The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #497 - Tim Kennedy

00:00:00.000 In the background.

00:00:01.000 Yeah.

00:00:03.000 Eventually, that's what it'll be.

00:00:05.000 But right now, it's coffee.

00:00:06.000 This episode of the Joe Rogan Experience podcast... 0.99

00:00:09.000 I fucking said it. 0.99

00:00:10.000 I said my own name. 1.00

00:00:11.000 I hate doing that.

00:00:12.000 The podcast.

00:00:14.000 It's very douchey when someone says their own name.

00:00:16.000 Unless you really have to.

00:00:17.000 Like someone asks you what your name is.

00:00:18.000 And you go, my name's Joe Rogan.

00:00:20.000 Then, it's okay.

00:00:21.000 But if you say it...

00:00:26.000 I'm just trying to not be as douchey as possible, folks.

00:00:28.000 It's hard.

00:00:29.000 It's very hard.

00:00:30.000 This episode of the podcast is brought to you by Stamps.com. 0.51

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00:01:28.000 Before you do anything else, click on the microphone at the top of the homepage and type in JRE. That's Stamps.com.

00:01:37.000 And type in J-R-E. We're also brought to you by 1-800-Flowers.

00:01:43.000 It's Mother's Day, freaks. 0.88

00:01:44.000 It's right around the corner.

00:01:45.000 Was it this Sunday?

00:01:46.000 Yes.

00:01:47.000 It's always this Sunday, right?

00:01:48.000 It's always on Sunday?

00:01:49.000 Is Mother's Day always on Sunday?

00:01:50.000 Yes.

00:01:50.000 Should be.

00:01:51.000 It would suck if your mom had Mother's Day and was on Tuesday. 1.00

00:01:54.000 That would be some bullshit. 1.00

00:01:56.000 Mothers deserve credit. 1.00

00:01:57.000 They deserve respect.

00:01:58.000 Without them, you would not be alive, ladies and gentlemen.

00:02:00.000 Your mother gave birth to you.

00:02:02.000 Deal with that and go to 1-800-Flowers.com.

00:02:05.000 Scrape up some shekels. 1.00

00:02:07.000 What's a shekel worth? 1.00

00:02:10.000 Tim Kennedy, you're a worldly man.

00:02:11.000 What's a shekel worth? 1.00

00:02:12.000 I have no idea.

00:02:14.000 Is it a shekel to dollars ratio?

00:02:16.000 I just know it has something to do with Jews. 0.50

00:02:19.000 You've got to be careful when you use shekel. 0.99

00:02:21.000 Jews are very touchy. 1.00

00:02:23.000 Anyway, available only Thursday, May 8th, through Thursday, May 8th, which is tomorrow.

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00:03:10.000 Click on the radio microphone in the upper right-hand corner and enter in JRE. That's 1-800-Flowers.com and enter in JRE. Or call 1-800-Flowers.com and mention JRE. I'm going to give them to my mom,

00:03:25.000 but I've got to wait because my mom's in Mexico.

00:03:28.000 My mom is moving to Mexico. 1.00

00:03:30.000 Crazy bitch. 1.00

00:03:32.000 She's crazy. 1.00

00:03:33.000 And I mean bitch with all due respect. 1.00

00:03:35.000 I call myself a bitch. 1.00

00:03:36.000 I call everybody a bitch. 1.00

00:03:37.000 I don't really mean like a female dog or a bad person. 1.00

00:03:41.000 I mean, if you're really thinking about moving to Mexico, you're fucking crazy. 1.00

00:03:44.000 Anyway, Mother's Day. 1.00

00:03:46.000 Go.

00:03:47.000 1-800Flowers.com.

00:03:48.000 Use the code word JRE and save yourself some money and hook your mom up.

00:03:52.000 She'll be happy if you did.

00:03:53.000 We're also brought to you by Onnit.com.

00:03:56.000 That's O-N-N-I-T. Official sponsor of Tim Kennedy.

00:03:59.000 We've got to figure out a way to sponsor fighters actually in the UFC. The UFC has a muscle farm monopoly right now.

00:04:06.000 We have to break that.

00:04:08.000 I wouldn't care if it was actually good products, but MusclePharm is not.

00:04:13.000 It's not?

00:04:13.000 I don't think so.

00:04:14.000 I've never used it.

00:04:15.000 What is it?

00:04:16.000 Protein powders and stuff?

00:04:17.000 It's like plastic that...

00:04:19.000 Fills your stomach up?

00:04:20.000 What is it?

00:04:21.000 I don't know.

00:04:22.000 What is MusclePharm?

00:04:23.000 They make all the typical, you know, the pre-workouts, post-workouts, proteins, toilet stuff, you know, like jacks your heart rate up to 180 before your workout, and then afterwards when...

00:04:35.000 And it supposedly tastes good.

00:04:36.000 It's just full of sugar.

00:04:37.000 I've never had a good experience with a single Muscle Farm product.

00:04:40.000 Obviously, I like Onnit.

00:04:41.000 Whoa.

00:04:42.000 Tim Kennedy just laid down the law.

00:04:44.000 How rude.

00:04:45.000 I have nothing bad to say about Muscle Farm.

00:04:48.000 I have no relationship with them.

00:04:50.000 I have no experience with them.

00:04:51.000 But I do have a deep, long, and storied experience with Onnit.

00:04:55.000 Our protein powder is 100% natural and also 100% sugar-free.

00:05:01.000 The only sugar is one gram of sugar, which is naturally occurring per serving that comes from the hemp.

00:05:07.000 I have to answer this.

00:05:08.000 I have to say this every episode, but just because I get asked all the time.

00:05:11.000 If you eat hemp, you will not test positive for marijuana.

00:05:15.000 Hemp does not have any THC in it.

00:05:18.000 But again, if you eat poppy seed bagels, you will test positive for heroin.

00:05:21.000 Sounds crazy, but it's totally true. 0.99

00:05:24.000 Hemp Force, we use the finest available protein powder that we can buy, which we have to buy from Canada, because the laws are fucking goofy in America, and we're not allowed to grow hemp. 0.96

00:05:33.000 We can buy it, but we can't support American farmers, which drives me fucking crazy.

00:05:39.000 Hopefully, the laws have been changed, and hopefully soon we will be able to support farmers and buy our own...

00:05:46.000 Well, we're supporting Canadian farmers, but...

00:05:48.000 We'll hopefully be able to support American farmers and maybe even get our own hemp farm.

00:05:53.000 Right now, though, it's a little too sketch and I don't want to go to jail.

00:05:56.000 So...

00:05:57.000 We buy it, and then we sell it. 1.00

00:05:59.000 We sell the best shit that we can find, whether it's strength and conditioning equipment. 0.99

00:06:03.000 We sell just the finest kettlebells and steel maces and clubs and weight vests. 0.99

00:06:09.000 If we find something and it's good, we find something that's beneficial, whether it's a supplement or a food, we sell it.

00:06:15.000 And we try to get it at the most reasonable rates possible, and we find the best quality stuff, whatever it is, whether it's the best quality stuff. 0.97

00:06:23.000 Protein powders where it's the best quality, walnut, almond, cashew, butter, anything we sell, raw organic coconut oil, we just try to sell the best shit available. 0.73

00:06:34.000 And we try to sell it to you as cheaply as possible.

00:06:36.000 If you use the code name ROGAN, you will save 10% off any and all supplements.

00:06:41.000 Tim Kennedy is here.

00:06:43.000 Let's cue the music. 1.00

00:06:44.000 Why fuck around? 1.00

00:06:47.000 The Joe Rogan Experience. 1.00

00:06:57.000 Tim Kennedy, ladies and gentlemen.

00:06:58.000 I've been wanting to talk to you for a while, dude.

00:07:00.000 You're an interesting cat.

00:07:02.000 You've been around the world.

00:07:03.000 You're saying that you're laughing like you're not.

00:07:05.000 I'm not interesting, but I had wanted to talk to you in the octagon for a really long time.

00:07:11.000 It took a while.

00:07:12.000 It did take a long time.

00:07:14.000 It took a while.

00:07:15.000 12 years as a pro to finally get a little Joe interview.

00:07:17.000 Yeah, but the interview was...

00:07:19.000 You couldn't ask for a better environment to do that first interview.

00:07:23.000 When the UFC fight for the troops, to do it, and to do it after that spectacular knockout.

00:07:30.000 That was intense, man.

00:07:32.000 It wasn't just intense because you won.

00:07:35.000 What was really intense for me is, and I've always experienced this in these fights for the troops.

00:07:41.000 First of all, it's great to be able to go to them and put on these fights and have them in these hangers and these tight environments.

00:07:48.000 Just the appreciation and the respect that everybody has for the fighters is really intense.

00:07:56.000 You, first of all, you being a veteran and you being unabashed in your love for soldiers and your respect for your fellow military members, when you got on top of that cage and after, you know, they were cheering and you were yelling out to all those people that you loved them.

00:08:14.000 I mean, this is all off camera, man.

00:08:16.000 We'd cut to commercial.

00:08:18.000 And you're on top of the cage and you're just yelling at all those people, letting them know that you love them. 1.00

00:08:23.000 That's some intense, intense shit. 1.00

00:08:26.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:08:26.000 Overwhelming, emotional, near shutdown. 1.00

00:08:30.000 Yeah.

00:08:30.000 I'm walking out to the cage and I see this dude.

00:08:32.000 He flies for the 160th, which is like the Special Forces wing of aviation.

00:08:37.000 The last time I saw that dude was I was handing him my shot buddy.

00:08:42.000 I'm like, it's a big thing in the Special Forces community.

00:08:44.000 We're real tight.

00:08:45.000 I'm handing him my brother that has bullet holes in him, and I'm like, I don't want to let him go.

00:08:52.000 And he's like, hey, I got this.

00:08:53.000 This is what I do.

00:08:54.000 You go do what you're supposed to do and get back to work.

00:08:56.000 That was the last time I saw this dude.

00:08:58.000 Was handing him my buddy on a medevac. 0.78

00:09:01.000 Then I'm walking out of the cage and I was like, holy shit, there is that dude from the 160th that I handed my shot buddy to. 0.95

00:09:08.000 Totally overwhelming. 0.98

00:09:09.000 Then I have to go in there and fight.

00:09:10.000 And then, you know, 5th Special Forces Group is co-located there, so I saw a bunch of dudes from the Green Beret Regiment.

00:09:19.000 Yeah, it was entirely too much emotion.

00:09:21.000 I just wanted to, like, curl up and cry.

00:09:22.000 Yeah, it's a completely different kind of...

00:09:24.000 There's you on top of the cage up there in that photo.

00:09:27.000 That's just an intense, intense picture.

00:09:29.000 That picture should be framed and on your wall somewhere, because that is one of the greatest pictures I've ever seen.

00:09:34.000 If you could cut me out and just have the dudes...

00:09:36.000 No, no, no, no, no.

00:09:37.000 You need to be in there for reference.

00:09:39.000 But that's your attitude, what you just said, cut me out and leave the dudes. 0.81

00:09:43.000 That really is your attitude.

00:09:47.000 You were saying while you were up there that my job in here is easy, what you guys do.

00:09:53.000 You guys are my heroes.

00:09:54.000 You have good memory.

00:09:56.000 Yeah, I remember everything.

00:09:57.000 That's disturbing.

00:09:58.000 It's scary.

00:09:59.000 Don't get in a fight with Joe Rogan verbally.

00:10:01.000 It does not go well for you.

00:10:03.000 I remember things.

00:10:04.000 Well, I remember important things, and that was a deep moment.

00:10:08.000 I wrote a thing a long time ago about one of the fights for the troops about the national anthem, and I recorded it.

00:10:17.000 I filmed it on my phone when someone was singing the national anthem, and you turn around, and I was filming the crowd while it was all going on, And the feeling in the air, the electricity in the air of hearing the national anthem while you're around active duty soldiers who are in a war currently,

00:10:35.000 have had friends, had loved ones die, have experienced firefights, have been there, have come back, and now they're here in time off, getting to enjoy a fight, and everyone's standing up, and there's electricity.

00:10:47.000 Electricity in the air, man. 0.99

00:10:49.000 Your fucking hairs are standing up on your back. 1.00

00:10:52.000 It's crazy. 1.00

00:10:53.000 It's intense.

00:10:54.000 It's intense.

00:10:55.000 It's a totally different experience.

00:10:57.000 It's there.

00:10:57.000 I don't understand the whole realm outside of what you can physically see, but there's no way to describe moments like that Where you're surrounded by these heroes, these selfless freaking superstars of humanity.

00:11:13.000 And, you know, they bleed in every sense of the word for their country.

00:11:18.000 And then the national anthem come on, or the flag goes up, and you see them all.

00:11:22.000 And there's this energy there that just can't be described.

00:11:25.000 It can only be experienced.

00:11:26.000 It's surreal.

00:11:27.000 You know, that's the really intense aspect of it, is that there's a lot of resistance and blowback towards war and towards the military-industrial complex and towards...

00:11:42.000 Both of which are horrible.

00:11:43.000 Yeah, but...

00:11:45.000 What's important is...

00:11:47.000 Everybody wants everything to be black and white.

00:11:49.000 And there's no black and white in this world.

00:11:51.000 There's this gigantic spectrum of shades.

00:11:54.000 And there's positive and there's negative.

00:11:56.000 There's good and there's bad.

00:11:57.000 But there are real heroes in the world.

00:12:00.000 Pat Tillman is a perfect example of a guy who is a real hero, in my opinion. 0.99

00:12:04.000 A guy who saw what was going on and said, you know what, fuck this NFL career. 0.98

00:12:08.000 I don't need millions of dollars. 0.99

00:12:10.000 What I need to do is do what's right, and I need to fight for my country.

00:12:13.000 He goes over there, and then when he gets there...

00:12:15.000 He experiences chaos and nonsense, and he's super vocal about it, as is his brother.

00:12:22.000 And that's, to me, a perfect example of that there is no black and white. 0.80

00:12:29.000 There's a lot of...

00:12:30.000 There's real heroes.

00:12:32.000 There's people that have heroic intent, and there's people that have...

00:12:36.000 Heroic ideals, and they really do love and respect the idea of freedom, but they get thrust into a situation where everything is completely out of control and chaotic, and a guy like Pat Tillman was very vocal about it.

00:12:50.000 And well-spoken.

00:12:51.000 Very well-spoken, as is his brother.

00:12:53.000 It's a very intense thing.

00:12:56.000 When people are anti-war, it's fashionable to be anti-war.

00:13:04.000 It's a thing that a lot of people put on like an outfit.

00:13:08.000 They just sort of jump into the sentiment that we shouldn't have a military and we shouldn't have war.

00:13:13.000 The real problem is human beings are still animals in a lot of respects, a lot of senses.

00:13:18.000 And probably nobody knows that more than a guy like you who's been there.

00:13:23.000 War is horrible.

00:13:25.000 I hate war.

00:13:25.000 I am anti-war.

00:13:26.000 I've been anti-war my whole entire life with, you know, uncles that fought in World War II, or in Vietnam, you know, grandparents that fought in World War II. But with that...

00:13:51.000 It's necessary.

00:13:53.000 I wouldn't wish what I've seen in my life on my worst enemy.

00:13:57.000 There's no way I'd want...

00:13:59.000 The people I hate to have to see what a little girl looks like once she's had acid throw on her because she tried to go to school.

00:14:05.000 I want that on my worst enemy.

00:14:07.000 But there's people that do those things.

00:14:10.000 There's people that go and kidnap 300 girls in school this week because they were going to school. 1.00

00:14:18.000 Those people have to answer to somebody and the only people they would answer to are guys like me or guys that are better than me that are still doing it.

00:14:27.000 And it's a necessary evil.

00:14:29.000 You fight fire with fire.

00:14:31.000 You fight evil with just a more violent, better version of evil.

00:14:35.000 And that's a crazy way to look at the world.

00:14:38.000 But in a lot of respects, there's no other options.

00:14:42.000 In some situations, there are no other options unless you let evil overwhelm an area or evil overwhelm a group of innocent people.

00:14:49.000 There's almost no options.

00:14:51.000 And to deny the existence of evil is... 1.00

00:14:55.000 Completely fucking ridiculous. 0.99

00:14:57.000 Especially if you just look at human history. 1.00

00:15:00.000 Look at human history from recorded times, from the beginning when people started writing things down, people always did awful shit if they could get away with it. 0.94

00:15:07.000 To get away with it, for evil to prevail, all it takes is for Goodman to do nothing, right? 0.96

00:15:12.000 Yes, great quote.

00:15:14.000 You just have to do something, even if it's horrible.

00:15:17.000 How long were you over there for?

00:15:19.000 I was eight years active duty Special Forces and now it's been three years as a National Guardsman in Special Forces.

00:15:28.000 How old are you now?

00:15:30.000 34. So, wow.

00:15:32.000 So you were really young.

00:15:33.000 So you're essentially like, you know, college age.

00:15:36.000 Yeah.

00:15:37.000 I was in grad school when I enlisted.

00:15:40.000 And how old were you then?

00:15:41.000 I was 22. Wow.

00:15:44.000 So you saw what was going on and you just decided that this was calling you.

00:15:51.000 It was a balance.

00:15:52.000 It was like the perfect storm for me to go in.

00:15:55.000 I was...

00:15:57.000 I was kind of—this was before—we'll call it pro.

00:16:00.000 I was a pro MMA fighter, and I had five fights.

00:16:03.000 I was four and one.

00:16:04.000 I just won this ECC 50 big eight-man tournament.

00:16:08.000 Jason Miller, Dennis Kang, myself were all in it, and I was the one that won it.

00:16:12.000 So I had good promise. 0.96

00:16:13.000 I was a douchebag. 1.00

00:16:14.000 I was a little idiot. 1.00

00:16:17.000 In San Luis Obispo, with the mecca of fighting at the time, worrying about what jeans I was going to wear to the next party. 1.00

00:16:26.000 With my next winnings from this fight, I'm going to go buy something stupid. 0.98

00:16:31.000 Did you have jeans that were already ripped? 1.00

00:16:33.000 Oh yeah, absolutely.

00:16:35.000 Yeah.

00:16:37.000 Can I pay way too much for really crappy jeans that looks cool?

00:16:40.000 Anyways, so making a lot of poor decisions and, you know, 9-11 happened and it was just one of those instances that's godsend. 1.00

00:16:48.000 Divine intervention, maybe, where you get this existential perspective of how much of an idiot you are. 1.00

00:16:55.000 And that's what I had. 1.00

00:16:56.000 I was like, God, I am really one of the worst people on the planet.

00:16:59.000 You know, not being a productive contributing member to society in any way, just being a succubus of life.

00:17:06.000 So I walked down after 9-11 to the recruiter's office and I wish I could just knock on the door but that wasn't the issue.

00:17:13.000 The issue was that there was like a thousand other dudes lying ahead of me that all wanted to do the same thing.

00:17:17.000 Just to give you a testament about how amazing the backbone of our country still is.

00:17:22.000 What was that feeling like when you showed up and you see a thousand other people that are...

00:17:26.000 Wrapping around the supermarket.

00:17:28.000 That have the same mentality.

00:17:31.000 Humbling. 1.00

00:17:32.000 Again, I'm still a little fucktard. 0.99

00:17:36.000 I was thinking, I'm going to go enlist. 0.98

00:17:39.000 When I get down there, I was like, man, I should have been here like five hours ago.

00:17:46.000 It was cool.

00:17:49.000 It was amazing.

00:17:50.000 It was humbling is what it was to see all these dudes ahead of you.

00:17:53.000 That, um, their instant reaction, you know, it wasn't a little retrospective perspective of like what you're doing in your life. 0.99

00:18:00.000 It was like, fuck this. 0.99

00:18:02.000 Those dudes just flew planes into our buildings. 1.00

00:18:04.000 I'm going, you know, that's, that's what they were where I was a little bit late.

00:18:08.000 So I think just the response is humbling.

00:18:11.000 Yeah, it's very tricky because the people that flew the planes are already dead, right? 0.57

00:18:15.000 But the idea that there's a faction of the world that's planning things along these lines and it's willing to go to such extreme lengths When you see shit like that happen in the world and you see it from a perspective of an outsider versus seeing it from a perspective of someone who's actually there and in the military,

00:18:37.000 what is the difference?

00:18:38.000 What is the feeling like?

00:18:40.000 Once you became active duty, once you're there, what is the difference in your perspective?

00:18:48.000 You know, at 9-11, I think everybody remembers exactly where they were.

00:18:51.000 You know, I'm no different.

00:18:52.000 I remember the exact place that I was and exactly what I was doing.

00:18:57.000 You know, and I remember my response being anger.

00:19:00.000 You know, like, I wanted to lash out in revenge.

00:19:05.000 I don't have that in...

00:19:06.000 That's not in me anymore.

00:19:07.000 You know, I never respond that way anymore.

00:19:09.000 When I see things happen...

00:19:11.000 I almost have this cold, calculated response.

00:19:15.000 I hear about something happening, and I don't want to go over with a baseball bat and smash a bunch of dudes' heads in like I did 12 years ago.

00:19:24.000 Now it's like when Bin Laden was killed. 1.00

00:19:29.000 I spent some prime years of my life in mountains of Afghanistan and Pakistan looking for that idiot. 0.99

00:19:35.000 And then Navy SEALs go in and get him, and I was like, dang it, I missed it. 0.99

00:19:40.000 You know, I was kind of sad.

00:19:41.000 I wasn't mad.

00:19:42.000 I wasn't angry.

00:19:42.000 I didn't want to be there.

00:19:43.000 I didn't want to shoot him myself, but I was like, oh, man.

00:19:46.000 You didn't want to shoot him yourself?

00:19:48.000 Not that I would love to have shot him myself, but I wasn't mad that I didn't get to, which was like my response, you know, 11, 12 years ago.

00:19:57.000 Just calculated, like, ah.

00:20:00.000 That whole event was one of the biggest, like, what do you think really happened conspiracies online.

00:20:07.000 When they didn't show the body and they threw it in the ocean and the whole idea that he was going to be a martyr, like, that was so perplexing to me.

00:20:15.000 The whole thing was so completely perplexing to me.

00:20:17.000 Like, why wouldn't you just show his body?

00:20:20.000 Like, can't we take a look?

00:20:22.000 The whole world wants to see the bad guy.

00:20:24.000 Yeah.

00:20:25.000 Historically, through the course of this war, we've done it on numerous instances, whether it's Saddam hanging or Zarqawi in his blown up body.

00:20:35.000 Some I was involved with, some I wasn't.

00:20:37.000 It's been very clear, the response by the fanatic side when they see the body.

00:20:45.000 Maybe that person becomes a martyr and then he's idolized for years.

00:20:50.000 Or maybe it just incites an immediate riot. 0.99

00:20:54.000 So, yeah, it sucks. 0.75

00:20:56.000 We want to have that justice feeling of, like, the conclusion, you know, like, the finality of, like, ah, there's bin Laden. 0.98

00:21:02.000 He's dead.

00:21:03.000 Look at that pointy beard of his.

00:21:05.000 That's definitely him.

00:21:06.000 All right, we can sleep at night.

00:21:07.000 You know, the boogeyman bin Laden's not under the bed.

00:21:10.000 But had they done that, the repercussions would have been so much more severe with riots and possibly, you know, a longstanding martyrdom.

00:21:18.000 So, I don't know.

00:21:19.000 Yeah, I know what you're saying.

00:21:20.000 Shades of gray, like you said. 1.00

00:21:22.000 It sucks. 0.99

00:21:23.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:21:23.000 Yeah, I'm selfish. 0.99

00:21:25.000 I want to see the dead body.

00:21:27.000 And plus, I don't totally believe everything they say.

00:21:31.000 So, you know, when you talk to high-ranking military guys that say, that guy's been dead forever.

00:21:36.000 He's been dead a long time ago.

00:21:37.000 That was another part of the conspiracy.

00:21:39.000 Guys that were, you know, in the know were saying, I think that guy was dead already.

00:21:44.000 There's no way that he's still alive, because we've probably killed him like 10 times now.

00:21:50.000 So whether this was the final version of him or the 10th, it's irrelevant.

00:21:54.000 All versions of Bin Laden are dead.

00:21:56.000 Yeah, he's not Jason.

00:21:57.000 He's not going to pop up out of the ocean.

00:21:59.000 The 11th time.

00:22:00.000 Yeah, swim to shore. 1.00

00:22:02.000 I tricked you, bitch. 1.00

00:22:03.000 I'm going to start from scratch. 1.00

00:22:05.000 The idea is terrifying to us.

00:22:08.000 Fanatical religious fundamentalists that are willing to die is terrifying for a good reason. 1.00

00:22:14.000 It's one of the worst aspects of human beings is that we can talk people into believing in some completely ridiculous shit and talk them into believing in so much so that they're willing to kill themselves. 0.99

00:22:24.000 The other problem with human beings is that Once a guy gets that far, once a human, man, woman, whatever, is that far gone, how do you bring him back? 0.98

00:22:34.000 You don't.

00:22:35.000 I have a friend who has adopted a child.

00:22:38.000 And the kid was, I think she was probably three when they adopted her.

00:22:44.000 And she's about six now.

00:22:46.000 And the poor kid's a mess.

00:22:47.000 You know, and they're really worried.

00:22:49.000 They don't know what to do.

00:22:50.000 She experienced a lot of abuse before they ever got to her.

00:22:53.000 And now she's six years old and they're just trying to wrangle her and educate her and give her love. 0.97

00:22:58.000 But they're like, God damn, if we just got there sooner. 0.98

00:23:02.000 That's their idea. 0.98

00:23:02.000 You're talking about three years old. 0.98

00:23:05.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:23:05.000 You know, get some guy who's fucking 30 and he's a la Wakba all day, you know, bowing and ready to be a martyr. 0.99

00:23:15.000 It's fucking impossible to change the course of that sort of ideology. 0.99

00:23:21.000 Yeah. 0.98

00:23:23.000 I have no idea how.

00:23:24.000 You're smart.

00:23:25.000 Ecstasy, mushrooms, isolation, reprogramming, you know, some of that.

00:23:32.000 My solution was way easier.

00:23:34.000 Yeah.

00:23:34.000 But I had infinitely more repercussions.

00:23:38.000 Yeah, well, you know what?

00:23:39.000 We're all gonna live, we're all gonna die, and you gotta pull weeds out of a garden sometimes.

00:23:45.000 That's just the reality of the situation.

00:23:48.000 The idea of equating a human being like a weed is pretty gross, but it's just a bad analogy.

00:23:54.000 We're not all flowers.

00:23:56.000 I don't think you're a flower.

00:23:58.000 No, I don't think I'm a flower.

00:23:59.000 I'm a vegetable.

00:24:01.000 Some sort of a...

00:24:02.000 I'm an artichoke.

00:24:04.000 I have layers.

00:24:04.000 Artichokes are great.

00:24:06.000 I love artichokes.

00:24:07.000 I'm like a pineapple.

00:24:08.000 I'm rough on the outside, but inside I'm delicious.

00:24:10.000 But the core is really hard as well.

00:24:13.000 Yes.

00:24:14.000 There's elements to you.

00:24:16.000 Deep inside, I'm very fibrous.

00:24:18.000 That's a good metaphor.

00:24:19.000 I like it.

00:24:21.000 So, you were over there, and you continued your mixed martial arts training while you were over there as well?

00:24:28.000 Yeah, Special Forces as a whole, like, there's the...

00:24:33.000 Expectation that all of us are just good fighters.

00:24:35.000 Like, we're just born badasses.

00:24:38.000 Obviously, this is not the case, right?

00:24:40.000 Nobody is.

00:24:41.000 So, we train.

00:24:43.000 You know, we shoot all day long, and morning and night, we fight.

00:24:46.000 You know, usually PT is some form of jiu-jitsu, boxing, wrestling, kickboxing, hand-to-hand combat, small arms.

00:24:53.000 And then evening is more recreational, you know, after you get back from the range.

00:24:57.000 So, you get up, you work out.

00:24:59.000 Then you go to the range and shoot for three, four hours, go back, clean the guns, and then your evening is usually on the mat.

00:25:05.000 That's Monday through Thursday.

00:25:07.000 Fridays, you're trying to fix whatever you broke during the week.

00:25:10.000 That's the week.

00:25:11.000 So do you guys, when they set up training for you, whether it's physical martial arts training or fitness training, is there instructors who set a program for you?

00:25:23.000 How does it work?

00:25:26.000 So, sometimes you bring in experts.

00:25:28.000 You know, Hoist Gracie came, you know, and trained us countless times. 0.53

00:25:33.000 You know, Greg Jackson comes out still.

00:25:36.000 You know, guys like Greg Thompson, you know, he's a Hoist Black Belt.

00:25:42.000 He's there permanently.

00:25:43.000 So, there's permanent fixtures at the Special Forces installations that train guys on a daily basis, and they have relationships to bring in experts.

00:25:52.000 Obviously, What you do in a house once you blow a door in when you're going inside on a kill-capture mission is different than you're going to do in the cage.

00:26:00.000 So it has to be guys that can adapt whatever they're teaching or know what their limitations are.

00:26:05.000 Greg Jackson doesn't go in there and try to teach knife fighting.

00:26:09.000 He knows what his left and right limits are, but he's one of the best, so he comes in and gives the best instruction that he can to try to provide tools for guys to be better at what they do.

00:26:19.000 You train a lot down there in Albuquerque.

00:26:21.000 I do, yeah.

00:26:21.000 He's a fascinating guy.

00:26:22.000 He is a cool cat.

00:26:24.000 He's a one-of-a-kind.

00:26:25.000 Very unique dude.

00:26:26.000 Like, really humble.

00:26:28.000 Like, really humble.

00:26:29.000 Like, there's a lot of people that pretend to be humble, but if you...

00:26:32.000 To a fault. 0.99

00:26:33.000 You pick away at them, and you find some bullshit that's just putting on a little humble mask. 0.99

00:26:36.000 No, he's humble to a fault. 0.99

00:26:37.000 To a fault?

00:26:38.000 Yeah.

00:26:38.000 How so?

00:26:40.000 Um...

00:26:40.000 He and Winklejohn both, I say humble to a fault, where they have...

00:26:48.000 They have all these things to give.

00:26:50.000 They're the best that there has ever been on coaching staff.

00:26:53.000 They've trained more champions.

00:26:55.000 They have the best stable of fighters on the planet, arguably.

00:26:59.000 And they're still training guys.

00:27:03.000 It's not by design.

00:27:04.000 This is just out of almost necessity.

00:27:07.000 This scary staff...

00:27:10.000 No, it's not even scary.

00:27:11.000 I don't know.

00:27:12.000 Out of a barn.

00:27:13.000 Barn, warehouse, industrial, commercial...

00:27:18.000 Ghetto building, where I can walk out the door and score some meth as fast as I can come inside and get around with Jon Jones.

00:27:24.000 Those are my options.

00:27:25.000 Front door parking lot, get some meth, come in.

00:27:29.000 Is that bad a neighborhood?

00:27:30.000 Oh yeah, absolutely.

00:27:31.000 Really?

00:27:32.000 Yeah.

00:27:32.000 All you ever see is the outside, you know?

00:27:34.000 Yeah, no, no, no.

00:27:35.000 Jackson Winklejohn, like, oh yeah.

00:27:37.000 Driving down Central, it's like, you can count anywhere from four to eight transvestites any given morning.

00:27:42.000 Nice variety.

00:27:44.000 No, yeah.

00:27:44.000 Yeah.

00:27:45.000 There's a famous one named Grace. 1.00

00:27:47.000 She's this beautiful black girl that wears this huge wig and she's like four or five inches taller than I am and probably 50 pounds bigger than I am. 1.00

00:27:54.000 Whoa.

00:27:55.000 Yeah.

00:27:56.000 But it's, you know, he...

00:27:58.000 Bring her in. 1.00

00:27:59.000 I know.

00:27:59.000 She's amazing.

00:28:01.000 She's scary.

00:28:03.000 Bring her in. 1.00

00:28:04.000 And every corner is like, oh, there's that drug dealer, there's this drug dealer, and then you're like...

00:28:08.000 Wait, is that the guy from Breaking Bad?

00:28:10.000 No.

00:28:11.000 Maybe it is.

00:28:11.000 Is he really selling meth?

00:28:13.000 And then the irony is there.

00:28:14.000 No, that is not the guy from Breaking Bad, but he's really selling meth and he's dressed like the guy from Breaking Bad.

00:28:18.000 Wow.

00:28:19.000 Yeah, that is what it's like there.

00:28:21.000 Albuquerque's a weird spot.

00:28:22.000 It is.

00:28:23.000 It's kooky.

00:28:23.000 Why do they stay?

00:28:24.000 It's just because the gym's there and good stable of tough guys there.

00:28:29.000 I mean, I would love it if Mike Winkerjohn and Greg Jackson, you know, let's say we're in Austin, Texas, you know, or LA or, you know, San Luis Obispo, but they're in Albuquerque, New Mexico.

00:28:41.000 So that's where I go.

00:28:42.000 If they're in Idaho, that's where I would go, but that's where they are. 0.58

00:28:45.000 You train in Austin during your time in between fights.

00:28:47.000 Yes.

00:28:48.000 How do you plan out?

00:28:51.000 How many weeks do you give yourself when you go to Albuquerque?

00:28:55.000 I get six weeks.

00:28:56.000 Six good weeks in Albuquerque.

00:28:58.000 So, you know, hopefully you'll get ten week heads up to your fight.

00:29:05.000 So then I have four weeks to start doing pre-fight camp development, like strength, speed, you know, explosion.

00:29:12.000 Type physical stuff, working on specific techniques, and then move to Albuquerque for the six weeks for the final fight camp.

00:29:20.000 You trained at a great spot in Austin, too.

00:29:22.000 I was down there really recently, and I met the owner of that facility.

00:29:26.000 What's that guy's name?

00:29:27.000 Donald Parks and Paulio Brandau.

00:29:29.000 Yeah.

00:29:29.000 Great facility.

00:29:31.000 Amazing.

00:29:31.000 Yeah, really nice guys too.

00:29:33.000 Yep.

00:29:33.000 And so you do just all your most in-between fight preparation there.

00:29:38.000 Good group of fighters out there as well.

00:29:40.000 Yep.

00:29:41.000 Eastside Austin Elite.

00:29:42.000 Justin Lake was my strength and conditioning coach.

00:29:44.000 He's like my brother on a whole bunch of different levels.

00:29:46.000 He married my wife's sister.

00:29:51.000 We used to go to college together.

00:29:52.000 We used to hang out with the same girls together.

00:29:56.000 Yeah.

00:29:57.000 And then we enlisted together, he went to Special Forces, went to 7th Group together, went to Afghanistan together, and then he married my sister-in-law.

00:30:03.000 He might be stalking you.

00:30:04.000 Yeah, no.

00:30:06.000 I hope not, because he's like 200 pounds, snatches 250 pounds, deadlifts 500 pounds.

00:30:12.000 It would be a bad thing if he was stalking me.

00:30:15.000 Is he fighting?

00:30:16.000 Does he do MMA? No.

00:30:18.000 Just trains?

00:30:18.000 Just trains.

00:30:20.000 Yeah, there's a lot of those dudes that are scary that just train.

00:30:24.000 Please don't ever get mad at me and tear my limbs off and beat me to them.

00:30:28.000 How did you get hooked up with Jackson and Winklejohn?

00:30:32.000 When I lost the Strikeforce title to Jacare, it was a really close fight.

00:30:38.000 Very close fight.

00:30:38.000 I thought you won.

00:30:39.000 I thought I did too, but it was close and there were just like small adjustments I needed to make and adjustments that I wasn't making on my own.

00:30:48.000 I needed...

00:30:54.000 Yeah, Jackson's an interesting guy in that he didn't have any professional MMA fights, but he's a virtuoso.

00:31:07.000 I mean, he really is.

00:31:07.000 I've had long conversations with him about strategy.

00:31:10.000 Weird shit about music, about how he listens to symphonies and compares the rhythm of symphonies to the changing rhythm of a fight. 0.98

00:31:23.000 He looks at everything as strategy. 0.99

00:31:25.000 Whether it's like he's playing Lemmings, like the old school Lemmings.

00:31:29.000 What is that?

00:31:29.000 I don't even know what that is.

00:31:30.000 Oh, it's a video game where you move Lemmings to certain portions of the map to try to achieve some stupid engineering goal. 0.79

00:31:37.000 It's a very archaic 16-bit game from almost Commodore 64 type things.

00:31:44.000 He still plays stat.

00:31:45.000 Not often, but he's like, you know, everything has strategy.

00:31:48.000 Whether it's chess or backgammon, or if he's playing Monopoly with a family.

00:31:55.000 It's like, everything's about strategy.

00:31:57.000 He had a conversation with my friend Ari.

00:31:59.000 My friend Ari Shafir has a podcast called Skeptic Tank.

00:32:02.000 And Ari's a really smart dude. 0.98

00:32:04.000 And him and Greg Jackson, Greg was his guest.

00:32:07.000 And Greg was picking his brain about the comparisons.

00:32:10.000 He was trying to figure out how one crafts a piece of comedy and tries to attack an audience with it.

00:32:17.000 Like how you get an idea past the boundaries of someone's consciousness.

00:32:22.000 Can that be adaptive?

00:32:23.000 Yeah.

00:32:24.000 When you're talking to this audience, you already have kind of the...

00:32:27.000 The template of what you're trying to get to them.

00:32:29.000 But then their responsiveness, can it change?

00:32:32.000 I envision that is exactly something that Greg would do.

00:32:35.000 Yeah.

00:32:36.000 It's fascinating to listen to his mind because I don't know anybody like him.

00:32:41.000 It's a very unique sort of a mindset.

00:32:43.000 And then Winklejohn, who's a great striking coach, was a great kickboxer himself.

00:32:48.000 He's an interesting guy too.

00:32:50.000 Yeah, he's like the yin to the yang with Greg.

00:32:53.000 He's a linear thinker.

00:32:55.000 He's...

00:32:57.000 He knows what, like where Greg wants you to paint the best version of yourself.

00:33:04.000 Winklejohn doesn't have that kind of responsive approach to you.

00:33:09.000 He knows what you need to do to be better.

00:33:11.000 You know, and he says, this is what you should do to be better.

00:33:14.000 And this is what we're going to drill it relentlessly until you are.

00:33:16.000 You know, Greg's like, alright, I want to see you develop this.

00:33:20.000 Let me give you some tools so you can implement this in your fighting style and it's going to be adaptive to every single different athlete that he has.

00:33:27.000 Where Winklejohn's like, no, this is what you need to do and this is how we're going to do it.

00:33:30.000 You're like, yes sir, please don't hurt me.

00:33:33.000 What eye do I look at?

00:33:34.000 What eye do I look at?

00:33:35.000 For folks who don't know, he lost an eye in training.

00:33:39.000 Someone, they threw a kick and the toenail missed the pad and caught his eyeball, which is the first I've ever heard of that happening, ever.

00:33:48.000 I've heard of guys getting scratched badly in training from sparring, but never from holding pads.

00:33:54.000 He wears safety glasses every time he holds now.

00:33:57.000 He has one eye.

00:33:59.000 Can you see anything out of that other eye?

00:34:00.000 No, definitely not.

00:34:01.000 Wow.

00:34:02.000 No, the eye like poured out of his face. 1.00

00:34:05.000 Fuck. 1.00

00:34:05.000 I was like, that was my eye. 1.00

00:34:07.000 Fuck. 1.00

00:34:08.000 Trim your toenails, bitches. 1.00

00:34:10.000 Seriously. 1.00

00:34:11.000 Dude, I get on the mat, fingernails and toenails and hygiene, like, no, I'm not rolling with you.

00:34:16.000 Go clean yourself and trim that stuff.

00:34:18.000 Yeah, I got one of the nastiest infections once from a guy peeling my hooks off, and he had these giant fingernails.

00:34:25.000 I brought it out to the class.

00:34:28.000 I'm like, come here, folks.

00:34:28.000 Look at this.

00:34:29.000 You can't have this.

00:34:31.000 That's good to go. 1.00

00:34:32.000 You're going to fuck everybody. 1.00

00:34:33.000 It's not going to make you a better fighter. 1.00

00:34:35.000 You can't have this.

00:34:36.000 I have toenail clippers in my jujitsu bag.

00:34:38.000 Yeah, me too.

00:34:39.000 It's like gi, belt, headgear, mouthpiece, toenail clippers. 0.99

00:34:42.000 And file them bitches, too. 1.00

00:34:44.000 Cut them, and then there's rough edges. 1.00

00:34:46.000 File those bitches down. 1.00

00:34:47.000 Yeah, when you see guys about to go into the cage, and Herb Dean would look at their nails, and they bite them. 0.99

00:34:52.000 I'm like, no!

00:34:54.000 This is not the time for that.

00:34:56.000 You don't bite them down now.

00:34:58.000 You should have done that already.

00:34:59.000 Then you come home, and your wife's like, why do you have scratches all over you? 1.00

00:35:03.000 You're like, I fight for a living.

00:35:04.000 Why do you think I have scratches on me?

00:35:07.000 You know?

00:35:08.000 Golly!

00:35:09.000 Yeah, that's hilarious.

00:35:10.000 Why are they on your back? 0.99

00:35:11.000 Because someone was fucking scratching my back! 0.99

00:35:14.000 I didn't want them to! 0.99

00:35:17.000 The moan scratches.

00:35:19.000 Oh, Tim.

00:35:21.000 Oh, more.

00:35:23.000 More.

00:35:25.000 Yeah, not good. 0.99

00:35:27.000 Is there a solution for fucking eye pokes? 0.99

00:35:29.000 Yeah, we change the gloves. 0.99

00:35:31.000 What should be done?

00:35:32.000 Heaven forbid we ever say that anything was done better in Pride.

00:35:35.000 Yeah.

00:35:36.000 Their gloves are better.

00:35:37.000 They're better, right?

00:35:38.000 They're better.

00:35:38.000 They're curved more?

00:35:39.000 They're curved.

00:35:40.000 How many guys right now do you see with broken hands?

00:35:42.000 A lot.

00:35:43.000 It's like tons of them.

00:35:44.000 So we have this padding on the...

00:35:47.000 Two-thirds of our hands, right?

00:35:48.000 Well, that's not where we break our hands.

00:35:50.000 We break our hands in metal carpels in the back of the wrist, or just above the wrist, the bottom of your hand.

00:35:55.000 Pride gloves had padding there, which provided support.

00:35:58.000 So it's a lot harder to break your hands.

00:36:01.000 Also, the padding was curved.

00:36:03.000 So you actually had to straighten your...

00:36:05.000 I'm a grappler, obviously.

00:36:07.000 I like to grapple.

00:36:08.000 So as a grappler, I could complain that I want to have the total...

00:36:13.000 Use of my extremities.

00:36:15.000 Right.

00:36:16.000 No gloves would be better for most grapplers.

00:36:18.000 Yeah.

00:36:18.000 Absolutely.

00:36:19.000 You could slide things in better.

00:36:21.000 With that said, I don't want to get poked in the eye.

00:36:23.000 Yeah.

00:36:23.000 So, the pride gloves.

00:36:25.000 That's how we make them better.

00:36:26.000 Yeah.

00:36:26.000 We own pride.

00:36:28.000 The UFC owns pride.

00:36:28.000 Just take their gloves and just take the word pride off of it and then put those three letters on there.

00:36:33.000 Bam! 0.98

00:36:33.000 Yeah, they brought over some new glove, and they're like, here's the new glove. 0.98

00:36:37.000 And I put it on, and I was like, what the fuck is the difference?

00:36:39.000 It's just slightly curved. 0.99

00:36:41.000 Like, these bitches should be, like, really curved. 1.00

00:36:44.000 Like, whereas, if you want to do that, it's an effort. 0.98

00:36:47.000 And when you relax, it goes right back to that.

00:36:49.000 But the effort is for 15 to 25 minutes.

00:36:51.000 Yeah.

00:36:52.000 Like, I'm sure my hand is strong enough to go like that when I need it to.

00:36:55.000 Yeah.

00:36:55.000 For 15 to 25 minutes.

00:36:56.000 Well, I mean, as long as you can do it in certain situations.

00:36:59.000 Like, you know, you're trying to apply a choke or something, but... 0.99

00:37:03.000 It's very disheartening to me, all the people that are having detached retinas and Alan Belcher's eyes are fucked up. 0.99

00:37:10.000 Bisping, yeah. 1.00

00:37:12.000 Bisping's eyes are all fucked up. 1.00

00:37:12.000 I can't look at him in the eye. 1.00

00:37:13.000 I was just like...

00:37:15.000 Well, he's got oil in his eye.

00:37:16.000 They inject oil in his eye, right?

00:37:18.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:37:19.000 I don't know what he can see out of it or what it looks like.

00:37:22.000 I mean, I guess it's diminished in some respect.

00:37:24.000 It has to be. 0.97

00:37:25.000 Yeah, it's so fucking weird. 0.87

00:37:27.000 And he's had a couple eye surgeries, right? 0.95

00:37:28.000 Bisping's had more than one eye surgery. 0.99

00:37:30.000 It's fucking crazy, man. 1.00

00:37:32.000 It's crazy. 1.00

00:37:32.000 I like my eyes. 1.00

00:37:32.000 I don't want them. 1.00

00:37:33.000 Yeah.

00:37:34.000 I need them.

00:37:34.000 Is it possible to do something where the fingers aren't exposed?

00:37:38.000 Or you chop them off?

00:37:39.000 No, no, no.

00:37:40.000 I'm talking about a covering.

00:37:42.000 What I was thinking of was a lambskin sort of a covering.

00:37:46.000 Something that's not thick, but maybe a band around the tips where you don't really do this ever anyway.

00:37:53.000 I do.

00:37:54.000 Do you?

00:37:55.000 Yeah.

00:37:55.000 When do you do that?

00:37:56.000 Body lock takedown stuff.

00:37:57.000 You grab like this?

00:37:58.000 No.

00:37:59.000 No, but you do this.

00:38:00.000 You still have this or this.

00:38:01.000 But wouldn't you still have that?

00:38:02.000 I don't know.

00:38:03.000 I mean, you mostly do this, right?

00:38:04.000 Let's design it.

00:38:05.000 Okay, well, I'm saying, for folks who are listening, there's a thing called a gable grip.

00:38:09.000 And the way a gable grip works is...

00:38:12.000 Picture your hand if you're going to karate chop someone and your thumb was pressed tight against the side of your hand.

00:38:17.000 Then have your hands in a cross position, where one's sideways and one is sitting straight up.

00:38:25.000 And then crush down with your hands, with your fingertips.

00:38:29.000 That would be what a gable grip is like.

00:38:30.000 And that is the majority of wrestling, of grabbing, when you cinch around the waist, that's most of the way you grab.

00:38:37.000 The other way would be an S-grip, which is you would, you know, make like a hook.

00:38:42.000 69 of your fingers.

00:38:43.000 Yeah, 69. That's a yin and yang if you're more uncouth or couth.

00:38:47.000 And you grab like that, but you never, very rarely do you do this.

00:38:51.000 Very rarely do you let your fingers intersect with each other.

00:38:54.000 So they don't have to be free like that.

00:38:58.000 And when they're free, that's when fingers go in eyeballs, you know?

00:39:02.000 I thought maybe like maybe there could be some sort of a flexible rounded covering which would eliminate pokes. 0.99

00:39:09.000 Seems like they've had to have tried it, you know.

00:39:11.000 I don't think they have.

00:39:12.000 Well, let's give it a whirl. 0.69

00:39:14.000 It's amazing to me how things just stay stagnant when they're retarded. 1.00

00:39:18.000 Like when they don't make any sense like the 12 to 6 elbow.

00:39:23.000 God, I love those.

00:39:24.000 Why can't we do those?

00:39:24.000 They should be in.

00:39:25.000 Knees to the head on the ground. 0.99

00:39:27.000 Were you telling me you can kick someone in the head with your shin? 0.88

00:39:32.000 But you can't drop an elbow down your head.

00:39:34.000 Someone has never been kicked in the head with a shin.

00:39:37.000 Obviously.

00:39:37.000 That's the only reason why you would make that rule.

00:39:39.000 Can't we thank John McCain for this one?

00:39:41.000 Wasn't it that era?

00:39:42.000 It was that era.

00:39:43.000 According to John McCarthy, who was there when it was all going on, John McCarthy, famous referee, the gold standard.

00:39:49.000 Love that guy.

00:39:50.000 Great guy.

00:39:51.000 Big John told me that they were having this meeting with the Athletic Commission, and they had seen karate-breaking demonstrations on ESPN at 2 o'clock in the morning.

00:40:01.000 Hi-ya! 0.96

00:40:02.000 And the boards shatter and everything.

00:40:04.000 Well, they said you can't do that move because that move could kill someone.

00:40:09.000 Yeah, if you can break bricks, you can obviously break somebody's neck.

00:40:12.000 Exactly. 0.97

00:40:12.000 And just blow their scalp. 0.97

00:40:14.000 So that is the real reason why the 12 to 6 elbow is illegal.

00:40:19.000 But arguably, this elbow is stronger.

00:40:23.000 Definitely.

00:40:23.000 It's got more torque to it.

00:40:25.000 It's a more natural movement of the body.

00:40:27.000 This is an awkward movement in comparison.

00:40:29.000 Yeah, but I mean the...

00:40:31.000 Do you remember Cobra Kai?

00:40:32.000 Yes.

00:40:32.000 I mean, Daniel's son watched those guys breaking boards.

00:40:35.000 Yeah, it's tough to argue with that kind of logic. 0.83

00:40:38.000 But that is the logic that literally is complete pure ignorance.

00:40:41.000 If you asked mixed martial arts competitors, trainers, fighters, people in the know, and asked them what should be illegal.

00:40:49.000 The 12-6 elbow is not going to be on that list.

00:40:52.000 Nowhere near.

00:40:52.000 It's a fine technique.

00:40:54.000 It's a good technique.

00:40:55.000 It's excellent.

00:40:56.000 As are knees on the ground.

00:40:57.000 I think knees on the ground...

00:40:59.000 It could be...

00:41:00.000 If someone wanted to have some sort of a compromise, maybe it would be knees on the ground when you're not pressed up against the cage.

00:41:08.000 That could be a possibility.

00:41:10.000 The idea being that...

00:41:12.000 The knees to the head on the ground would be problematic against the cage because a guy couldn't move.

00:41:16.000 And that was one of the good things about pride was the ropes.

00:41:19.000 If soccer kicks and all those things, you can kind of scoot your head under the ropes to get away from things.

00:41:24.000 You're not contained by your environment to the point where you would suffer a damaging blow that you could have avoided by your own power.

00:41:32.000 Yeah.

00:41:33.000 Outside of like...

00:41:34.000 The north-south, you know, 69 position for knees to the head on the ground.

00:41:37.000 That's the only position I could think, you know, like, obviously the limitation is you still can't strike to the top of the head or the back of the head with a knee.

00:41:44.000 Right.

00:41:44.000 And that, under that premise, then it doesn't really matter where you need somebody from because you can't hurt them any worse than you could in any other way with any other strike from any other position.

00:41:54.000 Right.

00:41:55.000 So...

00:41:56.000 Yeah, and also, I don't like this thing that guys are doing where they drop one hand down to avoid being kneed in the head, and they pick it up and they drop it down.

00:42:03.000 Like, oh, let's gameplay this.

00:42:05.000 Yeah, the gameplay.

00:42:05.000 Oh, I'm down, I'm down, I'm down.

00:42:07.000 Don't need me.

00:42:08.000 Yeah.

00:42:08.000 I'm up.

00:42:09.000 Well, it's very, very weird.

00:42:11.000 It's a weird gray area that I think needs to be sat down.

00:42:15.000 And then, of course, there's the scoring system, which is adopted from boxing, this game.

00:42:20.000 10-point must scoring system, which is just terrible.

00:42:24.000 And the implementation of it is even more terrible because very few 10-8 rounds get scored.

00:42:30.000 Yeah.

00:42:30.000 Rarely.

00:42:31.000 There's 10-9 rounds that are squeakers, right?

00:42:34.000 Like maybe one of your rounds with Jacare might have been a 10-9 round. 0.97

00:42:37.000 And then there's 10-9 rounds where a guy just gets fucking mollywhopped. 0.97

00:42:42.000 Dropped two, three times. 0.97

00:42:44.000 And it's still a 10-9 round.

00:42:45.000 Like, how is that possible?

00:42:47.000 It's a terrible system.

00:42:49.000 And I don't know if you ever saw Doc Hamilton's scoring system?

00:42:52.000 Yeah.

00:42:53.000 He had a half point scoring system, which is much better.

00:42:55.000 Way better.

00:42:56.000 Way better.

00:42:56.000 I would want Doc Hamilton's and to know what the scores are every round.

00:43:01.000 I agree.

00:43:02.000 100%.

00:43:02.000 I agree.

00:43:03.000 Every other fucking game. 1.00

00:43:04.000 Whether it's football, basketball, everything else. 0.99

00:43:06.000 I think it should be that way in boxing, too. 0.99

00:43:08.000 So it would discourage shitty judges from continuing their shittiness. 0.99

00:43:12.000 Yep. 1.00

00:43:13.000 And shitty fighters from continuing their shittiness. 1.00

00:43:16.000 Yes. 1.00

00:43:16.000 You know? 1.00

00:43:17.000 The only real worry would be that a guy would be so far ahead that he would run in the last round.

00:43:22.000 He's up four rounds.

00:43:23.000 John Jones moving into the fifth round against Glover.

00:43:25.000 Right, right, right.

00:43:25.000 You know, he's like, alright, I have this.

00:43:27.000 But a guy like John wouldn't do that anyway.

00:43:29.000 Neither would I, you know?

00:43:30.000 Yeah, the great fighters would still fight the same way.

00:43:33.000 And not only that, the other guy is going to get more desperate, so it'll make it even more exciting because he's going to have to.

00:43:38.000 And if he doesn't, are you not trying to win?

00:43:41.000 You know you're not going to win a decision. 0.93

00:43:43.000 So either you just fucking throw caution to the wind and throw yourself in the line of fire, or why are you fighting? 0.91

00:43:49.000 Move on. 0.98

00:43:50.000 Yeah, move on. 1.00

00:43:51.000 Jon Jones is a fucking phenomenon, man. 0.99

00:43:54.000 That dude, as good as he has looked in the past, the fight against Glover was just sensational. 0.99

00:44:02.000 It was masterful.

00:44:02.000 It was something to behold.

00:44:04.000 I was like...

00:44:05.000 He's amazing in the gym.

00:44:07.000 He's so talented in every respect.

00:44:10.000 I've been doing jiu-jitsu forever.

00:44:12.000 And he's good.

00:44:14.000 He's really, really good.

00:44:15.000 And then stand-up is a whole different world.

00:44:17.000 His wrestling is just out of this world.

00:44:19.000 And then he goes on game day, on fight day, and he's better.

00:44:23.000 He improvises.

00:44:25.000 Dude, it's beautiful. 0.96

00:44:26.000 Yeah, when I asked him about the elbows in tight, like fighting Glover against the cage like that, I knew, I just had a fucking feeling that he was improvising that. 0.61

00:44:36.000 I was like, is this something you planned out? 0.77

00:44:37.000 I was like, no, I just felt it.

00:44:39.000 He was winding up and I just felt like I could get away with that.

00:44:42.000 We were in fight camp at the exact same time.

00:44:44.000 I fought one week before him.

00:44:46.000 And he didn't drill those.

00:44:49.000 We're watching out for Glover's big overhand right, obviously.

00:44:53.000 We're looking for the two three-punch combos that he does in entrances.

00:44:57.000 Watching, of course, for Glover's wrestling.

00:44:59.000 He's a beast on top.

00:45:01.000 And then you watch the fight, and you're like...

00:45:05.000 He didn't do that stuff in fight camp.

00:45:06.000 He just, fight night, started improvising and destroying the still number two dude on the planet so decisively, it's disturbing.

00:45:15.000 He also added a new thing to his game that I think you're going to see a lot of people do.

00:45:19.000 That's that attacking the shoulder with that loose underhook. 0.74

00:45:21.000 When a guy has that relaxed underhook and you yank that arm up, I mean, he fucked Glover's shoulder up in the first round. 0.96

00:45:27.000 He never really recovered. 0.82

00:45:29.000 No, it changed the The whole feeling of what Glover could do offensively from that point forward.

00:45:49.000 He's got to watch the finger pokes though, man.

00:45:51.000 John is always doing that thing where he's extending his hands and, you know, guys trying to move forward, they wind up running into his fingers all the time.

00:45:59.000 I really do believe, I hate finger pokes, knees to the groin when guys get tired, cage grabbing, like...

00:46:08.000 Don't like it at all.

00:46:09.000 So he's a teammate.

00:46:11.000 I really do believe that he doesn't intend to hit them in the eyes.

00:46:14.000 He likes controlling range, and he has that open hand out to try to set that range and responsively counterattack.

00:46:24.000 And just like you said, guys, just run into it.

00:46:26.000 You know, he's not trying to poke him, but it's his fault because his hands open and his fingers are freaking pointing up there.

00:46:31.000 Yeah, I don't think he's doing it intentionally either, but it is an issue.

00:46:34.000 It has to change.

00:46:34.000 It happened with Gustafson.

00:46:36.000 It happened with Glover.

00:46:37.000 You know, it's a very tricky situation because on one hand, it's a good tactic.

00:46:43.000 It's a good tactic to try to palm the forehead. 0.98

00:46:45.000 And, you know, I mean, it's a big one in Muay Thai, but in Muay Thai, of course, you're dealing with a fully enclosed glove.

00:46:50.000 Yeah. 0.97

00:46:51.000 I don't know what the fuck they can do, but they really need to do something. 0.98

00:46:54.000 It needs to be a priority. 0.98

00:46:56.000 Pride gloves.

00:46:57.000 Yeah, there it is.

00:46:58.000 It's one of them.

00:46:58.000 Yeah, man, you watch Pride, and I've been watching a lot of Pride lately, because at home, I... It's awesome.

00:47:04.000 Yeah, it's fucking awesome. 1.00

00:47:05.000 It's just the greatest shit ever. 0.99

00:47:07.000 You know, it's really interesting to watch their evolution of the sport, too, when you watch Pride. 0.99

00:47:11.000 You watch, like, guys, and you compare them to the best guys of today, and you're like, wow, there's been a big fucking jump. 0.89

00:47:17.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:47:17.000 Big fucking jump. 0.99

00:47:18.000 I love Don Frye and his mustache. 1.00

00:47:20.000 Rest in peace mustache.

00:47:22.000 He shaved it off, I heard.

00:47:24.000 That's crazy.

00:47:25.000 But Don Frye in Pride, compared to the light heavyweights now, just the disparity of skill and technical level, even athleticism.

00:47:35.000 And Don was a beast.

00:47:38.000 It's night and day.

00:47:39.000 Well, I was watching Vanderlei, the best of Vanderlei in Pride.

00:47:44.000 There was an episode in The Best of Pride where it was all Vanderlei's fights.

00:47:47.000 And, you know, Vanderlei's one of my favorite fighters to watch.

00:47:49.000 He's a wild man.

00:47:50.000 But, you know, you compare his skill level to, like, a guy like Jon Jones, where they're fighting at the same weight class.

00:47:55.000 You're like, that wouldn't even be a hard fight for Jon.

00:47:58.000 No, that'd be like a round. 0.99

00:47:59.000 Yeah, it would be, you can't touch me, and I'm going to keep hitting you, and you're going to not know what to do, and then either you're going to get choked unconscious or beat the fuck up. 0.99

00:48:09.000 Yeah. 0.79

00:48:09.000 It's amazing how much of a jump there's been from 93 to 2014 as far as the evolution of martial arts. 0.79

00:48:17.000 I say it like it's a line that I keep saying, but it's true. 1.00

00:48:20.000 In those two decades, martial arts have evolved more than they have in the last 2,000 years.

00:48:26.000 It's incredible.

00:48:26.000 Absolutely.

00:48:27.000 It's the longest time, man. 0.81

00:48:29.000 I grew up doing martial arts in the 80s, and nobody knew what the fuck worked. 0.67

00:48:33.000 It was all just guessing. 0.90

00:48:35.000 Everybody knew that if you were a really good wrestler, you could take guys down.

00:48:41.000 And if you were a really good boxer, you could probably punch better.

00:48:43.000 But what would work better?

00:48:45.000 Karate or judo?

00:48:47.000 What would work better?

00:48:48.000 Jiu-jitsu?

00:48:48.000 Nobody knew.

00:48:49.000 Nobody fucking knew. 0.99

00:48:50.000 It was just all guessing. 0.99

00:48:51.000 Guys naming new moves every single card.

00:48:53.000 Like, oh, what are you going to call this one?

00:48:54.000 Like, how can we progress so quickly where every Saturday night we're like, oh, here's a new submission.

00:48:59.000 Yeah.

00:49:00.000 You know, it's just unbelievable.

00:49:01.000 Yeah, the Peruvian necktie, you know, the Tony D'Souza, which you very rarely see.

00:49:06.000 I mean, C.B. Dalloway is probably the only...

00:49:07.000 I think...

00:49:07.000 I don't even know if D'Souza's ever pulled it off inside the octagon, but C.B. Dalloway's pulled it off.

00:49:12.000 There's a few guys that use that Peruvian necktie.

00:49:15.000 And then there's a few chokes that... 1.00

00:49:19.000 You see them once, and then you never see them again.

00:49:22.000 It's a fascinating thing where you're watching all this stuff evolve right in front of your eyes.

00:49:28.000 How do you manage your training when it comes to working on new techniques, adding new things to your arsenal, and then still just the conditioning, the sparring, the day-to-day drilling that you have to do?

00:49:41.000 How do you manage stuffing all that stuff in?

00:49:44.000 Time management, like a good athlete, you know, I do things in like ratios, percentages of, okay, I want to develop or give a certain percentage of time to getting better.

00:49:56.000 So I'm going to, you know, let's say I have 10 classes a week.

00:50:01.000 Just an easy round number.

00:50:03.000 In those 10 classes, you know, like I want...

00:50:06.000 I want two or three of them to be exclusively focused on drilling new techniques.

00:50:11.000 You know, then I want two or three of them to be maintenance of things that I do well and want to continue to do well.

00:50:18.000 And there's just grappling, like in a one-week 10 class setting and then you know two or three of them are hard grappling, rolling, sparring type sessions.

00:50:28.000 You know the other ones like maybe a floater of I'm teaching or I'm working with just you know a handful of black belts trying to create new stuff. 0.99

00:50:36.000 You know so like it's equally proportionate to staying good, challenging myself physically, and developing new technique and learning.

00:50:47.000 What about recovery?

00:50:49.000 Screw that stuff.

00:50:51.000 Recovery. 1.00

00:50:52.000 That's for pussies. 1.00

00:50:53.000 Yeah, it's for the birds. 0.99

00:50:54.000 What do you do?

00:50:54.000 Do you have a routine as far as deep tissue massage, cryotherapy?

00:50:59.000 Yes.

00:51:00.000 What do you do?

00:51:01.000 Yes to both of those.

00:51:02.000 All those?

00:51:02.000 Yeah, so Austin cryotherapy, I'm there.

00:51:04.000 Is that one of those things you stand in one of those chambers and it's 50 below zero or something crazy?

00:51:08.000 Like negative 300. Is that crazy?

00:51:10.000 What happens to your dick when you do that? 1.00

00:51:12.000 That seems to me to be a problem. 1.00

00:51:14.000 So I have gloved fingers and I take those gloved fingers and I cover what is going to be my very small penis in like seconds. 0.97

00:51:21.000 And I make sure I double hand it so both my hands are double insulated. 1.00

00:51:25.000 Does anybody go raw dog and just let their dick freeze? 0.99

00:51:28.000 That would be a... 0.99

00:51:29.000 Because if you found out that guy did it, you'd probably have to do it too, wouldn't you?

00:51:33.000 No.

00:51:33.000 I would assume that you would be one of those guys who'd be like, alright.

00:51:36.000 I am that dumb. 1.00

00:51:38.000 It's true. 1.00

00:51:39.000 Like, I am so stupid, I'm gonna... 1.00

00:51:40.000 Did you really? 1.00

00:51:41.000 Are you messing with me? 1.00

00:51:42.000 Fuck it. 1.00

00:51:42.000 Fuck! 1.00

00:51:43.000 I'm gonna do it. 1.00

00:51:44.000 Yeah.

00:51:44.000 Just do it in a monk position.

00:51:48.000 You're only in there for like three minutes.

00:51:50.000 Right.

00:51:51.000 And then you get out, huge infusion of blood, you feel better.

00:51:55.000 Eddie Bravo did this in preparation for his Hoyler match, which is the first time I'd heard about it.

00:52:00.000 Explain it to me and for the lay people at home.

00:52:03.000 Your neck is above, right?

00:52:05.000 Your head is exposed.

00:52:06.000 Yeah.

00:52:06.000 So it closes on you like a sun tanning bed.

00:52:09.000 Exactly, but you're standing up.

00:52:11.000 They punch liquid nitrogen gas in there, so up to about your chin, down to like negative 300 degrees.

00:52:18.000 So you're breathing, the gas is coming up to your chin, and the largest organ in your body is your skin.

00:52:23.000 So it's very responsive.

00:52:25.000 It can absorb quickly.

00:52:27.000 People take drugs that way.

00:52:30.000 It's very responsive.

00:52:33.000 So it gets exposed to negative 300 degrees.

00:52:36.000 The first thing it does is take blood from the extremities and rushes it to the vital life-sustaining organs of your body, your brain, your heart, and your lungs.

00:52:46.000 So, all the blood goes from your extremities to your core, and then you're there for like 2-3 minutes, and it's super crazy, because if you have an injury like a hurt knee or a hurt hand, where you have extra fluid there, it gets super cold there, because you have more fluid there,

00:53:01.000 and more fluid is conductive, and it gets colder faster.

00:53:04.000 So you can feel these injuries on your body get crazy cold.

00:53:08.000 And then you hop out, three minutes up, you get out of the chamber, and then your body responds to being in 80 degrees.

00:53:15.000 And all the blood rushes back out to the extremities.

00:53:19.000 So you get this huge infusion of good, healthy blood back out to these injuries and back out to your extremities.

00:53:26.000 It's a rush.

00:53:26.000 It feels like you just drank like five cups of coffee and you're like amped.

00:53:30.000 It's just this weird, tingly, fantastic sensation.

00:53:35.000 So, that's what happens.

00:53:36.000 And how does it help you recover by doing that?

00:53:38.000 Infusion.

00:53:39.000 Circulation.

00:53:39.000 Like, in the...

00:53:43.000 Trying to treat an injury, you know, you have, you have rest, ice, compression, elevation, you know, when, when you're trying to work on recovery without injury, you want circulation.

00:53:52.000 So you want good, healthy blood going to muscles that you've just fatigued to increase recovery and response time.

00:53:59.000 So like if you just like simple terms, if I went and did like a big squat and deadlift workout for the day, right?

00:54:06.000 My legs and back and butt are going to be sore.

00:54:09.000 Um, You know, those extremities, it's vascular region.

00:54:13.000 So go hop in the cryo chamber. 0.53

00:54:15.000 All the blood that's sitting there In that area, in my legs, in my back, in my butt, all rush to my brain and lungs and heart. 0.82

00:54:24.000 Then I get out and all sorts of great new fantastic blood goes back to my legs, back and butt.

00:54:30.000 So I get a great huge infusion of good healthy blood back out to my extremities to increase recovery time because I'm just increasing circulation.

00:54:38.000 Increasing circulation is increasing recovery. 0.99

00:54:40.000 Wow, that's fascinating shit, man. 0.97

00:54:43.000 It's fascinating when you see all these new innovations when it comes to strength and conditioning and recovery and fitness. 0.99

00:54:50.000 That's a unique one, man.

00:54:52.000 That's interesting stuff.

00:54:53.000 It's cold, though.

00:54:54.000 Yeah.

00:54:55.000 How many days a week do you do that?

00:54:56.000 Four.

00:54:57.000 Wow.

00:54:58.000 And they have a place like that in Albuquerque?

00:55:00.000 No, they don't.

00:55:01.000 They have a trailer that sometimes they'll bring out to me in fight camps.

00:55:06.000 That has that in it?

00:55:08.000 Yeah.

00:55:09.000 Oh, that's nice.

00:55:10.000 That is super nice.

00:55:11.000 Wow.

00:55:11.000 So Albuquerque doesn't have that?

00:55:13.000 Nope. 1.00

00:55:13.000 Greg Jackson, get on the ball, bitch. 1.00

00:55:15.000 I know. 1.00

00:55:15.000 Come on. 1.00

00:55:16.000 You should have that.

00:55:17.000 Deep tissues, great.

00:55:20.000 You know, they...

00:55:22.000 I believe the tenets, the foundations of being a healthy, recovering athlete, good sleep, good food, good sex, you have to have those.

00:55:32.000 If you're doing those things, then your body's going to...

00:55:36.000 Adapt to whatever the workload of volume that you're putting out so I have a crazy volume like guys that come and train with me They're like this is normal.

00:55:43.000 Yeah, this is normal.

00:55:44.000 Like this is what I do normally But I just have a very healthy foundation of a lifestyle You know like where I don't really drink.

00:55:51.000 I don't ever smoke You know like I train every single day two three times a day like this is my body is adaptive to that and then everything else the supporting structure of eating well, you know having awesome supplements You know having everything just to make my body Respond properly to training.

00:56:07.000 Volume is there.

00:56:08.000 How do you work your diet out?

00:56:11.000 Do you have a nutritionist that you work with?

00:56:13.000 Do you do it on your own?

00:56:15.000 A little bit of all of the above.

00:56:17.000 I have nutritionists that I bounce stuff off of and people that are way smarter than me that...

00:56:23.000 And then I'm surrounded with so many other elite athletes talking to them and their coaches.

00:56:28.000 You know, the guys on it, you know, they have a stable of guys there that are always looking for the next best thing.

00:56:35.000 Or even not the next best thing.

00:56:37.000 Things that have just been there around for thousands of years that nobody uses like they should.

00:56:41.000 So it's a constant discussion of like how to improve.

00:56:44.000 I know what my calories that I'm burning in a day because I log everything.

00:56:47.000 You know, I fought two weeks ago.

00:56:49.000 So I was on crazy strict diet for like three, four months to get down to 185. So now I'm back in Austin, Texas.

00:56:56.000 Maybe I'll have a little bit of brisket.

00:56:57.000 It's getting in there.

00:56:59.000 Or, you know, some tacos.

00:57:01.000 So...

00:57:02.000 Which I think is actually needed.

00:57:04.000 You can't be perfect all the time.

00:57:06.000 Your body needs those cheats.

00:57:08.000 Yeah, I agree.

00:57:09.000 I think cheat days are important.

00:57:10.000 I think people that are just completely clean and strict, you're robbing yourself also of enjoyment.

00:57:15.000 Yeah, life's too short not to enjoy it.

00:57:17.000 Yeah, there's some delicious food that you shouldn't eat all the time, but you should eat sometimes.

00:57:22.000 Definitely, right?

00:57:23.000 Yeah.

00:57:24.000 So when you say that you log the amount of calories that you burn, how do you calculate that?

00:57:30.000 So heart rate monitor, right, during the workout knows my resting metabolic rate is key.

00:57:35.000 You have to know what that is.

00:57:36.000 And once you know what that is, kind of in between workouts, you...

00:57:41.000 Know cumulatively in a day what you've burnt.

00:57:43.000 And then you just add during the workouts, you know, if I work out two or three times that day, you know, if I'm doing a 90-minute strength and conditioning session, you know, I'm going to burn anywhere between 12 to 1600 calories in that session, you know, from warm-up to cool-down.

00:57:58.000 You know, like, last night I had a two-hour jujitsu session, you know, like, and it smashed afterwards, you know, like...

00:58:06.000 I know kind of what my heart rate was at during the entire time and two hours.

00:58:12.000 That's going to be another 1,500 calories that I'm putting on top of what I burnt in that day.

00:58:16.000 So I get a snapshot that I burnt 5,500 to 6,000 calories.

00:58:20.000 That's insane.

00:58:21.000 Yeah.

00:58:21.000 That's way more than most people eat in a day.

00:58:23.000 Yeah.

00:58:24.000 It's fun to eat that though.

00:58:26.000 How do you stuff that in, though?

00:58:29.000 I'm in Austin, Texas.

00:58:31.000 Just brisket.

00:58:33.000 So easy.

00:58:34.000 Do you have any other nutritional requirements?

00:58:38.000 Do you eat gluten?

00:58:39.000 Do you take sugar into your diet at all?

00:58:42.000 I try not to.

00:58:44.000 Definitely Fight Camp, I don't have either of those.

00:58:46.000 But right now, I had an apple fritter bagel on Monday.

00:58:50.000 I hadn't had one of those in...

00:58:53.000 I don't even know how long.

00:58:54.000 And it was amazing. 0.73

00:58:55.000 It was like a small orgasm in my mouth. 0.53

00:58:57.000 I don't even know what that is, an apple fritter bagel.

00:59:00.000 No, not bagel, just an apple fritter.

00:59:02.000 Oh, okay.

00:59:02.000 Apple fritter donut.

00:59:03.000 Oh, okay.

00:59:04.000 So it's like just donut with apples.

00:59:07.000 Yeah, gluten and sugar and apples.

00:59:08.000 Sugar and that sort of, what is that, syrupy stuff in with the apples and the cinnamon.

00:59:15.000 That's exactly what it is.

00:59:16.000 Ooh, that sounds good.

00:59:17.000 It was good. 1.00

00:59:17.000 Shit. 1.00

00:59:18.000 Do you Krispy Kreme it? 1.00

00:59:19.000 Do you ever Krispy Kreme it?

00:59:20.000 No.

00:59:21.000 You don't do Krispy Kreme?

00:59:22.000 No.

00:59:24.000 There's a spot that I go to.

00:59:25.000 I'm getting Regenikine.

00:59:27.000 Do you know what that is?

00:59:28.000 I don't.

00:59:28.000 That's a thing that they go to Germany for that Dr. Peter Weller invented.

00:59:32.000 It's a blood-spinning procedure.

00:59:34.000 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:59:34.000 NFL guys are doing it, too.

00:59:36.000 Yes.

00:59:36.000 Yeah.

00:59:37.000 I've been getting it done.

00:59:37.000 I had it done on my neck.

00:59:39.000 I had a bulging disc in my neck that was impinging on nerves.

00:59:42.000 I was getting some numbness in my hand from jujitsu.

00:59:44.000 Yeah.

00:59:45.000 Went away totally.

00:59:46.000 Magic.

00:59:47.000 The thing just shrunk down to nothing.

00:59:49.000 But the place where I get it is right down the street from Krispy Kreme.

00:59:52.000 And I drive and I'm like, do I want to fuck up what I just fixed? 0.74

00:59:56.000 Just do it! 0.94

00:59:57.000 Inflammation, you know.

00:59:59.000 Apparently inflammation and I found out about it from a physical therapist that gluten and inflammation, they're like, people say, oh, you know, you're not really gluten sensitive.

01:00:07.000 Most people aren't.

01:00:08.000 I mean, you can eat gluten and you'd be fine.

01:00:10.000 But the reality is, it does cause some inflammation.

01:00:12.000 The more you eat, the more you get.

01:00:14.000 Yeah, that's a fascinating thing, that it's a normal part of everybody's diet.

01:00:17.000 You wouldn't think that it would have that sort of an effect on your joints or your back, but it really does.

01:00:23.000 Yeah, well, especially if they train like we do.

01:00:25.000 Then, now we're just compounding problems where we have the enablers to cause inflammation, and then we're diet- Giving something that helps cause it.

01:00:34.000 Now things are just compounded and it's exponential.

01:00:38.000 What about dairy?

01:00:39.000 Not much at all.

01:00:41.000 Some cheeses I just can't live without.

01:00:43.000 Cheeses?

01:00:43.000 You're a cheese guy?

01:00:44.000 Yes.

01:00:45.000 I'm a food guy.

01:00:46.000 If it's good, I want it.

01:00:47.000 Yeah, you cook, right?

01:00:48.000 Oh, God, I love to cook.

01:00:49.000 What do you cook?

01:00:51.000 I love everything, but...

01:00:56.000 I love cooking real.

01:00:58.000 When I say real, it's my food that I shot, that I cleaned, that I froze, that I packaged, that I brought in from my greenhouse, my backyard.

01:01:10.000 My food.

01:01:11.000 Right, right, right.

01:01:12.000 I'm with you a thousand percent.

01:01:14.000 I love being connected to what I put in my body.

01:01:17.000 Yeah, there's very few people who have experienced that, haven't said that it's something special.

01:01:23.000 When you cook an animal that you actually hunted, shot, butchered, cut up, put in your freezer, or eat it in camp, which is even better, when you're eating it a couple hours after it died, this is an amazing connection that...

01:01:37.000 People will poo-poo that.

01:01:38.000 It's not important. 0.96

01:01:40.000 Oh, you're just using that as an excuse to go out and shoot animals. 0.98

01:01:43.000 No.

01:01:44.000 I would really like to take someone who is a meat eater who is anti-hunting.

01:01:50.000 You need to just experience this.

01:01:52.000 Just experience this.

01:01:53.000 I 100% agree.

01:01:54.000 I wish every person that ate meat, and ironically, a ton of anti-hunters eat meat, obviously.

01:02:01.000 Yeah.

01:02:01.000 There's no connection to food these days.

01:02:03.000 People just want to go to the grocery store and pick their stuff off the shelf and have no idea how it got there, what was put in there.

01:02:10.000 But then they judge me because I hunt.

01:02:14.000 But I know exactly where this animal came from.

01:02:17.000 I felt sorry for it when I shot it.

01:02:19.000 I thought it was beautiful.

01:02:20.000 I still do.

01:02:21.000 I'm enjoying every single bite of it.

01:02:23.000 But they're going to sit there and be like, oh man, that guy hunts.

01:02:26.000 I'm an absolute fanatic conservationist.

01:02:29.000 But I hunt, yeah.

01:02:30.000 And I love my food, and I love good food.

01:02:32.000 So they're all connected, and I think people should wake up and realize.

01:02:37.000 It's also what we were kind of talking about earlier is that there's a broad spectrum of things that are going on in this world.

01:02:43.000 There's no black and white when it comes to hunting. 0.99

01:02:45.000 You can actually love animals and still shoot them and kill them. 0.99

01:02:49.000 I love them. 0.97

01:02:50.000 It's a crazy thing.

01:02:51.000 People find that impossibly contradictory, but it's not. 0.99

01:02:57.000 The other thing that people don't want to admit is that if you do not shoot these animals, they're going to continue to fuck, they're going to continue to procreate, and then how are you going to control the population? 0.99

01:03:07.000 Because you have two options. 0.99

01:03:08.000 Either you can hunt them or you can bring in wolves.

01:03:11.000 Yeah.

01:03:11.000 So what do you want to do?

01:03:12.000 You want wolves running around through your fucking neighborhood, killing everything that they can get a hold of, including dogs, including livestock? 1.00

01:03:18.000 Do you want wild panthers? 1.00

01:03:20.000 What do you want?

01:03:21.000 How are you going to control the populations of these animals that don't have natural predators?

01:03:27.000 First, my experience, I was like a prepubescent kid when Catalina Island, off the coast here of California, somebody accidentally introduced a hog.

01:03:47.000 We're good to go.

01:04:00.000 Like, get rid of these hogs that were destroying the entire ecosystem of that island. 1.00

01:04:08.000 And that happens on a much more, that's the micro example on a tiny little island with a tiny little animal.

01:04:14.000 But if you look at the big picture of, you know, like, Deer in the south, or hogs from Florida to Texas, or the python that was introduced in the Everglades, they have to be hunted to maintain the balance of harmony in the ecosystem.

01:04:30.000 The ecosystem will crash if it's not done.

01:04:34.000 So you either, like you said, give a predator, and that predator has serious problems that come along with it, or you have the hunter that does it properly, and then you have the benefits that come along with it, which is a proper ecosystem.

01:04:48.000 And you get delicious wild ham.

01:04:50.000 Look at that. 1.00

01:04:51.000 I smoked that bitch myself. 1.00

01:04:53.000 Look at that. 1.00

01:04:54.000 That's so beautiful.

01:04:55.000 In my backyard.

01:04:55.000 I shot it and I smoked it.

01:04:57.000 And it was the best tasting ham ever.

01:04:59.000 Wild pig has a completely different texture.

01:05:02.000 Than anything.

01:05:04.000 I marinated it, or brined it rather, for seven days before I smoked it.

01:05:09.000 But even so, it's a more dense meat.

01:05:13.000 It's more muscle.

01:05:14.000 It's darker.

01:05:15.000 It tastes better.

01:05:16.000 It's better for you. 1.00

01:05:17.000 And you fucking have to kill them because there's 50,000 hogs. 1.00

01:05:21.000 The place where I go to is Tohono Ranch. 1.00

01:05:24.000 We're only an hour and a half outside of L.A. And they have elk.

01:05:27.000 They have a pond up there that they put a trail camera on just to see what's eating there.

01:05:31.000 Sixteen different mountain lions.

01:05:34.000 Oh, nothing. 1.00

01:05:35.000 Just sixteen different fucking wild murderous cats. 1.00

01:05:38.000 And it's because there's so many pigs, there's so much game up there. 0.99

01:05:42.000 You could, from Texas to Florida, you could bring in every hunter in the nation and have them kill ten pigs apiece and it wouldn't even dent the population of wild hogs in the southeast.

01:05:58.000 Have you ever seen Aporkalypse Now?

01:06:00.000 No, it sounds like the best movie ever.

01:06:03.000 It's a show.

01:06:05.000 There's a dude, his name is Brian Kwaka, I think is his name.

01:06:10.000 That's a great name.

01:06:10.000 He's a guy from Texas, and he's got a show called Pigman.

01:06:14.000 And Pigman is a hunter in Texas, and he hunts wild pigs, and then he owns a barbecue place, and then serves up wild pig barbecue.

01:06:24.000 Now he's got a show on...

01:06:27.000 One of those, like history or something like that, it's called Boss Hog, and the show sort of details what he's doing.

01:06:33.000 I'm familiar with it. 0.98

01:06:34.000 Him and Ted Nugent got helicopters with fucking machine guns, and they're flying around with ARs shooting pigs out of the sky. 1.00

01:06:44.000 I mean, it is the craziest fucking thing I've ever seen on TV. That's legal now. 0.99

01:06:49.000 Yeah.

01:06:49.000 We passed legislation.

01:06:50.000 They have to do it.

01:06:51.000 Yeah.

01:06:51.000 You have to.

01:06:52.000 And for folks who don't, that's cruel, that's horrible. 0.99

01:06:55.000 There are millions of pigs. 1.00

01:06:58.000 And they don't care. 1.00

01:06:59.000 Not only that, they don't stop fucking. 1.00

01:07:01.000 They breed all year round. 1.00

01:07:03.000 It's not like deer that have a rut and then they'll have a fawn.

01:07:06.000 No, these are animals that are shitting out four or five pigs every four or five months.

01:07:12.000 And they just... 0.98

01:07:12.000 This is the video of them shooting these things from the sky. 0.98

01:07:19.000 There's actually companies...

01:07:21.000 This is the wrong one.

01:07:22.000 What you're showing is there's a pig hunting video.

01:07:26.000 That was a pig hunting promo for the Sportsman's Channel.

01:07:29.000 But this is...

01:07:30.000 They had a whole episode.

01:07:32.000 And in the episode, they killed 450 pigs. 1.00

01:07:35.000 In a fucking 22-minute episode with commercials. 1.00

01:07:37.000 But that's a drop in the ocean to what's there. 0.99

01:07:41.000 Yeah, literally.

01:07:42.000 It is like taking a shot glass and tossing it into the ocean. 0.98

01:07:45.000 I mean, it's the most ridiculous thing you've ever seen in your life. 0.96

01:07:48.000 And they're just... 0.98

01:07:50.000 And they're catching these pigs running, headshots where they're tumbling while they're running, and there's something barbaric and fucked up about it, but they're taking that food and they're feeding hungry people, they have Hunters for the Hungry, they give the wild pork, which is excellent meat, they give it to hungry families, 0.92

01:08:05.000 and it's really, really, really delicious food, and it's important too, but... 0.99

01:08:10.000 Then there's that thing where people are like, well, that's fucked up, man. 0.94

01:08:13.000 That's not really hunting. 0.98

01:08:14.000 They're shooting.

01:08:15.000 Well, they're not really hunting.

01:08:16.000 They're eradicating these problematic, delicious animals.

01:08:20.000 That's the best way to look at it.

01:08:22.000 They have to be eradicated, and while it might not be the most humane approach to it, it's a necessary one that has to happen.

01:08:28.000 And so, I don't know, it's a necessary evil a little bit.

01:08:32.000 Well, you know what's going on in the Hamptons?

01:08:33.000 You know, the Hamptons, the luxury area outside of Long Island where all these rich folks...

01:08:38.000 No, I don't know what's going on.

01:08:39.000 They have so many deer up there that they're bringing in snipers.

01:08:42.000 They're bringing in snipers in the middle of the night, and the town has proposed to give these deer birth control, to somehow or another give them food, put food out that has birth control in it, which, by the way, the male deer are going to... 0.97

01:08:54.000 So you're going to make bitches out of the male deer. 1.00

01:08:56.000 The male deer are going to run around, I think I'm fucking pregnant. 1.00

01:09:00.000 Why am I full swollen? 0.99

01:09:01.000 Is this natural?

01:09:03.000 Yeah, so you're going to have these male deer that are eating birth control, female deer, and it's going to cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. 0.78

01:09:09.000 And it's a direct result of the failure to eradicate these animals or control their population through hunting.

01:09:15.000 There's a place in Pennsylvania where they have 24 hour a day, 7 day a week hunting 365 days a year.

01:09:24.000 You can hunt with bows and arrows.

01:09:26.000 You can hunt all years around because there are so many deer. 0.99

01:09:28.000 They're like, just fucking bring in hunters. 0.99

01:09:31.000 And the hunters come in and there's these huge estates that have these 10-acre properties where there's fucking tree stands. 1.00

01:09:38.000 There's million-dollar houses with fucking putting green courses and dudes in tree stands launching arrows at deer because they're fucking everywhere. 0.99

01:09:45.000 They're like ground squirrels. 0.99

01:09:47.000 You ever drive into a ranch that has ground squirrels?

01:09:50.000 And as the car is running, you see like...

01:09:53.000 Thousands of them just run across the road.

01:09:54.000 It's incredible.

01:09:55.000 Yeah.

01:09:55.000 Like Tohono Ranch, which has 50,000 hogs.

01:09:59.000 It has Rocky Mountain elk.

01:10:00.000 Gigantic elk.

01:10:01.000 They have thousands of deer.

01:10:03.000 They have bears.

01:10:04.000 They have mountain lions.

01:10:05.000 They have everything.

01:10:05.000 The number one animal mass, pound for pound, is ground squirrels.

01:10:10.000 And this 2,700,000 acre ranch, number one is ground squirrels.

01:10:16.000 Believe it.

01:10:17.000 My dad, he was a narcotics officer for 30 years, door-kicking superstar.

01:10:22.000 He spends his retired time now shooting ground squirrels.

01:10:27.000 He's like the most amazing setup.

01:10:30.000 For ground squirrels?

01:10:31.000 For ground squirrels.

01:10:31.000 But you can't even eat ground squirrels.

01:10:33.000 No, on the ranch, the cows will step in their holes and break their legs, or they destroy irrigation for the vineyards. 0.94

01:10:43.000 They're nasty, they're disease-carrying, and they also breed like crazy.

01:10:47.000 You can't stop them. 0.98

01:10:48.000 They're cannibals, too. 1.00

01:10:49.000 You shoot one, they'll drag it into the hole and eat it. 0.70

01:10:52.000 Yeah, but they're very different from tree squirrels.

01:10:55.000 Tree squirrels are actually good.

01:10:57.000 I've eaten tree squirrel.

01:10:58.000 They're delicious.

01:10:58.000 I've eaten squirrels.

01:10:59.000 They're pretty.

01:10:59.000 They taste good, man.

01:11:01.000 Steve Rinella, the guy who was the host of Meat Eater, shot a squirrel when we were in Wisconsin and cooked it.

01:11:05.000 It's a very unique taste, too.

01:11:08.000 It doesn't taste like anything else.

01:11:10.000 But, um, ground squirrels, man.

01:11:12.000 I wouldn't eat one.

01:11:13.000 Yeah.

01:11:14.000 Apparently you can't. 1.00

01:11:15.000 Apparently they're just fucking disgusting. 1.00

01:11:17.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:11:17.000 It's like, I mean, I guess you could eat it if you were starving to death, but another problem is, if you shoot them, you have to kill them. 1.00

01:11:23.000 Because if you shoot them and you wound them, they run into their hole and then the other ones eat it. 0.99

01:11:28.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:11:29.000 Fucking creepy little. 1.00

01:11:30.000 Yeah, they're nasty. 1.00

01:11:31.000 There's a lot of creepy little animals out there.

01:11:34.000 Yep.

01:11:35.000 But this, I mean, the idea that this one ranch with 2,700,000 acres, their largest animal mass is ground squirrels.

01:11:43.000 Well, they say that the largest mass of life on Earth, moving life, is ants.

01:11:49.000 And that there's more pounds of ants than there are humans.

01:11:54.000 Pounds of humans.

01:11:55.000 It's incredible.

01:11:56.000 Yeah.

01:11:56.000 And they're like 10,000 times stronger than we are.

01:11:58.000 Yeah.

01:11:59.000 Percent ratio.

01:12:00.000 Yeah.

01:12:01.000 I hope they never get mad at us.

01:12:03.000 Or they better not start growing.

01:12:05.000 You know, if you go back throughout history and you find some of the animals that were just really enormous just a few hundred million years ago and they've somehow shrunk down to a manageable size.

01:12:15.000 Yeah, like if bees.

01:12:16.000 If bees are the size of horses, we'd have real problems. 0.95

01:12:20.000 Yeah.

01:12:21.000 But I love honey.

01:12:22.000 Yeah, honey's delicious.

01:12:23.000 You know, vegans don't eat honey.

01:12:25.000 That's horrible.

01:12:26.000 That's hilarious.

01:12:28.000 It's hilarious. 0.94

01:12:29.000 If you ever want to know how retarded being a vegan is, you won't eat honey. 1.00

01:12:33.000 I know they're retarded the moment that they start with, I'm a vegan. 1.00

01:12:38.000 Well, they can't help say it. 0.98

01:12:39.000 It's like they're holding a hot pan.

01:12:42.000 They run marathons?

01:12:43.000 Yeah, it's like the other thing that comes out right away.

01:12:45.000 It's like, I'm a marathoner, or I'm a vegan, or I eat paleo, or I'm a CrossFit.

01:12:50.000 That's like, nobody can help but tell you those necessary elements of themselves.

01:12:55.000 Yeah, what is that?

01:12:56.000 I don't know what it is.

01:12:57.000 It's they want to tell you they're awesome.

01:12:59.000 Yeah.

01:13:00.000 But to me, that almost discounts you as being such.

01:13:04.000 Yeah, if you're a vegan and you cannot tell people for a long period of time, that's super impressive.

01:13:09.000 I'll like you more.

01:13:12.000 Wow, you're a vegan and it took you two weeks to tell me?

01:13:15.000 I'm impressed.

01:13:16.000 Can I buy you lunch?

01:13:17.000 A vegan lunch?

01:13:18.000 I get it for people that don't want to be cruel.

01:13:21.000 I totally get the whole sentiment.

01:13:23.000 I get all of it.

01:13:24.000 I get the idea of wanting to eat fresh vegetables and it's healthy for you.

01:13:28.000 I get it.

01:13:29.000 But the finite nature of life itself, it seems to me it's so silly that you think that somehow or another you not killing animals is somehow going to balance things out.

01:13:38.000 Or you not being a part of killing animals is going to balance.

01:13:41.000 They're killing each other.

01:13:43.000 Do you know that?

01:13:44.000 Like there's a war going on.

01:13:45.000 All the animals are involved in it, including humans.

01:13:48.000 We're just so far ahead we forgot it's a war.

01:13:50.000 And we have POW camps that we set up in cities.

01:13:53.000 We call them zoos.

01:13:54.000 And that's what that is.

01:13:56.000 They didn't ask to be there. 1.00

01:13:57.000 We capture those motherfuckers and we put them... 1.00

01:14:00.000 And they're in these weird things where we don't let them interact with the other animals in the zoo. 1.00

01:14:04.000 We block them off in their own little apartments so we could stare at them while we eat popcorn.

01:14:11.000 I'm not sure I agree with that.

01:14:12.000 I don't. 0.99

01:14:13.000 I think that if you should have zoos, you should lump all those bitches together. 1.00

01:14:16.000 And if you run out of monkeys, go get more. 0.99

01:14:21.000 There's a lot of those, too.

01:14:22.000 The monkeys that survive are going to be the ones that know how to get away from the cats.

01:14:25.000 Yeah, he's a badass.

01:14:27.000 That monkey I want as a pet.

01:14:28.000 Yeah, that's a monkey who knows how to zig and zag.

01:14:30.000 He knows how to juke.

01:14:31.000 When the cat's coming, he knows how to get to the tall branches. 0.99

01:14:35.000 The monkey that stays in the ground and picks his ass while the jaguar is slowly creeping up on him, that's the monkey that's supposed to die.

01:14:41.000 The weird part about the SeaWorlds and the zoos of our life is that I love when people are like, oh, did you see the movie Blackfish? 0.98

01:14:52.000 It's so horrible.

01:14:53.000 I'm going to boycott SeaWorld.

01:14:55.000 You're like...

01:14:56.000 Have you ever given a cent to marine biology or the preservation of marine wildlife?

01:15:02.000 No, but you're going to boycott SeaWorld.

01:15:04.000 How much money have they given in the research and preservation of marine wildlife?

01:15:10.000 Oh yeah, a thousand times more than you.

01:15:12.000 It's the same with the zoos.

01:15:13.000 You know, like, I don't like zoos.

01:15:14.000 I think it's horrible that the animals are there, but they do more in research.

01:15:26.000 Yeah.

01:15:32.000 Yeah.

01:15:38.000 We don't even understand how smart they are because they can't alter their environment.

01:15:42.000 So we don't think of them as being smart because they don't have thumbs, they don't pick things up, because they can move in 3D all around the ocean. 0.68

01:15:49.000 They can fucking dive and swim and move around and they have these pods, they stay together, they have families, they have dialects, they have languages. 0.70

01:15:56.000 They're so intelligent That we're just now starting to understand that they have variations in the way they speak, depending upon what geographic location they're at. 0.99

01:16:06.000 They're really fucking smart. 0.99

01:16:08.000 Like, human-type smart. 0.99

01:16:09.000 And just because they're different from us, and they don't build houses, doesn't mean they're not smart.

01:16:14.000 So, to me, it's like slavery. 1.00

01:16:16.000 It's like, just because, you know, we have donated so much money into slavery research, but you're still fucking slave owners, you cunts! 0.99

01:16:23.000 You know, the reason why there needs to be slavery research I just think that anything smart shouldn't be in captivity. 1.00

01:16:31.000 But like giraffes? 1.00

01:16:32.000 They're so stupid. 1.00

01:16:33.000 You go to the zoo and they seem happy as fuck. 1.00

01:16:36.000 Babies feed them. 1.00

01:16:37.000 They let babies feed them. 1.00

01:16:38.000 I have a three-year-old.

01:16:39.000 She holds up lettuce, the giraffe comes and take it. 1.00

01:16:41.000 That fucking giraffe's not upset at all. 0.99

01:16:43.000 They're so confident that giraffes are chill that they let babies feed them. 1.00

01:16:47.000 They are.

01:16:48.000 They are so chill.

01:16:49.000 They're just happy there's no lions.

01:16:51.000 For you to be a giraffe all day, you have a giant target. 0.64

01:16:55.000 Your neck is just this huge target that somebody wants to bite.

01:16:59.000 There's not one spot. 0.99

01:17:01.000 It's not like a warthog that has this little short fucking stubby neck that's tough to get to. 0.99

01:17:05.000 You have this giant neck like a tree. 1.00

01:17:07.000 Everywhere around it, you could bite and kill you.

01:17:10.000 I mean, they're so happy they're in the zoo.

01:17:13.000 They're so happy.

01:17:13.000 No, they don't know how happy they are.

01:17:15.000 They're like, wait, nothing's eating me?

01:17:18.000 And this three-year-old's giving me food?

01:17:20.000 Yeah.

01:17:20.000 Okay, I think this is good.

01:17:22.000 But then there's weirdness when it comes to captive animals, like these hunting camps that they have in Africa.

01:17:31.000 It gets, again, the gray area, the weirdness of the world, because you know Louis Theroux, the documentary guy?

01:17:38.000 Fascinating guy.

01:17:39.000 I had him on the podcast.

01:17:40.000 Really, really interesting cat.

01:17:41.000 I want to watch that one.

01:17:42.000 It's a good one.

01:17:42.000 One of the best documentaries that he did was when he went to Africa and went to these hunting camps.

01:17:48.000 They have these high fence hunting camps where they take these animals and they put them in these huge enclosures and they let people hunt them.

01:17:55.000 The irony is these animals are, there's higher populations, they're healthier, there's more of them.

01:18:01.000 Animals that were on the verge of extinction are now, there's many, many, many of them, but they're hunted.

01:18:08.000 So it's like people have this weird sort of like, well, yeah, the animals are healthier, the populations are healthier, but the reason being is because people can pay to go kill them.

01:18:18.000 Whoa.

01:18:19.000 But it's just another example of the world not being so clear-cut.

01:18:24.000 There's a lot of weirdness out there.

01:18:26.000 Yep.

01:18:26.000 Ironically, some of the rhinos that are left in this world are at those camps.

01:18:32.000 They're not being hunted.

01:18:33.000 They're being protected.

01:18:34.000 They're in these high-fence, game-fence areas where people are coming.

01:18:37.000 They'll come...

01:18:38.000 Look at the rhino and be like, oh wow, what a beautiful rhino.

01:18:41.000 Alright, let's go shoot a Gems buck and a kudu. 1.00

01:18:43.000 How much does it cost?

01:18:44.000 You know, like something they couldn't do 20 years ago because there weren't enough of them.

01:18:47.000 But now, like, oh, Limitless Impala?

01:18:49.000 Well, that's a blessed buck?

01:18:50.000 Oh, I'll take one of those.

01:18:51.000 That's $1,000?

01:18:51.000 Not a problem.

01:18:52.000 You know, like, that's what it's like there.

01:18:54.000 But they saved species by making them available to be paid for.

01:19:00.000 Yeah, it's very strange.

01:19:02.000 And Louis Theroux's documentary really captured it.

01:19:05.000 What was his position?

01:19:06.000 Well, his position is, you know, he's trying to get to it.

01:19:09.000 He's trying to get to his position during the whole documentary.

01:19:12.000 He's like, okay, I see.

01:19:15.000 But the real position is really clearly established by the guy who runs the hunting camp because he gets angry at Louis.

01:19:22.000 At one point in the show, like, you know, three quarters of the way in, he goes, you don't understand. 1.00

01:19:27.000 He goes, Africa is fucked! 1.00

01:19:29.000 He goes, it's fucked. 1.00

01:19:30.000 Unless something is worth money, it's gonna fucking die. 1.00

01:19:34.000 They fucking kill everything. 1.00

01:19:36.000 It's fucked. 1.00

01:19:36.000 There's nothing here. 1.00

01:19:37.000 The reason why these fucking animals are here is because they're worth money. 1.00

01:19:41.000 That's it! 1.00

01:19:42.000 That's it!

01:19:43.000 Do you understand?

01:19:44.000 And, you know, Louis is like, I guess, I understand.

01:19:47.000 It's true.

01:19:47.000 It is true.

01:19:48.000 It is true.

01:19:50.000 And, in a sense, that sort of mirrors What's going on when it comes to wildlife in America.

01:19:56.000 More money has been spent by hunters to conserve wetlands, to preserve wildlife habitat for elk, to preserve areas where deer live and to establish clear protocols as far as how many animals Can be sustained in any given location and keep the populations healthy.

01:20:18.000 All that money comes from hunters.

01:20:19.000 Yeah.

01:20:20.000 Which is just amazing.

01:20:21.000 It's another one of those things.

01:20:23.000 It's like, when you look at it in clear, objective terms, you see that this is a very complex issue.

01:20:30.000 And it's not as simple as, these animals are beautiful, we should not kill them.

01:20:34.000 They are beautiful. 1.00

01:20:35.000 Yeah, you have to kill them, though. 1.00

01:20:37.000 But you have to kill them. 1.00

01:20:37.000 Whoa. 1.00

01:20:38.000 Yeah.

01:20:38.000 Right?

01:20:39.000 It sucks. 1.00

01:20:40.000 Not really, they're delicious! 0.99

01:20:42.000 That's the crazy thing is, no, it doesn't really suck.

01:20:45.000 They are delicious. 1.00

01:20:46.000 Like, fuck, man. 1.00

01:20:48.000 There's so much going on there. 1.00

01:20:49.000 And again, it's just the way the world is. 1.00

01:20:53.000 Which is like this ironic contrast to the first 10 years of my life where, like, I didn't think what I was shooting was beautiful because they're evil fuckers. 0.99

01:21:02.000 Now, as a sportsman, a hunter, I love these animals. 0.99

01:21:06.000 Which animals do you think were evil?

01:21:09.000 Terrorists.

01:21:10.000 You said for the first 10 years of your life, you're shooting terrorists?

01:21:13.000 No, 10 years of my career as a shooter.

01:21:16.000 Oh, I thought you were saying as your life.

01:21:18.000 Wait, so when you're 9 years old, you're hunting terrorists?

01:21:21.000 No, like, at 23. You know, I was like, no remorse, slept very well at night, you know, because these were evil people.

01:21:27.000 And now I'm like, oh man, I don't want to shoot that.

01:21:30.000 That's pretty.

01:21:31.000 You know, that thing's beautiful.

01:21:32.000 That I'll shoot, you know, because that is really yummy and there's too many of them.

01:21:36.000 Yeah, I have a buddy who served and came back, and he loves fishing, and he had a real hard time getting back into hunting.

01:21:44.000 He said, you know, you see so much death at a certain point in time, you don't want to be a part of any of it.

01:21:50.000 Totally sympathize.

01:21:50.000 Yeah.

01:21:51.000 He got back.

01:21:52.000 He lives in New Mexico, and he got back into elk hunting.

01:21:55.000 New Mexico is great for elk.

01:21:56.000 He got back into it after a while, but it took him a while.

01:21:58.000 It took him a while to just sort of settle in.

01:22:01.000 He's just like, I saw too much death.

01:22:03.000 Yeah.

01:22:05.000 Totally empathetic to that.

01:22:08.000 Is there ever going to be a time where there's no war? 0.66

01:22:10.000 Is that even possible with human beings?

01:22:13.000 Not in my lifetime.

01:22:15.000 That's a disturbing idea for people because if people have this idea, I mean, this is a shitty analogy, but it's one that I use.

01:22:23.000 If 20 people can get along, if like, okay, there's five of us in this room or four of us in this room.

01:22:28.000 If there's four people in this room and we can get along, can 40 people get along?

01:22:33.000 Yes, 40 people can get along.

01:22:34.000 You could have a community of 40 people with no problems and just live from birth to death and nobody kills anybody.

01:22:40.000 Maybe that weird outlier at 40. But as a community, they'll absorb him for what he is or whatever.

01:22:46.000 Yeah, but then you get to 4,000.

01:22:50.000 No.

01:22:51.000 Someone's going to die. 1.00

01:22:52.000 Jim's a douche. 1.00

01:22:53.000 We've got to take out Jim. 1.00

01:22:54.000 And everybody's going to meet by the campfire and go, look, this motherfucker is just ruining our life. 1.00

01:22:59.000 He doesn't hunt. 1.00

01:23:00.000 He eats all our food. 1.00

01:23:01.000 He fucks our women when we're not there. 1.00

01:23:03.000 He beats our kids. 1.00

01:23:05.000 We've got to kill this guy. 1.00

01:23:06.000 And out of a certain number, there's going to be this one that comes up. 0.99

01:23:11.000 And then when you deal with seven billion, it's like, whoa, how does...

01:23:18.000 How does that ever become manageable?

01:23:21.000 I mean, do human beings have to evolve past what we are right now?

01:23:25.000 Do we have to reach some new stage?

01:23:27.000 Yeah, I hope so too.

01:23:30.000 Well, you would know better than anybody what the horrors of war are.

01:23:35.000 So would you think that someone who has experienced that would have a better perspective about what's necessary and what's not necessary when it comes to Sort of just managing peace?

01:23:49.000 Try to...

01:23:50.000 Yes and no.

01:23:52.000 You know, there's no, like, nirvonic moment where you have, like, this clear sight of, you know, what...

01:23:57.000 An understanding of what's necessary and what's not, how people should be or how people shouldn't be.

01:24:03.000 Like, if anything, you know, as six years as a door kicker, assaulter, and then four years as a Halo sniper guy, I've seen death, like, from a foot away and from a mile away.

01:24:16.000 So there's no range of death I haven't seen.

01:24:19.000 So if anything, I value life more, I think.

01:24:22.000 I hate war more. 0.95

01:24:24.000 I think it's horrible and disgusting.

01:24:27.000 But without a doubt, I think it's absolutely necessary.

01:24:30.000 And needed to such a level that I can't even imagine what this world would be like.

01:24:40.000 Had we not been involved to the degree that we've been involved in for the past 12 years, trying to eradicate this fanatic group of psychopaths.

01:24:49.000 So, I don't want to think about what the world would be like.

01:24:53.000 But, you know, I don't want my nieces and my nephews or my kids to ever have to do what I did.

01:24:57.000 Or see what I saw.

01:24:59.000 So, I don't know.

01:25:00.000 Like...

01:25:04.000 I hope we never have to invade a country.

01:25:06.000 I remember we were talking about Syria.

01:25:08.000 You're like, are we going to go over there?

01:25:09.000 I was like, God, no!

01:25:10.000 There's no need.

01:25:12.000 There's no resource.

01:25:12.000 There's no necessary element for us to be involved in.

01:25:15.000 But the preservation of human life, isn't that needed?

01:25:20.000 Right.

01:25:21.000 Well, that's one of the reasons why...

01:25:24.000 False flags and false flag operations are so disgusting when you find out that someone's lying about the motivation for profit.

01:25:33.000 There's nothing worse than somebody that lies for the benefit of themselves.

01:25:39.000 Joe, I think you're a good-looking man, and I think that dress looks great on you, and it makes you look thin.

01:25:45.000 That's an okay lie sometimes to tell.

01:25:50.000 Wait, it's your 28th birthday?

01:25:52.000 That's great to hear.

01:25:53.000 No, I'm 40. Whatever.

01:25:55.000 Those are not self-serving lies.

01:25:57.000 Those are cute lies.

01:25:58.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:25:58.000 But when you're lying so that you can put money in your pocket at the expense of human life, I hope you burn in hell forever. 1.00

01:26:04.000 It's a dark lie. 1.00

01:26:06.000 It's a very, very dark lie.

01:26:08.000 It's a confusing lie, too, because it's like, wait a minute, wait a minute, this has actually happened?

01:26:13.000 When you find out about the Gulf of Tonkin or Operation Northwoods, that there have been these moments in time where people have tried to figure out a way to lie in order to drag people into war, a war that otherwise the public wouldn't support.

01:26:27.000 It's dark.

01:26:30.000 It's dark.

01:26:30.000 It's a very weird aspect of society.

01:26:34.000 Not only that exists, but that's ignored.

01:26:37.000 It's ignored and almost brushed under the table when you start talking about war and about policy.

01:26:41.000 This is something that people don't want to acknowledge, that we have been duped by the military-industrial complex in the past, and that it is actually standard operational procedure.

01:26:51.000 They will come up with different ways in order to get people to support war, and one of them is the lie.

01:26:59.000 Yeah.

01:27:01.000 When guys come back, the big one is PTSD. That's the hardest aspect, it seems, to integrate back into a normal society with normal life and normal jobs and normal...

01:27:16.000 Just the things that we all just deal with on a regular basis, for some folks, it becomes almost unbearable.

01:27:22.000 What is the difference between people that integrate smoothly and people that have an incredibly difficult time?

01:27:30.000 You know, from that incredibly difficult time to smoothly are all scales, you know, and the biggest or the factors are the degrees of coping mechanisms that an individual has.

01:27:42.000 I have a very strong family, you know, like an amazing wife, fantastic father and mother, they're still married, amazing brother and sister, great, like, so family unit, very supportive.

01:27:52.000 I'm very fit, I'm very healthy, I'm well educated, I was well trained.

01:27:57.000 These are all different mechanisms to deal with stress.

01:27:59.000 Everybody deals with stress differently, but the foundation of how you deal with stress, you have to have these fundamental elements to be able to do it.

01:28:07.000 The more of them that you have, the more stress you can deal with.

01:28:10.000 So a guy like me that was a ranger, sniper, Green Beret, like, killed lots of dudes, can come back and sleep well at night.

01:28:19.000 You know, yeah, I had to adjust.

01:28:21.000 There are things that, you know, like, I had moments where a guy smoking a clove that maybe just ate at an Indian restaurant, so I'm having some sensory to, like, how he smells, listening to...

01:28:31.000 You know, music from that culture that I just spent six, you know, six months with. 0.72

01:28:36.000 You know, like, I'm like, I want to shoot this person. 0.97

01:28:38.000 Like, that instant reaction. 0.68

01:28:40.000 But then I'm like, okay, no, everything's okay.

01:28:42.000 Wow, what is that like?

01:28:43.000 It's weird.

01:28:44.000 I was walking to a Best Buy, and that was an example.

01:28:46.000 This guy driving a yellow BMW. He was smoking a clove.

01:28:50.000 And I got this whiff of, like, curry.

01:28:52.000 And so everything was there.

01:28:53.000 Like, the music, the look, what he was wearing, you know. 0.94

01:28:57.000 You know, I was just like, that guy looks like a terrorist. 0.78

01:29:01.000 You know, snap judgment. 0.99

01:29:02.000 Like, I just got back a couple of days later and I was like, should I shoot this person? 0.98

01:29:06.000 Wow. 0.97

01:29:06.000 No. 0.97

01:29:07.000 I'm in Fayetteville, North Carolina walking into a Best Buy to buy the new Avengers movie.

01:29:12.000 No, I think it was Iron Man.

01:29:12.000 I don't remember what it was.

01:29:13.000 But you were an educated guy and you're an intelligent, introspective guy.

01:29:19.000 For a guy who's not, that's very problematic.

01:29:22.000 So those coping mechanisms, like how much does that person have?

01:29:25.000 You have a National Guardsman that enlisted out of high school.

01:29:28.000 He comes from a broken home.

01:29:30.000 He's poor, you know...

01:29:32.000 Then he goes, he enlisted to be a truck driver, and then his truck gets blown up, and they get in a firefight, and then he sees death.

01:29:40.000 He saw, you know, the guy that his navigator just lost an arm.

01:29:43.000 Dude, that guy is scarred for life.

01:29:45.000 You know, he has no coping mechanisms to deal.

01:29:47.000 And then he comes home, and he's broken, and he's damaged.

01:29:50.000 How does that person reintegrate into society without all the necessary coping mechanisms?

01:29:55.000 It's hard.

01:29:57.000 When you hear about stories where guys snap, and there have been several over the course of these two wars, and one of the big ones was a decorated guy wound up killing a bunch of civilians, and it made...

01:30:12.000 You made a lot of the rounds on these talk shows where people try to discuss PTSD and traumatic events and that this guy was having real problems and reporting having real problems before all this happened and they kept sending him back over there.

01:30:27.000 Do you relate to that and you try to figure it out for yourself?

01:30:33.000 When you see these stories in the news, how do they hit you?

01:30:37.000 I wish I could be empathetic.

01:30:39.000 I've had PTSD nightmares where I wake up in a sweat and I put my hand through the wall.

01:30:44.000 My wife's like, are you okay?

01:30:47.000 That was years ago.

01:30:49.000 First came back after some bad, rough trips.

01:30:54.000 So maybe I have some empathy to that.

01:30:57.000 The Special Forces unit by design is very tight.

01:31:02.000 And, you know, like, if you're having issues, I can go to my team sergeant or I can go to my senior and bounce things off of them.

01:31:08.000 I get really resentful over people making snap judgments about these guys that are coming back and having issues.

01:31:14.000 You know, like, oh, you're a veteran?

01:31:16.000 Is it safe for my kids to be around you?

01:31:18.000 You know, like, hell yeah, they're like the greatest human beings on the planet, you know, and like one in a million have...

01:31:26.000 A very small percentage have serious issues, but we have to have our eyes wide open about how to deal with post-traumatic stress.

01:31:34.000 And there's not one easy solution, and it's a lot of hard work to get there.

01:31:39.000 It's not one easy solution.

01:31:40.000 There's not one standard set of experiences that each veteran experiences over there and brings back with them.

01:31:46.000 It varies.

01:31:47.000 And that's such an important thing that you said about the coping mechanisms that you have in place.

01:31:52.000 What What's done to help veterans when they come back as far as help them strengthen their coping mechanisms, help them deal with situations?

01:32:02.000 What kind of support do they offer you?

01:32:05.000 Now, you know, we've been at war for a long time.

01:32:07.000 We have a lot of things in place where, you know, FRG, the Family Readiness Group, is there for your family.

01:32:13.000 So when you're coming back, your family has an understanding of what you've experienced or how to deal with you.

01:32:20.000 You know, like, you're not...

01:32:21.000 Hey, Saturday you're going to be coaching kids softball.

01:32:24.000 Saturday night we're going to mom and dad's.

01:32:26.000 They're not overwhelming you with American life, which is normal to everybody else unless you've been in a plywood building for 12 months and now you're back surrounded with thousands of people that you have no idea.

01:32:38.000 It's weird.

01:32:42.000 So, the military has done a way better job of trying to reintegrate soldiers back into, you know, normal life.

01:32:50.000 But then you have a lot of great organizations that are veteran-started.

01:32:56.000 And these guys really get it.

01:32:59.000 You know, like, Brian Stan is a great example, Hire Heroes.

01:33:04.000 You know, he's involved with getting these guys back to work.

01:33:09.000 Veterans Outdoors, like a Make-Wish Foundation for wounded guys.

01:33:12.000 So if you have a serious physical ailment from battle, whether it's internal or physical, they'll give you these crazy things just to be like, hey, things are okay.

01:33:23.000 You're still surrounded by friends.

01:33:25.000 Let's get you reconnected to a community that you're involved with and do something fun at the same time.

01:33:30.000 So there's a lot of different ways.

01:33:31.000 Like the worst thing, though, is when they start throwing pills at these guys.

01:33:35.000 You know, the pharmaceutical approach, where it's like, alright, let's put you on an antidepressant and hope for the best.

01:33:40.000 There's a lot of that, right? 0.99

01:33:42.000 Freaking retarded. 1.00

01:33:43.000 When you're over there, do they try to offer it to you when you're actually in country? 1.00

01:33:48.000 Ugh.

01:33:51.000 Not, like, antidepressants.

01:33:53.000 You know, there's pharmaceutical things, like, to keep you awake longer, to make you alert longer. 0.99

01:33:59.000 Like, what kind of shit? 0.98

01:34:00.000 I mean, it's just, like, you're in special forces. 1.00

01:34:02.000 Like, hey, here's, you know, this...

01:34:04.000 Well, I mean, even some great stuff where, like, over-the-counter things...

01:34:07.000 Like, I wish I had AlphaBrain when I was there.

01:34:10.000 Like, not plugging intentionally, but...

01:34:13.000 Like, that stuff's fantastic.

01:34:14.000 You're focused.

01:34:15.000 You feel good.

01:34:16.000 You're ready to go.

01:34:17.000 You know, that would have been a thousand times better than, you know, like, hey, here's something the DOD just sent down for us to use.

01:34:23.000 You know, it'll keep you awake for three days.

01:34:25.000 Awesome.

01:34:26.000 What did they give you?

01:34:28.000 I have no idea.

01:34:29.000 You don't even know what they were?

01:34:30.000 No, not really.

01:34:31.000 Whoa.

01:34:31.000 Yeah.

01:34:32.000 But I know I was awake for three days.

01:34:34.000 Yeah, I have friends who went over there and said they just gave them steroids.

01:34:37.000 They just, they gave them oral steroids.

01:34:39.000 Well, do you know what?

01:34:40.000 I've never done steroids.

01:34:42.000 I swear by all, it's only true.

01:34:44.000 Were they offered and available?

01:34:46.000 Yeah.

01:34:47.000 But we have a Special Forces guy.

01:34:49.000 He's 38 years old.

01:34:51.000 This is his 6th, 7th combat tour.

01:34:53.000 We're doing 2, 3, 4 hits a night.

01:34:57.000 Hits like missions.

01:34:58.000 We're doing mission, follow-up mission, follow-up mission.

01:35:01.000 We're doing a helicopter landing.

01:35:03.000 We're doing a GAF where we're on a ground assault force.

01:35:07.000 And this guy's broken.

01:35:08.000 He's hurt.

01:35:09.000 He physically can't keep up.

01:35:11.000 He needs it.

01:35:12.000 Do I want the 38-year-old dude next to me that's on steroids, or do I want the one that can barely walk because everything hurts so bad?

01:35:20.000 I want the 38-year-old on steroids. 1.00

01:35:22.000 Yeah, and that sort of brings up what we were talking about before, where it's the...

01:35:29.000 The discussion of TRT when it comes to mixed martial arts training, testosterone replacement therapy, for folks who don't know this debate, they're not mixed martial arts fans, and there's probably a lot of people listening to this that aren't,

01:35:47.000 For a long time, over a year, two years, whatever it was, you were allowed to get prescribed testosterone.

01:35:54.000 And Brennan Schaub said it best.

01:35:57.000 We were discussing it on the podcast.

01:35:58.000 He said that there's youth.

01:36:01.000 And with youth, you have elevated hormone levels, but you have a lack of experience, you have a lack of knowledge.

01:36:07.000 And then as you get older, you get wiser, you get smarter, you have more knowledge, but the body just does not respond the way it used to.

01:36:15.000 Eve Edwards was talking to him and he was saying, you know, man, he's like 37 now.

01:36:20.000 He's like, I know so much now, but my body just doesn't listen.

01:36:23.000 It just doesn't do what it did when I was 20 and I didn't know as much.

01:36:28.000 I love that guy.

01:36:28.000 I love Eve.

01:36:30.000 He's a great guy.

01:36:31.000 But there's that nature balance that is sort of stopped and it's placed with injections of testosterone.

01:36:39.000 And then you're introducing this weird element into...

01:36:44.000 One of the most dangerous sports competitions the world has ever known.

01:36:47.000 Mixed martial arts.

01:36:48.000 One of the most...

01:36:49.000 There's more on the line as far as your emotions, your physical body is at risk.

01:36:55.000 There's always...

01:36:55.000 And you're sort of...

01:36:57.000 You're changing nature. 0.96

01:36:58.000 You're making it so that these old wise people now are juiced to the gills and they can train 17 hours a fucking day and it gets real weird. 0.96

01:37:09.000 It gets real weird when that's... 0.96

01:37:24.000 Right.

01:37:25.000 Right.

01:37:27.000 Right.

01:37:31.000 Through testosterone, which is what guys have been able to do for the past couple of years.

01:37:35.000 It's dangerous.

01:37:38.000 If it was golf, I wouldn't care.

01:37:41.000 If it's baseball and Sammy Sosa, Mark McGuire era, I don't really care.

01:37:46.000 But we're in a sport where we're Hitting each other in the face and choking each other unconscious.

01:37:52.000 We do not need the advantage of taking the years of experience of doing martial arts for, you know, 20 some odd years, and then giving us bodies of 20 year olds.

01:38:03.000 The physicality, the recovery, the responsiveness.

01:38:08.000 It's horrible, but guys have been doing it.

01:38:10.000 And now we're at this juncture where we're now saying, okay, it's not okay.

01:38:15.000 You can't have an athletic commission allow you to do it.

01:38:19.000 So does that mean that guys are going to do it on the side and do it orally because they know when they're going to get tested or now they're not being monitored, so they're just going to do it whenever and however they want?

01:38:28.000 What does that mean?

01:38:30.000 It's scary.

01:38:31.000 It's weird because there were a few guys that were on it for several years and they were being very successful while they were on it and then all of a sudden it gets pulled away.

01:38:40.000 So what do they do?

01:38:42.000 Do they try to bring their body up to natural levels?

01:38:45.000 See, but that takes time.

01:38:46.000 It takes a long time.

01:38:47.000 You know, for like a, I don't know, let's say a hypothetical 37-year-old that's been on testosterone for four or five years, and then he can't have it anymore.

01:38:55.000 It's going to take that guy a long time, if ever, to be able to naturally produce testosterone.

01:39:01.000 And he'll never have the levels that he had when he was on it.

01:39:03.000 No.

01:39:03.000 Because the levels he's had when he was on it were 25-year-old's levels.

01:39:06.000 Yeah.

01:39:07.000 And the other thing is the things that you can take to bring your levels back up are also banned.

01:39:12.000 Things like Clomid and all these different estrogen-producing or estrogen-suppressing devices.

01:39:20.000 All these different chemicals that people do post-steroid cycle are also illegal.

01:39:25.000 Yeah.

01:39:26.000 So it becomes, like, that was what Dennis Seaver got popped for.

01:39:30.000 He got popped for one of these post-steroid cycle things, and now he's on the shelf for nine months because of this.

01:39:38.000 Yeah, people are like, wait, wait, why was that guy, he failed a drug test because he's blocking estrogen?

01:39:43.000 Yeah.

01:39:43.000 Yeah, you have to, or otherwise you're going to grow breasts after you've been using anabolic steroids and testosterone.

01:39:49.000 Like, you have to.

01:39:50.000 Yeah, when you...

01:39:51.000 Well, see, there's testosterone replacement. 0.73

01:39:54.000 Like, if you went to a doctor and you said, you know, hey, doc, I'm 60 years old.

01:40:00.000 I would like to get on some testosterone and have a better quality of life.

01:40:03.000 The doctor will give you a slow dose of testosterone, slowly ramp you up.

01:40:08.000 He's not going to, bam, jack you and turn you into a 20-year-old.

01:40:11.000 But what a lot of fighters are doing is they're taking weight.

01:40:15.000 Way more than you would have when you were 20. And what happens is your body goes, what the fuck is going on? 0.98

01:40:20.000 And it grows tits. 0.99

01:40:21.000 Literally, your body starts producing massive amounts of estrogen to counteract the massive amounts of testosterone. 0.98

01:40:28.000 Your body gets so confused as to these levels of hormones that are completely supernatural in your body.

01:40:33.000 And... 1.00

01:40:34.000 Under those conditions, under those conditions, you develop bitch tits. 1.00

01:40:38.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:40:38.000 And a lot of guys have had them. 1.00

01:40:40.000 And you'll see this weird, like, thing. 0.95

01:40:42.000 You see this jelly, like, growing around their nipples. 0.99

01:40:46.000 And I've seen guys where they bounce up and down in the cage and they have tits. 1.00

01:40:52.000 Wait, it's remarkable to me where... 0.98

01:40:55.000 People don't understand.

01:40:56.000 We're a pugilistic sport.

01:40:58.000 Guys are trying to take every advantage, every shortcut that they possibly can.

01:41:03.000 You and I can look at a dude and we just from the texture of his skin can know if he's on a cycle, if he's off a cycle, if he was on a cycle.

01:41:13.000 By texture of their skin, you mean like zits on their back and stuff like that?

01:41:16.000 Yeah, like acne or acne scarring or...

01:41:18.000 It's possible that they have that naturally, right?

01:41:21.000 It's possible.

01:41:22.000 Some guys, but it is a sign.

01:41:23.000 It is a sign. 1.00

01:41:24.000 And then they have bitch tits. 1.00

01:41:26.000 Another sign, another clue. 1.00

01:41:28.000 Or like a guy looked one way five years ago when he was 32 and now he's 37 and he looks 10,000 times better than he ever has in his whole entire life.

01:41:37.000 You talking about Vitor Belfort?

01:41:38.000 No, I'm just giving you an example of perhaps another clue.

01:41:42.000 Okay.

01:41:42.000 You know, like, yes, I am.

01:41:44.000 Just so we're not being unclear about this.

01:41:46.000 Can you talk about what we were talking about before the show, or is that the offer?

01:41:50.000 No.

01:41:51.000 No, okay.

01:41:52.000 So, you know, he's a scapegoat, I think, a little bit for TRT, because it was a bigger problem for the entire sport, where...

01:42:03.000 He, in my opinion, just personified a problem.

01:42:07.000 And then everybody pinned everything on him.

01:42:10.000 But it was a big problem throughout the whole entire sports, which is performance-enhancing drugs.

01:42:14.000 And is it right for a 37-year-old dude like Vitor Belfort to be on testosterone for five years look amazing and fantastic while he's on it?

01:42:24.000 And nothing like he did five years ago where he was struggling, winning a fight, losing a fight.

01:42:30.000 Now he's knocking guys out with...

01:42:33.000 Crazy fight of the night, fight of the year, like knockout of the night, knockout of the year type stuff.

01:42:37.000 You know, you can't have that turnaround.

01:42:39.000 And then like, stop testosterone and two months later he's ready to go.

01:42:43.000 No, that's chemical.

01:42:44.000 You know, like, that doesn't work that way.

01:42:46.000 Yeah, how does a guy get off of it in that short of a time and then have the ability to compete again?

01:42:53.000 It would seem like it would take like a year.

01:42:55.000 If ever.

01:42:56.000 Yeah.

01:42:57.000 Chemically.

01:42:58.000 Yeah.

01:42:59.000 There's no way around it.

01:43:00.000 No.

01:43:02.000 I'm not a doctor, but having been a professional athlete for 13 years, I've never seen somebody that was so responsive to testosterone like he was and then come clean and try to be an athlete like they were when they were using performance-enhancing drugs afterwards and just miraculously...

01:43:25.000 Being as good as they were when they were on it.

01:43:27.000 It has never happened.

01:43:28.000 I can't think of a single sport, a single sportsman in history where they got popped, they were watched closely, and then performed as well after that point.

01:43:40.000 Yeah, I completely agree with you that it's so different than baseball and all these other things.

01:43:46.000 What I don't like about the baseball steroid controversy is that a young kid who's coming up who wants to play baseball almost has to do it in order to compete.

01:43:56.000 So when there's a guy like Mark McGuire who's juiced to the gills, crushing the ball out of the stadium, a young guy coming up that wants to be like Mark McGuire Most likely, unless you have incredible genetics, you're just a genetic specimen, just a weird freak of nature,

01:44:12.000 some guy who's just extreme mesomorph, you're probably not going to ever be able to do that.

01:44:18.000 Yeah, I know.

01:44:19.000 Yeah, that to me sucks, that a young guy has to risk his endocrine system and put it in it, but there's such a big difference between that and a combat sport.

01:44:29.000 Yeah. 0.83

01:44:31.000 Yeah.

01:44:31.000 I don't know what the solution is.

01:44:33.000 Testing.

01:44:34.000 Testing, right?

01:44:35.000 Year-round testing, random testing, in-fight camp, post-fight.

01:44:38.000 You know, like right now, I fought two weeks ago.

01:44:42.000 I'm getting back into training two, three times a day.

01:44:44.000 This is when a guy...

01:44:47.000 Test him.

01:44:48.000 And just show up.

01:44:50.000 Hi!

01:44:50.000 Yeah.

01:44:50.000 Joe Silva's about to throw an offer my way, let's say, to fight in 10 weeks.

01:44:56.000 He knows he's going to throw an offer my way.

01:44:58.000 Before he throws the offer my way, a guy from the Athletic Commission in the respective state that I'm going to be fighting in shows up and says, hey, pee in the cup.

01:45:07.000 That's how you're going to get a fair, equal system.

01:45:11.000 Not where you tell a guy in Brazil, hey, you need to come up here and take a drug test. 0.96

01:45:15.000 And he's like, oh yeah, man, I'll be there in like four days.

01:45:20.000 No, dude.

01:45:22.000 Athletic Commission guy shows up randomly, And right there, peanut of the cup.

01:45:29.000 And when you catch someone, I think it should be more than nine months.

01:45:33.000 And I think in this day and age, you should let everybody know, hey, look, we're going to cut you.

01:45:38.000 You're not going to fight for this organization anymore.

01:45:40.000 And let them know and then just say, this is the rule.

01:45:43.000 This is where we're at right now.

01:45:45.000 So everyone's been served notice.

01:45:47.000 Everyone knows what the repercussions are of this illegal activity that puts people in jeopardy.

01:45:52.000 My real concern is medical science is not going to stop.

01:45:57.000 Medical science and the innovative...

01:46:01.000 The way guys are going to cheat.

01:46:03.000 Not just cheat, but just the things that they're going to come up with to change the human body.

01:46:09.000 Just restorative capabilities of new advancements and new techniques.

01:46:14.000 You could say that getting in that cryo chamber.

01:46:18.000 If you can do that cryo chamber and another guy can't do that cryo chamber, do you have an advantage?

01:46:22.000 Is it an unfair advantage?

01:46:24.000 Where do you draw the line?

01:46:26.000 Should you be able to take creatine?

01:46:27.000 Well, creatine's legal.

01:46:28.000 Doesn't that increase muscle power and It does.

01:46:31.000 It increases your ability to work harder.

01:46:33.000 It's like, where is the line?

01:46:36.000 Can you take tribulus?

01:46:37.000 Can you take, you know, on its T-plus?

01:46:40.000 We're having great results with that T-plus stuff where guys are showing these 50% increases in rates of lifting and their rate of progress over people that are not taking it and double-blind placebos.

01:46:53.000 Like, when does it become legal and when does it become cheating?

01:46:57.000 When is it like a nice supplement and when is it a performance-enhancing drug?

01:47:03.000 I think one of the big things is what does it do to your body in the long run?

01:47:09.000 Right.

01:47:09.000 You know, when you're using a supplement, we'll just call them all supplements, we'll just even remove performance-enhancing drugs from the discussion, just a supplement that does In the short term, great benefits.

01:47:23.000 In the long term, big damage.

01:47:25.000 When you have WWE stars that are dying at 41 from heart attacks, and lo and behold, they've been doing steroids for 12 years, it's tragic, it's sad, but not surprising.

01:47:35.000 Isn't a lot of those guys, it's pain pills.

01:47:37.000 Yeah.

01:47:38.000 Those guys are... 0.96

01:47:39.000 Folks who don't respect pro wrestlers, I know a lot of people think that, oh, it's all fake, it's silly. 0.71

01:47:45.000 Those guys work hard.

01:47:48.000 And damage their bodies.

01:47:49.000 All the time.

01:47:51.000 If you watch those guys flying through the air and jumping on each other, that's not a free ride.

01:47:55.000 They're getting hurt all the time.

01:47:57.000 And a huge problem in that world is guys that get hooked on pain pills, man.

01:48:03.000 So they damage their body, but then they have a show next Saturday.

01:48:07.000 They have to...

01:48:09.000 You know, McMahon's like, no, you've got to perform, bro.

01:48:12.000 That's like, you're on contract.

01:48:13.000 You're going to get paid.

01:48:14.000 Like, I can't move my hands right now.

01:48:17.000 Like, I can't use my fingers.

01:48:18.000 All right, well, take this.

01:48:20.000 You know, now everything doesn't hurt and you'll be able to perform because that's what's important.

01:48:25.000 Yeah.

01:48:25.000 Yeah, it becomes like a thing where there's things that you can take that elevate your body's natural production of testosterone, and they can enhance your body's production.

01:48:34.000 But what they don't do is introduce synthetic versions of it that shut down your endocrine system. 0.95

01:48:39.000 What they don't do is give you these hyperhuman levels that are causing you to grow tits. 0.83

01:48:45.000 You know, there's...

01:48:47.000 There's got to be like a comfortable medium between eating healthy, having benefits like the cryo chamber and all these different things that do enhance recovery, but don't put you and your body in danger.

01:49:00.000 Don't burn you out in the short term. 0.99

01:49:03.000 You know, to give you, like, the rest of your life, you're fucked. 1.00

01:49:06.000 You know, from 35 on, your body's just devastated. 1.00

01:49:10.000 And it's not going to be black and white.

01:49:11.000 You know, it's not going to be a line drawn in the sand.

01:49:14.000 You know, that line needs to be able to be moved.

01:49:15.000 You know, it needs to have, you know, commissions and medical professionals that can adjust and adapt to what's happening, you know, with the growth of science.

01:49:23.000 You know, like, there's a reason why we're breaking records at every Olympics.

01:49:26.000 We're getting better.

01:49:27.000 You know, like, with the human body, how to make it perform better.

01:49:30.000 Um...

01:49:31.000 Having people that are smarter than me figure out where those lines are and move them.

01:49:36.000 But that line has to be there.

01:49:39.000 It can be a mobile line that they move from year to year, but that line has to be there.

01:49:44.000 And when guys step across it...

01:49:47.000 You know, there has to be repercussions.

01:49:49.000 My concern is what's really going to happen in the future, which happens with almost anything that involves human innovation.

01:49:57.000 Like if you look back at the cell phones of the 1990s where they had these fucking giant bricks and they'd hold them up to the head and wrap videos.

01:50:04.000 Now you can go anywhere in the world in a third world country in an impoverished neighborhood and people have these really small Incredibly complex cell phones that are just these magical devices that allow you to interface with the entire knowledge base of the world.

01:50:19.000 And they're everywhere.

01:50:20.000 I wonder what's going to happen when you have the kind of technology that they're working on right now, genetic engineering, at a cellular level where they're able to change people.

01:50:30.000 I mean, I'm sure you're aware of the myostatin inhibitors, like these things that they've demonstrated in Whippets, these dogs.

01:50:39.000 Just because of breeding, just a mistake in breeding, they've produced these super hyper-muscular dogs that have double the muscle, and cows as well.

01:50:49.000 Have you ever seen those images?

01:50:50.000 It's incredible, right?

01:50:52.000 Well, people are being born, just born with it.

01:50:55.000 A kid in Germany was born just a genetic mistake or a benefit to him. 0.55

01:51:00.000 Well, they're going to be able to figure that out with a pill or with a shot. 1.00

01:51:03.000 And your fucking mailman's going to have it. 1.00

01:51:05.000 Your mailman's going to look like the Hulk. 0.99

01:51:07.000 And when that happens, when it's everywhere, what do we do with athletes?

01:51:14.000 The Germans were trying it with eugenetics. 0.94

01:51:16.000 We've done it periodically throughout history.

01:51:18.000 The Spartans did it.

01:51:20.000 What did the Spartans do?

01:51:21.000 They'd throw babies that didn't meet their requirements off the cliff. 0.99

01:51:26.000 Yeah.

01:51:27.000 There's eugenetics at a very primal level.

01:51:29.000 It happens in nature all the time where a mom will be like, this cub is not going to be able to walk. 1.00

01:51:35.000 I'm leaving it.

01:51:37.000 So that's eugenetics.

01:51:39.000 That's survival of the fittest.

01:51:40.000 Now, we as super too smart for our own good sometimes, humans can take eugenetics and fix it with chemistry. 0.76

01:51:50.000 That's scary.

01:51:51.000 Where we can just magically pop out superhuman.

01:51:54.000 I don't know if I'm ready for that.

01:51:56.000 I don't know if anyone's ready for it.

01:51:58.000 Or the implications of what that means morally.

01:52:00.000 If we don't get hit by an asteroid or invaded by aliens or blow each other up with nukes, it's common. 0.95

01:52:05.000 They're not going to stop. 0.99

01:52:07.000 There's eggheads that are in laboratories right now that are constantly working on new shit. 0.99

01:52:12.000 And that's what they do. 1.00

01:52:14.000 And that's what humans do.

01:52:15.000 We push the boundaries of innovation.

01:52:17.000 We always have.

01:52:18.000 It's part of what makes us human.

01:52:19.000 It's why we're on a podcast right now talking to a microphone that neither you nor I could have ever figured out on our own.

01:52:24.000 It's just a part of the program.

01:52:26.000 And They're gonna figure out something, man.

01:52:27.000 They're gonna inject you with nanobots or some sort of a new chemical that allows your body to work like Spider-Man. 0.97

01:52:35.000 I mean, you're gonna fucking climb walls. 0.63

01:52:37.000 You're gonna have incredible balance. 0.75

01:52:39.000 They're gonna figure out a way to stop traumatic brain injury by re-engineering the human mind. 0.99

01:52:44.000 There's gonna be a lot of crazy shit. 0.79

01:52:46.000 It might not be in our lifetimes, but our children's children, for sure, are gonna experience human beings that no one has ever experienced in the entire... 0.97

01:52:55.000 History of the world itself.

01:52:57.000 Yeah.

01:52:58.000 It's coming.

01:52:59.000 It's coming by human innovation.

01:53:00.000 It's going to leapfrog evolution.

01:53:03.000 I'm not sure I want to...

01:53:04.000 I'm kind of sad that I'm going to miss it, maybe.

01:53:07.000 Because I want to reap the benefits of it.

01:53:09.000 But then at the flip side, I don't want to have to deal with the implications of that.

01:53:16.000 I'm sad that I'm going to miss it, too.

01:53:17.000 Or we might not miss it.

01:53:19.000 We might just catch the wave. 0.99

01:53:21.000 But I'm also glad that I saw the world before a lot of shit was there. 0.98

01:53:27.000 Like, my kids are going to grow up in a world... 0.98

01:53:30.000 I have a 17-year-old, and she doesn't have any idea what life was like before the internet.

01:53:34.000 She has no idea.

01:53:35.000 The internet's always been there.

01:53:36.000 If she has a question, oh, there's the answer.

01:53:39.000 I grew up, I was retarded when I was her age. 0.95

01:53:42.000 And I put it in her head every day. 1.00

01:53:43.000 I go, let me tell you, if you met me, if I was 17 and you were 17, you would think, oh my god, this is the dumbest fucking guy that's ever walked the face of the earth. 1.00

01:53:50.000 And he thinks he's so smart. 1.00

01:53:52.000 I was an idiot! 0.99

01:53:53.000 I knew how to throw kicks, and I knew which Stephen King books I liked. 1.00

01:53:59.000 That's it! 1.00

01:53:59.000 I knew the right combination of words to say to get a girl to fuck me. 1.00

01:54:04.000 Sometimes, that's it. 1.00

01:54:05.000 That's all I knew. 1.00

01:54:05.000 I was a moron. 1.00

01:54:06.000 Like, what a 17-year-old knows today, as opposed to what they knew when I was... 1.00

01:54:10.000 Now, the future is going to be even crazier than that, but at least I got a perspective.

01:54:16.000 I got to see what it was like to grow up, where you didn't know... 0.97

01:54:21.000 If you called someone and they weren't home, they just weren't fucking home. 0.98

01:54:24.000 You know? 1.00

01:54:25.000 I remember when answer machines were invented, where people were like, holy shit! 0.91

01:54:30.000 You'd go on the internet and you'd hear this beep. 0.87

01:54:32.000 Yeah. 0.99

01:54:36.000 And it was slow as fuck. 0.99

01:54:38.000 And if you wanted to see a picture of something, it would be like click, click, click, click, click, click. 0.99

01:54:42.000 And maybe it was black, white, and green.

01:54:44.000 Yeah.

01:54:45.000 Variations of those three.

01:54:46.000 Oh, yeah.

01:54:47.000 Yeah.

01:54:48.000 Well, I remember when internet searches first came about, too.

01:54:51.000 When you would first find...

01:54:53.000 I got a great story.

01:54:54.000 There was...

01:54:55.000 We don't even need to say the name of the organization, but a buddy of mine used to be co-owner of a small mixed martial arts organization.

01:55:03.000 And this was in the late 90s.

01:55:05.000 And they were just starting to...

01:55:09.000 Promote fighters through the internet, and they were just starting to do bios where they would research a guy through the internet.

01:55:15.000 Well, they researched this guy and they find out that a guy with the exact same name won something called the Hungriest Butt Contest. 0.97

01:55:25.000 So their gladiator, their heavyweight, their Adonis, 6'4", shredded man with his penthouse pet girlfriend that he would parade around at all these events also had done gay porn. 0.98

01:55:39.000 And so they pull down the picture. 0.98

01:55:42.000 They download some pictures.

01:55:43.000 And my friend described it as like, you see click, click, click, click, click, click.

01:55:47.000 You know how those pictures would slowly show up on a 56K modem?

01:55:51.000 It would, like, you would get the top of it, and it would slowly start to pan down.

01:55:54.000 And as it pans down, well, that looks like his hair.

01:55:57.000 Click, click, click.

01:55:57.000 That looks like it could be his forehead.

01:55:59.000 Click, click.

01:56:00.000 Well, that's his eyes.

01:56:01.000 Click, click, click. 1.00

01:56:01.000 That's a dick in his mouth. 1.00

01:56:03.000 Oh, my God. 1.00

01:56:04.000 And there's a dick in his ass. 1.00

01:56:05.000 Oh, my God. 1.00

01:56:06.000 And there's two guys using him, like, Chinese finger handcuffs.

01:56:09.000 And they're like, whoa.

01:56:10.000 And so this dude had no idea that that was even possible to internet.

01:56:15.000 He'd use the same name.

01:56:17.000 Yeah. 0.93

01:56:17.000 You know, he just figured, ah, no one's going to look that up but homos. 0.93

01:56:20.000 You know?

01:56:21.000 Thank you.

01:56:22.000 And then they did.

01:56:23.000 Yeah.

01:56:23.000 Well, they also said, you know, he needed a lot of money, and they gave him some money, so he did it once.

01:56:28.000 Turn around, he did like 100 films.

01:56:30.000 It was a lot.

01:56:32.000 He did a lot.

01:56:33.000 How good could it be?

01:56:34.000 The joke is, I would say, you know, what does a lot of money mean to you? 0.97

01:56:39.000 A lot of money to me means I do one gay porno, and I live like in a Jay-Z video for the rest of my life. 0.90

01:56:46.000 You know, I'm in my underwear with two bottles of Cristal on a yacht with a thousand models forever. 0.85

01:56:52.000 If he did a hundred porns, he should have all the money on the planet by my calculations.

01:56:57.000 Yeah, there's no one richer ever.

01:56:59.000 Anywhere. 1.00

01:57:00.000 Fucking his con. 1.00

01:57:02.000 Fuck everyone who's ever lived, who's got money. 1.00

01:57:04.000 That guy would have all the money. 1.00

01:57:06.000 Every country would be bankrupt, and this guy's bank account would have all the cash.

01:57:10.000 Yeah.

01:57:11.000 But the thing is, it's just like no one knew before that that an internet search was a possibility.

01:57:17.000 And think about how many people that have done things that just had no idea, well, you're going to be able to find that out?

01:57:23.000 And find it out on your phone.

01:57:26.000 Just...

01:57:27.000 And be able to access the person that said content is about.

01:57:32.000 Never in our history, in mankind's existence, have we been able to connect so effortlessly to so many different people.

01:57:40.000 A fan that doesn't like me can just get on Twitter and tell me that I'm a baby killer just because.

01:57:47.000 Or they can do anything, anytime, anywhere.

01:57:51.000 You can find out anything about anybody and then probably reach that person.

01:57:55.000 Especially a fighter or someone who's got a social media account or a presence.

01:57:59.000 Who doesn't have a social media account?

01:58:00.000 There's a few folks that I know that just avoid it all together, but they don't have to do it.

01:58:05.000 350 million people here.

01:58:08.000 Almost all of them?

01:58:09.000 And Mexicans. 0.99

01:58:11.000 Gotta count Mexicans. 0.98

01:58:12.000 It's probably another 50 million?

01:58:14.000 At least.

01:58:14.000 Who knows how many?

01:58:16.000 I love Mexicans.

01:58:17.000 Don't get me wrong.

01:58:18.000 But there's a lot of them that aren't taking the census. 0.99

01:58:22.000 How often do you get fucked with on social media? 0.99

01:58:25.000 Oh, all the time. 0.99

01:58:26.000 All the time.

01:58:27.000 I guess I'm like a polarizing figure.

01:58:28.000 I don't know how.

01:58:29.000 I think I'm kind of a likable guy, but for some reason...

01:58:33.000 People have a problem with strength.

01:58:35.000 People have a problem with confidence.

01:58:37.000 People have a problem with folks that have strong opinions or controversial opinions.

01:58:42.000 A lot of those.

01:58:43.000 Well, you know, you should.

01:58:45.000 I think anybody who's paying attention to the world and sees all the contradictory information that we're receiving, sees the chaos, just sees how fucked our political system is, our financial system, if you don't have strong opinions.

01:59:00.000 If you don't have controversial opinions, you're not paying attention. 0.70

01:59:04.000 Open your eyes.

01:59:05.000 Yeah.

01:59:05.000 I mean, I can't tell you how many conversations I've had about gun control, just about guns itself.

01:59:13.000 I'm like, goddamn, guns aren't the problem. 0.98

01:59:15.000 It's people that use guns that are the problem. 1.00

01:59:18.000 You know that old adage, guns don't kill people, people kill people. 0.99

01:59:22.000 And people will fucking argue that to the end of time. 0.99

01:59:25.000 Goddammit, it's true. 0.99

01:59:26.000 Every time you go to the gas station, you've got a store in that gas station that sells lighters.

01:59:30.000 You've got fluid that comes out of a pump.

01:59:32.000 And anyone can just light people on fire.

01:59:36.000 I mean, anyone can do it.

01:59:38.000 It hasn't happened that often, but anyone can do it.

01:59:41.000 Or just take your car and turn two degrees to the right and run down the sidewalk.

01:59:46.000 Yeah. 0.98

01:59:46.000 The option to kill is always there. 0.98

01:59:49.000 It's always there.

01:59:50.000 It's a choice.

01:59:51.000 But it's a tool, it's a mechanism that serves no other purpose.

01:59:54.000 A car can get you from point A to point B, so why do they need a gun if the only thing it does is kill?

02:00:01.000 I could say the same thing about a tractor if I wanted to.

02:00:04.000 If I wanted to make a killer tractor, the only thing that it's designed for is to kill because I put spikes on its wheels and it doesn't excavate anything besides human souls.

02:00:13.000 Yeah. 0.99

02:00:14.000 No, it's the choice to kill.

02:00:17.000 It's like, get over it.

02:00:18.000 People kill.

02:00:19.000 It is a way that they can do it easily, and that is an issue.

02:00:24.000 But it's also, why does a person have the ability to do that?

02:00:31.000 And how come so little effort and so little emphasis is on what causes a person to be able to disconnect or to be able to have so much hate and anger in their heart that they can kill a bunch of school children?

02:00:43.000 That they can use a gun to shoot up a mall.

02:00:46.000 Why isn't that the subject of discussion?

02:00:49.000 And why is it always the tool for madness?

02:00:51.000 It's not the madness itself.

02:00:53.000 It's the tool of madness.

02:00:54.000 But that same tool could be used by anyone else to do a million other things.

02:00:59.000 It's a bad analogy, but it's one that I always use with marijuana.

02:01:02.000 People go, oh, you could ruin your life if you smoke pot.

02:01:05.000 You could... 1.00

02:01:06.000 You could also take a hammer and hit yourself in the dick. 1.00

02:01:10.000 You know, should we make hammers illegal? 1.00

02:01:12.000 Because a hammer is just a tool. 0.93

02:01:14.000 If you take marijuana and just enjoy it and you don't hurt anybody, should that person be penalized because someone decided to just wake and bake every day and then fucking go into debt and wind up... 0.99

02:01:27.000 Humans are the problem. 0.99

02:01:29.000 And human weakness and a lack of character and all sorts of chemical imbalances.

02:01:35.000 Or the culture and the structure around the person that led them to subsequently make these horrific decisions and actions that they use, whatever tool, don't care what it is, gun, knife, everything up to that point is what we should, the emphasis of trying to understand or prevent and acknowledge and research should be done.

02:01:55.000 Not take away, you know...

02:01:58.000 Whatever it was that was the end conclusion, it's all the things up to that point that are important, that nobody pays attention to, nobody cares about.

02:02:05.000 That's what's ridiculous about any sort of control, gun control, knife control, bow and arrow control debate.

02:02:13.000 It's not that.

02:02:14.000 It's what constitutes—what makes a human being capable of horrific things.

02:02:20.000 And I think you're uniquely qualified for a bunch of reasons.

02:02:23.000 One, because you have a family.

02:02:24.000 You know what it's like to raise a person. 0.98

02:02:26.000 And two, you've seen the consequences of human beings when they're in this environment that is totally fucked— From the jump and you see these religious fanatics and you see fundamentalism, you see chaos and a land that's just overrun with it. 0.98

02:02:46.000 It's humans. 0.97

02:02:47.000 It's the development of humans.

02:02:49.000 In error.

02:02:50.000 They use the development, erroneously, like the development of human, the wrong way.

02:02:55.000 There's the right way.

02:02:57.000 Not there's the right way.

02:02:59.000 There's about a billion right ways.

02:03:01.000 And there's a couple of wrong ways.

02:03:03.000 And the couple of wrong ways end up with...

02:03:06.000 Bad products.

02:03:07.000 And it's, again, it's a sort of contradictory thing that through combat and through, you know, especially through martial arts, I think the deepest bond of commitment that I've ever experienced, outside of my family, is the friends that I've trained with and people that I've competed with. 0.99

02:03:24.000 That have just, you see them, you know who the fuck they are.

02:03:29.000 When you see a guy break in training, when you see a guy You know, with 30 seconds to go in the round, put his hands down on his knees and just take deep breaths and step away. 0.99

02:03:38.000 And then you see the coach go, get back in there!

02:03:40.000 And you see him suck it up and, you know, there's the guys who suck it up and there's the guys who don't. 0.97

02:03:45.000 And you see the difference. 0.52

02:03:46.000 You see who they are.

02:03:47.000 You see their soul.

02:03:48.000 And you learn about people that way in a way that a lot of folks don't ever get a chance to learn even about themselves.

02:03:55.000 Yeah.

02:03:55.000 The refiner's fire is like this beautiful thing.

02:03:59.000 The what?

02:04:00.000 Say that again?

02:04:00.000 Refiner's fire.

02:04:01.000 Refiner's fire?

02:04:02.000 Yeah.

02:04:03.000 You take a metal.

02:04:04.000 Refineries.

02:04:05.000 Yeah.

02:04:05.000 Right.

02:04:05.000 Okay.

02:04:06.000 Like when you're making a sword, you know, the folding process of heating it up and pounding out the impurities and folding it again and pounding out the impurities.

02:04:14.000 Like the hotter the fire, the more bad stuff gets cooked out.

02:04:18.000 Yeah.

02:04:19.000 That's the same with people. 0.58

02:04:20.000 You put them in a room that's hot, put them in a gi that's hot, around a whole bunch of other dudes that are trying to choke each other out and kill you. 0.99

02:04:29.000 You get glimpses of the depth and hardness of somebody's character and soul.

02:04:33.000 And it's these awesome snapshots.

02:04:36.000 And even kids, down at the youngest level, putting them into competitions of martial arts, you see the exact same thing.

02:04:42.000 You see the development of this character and of somebody's soul as they get tougher and...

02:04:49.000 Deeper, you know, as a human.

02:04:51.000 And in these snapshots, you get a clear glimpse of who that person is.

02:04:56.000 What's part of them?

02:04:57.000 You're like, it's gorgeous.

02:04:59.000 Cron Gracie said it best. 0.98

02:05:00.000 He said, you know, I... Reserve judgment until I've trained with you.

02:05:06.000 Yeah.

02:05:08.000 He said, I think, you know, you seem like a nice guy, but I reserve judgment until I've trained with you, which is such a great way to put it. 0.97

02:05:16.000 And, you know, a lot of people think, well, I don't want to fucking train you. 0.95

02:05:19.000 You don't have to. 0.97

02:05:19.000 It's not that. 0.97

02:05:20.000 It's just you should in your life do something difficult.

02:05:24.000 If it is not martial arts, maybe it's mountain climbing, maybe it's hiking, maybe it's anything.

02:05:29.000 Mud runs.

02:05:29.000 It doesn't matter.

02:05:30.000 Do something that's hard to do.

02:05:32.000 Maybe it's write a book. 0.99

02:05:33.000 Find out what your fucking barriers are. 1.00

02:05:35.000 Because the most reprehensible thing, the thing that we all pretty much universally despise, is a spoiled rich kid. 1.00

02:05:42.000 A spoiled kid that never had to work for anything.

02:05:45.000 They were handed it their whole life.

02:05:46.000 Their parents never gave them values.

02:05:48.000 And what'd they do? 1.00

02:05:49.000 They grew up yelling at servants and then they become some rich asshole that's a sociopath. 0.99

02:05:54.000 I mean, that's a key character in so many movies, in so many books, literature. 0.99

02:06:00.000 We all can relate to that person who didn't earn it, who got that place without hard work and how gross they are. 1.00

02:06:07.000 I hate that pussy. 1.00

02:06:08.000 Fucking everybody does. 1.00

02:06:09.000 You're supposed to. 0.99

02:06:11.000 They're not supposed to be there.

02:06:13.000 It's not supposed to happen.

02:06:14.000 You're not supposed to win the lottery like that. 0.98

02:06:16.000 That fucks you up. 0.98

02:06:17.000 But...

02:06:18.000 The really remarkable ones that are the ones that could or have access to all of that and then choose not to, or on the total flip side, the guys that have access to none of that and challenge themselves and put themselves through hardships, the Aldos.

02:06:34.000 They have nothing, and just through hard work, determination, they become something.

02:06:40.000 Those are two complete polar opposites of a human that I adore.

02:06:45.000 Yes.

02:06:46.000 In the military, you see these guys, you're like this Ivy League, super rich, you're enlisted.

02:06:55.000 Why are you here?

02:06:56.000 You could have done anything.

02:06:58.000 They're like, I wanted to be here.

02:07:00.000 I love you.

02:07:00.000 You're amazing.

02:07:01.000 And then the flip side, the Puerto Rican that his parents swam over here or on some horrible boat. 1.00

02:07:09.000 And, you know, they're one generation removed and they have, like, they put themselves through college or maybe they, like, joined the military so they could go to college and they're at this exact same point of their life as this rich yuppie guy that are just there because they want to see how far they can push themselves.

02:07:27.000 Yeah, human beings are just, we are just a mass of potential.

02:07:32.000 And it's awesome to see someone rise through adversity and reach a potential that elevates us all.

02:07:40.000 Because when you see someone reach their potential or reach a very high level of anything, it changes the way you look at what's possible.

02:07:48.000 When you see a guy who gets up at 6 o'clock in the morning, the alarm clock goes off, And he just fucking hits those hills and starts running and he does it every morning before work. 1.00

02:07:57.000 You go, fuck, I'm a bitch. 1.00

02:07:58.000 I'm just a weak bitch. 1.00

02:07:59.000 I don't do that. 1.00

02:08:00.000 Fuck. 1.00

02:08:00.000 And then it changes your perspective. 1.00

02:08:01.000 You want to do that too.

02:08:03.000 You want to absorb a little bit of that guy's strength and that feeling that you get from being around that guy.

02:08:08.000 It's empowering. 1.00

02:08:09.000 Or you're one of those guys that diminishes that and tries to squash it because you're insecure and you want to tweet Tim Kennedy, you fucking bitch and fuck you and fuck the military, man. 1.00

02:08:22.000 There's folks like that, too. 1.00

02:08:24.000 I think that strength is the best antidote for a lot of the weaknesses that we find in our society that we consider to be strength, like bullies.

02:08:35.000 People say, what's the best solution to bullies?

02:08:37.000 Teach them how to fight.

02:08:39.000 Teach them all how to fight.

02:08:40.000 Everyone.

02:08:41.000 I think that is a core problem with men.

02:08:44.000 Men have a giant fear hanging over their head all day long, and that is being dominated by other men. 1.00

02:08:50.000 You know, I mean, what led me to martial arts 100% was I was scared of dudes kicking my ass. 0.99

02:08:57.000 So I got into martial arts as a very young kid because of that. 0.96

02:09:00.000 And I think that the more kids, if we had programs in school where we taught martial arts to kids in class, You would have so few instances of bullying.

02:09:11.000 I think the dramatic decrease in bullying and the respect that people have for each other would change.

02:09:17.000 The respect that people have for themselves.

02:09:20.000 A bully cannot respect themselves.

02:09:22.000 They just can't.

02:09:23.000 Unless there's some sort of a complete sociopath, you're not going to be happy with yourself if you pick on someone smaller than you.

02:09:29.000 You're doing it because you're insecure. 0.80

02:09:30.000 But if you weren't insecure or you were less insecure or you had some sort of sense of personal sovereignty because of training, you would have less of this inclination to do something shitty to someone like that.

02:09:42.000 Yeah, it'd be cool to see. 1.00

02:09:44.000 Fuck yeah, man. 0.99

02:09:45.000 I think martial arts programs should be mandatory in school, just like they have P.E.'s mandatory for boys, especially. 1.00

02:09:53.000 Martial arts should be mandatory.

02:09:54.000 Yeah, you want to see your kid have discipline, focus, understanding of right and wrong, a little bit of confidence, restraint.

02:10:03.000 Put him in martial arts.

02:10:05.000 Yeah.

02:10:06.000 You did it so you didn't get beat up.

02:10:08.000 I did it because I was second born.

02:10:11.000 I was a crazy middle kid.

02:10:13.000 My dad's like, at a very early age, like, you are going to be doing martial arts.

02:10:18.000 So I was like nine, and I remember saying a bad word on the mat and having my sensei come up with a screamer stick and hit me in the back of the head.

02:10:27.000 I messed up in doing something.

02:10:29.000 He's like, ah.

02:10:30.000 And then I said a bad word when I messed up, and then pow!

02:10:33.000 I didn't say that bad word again, but more importantly, I was able to control myself, which was the necessary element that I needed.

02:10:42.000 And also the great feeling of accomplishment that you get when you learn that you can control yourself.

02:10:48.000 When you feel yourself improving, you feel your character improving, and you have a difficult situation and you navigate it successfully, and you go, oh, I'm a better person now than I was when I was...

02:11:00.000 Whatever. 0.99

02:11:01.000 When I was young and stupid. 1.00

02:11:03.000 And that's just one of those things where everybody wants to be comfortable. 0.99

02:11:06.000 Everybody wants to look towards their golden age and everybody wants to retire and sit on the couch and put your feet up. 0.98

02:11:12.000 That's horseshit. 0.95

02:11:13.000 That's not... 0.99

02:11:14.000 You only can experience that and enjoy it if you've earned it.

02:11:19.000 No one wants to earn it.

02:11:21.000 The earning it is the most important part of your life.

02:11:24.000 Individual responsibility.

02:11:26.000 Nobody has it.

02:11:27.000 You gotta earn it.

02:11:27.000 You gotta work for it.

02:11:28.000 You gotta, you know...

02:11:31.000 And it's so much better when you do.

02:11:32.000 Yes.

02:11:33.000 Well, that's why I think guys like you are important, man.

02:11:35.000 I think you set a great example on that.

02:11:37.000 I think you set a great example with your words.

02:11:39.000 I think you set a great example with your actions.

02:11:41.000 It's one of the reasons why I've been wanting to talk to you on the podcast.

02:11:44.000 You're a very inspirational guy, in my opinion.

02:11:46.000 I think the way you talk about things and the way you express yourself, it's admirable and I think it helps people.

02:11:55.000 It sets a very high standard and I think setting a high standard is one of the key things that young men and I'm sure young women as well need in life.

02:12:05.000 They need to see a high standard.

02:12:07.000 I'm not perfect.

02:12:08.000 I make mistakes probably way too much or more often than I like to admit.

02:12:14.000 But I'm always searching and seeking to get better.

02:12:19.000 And I think that's something that I always try to project.

02:12:23.000 And the only way to get there is like you've just said.

02:12:26.000 It's through hard work.

02:12:27.000 It's through determination.

02:12:28.000 It's through the amazing innate part of the human being, which is the ability to do.

02:12:35.000 You know, and to not quit and to have the inner strength to try to achieve and surpass whatever it was before.

02:12:41.000 And there's beauty in imperfection.

02:12:44.000 You know, this idea that you're going to be this enlightened Kwai Chang Kang character like in the TV show.

02:12:49.000 You got to take a leak?

02:12:50.000 Go ahead, head on.

02:12:51.000 I saw you drinking that gigantic smart water.

02:12:53.000 There's dudes who have bladders like mine who could just power through a three-hour podcast.

02:12:58.000 And then there's guys like Tim Kennedy.

02:13:00.000 You know, it's cool.

02:13:01.000 It's like, you know, we all learn.

02:13:03.000 We just, we show.

02:13:04.000 We show that there's higher levels. 1.00

02:13:06.000 My fucking bladder, bro. 1.00

02:13:08.000 It's like a duffel bag that you can carry guns in. 1.00

02:13:11.000 It's large and it's durable and it gets dirty and filled with liquid.

02:13:16.000 But don't worry about it.

02:13:17.000 I can hang in there.

02:13:19.000 What I was saying to Tim that's important is...

02:13:22.000 I think everybody has this idea that there's some guy out there that's like Jet Li, that's like a perfect person, some character.

02:13:29.000 The beauty really is in the imperfection.

02:13:32.000 The beauty is in knowing that we're all just these weird, flawed creatures that are trying to figure out.

02:13:42.000 It's not even that we're flawed, it's just that we're dealing with an impossible amount of variables that we're constantly navigating.

02:13:51.000 This idea that you should have gotten it right.

02:13:55.000 It's not what it is.

02:13:56.000 The idea is that you learn from what you get wrong, and then that thing you don't do the same way next time.

02:14:05.000 You say, you know what, I made a mistake the last time I was in a similar situation.

02:14:09.000 Now I know that, and so now I'm going to power through with the knowledge that I've accumulated in my life from my past mistakes.

02:14:18.000 That's a huge factor about being a person. 0.98

02:14:21.000 A huge factor is that we're all learning from each other and I said a lot of cool shit when you were gone.

02:14:30.000 But learning and learning from each other is the whole reason why it's great to have inspirational people to draw from and I think that now There's never been a time like this where you could just go on YouTube and you could be inspired for 24 hours a day, 0.75

02:14:49.000 7 days a week.

02:14:50.000 You could watch videos of guys pushing through things. 0.83

02:14:53.000 Guys are doing fucking 100 mile ultra marathons and just seeing people talk about the things that inspire them and what pushes them.

02:15:02.000 There's never been a time like this where inspiration is available everywhere you look. 0.98

02:15:09.000 Not everybody's inspired the same way.

02:15:13.000 I think it's amazing to see a guy that has nothing do something remarkable.

02:15:19.000 Not the underdog, but that has no resources.

02:15:24.000 There's this guy in Austin, Texas.

02:15:27.000 He runs this running group called the Gilbert Gazelles.

02:15:32.000 The Hutu, when the genocide was occurring, he has these burns on his body because his family was murdered and he was piled into this pile of bodies and set on fire.

02:15:43.000 And once the militias left from the Hutu and Tutus, he got up and started running.

02:15:49.000 Then he went to the NCAA and started running there.

02:15:51.000 And then he went to the Olympics.

02:15:52.000 And now he runs.

02:15:53.000 He's an inspirational dude in Austin that just...

02:15:57.000 Tells people to run.

02:15:59.000 And he's one of the most remarkable human beings.

02:16:01.000 And there's tons of people out there that are so amazing and remarkable.

02:16:05.000 And if you just look, you can find them.

02:16:08.000 I love latching on to people like that and just trying to get into what's in there.

02:16:14.000 I don't want to say steal it, but I want some of that.

02:16:16.000 Well, you don't steal it because they still have it.

02:16:18.000 They'll always have it.

02:16:19.000 Yeah, but you absorb some of it.

02:16:21.000 It's very important.

02:16:23.000 We surround ourselves with inspirational people and we become inspired. 0.97

02:16:27.000 Surround yourself with negative cunts and your life is going to be a wreck. 0.97

02:16:31.000 A lot of people don't realize that and they just try to work through these negative cunts in their life. 1.00

02:16:36.000 You've got to cut them off, man. 0.99

02:16:38.000 You've got to cut them off and keep moving because they will hold you back.

02:16:41.000 There are crabs in that bucket, and when you try to reach the top of that bucket, they will latch ahold of your little crab legs and drag you down with them.

02:16:48.000 My dad was so...

02:16:49.000 Retrospectively, my dad was so wise when he's like, no, you don't want those guys around you.

02:16:54.000 You're going to be who you surround yourself with.

02:16:57.000 I was like, whatever.

02:16:58.000 That guy is so cool.

02:16:59.000 I want to hang with that guy.

02:17:00.000 Now I'm like...

02:17:01.000 God dang it.

02:17:03.000 It's hard.

02:17:04.000 How did he know so early?

02:17:05.000 There's always going to be people that will...

02:17:07.000 But those people are also important because you learn. 0.99

02:17:11.000 You learn from watching them fuck their lives up. 0.98

02:17:14.000 I've never done cocaine. 0.95

02:17:16.000 And one of the reasons why I never did cocaine is because I grew up with a buddy of mine whose cousin was selling cocaine.

02:17:23.000 And I watched this guy fall apart.

02:17:25.000 Him and his girlfriend would just do blow, and they would hide out in their place, and they would... 0.98

02:17:29.000 They had this attic apartment, and they would just fucking watch TV all day, and they would shrink. 1.00

02:17:34.000 Like, their fucking face was shrinking, their body was shrinking. 1.00

02:17:37.000 All they would do was do coke. 1.00

02:17:38.000 I didn't even know if they ate.

02:17:39.000 You know, and I watched this guy.

02:17:41.000 It was like a guy who got bit by a vampire and became, like, this disease thing. 1.00

02:17:46.000 And I went, whoa, keep the fuck away from coke. 1.00

02:17:49.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:17:49.000 And I didn't have to do coke and go to rehab and pull myself out. 1.00

02:17:54.000 I lived 40 plus years of my life with no desire to do coke. 1.00

02:17:58.000 Fuck that. 0.99

02:17:59.000 And so it's not... 1.00

02:18:02.000 Always good. 0.99

02:18:03.000 You need losers. 0.99

02:18:04.000 You know, losers are there, too, for a reason. 0.96

02:18:07.000 The whole world was filled with inspirational winners. 0.99

02:18:09.000 Like, how would you figure out, where do we begin if everybody's a fucking winner? 0.95

02:18:14.000 No, you gotta see people who ring that bell, right? 0.99

02:18:16.000 You gotta see people who tap out quick.

02:18:18.000 You gotta see a guy who taps before the choke is even sunk in.

02:18:21.000 Like, what are you doing?

02:18:22.000 Or taps to strikes.

02:18:25.000 Well, you know, sometimes, you know, GSP versus Matt Serra, sometimes it's good to tap the strikes because the fight's over.

02:18:31.000 You're not going anywhere.

02:18:32.000 When the guy's on top of you dropping bombs and you're starting to see sparks and the elevator doors closing, do you think tapping the strikes is a bad idea?

02:18:40.000 I don't know if I have it in me.

02:18:45.000 I'm not saying it's a bad idea.

02:18:46.000 Maybe I should respect the guy that's smarter than I am.

02:18:49.000 I'm kind of like an oak. 1.00

02:18:51.000 I'm big, I'm strong, and I'm dumb. 0.95

02:18:53.000 I'm going to grow and I'm going to do what I do. 0.98

02:18:57.000 Maybe I wish I was smart enough to tap to strikes.

02:18:59.000 I don't think I am.

02:19:00.000 I don't think I have it in me to be like, okay, I'm not going to get out of here.

02:19:05.000 I'm just going to quit.

02:19:07.000 I don't think this is a problem with tapping and strikes, but I respect your viewpoint.

02:19:11.000 I know what you're saying, and I think you probably have to have that sort of mentality to be an elite-level competitor in something like MMA, where it's not even an option in your head.

02:19:21.000 These guys don't tap. 0.98

02:19:23.000 Look at fucking War Machine. 1.00

02:19:24.000 He just gets choked out. 0.99

02:19:25.000 There's a lot of guys that just say, I will never tap.

02:19:27.000 I will go out.

02:19:28.000 I will get my arm broken. 1.00

02:19:30.000 Fuck it. 1.00

02:19:30.000 I'm not tapping. 1.00

02:19:31.000 It's not in there.

02:19:32.000 Yeah, it's not.

02:19:33.000 Look at Jon Jones.

02:19:34.000 We fought Vitor.

02:19:35.000 His arm was completely hyperextended.

02:19:37.000 Would not tap, let it get completely popped backwards, and then won the fight anyway.

02:19:45.000 Before you go to Special Forces Selection, there's this phase for guys off the street called SOPSI, Special Operations Preparation Course.

02:19:52.000 The only thing that is isn't a tritter.

02:19:54.000 They take like 400 dudes, and they end up sending 80 of them to selection.

02:19:58.000 The other 320 at some point either got broke or quit.

02:20:03.000 I remember seeing the gong that you go up and hit and it's like so longingly looking at that thing being like that's the smart thing to do like you know you have blisters in your feet that you've injected stuff into so that you can't so like your skin like glues back to what portion it separated itself from you know like you've lost 20 pounds in the course of 30 days and you're looking at that gong and you're like a smart person would go and hit that gong And I watch guys go up and do it,

02:20:33.000 and I was like, that's a smart person, probably.

02:20:35.000 I just didn't have it in me. 0.99

02:20:37.000 So, maybe I'm dumb. 0.98

02:20:40.000 I think that's my take. 1.00

02:20:41.000 I'm either, like, too dumb. 0.96

02:20:44.000 There's a balance there, and I think we're kind of agreeing with each other from different perspectives. 0.99

02:20:48.000 Well, I think that you're being self-deprecating when you're calling yourself dumb. 0.97

02:20:52.000 It's not a dumb thing, but... 0.98

02:20:55.000 If you wanted to be smart about the amount of punishment that you endure, yeah. 0.96

02:21:01.000 But if you wanted to build the highest level of character and durability and mental toughness possible, then it would be dumb to hit that gong. 0.91

02:21:11.000 Yeah, I don't know.

02:21:12.000 Because the benefits of not hitting that gong is what you are today.

02:21:16.000 I would have got a cup of coffee and a hot breakfast.

02:21:19.000 But you didn't.

02:21:19.000 I didn't.

02:21:20.000 And you'd get a cup of coffee today and have the knowledge that you didn't hit that gong.

02:21:25.000 It's a good-looking gong.

02:21:27.000 I could go back.

02:21:29.000 You're a thick guy for 185 pounds.

02:21:32.000 You're built in a very muscular weight class.

02:21:35.000 Squat is the word my wife uses. 1.00

02:21:37.000 What do you walk around at before you start your cut?

02:21:41.000 Day of cut?

02:21:43.000 No.

02:21:43.000 If you had a fight that was four months from now and you don't have to worry about your weight, what are you going to weigh?

02:21:49.000 220. 220. Wow.

02:21:52.000 And did you fight light heavyweight at all?

02:21:54.000 Yeah, I think I fought WC as heavyweight, IFL as a light heavyweight, middleweight, and then I've stayed at middleweight for a while.

02:22:03.000 So if you're walking around in the 200s, how do you navigate a weight cut to get down to 185 pounds?

02:22:10.000 Because that is a big issue in MMA, is that point of diminishing returns.

02:22:15.000 Where some guys, like Anthony Rumble Johnson, perfect example.

02:22:18.000 God, he's good at 205. Jesus Christ!

02:22:20.000 The kid was so fucking big in between fights. 0.99

02:22:24.000 I would see him walking around. 0.99

02:22:26.000 He was fighting at 170, he fought Kevin Burns, and I saw him like, two months later, he was 230. I go, what the fuck are you eating? 0.99

02:22:33.000 He's a house! 1.00

02:22:34.000 He was bigger than Fedor.

02:22:35.000 I mean, he was on Inside MMA with Fedor, and he was towering over him.

02:22:39.000 Wider, thicker, you're like...

02:22:41.000 What is going on? 0.96

02:22:43.000 And then finally he gets his shit together, decides to come back as a light heavyweight and dominate Phil Davis at 205. And you're like, okay, this kid was obviously past the point of diminishing returns. 0.98

02:22:55.000 He was diminishing his own ability to perform by cutting so much weight.

02:23:01.000 What is that number?

02:23:03.000 I think it's different for every athlete and person.

02:23:07.000 When I'm 215, 220, I feel like I'm a juggernaut.

02:23:12.000 I never have training-related injuries.

02:23:16.000 I'm running an extra 3-4% body fat.

02:23:18.000 I'm just all around healthier.

02:23:21.000 My brain's working right.

02:23:22.000 My libido's good.

02:23:24.000 I'm sleeping very soundly all 8 hours.

02:23:28.000 Everything's great.

02:23:29.000 When I'm down to that 195-193 pre-cut type weight, where I'm like that 5% body fat, my brain's not firing on all cylinders.

02:23:42.000 I'm It's...

02:23:43.000 Libido's rough.

02:23:44.000 You're training three, four times a day. 0.99

02:23:46.000 Like, just things suck.

02:23:48.000 You know, everything hurts. 0.77

02:23:50.000 You get down to 5% body fat when you're like 195?

02:23:53.000 Yeah.

02:23:54.000 Are you doing...

02:23:55.000 How are you measuring it?

02:23:57.000 Pinch tests and water stuff.

02:23:58.000 The water tanks and then the calipers.

02:24:01.000 That's a lot.

02:24:02.000 That's really low.

02:24:03.000 Yeah, it is.

02:24:03.000 And then you're going to cut another 10 pounds on top of that.

02:24:06.000 But that's just water.

02:24:07.000 Right.

02:24:07.000 10 pounds of water.

02:24:09.000 I think my final cut's usually like 8 pounds.

02:24:12.000 But my body doesn't...

02:24:14.000 I don't think it even recognizes...

02:24:16.000 I'll cut...

02:24:18.000 I fought Michael Bisping...

02:24:20.000 I was probably 205 when I fought him.

02:24:22.000 I weighed in at 186 the day before, and then 30 hours later, I've been eating and drinking, and...

02:24:32.000 Feeling fantastic.

02:24:33.000 Do you IV? Do you recoup for that?

02:24:35.000 How many bags do you use?

02:24:36.000 1,500 milliliters to 2,000 milliliters, like the Gringer.

02:24:40.000 I honestly don't know fighters that don't.

02:24:43.000 Right.

02:24:43.000 And nowadays, yeah, pretty much everybody does, unless you're like a Frankie Edgar that literally weighs in at what he fights at.

02:24:49.000 Maybe he's like putting some weights in his pocket.

02:24:52.000 Yeah, Frankie fought at 155 and weighed 155. Leota Machida fought at 203 for the longest time and weighed in at 203 for a 205-pound weight class. 1.00

02:25:02.000 But look how good he is at 185. Yeah, better.

02:25:04.000 Much better.

02:25:04.000 So the diminished returns, it's different for everybody.

02:25:09.000 I'm 5'11".

02:25:10.000 I have a 73-inch reach.

02:25:12.000 There's no way...

02:25:14.000 I can hang with the 205ers that have 86-inch reaches that are 6'4". 0.59

02:25:20.000 Yeah, I might be as strong as they are, but I'm like, as Brian Stan calls me, like a squat little hobbit, angry hobbit, sometimes troll.

02:25:30.000 Endearingly, he refers to me as these things, but he's right, and I just can't reach him. 1.00

02:25:34.000 Like John Jones runs around the cage and jabs me to death, and then when I try to athletically explode in, then he violates me with something painful.

02:25:43.000 Yeah.

02:25:44.000 Do you ever think about going 170?

02:25:46.000 Is that possible?

02:25:47.000 Definitely possible.

02:25:48.000 Yeah?

02:25:49.000 Yeah.

02:25:49.000 We've honestly had Robbie Lawler beat Johnny Hendricks.

02:25:55.000 I would cut to fight Robbie.

02:25:57.000 Really?

02:25:58.000 Because you beat Robbie in Strikeforce?

02:25:59.000 Yeah.

02:26:00.000 When you walk around at 205 or 220 rather, is it because you're lifting a lot of weights?

02:26:06.000 Is it because you're doing a lot of...

02:26:09.000 Yeah, yes.

02:26:10.000 I treat the annual cycle of fight camp, post-fight camp, pre-fight camp, fight camp, fight.

02:26:18.000 If you look at an NFL player, they have that pre-season where they're trying to get their body strong and healthy so that when they go into the season, they have everything that they need to perform during that season.

02:26:32.000 So my pre-fight camp right now, where I'm lifting a lot of weights, doing a high volume of work, where I'm working on...

02:26:40.000 My sparring stuff now is a lot more drill oriented.

02:26:45.000 I'm not burning tons of calories, grappling or boxing or sparring, kickboxing.

02:26:50.000 I'm lifting a lot of weights, so my body's responsibly getting healthy, big and strong again.

02:26:55.000 I'm getting my technique better.

02:26:56.000 So when I move into that fight camp, I have this mold of clay that's totally healthy that can be shaped into what needs to be shaped to be executed for a particular fight.

02:27:07.000 So when you think about like 220 and a guy like Rumble Johnson who used to weigh somewhere around that even heavier and get down to 170. It's crazy talk.

02:27:14.000 If you were going to get down to 170 if Robbie Lawler beat Johnny Hendricks...

02:27:19.000 How would you do that?

02:27:20.000 Would you cut out the weightlifting and start doing marathon running?

02:27:23.000 What would you do to get yourself leaner?

02:27:25.000 Yeah.

02:27:26.000 Would it be leaner or would it be less muscle?

02:27:29.000 A little bit of both.

02:27:31.000 I definitely have to lose a little bit of muscle to be able to...

02:27:33.000 And how would you do that?

02:27:34.000 By not lifting?

02:27:36.000 Just changing the type of lifting that I'm doing.

02:27:38.000 I'm not doing those three rep maxes of deadlift at 400 or 500 pounds.

02:27:42.000 Is that what you do these days?

02:27:43.000 Yeah.

02:27:44.000 Right now, yeah, absolutely.

02:27:45.000 I'm loving it.

02:27:46.000 I did shrugs yesterday.

02:27:48.000 Just shrugs?

02:27:49.000 Well, not just shrugs, but I got to do shrugs.

02:27:52.000 I was asking my strength to go, can we do some curls?

02:27:55.000 He's like, shut your mouth!

02:27:57.000 You know, straps that you use on bars.

02:28:00.000 I'm never allowed to touch those.

02:28:02.000 I was looking at those like...

02:28:03.000 How about I use some straps?

02:28:05.000 Grab the bar and do some more weight.

02:28:07.000 He's like, no.

02:28:08.000 The point of departure has come.

02:28:10.000 He's like, come back to me, Tim.

02:28:12.000 We're not doing curls.

02:28:13.000 I'll let you do shrugs.

02:28:14.000 But that's all.

02:28:15.000 So straps being you don't do straps because you only want to lift what your hands can hold up.

02:28:20.000 Yeah.

02:28:20.000 What's the point?

02:28:21.000 Yeah, I don't ever use straps.

02:28:23.000 I see people using straps and I get it.

02:28:26.000 My ego wants to use straps.

02:28:28.000 Functionally, though, it should be whatever you could carry with your hands, too.

02:28:33.000 Especially for a grappler, right?

02:28:34.000 Yeah, absolutely.

02:28:36.000 So you would just start doing high reps?

02:28:39.000 Yeah, high volume, a lot more speed.

02:28:41.000 I think I'd have to be faster, too, at 170. Watching these guys, they're just like, all over the place.

02:28:49.000 You see Damien Maia, when he dropped down to 170 and fought Rick Storey.

02:28:53.000 And you see the difference in the amount of physical strength that he had over a guy who was used to fighting at 170. It's a big leap.

02:29:01.000 Do you think there should be more weight classes?

02:29:03.000 Yeah.

02:29:04.000 I do too. 0.99

02:29:05.000 Yeah, I think that like 185 to 205, Jesus fucking Christ, that's 20 pounds. 0.94

02:29:10.000 There should be three champions in between those weight classes. 0.97

02:29:13.000 Or at least two.

02:29:14.000 Yeah, I mean, if you look at a guy from, I'll go all the way down from like 155 to 205. You know, you have 55, 70, 85. You have four weight classes from 155 to 205. That's crazy.

02:29:27.000 Yeah.

02:29:28.000 Yeah, I agree.

02:29:29.000 I think it's crazy.

02:29:30.000 And I think that, you know, a lot of people say that boxing is watered down by all the weight classes.

02:29:34.000 I think it's watered down by all the titles, but I don't think there's anything wrong with having a welterweight class at 147 and then a junior middleweight at 154 and then a middleweight at 160. The six pounds between 154 and 160 is fucking significant.

02:29:46.000 Six pounds is significant. 0.99

02:29:48.000 20 pounds is crazy.

02:29:51.000 And I just think that there's just a lot of fighters who are tweeners, like Diego Sanchez.

02:29:55.000 I think Diego should be fighting at 165. You know, I think when he gets to 155, I think he's too diminished.

02:30:00.000 He's too scrawny.

02:30:01.000 When he fights at 170...

02:30:02.000 He's a little soft.

02:30:03.000 He's a little small for some of those really big, giant dudes.

02:30:07.000 I think I'm kind of between 185 and 170. Yeah.

02:30:10.000 Like my shape, you know, like my reach, my height.

02:30:12.000 You know, like I would love there to be like a 180. Yeah, I think there really should be more of that.

02:30:19.000 I mean, those are the things that I would like the UFC to change.

02:30:21.000 The downward elbows, the knees on the ground, and more weight classes.

02:30:25.000 We've solved a lot of problems.

02:30:26.000 Dana, can we go ahead and execute these things that Joe and I have concurred on from today's podcast?

02:30:32.000 Yes.

02:30:32.000 It's not even Dana.

02:30:34.000 It's the athletic commissions.

02:30:35.000 That's what's really crazy, is that it's sanctioned by athletic commissions, and you really don't have that much influence over athletic commissions.

02:30:43.000 Any...

02:30:44.000 Yeah.

02:30:44.000 Well, now that Keith Kaiser's gone, maybe they have a little bit more, but I don't know how much they listen.

02:30:50.000 I wish they would listen about a few things.

02:30:53.000 Certainly downward elbows, and certainly at least consider revamping the scoring system, and then adding weight classes.

02:31:02.000 What other things about weight cutting do you find that are an issue?

02:31:09.000 Like, there's obviously an issue with...

02:31:12.000 Injuries, and there's obviously an issue with diminishing health.

02:31:17.000 Do you worry about the long-term repercussions?

02:31:20.000 There was an article recently, Jim Miller was talking about weight cutting.

02:31:25.000 He's like, I know I've taken years off my life through weight cutting.

02:31:28.000 Do you worry about that?

02:31:30.000 I do.

02:31:31.000 I am really conscious about my brain.

02:31:37.000 When I'm cutting weight, I love reading.

02:31:41.000 I love writing.

02:31:44.000 Creative writing, too.

02:31:45.000 I love...

02:31:47.000 Do you write a blog?

02:31:48.000 Do you keep a blog or anything?

02:31:49.000 Yeah, for me.

02:31:50.000 Just for you?

02:31:51.000 Yeah.

02:31:51.000 Are you going to publish it someday?

02:31:53.000 Maybe.

02:31:53.000 There are a couple of times where I wrote some blogs when I was deployed.

02:31:57.000 Letters from a foreign land.

02:31:59.000 And people love...

02:32:01.000 I'm an okay writer.

02:32:03.000 I'm not the best.

02:32:04.000 Anyways, everybody's the worst critic.

02:32:07.000 And when I'm cutting, my brain doesn't work right.

02:32:10.000 I feel it.

02:32:11.000 And then when you're getting hit in the head while you're cutting...

02:32:14.000 From guys like John Jones and Carlos Condit. 0.99

02:32:18.000 Life sucks. 1.00

02:32:19.000 Your brain sucks. 1.00

02:32:23.000 My eyes are wide open that there's physically going to be some repercussions to me fighting. 1.00

02:32:32.000 From me jumping out of airplanes.

02:32:34.000 At what point do I say...

02:32:37.000 I'm not going to do this because it hurts me in the long term.

02:32:40.000 You're 34. Do you have a cutoff?

02:32:44.000 Do you have an age where you're like, this is the age where I don't want to be doing this anymore?

02:32:48.000 Definitely.

02:32:49.000 What age is that?

02:32:50.000 I can't tell you.

02:32:50.000 You can't tell me.

02:32:51.000 But you have a number in your head where you would like a goal to reach?

02:32:55.000 I love Randy Couture and Dan Henderson.

02:32:59.000 They had some of the greatest fights towards the end of their career.

02:33:03.000 I am not going to be fighting at 40. I'm not going to be fighting in my late 30s.

02:33:07.000 Oh, you told me the number then.

02:33:09.000 You're leaving out five years.

02:33:11.000 You have a window there.

02:33:12.000 Yeah, you've got a five-year window then.

02:33:13.000 Wow.

02:33:15.000 Yeah, no way.

02:33:16.000 I got too much I want to do.

02:33:17.000 What do you want to do?

02:33:19.000 I want to change people's lives.

02:33:21.000 I want to be able to impart individual responsibility to people.

02:33:25.000 I want to save some animals.

02:33:26.000 I want to hunt some more.

02:33:28.000 I want to make some awesome TV shows.

02:33:31.000 What kind of TV shows?

02:33:36.000 So Duck Dynasty.

02:33:37.000 No, I do not want to do Duck Dynasty at all.

02:33:39.000 And I don't even think I've ever seen a full episode.

02:33:42.000 Good for you.

02:33:44.000 I haven't.

02:33:45.000 Maybe I've seen like three quarters of an episode.

02:33:47.000 You done lost your redneck. 0.99

02:33:49.000 I ain't lost my redneck.

02:33:52.000 Those guys took values that they wanted to project and they figured out a conduit to do it. 1.00

02:33:57.000 We might call them idiots and they have horrible accents and they do stupid things. 1.00

02:34:02.000 But they had a set of morals that they try to convey and they found an avenue to reach millions of people. 1.00

02:34:09.000 You know, like, I want that platform because I have some good things to say.

02:34:15.000 And I think I want to have an opportunity to make a difference.

02:34:19.000 Why don't you do a podcast?

02:34:21.000 Start off with a podcast.

02:34:22.000 Do a podcast now.

02:34:23.000 Be like one of the first MMA guys.

02:34:25.000 I mean, Brendan Schaub does one with Brian Callen, but Brendan's kind of a meathead, let's be honest.

02:34:30.000 He's a great guy.

02:34:30.000 I love him.

02:34:33.000 You're intimidating and smart.

02:34:34.000 How could I compete with the Joe Rogan? 1.00

02:34:36.000 Get the fuck out of here. 1.00

02:34:37.000 Fuck out. 1.00

02:34:37.000 Don't blow smoke up my ass, sir. 1.00

02:34:39.000 I know what you're doing. 1.00

02:34:41.000 I'm not that smart.

02:34:42.000 You are.

02:34:42.000 Nope.

02:34:43.000 I was warned.

02:34:44.000 Don't get into an argument with Joe because he doesn't forget anything and he's deceivingly smart.

02:34:49.000 I was like, I'm aware of these things. 0.95

02:34:51.000 Well, I definitely look dumber than I am, for sure. 1.00

02:34:53.000 But that's not saying much, because I look really fucking stupid. 1.00

02:34:56.000 I use that to my benefit as well. 1.00

02:34:58.000 Yeah.

02:34:58.000 I was like, I'm an infantryman, I'm a grunt, I'm an MMA fighter.

02:35:01.000 I'm dumb. 0.99

02:35:02.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:35:02.000 Go ahead, talk shit to me. 1.00

02:35:03.000 Go ahead. 1.00

02:35:03.000 For sure. 1.00

02:35:04.000 Yeah, I've definitely, I smoked a lot of weed.

02:35:06.000 I've got plenty of brain damage going on.

02:35:08.000 Absolutely. 1.00

02:35:10.000 But I'm not nearly as dumb as I look. 1.00

02:35:12.000 I look way fucking dumber. 0.99

02:35:15.000 I think you would be great on a podcast. 1.00

02:35:18.000 The beautiful thing about a podcast is...

02:35:20.000 And I fucking swear to God, everybody who comes on my podcast is like, you should have a podcast. 0.81

02:35:24.000 I'm like trying to give... 0.98

02:35:26.000 I don't know.

02:35:26.000 I don't believe...

02:35:28.000 It's not that I don't believe in competitions.

02:35:30.000 I have the exact opposite of a famine mentality. 0.98

02:35:33.000 I think there's 300 million fucking people out there. 0.97

02:35:37.000 Everybody could support everybody and there's still plenty to go around. 0.99

02:35:40.000 I really believe that.

02:35:42.000 Obviously my bladder even can't handle the podcast at this length.

02:35:46.000 So we've already discovered a limitation to...

02:35:49.000 Well, in your defense, you have a one liter smart water and you've drank a big cup of Bulletproof coffee.

02:35:56.000 There's a lot of liquids in there.

02:35:57.000 It was.

02:35:57.000 And it's also just stamina.

02:35:59.000 I probably couldn't keep up with your strength and conditioning program and you can't keep up with my bladder program. 0.99

02:36:04.000 My bladder is like a fucking, it's like a leather satchel back in the old days. 0.99

02:36:08.000 It used to make them out of buffalo skins. 0.99

02:36:10.000 Strong, durable, last a lifetime.

02:36:13.000 Hand it down to your grandchildren.

02:36:15.000 You could easily do a podcast, dude.

02:36:17.000 And the beautiful thing about it is that no one would be able to tell you what to do.

02:36:20.000 No one would tell you what to say, what to talk about.

02:36:23.000 You wouldn't have to converse with producers.

02:36:25.000 I want the access to the audience to influence lives.

02:36:32.000 Would my words have enough meaning to draw in enough people?

02:36:37.000 Of course they would.

02:36:38.000 I hope so.

02:36:39.000 They are doing that right now.

02:36:41.000 Right now, millions of people are going to listen to this.

02:36:43.000 If I jump out of an airplane, you know, into the water, you know, into the ocean with a whole bunch of sharks and go swim with them, like, people are going to tune into that.

02:36:51.000 Yeah, but what if you get eaten?

02:36:52.000 I'll survive. 1.00

02:36:53.000 And then they're like, this whole thing is fucked now. 0.97

02:36:55.000 But then I get out of the water. 0.99

02:36:56.000 I'll survive, he says.

02:36:57.000 And I can talk to them.

02:36:58.000 You know, it's like...

02:37:00.000 Sixteen million people watched Tim parachute out of this plane into shark-infested waters.

02:37:04.000 Oh, you're out of your mind.

02:37:05.000 And then rode a motorcycle up onto the beach.

02:37:07.000 But then I have him.

02:37:08.000 But you have him already, man.

02:37:10.000 You don't have to do that.

02:37:11.000 Trust me.

02:37:11.000 You don't have to do that.

02:37:12.000 You've already done enough that you're qualified.

02:37:15.000 You're a qualified, legit badass.

02:37:17.000 The idea that you're going to parachute into sharks and that's going to change everybody. 1.00

02:37:20.000 Well, the guy's a fucking pussy. 1.00

02:37:23.000 Sharks? 1.00

02:37:23.000 Oh, he's got me. 1.00

02:37:25.000 Let's sit down and listen to what Tim has to say.

02:37:28.000 You're so powerful.

02:37:29.000 Joe Rogan just broke his microphone.

02:37:31.000 I think this microphone was...

02:37:33.000 I'll just hold on to it until we're done.

02:37:34.000 Bare hands.

02:37:35.000 This microphone is made from a...

02:37:36.000 Made in a foreign land where quality is not valued. 1.00

02:37:40.000 You easily, dude, could do a podcast.

02:37:43.000 Easily.

02:37:44.000 Without a doubt.

02:37:45.000 And I think that...

02:37:47.000 You do a lot of videos too with Ranger Up, right?

02:37:49.000 If you call them that.

02:37:51.000 I call them that.

02:37:52.000 What was the one where you did the Black Swan thing?

02:37:54.000 That was Interpretive Dance.

02:37:56.000 Can we show that?

02:37:57.000 Yeah, that's fine.

02:37:58.000 Pull it up.

02:37:59.000 What's the name of that?

02:38:01.000 I think it's Tim Kennedy Black Swan.

02:38:03.000 Pull up Tim Kennedy Black Swan and I'll try to fix this microphone while that's happening.

02:38:08.000 Yes.

02:38:09.000 But the problem you're going to have with doing a television show is producers. 1.00

02:38:13.000 Because they're going to look at you and they're going to try to put you in a mold and they're going to try to get you to do a bunch of fake shit. 1.00

02:38:19.000 They do fake shit, man. 1.00

02:38:21.000 They fake shit. 1.00

02:38:22.000 I had a problem with fake shit on my sci-fi show. 1.00

02:38:24.000 They faked a bunch of shit and I didn't find out about it until it was aired. 0.99

02:38:27.000 And I came on the podcast and I apologized and I didn't know. 1.00

02:38:32.000 It was a huge fucking problem, and that was on a show called Joe Rogan Questions Everything. 0.99

02:38:37.000 I'm trying to find the truth about these things, and their instinct is still to fake shit, and to put fake shit in that you don't even know about. 1.00

02:38:45.000 I wouldn't respond well to that. 1.00

02:38:45.000 It's fucking horrible. 1.00

02:38:47.000 I'm not very malleable. 1.00

02:38:48.000 No, you're not.

02:38:49.000 That's why a podcast is perfect.

02:38:51.000 You have a very unique vision, and your unique vision is qualified by your unique life experiences.

02:38:59.000 Any Hollywood douchebag is not going to understand that. 1.00

02:39:02.000 And they're going to try to mold you in what they think could be more profitable for the network.

02:39:06.000 Yeah, but they would also have to sleep at night and they'd be scared of what I could do to them once they go to bed. 0.67

02:39:09.000 They would, but they wouldn't. 0.98

02:39:10.000 They live in gated communities and they fucking hire people to keep an eye out for you. 0.99

02:39:15.000 Is this it? 0.99

02:39:16.000 Here, play that and I'll fix this thing. 0.99

02:39:19.000 Hello and welcome to Masterpiece Theatre.

02:39:22.000 Here is a scene from Black Swan performed by MMA fighter and Special Forces operator Tim Kennedy.

02:39:31.000 I had the craziest dream last night about a boy who was turned into a swan but a queen falls for the wrong guy and he kills himself.

02:40:15.000 For the folks who are not watching this, please watch this.

02:40:19.000 Go to YouTube.

02:40:20.000 What compelled you to do this?

02:40:23.000 So, the movie Black Swan, obviously.

02:40:26.000 Well, Natalie Portman is beautiful.

02:40:29.000 She is beautiful.

02:40:31.000 And my mom used to make us take dancing lessons.

02:40:35.000 So, as you can see, there's some skill here.

02:40:38.000 You just can't do this stuff.

02:40:40.000 Whatever.

02:40:41.000 That is scary.

02:40:43.000 Your mom made you take dance and your dad made you take martial arts.

02:40:47.000 Yeah.

02:40:48.000 Interesting.

02:40:48.000 Cooking classes with my mom.

02:40:50.000 Cooking classes?

02:40:51.000 Yep, hunting with my dad.

02:40:53.000 That makes a balanced person.

02:40:55.000 That's like Miyamoto Musashi's Book of Five Rings.

02:40:58.000 He believed that every warrior should also be well-versed in poetry and calligraphy and art.

02:41:05.000 Yeah.

02:41:06.000 It wasn't by choice.

02:41:07.000 I was like, yeah, let's go to ballroom dancing and learn how to swing dance.

02:41:11.000 Ballroom dancing?

02:41:11.000 Oh, yeah, she got them all.

02:41:13.000 Oh, God!

02:41:14.000 I'd have probably moved out.

02:41:16.000 I was like 11. I didn't have a choice.

02:41:18.000 Yeah, I would have found someone to take me.

02:41:21.000 Motivation was having fun.

02:41:25.000 If you don't enjoy and have fun in life and be able to laugh at yourself and put on a tutu and dance around like a beautiful fairy, butterfly, swan, both the black and white version, and be able to understand...

02:41:43.000 The transition, the metamorphosis from the black to white swan, it's a scary process.

02:41:48.000 It is.

02:41:49.000 Once you understand that about yourself, there's really nothing more frightening that you could do in the rest of your life.

02:41:57.000 If I was that guy from, what is that show, Inside the Actor's Studio?

02:42:00.000 Is that analogous to your transition as a fighter?

02:42:07.000 I really, really try to personify Are you the black swan or the white swan when you fight?

02:42:15.000 In me, it's the journey to the black swan.

02:42:19.000 I'm neither.

02:42:20.000 It's like the scary down the rabbit hole.

02:42:23.000 I took the blue pill and now I'm becoming the black swan and there's violent, scary things on the way there.

02:42:30.000 That's where I try to fight at, is on the journey to the black swan.

02:42:34.000 Is that why you come out to the rooster?

02:42:36.000 No, I come out to the Rooster because it's a badass song.

02:42:39.000 It is a badass song.

02:42:40.000 Roosters like to fight.

02:42:42.000 They do like to fight, but the song's about Vietnam.

02:42:45.000 It's about Vietnam vets, the 101st.

02:42:48.000 They used to call the machine gunners the Rooster on the team.

02:42:53.000 Is that Alice in Chains?

02:42:54.000 Yeah.

02:42:55.000 So like POWs, MIA, Vietnam Vets, all of them, that song, the song was written by the lead singer about his father who disenchanted, they grew apart, and he kind of resented him for being in the war, and then he kind of had this revelation that he had to,

02:43:13.000 he didn't have a choice.

02:43:15.000 So he wrote that song to reconnect with his father, who was a Vietnam vet.

02:43:21.000 So that song has a lot of meaning to me and my community, veterans.

02:43:28.000 When I walk out of that song, man, there's like...

02:43:32.000 I feel like there's nothing...

02:43:34.000 You could hit me with a freight train, and I wouldn't care.

02:43:37.000 I'd grab the portions of my body and try to keep fighting. 1.00

02:43:40.000 It's a great fucking song for you, man. 0.99

02:43:41.000 There's certain songs that just sort of... 1.00

02:43:44.000 You hear that song, and you know that guy's fighting.

02:43:47.000 There's Country Boy Can't Survive, when Matt Hughes fights.

02:43:51.000 You know, there's just no getting around it. 0.98

02:43:53.000 Stranglehold, when Benavidez fights, Joseph Benavidez fights, he comes out to Ted Nugent, Stranglehold, which is a great fucking song for him. 0.54

02:44:00.000 You know, it's just there's certain songs that just personify a fighter. 0.66

02:44:05.000 You know, that's a good one for you, man.

02:44:07.000 I'll have it forever.

02:44:08.000 That's my song.

02:44:09.000 Do they give you any pressure about songs?

02:44:12.000 Do they, like, you have to approve it?

02:44:13.000 Because I know...

02:44:15.000 Uriah Faber, he always comes out the California love, but he wanted to do Going Back to Cali, and they wouldn't let him do it.

02:44:25.000 I don't think it's the UFC, Zufa.

02:44:28.000 I'm not sure it's them, because they have to get rights to use that music in the production, and I have no idea how...

02:44:38.000 You know, legally that occurs.

02:44:40.000 So sometimes they have a list of what you're allowed to do.

02:44:44.000 You know, there are some fight promotions where like, alright, you know, submit your song that you want to walk out to two weeks before and we'll see if it's approved or if we can get approval.

02:44:55.000 You know, it's, I don't know, I have no idea how it works, but thank God I can walk out to Rooster because I'd be really sad if I couldn't.

02:45:02.000 Yeah, it's perfect for you.

02:45:04.000 I'm glad that you have an exit strategy because there are a lot of fighters that don't and the saddest thing to me is a guy who looks at fighting as everything.

02:45:16.000 Like that is all they're capable of, that is all they're ever going to be capable of.

02:45:19.000 They don't know what to do next and they get out of it and they have this thing.

02:45:24.000 Where they're diminished.

02:45:26.000 Like, you could see their aura is diminished.

02:45:28.000 You know, if you believe in auras.

02:45:30.000 But whoever they are, like, seems less when you're around them than who they were when they were competing.

02:45:37.000 Yeah.

02:45:38.000 There's nothing more tragic than seeing the guy that bled and sweat for your entertainment.

02:45:44.000 And at the end of his career, you know, he wasn't smart or he didn't do things...

02:45:49.000 How he should have.

02:45:51.000 And then at the end of his career, he has nothing.

02:45:52.000 He's fought 20 fights.

02:45:54.000 He's broken physically and mentally.

02:45:56.000 And there's nothing left in him.

02:45:58.000 And he has no resources to continue his life.

02:46:00.000 I have Ranger Up, a company that I'm intimately part of.

02:46:05.000 I have great relationships with partners that are going to go outside of the cage when I'm done fighting.

02:46:09.000 That are going to be part of whatever TV series that I'm in.

02:46:13.000 But...

02:46:14.000 It breaks my heart seeing these guys that at the end of their careers, they have nothing.

02:46:18.000 And you're just like...

02:46:20.000 Yeah, it breaks my heart too. 0.99

02:46:22.000 And I've seen it so many times that it just drives me fucking nuts, man. 0.98

02:46:27.000 It just drives me nuts. 0.88

02:46:30.000 I almost want to grab them in the middle when they're peaking and go, listen, man, this is beautiful, but it ain't gonna last.

02:46:38.000 You gotta have something else.

02:46:40.000 You gotta have something that you have as much passion for as you do this.

02:46:45.000 Maybe that's one area where you have an advantage and you've been in so many life-or-death struggles, firefights, being deployed overseas, seeing life and death, and your perspective is far broader than a person who's just been an athlete.

02:47:00.000 Just been an athlete that has just sought glory and believes that that is the end-all be-all.

02:47:06.000 Maybe.

02:47:07.000 You know, I definitely have this perspective that...

02:47:11.000 We have a shelf life as an athlete.

02:47:13.000 And it's short.

02:47:14.000 It's this window of opportunity that if you don't capitalize on it, it's come and it's gone.

02:47:19.000 And most people don't understand that.

02:47:21.000 We have this window to our earning potential small for an athlete.

02:47:27.000 I never had that.

02:47:28.000 This is something that I wanted to do.

02:47:30.000 I wanted to be champion.

02:47:31.000 I want to be champion.

02:47:32.000 And that's what I'm trying to achieve in this window.

02:47:34.000 Not...

02:47:37.000 If I don't achieve it in that window, I can move on to the next thing to then achieve the next thing that I'm trying to do.

02:47:45.000 But these guys that go in there, the Mike Tyson's a perfect example of where he literally pissed it all away.

02:47:53.000 And then at the end of, what happened to $230 million that you had?

02:47:56.000 You're bankrupt?

02:47:59.000 Didn't you just stash away 10? 1.00

02:48:01.000 You could live off 10 for a long fucking time, man. 0.99

02:48:04.000 Just take 10. Blow 220. Yeah, it is crazy when you see those stories, but it's almost like the hubris that allows you to be a combat athlete in a lot of ways. 1.00

02:48:15.000 This idea that I'm different. 0.86

02:48:16.000 Or like your idea that you're going to fucking parachute into sharks, you're going to be fine. 0.99

02:48:20.000 I'll be fine. 1.00

02:48:21.000 I'm not like that poor fuck that was triathlon training off the coast of San Diego and got bitten in half in front of his friends. 1.00

02:48:30.000 That happens, bro. 1.00

02:48:31.000 It happens to anybody that gets in there.

02:48:33.000 It's a bad world.

02:48:34.000 The ocean's a bad world.

02:48:35.000 It's a scary place.

02:48:37.000 I don't like it at all.

02:48:39.000 Sharks are beautiful.

02:48:40.000 Yeah, they're beautiful when you have them filleted over a grill.

02:48:43.000 It's delicious as well.

02:48:47.000 170, this is the last question.

02:48:49.000 Do you think that your best chance for a title would be at 170?

02:48:53.000 No, I think I'm close either.

02:48:57.000 Next fight, you know, who Joe Silva gives me is, you know, if it's the Vito Belfort, it's the Jock Rays, you know, that puts me right there. 0.99

02:49:05.000 You know, I'm number six.

02:49:06.000 I beat number two, three guy.

02:49:08.000 That's the title fight.

02:49:09.000 You know, I'm 4-0 in the UFC just beating in a title eliminator.

02:49:13.000 My last two fights have been five-rounder main events.

02:49:15.000 You know, how can you not say, so am I potentially one fight away?

02:49:22.000 Mark Munoz and Mousasi are fighting.

02:49:24.000 Could I potentially be fighting the winner of that fight?

02:49:27.000 That's definitely in the realm too.

02:49:28.000 And if that's the case, then maybe I am two fights away.

02:49:31.000 If I cut down to 170, I don't think they'd let me fight for the title.

02:49:36.000 I'd still be one fight away.

02:49:37.000 Maybe two.

02:49:39.000 So, no, I don't think I'd be any closer.

02:49:42.000 Would physically, the physicality of me being a bigger 170 than a lot of guys, stronger than 170, yes, there'd be benefits there.

02:49:50.000 But again, diminished returns.

02:49:51.000 What am I giving up for that in exchange for?

02:49:54.000 Do you look at the window that you have?

02:49:56.000 I mean, we've established that you think you have a five-year window.

02:49:59.000 I know you don't want to give up the number, but you already did.

02:50:02.000 Do you look at that and say, well, if I do get to a title shot at 185, how much time would I have left to work myself up to a title shot at 170, or would I regroup and try again at 185 if I wasn't successful the first attempt?

02:50:16.000 Do you have those thoughts in your head, or do you just think about next fight?

02:50:19.000 No, I definitely have those thoughts in my head.

02:50:22.000 I love having...

02:50:24.000 The 5 meter target, that's the super close thing that I'm looking at.

02:50:27.000 That I'm like, this is the goal that I'm trying to achieve.

02:50:28.000 I'm trying to get a perfect grouping right here.

02:50:30.000 That's that potential next opponent.

02:50:31.000 That's that guy that's ranked 2, 3, 4. So I can get a title eliminator type fight.

02:50:36.000 But then I see the long road.

02:50:38.000 We're like, okay, I fight in that fight.

02:50:40.000 I win.

02:50:41.000 I'm fighting for the title and I lose the title.

02:50:43.000 Can I kind of chael son in it and talk my way into another title fight at a different weight class?

02:50:49.000 Chael son in it is an interesting way to describe it because that's what a lot of people are doing now.

02:50:52.000 Yeah, dude, when your name has become a verb, you know, like, dude, he just totally got Chael Sonnen.

02:51:00.000 Well, Chael's a master wordsmith.

02:51:02.000 He really is. 0.97

02:51:03.000 You did a great fucking job Chael Sonnen-ing it with this Michael Bisping fight, though. 0.99

02:51:07.000 Both of you did. 0.98

02:51:09.000 I mean, it got interesting, and I was very happy that you guys sort of sorted it out inside the Octagon, and you both gave each other a lot of respect, but god damn, there was a lot going back and forth between you two. 0.79

02:51:20.000 Yeah, we're never going to be friends, you know, but when you hit... 0.94

02:51:24.000 I hit him so hard, so like...

02:51:26.000 I had the same performance in strikes landed in percentage that Jon Jones to Teixeira did as I did to Michael Bisping.

02:51:35.000 I hit that guy that many times.

02:51:36.000 You blasted him with some hard shots. 0.82

02:51:38.000 He took them. 0.53

02:51:39.000 He took them.

02:51:40.000 I know I hit hard.

02:51:41.000 I put guys down in the gym with way less.

02:51:44.000 I'm wearing four-ounce gloves and Michael Bisping was like, Hey, I'm here for 25 minutes.

02:51:49.000 You're not going to put me away.

02:51:50.000 How can you not respect a guy for that?

02:51:52.000 He's definitely a tough dude.

02:51:54.000 He's very, very determined.

02:51:56.000 He's also, like, you gotta give it up for him for mental toughness.

02:52:00.000 Just not even considering retiring, the fact that he's fucked his eye up, had two eye surgeries, not even, it's just, it's just a thing, I'm gonna pull aside, get back in the gym, you know, work on me striking, you know.

02:52:14.000 He's tough as they come. 0.80

02:52:16.000 He's a born fighter.

02:52:17.000 That's what he's supposed to be doing.

02:52:18.000 Is he the personification of our nightmare?

02:52:21.000 In two, three fights, let's say he loses two more fights, that is the end of his career.

02:52:27.000 His eye is going to be permanently damaged the rest of his life.

02:52:31.000 How much brain damage has he had and how many fights and how many sparring preparations for a fight has he had?

02:52:36.000 Now he's done, and he's out of the limelight, and he's broken.

02:52:40.000 Was he smart enough to prepare for that?

02:52:43.000 I think he was, but he is that example of he left everything in the cage time and time again.

02:52:50.000 At 24 minutes of the fifth round, that dude was still trying to get up from me.

02:52:55.000 When the 30-second call was from our corners, he started coming right at me after I just dominated him for 24 and a half minutes.

02:53:03.000 Yeah, he wasn't giving up.

02:53:04.000 I was still trying to win that fight.

02:53:05.000 Dude, what a great...

02:53:06.000 He's a tough dude, no doubt about it.

02:53:08.000 And he's got some serious problems.

02:53:09.000 He's got a real injury to his neck that's affecting the strength of his arm.

02:53:15.000 He's as tough as they come.

02:53:17.000 He's definitely as tough as they come.

02:53:19.000 But I know what you're saying as far as guys that accumulate injuries and then they get to a certain point in time.

02:53:24.000 Like, what is left?

02:53:26.000 There's a lot of guys that have done far less work.

02:53:30.000 You know, less successful than him that their bodies have given out along the way. 0.99

02:53:35.000 It's a fucking hurt game. 0.99

02:53:38.000 It's the hurt game, and the hurt game is along the way. 0.99

02:53:41.000 Just the amount of accumulation of damage that you get in training.

02:53:45.000 Forget about it.

02:53:45.000 That's what most casual fans just have no idea.

02:53:49.000 You see little cuts, a little bit of blood, a little bit of sweat in the fight.

02:53:52.000 That's nothing.

02:53:53.000 You know, like, leading up to my 25-minute fight with Michael Bisping, like, my sparring partners were, like, Bob McDaniel and Carlos Condit when they were peaking for their fights.

02:54:00.000 And then they moved on, and then, you know, I had Jon Jones, myself, like, this room full of dudes that are...

02:54:09.000 The best in the world.

02:54:10.000 And if we're sparring two times a week for six, seven, eight weeks, you know, like leading up to that fight, you know, and like we're hitting each other just as hard there as we are in the cage, you know, because you have to...

02:54:26.000 Push yourself as far as you can in training so that the best element of who you and what you are occurs in the cage.

02:54:32.000 How do you feel about that as far as sparring hard?

02:54:36.000 Do you think that you have to spar as hard as you fight?

02:54:40.000 Or do you think that there's a way...

02:54:42.000 Robbie Lawler famously said that he doesn't really spar.

02:54:45.000 Much anymore.

02:54:45.000 Yeah, he said he knows how to fight.

02:54:47.000 He said it's just about getting in shape and working on his technique.

02:54:50.000 I spar way less than I used to.

02:54:53.000 I... And on very rare occasions do I really go all out.

02:55:00.000 But I think there are times in a fight camp where both your coaches need to see you and you need to see yourself when you're trying to do it all.

02:55:12.000 When you're broken, when you're hurt, when you're tired.

02:55:16.000 And sometimes the only way to get there is to push yourself to the limit.

02:55:20.000 And the only way to get there is...

02:55:23.000 And so you have to feel what it's like to be inside that position, to be inside that Position where you're just duking it out at a hundred percent.

02:55:38.000 There's no holding back.

02:55:39.000 You know what it's like to be exhausted.

02:55:41.000 You know what it's like to be stung.

02:55:42.000 You know what it's like to be hurt.

02:55:43.000 You know what it's like to bounce back from being dominated in a training session.

02:55:47.000 There's no substitution for that actual fight.

02:55:51.000 No.

02:55:52.000 In grappling, am I in a position for me to work on an escape of an arm bar?

02:55:59.000 No, there's a thousand ways that I could have prevented ever getting there, but I still have to see what it's like to get out of it.

02:56:05.000 And the only way I'll ever see what it's like to get out of it is if I'm actually put in it.

02:56:10.000 So it's the same in fighting.

02:56:13.000 When I... I thought I had really hurt my hand in the first round.

02:56:18.000 I sit down and I come out the second round and I just tanked.

02:56:24.000 Pain, adrenaline dumps against Mike.

02:56:27.000 I come back to the corner at the end of the second round and they're like, alright, so you're going to lose this fight if you do that.

02:56:32.000 I was at the pits.

02:56:33.000 My hands hurt.

02:56:35.000 I wasn't sure if I could throw my right hand again.

02:56:38.000 But you threw it.

02:56:39.000 Yeah.

02:56:39.000 What was wrong with it?

02:56:41.000 Broken.

02:56:42.000 It was broken.

02:56:43.000 But it's okay now.

02:56:44.000 I have the brace in the car that I'm supposed to be wearing.

02:56:46.000 I'm just embarrassed.

02:56:48.000 What's broken on it?

02:56:49.000 The metal carpal on this right here.

02:56:52.000 How bad is it broken?

02:56:53.000 Not super bad.

02:56:54.000 Just a hairline fracture?

02:56:55.000 Yeah, hairline fracture.

02:56:57.000 They said six weeks in a cast, and I was like, I can't handle a cast, so they gave me a brace. 0.99

02:57:02.000 Just jump in the fucking ocean and have the sharks take care of it. 0.99

02:57:05.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:57:06.000 Dude, you're a crazy man. 1.00

02:57:08.000 But that's why you do what you do. 1.00

02:57:10.000 Yeah.

02:57:11.000 Look, we're out of time. 1.00

02:57:12.000 Tim Kennedy, you're a bad motherfucker. 1.00

02:57:13.000 This is a blast. 1.00

02:57:14.000 This is a very fun podcast.

02:57:15.000 Long time coming.

02:57:15.000 We've got to do it again.

02:57:16.000 And please, do one of your own, man.

02:57:18.000 Please.

02:57:18.000 You'd be awesome at it.

02:57:19.000 We'll see.

02:57:20.000 Please.

02:57:21.000 Thank you.

02:57:21.000 Follow Tim online.

02:57:23.000 You can get a hold of him on Twitter, but be nice, you fuckheads. 1.00

02:57:26.000 Don't be a dickwad, alright? 1.00

02:57:28.000 TimKennedyMMA on Twitter. 0.63

02:57:29.000 Do you have a website?

02:57:31.000 Yeah, Tim Kennedy MMA. Facebook's Tim Kennedy MMA. Instagram's Tim Kennedy MMA. It's Tim Kennedy MMA. Tim Kennedy MMA, ladies and gentlemen.

02:57:39.000 Thank you very much, brother.

02:57:40.000 It was a great time.

02:57:41.000 Thanks to our sponsors.

02:57:42.000 Thanks to 1-800-Flowers.com.

02:57:44.000 Go to 1-800-Flowers.com and enter the code word J-R-E or call 1-800-Flowers and mention J-R-E to get yourself 24 beautiful multicolored roses for just $29.99.

02:58:00.000 And...

02:58:01.000 That is regularly $49.99.

02:58:03.000 So you will save yourself $20.

02:58:05.000 That offer is only good today.

02:58:07.000 It expires tomorrow, which is Thursday, May 8th. 0.98

02:58:14.000 So do that, you fucks. 1.00

02:58:18.000 Thank you, 1-800-Flowers. 0.99

02:58:19.000 Thank you also to stamps.com.

02:58:22.000 Go to stamps.com and use the code word JRE to get a $110 bonus offer, which includes a free digital scale and up to $55 of free postage.

02:58:36.000 Save yourself the inconvenience of the post office.

02:58:39.000 Print U.S. postage directly from your home computer, folks.

02:58:43.000 Thanks also to Onnit.com.

02:58:45.000 Go to O-N-N-I-T. Use the code word ROGAN and save 10% off any and all supplements.

02:58:52.000 All right, we will be back this weekend.

02:58:54.000 Most likely, Brendan Shaw, Brian Count, and I are going to do a podcast simultaneously while the UFC is on on Saturday night.

02:59:01.000 And I think I have a podcast with Aubrey this weekend too. 0.99

02:59:04.000 A lot of good shit coming up. 0.98

02:59:05.000 A lot of good people. 0.98

02:59:06.000 Much love to everybody.

02:59:08.000 Big kiss.

The Joe Rogan Experience - May 07, 2014

Joe Rogan Experience #497 - Tim Kennedy

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