900 with your pants down i think that um you don't want to be caught at all covering up from a global

00:16:09.300 pandemic that killed hundreds of thousands of people yeah so there's i think um i think see

00:16:16.140 and hold on let me be very clear about who doesn't want to be caught with their their pants down

00:16:20.720 causing a global pandemic um very the senior people within um dni's um

00:16:29.680 the part of the dni that's responsible for looking into wmd matters and bioweapons matters

00:16:37.140 and the weapons encounter proliferation center over at the cia there's very senior people over

00:16:41.540 there that had a heavy hand in what happened and it's not the analyst like the the technical

00:16:49.560 analysts that were were pushing saying hey listen guys this looks like this is a lab leak their

00:16:55.200 careers were destroyed for pushing it this is the story that i really want to make sure gets out i

00:17:00.360 want to correct the record they were not bribed there was this there was a number of analysts

00:17:06.060 inside the cia and they did everything in their power to include writing a little dissent email

00:17:12.720 that went all the way up to the top of wcpmc saying hey listen guys we're technical experts

00:17:18.260 and i'm paraphrasing obviously we have this much expertise and it's it looks like a lab leak

00:17:25.380 their careers were destroyed after that they weren't no longer part of that establishment

00:17:30.380 and um if there's ever uh so the entire leadership of ca swung behind this lie

00:17:36.980 that it was from an animal yeah and why are they still doing it well because because i well tell

00:17:46.820 what when the cia produces the documents that were requested to help finish the investigation i think

00:17:52.640 we'll have a better answer on but how can cia get away with not producing those documents or

00:17:57.660 documents from the kennedy assassination 63 years ago which they also haven't produced as you know

00:18:01.680 how who allows that to happen oh that's a that's a packed question there's a few pieces to that

00:18:08.700 so senior managers allow it to happen inside the cia um and oversight to some extent lets it well

00:18:16.400 oversight has failed clearly over the years i'm not criticizing right now i just want to be clear

00:18:22.080 i'm not i think actually rick crawford is on it right now i'm definitely he'd be the member of

00:18:27.220 congress who oversees the house in telco yes yes so historically they've abdicated their their role

00:18:34.840 in oversight let me give you an example i want to give you a very clear example when i was a young

00:18:40.480 officer, you know, not a young officer, but, you know, I had earned my stripes, done my work,

00:18:46.760 and I was going to do my first meeting with a liaison service. Now, most of the time it's like,

00:18:52.600 good luck, buddy. Yeah. Have fun. I actually had a senior officer pull me aside. He said,

00:18:57.820 listen, here's how this would be a foreign intel service. So this is where you get declared to the

00:19:02.080 foreign intel service. You're no longer hiding from everybody. And you're working together on

00:19:06.940 goals that are, you both care about, hopefully. And, um, he said, listen, this isn't going to

00:19:13.140 go well. Here's how this is going to happen. Here's what I need you to do. He did what rarely

00:19:17.240 happens for CIA ops officers. He trained the junior officer on how to handle the meeting.

00:19:22.640 I was so grateful. Years later, and I love the guy, um, years later, he disagrees with me,

00:19:30.400 by the way, on just about everything of substance, but he's a great officer.

00:19:33.300 and um he pulls me aside i had gotten a job where i was interacting with oversight on a very regular

00:19:41.280 basis my job was to ensure that the things that were coming from the cia that were going over to

00:19:46.680 oversight were truthful honest we were we were producing things that was valuable for them to

00:19:53.400 actually do their job so and i never really done that kind of work i dealt with oversight before

00:19:59.640 He says, here's how oversight works.

00:20:02.100 Take, for example, we are supposed to report all of the organizations that have human rights abuses that we work with.

00:20:13.240 I mean, the CIA works with bad people.

00:20:14.980 That happens.

00:20:15.720 It's by statute we're allowed to do that.

00:20:17.880 But we have to report it.

00:20:19.020 We have to make sure that they know.

00:20:20.900 So we give them a list.

00:20:21.780 And I don't know if it's quarterly or every other year or whatever it is, but there's a report that comes out.

00:20:26.400 and he said if he was explained to me let's say somebody on the other side of the table says hey

00:20:32.420 this service here i don't like this i don't want you working with this service um so he says how

00:20:40.660 do you handle that i'm like i don't know you tell me he goes you say well just tell us to stop and

00:20:46.820 the meaning is we know that you can tell us to stop but you got to get everybody else to tell

00:20:52.480 to stop and if if we keep doing it you got to get everybody else to pull the purse strings

00:20:56.660 and that never happens so like you should just tell us to stop doing it then

00:21:01.120 it's become a kabuki dance in my opinion a kabuki dance i sat in an oversight meeting that was

00:21:08.620 three years after a a huge failure happened and they're asking the people sitting on the other

00:21:15.860 side the other people are talking to the the agency officers they're like has anyone been

00:21:20.900 held accountable for something that happened three years prior and uh the agency lawyer

00:21:25.980 leans in and says we're holding the system accountable so unless just how are we doing that

00:21:34.880 i uh i don't i don't well if they're holding the system accountable they need some work because

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00:23:32.640 ontario.ca tnc supply um where does tom cotton who is the senator who chairs the senate select

00:23:40.960 Committee on Intelligence. Where does he

00:23:43.000 fit into all this? Well, I think he's a chair

00:23:44.980 leader for everything we do. He has no role

00:23:47.060 in oversight. I think he's a complete

00:23:48.880 chair leader. And I'll give you a very good example.

00:23:51.220 I'll provide you a couple documents

00:23:53.120 here. After my

00:23:54.900 hearing, Senator

00:23:57.100 Rand Paul sent another subpoena

00:23:58.640 over to the ODNI

00:24:00.640 saying, we need all of this information.

00:24:03.640 I'll leave it with you.

00:24:05.200 We want it. Well,

00:24:07.200 Director Gabbard leaves. Balte

00:24:08.840 takes over.

00:24:10.960 And Pulte gets a letter from Senator Tom Cotton's team saying, hey, listen, here's what you need to understand.

00:24:22.700 Sissy maintains oversight responsibility.

00:24:26.580 Sissy's the Senate Intelligence Committee.

00:24:28.040 Sorry, Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.

00:24:29.560 We maintain primacy on oversight for these sort of matters.

00:24:35.540 And so, hey, Pulte, make sure.

00:24:38.020 Make sure that you consult us before you decide to give anything over to them.

00:24:42.260 Okay, and not only that, I said that I had done a six-hour and 40-minute transcribed interview in a skiff in March of this year for his GAC.

00:24:51.440 Republicans and Democrats were both there.

00:24:53.340 Well, let me clarify that.

00:24:55.180 The Democrat tried to leave, but I insisted that he stay.

00:24:59.140 Now, I finished that transcribed interview.

00:25:02.160 They won't give it back.

00:25:03.420 they won't give it back to his gag sissy will not his gag is the sorry the homeland security

00:25:10.360 government affairs committee the one that ran paul's on and ron johnson's on uh i think some

00:25:15.320 of the democrats around are fetterman a few others um wouldn't know they didn't show up to the

00:25:20.200 hearing um so you know sissy's saying you can't have your own transcribed interview

00:25:28.500 Sissy saying, we are the ones who have primacy over oversight over the Intel community, but they're not doing oversight.

00:25:37.400 And how do I know they're not doing oversight?

00:25:39.040 I've already sort of mentioned it.

00:25:41.040 I went to Sissy in April of 2024, and I told them a story about six of seven technical experts saying COVID origins, you know, COVID originated in a lab incident.

00:25:53.340 And they did nothing with it in 2024.

00:25:55.340 So of course Tom Cotton doesn't want somebody else digging into it because it probably just exposes the failure of their oversight.

00:26:02.640 Tom Cotton is so clearly a tool of CIA.

00:26:05.740 Oh, yeah.

00:26:06.380 Yeah, I mean, as far as I can tell, that guy, he's there to make sure that he protects the CIA.

00:26:11.180 But that's the opposite of what the job entails.

00:26:14.300 That is exactly the opposite, yes.

00:26:17.320 Now, his wife worked at CIA as an analyst in Langley.

00:26:20.280 I don't know, but I believe you know.

00:26:22.000 And that is correct.

00:26:23.480 I've talked to her about it.

00:26:24.820 And so I'm not blaming him.

00:26:27.860 She's very nice.

00:26:28.540 I'm not attacking his wife, just to be clear.

00:26:30.440 But that's a pretty close relationship

00:26:33.800 for someone who's going to be in charge of oversight

00:26:36.240 of that same agency.

00:26:37.260 Yeah, it's sort of like Fauci having his wife

00:26:39.760 in charge of bioethics.

00:26:41.240 That's an interesting little relationship.

00:26:43.260 Right, so that's just, again,

00:26:44.320 I'm not accusing Mrs. Cotton of anything.

00:26:46.560 She's a nice person, and I think she's left CIA.

00:26:48.800 But the point is, that's weird.

00:26:50.880 and then Cotton's reflexive defense of CIA

00:26:55.960 against everybody,

00:26:57.580 including the Office of the Director

00:26:58.600 of National Intelligence,

00:26:59.740 is very, very striking.

00:27:02.020 And his impulse always is to hide more from the public.

00:27:06.060 That isn't what we voted for.

00:27:07.460 I'm very aware of that.

00:27:09.040 And you have to,

00:27:09.760 and of course he's a very weird guy.

00:27:12.880 I don't know him.

00:27:14.220 Let me just say again,

00:27:15.480 he's a very weird guy.

00:27:16.520 And almost everybody I know on those committees,

00:27:19.700 I know a bunch of members,

00:27:20.560 I mean, Dan Crenshaw was on the House Intel Committee.

00:27:24.840 So it's like, what is going on here?

00:27:27.700 It feels like the IC, CIA probably taking the lead on this controls these people.

00:27:34.900 How do they do that?

00:27:37.040 You know, I hate to say this, but we've squandered a historic opportunity.

00:27:43.700 And Director Radcliffe and Deputy Director Michael Ellis,

00:27:48.520 I think when history looks back,

00:27:51.200 they're going to say that they were the worst leadership team

00:27:53.860 the CIA could have gotten.

00:27:55.140 Of course.

00:27:55.820 And it's not because they're,

00:27:57.800 it's because of what they're not doing.

00:27:59.320 They have an opportunity for reform,

00:28:01.460 but they've kept all the same people

00:28:03.300 that were involved in covering up COVID,

00:28:05.900 covering up Havana syndrome.

00:28:07.260 They're all sitting in senior positions.

00:28:09.720 And why would Trump,

00:28:11.200 so Radcliffe has been in contact with John Brennan, right?

00:28:15.640 And I've heard that.

00:28:16.680 Do you believe that's true?

00:28:17.440 I believe that's true.

00:28:18.420 Right.

00:28:19.160 So Brennan is a sworn enemy of Trump.

00:28:21.820 So why would you ever in a million years, and Trump has said a million times, I hate

00:28:26.620 John Radcliffe, stripped him of his security clearance.

00:28:28.720 Why would you put a guy he's in contact with in charge of CIA?

00:28:33.220 Like, what the hell is that?

00:28:35.380 I don't know.

00:28:36.720 I don't know.

00:28:37.400 But what I hear-

00:28:37.880 Do you think that's weird?

00:28:38.560 I think it's very weird.

00:28:39.700 It's very weird.

00:28:40.680 It's very weird.

00:28:41.320 And there's other data points that I think speak to this.

00:28:44.200 John Radcliffe

00:28:46.620 take the Trump-Russia collusion documents

00:28:48.500 that Director Gabbard released in

00:28:50.180 was it late July 2025

00:28:51.980 so those documents were

00:28:54.540 damning I mean it's treason

00:28:56.440 what they were trying to do 0.99

00:28:57.560 it was like and I read the

00:29:00.160 unredacted documents I read the documents

00:29:02.500 if this is our story we're sticking to it

00:29:04.760 okay you can't unread that

00:29:06.600 and then go away

00:29:08.400 thinking boy good thing we've got great

00:29:10.220 leadership at the IC

00:29:11.940 so that's all real

00:29:14.200 The thing is, Director Radcliffe was Director D&I.

00:29:19.900 He had possession of the documents that were released by Director Gabbard when he was over at the D&I.

00:29:25.100 Right.

00:29:25.700 He could have released them.

00:29:27.640 He could have released them when he was at D&I.

00:29:29.440 Maybe he was scared.

00:29:30.660 I mean, I could.

00:29:31.820 But Trump, he ran D&I in the first Trump term.

00:29:40.180 So, Trump knew this.

00:29:42.680 Everyone knew that.

00:29:43.480 that John Radcliffe is also, by the way,

00:29:47.240 loyal to a foreign power, I would say.

00:29:49.680 And he's in touch with Trump's enemies

00:29:52.160 and he's doing nothing to help Trump

00:29:54.780 on the issues that Trump claims he cares about most.

00:29:56.960 And then the first thing Trump does when he gets elected

00:29:59.200 is appoint that guy director of central intelligence.

00:30:02.960 Like what the hell are we looking at?

00:30:05.620 Yeah, I can't get into President Trump's head on that one.

00:30:09.380 But what I can do is-

00:30:10.420 Can you just affirm again my suspicion 0.99

00:30:12.360 this is like the weirdest thing that's ever happened yeah this is dumb it's flat out dumb 0.97

00:30:16.680 like if if you want to be followed like he's he's proven president trump has proven that there are 0.98

00:30:23.240 people within the federal government that will go to great lengths to destroy people yes if you want

00:30:28.900 to continue him especially him if you want to continue to be destroyed this is exactly what 0.98

00:30:34.480 you do exactly so it's dumb i well dumb at best it sounds like that's the nicest way under duress 0.98

00:30:41.100 to me. I don't know why any person 0.98

00:30:42.980 would do that, especially with someone with

00:30:44.520 finely honed self-preservation instincts,

00:30:46.960 which Trump has. Why would you do that?

00:30:49.260 And I also noticed something else. Tell me if you

00:30:50.900 have, too, that of all the

00:30:52.960 appointees, high-level cabinet secretaries,

00:30:55.860 big appointees in this

00:30:56.780 administration, Ratcliffe has basically

00:30:58.880 received no scrutiny in the press at all.

00:31:01.200 Yeah, neither did Rubio, for the most part.

00:31:03.220 Sorry. Sorry, I wanted to add.

00:31:04.720 Fair. Fair. Thank you.

00:31:08.380 But did you

00:31:09.140 notice that? Of course I noticed it.

00:31:10.680 You're a CIA director.

00:31:12.040 You're one of the most powerful people in the world.

00:31:13.160 It's a giant red flag.

00:31:15.280 It's a giant red flag to me.

00:31:16.400 I'm sorry.

00:31:17.480 You got to have, if you're coming into one of those positions, I want, it doesn't matter who's in charge.

00:31:22.880 I expect controversy.

00:31:24.440 I want an argument over it.

00:31:26.100 I want to see people get mad about the person that's going to be there.

00:31:29.800 But to this day, most people have no idea who the director of national intelligence is.

00:31:32.880 Right.

00:31:33.240 And he's treated like a head of state when he travels abroad.

00:31:35.040 He runs CIA.

00:31:36.240 We don't know what their budget is.

00:31:37.280 what the i mean it's incredibly powerful agency as you know better than i so and this guy no one

00:31:43.800 says a word about him so that tells me that the american media are at the very least beholden to

00:31:49.960 if not controlled by cia like where are they we're cnn where's the new york times on this

00:31:54.680 where's the washington post yeah i'm glad you mentioned the media because uh the media

00:32:00.540 plays a huge role at this point in in american freedom our future and like take a look at the

00:32:08.700 media blackout even on like i'll personalize it here on may 13th you would have thought every

00:32:14.480 news outlet would want to hear what what was happening behind the scenes during covet fox

00:32:19.620 news was the only one that covered it um and that happens all the time it tells me that the media is

00:32:25.960 controlled the media is controlled by the government this this thing where we've got an

00:32:29.660 independent media it doesn't exist okay and that's a big problem for um government oversight it's a

00:32:36.500 big problem because whistleblowers who go through the system sorry i'm going to pivot just a little

00:32:44.660 here but whistleblowers are essential to holding the system accountable but to honest government

00:32:51.960 to honest government so i can tell you i've i've i've personally walked through the system and it's

00:32:58.180 so broken that now when people come to me and say, should I be a whistleblower? I tell them no.

00:33:04.500 And that's the honest, I say, the only reason you should be a whistleblower is if you're prepared

00:33:09.080 to lose everything. Okay. Cause you're not going to, you're not going to get a gold star when

00:33:14.060 you're done. Okay. It's not going to make it good for you personally. It's not going to be,

00:33:17.920 make it good for you professionally. And if you say, go through the IC system,

00:33:23.200 they continue to investigate themselves and find no wrongdoing if you go to the icig i went to the

00:33:30.920 icig and i tried to get them to intelligence sorry inspector general thank you i apologize

00:33:36.820 no it's all right the internal watchdog yeah the internal watchdog and chris fox by the way i think

00:33:41.700 is another one i should mention specifically i think he's got the the spine to try and get

00:33:47.580 something done to clean things up. And I said that in my testimony. But let's say you go through the

00:33:53.640 whole system and you realize, oh my gosh, the system is broken. What do I do now? Well, that

00:33:59.080 last line of defense, the last line of defense for a free society is a free media. And let's say you

00:34:05.920 want to, you're like, you know what? This is wrong. I have to do something. And you say, I'm going to

00:34:11.740 go to the media well that is that's russian roulette okay and by the way let me be perfectly

00:34:17.620 clear i am not advocating that people with classified information go immediately to the

00:34:22.440 media and just start spouting their mouth off that is not what i'm saying no they should just

00:34:26.120 dump it on the internet that's what i think put it on the blockchain just want to be clear okay

00:34:31.160 i am advocating for that and i do think that people with relevant classified information

00:34:34.860 should disclose it to the public they should they should um but i don't blame any of them for not

00:34:41.020 The system is broken.

00:34:42.340 Christians ought to be safe in the Holy Land of all places, but they are not. 0.99

00:34:46.720 Keep in mind, these are the descendants of the first converts, the first people who followed Jesus, 0.83

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00:34:57.620 And these same people are now facing enormous pressure to leave, fleeing their homes amid war and anti-Christian terrorism.

00:35:05.980 Untold numbers of innocents are lost and without hope, fellow Christians.

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00:35:18.980 We think that's wrong.

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00:35:21.820 And so we've looked far and wide to find a group 1.00

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00:35:29.020 It's called the Vulnerable People Project, VPP.

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00:36:33.560 Thank you.

00:36:34.420 And if you go to the media...

00:36:35.440 So if you go to Jake Tapper,

00:36:36.520 maybe you're not,

00:36:37.240 he's not going to...

00:36:38.000 Yeah. No, he might criticize CIA too much.

00:36:40.200 Yeah. Yeah. You're, you're playing, playing with fire because you could be putting yourself in a

00:36:44.500 lot of trouble. And that, that's, that is an oversight mechanism. The whistleblower system

00:36:49.280 is an oversight mechanism. And that's what, sorry. And that's what I love about Gabbard's

00:36:53.900 release of information. For example, take the Trump Russia collusion documents. She included

00:36:58.700 whistleblower testimony. It's not just straight documents. It also provides a contextual sort of

00:37:04.840 real feel of, not sort of, a real feel of what was happening at the time from a real person.

00:37:12.300 And so, yeah.

00:37:14.120 Do you have any idea why this is the case? Which is to say, do you have any clue how CIA influences

00:37:21.580 the behavior of the Washington Post, the New York Times, CNN, NBC News, the Associated Press,

00:37:29.220 etc my limited window because i like i said i'm a ops officer up until recently all i cared about

00:37:37.020 was stealing secrets right in some foreign country yeah yeah nothing yes to be clear not american

00:37:42.440 secrets i want to ask you about that in a minute but okay um my limited window is there's clearly

00:37:50.720 some preferred outlets that they will go to um i mean i i see some of these things and these are

00:37:57.500 puff pieces these are these are cheerleading pieces uh you know talking about how great things

00:38:02.820 are you know talking about all the things all the reform that's i've seen a few recently the problem

00:38:07.520 with cia i've long thought this is it doesn't get enough money and so congress needs to appropriate

00:38:11.760 more money to say that every piece is like that no right if only if only they could you know they

00:38:17.160 had full funding um right what right which i mean which is a great point you know not only do they

00:38:24.320 not get enough fun no um the funding piece is actually interesting that you mentioned it because

00:38:29.060 it's also sorry this might be a non sequitur but i think it's important part of the the reason we

00:38:35.840 failed is um the patriot act and 9-11 um you know i i was part of the whole system post 9-11

00:38:45.940 i can tell you i never had a time even during continuing resolutions where like if i went to

00:38:51.720 the boss and said, hey boss, I got this great operation going on. You need more money. They

00:38:56.900 always found money for me. And I think, I think, I think we started confusing good managers for

00:39:05.520 good leaders. So after 9-11 Patriot Act opened up a bunch of authorities, a bunch of operations

00:39:12.040 were opened up and you know, the good managers are the ones who could juggle a gazillion different

00:39:17.660 things at once. I, you know, I wish I was one of those people. I was never good at juggling a

00:39:22.260 gazillion things at once. I, you know, I stuck to sort of a handful of things I knew I could

00:39:25.700 accomplish, but the good managers, they could. And they were working in a time where there was

00:39:31.080 a ton of money. We've always had money. We've always had money. And so those good managers

00:39:35.760 who didn't really have to get tested about, Hey, should we do this? Should we save this money for

00:39:41.280 something else? Should we make this moral decision on blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

00:39:44.900 uh they got confused as good leaders so they got they matriculated upwards and they were never

00:39:51.440 really and this is a generalization they were never really tested in terms of moral decisions

00:39:57.500 or decisions that were weighty in terms of like should we continue doing this operation or not so

00:40:05.080 you know and we had chances to be tested how many people spoke up during um the whole enhanced

00:40:12.600 interrogation piece how many people came forward and said hey last i checked that's torture well

00:40:18.560 one did one did and he was destroyed right went to prison he went under the subsequent

00:40:23.220 administration which was the amazing part that's crazy so he came forward during bush but obama got

00:40:28.440 there and john brennan immediately saw that he was indicted and sent to prison and wrecked his life

00:40:33.900 so all these managers who have continued to be moved up they've never had to make a hard moral

00:40:39.860 decision covid heads and you got people saying hey i've got religious rights hey i've got bodily

00:40:44.920 rights hey this is executive overreach and no one knew how to handle that and it proved beyond a

00:40:52.540 shadow of a doubt the management they're not leaders the managers in the cia are not trained

00:40:59.940 to handle conscientious dissent and real moral decisions it for me that was that was it they

00:41:06.480 They failed a test of their humanity, and that opened my eyes.

00:41:15.360 There's an open question.

00:41:17.180 No one asks this question very often, but where does CIA's funding come from?

00:41:21.320 Well, it comes from the Congress in part, but that's not the entirety of its funding, period.

00:41:29.000 But the part that is appropriated is classified, so we don't know exactly what the budget is.

00:41:33.840 how can you

00:41:35.660 and I'm pretty sure

00:41:36.600 the president doesn't know

00:41:37.620 in fact I'm pretty

00:41:38.660 certain the president

00:41:39.500 doesn't know

00:41:39.920 so like

00:41:40.320 how is that

00:41:42.380 civilian control

00:41:43.080 of an agency

00:41:43.720 if no one really knows

00:41:45.640 how much money there is

00:41:47.200 or even where it's coming from

00:41:48.280 it's not

00:41:49.100 you know

00:41:49.420 and there's

00:41:50.020 you know

00:41:52.140 there are reasons

00:41:53.140 why they

00:41:54.000 want to hide budget

00:41:55.080 oh I understand

00:41:55.740 and like

00:41:56.680 I really

00:41:58.280 believe in sources

00:41:59.620 and methods

00:42:00.160 we don't want to see

00:42:00.720 sources dead

00:42:01.340 we don't want to see

00:42:01.900 sensitive methods destroyed

00:42:03.160 but um you know if if the naming conventions for um the various offices at the cia are made

00:42:13.880 so indistinct that outsiders can't understand what they do in that office

00:42:19.820 well um that that's meant to protect the type of operations where there's sources and methods

00:42:26.220 but there's a real question on the oversight piece like how does oversight happen if you

00:42:31.640 can't go what exactly does that office do right there what does it do it's got a weird name where's

00:42:37.320 the money going yeah how why does it need that much money and you also have to ask like is cia

00:42:43.280 doing anything that's so critical to the interest of the united states that you would give up any

00:42:49.660 hope of managing it or having oversight over it that you would allow it to be its own country in

00:42:54.360 the middle of your country the answer is there that shouldn't occur period i mean morally ethically

00:42:59.480 know is it occurring i worry it is oh i think it was definitely occurring there's no question about

00:43:05.640 i mean just i mean yeah i mean from my experience it sure looks like it yeah it sure does and again

00:43:11.560 if we don't even really know there's a big debate which i've listened to carefully about where this

00:43:18.060 money is coming from and again is not all coming from the congress so what um follow the money

00:43:26.480 But how can you, if CIA is running businesses or engaged in business practices as an agency, which it is, it's like, I get that this can all be justified.

00:43:36.840 If I were king for a day, if I were in charge and I wanted to start the process, I totally get this.

00:43:43.260 It's become such a gargantuan problem.

00:43:46.160 Where do you even start?

00:43:47.420 Right.

00:43:47.640 But if I wanted to like make immediate gains on that question, how do we, I would.

00:43:54.220 So the director of CIA, the deputy director of CIA, and it used to be the chief operating officer, they've changed names.

00:43:59.980 They have special authorities to grant no-bid contracts under national security auspices.

00:44:08.460 I would come in and I would start auditing every single one of those contracts that were given out by the director and deputy director, particularly in that little window between administrations.

00:44:20.900 okay once you catch a little bit of wrongdoing it makes a lot easier to justify okay now we're

00:44:26.600 going to start doing the deep dive why don't we take a look at you know the other funding

00:44:30.480 mechanisms that are in play for various type types of uh intelligence work i would definitely

00:44:36.740 i would definitely audit incutel 100 percent incutel needs to have a full audit can you explain

00:44:43.420 for people who don't know what incutel is incutel is uh you know it's it's the venture capital arm

00:44:48.540 that funds all sorts of stuff that um venture capital arm of what of the cia okay i mean i

00:44:55.840 know the answer i just want to make sure that everyone listening understands that cia has its

00:44:59.720 own and i'm quoting you venture capital arm yeah so we thought that's something that happened on

00:45:04.600 like sandhill road and you know northern california but no cia has its own venture firm yeah yeah i

00:45:10.920 I mean, you know, there's real reason

00:45:14.360 to have an insight into things that are tech

00:45:18.680 and things that are about it.

00:45:20.360 There are.

00:45:20.860 There's good reason to have it.

00:45:22.920 But if you're going to do it,

00:45:25.220 if you're going to do it,

00:45:26.880 you better be able to justify every penny.

00:45:30.600 Well, and you have to have control over it

00:45:33.200 by the public through its representatives.

00:45:35.720 So what happened in Pakistan, as you know,

00:45:37.520 I don't know if you've been posted in Pakistan, 0.57

00:45:38.900 But like Pakistan did this with its military. 0.89

00:45:41.420 And the next thing you know, the military runs Pakistan.

00:45:45.520 And no matter who you vote for, the military still runs Pakistan.

00:45:48.460 So you don't want that because that's the opposite of democracy, right?

00:45:51.200 I spent two years in Pakistan.

00:45:52.640 Okay, then.

00:45:53.240 I didn't even know that.

00:45:54.620 Is that a fair assessment?

00:45:55.780 Yeah.

00:45:56.180 Yeah, it's a fair assessment.

00:45:57.100 I mean, how many businesses does the Pakistani military own?

00:46:00.320 A lot.

00:46:01.140 A lot.

00:46:01.420 A lot.

00:46:02.020 A lot.

00:46:02.280 Right.

00:46:02.580 And they're the best funded institution in the country.

00:46:04.140 It's really obvious when you drive around Pakistan.

00:46:05.540 man. It's like all the mowed lawns are the military bases. Yep. Yeah. Well, having life 1.00

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00:47:05.280 application times may vary but it's great so um you don't want that here right no no i do not

00:47:11.920 and i the american people don't want that what they want in my opinion is um we were told that

00:47:19.100 we were going to get some ic reform and um we haven't seen one lick of it except sorry that's

00:47:26.960 not true, except with Director Gabbard. She did exactly what President Trump said. I want you to

00:47:32.640 downsize the DNI. I want you to pursue de-weaponization of intelligence. I want you to

00:47:38.280 pursue COVID origins. I want you to pursue Havana syndrome and election security. She did all those 0.92

00:47:44.420 things. She tried to pursue those things and she got beat up for it. I want to get to that in some 0.98

00:47:49.660 detail in just a second. But first, I just want to go back to John Ratcliffe, former congressman

00:47:55.160 who runs CIA

00:47:57.240 why hasn't he pursued

00:48:01.160 reform of CIA

00:48:02.400 that's a very tough question

00:48:06.980 because I'm not in his inner circle

00:48:09.160 but as far as I can tell it's because he doesn't

00:48:11.260 want to he's perfectly

00:48:13.180 happy to let the people that

00:48:15.140 are running the agency who are those

00:48:17.120 people those managers who matriculated

00:48:19.020 upwards who were confused for good leaders

00:48:21.160 yeah they're running the place

00:48:22.300 I don't know why he's letting that happen 0.69

00:48:25.160 Um, everybody I know in that world says that he's just a pure mouthpiece from Assad. 0.52

00:48:31.800 Everybody says that about John Radcliffe.

00:48:33.560 I don't know about that.

00:48:34.840 Um, I can't speak to that, but what I will say is, um, he's not getting it done.

00:48:39.500 He's not reforming anything.

00:48:40.980 I mean, there's still, and I don't remember what they're called and I'm not even sure

00:48:44.100 I'm allowed to say what they were, but, um, you know, right before the administration

00:48:49.360 changed, the DA came up with three new ways to write products that only stay inside the

00:48:55.140 CIA. They don't get propagated out. So what good is that? And so the CIA continues to create

00:49:01.080 products that, um, have no oversight and, um, can be held onto, especially if they're writing

00:49:07.020 things up that they want to wait. Explain what a product is. You're not, you're not talking about

00:49:10.520 a new kind of toothpaste. Right, right. No. So, you know, analysts will write a paper,

00:49:15.440 finished intelligence on some topic and there's different types of papers. You can really,

00:49:20.040 They've got different names, but there's a new type of analytical product that they

00:49:26.800 can write up now, which that is supposed to be shared with the community.

00:49:30.040 That's the whole point.

00:49:30.820 You write something up, you share it with the community.

00:49:32.800 No, they decided they're going to keep it inside the CIA and not propagate it outwards.

00:49:38.540 If Oversight wants to look at something, look at those papers that are being written that

00:49:43.780 are meant to stay inside the CIA and not go anywhere.

00:49:47.520 My gut tells me they're just going to hang on to him

00:49:49.860 until they can make him go somewhere,

00:49:51.900 maybe the next administration.

00:49:53.360 Who knows?

00:49:54.180 Right.

00:49:54.660 I mean, you're describing the ability

00:49:57.060 to create dossiers on people.

00:49:59.840 Dossiers on all sorts of stuff.

00:50:01.820 So here's the reform that I would institute

00:50:05.020 if I had the power to do it.

00:50:06.800 The President of the United States

00:50:07.840 asks for information that is held

00:50:10.420 by one of his agencies that he oversees

00:50:12.240 because he's one of only two elected officials

00:50:13.920 in the entire executive branch of government.

00:50:15.460 and the CA does not produce that information.

00:50:19.420 And then that's the point

00:50:20.240 at which you call John Radcliffe 1.00

00:50:21.440 and you say, listen, bitch, 1.00

00:50:22.880 you've got 24 hours to do this 1.00

00:50:24.680 or I'm having Kash Patel have you arrested.

00:50:27.300 But there's none of that.

00:50:28.600 It's like the president's proxies

00:50:31.200 ask for information from CA

00:50:32.700 and they're like, we can't find it.

00:50:34.440 Yeah.

00:50:35.020 When everyone knows that's a lie.

00:50:36.940 Well, election security.

00:50:37.960 Here's a good one.

00:50:38.720 Kurt Olson is the guy.

00:50:39.900 But like, would that work?

00:50:41.060 Why couldn't you do that?

00:50:41.960 You could in theory.

00:50:43.460 What do you mean in theory?

00:50:44.080 The president, this is the president's agency.

00:50:46.220 He was elected by the public to run CIA.

00:50:48.960 Like I'm, I'm missing something.

00:50:50.440 Sorry, no, you are 100% right.

00:50:52.120 Trump treats CIA like it's a foreign power that he has to negotiate with.

00:50:56.620 I don't, I can't understand why.

00:50:58.500 It's the craziest thing I've ever seen.

00:51:00.300 It should work like that, but it's, it's not, it's not working like that.

00:51:04.740 There are negotiate, like, frankly,

00:51:07.220 Director Gabbard shouldn't have to negotiate with,

00:51:09.180 with Director Ratcliffe over some of this stuff.

00:51:12.800 She had people in her team that have all the intelligence background to handle the type of products that were coming out of CIA, operational traffic, those sort of things, and had to negotiate.

00:51:27.200 Everybody's got to negotiate.

00:51:28.260 Why do we have to negotiate?

00:51:30.320 Why would President Trump—

00:51:31.300 But where's the president in this?

00:51:32.740 The president issues an executive order January 23rd saying, I want all available documentation on these number of historical incidents, including the assassinations of the 60s, but not limited to those.

00:51:45.420 He doesn't get it.

00:51:46.700 He does not.

00:51:47.720 And, you know, I—

00:51:48.680 So why doesn't Trump say, okay, it's been a month.

00:51:52.300 I want it by this afternoon.

00:51:54.560 Where is it?

00:51:55.620 Or you're under arrest.

00:51:56.800 I just don't—I don't—what is going on?

00:51:58.960 I wish I knew.

00:51:59.720 I wish I knew because we expected, we, and I, you know, when I say we, I mean the American public voted for the greatest disruptor in American history.

00:52:12.440 It's not hard, is it?

00:52:13.560 But he's not, for some reason, he's not being the greatest finisher, in my opinion.

00:52:18.440 He's a colluder with the system.

00:52:20.440 I don't get it.

00:52:21.600 I don't understand because we really want to see him successful.

00:52:26.940 So how hard is it to get, and I'm just going to pick the most benign of them all, and that was Kennedy's murders because it's so old, right?

00:52:34.260 But there's, it's not possible you're revealing sources and methods.

00:52:37.860 Everyone's dead.

00:52:38.840 Like, I don't really see the legitimate impediment to producing these documents after all these years and all these votes by the Congress to do it, multiple executive orders, including this one.

00:52:48.780 So they don't produce those documents, which they have not.

00:52:51.160 They have not.

00:52:51.560 why why is it would be hard for trump just to say time's up i want him now there is a sea of lawyers

00:52:59.280 who cavets and say there's here's all the things that are um here's all the reasons you could be

00:53:04.780 sideways with the law here's all trump has full power to do all this but he does correct he could

00:53:10.280 just do it immediately but for some reason the bureaucrats they all sit around cavetsing over

00:53:17.200 all the legal ramifications i think and tom cotton too is tom cotton too he does not want

00:53:23.760 disclosure does not want disclosure at this point like if we're serious about reform we just got to

00:53:28.860 lay it all out and let it let it like if if the documents are that come out these operational

00:53:35.160 records come out uh you know and they show all sorts of wrongdoing that happened decades ago

00:53:41.380 maybe we can finally start correcting those mistakes that happened and improve the institutions.

00:53:48.520 I physically handled the MKUltra documents, okay? They were about, you know, this high in the

00:53:55.640 office. And again, I was hired labor that day. I just needed to move the documents for somebody

00:53:59.760 into another office. But those were the MKUltra. I thumbed through them. And there's no reason, 0.64

00:54:06.000 there is absolutely no reason to to not just put that out okay i think those documents that are

00:54:13.280 jfk which um there was no daring daylight raid or anything like that that just that was incorrect

00:54:19.620 um dni was locked out of a of getting those access to those documents and some of those documents um

00:54:27.160 they're going to use bureaucratic doublespeak to talk about why you know dni doesn't need

00:54:32.740 certain documents, why some of these documents probably need to stay, you know, behind closed

00:54:37.680 doors. It's all bullpucky. Um, it's too old. It's too long ago. It, it has to be released.

00:54:45.500 There's an executive order with the force of law requiring the release of these documents with no

00:54:50.480 caveats in it. Yeah. So they're breaking the law by holding these. You could say the same thing

00:54:56.640 with the COVID Act of 2023.

00:54:58.380 That was unanimously passed.

00:55:00.080 Said, we want all of it disclosed.

00:55:02.860 Was it?

00:55:03.460 No.

00:55:04.020 No, there's thousands of documents

00:55:05.700 that are still sitting there.

00:55:06.780 And I pray that Pulte

00:55:08.080 or whoever else comes after him,

00:55:09.840 or even Ratcliffe,

00:55:11.160 I don't care who does it,

00:55:13.400 declassify him.

00:55:14.640 There's thousands of documents.

00:55:15.780 Well, that's of course not going to happen.

00:55:17.160 And I'm sure Tom Cotton

00:55:18.660 would jump up and prevent it.

00:55:20.760 Yeah.

00:55:20.980 And it's too bad

00:55:21.800 because the people

00:55:25.420 who put this administration in office

00:55:28.620 is going to look at that

00:55:29.700 and they're not going to be happy.

00:55:34.740 Well, it's not a democracy

00:55:35.960 if you don't know what your government's doing.

00:55:37.660 Yeah.

00:55:38.360 And what about 9-11?

00:55:40.160 Was there ever an effort to,

00:55:42.560 because as you just said yourself,

00:55:44.060 it was the Patriot Act in the wake of 9-11

00:55:46.080 that changed the whole structure,

00:55:47.680 changed the country forever.

00:55:49.700 There's never been a meaningful push

00:55:51.260 to declassify it after 25 years.

00:55:54.200 You know, I can't.

00:55:58.180 There was no push for 9-11 during my time at the dig to declassify anything.

00:56:04.520 Oh, I'm very aware of that.

00:56:06.120 I wonder why.

00:56:07.600 I have my theories.

00:56:09.200 I mean.

00:56:09.440 What are your theories?

00:56:10.980 That there's something that's, you know, all these people who are out there that say, you know, the government can't keep a secret.

00:56:21.160 And, you know.

00:56:21.720 That's not true. 0.60

00:56:22.340 You're a kook if you think that, you know, there's a possibility there was something, some underhanded thing happening behind the curtain. 0.98

00:56:31.600 I can tell you we can keep a secret. 0.95

00:56:33.320 I know.

00:56:33.900 I've kept secrets.

00:56:34.880 I am keeping secrets.

00:56:36.520 Okay?

00:56:38.280 Morally, ethically, I'm keeping secrets.

00:56:41.740 And if somebody says that a group of people can't keep a secret about 9-11, that's not true.

00:56:47.200 Okay?

00:56:47.900 I have questions about Building 7.

00:56:50.140 That, for me, was a wake-up call.

00:56:52.200 That's where the CIA office was.

00:56:53.860 Yeah.

00:56:54.560 And so I have a real question about Building 7.

00:56:57.740 It does not make sense.

00:56:59.740 And this is, and again, I used to be a normal CIA officer.

00:57:05.420 You know.

00:57:06.880 That's such a great sentence.

00:57:08.540 I used to be a normal CIA officer.

00:57:11.020 It's true.

00:57:11.820 Assuming that's a category.

00:57:13.020 You know, it is a category.

00:57:14.800 I'm just joking.

00:57:15.380 I know it's a category.

00:57:17.260 You know, and I still love the agency.

00:57:21.420 but there's something uh there's something off with with building seven and something off yeah

00:57:30.200 like how did it fall down uh why why was it announced on television before it fell down

00:57:36.660 those are real questions that need real answers so because the cia there was a cia office in that

00:57:42.920 building they admitted it um i didn't misremember that no you didn't did anyone ever talk about

00:57:49.300 this well you mean at cia at cia over the course of my career what yeah like what happened to our

00:57:54.700 office in building seven there are the building that no plane hit but somehow it fell down so

00:57:59.280 when i say i used to be a normal cia officer for most of my career no one i knew talked about that

00:58:04.400 right and it wasn't till covid that i started running into people um whatever this means it

00:58:11.460 wasn't till covid that i started running into people that started asking those questions and

00:58:14.940 i was listening to them going first it i had a cia employees yeah cia employees i had a visceral

00:58:21.400 reaction when i first heard that i was like what are you talking i did exactly that what are you

00:58:24.920 talking about they can't like that that didn't happen and as time has gone on i had the same

00:58:29.040 reaction by the way you know i'm a slow learner i'm a slow learner and um i'm a slow learner

00:58:35.560 but um there's a lot of questions that need so what were what were other cia employees who had

00:58:41.840 thought about this before you did, or I did,

00:58:43.900 what was their theory about how that building came

00:58:45.840 down?

00:58:47.920 Well, put me

00:58:49.900 on the spot here, but... Doesn't mean it's true, and you're not

00:58:51.800 endorsing it. I'm not endorsing it. I'm interested to

00:58:53.780 know what actual CIA employees think

00:58:55.920 about the destruction of the CIA office

00:58:57.880 in Building 7. A lot of people had

00:58:59.760 questions about, you know, the folks

00:59:01.940 that were dancing on top of the

00:59:03.300 building and celebrating... The Israelis, the 0.55

00:59:05.600 Mossad officers, yeah.

00:59:07.400 A lot of people had questions about that. A lot of people had

00:59:09.760 questions about why

00:59:11.480 um was it an insurance policy i believe you did a whole segment that's right you did a whole

00:59:17.360 segment on this yeah we did a documentary yeah uh there's um there's an insurance policy that

00:59:22.740 was taken out right beforehand which is pretty pretty uh fortuitous pretty prescient um

00:59:28.000 they've brought up a whole bunch of things and um from my perspective from my perspective

00:59:35.600 these are good questions that deserve answers so was the feeling that that building was by

00:59:40.700 someone brought down yeah i mean some have said that explicitly that i've spoken to you know they

00:59:46.180 said explicitly yes it sure looks like that thing was controlled explosion and you know fell in on

00:59:51.220 itself um and these are yeah these are active cia officers i mean it's pretty obvious if you if you

00:59:59.660 take you know if you filter out the propaganda the screaming in your ears from jake tapper like

01:00:04.320 shut up conspiracy nut and just ask like well how did that happen you can't get an answer because

01:00:08.700 obviously was brought down with explosives of some kind. 0.95

01:00:12.960 Right. So, but who did that and why?

01:00:15.540 And by the way, that building collapsed in exactly the same way

01:00:18.800 that the first two towers collapsed.

01:00:20.900 So it does raise like a bigger question.

01:00:23.000 If that was fake, well, what else is fake, if anything?

01:00:25.240 I mean, we don't know.

01:00:25.940 But anyway, so all of these questions,

01:00:28.560 if you're a former normal person and your colleagues at CIA,

01:00:34.020 presumably also these normal CIA officers you described,

01:00:37.840 who I love. They're great officers.

01:00:39.980 No, of course. They work hard. Totally kidding.

01:00:42.540 Barrel-chested freedom fighters. Yeah.

01:00:44.280 And I've known a lot of

01:00:46.080 people like that in various federal agencies

01:00:48.080 who are like good people. Not everyone's bad, right?

01:00:50.380 It's true. However,

01:00:52.340 if they're coming to the same conclusion, then

01:00:53.800 it seems like 9-11 would be the number

01:00:56.080 one thing you looked at in the dig.

01:00:58.340 I would have liked to have

01:01:00.000 taken a look at it. I would have liked to have taken

01:01:02.060 a look at it. It seems obvious to me that

01:01:03.840 because, unlike

01:01:05.360 Like the MLK assassination, which is, I'd love to know more about it.

01:01:08.800 Yeah.

01:01:08.960 Clearly it was a conspiracy, I think.

01:01:11.120 But like in the end, it didn't change the world in the way that 9-11 did.

01:01:16.820 Maybe it's just too big to investigate.

01:01:19.540 Maybe.

01:01:20.440 Maybe.

01:01:20.860 Have you ever heard anybody say, hey, we should look, we should just declassify the 9-11 documents?

01:01:25.320 Well, yeah.

01:01:25.640 Some of the people in the dig said a couple times, but I mean, we have to be direct.

01:01:31.600 We were doing only what we were directed to do.

01:01:34.260 What the EO told you to?

01:01:35.180 EO told us to do.

01:01:36.200 We're trying to be-

01:01:38.540 Trying to follow the law.

01:01:39.680 Well, yeah.

01:01:40.360 Yeah, trying to follow the law,

01:01:41.460 trying to make sure that we accomplish the mission

01:01:43.920 that was put in front of us

01:01:45.080 and get that done as quickly

01:01:46.960 and as effectively as we could.

01:01:49.160 And we found that, well, the deep state exists.

01:01:52.040 I mean, I don't know what you want to call it.

01:01:53.640 I love Mike Benz's description of it, the blob.

01:01:57.400 I think it's the most accurate description.

01:01:59.100 I agree with that.

01:02:01.080 Because it's amorphous.

01:02:02.620 Yeah.

01:02:02.940 There's no meaning.

01:02:03.520 It's everywhere.

01:02:04.300 and it just rolls in

01:02:05.880 and fills space

01:02:06.880 and fills the cracks.

01:02:08.280 It pops up everywhere.

01:02:09.360 It's miserable.

01:02:10.620 So what,

01:02:11.440 so the dig was the director's

01:02:14.240 initiatives group.

01:02:15.400 Initiatives group.

01:02:16.280 And that's the group

01:02:17.280 within the office

01:02:18.640 of the director

01:02:19.140 of national intelligence,

01:02:20.220 ODNI,

01:02:21.680 run until recently

01:02:22.860 by Tulsi Gabbard

01:02:23.820 that was charged with

01:02:25.360 producing these documents

01:02:27.420 that Trump had called for

01:02:28.280 in his executive order.

01:02:29.780 Is that all true?

01:02:30.820 Yeah.

01:02:31.220 Yeah.

01:02:32.040 So what were the

01:02:34.300 if you'll just jog my memory,

01:02:36.740 the cases, the events that you were looking into?

01:02:40.600 Well, a lot of them are listed in that Rand Paul subpoena.

01:02:44.740 So if it's okay.

01:02:45.740 Oh, of course.

01:02:46.580 So it was the JFK assassination.

01:02:49.380 Oh, the declassification effort.

01:02:51.080 And they sort of lumped MLK, JFK.

01:02:53.820 Bobby Kennedy.

01:02:54.440 Bobby Kennedy.

01:02:55.560 In that category, there was election security issues.

01:02:59.180 There was January 6th.

01:03:01.580 Um, there was, uh, COVID, Havana syndrome, UAPs, um, and a couple other issues.

01:03:10.400 They tried to compartment out things.

01:03:12.260 So like everybody wasn't working on the same things.

01:03:14.540 And so there's some things that I was, those are all super interesting topics.

01:03:17.380 So let's just go through them really quick.

01:03:18.480 And I'm going to ask you, do you learn anything new about the JFK assassination?

01:03:21.740 So I have to admit, I'd never really followed it.

01:03:24.680 So I was just hoping we'd just release it all.

01:03:26.980 And I assumed there was a lot of people who were into it and they would pull the documents

01:03:31.240 and make those conclusions for me.

01:03:34.640 So I don't have any revelations

01:03:37.360 that I was following very closely.

01:03:39.000 I was shocked to know that the CIA

01:03:40.780 was running Oswald.

01:03:44.680 Yeah, that's true.

01:03:46.480 He defected, but that was all a scam.

01:03:49.800 The Russians were very paranoid about Lee Oswald.

01:03:54.340 He was a Marine Corps corporal, I think.

01:03:57.160 And he shows up in Russia and they're like,

01:03:59.380 you're a secret agent, but he actually was.

01:04:01.240 so i didn't know that um mlk anything come to mind i wasn't followed sorry yeah january 6th

01:04:09.300 uh i think your interview with steve baker covered quite a bit with that and i think the only thing

01:04:15.820 i'll i want to add to that is um steve baker's provision of information to the dig i think that

01:04:25.520 was sort of the first step to the dig being shut down and um i've never seen a reaction quite like

01:04:34.160 what i saw from the agency tell us what baker did just so we have context yeah sure sure sure um so

01:04:39.680 steve baker uh provided information based off gate analysis that indicated that a current cia officer

01:04:47.860 former capitol police officer um may have been the person who placed the the the bombs that were

01:04:54.720 outside the rnc and dnc on the evening of january 5th early morning whatever it was and um provided

01:05:02.180 it to the dni now he provided it to the dni because and i didn't realize this till much later

01:05:08.540 you know as we're doing these investigations sometimes you just need to bring in a an expert

01:05:14.460 and he had been following it for so long somebody and i'm not sure which part of the team did it

01:05:19.620 they asked him to hey would you like to help us with this he deferred he said listen i'll

01:05:24.720 be glad to give you anything you need,

01:05:26.540 but I don't actually formally want to be part

01:05:28.560 of the investigatory work

01:05:30.400 because he wants to be a journalist.

01:05:32.240 He's actually a musician,

01:05:34.260 which I find great.

01:05:36.640 And so he provided that information

01:05:39.060 and a memo was typed up.

01:05:43.260 The memo went to the PDD&I,

01:05:46.580 the Principal Deputy Director

01:05:48.120 of National Intelligence, Aaron Lucas,

01:05:50.340 and it got scanned in

01:05:51.400 and sent over to Michael Ellis.

01:05:52.780 And that thing got shot.

01:05:54.060 Number two at CIA.

01:05:55.460 Number two at CIA.

01:05:57.000 Shot all over the CIA, and next thing you know, people were losing their minds.

01:06:01.760 When I say people—

01:06:02.360 Because they were so excited to get to the bottom of this case.

01:06:04.120 Right, right, right.

01:06:05.480 We finally figured it out.

01:06:08.320 No, they were pretty upset.

01:06:09.900 They're like, what are you doing?

01:06:10.800 This is defamation.

01:06:11.820 And, you know, people were pulled in front of other people.

01:06:16.640 Defamation in what way?

01:06:17.700 Well, you know, they're saying, listen, this person who was named in this investigation, you know,

01:06:23.400 she's not that that individual was not the the person who did it and you know you could get

01:06:28.420 yourself in a lot of trouble you could get sued how do they know that person didn't do it they

01:06:32.160 don't uh they don't know that and we know they're a bunch of liars is what you're saying uh that is

01:06:38.340 definitely one way to say it but yeah i mean they don't know that and it's weird to me because the

01:06:44.500 cia's job is to take in information and actually and and are by law if there's a chance that there

01:06:50.660 is some illegal activity that occurred,

01:06:52.640 we have to inform the

01:06:54.780 CIA that, hey, listen, there's an

01:06:56.600 employee that might be involved

01:06:58.620 in this. Take it seriously.

01:07:00.500 But you're saying that CIA did not

01:07:02.520 respond coolly

01:07:04.940 or analytically

01:07:06.540 to this information from Steve Baker

01:07:08.480 as provided by ODNI. They did instead what?

01:07:11.920 They decided

01:07:12.840 they were going to investigate the dig.

01:07:14.800 Okay? And I,

01:07:16.680 like, for what purpose?

01:07:18.560 The people who provided the information. Yeah.

01:07:20.180 gave it to him and you know it to me it's it's insanity um were they upset about this information

01:07:27.180 sure seemed like it because you don't send somebody for you don't call somebody up and

01:07:31.540 say we'd like you to show up at this facility for an interview and that facility is for polygraphs

01:07:37.060 by the way which is basically an interrogation tool and um and say hey listen come on by i mean

01:07:43.340 there was a fellow sitting next to me he asked me you know how do i deal with this and i said

01:07:49.300 Well, you tell them that you work for the DNI and that you would like them to send a full list of the questions they'd like to talk about, maybe send it to your lawyer, and you make sure you CC everybody in the DNI front office on that email chain because you want them involved in fixing this.

01:08:05.860 It was insane.

01:08:08.000 The reaction we got from them was a visceral reaction.

01:08:11.780 and

01:08:12.820 so if you I mean you were

01:08:15.680 practicing tradecraft

01:08:17.820 your career at CA so you

01:08:19.660 know that that kind of reaction

01:08:21.820 suggests oh yeah

01:08:23.680 not good not good I immediately

01:08:25.920 assume that there's wrongdoing and

01:08:27.720 like right or wrong that's

01:08:29.740 what I assume if you're going to react like that

01:08:31.680 well hold on a second

01:08:33.020 what are you protecting why are you

01:08:35.780 of course and so

01:08:37.560 and everybody I'm like I'm not a genius here

01:08:39.760 you don't need to be a CO to

01:08:41.520 to have the exact same question so what i'll say about this was um the cia decided that that was

01:08:51.460 the end of it and so they put up they made every obstacle they could to try and prevent us from

01:08:59.380 conducting our investigations and um it was simply refusing things slow rolling things um you know

01:09:05.680 So even within the D&I's Office of General Counsel, there are things that we want to push through there to make sure that we're street legal.

01:09:15.220 Somehow, they managed to slow roll even the stuff we were trying to get over to, for example, Senator Rand Paul's committee.

01:09:21.260 There was questions and follow-ups that sat with that group for months.

01:09:26.560 But on the specific case of January 6th, there are a couple of things that jump out.

01:09:34.700 One, that of all people in the world

01:09:37.560 to be identified by a distinctive gait,

01:09:41.260 apparently it's a product of a sports injury.

01:09:43.360 Sounds like it.

01:09:44.140 That's what Steve Baker says.

01:09:45.360 But whoever was in the figure in the picture

01:09:48.420 at a weird gait,

01:09:50.700 the woman Steve Baker says he thinks is that person 0.96

01:09:53.820 has a sports injury.

01:09:54.980 She's a Capitol Police officer. 0.59

01:09:57.180 But of all places to wind up working, it's CIA.

01:09:59.540 How did she wind up, right?

01:10:02.060 According to the court documents,

01:10:03.280 She had applied for a job prior to, six months prior to January 6th.

01:10:11.100 I can't remember.

01:10:12.620 Okay.

01:10:12.840 But, I mean, it's possible to get a job over there.

01:10:17.440 It's not easy to get hired by the CIA. 1.00

01:10:20.340 What does she do there? 0.89

01:10:21.160 Do you know? 1.00

01:10:22.140 She works in security. 0.99

01:10:23.080 I don't know the specifics of her exact job.

01:10:25.980 Is it possible that she provided security to the director?

01:10:29.700 I don't know.

01:10:30.600 It is possible, I suppose.

01:10:33.280 They pull people in if they're short.

01:10:35.900 So they'll pull people in to, like,

01:10:37.760 there's a special group of people that handle security

01:10:40.560 for the director, deputy director, the coup.

01:10:44.100 Maybe not the coup.

01:10:44.920 Well, the coups change names,

01:10:46.420 but, like, the director and deputy director over at the coup,

01:10:49.420 the chief operating officer is now.

01:10:50.720 The coup against Mosaddegh?

01:10:51.780 Oh, I'm sorry.

01:10:53.660 No.

01:10:54.020 Just kidding.

01:10:54.380 It was a little CIA joke.

01:10:55.300 Yeah, yeah.

01:10:55.840 You guys know coups. 0.99

01:10:56.880 We know them.

01:10:57.620 This is a different coup.

01:10:58.240 Yeah, yeah.

01:10:58.560 Okay.

01:10:59.460 So, yeah, I suppose it's possible.

01:11:02.720 It doesn't matter whether she did or didn't.

01:11:05.600 What really matters to me was that reaction.

01:11:07.920 And it's worse because the information,

01:11:13.140 there was a Homeland Security investigator

01:11:15.620 that was given the information and asked to pursue this.

01:11:19.060 What was his name?

01:11:20.840 Osborne.

01:11:21.980 Osborne.

01:11:23.360 And so he was found dead weeks later in his apartment,

01:11:29.560 in his condo.

01:11:30.260 and um that's worrisome it's worrisome because there's questions about how he died and you know

01:11:38.180 people there's a lot of people who don't want to talk about um mr osborne and his death uh

01:11:47.600 what is well i think i think what they they don't want why don't they want to talk about it

01:11:54.440 they don't want to talk about there's no obituary i noticed yeah well there's no

01:11:58.600 it's still an open question about how he died okay we don't know did he commit suicide did he

01:12:04.740 he was killed by a gunshot he was killed by a gunshot okay and um it's worrisome because

01:12:10.980 if he was pushing to pursue this investigation and people don't want to talk about it because

01:12:17.460 they say well listen we got to let the system work work work the investigation we got to let

01:12:21.840 the system figure out whether or not there's something to this my issue with that is if there

01:12:27.600 is nefarious intent, which I hope to God, this is just some horrible thing that happened to this

01:12:33.980 poor man. Or if it's suicide, I hope his family isn't suffering. All those things. I pray for him,

01:12:40.500 pray for his family. But if there was nefarious action that occurred with that, this is not

01:12:46.400 something you want hidden behind a wall of secrecy because it's not safe for anybody else

01:12:51.500 who was

01:12:53.520 aware of what was happening

01:12:56.060 with that. It has to be

01:12:58.140 talked about publicly.

01:13:00.300 And I hope that Fairfax County

01:13:01.980 Police, because that's where the investigation is going on,

01:13:04.340 I hope they're getting to the bottom of it.

01:13:06.140 I really do. Because

01:13:07.880 It's just interesting that as someone who

01:13:10.040 spent his adult life working for CIA

01:13:12.000 and you said you loved it

01:13:14.140 and got so much out of it,

01:13:16.080 but you seem to believe

01:13:18.040 by what you're saying that the CIA would at least

01:13:20.160 be capable of killing this guy well i don't know who did that i'm not saying the cia did it but

01:13:25.200 something happened something happened he was killed and um it you could make that supposition

01:13:30.920 that well it might be the cia could be could be other people with interests and i also find it

01:13:38.900 fascinating that within a very short period of that steve baker piece coming out saying we found

01:13:44.060 the woman who placed these pipe bombs,

01:13:47.140 the Department of 0.99

01:13:48.140 Justice, after, well,

01:13:50.080 I guess, five years

01:13:51.920 of not finding

01:13:54.220 a suspect, arrested some 0.93

01:13:56.120 autistic black kid and charged him with the crime. 0.98

01:13:58.080 It's crazy. I don't believe 0.98

01:14:00.160 that for one minute. That the autistic 1.00

01:14:02.060 black kid did this? Yeah. No, I don't. 1.00

01:14:03.920 Not for one minute. And the other issue, I don't

01:14:06.140 know... Do you think the Department of Justice is capable

01:14:08.100 of framing someone like that?

01:14:11.000 Apparently.

01:14:12.000 I don't...

01:14:14.060 I can't speak to motives.

01:14:15.620 That's so evil, though.

01:14:17.160 If this is what happened, it's pure evil.

01:14:19.540 And there's other data out there.

01:14:21.640 People should go take a look at Kyle Serafin's podcast.

01:14:25.540 He was on the surveillance team,

01:14:27.980 surveilling Person of Interest 3.

01:14:30.060 There's other data out there that seems to indicate

01:14:32.240 that this is not the full story.

01:14:35.860 I don't believe that that kid,

01:14:38.000 this is just my opinion,

01:14:40.140 but I don't believe that that kid is the one,

01:14:42.420 the guy they got arrested, 0.98

01:14:43.360 The autistic kid that has feet that are six sizes too big to be the same person, uh-uh. 0.98

01:14:51.160 It doesn't add up. 1.00

01:14:52.580 But I will say-

01:14:53.260 Is the NAACP involved in this?

01:14:54.740 All the professional defenders of black people out there who were out in force five years

01:14:58.500 ago?

01:14:58.660 I love black people. 0.86

01:14:59.600 Okay.

01:15:00.120 Now is the time for everyone who stood up five years ago during the George Floyd insanity

01:15:04.400 and said, I love black people.

01:15:05.880 What about this black guy? 0.57

01:15:07.320 This autistic black kid? 1.00

01:15:08.320 Who's defending him? 1.00

01:15:09.140 Anybody?

01:15:09.580 Nobody.

01:15:10.300 Nobody.

01:15:10.620 Nobody. 1.00

01:15:11.200 Oh, all the I love black people are absent? 1.00

01:15:13.360 on this apparently yeah okay apparently i mean not surprised it's it's sickening to me it is 0.98

01:15:18.180 sickening you know i i never said i love black people i never treated black people like gods

01:15:23.020 they're people like you and me yeah but i'm offended by this well i'm offended because 0.93

01:15:27.160 if this poor kid you know he's sounds like he's got some spectrum issues yes spectrum you know i

01:15:34.540 you know i've got people very close to me with mental health issues and to think that you'd like

01:15:39.980 you know what?

01:15:40.280 This is a throwaway person.

01:15:41.940 This is a throwaway person.

01:15:43.300 That's what they're saying.

01:15:44.120 If this is really is as bad as it looks to me,

01:15:48.500 they're basically saying.

01:15:50.000 It's not the first time when Mary Pinchon Meyer was murdered in the,

01:15:52.680 on the towpath right near my house,

01:15:54.540 childhood home in Georgetown,

01:15:56.400 Cord Meyer's widow,

01:15:57.340 wife,

01:15:59.660 she was not, 0.98

01:16:00.440 they grabbed some black guy and put him on trial for her murder.

01:16:03.600 When they knew when CIA was perfectly aware that he didn't do it and they

01:16:07.660 allowed the DC police to arrest this guy and put him on trial.

01:16:09.920 yeah well what i'd say about all of this sorry it just makes me mad it makes me mad too i mean

01:16:17.980 it's so mean it well it's it's and it's every single one of these acts that that they're in

01:16:27.980 our face it's so obvious and they're throwing in our face they're it's meant to demoralize us

01:16:33.040 and and make us make us feel like there's nothing we can do against this giant blob

01:16:38.200 that does whatever they want.

01:16:41.680 Run by, yeah, John Radcliffe.

01:16:44.760 And so, you know, as far as the dig is concerned,

01:16:49.580 as far as Steve Baker's story is concerned,

01:16:52.020 that was the death knell for the dig.

01:16:54.420 And I think-

01:16:55.280 But it's got to make you think

01:16:56.200 if CIA is this involved in it,

01:16:59.080 clearly they were this involved in January 6th.

01:17:02.020 I mean, why else?

01:17:04.160 If I'm running, if I'm John Radcliffe, okay,

01:17:06.440 and I find out that someone on our security team

01:17:10.840 has been identified by gate recognition software

01:17:14.180 as the person playing to the pipe bombs on J6,

01:17:16.320 I would say at least we got to look at this.

01:17:18.200 Yeah.

01:17:18.900 So I wouldn't say let's shut down the investigation

01:17:22.020 that produces information.

01:17:23.720 Right, right.

01:17:24.620 And if I were, I'll take Kyle Serafin's surveillance team.

01:17:28.980 If I were on the surveillance team

01:17:30.320 that was surveilling all these people

01:17:31.620 that were in the vicinity,

01:17:33.760 as soon as that new information came out from Steve Baker,

01:17:36.000 I'd be, I'd be calling up my surveillance team and I'd be saying, Hey boys, we've got some new

01:17:39.700 information. We're going to, let's go over the old files and we're going to, I'm an intelligence

01:17:43.580 officer. I'm not a law enforcement, but I, as an intelligence officer, if I were doing something

01:17:49.680 overseas and it had some shades of what this is, I would immediately call my surveillance team

01:17:55.300 together and say, let's get on the target again. Let's, let's start, let's start getting some,

01:18:00.600 some brass tacks of what's, what's going down, go through the old files, figure out what is

01:18:05.620 happening none of that's happening i mean this person who like i don't know anything i mean i

01:18:11.480 was not involved in investigating this i've just talked to steve baker and you that's it so i'm

01:18:14.800 not alleging anything but i mean dan bongino at fbi was defending this person and attacking

01:18:22.120 steve that's correct yeah is that can you verify that attack wait attacking steve baker yeah steve

01:18:28.440 yeah i'm gonna help fund a libel suit against you and all this stuff i supposedly he said but he was

01:18:35.280 certainly attacking steve baker what does steve baker do he used gate recognition software which

01:18:40.100 the federal government uses by the way yeah it's not a crackpot technology no no does it prove

01:18:44.900 anything but it moves you closer like like anything else facial recognition right yeah

01:18:49.300 i mean it breaks things open so that you can start conducting more investigations okay so

01:18:54.660 you're an expert in human behavior of course because you're like recruiting spies if this

01:18:59.600 were happening in pakistan not your country you'd be like this agency must be involved yes

01:19:05.040 in the event in question, J6. 1.00

01:19:07.700 Yeah, I mean, that's the problem. 1.00

01:19:11.940 I keep seeing parallels to third world countries

01:19:14.880 of things like this happening,

01:19:16.400 where I'm like, if this were happening in another country,

01:19:19.080 I'd run an intelligence operation.

01:19:21.640 You know, I've monitored elections in foreign countries

01:19:24.180 as part of that process.

01:19:26.600 And here's another example.

01:19:28.820 If I had seen the anomalies that had occurred

01:19:31.580 during our election that caused January 6th in some foreign country, State Department would be

01:19:37.940 probably sending out a demarche. So there's enough- And will you explain to people who don't know

01:19:42.280 what that, what does that mean? Oh, it means we'd be criticizing that country for their election

01:19:45.980 practices. We'd give them a formal statement saying, you have done wrong and we think that

01:19:51.760 you need to stop doing X, Y, and Z because your elections are fraudulent. That's what I'm saying.

01:19:58.920 So that's another example.

01:20:01.080 I keep seeing these parallels.

01:20:02.620 If this had happened in some foreign locale.

01:20:06.060 It's kind of weird if you take three steps back.

01:20:08.260 I'm not alleging anything at all.

01:20:09.500 I just happened to notice the pattern that this happens in 2020.

01:20:12.900 It's clearly no one's proved that the election was stolen,

01:20:16.900 so far as I can tell.

01:20:17.820 But the evidence that this was not how you run an election,

01:20:20.420 this is how a fraudulent election is run.

01:20:22.540 It's overwhelming.

01:20:23.100 And then Trump gets shot in Butler and then decides to hire Marco Rubio as Secretary of State, Steve Walsh as National Security Advisor, and critically, John Ratcliffe as Director of Central Intelligence.

01:20:37.800 And then he wins the election with the majority of the popular vote, and you don't have any of these problems.

01:20:45.100 I mean, if this were happening in a foreign country, what would you say?

01:20:47.900 I have some questions.

01:20:48.800 I will say part of the reason President Trump won was because he managed to capture the Maha vote, and he should be probably a little more cognizant of what Maha wants.

01:21:01.500 He shouldn't be endorsing mRNA technology.

01:21:03.680 Yeah, stuff like that.

01:21:04.360 But that's separate from your point.

01:21:06.760 It's just kind of weird.

01:21:07.800 like if you wanted above all

01:21:10.000 to have a war with Iran,

01:21:12.320 not just to get rid of their nuclear program, 0.90

01:21:13.680 but to reset the world order. 0.67

01:21:15.260 Right. 1.00

01:21:15.760 Get the U.S. out of the Middle East 0.98

01:21:16.980 and the U.S. dollar and the petrodollar. 0.94

01:21:20.420 And that was your plan.

01:21:21.480 Clearly, that's the plan.

01:21:23.340 It's happening.

01:21:24.960 And no American president would go along with that

01:21:27.140 because that would like destroy your legacy

01:21:28.840 and your nation.

01:21:29.840 Right.

01:21:30.480 Especially for someone who campaigned on no...

01:21:32.940 Of course.

01:21:33.700 And clearly didn't want to do it.

01:21:34.820 But let's say that was your plan.

01:21:35.880 and that's a big plan that's a history changing plan yeah you would um you know you'd do whatever

01:21:44.240 you could to to make it clear to that guy like there's a carrot and a stick here like maybe you

01:21:50.720 get elected maybe you don't get killed if you go along with it yeah has that ever occurred to you

01:21:56.960 yeah i mean if i'm being honest with myself yes um i don't know that that happened i don't nobody

01:22:04.260 has ever bothered to explain what did happen if that's not what happened like oh it's just totally

01:22:08.900 normal that that we invaded iran after you know six months after saying we ended the nuclear program

01:22:13.720 to like restart again without trying to convince the public and then just do this thing that we

01:22:17.300 know is going to wreck our country which it now is yeah i what i what i mostly uh not mostly what

01:22:25.120 i very much dislike is the alternative voices that came together to form this coalition because

01:22:32.220 whatever MAGA is, whatever Maha is,

01:22:35.860 like all these people came under a very big tent

01:22:37.940 and they offered their voices,

01:22:39.160 their support for President Trump

01:22:40.460 because he was just-

01:22:41.140 What a great coalition it was too.

01:22:42.300 Yeah.

01:22:42.680 It was awesome.

01:22:43.380 It was awesome.

01:22:45.260 You had these people came forward

01:22:47.160 and then the alternative voices

01:22:49.500 have been systematically removed

01:22:51.820 from the pool of people

01:22:53.780 that are supposed to be advising.

01:22:55.720 Is that true?

01:22:56.500 I think so.

01:22:58.220 Sorry, I'm just laughing.

01:22:59.460 I was one of them. 0.98

01:23:00.520 Yeah, no, that is definitely true.

01:23:01.940 And like Joe Kent, for example.

01:23:03.800 Oh, the best.

01:23:04.800 He's a wonderful human being.

01:23:06.320 I agree.

01:23:07.740 I look at the reaction to him resigning the way he resigned.

01:23:12.060 And I have friends who I deeply respect.

01:23:14.980 I love them.

01:23:15.440 And they're like, oh, you shouldn't have done it that way because it criticized President Trump.

01:23:18.240 I'm like, you know, for many years, when people resign from office, a lot of times they'd resign on principle.

01:23:26.960 And they'd write a letter just like that.

01:23:29.120 Joe Kent was not disrespectful to President Trump.

01:23:32.480 At all.

01:23:32.980 At all.

01:23:33.860 And if you can't get through to a president,

01:23:39.360 you can't get your message across,

01:23:40.860 say, hey, listen, I need you to listen to me.

01:23:42.640 At some point, doing the right thing

01:23:45.560 is writing a respectful letter that says,

01:23:48.040 hey, I disagree with this policy.

01:23:51.760 I'm leaving for this reason.

01:23:53.140 This happened all the time before.

01:23:54.980 The thing that bothers me is-

01:23:56.300 What's the option?

01:23:56.980 leaking to the media, subverting the president's program. Those are clearly less honorable

01:24:03.960 responses. Completely. If you can't carry out a job consistent with your own values, don't.

01:24:10.240 Yeah. I mean, I don't know what, how is that bad? Isn't that what we ask our children to be?

01:24:15.140 It's exactly what we ask. And Joe Kent did exactly what many, many other people have done

01:24:20.320 in many other administrations. My problem is the screeching and the gnashing of teeth that came

01:24:26.740 from this people associated with this administration you know that they treated him worse than if he

01:24:34.620 was like some kind of leaker well actually they claimed he was um well they claimed he was a

01:24:40.260 criminal a criminal he was under criminal investigation his security clearance was

01:24:44.960 unimpeded till the day he left so we know that that's not it's not true it's a lie they admitted

01:24:49.200 it was a lie but they trashed the guy's reputation they trashed his wife yeah i mean just this i

01:24:55.720 mean i'm sorry he has sacrificed for this country and um you know he did an honorable thing uh he

01:25:04.480 he he spoke with respect to the president he couldn't get through so he decided to leave um i

01:25:10.760 i keep seeing these indications that there are blast doors up around the white house around

01:25:15.980 key figures that you can't get through you can't talk to them and again i wish i was part of the

01:25:21.140 inner circle so i could see what was happening but as somebody who was you know maybe one or two

01:25:26.180 layers below that it sure looked like blast doors were going up around a whole lot of people

01:25:31.120 and um i yeah i don't know how we got on that but but well i mean it's just because it's sad

01:25:38.800 and the coalition that brought trump back to the white house in 2024 was like a beautiful thing

01:25:43.920 it wasn't organized around a race or even a political party it was organized around a kind

01:25:50.380 of idealistic hope that the country could be better and that some measure of power be returned

01:25:54.700 to the citizens who own it. It's like, these are not radical ideas. They're foundational ideas. 0.80

01:25:59.060 Well, now that I am... It wasn't a hate-based thing at all. No. And now it's totally blown

01:26:03.860 up because a small group of true haters, the genocide defenders, have all been basically

01:26:09.420 committed to destroying this coalition. And it worked. And that's really... It has worked. And

01:26:14.020 truthfully, now that I am not a government employee, I can speak about my personal political

01:26:19.740 beliefs um i am a lifelong conservative like i voted for ross perot i yeah you know i'm a ross

01:26:26.280 i i gave you bill clinton at one point i'm a lifelong conservative and i was going to vote

01:26:32.880 for kennedy yeah i was going to vote for kennedy and um i was going to go that like i am a lifelong

01:26:38.860 conservative that was going to go the distance for a president kennedy and in my opinion he did

01:26:45.840 one of the most presidential things that, um, I've seen in my lifetime. He chose, um, the American

01:26:53.240 people over, over power. He said, listen, I've got an opportunity. If I, if I work with this

01:26:59.560 administration, I've got an opportunity to make America healthy again. Um, it, it was the most

01:27:06.980 noble thing I'd ever seen. I was really pissed off that he, uh, he pulled out. I really was

01:27:11.460 going to go the distance and i'd never if someone had asked young jim hey someday are you going to

01:27:16.020 vote for for a democrat um i would have been like that's that's crazy talk uh you know i might vote

01:27:22.800 for occasional libertarian or ross perot but probably not a democrat and i was going to go

01:27:28.040 the distance uh with him that coalition that he brought in he i don't think president trump would

01:27:37.280 be president if he had not brought that in. And so for me, if we're talking about the coalition

01:27:43.140 that said no more war, um, make America healthy again, we're losing the promises are being broken.

01:27:52.060 The promises are being broken, mocked, mocked, openly mocked. And like, I, you know, I'll still

01:28:00.240 go the distance with anybody who wants to protect religious rights, bodily autonomy,

01:28:05.680 all those things um somebody needs to wake up this administration and say hey listen 0.61

01:28:12.500 if the person who owns the the maha agenda at the polls they're probably going to get those 0.93

01:28:19.960 those little bits of votes that are going to put them over the edge um it's it's a it's too late 0.78

01:28:26.540 i mean betrayal is hard to recover from you know you get in an argument with your wife and you can

01:28:32.840 get past it you catch her in bed with the pool boy and you're never going to see her the same

01:28:36.560 way because she betrayed you no on a very deep level not that that happened i hope it never does

01:28:41.600 but but you know what i mean that's what this is you you caught trump in bed with someone it's like

01:28:46.820 he cheated on you and then to lecture you about your lack of loyalty is too much you're disloyal

01:28:53.580 joe kent was disloyal really joe kent's wife got killed in syria because of the neocons yep and

01:29:00.720 rather than whine about it he kept going and tried to serve his nation and did and he was right by

01:29:07.500 the way on the merits and then he calls trump tries to see trump on his way out because he

01:29:12.460 likes trump actually he's a respectful guy and trump trashes his wife and says oh he got remarried

01:29:19.200 awful quick really because it was under your administration that his first wife was killed 0.98

01:29:23.220 because you didn't have the balls to get american troops out of syria because you're controlled by 0.97

01:29:27.460 israel that's a fact so then to lecture joe kent about getting married again after you ever saw the 0.96

01:29:33.040 death of his first wife i was like oh oh can't deal with this anymore yeah you know it's it's

01:29:39.640 there's been a lot of disappointment i know that's the understatement of the year but um a lot of

01:29:46.340 disappointment like i have disappointment like to bring it back around to the conversation about

01:29:49.980 the agency and everything else i have disappointment with the agency i wanted reform i wanted real 0.91

01:29:53.800 reform i'm okay with getting rid of some of the chaff i'm okay with making some big changes and 0.97

01:30:00.140 and never happened never happened in fact this administration's is just letting it move on like 1.00

01:30:08.660 i've left government service now um you know i co-founded an organization if it's okay i'm going

01:30:15.180 to talk a little bit about that because i think it's important you know i at some point i'm going

01:30:20.940 to go into the private sector. But the thing about being a government employee, if you're

01:30:24.600 in military or forward facing, you want to have a mission. You want to have something that you're

01:30:29.060 like, no, no, no. I want to be part of something bigger. And that's the hardest part of leaving

01:30:33.020 government service. You know, that and you realize that, you know, there's a lot of people in the

01:30:38.740 private sector who are incredibly impressive and you have to compete against them. So some of these

01:30:43.780 government schlubs are afraid to leave. Yeah, of course. But, you know, I co-founded an organization

01:30:49.660 that sued the federal government over vaccine mandates um we got together we didn't know what

01:30:54.820 we're doing we built the car as we rolled it out of the uh rolled it out of the garage but we were

01:30:59.300 we were successful we got a nationwide injunction that shut down the vaccine mandate for all staff

01:31:04.900 federal government employees throughout the entirety of the biden administration done

01:31:09.360 succeeded we filed 17 class action eos uh you know towards the end of my time at the dig the

01:31:19.180 last year in the dig turns out that the uh cia decided that every single person who is non-compliant

01:31:26.420 with those vaccine mandates yeah they weren't you know just insubordinate they were spies

01:31:33.400 so they had all of them investigated by the counterintelligence mission centers

01:31:40.080 counter espionage uh department not really oh really all of them said yep we got a check

01:31:46.500 so um i i personally filed an op office of privacy and civil liberties complaint

01:31:55.660 and i blind cc'd every single unvaccinated officer in the cia and then when nothing happened

01:32:03.420 after 40 days i sent it up to the intelligence community inspector general i said you need to

01:32:08.960 investigate this my problem is they're purposely waiting longer than a 45 day period because 0.99

01:32:15.160 as soon as I CC'd all these unvaccinated officers,

01:32:19.140 as soon as I CC'd them,

01:32:20.220 they have a 45-day window to file an EEO complaint.

01:32:22.980 I know a lot about the complaint process now.

01:32:24.700 Never used to.

01:32:25.500 Never made a complaint until COVID.

01:32:28.260 And I wanted to give them the chance,

01:32:29.500 if they were upset about it,

01:32:30.460 to actually file those complaints.

01:32:31.720 A bunch of people filed the EEO complaints.

01:32:33.760 But all we really wanted was,

01:32:35.440 and again, this is under Director Radcliffe.

01:32:38.240 All we wanted to do was to expunge the records.

01:32:41.220 See, when you have a counter-

01:32:42.560 Wait, John Radcliffe okayed

01:32:45.160 Counter-espionage investigations?

01:32:47.280 The investigation occurred in 2021.

01:32:50.280 Right.

01:32:50.760 Okay.

01:32:51.560 It was discovered.

01:32:52.460 So after it was discovered, we said, hey, listen, new administration, this is an easy fix.

01:32:58.820 Here's what we want.

01:32:59.920 Just expunge the records.

01:33:01.440 Just get that off your permanent security file because that's-

01:33:04.940 You were investigated as a foreign spy because you didn't want to take the death shot?

01:33:07.800 Yeah, because you didn't want to take the death shot.

01:33:09.720 And that was a simple request.

01:33:11.500 Hey, please, just, we asked.

01:33:14.180 Did Ratcliffe do it?

01:33:15.160 no so now we have to sue and so you know i found pro bono legal support why is ratcliffe so vested

01:33:21.740 in i have no idea slander against people who didn't take the vac i have no idea we and i don't

01:33:28.120 know maybe he's incompetent too i he should have his staff were aware i made sure that both deputy

01:33:34.060 director and the director staff were aware that this was occurring i wanted them to just fix it

01:33:39.960 And they didn't.

01:33:41.220 So we're going to sue them.

01:33:43.100 Good.

01:33:43.560 So I got out of government service, but I'm still working the Feds for Freedom.

01:33:49.500 Where Feds for Freedom is suing the CIA over this.

01:33:53.160 And we are still actually litigating class action EOs.

01:33:56.920 And this is a half decade later.

01:33:58.620 So we've got an FBI class action EO.

01:34:01.320 We've got a, there's a couple others, DOD, NASA.

01:34:06.320 We're still litigating this stuff a half decade later, which is, 1.00

01:34:09.960 absolutely idiotic. It's this administration. They said, they said flat out, we shouldn't have 1.00

01:34:14.840 to have... Well, it's just an attack on Christians. That's what it was. Here's a shot with aborted

01:34:19.320 baby parts in it. Can you take it? The people who said they can't, they get investigated as

01:34:23.740 spies. Get all the Christians out. Yeah. So at some point I'm going to go find a normal job, 1.00

01:34:29.520 but for right now I'm going to... Let me ask you one final question, one final category of

01:34:34.140 questions so back to january 6th sure based on everything you've said without any other evidence

01:34:40.840 i would find it very likely that the cia was involved in january 6th just by their reaction

01:34:46.420 to it or is aware that doj isn't covering for doj or something the government is clearly based on

01:34:51.920 their reaction it's actually the worst possible um conclusion if i'm just going off reaction i

01:34:58.060 have no data i can't prove anything but it means that the capital police the fbi and cia were all

01:35:03.820 in bed yeah and um they perpetrated a hoax of such colossal proportion and they you know january

01:35:12.700 6th you had people rotting in these jails oh i know for a very long time if cia was involved in

01:35:19.260 that um maybe that four wins thing maybe that's maybe that's where we should be going we should

01:35:24.800 certainly a church committee 2.0 just shut it down at that point yeah so but that raises the

01:35:31.740 question i mean like the firewall always was involvement in domestic politics yes we did

01:35:37.560 overthrow mosadeck yes we did this that and the other thing abroad but it was in the service of

01:35:41.460 american foreign policy goals and so it's okay but what we'll never do is start tampering in

01:35:47.120 our domestic politics our democracy right right and and yet i know for a fact

01:35:54.200 that there are cia domestic influence operations

01:35:57.980 i've never seen one but uh all the indications are when you take a look at the media

01:36:07.640 um media blackouts what media covers it starts looking like something's happening and you know

01:36:17.460 yeah they're pretty obviously involved the monica lewinski thing not that i'm pro-clinton

01:36:23.760 never have been yeah but do you think that's fair to say i think it is yeah yeah

01:36:27.580 so um that's like pretty shocking that they would be involved in our politics don't you think

01:36:34.160 it is shocking and like i said i used to be different and um

01:36:41.980 the variety of things that i entertain as possibilities are much much wider than they

01:36:50.520 used to be you can't you can't read an email that says this is our story and we're sticking to it

01:36:55.880 and not, you can't go back.

01:37:00.940 You can't go back to that.

01:37:02.800 So yeah, it's disturbing.

01:37:07.120 We're not getting reform

01:37:08.200 and I have a feeling we've got more pain ahead for us

01:37:12.500 if we don't make some changes.

01:37:14.100 I agree with that.

01:37:15.340 Thanks so much for taking all this time, Jim,

01:37:16.820 to talk to us.

01:37:17.960 My pleasure.

01:37:18.680 Congrats.

01:37:19.040 You've been out of CA less than a month

01:37:20.220 and you're already doing good work.

01:37:22.160 Thank you.

01:37:22.480 Thank you.

01:37:22.960 Thank you.

01:37:25.880 We'll be right back.

The Tucker Carlson Show - July 27, 2026

Ex-CIA Agent Speaks Out： JFK, 9-11, UAPs, MLK, MKUltra & Everything Trump Is Hiding

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