Rebel News Podcast - SPECIAL： Interview with Conrad Black about his NEW book, “The Canadian Manifesto”

00:00:00.000 Hey folks, special show today, it's one extended interview with Conrad Black.

00:00:05.660 It's about his new book, The Canadian Manifesto.

00:00:08.540 I sat down with him at his house, had a great time.

00:00:11.380 And we talked about other things besides his book too, including a question I asked him

00:00:16.200 about his time in prison.

00:00:18.080 Anyhow, before we get to that, can you do me a favor?

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00:00:26.540 Doesn't that sound cool?

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00:00:46.280 All right, without further to do, here's Conrad Black.

00:00:49.200 You're listening to a Rebel Media Podcast.

00:00:52.440 Tonight, a special feature interview with Conrad Black about his new book, The Canadian

00:00:57.640 Manifesto.

00:00:58.840 It's May 10th, and this is The Ezra LeVant Show.

00:01:03.420 Why should others go to jail when you're a biggest carbon consumer I know?

00:01:07.100 There's 8,500 customers here, and you won't give them an answer.

00:01:11.160 The only thing I have to say to the government about why I publish it is because it's my bloody

00:01:16.060 right to do so.

00:01:21.840 I can't believe how prolific Conrad Black is.

00:01:25.180 As an author, his last book about Donald Trump was great.

00:01:29.060 Not only is Black one of the few journalists who truly understands Trump, but he is also

00:01:33.680 a personal friend of his from before his presidential days.

00:01:37.460 So it was a great review of the 45th president from someone who really knows him.

00:01:41.560 I love that book.

00:01:43.000 Well, Black has a new book out, and it's 100% Canadian this time.

00:01:47.560 It's even called The Canadian Manifesto, which sounds like a political call to arms.

00:01:54.000 Sounds like a blueprint for a movement.

00:01:56.440 I had so much fun talking with him about his Trump book.

00:01:59.400 I sat down with him to talk about this one.

00:02:01.360 Now, I only received the review copy just right before we talked, so I hadn't gone through

00:02:06.220 it in depth as much as I wanted to before our interview, so our conversation was partly

00:02:10.680 about the book and partly about life in general, including a surprising answer he gave me when

00:02:16.720 I asked him about his time in prison, which I found interesting, and maybe you will too.

00:02:21.460 So without further ado, here is my interview with Conrad Black about his new book, The Canadian

00:02:26.960 Manifesto.

00:02:27.600 So if you're interested in it, you can buy it at the Amazon link below.

00:02:46.260 Thanks for taking the time to meet.

00:02:47.860 I have to tell you, the first thing that stood out to me about this book was how short it

00:02:52.240 was.

00:02:52.540 And I was thrilled because I have your other books.

00:02:56.380 They're about this thick.

00:02:57.640 Why did you write something that was 166 pages?

00:03:00.900 Well, ever since John Turner objected that I was causing my arthritis, holding first my

00:03:08.180 Roosevelt book, then my Nixon book, and then my history of the U.S., then my history of

00:03:11.980 Canada, I've been slimming it down, and I got down to about 220 pages in my book about

00:03:18.840 President Trump, and I'm trying to turn it into a pamphleteer, you see.

00:03:23.940 I'm grateful.

00:03:24.940 Then your sails go up.

00:03:25.940 Well, you know what?

00:03:26.940 It's daunting.

00:03:27.940 With this book, you could tear through it in one long sitting on the throne or something.

00:03:32.020 I mean, it's a good book.

00:03:33.360 A flight from here to Montreal.

00:03:36.540 That's a nicer way to put it.

00:03:37.760 That's a nicer way to put it.

00:03:39.080 But it's called a manifesto, and I read it, and it felt a little bit like a political party's

00:03:47.040 platform.

00:03:48.820 Is that what you're thinking?

00:03:50.460 Yeah.

00:03:50.840 Well, I give the historical background for it, and then I make some policy ideas.

00:03:55.580 So it is like a political party's platform.

00:03:57.220 All right.

00:03:57.760 Now, have you consulted with any politicians?

00:04:01.280 I mean, you're a bit of a politician yourself, even though you have no elected office.

00:04:05.020 You're weighing into...

00:04:05.960 No, I'm a legislator in another country.

00:04:07.540 There you go.

00:04:08.740 But have you bounced this off Canadians? 0.83

00:04:11.060 Did you consult with Canadian politicians?

00:04:12.320 Well, I showed it to, yes, a couple of people.

00:04:15.940 I think it would not be fair to say who, but that are elected, and they're from a bit

00:04:21.900 of a range of the political spectrum.

00:04:23.720 And they made some suggestions.

00:04:26.620 Actually, useful factual suggestions, but not particularly policy ones.

00:04:30.780 Now, the subtitle of the book is How One Frozen Country Can Save the World.

00:04:35.580 That was my publisher, Kevin Wright, who came up with that.

00:04:38.020 Well, I like...

00:04:38.360 It's a great line.

00:04:39.300 Yeah.

00:04:39.580 It's funny.

00:04:40.980 It's a little bit of un-Canadian chutzpah.

00:04:45.240 It's a little bit...

00:04:45.880 Yes.

00:04:46.620 You know, Canadians are modest. 0.85

00:04:47.800 We're always sorry, sorry, after you, after you, sorry.

00:04:49.940 Exactly.

00:04:50.540 It's a little Trumpy to say, we're going to save the world.

00:04:54.100 Are you serious?

00:04:54.440 I thought the reference to Canada being frozen played into a caricature that Canadians don't

00:04:58.800 like, because, you know, they don't like being thought of that we're living in England

00:05:02.420 up here.

00:05:03.000 But I've got to tell you, right now, it looks like we can't even save ourselves, let alone

00:05:05.840 save the world.

00:05:06.500 We're a mess right now.

00:05:08.400 Foreign affairs.

00:05:09.580 Save the world.

00:05:10.120 I think the government's not doing well.

00:05:12.180 We can't even get our phone calls answered.

00:05:12.820 It's still a great country, but the government's not doing well.

00:05:15.440 Well, first we've got to save ourselves before we save the world.

00:05:18.480 Yeah.

00:05:19.120 This...

00:05:20.120 The fact is, if you get into it, Ezra, as you know, the definition of saving the world

00:05:26.940 is, in fact, making Canada sufficiently noteworthy and recognized in the world because of its

00:05:31.880 level of good government, if the program enunciated here is followed.

00:05:36.760 It isn't...

00:05:37.360 It isn't save...

00:05:38.560 We save the world by saving ourselves, so it's not as contradictory as it sounds.

00:05:42.940 You know, you broke this book into three parts.

00:05:46.120 The first is sort of a history pointing the way.

00:05:49.040 And I'm glad you did that because you're a historian by, I'd almost say by profession.

00:05:53.540 It's what you do, I think, more than anything.

00:05:55.540 Nowadays, yes.

00:05:56.520 And it's a good reminder.

00:05:58.740 Sometimes we think, oh, we don't...

00:06:00.200 We haven't done much here in Canada, but we've actually done a lot.

00:06:02.460 Not true.

00:06:03.560 We've had a very distinguished history.

00:06:05.340 And, you know, we often think about the Quebec quarter of our country.

00:06:10.040 Yes.

00:06:10.280 But we've managed to do that without, as you point out, a U.S. civil war, without the Irish 0.99

00:06:15.800 challenges of the U.K.

00:06:17.760 Yeah, I mean...

00:06:19.200 After the...

00:06:21.020 You know, frankly, the British almost...

00:06:22.840 Oh, they starved them out of their island.

00:06:24.560 You know, for all our quirks as a country, we have kept it together.

00:06:30.620 We have.

00:06:31.440 And the only countries in the world with more people than Canada, larger population than

00:06:37.620 Canada that have had political institutions continuously longer, pardon me, longer than

00:06:42.720 we have are Great Britain and the United States.

00:06:44.840 And as you say, the British lost a province at the end of World War I, and the Americans

00:06:49.420 just two years before we set up Confederation ended a terrible civil war in which three-quarters

00:06:55.540 of a million people died in a population smaller than Canada is now.

00:06:59.560 Yeah, that's incredible.

00:07:02.280 Now, Canada...

00:07:05.060 When I was a kid, we learned it's a middle power.

00:07:07.980 Wasn't it going to be a superpower?

00:07:09.600 Yeah.

00:07:09.800 But it was a middle power, and we like to punch above our weight.

00:07:12.600 Does it matter?

00:07:14.040 I mean, there are great countries that are middle powers that I don't think aspire to 1.00

00:07:19.900 be...

00:07:20.540 to save the world.

00:07:21.180 Switzerland is an example that comes to mind.

00:07:23.440 I don't think the Swiss want to double their population and throw their weight around. 1.00

00:07:27.640 I think they're just happy being Swiss. 0.51

00:07:28.580 No, but they've made a vocation of what they have.

00:07:30.580 As you know, it's a trilingual country, and it's between the traditional great powers of

00:07:37.040 continental Europe, and it's sort of a haven country, and it's a small country, so it

00:07:41.500 could never aspire to more.

00:07:42.680 So it does well at what it can do.

00:07:46.140 I...

00:07:46.380 I bet you might as well say this.

00:07:48.040 You know, Luxembourg's a wonderful tax haven country.

00:07:51.060 So is Monaco.

00:07:52.540 You know, Kuwait's a good petro-state.

00:07:55.520 But, you know, if you only have a little country, you can't do that much with it.

00:07:59.540 I don't think we're that little.

00:08:00.640 We're certainly geographically...

00:08:01.600 No, no, no.

00:08:02.180 I'm saying we should distinguish ourselves from those others because...

00:08:08.240 Not in disparagement of them.

00:08:10.000 The Swiss make the absolute most of what they have, and I don't think we do, and that's 1.00

00:08:14.060 my point.

00:08:15.020 You know, under Stephen Harper's prime ministership, I think Canada did have a moral force in the

00:08:20.660 world that was larger than our size.

00:08:22.440 On Israeli matters, yes.

00:08:24.380 And to some degree opposite Russia and China, yes.

00:08:27.060 That's exactly what it was...

00:08:28.060 But you can't do much.

00:08:30.680 If that's what you're going to do, you can't do much unless you pay your way militarily.

00:08:35.400 And we didn't do it.

00:08:36.220 If we had, we could have had much more influence in NATO, I think, and in the United Nations.

00:08:40.760 Well, by contrast, our current prime minister has made such an obsession with getting on the

00:08:46.020 Security Council of the United Nations, which I think is just nothing but a bauble, but

00:08:50.360 a bragging point.

00:08:53.240 And in his path towards that, I think he's burnt so many of our key relationships.

00:08:59.580 But even if we were to...

00:09:00.860 Like, what's the point?

00:09:02.040 Like, who cares if we're giving out foreign aid to corrupt third world countries? 1.00

00:09:07.540 Who cares if we're at the front row of a corrupt institution like the UN?

00:09:11.640 Like, does it really matter?

00:09:12.820 We should be leading the movement to reform the UN.

00:09:16.060 We were a co-founder.

00:09:17.340 We have a good reputation there.

00:09:19.420 We've earned the good reputation.

00:09:20.860 I mean, I think a lot of it's nonsense, as you do.

00:09:22.800 But that's not the point.

00:09:24.440 As it is now, it would absolutely horrify its founders.

00:09:29.380 And it's a primal screen therapy for the most disreputable regimes in the world.

00:09:35.800 And we should...

00:09:37.060 We are the logical people to lead the reform movement.

00:09:40.800 I want to ask you about immigration.

00:09:43.960 You talk about immigration, and you are politically incorrect enough to say,

00:09:48.360 we've got to watch out for Islamism. 1.00

00:09:50.740 We've got to watch out for people who would want to...

00:09:53.240 We've got to watch out for unassimilable immigrants. 1.00

00:09:56.780 Well, okay, let's talk a little bit more about that.

00:09:58.720 Because there is no one in our Canadian political firmament right now who is saying that.

00:10:04.740 They're saying keep out security threats.

00:10:06.460 But that is a very different thing from keeping out someone who does not believe in the equality

00:10:10.340 of men and women does not believe in the separation of mosque and state.

00:10:12.920 And there's no ambition to assimilate to either official culture in this country.

00:10:16.320 How do you do that?

00:10:17.260 How do I have...

00:10:18.300 Well, you've redefined your criteria.

00:10:21.400 Give me an example.

00:10:22.440 And I...

00:10:23.180 This is a very practical issue.

00:10:24.700 And I think that this is an issue where the elites are on one side and the people are on the other.

00:10:29.280 I refer to an Angus Reid poll that shows only 6% of Canadians want more immigration.

00:10:35.320 49% want less.

00:10:36.780 And yet we have Justin Trudeau saying, we're going to give you more than ever.

00:10:40.480 My own view is we need more population.

00:10:43.020 So I'm not a small number of immigration people.

00:10:46.180 We want assimilable people.

00:10:48.100 Where are they going to come from?

00:10:49.200 Because...

00:10:49.320 Well, I think, believe it or not, we could get some from the United States.

00:10:53.000 I think we could get good many from Central and Eastern Europe.

00:10:57.160 Right now, if you look at where Canadians are coming from, new Canadians, China, Philippines, Pakistan...

00:11:03.180 I have nothing against any of those countries as long as the attitude of the applicants is the correct attitude.

00:11:08.940 Well, let's talk about Islam.

00:11:10.340 And that's tough to do.

00:11:11.900 But...

00:11:12.020 No, it's not tough for me to do.

00:11:13.320 How do you...

00:11:14.740 How...

00:11:15.180 I agree with you.

00:11:16.060 I mean, Chinese Canadians, Filipino Canadians, integration, assimilation, I don't sense that's a problem.

00:11:21.340 And with most Muslims, I don't sense it's a problem.

00:11:24.160 Not a problem.

00:11:24.900 I mean, look, some of these street gangs are Vietnamese. 0.98

00:11:27.800 They're dangerous.

00:11:28.400 But the Vietnamese in general are welcome here.

00:11:30.520 They're ingenious people.

00:11:31.860 Many of them speak French from the French days.

00:11:34.020 How do you deal with the Islamism? 1.00

00:11:36.840 I'm not talking about a Muslim. 1.00

00:11:38.400 I'm talking about the political ideology of Islam as being superior to the secular law of the land. 1.00

00:11:45.780 Quebec is reacting to this.

00:11:46.900 We can't have that.

00:11:47.720 Look, I don't particularly get into this in this book.

00:11:50.500 But on the issue you raise, I'm happy to talk about it.

00:11:53.380 We cannot have Sharia law in this country. 1.00

00:11:56.600 I mean, look, they're perfectly entitled to religious views like you and I are.

00:12:00.440 But...

00:12:01.000 And just as much as you and I are.

00:12:03.040 But they are not entitled to demand religious exceptions to the laws of this country.

00:12:09.420 I only mention that because when I read that you want Canada's population 50, 60 million,

00:12:14.580 I thought, they're not going to come...

00:12:16.300 I mean, wouldn't it be great to get people who...

00:12:19.240 If we did it right, we'd get a lot of people from Belarus and Ukraine and Russia and so forth.

00:12:24.520 We'd get a lot.

00:12:25.360 And look, I want to be clear.

00:12:28.340 Everybody's welcome.

00:12:29.120 It's not a race thing.

00:12:30.320 It's not a religion thing.

00:12:31.260 It's an assimilability thing.

00:12:33.040 Well, OK.

00:12:34.320 I want to talk a little bit about that because high immigration is good for landlords, drives 1.00

00:12:40.780 up rents.

00:12:41.680 It's good for factory owners, drives down wages.

00:12:44.580 But I'm not sure if that works in today's economy.

00:12:46.940 I'm worried we're teetering on the edge of a recession.

00:12:49.200 I guess you're thinking in broader sweet...

00:12:50.920 We may achieve the utter...

00:12:54.660 Now, we're straying from my book, but that's fine.

00:12:57.240 I mean, you're...

00:12:58.960 Free speech prevails in my house.

00:13:01.040 We'll get back to the book.

00:13:02.060 No, no.

00:13:02.600 But we may achieve the astounding feat of having a recession in this country while the United

00:13:10.280 States is having the greatest economic boom in its history.

00:13:13.740 How do we get along with the United States?

00:13:15.700 Because Stephen Harper, I think, bit his tongue and went along with Barack Obama for the good

00:13:20.260 of Canada.

00:13:21.500 And I think he actually got a grudging respect in return from Obama.

00:13:24.980 It wasn't until Harper was gone that Obama nixed the Keystone XL, for example.

00:13:29.140 How does Canada stay Canadian and get along with our biggest ally and trading partner?

00:13:34.760 Oh, you can do that.

00:13:35.800 Mulroney did it very well.

00:13:37.080 Mr. King did it very well.

00:13:38.860 Is it a...

00:13:39.560 The Americans have no desire to tell us what to do.

00:13:43.200 They don't want to meddle in this country the way Brussels meddles in the governments

00:13:47.420 of the member states because, ostensibly, the European Union is seeking an ever-closer

00:13:52.600 union.

00:13:53.080 It's falling apart, but that's not the point.

00:13:54.920 In Brussels, they're still seeking it.

00:13:56.580 The Americans don't want to dominate us.

00:13:59.940 They just want arrangements with us that they're happy with.

00:14:03.900 That's all.

00:14:04.700 You know, there's a while there where we heard different people in Ottawa talk about changing

00:14:09.440 the sun around which we orbit, replacing America with China. 0.91

00:14:14.220 Oh, please.

00:14:14.780 Well, I heard that from Catherine McKenna and Gerald Butts about, well, if America's not

00:14:19.280 following the global warming scheme, maybe China is, and let's reorient towards China.

00:14:23.560 China is.

00:14:24.020 They're the greatest defender to it.

00:14:25.440 I know that.

00:14:26.380 But that's...

00:14:26.860 I mean, they are, one, the greatest polluter in the world, and two, the head of G77, the 1.00

00:14:31.240 77 countries, patting around with cupped hands and begging bulls, saying, you advanced economies

00:14:38.280 have to pay us conscience money.

00:14:39.960 I mean, if you let...

00:14:42.380 I mean, the Chinese, like anyone else, if you leave the door open, they'll push the door. 1.00

00:14:48.760 So what is the best way to handle China, which is a huge market, but it's crony capitalism,

00:14:55.460 and it's aggressive militarily?

00:14:56.780 Look, look, it's 40% a command economy.

00:15:01.020 It's a semi-totalitarian state.

00:15:04.940 And it pursues not only an aggressive foreign policy, but one with certain racist overtones.

00:15:11.760 And it has to be respected as the other great power in the world next to the United States.

00:15:18.020 But the way to do it is to maintain cordial relations with those kind of...

00:15:25.020 Well, maintain as cordial relations as we can with China without in any way subordinating

00:15:30.620 ourselves on matters of principle or our national interest, and keep friendly with that arc of

00:15:36.420 states that is resisting the...

00:15:40.360 It's not a military expansion, but the general expansion of Chinese influence in the Far East.

00:15:46.980 We're talking about Japan, Indonesia, Philippines, Taiwan, Vietnam, South Korea, Malaysia, Singapore,

00:15:57.620 even though it's a Chinese country, and India and Australia.

00:16:01.840 They're all countries we're friendly with, and the Americans are essentially encouraging

00:16:07.900 all of them not to be bullied by China.

00:16:12.320 It is a very soft and appropriately different version of the containment strategy in Western Europe

00:16:18.680 in the days of the Cold War.

00:16:20.640 I'm having trouble staying focused on your book because I want to talk to you about the whole world.

00:16:24.100 Yeah, I didn't get into that in the book.

00:16:26.920 Let's get back to the book.

00:16:27.980 I was reading your passage about oil and gas and natural resources and pipelines.

00:16:32.660 I mean, Ontario was built by mining, and the Atlantic, and forestry, and fisheries, and

00:16:39.940 Canada has more oil than any country in the world other than Saudi Arabia or Venezuela.

00:16:46.480 But we've actually, for the first time in a decade, had a reduction in oil production.

00:16:52.440 No, it's a shameful thing.

00:16:54.000 What are we going to do about that?

00:16:55.020 Well, you've changed governments, and you proclaim an imminent domain that requires

00:17:02.880 the construction of pipelines east and west from Alberta.

00:17:06.020 It is an absolute scandal and an outrage that we import one drop of oil.

00:17:11.280 Okay, well...

00:17:12.460 And, you know, you stop inviting the native people to declare the whole of Canada a sacred burial ground.

00:17:22.060 There are Indian bands who support these oil pipelines.

00:17:25.060 Northern Gateway pipeline was 10% owned, 10% set aside for Indian bands, and yet it was

00:17:29.740 stopped.

00:17:30.620 I don't know if...

00:17:32.500 There will always be an activist.

00:17:34.600 There will always be an environmentalist who says no.

00:17:37.760 What do you do when you've got all your permits, and yet activists show up to either physically

00:17:44.400 block or even do some violence or, God forbid, eco-terrorism?

00:17:48.720 What do you do when people just say, I will not abide by the rule of law.

00:17:53.420 I will stop this with my body and my violence?

00:17:55.880 What do you do?

00:17:56.600 Well, you use the military.

00:17:58.720 Is that risking another OCA?

00:18:00.480 That's what Justin Trudeau thinks.

00:18:02.680 Look, I mean, obviously you try and avoid the violence, and if there is violence, you

00:18:07.600 try and ensure that it isn't fatal violence.

00:18:09.660 But the fact is, you do the necessary to ensure that the writ of the government of Canada

00:18:16.700 runs throughout the country.

00:18:18.920 Help me out with...

00:18:19.660 I mean, like you...

00:18:20.960 I mean, otherwise, it's just a house of cards and not a government.

00:18:25.920 Vancouver, Victoria, Montreal.

00:18:29.040 These cities, even Toronto, talk about a climate emergency.

00:18:32.580 Oh, bunk.

00:18:33.900 Absolutely bunk.

00:18:34.460 Well, here's the thing.

00:18:35.240 I mean, they love oil and gas in all those cities.

00:18:37.640 No one's driving any less.

00:18:38.840 No one's flying any less.

00:18:39.340 There's no climate emergency in any of those cities.

00:18:42.040 There's a hypocrisy.

00:18:43.320 Look, let's get this straight.

00:18:45.520 I mean, I touch on this in the book, so you're not off topic.

00:18:49.600 The carbon footprint of Canada and the world is a fraction of 1%, as you know.

00:18:53.820 If we had belching factories side by side from Halifax to Vancouver, it would have no impact 1.00

00:18:59.060 on the world at all.

00:19:00.380 Secondly, we don't know a thing about climate change.

00:19:04.160 We know at this point the world is not, in fact, warming.

00:19:08.280 The first 15 years of this century were colder than the last 15 years of the previous century.

00:19:13.740 Who has got the courage to say that in an election campaign?

00:19:16.920 Well, certainly the president of the United States does.

00:19:19.540 Well, he's an anomaly.

00:19:20.520 What about in our country?

00:19:21.400 Well, we've got to...

00:19:22.720 Leadership is you tell the people the facts, and nobody's telling them the facts.

00:19:27.600 Well, I'm with you on that.

00:19:28.580 I mean, the whole thing...

00:19:29.660 Look, let's get this straight.

00:19:31.540 Basically, the conservation movement, which we all agreed with.

00:19:34.760 I mean, I'm older than you, but years ago when we were young, it was essentially avoidance

00:19:40.300 of pollution.

00:19:41.060 And it consisted of bird watchers, butterfly collectors, and the Sierra Club.

00:19:45.260 You know, Greenpeace, even though I got a little tiresome about nuclear weapons.

00:19:48.420 But they just wanted a good environment.

00:19:50.980 When the international left was defeated in the Cold War, the forces of Marxism piled into

00:19:57.860 the ecological movement.

00:20:00.560 And in the guise of saving the planet, they've turned it into an assault on capitalism.

00:20:06.080 And it's a fraud.

00:20:06.940 What gets me is...

00:20:08.160 The Paris Climate Agreement is the most outrageous, fraudulent agreement in history, except for

00:20:13.700 the Iranian nuclear agreement.

00:20:15.060 And they were both the work of the Obama administration, and Trump is undoing them both.

00:20:18.780 I point out that Andrew Scheer, the leader of the Conservatives, one of his first acts

00:20:22.980 as leader, was to whip his MPs, including his oil patch MPs, to support the Paris Climate

00:20:27.580 Agreement.

00:20:27.600 I don't agree with Andrew on that.

00:20:29.880 What I was getting at about these cities, Vancouver, Victoria, Toronto, and Montreal, is they use

00:20:36.560 oil and gas as much as anyone.

00:20:38.680 But psychologically, they say, I don't want that dirty oil from Alberta, but they're buying

00:20:43.600 oil from America?

00:20:45.940 Ezra, I think you spent...

00:20:48.560 I mean, it's your job, so you need to do it.

00:20:50.440 I'm not criticizing you, but you're missing the silent majority.

00:20:55.420 The silent majority don't think like that.

00:20:58.020 Well, okay, here's...

00:20:59.140 I mean, you used to bestride this country in your newspapers, and I worked for the National

00:21:04.200 Post when you were the proprietor of it, and I felt like we were pushing back against that

00:21:09.060 narrative, that consensus narrative.

00:21:11.560 I felt that way when I worked for the National Post 20 years ago.

00:21:14.080 Well, it was part of my reason for founding the National Post.

00:21:16.000 But I look around, and my chief complaint...

00:21:18.920 But how do you stand up against the Paris Accord?

00:21:21.900 How do you stand up for pipelines?

00:21:23.360 How do you stand...

00:21:23.840 Well, you just do it.

00:21:24.700 But what if 90% of the voices in the country at the discussion table are the think-alikes

00:21:32.140 on the vanilla left?

00:21:34.460 Ezra, that's leadership.

00:21:36.320 In 1939, not quite 90%, but almost 90% of Americans were isolationists.

00:21:42.420 They wanted nothing to do at all with the belligerent powers in Europe.

00:21:46.200 By the middle of 1941, well before Pearl Harbor, a majority of Americans wanted to support the

00:21:54.760 British and Canadians, even if it led to war, though they hoped it wouldn't.

00:21:58.040 Now, that was leadership by President Roosevelt.

00:22:00.540 At the end of the war, an overwhelming majority of Americans didn't want anything to do with

00:22:06.260 keeping forces in Europe.

00:22:07.540 President Truman explained the facts.

00:22:09.760 And within a year, he had a majority of support for the Marshall Plan and setting up NATO.

00:22:15.740 That's leadership.

00:22:16.600 That's what leaders do for a living.

00:22:19.440 I don't know the media landscape back then enough offhand.

00:22:23.860 But here in Canada, on the issue of global warming, even the old National Post's dissident

00:22:29.620 approach is gone now.

00:22:30.820 I see pro-global warming.

00:22:33.420 And the media in this country is completely hopeless, and not just because of its political

00:22:37.600 bias.

00:22:37.840 So you can have...

00:22:38.400 Most of them can't write, and most of them are slothful.

00:22:42.480 How can you be a courageous leader proposing the ideas that you do in your book when you

00:22:50.200 know in advance that the Huffington Post and Vice and BuzzFeed, let alone the CBC, CTV,

00:22:57.440 the Globe and Mail, are going to take the mushy, think-alike, lefty view?

00:23:02.900 If you can't get your point of view out, how can you be a leader if no one repeats your

00:23:07.500 message?

00:23:07.700 Well, no, if you're in a position of official responsibility, you can...

00:23:13.880 To use Margaret Thatcher's old line, you have a direct line to the people.

00:23:18.180 And now they may comment on it.

00:23:19.500 The mushy-minded people, as you say, may comment on it and distort it and misrepresent it.

00:23:23.500 That happens.

00:23:24.000 But when Reagan referred, when he opened the Strategic Defense Initiative, you're certainly

00:23:30.360 old enough to remember that, he was ridiculed everywhere.

00:23:33.440 Star Wars, they thought he'd gone crazy and had cartoons of him as Darth Vader and everything.

00:23:38.160 Meanwhile, the country followed it, and basically that ended the Cold War.

00:23:43.420 The Russians collapsed. 0.97

00:23:45.500 I mean, the Soviet Union collapsed, not the Russians.

00:23:47.960 Well, listen, I read your book, and it's called A Manifesto, so you got my attention, and it

00:23:52.900 was a nice short read, 160 pages.

00:23:54.980 No, but it is.

00:23:55.660 I do propose a lot of policy alternatives in different fields.

00:24:00.180 All right.

00:24:00.560 Go through some more of them, because I read the book quickly before.

00:24:03.380 Look, on the tax side, I don't want to sound too simplistic.

00:24:08.240 These are complicated matters.

00:24:09.400 But on the tax side, I want reduced income taxes and an increased HST on nonessential spending,

00:24:17.440 which, obviously, you don't raise HST on groceries bought in food stores, but you can raise it

00:24:23.640 on luxury restaurant bills, you know, that kind of thing.

00:24:26.520 And in poverty reduction, I think we go to a self-eliminating wealth tax, very small percent

00:24:36.780 on high wealth numbers, but the way it's paid is not just paying a tax, pay for more civil

00:24:44.740 servants.

00:24:45.600 It is the wealthy people certify in the way that bona fide charities are certified methods

00:24:53.520 of poverty reduction.

00:24:54.780 And as statistically defined poverty is reduced, the tax is eliminated.

00:24:59.420 So you give the wealthiest and most commercially and economically astute people in the country

00:25:04.900 an incentive to help eliminate poverty, and you align exactly the interests of the poor

00:25:11.200 people and the rich people.

00:25:12.500 I think we've gone as far as we can go with our well-intentioned, but now over-manned and

00:25:18.040 rather inefficient welfare system.

00:25:20.080 So you're saying you're calling on private individuals to solve the problem of poverty

00:25:25.480 as a way to get out of their wealth tax.

00:25:28.260 Is that what you're saying?

00:25:31.440 Look, I think official action has reduced poverty a long way from where it would be, but to finish

00:25:36.820 it off, yes.

00:25:37.840 But, you know, the Bible says the poor will always be with us.

00:25:42.520 Yeah, but we don't have, I agree it says that, but that doesn't mean it's necessarily

00:25:47.960 true.

00:25:48.340 If you define it as, let's say, the lowest 10% of income earners, you will always have

00:25:54.740 a lowest 10% even in the richest country of the world.

00:25:57.060 They need not necessarily be in a state of poverty.

00:26:00.320 Okay.

00:26:00.780 I'm not trying to create equal levels of wealth for everybody.

00:26:04.280 I'm not a Marxist.

00:26:06.640 I think that...

00:26:08.040 I'm an anti-Marxist.

00:26:09.240 There's a great tradition in Canada, and even stronger in America, of wealthy people doing

00:26:17.500 enormous charitable acts.

00:26:19.620 Indeed.

00:26:19.920 That, I think part of that is made possible if people are allowed to get wealthy in the

00:26:25.840 first place.

00:26:26.460 Of course.

00:26:27.480 And also, if we...

00:26:29.000 Don't imagine for a second I'm trying to stop that.

00:26:32.120 I'm cutting income taxes in my plan.

00:26:34.100 People will get wealthier.

00:26:35.660 It's just that the tax they pay will be a slightly different tax.

00:26:39.040 I think, I mean, listen, I've never been wealthy enough to donate a hospital wing or anything

00:26:43.700 like that, but I would imagine people do that partly for the pride and the joy and the

00:26:48.720 feeling that I'm a community builder, but I think there's been a demonization of wealth

00:26:54.140 and the wealthy, Bernie Sanders, that whole, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, there's a new love

00:27:00.660 for socialism and a misunderstanding of socialism and capitalism, I think, from millennials, and

00:27:06.480 I'm worried that we're demonizing...

00:27:08.660 Look at Howard Schultz, who's thinking of running as an independent for president. 1.00

00:27:11.360 No, he's a complete jackass. 0.99

00:27:12.640 But he started with nothing. 1.00

00:27:14.160 Yeah, yeah, he's fine as a businessman, but as a politician, he's a jackass. 0.98

00:27:17.460 I, but some of his clips that I've seen online are startling. 0.96

00:27:22.580 He says, look, we have to keep with the American way.

00:27:24.740 It's what allowed me to go from poor to wealthy, and he was...

00:27:28.720 He's a conservative Democrat, which is basically, doesn't exist anymore.

00:27:32.460 And that's my point, is that the Democrats have demonized wealth and wealthiness so bad,

00:27:39.080 I'm worried that that's undermining the American dream.

00:27:41.660 I blame some of this, and it certainly wasn't what they intended, but on these immensely

00:27:46.540 wealthy people making sort of leftist gestures, like Warren Buffett and Bill Gates saying, I'm

00:27:52.260 not leaving anything to my heirs, you know?

00:27:54.280 I mean, you know, Uncle Warren padding around in his corduroys and his viola shirt and masquerading

00:28:02.320 as just the, you know, the friendly uncle in the old age home or something.

00:28:07.000 I mean, it's wonderful PR for him, and he's a brilliant man, and to the very small extent

00:28:14.400 I know him, he's a very courteous, nice man, too.

00:28:17.260 A tough, tough businessman, naturally.

00:28:19.380 That's how he got so wealthy.

00:28:20.280 But it sort of invites the next step to Sandersism.

00:28:26.940 Look here, these guys aren't leaving their money to anybody.

00:28:29.460 Why the hell did they make it in the first place, and why shouldn't we take it now, instead 0.96

00:28:32.760 of waiting for them to die? 0.97

00:28:34.320 You know, I tell you, there's a hundred things we've talked about that I could go down deep,

00:28:38.460 but I want to come back to the book.

00:28:39.840 We've talked a little bit about taxes.

00:28:41.700 We've talked about oil and gas.

00:28:42.700 We've talked about immigration.

00:28:43.980 My favorite subject.

00:28:44.920 Sorry we took so much time on it.

00:28:46.740 We've talked about foreign affairs.

00:28:47.200 Terribly important subject, though.

00:28:48.380 Now, what about, I think that constitutional matters were pretty much put in the freezer

00:28:54.520 during Stephen Harper's tenure.

00:28:56.160 Yes.

00:28:56.680 Western alienation was evaporated.

00:28:58.960 You had a Calgarian in 24 Sussex Drive. 1.00

00:29:02.920 Quebec was appeased, I think, because Harper was not part of an age-old feud himself.

00:29:08.400 It allowed him to, that's my thing.

00:29:09.900 Look, he spoke French tolerably.

00:29:12.060 They didn't like him down there, and they didn't give him much support, but at least he spoke French

00:29:15.700 tolerably well.

00:29:16.360 Well, he recognized Quebec as a distinct society.

00:29:19.080 And separatism was a dog that did not bark.

00:29:21.880 There was no left-handed crisis.

00:29:22.500 Yeah, I wouldn't credit Harper with that.

00:29:25.180 But look at Canada now for three years of Trudeau.

00:29:28.700 I can tell you, Alberta...

00:29:31.140 Oh, no, Alberta has been treated outrageously. 1.00

00:29:33.420 But even, I think that you see province after province turning against the hard-fisted tactics

00:29:40.520 of Trudeau and the carbon tax, for example. 0.92

00:29:42.300 It's a ridiculous tactic.

00:29:43.640 I mean, look, if you have to raise taxes, you have to raise them, but don't pretend you're 0.86

00:29:47.420 saving the planet.

00:29:48.480 And that's why Macron has these gilets jaunes out there.

00:29:51.200 You know, the French don't like paying taxes, but they would pay it if they have to, for 0.93

00:29:58.000 valid reason.

00:29:59.420 But the idea they're paying it to save the world's climate is just a load of God's wallop,

00:30:03.540 and they know it.

00:30:04.620 Well, let's talk about the gilets jaunes, the yellow vest protests, which have been going

00:30:08.600 on for pretty much half a year now.

00:30:11.160 Yeah, but you can't deal with them the way Macron is.

00:30:13.240 In Canada, we have some people who put on yellow vests as a symbol of being dissident,

00:30:20.140 but it's not a real movement.

00:30:21.280 This is more Canadian imitative.

00:30:23.100 I mean, let them put on the, you know, pink tukes like the women who were complaining about 1.00

00:30:29.640 Trump a few years ago.

00:30:30.520 But the great use of that is that it's allowed Justin Trudeau, Chrystia Freeland, Ahmed Hassan,

00:30:39.400 Ralph Goodale, all the Trudeau senior cabinet to say, ah, we have a tremendous problem in

00:30:45.840 Canada with neo-Nazis, alt-right, and white supremacists.

00:30:49.920 I think that's going to be their theme going forward.

00:30:52.720 First of all, do we have a problem in Canada?

00:30:54.320 The world won't fly.

00:30:55.040 You can't frighten Canadians about Canadians.

00:30:58.320 Are you sure?

00:30:59.580 I'm confident.

00:31:00.660 I'm confident.

00:31:00.960 That one, I'm confident. 0.90

00:31:02.100 The average Canadian knows, of course, in any society, there are some crazy people and

00:31:08.360 there are some extremists and you can't take their rights away, but you've got to watch

00:31:12.700 them closely to make sure they don't do really seriously bad things.

00:31:17.080 But that Canada has a real problem, that our society is threatened by the numbers and ferocity

00:31:25.960 of these people, bunk, and everyone in this country knows it's bunk.

00:31:29.200 Well, I hope you're right.

00:31:29.960 The CBC sure likes that theme.

00:31:31.340 Well, yeah, they do.

00:31:33.460 But the answer to that is get better media, not change society.

00:31:37.720 Well, now you're talking my language.

00:31:39.580 Claude Wagner, you know, who I supported for leader when he ran against Joe Clark, he

00:31:45.320 used to quote Duplessis and say, le peuple est bon, but people are good.

00:31:49.560 It's the elites that are not so good.

00:31:51.060 Yeah, I like that, your take on that.

00:31:53.160 Well, that's funny because you're a lord, a house of lords.

00:31:56.860 It's a very meritocratic house, though.

00:31:59.020 There are only a few inherited ones.

00:32:01.120 They're all life peers now.

00:32:02.560 And I think partly because of how you carry yourself, partly because of your vocabulary,

00:32:08.460 and partly because, you know, media tycoons, that's a certain image.

00:32:13.160 You would normally be called fancy, but you have this populist streak to you.

00:32:19.320 You, you, you, you're a Trumpist, which by definition means you're, you're a sort of a blue,

00:32:26.180 you sympathize with the blue collar workers in a way that I don't think most people in

00:32:30.800 your station would.

00:32:31.600 How did that happen?

00:32:33.360 I always find people interesting.

00:32:35.580 Everybody has their story to tell.

00:32:37.000 I mean, when I, you know, was an outrage, it's widely recognized now to be an outrage,

00:32:42.180 and the last shoe hasn't dropped yet, but it will, on, on, on the legal problems I had.

00:32:46.720 And, you know, everybody in the media here was saying, oh, well, when he gets to an American

00:32:51.860 federal prison, you know, they'll do terrible things to him and so on.

00:32:55.420 I got on like smoke with everybody.

00:32:57.360 When, when, when the public address system announced that I was under a Supreme Court

00:33:01.740 release order, 200 people wanted to accompany me to the gate.

00:33:06.600 I mean, I'm interested in people.

00:33:09.000 Well, you know, I mean, I am what you said.

00:33:10.740 I'm an educated person.

00:33:11.860 I'm a well-to-do man.

00:33:12.800 And my father was a well-to-do man.

00:33:14.560 But, you know, and I certainly know a lot of socially prominent people, but in various

00:33:21.200 countries, but, but I'm interested in everybody, not just, not just rich people.

00:33:25.900 Well, I've seen that.

00:33:26.660 I mean, I've, I've seen you when a 17-year-old cadet said hello and you stopped and you talked

00:33:34.300 to him for 15 minutes about every, I've seen you do that.

00:33:37.920 It's not just, I mean, and it's amazing.

00:33:40.600 It's a, it's a personal skill.

00:33:43.220 Can I just ask you one more question?

00:33:44.780 Of course.

00:33:44.980 I've never asked you about your, your time in prison and maybe you don't want to tell

00:33:48.120 me, but I'm curious because talk about a fish out of water.

00:33:51.560 I mean, if, if it weren't so grave and unjust, that would be a hell of a movie.

00:33:55.760 It had its humorous moment.

00:33:57.140 I was going to say, I mean, that's a hell of a, that's a trading place.

00:34:00.300 It's entertaining.

00:34:01.480 Maybe it's absurd to ask.

00:34:02.460 I mean, some of them are, are bad news, but, but, but, but I got on fine with them.

00:34:06.960 Have you ever.

00:34:07.280 Even the Don of the Genovese family.

00:34:09.640 Did you, have you kept in touch with any of them?

00:34:11.720 Would any of them?

00:34:12.320 Are you serious?

00:34:13.160 Yeah.

00:34:13.300 Would you call any, I mean, I guess you're.

00:34:15.300 There are a few of them on my phone, yeah.

00:34:16.620 Really?

00:34:16.780 And vice versa, they phone here.

00:34:18.180 Isn't that interesting?

00:34:19.000 Yeah.

00:34:19.480 Huh.

00:34:20.200 All right.

00:34:20.500 Well, you've been very generous with your time.

00:34:22.360 I want to talk more about.

00:34:23.940 I'm trying to sell books.

00:34:25.260 I'm grateful to you for helping me out here.

00:34:27.440 Um, I like the fact that you still love Canada and that you, it's called a manifesto and you

00:34:35.300 want these things to happen.

00:34:36.880 Are you going to do anything to make them happen?

00:34:39.380 Are you going to have a conference?

00:34:41.140 Are you going to go on a tour, a speaking tour?

00:34:43.200 Are you going to, I mean, this book is, it's affordable and it's on Amazon and people can

00:34:48.200 get it.

00:34:48.520 Are you going to do anything to, to push these ideas into, into places where they might be

00:34:53.660 acted on?

00:34:54.140 I, I, I might.

00:34:55.800 I'll see how it goes.

00:34:56.500 I'll, I'll do what I can.

00:34:57.780 That's right.

00:34:58.160 You know, I'll do what I can.

00:34:59.120 And, and if, if I was, uh, if anyone in, I mean, I'm not at this stage about to hurl

00:35:05.500 myself into politics and I'm not even at this point a citizen in this country, though.

00:35:09.140 I think, I think that'll change probably fairly soon.

00:35:12.160 But the, the, um, uh, and I, I like the situation I have in Britain because I, you know, I am a

00:35:19.320 legislator and I can speak and it's on television and if it's any good, it's noticed and quoted.

00:35:24.700 And, uh, but here, um, if, if, if somebody asked me to do something that I thought I could

00:35:34.380 do properly and, and, and, and, and was, it was interesting, I'd, I'd do it.

00:35:39.120 Yeah.

00:35:39.320 I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'll, I'll, I'll see what I can do.

00:35:42.200 I'll do what I can and I'll see what I can do.

00:35:43.880 All right, last question.

00:35:45.020 I mean, I, I, there's a lot of things in the book when you talk about constitutional matters,

00:35:49.520 you talk, there's a lot of things we haven't even touched on, but if you could identify

00:35:53.300 one problem in Canada that you think is soluble, like not just a, wouldn't it be great if, but

00:36:00.460 if there was one thing out there, a low hanging fruit, something that you think, my God, we

00:36:04.120 got to knock that off our to-do list.

00:36:05.540 What would that problem be and what would your prescription be?

00:36:12.740 So there's a lot of things in your book, but what's the one thing that's a no-brainer?

00:36:16.080 Uh, the no-brainers are not so, uh, they're not so many of those. 0.91

00:36:20.380 I mean, if there were, in fairness, I think the others would have got onto them already.

00:36:25.260 Can I just mention a couple of things?

00:36:26.820 Sure.

00:36:27.000 On the, um, education side, I think we have to start, I think we have to decertify the

00:36:36.460 teachers unions and institute, uh, a, a meritocratic, uh, system of rewarding performance, both

00:36:49.260 the students and the teachers, and occasionally this is attempted, but it's always rigged, and,

00:36:55.400 and, and we've got to stop that, because we're spending, as a civilization in the Western

00:36:59.860 world, in almost every country, more and more and more money to get less and less well-educated

00:37:06.400 people, and we've got to reverse that trend. 0.89

00:37:08.940 The second thing I'd, I'd mention is on, on, on, I'll mention three of them.

00:37:15.020 We have to integrate private medicine into our, into our healthcare system.

00:37:21.720 We don't have enough doctors per person, per unit of population, to, to get rid of waiting

00:37:29.860 lists and provide efficient healthcare, and we, we can only deal with it by bringing some

00:37:34.720 level of private medicine back into the system.

00:37:38.520 And third, on the justice side, other than in the most egregious cases, we should not imprison

00:37:46.660 any non-violent first offenders.

00:37:49.120 It is nonsense.

00:37:50.060 It's just done, because it's always been done.

00:37:52.920 I'm, I'm, I'm all for punishing crime, but, but there are much better, more efficient, more

00:37:59.780 just, and less costly ways of doing it.

00:38:02.200 Yeah.

00:38:02.720 Interesting.

00:38:03.480 Well, listen, I, I'm amazed at your output, the number, I've, I've got to keep up with you.

00:38:09.100 I mean, you've written more books.

00:38:10.660 If you make the book short enough, you can put them out quickly.

00:38:13.440 You've written more books than a lot of folks have read.

00:38:16.180 I, I, I like the fact that this and your Trump book, which was great, is so accessible.

00:38:21.500 And I'm grateful, because, I mean, I love your thick history books, but.

00:38:26.080 No, but in, in fairness, the, the life of Franklin D. Roosevelt, if you're going to be serious,

00:38:30.560 you can't do it in 200 pages.

00:38:32.020 He's a four-term president.

00:38:33.160 Well, I, I congratulate you on this new book, and we will, we'll send this video to our

00:38:40.740 folks out there, and I think in this country, people are, after three and a half years of

00:38:46.620 Justin Trudeau, I think people are, are looking for someone who loves Canada, who's maybe studied

00:38:52.160 Canada a little bit, and knows our history, and has done some serious thinking about the

00:38:56.020 future.

00:38:56.440 That's you.

00:38:56.740 I want to say, I personally like Justin Trudeau.

00:38:59.220 I, I, I think he's a very genuinely nice man, uh, and smarter than his detractors say,

00:39:05.680 but I, I, I do not think he's had a successful government, unfortunately.

00:39:09.120 It's been a disaster.

00:39:10.440 Well, it's great to see you.

00:39:12.180 Congratulations on the new book, and, uh, we look forward to your next book as well.

00:39:17.180 I mean, and for me, I think the test will be, can your ideas in the manifesto, which suggests

00:39:23.940 action, can they take root in this country?

00:39:26.500 I hope they will.

00:39:27.260 Thanks so much, Ezra.

00:39:28.160 Thank you.

00:39:29.220 Well, what did you think of that very interesting character?

00:39:43.520 I tell you, he's a polymath.

00:39:45.720 He's interested in so many different things.

00:39:48.080 I wish I had had a little more time to go through the review copy, which I just got that

00:39:52.500 day, so my questions would be more specific to his book, but I hope you enjoyed our conversation

00:39:57.440 nonetheless, and if you want to buy his book, and I think we should support conservative

00:40:01.920 authors.

00:40:02.520 I tell you, the bestseller list is jammed with liberal books.

00:40:05.820 When a conservative actually writes a book, I think we should support it, so please consider

00:40:10.800 going to the Amazon link below this video to buy a copy for yourself.

00:40:14.860 What's so great is that Conrad Black, he writes these big, thick history books, but this one's

00:40:20.040 just 166 pages.

00:40:22.040 Like, you could really read it quickly.

00:40:23.540 I like this new briefer, Conrad Black.

00:40:26.980 I think it's going to sell a lot of copies, by the way.

00:40:29.520 Well, let me know what you think.

00:40:31.740 Send me an email to ezra at therebel.media.

00:40:34.300 And until next time, on behalf of all of us here at Rebel World Headquarters, good night

00:40:39.640 and keep fighting for freedom.

00:40:41.300 Thank you.

Rebel News Podcast - May 11, 2019

SPECIAL： Interview with Conrad Black about his NEW book, “The Canadian Manifesto”

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