The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #749 - Carlos Condit & Erwan Le Corre

00:00:10.000 Is it live?

00:00:11.000 Alright, we're live.

00:00:13.000 Carlos Condit and Erwan LaCour.

00:00:15.000 Welcome, gentlemen.

00:00:17.000 Welcome.

00:00:17.000 Thanks for doing this.

00:00:18.000 Appreciate it.

00:00:19.000 Of course.

00:00:19.000 Thanks for having us.

00:00:20.000 So, first of all, for folks who are not aware of the situation, what's going on, Carlos, professional MMA fighter, one of the best in the world, just fought for the welterweight title, extremely close fight against Robbie Lawler, and you spent a lot of your time this camp.

00:00:34.000 How many camps was it when you trained with Erwan?

00:00:37.000 Two now.

00:00:38.000 Two now.

00:00:38.000 Yep.

00:00:39.000 And Irwan, you are a movement specialist, and this is all the rage in MMA right now.

00:00:44.000 It's really kind of fascinating.

00:00:46.000 As this sport grows and develops, we're looking at a sport that's really only realistically been around since 1993. That's when it sort of formed.

00:00:56.000 Martial arts, of course, have been around forever, but as a sport where people really started picking it apart and trying to figure out what's the best way to pursue this, it's really only been since about 1993 when the UFC first started.

00:01:07.000 And the most recent trend is guys trying to improve upon balance, movement, and their ability to close distances and attack And be in a position to constantly be able to do that in between those techniques.

00:01:26.000 So instead of concentrating on just hitting pads or just shooting doubles or doing various drills, you're concentrating on the movements that take place in between those techniques.

00:01:37.000 Is that a fair way to describe it?

00:01:39.000 Yeah.

00:01:40.000 And I think that the movement...

00:01:44.000 Also helps in the techniques themselves.

00:01:48.000 We can focus specifically on martial arts techniques, which are, on a base level, movement.

00:01:55.000 Right, right.

00:01:56.000 And how did you guys get hooked up?

00:01:59.000 I'll recharge to Carlos.

00:02:01.000 Actually, it's one of your comments that you were commanding on one of those UFC events and you talked about the current state of the welterweight division and at some point you talked about Carlos and he was still recovering from his injury and you said that at this point You know, he was 31 or three years old back then and it was a serious injury and that from then on it could only somewhat get slower.

00:02:24.000 And that made me react because it was both true and not true.

00:02:27.000 True from a conventional standpoint.

00:02:30.000 That's true, but from a training, coaching, movement, practice standpoint, I knew that there was a possibility to reverse that.

00:02:41.000 To improve.

00:02:41.000 Right, and this is actually that comment that made me think, Carlos is right there, I need to reach out to him, I can train him, and I can show that there are some different methods that can bring results, even in seasoned fighters like Carlos.

00:02:56.000 What is your background?

00:03:00.000 Training in the woods a lot when I was a kid.

00:03:02.000 Moving in the woods, climbing trees, jumping from rock to rock and being encouraged to do that by my own dad.

00:03:12.000 And then later on, I did some extreme trainings, I would say, in Paris with a very small group and we would climb scaffoldings and we would jump off bridges and we would Balance on top of the scaffoldings.

00:03:29.000 Like parkour type stuff?

00:03:30.000 It was a parallel movement because the founder of parkour, David Bell, was almost my neighbor and practically we're the same age but we didn't know each other back then and I was following an old guy and we would do these These trainings because we wanted to go against the normalcy,

00:03:52.000 how heavy the inertia of normalcy, of wanting to know ourselves through movements and exercises and challenges that were completely out of this world.

00:04:07.000 What do you mean by heavy, the inertia of normalcy?

00:04:10.000 What exactly do you mean by that?

00:04:11.000 Well, I like to say that normalcy is a silent killer.

00:04:14.000 A lot of people are just extremely bored by their day-to-day routines.

00:04:18.000 It kills them.

00:04:19.000 It shrinks their comfort zone all the time.

00:04:21.000 And it robs their creativity, their vitality, because we're not meant to Live such predictable lives.

00:04:33.000 And we're actually supposed to be extremely adaptable at a mental and physical level.

00:04:40.000 And we need to train that adaptability by presenting ourselves with the challenges that are going to maintain that adaptability.

00:04:52.000 We need a strategy.

00:04:55.000 If a lifestyle is boring, if we're bored in our lifestyle, there's nothing in this world that's going to really change that.

00:05:05.000 We can entertain ourselves.

00:05:06.000 We can consume tons of entertainment.

00:05:09.000 But what we need truly to get out of this is a strategy.

00:05:13.000 The perception of oneself that is different, and then the strategy that's in line with that perception of a stronger self, a more free self.

00:05:22.000 I know it's very philosophical, but while you ask me about it, I'm just telling you the way I think about it.

00:05:30.000 If I had followed the box, the textbooks, the conventions, I would not be in the place I am today.

00:05:38.000 I would not have done what I've created.

00:05:41.000 So it's a philosophy as much as it's a training modality.

00:05:45.000 Because everything in life is philosophy, but you call it philosophy, outlook, perspective, opinion, values, whatever you call it.

00:05:55.000 It's something in your mind is a certain perception that makes you see yourself, see the world a certain way and behave accordingly.

00:06:03.000 A bodybuilder You may think that's purely physical, but it's not.

00:06:07.000 It's a philosophy.

00:06:08.000 The guy who wants to be big has a perception of himself as being very big, and he's going to train accordingly.

00:06:14.000 So it always starts with the perception, and then you behave accordingly.

00:06:19.000 So everything in that sense is philosophy.

00:06:22.000 Now, when you met this character, what was it?

00:06:27.000 Why do all these movement teachers look like Jesus?

00:06:30.000 Because that's a question that's been coming up over and over again on the forums and I feel obligated to ask.

00:06:36.000 I think they are of the naturalistic persuasion.

00:06:46.000 So, first impression of Erwin was that he was very intense.

00:06:51.000 You know, we went and we, you know, there's a wooded area there in Albuquerque and we, you know, I thought we were going to go play around, you know, walk on some, you know, walk on some logs and just kick it and immediately it's like...

00:07:02.000 We're working.

00:07:06.000 From the first time that we started, he was demanding excellence and demanding quite a bit of focus.

00:07:17.000 For me, I'm kind of like an ADD type of person.

00:07:22.000 That's why I fight.

00:07:23.000 There's a lot of different things to do.

00:07:25.000 I can move.

00:07:25.000 I can play.

00:07:26.000 I can focus at certain times and then go fuck around at other times. 0.98

00:07:31.000 Working with Erwin, it's not only been beneficial for me physically, but also as far as my focus and just my attention. 0.94

00:07:45.000 Physically, initially, it was hard, man.

00:07:47.000 I was just maybe seven or eight months off of my knee surgery.

00:07:52.000 My body was stiff.

00:07:53.000 I had a great physical therapist, and we were making progress in that respect, but I wasn't there yet.

00:08:00.000 I had a lot of imbalances. 0.99

00:08:03.000 I was still kind of fucked up. 0.92

00:08:05.000 What type of knee surgery? 0.98

00:08:07.000 You had ACL reconstruction?

00:08:08.000 Did you get cadaver or patella?

00:08:10.000 I had an allograft, so a cadaver.

00:08:13.000 I like that.

00:08:14.000 That's my favorite one.

00:08:15.000 I encourage people to do that.

00:08:17.000 I know that guys have said that it doesn't take, but when guys say it doesn't take, I always wonder if they were training too hard, too quick.

00:08:24.000 So I have a good friend who's an orthopedic surgeon, and he told me that It's strong initially because they use somebody's Achilles tendon, which is four times thicker than your actual ACL. It's 150% stronger than a regular ACL. But as your body's assimilating it,

00:08:42.000 it gets weaker.

00:08:44.000 Apparently, your body does this scaffolding of its own cells around it as it's assimilating it to your own tissue.

00:08:53.000 It gets weaker during that point.

00:08:55.000 Eventually, you wait a year, 18 months, it's going to be stronger than it was before.

00:09:00.000 But in that period, seven, eight months where you're feeling good, the inflammation's gone away, the swelling's gone down.

00:09:08.000 You're like, oh, I feel amazing. 0.98

00:09:09.000 I can go fucking train. 0.99

00:09:11.000 I can go spar. 1.00

00:09:12.000 Boom, you blow it.

00:09:13.000 Yeah, and they say it didn't take, but that's not really true, right?

00:09:16.000 I don't think it's true.

00:09:18.000 That wasn't my experience, thankfully.

00:09:20.000 From what I've talked to doctors, that's exactly how they said it, too, that you feel really good and you start training hard, then you blow it out.

00:09:27.000 Ed Herman did that.

00:09:28.000 Dominic Cruz did that.

00:09:30.000 A bunch of guys have done that, and it's very common.

00:09:35.000 Yeah, so...

00:09:37.000 Erwin and I started working together. 0.92

00:09:40.000 Initially, it sucked, man.

00:09:41.000 I couldn't do hardly any of this stuff, and I'm a high-level athlete, and it was frustrating.

00:09:46.000 I would go, and I'd input a little bit of information from him.

00:09:49.000 I'd work a little bit by myself, and then the next time we worked, I would have made some progress.

00:09:56.000 We'd work together once a week, maybe twice a week for over a year now.

00:10:02.000 Now, how are your camps structured?

00:10:04.000 Because a lot of people, they structure their camps, they're very regimented.

00:10:07.000 They have particular days for strength and conditioning, and it's all sort of designed so that they have enough time to recover for their skill work, and especially if you're working at specific techniques for a specific type of fighter.

00:10:19.000 And you would have to incorporate all these things, and then this movement training and stuff as well.

00:10:26.000 How would you figure out when to put that in?

00:10:28.000 Did you have to experiment, or...?

00:10:31.000 Every camp really is an experiment because as I've grown as an athlete, I've changed.

00:10:37.000 I've got older.

00:10:38.000 I have to take more time off than I did before.

00:10:41.000 I have to really pay attention to my body.

00:10:44.000 So we do have somewhat of a structure like that, but all the scheduling is tentative.

00:10:52.000 It's like, okay... 0.96

00:10:53.000 Yeah, I have this scheduled on this day, but if I'm feeling like shit, I'm not gonna go in there and do that. 0.99

00:10:58.000 That's a good way to get hurt. 0.98

00:10:59.000 Right.

00:10:59.000 It's a big fight.

00:11:00.000 I can't get fucked up. 0.99

00:11:02.000 So when you feel like real worn out, you have to sort of like really be paying attention to your body. 0.99

00:11:07.000 Yeah, absolutely.

00:11:09.000 And we do active recovery.

00:11:10.000 My strength and conditioning, the place that I go, we do a lot of different things.

00:11:17.000 They use some biofeedback software that's pretty cool.

00:11:24.000 You stick some fucking sticky pads on your body and like an EKG thing, and it can actually tell you physiologically what your readiness level is. 0.76

00:11:33.000 And this has been being used by a ton of different You know, professional teams, collegiate teams and professional teams, and Olympians. 0.99

00:11:44.000 So they're checking, like, muscle balance, lactic acid?

00:11:49.000 No, this, what it does is it measures heart rate variability and central nervous system activity and the correlation between the two and whatever their algorithm is that they've come up with to figure out, you know, the, you know, What the correlation means,

00:12:07.000 they can, you know, you got a little dumb screen that shows you blue or green, you know, yellow, red.

00:12:13.000 As far as your trainability, I can, you know, I can do strength and speed, but my power and strength, you know, level readiness is down.

00:12:22.000 And then so we use that as a tool.

00:12:25.000 There's sometimes we just got to go.

00:12:26.000 Sometimes we just got to go old school and be like, you know, yeah, this is...

00:12:30.000 This is fancy, but I need to push through today.

00:12:33.000 But it's a tool to help mitigate overtraining.

00:12:37.000 Wow, that's really fascinating.

00:12:39.000 So it seems like experience is probably the most important thing then.

00:12:43.000 I think so.

00:12:44.000 I think so.

00:12:45.000 And that's hard, though.

00:12:46.000 When I'm in training camp, I'm like a racehorse, man. 0.98

00:12:49.000 I want to fucking run. 0.98

00:12:50.000 And I really need somebody to pull back the reins. 0.99

00:12:54.000 And sometimes I can do that myself, but sometimes I'm in fucking shark frenzy mode. 0.86

00:12:59.000 I just want to go, go, go, go, go. 0.92

00:13:01.000 And...

00:13:04.000 I have to have people around me to be like, hey, no, whoa, kick it. 0.63

00:13:08.000 You need to kick back.

00:13:11.000 And your relationship with Erwan, when you guys first started, how did you work in the movement training with all the other stuff that you were doing?

00:13:19.000 Did you have a specific day?

00:13:21.000 You'd say, hey, we're going to meet on Tuesday, and just set Tuesday aside?

00:13:25.000 Pretty much, yeah.

00:13:26.000 We would go...

00:13:28.000 You know, block out maybe three or four hours later in the week and, you know, just hit it.

00:13:36.000 And it wasn't always intense.

00:13:37.000 That was a cool thing about work with Erwin.

00:13:38.000 It wasn't like physically intense.

00:13:40.000 It was mentally and neurologically taxing.

00:13:45.000 So after we did this stuff, I was absolutely wiped out.

00:13:48.000 But, you know, I got my heart rate up a little bit, but these weren't hard workouts.

00:13:52.000 They weren't taking it out of me physically.

00:13:53.000 That's interesting.

00:13:54.000 So what wiped you out about it?

00:13:58.000 I think we're training the neuromuscular system, and we're training the...

00:14:03.000 He could probably tell you more about it than I can, but it was really, really precise...

00:14:15.000 Movements that just tax you neurologically.

00:14:21.000 You could probably tell me more about that.

00:14:24.000 What's he babbling about?

00:14:27.000 Well, first off, Carlos is surrounded by a team of world-class people.

00:14:34.000 The person he was talking about, Adrian of Elevate in Albuquerque, is a strength and conditioning coach.

00:14:40.000 He works specifically with him on this area of this training, and then there's Brendan Gibson, and then there's Ricky Landell, and then of course there's Greg Jackson and Wayne Conjol.

00:14:50.000 So me, I had to address areas of this training that I believed were lacking.

00:14:59.000 If I was to find a word to describe what we've been training with him, I would say, Carlos, we've been training your brain.

00:15:06.000 Because the number one reason why we have a brain from an evolutionary perspective is for movement.

00:15:12.000 It's not to discuss fine wine or the history of art, which is great, but originally it's so that an animal can navigate through complex movement, through complex environments.

00:15:24.000 That's the reason why we have a brain.

00:15:27.000 Intensity is not necessarily raising the heart rate, you know, going really hard and burning all over.

00:15:35.000 Intensity can be in the mindfulness that you apply to intentionally perform movement very specifically with a high level of efficiency.

00:15:47.000 That requires a level of focus that challenges, stimulates, and helps the connective functions grow.

00:15:56.000 As a matter of fact, movement itself is a major, if not the major secret or reason for helping connective functions.

00:16:11.000 It does a whole deal of things, you know, processes in the brain that's going to help it grow.

00:16:22.000 And what you acquire through movement transfers to any area of life, but obviously transfers to better movement.

00:16:31.000 And better movement is not always just more power or new techniques.

00:16:38.000 I told Carlos, Carlos, listen.

00:16:40.000 You've been training for 13 years.

00:16:43.000 You are extremely seasoned, extremely experienced.

00:16:46.000 And I bet that you've tried diverse modalities of training, but that currently every camp is pretty much the same in terms of preparation, except what's specific to a game plan for a given opponent.

00:17:03.000 So I said, you may try to acquire more power.

00:17:08.000 It's going to take a lot of energy because you have already a lot of power for your weight category.

00:17:16.000 You may try to acquire more endurance, but that's going to be putting a lot of time, a lot of energy to get that.

00:17:24.000 You can try to learn more techniques, but you know already so many techniques.

00:17:28.000 So one of the things that you can do is to move better.

00:17:33.000 So any technique that you already know, we want to perform them Better.

00:17:39.000 Okay, so what is involved in movement training?

00:17:42.000 Say it's day one, you get a guy and he says, hey, I love this idea, hook me up.

00:17:50.000 Well, in the case of Carlos, it had to be something specific to him as a fighter, to what I saw.

00:17:59.000 I saw, you know, what are his fortes, his strong points, but I also saw what I believed were Deficiencies.

00:18:07.000 And that may seem presumptuous, but when I talked to him about it, what I saw that could be improved, he said, well, that's exactly what I've been told for years by my coaches.

00:18:17.000 And what was that?

00:18:19.000 I thought that his stance was too high.

00:18:22.000 He used mostly this particular, you know, typically Thai boxing square stance, you know, with his feet in the L shape.

00:18:32.000 And to me that caused a ton of instabilities but also prevented him from being as fast as I believe he could be in moving in and out or sideways.

00:18:42.000 So what adjustments did you make as far as the stance?

00:18:48.000 The position of his back foot is orientated at a 90 degree angle.

00:18:53.000 So we moved it forward more at a 45 degree angle.

00:18:58.000 But the problem when we did that is that when we have a square stance, basically your feet are in line.

00:19:04.000 So if you move, you are relatively stable only because the back foot is going that way.

00:19:10.000 Now when you move it that way, you shrink a bit your base of support.

00:19:14.000 It creates even more instability.

00:19:16.000 So what you need to do is to have your feet wider, to widen, you know, a bit wider...

00:19:24.000 To the front or to the back and then to the sides, something like a shoulder width or a hip width.

00:19:32.000 So that was really a lot of...

00:19:34.000 When I was tweaking something, it may create a negative...

00:19:40.000 So we had to do a lot of drilling to improve that stance to make it better.

00:19:46.000 Now, the stance that you developed, sort of classic stance, you know, and you're a tall guy, you would fight tall and stand up high.

00:19:55.000 Were there any issues when you started adjusting the way you placed your feet or did you have to relearn things?

00:20:01.000 Oh yeah, without a doubt.

00:20:03.000 I've been training, you know, Muay Thai since I was 15 years old.

00:20:08.000 And so, yeah, I mean, these things have been, you know, have been stratified in my freaking, you know, my muscle memory for years.

00:20:20.000 So yeah, it took quite a bit of, and I probably, you still see me going back to my old habits.

00:20:26.000 You're going to, especially when you're tired or you're stressed or you're in different situations, you're going to revert back to the thing that you've trained the most.

00:20:32.000 But when I'm mindful of it, for the most part, I definitely think that the improvements or the adjustments we've made We're major improvements.

00:20:43.000 We also worked on, instead of being real, real heavy on my front leg, having more of an upright stance as far as my torso and not being so heavy, being more 50-50 on my legs.

00:20:55.000 That allowed me to move in and out faster, not only forward but back.

00:21:01.000 That showed big time in the fight against Tiago Alves.

00:21:04.000 I think that was the reason I was able to You know get in get inside land with the elbows as effectively as I did and You know and then kind of you know get get the fight rolling we're seeing some I love watching different Sort of patterns that are developing the fighters start following but one of the things that we're seeing There's a lot of people that are standing in more of a karate stance More sideways and wider stance.

00:21:31.000 And with that, like sort of Lyoto Machida style, Gunnar Nelson likes to fight like that.

00:21:36.000 You can bounce, Conor McGregor, you bounce in and out easier.

00:21:40.000 It seems like a lighter footprint sort of stance.

00:21:44.000 Yeah, and that's very much what we were aiming at.

00:21:47.000 Yes. 0.99

00:21:48.000 I execute it the way that I do because I'm a flat-footed kind of fucking goofy guy. 0.99

00:21:53.000 And I do my best. 0.99

00:21:55.000 I'm lucky I got a hard head sometimes because I'm not Mr. Technique all the time.

00:22:01.000 But we definitely made improvement.

00:22:04.000 I must say that working with Carlos and he's extremely focused actually.

00:22:11.000 When he trained there was like no, it was like a zero fat kind of training like completely entirely focused from the beginning to the end.

00:22:19.000 Always really applied himself during the training and I know that he drilled a lot also on his own in between every session to make those adjustments to make them become second nature.

00:22:31.000 Because when you change any aspect of your technique, at first it feels unnatural because your brain is, you know, you have something, certain patterns that are ingrained in your neuromuscular memory and they are a little hard to change.

00:22:48.000 But Carlos was able to change things really fast, actually, and I was always impressed by how fast he would make those progresses.

00:22:57.000 And again, those progresses were not That much physical, you know, in the sense of strength and conditioning, like it would have to work hard.

00:23:08.000 The changes were...

00:23:10.000 I always told him, you have...

00:23:13.000 the body has it.

00:23:15.000 What you need is that map in your brain somewhere to really understand, recognize, identify, and assimilate fully that particular pattern.

00:23:27.000 You've done so many movements, so much footwork, but that way to do it requires a different wiring between the mind and the body, between the brain and the body.

00:23:41.000 And the body.

00:23:42.000 That's a big part of it, right, is just patterns and getting those patterns ingrained in your system to the point where they come out automatically.

00:23:49.000 Yes.

00:23:50.000 Like, you know those movements that happen either in sparring or in competition where all of a sudden you're executing something and you had zero thought.

00:23:59.000 It's just completely your training takes over.

00:24:02.000 You slip a punch and counter and you don't even...

00:24:05.000 There's no conscious thought at all.

00:24:06.000 And that has to sort of similarly...

00:24:11.000 Exactly, and that's what stimulated Carlos' brain that much, that he had to take a nap after every training, whereas he's used to really, really hard training.

00:24:22.000 But with that training, which is relatively low intensity and The brain is so stimulated that it needs to recover because it needs to process while it is...

00:24:35.000 It's like if the movement, the mindful movement is the input that the brain needs to do that re-circuiting differently and to deconstruct old patterns,

00:24:52.000 replace them with more efficient patterns.

00:24:55.000 And that didn't happen while we were doing it.

00:24:57.000 You know, while we were doing it, a lot of the times I was struggling with this stuff.

00:25:01.000 But I'd go home and I would rest and I'd go back to my regular training, work a little bit on it, not a whole lot, but then the next time I would come back, it was almost as if my...

00:25:12.000 My mind and my body had digested this stuff and assimilated and put it into practical application unconsciously, without me even really working on it too much.

00:25:26.000 He says that I would work in the meantime between our sessions.

00:25:30.000 Sometimes I did, sometimes I didn't.

00:25:32.000 Sometimes I had a lot of other stuff going on.

00:25:37.000 But it looked like I did because I feel like, and I think this is kind of a consensus that you make gains during your rest.

00:25:50.000 You can lift and lift and lift and lift, but if you never rest, you're never going to make those gains.

00:25:54.000 The same thing with your technique and this neurological training.

00:25:59.000 I think it works the exact same way.

00:26:03.000 The whole movement that's going on right now is really fascinating because there's a bunch of different sort of branches of it.

00:26:11.000 And there's like what Ido Portal is doing, there's what you're doing, but there's also what Nick Kurson's doing.

00:26:17.000 He's a guy who's a strength and conditioning coach for Fabricio Verdum and Rafael Dos Anjos.

00:26:22.000 And I had him on the podcast and I asked him like, what is...

00:26:26.000 One of the most important things that fighters are lacking and that you try to improve on.

00:26:32.000 And he said foot strength.

00:26:34.000 And I found that to be really interesting.

00:26:36.000 And when I watched what you guys were doing, a lot of this barefoot jumping and leaping and balancing, and it requires some pretty extreme foot stability.

00:26:45.000 It's the number one thing we addressed with cars.

00:26:48.000 Number one.

00:26:48.000 Number one, I said your feet are not strong.

00:26:51.000 Wow.

00:26:51.000 And they're not smart enough.

00:26:54.000 Not that feet have a brain, but there is an extremely strong correlation between the proprioception in the foot and the brain and movement.

00:27:05.000 So most of the time when we move we're on our feet and that's the reason why there are so many Sensors, nerve terminations in the feet.

00:27:14.000 Thousands and thousands of them.

00:27:16.000 Why?

00:27:16.000 Because it's about intelligence.

00:27:19.000 Intelligence in the sense of information.

00:27:21.000 We talk about proprioception, exteroception, which is the particular perception of a given surface and its texture.

00:27:29.000 Is it slippery?

00:27:31.000 Does it give traction and things like that?

00:27:33.000 Is it stable or shaky?

00:27:36.000 Anyways, so the moment you place your feet, boom, it sends an information to the brain.

00:27:42.000 The brain processes and gives order to all the rest of the body to shift the weight, to just give some order, some intention.

00:27:52.000 It happens without you having to think about it, and it happens extremely fast.

00:27:56.000 However, the more your feet are Sensitive in that sense, the faster that information travels up and back down.

00:28:06.000 And secondly, also the stronger your foot is, the more reliable your base of support is.

00:28:12.000 So we talk about the strength.

00:28:15.000 Of the foot.

00:28:16.000 We talk about the elasticity of the muscles in the feet to be sometimes more bouncy, just simply faster, to be also more endurant, to last longer with that elasticity and speed.

00:28:33.000 And we did a lot of that through balancing drills, even like loaded balancing drills, but also specific footwork drills.

00:28:42.000 And moving in and out.

00:28:44.000 And it was not only the footwork itself, it's also how the level of alertness that you have in relation to an openet and the level of responsiveness that you have in your movement in relation to an openet.

00:28:57.000 Because it's not just reinforcing a particular part of your body as if you're made of parts.

00:29:02.000 It has to work as a whole.

00:29:04.000 We had to make sure that anything would improve specifically then would be brought back to the whole spectrum, which is movement in a fight and work and actually improve.

00:29:15.000 And that's what Carlos did every time when he would go sparring.

00:29:19.000 And then he would see by himself and then tell me back, I've improved this, I've improved that, and my coaches see it too.

00:29:27.000 So the proof is in the pudding, as Carlos would always say, it works.

00:29:33.000 You know, most people would think that if you're a fit guy and you're a strong guy, and you know, like say maybe you do squats or something like that, you'd have strong feet.

00:29:41.000 And one of the things that shocked me the most when I started doing yoga is that's what would give out.

00:29:46.000 It's my feet would give out.

00:29:47.000 I was like this is so bizarre like I felt like okay if I could stand on one foot like if you made me stand here on one foot with my sneakers on it's not hard I'll stand on one foot you know okay no big deal but when you're balancing my feet would fucking ache you know like you're doing like bow pose or something like that you got one leg up here and your arm is stretched forward and you're balancing my feet would be what was giving out and I started thinking about how little stability You know,

00:30:16.000 most people probably have from training with shoes on, lifting weights with shoes on, doing running with like big thick cushy shoes, all those things.

00:30:26.000 Even elite athletes and even elite MMA fighters.

00:30:31.000 And the reason why, even when they are training barefoot in dojos or in gyms, but you have to think of what's the background of a given person.

00:30:41.000 Most people today in modern populations grow up Indoors. 0.96

00:30:46.000 With shoes on.

00:30:47.000 All the time.

00:30:48.000 Walking where?

00:30:49.000 Walking on flat, smooth surfaces.

00:30:52.000 Very predictable.

00:30:52.000 There's no challenge to the body.

00:30:55.000 There's no challenge to the feet.

00:30:56.000 The feet become numb.

00:30:57.000 The feet become weak, structurally.

00:31:00.000 And in terms of strength, in terms of...

00:31:04.000 They just sort of get laced into these shoes.

00:31:06.000 Yeah.

00:31:07.000 So...

00:31:09.000 If you're trying MMA because you're going to do, you know, say, striking, move on your feet, it's going to help.

00:31:16.000 Definitely, it's going to help your foot strength, your foot mobility, your foot stability, but not as much as what you're going to gain when you have to balance on...

00:31:29.000 On narrow surfaces or in certain positions, in certain transitions, kneeling and sitting and get ups and get down, especially with loads on or at a certain pace, at a certain speed.

00:31:43.000 It's different.

00:31:44.000 And when you make the feet stronger, then your footwork is stronger.

00:31:48.000 When we talk about movement coaching, some people are confused because when they hear movement in relation to fighting, they think footwork.

00:31:57.000 And it is footwork, but it's also more than that.

00:32:01.000 Do you remember a few years back, it was all the rage, you were hearing about a lot of NFL players were doing ballet.

00:32:09.000 Do you remember this?

00:32:10.000 Yeah, I remember.

00:32:11.000 It was a big deal.

00:32:13.000 People were mocking it and joking around about it.

00:32:16.000 And I remember thinking, man, that is really interesting.

00:32:18.000 They must have some sort of benefit. 0.98

00:32:21.000 In that if they're doing it, but if you think about ballet, the movements are incredibly difficult, and especially if you're a 260-pound fucking stud athlete covered in muscles. 0.96

00:32:32.000 There was a guy that was in a yoga class recently. 0.95

00:32:35.000 He was a former football player.

00:32:37.000 Real big guy.

00:32:37.000 He's like 6'4", and real thick and heavy.

00:32:41.000 It's so much harder for him to do these movements and say like a girl who weighs 100 pounds.

00:32:46.000 It's like a castle in the sand.

00:32:48.000 You know, it's not an Achilles tendon.

00:32:50.000 It's like an Achilles foot.

00:32:52.000 You have a whole mountain that's built on a very weak foundation.

00:32:57.000 So ballet, even for NFL players, was actually a very smart move because when you look at the strength of the cows, I had a Kudzin who was a professional dancer.

00:33:12.000 Her calves, her foot strength was completely amazing because, you know, they do this gracious movement. 0.93

00:33:18.000 People see the grace, but they make extraordinary movement look easy, but they're not.

00:33:23.000 Like floor gymnasts too, I would imagine, because they have to stick, like your foot has to have the ability to catch you and then just stay in that position completely locked in.

00:33:36.000 Absorb Foot, ankle, knee, hip, stability, core stability.

00:33:41.000 It starts in the foot.

00:33:44.000 Balance.

00:33:46.000 Everything is integrated, of course.

00:33:49.000 But it starts with your feet.

00:33:51.000 I saw you doing, in some of the countdown shows, you were doing a lot of jumping over things and standing and jumping onto what looks like a board and landing on what looks like a 2x4 or something like that and locking in place on that.

00:34:05.000 It was pretty impressive stuff.

00:34:06.000 There it is right here.

00:34:07.000 Jamie, you're on the ball.

00:34:10.000 But this kind of stuff.

00:34:12.000 When you were doing these kind of movements, you'd see it here on this How do you design these, Erwan?

00:34:20.000 Are you looking for different things specific to Carlos?

00:34:25.000 Totally 100% specific to Carlos.

00:34:28.000 Because that's the point.

00:34:30.000 Movement coaching, for lack of a better term, it's not giving a fighter random movements that are not fighting movements.

00:34:42.000 Ballet dancing or...

00:34:44.000 Whatever.

00:34:45.000 Tai Chi.

00:34:47.000 It could be anything.

00:34:48.000 It could be any movement.

00:34:49.000 Movement is such a very...

00:34:51.000 It's a vast world or universe.

00:34:54.000 If you're lucky, you're going to...

00:34:56.000 If you give something randomly, you're going to find something that happens to be useful.

00:35:02.000 But in the case of Carlos, I looked at his fights.

00:35:06.000 I analyzed this movement.

00:35:07.000 I had some intuitions about what was there, what was missing.

00:35:12.000 And then...

00:35:14.000 As I was training him, I was constantly adjusting the movement programs, what was in every session, to what I saw was working, what I saw was not working, depending on the level of progress that it was making, we would do something more difficult or at a higher level of intensity.

00:35:32.000 It's tailored, it's customized, not random.

00:35:35.000 How did you develop this program?

00:35:37.000 This is very interesting because I would imagine that You would get athletes from a bunch of different sports that would come to you, right?

00:35:46.000 No.

00:35:46.000 No?

00:35:47.000 I'm not looking.

00:35:48.000 I told Carlos, Carlos, listen, I'm focusing 100% on you.

00:35:53.000 Right.

00:35:53.000 There's no other athlete that I want to train.

00:35:55.000 But you have like a gym, right?

00:35:57.000 I mean, you have this Move Nat, is this company, you have this website.

00:36:01.000 Yeah, we have thousands of certified trainers who are using our methods.

00:36:06.000 Thousands?

00:36:06.000 Yeah, thousands of trainers.

00:36:07.000 Wow.

00:36:07.000 I think somewhere around 3,000 at this point.

00:36:09.000 How long have you been doing this worldwide?

00:36:11.000 The company since 2009. So this is all your creation?

00:36:17.000 You've developed this all yourself?

00:36:18.000 The method is my creation.

00:36:21.000 However, I do draw from the history of physical education, which I have studied a lot, especially what comes from Europe.

00:36:30.000 And in my case, because I'm originally from France, there used to be a method called the natural method by a guy called Georges Baer, Who himself was not...

00:36:41.000 He was seen as a pioneer, but himself was, you know, at some point, that long line of people.

00:36:49.000 Before him was Amoros and Pestalozzi and Mercurialis, a lot of guys who were working on these different methods.

00:36:56.000 But we're talking...

00:36:59.000 20th century, 19th century, 18th century and before and before and before.

00:37:04.000 And back then people didn't have exercise science.

00:37:08.000 So what is it that they were training?

00:37:10.000 They were training the most down-to-earth Practical movements.

00:37:16.000 They would jump, they would run, they would crawl, they would lift and carry things and throw and catch things.

00:37:23.000 Why?

00:37:23.000 Because these are the movements that people needed back then, that they were in the military or firefighters.

00:37:32.000 And when you look at it today, if there is a situation that's potentially life-threatening, These are still the movements that you need to do to save your life or to save somebody else's life.

00:37:45.000 They're natural, but they are natural also to the point that they are vital.

00:37:49.000 So you have this gym, right?

00:37:52.000 What is your normal clientele, like the normal person that comes to a Move Nat gym?

00:37:58.000 It's impossible to shrink to a particular category because...

00:38:03.000 Do you get like housewives? 0.99

00:38:04.000 Do you get athletes of all sports?

00:38:07.000 Yes, yes.

00:38:08.000 Old and young, men and women.

00:38:10.000 So some woman comes in, she's a housewife. 1.00

00:38:12.000 Uh-huh. 1.00

00:38:13.000 Women hate that fucking expression. 1.00

00:38:15.000 A woman comes in who's a non-professional athlete who's just looking to get back in shape maybe after having a baby. 1.00

00:38:21.000 Do you design a protocol specifically for her?

00:38:24.000 Is that what you would do?

00:38:26.000 Yeah.

00:38:26.000 Or do you have classes?

00:38:27.000 The movements, there are some movements that are fundamental movements that anybody can do.

00:38:34.000 And then you have more advanced movement.

00:38:37.000 And then you have, say, a simple jump.

00:38:40.000 You see Carlos jumping.

00:38:42.000 You're like, this woman you're talking about won't be able to do that.

00:38:46.000 Actually, yes, she will, but not at the same level of intensity.

00:38:51.000 Right.

00:38:51.000 Oh, I see.

00:38:52.000 So you would have her do it like shorter jumps over lower bars. 1.00

00:38:56.000 It can be a simple jump on the spot where you jump two inches above ground and land in the same spot where you were standing.

00:39:03.000 Two inches?

00:39:03.000 I think she could do four.

00:39:04.000 You've got to push her.

00:39:05.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:39:07.000 Well, you just need to keep the training never too hard, never too easy.

00:39:14.000 That was actually also my concern when I started to train Carlos because he was recovering and I was extremely worried that I wouldn't do anything that would...

00:39:24.000 Compromise, recover in any way that would actually help him recover even faster.

00:39:29.000 So you have a method only when it's scalable and also when it is progressive.

00:39:34.000 And because these movements are natural, they belong to all of us.

00:39:39.000 It's like, what would be the best way to train a wild tiger?

00:39:45.000 Can you imagine that you're going to try to isolate their, you know, their hind legs and then try to have them do another workout for the front legs and then put them on a treadmill for cardio?

00:39:58.000 That wouldn't make any sense.

00:40:00.000 That would be hilarious because to be optimally strong and agile and like a good hunter, a good predator...

00:40:08.000 The wild tiger just needs to be and behave and move like a wild tiger in its original environment. 0.95

00:40:14.000 But I think if you get a tiger on an inverted treadmill and really push that motherfucker, have some good music going, maybe some motivational videos. 0.98

00:40:23.000 Turn the heater up. 0.99

00:40:24.000 It would be a drago tiger.

00:40:26.000 Well, you know, they do that with pit bulls. 1.00

00:40:29.000 You know, pit bulls, when they train them for fighting, they put them on treadmills. 0.53

00:40:34.000 They put them on a treadmill that's sort of self-propelled, like the animals propelling the treadmill, and they'll put something in front of it that it wants to get to.

00:40:42.000 So exercise science for pit bulls.

00:40:45.000 Yeah, well, it's a real thing.

00:40:47.000 I mean, they sell these.

00:40:48.000 They have weigh-ins.

00:40:49.000 Yeah, they do. 1.00

00:40:51.000 This shit's serious, man. 1.00

00:40:52.000 Oh, yeah. 1.00

00:40:53.000 Why not?

00:40:53.000 But my point was...

00:40:56.000 I believe everybody needs the fundamental of movements before you go through a very specific science-based exercise for anybody.

00:41:10.000 Most people don't need that.

00:41:12.000 Most people just need to move in the first place.

00:41:14.000 They don't even move.

00:41:15.000 They can't even squat.

00:41:16.000 Right, right.

00:41:16.000 Most people are just sedentary.

00:41:18.000 They're just sitting in offices and cubicles or what have you.

00:41:21.000 And the cause of most of their physical ailments is that improper movement behavior, lack of movement or too specialized movement, lack of diversity.

00:41:34.000 And the good thing is that the antidote for that is movement also, movement behaviors.

00:41:40.000 Movement behavior is the cause and the solution to a lot of physical issues.

00:41:45.000 Yeah, so when you think about it, what do we do? 0.98

00:41:47.000 We fucking stand, we sit, we lay, we bend. 0.99

00:41:52.000 That's about it. 0.99

00:41:52.000 That's like four things, right, throughout our day, you know? 0.99

00:41:56.000 And that is so, so narrow of a movement spectrum compared to what should we do?

00:42:01.000 We should throw.

00:42:02.000 We should run.

00:42:03.000 We should catch.

00:42:03.000 We should swim.

00:42:05.000 We should balance.

00:42:05.000 We should pull.

00:42:07.000 We should carry.

00:42:08.000 We should fight.

00:42:10.000 All this variety of things that the human body is supposed to do, and yet we are in these constraints of our...

00:42:19.000 We have chairs. 1.00

00:42:20.000 We're We're sitting here on fucking chairs. 1.00

00:42:22.000 Before there was chairs, there was a fucking, you know, a low squat or kneel or, you know. 0.99

00:42:28.000 There's also the... 0.97

00:42:34.000 The neurological benefit of doing those things.

00:42:37.000 Because for you to move that way, your brain has to do it for you.

00:42:44.000 It has to fire those synapses off. 1.00

00:42:46.000 We're not doing that by this boring ass shit. 1.00

00:42:50.000 Or even if we're fit. 1.00

00:42:52.000 We're still laying.

00:42:54.000 We're sitting on machines.

00:42:55.000 I'm doing an elevated whatever.

00:43:01.000 Bench press or something.

00:43:03.000 We're still kind of isolated.

00:43:06.000 It's very minimal.

00:43:08.000 We're not supposed to be like that. 0.99

00:43:10.000 We're supposed to fucking move. 0.99

00:43:12.000 Exactly. 0.97

00:43:13.000 Even the people who are brave enough to Go against that inertia of normalcy and go to the gym and they will exercise with machines.

00:43:23.000 I see a huge problem with that.

00:43:25.000 Yeah, like Nautilus type machines.

00:43:28.000 It's totalitarian because machines dictates your movement, shrinks it, shapes it.

00:43:36.000 You have no choice.

00:43:37.000 You follow a very simplified It's a pattern that's imposed by the machine.

00:43:43.000 This is not who you are.

00:43:45.000 This is not what you're supposed to be and move like.

00:43:48.000 Because you're supposed to be highly adaptable in the way you move. 0.97

00:43:51.000 But when you try to isolate your muscles, you're treating yourself like you're a freaking machine.

00:43:57.000 It's like a factory when you should be like a wild forest or a permaculture garden or something like that.

00:44:04.000 It's not what your design By evolution or creation, whatever, to do.

00:44:13.000 And so bringing it back around to MMA, to stepping in the octagon to fighting, the nature of our sport has so many different variables.

00:44:23.000 Anything can happen.

00:44:24.000 We go through, we're using various energy systems. 0.74

00:44:28.000 We go from going aerobic to anaerobic to using an isometric hold all the way back through So many different things involved, because basically we're able to do whatever the fuck we want in there under a very limited amount of rules.

00:44:45.000 So training this way just makes sense.

00:44:51.000 It's much more along the lines of what we're actually going to do in competition.

00:44:56.000 How much of a factor does flexibility play?

00:45:00.000 And how often do you train flexibility?

00:45:06.000 A lot of flexibility is huge, mobility is huge because the more mobility you can explore, manifest physically a full range of motion, but it also plays a huge role in how relaxed you are and therefore how much power you can generate.

00:45:28.000 That's actually one of the main points focused on the second camp that we did for the fight for Robi.

00:45:36.000 So we established a strategy.

00:45:38.000 I proposed a movement strategy to Carlos.

00:45:43.000 When he talked to Greg Jackson about his gameplay, they came up with the same thing.

00:45:51.000 And that was to use his wrench, to always keep control of the wrench.

00:45:55.000 And therefore, to use his reach through using his kicks more and better.

00:46:01.000 And we had to address some deficiencies in flexibility.

00:46:06.000 Because what we noticed right away is that when Carlos was trying to reach a certain height, he had to somewhat go a little beyond his...

00:46:17.000 Is back then current level of mobility.

00:46:19.000 You mean height with a kick?

00:46:21.000 Yes, yes.

00:46:22.000 And so when you try to somewhat force a little your mobility, what creates is instability.

00:46:26.000 And it slows down the movement and then you also lose accuracy and power and accuracy.

00:46:32.000 So we did tons of stretching, but we did that stretching through natural movement, through a lot of movement on the ground and yeah, through those natural patterns.

00:46:47.000 So I think, and tell me if you agree, in MMA as opposed to traditional martial arts, I think we skip over a lot of the intricacies.

00:46:59.000 I know you're a martial artist.

00:47:02.000 You came up in Taekwondo.

00:47:05.000 And I feel like traditional martial arts really emphasize you don't go past this point until you've mastered this thing.

00:47:12.000 And it's very...

00:47:16.000 Very specialized.

00:47:17.000 In MMA, I think we get a guy and he's got a wrestling background.

00:47:23.000 We'll teach him a little bit of boxing.

00:47:26.000 We won't get him necessarily super crisp.

00:47:29.000 Teach him how to stay out of a few submissions.

00:47:31.000 Get him real strong, get him in shape, and then put him out there and let him go with intensity.

00:47:36.000 And a lot of times that'll carry a lot of guys to the top levels.

00:47:39.000 And yet they've missed some of these smaller basic nuts and bolts kind of thing with the movement.

00:47:49.000 And I think that going back to...

00:47:52.000 That's all good.

00:47:53.000 That's all well and good.

00:47:54.000 You need that mix of stuff.

00:47:56.000 You need the intensity.

00:47:56.000 You need to be able to get out there and bite down on your mouthpiece and throw down when the time comes.

00:48:03.000 But if you have that, you can always go back and work on that other stuff.

00:48:07.000 And that's what I feel like I did quite a bit with Erwin.

00:48:13.000 Making these tweaks on these very fundamental things that had been skipped over because...

00:48:20.000 You know, I'm, you know, I'm kind of, I'm built to be a, I got, I got the fighter thing here. 0.96

00:48:24.000 Um, and you put me, you know, against whoever, I'm gonna, I'm gonna fucking go.

00:48:29.000 But now let's just refine, let's refine, let's refine and, and, uh, um, Maximize the potential of what I can do.

00:48:39.000 Yeah, it seems like almost having that kind of go-go-go mentality, that fighter mentality, it's obviously a huge benefit when you're in a fight, but it almost seems like maybe sometimes it's against your benefit when you're training, because when you're training,

00:48:56.000 you almost should be looking at it like a science.

00:48:59.000 You almost should be looking at, instead of just trying to be the toughest guy in the room, you should almost be looking at it like you're building a castle.

00:49:07.000 You have to make sure the foundation is good.

00:49:09.000 And in traditional martial arts, you have your white belt techniques.

00:49:13.000 And then, you know, as you develop in the ranks and you get new belts, you move up and you get higher ranks.

00:49:20.000 One of the things you say, you get higher techniques or more difficult techniques, but one of the things you see in MMA is there's guys that have mastered, like truly mastered one particular aspect of MMA. Damien Maia is a perfect example.

00:49:34.000 He's a legitimate jiu-jitsu master, world champion.

00:49:37.000 And because of that, his specialty is so strong that when he gets to that spot, he's just got this massive advantage over almost anybody.

00:49:48.000 And you see that when he fights really good guys, like Gunnar Nelson.

00:49:53.000 Gunnar Nelson. 1.00

00:49:53.000 I mean, Gunnar Nelson's a motherfucker. 1.00

00:49:55.000 Yep. 1.00

00:49:55.000 A motherfucker on the ground. 1.00

00:49:56.000 But Damien's so goddamn good. 1.00

00:49:59.000 Like Neil Magny's another one. 0.94

00:50:00.000 Neil Magny is so good.

00:50:01.000 He's so tough and so good at avoiding submissions.

00:50:05.000 His defense is excellent.

00:50:06.000 And Damien just ran right through him.

00:50:09.000 And he runs right through him because his technique is samurai sword sharp.

00:50:14.000 And he has polished it down.

00:50:16.000 And then...

00:50:17.000 Yeah.

00:50:19.000 Yeah.

00:50:41.000 Yeah, and I would say that that's probably me.

00:50:46.000 I'm good at a lot of different things.

00:50:50.000 Maybe not a master in necessarily anything.

00:50:52.000 Your stand-up is pretty high level.

00:50:54.000 Pretty high level, yeah.

00:50:55.000 Pretty high level.

00:50:57.000 You stand up with pretty much anybody.

00:51:00.000 I put your stand-up at a very high level.

00:51:02.000 But your submissions are very good too, man. 0.98

00:51:06.000 If you spent five years and did nothing but jiu-jitsu every day and started competing in the Mundials and Abu Dhabi and Naga and all that shit, and who knows what the fuck your jiu-jitsu would be like. 0.92

00:51:18.000 Which sounds awesome. 0.88

00:51:19.000 I mean, when I was coming up, Greg Jackson's gym now is very much a...

00:51:25.000 It's seen as kickboxing, lots and lots of striking.

00:51:29.000 Some wrestling, some jiu-jitsu, but mainly striking.

00:51:34.000 Back in the day when I first started with Greg and his system and his affiliates, it was mainly grappling school.

00:51:40.000 It was Gaido Jitsu, right?

00:51:42.000 Gaido Jitsu, yes sir.

00:51:44.000 His style that he had created.

00:51:45.000 Yeah.

00:51:46.000 Well, him and some other guys kind of got together and created this thing.

00:51:50.000 Does he still call it that?

00:51:52.000 Or is that history?

00:51:53.000 No, that's history, man.

00:51:55.000 That's old school stuff. 0.95

00:51:57.000 I don't know how the fuck I still remember that. 0.57

00:52:00.000 But, you know, a guy like Keith Jardine, who by the time he got into the UFC was kickboxing everybody. 0.67

00:52:06.000 When I first met Keith, Keith was a jiu-jitsu guy, man.

00:52:09.000 He was competing in the advanced level at these Grappler's Quest tournaments and that sort of thing, and then kind of got away from that.

00:52:19.000 I think my first 12 or 13 wins or something were by submission, and now I haven't had a submission in years.

00:52:28.000 We just got away from that.

00:52:32.000 The sport kind of evolves and then it comes full circle.

00:52:37.000 Like it goes, you know, swings one way and then the other.

00:52:41.000 And you see that with fighters as well.

00:52:42.000 Like Paul Felder is a perfect example.

00:52:44.000 Kid's this excellent striker.

00:52:46.000 And he had a couple really close decision losses to Barboza and Ross Pearson.

00:52:51.000 And then he wins his next fight by submission.

00:52:53.000 And attacked with another submission before he got the rear naked choke, he almost got him in a guillotine. 0.98

00:52:58.000 Like you see guys going, hey, there's other ways to fucking skin a cat. 0.99

00:53:02.000 Absolutely. 0.98

00:53:02.000 I've got to figure out how to be more predictable. 0.98

00:53:05.000 Or unpredictable, rather.

00:53:06.000 And I think that that's one of the real problems with guys who are specialist strikers.

00:53:10.000 Is that when you fight a guy who's a specialist striker, you know that he's not going to be shooting on you.

00:53:15.000 So you're more relaxed.

00:53:16.000 You know, you can loosen your legs up a little bit.

00:53:19.000 You know, your footwork, your stance takes a different position because you're not squared off, always looking to sprawl and hit underhooks.

00:53:26.000 Absolutely.

00:53:27.000 And, you know, you bring that up in that...

00:53:31.000 Makes me think about my last fight.

00:53:33.000 I'm a well-rounded fighter, but I went in there and had a kickboxing fight with Robbie.

00:53:39.000 Well, I thought that would actually be to your benefit, because what I said in the pre-fight thing was that issues you've had in the past with guys who've been able to hold on to you and grab you down, like Hendrix, and that that might be a benefit to you in the Robbie Lawler fight, 0.97

00:53:54.000 because fucking Robbie, he's a gladiator. 0.83

00:53:57.000 I mean, that dude, he's so rare in that regard. 1.00

00:54:01.000 What you see is what you get.

00:54:03.000 That guy, you know, he is all bite down the mouthpiece and move forward. 0.98

00:54:07.000 He's got excellent technique and he's just fucking tough as nails. 0.97

00:54:11.000 But he's a born fighter. 0.99

00:54:12.000 Born fighter.

00:54:13.000 Yeah.

00:54:14.000 Well, that's why that fight was so good between you guys.

00:54:16.000 That last round, man.

00:54:17.000 Jesus Christ. 0.99

00:54:18.000 When the fucking round was over and you guys both put your arms on the cage, that was the... 0.99

00:54:24.000 The perfect example of leaving it all in the octagon. 0.99

00:54:28.000 You guys just emptied out the tank, you were on fumes, and then the buzzer rang, and you both did the same thing. 0.99

00:54:35.000 When the fuck has that ever happened? 0.96

00:54:36.000 I don't think that's ever happened in a fight, where the fight's over and both guys just walk to the cage. 0.98

00:54:41.000 You didn't hug each other. 0.93

00:54:42.000 You're like, that'll fucking happen later. 0.97

00:54:44.000 Look at this. 0.98

00:54:44.000 Look at this picture right there. 0.98

00:54:45.000 That's you guys. 0.99

00:54:46.000 That's fucking never happened, man. 0.99

00:54:48.000 I've never seen that. 0.98

00:54:49.000 I wasn't even conscious of that at that point.

00:54:50.000 I think I was oxygen-deprived, hypoxic, probably mildly concussed from taking shots. 0.99

00:54:58.000 That was a fucking amazing fight. 0.98

00:55:00.000 It was an amazing fight. 0.99

00:55:02.000 And it was an amazing round. 0.98

00:55:04.000 That fifth round was just goddamn chaos. 0.98

00:55:07.000 I mean, that to me is... 0.97

00:55:09.000 All of the scariest aspects of MMA as far as damage and what you guys are doing to each other and all the greatest aspects of MMA as far as display of heart and courage and willpower and just determination because you had to be burning.

00:55:25.000 I mean, everything.

00:55:26.000 What was it like in there, that fifth round?

00:55:29.000 I came out and I was...

00:55:33.000 I was feeling good.

00:55:34.000 I think I came out and finishing that fourth round, I finished strong.

00:55:37.000 I almost had him finished in that fifth round.

00:55:40.000 I knew that he was going to come out like a bat out of hell. 1.00

00:55:44.000 So I wanted to finish strong.

00:55:46.000 You never know with the jugs.

00:55:48.000 I didn't know where I was. 1.00

00:55:49.000 I felt like I was maybe up on the scorecards, but I'm like, fuck it. 0.99

00:55:52.000 I need to go out there. 0.99

00:55:52.000 And I started the round really, really strong, I think. 0.99

00:55:55.000 And then he woke up and came on.

00:55:59.000 Turned on his beast mode like he does at the end of a lot of fights and landed some really heavy strikes.

00:56:06.000 But it was...

00:56:07.000 I mean, we were just digging.

00:56:09.000 I don't even remember.

00:56:10.000 Honestly, I remember at certain points...

00:56:12.000 I guess the only thing that I could compare it to was being in the ocean and having waves crashing on you and you're just...

00:56:23.000 Getting your head above water just to get enough breath, and then boom, you're getting another one crashing down upon you, and you are out of breath, you're fucking struggling for survival, and you're just doing your best to come up.

00:56:40.000 A moment like that and a fight like that has got to be something that fuels you in a way that nothing else can when you're in the gym because you know that those moments can happen.

00:56:50.000 Like when you're thinking about slowing down in a strength and conditioning program or when you're doing rounds in the bag and you're thinking about slowing down, that moment's like thinking about that fight.

00:57:00.000 Mm-hmm.

00:57:01.000 I mean, that has got to be... 0.94

00:57:02.000 Yeah, that's something tangible that you can fucking grab onto when you're hitting those points. 0.75

00:57:09.000 You're hitting your edge and you don't know if you can go any farther. 0.84

00:57:15.000 That sort of thing can bring you through.

00:57:17.000 You know, there's the debate in MMA, like, what is the most important aspect of training?

00:57:22.000 Is it strength and conditioning?

00:57:24.000 Is it skill training?

00:57:25.000 How do you quantify that when it comes to a fight camp?

00:57:29.000 And one of the things that Nick Kurson was saying when I talked to him about it is, like, he believes that when a fighter comes to him or when a fighter is preparing for a fight, they already have all these skills.

00:57:39.000 They already know how to fight.

00:57:40.000 They already know how to kick box. 0.85

00:57:41.000 They already know jujitsu.

00:57:44.000 When it comes down to what a camp is, he believes that the primary focus should be on physical preparation.

00:57:51.000 The primary focus should be on getting your body to be able to perform at an extremely high output for a long time and recover quickly.

00:57:59.000 And if you can get there, the benefits of that are greater than the benefits of just consistently working on skill training and drilling and all these other things. 0.99

00:58:08.000 I think there has to be a balance because you can be in phenomenal fucking shape, ready to go five rounds and then step out and get knocked the fuck out in a couple of seconds. 0.98

00:58:16.000 That's true too, right? 0.99

00:58:17.000 Yeah.

00:58:17.000 That's true.

00:58:19.000 Or you could freeze up.

00:58:21.000 So I think the mental aspect of it and the psychological aspect is super, super important.

00:58:26.000 Do you drill anything like that?

00:58:28.000 Do you have a mental coach or do you have visualization drills or anything along those lines?

00:58:34.000 I visualize, I do, but I've done this quite a bit.

00:58:38.000 A coach I work with, Ricky Lindell, talks about bringing it to the moment.

00:58:44.000 It's about being a game day player.

00:58:46.000 I love Ricky, by the way.

00:58:47.000 He's awesome.

00:58:48.000 Absolutely.

00:58:48.000 Great grappler, super smart guy, and just cool as hell.

00:58:51.000 Yeah.

00:58:52.000 Love that guy.

00:58:53.000 Good all-around dude, for sure.

00:58:54.000 But being a game-day player, you know, you get a lot of these guys in the gym there.

00:59:00.000 Killers.

00:59:00.000 World beaters.

00:59:01.000 But then, you know, the bell rings, they're under the bright lights, and they just, they wilt.

00:59:06.000 Yeah, the doubts come haunting home.

00:59:09.000 Yeah, and then you get these other guys, you're like, really?

00:59:12.000 He's fighting who in the UFC? And you're seeing him training, you're like, oh man, I don't know how well this, I don't know if I want to watch this, he's a nice guy, he's gonna get worked.

00:59:20.000 And then he goes out there and does work and rises to the occasion and accomplishes something that maybe you and maybe not even he realized that he could do.

00:59:33.000 Yeah, it's an interesting thing to try to figure out where the balance, where the focus should be.

00:59:39.000 And I think it's different for everybody, man.

00:59:41.000 Yeah.

00:59:41.000 It's different for everybody.

00:59:42.000 There's no one answer.

00:59:43.000 That's the thing about martial arts.

00:59:46.000 Like, I've heard this guy talking about this once, that it's not an art.

00:59:51.000 You know, that it's just people beating each other up. 0.97

00:59:53.000 And I'm like, wow, that is such an ignorant thing to say. 0.77

00:59:56.000 Because when you watch someone fight, you are watching art. 0.97

01:00:00.000 It's just violent.

01:00:01.000 It's a violent art.

01:00:03.000 When I watch, like, your fight with Tiago Alves, you can't tell me that was an art.

01:00:07.000 That was an artistic performance.

01:00:09.000 Like, your interpretation of the movements and the moment to step in and blast that elbow, that's a beautiful thing.

01:00:19.000 I mean, it's not beautiful to him or anybody who cares about him.

01:00:21.000 Or his facial structure.

01:00:23.000 But that's...

01:00:23.000 It's beauty.

01:00:25.000 There's beauty in that.

01:00:26.000 There's beauty in that.

01:00:26.000 And, you know, there's beauty when he did that to Matt Hughes.

01:00:29.000 And when he hit Matt Hughes, that flying knee.

01:00:31.000 There's beauty in martial arts.

01:00:33.000 There is.

01:00:34.000 Well, for me, it always has been a creative outlet.

01:00:38.000 I can put together all these sequences and all these different things in a way to solve a particular problem.

01:00:47.000 Right. 0.82

01:00:47.000 While somebody else is trying to do the same thing against me, and the margin for error is really fucking thin. 0.82

01:00:55.000 If I zig when I should have zagged, I'm catching a shin upside my head, and there's going to be bone exposed.

01:01:04.000 That's why this is a great thing. 0.93

01:01:05.000 That's why MMA is so fucking cool. 0.97

01:01:07.000 It's so fucking cool to watch. 0.97

01:01:10.000 The preparation for one night, like the idea that you're, especially for a guy like you who came off of a knee surgery, you're out for a year, and then you have... 0.95

01:01:22.000 You were out for more than a year before the Tiago fight, right?

01:01:24.000 How long was it?

01:01:25.000 Probably 16 months.

01:01:29.000 So you have all this time building up to this one moment.

01:01:35.000 Mm-hmm.

01:01:36.000 How difficult is it to just be in the moment when that happens and not be overwhelmed by the fact that so much of your future is riding on this, you're not entirely set for life financially yet.

01:01:52.000 You know, there's all these different variables.

01:01:54.000 You have a wife, you have a child, you have a family, you have obligations, you have all these things, but yet here you are preparing for this one completely It just slips through your fingers, this moment.

01:02:09.000 This moment that's just there.

01:02:11.000 You can't hold down, and you're sharing this moment with another trained killer.

01:02:17.000 And you're just locked into a cage, and your future rides on your success.

01:02:23.000 I like to say that fight day... 0.97

01:02:27.000 You know, that night could be the best night of your life or the worst, and you don't know fucking which one. 0.99

01:02:33.000 And there's an incredible mix of emotions, and I feel happy, I feel sad, I feel fucking nervous, I feel elated to be there, and then fucking scared as shit, 0.97

01:02:48.000 and I don't want to do this anymore. 0.91

01:02:50.000 And I really just have to ride it out and be...

01:02:55.000 Trust in my training trust in the preparation that I've done up to that point Because man my mind and my emotions do all sorts of things But I just have to know that I've done what I need to do in preparation For this fight that I'm gonna be alright and that no matter what I know that I will never give anything less than 100%,

01:03:15.000 than my best.

01:03:17.000 I will never give anything less than what you saw in that fight.

01:03:22.000 I may get knocked out, or it may be an early night for me, it may be a terrible night, but that's out of my control.

01:03:30.000 I gave everything that I could to each round, each training session, each minute of... 0.67

01:03:39.000 Of the training camps so that when I step out there, I've done everything in my control to fucking win this fight and to compete to the best of my ability.

01:03:50.000 There's also the things that are out of your control. 1.00

01:03:53.000 You can't worry about that shit. 1.00

01:03:54.000 Injuries. 1.00

01:03:55.000 Like the Tyron Woodley fight.

01:03:57.000 Or catching that one that you don't see. 1.00

01:03:59.000 You know, shit happens. 0.99

01:04:01.000 But that's kind of the thrill of it. 0.99

01:04:06.000 Does that make the highlights sweeter?

01:04:10.000 Knowing that those, you know, the bad moments are out there, that they're possible.

01:04:15.000 Oh yeah, definitely.

01:04:18.000 Like I said, we're walking on a razor's edge on this thing.

01:04:22.000 I mean, it could be a phenomenal night, it could be a terrible night. 0.99

01:04:26.000 Fuck, I don't know, nobody's died in MMA at this point. 0.99

01:04:29.000 Well, not in the UFC. Yeah, not in the UFC, but that shit could happen. 1.00

01:04:33.000 This is a tough thing. 0.97

01:04:34.000 What's your feelings on weight cutting?

01:04:38.000 If you could be assured that...

01:04:43.000 Weight cutting would be out of the picture.

01:04:45.000 Like, let's just throw all the weight classes out.

01:04:47.000 And let's just say, like, what do you walk around at?

01:04:50.000 Like, 185, 190, something like that?

01:04:52.000 Yeah, between 190, 195. If you could be assured that that is just, that's what your opponent's going to weigh, that's what you're going to weigh, you don't have to cut any weight, wouldn't you think that that would be a better way to compete, to just completely eliminate that from the equation?

01:05:06.000 Just find out whatever is your natural healthy weight, And compete at that instead of this insane thing that everyone's doing where they're dehydrating themselves.

01:05:16.000 A massive percentage of your body weight, sometimes as much as 10% of your body weight, just getting sucked away in water to the point where you could literally only exist in that state for a short period of time.

01:05:28.000 Couple hours, yeah. 0.87

01:05:29.000 Yeah, that's fucking bananas that that's a part of cage fighting. 0.98

01:05:34.000 That one day. 0.99

01:05:35.000 To me, I feel like The athletic commissions are sleeping on a potential time bomb.

01:05:44.000 They're just ignoring that this is a huge issue.

01:05:47.000 While they're concentrating on steroids and EPO and all these other things, which are real issues.

01:05:52.000 Those things are unquestionably real issues.

01:05:55.000 But just as big of an issue is massive dehydration 24 hours before a cage fight.

01:06:01.000 Especially now that they've eliminated the IV rehydration methods.

01:06:09.000 We know now, medical science has proven that the brain does not rehydrate as fast as the rest of the tissue.

01:06:17.000 It takes longer.

01:06:18.000 It takes as much as 70 hours.

01:06:21.000 Yeah, 70 hours. 0.97

01:06:22.000 Which is fucking crazy. 0.99

01:06:25.000 Yeah, to rehydrate your brain. 1.00

01:06:29.000 Yeah.

01:06:31.000 I think it'd be interesting to see different proposals.

01:06:34.000 I know that 1FC is doing something.

01:06:37.000 Yeah, they've eliminated it.

01:06:39.000 They're going to check your hydration levels?

01:06:41.000 They're going to eliminate weight cutting?

01:06:43.000 Yeah, well, I know that they're doing the hydration levels on like a...

01:06:48.000 Collegiate and high school wrestling level, and I still know guys that are trying to game that system.

01:06:56.000 Yeah.

01:06:56.000 Well, let them try to game that system.

01:06:58.000 Yeah.

01:06:58.000 But if you can eliminate that and test hydration levels, imagine a guy like Johnny Hendricks who never made it to the fight with Tyron Woodley because of the weight cutting.

01:07:07.000 Imagine them getting to a point where they check him and they go, Hey, man, you're fucking dehydrated. 0.92

01:07:12.000 You can't fight. 0.99

01:07:13.000 Yeah.

01:07:13.000 You didn't make weight.

01:07:15.000 You're not where you're supposed to be.

01:07:20.000 I'm on the side of health for fighters and guys taking care of themselves.

01:07:26.000 We're doing this for a very brief period of time in our lives and the repercussions long-term from a lot of the different stuff involved, including weight cutting, this is going to have long-term ramifications.

01:07:40.000 For internal organs, specifically kidneys, right?

01:07:43.000 Yeah, man.

01:07:44.000 And I think...

01:07:45.000 It ages you, man.

01:07:47.000 Especially if you're not doing it correctly.

01:07:49.000 Especially if you're not living a healthy lifestyle year-round.

01:07:52.000 All of a sudden, boom, I'm going to change the way that I eat so drastically that my body's going to freak the fuck out.

01:07:59.000 Which you see a lot of these guys.

01:08:00.000 And then they don't make it to the weigh-in because their system isn't used to them.

01:08:05.000 I'm eating like this. 0.91

01:08:06.000 I'm used to eating a bunch of bullshit, and now I'm all of a sudden eating greens, which is good for you, but your body's still going to have this reaction to it when you're not used to it. 0.97

01:08:17.000 So, yeah, I would definitely like to see some change. 0.98

01:08:21.000 If it benefits the health of fighters, I'm all for it.

01:08:23.000 I don't think it could possibly not benefit them.

01:08:26.000 I think that would be the biggest thing that we could do, even more so than...

01:08:29.000 I think what Jeff Nowitzki and the UFC is trying to do with eliminating performance-enhancing drugs is awesome.

01:08:36.000 I love the fact they're catching people.

01:08:38.000 I can't believe that they caught Yoel Romero.

01:08:40.000 Who would have thought that that guy was taking steroids?

01:08:43.000 That's crazy!

01:08:45.000 Who would have thought that?

01:08:46.000 That's amazing.

01:08:47.000 A couple of those guys, man.

01:08:48.000 I would have never believed it.

01:08:50.000 Him or Hector Lombard was another one.

01:08:52.000 Who saw that coming?

01:08:54.000 That's nuts.

01:08:55.000 Vitor Belfort?

01:08:56.000 Are you kidding me?

01:08:58.000 Nuts.

01:08:59.000 Cyborg?

01:08:59.000 Really?

01:09:00.000 Wow.

01:09:01.000 Crazy.

01:09:02.000 Yeah, I think that it's awesome.

01:09:05.000 Because, I mean...

01:09:08.000 We're going to come to a point in time in the real near future where it's impossible to cheat.

01:09:12.000 I mean, they're pretty close to it now.

01:09:14.000 They're pretty close to it now where they're so good at catching people, but they're also saving urine, which I think is fascinating.

01:09:21.000 See, urine and blood for eight years.

01:09:23.000 To test it in case they don't have a test that detects whatever it is you're testing at this point.

01:09:29.000 We can test you down the way.

01:09:31.000 Exactly.

01:09:32.000 And you can come off hot down the way, which is, that is cool.

01:09:35.000 They're super close to being able to catch you doing anything now, but what they're doing is they're coming up with all these little designer things and peptides, and that's what Yoel Romero got caught for, some designer peptide which artificially increases your body's own production of testosterone.

01:09:51.000 So they're doing all this sneaky, weird shit that used to be totally undetectable five, six years ago or what have you.

01:09:59.000 Yeah, well, I think that's what they've been doing for a long time, correct? 0.98

01:10:02.000 It's been like an arms race between the dopers and the anti-dopers.

01:10:09.000 That's what I understand with Lance Armstrong.

01:10:12.000 It was like a constant thing, man. 0.98

01:10:14.000 They were like some super sophisticated fucking programs to beat these tests. 0.98

01:10:21.000 Yeah, and with Lance Armstrong, one of the interesting things was everybody was dirty. 0.98

01:10:28.000 I mean, it's not like MMA, where you have, there's a few guys that, like Nowitzki, I think he calls it the smell test or the look test. 0.99

01:10:36.000 Well, you look at them and you go, hmm, what the fuck's going on over there?

01:10:40.000 But with Armstrong, none of those guys looked alike. 0.84

01:10:45.000 Yoel Romero.

01:10:46.000 They're just little skinny guys on bikes.

01:10:48.000 Yeah.

01:10:48.000 It's the nature of the sport.

01:10:50.000 Yes. 0.95

01:10:50.000 And I think what they were, probably what they were taking is different than what fucking, you know, what these big muscled up, you know, prize fighters are taking. 0.95

01:10:58.000 Well, another important distinction about these bans and about the banning of IV rehydration is now you can't blood dope. 0.84

01:11:08.000 Mm-hmm.

01:11:08.000 Because they used to be able to...

01:11:10.000 The blood dope used to be able to...

01:11:11.000 Pretty easy to just take your blood out and reinsert it into your body.

01:11:16.000 You have more blood.

01:11:16.000 And you get the same sort of benefits that you would get with EPO. So you can't do that anymore because they'll be able to detect...

01:11:23.000 They can actually detect plastics in the blood that come from the bags and from the tubes. 0.99

01:11:28.000 It's fucking nuts, man. 0.99

01:11:29.000 That's wild, yeah. 1.00

01:11:30.000 It's nuts. 0.99

01:11:31.000 It's fucking crazy what they can do. 0.99

01:11:34.000 I've heard, I've heard though, like... 0.99

01:11:36.000 In, you know, we're talking about the arms race, that people can use glass and then Sterilize veins from animals as they're tubing.

01:11:52.000 That's what I've read.

01:11:53.000 Oh my god!

01:11:54.000 Oh my god, that's so crazy. 1.00

01:11:56.000 Like sausage casing and shit. 1.00

01:11:59.000 Oh my god, that's fucking... 1.00

01:12:01.000 Now they're gonna check for pig veins and shit. 1.00

01:12:05.000 Sausage casing. 1.00

01:12:06.000 Down the rabbit hole with all that stuff.

01:12:08.000 I mean...

01:12:09.000 Well, Nowitzki was telling me that they've now figured out a way to develop testosterone from animals, and it's semi-theoretical at this point.

01:12:18.000 They haven't caught anybody who's done it yet, and that may be one of the reasons why they're holding onto this blood for eight years.

01:12:25.000 But he said they've figured out a way, because right now, I don't understand the process, but right now the way they develop artificial testosterone is through wild yams.

01:12:34.000 They use Mexican yams. 0.98

01:12:36.000 I fucking don't understand it. 0.99

01:12:38.000 But somehow through yams, they can develop testosterone. 0.99

01:12:42.000 The yams are manly.

01:12:44.000 Manly yams.

01:12:46.000 I've always said, I yam what I yam.

01:12:48.000 That's why I popped up.

01:12:49.000 Popeye knew.

01:12:51.000 He was ahead of the time.

01:12:52.000 They make me feel manly.

01:12:53.000 So they've figured out a way through these carbon isotope tests to detect that the testosterone in your body was non-endogenous, that it was exogenous, that it somehow or another came from something else. 0.95

01:13:06.000 But they won't be able to do this, right now at least, with animal testosterone, which is so fucking bizarre.

01:13:16.000 It will always be a race between the cheaters and those who control those.

01:13:21.000 With the French Tour de France cyclism biking back in the early 20th century, they were doing it already.

01:13:31.000 And then today, every Sunday, there's some competition somewhere, like a local short-distance triathlon and those Sunday athletes, and they're dope.

01:13:41.000 Yeah, they're saying that executives that want to show off are taking EPO and entering in triathlons and winning them.

01:13:49.000 So they can put that on their resume. 0.99

01:13:51.000 Jack to the tits on EPO, which is really fucking dangerous, apparently. 0.99

01:13:55.000 I don't understand EPO, but the way it's been described to me was that when you have so much extra blood in your system, there's a high risk of stroke. 0.99

01:14:05.000 And that you have to mitigate the amount of EPO and the amount of blood in your system by constantly exercising.

01:14:12.000 Like, you have to exercise.

01:14:13.000 You have to drink water and exercise.

01:14:14.000 Otherwise, your blood gets too thick.

01:14:17.000 As we talk, millions of people are doing crazy things in their day-to-day life that are going to mess up with their brain, mess up with their whole physiology and hormonal balance and stuff like that.

01:14:28.000 And they're not getting paid to do it.

01:14:30.000 They just do it out of whatever ignorance or laziness or...

01:14:33.000 So why wouldn't these professional athletes, some of them...

01:14:37.000 Especially in combat sports.

01:14:38.000 Yeah.

01:14:39.000 Yeah, I mean, there's one thing, winning a bike race is one thing, but not getting kicked in the head or being able to kick the guy in the head because you have that extra juice of energy.

01:14:48.000 You know, when you're tired and you're in that fifth round, but you come out because you're on EPO and you're fucking Dominick Cruz stepping and throwing high kicks and the other dude is gasping for air.

01:14:59.000 That's where it becomes a huge issue. 0.88

01:15:01.000 Absolutely.

01:15:02.000 I mean, we're talking...

01:15:03.000 You know, potentially life or death.

01:15:06.000 Yeah, sure.

01:15:06.000 Well, the way I describe MMA is it's high-level problem-solving with dire physical consequences.

01:15:12.000 And we've seen it.

01:15:14.000 We've all seen guys get flatlined.

01:15:16.000 We've all seen people...

01:15:17.000 I mean, you've done it to a bunch of guys inside the octagon, and it could have been you, you know? 1.00

01:15:21.000 I mean, it's a fucking nutty sport. 0.98

01:15:24.000 And in this sport, the doping has just a much higher level of... 1.00

01:15:29.000 Consequences.

01:15:30.000 Yes.

01:15:31.000 Ramifications.

01:15:31.000 Ramifications is the right word.

01:15:33.000 What's interesting to me though, I'm absolutely anti-doping, but I'm pro the science involved in it because what we're experiencing right now, what I believe, is that we are in a period of time in human history where our understanding and the scientific understanding of the body and its mechanisms and all the things they can do to it is being sort of deciphered and tweaked and poked by all these various scientists Although I believe that that should be outside

01:16:03.000 of competitive athletics, we're going to get to a point in, you know, who knows, 10, 20, 30 years, where they're going to be able to genetically re-engineer human beings.

01:16:12.000 And this is all going to be out the window.

01:16:14.000 I think we're kind of experiencing the last years of natural competition.

01:16:19.000 Yeah, gene-doping type stuff.

01:16:21.000 It's going to happen.

01:16:22.000 I mean, they have this new thing that they've figured out how to do, where they, because of, there's this really interesting science, it's called CRISPR, is what they've developed, and I'll butcher it if I try to give the scientific definition of it,

01:16:39.000 but they can literally add genes and manipulate genes, and they're doing so in small animals and, you know, Small multicellular organisms and they're getting it to a point where they really understand it and they're saying that in China they're starting to do this with human beings and they're starting to fuck with it and test it and you know you might see some Chinese Wolverine type dudes in the next 20 years and you'll know well that that kid's the product of these 0.56

01:17:09.000 Chinese experiments you know I mean that's what they used to call Corellin they used to call Corellin the experiment Because if you've ever seen Corellin's family, his mother and father are like 5'6".

01:17:20.000 They're like these tiny people. 0.97

01:17:23.000 And Corellin was this fucking monster of a wrestler. 1.00

01:17:27.000 Do you know who we're talking about? 1.00

01:17:29.000 Alexander Corellin?

01:17:30.000 I've never heard of him, no.

01:17:32.000 Undefeated wrestler.

01:17:32.000 I mean, he lost one time to Rulon Gardner, but the only reason why he lost is they changed the rule.

01:17:37.000 They changed the rule.

01:17:38.000 This is Greco so crazy, where if you release your grip, if someone gets you to release your grip, it's a point, which is insane.

01:17:46.000 And that's how Gardner beat him.

01:17:47.000 He couldn't do anything to him, but he got Corellon towards the end of his career.

01:17:52.000 I mean, he'd wrestled forever.

01:17:54.000 He was so scary that guys would try to flatten out to keep from getting thrown by him, because he was so strong, that he would take these men, 280 pound men, and he would just go under them while their belly down, flattened out on the mat, just praying they don't get taken for a ride.

01:18:11.000 And he would lift them up and throw them through the air with all his weight and their weight, BOOM! Coming down on them.

01:18:18.000 So he's essentially knocking them the fuck out with the mat. 0.98

01:18:22.000 Where everybody else was wrestling, you know? 0.97

01:18:24.000 He was wrestling as well, but he was also hitting you with the world, you know? 0.98

01:18:29.000 It was crazy, and no one knows how he got so fucking big.

01:18:33.000 In history of sports, there are always these freaks of nature, these completely exceptional athletes in a given sport, but with what you say and the manipulations they're going to be able to do on On physiology, maybe using nanotechnologies or indeed genetic modifications. 0.88

01:18:51.000 They might be able to replicate, to clone those freaks of science. 1.00

01:18:59.000 Oh, they're going to.

01:19:00.000 They're going to.

01:19:01.000 If it doesn't happen in our lifetimes, it will happen in our children's lifetimes.

01:19:04.000 It's going to happen.

01:19:06.000 Science doesn't stop.

01:19:07.000 I mean, if you just go back...

01:19:09.000 40, 50 years what they were able to do if you had a knee surgery.

01:19:14.000 You're talking about your knee graft. 1.00

01:19:15.000 You were fucked back then. 1.00

01:19:17.000 You were fucked. 1.00

01:19:18.000 You were crippled. 1.00

01:19:19.000 Bum knee.

01:19:20.000 Yeah, that's just 50 years ago.

01:19:21.000 That's inside of a living person's lifetime.

01:19:24.000 Well, 25 years ago or less, they weren't able to do this one that I had successfully.

01:19:29.000 Yes.

01:19:29.000 My friend Steve Graham was on the U.S. ski team, and he's had some fucking insane number of surgeries.

01:19:35.000 I want to say he's around 18 knee surgeries.

01:19:39.000 He has his knees capped. 0.98

01:19:40.000 I'll show you this so you'll fucking freak out. 0.99

01:19:42.000 He has his knees resurfaced. 0.99

01:19:45.000 The tops of his knees, it's all steel. 0.99

01:19:49.000 It's fucking bizarre, man. 0.99

01:19:51.000 It's so freaky to look at. 0.99

01:19:53.000 But he came around when they were doing all these experimental surgeries.

01:19:59.000 They just couldn't, they just didn't know how to do it.

01:20:02.000 They just were taking all these risks.

01:20:04.000 And here it is right here.

01:20:05.000 I'm going to show you this. 0.99

01:20:05.000 This is fucking freaky. 0.99

01:20:10.000 That's the surface of the inside of his knee. 0.99

01:20:12.000 So he has no more cartilage.

01:20:15.000 And all the meniscus is gone as well.

01:20:18.000 So if you see that white thing down there, that's artificial meniscus.

01:20:22.000 That's like a pad that they put in place.

01:20:25.000 So they put this artificial pad in place.

01:20:28.000 Then they have the tops of the knee, the top of the femur.

01:20:32.000 And that glides upon the plastic.

01:20:36.000 It looks like an abstract painting to me. 1.00

01:20:38.000 It's fucking chaos. 1.00

01:20:39.000 It's like dinner. 1.00

01:20:40.000 Yeah.

01:20:40.000 I told him, dude, you gotta send me this after you get your latest operation.

01:20:44.000 Because he's had so many operations.

01:20:46.000 He was so chewed down to the wire that this is the latest sort of fix.

01:20:52.000 That's wild, man. 0.99

01:20:53.000 It's fucking crazy. 0.98

01:20:55.000 And he's had multiple ACL surgeries on both legs, MCL, just the whole deal. 0.99

01:21:02.000 Meniscus, scopes, and this and that.

01:21:04.000 There's nothing left.

01:21:05.000 They predicted that so many years ago when I was a kid.

01:21:09.000 Steve Austin, whatever the name was.

01:21:11.000 Yeah, Bonac Man. 0.89

01:21:12.000 Right.

01:21:13.000 It was fascinating back then.

01:21:15.000 Yeah.

01:21:16.000 We're close to that.

01:21:17.000 I mean, they're putting artificial hips in people and having them being more durable than the natural hips.

01:21:23.000 Yep.

01:21:23.000 They're also using exoskeletons.

01:21:26.000 Yes.

01:21:26.000 Especially in Japan.

01:21:27.000 They're really big on all these robotics innovations.

01:21:30.000 I got in one of those.

01:21:31.000 I got an exoskeleton.

01:21:33.000 I found it beautiful for people who really need it.

01:21:36.000 You had a very serious accident.

01:21:38.000 There's nothing you can do, but it's not your responsibility or you come back from war and you need that kind of assistance.

01:21:45.000 In that case, I believe it's beautiful.

01:21:47.000 Yes. 0.91

01:21:47.000 But my concern is that this kind of new technology is going to be available to millions of people who basically don't give a crap about their body. 0.91

01:21:56.000 Their body has become completely alien to themselves and they neglect it and they let it deteriorate.

01:22:04.000 You could think about it that way, or you could say, you know what, man, it's just technology.

01:22:10.000 It could be used or abused.

01:22:12.000 I mean, like cars. 1.00

01:22:13.000 I mean, cars could be used to get places, or you could be a fat fuck, and they could just wheel you over to your car, and you ooze your way into the car, and they push you in and shut the door, and then the car drives you around because you're too fucking lazy. 0.99

01:22:23.000 It's the balance, and I think in our society... 0.99

01:22:25.000 We always go too far.

01:22:27.000 It's like that exoskeleton for your body becomes what the shoe is to your foot.

01:22:33.000 And I think that's your point.

01:22:35.000 That's a very good analogy.

01:22:36.000 Your foot is going to atrophy.

01:22:39.000 Or your body is going to atrophy because your foot has this artificial arch.

01:22:44.000 But from birth, like in Wally...

01:22:48.000 Love that movie.

01:22:51.000 The thing is that, yeah, it's freedom.

01:22:53.000 It's individual freedom.

01:22:54.000 You do whatever you want.

01:22:55.000 Completely agree with that.

01:22:57.000 But ultimately, it becomes the norm.

01:22:58.000 It becomes something that's not shocking anymore.

01:23:01.000 Like in the WALL-E world, that movie, in the end, not being able to even stand, let alone to walk, It's not shocking.

01:23:11.000 It's the norm.

01:23:12.000 It's just something normal.

01:23:13.000 My grandma was able to walk a little, a few steps. 1.00

01:23:17.000 Wow, she was extremely fit. 0.99

01:23:20.000 Ultimately, through generations, we changed the norm.

01:23:26.000 I won't be there, you won't be there, we won't be there.

01:23:29.000 But I'd like to know that we're going in a good direction, a healthy direction, not to some kind of crazy world.

01:23:37.000 It's definitely crazy.

01:23:38.000 I don't know if it is a bad direction. 0.97

01:23:39.000 But if we went back to single-celled organisms, like, oh, look at these pussies with their multiple cells. 1.00

01:23:44.000 Back when I was a fucking kid, you had to have one cell and you were happy. 0.99

01:23:47.000 So I don't think it's good or bad. 0.98

01:23:50.000 I think it's how it's applied.

01:23:53.000 And is it beneficial?

01:23:55.000 Is it detrimental?

01:23:58.000 And what is the implication on a societal level, on an overall thing?

01:24:04.000 We can look at technology in general in that respect.

01:24:11.000 I like to see that as options, as additional benefits to our current society and culture.

01:24:20.000 It means that, let's imagine utopia, like a society where every individual would consider their own health and movement ability as somewhat their personal biological benefits.

01:24:33.000 So they would really make sure that they stay strong, they stay healthy, they can move, they're in shape, they're sharp physically and mentally.

01:24:41.000 And on top of that, whenever needed, they would punctually and wisely use those technologies.

01:24:47.000 Then that would be an enhanced lifestyle in society.

01:24:50.000 But when you have people, it's just there to support people who have voluntarily disempowered themselves, degenerated themselves.

01:25:00.000 I don't like the direction where that would be going.

01:25:02.000 Aren't we basing that on the current paradigm, though?

01:25:05.000 If we keep moving in the same direction, it's entirely possible that you're not going to need to be in shape or get in shape.

01:25:12.000 You're just going to be in shape.

01:25:14.000 You're going to have something that they've invented, whether it's some sort of a biotechnology or what have you, where you never get out of shape.

01:25:20.000 You're always physically fit.

01:25:22.000 Your body regenerates tissue.

01:25:23.000 If you lose an arm, it grows back.

01:25:25.000 Yes and no.

01:25:26.000 It doesn't mean, because here's the problem, you won't be the master of the technology.

01:25:30.000 Somebody else will.

01:25:31.000 The same way, it's like if everybody stops growing their food.

01:25:38.000 So when you're hungry, you need that food to be delivered to you, to be produced for you.

01:25:43.000 If at some point the production of food is in the hands of very little, very few people, there's no freedom anymore.

01:25:51.000 So you say, yeah, but it allows you to be always strong, always fit, always healthy.

01:25:55.000 Yeah, but the technology is in the hands of the few people. 0.99

01:25:58.000 And when they want to take it back, That sounds like some Illuminati type shit. 0.97

01:26:04.000 But you don't have to go into a conspiracy theory to think about, are you in control? 0.98

01:26:13.000 Is it something that you can fix yourself?

01:26:16.000 Like when you have a car or a bow or something, can you fix it?

01:26:21.000 Fix the technology yourself.

01:26:23.000 Does it belong to you?

01:26:24.000 Do you control it or not?

01:26:26.000 I think you're talking about things in a practical sense, and I agree with you.

01:26:31.000 In a practical, sort of a pragmatic approach.

01:26:33.000 I'm extrapolating a hundred years from now when it's all nonsense.

01:26:37.000 Because I'm saying there's going to become a time in the future where there are no natural athletes because there's no natural people.

01:26:43.000 We're probably...

01:26:45.000 We're just a few years away from being symbiotically connected to electronics.

01:26:51.000 We're pretty close now with phones.

01:26:53.000 You leave the house without your phone, you freak out.

01:26:56.000 Very few people live without a car.

01:26:58.000 You have your navigation system to get you around.

01:27:00.000 I only remember like three or four phone numbers now.

01:27:03.000 When I was a kid, I remembered everybody's number.

01:27:05.000 I could be able to call my friends.

01:27:07.000 I could be able to call my house. 0.97

01:27:08.000 I fucking barely know my own home number now. 0.95

01:27:11.000 I give someone my cell phone number after Think. 0.98

01:27:14.000 You know, I have to think about that number.

01:27:15.000 So you do give up some of your control.

01:27:18.000 You do, but you get Google. 0.99

01:27:21.000 You get all sorts of good shit as well. 1.00

01:27:25.000 True. 1.00

01:27:25.000 And the bad shit that comes with it, though. 1.00

01:27:28.000 So, you know, what, 50 years ago they started, or maybe longer, I don't know, they started making fucking processed foods. 1.00

01:27:35.000 And that was like the best thing ever. 0.98

01:27:37.000 Oh my god, we don't have to fucking cook our food anymore. 0.90

01:27:39.000 We could have it made for us in a factory and we just throw it in the oven and it's done. 0.97

01:27:44.000 Boom, this is the greatest thing ever, you know? 0.99

01:27:47.000 Fast forward, you know, 30, 40 years and now we're fat and unhealthy and our, you know, our national GDP, you know, for our healthcare is fucking, you know, our healthcare cost exceeds our fucking gross domestic product for the fucking United States. 0.98

01:28:05.000 And we're just, you know... 0.98

01:28:08.000 There's good parts of it.

01:28:10.000 Yeah, they probably made food safer in a sense. 0.97

01:28:13.000 Less people are dying from fucking listeria outbreaks and that sort of thing. 0.99

01:28:17.000 But on the flip side of that, now we're really fucking sick and fat. 0.98

01:28:21.000 I 100% agree with you, Carlos, because it's not like you could say... 0.99

01:28:25.000 Wait.

01:28:26.000 We won't be very when this will happen.

01:28:29.000 There will be some adverse consequences to all this, but we won't see it.

01:28:35.000 It's already here.

01:28:36.000 It's already altering people's life today as we speak.

01:28:39.000 The people are listening to us, maybe suffering from this and that.

01:28:43.000 They don't even know why.

01:28:44.000 Well, maybe you're surrounded by...

01:28:46.000 There are thousands and thousands of chemicals in all your hygiene products that you breathe, that go through your pores, that go in your system, that alter your homophysis and stuff like that.

01:28:59.000 Maybe you're eating GMO. Maybe everything is altered in your day to life and you see it as something normal.

01:29:05.000 It means you don't see it, basically.

01:29:07.000 It doesn't bother you.

01:29:10.000 You're not conscious of it, but it does bother you in how well you live.

01:29:16.000 And ultimately, somebody's profiting off it.

01:29:18.000 Then that's the thing.

01:29:20.000 With any of this stuff, it will become the norm if somebody's profiting off it.

01:29:25.000 If they can sell it to you.

01:29:26.000 If they can convince you that this is better, whether it is or whether it's not, but through whatever.

01:29:33.000 They're already selling water to us.

01:29:36.000 Maybe they'll sell air.

01:29:38.000 Pure air.

01:29:39.000 Aren't they in some places?

01:29:40.000 Can't you buy canned air in China?

01:29:42.000 I think they buy canned air with a little mask on it. 1.00

01:29:45.000 You suck the canned air. 0.95

01:29:46.000 I've done that in Japan, actually. 1.00

01:29:49.000 It's pretty wild.

01:29:49.000 Made my veins blue.

01:29:51.000 What?

01:29:52.000 It's wild, yeah.

01:29:53.000 What?

01:29:53.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:29:54.000 Because you had so much pure oxygen.

01:29:56.000 You could get it at like 7-Eleven over there.

01:29:58.000 Next to the weird squid hot dogs.

01:30:02.000 Whoa.

01:30:03.000 I did an oxygen bar once in Vegas.

01:30:06.000 Remember they used to have those?

01:30:08.000 Yeah, they're probably still around.

01:30:09.000 I think they do.

01:30:10.000 You put a little pipe up your nose, and I'm supposed to be like, what am I supposed to be getting out of this?

01:30:13.000 Yeah.

01:30:14.000 It's like one of those oxygen things you see old smokers roll around with.

01:30:18.000 Yeah, totally.

01:30:19.000 And the thing goes up your nose, these little tubes go up your nose, and we're sitting there going, okay, what am I supposed to feel?

01:30:23.000 Yeah.

01:30:23.000 A sense of euphoria, a lot of extra energy.

01:30:26.000 And the cute chick that works there comes up and rubs your back and does that weird thing on your scalp. 1.00

01:30:31.000 And you kind of feel like, shit, I felt good. 0.97

01:30:33.000 But it would come to your mind to do something like that if you're in a mountain and the air is pure, surrounded by trees. 1.00

01:30:41.000 Why on earth would you try to put some whatever oxygen in your brain?

01:30:45.000 You don't need it.

01:30:45.000 Well, that's one of the things that I love about forests and trees is that you can physically feel the difference in the air because trees literally absorb carbon dioxide and express oxygen.

01:30:59.000 They produce oxygen and you breathe it in.

01:31:00.000 It feels better.

01:31:01.000 My point is that you need these...

01:31:04.000 Enhancements when you're living within an environment that is tremendously deteriorated, completely altered.

01:31:10.000 Then you're like, oh my god, I need better air and more natural food.

01:31:14.000 I need to try to make my house a bit more complex so that it stimulates my movement and things like that.

01:31:22.000 That's because you're already out of a universally, I would say, a universally natural environment.

01:31:29.000 Comprising not just where you are, but What you eat, how you breathe, the light, and even your own behaviors, how much you sleep, how you think.

01:31:38.000 All of that is behavior and environment.

01:31:41.000 And all that will impact you positively or not in terms of how you look, how well you perform, how you feel.

01:31:50.000 It all matters.

01:31:51.000 All these variables matter.

01:31:53.000 What is your diet like when you're training?

01:31:55.000 Do you have someone who monitors that stuff?

01:31:57.000 Do you have a dietician that you work with or anything?

01:32:00.000 So I worked with my Dolce for this last camp, this last cut.

01:32:06.000 I met Mike when my knee was hurt and I was in recovery for that.

01:32:11.000 I was doing some seminars.

01:32:13.000 He was going and doing these talks at some military bases on diet, nutrition, holistic living.

01:32:20.000 And they brought me out as the special guest or whatever.

01:32:25.000 And I spoke on it too.

01:32:26.000 But our...

01:32:29.000 Our philosophies on food and nutrition clicked.

01:32:32.000 I mean, they were pretty much aligned.

01:32:34.000 We have a little bit different approaches.

01:32:37.000 I started learning about nutrition from a strength and conditioning coach when I was about 19 years old.

01:32:45.000 Up to that point, it was like, you know, whatever. 0.98

01:32:47.000 I fucking... 0.98

01:32:49.000 I was eating off the dollar value meal at Wendy's. 1.00

01:32:52.000 Really?

01:32:53.000 Yeah.

01:32:54.000 During the time you're like fighting in the WEC or the UFC? No, this was before then.

01:32:58.000 This was I was fighting in like little casinos out in the middle of the desert in New Mexico and like making $200 for a fight.

01:33:05.000 If you're lucky.

01:33:06.000 At a 400 person venue.

01:33:07.000 Yeah.

01:33:08.000 And yeah, so it was like, oh, if I only eat half of this four-piece nuggets, I'm definitely going to make weight tomorrow.

01:33:15.000 I vividly remember those days.

01:33:19.000 Anyway, I got with this guy, and he just kind of taught me the basics.

01:33:22.000 Basically taught me about macronutrients, and he mainly trained bodybuilders, but gave me some basics.

01:33:30.000 And then since that point, I've...

01:33:37.000 Through my own practice, through my own practical applications of running through these training camps, running through these weight cuts, and absorbing information, going out there and looking at information myself.

01:33:49.000 Have kind of figured it out pretty much on my own.

01:33:53.000 And I cook. 0.99

01:33:55.000 I fucking love to cook. 0.98

01:33:56.000 That's like my hobby. 0.97

01:33:57.000 And so that helps out because I'm cooking for fun, kind of as a cathartic thing after I'm training, but it works well because I'm cooking the nutrient-dense food that I need to perform and to train and to make weight and to be a high-level athlete.

01:34:18.000 I saw that you and Erwan were working on bowhunting exercises.

01:34:22.000 Do you do bowhunting?

01:34:24.000 Yes.

01:34:25.000 I started bowhunting three years ago. 0.99

01:34:29.000 I have yet to fucking kill anything. 0.98

01:34:33.000 I'm very much a novice, but I'm learning. 0.97

01:34:39.000 Is anybody teaching you?

01:34:41.000 Yeah, I've gone with some guys, some older guys that are my dad's age.

01:34:45.000 My dad's not an outdoorsman at all.

01:34:47.000 He likes to fish, but he doesn't go farther than about 20 feet away from his car to fish.

01:34:52.000 So all this stuff, Erwan, if you could back that up a bit, please, Jamie, to that bowhunting thing that you just showed.

01:34:59.000 What exactly is involved in these bowhunting exercises that you got him doing?

01:35:06.000 So that was in between the two camps that we did together and...

01:35:12.000 Carlos already knew that he was going to fight Robbie Lawler.

01:35:16.000 Shooting lefty, huh?

01:35:17.000 It was somewhere late September, if I remember well.

01:35:26.000 New Mexico is the best spot to hunt elk, next to Colorado.

01:35:30.000 I was like, New Mexico and Colorado are the spots in this country.

01:35:33.000 New Mexico is the best place to just live.

01:35:36.000 Really?

01:35:36.000 You think?

01:35:39.000 Let's keep it a secret.

01:35:40.000 Why do you say that?

01:35:42.000 Diego Sanchez lives there?

01:35:46.000 Yes!

01:35:47.000 The beauty, the landscapes.

01:35:49.000 But again, other people will prefer another place.

01:35:52.000 But there's a certain energy.

01:35:55.000 Some places resonate with you more than others.

01:35:58.000 Me, I moved to Santa Fe, New Mexico, never left, and then find Jessica, my soulmate, and everything is beautiful there.

01:36:08.000 Well, you look like Jesus.

01:36:10.000 It's a perfect place to live.

01:36:11.000 Santa Fe, it's a lot of hippies.

01:36:12.000 You got a scarf on, even though you're indoors.

01:36:15.000 It's a perfect place.

01:36:16.000 I'm European.

01:36:17.000 I can't afford it.

01:36:18.000 Whatever.

01:36:19.000 I'm French, so...

01:36:22.000 What do you say to that?

01:36:24.000 Yeah, what do you say to my scarf?

01:36:26.000 Right. 1.00

01:36:26.000 Fuck you. 1.00

01:36:29.000 But you love New Mexico, though? 1.00

01:36:32.000 I love New Mexico.

01:36:33.000 I need to get there.

01:36:34.000 I'm a New Mexican now.

01:36:37.000 Really?

01:36:37.000 I can't say like they say, born here all my life.

01:36:41.000 Yeah, you definitely don't sound like it.

01:36:43.000 No, I have a profound love for this land.

01:36:47.000 Where I live, it's surrounded by 19 pueblos, native Indian energy, which I really relate to.

01:36:54.000 Oh, so you can go and see these ancient sites where they used to live?

01:36:58.000 You can.

01:36:58.000 They still live there in some of them.

01:37:00.000 Oh, that's straight up.

01:37:02.000 Right.

01:37:03.000 Like in the mountains?

01:37:04.000 Like tucked into the mountains?

01:37:05.000 Yeah.

01:37:07.000 There's lots of reservations also.

01:37:09.000 These mud kind of... 1.00

01:37:11.000 Old school, like, Stone Age apartment kind of buildings.

01:37:16.000 And they have cable and now they have...

01:37:19.000 Cable?

01:37:20.000 Yeah.

01:37:20.000 Well, they got satellites hanging off the side of them now.

01:37:23.000 What?

01:37:24.000 Yeah.

01:37:24.000 Oh my God.

01:37:25.000 That's insane.

01:37:26.000 If you ever come out to New Mexico, I'll take you by Acoma, bro.

01:37:29.000 Dude, I'm going.

01:37:30.000 I've been thinking about going to New Mexico and doing a show there for a while.

01:37:32.000 I want to do something and probably Albuquerque is the place to go, right?

01:37:36.000 Albuquerque or Santa Fe?

01:37:37.000 Where should I go?

01:37:37.000 Santa Fe's an hour away, so come to Albuquerque and then boom.

01:37:40.000 There's a lot of stuff right around.

01:37:42.000 Come hunt.

01:37:45.000 There's the Apache, Gicaria, Apache Reservations.

01:37:50.000 It's still there.

01:37:51.000 It's really...

01:37:52.000 A lot of cool stuff.

01:37:54.000 A lot of cool stuff.

01:37:55.000 But it's a secret.

01:37:56.000 Let's not talk about it.

01:37:58.000 Too late.

01:38:00.000 So with regards to the bow hunting stuff, honestly, the stuff that we were doing wasn't a whole lot different than what we were working on for the training camps.

01:38:09.000 We were working foot, ankle, knee, hip stability in complex environments, in walking on logs or navigating different terrain while staying aware of my surroundings.

01:38:23.000 If I'm fucking sitting there looking at my feet and stumbling over myself, And worrying so much about being quiet and where I'm standing. 1.00

01:38:32.000 Fuck, I might miss a goddamn something right there. 1.00

01:38:36.000 And feeling with your feet. 1.00

01:38:39.000 A saying that Irwin has that helped me out quite a bit as kind of a coaching cue is put your mind in your feet.

01:38:48.000 So that I'm looking here and I'm aware of what's going on around me, but I can feel where I'm going, boom.

01:38:55.000 I hunt in like minimal boots, so I can feel if I'm about to crack that stick and make that, you know.

01:39:03.000 What kind of boots do you wear?

01:39:04.000 Like a lightweight?

01:39:05.000 They're called, the ones I use are called mini mill, and they are...

01:39:09.000 How do you spell that?

01:39:11.000 M-I-N-I-M-I-L-L, I think is what it is. 1.00

01:39:15.000 And they're dope, man.

01:39:17.000 So I think initially, the Vibram's five fingers came into vogue in the military.

01:39:24.000 They loved it, right?

01:39:25.000 And everybody was all about the minimal footwear.

01:39:29.000 But if you go too minimal too fast, you're going to hurt your feet because our feet...

01:39:34.000 Our bones, our tendons, our muscles are atrophied from being in basically casts for our entire life.

01:39:43.000 And all of a sudden, I'm going to go run a couple miles like I did in these supportive shoes and you're going to get stress fractures, you're going to get all kinds of injuries.

01:39:50.000 So I think the military, a couple of the branches banned the five-finger shoes or the five, yeah, that's what they're called.

01:39:57.000 Because people are getting hurt?

01:39:58.000 Because, yeah, foot injuries.

01:40:00.000 Lots.

01:40:02.000 Because people's bodies and physiology are just not ready structurally.

01:40:07.000 You have to work your way up to it.

01:40:09.000 This guy runs barefoot through the mountains.

01:40:13.000 You run barefoot?

01:40:14.000 Yeah.

01:40:15.000 You don't wear any shoes at all?

01:40:16.000 Well, sometimes, but it depends on what I do.

01:40:19.000 But I do train also to be barefoot because it makes you extremely sharp mentally.

01:40:27.000 You have to be extremely focused to just not injure yourself, to be extremely adaptable.

01:40:33.000 So it doesn't just train.

01:40:34.000 People think, oh, okay, so it's going to make the sole of your foot tougher.

01:40:39.000 What about that?

01:40:40.000 What's special about that?

01:40:41.000 But that's not the point.

01:40:42.000 There's many more benefits beyond just making your feet tougher.

01:40:47.000 It's so fascinating that in the invention of the running shoe, which they thought was an advancement, oh, we're going to put cushioning, it'll save people's bodies, the wear and tear, and it actually wound up fucking people up and getting more injured.

01:40:59.000 The food is a masterpiece.

01:41:01.000 There's nothing to change about it.

01:41:04.000 The human food is a masterpiece.

01:41:07.000 You try to come up with some cutting science shoes, footwear. 1.00

01:41:16.000 It's bullshit. 0.98

01:41:17.000 You just need minimal protection to avoid abrasion and punctures and things like that. 0.99

01:41:23.000 But otherwise, you need to let the foot work as naturally as possible.

01:41:29.000 And if you don't, then you will make your feet weaker.

01:41:32.000 It will shrink it.

01:41:34.000 It will numb it.

01:41:36.000 But then on the flip side of that coin, my feet aren't strong enough to just go and run as I would normally in completely minimal shoes.

01:41:45.000 I have to kick back.

01:41:46.000 I have to kick back the intensity and the distance.

01:41:49.000 So if I really want to get a really hard, hard run in and get fatigued, I throw on some regular old running shoes.

01:41:58.000 Shorter distances, I'm specifically training my feet and Conditioning my tissues and everything to be able to do that.

01:42:09.000 And that's kind of a distinction.

01:42:13.000 So I don't hurt myself.

01:42:15.000 Moving barefoot in wild environments is not...

01:42:20.000 It's not mandatory to people who say wanna.

01:42:22.000 Mandatory.

01:42:24.000 Well, forgive my French.

01:42:26.000 When I have to do the math in my head as to what you said, I feel like I have to clarify for the people listening.

01:42:31.000 Well, thanks.

01:42:32.000 That's good.

01:42:32.000 Thanks.

01:42:34.000 It's not mandatory.

01:42:36.000 Mandatory.

01:42:37.000 Mandatory.

01:42:38.000 Mandatory.

01:42:38.000 Thanks, Joe, for correcting my flawed English.

01:42:41.000 It's very good English.

01:42:42.000 It's way better than my French. 1.00

01:42:45.000 You start resetting your body in a more natural way through these natural movement patterns and you can do that in indoors environment even wearing some minimal footwear and then you remove the footwear and then you start to expose the body through this natural movement on more challenging more complex environments.

01:43:06.000 Ultimately if you want to you can become You can go through these more, say, badass trainings where it's like the real deal.

01:43:13.000 You're in the wild.

01:43:14.000 There are maybe cactus and sharp stones and all kind of things.

01:43:18.000 And still, you can do that.

01:43:20.000 But that doesn't mean that you have to do that right away or that you ever have to do that.

01:43:25.000 Right.

01:43:26.000 The bow hunting practice was...

01:43:29.000 Yeah, these balancing movements, the point was not just the movement itself.

01:43:36.000 When you move in complex environments, there are also situations.

01:43:40.000 For instance, you're hunting.

01:43:43.000 Your goal is to catch the game.

01:43:45.000 So you need to be aware of what's going on, you need to avoid being detected, and you need to look and scan your surroundings and be as light as possible, as silent as possible.

01:43:57.000 If you're already in trouble with your movement, if you're already struggling with your movement, how much of your brain activity and awareness is going to be dedicated to the situation itself, which is the hunting part.

01:44:09.000 Right.

01:44:10.000 Because the movement part and the environment part is not there.

01:44:15.000 You're struggling.

01:44:17.000 It's not just a matter of, oh, I have some cardio, so I'm good.

01:44:20.000 No, well, maybe you have a hard time just kneeling, just getting up and getting down.

01:44:25.000 Let alone in a supple, silent, smooth way that is not detectable.

01:44:32.000 Bowhunting in particular sort of experienced this, most recently, this fitness movement where a lot of guys are getting in extremely good shape to be able to run the mountains.

01:44:46.000 So that they can hike long distances and not be fatigued and so that they can take shots and have some mobility where you can be on your knees.

01:44:56.000 And for long periods of time, you might have to be held at full draw while an animal's looking at you.

01:45:02.000 After having run up a hill and you're fatigued.

01:45:06.000 Yeah, and it's the difference between being successful and not being successful.

01:45:09.000 In today's day, you can still go to the supermarket, but ultimately what it means is whether or not you can eat or not eat.

01:45:15.000 So you have to be in physical shape to be able to do that kind of hunting, and a lot of it is at high altitude, so you're trudging through the mountains with low oxygen.

01:45:23.000 Both the body and mind have to deal with so many diverse variable changing, and again, that's adaptability.

01:45:32.000 It's about adaptability.

01:45:34.000 I got the chance to train the seals in Coronado.

01:45:39.000 And these guys are, well, number one, they are gentlemen.

01:45:42.000 They're real good people.

01:45:43.000 But they are extremely fit from the standpoint of How much they can run, how much they can endure.

01:45:52.000 But I would challenge them with very simple movements, such as some of the movements we've trained together with Carlos, when you're in that split squat position and you reverse your orientation from forward to backward, while maybe holding a stick that represents a rifle or a bow or a camera if you're shooting photos.

01:46:15.000 So if you're struggling with a movement, you have imbalances.

01:46:19.000 How much, again, of your situational awareness can be dedicated to the situation at hand?

01:46:24.000 Right.

01:46:25.000 At stake?

01:46:26.000 That's a good point.

01:46:26.000 Because you're surviving the movement.

01:46:28.000 Oh, excuse me.

01:46:29.000 Stay close to the mic.

01:46:30.000 Oh, all right.

01:46:31.000 And then for a split second or maybe for a little longer, you're in trouble.

01:46:35.000 So in a cage situation, it's very similar because you need to always keep an eye on your opponent.

01:46:43.000 So you need that situational awareness while also not having to think exclusively at how you move.

01:46:49.000 So the more comfortable your movement, the more fluid, the more second nature it becomes, then the more attention your brain can dedicate to the situation and to the adaptability, the range, the timing, all of these subtle little adaptations.

01:47:06.000 And your brain is in charge.

01:47:08.000 Your brain commands, not the body.

01:47:09.000 So the body needs to be able to To move in a highly reliable way.

01:47:18.000 Ultimately, that it is the movement itself or the situational awareness, it all boils down to the brain.

01:47:28.000 What I was getting at before with the bow hunting is, with regards to your diet, do you eat wild game?

01:47:35.000 I do, yeah.

01:47:37.000 Mainly I eat grass-fed, free-range meats.

01:47:43.000 I get as much wild game as I can.

01:47:45.000 Like I said, I didn't kill anything the last two years, but the people that I did go with, they harvested elk.

01:47:52.000 So, you know, we all share the meat.

01:47:56.000 So yeah, I eat as much wild game as possible because I feel like that's, I mean, that's about as pure as you can get.

01:48:02.000 Yeah, it really is healthy too when you eat it.

01:48:04.000 It does have like a different effect on your body.

01:48:06.000 You can feel it if you're...

01:48:09.000 Health conscious and if you're aware of what you're taking in on a regular basis, you're sort of aware of how your body reacts, you'll feel different when you eat wild game.

01:48:18.000 It's just more nutrient dense.

01:48:19.000 Yeah.

01:48:20.000 And there's other aspects to it, man.

01:48:25.000 See the animal die or you kill the animal. 0.99

01:48:27.000 There's just a sense of gratitude, I feel like, for this thing giving its life to nourish your body as opposed to buying something in a nice little neat package with fucking saran wrap over it.

01:48:40.000 You don't really think that a life was separated to give you to nourish your body, but when you go out and you see it or it's in front of you, you realize that You're a little bit more connected to what you're putting in your body and I think that disconnect is a part of the problem with our food chain.

01:49:05.000 I guess a sickness or food culture that we're experiencing these days.

01:49:11.000 The gratitude is certainly an aspect of it and also the connection, just an understanding, a real understanding of what happened, how you got there, what this meal is, and it feels better.

01:49:22.000 It feels better to eat it.

01:49:24.000 Yeah.

01:49:25.000 Yeah.

01:49:26.000 It's a mix of things.

01:49:27.000 You actually feel as opposed to just not even thinking about it.

01:49:31.000 Not even considering it.

01:49:32.000 Yeah.

01:49:33.000 Just, oh, this is awesome.

01:49:35.000 Now, Mike Dolce, you were saying, works with you or worked with you for this last camp.

01:49:40.000 What was the difference?

01:49:42.000 Like, what different things did you eat and what approach did you take?

01:49:46.000 Did you do any blood work to examine your nutrient levels?

01:49:49.000 I did not.

01:49:50.000 I didn't do any blood work.

01:49:51.000 The difference was...

01:49:54.000 We didn't change what I was eating.

01:49:55.000 We changed the structure and the timing of when I was eating.

01:50:00.000 I didn't have much of a structure.

01:50:04.000 I was like, I'm eating the right things.

01:50:07.000 I'm good.

01:50:09.000 He He's like, okay, well, no, this is how we're going to do it.

01:50:14.000 You're going to sit down and you're going to eat until you're full.

01:50:17.000 Every three hours, you're going to do feedings.

01:50:20.000 You're not going to kind of snack and graze here and there, which is what I was doing.

01:50:25.000 And...

01:50:26.000 Dude, it increased my energy levels immensely.

01:50:30.000 Why?

01:50:30.000 How so?

01:50:31.000 In what way?

01:50:32.000 I felt awesome.

01:50:32.000 So, I don't know why.

01:50:34.000 I don't know the physiology behind it, but I think it's hormonal.

01:50:40.000 So, after I would eat these big meals, boom, I would get...

01:50:43.000 I would get tired.

01:50:44.000 I would get an insulin dump, be tired for a little while, but the next time I went to train, I just felt like I had more fuel, more energy, more sustenance for these training sessions.

01:51:01.000 My weight cut was...

01:51:03.000 I've never had a weight cut as easy as that.

01:51:06.000 We were eating full, large meals right up until the night...

01:51:11.000 Even the night before weigh-ins.

01:51:13.000 What?

01:51:13.000 I was...

01:51:16.000 I came down so quickly.

01:51:17.000 And I kind of have a weird deal, man.

01:51:19.000 I feel like my body...

01:51:20.000 I've cut weight so many times.

01:51:22.000 I have 40-plus professional fights between kickboxing and MMA. And I think my body just kind of knows.

01:51:31.000 It just drops.

01:51:31.000 Even Mike's like, dude, I've kind of never worked with an athlete that just...

01:51:35.000 Boom, boom.

01:51:36.000 It's just on a schedule.

01:51:38.000 My weight drops.

01:51:41.000 And...

01:51:42.000 Yeah, but I felt amazing.

01:51:44.000 I felt good in the fight.

01:51:46.000 I think I looked good in the fight.

01:51:47.000 I performed well.

01:51:48.000 The cut was awesome.

01:51:51.000 So you're eating big meals?

01:51:53.000 I mean, relatively big meals.

01:51:56.000 How many calories have you counted out?

01:51:59.000 So I would say I would have probably an 8-ounce portion of Of salmon, probably a cup of white rice, and then a good amount of vegetables.

01:52:13.000 We're talking about several times a day.

01:52:15.000 Really?

01:52:16.000 Yeah.

01:52:17.000 Wow, that's interesting because most people think of weight cuts being that, you know, you severely restrict the amount of calories you have, your body starts to go into ketosis or what have you, starts absorbing fat instead of carbohydrates, you dehydrate yourself then after that,

01:52:34.000 and that's how you get to that state.

01:52:36.000 Yeah, well, I mean, that's one way to do it, and I've definitely done that way before. 0.91

01:52:41.000 I've done it a bunch of shitty ways.

01:52:43.000 What's the worst way you've ever done it? 0.67

01:52:46.000 Not the chicken nuggets way, but I mean...

01:52:49.000 Right around that same time, not eating, I remember.

01:52:54.000 So my first kickboxing fight ever, I fought a guy named Andy Sauer.

01:52:58.000 I don't know if you're familiar with Andy Sauer.

01:53:00.000 That was your first kickboxing fight?

01:53:01.000 My first kickboxing fight ever. 0.99

01:53:02.000 What the fuck is that? 0.99

01:53:03.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:53:04.000 Who was your manager?

01:53:06.000 How long had Andy been fighting then?

01:53:08.000 His record at the time, I remember...

01:53:11.000 62-4 or something?

01:53:12.000 93-1.

01:53:13.000 Oh my god, that's so insane.

01:53:16.000 93-1.

01:53:17.000 Your first kickboxing fight, oh my god.

01:53:20.000 So I was 12-0 as an MMA fighter.

01:53:23.000 Oh my god.

01:53:24.000 I was 19 years old.

01:53:26.000 I had maybe one or two amateur boxing fights, and I had been training kickboxing for a long time.

01:53:32.000 But anyway, I go out to...

01:53:33.000 But he had 90 what?

01:53:35.000 93-1, I remember.

01:53:36.000 Oh my god. 0.99

01:53:37.000 What fucking governing body sanctioned that? 1.00

01:53:41.000 It was in Japan. 0.99

01:53:42.000 I was the guy that they were bringing in.

01:53:45.000 You could have fought a lion in Japan.

01:53:46.000 Exactly.

01:53:46.000 I was the guy that they were bringing in for the slaughter.

01:53:48.000 Oh my god. 0.95

01:53:49.000 And I show up out there, and I'm only, I think I remember, I was only like eight pounds out, and We didn't know what the fuck we were doing with regards to the weight cut at the time. 0.98

01:54:00.000 I was 19, and so I'm like, oh shit, and I just stopped eating. 0.96

01:54:04.000 I just didn't eat for about four days. 0.99

01:54:07.000 Oh no!

01:54:08.000 Yeah.

01:54:09.000 Oh no, that's so cool. 0.99

01:54:10.000 Meanwhile, eight pounds ain't shit. 0.99

01:54:13.000 I'll do that. 0.99

01:54:13.000 I'll do that, yeah. 0.99

01:54:15.000 The day before, eight pounds, you're like, oh, we're good.

01:54:17.000 Yep.

01:54:18.000 Exactly.

01:54:18.000 Still eating fairly well.

01:54:19.000 It's one day in the sauna.

01:54:21.000 Yeah.

01:54:21.000 Yeah, that's nothing.

01:54:22.000 Oh, my God.

01:54:23.000 And so I starved myself for about four days, and...

01:54:26.000 Were you checking your weight while you're starving yourself?

01:54:28.000 Yeah, I think I was.

01:54:29.000 I don't remember.

01:54:30.000 It was a long time ago, but it was same-day weigh-ins, too.

01:54:34.000 Oh, Christ.

01:54:34.000 I weighed in in the morning, and then fought about maybe eight or nine hours later.

01:54:41.000 Oh, my God.

01:54:41.000 That's insane.

01:54:43.000 And, uh...

01:54:44.000 I went five rounds with him. 1.00

01:54:45.000 I got my ass kicked. 1.00

01:54:49.000 I got my ass kicked, but I learned a lot and I grew from the experience. 1.00

01:54:55.000 I'd imagine. 1.00

01:54:56.000 Holy shit. 0.99

01:54:57.000 Andy Sauer's a legend. 0.99

01:54:58.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:54:59.000 That is so crazy.

01:55:00.000 That was your first kickboxing fight.

01:55:02.000 He TKO'd me with 17 seconds left to go.

01:55:05.000 He had chalked my legs down to the point where I couldn't even stand.

01:55:09.000 I was falling through the ropes. 1.00

01:55:10.000 I was all fucked up. 1.00

01:55:11.000 Wow. 0.99

01:55:12.000 Yeah.

01:55:13.000 It was awesome, though, man.

01:55:14.000 It was dope.

01:55:16.000 It was cool.

01:55:16.000 I went back in.

01:55:17.000 I came back to Albuquerque.

01:55:19.000 I went down to the gym.

01:55:20.000 These guys had been kind of throwing me around up to that point.

01:55:23.000 I specifically remember Diego Sanchez.

01:55:26.000 I mean, at the time, he's the king of the cage champion.

01:55:28.000 He's like the man, the New Mexico man of Jackson's.

01:55:31.000 And he always gave me a really, really, really tough fight or tough sparring matches at the point. 0.99

01:55:38.000 And after I went through that experience, it was just kind of like, ah, you can't do shit to me. 0.99

01:55:43.000 Wow. 0.99

01:55:44.000 Just changed you.

01:55:46.000 That's interesting.

01:55:47.000 That's amazing. 0.99

01:55:48.000 What a fucking crazy matchup that is. 1.00

01:55:51.000 That's criminal. 1.00

01:55:52.000 You should find out whoever matched you up and go beat their ass. 1.00

01:55:55.000 I know who did it. 1.00

01:55:56.000 I'm glad.

01:55:57.000 I shake their hand.

01:55:58.000 You know, that shaped me.

01:56:00.000 Yeah.

01:56:01.000 Well, for you, for a guy like you, you could handle it. 0.99

01:56:03.000 But goddamn, that could have ended a lot of people. 0.99

01:56:05.000 And I think they knew that. 1.00

01:56:06.000 The Stockholm Syndrome.

01:56:08.000 Stockholm Syndrome?

01:56:09.000 Yeah.

01:56:11.000 Yeah, right?

01:56:13.000 Becoming friends with your captors.

01:56:15.000 That's insane, man. 1.00

01:56:17.000 What a crazy fucking matchup. 1.00

01:56:19.000 I've never seen it. 1.00

01:56:21.000 I've never seen a video of it.

01:56:22.000 I think it's out there.

01:56:23.000 I think even Andy Sauer hit me up on one of the social media asking if I had ever seen it.

01:56:30.000 I'm like, no.

01:56:31.000 Up to this point, I have not.

01:56:33.000 It was under shootboxing rules.

01:56:35.000 So shootboxing, I don't know if you're familiar, was...

01:56:39.000 Billed as no-holds-barred stand-up, so it was throws and takedowns with kickboxing, no elbows.

01:56:48.000 Like Drakka?

01:56:49.000 Remember when they used to do that?

01:56:51.000 They were doing that in the United States for a while, was kickboxing with takedowns.

01:56:55.000 I don't remember that, but that's what this was supposed to be.

01:56:58.000 Maury Smith did that for a little bit.

01:57:00.000 And standing submissions.

01:57:02.000 What?

01:57:02.000 Yeah, you were supposed to be able to do standing submissions.

01:57:04.000 And I actually caught him in a few chokes standing. 0.95

01:57:07.000 And I think the rules were if the guy hits his knees, they break it and they stop it.

01:57:15.000 What?

01:57:15.000 Yeah.

01:57:16.000 I don't know.

01:57:17.000 It was weird.

01:57:18.000 It was cool, man.

01:57:19.000 It was a good experience.

01:57:21.000 I was 19 years old.

01:57:22.000 I got to go to Japan.

01:57:24.000 Yeah.

01:57:25.000 Fight for, I don't know, probably 500 bucks.

01:57:27.000 I don't even remember how much it was.

01:57:30.000 Japan's crazy. 1.00

01:57:31.000 Did you see Ryzen?

01:57:33.000 What's that?

01:57:34.000 Did you see Ryzen, the Japanese, the New Year's show with Fedor?

01:57:38.000 I did not.

01:57:39.000 Yeah, it's the ultimate freak show.

01:57:41.000 Yeah?

01:57:41.000 It was awesome.

01:57:42.000 Cool.

01:57:42.000 Yeah, it was almost like early days of Pride, where it was kind of chaotic.

01:57:48.000 Gabby Garcia was there, 220 pounds. 1.00

01:57:51.000 I saw that fight, yeah. 0.99

01:57:52.000 Just juiced to the fucking earlobes. 0.99

01:57:55.000 What's that? 1.00

01:57:56.000 And she got dropped, right?

01:57:57.000 She did.

01:57:57.000 Right off the bat.

01:57:58.000 But she came back and she cracked the chick with a back fist. 1.00

01:58:02.000 Fucking back fist coming back, man. 0.99

01:58:04.000 Arlovsky with Travis Brown, he landed a back fist. 0.99

01:58:07.000 Oh, this one?

01:58:08.000 Yeah, a regular back fist.

01:58:10.000 Not a spinning back fist, a regular back fist.

01:58:12.000 Just a pimp hand.

01:58:13.000 The backhand pimp hand.

01:58:15.000 But it was two days of fights.

01:58:18.000 Wow.

01:58:19.000 Yeah, Sakuraba...

01:58:20.000 It might have been more than two days.

01:58:22.000 Sakuraba fought Aoki, which was just criminal.

01:58:25.000 They shouldn't let Sakuraba fight anymore. 0.57

01:58:27.000 It's just awful to watch.

01:58:28.000 How old is he now?

01:58:29.000 It's not how old he is.

01:58:31.000 It's the miles.

01:58:33.000 You know, he's probably younger than Anderson.

01:58:36.000 You know, if I had to guess, I would say he's younger than Anderson.

01:58:39.000 But the beatings that guy's taking...

01:58:42.000 Did you see the Melvin Manhoof fight?

01:58:43.000 When Melvin was soccer-kicking him, and he's down.

01:58:46.000 It's just...

01:58:48.000 It's so hard to watch.

01:58:50.000 Those Vanderlei knockouts that he suffered, those were brutal.

01:58:54.000 Those were ruthless, yeah.

01:58:54.000 That guy's been through the ringer, you know?

01:58:56.000 He's so cruel.

01:58:58.000 What a legend, though, that guy is.

01:59:00.000 What a legend.

01:59:00.000 Absolutely.

01:59:01.000 I remember the first time I saw Pride, I saw him fighting Hoist Gracie.

01:59:05.000 Oh, wow.

01:59:05.000 And just wasting him.

01:59:06.000 That was that 90-minute fight.

01:59:08.000 That was that 90-minute one, and he had Hoist in that...

01:59:11.000 That, like, dead to rights knee bar.

01:59:14.000 And Hoist would not tap.

01:59:15.000 I forget what ended up happening.

01:59:17.000 Was it a draw?

01:59:18.000 Decision, yeah.

01:59:19.000 Well, it was a draw, because they went the 90 minutes and nothing happened.

01:59:22.000 I think it was a draw.

01:59:24.000 I think that's how they...

01:59:25.000 No, no, no, no, no.

01:59:27.000 Hoist broke his ankle.

01:59:28.000 That's right.

01:59:29.000 Didn't he break his ankle and he couldn't continue? 1.00

01:59:31.000 Fuck! 1.00

01:59:32.000 Why do I not remember that? 1.00

01:59:34.000 Jamie will pull it up.

01:59:35.000 He'll find out.

01:59:35.000 There was two fights.

01:59:37.000 They had another one in K1, and that was in America.

01:59:40.000 I was there live for that one, and the hoist was juiced up.

01:59:43.000 He was big.

01:59:44.000 He was yoked up. 0.94

01:59:45.000 Then he tested positive, and they fined him a fuckload of money.

01:59:48.000 I don't know if he ever paid it, but he vanished.

01:59:50.000 But now he's back.

01:59:51.000 He's fighting, which is crazy.

01:59:52.000 He's fighting Ken Shamrock.

01:59:53.000 I saw that on Bellator.

01:59:56.000 Yeah, it's the main event in February.

01:59:58.000 That's crazy.

01:59:59.000 Yeah, it's so strange.

02:00:01.000 Yeah.

02:00:02.000 I remember their fight was the first fight I ever saw.

02:00:05.000 It was the first UFC fight I had ever seen.

02:00:08.000 Sakuraba and Hoist? 0.99

02:00:09.000 No, no, no.

02:00:10.000 Cannon and Hoist.

02:00:12.000 Cannon and Hoist.

02:00:13.000 And Hoist was choking him with his gi.

02:00:16.000 Yeah.

02:00:17.000 It was wild, man.

02:00:18.000 The early days, man.

02:00:19.000 The first fight I ever saw was Orlando V... Versus Remco Pardew.

02:00:26.000 When Remco Pardew took him down and elbowed the fuck out of him from side control. 0.89

02:00:31.000 He had him like that judo scarf. 0.94

02:00:33.000 I remember watching that going, Jesus Christ. 1.00

02:00:37.000 What kind of fucking crazy sport is this? 0.99

02:00:40.000 The Pardew guy kind of hits him a few times. 1.00

02:00:43.000 He's surprised that he's knocked out.

02:00:45.000 He kind of just lets him go.

02:00:46.000 The refs at the time would just let them Melee. 1.00

02:00:49.000 Yeah, Big John.

02:00:51.000 Big John was one of the refs back then, which is crazy. 0.97

02:00:54.000 You remember when, what the fuck is his name, fought that ninja dude, Pat Smith. 0.99

02:01:00.000 Pat Smith fought some dude who was doing, they had his pre-fight video, and his pre-fight video was doing ninja techniques and fucking all this crazy shit that doesn't really work. 0.98

02:01:12.000 And then he got in there with Pat Smith, who was a pretty seasoned kickboxer. 0.93

02:01:16.000 Yeah.

02:01:16.000 And it was dropping just wicked elbows on him.

02:01:19.000 From the mount.

02:01:20.000 It knocked him out and then woke him up and then knocked him out again before the ref stopped. 0.99

02:01:25.000 Yeah, well he got up and it was just a bath of blood.

02:01:28.000 His whole head was essentially opened up.

02:01:30.000 Boy, that was the early days, man.

02:01:33.000 The early days were really fascinating because...

02:01:37.000 You were around martial arts before the UFC, so you had seen karate and you'd seen all these different Judo and all this different stuff, and nobody really knew what the best stuff was.

02:01:49.000 I always knew that wrestlers could take you down.

02:01:51.000 I always knew that was going to be a problem, because I wrestled in high school and I had a good buddy of mine, my friend Steven Arduino, when I was doing Taekwondo and he was wrestling.

02:01:59.000 One of the reasons why I got into wrestling is because I didn't think that he could take me down.

02:02:04.000 Like, we're out in the grass.

02:02:05.000 He's like, I can take you down anytime I want. 1.00

02:02:07.000 I'm like, bullshit. 1.00

02:02:08.000 He took me down over and over again. 1.00

02:02:10.000 I was like, this is crazy.

02:02:11.000 It was so humiliating.

02:02:12.000 Like, he just took me down every time he wanted to.

02:02:15.000 And I was like, this is mad.

02:02:16.000 I gotta start wrestling.

02:02:17.000 So I started wrestling.

02:02:18.000 It's one of the reasons why I started wrestling. 0.97

02:02:20.000 A dude got me in a headlock and fucking threw me down in the locker room. 0.97

02:02:23.000 He could have beat me up, but didn't. 0.99

02:02:25.000 I was like, goddammit, I'm fucking frail. 0.99

02:02:28.000 So I had to learn wrestling, but I always knew that wrestlers could take you down if they wanted to. 0.99

02:02:32.000 But I always felt like a guy who knew a little bit of wrestling, was a good kickboxer, would probably be able to keep the fight standing.

02:02:39.000 But then when Hoist started choking people, I was like, oh no.

02:02:43.000 This is a whole different thing.

02:02:44.000 This is a completely different thing.

02:02:45.000 That guy beat that guy from his back. 0.99

02:02:47.000 Who the fuck wins on their back? 1.00

02:02:49.000 It was just a whole new element. 0.99

02:02:52.000 It's interesting because you've been around from the WEC days, which were when you were the WEC champ, it was so small in comparison to what it is now.

02:03:05.000 For you to go from that to that last fight against Robbie in Vegas, which was just this massive fucking media event, you're fighting for the world title, you get there, the place is sold out, it's craziness, the roar of the crowd...

02:03:22.000 You know, it's time! 0.98

02:03:24.000 Like, what a fucking odyssey you've been through in your career. 0.98

02:03:28.000 Because you were there sort of when it was kind of just starting to take off. 0.99

02:03:33.000 Yeah, I really got in on kind of the ground level.

02:03:36.000 Yeah.

02:03:37.000 I mean, even before WEC, I told you we were fighting at like 200, 300-person venues in the middle of the desert.

02:03:44.000 It's been crazy, man.

02:03:46.000 It's been... 0.98

02:03:48.000 It's been an incredible ride, and it has been the coolest fucking thing ever. 0.90

02:03:53.000 I wanted to, as a young kid, none of this existed, but I was into the early 90s martial arts movies and the Ninja Turtles, and I wanted to be a ninja. 0.93

02:04:06.000 That's what I wanted to do.

02:04:07.000 Of course.

02:04:08.000 I remember that was the second movie that I had ever seen. 0.99

02:04:10.000 It was the first Ninja Turtles movie, and I came out of there throwing fucking kids. 0.99

02:04:18.000 We're good to go. 0.99

02:04:33.000 You know, by, you know, kind of inexplicably good for a small podunk place like Albuquerque.

02:04:41.000 But not just inexplicably good for what it was, but also for the time, and it evolved.

02:04:49.000 Whereas a lot of those camps that were big back then, like the Lion's Den, they're gone.

02:04:54.000 You know, the Pat Miletic's gym, it's gone.

02:04:57.000 Like these gyms that were really big at the time.

02:05:00.000 They didn't evolve, or they didn't carry on, or for whatever reason, they stopped doing it.

02:05:05.000 You know, your gym has not just evolved, but evolved to be one of the premier gyms in the world.

02:05:11.000 It's really kind of incredible.

02:05:13.000 Yeah, and there's been a lot of change, you know, like a lot of the original guys have branched off and are kind of doing their own thing, but yeah, the...

02:05:23.000 The genesis of MMA and Albuquerque is kind of an interesting story.

02:05:29.000 And I wasn't there.

02:05:31.000 I was told this.

02:05:33.000 This is kind of first-hand hearsay from the people who did develop this thing.

02:05:39.000 Basically, these guys from these different disciplines got together and they had watched the UFC and wanted to...

02:05:46.000 Oh, I have a wrestling background.

02:05:47.000 This guy has a Kempo background. 0.97

02:05:49.000 This guy is like a...

02:05:52.000 AKK, karate, kind of background, whatever. 1.00

02:05:56.000 They all got together and they started formulating this shit. 0.99

02:05:58.000 And this one guy was a flight attendant. 0.99

02:06:01.000 And he was flying all over the country.

02:06:04.000 And everywhere he'd stop, he would go to these different schools.

02:06:10.000 Because there wasn't the internet at the time.

02:06:11.000 You couldn't jump on YouTube and look at techniques.

02:06:14.000 So he would go.

02:06:15.000 The guy's name is Chris Luttrell.

02:06:17.000 And he cornered me for my fight against GSP. And he's one of the founding members of Jackson's.

02:06:24.000 He was going to these different jujitsu, judo, pancreation schools and seeing what they were doing.

02:06:31.000 Then he was bringing the information back.

02:06:32.000 And then they were, you know, kind of getting into the laboratory and see what was working.

02:06:37.000 At the same time, some of these guys were bouncers and police officers and literally using this stuff, you know, on the street in some, you know... 0.97

02:06:49.000 I had Roadhouse type fucking situations. 0.97

02:06:53.000 That's awesome. 0.99

02:06:54.000 My original trainer was like a Patrick Swayze from Roadhouse type kind of guy, Tom Vaughn.

02:07:00.000 I don't know if you know Tom Vaughn.

02:07:02.000 He trains Tim Means.

02:07:03.000 Yes.

02:07:04.000 Fit NHP now in Albuquerque as well.

02:07:07.000 Him and Greg were, I mean, he's one of the founding members as well.

02:07:12.000 It's kind of crazy that there's two big gyms like that in a place as small as Albuquerque that have UFC fighters.

02:07:20.000 Well, they split up there.

02:07:21.000 Yeah.

02:07:21.000 They're from the same place.

02:07:22.000 They branched off at one point.

02:07:24.000 Mm-hmm.

02:07:24.000 Yeah.

02:07:24.000 Or they split up.

02:07:25.000 It's crazy that, you know, these both guys have developed really high-level talent.

02:07:30.000 Huh.

02:07:30.000 Well, it's because they all came from the same original thing.

02:07:35.000 That's a fascinating story about the flight attendant.

02:07:38.000 I'm sorry, what was his name again?

02:07:39.000 Chris Luttrell.

02:07:40.000 Chris Luttrell.

02:07:41.000 Because him traveling and doing that, that's similar to what Hollis Gracie did.

02:07:45.000 Holes did. 0.96

02:07:46.000 Holes Gracie traveled to America and learned a lot of wrestling shit and learned catch wrestling stuff. 1.00

02:07:52.000 That's why the Americana is named the Americana. 0.96

02:07:55.000 It's a...

02:07:56.000 It really came from American catch wrestling, and they started incorporating it into Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, along with some wrestling techniques and some sambo. 0.96

02:08:04.000 He learned a bunch of shit, and he was the guy that really was Hickson's mentor. 0.96

02:08:08.000 He was the guy that was the head of the family. 1.00

02:08:10.000 Before he died, he was the man.

02:08:12.000 He died in a hand-gliding accident in Rio.

02:08:16.000 Yeah, and he was the guy.

02:08:18.000 He was the head of all the others.

02:08:21.000 He was the one alpha of all the grapplers.

02:08:25.000 He was dedicated to learning and incorporating different techniques.

02:08:29.000 I think like in any other...

02:08:32.000 Context that those were the most adaptable most open to change and evolution are those who who survive look sure I remember Eddie Bravo Showing his approach to Rickson grassy Hickson Gracie right?

02:08:47.000 Why is it so hard?

02:08:48.000 Why is so hard on me?

02:08:50.000 No, I'm not and he was Despite his his amazing knowledge and background and He was open enough to listen carefully, respectfully,

02:09:06.000 with humility.

02:09:08.000 He even asked questions, like Hickson was asking questions about different aspects of the positions.

02:09:12.000 And coming from the BJJ world, that's unusual actually.

02:09:16.000 Hickson is a very unusual guy Hickson was a yogi like he was the first guy to incorporate yoga and he is a legit yogi like have you ever seen the videos of him doing those exercises in Santa Monica where he's Balancing on one leg and he puts his leg up in a full split He has incredible control of his body.

02:09:35.000 Yes, and then and hence the the people Legitimately legitimately saying hey Rickson was The first to implement movement in this training.

02:09:47.000 He was, yeah.

02:09:48.000 He was.

02:09:48.000 But here's the thing.

02:09:50.000 To me, I want to pay tribute to all coaches that they are Muay Thai striking coaches, judo coaches, even strength and conditioning coaches.

02:10:01.000 They are all movement trainers and movement specialists.

02:10:05.000 They all are.

02:10:06.000 More or less specialized, but they are.

02:10:08.000 It's all movement.

02:10:10.000 It is.

02:10:10.000 And you know, there's an interesting aspect that's going on right now in 10th Planet Jiu Jitsu with break dancers.

02:10:16.000 There's a bunch of these guys like Richie Martinez, who was a break dancer, like amazing break dancer, and his brother Gio. 0.98

02:10:24.000 These guys, they can do crazy shit with their body. 0.93

02:10:27.000 They're standing on one hand and spinning around. 0.99

02:10:29.000 And because of that...

02:10:31.000 You have another term, hip-hop.

02:10:32.000 It's a lot about how you control your hips, which is the fundamental of jiu-jitsu.

02:10:37.000 I don't think that's hip-hop.

02:10:38.000 I don't think that's where it is.

02:10:39.000 Because it rhymes.

02:10:40.000 It came from, like, Sugarhill band.

02:10:46.000 Hip-hop, ahibbity-hibbity-hip-hop.

02:10:48.000 What you don't know, Joe, those guys had incredible movement.

02:10:51.000 They didn't show it much.

02:10:53.000 They had to to carry those chains. 1.00

02:10:55.000 Their rhymes overshadowed their fucking stability, their core stability. 1.00

02:11:00.000 There's the dance... 0.99

02:11:00.000 There's the dance, and then there's the music, and then in breakdancing, you're going to use your hips like crazy. 0.99

02:11:08.000 A lot of those movements are achieved because you have great hip control.

02:11:12.000 And in jiu-jitsu, you must have great grip control.

02:11:15.000 Play that from the beginning, Jamie.

02:11:17.000 Watch what this guy can do.

02:11:19.000 This is just one of the breakdowns. 1.00

02:11:21.000 Look, he's standing on his fucking head. 1.00

02:11:24.000 Just his head. 1.00

02:11:26.000 Triangles.

02:11:27.000 Yeah.

02:11:28.000 All sorts of stuff.

02:11:29.000 Absolutely.

02:11:30.000 Well, these guys, when Eddie first started training them and rolling with them, he was amazed at how freakishly strong they were.

02:11:38.000 And you look at them, they look like regular people.

02:11:40.000 But the physical control of their body is just spectacular because of...

02:11:46.000 You know, it's essentially similar to gymnastics in a lot of ways. 1.00

02:11:49.000 Like, look at this fucking guy! 1.00

02:11:51.000 That's Smeagol level. 1.00

02:11:53.000 Oh my god!

02:11:54.000 He's triangling himself and walking on his hands.

02:11:57.000 This is nuts, man. 1.00

02:12:00.000 That is fucking nuts. 1.00

02:12:01.000 What's the name of this video, Jamie? 0.99

02:12:03.000 So if people are listening, they can watch this.

02:12:05.000 Tenth Planet Breakdance Crew Freak Show.

02:12:07.000 Yeah, they all call themselves Freak Show.

02:12:10.000 He owns Tenth Planet San Diego.

02:12:11.000 Is he trying to submit himself?

02:12:13.000 Yeah, looks like it.

02:12:15.000 Yeah, he can submit himself.

02:12:17.000 There's a couple of those kids that could put themselves in triangles, like legitimately put themselves in triangles. 1.00

02:12:20.000 Look at this fucking... 1.00

02:12:21.000 Look at this shit! 1.00

02:12:22.000 I'm sassing, but I admire at the same time the skill. 1.00

02:12:25.000 There's no doubt.

02:12:26.000 Oh, there's no doubt.

02:12:27.000 The physical control of the body is just spectacular.

02:12:30.000 Right.

02:12:30.000 And this is the first time I've seen this, but I mean, I can see the application to combat sports.

02:12:36.000 Oh, yeah.

02:12:37.000 Immediately.

02:12:38.000 I've rolled with a couple of these guys. 1.00

02:12:39.000 They're fucking freaks. 1.00

02:12:41.000 You can't hold on to them. 1.00

02:12:42.000 They move all over the place and they can catch you and shit from all sorts of weird angles. 0.96

02:12:47.000 Look at that! 0.98

02:12:48.000 He's on one hand and he puts his legs in full lotus, standing on one hand, jumping up and down.

02:12:54.000 It's nuts.

02:12:55.000 Tenth Planet Jiu Jitsu is a very explorative, innovative school of jiu-jitsu.

02:13:03.000 In the game of MMA, those gyms who also are open and collaborative are going to keep themselves at the upper echelon.

02:13:14.000 And those who don't evolve will disappear because it is indeed the methods.

02:13:19.000 The end result is the same.

02:13:21.000 It's the fight.

02:13:21.000 It's fighting, but the methods to get there and to be proficient.

02:13:27.000 It boils down to the methods that you use.

02:13:31.000 And with Carlos, there was no resistance when I approached him and started to train.

02:13:39.000 He talked to his coaches about it, and they may not understand right away exactly what it was about or what it was going to bring to his game, but they were at least open to it.

02:13:49.000 And eventually they saw What together we've been able to to improve and achieve and if it didn't have that attitude then Carlos would have not benefited.

02:14:02.000 Did you contact Jackson and Winklejohn before you worked with Erwan or did you try it out first and go hey, I think I'm on to something?

02:14:15.000 I don't know.

02:14:16.000 I don't remember how that worked, but what was really interesting, and Irwin touched on it earlier, was that they saw the same thing.

02:14:23.000 They both watched.

02:14:24.000 So after my...

02:14:25.000 The widening the stance.

02:14:27.000 Yeah, and the ability to move forward and back.

02:14:30.000 Me and Greg Jackson sat, and he wanted to watch a couple of my fights, and he wanted to see what we were doing well and what we needed improvement on.

02:14:38.000 Yeah.

02:14:39.000 I saw a few things and I started working with Irwin completely independently.

02:14:45.000 We're walking on logs and this and that.

02:14:47.000 He's like, well, this is kind of a plan that I have for you and this is what I see.

02:14:51.000 It was exactly the same thing that Greg Jackson, who is considered to be one of the most brilliant minds in MMA, saw.

02:14:59.000 Irwin is a movement specialist and Irwin had a plan and a strategy on how to improve that.

02:15:05.000 What was Jackson's idea of dealing with it?

02:15:08.000 What did he think?

02:15:09.000 Well, he knew what needed to be done.

02:15:11.000 I don't think he necessarily knew how to get there.

02:15:13.000 So he knew that you needed to be able to move in and out better.

02:15:17.000 Yes.

02:15:17.000 But he didn't have any strategy.

02:15:19.000 Yeah, well, I mean, I wouldn't say that he didn't have any strategy.

02:15:21.000 It was kind of, okay, you know, we'll work on that.

02:15:23.000 Let's figure out how to do it.

02:15:24.000 Yeah, let's work on that.

02:15:26.000 Maybe just drill it.

02:15:27.000 Yeah, exactly.

02:15:28.000 Drill it.

02:15:30.000 Erwin and I, we videotaped us moving across the same distance, and this dude's fast, man. 1.00

02:15:38.000 He's like a fucking deer. 0.99

02:15:40.000 He moves really, really, really quickly. 1.00

02:15:42.000 He can run, he can jump.

02:15:43.000 He kind of looks like a deer.

02:15:44.000 Yeah, he does.

02:15:45.000 He's got that look in his eyes.

02:15:46.000 I don't find myself in the corner of the wood with me being a so-called deer and this guy with his bow because he shoots like super sharp.

02:15:55.000 So, anyway.

02:15:57.000 So, videos, you're going back and forth.

02:15:59.000 Yeah, so we're looking at this stuff in slow-mo, frame by frame, where his body position is compared to where mine is, and what's the difference?

02:16:09.000 He's moving faster because, boom, he's more upright.

02:16:12.000 He doesn't have so much weight on his front foot that he has to load and take another half second before he springs backwards.

02:16:21.000 And so, we're like, boom, that's it.

02:16:24.000 This is what we need to improve on.

02:16:26.000 This is what we need to do.

02:16:28.000 Now we are going to drill it and there's a variety of different things to instill that stance and the posture on a neuromuscular level.

02:16:40.000 Are you having other fighters approaching now?

02:16:43.000 Not yet.

02:16:44.000 Really?

02:16:46.000 After I saw that video, I would imagine the video of you guys training together.

02:16:50.000 Here's the thing.

02:16:51.000 I think there is still probably some skepticism.

02:16:56.000 You know, what's this mold man coaching?

02:16:58.000 If the guy doesn't look like Jesus, doesn't have a man bun and a suave foreign accent, it's a ripoff. 0.84

02:17:10.000 I think that they don't know exactly what it is about, and they probably believe that it's probably random.

02:17:20.000 But if you listen to what Carlos says, it was actually highly specific.

02:17:26.000 A camp is three months.

02:17:28.000 We would train once a week, maybe sometimes twice a week.

02:17:32.000 But that's still a limited amount of time to make those changes happen.

02:17:35.000 So I had to choose my battle.

02:17:37.000 And then I told Carlos, listen, this is what I believe we need to work on and just focus on.

02:17:44.000 And we did that for the first camp.

02:17:46.000 And then the second camp for Lawler was completely different.

02:17:50.000 Completely different.

02:17:51.000 And highly specific to improving kicking.

02:17:55.000 What were you going to say?

02:17:57.000 We do have some guys that are...

02:18:00.000 They've been doing this kind of independently.

02:18:03.000 One of the guys is a young guy, and they're fighting on amateur and regional levels, but I have a feeling you're going to know their names here in the next couple of years.

02:18:12.000 They're up-and-coming guys.

02:18:13.000 They're young, like 21, 22, 23-year-old, kind of making their way.

02:18:20.000 One of them has been watching Erwin's videos since he was like 15 years old.

02:18:24.000 He met Erwin.

02:18:25.000 He was all starstruck.

02:18:26.000 Oh my god, this is Erwin LaCour.

02:18:27.000 How did you even meet?

02:18:29.000 And they are incorporating movement quite a bit.

02:18:34.000 So it's not that they haven't sought him out.

02:18:38.000 They're kind of very interested in this and doing their own stuff and Finding this stuff online and watching the portal stuff, watching Irwin's stuff, and definitely incorporating a lot of this stuff.

02:18:52.000 And one of the kids is a gymnast.

02:18:53.000 He was a gymnast before. 1.00

02:18:55.000 And so now he can do all kinds of crazy shit. 0.99

02:18:58.000 They're all looking for an edge, definitely. 1.00

02:19:00.000 They're all looking for an edge.

02:19:01.000 Even Carlos was looking for it.

02:19:04.000 Well, George St. Pierre was doing a lot of gymnastics.

02:19:07.000 Pat Cummings does a lot of that as well.

02:19:09.000 It's the same thing.

02:19:10.000 Now we see with Conor McGregor, so it's like this big thing.

02:19:16.000 GSP was doing gymnastics for the same exact reasons.

02:19:20.000 To be able to move his body through space and ultimately become a better fighter and be able to... 0.99

02:19:29.000 Better beat the shit out of people. 0.98

02:19:31.000 That's the goal, right? 0.99

02:19:33.000 It's fun and it's cool.

02:19:34.000 It's a cool way to train.

02:19:36.000 And after the fact, I think this is a cool fitness modality that's very different.

02:19:42.000 I absolutely love it. 0.99

02:19:44.000 I've been an athlete all my life and I plan on being an athlete till the fucking day I die. 0.98

02:19:49.000 How much longer do you think you're going to be fighting? 0.99

02:19:52.000 Have you considered that?

02:19:54.000 Oh yeah.

02:19:55.000 I've heard you talking about that after the Robbie Lawler fight.

02:20:00.000 I don't know.

02:20:01.000 I don't know.

02:20:03.000 How old are you now?

02:20:05.000 31. I'll be 32 in a few months.

02:20:07.000 You're still in your prime.

02:20:08.000 I am, but this has been a long road.

02:20:11.000 I started fighting professionally at 18. I've had Over 40 fights.

02:20:19.000 And you feel it?

02:20:19.000 You get dinged up?

02:20:20.000 I get dinged up, and I still feel great.

02:20:23.000 I think my concern is the long-term neurological stuff that is coming to light with all the studies on the concussions.

02:20:34.000 You've seen me fight.

02:20:35.000 I don't go in there and not take damage. 0.99

02:20:37.000 I fucking take damage. 1.00

02:20:39.000 I take punishment. 1.00

02:20:42.000 I'll take two to give one, and that's just kind of my style.

02:20:45.000 Well, you didn't fight like that in the Nick Diaz fight.

02:20:47.000 That was one of the few fights where you didn't fight like that.

02:20:50.000 Yeah.

02:20:50.000 You know, I felt...

02:20:53.000 I'd seen a lot of guys go in against Nick Diaz and gas themselves out trying to knock that guy out.

02:20:59.000 It's like, you can't knock him out.

02:21:01.000 He took a full-on left hook from Paul Daly... 0.99

02:21:06.000 Flopped around a little bit, popped back up, Paul Daly blew his wad trying to finish him, and then got knocked the fuck out himself. 0.99

02:21:13.000 And I've seen a lot of guys hurt him, but he's so goddamn tough. 0.98

02:21:19.000 He's so hard to put away. 0.94

02:21:21.000 And so, yeah, it was more of a calculated approach.

02:21:26.000 As I got flowing later in the fight, I started opening up a little bit.

02:21:31.000 But I think that's what a lot of Nick Diaz's strategy is.

02:21:34.000 He wants, for one, he wants to get in your head.

02:21:36.000 And he wants you to fight emotionally.

02:21:38.000 He wants you to sit there and have a face punching competition with him. 0.52

02:21:43.000 You know? 1.00

02:21:43.000 Oh, we're gonna stand here like it's the fucking schoolyard. 1.00

02:21:45.000 Was he talking a lot of shit to you? 1.00

02:21:47.000 He was, but I knew what he was going to do. 1.00

02:21:52.000 I mean, I grew up with dudes like that my whole life.

02:21:58.000 So I was kind of used to that, and I knew that I was going to have to be emotionally prepared. 0.98

02:22:05.000 Yeah, emotionally kind of shut down and just fight a strategic fucking game plan against the guy. 0.99

02:22:12.000 Yeah, it was interesting to watch that fight because, you know, he was extremely frustrated by that, you know, and he couldn't get you to change, you know, whereas he's been able to, like, fuck with guys' heads. 0.98

02:22:26.000 Like, the Frank Shamrock fight, like, you could see Frank Shamrock going, I can't fucking believe this is happening to me. 0.99

02:22:31.000 Like, when Nick was talking shit to him, like, what, bitch, what? 1.00

02:22:34.000 And then popping him with a jab. 1.00

02:22:35.000 You could see, like, for some people, that shit-talking becomes overwhelming with Nick. 0.99

02:22:42.000 Yeah. 0.99

02:22:43.000 You know, what's funny is both me and Cowboy fought the Diaz brothers within a few weeks of each other, right?

02:22:51.000 Cowboy lost to Nate, and I fought Nick just a few weeks later. 0.97

02:22:55.000 And in preparation for both of our camps, we were switching roles and both fighting Southpaw and both fighting, you know, like one round I would fight Southpaw and talk a bunch of shit and try... 0.76

02:23:08.000 And try to emulate the Diaz style, and then the next round he would do the same. 1.00

02:23:15.000 Did you yell out, Stockton, motherfucker! 1.00

02:23:17.000 209! 1.00

02:23:20.000 I did my best impression.

02:23:22.000 That reminds me of a Buddhist monk drill where they're all in their meditation posture and they partner up and the other guy is like trying to instigate them and talk crap to them to have them get out of their meditation.

02:23:38.000 That's the drill.

02:23:40.000 Well, there's definitely something to that. 1.00

02:23:42.000 I mean, if you're not used to people that talk shit, when someone talks shit to you, it can be like emotionally devastating. 0.99

02:23:48.000 You're like, what? 1.00

02:23:49.000 What's happening here? 1.00

02:23:50.000 But if you're used to be like, fuck you, I've heard this shit, you know, it becomes normal, you know? 1.00

02:23:55.000 I mean, I tried to explain that to fighters when they deal with online criticism as well. 1.00

02:23:59.000 Like, I've talked to guys who would go on, like, the Underground and see, like, some shit that people were talking about and just be fucking devastated and get so upset. 0.98

02:24:08.000 And I was like, look, man, you got to treat it like snake venom. 0.99

02:24:10.000 You get a little bit of that shit in your system and you're going to be okay. 1.00

02:24:14.000 You get a little bit more and you eventually deal with it. 1.00

02:24:16.000 Build up an immunity to it.

02:24:18.000 And then you go, oh, I get it. 1.00

02:24:19.000 You're just a bunch of little cunts who've never accomplished shit. 1.00

02:24:23.000 So you're talking shit about fighters, calling them pussies. 1.00

02:24:26.000 Because to some fighters, you have a loss. 1.00

02:24:28.000 And you're like, good, I'm glad he got knocked out. 0.99

02:24:30.000 I fucking hate watching that guy fight. 1.00

02:24:32.000 He's a pussy. 1.00

02:24:34.000 To them, it's some hateful stuff. 1.00

02:24:37.000 And initially, it's like, whoa.

02:24:41.000 I'd never experienced that until, really, until after the DS fight.

02:24:45.000 There had been some, but after the DS fight, you know that.

02:24:48.000 Big time.

02:24:51.000 I call it the unique snowflake syndrome.

02:24:57.000 You're told since you're a kid, you're a unique snowflake.

02:25:00.000 But the problem is that they can't stand the heat.

02:25:04.000 Does that make sense?

02:25:07.000 Who are you talking about, though?

02:25:09.000 Who is the unique snowflake? 0.99

02:25:10.000 The person talking shit or the fighter? 0.99

02:25:13.000 Whoever is being told all the time, hey, it's okay to be different or it's okay to be this and that. 0.99

02:25:18.000 But the problem is that sometimes you do need to...

02:25:22.000 Hear stuff about yourself that is challenging and to take it criticism.

02:25:27.000 I don't necessarily know you need to hear it.

02:25:31.000 I mean, I would appreciate, I mean, man, it's hard because I like both ways.

02:25:36.000 I kind of love, like, Nate Diaz punching Michael Johnson in the face and then pointing at him. 0.99

02:25:41.000 Ah, I just fucked you up. 0.99

02:25:42.000 Like, it's funny. 1.00

02:25:43.000 You know, when Anderson fought Nick and Nick laid down on his back and pretended he was sleeping for a second, I was fucking crying laughing. 0.98

02:25:50.000 I love it. 0.98

02:25:50.000 When Conor McGregor talks mad shit to Jose Aldo for months, till he just rents space in his head, to the point where Aldo just, he literally can't fight his fight. 0.98

02:26:00.000 He has to run at Conor because he's just so overwhelmed with emotion, and then Conor sleeps him. 0.97

02:26:06.000 I like both, but I prefer, in a perfect world, I prefer martial artists.

02:26:12.000 I prefer guys to go out there, treat each other with respect, shake each other's hands, and then just go at it.

02:26:18.000 Just let their skill take it.

02:26:20.000 It's an effective tactic.

02:26:22.000 To these fighters, it's part of their weapons. 0.99

02:26:24.000 It fucking works. 0.99

02:26:25.000 It's not something outside their game. 0.99

02:26:27.000 It's completely embedded in their whole game.

02:26:31.000 Oh, yeah.

02:26:31.000 Well, it's also a lot of fighters define themselves by respect, by how much someone respects them and how much...

02:26:38.000 Like, to a fighter, when someone's not scared of them, it becomes a very devastating thing.

02:26:43.000 Like, I remember when Anderson fought Chris Weidman.

02:26:45.000 When Weidman and Anderson were at the weigh-ins, and Anderson's staring at him, looking at him, and Weidman goes, I'm not scared of you, dude.

02:26:52.000 I'm not scared of you. 0.98

02:26:53.000 And you could see Anderson was like, shit, this guy really isn't fucking scared of me. 0.99

02:26:57.000 Like, you could see there was a tangible moment where this guy wasn't pretending he wasn't scared. 0.99

02:27:02.000 He just literally wasn't scared.

02:27:05.000 And you could feel it.

02:27:08.000 Similar situation at the weigh-ins with Ronda Rousey and Holly Holm.

02:27:13.000 Yes.

02:27:14.000 Same thing, and I felt like that was a precursor to what ended up happening.

02:27:19.000 Well, the big part was when Holly didn't flinch.

02:27:21.000 Exactly. 0.98

02:27:22.000 When Ronda was yelling at her, you fake bitch, you preacher's daughter, all this stuff and stuff, and she wrote all this stuff on Instagram about her, and Holly's just standing there. 1.00

02:27:29.000 And then when I interviewed Holly afterwards, she goes, well, I was just trying to get a sip of water. 0.99

02:27:32.000 And you realize, like, whoa, this girl's so fucking composed. 0.97

02:27:36.000 Like, so composed. 0.98

02:27:38.000 And also, she'd been to so many dances.

02:27:41.000 She'd fought for so many boxing titles and kickboxing and MMA. She'd been in so many dances that the bright lights weren't an uncomfortable thing to her.

02:27:51.000 She's like, okay, we're here again.

02:27:53.000 Whereas for a lot of people, it's like, whoa, this is the big show. 0.99

02:27:57.000 Holy shit, I can't believe I'm here. 0.99

02:27:59.000 Yep. 1.00

02:27:59.000 Absolutely. 1.00

02:28:00.000 Being overwhelmed by the moment is almost something that you can't prepare for.

02:28:04.000 It seems to me that for a lot of people, some people just naturally can deal with moments.

02:28:09.000 And some people, they have to experience it a couple times to get loose.

02:28:13.000 They've got to get comfortable with it.

02:28:15.000 And then they have to, like some people, like Cowboy's a perfect example.

02:28:18.000 He fights his best when he fights a lot.

02:28:21.000 He's got to fight all the time.

02:28:22.000 He fights three, four times a year, and then you're going to get the best Cowboy you can get.

02:28:26.000 But you make him take a year off or take a long time off, and he's much better when he's active.

02:28:32.000 He's got to stay loose and looped up and fired up. 0.96

02:28:37.000 That fight with Tim Means is going to be fucking crazy. 0.92

02:28:40.000 When they announced that, I went, whoa! 0.95

02:28:42.000 Why did Cowboy decide to take that fight?

02:28:44.000 Because he doesn't like cutting weight?

02:28:45.000 I have no idea.

02:28:47.000 I don't know.

02:28:48.000 I haven't talked to Cowboy about it.

02:28:49.000 I mean, I said, hey, what's up?

02:28:51.000 But we didn't really talk about the fight at all. 0.98

02:28:53.000 Well, he's so crazy.

02:28:54.000 You could probably offer him Brock Lesnar. 0.60

02:28:56.000 He'd be like, come on, bring it on.

02:28:57.000 Oh, for sure. 0.99

02:28:57.000 He's fucking do it. 0.99

02:28:58.000 That's it. 1.00

02:28:59.000 That's why.

02:28:59.000 It's because he's Cowboy.

02:29:01.000 Yeah, he's just nuts, man. 1.00

02:29:03.000 Yeah. 0.92

02:29:03.000 He's a fun dude, man. 0.92

02:29:05.000 Yeah.

02:29:06.000 Absolutely.

02:29:06.000 Fun to watch fight.

02:29:08.000 Fuck, he's either on or he's off. 1.00

02:29:10.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:29:10.000 Unfortunately. 1.00

02:29:11.000 Unfortunately.

02:29:12.000 Well, I don't even necessarily know if it wasn't that he was not on. 1.00

02:29:16.000 It's that Dos Anjos is a fucking demon. 1.00

02:29:18.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:29:18.000 He just jumps all over you. 1.00

02:29:20.000 He's a demon. 0.99

02:29:20.000 Did that to him. 0.99

02:29:21.000 Did that to Pettis.

02:29:22.000 Yeah, man.

02:29:22.000 Nobody's done that to Pettis, man.

02:29:24.000 Dude, dude, but he's just so fucking fat. 0.97

02:29:27.000 And again, he's a guy who trains with Nick Kurson, and Nick Kurson's gotten doing all these plyometrics and jumps and sprints and foot strengthening stuff. 0.99

02:29:36.000 You ever seen that stuff where they're lying on their back and their feet are pushing up these bars, and they're kicking up these bars and catching them with their feet and exploding with their feet?

02:29:46.000 I saw the video before the Cowboy fight.

02:29:48.000 Yeah, it's all based on Marv Marinovich's Training strategies. 0.99

02:29:54.000 That's the same sort of shit that he used with BJ Penn. 0.94

02:29:57.000 Really, it's really interesting. 1.00

02:29:58.000 I remember that.

02:29:58.000 I remember watching that.

02:30:00.000 And BJ was standing on the tennis balls and all that sort of thing.

02:30:05.000 Very similar.

02:30:06.000 Yeah, very similar.

02:30:07.000 And it's...

02:30:09.000 It's all very similar, different ways, different methods, but it's all kind of the same goal.

02:30:19.000 So, what's next for you now?

02:30:21.000 Do you hang back for a while? 0.98

02:30:22.000 You had a brutal, crazy five-round war for the title where it was as close as you're ever gonna fucking get. 0.63

02:30:29.000 I mean, a lot of people saw it your way, a lot of people saw it Robbie's way. 0.87

02:30:33.000 It was just that close.

02:30:34.000 Split decision.

02:30:36.000 What do you do now?

02:30:40.000 I'd like another shot at Robbie.

02:30:42.000 I felt like I won the fight, and like you said, it was a razor, razor close decision.

02:30:49.000 Could have gone either way.

02:30:51.000 MMA judging is subjective. 0.98

02:30:52.000 The scoring system is so fucking crazy, too. 0.97

02:30:54.000 It is, absolutely. 0.97

02:30:55.000 It's just nuts that we're still using that 10-point must system.

02:30:58.000 Yeah, it doesn't...

02:30:59.000 It doesn't apply very well to MMA. And that's proven over and over again.

02:31:05.000 Yeah, I'd like another shot at Robbie.

02:31:08.000 I feel like I should have the belt right now.

02:31:09.000 But it seems like Tyron Woodley's next, right?

02:31:12.000 I mean, at least he was sort of promised that based on the Hendricks fight where Hendricks didn't make weight.

02:31:19.000 It seems like that's what's probably being set up.

02:31:23.000 But you never know with the UFC. I mean, Misha Tate was supposed to fight Ronda.

02:31:26.000 If she beat, was it Jessica Ai?

02:31:29.000 Is that who it was?

02:31:30.000 I think that's who it was.

02:31:32.000 And then they decided no.

02:31:34.000 So it's interesting because the UFC kind of decides to call the shots.

02:31:39.000 Has anybody talked to you about whether or not they would do that again?

02:31:42.000 I think it's definitely a possibility.

02:31:45.000 I think the first fight, they made that fight because that was the fight that people wanted to see.

02:31:51.000 Among any of the contenders, that was the one that got everybody excited.

02:31:57.000 That was the one.

02:31:59.000 A rematch of that fight?

02:32:01.000 Oh, yeah.

02:32:01.000 Come on now.

02:32:02.000 Well, I think as far as public interest, that would be the biggest fight out there.

02:32:07.000 Yeah.

02:32:07.000 But I feel like I just hate when someone gets promised something.

02:32:11.000 Yeah.

02:32:11.000 You know, and I would feel the same way if it was you.

02:32:13.000 Like Tyron Woodley promised that title fight.

02:32:16.000 If he beat Hendrix, Hendrix fucks up and doesn't make weight and the fight fights off and then Woodley's sort of left out to dry.

02:32:23.000 Mm-hmm.

02:32:24.000 I feel for him.

02:32:25.000 And I do too.

02:32:27.000 I have a loss to Woodley.

02:32:30.000 That's definitely on my radar to avenge that loss. 0.99

02:32:34.000 Does a loss like that, an injury loss, fuck with you as much as a loss by decision? 0.99

02:32:41.000 That's kind of a crazy loss because your knee blew out. 0.99

02:32:45.000 I think even more so just because of the fact that I didn't get to do as much as I wanted to do.

02:32:51.000 I didn't get to leave everything out there.

02:32:54.000 This last one, it's a bummer I didn't take the belts home that night.

02:32:58.000 It didn't go my way, but I pushed it. 0.96

02:33:01.000 I was able to fucking empty the tank. 0.97

02:33:04.000 He definitely emptied the tank. 0.99

02:33:06.000 You both did.

02:33:07.000 In the Woodley fight, I didn't.

02:33:09.000 My body gave out.

02:33:10.000 My knee blew out.

02:33:12.000 From that perspective, I definitely see where you're coming from.

02:33:16.000 He was promised the fight.

02:33:18.000 But I'm not in charge of Tyron.

02:33:20.000 I'm not in charge of picking the fight.

02:33:22.000 I'm in charge of Carlos Condit and trying to get myself in the best fight.

02:33:27.000 That being said, honestly, that's about the only fight that interests me at this point.

02:33:32.000 Well, I'll tell you what, I wouldn't be mad if they decided to make a rematch. 0.98

02:33:35.000 I'd feel bad for Tyron, but fuck, I'd love to see that again. 0.98

02:33:39.000 Yeah, I'd love to do that again. 0.98

02:33:42.000 How much time would you need off after a fight like that?

02:33:46.000 I think I'd be ready to go in late spring, early summer.

02:33:52.000 UFC 200. Sounds good to me.

02:33:56.000 Sounds good to me.

02:33:57.000 I don't know.

02:33:58.000 That would be gigantic.

02:34:00.000 UFC 200?

02:34:02.000 Oh my goodness.

02:34:04.000 I wanted that fight to be legendary, and I think that it lived up to that.

02:34:09.000 Oh, it was legendary.

02:34:10.000 It was one of the greatest fights I've ever seen.

02:34:12.000 I've probably called 1,500 fights or something like that, something crazy like that.

02:34:16.000 That was easily in the top 10. Everybody wants to see a sequel.

02:34:22.000 Except Tyron.

02:34:23.000 It's like an unfinished business.

02:34:24.000 Except Tyron Woodley. 1.00

02:34:25.000 He's right now listening going, fuck that shit! 1.00

02:34:27.000 That's my fucking shot! 1.00

02:34:29.000 Yeah, and I understand where he's coming from, but... 1.00

02:34:32.000 Yeah, I get it too.

02:34:33.000 I get it too. 0.99

02:34:34.000 Hey, maybe they can, you know, fucking give him a little... 0.99

02:34:37.000 Kudos. 0.99

02:34:38.000 Listen, Tyron, take a few of these.

02:34:41.000 Kick back, relax.

02:34:42.000 Have a good time.

02:34:45.000 I don't know. 1.00

02:34:47.000 I still love this shit. 1.00

02:34:49.000 I still love the process, training camp, even fucking fight week I enjoy. 1.00

02:34:55.000 That's awesome. 0.55

02:34:56.000 One of my favorite things in life is to get in there and mix it up with a guy like Robbie.

02:35:02.000 Well, it was one of my favorite things to watch because it was just an amazing fight.

02:35:05.000 Like I said, after the fight, it was an honor.

02:35:07.000 It was an honor to be there and to call it.

02:35:10.000 Because I know that when...

02:35:12.000 This is all over, and we're old, and we're sitting around at a bar or at a picnic someday.

02:35:18.000 We're picnicking? 1.00

02:35:19.000 The fuck am I talking about? 1.00

02:35:19.000 We're talking about the past. 1.00

02:35:21.000 We're going to talk about that fight.

02:35:23.000 You know, the way people talk about Leonard and Duran, or the way people talk about any great, crazy fight that they were there for.

02:35:31.000 Yeah, and win or lose, ultimately, that's...

02:35:36.000 That's what I want to be said.

02:35:37.000 That's the legacy that I want to leave.

02:35:39.000 Well, I think it was martial arts in its best form in a lot of ways.

02:35:43.000 It was heart, determination, willpower, technique, the discipline to go through camp to get yourself in the kind of shape that you need To compete for five rounds like that, which is just an insane amount of physical conditioning.

02:35:58.000 You guys fucking emptied, and your workload was extremely high in that fight, especially kicks.

02:36:05.000 I remember that was one of the things that we commented on, like how many kicks you had thrown. 0.99

02:36:08.000 I mean, it was really a really fucking crazy, crazy fight. 0.98

02:36:12.000 Yeah. 0.96

02:36:13.000 Yeah.

02:36:14.000 It was fun, man.

02:36:15.000 I had fun.

02:36:16.000 Maybe I'm a little bit twisted, but I was...

02:36:19.000 I would definitely say you're a little bit twisted.

02:36:23.000 You know, that was a good time.

02:36:25.000 The kicks were a big part of the strategy too.

02:36:28.000 I think that a lot of people wonder why is it that Lawler was not as aggressive as usual.

02:36:33.000 I believe there is a reason because it's not like he was less hungry or less in shape.

02:36:37.000 It's because the strategy worked of Higher volume and higher accuracy and with with those cakes to To you know lower his his aggressiveness It worked well sticks are always so dangerous too because it just takes one slip up You know,

02:36:57.000 it's they're so much harder than punches and you're taking them on your arms And they fuck your arms up the point where you can't throw punches anymore.

02:37:05.000 So you got to be careful what you absorb and Right.

02:37:09.000 Statistically, the volume is going to create damage to different divers, part of the body.

02:37:16.000 I've heard the debate about the fight metrics.

02:37:19.000 I threw a lot.

02:37:21.000 I didn't necessarily land a lot.

02:37:25.000 And I feel like the kicks and the volume of punches that I was throwing out was the equivalent of, say, putting down cover fire if you're in a firefight.

02:37:39.000 Yeah, you're not necessarily...

02:37:42.000 Popping people's nuggets.

02:37:44.000 But it's part of an overall strategy to come out with victory.

02:37:49.000 You're throwing him off.

02:37:51.000 You're making him keep his hands up.

02:37:53.000 You're keeping that distance.

02:37:54.000 You're making the enemy keep their head down in this analogy.

02:37:58.000 And you weren't also loading up either.

02:38:00.000 You were touching him with a lot of these things and keeping him on his toes.

02:38:03.000 And that was something that Dwayne was calling TJ Dillashaw to do in his fight with Dominic Cruz.

02:38:08.000 He was like, just go out and then touch him.

02:38:10.000 Just keep touching him and then the shots will come. 0.62

02:38:12.000 But he got so emotional and tied up and trying to knock Dominic out.

02:38:17.000 You could see him standing more flat-footed, swinging more single shots, single kicks, single punches.

02:38:22.000 Yeah, this guy that had looked just incredibly dynamic with his footwork and looked like Dominic Cruz against other guys and looked really well.

02:38:32.000 Dominic Cruz goes out there and makes him look like a very orthodox fighter.

02:38:39.000 He's not moving like that anymore.

02:38:40.000 At times.

02:38:41.000 Initially, they came out and they were both moving like that.

02:38:44.000 I'm like, oh, this is crazy.

02:38:46.000 These guys are going to open up a wormhole. 1.00

02:38:47.000 What the fuck's going on? 0.99

02:38:49.000 You know? 1.00

02:38:50.000 Yeah, right. 1.00

02:38:51.000 This shit's going to be, you know, this shit's wild. 1.00

02:38:53.000 Well, I think that's what a lot of us expected. 1.00

02:38:55.000 But it's interesting that what Uriah had said about TJ, that he had a feeling that TJ was going to get emotional because TJ's a super competitive guy.

02:39:02.000 He'd get really geared up and, you know, that was an interesting fight.

02:39:08.000 Really interesting fight to watch.

02:39:09.000 It's crazy that Dominick Cruz was able to come back, having essentially only fought once in four years.

02:39:14.000 Yeah.

02:39:15.000 And win the title like that.

02:39:16.000 Perform like that, yeah.

02:39:17.000 He's a different kind of animal. 1.00

02:39:18.000 He's a smart motherfucker, too. 1.00

02:39:20.000 You talk to that guy? 1.00

02:39:21.000 Oh, yeah.

02:39:22.000 I've known him since WEC. I listened to his analysis of fights, like when he talks about what mistakes guys make and things guys are doing right and correctly and what they need to do.

02:39:32.000 And you realize he's operating on a very, very high level.

02:39:35.000 Oh, yeah.

02:39:36.000 Very high level.

02:39:37.000 Absolutely.

02:39:37.000 And that's probably part of why he was able to come back and compete at the level that he did.

02:39:43.000 Because he was sitting there...

02:39:45.000 You know, analyzing this.

02:39:46.000 You know, they talk about...

02:39:48.000 You can sit there and do repetitions of a kick or a technique, you know, a hundred times, but it's almost the same...

02:39:57.000 thing neurologically to visualize yourself doing that.

02:40:01.000 They say that visual training is very similar and almost as effective as actually doing it.

02:40:08.000 So I wonder if there's kind of a correlation there.

02:40:12.000 I would imagine there is.

02:40:13.000 Well, he's interesting in a way also because he says that there's no such thing as octagon rust.

02:40:18.000 Like I asked him about, and he's like, it's not real.

02:40:21.000 It's mental weakness.

02:40:23.000 If he believes that, it's true.

02:40:25.000 But when you watch the fight, it certainly looked true.

02:40:28.000 I mean, he didn't look rusty at all. 0.99

02:40:29.000 It's just fucking kind of nuts. 0.99

02:40:32.000 I think that's the thing. 0.99

02:40:34.000 It's a belief thing.

02:40:36.000 He's not going to let that one second hinder him.

02:40:40.000 I agree with Carlos because in the absence of actual movement training due to his injury, it's very likely that he was still visualizing every day his movements and therefore using his brain to keep practicing the movements even though the body could not follow during that time.

02:40:59.000 Do you examine Dominic's footwork?

02:41:01.000 Do you examine guys that are fighting?

02:41:03.000 Do you watch different guys' movements?

02:41:05.000 It's close to perfection and easy using a particular technique, yes, but also most importantly, it's all about his alertness and responsiveness and timing.

02:41:18.000 And that again, it's not how much your body can do it, how much your mind is able to operate your body to achieve that.

02:41:29.000 So you need a brain that is extremely sharp. 0.95

02:41:33.000 Well, I was super impressed with him, but one of the things that I thought of when I watched that fight is, God damn, how good is Mighty Mouse? 0.98

02:41:39.000 You got to take a leak? 0.96

02:41:40.000 Is that what's going on? 1.00

02:41:41.000 Yeah, let's just wrap this fucker up. 1.00

02:41:43.000 Yeah, we did almost three hours, but listen, thank you very much. 0.97

02:41:47.000 It was awesome.

02:41:48.000 Thank you, Irwan.

02:41:49.000 Really appreciate it.

02:41:49.000 Thanks, Joe.

02:41:50.000 So, your Twitter handle is, there's Movenat, N-A-T. M-O-V-N-A-T. M-O-V-N-A-T. And then there's also yours, which is just Irwan LaCour.

02:42:00.000 Irwan LaCour, Movenat.com.

02:42:02.000 And you can find it on my Twitter page because I tweeted it today.

02:42:05.000 And Carlos, it's Carlos Condit.

02:42:07.000 Yep.

02:42:07.000 And MoveNot.com.

02:42:09.000 MoveNot. 0.93

02:42:09.000 Right. 0.93

02:42:10.000 M-O-V-N-A-T. Thank you, brother.

02:42:12.000 Really appreciate it.

02:42:13.000 Absolutely, man.

02:42:13.000 It's been a pleasure.

02:42:14.000 Thank you so much, Joe.

02:42:15.000 Thank you.

02:42:15.000 All right, folks.

02:42:15.000 We'll be back tomorrow with the guys from Cowspiracy.

02:42:18.000 Holy shit. 0.99

02:42:19.000 Here we go. 1.00

The Joe Rogan Experience - January 20, 2016

Joe Rogan Experience #749 - Carlos Condit & Erwan Le Corre

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