Arizona leaders at the state and federal level are calling for investigations into armed civilian patrols along the state s border with Mexico. At issue is the safety of the people on the border, and the legality of the so-called militia groups formed out of frustration at the inability of the U.S. border patrol to slow illegal immigration from Mexico.
00:00:38.000Arizona leaders at the state and federal level are calling for investigators, investigations into armed civilian patrols along the state's border with Mexico.
00:00:48.000At issue is the safety of the people on the border.
00:00:50.000And the legality of the so-called militia groups formed out of frustration at the inability of the U.S.
00:00:56.000border agents to slow illegal immigration from Mexico.
00:00:59.000Now, millions a year, just right there in Cochise County, we've had the newspaper editor on who called for the militia to be formed.
00:01:07.000Last week, we covered the Arizona Republic news reports, and we're now joined by Congressman Grill Halva.
00:01:14.000Congressman, thank you for coming on the show today to talk about your concerns.
00:01:22.000So, exactly what's happening and you're quoted here saying you're very concerned about this.
00:01:28.000I think the rhetoric you're hearing from some of the leaders of these groups is very dangerous to the overall security of the region.
00:01:33.000You said the potential for violence is escalating and I think the whole situation has to be investigated.
00:01:39.000Yeah, those were the comments and I think it's It's uh... you know the whole border region is is uh... is a national problem and and uh... you know that
00:01:52.000uh... an agreement that the the policy in place to fail whatever perspective
00:02:41.000We know that if you or I try to sneak across the Mexican border, we'll get shot, or if we're lucky, end up six months in a dirt floor jail.
00:02:50.000So, you know, to hear that, oh, you know, the Americans are being abusive, I mean, I'm a Texan.
00:02:56.000I've been across the border many times with Mexico.
00:02:59.000No, it's not a question of accepting, sir.
00:03:01.000with the federalism mexican troops and the rest of it i mean
00:03:04.000uh... bush has called more border patrol off that area of your area of
00:03:09.000of arizona dot all over the news what are the people supposed to do there just just accept
00:03:14.000uh... that's a little bit no it's not a question of accepting sir it's a quick
00:04:09.000There's discussions, financial discussions occurring today between the Bush administration and the Fox administration on the issue.
00:04:15.000But we have a complex problem that a simplistic attitude of calling Picking up arms is not going to solve, and all it does is acclimate it.
00:04:24.000But that's what the Mexican troops do.
00:04:26.000They pick up arms all the time, and people try to interfere with drug shipments.
00:04:30.000And they're shooting people, running around shooting at vehicles.
00:04:34.000They've been captured coming across the border ten miles.
00:04:37.000I mean, Mexico, everybody whines about what the U.S.
00:04:42.000Well, there's a joint responsibility here.
00:04:45.000That's why the discussions have to be bi-national.
00:04:50.000If those behaviors that you're illustrating to me are indeed true, that still begs the question, should then our civilian side and the American side take up that same kind of behavior?
00:06:20.000The issue is that The issue that you're specifically asking about, the whole policy of migration and immigration, and what we're doing about it, has been a neglected issue in the Southwest and all over this country.
00:06:31.000It's not just happening here, it happens... But it's not neglected, it's a policy to leave the border wide open.
00:06:36.000How come they say, give up your right to homeland security?
00:06:38.000Let's examine for a second the policy that's in place now.
00:06:43.000The policy of containment, the policy of sealing the border, the policy of gatekeeper, the policy of putting up walls, Now, if that deterrent that was seen as the way to do it, and if we follow your logic to seal that border, has that worked?
00:07:09.000The issue is much more complex and needs a much broader, comprehensive approach to it, and we're not doing that.
00:07:15.000The ball has been dropped at many levels.
00:07:18.000And one of the levels that's been dropped is at the national level with this Congress.
00:07:22.000And now, belatedly, this administration is beginning to understand that if we don't deal with this problem, this problem is just going to get worse and worse.
00:07:29.000Yeah, but the way that you and Vicente Fox, as I'm reading some of your other quotes from your other story, is to give more amnesty, which will only take another 20 million people up here and our infrastructure can't... This is legalizing a reality.
00:07:58.000It's a reality that our government is becoming as tyrannical as the Mexican government.
00:08:03.000Or the Venezuelan government, or the Chilean government, and I'm really freaked out about it.
00:08:08.000I have to tell you, I mean, I'm so worried about America, I might move down to Costa Rica.
00:08:12.000It's not that I don't want to be around Latin people, it's that I don't want to be around a government that has two tiers in society, and, I mean, it's going to destroy our wages, destroy our infrastructure, to have this $400 million coming this way.
00:08:27.000Well, I think the number's exaggerated, sir.
00:08:29.000With all due respect, there's not $400 million coming this way.
00:08:32.000The issue is... Yeah, $20 million every year!
00:08:35.000No, I don't think that number's correct.
00:08:38.000I think the issue of legalization, the issue of unification of families, the issue of the guest worker program and temporary workers are all issues that are on the table because there is no other way to deal with this issue other than to accept the reality.
00:08:53.000Congressman, isn't this really about a Pan-American Union?
00:08:55.000I mean, Bush has got the colored money coming out next year.
00:08:58.000They're talking about the Amaro in the mainstream news.
00:09:00.000Isn't this talking about just getting rid of sovereignty of all these countries?
00:09:42.000So, I'm just showing how ultra-out-of-control, uh, you know, Bush just got one of the most draconian gun control bills ever seen passed through the House.
00:09:49.000I mean, you'll probably agree with that legislation.
00:09:54.000I just agree with the Brady Bill, and I agree with background checks, and I agree that gun shows should require the same background checks.
00:10:18.000You know, one of the things that came up that I'd like to see is I'd like to see the Assets of the Mexican government in the United States frozen and then distributed to all the victims, criminal victims, by the Mexican government, you know, so that we see our hospitals funded.
00:10:34.000You know, we see all the people that have been hurt and all the damage that these illegals are causing, you know, paid for by the Mexican government.
00:10:40.000I wonder if you could do that in Congress and see too that it gets done.
00:10:44.000The other thing, American people here in Tucson, they know about La Raza and the Hazardland.
00:10:49.000And they know that the Mexican government is encouraging the illegals to basically push out the Americans so that they can get the land back to Mexico.
00:10:58.000I've been to some of these meetings and aired some of the tapes.
00:11:01.000And the president beforehand said this is all one big region, one country.
00:11:06.000And Oslon and this Mecha thing they call for, do you believe Texas and California and all this are part of a mythical kingdom of crystal pyramids controlled by the Aztecs?
00:11:18.000But the issue here is that, you know, I don't think this issue needs to be dominated by the kind of stereotyping and prejudices that the one caller did and some of the comments that you've made.
00:13:09.000So, I think a lot of people are getting involved in this racially.
00:13:13.000People who never thought of themselves racially are... I mean, certainly there are white supremacists, there are black supremacists, there are Hispanic supremacists.
00:13:23.000Are you saying there isn't a movement in Metro that calls for that?
00:13:27.000No, my familiarity with what MECHA is doing, and has done, is they talk about political empowerment, they talk about educational achievement, they talk about history, they talk about identity, they talk about diversity.
00:13:41.000I consider all those things to be legitimate points.
00:13:44.000Yeah, their history is that Aztecs, a god race, ran Texas, Colorado, New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, California.
00:13:55.000I believe that, yeah, I think there's a link between Mexico and the Southwest.
00:13:59.000There always has been, and always will continue to be.
00:14:02.000I thought it was, uh, the Indians of this country are completely different from the Aztecs that were horrible, bloodthirsty Indians that sacrificed people and grabbed up and killed other Indian populations.
00:14:13.000I don't think they were very well loved by the Indians.
00:14:18.000So you, were you a member of Mecha in college?
00:14:21.000Yeah, when I was at the University of Arizona I was.
00:14:35.000So, you think it's bad to have citizens... What about the patrols on their own ranches?
00:14:39.000You think it's bad for folks to arrest people on their own property?
00:14:44.000I mean, I can do that in my own home or in my backyard at night.
00:14:47.000They shouldn't be able to do it on their own ranches?
00:14:49.000Yeah, the issue of protecting your private property.
00:14:51.000But I think the issue has gone way beyond there when you are having a national call-to-arm And inviting people from throughout the country to come into the region and patrol and to be armed and to serve as a civilian patrol and a civilian militia.
00:15:06.000That's gone way beyond the categorization of simply protecting one's property.
00:15:11.000Why do you think Bush called the Border Patrol two of the teens out of Cochise?
00:15:21.000For deployment reasons somewhere else, but I don't have a good answer for that, no.
00:15:25.000Well certainly, you know Cochise is one of the biggest areas in the country where they're pouring across.
00:15:32.000The whole region along the southwest is an area in which, you know, we have a region here in the part of my district where 170 people have died in the desert.
00:15:42.000Well, now the government's putting water stations up, so that's... And I believe that's totally appropriate.
00:16:46.000Are you saying it's a conspiracy theory to say Mexican troops are routinely shooting at Border Patrol and shooting at vehicles?
00:16:51.000Those individual incidents, as I said earlier, does not beg the question of if that individual incident... Well, what's the conspiracy theory?
00:17:01.000...then that does not give Anyone in the right can commit those things.
00:17:15.000I'm talking about documented stuff here.
00:17:17.000There's documented stuff on these militias as well that you don't highlight.
00:17:21.000The documented stuff of their meetings where the whole tone is racist, where the whole tone is white supremacist tone, where things Uh, Nazi literature is handed out.
00:17:32.000Well, you know, I want to give you a chance to talk about that.
00:17:34.000You said it was a few minutes before you want to go.
00:17:36.000I don't bring up those examples because those are... Do you have to leave as congressman or do you want to stay?