Based Camp - Muslim Heaven Is WAY More Psycho Than You Think

00:00:00.000 Hello Simone! I'm excited to be here with you today. Today we are going to learn what Muslims

00:00:04.640 believe happens in heaven. And here I do not mean Western Muslims or apologist Muslims. I wanted to 0.87

00:00:11.620 get an understanding of what your standard Afghani man, Pakistani man would believe is going to

00:00:18.100 happen to them after they die. And it is way crazier than you think and it reframes for me 0.57

00:00:23.980 why muslims in islamic culture and far progressive culture get along so well

00:00:30.660 what so first just a few to throw out some crazies here if i were to convert to islam 0.98

00:00:38.240 okay when i die you would believe and i would believe that i get at least one additional wife 0.94

00:00:47.720 no i'm okay with that no muslim man in heaven has fewer than two wives so wait wait if i

00:00:55.860 an islamic woman a believer choose to marry a man i know that i'm gonna have a sister wife 0.97

00:01:03.200 in heaven at least absolutely there is no getting around it and unless he goes to hell do i get a 0.99

00:01:09.040 no no no no even if he goes to hell you when you get to heaven get married to a believing muslim 0.98

00:01:15.000 man as an extra one of his wives and he will have at least two wives wait hold no woman in heaven 0.98

00:01:21.520 is in a relationship with a man without a sister you can't be a female single in heaven not allowed 0.79

00:01:28.540 you're not allowed to be single and not allowed to be single and if a woman's like but what if i 0.89

00:01:33.760 don't want that like what if i get jealous what muslims believe is a satisfying answer is well 0.89

00:01:40.220 god just brainwashes you into being okay with it so you don't even know everyone's kind of poly in

00:01:46.380 heaven it's fine he messes with your brain so that you no longer experience jealousy everyone belongs

00:01:52.840 to everyone else yeah no that really does feel like one of those scary like the faculty or

00:01:58.260 something like that where i think to an american mindset especially like a backwards american

00:02:03.120 mindset if somebody comes to you and they're like there'll be no pain there'll be no suffering

00:02:08.520 there'll be no and it's like but it's not me anymore it's something else yeah it is so much

00:02:15.560 better there's no fear or pain it's beautiful and you will be beautiful no problems or worries

00:02:25.600 we want you 1.00

00:02:27.700 no pain stan we're gonna come in here and i'll show you some fucking pain 1.00

00:02:34.740 you're gonna kill me is what you're trying to say other crazy facts about heaven okay well the number 1.00

00:02:41.440 of additional wives i get so the crazy thing is if you help me be an extra good muslim man 0.99

00:02:45.920 the better i am as a muslim man the better you make me as my wife the more additional wives you

00:02:52.800 need to deal with oh man and the the 72 wives that martyrs get right you can get way over 72 wives 0.85

00:03:02.000 oh some men live in tents where there's so many women wait all you get in heaven is a tent

00:03:08.940 or is this a fema heaven what what is this yeah i it's a we'll get to it's weird oh another thing

00:03:15.200 you can have babies in heaven and you can have a baby and you can make the gestation whatever

00:03:21.360 lengths you wish so you could make the gestation a day if you wanted to okay you could make the

00:03:27.400 gestation a week if you wanted to and then you could have them age at any speed you want

00:03:32.040 so there are no diapers in heaven if you don't want them okay oh well also all of your uncleanness 0.80

00:03:38.680 you don't menstruate anymore i think you don't pee or poo anymore oh no pooping in heaven but

00:03:43.600 what's really interesting about these babies born in heaven okay it's me is they have human souls

00:03:50.520 like they are actual human souled babies but they don't have to go through the trials that god made

00:03:56.780 all of the rest of humanity go through to get into this heaven which seems why did we all have

00:04:03.980 to go through it and these souls don't have to go through it it seems bizarre and unfair but

00:04:08.840 then again these people oh another fun one about women in heaven okay so muhammad said that when 0.53

00:04:15.700 he went to hell he saw many more women in hell than men hell was a majority female hell is female

00:04:22.080 that's far fewer females so you know straight no how is that pot there cannot be far fewer 0.93

00:04:27.840 females because every man has all these wives well this is mathematically impossible hold on 0.99

00:04:33.800 because a lot of these wives might be who ares or who are uh who are who it sounds like whores 0.97

00:04:41.760 okay but it's spelled like h-u-r-o something the point being from now on we need to spell 0.97

00:04:47.660 whores that way is they are constructed beings that are not fully human and they are meant to 1.00

00:04:55.560 look like young beautiful maidens so they're sex bots you have they are sex bots yeah and the 0.99

00:05:01.360 hadith spends a lot of time talking about like how nice their breasts are and that they're they're 0.99

00:05:07.900 real dolls there are real dolls and you know you as a man get infinite stamina for sex explicitly 0.98

00:05:14.700 it says infinite stamina for sex wait i thought this is one of the circles of hell this is this

00:05:21.060 is lust why are we lust maxing in heaven well actually this is the point i'm gonna get to 0.92

00:05:26.840 it made me realize that islam is above all else a max hedonism religion yeah no kidding like i mean 0.98

00:05:35.400 no other religion is like yeah you get all the sex bots you want in heaven right like you're like 1.00

00:05:41.140 well don't worry in heaven you'll be stripped of this licentiousness and these these basal drives

00:05:46.440 you can rise above and and yeah they're like don't worry the entire point of all of this 0.76

00:05:52.460 is to be super freaking infinite heaven sex and then have all the babies you want and getting

00:05:58.940 this is well what kind of i mean that's the i i'm speechless i'm actually this is where i think it 0.80

00:06:07.580 it works pretty interesting with technopuritanism no no because the twain shall never meet i'm

00:06:14.380 seeing that we are incompatible well hold on hold on you might see we're more compatible

00:06:18.240 okay sure explain this to me so within the technopuritan afterlife we haven't done our

00:06:24.700 full afterlife track series yet but i do have the research notes for it because i've been doing a

00:06:29.040 lot of research on it recently and people know we think that you're going to be raised again into a

00:06:34.000 new body and that that body will likely, because it's described in the Bible as being neither

00:06:39.400 physical nor spiritual, likely some form of simulation in an artificial environment that's

00:06:44.900 given. And so the question is, what are those environments like? And we know that some people

00:06:50.060 are given work in heaven and some people reign over others in heaven and some people reign over

00:06:55.780 cities in heaven. And so what does that mean? And so what it could mean is that heaven is sort of

00:07:00.600 like a tiered system it's very clear that souls are tiered in traditional christian heaven and so

00:07:04.520 in techno puritan heaven yes this is our weird belief system for people who do not know but what

00:07:09.080 because it says that some people can be like angels we would think well some people if you're

00:07:12.760 like good enough in this series of simulations you leave the simulation and you re-enter future

00:07:18.000 society potentially as an ai on a spaceship or something like that or either in like a humanoid 0.99

00:07:24.000 body or whatever yeah form the world has taken at that point but muslims would be forever trapped 0.96

00:07:30.440 even the good ones in their heaven and never brought into the real world again because what 1.00

00:07:35.800 they cared for more than anything was an afterlife of pure hedonism and so their souls are permanently

00:07:42.040 trapped in hedonistic simulations which is what they wanted anyway so it's not like we're doing

00:07:47.620 anything bad to them you know they they did all of this so they could get the hedonistic simulation

00:07:52.460 but hold on i'm big deviant here i haven't mentioned the young boys yet you also get oh i

00:07:59.700 should talk more about the hurrahs so the these things in heaven now some muslims believe that

00:08:05.380 every true believing muslim male gets at least two real women in heaven and then they get hurrahs on

00:08:12.160 top of that whereas others think and the math on that just doesn't make sense there's no way you 0.89

00:08:18.120 could have every true believing muslim man get two women and men are more righteous than women that

00:08:22.600 that just doesn't make sense there's slightly more women than men in the world but it's like

00:08:27.220 one percent more that's the argument because i asked how can you explain this and the ai was

00:08:31.480 like well you know there's more women born and i'm like that that doesn't explain enough to one

00:08:36.120 yeah yeah but it seems like the majority of muslims what they believe is the additional 0.60

00:08:41.280 women are made up the hewers and these creatures that are made for muslim men's pleasure in heaven 0.98

00:08:49.920 i mean really or not i'll know people are like wait so then the wife has to compete with these 1.00

00:08:55.860 sex spots it's like no she doesn't because it said all throughout the hadiths that the these 0.99

00:09:01.160 additional ones the hurrahs are way less hot than real women are and the reason why they're less 0.91

00:09:08.080 hot is because they haven't undergone the moral trials of a real life okay so you're hotter if

00:09:15.220 you've withstood hardship that's kind of i appreciate that kind of yeah i appreciate that

00:09:20.260 yeah yeah so oh it's also so the little boy servants i've got to talk about them

00:09:26.380 so it goes into and it spends a lot of time on like like the words kind of like creep you out

00:09:32.240 of your reading it like if you ask an ai about them it has to be like very explicitly they are 0.99

00:09:36.620 not used for sex yes i know it goes on and on about how pretty they are oh my god but no homo 0.98

00:09:42.360 but they are very pretty they're like it it makes that clear like very pretty young i think 0.99

00:09:49.400 explicitly underage males act as slaves for you in heaven and these are another class of created

00:09:55.880 built beings like the the horas now note having young child slaves was actually very common for

00:10:03.480 muslims during the periods where this hadith tradition was growing so as i i have talked about

00:10:08.320 before islam worked really well and did really well during the period where it acted as only the

00:10:14.620 the masters believed it like only the people who ran society believed it and none of the the lower 0.89

00:10:20.320 classes believed it because it is basically built to be a slave religion right like as we point out 0.51

00:10:25.080 even muhammad owned sex slave right like it's it's sort of designed to be a religion of a ruling 0.81

00:10:30.080 class and it works really well when it's the religion but not really well but i mean islam 0.77

00:10:36.020 had a significant period of expansion and success until it reached all levels of society and then 0.99

00:10:42.320 you begin to get breakdown but because there's also a totalizing religion also note here very 0.98

00:10:46.720 interesting the lowest level of hell in islam is for hypocrites and at first i was like oh that's 0.90

00:10:52.100 really awesome like i don't like hypocrites either good on you for being so harsh with them okay and 0.98

00:10:57.260 then i looked up what it meant by hypocrites and what it means by hypocrites is individuals who

00:11:04.060 say that they follow islam but don't really in their hearts believe it's all true oh so just 0.87

00:11:09.820 infidels that okay well well no but it's it's infidels who pretended to convert so that they 1.00

00:11:15.800 could get like power in society which actually happened a lot when muslims acted as a ruling 0.99

00:11:19.860 class in a number of regions anyway back to the i feel like that just goes without saying if you

00:11:25.460 don't have genuine faith then like you're not going to end up in the right place in in religions

00:11:30.720 that have that whole thing yeah right well back to how do you know if you if you messed up if

00:11:37.840 islam is right because we had a video on one of our weekend videos for like paid subscribers we

00:11:41.800 offer on patreon and sub stack weekend videos and one of the ones we did this weekend was i did a 0.93

00:11:46.820 similar breakdown but on mormonism and i thought i knew what happened after you die when you're

00:11:53.120 that was mind-blowing no idea no man i get now for real why mormons always wear their temple

00:12:00.780 garments why some mormons even used to shower in their temple garments because if you know what i 0.92

00:12:04.700 know now yeah i know yeah i know why they don't masturbate yeah fun fact on mormons the most

00:12:10.600 shocking one for me it's not like the the planet thing or you know the eternal progression everybody

00:12:16.380 knows about that everybody knows about that what i didn't know is more than think that like everyone

00:12:21.220 who's ever lived it's like a ghost just walking around living life they have emotions they

00:12:26.660 interact with each other they have conversations and they're they are on earth here with us until

00:12:32.140 judgment day and so right now there's just like ghosts everywhere in this room this house it's

00:12:37.600 like 200 whatever years old they're they are all around us right now especially in my room because 0.95

00:12:42.960 mine's the dying room it's it's nice you you masturbate and there is a room full of like 0.97

00:12:50.000 victorian old women looking at you like commenting on your form yeah just like that young man's 0.99

00:12:56.900 building a death grip he needs to ease up what is he watching that gives me so much more than

00:13:03.260 god watching me like god watches you whatever right but the idea of a bunch of ghosts like

00:13:09.460 god has seen everything you know he's less judgmental at this point it's you know tens

00:13:13.500 of thousands of years of humanity but like you know victorian woman the colonial woman

00:13:19.640 and men who died in this room i know i'm not ready for that no i i think i'm more i never

00:13:26.920 have sex i was a mormon i don't want like i know how do they have all these kids if it's not through

00:13:31.340 ivf i mean i get ivf that's that part's easy well we've talked about higher rates of like 0.97

00:13:35.760 cooking and like vorism behavior in mormonism maybe and the ghosts are watching them do this

00:13:40.340 because they had to learn to be okay or even get off to a room full of oh yeah they're like look

00:13:46.020 i'm gonna have to do it as a ghost let's just start practicing i don't want to have to deal

00:13:50.820 with this in the afterlife oh my god but still actually in the end i think that the mormon

00:13:55.180 afterlife is super wholesome and sweet and nice and i really know it's actually it's my favorite 0.69

00:14:00.180 afterlife honestly of all the afterlife islamic afterlife this sounds like a horrible afterlife 0.97

00:14:06.640 do you know what the mormons do when they're going i go to someone i go yeah what mormons 0.83

00:14:12.240 think they immediately start doing when they become a ghost of course they start trying to

00:14:16.280 convert other ghosts aren't you they are and you're you're totally out off the hook if you

00:14:21.420 get converted after you become a ghost like there is no reason i know i know i know i know i know

00:14:26.240 yeah it's great yeah no we're just gonna we'll convert so yeah if if if you die and you're 0.71

00:14:32.780 immediately a ghost you're like the mormons were right yeah and then you just convert it's great 0.97

00:14:37.380 if if you die okay more is more is worse oh yeah so but if you die and there's a black guy staring 0.99

00:14:45.740 at you you know you're in muslim world a black guy because when you die as a muslim 0.99

00:14:53.940 one of two options a white angel can come to you or a black angel can come are you 0.99

00:14:59.980 you not wait hold on though what about all the the black muslims especially in the united states 0.99

00:15:06.680 oh no i think about this muhammad kept like black slaves like i know but like all of the people who 0.91

00:15:13.080 originally like nation of islam but then they're like oh now we're just actual islam look i mean 0.77

00:15:17.240 if you go just sorry we did an episode on this recently but the islamic slave trade was

00:15:21.760 significantly larger than the american slave trade and lasted significantly longer than the

00:15:26.680 american slave trade like they're not even close right like but help me understand this because

00:15:31.280 like if you just go to philadelphia right like right by our house you will walk around in the 0.79

00:15:36.520 streets there are tons the only people that i see wearing hijabs in philadelphia are black 0.96

00:15:41.260 like they're not i mean muhammad didn't like your people very much and so how do they reconcile this 0.89

00:15:46.800 whole like well if you die and you're going to the the not good place well they say oh it means

00:15:52.900 you know does everyone become white and delights them in heaven when they're when they're talking 1.00

00:15:57.400 to you but when it's like in aslam they're like oh well that's just a symbolic of evil blackness 1.00

00:16:02.100 symbolic of evil and whiteness is symbolic of good and that's what they're trying to say it 0.56

00:16:07.460 doesn't come off to me that way but anyway and you know muhammad did again we know he explicitly had 0.58

00:16:13.660 african slaves we know they engaged in slavery in that region we know that they were significantly 0.87

00:16:17.500 worse to their slaves than the americans were because they predominantly used them for sex

00:16:20.380 slavery and so they would castrate the males which had a very high rate of just killing them 0.72

00:16:25.120 and then the females were really horrible really horrible we did another episode where we talk 0.56

00:16:29.780 about that i'm not talking about that now we're talking about right now muslim afterlife so you 0.96

00:16:34.440 die an angel comes to you the angel takes you out of your body and you go up to heaven and it's like

00:16:40.700 painful to be taken out of your body if you're not muslim and it's like not painful if you are

00:16:43.940 muslim okay so you go up to heaven you then have judgment passed on you okay then you're sent back 0.95

00:16:50.960 to your body all right and you then just wait in your grave until judgment day now wait 0.99

00:17:01.820 how are dead islamic bodies prepared and what if you get cremated muslims are super against 0.97

00:17:08.520 cremation for this reason so yeah okay well what if you die in route on a battlefield what if you 0.98

00:17:14.880 die incredibly devout but penniless and the state finds your body and cremates you i'm sure they 0.99

00:17:22.980 have some and god makes it better somehow but you shouldn't do it okay but anyway so you muslims 0.96

00:17:29.820 believe that all of their dead ancestors every dead muslim including muhammad except for one

00:17:34.880 class that we'll get to in a second is right now still in their grave okay but they have a view 0.95

00:17:42.480 of the heaven they're eventually going to inherit wait are they on pause is this like a stasis cryo

00:17:48.220 kind of thing or are they just like a bride on her bride's night so they say it's a pleasant

00:17:54.600 feeling but for me this doesn't feel pleasant it feels like being endlessly like what's that word

00:18:00.620 that people like edged in sex or something like that like heaven's coming heaven's coming heaven 0.64

00:18:06.340 aren't like islamic women virgins when they enter heaven yes mary get to that no no when they marry 0.52

00:18:12.240 i'm just like thinking like a bride night would probably be very like stressful for 0.54

00:18:15.980 true but then it's what the muslim men thought the bride night was like oh great okay they're 0.98

00:18:22.720 the ones writing all this so they're looking at paradise right now they're all in their graves 0.99

00:18:28.240 looking at paradise waiting for the door to open now they they have a door they just can't open it

00:18:33.240 it's sometimes a window sometimes a door whatever anyway the one group that gets into heaven

00:18:37.300 immediately are prepubescent children so they get directly into heaven early entrance to disneyland

00:18:43.780 got it yeah they're all cared for by i want to say abraham and abraham wasn't that good of a dad

00:18:49.500 i'm very concerned about this that's actually a good point yeah man who's who's putting him in

00:18:55.520 charge oh anyway so all of the kids in heaven right now and they stay young until the trumpet

00:19:03.720 blows and when the trumpet blows they immediately turn 30 and everybody when they get to heaven

00:19:09.140 turns 30 as well wait so hold on like a woman her her kid dies and she's like oh like i'll be able

00:19:16.960 to embrace my child in heaven but then she gets to heaven and he's like 30 and she can have another 0.61

00:19:22.820 one in heaven and make him look however she wants and make him age however she wants oh but of course

00:19:27.740 it's okay because she'll be brainwashed to love it all but what's the point if you're brainwashed

00:19:32.440 to love at all why even go through all like why give the why give away the real dolls and the 0.90

00:19:38.000 whores and why why all this yeah why can't the men just be brainwashed to love their wives 0.99

00:19:42.820 why don't you just be in your grave and like muhammad's like ah but you'll be incredibly 1.00

00:19:46.200 happy like you didn't have to do all this other stuff it's just like look you'll get to heaven 0.99

00:19:50.040 and it's darkness and nothing and you'll just be super happy like did we need the details did we

00:19:55.260 need the debauchery i think you make a really strong point here right like if you're gonna say 0.99

00:20:00.020 if you'll be brainwashed to like it or recreated in a way that you like it it's the way the muslims 0.99

00:20:04.860 like to say they don't want to sure okay recreated in a way where your brain enjoys all recreated 0.93

00:20:10.320 that just sounds like a copy of you that's not you it's worse than brainwashed and recreated

00:20:16.580 in a way where you like all of this okay the question then becomes and i think simone lays

00:20:21.740 it out why can't the men just be programmed to be perfectly satisfied with their existing wife 0.74

00:20:27.760 or why yeah maybe maybe you can just be recreated to not be a sex pest or have a high sex drive 0.92

00:20:36.460 you could just i don't know i don't know man okay carry on no this this really understanding this 1.00

00:20:43.820 understanding what's at the end oh the other thing you should know about muslim hell and no here 0.97

00:20:48.340 within all of this wait wait wait sorry sorry i i totally steamrolled you on muslim hell 0.98

00:20:53.200 So a black person addresses me, and what's happening next? 0.99

00:20:59.060 Well, so the point I was making is you, this isn't talking about Technopuritan Muslims. If 0.50

00:21:04.120 you are Islamic and you follow a version that is a Muslim version of Technopuritanism, 1.00

00:21:10.580 you wouldn't believe any of this nonsense. You would go back and try to find something in the 1.00

00:21:15.680 text that actually makes sense, and you can make a lot of it. Like when I was trying to apply a

00:21:21.900 techno-puritan reading basically what i learned about islam is you have to be a quranist to apply 0.93

00:21:29.120 the hadith just are completely incompatible with techno-puritan throw them out okay but this is

00:21:34.240 the same with the jews you could say oh you're applying something similar to muslims no with

00:21:38.340 the jews i say you've got to throw out kabbalism like that's obviously that's a later edition 0.74

00:21:43.260 which puts you in a very small minority camps the people who throw out the hadith it's a small

00:21:48.080 number of muslims but yeah but look the star wars franchise although that's not a great example to

00:21:53.280 use but they don't like incorporate fan fiction the harry potter universe isn't like fan fiction

00:21:58.100 is canon and that's what kabbalah is that's what the hadiths are they're not but that's the way

00:22:03.680 almost every school of muslim takes it seriously like for example the additional wives things you

00:22:09.420 don't get if you throw out the hadiths you you can read around that oh okay okay but the hadiths

00:22:15.580 add a lot of that stuff more explicitly. Okay. No, I note here, it's easy to be like, well,

00:22:20.360 that's unfair to Jews and Muslims. You're saying what Jews can't believe in the Kabbalah and

00:22:25.280 Muslims can't believe in Hadith. How come Christians still get to believe everything? 0.98

00:22:28.980 It's like, well, no, actually not. In Technopuritanism, anything that happened to the 0.99

00:22:32.720 Council of Nicene, any of that later stuff that was added to Christianity, like the Trinity,

00:22:37.040 that's not actually in the Bible or wasn't something that early Christians believed,

00:22:41.260 we throw that stuff out as well and for most christians throwing out the trinity is a much

00:22:46.380 bigger deal than throwing out something like the hadith or throwing out something like kabbalism

00:22:51.940 but anyway so i'm going to point out here i'm not i'm not talking about necessarily well one thing

00:22:56.120 is is the quran is way more explicit about hell and and and the hadiths are more explicit about

00:23:01.020 hell okay do you do some christianity okay okay they get really inventive with the tortures in 0.90

00:23:06.060 hell and stuff like that they go yes like dante's inferno is like built into the the religion in a

00:23:10.940 way that it's just not with like um if you put out it was in technical puritanism i can i can read

00:23:15.640 like every line about hell and i can be like i think it's just talking about erasing people

00:23:20.200 right like that's an analogy for erasure you're you're removed from the book of life that means

00:23:26.220 you're not one of the people who's going to be raised again in the future that simple right and

00:23:30.440 people are wondering if you haven't seen that tract how i get around the one where jesus takes

00:23:34.620 the guy to haves i'm like well it says it take he takes him to haves so it's clearly a parable

00:23:38.480 because like we don't believe in Hades right like it it would say show if it meant like the real

00:23:45.320 Jewish hell right but it didn't it said Hades so it's it's a parable and there's a reason why he

00:23:50.700 had to do the parable that way do you call it Hades for the same reason you call it Nike

00:23:54.700 what it was Hades oh it's whatever the the reason he had to do it that way is the parable doesn't

00:24:02.640 work if he's in the real afterlife or erased or ensure we're like you can't interact with

00:24:08.380 somebody because he needed to have a regret so he had to use an afterlife that people would

00:24:12.460 understand had a still a sense of sentience within it um but anyway they're going to get

00:24:18.360 into weird techno puritan stuff here i'm going to keep going with the muslim stuff but what i found 0.99

00:24:22.720 very interesting about all this is it helped me understand why i think islam often has worse

00:24:29.180 outcomes than other religions in terms of the rates we see things like terrorism or essay you

00:24:36.600 see this like in egypt one survey showed 99 of women have experienced it like really high rates

00:24:42.060 within a lot of these countries within a lot of these communities and i think one of the reasons

00:24:46.600 is one thing you got to know is was as a muslim you generally still get into paradise even if you 0.93

00:24:52.680 do fairly egregious sins so long as you're a true believing muslim you just get punished for a period 0.90

00:24:58.440 first so to be clear because i got double check this you can grape a child you can torture somebody 1.00

00:25:04.160 you can murder anything you still get into heaven if you're muslim and if you're like well that 0.84

00:25:08.980 sounds really unjust how could anyone believe that keep in mind traditional christians essentially 0.99

00:25:13.600 believe the same thing just believe in christ and answer forgiveness and you get in no matter what

00:25:18.620 you did so very similar to how i've heard some catholic retellings where look as long as you

00:25:25.240 repent by the time you you die you're kind of good you're solid yeah well yeah except you you do face

00:25:33.000 more punishment i think you can get around most of that in theory right but yeah yeah you can get

00:25:37.980 around most of that by just repenting in most forms of christianity not techno puritanism by

00:25:42.400 the way no no no no no no that repent on your deathbed thing doesn't work um well i mean it

00:25:48.940 does kind of if it is a true repentance because you know we think the point of the things that

00:25:54.660 happen to you after you die let's say the the stimulated worlds is to test your soul to see if

00:26:00.200 you are worthy of being like the angels,

00:26:02.980 which it says some souls become in heaven.

00:26:04.560 And this then means you're reentering

00:26:06.460 a consequential interaction with reality again.

00:26:10.180 So like if your soul had actually improved itself

00:26:12.220 that amount to the end,

00:26:14.080 then you'd be closer to that particular end state, right?

00:26:16.780 Like, and the technology would be able to determine this,

00:26:19.740 but you can't just be like, oh, I, you know,

00:26:22.700 like there's a one famous serial killer who did that, right?

00:26:25.240 Well, and it matters.

00:26:26.200 What matters is what you've done, not what you say.

00:26:28.380 I think that's the bigger thing.

00:26:30.200 well you can say what you say but a lot of people are like no you're saved through through christ

00:26:34.200 alone and faith alone that gets through everything and i don't i don't think that sounds moral to me

00:26:37.660 at all no it's not it's not a religion i want to be a part of oh the god's endless grace or

00:26:42.360 whatever and it's like well if somebody like tortured a kid or something like that i kind

00:26:47.260 of think grace there should be ramifications for that right well the old testament's clear like

00:26:51.720 even if you like make a widow or a fatherless child cry out to god like you're deleted essentially

00:27:01.800 like you shall you shall burn in fire and your entire family basically will be ended it's it's

00:27:06.980 very clear like don't do that you're gonna get in big trouble you can't just be like i'm sorry

00:27:11.460 it doesn't say and then by the way if you say i'm sorry it's totally fine well this is traditional

00:27:17.420 traditional christians believe that's the moment you're pissing off a lot of i haven't gotten to

00:27:20.860 the new testament i get that guys but also a lot of christians this is the traditional view in

00:27:26.640 christianity and they're welcome to feel that we have different views we're joking about it because

00:27:30.560 if we're gonna joke about islam and we're gonna joke about what traditional muslims think we're 0.85

00:27:34.140 gonna joke about where we think that this sounds silly to us and and where it seems like it's but 0.99

00:27:38.800 that that to me is not as egregious as just like how dover muslim women get you know like 0.99

00:27:45.180 don't worry they'll be happy about it you'll like it but no what's fascinating to me is if you have 0.90

00:27:52.240 this view of the afterlife like i think the negative ramifications what it means is one

00:27:57.540 you can still sort of get away with what you want to get away with and two in in addition to that

00:28:02.820 you and gosh i didn't know about some of this stuff like some of our fans have sent us stuff

00:28:07.960 like there's a line where i don't remember this is a quran or the hadith where they're asking about

00:28:13.760 when we're graping policists whose villages we're wiping out do we pull out and it's like no of

00:28:20.260 course don't pull out you know this is like when you're doing war crimes it's like if god's the

00:28:25.600 one who controls whether they get pregnant or not so for full context on this one this is from one

00:28:29.320 of the hadith and they had captured women from a policist tribe and the men wanted to grape their

00:28:35.520 women but then they would be able to sell them back less as slaves to sell them back as hostages

00:28:41.760 if they ended up getting pregnant and so they asked muhammad for we do coitus interruptive do

00:28:47.040 we not grape them and he's like no no no of course grape them like obviously right but you know also

00:28:53.460 don't do coitus interruptive because you don't need to worry about that because muhammad takes

00:28:58.100 care of all that and just to be clear for people who are like well that's just what you did back

00:29:01.620 then both christian and jewish law prevented acts like this centuries before this this isn't just

00:29:09.400 what you did back then this was unique to muhammad and his people and if you're like what's the

00:29:15.300 techno puritan perspective on this because obviously sometimes you still need to go to war

00:29:19.100 well if you go to war and the population needs to be that population but as painlessly as possible

00:29:27.400 as quickly as possible and if you have people who are temporarily captives you sell them back

00:29:34.040 or you eliminate them you do not treat them as grape slaves ever and if you are selling them

00:29:39.680 back i would say unless there is is something that makes this an extremely unfavorable thing

00:29:44.520 to do in specific conditions they should be sterilized before they're given back your goal

00:29:49.360 is to lower the population of those groups that want you eradicated or to put it in other words

00:29:54.700 to lower future bloodshed future suffering where it's possible not not awesome not awesome but

00:30:03.440 there's a lot of stuff where i'm just like this is this is quite i don't know like i'm gonna be

00:30:08.580 honest even even to our fans who are months i would seriously like i i do think that there

00:30:13.480 might be a way for a portion of its alum to like work well but like i would seriously

00:30:18.480 think about whether that's something you want to continue to follow more so with other religions

00:30:25.380 where i'm just like no you can you can find a way to you know stay jewish or whatever i don't know

00:30:29.380 like the some of that stuff is just like that's that's gruesome man that's really gruesome but

00:30:35.040 to continue here because we yeah even our fans were like no it's i won't get into this argument

00:30:41.580 again because we've we've litigated it numerous times whether or not a muslim can legally within

00:30:47.380 sharia law grape a non-muslim we say no a lot of people say yes i'm not gonna i think that yeah

00:30:55.200 where it comes down to is as we i haven't been given by the arguments people have given us 0.53

00:30:59.820 yeah they think that like anyone's just allowed to basically act as though they're at war

00:31:06.100 even if say they're an asylum seeker who has come on their knees saying oh help me to their

00:31:12.120 host country that somehow that means that they're also at war with their host country no absolutely 0.66

00:31:16.940 not look muhammad yes he he did a lot of really crappy things but he was also very clear like

00:31:22.520 i'm gonna come and get you like he was always kind of at war these people are not they're not at war

00:31:28.240 if you're not at war then you can't do the war things well they would say that he did things in

00:31:33.840 his battle tactics to try to trick his enemies and ended up being able to kill them like raiding

00:31:38.560 early in the morning and i'm like it's not the same thing right like no and i'm saying all this

00:31:42.980 because i want to point out that like we don't always just go like take the maximally anti-islamic

00:31:47.480 approach to something right you know i think that there are places where you have to give them their

00:31:51.760 do's and and that is one of them but what i mean is if what is at the end of the day in store for

00:31:58.060 you is as many additional wives as you could you know based on how moral you are you don't have the

00:32:04.560 same motivation to treat your earthly wife very well because what she's just gonna be hotter and

00:32:10.580 like cool with you no matter how you treat her anyway so you can basically right oh yeah yeah

00:32:16.000 they're they're hotter oh by the way did you know that you're not allowed to have threesomes with

00:32:19.240 your earthly wives in in islam oh wait so if they're both married to you like you you can

00:32:26.020 have max four wives you cannot have a how would have a fivesome yeah well you can have max four 0.99

00:32:34.200 wives and infinite sex slaves right right well can you have can you see but you can't have sex 0.97

00:32:40.100 concurrently with up to four wives in your life life your earth life yeah you can't even on earth 0.99

00:32:46.080 you can't have three ways no muslim three ways oh but also there are no three ways in heaven so

00:32:49.720 there's infinite viagra no no three ways one on one yeah yeah i guess you have infinite time so

00:32:54.980 who cares even even if the women are into it which i thought was interesting i didn't know that i 1.00

00:32:59.080 thought like the women were probably allowed to sleep with each other at least if they're your 1.00

00:33:02.220 wives but like no oh wait they can't sleep with each other no no no lesbians no lesbians in 1.00

00:33:08.420 islamic heaven but there's really cute boy slaves lots of those around yeah no homo so cute 0.99

00:33:16.880 well they're the only children who don't immediately grow up which is interesting 1.00

00:33:23.460 but a lot of islamic countries like afghanistan have problems with lots of gay sex but it's not 0.94

00:33:29.160 like same age game sex it's like huge age gap gay sex which was a huge problem for the troops and 0.97

00:33:35.440 And so like, this has been around in Islamic culture for a long time. 1.00

00:33:39.540 We see it like during the Muslim, the height of these Muslim empires. 0.83

00:33:42.560 If you go to, you know, their CR episode on like how Islam went from like the maximally 1.00

00:33:48.140 debauched religion to like a religion that was very, very strict in a fairly short time 1.00

00:33:52.460 window where it used to be, you know, all these giant harems and belly dancing and,

00:33:57.340 you know, people drinking all the time. 1.00

00:33:58.880 There's the one court where the mom made all of the girls dress up like boys to try to 0.98

00:34:03.480 seduce her son, you know? 0.89

00:34:04.640 and then it became popular for a while for all the girls to dress like boys because 0.92

00:34:08.380 they were trying to seduce a gay prince the era of the tomboy the era of the tomboy yeah 0.54

00:34:14.400 we're for it you know look the point being is if you think that that's what all this is for 1.00

00:34:19.320 and you know that like your wife won't be able to ever be like hey you were a dick to me and 0.98

00:34:24.440 now we're together for all eternity you don't have to worry about any of that the other thing 0.99

00:34:29.180 is that you don't need to worry about the long term of human civilization you don't need to worry

00:34:34.780 about what happened like nuking the entire planet that's totally fine in fact that might even cause

00:34:39.420 judgment day right you don't need to worry about like the the russians love their children too

00:34:45.060 song you know like that no they're actually okay with that because all the kids get immediately

00:34:48.980 perfect heaven right and because what you're fighting for is ultimately hedonism you're not

00:34:54.760 really worried in sort of like a higher moral calling either right like in in being efficacious

00:35:00.600 with your life or anything yeah yeah yeah because the whole point is max hedonism so you're never

00:35:06.400 going to rise above it it's your motivating factor and this is and i think in terms of heavens if i

00:35:11.940 was going to rank like afterlives in terms of creating good moral action i think the lowest

00:35:16.860 you could have is buddhism okay that's just like that's negative utilitarianism as a religion okay

00:35:23.380 Yeah, the gift of the universe. That's a good end state.

00:35:27.200 Yeah, destroy reality is a good end state. I don't think that that motivates particularly

00:35:32.180 moral behavior. Well, okay, it motivates more moral behavior than perhedonism. Let's say that,

00:35:37.180 okay? We'll put Islam, traditional Islam, there's different interpretations of what we're talking

00:35:41.360 about, the traditional one, at the very lowest in terms of motivating moral behavior, because it 1.00

00:35:44.540 motivates you to devalue women, devalue your wife, devalue your relationship, devalue the long-term 0.63

00:35:50.400 future of humanity and not a ton of reason to act particularly morally especially to non-muslims 0.96

00:35:57.500 actually it makes it makes so much like a lot of the human rights issues that you see take place 0.80

00:36:03.800 in many predominantly muslim countries have a lot more context now because it doesn't appear 0.99

00:36:10.720 to really matter like even within your own family it's like look what they what they do right now 1.00

00:36:17.940 doesn't matter at all and what i do to them doesn't matter you know like they're just they're

00:36:22.860 going to be better when they're dead honestly yeah which is that's going to change people's

00:36:27.660 it's a very it's a very sick view i i i we used to come out to being so neutral we were so nice

00:36:36.120 we're like oh all religions but then the next bad and i think traditional christian heaven

00:36:41.200 is not a very good moral framing what are we talking here not mormon heaven but like

00:36:46.140 no traditional christian heaven is you go to heaven you're unmarried your your family

00:36:52.020 relationships essentially dissolve you are sort of basking in god's grace forever you're you're

00:37:00.420 you're not typically this this is the heaven that i grew up being taught i'm not saying because

00:37:05.580 there's different ways of interpreting the heaven in the bible i'm talking about the heaven that i

00:37:08.540 grew up believing that christians believed in it's a heaven where you're the just feeling a form of

00:37:15.960 hedonism that's higher than having sex all day well right because you're fangirling over god for

00:37:21.960 all eternity yeah i this i don't like for a number of reasons i i think it leads to less moral

00:37:28.640 behavior because you don't care about the long-term consequences to the human condition

00:37:31.440 eventually humanity is going to be wiped out so humans anyway and it doesn't mean that you know

00:37:37.660 you're going to have to take responsibility for the way that you treated your wife if you guys

00:37:41.100 have a bad relationship if you have a bad relationship with your kids and it's a heaven

00:37:44.640 where because it's a form of hedonism axing just a higher form of hedonism axing there's no you

00:37:50.380 don't do anything consequential like to me this is sort of like if somebody said if i could take

00:37:56.160 you right now and i could put you in a your brain in a vat and i could connect you with all of the

00:38:01.420 right emotional chemicals to make your brain feel absolutely perfect right you know like the highest

00:38:08.320 you could ever feel would you prefer that feeling or being in the world where you can efficaciously

00:38:13.760 interact with things. I would always say I'd rather be in the world, right? Even if it meant

00:38:18.900 suffering, even if it meant pain, even if it meant a life from today until the day I die of suffering,

00:38:24.480 I judge quality of life. And a lot of people, I think, feel this way intrinsically. When we talk

00:38:30.340 about, are we potentially in a matrix? Are we potentially in a simulation? You know, a simulation

00:38:35.920 theory. Well, in the future, they can make thousands of simulations, hundreds of thousands,

00:38:39.520 billions of simulations that are just lifelike. You're more likely to be in a simulation

00:38:43.600 than in reality and and humorously we think they do end up doing that and that is part of what

00:38:49.800 heaven is but those simulations are a thing you can eventually get out of and live efficaciously

00:38:56.340 again which is something i didn't i went to simone because at first i thought oh it's just

00:39:00.480 simulations i was like but i don't really and she's like malcolm go read the bible say if the

00:39:05.120 bible says anything that makes it seem like that's not true and so then i go and it says oh you're

00:39:08.900 going to be like angels you're going to have jobs you have to serve in heaven you you have to reign

00:39:13.460 in heaven you might be managing something like variably managing cities based on how competent

00:39:19.300 you are huh that sounds a lot like actually interacting with the world again and so this

00:39:24.580 isn't just in technically mormon heaven also may have a feature like this as well where again you

00:39:30.080 are undertaking an actual project which is trying to help other people's improve themselves like a

00:39:37.320 new generation of humanity or something like that. And I would feel like heaven wasn't a

00:39:45.160 particularly big reward if it was just max good feelings. And note here, I'm not saying that the

00:39:50.380 brain in the jar can simulate whatever it feels like to bask in God's grace. I'm just saying that

00:39:55.220 at the end of the day, that still is an emotional state. And it's an emotional state where you're

00:40:00.600 separated from the things you did in life, like your family and everything like that, which to me

00:40:05.320 would be hell like the idea of being and people can say well you're remade to not care about

00:40:10.160 simone anymore and it's like i don't want to be remade to not care about simone right

00:40:14.100 i want to be with simone forever okay i don't i don't i don't want to if if they remake us in

00:40:22.460 the future i want to be made in a pair of ai's running a ship together not you know yeah although

00:40:28.640 this is like where you know buddhism comes in they're like no that's your problem you'll love

00:40:33.560 people. How dare you? And note here, I will be clear. The Bible very clearly does say

00:40:40.240 that you will not be husband and wife anymore, which we won't be because we won't, you won't

00:40:47.140 even, I mean, you will be remade to the extent that like you and I wouldn't even want to have

00:40:50.540 sex if we're AIs managing a ship, but we would want to make the world a better place, right?

00:40:55.140 Like continue humanity's expansion. But yeah. Yeah. That was wild. So how explicit were they

00:41:02.820 about hell and is there a place for lusty people in hell like are the sins similar or super

00:41:07.440 different i know you didn't give really far into hell because this was all about heaven but what

00:41:11.320 what were your big takeaways from hell okay yeah let's let's go into this so burning and renewing

00:41:17.040 of skin every time your skin is burned through it is replaced with new skin so the person continues 0.88

00:41:21.180 to feel pain that's from the quran directly boiling water and fluids boiling water is poured 0.98

00:41:26.680 over their heads melting their insides and skins they drink boiling water pus or melted brass 1.00

00:41:31.780 food of zachum they eat from the tree of zachum whose fruits are like the heads of devils it 0.90

00:41:37.860 fills the belly but scalds the inside like boiling oil closing and restraints that they

00:41:43.180 wear garments of fire or pitch they are bound in heavy chains and dragged with iron hooks

00:41:48.380 heat and physical agony the fire seizes people to different degrees ankles knees waist or neck

00:41:55.140 depending on their sins it's a very temperature sensitive environment this is for people who are

00:42:00.620 yeah even the lightest punishment in hell is described as two burning coals under the feet

00:42:06.440 that make the brain boil no escape by death and you undergo this forever and this is like again

00:42:13.560 a good god doesn't do this for that's not a that's not a just i'm sorry it's just not a

00:42:20.840 just punishment it's not no and that that's why i like the techno puritan interpretation of just

00:42:27.060 deletion in the end because it even really agrees well with all the evidence we have around crime

00:42:34.900 punishment and incarceration where when people have done systematic reviews of the research

00:42:40.320 different experiments with crime and punishment they found that like the the severity of the

00:42:45.200 punishment doesn't really affect crime doesn't make communities safer like if you punished

00:42:51.260 stealing by cutting off a hand or by you know capital punishment it's not going to make society

00:42:56.080 be safer the only thing that makes society a better place is removing the bad actors the reason

00:43:01.500 why prison is effective and helpful isn't because it's like reforming people it's that they're not

00:43:07.880 in society when they're in prison which is why i'm so big on penal colonies just like get them out

00:43:12.420 but yeah i mean like in the end you you can't make it right by hurting someone you just can't

00:43:20.240 it's very frustrating and so i like this idea of hell hell is deletion the punishment is just you're

00:43:25.560 gone well i mean i think that that's what and people can see our other tract where we go over

00:43:30.040 why we believe that and we go over every single verse that talks about hell but it seems to align

00:43:35.720 with like even the idea of gehenna where like you burn stuff right like the the only way an

00:43:40.340 ancient person would have understand total erasure is burning right and it talks about being struck

00:43:45.140 from the book of life which would be a book of the people that are going to be brought back in

00:43:48.040 the future and the way that we know that not all bad people are destroyed written from the book of

00:43:53.640 life or erase the synonyms for the same thing it's because in daniel it says that some of the people

00:43:59.160 who are raised again are ashamed about being raised again and will live with that shame forever

00:44:05.060 will be shamed which basically says they never leave the simulation they never reach the state

00:44:09.440 that heaven is meant to get them at but they're also not permanently erased but i but i also think

00:44:14.020 that like the morality of a book the idea of punishing a person forever terribly punishing

00:44:19.600 them in like a lake of fire instead of just saying that means erasure for fairly mild sins frankly

00:44:26.080 would would qualify you for this in a many traditional understandings i think is just

00:44:31.420 evil like especially when he's out there putting bones in the ground to make it look like there's

00:44:36.980 dinosaurs and stuff if you get that wrong like well why'd you do it why did you make it look

00:44:42.320 like a star exploded a billion years ago you didn't have to do that you really didn't you made

00:44:47.100 up that light on the way to with us you know so that that's why i take this interpretation where 0.98

00:44:54.060 i'm like no no no i don't think he's actually a jerk but like the level of jerkiness of the god 0.53

00:44:58.640 that's being described in a traditional understanding of the quran is just like 0.95

00:45:03.040 very high because you can't get around it as easily as you can with a techno puritan framing

00:45:07.660 of just saying oh it's it's talking about deletion which which predominantly takes you

00:45:12.880 know the the christian sect but you know your description of hell puts heaven to a lot more 0.94

00:45:18.080 context because at first i'm like look why on earth then would a muslim woman sign up for this 0.91

00:45:24.960 like why and i guess it might be because she doesn't want her skin burned off every single day 1.00

00:45:30.960 from the inside and the outside oh yeah obviously big punishments for anyone who leaves islam as

00:45:36.160 well so they're really taught oh you better not leave and then your family will hunt you down 0.98

00:45:40.340 and torture you to death anyway if you try to leave even if you you know make it to a western

00:45:45.360 country or something which has happened before right like the the it's a very different culture 0.69

00:45:50.520 and i i think i wish the the the westerners were like oh you know but i do think that the the one

00:45:59.160 thing i take away from this is one you know i'm willing to be critical of traditional understanding

00:46:03.440 as a christianity as well and i i do think that a heaven where you for many people where your your

00:46:11.000 actions no longer at all matter on earth now if you got to be like a guardian angel after you die

00:46:16.040 that'd be chill like maybe that's you could say take a totally traditional christian view just

00:46:20.280 saying well it says you can be like the angels so it means that some humans come back and help guide

00:46:24.100 other humans that's great i would be totally okay with that but yeah you know like in all dogs go to

00:46:28.700 Kevin. But if it's just like totally your actions affect nothing after that, that's like the end

00:46:34.700 game. I don't know. I don't think I like that a lot. I am overly tied to being productive. And

00:46:39.960 you can say, oh, that's a love of earthly things, whatever. I think that that's the highest form of

00:46:44.720 being, right? And when you remove that from somebody, you've removed humanity. But what

00:46:51.280 are your thoughts more broadly on all of this? I had no idea. I had no idea either.

00:46:57.940 i had no idea about the mormon ghosting to go check out our episode on that our weekend episode

00:47:01.740 really loved you know more paid people or i had no idea about that i'm in the future whenever i 0.72

00:47:08.060 hear like a muslim i'm always gonna ask them do you think your husband's gonna get additional 0.98

00:47:10.900 wives do you think if you die unmarried you're gonna ask i wanna yeah i really want to know

00:47:15.780 if people know i mean i think the answer almost 80 percent of of the case it has a time i would

00:47:25.860 say has to be no, because something trending on Twitter earlier this week was some article

00:47:36.060 talking about the average voter and just how uninformed they are. And this one journalist,

00:47:45.780 I think from the Atlantic, went to some part of New York where an unusual number of conservatives

00:47:51.000 voted for mom donnie and i guess they wanted to understand why because mom donnie is an open

00:47:55.740 member of the democratic socialists in america he's very progressive etc and these people thought

00:48:02.720 like she this this journal i don't know who they were but this journalist interviewed a couple

00:48:08.780 that was either centrist or conservative like they are they were republicans registered but

00:48:14.460 they had voted for mom donnie because they thought that he was more centrist than andrew cuomo

00:48:22.480 and because they thought he was an italian from astoria because his name ended with an i like mom

00:48:32.340 donnie is italian and so they voted for him and they were a little off and it's funny because no

00:48:40.040 one was hiding what mom donnie was all about right like these people just chose to believe

00:48:45.500 that he was some italian guy from the story and i so i wouldn't be surprised at all if most of the 0.95

00:48:55.500 people who are i'm just constantly thinking that woman on caleb hammer who was like islam is the 0.99

00:49:02.600 most feminist religion islam is probably the most feminist religion there is yes it is certainly

00:49:08.800 middle eastern countries that are most known for their feminism and freedom for women

00:49:17.060 it is i don't have a problem with islam as a whole but when you come here and you say it is 0.92

00:49:22.480 the best and most feminist religion for women you would be beat in iran if you took the scarf off

00:49:27.300 as of quran 2 282 woman's testimony in financial matters is actually worth half of that of a man's 0.93

00:49:34.960 because we're doing the saria version so we have to follow the rules because it's the most feminist

00:49:39.040 and you had a son right yes okay very good are you guys have any daughters hopefully well they

00:49:43.880 can only get half the inheritance actually legally sons they get 100 women they actually

00:49:50.220 can only get half and i just wish caleb has been like has your husband because you converted for

00:49:54.500 him has he told you yet he's going to get an additional wife when you die like when you guys 1.00

00:49:58.740 maybe the most feminist thing is just not caring anymore you know it's the ultimate feminist freedom 1.00

00:50:04.340 you know it's okay i really want to watch the husband because you can see he's just eating a 1.00

00:50:10.300 shit eating grin that whole interview that he's been able to brainwash this woman and i just want 1.00

00:50:15.980 to be like has he told you about the extra wife yet yeah but look in heaven she's not going to 1.00

00:50:20.420 be mad at him who cares right like now she's a believer and she's stuck so 0.97

00:50:26.960 jokes on her i guess yeah like the whole point is you just gotta trick your wife this really 0.77

00:50:33.220 explains so much spousal abuse in Islamic countries, because it really doesn't matter.

00:50:39.400 And it even has that built-in victim blaming. Because when I asked AI about heaven and Islam, 0.92

00:50:47.200 it was like, well, if a wife dies in childbirth or dies when her husband is especially happy with

00:50:53.740 her, she'll get extra rewards. But yeah, obviously there were more women spotted in hell.

00:50:59.020 so there's kind of this victim blaming element too of look girl this was your fault like your 0.67

00:51:05.160 whole point is to make him happy if you can't do that you go to hell and by the way heaven's only

00:51:11.860 really good if you're really good to your husband and so it's all your fault if you're not good at

00:51:16.060 any of this that's the the other thing that i think makes a mormon heaven lead to uniquely

00:51:20.400 good action or good families is because you're stuck together even in heaven right and simone

00:51:25.500 was saying no because some mormons believe that you're allowed to choose to not raise your wife

00:51:30.940 with you that's a folk belief that's not like actually because there's i mean at least elissa

00:51:36.720 grenfell's talked about it you know your go-to everyone's go-to ex-mormon yeah there's a lot of

00:51:42.440 mormon folk beliefs fair enough yeah because that that one seems a little a little weird

00:51:49.360 yeah so weird so bizarre please please if you got to the end of this episode and you 0.95

00:51:58.860 are a muslim do is this do you believe are are you planning for this are you planning for this

00:52:09.440 please tell me what are what are people telling you i want to know what they're telling you

00:52:15.360 what are what is your mom telling you what are they saying at the mosque i mean they have separate

00:52:22.160 services for women and men no they watch the same person i don't know how it works at the mosques

00:52:26.120 they separate no i think they have separate services for men and women because maybe they're

00:52:29.460 like women it's feminist let's see do moth but maybe like everyone's looking at the same speaker

00:52:37.240 but they're just in cordoned off places because i think with weddings you're all in the same room 0.98

00:52:42.040 There's just a screen in between the men's wedding section, reception section, and the women's wedding reception.

00:52:51.200 So, yeah, they're listening to the same call to prayer, but they are in different sections.

00:52:56.820 So it's not like they're being told a different story.

00:53:00.460 I think it's like, why do these women put up with Andrew Tate, right?

00:53:03.240 Like, they've just had the hope beaten out of them.

00:53:05.800 they've had the the will to to expect for themselves a degree of equality beaten out of 1.00

00:53:12.480 them you know it's all the way down to the the writing itself there's more women in hell right 0.87

00:53:16.540 like women it's just such a depressing view though like even if you're a man 1.00

00:53:20.540 basically this is a religion that turns women into sex dolls and cows and how depressing is it 1.00

00:53:28.320 to have to marry a cow slash sex doll like i don't want to spend my life with have to eat dinner with 1.00

00:53:34.740 like a cow who's dumb and you know stupid and who cares you're from a different cultural tradition 1.00

00:53:41.320 the the the backwoods tradition has always valued women who are autonomous and who are able to fight 1.00

00:53:49.120 for themselves and who are rough and tumble yeah but like look if you could like go to a restaurant

00:53:53.480 and have a meal do you want to have a meal with a good conversationalist or do you want to have a

00:53:59.020 meal some males are genuinely born just wanting a submissive wife that does whatever they ask

00:54:05.700 that is not what my people want it's not what i would want my daughters to become hold on also 0.98

00:54:10.540 if you made it this far and you actually just want the human cow sex doll admit it tell me i 0.91

00:54:16.900 i i i don't believe this i don't believe this i and i will change my mind if someone don't troll 0.98

00:54:23.800 i'm asking for legit responses tell me if this is really what you want i will i mean i'll judge you

00:54:33.260 but like at least you'll know i i need to know the truth okay sorry thank you malcolm okay oh and i

00:54:40.020 will in this because we haven't done this into a tract and this will be one of the tracks

00:54:43.740 is because i found this when i was talking about like how do you know when a spirit is telling you

00:54:49.200 the truth or not like for us this would be more like an intuition something that's moving you

00:54:53.060 And the Bible lays it out. Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits, whether they

00:54:58.320 are of God, because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby you, the spirit of God,

00:55:03.680 every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God. And every spirit

00:55:09.140 that confesses not that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit

00:55:13.940 of the Antichrist. Wherever you have heard that, it should come. And now already it is in the world.

00:55:20.000 so note this again aligns remarkably with the techno puritan reading it doesn't say

00:55:24.960 that jesus christ is the trinity it doesn't say that jesus christ is also god it doesn't say that

00:55:29.860 all of these other things it says that jesus christ has come in the flesh which is what

00:55:33.100 techno puritans believe so you guys can say oh oh we are so heretical and i'd say well the bible

00:55:41.160 tells me you're of the antichrist okay so you know we have our differences and that's that's

00:55:46.360 But this is very useful because when a spirit comes in, like talks to you, you know, you're

00:55:51.180 kind of humbled in the moment, right?

00:55:52.620 Either you're having a weird trip or it's a real spirit or it's a demon, right?

00:55:56.800 But either way, it's a lot.

00:55:59.820 Okay.

00:56:00.040 You're overwhelmed.

00:56:01.460 Are you going to be like, Oh, secret password first, please tell me, did Jesus come in the

00:56:06.280 flesh?

00:56:07.160 Like, no.

00:56:08.360 And also they're not coming and being like, hello, I'm an angel.

00:56:12.720 Jesus came in the flesh.

00:56:13.640 and no they're just like you must talk to the people you know like who is ever well oh yeah

00:56:21.520 i forgot to mention the password so wait there's a password no this was the password oh is there a

00:56:26.180 past oh is there yeah so when you die you're asked three questions so it's similar to the

00:56:31.640 secret handshakes of the lds church yeah well except they're really easy questions it's like

00:56:37.000 who was the prophet were you a real muslim like what what religion did you follow no says someone

00:56:43.640 instantly regretting their answer yeah well remember that they you could say this is a 0.56

00:56:50.780 cheat to get into muslim heaven because the moment a black angel is coming at you and asking you 0.99

00:56:54.900 these questions now you could say this would put you in the hypocrite rung of hell but not really 1.00

00:56:58.380 cares it's all no no not really because if i can saw a black angel coming and talking to me after 0.99

00:57:03.840 i died i'd be like oh islam is definitely 100 so you just insta convert yeah i would 100% really

00:57:09.720 believe if i of i saw pro tip yeah you just gotta know your hacks for getting into heaven for yeah 0.80

00:57:17.440 yeah yeah yeah yeah okay if you get mormon converts a ghost yeah right you just have to hope you don't

00:57:23.320 die like during the second coming no but sorry another thing i was going to point out here

00:57:27.280 because i went on a bit of a tangent about this is i do think like you look at the ways that people

00:57:31.520 are punished for fairly trivial things in traditional Christianity. But even those

00:57:35.260 punishments aren't as bad as the punishments in Islam for fairly trivial things. And it just sort

00:57:40.560 of feels very immoral to me if I contrast it with, again, I'll use Mormonism as a contrast here,

00:57:45.480 because people have heard, I've done episodes that are very anti-Mormon. But what Mormons

00:57:51.080 believe about the afterlife is maximally forgiving. Like you can convert after you die.

00:57:56.640 even if you are a bad person you can still often get into heaven even if you weren't a mormon you

00:58:02.920 can still often get into heaven like there's so many forgivenesses and then for like the very

00:58:07.520 worst right like the only people who don't eventually get into heaven are the people who

00:58:12.160 go to the outer darkness which again isn't even a punishment you're just sort of floating about

00:58:16.640 the void right like it was it it feels like um uh i i guess i when i'm thinking about like the

00:58:26.200 morality of a religious system that one i'm like more okay with right like i'm like okay yeah

00:58:31.200 yeah that that seems that seems like a morally justified series of events there anyway i've

00:58:39.920 enjoyed talking to you about this i've been wanting to talk to you about this forever because

00:58:42.040 i found this to be and you've been giving me teasers all weekend blowing my mind and i didn't

00:58:48.320 know you had this much more this is wild i cannot believe you can give birth i can't believe you get

00:58:53.860 additional wine i can't believe any woman is okay with this well yeah except then you read about 0.56

00:58:59.800 heaven you're like oh they don't want to eat food that burns them from the inside and stand on coals

00:59:07.900 that burn their brains yeah so if you want to see the more of an episode by the patreon sayings

00:59:12.740 always feel free to check out rfab if you want to do some like adventure role play with ai that's

00:59:17.860 rfab.ai and if you want to learn more about our religion techno puritanism and our weird take of

00:59:23.120 of the bible you can check out technopuritan.com where we have all the tracks listed and you can

00:59:28.800 learn about it quickly instead of watching all the tracks because it's like 50 hours or something at

00:59:32.940 this point and just take an ai to it we have it made so it's very easy for you to ask ais like

00:59:38.260 how do they get around this problem if they believe this right like if you're like there's

00:59:42.680 no way that especially if you're going to send us something that you think counters techno

00:59:46.880 puritanism or something really well you might want to run it through an ai first with with the

00:59:51.200 techno pure with access to techno puritan website and be like are they going to find this at all

00:59:55.180 compelling or just ridiculous because generally it's no we we don't find it particularly compelling

01:00:01.340 right yeah we're fairly deep believers anyway love you simone i love you too great episode

01:00:08.620 do any other religions you want to go into their afterlives

01:00:11.380 man i mean like we just keep going there are so many i i people in the comments can can call us

01:00:19.620 out here if you think you know a religion that has a particularly egregious or cool afterlife or

01:00:24.760 the afterlife isn't the afterlife you would expect let us know i would be very interested

01:00:30.700 to explore more because this is supposed to be the stuff that gets you gets you excited

01:00:35.500 and yeah yeah and i know we're gonna have a bunch of you know traditional christians being like oh

01:00:40.160 you guys just aren't close to god enough so you don't understand why just vibing with god would

01:00:44.000 be so great and like maybe that's the case maybe maybe that you know that's that's true

01:00:50.100 but i don't i think i i would want to still help people if i wasn't helping people still

01:01:00.240 i think that life would feel the degree of hollowness like being trapped in a simulation

01:01:04.520 forever and the groundhog day yeah the other interesting thing about techno puritas afterlife

01:01:10.660 belief system is we very well could be in one of those simulations right now

01:01:15.640 yeah malcolm worries about that sometimes well no i don't worry about it well because well this

01:01:22.140 belief means even if there are simulations it would be evil for a truly moral super powerful

01:01:29.280 far future entity to create simulations that you had no way to get out of and interact with the

01:01:33.660 real world again if that was your want and you were morally capable of doing so justly right

01:01:38.880 and so the idea being is that it's through the lifetimes in these simulations that you show

01:01:43.880 your worthiness to be let out of the simulation to have real agency in that world again

01:01:48.800 yeah so even if we are in a simulation our morality is still being tested and our lives

01:01:57.520 are still being tested just through the simulation

01:02:00.320 to see if we're good enough to be released

01:02:03.360 into the real world again.

01:02:07.840 What a world.

01:02:08.820 And maybe it took us how many simulations

01:02:10.620 to realize what's true and realize what's actually

01:02:13.680 in the Bible, despite everyone saying

01:02:15.540 that's not what it says.

01:02:16.860 That would be quite a test for a simulation.

01:02:18.840 And that could be our, this could be our final run, Simone.

01:02:21.600 It might not be that this is a real world.

01:02:24.060 It might be that this is our final run on the simulation.

01:02:25.960 it could be now this might seem ridiculous to you but actually think through it okay suppose

01:02:32.480 your far future super advanced whatever humanity ends up becoming whatever ai ends up becoming

01:02:38.140 and you've got spaceships and stuff like that and you need someone to run the spaceship someone to

01:02:44.980 have a leadership role in your society or colonies somebody to run the colonies because you know

01:02:50.440 jesus says they'll run 10 cities they'll run five cities based on their morality so you have these

01:02:56.300 colonies and you need something to run them now all of the ais now keep in mind all the ais and

01:03:02.280 all the humans are really well who's the moral ai who's the moral human and they're like you know

01:03:06.640 what let's do this let's run millions of past iterations of humans that existed and find the

01:03:16.800 most moral the most chaste the most disciplined and once we have found them and trained them

01:03:27.600 through iterative levels we will put them in a position of authority that's what i think is

01:03:33.680 happening here and i also think it's the logical thing to do it is both the moral thing to do

01:03:38.240 and it's the logical thing to do and it's what the bible describes happening if you look at the

01:03:44.100 actual lines again see the attached like notes episode the thing on technopurition.com

01:03:49.740 well i'm enjoying it whatever it is i'm i'm cool with this let's keep going you know

01:03:55.260 yeah yeah that's that's why our lives are so good because we reached a state of morality where we

01:03:59.840 deserve good lives in the simulation and the people who are suffering in the simulation

01:04:03.220 aren't really suffering it's simulated you know

01:04:05.020 maybe yeah i don't know i just i just really like it i like you it makes no sense podcast

01:04:13.000 this could be the real world right like you agree it's preposterous like all of our kids are

01:04:17.380 perfect they're amazingly nice to us they're fantastic we have degrees from what are supposed

01:04:22.720 to be the best institutions in the world we have friends like elon we have amazing friends like

01:04:26.860 leaflet like like maximally moral people who have never done anything to wrong like our entire friend

01:04:32.520 group these days it's like never done anything to wrong us is nothing but nice is nothing but

01:04:36.660 you guys are the greatest you know your heroes like nux and stuff like this reach out and help

01:04:41.340 you all the time right like the the just the other day you're talking with like a senator's 0.57

01:04:47.000 offices about getting things done for the u.s government or like we're invited to talk to the

01:04:51.840 white house i'm just a normal guy like none of this stuff should be happening right like

01:04:56.320 it is suspicious it anyone can say like malcolm it is and then you even get the whole

01:05:05.980 you know born to the super prestigious family who ties to the illuminati but then cast off and

01:05:14.180 made to fend for yourself and then you make it all yourself again it's too simple of a both

01:05:20.280 oh well you were actually born to be a duke like the story but also you get the but you were cast 0.99

01:05:26.120 the redemption story and then made it back yourself it's just like a mawa it doesn't make

01:05:31.180 is this why you like those so much because you can yeah well yeah this character you're born to 0.66

01:05:36.640 the ducal family and then you're cast off and then you make your way back up as a villainous

01:05:40.700 which is what i'm playing right now you know in in the world but no you you it doesn't make

01:05:47.120 sense and then i talk to people like the the ideas or things i build i don't think you need

01:05:53.820 to be particularly creative to come up with the idea for artfap i don't think you need to be

01:05:56.700 particularly creative to come up with the idea for techno puritanism all of the stuff is just

01:06:00.820 like right there and a lot of people's like oh yeah i thought of the same thing then why aren't

01:06:04.100 they fair and then and then that other people didn't do it maybe the simulation's not even

01:06:08.660 at full capacity maybe i want like the dumb person simulation most people aren't fully simulated

01:06:15.620 maybe human music human music it's always oh look i'm not i'm not gonna question it i enjoy

01:06:25.460 it i think all we can do is just our best and i think you know i used to think that everyone was

01:06:33.080 doing their best and maybe they are i i feel like the general thing is every human is going to do

01:06:38.000 the best they can given the resources they have and i just couldn't understand why people would 0.95

01:06:42.360 do unspeakably horrible things but then i look at religions like islam and i'm like oh well that's

01:06:50.660 why i mean look at their heaven look at look at how people are regarded or not that an entire 1.00

01:06:56.900 sex is is not really not really human really if you think about it they they get all the

01:07:06.320 punishments of a human but none of the benefits yeah i mean it's it's it's sad but this helps to 0.86

01:07:15.600 I don't know. It helps me understand why people will do unspeakably cruel things,

01:07:20.800 even if in general people are doing the best they can with the hand they've been dealt.

01:07:25.280 Even in secular society, I don't think everyone is doing their best. I think a lot of people

01:07:28.860 are just trying to act out some role, right? That they think that they're supposed to be playing,

01:07:33.440 right? Or they're trying to maximize their own personal happiness or hedonism. I have met a lot

01:07:38.800 of people who are trying to maximize their own status or hedonism, and they don't really care

01:07:43.460 about anything else. And I think that these people are genuinely evil, like the purest form

01:07:52.820 of evil. And I think that people who live lives simply for their own happiness and have never

01:07:58.480 questioned why they should want more than that from themselves, this is a category that we've 0.90

01:08:04.340 recently been naming pre-atomites. But the reason I said they get along, so it was the urban

01:08:11.180 monoculture, the Islamic faiths, they both fundamentally are hedonistic at the end of the 1.00

01:08:15.460 day. The pleasures awaiting the Muslim at the end of the day are hedonistic, which they are not in 1.00

01:08:22.160 most other religious traditions. It's the pre-Adamite religion. Yeah. There's no rising 1.00

01:08:27.820 above. There's no rising above the most basal instincts of an animal. Yeah, the instincts of

01:08:35.460 an animal. Just with greater capacity for pain and for inflicting suffering, which makes that

01:08:42.900 worse than an animal. That's why I have so much trouble with pre-atomites is that animals are

01:08:49.000 cruel, but in general, with the exception of some apes and maybe killer whales, they don't enjoy 1.00

01:08:56.480 inflicting pain and they don't find creative and exquisite ways to inflict pain. Humans can.

01:09:03.160 and that is why humans who lack that moral capacity to to to make a judgment to not do that 0.99

01:09:12.080 are worse worse than animals at least most animals god killer whales are so screwed up 0.99

01:09:17.820 but there were so many apes dolphins too pretty screwed up do dolphins do dolphins torture and 0.98

01:09:22.820 killer whales torture i was making a video game and one of the the dolphins are are a 0.51

01:09:28.000 paw yeah they yeah and torture a lot do yeah yeah yeah not as much as killer whales killer whales

01:09:35.520 are like in in my a game that i was making one of the other far future species is a is a uplifted

01:09:42.200 killer whale species that just always go evil like completely comically evil maxed because of

01:09:48.840 course uplifted killer whales would be evil max yeah they really they were well and what makes it

01:09:54.420 hard though is that they're also very very capable of sentimentality and suffering is there isn't

01:10:00.680 there that one mother killer killer whale who lost her child but then kept wearing it on her

01:10:05.640 head like a hat am i yeah i think that's killer yeah but yeah killer whales so which which makes

01:10:10.860 it worse that they don't understand that no that's that that this is why i i have a big problem with

01:10:17.380 with pre-adamite minds essentially is because i yeah i guess it's it's probably not just humans

01:10:22.060 It's that it's something capable, technically, mechanically, probably, of rising above, but very, very, very smart and choosing to not, to not make those moral judgments and instead.

01:10:36.120 And this is why Simone makes me bake into a tract, so I'll do it for her because she really, even though you do sometimes, there are certain populations that you may meet one day, as we're told in the Bible, God does tell us sometimes to kill. 0.82

01:10:48.960 the Bible, complete tribes of hominids at points that, you know, that if you have the technology 0.90

01:10:57.060 to do it this way, you know, do it with gene drives, do it with sterilization. Don't actually 0.99

01:11:02.520 go in and murder everyone. Thank you. If you have the technology to achieve those things.

01:11:07.660 Yeah. Don't, don't never, never inflict pain again. Like what I think never inflict unnecessary

01:11:14.540 pain yeah i think what the bible yeah i mean pain as a way of building your own personal

01:11:20.200 strength and will and in testing your own resolve is you know as long as it's not senseless pain

01:11:29.300 which i think is is horrible and totally worth you know medicating away it's it's a normal and

01:11:34.900 even necessary very necessary part of life but yeah to to inflict needless pain especially as

01:11:40.420 retribution or punishment, I don't think is biblically supported and is not supported by

01:11:45.200 the research. It's not good for the punisher. The whole study on punching the wall and anger

01:11:51.640 only makes you more angry. It's not going to help you, the angry person. And it's not going to

01:11:59.120 change the damage that antisocial or dangerous people are going to do to society. Their removal

01:12:05.640 is the only thing that's necessary and swift and painless removal is the correct way to go

01:12:10.700 because if you stoop to someone's level like at that pre-adamite level then you're you're just

01:12:15.360 as bad as they are i'm not cool with it yeah well i love you to decimone uh very fun to do

01:12:24.620 we're doing way more tracks these days which i think are part of our audience loves yeah and

01:12:29.160 to those who don't i am so sorry again check out technopurgeon.com i'm actually going to include

01:12:35.240 a link here that will include the research that we did as to how we came to like all the bible

01:12:41.240 verses that mention heaven and like different ranks and labor in heaven and reigning over

01:12:46.440 things in heaven it'll go over why we came to hold these beliefs we did about the way the afterlife

01:12:50.140 probably works and after that and it's easier to engage with through ai if you're like why do they

01:12:55.220 think this why do they think this that's always better than just trying to read it you know

01:12:58.700 yourself and then we will also link to i don't know yeah i guess check it out oh yeah the weekend

01:13:08.800 episode of warrants have a good one swan i love you trend i think leaflet started it right i don't

01:13:15.440 know because she was she retweeted darling strobs and i don't know if she started it

01:13:21.080 Straubs, by the way, if you don't know, is Red's wife of making AI of what your opponents think of 0.99

01:13:27.920 you. And it's really funny. We did one. I'll put it on the screen here and I'll try to remember 0.86

01:13:32.840 to link the thread because it's quite funny. Oh my God. Everyone else had signs. We didn't

01:13:40.020 have signs just at our conveyor belt of babies. Oh, you know what Octavian likes? Because dad

01:13:46.420 insisted on eating out again while we were out. Some form of a calamari. Yeah. He likes calamari.

01:13:51.080 I knew it. He also really likes the lobster sauce, as he calls it, and he spoons it into

01:13:58.300 his mouth without the calamari even. Tartar sauce? No, it's the tomato-based sauce,

01:14:06.200 the red tomato-based sauce. Oh, just a marinara. Yeah, marinara.

01:14:08.880 Ketchup, basically. Slightly less obvious ketchup. Yeah, you know, he and Titan just

01:14:15.660 eat it straight ketchup that is i thought i was intense for just eating ketchup rice

01:14:22.020 but no i should try giving them ketchup rice maybe this is why they don't eat rice

01:14:28.520 insufficient ketchup

01:14:30.740 well i i'm gonna might have you cook dinner for dad tonight and not me

01:14:36.820 because i'm feeling pretty full from that

01:14:39.580 i'm making steak frites you guys are impossible you i tried to make nice meals and i didn't want

01:14:49.580 to eat out today but they made me they made you all right i'll just i'll get started okay

01:14:55.460 my dad's over people so octavian's at his hotel right now oh he's over there now yeah he must

01:15:04.240 be having the time helping him with stuff yeah octavia dad said he'd show him not

01:15:09.420 that's good oh i love that oh it's a good grandpa thing yes it is this is wonderful okay

01:15:18.320 if only it were that easy

01:15:24.920 Mommy, look. 0.96

01:15:26.920 Just one day.

01:15:28.920 There.

01:15:30.920 See?

01:15:32.920 When it goes like this,

01:15:36.920 then look.

01:15:38.920 Look.

01:15:40.920 When it goes like this, then the secret door opens

01:15:42.920 and the baby falls.

01:15:44.920 Look at that.

01:15:46.920 Aww.

Based Camp - August 25, 2026

Muslim Heaven Is WAY More Psycho Than You Think

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