00:00:00.180Hi! What's your name? Matthew, what's yours? Sarah. Nice to meet you, Matthew.
00:00:05.760So yeah, what do you think of this statement? Do you support or are you against?
00:00:09.240Well, I mean, it depends. Like, firstly, how do you define socialism, I guess, and what do you mean by it being a scam?
00:00:15.520So socialism is public ownership of the means of production, right?
00:00:18.940So it comes with well food distribution, it comes with, practically, a lot of government intervention, right?
00:00:24.840so i don't think it works in practice because pretty much every like literally every time we
00:00:29.840have tried socialism it has failed i'm sorry what was the first thing you said before government
00:00:33.560intervention i just misheard uh well that's like it's government ownership of the means of production
00:00:39.060okay sorry i thought i missed something yeah no like that's my full definition is government
00:00:43.120ownership of the means of production and wealth redistribution basically so practically you're
00:00:47.540what it promises is a society where everything is shared sort of equally not completely equally but
00:00:54.080sort of equally and where everyone has like sufficiency right but in practice i don't think
00:00:59.900it does because it results in shortage shortages so yes you might have equality but everyone is
00:01:05.120equally poor what do you mean by it causes shortages well because government is slow
00:01:11.460the government is yeah right so they they don't have the profit motive so they don't have that
00:01:18.100signal to be like oh we need to produce more of this or we need to like if something is like flat
00:01:25.060at the same price like say we rent control something or we or we frightfully uh price
00:01:30.600freeze something yeah it's demand may not stay the same right so if if it's artificially low
00:01:37.720well the supply would uh supply wouldn't catch up for demand because the price level is too
00:01:41.900right if it's too low then yeah so there would be you would run out of something like so what we saw
00:01:47.700in the Soviet Union was massive lines for bread, just the basic commodities, right? And that was
00:01:54.560because they had government-run agriculture. This is true. Like, I would say, yeah, I'm not
00:01:59.360the biggest fan of command-style economies. I find them to be quite inefficient. I think price is a
00:02:03.460very good signal for allocating resources effectively. But I would say, are you against
00:02:07.680government intervention in and of itself, or are you against social democracy?
00:02:12.960Do you mean, like, just democracy in general, like, or democratic socialism?
00:02:16.160Not democratic socialism. Well, I kind of, social democracy in the sense, like, I don't care about, like, the, how would I define it properly? Basically, just having a fairly large safety net in a fairly large welfare state.
00:02:31.220Yeah. And, yeah, just having government, having a strong, having strong government intervention for, like, dismantling monopolies and things like that.
00:02:40.600Okay. Yeah. So the idea of government intervention is that government would know better than what the private industry does.
00:02:48.560This is true. And I think there are many examples where government intervention is necessary.
00:02:53.100So there's something called natural monopolies.
00:02:55.360So if you think about a power company, think about like a, let's say there was a plumbing company.
00:02:59.960um it is far cheaper um that's a natural monopoly because because it is far cheaper for uh or it's
00:03:08.320far more effective typically for one plumbing company to build a sewer network for an entire
00:03:12.080city and then the marginal cost is very low uh for or is low relative to the case of if there
00:03:19.460are two plumbing companies competing in a city um typically there's not enough people in the fixed
00:03:24.340cost is so high to build plumbing infrastructure the marginal cost is higher so those typically
00:03:29.920those tend towards natural monopolies and when there are natural monopolies these companies
00:03:34.660corporations have a lot of power to just set the price as high as they want because well no one
00:03:40.200else is going to well step in because it's just a natural monopoly in the long run you can do
00:03:44.600whatever so in that specific case i think government intervention is strictly necessary
00:03:49.520to add price to add like a price ceiling or something like that so people aren't overly
00:03:56.620exploited like their consumer surplus isn't overly exploited right yeah so you're talking
00:04:01.280about like a monopoly and utilities so in that case when there you can't really have a lot of
00:04:06.300competition like you have basically three options you have like government run monopoly private run
00:04:11.940monopoly or regulated private monopoly so you have those three options yeah and you have to choose
00:04:16.780which one is going to be the best so a government-run monopoly it might be slow but okay we
00:04:23.360get we pay our taxes to it and it might be fine so I do agree with you there might be times when
00:04:27.520having the government actually run something is best for society but I think those cases are
00:04:32.440very limited right so like like down to like utilities and justice and the military and
00:04:39.480different things like that that the only way to effectively run them would be collectively or
00:04:45.860through the consent of the governed taxation right i wouldn't say collectively i would just
00:04:50.500say that um you just have a government which has enough power to basically set like price ceilings
00:04:55.320or price ceilings on okay on on like a utility company such that they don't overly exploit the
00:05:00.880consumer surplus right so like a regulated yes it's regulated yes okay um i think markets in
00:05:07.520general aren't i don't think of them as a morally good thing i just think of them as a tool um and
00:05:12.760they're very effective at allocating resources but regulation allows you to kind of play with
00:05:18.420the knobs of the market to have that market incentivized to optimize for like whatever
00:05:23.960the public good is whatever you want right but because again that is assuming that the government
00:05:28.840knows everything and knows what is best for the direction of that um there are many such cases of
00:05:34.940like um market failures and this is something that like i'm in economics and i've studied
00:05:39.540uh like a market failure would be like the one we were talking about with uh like a
00:05:43.700a monopoly that over is it's overly exploitative or cartels that can naturally happen so like
00:05:49.180do you know what a cartel is oh yeah or like an oligopoly yeah or um those i think necessarily
00:05:57.280require government intervention because if there is no regulation um then those uh companies in
00:06:04.220the cartel will um will um collude and that will sap away more consumer surplus it won't be
00:06:10.520efficient for the consumer or good for generally good companies in and of themselves are just
00:06:15.220agents that are optimizing for profit that's not necessarily good necessarily bad but if there's
00:06:20.020no regulation between a cartel they will necessarily by just their incentive collude
00:06:25.100and it requires a government with power to break up a monopoly all right so i think what you're
00:06:30.220talking about is Keynesian economics in sort of. Are you familiar with that? Keynesian economics is
00:06:36.100purely like it's talking about like monetary and fiscal policy. Okay but John Maynard Keynes he
00:06:43.080also thought that government intervention would be necessary to direct the economy. Yes. No this
00:06:48.400is true. And his policy has never really panned out. The government has never been able to do it
00:06:52.740better. Actually no I would disagree. I say Keynesian economics and very simply it's saying
00:06:59.400when the when the economy is running slow like let's say we're in a depression it is good for
00:07:04.920the government to inject money into the economy to ramp it up and speed it up so they tried that
00:07:10.140there's there's another part when when the economy is running hot when inflation is high
00:07:15.540the government is supposed to step back and to extract higher taxes increase the increase the
00:07:22.100borrowing rate or the cost of money governments don't typically do the second part and that's
00:07:27.720where it goes that's where it gets bad because well if you're a politician and let's say you're
00:07:32.880on like a four-year a four-year term you're a little bit oh yeah sure yeah if you're a politician
00:07:38.440and you're incentivized to make the economy look good um you're going to inject as much money and
00:07:45.140do as much as do as much fiscal spending as possible to bring up it's going to look good
00:07:49.420on on paper the gdp is going to go up but no no one's very incentivized on a short-term scale to
00:07:54.860say no we need to reel things in we need to raise taxes we need to increase the interest rates
00:07:59.360this it's it's i can it's uh politically uh hard to do that no one wants to do that everyone wants
00:08:06.660to increase spending but not increase taxes yeah which is what would be necessary with a lot of
00:08:10.880spending pardon me if you have a lot of spending then you would need higher taxes otherwise you
00:08:16.380have inflation no when you have you when you have spending you typically when you're trying to if
00:08:21.140speed up the engine of the economy you typically um decrease the tax bit you decrease the amount
00:08:27.320of taxes you're extracting decrease the interest rate or the borrowing cost of money and inject
00:08:31.680money into the economy or like you give subsidies first two pardon me i agree with the first two
00:08:36.900that you want to decrease taxes and decrease interest rates yeah to spend up like to fuel
00:08:41.740individual getting out there and doing something but actually pushing money into the economy
00:09:09.740I'd say, well, how did World War II, right?
00:09:13.220that was a the the u.s took out a bunch of debt and started lending a bunch of people and spent
00:09:19.120a lot of money on building up infrastructure to build tanks automobiles engines and ammunition
00:09:24.420they built up their infrastructure they built road networks and that was all on debt spending
00:09:29.200um but the economy was hungry for it because they they spent so much on these things that were
00:09:35.300useful in generated income like when you when you have to do a big when you have to spend on
00:09:39.040infrastructure people have to well you have to hire people when you hire people they have money
00:09:43.140now that they have more money they can spend money on things and that like the the companies
00:09:48.000or like the people selling products okay we have more money so we can start uh developing more
00:09:52.660products or selling things for cheaper and it's a self-reinforcing cycle yeah that's what it's
00:09:56.680supposed to do in theory that's what happened after world war ii that's why we had the baby
00:10:00.380but like in the 1930s and we're talking about the great depression which was before
00:10:03.860it actually didn't do that it just increased inflation well they weren't there weren't big
00:10:09.840projects that they were spending on on the side to the size of like the amount of spending that
00:10:15.160happened in world war ii um and the reason for like the great depression was they were um the
00:10:20.860economy was under regulated people were allowed to take out a lot of leverage a lot of debt to
00:10:25.780buy stocks they were making a lot of gambles on the economy and then one little thing happened
00:10:30.800and it shot down because so many people had debt and then they got called on their debt but they
00:10:35.000couldn't afford to pay it so they had to sell their shares and then that caused the price of
00:10:38.560those shares to go down and then because the price of those shares went down people had to sell
00:10:41.980and it's a negative self-reinforcing that's what caused it yeah but it was actually on its way to
00:10:47.520recovering until we shot a huge amount or the united states shot a huge amount of money into
00:10:53.400the economy yeah and things actually but if it was too bad if it was true that shooting money
00:10:58.720into the economy was not good or it wouldn't speed it up then the amount of money they injected in
00:11:03.200the economy in world war ii which was orders of magnitude higher that wouldn't you under your like
00:11:07.860logic it wouldn't really work but it did but there was like demand as well right so they were trying
00:11:14.660to put money into the economy to in it like invigorate demand which is not what it did like
00:11:20.600money is just a commodity right you're not actually creating goods with that no money is uh when you
00:11:26.480increase the money supply and you increase the rate of borrowing it makes it cheaper and easier
00:11:31.260to like for companies to build out infrastructure to manufacture products and to manufacture products
00:11:36.360at cheaper prices or if you allow or if there's like government spending like on the military
00:11:40.640or like some project it allows people to have jobs and it kind of it's like an engine it can
00:11:44.560kickstart the economy um but you need to temper it off and that's what that's not that doesn't
00:11:50.780happen yeah because like governments again are they go for their vote they want people to vote
00:11:57.320for them so if they promise a whole bunch of money then people are like oh hey he's promising
00:12:01.100money he's going to do a generational investment into the economy like our prime minister and
00:12:06.480our economy's like shrinking this is um this sometimes it is true sometimes it's not true
00:12:13.000um government spending like if you took out if you printed money to build something that's not
00:12:17.860necessarily bad what the issue is like if you if you spend a lot or print a lot of money to build
00:12:25.700some sort of infrastructure or some project and that project doesn't actually have any value then
00:12:30.560that's a negative but if it has value like suppose um we spent money there was no bridge between uh
00:12:35.840the u.s and canada but suppose we spent the money to build a bridge between the u.s and canada
00:12:40.060ambassador that costs a lot of money and we might take out debt to build that bridge but after the
00:12:44.860fact that increases the economic activity of canada as a whole and it brought more value
00:12:49.440into canada than the value value we kind of took out through printing money or whatnot or taking
00:12:54.780of debt it's just about pardon me yeah no like that's like a specific case but as a whole no
00:13:00.820but that's the general rule yeah like as a whole though when you just throw money at something
00:13:05.620it doesn't always fix it like no this is true but that's why i think you just cause inflation if we
00:13:10.740are spending money and there's a difference between like monetary and fiscal but even like
00:13:14.020fiscally if we are spending money um we should have uh people in power who are intelligent enough
00:13:20.200or sending it off to a think tank or something like that or who can evaluate okay what areas
00:13:25.180of the economy should we inject money into or add subsidies to to build up um if we just blanket
00:13:31.640gave everybody uh like ten thousand dollars i don't know if that's necessarily good i think
00:13:35.740we could do it in a more optimal way but maybe but like that is like you have to do it on a small
00:13:43.080scale because when when you're like it's okay it's different than like it's like if you're like
00:13:48.940taxing and then giving the money in a direction that might be better but when you're actually
00:13:53.940creating debt you're like calling for bonds and stocks and creating debt yeah on the government
00:13:59.520you're increasing the money supply without actually at the same time increasing the amount
00:14:04.160of goods in the economy or just the value added um yeah in that case that would be better but i
00:14:10.000think if you do it effectively and when the time calls for it i think it's a generally good thing
00:14:15.000even a government spending fiscally in taking out debt on something that's you you might think like
00:14:20.240where did we get the internet from that came from military spending where did we get like
00:14:23.920microtechnology like how did we get iphones and satellites and gps that was a huge amount of
00:14:28.220government spending on space exploration and nasa like that government spending but it was
00:14:33.440from taxation right it wasn't like debt yeah that was taxation or but they also they because they
00:14:38.380federal was on the 60s um they also did like take out money and spend it through like through debt
00:14:45.260they would lower interest rates that would allow more people to take out more debt or they'd print
00:14:49.440more bonds which allows more people to take out more debt yeah uh like the like when they print
00:14:55.700bonds though like when they actually have debt on the on the government or sell bonds yeah or sell
00:15:00.180bonds it it actually just results in inflation in general like what we've what we're seeing right
00:15:05.780now is inflation due to a huge amount of government spending that is actually not at the same time
00:15:11.200increasing the level of goods or we didn't spend money particularly well i would say that trudeau
00:15:17.400did not spend money particularly well that administration was bad i don't think he's not
00:15:20.760an economist he doesn't understand these things i think we are in agreeance on that but suppose um
00:15:25.480i think we should build out energy infrastructure i think we should build up more pipelines across
00:15:29.580canada so we can sell to asia i think we should in i think we should industrialize the north
00:15:34.300but that all requires government spending that requires debt well i would say where would the
00:15:39.600money come from it requires them giving the contracts out and opening yes but who's the
00:15:44.880government the government gives contracts to people the government has to pay the private
00:15:49.420industries where does it actually no it may not need to like you can set up incentive structures
00:15:54.160like yes like reduce regulation taxes let let people come in let the private industry do what
00:16:00.240it wants to do but when you talk about like the private industry doing things and uh like building
00:16:04.880very very uh building infrastructure whatnot like for this uh for uh for um like uh for for
00:16:11.580satellites in the space race um or um we gave out contracts to people we wrote a blank or america
00:16:17.420wrote blank checks and said yo private companies we'll give you this amount of money if you build
00:16:22.060this for us if you do something great and they the government was like here here's the money
00:16:26.660go do it or here's the money compete go do it if we're still even if there's competition which i
00:16:31.640like i like competition it's very efficient um the money to incentivize these companies has to
00:16:36.700come from somewhere and it comes from the government and also it lowers the risk for
00:16:40.800private industry to develop these things what because there's like the the government saying
00:16:44.720we'll definitely pay you there's less risk so company so companies can take on more risk
00:16:48.880competition right no there has to be but like the government says here um i'll give you a billion
00:16:54.400dollars if you build uh a road or if you come up with a great design for a new nuclear reactor or
00:17:00.820something right um and then it says okay there's company a b and c and they all compete for that
00:17:05.480contract there's still competition there they're competing but they're competing for a government
00:17:09.380contract the government contract is funded by well the government the tax base or there's in the end
00:17:15.380like theoretically only one person would have the contract yeah one private company would probably
00:17:20.400get the contract but then once they have that money what we've seen in the past like the arrive
00:17:26.700can app was such a glaring example of this where the government literally paid millions and millions
00:17:31.300of dollars out yeah to one contractor for something that could have been done with like a hundred
00:17:36.220thousand dollars well yeah no i would know but i'm never gonna agree to anything that was like0.96
00:17:40.580obviously there was some collusion or corruption or it was just stupid but it's like i can't say0.99
00:17:45.680like there will always be stupid people and my goal is to like not have those people there but0.99
00:17:50.520in if we have efficient people running the economy efficiently uh making good resort making good0.98
00:17:55.960uh policies then i think it's i think it's good it's not generally bad and yeah i just had a
00:18:02.280question so you you said in the past in like a few minutes ago you said that trudeau was generally
00:18:07.460bad not an economist would you say that mark carney is better because he's like an economist
00:18:12.780Well, I'm not going to say, like, he's better just because he's an economist.
00:18:16.380I prefer his economic prescriptions as opposed to Trudeau, 100%.
00:18:19.820Okay, but, like, just looking at everything, though, he hasn't added a net positive to our economy.
00:18:26.940Like, even, okay, yes, you could say there's a trade war, but he's actually flaming that up for his own personal gains to, like, win by-elections and different things like that.
00:24:30.680So it's not necessarily like it's a more free market stimulating trade that we're going to have.
00:24:34.820It's going to be, oh, hey, let's we're going to collaborate on military and AI and quantum.
00:24:42.480But like that stuff we could do without being like more subject to like their membership rules or whatever they come up with.
00:24:50.320We're less subject to the membership rules than like a full membership.
00:24:54.320And I would agree with you. I really don't care what they call it.
00:24:56.200I think it's generally probably a good idea.
00:24:58.400a regard like a generally a good idea i don't really care for the label it doesn't really
00:25:01.980matter to me i hope they do a visa-free labor i think that would be quite helpful for the economy
00:25:05.940okay um i mean like we're okay you were thinking visa-free free labor but the the immigration
00:25:13.160minister now is saying hey let's increase immigration again we need to stimulate the
00:25:17.420economy let's increase immigration but we don't have jobs for enough people what are your thoughts
00:25:22.260on that um i don't think we should blindly increase immigration immigration in a lot of
00:25:26.580ways can be very beneficial for the economy uh uh specifically right now i'm not sure um i'd be
00:25:32.780more open to like the uh having like uh easier uh in uh easy labor be able to easily uh move from
00:25:41.420europe to canada and vice versa because there's a lot of highly skilled labor yeah um there's a
00:25:45.920there's a lot of highly skilled labor and we may need that because we uh to to build out
00:25:49.620infrastructure to well i'm thinking you the eu might not have a surplus of skilled labor right
00:25:56.820right right now they're right now they have a huge amount of immigration as well so they're
00:26:01.980they're trying to pour a lot of people into their economy but it doesn't mean they don't have enough
00:26:05.440they don't have enough skilled labor they could have an over amount of they could have uh too
00:26:09.300much skilled labor and they could also have too much general immigration those two things they're
00:26:13.560not mutually exclusive okay but do you think that like again just to go back to the eu thing
00:26:23.600and the fact that we're trying to be a associate member when i talk to europeans who're like
00:26:29.480whoa i'm from germany please don't join the eu their regulations they will put you in a box you
00:26:35.500will be subject to their regulations don't do it in any way no partnership just just trade like i
00:26:40.960When I talk to people from Poland or Yugoslavia or like anywhere in France, even like they're saying, don't join the EU.
00:26:47.060Their court is above your court and everything else. Right.0.97
00:26:49.980So if we join the EU with associate member, we would probably like almost certainly have to comply with regulations in the areas we collaborate with.
00:26:58.260But we wouldn't be able to vote. These are all things that we we don't really know.
00:27:02.180If once we have the deal that's like kind of present, we can read through it, then I can really give an opinion on that.
00:27:08.640These are like hypotheticals that may or may not happen.
00:27:11.520And we probably have different ideas of how probable some aspects are.
00:27:15.460I don't think we're going to reconcile on that.
00:27:16.980I think it would be better to just have a conversation once we know the details there.
00:27:21.440I'm not going to speculate because I don't know.
00:27:24.260We could speculate a little bit, though, on what we've seen with other countries that have associate sort of members.
00:27:38.140i don't think we'd have the same deal as ukraine um it would just be like okay um do i want to be
00:27:43.000subject to all the same regulations probably not i'd have to look through them um i would i'm in
00:27:48.460favor of a deal that i generally think would be beneficial for the canadian economy and have and
00:27:53.820add a more rope and have the canadian economy become more robust i would be against things
00:27:58.340that would threaten that so it really does depend uh i would have to see what's gonna happen yeah
00:28:04.640that's that that's really what i can say on that really like again i don't know how much is actually
00:28:10.520going to stimulate the economy because already 99 of what we trade is tariff free so it's like
00:28:15.980flowing yeah but we're also the thing is though we're also decreasing trade with america so we're
00:28:20.980trying to increase trade ties with the u up and with europe and with asia and that requires some
00:28:26.740like soft power that requires mingling you know um and that may require new um legal infrastructure
00:28:32.740for how do we import all this this new oil these new natural resources that we have i don't know
00:28:37.540if there's a lot of uh there's not a lot of legislation involved with that right now because
00:28:41.880that hasn't been a big thing we've kind of done a majority of our trade especially natural minerals
00:28:45.940with the u.s but that is ceasing so we're going to have to if we want to engage with europe in
00:28:50.420like an optimal way we're going to have to kind of figure that out and that's a big unknown so i
00:28:55.200think getting a little closer and integrating more with them will make it easier to communicate
00:28:59.040what our economies can do to work together and that's that's my basic opinion um because we're
00:29:05.240reducing trade uh reducing trade with the u.s if that trade has to go somewhere and we want to
00:29:09.660increase the amount of trade as well so we're gonna have to well build new ties with europe
00:29:13.380build new ties with asia and you know with the rest of the world okay i would say though like
00:29:18.300we can end on this because we might have to go but um the way i see things is that yes we should
00:29:25.360diversify our trade and see who we can trade more with and different things like that but like i'm0.87
00:29:30.720iffy on trading with china simply because they are very they're aggressive they're communists0.81
00:29:34.500they have a lot of propaganda they're already trying to infiltrate our economy i see them as0.89
00:29:38.000more of a threat than the united states even so from where i see things i don't think i think it
00:29:43.600would actually be destructive to our economy right now to try to deliberately cut like trade ties
00:29:48.380off with the united states and like reduce trade i don't think we're trying to deliberately cut
00:29:52.200but if america is giving us a bad deal and we say no i don't like that deal i don't know if
00:29:56.600that's deliberate they're kind of the aggressor and then we're we have the ability to say yes or
00:30:00.840no and if it's not a good deal saying no i wouldn't frame it as like we're trying to cut off
00:30:05.140i think carney he would be like guys it would be awesome if we could just go back to normal
00:30:09.220i think if you gave him that option i think he'd do it because it would make the yeah everything
00:30:13.280more stable i mean what i've seen with the trade deal that they were offered like again i'm not
00:30:21.260saying that this would be good for us to necessarily like accept but trump was like uh you need to
00:30:26.500remove certain free speech regulations that you have in canada and we want to have some say in
00:30:31.580who else you trade with like think about that like he's telling us to how we should run our
00:30:35.580economy or how we should some some thing that's completely exclusive from our economy it's like
00:30:41.720guys you gotta you gotta change how you talk about free speech that has nothing to do with
00:30:45.540the economy these are like these are these are like it's like a marketing play i don't see he
00:30:50.640doesn't really care um that that's like a very why would i ever let think about why would i ever
00:30:56.140let a foreign power dictate to art dictate to me how we should run our country i don't like that
00:31:01.820framing would you want that framing would you want china telling us hey hey but that makes no sense
00:31:07.160then why he went to the eu when they're signing trade deals where the eu would have some regulation
00:31:12.740and say in who we trade no that isn't i can i amer wait the europe europe is saying that we
00:31:19.320can't trade with america if we become associate member or like certain deals that he's looking
00:31:24.260at sending right now they would have say in who we trade with i wouldn't like that idea i don't
00:31:29.800know if that's true or false i don't know if that will or will not happen i don't like that idea so
00:31:34.020if that's the case i don't like that but if that's not the case then i don't really care i know it's
00:31:37.660just i feel like it's it's hypocritical of us to be like oh i don't think it's hypocritical because
00:31:42.180because here's the thing trump did say this the thing you brought up with the eu is like i don't
00:31:46.340know if that's true there is no concrete deal there's no deal or there's no deal yet so if that
00:31:51.600does happen and that is what he signed with something that would be hypocritical if it was
00:31:55.440something like that but also it's a little it's a little different because that's even then i still
00:32:01.520don't like that but it's a little different saying oh this is an economic deal so you can't uh partake
00:32:05.520in some economic action trump said you uh to have this economic deal go through you need to take
00:32:10.620some political action that's different it would be like trump saying oh um to to get this trade
00:32:16.520deal passed canada you have to amend your constitution what i don't like that i'm not
00:32:20.500i don't want a foreign power telling me what i can and cannot do yeah and i understand that
00:32:23.900would you do you disagree with that no like i don't think he should have i don't think he should
00:32:28.100be telling us how to run our country but at the same time let's look at what he was telling us to
00:32:33.120do remove some anti-free speech no i don't i'm a very free speech i'm a free speech proponent but
00:32:39.480But I'm just saying, on the actual, on just the general case of some guy, some foreign power telling us what we can and cannot do with our political system, I don't like that at all.
00:32:54.600But I do think if a foreign power cares enough about what we're saying in our country, like the free speech that we have in our country, then I think it should give us pause to be like, okay.