00:00:00.000and all of a sudden now the rate payers are on the hook for large cost increases.
00:00:04.720We don't want any of that to happen in Alberta. The government of Alberta doesn't want that.
00:00:08.560And so Albertans would be right to say, hey, if you're going to do it that way, we don't want it.
00:00:12.320The good news is we're never going to do it that way. We took the time to do the homework. We spent
00:00:17.200the better part of the last two years developing a regulatory framework that's clear, fair and
00:00:21.440competitive. And AI data centers, if they're going to move forward in Alberta, they have to pay their
00:00:27.680own way today in this video we're going to be joined by alberta's technology and innovation
00:00:39.120minister nate glubish he sat down with me for a little bit and we talked about alberta's plans
00:00:44.480to expand into the industry and we talked about the concerns that a lot of people have
00:00:50.080largely focused on the amount of water that is needed to help cool these facilities and the mass
00:00:56.720amount of electricity required to fuel facilities thank you for joining me here today and i have
00:01:03.760minister nate glubish he oversees the ministry of technology and innovation mr glubish thanks
00:01:08.720for joining me today thanks for having me well i appreciate um you taking the time and uh we're
00:01:15.760gonna talk to a little bit today about ai data centers it's uh something that's talked a lot
00:01:20.240about here in Alberta and something I want to talk like ask you first is so in Alberta there's
00:01:28.320been a lot of talk from the UCP about needing to diversify Alberta's economy and for a long time
00:01:33.760it's been reliant upon oil and gas and there's been a real uptick lately under Premier Smith
00:01:41.120of talking about AI data centers and really making that something that we can push towards and so I
00:01:46.240guess my first question is why are ai data centers one of those things that alberta
00:01:52.000thinks that that this is what we should hitch our wagon to and really try and diversify ourselves
00:01:56.160into well a few reasons will i think you know one is uh as an mla i i hear all the time from
00:02:05.440albertans who say nate why don't we build more refineries in this province why don't we add
00:02:09.680more value to our raw materials before we ship it to other jurisdictions and capture more of the
00:02:15.840value for the benefit of Albertans? That's a great question. And ultimately, that's what data
00:02:22.520centers are. They're basically a digital refinery. Because think about it, we're taking the natural
00:02:27.100gas, we're upgrading it to electricity and adding value to it. We're taking the electricity and
00:02:32.040upgrading it and turning it into intelligence, and that adds significant value. And then we can
00:02:37.240export that intelligence all around the world through fiber to global markets as much higher
00:02:44.560value product. So this is an opportunity for Albertans to create a global market for our
00:02:51.400natural gas. But instead of just shipping the raw product, we're now shipping an upgraded version
00:02:56.340of that in intelligence and creating more wealth domestically here for the benefit of Albertans.
00:03:03.100So this is an economic diversification play. It is an expansion of our traditional oil and gas
00:03:09.560sector uh and it's going to create a ton of jobs here and a ton of revenues here to help fund
00:03:16.200critical services that albertans rely on like health care education and public safety um yeah
00:03:22.280data centers there's something that's really over the last couple of years they're really starting
00:03:25.800to pop up and really starting to become more and more popular but can you walk me through a little
00:03:30.280bit of the process for alberta and deciding this is where we really want to invest a lot of our
00:03:35.080focus into expanding the industry what that process is like well i think alberta has always
00:03:40.440been a global leader in ai research you know for the last 20 25 years uh we are renowned all around
00:03:47.720the world for the research we have at the alberta machine intelligence institute um and uh we're
00:03:54.280quickly becoming recognized as a north american expert uh among public service uh users of ai
00:04:01.160You know, we recently were able to develop some enterprise grade applications for the Department of Infrastructure using some AI tools that we had built.
00:04:10.500And we saved the taxpayer $52 million on that project compared to the traditional procurement process.
00:04:17.700And this is starting to happen every single day.
00:04:20.260So there's the opportunity to save tons of taxpayer dollars to deliver higher quality services, to reduce the time it takes to get permits across the finish line, to improve the quality of our health care system.
00:04:35.740It can transform every industry and make it more productive.
00:04:39.160But in order for that to succeed, you have to have the physical infrastructure as well.
00:04:43.720And that's the data centers and the power generation that support it.
00:04:47.340So, you know, we figured we're great at research, we're great at using AI to save Albertans money, and we also have the energy that the world needs. So it's a great combination of factors in Alberta that positions us well to be an AI superpower.
00:05:06.360um this week in rockyview county there was a they uh passed the moratorium uh there the council did
00:05:15.400there and they voted to put a pause on any uh projects or developments for um ai data centers
00:05:22.520and that expansion and they expressed some concerns they wanted to pause it until they
00:05:28.280can really develop a plan and some instructions for all of this um and you're seeing more and more
00:05:35.400of these situations where across north america and really the world but especially north america
00:05:41.960more places are voting against ai data centers or people are raising concerns about them are they
00:05:48.920right to have concerns look i think it's if folks are right to have concerns because they've seen
00:05:54.680examples in other jurisdictions where folks rushed in they didn't do their due diligence
00:06:00.040They didn't structure the deal well. And they provided subsidies. They paid for electrical
00:06:09.960generation and transmission infrastructure. And all of a sudden, now the ratepayers were on the
00:06:16.360hook for large cost increases. We don't want any of that to happen in Alberta. The government of
00:06:21.560Alberta doesn't want that. And so Albertans would be right to say, hey, if you're going to do it
00:06:25.480that way, we don't want it. The good news is we're never going to do it that way. We took the time
00:06:29.880to do the homework. We spent the better part of the last two years developing a regulatory
00:06:33.900framework that's clear, fair, and competitive. And AI data centers, if they're going to move
00:06:40.440forward in Alberta, they have to pay their own way. They're going to have to bring their own
00:06:43.580generation. They're going to have to pay for any connection fees into the grid. So Albertans will
00:06:50.580not pay a dime for the electrical infrastructure required for data centers. We're doing it
00:06:57.380differently in Alberta. We didn't want to be first. We wanted to be the smartest. And so my message to
00:07:02.820the folks in Rocky View is, look, most of the concerns that you've raised with your counselors
00:07:07.380are good criticisms and concerns. The good news is in Alberta, we already have answers to those
00:07:13.020concerns. We've already protected you from those kinds of scenarios. So my goal is to work with
00:07:19.060Rocky View counselors and make sure that they have all the information they need to make well-informed
00:07:22.500decisions and uh my commitment to albertans is that we only want projects that are good for
00:07:27.460all albertans and that makes sense and that are uh responsibly developed that's our focus
00:07:32.420as a provincial government um i remember so on saturday uh this past saturday the premier on
00:07:39.540a radio show had someone call in they're from california and they called in and asked the
00:07:44.100premier why alberta was investing 13 billion dollars to build a data center for sturgeon
00:07:50.100county um and um i think it really to me um capsize something of there's a lot of there's things that
00:07:57.460get said about ai data centers and there's a lot of noise about them online um and it can create
00:08:02.580some misconceptions and a lot of noise on it what do you think is one of the biggest misconceptions
00:08:07.780around ai data centers right now uh that albertans and that people yeah i should realize with it well
00:08:14.820first of all i want to be perfectly clear alberta is not spending a dime on data centers uh because
00:08:20.660we don't need to right you know we have what the world needs we have an abundance of energy
00:08:24.980and we have a a a a good uh a good reputation as a province that can get things done we have a
00:08:32.980track record of building big industrial things like the oil sands and petrochemical plants like
00:08:37.460the dow plant up in the fort saskatchewan region um so so we already have what the world needs we
00:08:45.620don't need to go and subsidize it we don't need to give away taxpayer dollars to attract this
00:08:49.380investment and that was really important to me right from the get-go we were very clear we will
00:08:53.540not put alberta taxpayer dollars on the line uh we talked a little bit about the power generation
00:08:59.300side of things that that's a an area where folks often have missed some misinformation so
00:09:04.020uh you know we made it very clear bring your own generation pay your own way 100 you pay 100 full
00:09:09.540freight of what it takes in order to build your infrastructure here uh if you do that we'll
00:09:13.700welcome you uh as a great corporate citizen in alberta if you don't then you're probably not
00:09:18.980going to see your project move forward here uh another big one is water a lot of folks ask
00:09:23.700questions to say hey we've heard stories of data centers in the u.s that use tons and tons of water
00:09:28.020for cooling and running their operations um the good news is that modern cooling technology is
00:09:35.040so efficient uh they use these uh closed loop liquid cooling systems so you fill it once and
00:09:41.040you run it like a radiator and it and it pulls the heat out of the system and then it takes
00:09:45.100advantage of our cold weather climate here where you basically get free dry cooling uh and it's
00:09:50.920far more efficient far more cost effective that's one of the reasons why these companies like alberta
00:09:55.680and uh as a result they're they're all they they don't consume water in the cooling process
00:10:02.680so the the meta data center site up in sturgeon county is actually going to use less water
00:10:08.660annually than the average golf course does so it's completely different than the the case studies
00:10:14.600that folks look to in the u.s where there's significant water usage that's not going to
00:10:18.780happen up here um for the meta example and it kind of it applies to everything but um so it'll
00:10:27.460use less than what a golf course would use annually but the idea of um taking it to fill like to fill
00:10:36.400the closed loop to begin with it'll come correct me if i'm wrong it'll come in a lump sum though
00:10:40.520to be able to fill it right so what is done to make sure that alberta's water supply is able to
00:10:46.860take that big chunk away at once in one moment, if that makes sense, kind of what I'm asking.
00:10:53.440Well, the initial fill is negligible, right? It's just filling the pipes inside of their
00:10:57.980system once. That's not going to be a shock to the system. But to your point, what protections
00:11:03.840do we have? Well, first of all, nobody can access water in Alberta without having a license.
00:11:08.600And nobody gets a license unless all the appropriate checks and balances have been met.
00:11:13.620And so, you know, our priority as a government is to ensure that water is protected, that, you know, citizens access to water for drinking water and for the household use is protected.
00:11:24.580And nothing like a data center like MEDAS is going to in any way compromise that.
00:11:31.180And then for the actual ongoing operations, you know, these sites are going to use such a small amount of water that we know that our system can support it.
00:11:42.660You know, again, the county of Sturgeon County has over a dozen golf courses.
00:11:47.700So this is this is I mean, for a bad pun, this is par for the course.
00:11:51.600This is something that we're very used to and that the system can absolutely sustain.
00:11:57.300One of the things when Meta got announced, Meta and the government talked about how it was going to bring its own power and there was going to be the accompanying natural gas pipeline that was going to play a big role in fueling this.
00:12:09.360but uh there was also something that individuals have raised concerns about about what's going to
00:12:16.800power the um the data center until the pipe or until the natural gas until everything is up and
00:12:23.520running i believe uh there was about a two-year break there um in between when it's scheduled to
00:12:30.400open and when the pipeline will be ready so how's that all going to work yeah so this this this
00:12:37.040project is a phased project so it's not going to be fully built immediately it's going to be built
00:12:41.920in stages the initial stage is going to be grid powered meta went through an extensive process
00:12:47.680to secure an allocation from the grid operator the grid operator had committed a certain amount
00:12:53.920of power for data center projects and meta was one of the proponents that secured that allocation
00:13:01.200what's important for albertans to to take away from this is that the grid operator did extensive
00:13:06.640of engineering and research to say how much excess capacity do we have in the grid and how much of
00:13:12.440that excess capacity could we safely allocate to data centers so that we are confident that it will
00:13:17.320not compromise reliability to our grid. And so they've made sure that there's a ceiling to how
00:13:26.500much power they were willing to offer. And Meta was able to secure a portion of that. And that's
00:13:32.720So that's going to power the first phases until they get their new power plant up and running and get the new gas supply into the region.
00:13:39.840So you can think of it, this is a bit of a catalyst to say, get your foot in the door, get the project started, attract the investment and the commitment.
00:13:45.900And that comes with Meta spending four and a half billion dollars with Pembina and Kineticor to build an 1800 megawatt power plant on their own dime.
00:13:55.400This is good news for Albertans. It's going to build more capacity to the electrical system in the province.
00:14:01.780and the best part is that Alberta ratepayers didn't have to pay for it.
00:14:06.480I'm curious on, so you mentioned that they went through and calculated how much grid power could
00:14:13.500be allocated to data centers. What is being done to make sure that once they're connected,
00:14:20.320once they're up and running, that there's X amount that's available to these data centers
00:14:27.620and they're not going over that x amount well first of all anybody who secures an allocation
00:14:32.900from the grid whether they're a data center or a business of any kind any kind of industrial business
00:14:37.700they have a contract with the grid operator and that contract stipulates what they're allowed to
00:14:42.420access and what they're not allowed to access and that's strictly enforced those rules have not
00:14:47.220changed those rules have served us well you know as i said we have a reputation of building big
00:14:51.780industrial things uh the albert industrial heartlands a great example of that with the
00:14:55.700petrochemical complex there all of those facilities use a lot of power all of those go through the
00:15:01.140grid process and we've been able to manage that for decades responsibly that same management
00:15:06.580process will apply here one of the things that we are doing going forward as new proposals continue
00:15:16.740to come forward is to say that any anybody who comes under the next round of allocations from
00:15:22.500the grid there will be an interoperability feature baked into their contract which would essentially
00:15:29.380say that if there is a grid event where you know we have a a perfect storm of of things going wrong
00:15:37.940that these large industrial loads like data centers would be the first things to be curtailed
00:15:43.780um and that that'll be in in the agreement right up right up front so you know our commitment to
00:15:48.820Albertans is, again, we didn't want to be first. We didn't want to compromise the grid. We didn't
00:15:54.700want to bring costs to Albertans. So we are designing our systems to make sure that we
00:15:59.040hard code protections for Albertans right from the beginning. And we're going to make sure that
00:16:03.440we protect that grid. And then last one here for you. I know you have to get running, but my final
00:16:09.560question would be, what is the government doing? Or are you guys looking to do anything to try and
00:16:13.680help educate Albertans on data centers and what Alberta is kind of getting themselves into right
00:16:21.440now. I know the NDP are holding town halls and they're going to be going around Alberta having
00:16:25.640these interactions. Is the UCP planning anything of this or are they doing anything to try and help
00:16:29.560Albertans? Well, we've already done a few town halls. Premier does her regular radio call-in
00:16:36.220show. I did a town hall in Olds. We'll be doing some more town halls going forward here.
00:16:41.700uh you know look we know a lot of folks have questions and they're right to be asking these
00:16:47.440questions as we've mentioned there's some case studies in the u.s where some poor execution led
00:16:53.120to projects that were not in the public interest uh we are confident that we have done the homework
00:16:59.780to uh put forward the right protections uh that safeguard albertans interests and we're not afraid
00:17:06.940get out there and have that conversation with albertans so uh you know we welcome feedback from
00:17:12.540albertans and our my goal is just to make sure that we can give folks the best information
00:17:17.100possible so that uh you know if they have the concerns they can they can see what we have done
00:17:23.100to address those concerns and my hope is that that's going to reassure folks and uh and um
00:17:29.100ensure that they're not uh worried unnecessarily well thank you minister thank you for taking the
00:17:34.060time to chat with us today and look forward to seeing what's coming ahead with Alberta and the
00:17:38.220AI data centers. Thanks Will, appreciate your time. And there you have it. Minister Nate Gloobis
00:17:44.060joined me and we talked about AI data centers and how Alberta wants to become the smartest
00:17:49.980jurisdiction to enter the AI data center realm, not the fastest to do so. So good conversation
00:17:59.100with him. Hopefully you guys enjoyed it. And I want to thank Minister Glubish for taking the
00:18:04.680time to sit down with me for this discussion. And as I mentioned, I've already written a story
00:18:11.020on this article. If you haven't already checked it out, go check it out on the Western Standard
00:18:15.480website. It's there. Add a little more detail to the interview and there's a great way for you to
00:18:21.420take it in and look at what Minister Glubish talked about. But in order to do so, in order to
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00:19:17.840minister glubish had to say about alberta's venture into the ai data industry did you enjoy
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