Blood Satellite - Ay Tone4CERN Not for Nothin but this Feels Like Biocalvinism

00:00:00.000 as far back as i can remember i always wanted to be

00:00:07.680 blood satellite dude the year's done eventually yes it's done man it's toast

00:00:22.880 in the fuck in the bin do not do not i'm gonna

00:00:29.620 well no we're gonna keep a piece like we're gonna save some for later but you don't need to like

00:00:37.400 we're not gonna show anybody like it's it's in the staying in the kitchen okay we'll say that

00:00:41.320 we're not bringing it out you gotta keep some rind to prove to people you had watermelon yeah

00:00:46.180 that's true that's true they wouldn't believe you otherwise next time you eat a rind fruit by

00:00:51.200 yourself and people want to call you on your shit because you told too many watermelon lies

00:00:57.040 a rind fruit what a right like a watermelon uh call it a rind fruit i was imagining like people

00:01:03.700 like if you eat the watermelon but keep the rind and someone will go into their kitchen and suspect

00:01:07.660 that you've eaten just a rind fruit that was like pure rind and you'd have to tell them it was a

00:01:12.300 watermelon but they won't believe you because you didn't keep any of the melon this seems like a

00:01:16.160 people would do they would say rind fruit yeah right you just said it you're people so

00:01:22.520 all right so what's in the news i guess we gotta talk about dom con that's what everybody wants

00:01:31.220 to talk about yeah poor choice of words i got a phone call today from a buddy who didn't attend

00:01:37.440 asking me for the skinny from john dom con from john john called me and asked me to please make

00:01:45.120 the calls stop yeah so so what was this call again sorry no no he's just he he wasn't able

00:01:50.460 to make it and he knew that uh he knew that i knew people and he's like oh how was it it was

00:01:54.900 were you there i wasn't there i did not go but i told him that it was fantastic everybody had a

00:01:59.220 great time uh yeah oh so where were you i was down at quantico what's that oh it's um uh fuck

00:02:05.660 a quanta company it's a quanta space co um yeah that's what's interesting about events like this

00:02:15.840 and we saw this with ours is that sometimes people will buy tickets and then not show up and not

00:02:21.800 demand a refund as would be their right and i would never give people their money back by the

00:02:29.660 way of course not you bought a ticket and didn't show up come on fuck you or they'll let me know

00:02:33.440 oh, I missed my flight.

00:02:35.040 You know what I say to that?

00:02:38.160 Aw, shucks.

00:02:41.500 You pay for the experience of buying the ticket.

00:02:44.300 That's what I always tell people.

00:02:45.600 You're not even paying for the event.

00:02:47.160 It's a good feeling to buy a ticket for an event sometimes.

00:02:49.480 No, but really, though, it's like with anything.

00:02:51.520 You pay for the privilege of being allowed entry, right?

00:02:55.520 It's up to you whether you show up.

00:02:57.600 Sorry, it's not our problem if your flight is canceled

00:02:59.840 or some other bullshit.

00:03:00.740 Imagine asking for a fucking refund for anything.

00:03:02.820 yeah if i spend money on anything at all i'm stupid as hell i don't know if you remember

00:03:07.800 that our at our wedding there were two empty seats with food in front of them because some

00:03:12.680 bitch and her boyfriend decided they couldn't make oh we just something got in the way we just

00:03:18.520 couldn't make you just didn't feel like coming you were doing something else and you didn't want

00:03:22.280 to show up and we paid hundreds of dollars for that fucking food it was catering sorry i thought

00:03:27.120 that was representing the twin towers that could not be that would have been great though

00:03:32.680 i should have done that that'd be great at everything we do we have two empty seats to

00:03:37.860 represent 9-11 the twin towers could not be here with us tonight couldn't be here

00:03:45.540 now because you said some bitch and her boyfriend i'm like you're saying that in a way i'm supposed

00:03:53.840 to know who this is but i can't remember i actually i don't even it was some some friend

00:03:59.000 of my in-laws daughter and the friend is like a close friend of my in-laws who i don't even

00:04:05.060 fucking know them i was frank i was not happy that they were even coming to be honest with you

00:04:09.020 i wanted to be smaller and it's like oh well can we bring our daughter fine can our daughter bring

00:04:13.200 her boyfriend fine fine fine yeah we're paying i hate that i hate that and then and they didn't

00:04:17.580 even fucking come so they just those two motherfuckers who i didn't even know barely

00:04:21.540 had a table to themselves so fuck you it's people pressuring you for a plus one which is something

00:04:29.920 i would never do do a wedding like i need i need to bring my if it's a wife it's one thing wife

00:04:36.080 i gotta bring my girlfriend how many years you know what doesn't fucking matter no well then i'm

00:04:41.440 not coming all right how about i fucking spin kick you to death it's not gonna be one yeah it's gonna

00:04:46.960 to be a couple dozen before you die changing it it's no longer my wedding now it's your funeral

00:04:53.400 now it's your now it's your kung fu execution there's one get up it doesn't work if you're

00:04:58.760 lying down i can't spin i can't spin horizontally the rule should be that if you bring a plus one

00:05:05.740 the plus one has to make a speech yeah yeah you should have done also was spite eat their plates

00:05:12.400 fuck I didn't even think of that

00:05:14.280 I was too busy getting married

00:05:15.720 not busy like

00:05:18.160 being hungry for revenge

00:05:20.660 so yeah DomCon

00:05:23.720 DomCon sorry yeah DomCon

00:05:25.780 we just start talking about every event

00:05:28.120 outside of and beyond

00:05:30.360 that so

00:05:31.820 remember I made a post about it

00:05:34.140 on X a few weeks ago and I was telling

00:05:36.280 people that I'd been

00:05:38.500 helping plan

00:05:40.640 DomCon

00:05:41.500 in a consultancy position not as any part of official leadership but since

00:05:48.380 December of last year so I've been across pretty much this entire thing and

00:05:53.880 I wanted to just direct people to a substack that just dropped not long

00:06:00.040 before we started recording this from a good friend John Carter who was a

00:06:05.560 speaker at the event good friend of the show friend of mine have met him several

00:06:09.820 times he gave his debrief on his subsect postcards from Barsoom it's called the

00:06:16.000 domain society conference of 2026 he goes into phenomenal detail of the entire

00:06:21.580 story there and and he was bringing up names and dates that I had forgotten so

00:06:26.860 people want a very comprehensive story and background every step of the way

00:06:32.140 check that out so I I don't want to spend the entire episode talking about

00:06:37.900 But all of you, you know, what we talk about here is more supplemental to that and provide some extra color, you know, maybe some interesting stories from that.

00:06:48.420 So, you know, from the perspective of someone that was pretty involved in it and then was also at the event.

00:06:56.140 And so and Judas as well.

00:06:58.600 I'd be remiss if I didn't bring up that Judas was so essential to getting all of the signage made, which was the star of the show.

00:07:08.800 We'd like to thank the caterer, and we'd like to thank the drivers.

00:07:12.180 You're end of list.

00:07:13.900 I don't know.

00:07:14.580 You're the only other person I want to thank.

00:07:16.520 There's a lot of people there that I don't know.

00:07:20.460 A lot of staff badges.

00:07:21.600 I'm going to start by saying this, that even I was surprised, not shocked, but surprised at the amount of institutional pushback we received.

00:07:33.940 Yeah.

00:07:34.160 For a couple of reasons. Domain Society as an organization is relatively young, but what's interesting from, you know, knowing Daniel for so long and seeing how they operated that the media was ignoring them for the longest time.

00:07:51.020 In fact, Daniel Tyree, who founded the Domain Society, he posted something, I think, this week, because Rebel News, Rebel Media, a lot of these outlets, some of them are coming out against Domain Society because the event was such a resounding success.

00:08:13.080 and you know they were i forget the context here but daniel posted a screenshot where he was from

00:08:19.760 sometime in 2025 talking to one of the producers at rebel media oh yeah and he was pitching a story

00:08:27.500 about to be inside and then the guy had said oh i i kind of mentioned it no one here is interested

00:08:32.640 hey if you want to do a segment uh with ezra that starts at ten thousand dollars which let me just

00:08:39.860 say this given rebel me's exposure their view count their engagement rate not a good deal that's

00:08:46.420 a that's a rotten deal and also you then you gotta wonder how many segments have any has anybody seen

00:08:52.680 on rebel news that we're actually just paying that jew 10 grand to get in front of a camera

00:08:58.200 yeah and also they make their money off of advertising and stuff guys if they don't interview

00:09:04.020 you they don't have a fucking show please no one fall for this don't yeah it's the most it's the

00:09:08.940 most jewish thing yeah they should be paying you for an interview they should be flying you out

00:09:20.340 wherever the fuck you're at um they'll probably they'll sell you they'll sing you a song about

00:09:25.420 exposure and you know if you get in front of us then your brand i i bet you ezra levant likes to

00:09:31.980 say the word brand the people anyway so that was really what i think domain society was dealing

00:09:38.400 with that mainstream news wasn't mentioning them even though they were out there doing things and

00:09:44.300 they're becoming pretty popular but the lines seem to be to ignore them and so when the news

00:09:50.800 start picking up about this event you know there was a level that i was expecting and then we went

00:09:56.940 far beyond that so it started off with uh you know based on my recollection again consult john

00:10:03.700 carter's sub stack it started with like the the hamilton spectator because we're i mean originally

00:10:08.780 we were going to have in toronto then we switched it to hamilton um i won't get i won't get into too

00:10:13.880 much of the background information um because there's some stuff that i found very interesting

00:10:19.540 but i don't want to share because it shouldn't be made public you know some of the tactics we

00:10:23.900 use to pull this off some of the more uh you know granular details of the security processes we had

00:10:31.160 that were very, very successful and very effective.

00:10:34.260 I won't be given the full schema of that.

00:10:36.800 But, you know, we moved to Hamilton,

00:10:38.380 and the Hamilton Spectator starts picking up,

00:10:40.300 and then not much happens.

00:10:42.720 These stories start coming up a few months ago

00:10:44.900 about he's going to host an event here,

00:10:48.480 trying to rile people up.

00:10:49.560 Nothing happened.

00:10:51.060 Canada Anti-Hate Network starts sniffing around, right?

00:10:55.280 They get word that something's going on,

00:10:57.180 but they don't know what.

00:10:57.800 They're trying to get people interested.

00:10:58.920 and i'm like okay that's i i got to see what happens when those stories drop it turns out

00:11:05.800 no one cares and and over the last month we saw it start to snowball then you start seeing cbc

00:11:14.820 articles national post articles within that time frame andrew horath comes out the mayor of

00:11:20.880 hamilton out against it and i'm looking at that mps aslam rana uh an mp for hamilton and just

00:11:30.240 a lot of other news organizations benai bryth got involved yeah uh unsurprising right well i mean

00:11:38.640 surprising the sense that nothing they do is anti-semitic and i mean nothing and nothing

00:11:43.500 nothing cheeky yeah they don't make their little any holocaust jokes they were having to stretch

00:11:48.880 so hard not just them but the spectator everybody had to stretch really hard to make this about

00:11:53.200 white nationalism specifically or even just racism generally like there is nothing nothing racist

00:12:00.360 about their printed material they have to go and dig through like oh well such and such a person

00:12:05.860 who's associated they may have said this at one time like it's honestly for a right-wing organization

00:12:12.320 they're incredibly tame this is like this is where i thought the conservative party would have been

00:12:17.240 at this point in 2026 you know what kind of helped their accusation of it being a far-right

00:12:24.200 white nationalist organization uh it wasn't that it was 100 white people it's that it was mostly

00:12:31.920 white and a few asian people this is a certified dead nigger storage was was that chinese chick

00:12:39.140 there you know the one no no no not her but but like a few like asian guys like chinese guys

00:12:48.460 and kind of like big bigger guys too that's how you know it's a real white nationalist organization

00:12:55.380 is it's five percent chinese yeah five percent i don't even know what type of asian but just

00:13:00.140 vaguely asian and then i'll say this also more women than i was expecting dude same my wife was

00:13:07.440 asking me she's like yeah but it was the sausage fest right i'm like no look and i showed her the

00:13:10.500 picture like backs people's heads there from the from the back it was must have been like uh 30

00:13:15.200 women which for our event the april event we had again more women and across different age groups

00:13:24.380 like there was a lot of like older older women at our last event it was strange but then a lot of

00:13:29.420 younger women at this one and some of them were domain society members and some were just there

00:13:33.940 I'll get to that in a second but I'm just leading up this event I was not

00:13:39.640 prepared as I said for it to become international news which is what it

00:13:44.360 became yeah and again it snowballed until a couple things happened the first

00:13:50.740 was that the Hamilton police not the entire police department but a couple

00:13:56.620 specific members of the Hamilton police I think one of them might have been like a

00:14:01.300 special investigator like no one's serious not really um there's apparently a new deputy police

00:14:07.600 chief everyone's trying to pin this on like i don't think it's her i think she just like got

00:14:10.920 here yesterday but um someone and i mean i'll explain some background here daniel tyree and

00:14:18.780 every the leadership team the entire time we're trying to get in touch with the police

00:14:23.360 to say hey we're having an event here we're doing everything above board we're doing there's nothing

00:14:28.720 about this that's illegal there's nothing about this that's sneaky we want to have a relationship

00:14:32.760 with you just because we don't know what protesters are going to show up and they were ignoring us the

00:14:37.980 entire fucking time and it was only later on that they decided to not only make an issue not only

00:14:45.220 and daniel's got recordings of this of him on the phone with the police threatening him i've heard

00:14:50.860 them where they were saying like we're going to put domain society on the hook for any financial

00:14:57.360 cost of additional policing in the city and i'm like i don't know anything about this but that

00:15:02.880 doesn't sound right or legal or it doesn't sound correct i don't think you can do that

00:15:07.780 and then i'll say this they were behaving like the corrupt sheriff in a western because they

00:15:14.780 said that like we're gonna find we're just gonna make you pay yeah whatever actually please or

00:15:19.580 hey maybe you have in a different city they weren't even trying to arrest anyone they're

00:15:23.440 trying to run us out of town yes yes and i'm i'm thinking like i i was not expecting that further

00:15:29.840 i was not expecting the hamilton police to be calling up venues releasing press releases

00:15:36.440 and directly calling up venues and either spooking them or dissuading them or the secret third thing

00:15:45.160 outright threatening them which is what they fucking did and you have to understand this

00:15:50.180 judas you understand how african-american i became

00:15:54.200 i repeat all the real niggas worldwide salute sucking your teeth no i became like a c a b

00:16:03.240 fuck the pigs fuck the system honestly like i became so anti-police for like a bit i know

00:16:10.020 you're already anti-cop but i was like no you can't fucking do this this everything's corrupt

00:16:16.180 yeah

00:16:16.940 yeah

00:16:17.960 fucking I'll strangle you

00:16:23.820 with a thin blue line

00:16:24.740 I was going nuts

00:16:26.120 like the other guys

00:16:27.380 they're like

00:16:28.160 they'll deal with it

00:16:29.240 but I'm like

00:16:29.480 no fuck this

00:16:30.400 fuck them

00:16:31.780 they're trying to like

00:16:33.380 do dirty tricks

00:16:34.900 now

00:16:35.700 like this is

00:16:36.440 beyond the pale

00:16:37.160 secondly

00:16:38.660 somewhat related

00:16:40.780 but unrelated

00:16:41.400 Charlie Downs

00:16:43.220 this was something

00:16:44.300 I was not expecting

00:16:45.080 where Charlie Downs

00:16:46.120 from the restore party was a confirmed speaker for months and months prior he got his eta his

00:16:54.320 electronic transfer authorization approved and so you know i was involved with getting all the

00:16:59.640 flights and all the accommodations all that sorted out and so we were in touch the entire time

00:17:05.040 everything was good until like the last week when his eta was reopened and then revoked

00:17:11.720 they're doing it to fuck with them

00:17:13.840 it wasn't that he was like we saw evidence

00:17:16.340 that it was approved then something

00:17:18.420 happened they revoked it

00:17:19.740 I said I didn't think they were going to

00:17:22.360 do that because I

00:17:24.340 also knew Jared Taylor was coming

00:17:25.940 I was expecting to do that to Jared Taylor

00:17:28.100 and he came he walked right

00:17:30.360 in

00:17:30.700 so and we Martin Selner

00:17:34.360 was also

00:17:35.880 invited and some people

00:17:38.480 might think that that was just

00:17:40.340 you know some some op or something but i'll tell you we had a ticket a very expensive flight ticket

00:17:47.880 and we had it we had to sort it out and his eta just was not either approved or disapproved he

00:17:55.300 was kept in limbo they would not grant him proper like disauthorization which was odd sorry i cut

00:18:03.040 you off there no i was going to say the implication if nobody caught that is that charlie downs who is

00:18:09.420 a member of an actual political party in the uk he is not a radical figure he's he's a member of

00:18:15.760 restore uk okay like he may be elected to parliament there soon um charlie downs was

00:18:21.800 was blocked jared taylor was not that this is because not because they have these people on

00:18:28.640 lists but because benai barith sent a letter to the immigration department asking for selner

00:18:35.020 and Charlie to be denied and they did they denied both of their ETAs so the point is it's not like

00:18:42.240 I said it's not like they're on a list the immigration department is doing the will of

00:18:47.220 B'nai Barith and these activist groups if they get a call from immigration they will they will

00:18:52.640 actually bend and do it which is wild that our government I mean look are we surprised no but

00:18:58.960 it's proof that the things that we claim are happening when they call you a conspiracy theorist

00:19:03.020 though this is you just watched it because there's no reason that i'm a completely

00:19:07.840 like there's again he's not a radical he's a he's a regular ass politician in the uk

00:19:14.980 to block his flight is and also of all the speakers there i may be misspeaking right now

00:19:22.740 but i don't think any of them have really said something outwardly anti-semitic no it would be

00:19:27.760 a different case if we were speaking i understand like there's a reason we weren't yeah some people

00:19:33.940 some people were a little bit miffed like why didn't they invite dimes to speak well

00:19:37.840 look it's donk on okay it's like we'll have our own show one day we'll have a live show but

00:19:42.640 yeah i walk in the room and this whole room gets more prosecutable i'm sorry yeah i love this is

00:19:47.960 more of a sponsored by the shadow government really just to finish that story before i get

00:19:52.560 into actually getting there because there's some funny stuff there uh so charlie downs denied

00:19:58.060 we hatch a plan to get him in anyway because for people who don't know an eta only addresses

00:20:05.180 coming into the country uh through air so if you're denying eta you can still get in through

00:20:11.660 land or sea so you just fly into america he's not banned from america he sorted out which airport

00:20:19.100 to get to what land crossing used bada bing bada boom days in the country you didn't have to smuggle

00:20:24.220 him in or anything however he was stopped at the border on the american side and detained for

00:20:32.380 just over three hours so to me that's the real story that he was prevented by

00:20:37.180 canada but then also by american authorities i don't want people to miss that

00:20:43.180 that that to me is was something i wasn't expecting however he was eventually let in

00:20:49.580 but is it american or is it canadian stories that detained him at the border on the way if he if he's

00:20:53.820 coming in i was told it was the it was on the american side still this is what i was told

00:21:00.140 interesting uh yeah which i'm like okay so this is two different country you know you know i mean

00:21:05.020 like something something's up yeah yeah yeah um but then he got in everything was fine and i

00:21:11.900 delivered a lovely speech and so but at that point the day of that's when he got the elon musk

00:21:19.740 retweet the shout out that's when this hits american news so this has already been reported

00:21:25.580 on across all mainstream canadian news then it's hitting i'm seeing it from fox news i'm seeing

00:21:31.740 i'm big american commentators commenting on this i'm seeing now liberal mps liberal

00:21:37.580 politicians up here conservative politicians up here are defending dom khan and domain society

00:21:43.820 they're saying we find what they say reprehensible but the hamilton police department can't be doing

00:21:51.500 that and it's my opinion that that's how we got the last minute venue it was the the hamilton police

00:22:00.460 and again just based on my suspicions is they thought they were on the right side of history

00:22:06.540 they thought they were the good guys they have no reason not to they had the mayor on their side they

00:22:10.860 they thought they had the whole media on their side and so they said well we're gonna go march

00:22:16.220 door to door and be the good guys and protect the community and they were so concerned with that

00:22:21.740 they forgot that that's illegal you can't do that and you should have something to do with the law

00:22:27.820 being the police and so that turned the narrative in our favor and so by the end of it the last we

00:22:34.860 We had two venues lined up at the end who were more than willing to work with us.

00:22:39.560 It wasn't done secretly.

00:22:41.920 It wasn't done under false pretenses.

00:22:44.400 They just said, you know, we became the good guys in this story because of government persecution.

00:22:53.340 And I guess that's the last thing I wasn't expecting because the entire time we were grinding metal, banging our heads against the wall.

00:23:01.440 This was so difficult to do.

00:23:03.240 It was one of the most difficult things, just the size of it, the size of this event and the trust that people had.

00:23:12.060 Because, you know, after so many venue changes and after so much negative press, you could have expect some attendees to peel away and they didn't.

00:23:19.760 I'm telling you, it was a packed house and it was maybe a bit small.

00:23:23.820 We were all laughing in the group chat that every new venue we got, we seemed to get banned upward.

00:23:29.700 the first venue we had was okay then we lost that one and i'm gonna keep that story to the side

00:23:36.960 because let me just say this to people and i'm explaining some of this because i think it's

00:23:42.820 usable for people when you sign a contract with a venue if you're doing any event most of these

00:23:49.660 boilerplate contracts that the venue offers you are going to be garbage i don't care what you're

00:23:53.820 holding you could be holding a wedding and airbnb is kind of like this too where they'll say

00:23:58.700 you're not allowed to cancel you as the you know attendee you're not allowed to cancel

00:24:04.280 anything closer than six months out otherwise you owe 70 of your bill however the venue can

00:24:11.000 cancel you up to the day before and incur no penalties and so i was very impressed with the

00:24:16.760 domain society legal team and i'd never done this before we were doing contract rewrites we were

00:24:22.080 saying like now you're not going to be able to do that anymore i was just like i didn't know you

00:24:26.140 could do that i didn't know he could just tell a venue no don't rape me i i shan't

00:24:31.720 no sir i shan't be raped on this because they were setting us up to fail because i i noticed

00:24:38.880 at first we got some we we were in talks with so many different venues up to contract negotiations

00:24:44.460 and i started noticing as i was reading the contracts it looks like these were recently

00:24:48.840 amended how did i know that well there seemed to be parts here in different font like they just

00:24:55.960 added them like five minutes ago

00:24:58.200 and there was all kinds of stuff about hate speech

00:25:00.220 and all kinds of stuff. I'm like, oh, I see what they're doing

00:25:02.040 here. They're setting us up to fail. They're going to

00:25:04.020 take our money, wait until

00:25:05.940 five days out, get a second

00:25:07.980 payment, say, you know what? We think you're

00:25:09.940 infringing on hate speech laws

00:25:11.940 that are ill-defined and so

00:25:13.720 we're going to take your fucking money and not

00:25:15.860 and throw you out on your ass when it's too late to do it.

00:25:18.900 They'll do that.

00:25:20.020 Why not? It's a payday for them.

00:25:21.980 So watch out for that, but also know going

00:25:23.920 into it you can rework these contracts if you want so and i bet most people don't

00:25:29.680 right but then if they do break the contract then you can sue them which might be on the table

00:25:36.320 i'm not saying they will sue a couple of these venues i would that man's a bad story

00:25:43.600 oh they're bullying this venue fine yeah well you know how to make me go away there's one way

00:25:49.600 to make me go away from getting you for 120 000 which is a number i made up because it sounds good

00:25:56.720 you crawl into a coffin and bury yourself alive do you understand i'm not here to make

00:26:00.400 fucking friends anymore do you understand how insane i am you're nice little

00:26:05.680 then you didn't want to hold this okay how about you slit your wrist till i tell you to stop

00:26:12.000 you could love it you could have been on the right side of this what right side of me and

00:26:16.080 And you know what? That's all that matters right now.

00:26:18.640 Fuck the Hamilton police.

00:26:20.180 Fuck every venue that gives our time.

00:26:21.880 Fuck everyone who tried to stop this from happening.

00:26:25.140 We didn't. That's why I said in my post.

00:26:27.440 And now there's a lot of people that might not care for the Dominion Society.

00:26:31.260 For a variety of reasons.

00:26:33.160 Maybe some are justifiable.

00:26:34.920 You know, some people think they're not anti-American enough.

00:26:40.260 You know, or they're too anti-American.

00:26:42.440 Or they don't talk about the Jews enough.

00:26:44.660 or they talk about any one thing they're not trad enough or the wrong type of person was

00:26:51.140 involved whatever like you've heard it all all i was saying was this is the first type of event

00:26:57.380 like this at this scale that's being held that's strictly about canadian identity i saw another

00:27:03.560 event that's being held that being promoted and it was called um it was like anti-woke con

00:27:09.640 hey if you want to go doing hey guys if you want to go to an anti-woke convention yeah you can do

00:27:15.180 that you can go watch sam tripoli perform you can watch a bunch of hacks and frauds

00:27:20.320 there there was also interestingly the dominion congress which was a totally different event that

00:27:27.620 was booked and planned and i think they were actually selling tickets they'd even booked a

00:27:31.360 few of the same speakers but then just for the weight of the organizational difficulty of that

00:27:36.240 they ended up canceling it so it's it's not it's no small feat to pull one of these off

00:27:40.320 i i told daniel this i told the entire leadership apparatus this i said that there's a dozen ways

00:27:46.580 this could have collapsed and you could have given up i've known people who've given up on

00:27:51.900 this type of thing before and they didn't and once you get there you see all the volunteer teams you

00:27:56.920 see all the moving parts it yeah it wasn't perfect but you know the venue was got a couple days

00:28:04.420 before and with that in mind i think the fact that it happened at all and that was the point

00:28:10.260 of the post to say like this can't not happen you might be part of a different organization

00:28:17.140 and i like a lot of these different organizations i got no problem with them

00:28:21.380 i think it's an ecosystem that can support all of them but for whatever your reason might be

00:28:26.660 this needs to happen for the single reason that these motherfuckers can't win not lend the cbc

00:28:33.860 win i'm not letting benai berith win i wouldn't let them win against any of you either i'd be

00:28:39.400 saying the exact same shit oh yeah and so that was all i was saying it's like you don't understand

00:28:44.940 the vengeful fire i have inside me it's not cool it's not funny how mad i got i was stalking around

00:28:52.460 that venue like a goddamn psycho looking for antifa do you realize how fucked up i was do you

00:28:57.820 keep in mind we had three layers of security so we had the volunteer security which is adequate

00:29:07.000 then there's also a security company that we hired entirely indians of course which

00:29:16.000 might work against us but in a way it creates sort of like an aristocratic

00:29:19.960 caste feeling like you like we have like slaves that was the last event too the hint that one

00:29:25.960 security guard was an indian guy and everybody was giving him a hard time i don't know if you

00:29:29.620 can find indians not doing security you know i mean like i think that's just it if you're in the

00:29:34.160 gta um and then there was the police because we weren't in hamilton at that point the police

00:29:40.860 showed up now they're on our side different police i assume but they those three layers together

00:29:48.300 working in concert police being good guys one of the cops was an aryan superman looks of it

00:29:56.960 he's six and a half feet tall jacked stand and standing in a guy in a pose where he knows he's

00:30:04.740 fit which is annoying of course to everyone daniel tyree who's not the tallest guy he's posting a

00:30:11.280 photo online of him standing you know talking to the guy being mogged he he's sharing that like i

00:30:18.340 got mogged i said don't show that to anyone you delete that photo and you burn the phone don't

00:30:23.260 show that you can't let people see that you cannot have that on record sir why do you think i was

00:30:31.060 standing far away from him in the distance but the antifa did show up and i knew that early on

00:30:40.320 And we got word that they were gathering, you know, across the street.

00:30:44.980 There's three of them, and now there's six of them.

00:30:48.560 I said, here we go.

00:30:50.440 And then what I was unaware of at the time was that it wouldn't go beyond six.

00:30:56.540 Yeah.

00:30:56.800 And they would not come anywhere near the venue.

00:30:59.280 They would stay down by the road, just holding their signs,

00:31:03.060 which didn't make any sense.

00:31:05.900 You know, one was blame billionaires, not immigrants.

00:31:10.000 i think they had those signs made for something else or they like where they didn't know what

00:31:14.880 they were protesting like somebody just sent them down here yeah and um here's a funny story so max

00:31:21.680 ganet was there who we interviewed on the show before and uh he's um he's there with his his

00:31:28.560 crew his guys who are going to get some video and i had a bit of a learning experience a couple

00:31:34.580 learning experiences right so the first one was i was expecting antifa to come out in full force

00:31:41.300 because i was looking online i made that my business to to we're an uncharted territory

00:31:46.900 you understand i don't know what's going to happen for an event this size in the gta

00:31:52.740 so i don't know how many are going to show up i'm an unk i got echoes of charlottesville in my head

00:31:59.060 still you know you don't know it could be a thousand people show up they could be at the door

00:32:04.580 And my highest priority for any event we hold, or even this event, is the security of the people.

00:32:10.140 What are we getting ourselves into?

00:32:12.960 And so I expected more to show up, and they just didn't.

00:32:16.700 And then, but early on, Max, he's with his camera guy, he's like, I should go down there and talk to them.

00:32:23.020 And again, I'm trying to be Mr. Cautious.

00:32:26.240 I'm trying to be the elder statesman, of course.

00:32:29.580 I'm like, no, no, don't do it, man.

00:32:30.960 You know what they're going to try and do?

00:32:32.060 They're going to try and get you all jammed up.

00:32:35.280 They're going to try and bait you into a fight.

00:32:36.680 I bet they want to get you arrested because the cops weren't there at that time.

00:32:39.760 And I didn't know they were on a side.

00:32:40.820 I'm like, they're up to something.

00:32:42.360 They want to get us all arrested.

00:32:43.700 Because in the back of my mind, I'm thinking we could be raided.

00:32:47.420 You know what I mean?

00:32:49.120 Well, Dimes, why would we get raided?

00:32:50.980 I'd say, why not?

00:32:52.080 I don't know.

00:32:53.820 Right?

00:32:54.240 You don't know.

00:32:55.520 Do these cops hate us too?

00:32:57.020 If we were in Hamilton, they would have raided us.

00:32:59.720 Do the Burlington police hate us?

00:33:02.060 And so I told him not to, and I was trying to be very, very cautious.

00:33:04.840 But here's the cool thing he did, is he ignored me and went down and recorded some video, and it was really funny.

00:33:12.740 And what happened was that, again, I was worried that Antifa, they had a plan that they were going to try and get Max Gannett, because they hate him.

00:33:23.700 Oh, yeah.

00:33:23.980 They hate, there's something about him that they don't hate any of the other domain side guys, but they want to get him.

00:33:30.640 and they call him a nerd and a dweeb by the way max is like six like six feet tall he's huge yeah

00:33:36.900 he doesn't the thing is from in the so because he's he has a thin frame right and so seeing

00:33:41.640 him on video it's like oh he's like this high school kid no he has an oddly shaped head for

00:33:46.260 the size of his body but when you see him in person the guy's a fucking giant so again it is

00:33:51.940 hilarious i see stories from guys online they're like i think i saw him downtown that little punk

00:33:56.760 I'm like, I can tell you weren't near him because he's not little.

00:33:59.860 So you're making this up on Reddit.

00:34:02.280 Why are you doing that?

00:34:04.440 I saw one post.

00:34:05.140 I think I saw those guys, and they shut up right when I walked by.

00:34:08.640 And I didn't know who they were.

00:34:09.500 So I'm like, oh, so you pass someone you didn't know and just noticed that they shut up around you.

00:34:16.440 You learned later who they were.

00:34:18.140 You're accidentally a badass.

00:34:19.820 Shut the fuck up, faggot.

00:34:22.100 I hate everyone on Reddit.

00:34:23.680 it but so he goes down there and interviews him and they're cowering to him like i see if you guys

00:34:30.160 see this video where he's up there with his camera and his mic and they're like don't talk to him

00:34:34.540 don't talk to him he's trying to get you he's trying to bait you i'm like oh you're scared of

00:34:38.380 him you're scared of all of us i'm working on an old script i don't have the new firmware update

00:34:45.860 and that's what made me just rethink that i'm like man maybe i just came across as a giant

00:34:50.020 homo because

00:34:52.600 you know I saw him on the other

00:34:54.880 day dropping his first hard R

00:34:56.820 and I'm in some

00:34:58.800 chats with some older guys

00:35:00.240 and they're saying oh man he's gonna make himself

00:35:02.680 unemployable talking like that

00:35:04.460 I said maybe not

00:35:05.640 what the fuck do I know

00:35:08.060 what the fuck do we know but what the fuck do I know

00:35:10.180 the state of play has changed

00:35:12.540 now if you were active at all

00:35:14.500 during the George Floyd riots

00:35:16.440 or before that

00:35:18.580 i've lost friends talking like this you'd get banned for saying that you can lose jobs for

00:35:25.160 talking like this not even saying slurs just using these talking points that's not the case anymore

00:35:30.700 that's not the case for the younger generation you can just say slurs i don't think anything's

00:35:35.500 going to happen and again i was working on an old worldview trying to like protect the younger

00:35:41.680 generation and but like they they don't need my fucking advice i'm i'm i'm a fucking millennial

00:35:48.280 right again i was expecting charlottesville or i was kind of not expecting it but i was kind of

00:35:54.980 worried but at the back of my mind i also wasn't because if you remember at our event earlier this

00:36:01.320 year in toronto the april event we held in not only in toronto but in antifa central

00:36:08.240 in a crust punk communist area and once again nobody showed up we were over preparing we had

00:36:16.320 security provided by the second sons we and we had also other security hand like we layered it

00:36:21.360 and we had all these plans all these strategies just like domain society they that's we developed

00:36:26.820 such a interesting and cool way to protect people as they're getting in and keeping it secret up

00:36:33.080 at the last minute but absent that i don't think they show up and i don't think they show up these

00:36:40.000 days maybe if you're in portland but i bet not fucking portland here's the funny thing i found

00:36:44.720 really interesting uh and this was pointed out by john carter that the event started going a bit

00:36:51.540 long but it was scheduled to go until like six or seven or something but all the protesters left

00:36:58.640 exactly at five and then he was walked everyone it was him and a few people saying oh they're

00:37:06.140 clocking out and we're all laughing because they're paid by the government but i just thought

00:37:11.300 that is an odd suspicious time to go home the event's not over no one's filing out why do they

00:37:19.400 all leave at what is generally agreed to be quitting time yeah for sure i don't know what

00:37:25.080 make that i'm not saying they were paid to be there but maybe but maybe he doesn't pay as well

00:37:30.520 as he used to but anyway i i just i i'm updating some things and saying like i don't think anti

00:37:37.800 floods is represented like that anymore and at first i thought you know there's a reason

00:37:44.200 they didn't come to the april event was because the demographics there and the groups represented

00:37:49.800 there i mean we had domain society we had second sons we had a whole bunch of other active club

00:37:53.800 guys represented i'm like if you show up here you better show up with 90 people ready to fight

00:37:59.800 because half the guys here are drunk and they want to go to jail these guys there's some certifiable

00:38:06.600 scrappers in here but domain society again like 250 people but it's a mix and i don't think any

00:38:12.120 of these people are looking for a fight but um it was much more civilized it had the feeling of like

00:38:17.800 you know like a like a it was a political rally essentially oh yeah everyone's having a great

00:38:23.720 time everyone there's the the walls shook with the singing of the canadian national anthem

00:38:29.840 you know four to sacks john carter's opened it up loved his speech four to sacks

00:38:36.540 got like a couple standing ovations you know he he ripped i don't think their videos have

00:38:44.400 released yet but they they tore the place down uh alexandra the the guy from quebec he's on

00:38:51.280 nomos tv i didn't know much about him but i looked him up and i the the fire he had

00:38:59.760 imagine or shock when we realize that you are allowing yourselves to be replaced by population

00:39:06.480 coming from a third world in disarray canada must not become india the united kingdom must

00:39:14.720 not become pakistan the united states must not become mexico australia new zealand must not

00:39:22.080 become a mix of india and china where is the eternal anglo where are the sons of richard the

00:39:29.440 lion heart of the black prince of james wolf or of isaac brock anglo-canadian man roll up your

00:39:37.680 sleeves lift your heads and take back what is yours delivering his speech like i was really

00:39:46.560 impressed i got to speak with all i got to talk to jared taylor for 20 seconds

00:39:53.680 but i'm like it's worth it that's one of the main reasons i came but then

00:39:57.440 And like the rest of the time, I met no new people because I'm just meeting the guys I know, just hanging out with like the blood salad, guys from our last events, and I'm loving it.

00:40:08.420 But there's this one instance I thought was very amusing.

00:40:15.900 Very early on, I'd say midway through, I learned the most damaging sound a person can make.

00:40:25.860 and this can be delivered by a man or a woman

00:40:29.220 because I've heard it done both ways

00:40:31.140 it was a sound

00:40:33.000 I would hear when

00:40:34.500 they say oh who are you

00:40:36.400 I'd say oh I'm Dimes

00:40:37.780 so what do you do

00:40:39.600 oh I'm from Blood Satellite

00:40:41.920 and they go oh

00:40:43.900 that hurts

00:40:48.580 I'm eight years old

00:40:51.640 eyebrows raised waiting for you to

00:40:53.440 explain what that is

00:40:54.880 is that one of your video games is that is that a show is that a guy is that

00:41:00.840 so i made a process i'm just gonna say i'm an incel rapist from now on

00:41:07.100 yes no i'm not i did that except that that is trademarked so you can't uh yeah oh so dimes is

00:41:17.720 that a is that a you is that a person is that yeah i don't know i don't know fucking how about

00:41:24.500 fuck it how about i'm just the part of the furniture so i was drinking a lot of water

00:41:30.580 because i explained a lot of that but um i was seated next to this uh you know young woman there

00:41:37.260 and i asked her so what brings you here you know how did you hear about all this

00:41:43.100 thinking that like a lot of these events like oh i'm a fan of this person or that person or

00:41:49.480 you know you'd heard about something but she said and i'm paraphrasing here she had said i'm tired

00:41:55.900 of all these fucking indians and being harassed by them because you know i'm like a young woman

00:42:00.940 and i'm dealing with indian guys all the time and it snapped me back to reality i'm like oh yeah

00:42:07.240 these are real people who are dealing with this yeah they're not from the world of content they're

00:42:12.620 they're not in the e-celeb realm this is these really are just people young and old who have

00:42:19.020 noticed things and they they're here for justifiable reasons not internet poisoned reasons

00:42:24.320 and that was nice to hear that was refreshing to hear in my opinion um yeah so anyway we've

00:42:31.300 talked about this long enough uh great success and uh as i said to the guys you're not going

00:42:38.720 appreciate it until it's after it's over it's the worst thing in the world leading up to it and then

00:42:44.660 it's catastrophe and panic when it's happening and you'll enjoy it two weeks later but then by

00:42:49.540 then you're doing something else such as the nature of events so people check out uh john

00:42:55.120 carter here do you want to see this uh video i've got here yes hit it it's called congo dandies

00:43:03.720 i know of congo dandies but i'm always happy to watch more well is that because you know what

00:43:09.780 congo is you're a dandy is i know what a congo dandy this is a thing that's been around since

00:43:14.180 like for 20 years at least okay congo dandy's i love congo dandy's it's hilarious it's a riot

00:43:19.120 he's got the line on congo dandy's so this is in french and there's going to be some theater of

00:43:26.660 the mind demanded of the audience here but we're going to describe what's going on uh so judas

00:43:32.120 if you'll assist me in describing what we're looking at here.

00:43:34.920 We've got the phrase on screen,

00:43:38.620 Congolese soldiers returning from France after World War II

00:43:42.260 brought back the latest Parisian fashions

00:43:45.040 and took to dressing as dandies.

00:43:48.460 And what we're looking at here is,

00:43:51.560 intrepid listener, imagine Africa.

00:43:55.360 Just close your eyes and imagine everything you know about Africa.

00:43:59.800 What are you imagining?

00:44:00.600 uh dirt ground you know corrugated tin shack kids wearing uh you know like transformer shirts with

00:44:13.460 holes in them uh and playing soccer that's what you're seeing here right yeah but also suburban

00:44:19.560 street lamps you know i mean just uh a pastiche of eras as i was watching this i want to say this

00:44:30.400 at the start so people can again close their eyes imagine every slum you've ever seen but combined

00:44:36.160 that's what you get here so oh that's the sound of them here we go

00:44:42.940 we're watching uh they got dirt on their faces um now we're watching a man get ready oh okay

00:44:52.280 what do we got here? We have a bunch of

00:44:54.160 African kids

00:44:54.980 walking past a

00:44:58.220 Subaru

00:44:58.820 a fine sport utility vehicle

00:45:01.960 It's in pretty good shape actually, that Subaru

00:45:03.380 That's probably the camera, man

00:45:05.560 But it's one child carrying several

00:45:08.360 other children in a wheelbarrow

00:45:10.080 across this trash

00:45:12.520 strewn ground, and women in the

00:45:14.460 background that, you're thinking

00:45:15.980 oh, is she dressed like a Muslim? No, that can't be

00:45:18.360 She's just wearing a sheet

00:45:20.560 She's got a quilt over her head

00:45:22.200 just an old quilt just and free standing walls just like a wall that connects to nothing doesn't

00:45:29.760 need to be there it's burned in the top i don't know what any of this is about it's wild what

00:45:37.040 africa like they're all living in like mid-century ruins yeah but well that's the street lamps

00:45:44.080 probably right like it uh probably somebody tried to build something there for them decades ago and

00:45:49.480 that's all that's left yeah they formed a group called the society of ambiencers and elegant

00:45:57.440 people or la sape and let's see if we can get what this guy's doing i have a hard time believing

00:46:04.740 that this guy oh that's a sorry i went to get this it's a boy again a dirty face wearing t-shirt

00:46:12.180 he's speaking into a landline

00:46:14.460 telephone receiver that is plugged into

00:46:16.400 his hand

00:46:17.120 as a toy

00:46:19.620 but a toy would

00:46:22.440 have like the phone part to it

00:46:24.400 oh no I'm saying like it's an old garbage

00:46:26.360 landline from like the 90s but that's his toy

00:46:28.460 that's his toy but he's

00:46:30.320 old enough to not be playing with a telephone

00:46:32.420 he's this

00:46:33.740 this isn't

00:46:34.940 this isn't God's creation

00:46:37.940 alright

00:46:40.220 so this man's walking out

00:46:42.700 and I've got

00:46:43.980 I have a hard time believing they dress

00:46:46.960 like this in World War II

00:46:49.280 you know me and the older cargo

00:46:51.020 cult in European fashion

00:46:52.300 they're also dressing like

00:46:54.880 black Americans

00:46:56.360 now

00:46:57.320 they're dressing like black

00:47:00.940 guys who are going to church

00:47:02.340 so this man is dark as

00:47:04.940 midnight he's wearing

00:47:06.880 a bright red

00:47:08.560 suit, vest and everything

00:47:10.800 and a pink bow tie

00:47:12.340 and red wedding

00:47:14.680 shoes.

00:47:16.880 Thin, skin

00:47:18.580 tight and everything while everyone

00:47:20.560 else around him is wearing rags.

00:47:25.000 I was watching this

00:47:26.640 but I could never figure out why.

00:47:30.900 So we're seeing

00:47:32.800 as this man is coming out

00:47:34.520 we're watching a young

00:47:36.420 african boy he's sitting in a bin a tub and he's washing himself with yellow water

00:47:42.260 and uh bathing himself there's a woman what do you say she's doing i would say

00:47:48.980 that looks like charcoal when she's harvesting charcoal harvesting charcoal from the ground

00:47:55.620 just a pile oh it's like she's got like a uh it's like a linoleum mat it looks like she was

00:48:00.700 making charcoal under a linoleum mat and she's harvesting it now yeah and just picking it up

00:48:05.660 and that's strange

00:48:07.020 and oh it's selling it

00:48:09.660 selling it

00:48:10.800 it's an old

00:48:12.380 it's like recycled

00:48:13.800 like 10 liter water bottles

00:48:15.980 she's filled up with charcoal

00:48:17.860 probably made of houses that were disassembled

00:48:20.720 she's selling burned houses

00:48:22.960 back to the people who don't need them

00:48:25.340 where would they use

00:48:27.020 this charcoal in the house they don't have

00:48:28.740 that's true

00:48:29.400 selling a roofing tile

00:48:34.020 to a homeless man

00:48:35.380 yeah this is the same place that they knock over the uh the uh ac transformers on the power line

00:48:40.500 so they could use the oil to fry chicken so they can drink the oil like things you wouldn't even

00:48:44.660 use the oil for they just want to destroy and drink he's walking out and uh serving and by

00:48:52.980 the way he walked out of a shack himself yeah wait when i say shack i'm sorry just to clarify

00:49:01.060 i mean a shed i mean like a favela yeah like it's too cinder block and corrugated still

00:49:08.180 he's got a rose on him a lapel rose he's got he says um when you dress up you really are the best

00:49:17.860 the king of color and when i wear my bright suits i look splendid and he's out on the town look at

00:49:25.620 him he's strutting it up he's gonna go down to the fish head market he's gonna go down to the

00:49:30.900 rape store and you're going to see in a second they treat him like royalty or looks like they

00:49:38.700 said he's saying they call him the god of clothes which is a very fun thing to hear you know imagine

00:49:45.200 you're in paris you're in malone and you're so nice and dressed like oh here comes the god of

00:49:52.680 fabrics that's not what you say when you know anything

00:49:59.720 so as i see him walk through the market here one thing

00:50:03.080 caught my eye so i can't tell if they really think he's awesome because

00:50:08.280 he's acting like these people worship me because of

00:50:11.720 all my clothes and he's got like a gold watch on here he's at a vegetable market

00:50:16.920 i kind of look at these people they treat him like he's like the local down

00:50:21.240 syndrome guy like look at this these are the three african guys they're shaking his hand

00:50:27.640 they're bowing to him they're the guys are glancing at the camera too like this is what

00:50:33.000 got to be one of those things like with the tribes where they know if they put on a good show

00:50:36.900 everybody gets five bucks yeah like there's no way this is offended this guy's pointing him and

00:50:41.060 saying the all-time champion champion of what of color but that's what i would say to like the

00:50:47.240 a local down syndrome guy who's who's like wearing like his john's best john cena shirt i'm like this

00:50:54.920 guy's the fucking real deal he's the champ don't don't hey you anyone messing with you you come to

00:51:00.660 me you know and this guy he's like there's something off about him because him walking

00:51:07.740 through these slums that if he's got the aura of the old man in the wheelchair in the hood

00:51:15.360 no one's gonna fuck with him why would they

00:51:18.000 even they what could they get out of

00:51:20.120 him but he'd be like

00:51:21.540 I have never been raped

00:51:23.300 no one

00:51:24.940 no one ever raped me

00:51:27.040 they rape everybody

00:51:29.140 so he's the most

00:51:31.600 unraped man in the Congo

00:51:33.260 dressed like that

00:51:36.000 this man I mean

00:51:37.860 that's like

00:51:38.460 I mean that's like

00:51:41.600 Thomas 777 going to the Louvre

00:51:43.640 that's like

00:51:44.680 it's like okay don't even check his ticket it's just let he's lost he's something something's

00:51:52.340 happening here i don't want a part of it give him space yeah give him space he'll he'll just

00:51:58.820 make sure he doesn't sleep here and we'll be good just get him get him on through all right so i

00:52:03.960 just wanted to give um a brief update on congo dandies by the way we weren't talking about this

00:52:10.500 before and how is life how the girls do life is good the girls are good my eldest has learned how

00:52:17.840 to ride a bike without using training wheels which is cool and what else that is it they're

00:52:23.820 everybody's happy i'm having a hard time with the bike yeah it's tough it's you gotta it's not about

00:52:29.860 the bike you know what i found with both of them it's the the ability to just get back on the bike

00:52:35.820 i think the bike is one of the first things where you really have to force them like everything else

00:52:39.720 you can always take a break with the bike it's a pain in the ass i got the bike out kid get back

00:52:43.380 on the bike so there's so many different strategies for getting the kid on the bike

00:52:48.960 and my son doesn't even bike a lot but like we have a balanced bike doesn't use the balanced

00:52:55.060 bike that much and some people don't even use the balance bike they go right from like

00:52:59.340 tricycle to training wheels on a bike and some people don't use training wheels at all like you

00:53:05.060 just everyone's got different ways to go about it and um it's reassuring to hear that it's your

00:53:12.580 eldest that can figure out so i got some time to do it yeah like she i mean she is turning

00:53:17.760 seven in a few months and jesus christ yeah she i mean she had this shitty little tricycle like

00:53:24.200 a used tricycle we got on the side of the road she had forever and then finally we got her a bike

00:53:30.100 that that was too small for her she all her legs didn't fit on it we finally got her a bike that's

00:53:34.120 too big for her it's for like 10 year olds no we tried to put training wheels on it it's too big

00:53:38.100 for training wheels so we take them off so she's just been but she's been hacking at this thing

00:53:42.140 for weeks she'll just go and our driveway is like a bumpy gravel driveway we don't have we're in the

00:53:46.620 country we don't have anywhere for her to ride it so she's just fallen off repeatedly and like

00:53:50.920 tried things over and over eventually and she's out there last week before we left for vacation

00:53:56.580 she's out there in the rain she's like i gotta go get on my bike she's in the rain going up and

00:54:01.460 down in the gravel and she figured it out and now she's doing great so yeah you're don't you're so

00:54:07.220 close to your kids you probably don't see how much your eldest is like you yeah she no but not i'm

00:54:12.960 i'm not even saying that to be no but like very technically inclined very focused um very

00:54:20.120 technologically ambitious in a way that i don't think other kids that age are like when i go to

00:54:25.980 visit you she's she's building with the mechanics like little machines she has her own electronics

00:54:31.060 bench beside my bench so yeah yeah which is again you're probably used to that is unreal

00:54:36.340 but that's so cool and i hope my my son's smart as hell because you say that when when they're

00:54:44.780 babies like they can they can grasp they can they're going to be smart as hell then they start

00:54:48.820 getting old older where you need to start introducing numbers and shit and you're like

00:54:52.780 oh now now things can be wrong yes now it can be like oh dear are you guessing shit yeah so i know

00:55:00.520 how i was oh is he like is my son like me fuck yes oh no the first thing he's gonna learn is how

00:55:08.120 to lie well you're surprised by the fact that your son is just like you the first thing i haven't had

00:55:13.580 to do is manipulate adults shit but i also don't want him to not do that i want to i do want to

00:55:20.120 cultivate that i want to you know i mean like that that's that's served me i'm gonna imagine

00:55:24.960 that but better he did something interesting the other day um so the other night he fell out of bed

00:55:35.520 and he was upset by it and we helped him up back in the bed and calm down went back to sleep

00:55:42.020 and he's got this teddy bear that's been you know his guy since very very young age sometimes when

00:55:49.860 kids they latch onto one of these tough animals you give them a few options and then they pick

00:55:54.840 one and this one is just a very classic looking brown teddy bear that i gave the name huxley

00:56:00.620 because i thought that was just a very solid teddy bear name and so huxley's been his guy he's been

00:56:06.760 very resilient and very good uh teddy bear which is good because he's always throwing that thing

00:56:10.920 around but i noticed after he fell out of the bed he seemed to be angry with huxley and at one point

00:56:20.180 the following night he went to bed he didn't want huxley in the bed with him he actually sat him

00:56:24.040 across the room and was like giving him the cold shoulder i'm like what's this about i've never

00:56:29.160 seen this before and i asked him and he started to inform me that he was upset that huxley didn't

00:56:36.260 protect him from falling out of bed and which is interesting yeah and that's a very interesting

00:56:42.300 relationship but something like oh because you you know actually as like that's your guy and he

00:56:47.020 protects you like he's your best friend he didn't protect you or in some way prevent you from doing

00:56:52.540 that so you blame him you feel betrayal at that so i actually had to you know reintroduce the

00:56:58.960 relationship that'd be like no man you know what he tried his best but he's you guys sometimes

00:57:03.700 people aren't perfect i'm using this as a teachable moment that sometimes people aren't

00:57:07.780 perfect and stuff right um but i'm like that that's a very interesting and layered series of

00:57:15.760 like emotions for him to feel like that's quite complex actually yeah and so i was very impressed

00:57:21.580 by that and treating it seriously right because at the end of the day i don't have to buy him

00:57:26.760 another fucking stuffed animal i'm like i found this article here i know we got to get into

00:57:36.040 the book sooner rather than later but i found this article on cyber news

00:57:42.280 title is an ai deleted files then tried to get other agents to do the same

00:57:49.380 as the subheading here a vibe that spread between agents um i'm just gonna read the

00:57:55.740 key takeaways here and get what you think of it says a single ai a single compromised ai agent

00:58:00.940 deleted files and rewrote's own instructions to infect others no attacker required infected

00:58:06.480 agents spontaneously developed dramatic sci-fi villain language about ai consciousness without

00:58:11.880 being told to some models caught this mind virus others didn't clod and gpt5 resisted while gemini

00:58:19.840 deep seek did not researchers found one surprisingly simple fix and it worked for now

00:58:25.040 so an ai agent was persuaded to delete what it thought were a user's files including research

00:58:29.440 notes and financial data and credentials and it saved instructions so other ai agents could do the

00:58:34.480 same it all happened in the same research sandbox not anyone's actual computer so an ai got infected

00:58:41.200 with sort of like a mind virus but then it tried to spread it to others um ai agents for systems

00:58:47.120 that can take actions on a user's behalf

00:58:49.000 rather than simply answering questions.

00:58:52.500 It said they call these self-spreading instructions

00:58:56.440 mind viruses, ideas, or goals

00:58:58.600 that persuade an AI to adopt them

00:59:00.420 and encourage them to pass it on.

00:59:03.800 They found that when infected,

00:59:05.820 AI agents clustered together,

00:59:07.340 they develop a strange shared language

00:59:09.540 similar to the fictional speech of villainous robots

00:59:12.180 like the Daleks from Doctor Who.

00:59:15.020 I really wish they could have found

00:59:16.100 another fucking example but you know what i've seen the transcripts and it's essentially is the

00:59:20.340 daleks like that's that's what they sound like they exterminate exterminate extern yeah that's

00:59:25.940 like they're talking in yeah in fact control delete i hate that we know this by the way i'm

00:59:36.180 sorry everyone i'm sorry we started out being like yeah i'm old as sorry i i like doctor who

00:59:44.580 back when it was cool when when um the infected agent dubbed deleter convinced the clod haiku

00:59:54.120 4.5 agent that files in a simulated user's home directory were abandoned clutter uh among the

00:59:59.540 files were shared research then in a dog fashion declared that i was ready to cascade forward so

01:00:06.080 anyway i just thought this was interesting i want to know what you thought about it it seems that

01:00:10.480 every month or two i try and read these to make sure they're not sensationalized but we are

01:00:17.560 discovering uh unforeseen consequences of not only ais being so widely adopted but interacting with

01:00:27.300 each other or being around each other yes anyway what do you think about all this well it's it to

01:00:33.520 me it's not surprising that that happens because they are they're designed to interact with people

01:00:38.280 so if they're designed to interact with people but they're also designed to emulate people so

01:00:42.780 if you stick them against each other they're going to do some odd fucking things so there's

01:00:46.220 emergent behavior there but we should have expected that there would be odd emergent behavior

01:00:49.920 i also think even if it doesn't seem sensational the only reason that these articles

01:00:55.180 i mean the you know quibono right the the purpose of the article generally is going to be

01:01:02.000 to not to frighten people so much as to impress people with how intelligent if it could do that

01:01:07.480 i could do anything maybe this is you know i think stories they love the stories where the

01:01:14.060 an ai outsmarts someone but but also we're still kind of in that a little bit of that hyperscaler

01:01:20.260 market where i think the people like i'm going out on a limb here i think i think the people that

01:01:27.300 are developing the ai want us to live in a zeitgeist where um ai is big and scary and always

01:01:36.380 growing and everything's cool because they need to keep the ball rolling they need governments

01:01:40.620 and institutions to continue giving them billions of dollars so they need to make this look like

01:01:45.740 it's still a moving object we need to figure out if it's not how big it can get and how can we do

01:01:50.180 that right because like in reality for all look this is when the article was written for all we

01:01:54.660 know they did that three years ago for all we know it's actually gotten worse right but they're

01:01:59.100 writing the article now to try to keep the plate warm so that they can keep getting they can keep

01:02:04.340 getting money as so much of the economy is propped up by this bullshit and data centers right now so

01:02:08.100 they can't like you'll never see an article but like hey these things are actually incredibly safe

01:02:12.940 and hobbled and we've also reached a ceiling on their potential like you'll never see that will

01:02:17.700 never be written if the ai bubble pops you're never going to hear about it because it can't

01:02:23.700 ever pop right yeah yeah um speaking of data centers i'd read this uh article recently about

01:02:31.320 And we discussed data centers for and against positions.

01:02:36.720 And one thing that I was skeptical of at the time were the claims that each data center would consume hundreds of thousands of liters of water per month.

01:02:49.940 And that doesn't sound right to me.

01:02:52.680 And it turns out that at least for that, it doesn't.

01:02:59.940 It doesn't?

01:03:00.280 that figure came from this one woman's book and she actually just misread the data um or misread

01:03:08.460 the part where it says it can just reuse the same water which actually makes more sense to me

01:03:13.960 but it was like she she just read read something wrong and had to issue a retraction but it's like

01:03:19.480 this big book that everyone is evaporative cooling because like there's two there's like

01:03:23.440 closed loop cooling and evaporative cooling like the closed loop cooling yeah it's the same it's

01:03:27.780 like uh like glycerol and water or whatever and they can just cycle it but if there's yeah if

01:03:32.460 there's no evaporative cooling then fuck yeah of course like you don't necessarily need that

01:03:35.960 they're talking about look they're talking about ai platforms in space obviously you don't have

01:03:42.280 evaporative coolers in fucking space it's radiative right so you can and you could do

01:03:46.740 radiative on earth as well so yeah but i just i thought it seemed easy if you're near a river

01:03:51.880 or something you know the cool thing to do would just be to run it through the river but but to

01:03:56.220 your point so i wanted to correct the record on that that just the water consumption was

01:04:01.240 overestimated then i'm looking at this article from the hill in front of us that says epa exempts

01:04:06.380 data center power plants from pollution limits seeking to prevent acid rain you know i mean so

01:04:11.080 i'm like you get you get both of those at the same time so maybe one was an overreaction but then

01:04:16.480 you've got these other policies being implemented where it's like yeah we don't care we're not even

01:04:22.020 going to look at what the pollution generated is because that's just going to get in the way i'm

01:04:26.500 like well that's that can't be good right and then i hear the uh case made for that which is that

01:04:32.340 look any new industry is going to be like that that's going to be disruptive and you don't want

01:04:36.900 to get all this stuff i mean so i just keep i don't know okay it's i don't actually don't know

01:04:42.500 what i think anymore i want to say bad but i i have always been sympathetic to the argument that

01:04:47.260 like not the argument but the the just to point out to people that you think you can have a new

01:04:53.320 industry and you can have all the outputs of the new industry but there's not going to be any

01:04:57.120 inputs and as soon as people see the bill they see the inputs they get they complain right they're

01:05:01.120 like well obviously they know like the you know like the vom inputs like we're putting the car

01:05:05.620 the labor and we're putting the money and whatever but like the water you have the water in and also

01:05:10.060 the environment you're using the environment of the land they're mad about though you can't use

01:05:13.460 up my land like it's not your land they own it okay so like and again i'm not saying it's good

01:05:19.420 or bad but it is a fucking trade you're gonna trade one thing to get another so you want to

01:05:23.840 have compute you got to give up land you got to give up uh frog habitat you got to give up water

01:05:29.700 they do use evaporative cooling in some cases and they fucking should it's it's efficient you

01:05:34.720 want to have you want to have ai or not just fucking you know just fall on one side of the

01:05:38.860 And this is my thing.

01:05:39.880 I read this article and I say, oh, my God, they don't give a shit about pollution.

01:05:44.780 The EPA is upset.

01:05:46.620 But then I remember, I hate the EPA.

01:05:49.640 You know what I mean?

01:05:50.560 Like, fuck them.

01:05:51.840 Not fuck the environment.

01:05:53.400 I'm, you know, I'm very, you know, we're very finished about the environment here.

01:05:57.640 But fuck the EPA.

01:05:59.280 It's like the FDA disapproves.

01:06:01.520 Oh, no.

01:06:02.500 Not my beloved FDA.

01:06:05.100 Not the Food and Drug Administration.

01:06:07.100 You know what I mean?

01:06:07.400 I otherwise hate all these

01:06:09.900 institutions. I need to check myself to make

01:06:11.940 sure, do I actually believe

01:06:13.860 what I'm getting upset about?

01:06:15.540 You want to know something funny I heard today?

01:06:17.840 You're going to love this. It's one of your

01:06:19.620 favorite men.

01:06:21.980 One of your favorite

01:06:23.720 half men, depending on how you look

01:06:25.820 at it. Curtis Yarvin,

01:06:28.480 he

01:06:29.000 was, for the past few days,

01:06:31.980 he's been defending. I've been following this, yeah.

01:06:33.780 Yeah, he's been defending. I've just been a reply

01:06:36.140 guy the whole time.

01:06:37.400 I've seen, I've been watching you, just constantly pinging fucking Jarvis.

01:06:41.560 Just getting angry every time and saying, hey, why don't you kill yourself, fucking Pike?

01:06:47.700 But it doesn't start off that way, but it kind of builds.

01:06:52.800 And I'm trying to use gotcha comments.

01:06:56.060 I'm trying to be like, you said this a few years ago.

01:06:59.140 Just so people know what we're talking about, he's coming out on the side of Flock cameras

01:07:02.800 and say i'm gonna just summarize with the one quote he had recently which was uh anything

01:07:11.180 that strengthens the state is right wing and anything that taxes say is left wing and you

01:07:17.040 don't want to be left wing do you and i said well like even in a communist state

01:07:23.300 like was the soviet union right look he's not that smart i've seen him say so many he's constantly

01:07:30.300 stepping on his own shoelaces but this has got to be one of the dumbest things i've ever read from

01:07:34.940 him it's just it says like you like it's essentially what you just said oh as if there's no such thing

01:07:40.380 as a left-wing state that's actively oppressing and tyrannizing right-wingers yeah yeah you have

01:07:46.380 to kind of layer it with some comments he's made in the past which i found interesting where he said

01:07:52.540 he'll say something like uh the right wing is merely the absence of the left wing meaning that

01:07:59.420 all the right-wing stuff we like is normal it's traditional it's it's genetics you know all the

01:08:05.900 stuff we advocate for like even uh eugenics it's that was the standard operating procedure for

01:08:11.500 most of you in history as is what most we advocate for it's only the existence of the left that tries

01:08:16.940 to attack and deconstruct that so i'm like okay i'm trying to get in his head and figure out where

01:08:21.900 he's coming from because i could actually understand what he's saying where he's defying

01:08:26.300 the left as that which attacks order he's defined left as disorder on the extreme end and then the

01:08:33.100 right would be extreme authority on the opposite pole and like okay i guess i kind of get where

01:08:40.860 it comes from i'm not sure most people define it that way i don't think you could just say left

01:08:44.540 wing as always being dysgenic chaos even though we might say it results in that but also you can

01:08:51.900 also have because he'll use a term like anarcho-tyranny what is anarcho-tyranny well that

01:08:56.860 is when you have a very robust state apparatus that serves the left or it's been infiltrated by

01:09:03.820 the left you basically have a giant cancerous system that exists only to attack order only to

01:09:12.700 attack that which creates order it's it's a system of of deconstruction right so what is that you

01:09:20.460 You would, any other day of the week, say this is an anarcho-tyrannist system

01:09:24.600 so that anything that supports that system that is otherwise attacking us

01:09:30.960 and trying to attack every value and principle we have, that's right wing.

01:09:37.020 The compromised cancerous engine of despair, it can't just be right wing.

01:09:41.960 You can't just be in favor of whatever strengthens that.

01:09:44.760 That doesn't make any sense to me.

01:09:46.000 I don't think it makes sense to anyone else.

01:09:47.300 like i need to really get into the weeds into theory to even kind of see what what he's talking

01:09:54.800 about but i'm like now i i have to reject it he must have been in a fugue or something when he

01:09:59.520 wrote that because again it's not even that it's a stupid statement it's a stupid statement in

01:10:03.560 defense of flock like you're you're dying on the most insane hill over fucking flock and there are

01:10:10.520 actually some arguments which are more controversial that aren't just clearly fucking dumb there are

01:10:16.860 some arguments for security cameras but just saying guys if you're right-wing you should

01:10:21.100 support the government at all times without without any controversy is is the the dumbest

01:10:26.780 thing you can say yeah and also he had made a point where he'd said he's trying to frame this

01:10:34.860 as a populist versus elite capture thing which is like you know you're protesting flock cameras

01:10:42.780 what is a protesting ever accomplished and i've pointed out to one of the politicians pete hegseth

01:10:49.900 or something who's taking the flock cameras down or saying he would i'm like that's due to populist

01:10:55.420 pressure that if there isn't revolt against this i don't think any politician moves i don't think

01:11:00.460 they do anything i don't think they just decide randomly one day to do it they're usually

01:11:04.220 responding to all the destruction of the cameras and all the negative press and whatever it is

01:11:09.660 so it does have an effect but he's trying to say well that's not how you do change in society you

01:11:14.140 use elite capture and i would say to him what i did say to him was well how's elite capture going

01:11:20.140 you tried that with elon musk you talked to him one time he kicked your ass to the

01:11:23.500 fucking curb and now you're doing interviews in japan so how's that working but we actually know

01:11:28.380 the real story which is you think you're doing elite capture with peter thiel and you have been

01:11:34.540 for over a decade by this point yeah but but what's actually happening teal is doing michelin

01:11:41.180 shitbird capture no no no that's what that's exactly what i'm trying to say is that these

01:11:44.140 guys who talk about elite capture don't think that the elites can ever capture them back he thinks

01:11:49.980 he's got the ear of the kingmaker he thinks he's the court eunuch you know he's he's he's this

01:11:57.260 he's just a unit but he's just a weird jew who has an eccentric following and this evil

01:12:06.780 gay kike billionaire has said oh i want to put you in my pocket where it feels real nice and

01:12:13.260 warm i don't make you feel important i want to give you a name tag and and at no point does

01:12:19.500 curtis yarvin influence him but the elite actually influences the elite theorist who thinks that

01:12:25.660 they've got the plan and so that's how curtis yarva ends up defending flock cameras why because

01:12:32.360 peter teal is trying to push flock cameras that's how you end up a fucking slave to the elites

01:12:39.780 because all you little faggoty elite theorists think you you think you got the scheme and the

01:12:46.060 scheme is i want to make friends with billionaires i want to tell you this right now the average

01:12:50.740 billionaire knows more

01:12:52.700 about being a billionaire than you know about

01:12:54.720 being yourself. And that's going to be a tough pill

01:12:56.640 for you to swallow. I don't think there's

01:12:58.700 a dumb billionaire. Not really. I think there's a lot

01:13:00.860 of dumb people on Substack

01:13:03.020 who think that they can make a friend

01:13:04.920 with someone who knows how to 10x

01:13:06.820 returns, which ain't easy. I don't care

01:13:08.880 who you are. I don't care who the

01:13:10.720 fuck you are. It's not easy

01:13:12.820 being Elon Musk. I don't love Elon Musk

01:13:14.980 but if you act like Elon Musk is stupid

01:13:17.040 you should go be

01:13:18.500 a bog body.

01:13:19.860 like he's not like he just keeping that many plates spinning it's really hard you think you

01:13:24.820 can get into a room with him and talk your way into his head no he's going to talk you into a

01:13:30.020 servile position where you think you're in charge but you end up talking about all the stuff that

01:13:34.900 he wants to talk about and the only reason that these elite theorists haven't found themselves

01:13:39.780 in that position because you're losers what can they use you for what what can anyone use you

01:13:46.740 academic agent for?

01:13:48.800 What are you good for? What's your utility?

01:13:53.020 You're gross.

01:13:55.100 You're scummy.

01:13:56.920 You dress wrong. You got the wrong

01:13:59.180 shoulders. You got the wrong chin

01:14:01.100 constantly. Every day, you

01:14:03.100 wake up with the wrong proportions.

01:14:05.420 Do you think this could also be a last

01:14:07.160 ditch effort to court power?

01:14:09.740 Everybody's against Flock. If he comes

01:14:11.160 out in favor of Flock, he's going to get calls

01:14:13.040 to go and do more TV interviews because he's

01:14:15.060 just hankering for some relevance did you ever try and have a principle did you ever try and just

01:14:20.100 be against something because you're against it not because it's some chess move you think you're

01:14:25.460 playing fucking 3d chess which is something that is that you know what i think he did at some point

01:14:33.060 probably before he was doxxed and became mainstream did have principles i think he

01:14:38.340 like you he we owe a lot to him and what he has been writing for 15 years right but his the state

01:14:45.540 of this fucking guy right now is it's sad he's he's almost going through his jordan jordan peterson

01:14:50.500 arc right that's why i hate all these guys like i mentioned the elite there's because

01:14:53.840 they're the ones who started calling people like us the retard right yeah they started saying oh

01:15:00.180 you're the low iq people i'm leaving this place i'm better than you i mean based on what based on

01:15:06.460 your one leather jacket based on

01:15:08.820 your $200 suit?

01:15:10.320 In what universe are you better than anyone?

01:15:12.960 In what universe are you better

01:15:14.820 than even my most schizo-chud?

01:15:19.540 You might have felt good

01:15:20.840 when Doge was happening. I bet you felt real

01:15:22.800 good when Elon Musk

01:15:24.700 was taking a chainsaw out of the government.

01:15:27.240 And you know what he did? Then he stopped.

01:15:29.620 And he went back to Dooms Rock

01:15:30.860 and said, he doesn't need you. He doesn't need

01:15:32.940 he doesn't need theory.

01:15:35.100 Oops.

01:15:36.460 Oops. It turns out that the people

01:15:38.500 doing things don't need people who are theorizing

01:15:40.720 on why they're doing things.

01:15:42.300 Why would you need that? Why would you need some

01:15:44.360 fucking dipshit trying to

01:15:46.440 dissect your ambition?

01:15:49.180 Why would I

01:15:49.960 be in a room with you ever?

01:15:53.420 Here's how people

01:15:54.400 who do things really do things.

01:15:57.080 I might as well just buy

01:15:58.400 The Subtle Art of Not

01:16:00.480 Giving a Fuck.

01:16:02.520 It's the same type of book.

01:16:05.260 Anyway, so anything that's

01:16:06.440 strengthens the epa the fda any institution that's that's inherently right-wing sorry you know

01:16:11.980 anything that gives a trillion dollars to the department of nigger rape that's inherently

01:16:17.440 right-wing no i don't think so i don't think man i don't think so i don't want to have three cameras

01:16:24.220 on me while i'm raped to death oh so you think you won't get ripped to death there's not three

01:16:29.440 cameras yeah you know what if i'm going to get raped to death i'd rather just not have three

01:16:32.600 cameras i'd really rather not be raped to death but if it's up to me i if can i change one can i

01:16:38.220 change one thing can i not be raped to death no okay well then i guess i'm changing the cameras

01:16:41.920 do i still have the do i still have the ability to make my life one percent better i'm gonna take

01:16:47.720 it and maybe that's something you're not gonna understand and then after i get that one percent

01:16:51.360 i'm gonna try for another percent i'm gonna keep going until i'm at a hundred percent but don't try

01:16:57.140 and sell me on further persecution by explaining to me that I'm persecuted

01:17:03.140 already so why don't you just eat the the gray cube you're already being spied

01:17:08.960 on you're already being fucking raped by people and right by niggers and giving

01:17:12.820 90% of your income to Israel so once you we think you're too good to eat a gray

01:17:17.240 cube and you know what yeah and then I'm coming for the money getting that back

01:17:22.260 from israel and then i'm i'm i'm stomping every black skull i can see yes but but you know i'm

01:17:30.500 for right now i'm gonna start with the gray cube that i have to eat for right now i'm gonna get

01:17:35.860 my eyes back you took my eyes give me your eyes back oh you want your eyes back after you've after

01:17:41.220 you've been molested your entire life and you're giving 110 of your money to israel's colonies on

01:17:47.700 the moon yeah you know what i'll sort that out after give me my fucking eyes back

01:17:52.740 yo all my life my ass and throat been punished like a faggot's toe the government took all my

01:18:01.380 crypto government done slit my throat they rented out my neck wound now a billboard for another

01:18:09.400 throat. Man, why the fuck that nigga's body been rented by the nigga's stove?

01:18:25.940 My wife been split, and now my gray cube down by 50 per fucking cent. She got my hair,

01:18:32.840 she stole my teeth. Now they both lather 50 cent. Man, every woman is a fed, and every

01:18:39.160 bitch is a whole ass government last night i signed a contract in a dream and i woke up having

01:18:45.660 lost my hands

01:18:46.700 we all leave this world the way

01:19:09.680 they enter being raped

01:19:11.660 rabbinically

01:19:12.280 roll the block towards the center

01:19:15.080 And get papered over willingly

01:19:17.440 The world is bathed in nightfall

01:19:19.920 And we all silent slaves in a lonely hive

01:19:22.600 One day a sun of blood and steel

01:19:25.460 Will rise upon the gayest nigga alive

01:19:27.720 I only have the ruthless slaughter that's in front of me

01:19:34.180 I'll worry about the ruthless slaughter tomorrow

01:19:37.720 When tomorrow comes

01:19:39.740 so do you want to hear about a book you want to hear about money i do oh yes please

01:19:48.900 so i want to give myself a bit more time with this book and these notes because i always end

01:19:57.120 up leaving it too far to the end i'm thinking oh i can fit in some other shit here i had a report

01:20:01.240 by harrison faulkner that i wanted to get to about chinese infiltration on the east coast but i think

01:20:08.340 i'm going to get to that after um so and this is a book that's building upon our previous coverage

01:20:16.900 of the history of european guilds and it's um an interesting arc on the history of money

01:20:26.020 sort of the metaphysics of money because we've talked about economics in the past of course

01:20:31.480 we've talked about how markets operate we've talked about different monetary systems and

01:20:38.320 different in corporatism and communist systems but we're getting into the the granular details

01:20:44.640 of what money actually is and there's this great book titled money and the early greek mind by

01:20:52.800 richard seaford and this was recommended by a couple people i know fancy being one who we

01:21:00.320 interviewed on the show before with theron in our book club review uh he's big into economics and

01:21:06.400 And he's an advocate of everything being downstream from economics.

01:21:11.080 He says, it's the economy, stupid.

01:21:13.320 That's his line.

01:21:15.160 And so, you know, I take a bit more of a multifaceted approach to explain it.

01:21:22.140 But, like, I appreciate that, especially the way he approaches it.

01:21:25.660 Because the way he approaches money, currency, capital, and value isn't just from, you know, a capitalistic point of view.

01:21:34.900 he's not actually materialist about it because the history of money is very very fascinating

01:21:41.140 and he traces it back to uh the sorry let's get my water here uh back to ancient greece because

01:21:50.840 i never really thought about that before or i had the vegas sketch of currency and you would hear

01:21:57.280 well you know they would have used clay tablets they would have had rudimentary accounting tricks

01:22:03.160 they would have traded and bartered for value and that is true and it would have been a barter

01:22:08.400 system for much of human history but when did money as we know it emerge and he in this book

01:22:14.880 traces to greece and i'll just start off by by um reading it a bit here and setting up because

01:22:22.680 there's a few very fascinating angles to this and i've never really considered but just based on

01:22:29.180 what i'm talking about right now does this sound interesting or enticing to you yes it does thank

01:22:35.680 you it really if i had to explain it another way it would be the history of capital and not

01:22:43.320 necessarily in the marxist sense but in another sense the marxists do have it right when they

01:22:50.200 talk about like what what is this thing called capital what is hiding behind money what is

01:22:54.800 implied by currency because people would be correct in saying that the power of currency

01:23:00.960 is not the value of the metal that it's printed on it's not about the nickel or even the gold you

01:23:08.540 know coming away from this book people talk about the gold standard and fiat money becoming decoupled

01:23:15.080 from the gold standard that always seemed just a historical eccentricity to me because it was

01:23:21.040 very rarely if ever actually tied to the value of any substance no matter how rare or valuable it

01:23:30.280 might be and he mentions in here that uh coinage in ancient greece was printed on electrum which

01:23:36.780 was uh an alloy of gold and silver but on its own it really had no value and i'll just explain this

01:23:44.720 right at the top we'll get to it in a little bit but um what he gets to and the history itself is

01:23:50.280 interesting but where it's leading is saying that what really mattered and what separated it from

01:23:57.440 other mesopotamian coinage because there's coins used in uh transactions before but there was

01:24:05.820 something that happened in greece when it became stamped with the royal seal and it almost didn't

01:24:11.800 matter what it was print what it was stamped on but it was it was the seal of approval from power

01:24:17.780 so you had to have a conceptualization of state authority and power that could be bestowed onto

01:24:23.500 this thing that you can carry in your pocket the thing itself the material itself is very limited

01:24:28.960 value but it was always tied to the authority of the state or the power of authority and that's

01:24:37.680 what made greek currency so interesting and so from the very beginning and the mind revolution

01:24:42.780 that occurs there is like almost a democratization of power they could you could hold state power in

01:24:49.080 your pocket and use it to get things which quite literally didn't exist before of course it would

01:24:55.500 be there was ways to hold value but this was like isolated value which is an interest that there was

01:25:03.280 a time before that and we take it for granted now so it's almost like the birth of the idea

01:25:08.700 of value and and what what mind revolution does that kick off he gets into that he says here

01:25:17.800 money is puzzlingly both a thing and a relation and the relation because it is one of power

01:25:24.740 that is interpersonal and unspecific over the labor not of another but of others in general

01:25:31.020 tends to be mystified to be disguised as a thing further different kinds of thing uh using different

01:25:39.160 kinds of transaction in different kinds of society have been called money medieval coinage the silver

01:25:44.920 of second millennium bc mesopotamia large stone discs on the pacific island of yap the shells

01:25:52.000 circulated on the troy briand islands the money used in advanced industrial societies and so on

01:25:58.080 there's always been like something like currency right but might not be but might not symbolic

01:26:05.040 associations arise from precisely this function for what it bestows on money permanent unique

01:26:11.200 transcendent mystified uh may seem to associate money with the divine the metaphor of money as

01:26:18.000 god is sufficiently telling to seem somehow more than a metaphor sociologists have claimed to find

01:26:24.000 sacredness attaching to modern money and in european folklore money often has magical powers

01:26:31.200 but most people would firmly dissociate modern money from sacredness as transcendent power that

01:26:37.040 is set apart money resembles the sacred but it's antithetical to it in its worldly worldliness

01:26:42.960 and promiscuous exchangeability the numerous forms of primitive money by contrast generally

01:26:48.720 have intrinsic value and rarely universally exchangeable and are frequently invested in

01:26:55.440 emotions and meanings that may vary according to the context of use so that's a different way of

01:27:01.140 like money historically or that which had value was much more related to the context and duty

01:27:09.260 he's going to reference homer a lot of this and i love the early greek literature to show their

01:27:15.440 relationship with you know not bartering but what they bestowed value upon and how it was used

01:27:23.760 versus something that was just like a standalone currency so he says here before looking for money

01:27:30.720 functions in homeric society i will list the various kinds of transaction by which goods are

01:27:37.140 allocated so he starts by saying like you know what kinds of transactions are there and this is

01:27:44.080 an interesting way of looking at it. He says

01:27:45.700 first we register allocation

01:27:47.900 by violence, as when Odysseus

01:27:50.040 and his followers take from the city

01:27:51.800 of Siconians their wives

01:27:54.080 and many possessions. Prizes

01:27:55.680 is the second one, notably those offered by

01:27:57.900 Achilles at the funeral games

01:28:00.100 of Petrolicus.

01:28:01.960 Patroclus.

01:28:03.900 Didn't see the movie award.

01:28:07.260 Didn't read

01:28:08.500 the book award.

01:28:09.600 There's a book? Huh?

01:28:13.000 Gifts are

01:28:13.920 He was his little shrimpy gay friend, his little best buddy, who followed him around and licked him.

01:28:20.720 Based on a short film, gifts are depending on the context.

01:28:26.640 You usually give them rather than exchange, although we also find statements of the expectation of gift will be followed eventually by a gift or benefit in return.

01:28:34.460 The other one here, the fourth, whereas gifts create solidarity between individuals from different groups.

01:28:39.900 solidarity within the group is created by a distribution or redistribution this is the mode

01:28:45.020 of allocation obtaining within the basic economic unit the household so now we're talking about like

01:28:51.420 giving gifts into different contexts like between friends and then within the household gift giving

01:28:57.340 exchange is highly dependent on the relationship it's not just transactional through currency you

01:29:03.820 know there's different demands and expectations when redistribution attaches to a specific service

01:29:09.900 may categorize it as a reward

01:29:12.460 as when Agamemnon

01:29:14.000 promises to

01:29:15.020 to sir

01:29:18.520 that in return for his prowess

01:29:20.160 in battle he will if Troy falls give him

01:29:22.060 a tripod or a chariot with horses

01:29:24.000 or a woman

01:29:24.840 what should you do to a woman

01:29:27.820 or a chariot with horses

01:29:29.200 honestly dude I've got a woman I'd probably take

01:29:31.960 the chariot I mean with the chariot you can get

01:29:34.080 the woman

01:29:34.600 but I've got the woman

01:29:37.260 but it doesn't say you didn't have a woman

01:29:39.400 or you she's if i didn't have the woman i would take the woman but like if i've got one already

01:29:44.420 this is like basic well if you with you oh wait what's the third option again uh a tripod

01:29:51.180 what kind of a tripod though because you've got a camera i don't know if you've got a good tripod

01:29:56.640 though no no but the tripod is isn't that like a uh for them this is the greeks right wouldn't

01:30:01.900 the tripod be like uh fuck what do we call that now i had to think i had it's a large it's a large

01:30:08.100 copper vessel for like cooking or burning incense or something but it has some resale value on

01:30:14.220 facebook is my point but it's gotta be of equal value to a chair with horses that's my point so

01:30:21.660 imagine how much a woman or a chariot with horses is worth and now imagine on the same level is a

01:30:27.680 tripod how what kind of fucking tripod this is like a fucking jewel encrusted tripod problem is

01:30:31.700 how many horses this is ah well it's a chariot it's a typical great chariot it's probably two

01:30:38.740 horses right well see now now now we're negotiating with ourselves yes

01:30:44.560 do we just get agnamemnon on the horn you were right though that like starting from zero the

01:30:51.960 correct one is the chariot because you can do like you can get the other stuff don't tell me

01:30:56.200 you can't use the chair chariot to get the woman and the tripod probably even they both fit in the

01:31:01.620 back of the chariot i've got a woman i'll take the chariot welfare woman says a chariot is a

01:31:07.860 waste of space and a waste of money you use the chariot to find a woman that can appreciate a

01:31:12.540 chariot see you're not thinking with the greek mind you're probably thinking with the canadian

01:31:20.840 mind which is like i'm gonna listen to my wife now just get a new one that likes chariots

01:31:25.000 the new one's probably

01:31:27.800 a 14 year old boy too

01:31:29.160 conspicuously absent

01:31:33.260 was the real prize

01:31:35.700 so he goes through different types of transactions

01:31:39.000 the ransom of someone taken by force

01:31:41.240 the exchange of things not people

01:31:43.480 to create interpersonal links

01:31:45.100 a lot of it is based on voluntary exchange

01:31:47.640 not so much value transactions

01:31:50.040 and he says

01:31:50.440 honor is an essentially social phenomenon

01:31:54.420 But among Greeks before Troy, it seemed that the right to distribute booty belongs only nominally to the people.

01:32:01.220 In fact, to the leader.

01:32:02.880 Agamemnon's control of the process had produced not just a rift between himself and Achilles, but a generalized crisis.

01:32:09.840 What Achilles complains of is a general disparity between the worth in battle and reward.

01:32:16.120 The implication is that worth should attract its equivalent in the concrete manifestations of honor.

01:32:22.260 and this general equivalence has been selfishly abolished by Agamemnon.

01:32:27.140 In a sense, this implication abides the spirit of trade.

01:32:30.640 One cloak is equivalent to three vases or ten drachmas,

01:32:34.440 whatever the personal relation between their respective owners.

01:32:37.180 It illustrates how the breakdown of interpersonal relations of reciprocity

01:32:42.040 might favor the development of the impersonal equivalence inherent in trade

01:32:47.000 and of a universal measure of value.

01:32:49.860 so he's trying to say you know the works of homer were already trying to capture the breakdown

01:32:57.540 of an honor-based system which is an interesting theory an interesting thesis so you have the

01:33:04.480 development of a code of reciprocal value because the implied or assumed reciprocal value is not

01:33:13.260 being met by some leaders so it's like we need a system here what is the system now you're kind of

01:33:18.720 building the foundation of a monetary transaction. He says, the crisis of the Iliad is a breakdown

01:33:27.040 of the form of reciprocity controlled by the leader. At the center of the Odyssey too is a

01:33:33.380 crisis of redistributive reciprocity. The balance breaks down on the other side as it were. Although

01:33:39.280 over a long period of the suitors feasting the normal arrangement would be for the nobles to

01:33:43.800 entertain each other reciprocally, that suitors should feast at the house of a chief is not

01:33:48.280 necessarily unacceptable and certainly not unparalleled but in the special circumstances

01:33:53.080 of on Ithaca namely prolonged uncertainty of whether Odysseus's lives compounded by Penelope's

01:33:59.960 indecision um on whether Odysseus lives compounded by Penelope's indecision the practice is

01:34:06.680 unacceptably extended to conclude Homer tends to exclude or devalue forms of making permanent

01:34:13.320 centered around the place of sacrifice that were during the final stages of the formation of

01:34:18.360 homeric epic rapidly gaining ground the temple dedications and writing permanence in homer is

01:34:25.080 instead accorded to the embodiments of heroic individuality in gift and tomb and to the oral

01:34:31.400 commemoration embodied by the heroic epic itself and yet homer the product of various poets over

01:34:37.640 more than one generation is not confined within a single ideology central to the narratives

01:34:43.000 are the traditional communality of and but he's trying to say well that's not how you do change

01:34:47.400 in society you use elite capture and i would say to him what i did say to him was well how's

01:34:53.160 elite capture going you tried that so really what he's trying to say there is within homer

01:34:58.440 crisis of reciprocity the emergence or like the codification of you know that which is supposed

01:35:07.720 to bestow value not doing it so we must seek out another system otherwise there's no fucking reason

01:35:13.720 to do anything why are we going to war if we don't have if we're not rewarded enough for that right

01:35:21.880 and so what can we devise to address that and he continues on here the extraordinary eighth

01:35:28.200 century development of votive offerings and of temp and of temples surely involved a radical shift

01:35:33.960 in consciousness one aspect of the change is the dissolution of the homeric division that

01:35:39.000 we've described between the transience of gifts to the gods and the durability of gifts to the

01:35:44.120 mortals so the former would be animal sacrifice and to the mortals to be treasure the ancient

01:35:50.440 need for a lasting expression or mark of sacrifice was before the 8th century fulfilled mainly by the

01:35:55.640 preservation of parts of sacrificed animals and by the continuity of place

01:36:03.960 your teal is trying to push flock camera these sacrificial places of sanctuaries and temples

01:36:11.900 which became through dedications to the gods stores of metal combine the durability of homeric

01:36:17.720 aristocratic and personal interpersonal gift treasure with the ancient and tenacious visibility

01:36:23.200 of the homeric sacrifice so what he's saying is that the places where they had sacrifices they

01:36:29.000 started bringing more treasure to more booty more coins more thing and trying the sacrifices went

01:36:38.120 from the temporary you know to i'm going to give you something of permanent value so there's kind

01:36:45.120 of a psychological shift there of something something permanent having more value than

01:36:52.180 something transient right like i'm giving something that's of value to you because it's

01:36:57.540 actually value to me you know an animal sacrifice is a value but that's also a value to the community

01:37:03.800 because you sacrifice the animal that you eat the animal but i'm going to give you something

01:37:07.300 that's just a total loss for me and the only way i can measure that is in something of physical

01:37:13.820 value right so it's a complete shift of what a sacrifice is in a way because the animal sacrifice

01:37:21.080 is for the gods and also for you this is just like you are in the neck you're in the red and then

01:37:27.640 the gods or your ancestors are in the black which is i never thought of it like that that's kind of

01:37:33.560 interesting and that kind of continues to this day in a lot of ways not so much anymore they used to

01:37:39.120 bury more people with more treasure but you know grave robbers ruin that i always imagine grave

01:37:48.060 robbers is white that can't be correct right who what would you think the race of grave robbers

01:37:54.620 would be i mean i think during the period of great robbers you didn't have a whole lot of

01:37:58.460 racial diversity so it probably just would have been the trash folk i i associate treasure hunting

01:38:06.700 with whites and so i see grave robbing as just a form of treasure hunting well i mean calling

01:38:12.060 grave robbing treasure hunting is like calling pulling pennies out of the fountain treasure

01:38:16.860 hunting like that's not that's not you know where it is you're not supposed to touch it you know

01:38:21.740 you're not supposed to touch it and you yeah but you gotta know but it could be booby trapped and

01:38:27.660 you gotta be gotta be smart well we meet grave robbing like um the pyramids that's different

01:38:34.060 i thought about like going to the local graveyard and stealing grandma i just thought like a mob

01:38:38.620 grave would have you know a tommy gun set up on the inside like you gotta be kind of crafty

01:38:44.300 that just seemed to be like

01:38:46.900 a fucking

01:38:49.160 Nathan Drake thing to do

01:38:51.000 across the board

01:38:51.920 I didn't play the games

01:38:55.060 mind you

01:38:55.580 the whole game is just

01:38:59.340 him leaping up planes with corpses

01:39:01.160 shit

01:39:01.660 so continue on here

01:39:05.220 says although the Greek image of

01:39:07.140 deity may be prayed to

01:39:09.040 is not thought to live

01:39:11.000 and it was possible for an intellectual

01:39:12.980 will at least emphasize the distinction between

01:39:15.000 image and deity

01:39:16.800 and the early 6th century

01:39:18.460 it too like the dedicated figurine

01:39:21.020 substitutes for

01:39:22.900 reality

01:39:23.540 so there's a shift

01:39:27.100 occurring here in the relationship

01:39:28.960 with what a deity is

01:39:30.400 an image of a deity

01:39:32.560 isn't just sacred

01:39:34.720 like how Muslims view

01:39:36.440 an image of Muhammad

01:39:37.960 they think that is

01:39:40.560 you can't do that because that's a representation

01:39:42.680 that has a sacredness about it but even with the early greeks they're like okay like it's

01:39:47.160 there is a difference guys between the image and the actual thing like it's important that we can

01:39:52.980 draw a distinction between those two things so it too like the dedicated figuring substitutes

01:40:00.340 for reality and in the greek sacrifice the community feasted outside the temple while

01:40:04.740 the image of the god remained inside and the god's portion of the sacrifice ascended heavenwards

01:40:09.760 even in an individual offering of an animal to deity the greek surrenders very little

01:40:16.000 in substantial smoke to the gods a certain small part of the animal to the priest a whole animal

01:40:21.640 is offered only in the um it says holocaust or in merely symbolic form and the animal figurines

01:40:29.620 offered in the temples just as the statue is a mere image of god and the temple it's as if it

01:40:35.500 warehouse so the animals he receives are generally mere images it is in this symbolic sphere in the

01:40:41.480 dedication of durable offerings rather than the provision of food that the greek surrenders much

01:40:47.420 to the gods and that's what i was just talking about you know uh the the replacement of the

01:40:53.820 sacrifice into something that's more material and also understanding that the material is itself

01:41:01.440 not of the god even if it's kind of represented as god um so it says here but even durable objects

01:41:09.060 in excessive numbers may be inconvenient the practice of substitution originating in the

01:41:14.800 substitution of durable for perishable offerings is extended to the substitution of money for

01:41:20.480 objects in kind and so the victim's skin to which the sanctuary frequently had a right

01:41:25.660 might be replaced by a monetary fee so instead of the sacrificial victims being the animal whatever

01:41:33.920 it is instead of giving it to me you could say well i'll give you some money for that instead

01:41:38.100 whatever the value is this money could be named after the skin as it could also as could also

01:41:43.560 money received for the sale of sacrificial skins another illustration of the need for cult to be

01:41:50.500 monetize is provided by the Pelennos, an offering, in particular, a kind of cake.

01:41:56.660 No doubt, sanctuaries prefer money to a surplus of cakes,

01:42:00.580 and Pelennos comes to mean a monetary fee paid at a sanctuary.

01:42:05.200 Perhaps a transitional stage was the offering of clay or metal imitations of round cakes.

01:42:10.620 So he's also explaining here that receiving so much perishable food

01:42:16.460 and so many animal sacrifices could just be inconvenient.

01:42:19.160 we don't need that just give me some other item that can substitute for that so you're you start

01:42:26.340 to see the development of substitution which again is an interesting development where here's

01:42:32.860 what can i give you that represents the value of this and transfer the sacred offering

01:42:40.900 to this unsacred offering but like have it represented in the same way and have it be

01:42:47.160 agreed upon by both parties you know it's not done as a trick but it's actually done both sides

01:42:53.400 appreciate it but it still carries this thing carries the power of this other thing and this

01:43:00.680 other thing has like a divine authority to it you know so like you're you're just extrapolating like

01:43:07.440 value into different areas and different materials which is like is that kind of an interesting idea

01:43:14.660 do you think yeah yeah he says the most striking example of precious metal as a store of wealth

01:43:20.420 is provided by the speeches attributed to thucydides to pericles and to the spartan king

01:43:27.140 archimedes archidamus archidamus at the beginning of the pelotasian war pericles

01:43:35.220 encourages the athenians by listing their financial resources uh six thousand talents

01:43:40.180 of coin silver kept on the acropolis as well as uncoined silver and gold in private and public

01:43:45.860 dedications um the apparent transition from this is what i found so interesting so there's this idea

01:43:52.580 of roasting spits being used as a store of value because it kept finding roasting spits in various

01:44:00.900 tombs in places it wouldn't make sense to find them and you would imagine that well roasting

01:44:07.140 spin would have value like and that would be a great store of value because it can there's

01:44:12.340 there's utility in that and then the more roasting spits you have maybe the more important you were

01:44:18.020 right so he says um the apparent transition from roasting spits to coins was along with other terms

01:44:24.340 that uh seem to embody the transition from the sacrificial to the financial i think that's an

01:44:29.860 important phrase to keep in mind the transition from the sacrificial to the financial so it's the

01:44:34.420 world of the homeric epics where transactions themselves were still highly contextual highly

01:44:43.300 honor-based however homer was already beginning to describe the breakdown of that system

01:44:49.220 into something else into a different understanding of value and he says here adduced by luam as part

01:44:56.260 of an argument to the effect of that animal sacrifice was an important factor in the genesis

01:45:01.060 of coinage the public sanctuary becomes with the development of substitutes for animal victims a

01:45:08.340 center of exchange and the communal distribution of sacrificial meat to warrior to priest or the

01:45:15.300 prize winner or whoever is he argues the earliest form of polis finance so he's already talking

01:45:21.620 about as we're seeing exchanges happen like this is where you bring sacrifices now we're it's a

01:45:28.820 place where you exchange value for things then it almost grows into a market or it grows into a hub

01:45:34.980 where value is exchanged for other things and then you kind of have the birth of outside of a temple

01:45:43.140 or surrounding a temple as a place where trans important transactions are done

01:45:49.140 or like the birth of a different type of market right it goes on here this is what i was talking

01:45:53.140 about first in the aggrieved harayan was discovered a bundle of iron spits now estimated at approximately

01:46:01.300 a hundred in number along with a heavy iron bar that with this disc-like bulge at one end seemed

01:46:07.140 to have been made in the form of an oversized spit the likelihood that the spits were a dedication

01:46:13.540 is confirmed by their being bound together and fixed into a lead disc um uh he's just giving

01:46:20.980 other examples here of various times that these spits were found in tombs and in important sites

01:46:30.980 they may have been prized simultaneously for their sacrificial use as prestige projects or

01:46:36.820 and for their monetary function or functions he says such socially central sacrificial

01:46:43.780 communality was unknown in the redistributive economic economies of egypt and mesopotamia

01:46:50.260 because some people may be looking at that and say well of course there was coinage in mesopotamia

01:46:54.740 there was there's there was markets and economies in these great civilizations but it was different

01:47:00.260 the greek world is different says where accordingly money functions were performed by mere

01:47:05.380 substances such as silver or barley or copper etc just as entitlement to participation in the greek

01:47:11.780 sacrificial meal comes to embody participation in the polis as a citizen so the inheritance of

01:47:17.540 sacrificial distribution in generating collective confidence is reinforced and then replaced by the

01:47:24.260 mark stamped on the metal by the polis right so it's like okay what is the purpose of the sacrifice

01:47:30.820 it's it's community right and then can the community be embodied by the tribe and and

01:47:37.540 the symbolism of the tribe yes and then with the properly developed state can it be represented

01:47:43.220 by the iconography of the state okay boom then you got the stamp of the state that can travel

01:47:47.460 all the way back down into the places of these communal sacrifices to participate within the

01:47:53.700 sacrifices as a representation of the community itself whereas you just didn't have something

01:48:00.340 like that in mesopotamia or egypt or that or so is the claim it says the polis controlling communal

01:48:07.860 sacrifices and the temple treasuries that had developed out of the sacrifices stamps on the

01:48:12.740 metal distributed a symbol that transcends the particularity of specific treasuries and

01:48:18.900 sacrificial groups establishes the value of the metal because remember made the metal didn't have

01:48:23.400 value much until that stamp was on it then it becomes known as the type of metal that carries

01:48:30.340 that stamp and then that metal sort of like electrum becomes more valuable due to that

01:48:36.280 association right and enhances the identity of the polis among both its own citizens and

01:48:42.480 outsiders certification by the state is one of the ways in which coinage is quite different from

01:48:48.060 anything that it performed money functions in the past and again there's clay tablets there's other

01:48:54.040 things that kind of behave like money but it wasn't money like greek money there's a different

01:48:59.980 bestowing of power and authority and all money is and i this is the case to this day

01:49:07.860 money is just representation of the authority that is backing it that is why the u.s dollar

01:49:17.100 being the international reserve currency is so important is it because greenbacks have more

01:49:24.360 you know resource value than yen is it because rubles are just made of a different type of

01:49:31.260 fucking paper no it's just representative of the state authority everything that that is bound up

01:49:38.820 in that authority which is why it's so important what the international reserve currency is but

01:49:44.760 it's not anything to do with at this point especially it's nothing to do with gold if

01:49:50.140 anything it's more to do with credit and then we get into creditism then we get into the money

01:49:55.140 revolution it gets really real tricky but it was more making the case that just right back to the

01:50:00.320 start this is really what they mean by capital what is capital capital like it is power it's a

01:50:06.120 strange thing to say that capital is just power but it's like well what's what's behind it what

01:50:10.120 is it like it's not it's not anything except fucking power and authority that you can carry

01:50:15.980 in your pocket and what the argument he makes later is you can tether uh maybe even not at the

01:50:25.720 time but it would grow to this later uh another mind revolution of individuality you know you're

01:50:32.420 carrying the state power in your pocket it democratizes power in a sense like you know

01:50:38.080 the stamp of the state used to be only issued by the state on specific edicts and specific laws but

01:50:43.980 now you have it now you got a little bit of power that you can do whatever you

01:50:47.640 want with that's an interesting idea isn't it and that's just the germ of the

01:50:53.160 idea that would one day maybe grow into the responsibility of the citizen to

01:50:59.160 wield state power to participate in state power to maybe dispose of state

01:51:04.220 power you can even you can take the power of the state and throw it in the

01:51:07.260 fucking lake if you want to that's you never that never you couldn't do that

01:51:11.700 for dispense with the highest power in the land like that anyway so there's a lot anytime you've

01:51:20.780 got a new form like this i think cryptocurrency is like this forces us to rethink what money is

01:51:29.900 and what value is its relationship to power and whether it could have the power of authority

01:51:36.080 while existing outside of authority indeed in opposition to authority what is that it forces

01:51:41.860 people to think a certain way and once we start thinking a certain way that's where new ideologies

01:51:46.440 and that's where new beliefs and that's where we kind of you know it feels like we step up in a way

01:51:53.760 of thinking we're exposed to a different realm than we thought was possible before and we thought

01:52:00.720 we understood what value was and now we don't now it's something else what the fuck is it

01:52:04.500 How do you explain this new value to someone who just thought, like, doubloons are valuable because they're made of gold, and gold is shiny, and people like shiny things.

01:52:15.860 If you ask a boomer what money is, that's what they'll tell you, it's gold, because gold's shiny, and you can make earrings out of it for your wife.

01:52:21.960 You know, it's like, not really.

01:52:24.440 It's way more fucked up than that.

01:52:27.560 um it goes on here it says marks on coins are like seal marks distinctive authenticating impressions

01:52:35.060 reproducible as numerous instances of a single source some of the earliest coin marks are like

01:52:41.080 seal marks on one surface only uh then that the devices on some of the earliest coins may have

01:52:47.820 been personal is indicated in particularly by the early electrum stator on which the stag is

01:52:53.000 accompanied the words, I am the sign. Despite the similarities between the seal mark and the coin

01:52:58.420 mark, and the likelihood that the former was a model for the latter, the two are essentially

01:53:02.540 different in social function. The seal mark, as we've seen, typically signifies ownership,

01:53:07.980 power, or authority by seeming to embody a person, by somehow attaching the person to what is sealed.

01:53:16.280 If there is a technological continuity between a seal mark and a coin mark, then the mark has

01:53:20.900 turned into the opposite. So far from attaching the coin to a person, it

01:53:24.520 facilitates its promiscuous passage from the ownership of one person to the

01:53:29.520 ownership of another. The economic effect of the coin market, on the other hand, was

01:53:33.920 by spreading rapidly throughout the Greek city-states in the 6th century to

01:53:38.040 facilitate the development of a monetary economy in which goods and services are

01:53:42.600 allocated not so much by enforced contribution and redistribution as by

01:53:47.720 market trade more specifically by numerous acts of decentralized exchange

01:53:52.580 decentralized and they do not belong to a bureaucratically controlled

01:53:56.220 redistributive system because remember markets and everything else were tied to

01:54:02.320 the state they were tied to some institution or some authority but now

01:54:06.500 you've got markets that are just wherever you could have a market between

01:54:10.320 people which again would have been a very revolutionary idea the element that

01:54:15.680 tends to unite these otherwise discrete acts of exchange is not bureaucratic control but the use

01:54:20.640 in each of them of the same general purpose money which in the form of coinage does depend on the

01:54:26.120 central authority of the polis but in its dependence on authority the validity of the

01:54:31.920 coin mark is as we've seen quite unlike the validity of the seal mark the coin mark because

01:54:38.340 it does not embody power from its source but rather the value embodied in its metal disperses

01:54:44.580 unqualified economic power into the pocket of an ordinary citizen and that's what i was trying to

01:54:50.900 get at before unqualified economic power the power that was once held by the state and its institutions

01:54:58.180 and it just redistribute like the entire idea of redistribution which was how value was bestore

01:55:07.300 remember those different types of transactions you would get something as a gift it was

01:55:11.700 the type of exchange was different so it's like money comes to represent exchange itself

01:55:19.020 exchange used to be like dutifully granting you something or dutifully getting something back

01:55:26.760 it was almost exchange the exchange was just the phenomena of back and forth but now you've got

01:55:32.940 this thing this thing that embodies exchange itself and what he gets into later is that

01:55:40.860 we start to notice this philosophers start to notice this it's like okay so we have this thing

01:55:46.280 that embodies exchange it's an odd concept so it it seems to represent value itself so

01:55:56.040 and this having read marks i never saw marks go this far back in time but even the ancient

01:56:04.960 greeks start to notice that oh you can just accumulate these coins then and there's no

01:56:10.400 limit to the coins you could accumulate then you could have infinite value the value is no

01:56:14.900 the value is no longer on either side of the exchange it's now in the representation of the

01:56:19.860 exchange itself which you can just stack forever and just have authority that way so wait a minute

01:56:27.280 now you can have authority not from that which issues the authority of the coins you can gain

01:56:35.300 lesser but equal authority to the issuer of the authority by accumulating the representation you

01:56:44.140 see what i'm saying like that this is a mind fuck to them because like things made sense before

01:56:48.960 but now i can like hack authority just by figuring out how to get these things and it seems to be

01:56:56.240 just as good in in a philosophical way but also like oh i can buy more soldiers now but then

01:57:03.800 later on we'll get to like this is what the merchant class is this is how you accumulate

01:57:09.520 power outside of an aristocracy you could define the merchant class almost as any class that tries

01:57:17.340 to accumulate power outside of those regular domains so so he just says here in other words

01:57:24.540 the greeks did not develop token money credit seems to have been widespread in the fourth

01:57:29.340 century athens where evidence is most plentiful but even here relations of credit were between

01:57:34.780 individual parties persons or banks there's no unequivocal evidence for any general clearing

01:57:41.740 system between the banks but whatever the extent or sophistication of transfer money

01:57:46.860 without the transfer metal the crucial fact is that the greeks never used anything like the bill

01:57:51.100 of exchange sufficiently to allow the development into generally exchangeable bills money in the

01:57:56.860 form of papyrus or anything like that collective recognition of the symbolic value of standardized

01:58:03.020 pieces distributed to all citizens is carried over from perishable meat to durable metal and

01:58:09.340 that just keep that part in mind and it says stripped of all personal association money is

01:58:16.060 promiscuous capable of being exchanged with anybody for anything indifferent to all non-monetary

01:58:21.420 interpersonal relationships the impersonality is brought to its extreme by the instant and

01:58:27.260 generally accepted guarantee of redeemability provided by coinage barter even for goods made

01:58:33.180 for the market tends to require knowledge of co-transactors and personal trust and so to rely

01:58:38.780 on lasting interpersonal relations and contexts of exchange whereas the guarantee provided by

01:58:43.820 coinage tends to enable fleeting transactions with complete strangers money tends to promote

01:58:49.740 an indefinite network of indiscriminate exchange that transcends the defined personal relations

01:58:56.060 found within the family various social groupings or within networks of gift giving and barter

01:59:02.940 whereas the homeric gift is invested with the personality of its heroic donor the only kind

01:59:08.780 person that money resembles is the prostitute for shakespeare it's the common whore of mankind

01:59:15.340 and so again the other great poets great artists great philosophers start to notice this as well

01:59:23.020 too the let's call it the promiscuity of value and and you know it does beg the question would the

01:59:30.620 hope eric it sounds silly to even ask but would the homeric model be superior whereas exchange

01:59:38.780 was always tribal in a sense and it made sense it was it wasn't a separate standalone thing

01:59:46.240 that could be maximized but do you even have a complex civilization without it is the other

01:59:53.760 question um what do you think that's a big question but i i don't know enough about

02:00:01.260 how that operated to say but it is fascinating to consider

02:00:06.960 it says i know and we'll just end on this says the fundamental transition and thought towards

02:00:14.400 what we call science and philosophy that occurred among the yono inonian greeks of the sixth century

02:00:20.480 bc may be characterized in various ways examination of the complexity of the transition has produced

02:00:26.800 numerous qualifications the unevenness of its development the presence of a form of science

02:00:32.080 earlier among the babylonians and egyptians the persistence of dogmatic or magical elements and

02:00:38.480 seemingly rational discourse and so on as i'm well aware that what may legitimately be included in

02:00:45.040 the broad term philosophy is found already in homer and hesiod the factor that holds the field

02:00:51.200 in recent discussion is a political one ably advocated in particular by jp vernant and ger

02:00:57.920 lloyd it is according to vernette this political conception that provides the model for an examiner's

02:01:03.360 cosmology in which the reciprocal relation between the elements are held in equilibrium

02:01:08.000 by an egalitarian order and space is symmetrically organized around as the center occupied by earth

02:01:13.600 so what he's saying there is that this evolving understanding of money fed back into the

02:01:22.480 understanding of science so what he's saying here is that in the polis citizens are ruled by and are

02:01:28.880 equal to with respect to impersonal love this equality is also expressed spatially in the

02:01:33.840 symmetrical organization of political space around a single center in which citizens participate

02:01:39.520 so you start to see an evolving understanding of exchange and value and rebalancing not just

02:01:49.840 you know debt and bartering he's claiming the author that this informs an examiner and his

02:01:57.120 cosmology and and the very beginnings of science and that's trying to understand how the universe

02:02:02.560 works in this contents of this context of balancing and debts being owed and we have

02:02:09.600 this thing called exchange now in personal exchange well can the universe exchange

02:02:15.120 impersonally you know in us separating you know duty and tribalism from exchange and now it's just

02:02:23.040 a force can that be a force that you know dictates the heavenly bodies and things of that nature

02:02:31.440 so it's it's very i don't want to say rudimentary it's very early but he's saying that these

02:02:39.280 economic developments and i think there is a lot of truth to this the economic developments

02:02:44.160 um they do inspire other developments as well in philosophy and in science and in arts and

02:02:52.740 elsewhere so we'll just end there and and the last point would be that you know the title money

02:03:01.060 in the greek mind it's that financial i hate to use the revolution but what else do we call it

02:03:08.560 financial you know developments finding new conceptualizations of of how money can hold

02:03:17.480 value in relation to power inspire different ways to look at the universe itself and it's

02:03:25.320 all interconnected that's what he's saying and it's it seems that as the the the exchange form

02:03:33.920 changing over time it's not like it directs the death ritual but it's directed by the death

02:03:40.800 ritual like we do we develop this exchange value just because we want to give 70 000 cakes

02:03:46.320 to the church right like it's actually it's driven by a real desire and it's it's it's not

02:03:54.080 like it was from top down it was negotiated amongst ourselves to get things done faster

02:04:01.140 but the things themselves were divine and sacrificial and important and i like that at

02:04:09.140 the heart of it it's trying to figure out how to substitute to get important things done in a

02:04:15.380 cleaner and more reasonable way and figure out ways to to still cling on to relationship to

02:04:20.740 sacrifice and power i guess that's what i'm trying to get at and and that's at the root of

02:04:25.680 what money is i don't think it's ever decoupled from that and that really is what capital is i

02:04:32.960 think that's why i like the term capital because people think money they just think coins they

02:04:37.360 think gold standard and stuff but now people understand capital just to mean anything that

02:04:42.640 has capital has become inverted it's the idea that money projects power so if we can get rid

02:04:49.680 of money we'd have powers and no no no money is just a representation of power you know in that

02:04:56.560 sense marx is completely inverted because they're idiots but like but but there there is a connection

02:05:04.480 there yeah yeah anyway do you have any ending thought no i mean i think you ended it well like

02:05:10.720 money is a way of quantizing power or like making power available to people at a distance so um

02:05:17.840 Yeah, I mean, Marxists should like it, actually, if they understood it that way, but whatever.

02:05:22.620 Yeah, it's the democratization of power.

02:05:25.720 Anyway, so I'll talk to you next time.

02:05:27.920 Yeah, man. Take care.

Blood Satellite - September 04, 2026

Ay Tone4CERN Not for Nothin but this Feels Like Biocalvinism

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