The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #759 - Cameron Hanes

00:00:00.000 Jamie. 1.00

00:00:03.000 Bam, motherfucker! 1.00

00:00:04.000 And we're live with Filthy Skills, by the way. 1.00

00:00:07.000 If people are wondering what Filthy Skills is, this is a hilarious story because I just saw you wearing...

00:00:11.000 I ran into you in Salt Lake.

00:00:12.000 I didn't know...

00:00:13.000 I was going to be there.

00:00:15.000 By the way, Cameron Haynes, my friend, Bo Hunter.

00:00:18.000 Where's my camera here?

00:00:19.000 Wildlife conservationist, ultra-marathon runner, ultimate badass.

00:00:22.000 I was in Salt Lake skiing with my family at the same time.

00:00:28.000 What was it called?

00:00:29.000 The Great Western...

00:00:30.000 It's a Western hunting...

00:00:33.000 Exposition, conservation exposition, something like that.

00:00:36.000 Which I really want to just drag some of the biggest diehard vegans, one of the most angry ones, just let them loose there and go wander around. 1.00

00:00:46.000 They'd go bonkers.

00:00:48.000 They'd run into walls and scream and probably pee themselves. 1.00

00:00:52.000 It's all just skulls and shit. 0.99

00:00:56.000 And mounts and big cool stuff. 0.99

00:00:58.000 And places you can go to shoot your own food.

00:01:01.000 But you were wearing this Filthy Skills shirt, so I'm like, what is Filthy Skills?

00:01:05.000 And I've been seeing it on your Instagram.

00:01:06.000 What is Filthy Skills?

00:01:07.000 Right.

00:01:08.000 This is hilarious.

00:01:09.000 So some guy sent you this, and we'll put it up on the screen so you can see it on YouTube.

00:01:14.000 Some guy sent this, which is a photo of a YouTube comment where this guy, you got it, Jamie?

00:01:24.000 Where some guy said to you, Here it is. 1.00

00:01:28.000 Fuck you for destroying our world with your filthy hunting skill. 1.00

00:01:32.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:01:33.000 Your filthy hunting skill. 1.00

00:01:35.000 Why don't you kill yourself instead to reduce the population, dumbass? 1.00

00:01:38.000 First of all, the spelling on this is atrocious. 1.00

00:01:42.000 It's almost like he got his dog to write that for him.

00:01:45.000 Yeah.

00:01:45.000 FK, space, letter U, space, for, you got destroying, right?

00:01:50.000 Yeah, that's a tough word.

00:01:52.000 Yeah, he's like, he's weird.

00:01:53.000 He's like, population's good, filthy's good, but you're, he does you are.

00:01:58.000 People that do you are, what do you do with all that extra time that you spend between, like, Y-O-U? What do you do with, you know, you don't have to spend that time working those fingers.

00:02:08.000 Very efficient.

00:02:09.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:02:10.000 Your filthy hunting skills. 0.97

00:02:12.000 So you saw that and were like, hey! 0.84

00:02:14.000 There's a couple things that I thought I did not know I had the power to destroy the world.

00:02:19.000 I am more powerful than I ever knew.

00:02:21.000 That's impressive, isn't it?

00:02:23.000 But then I also said, hey, I have filthy hunting skills.

00:02:26.000 I thought that was sort of like a compliment.

00:02:28.000 Yeah.

00:02:29.000 Hence the shirt.

00:02:31.000 There's such a disconnect going on in this world right now.

00:02:33.000 We were talking about this today while we're practicing.

00:02:35.000 It seems like there's some sort of a culture war.

00:02:38.000 There's a movement of people right now.

00:02:41.000 There's this whole eat what you kill movement.

00:02:43.000 And a lot of people are rejecting the idea of factory farming.

00:02:49.000 And rejecting the idea of buying processed food and buying cows that are locked up in pens and treated like a commodity rather than like a living animal.

00:03:01.000 Right.

00:03:02.000 And going out into the woods and hunting and getting their own food and connecting to this sort of primal existence.

00:03:10.000 Self-sufficient.

00:03:11.000 Self-sufficient.

00:03:11.000 That's what I like about it.

00:03:12.000 I don't rely on anybody to feed my family.

00:03:16.000 And a lot of people love that, but then there's this group of people that are completely disconnected from the way the wild works that are very angry about all this.

00:03:25.000 And there's some bizarre conversations that I've been having with some very well-meaning, very intelligent people.

00:03:32.000 They're very nice people.

00:03:34.000 And this is where there's a big misconception here.

00:03:38.000 I got into it with a gang of people recently.

00:03:41.000 I shouldn't even say I got into it, because I've kind of given up on insulting people online, because I don't get anything out of it.

00:03:49.000 I get it.

00:03:50.000 If you don't like me, I get it.

00:03:53.000 I like me.

00:03:54.000 I'm a nice guy.

00:03:55.000 I mean, if you meet me and you communicate with me nice, even if we disagree, I guarantee we're going to have a pleasant conversation.

00:04:02.000 I'm a nice person. 0.98

00:04:04.000 So, when someone insults me or says nasty shit or makes a nasty video about me, I don't watch it. 0.99

00:04:11.000 I'm not going to. 0.98

00:04:13.000 And people, why don't you respond?

00:04:14.000 I'm not going to.

00:04:15.000 Why would I? I don't have enough time.

00:04:17.000 I don't have enough time to spend with the people I love.

00:04:20.000 I don't have time to hang out with you.

00:04:23.000 What am I, do I have 15 extra minutes to watch a video and then make my own video?

00:04:26.000 I don't have time.

00:04:27.000 This world, this life is short, okay?

00:04:30.000 So, I get that people are upset, but the core message that everybody's getting out, there's one of two messages. 0.97

00:04:38.000 One message is, you should never eat animals at all, and that we should live this The idyllic existence where everyone lives off nuts and twigs and shit and vegetables and that's all you eat. 0.97

00:04:50.000 Pine cone. 0.99

00:04:50.000 Okay, that's fine. 0.99

00:04:52.000 You can do that.

00:04:52.000 But then there's the other that you support and I support that the best way to live in this modern world is to go out and get your own meat.

00:05:02.000 The problem with that, of course, and this is a real problem.

00:05:05.000 Everybody can't do that.

00:05:07.000 There's not enough wildlife.

00:05:08.000 There's not enough time.

00:05:09.000 And I don't think that we think everybody should do that.

00:05:14.000 No.

00:05:14.000 Our point is, and I think people like us, is you don't have to do it, but don't condemn it.

00:05:19.000 Yeah.

00:05:20.000 Don't condemn it because we, I mean...

00:05:22.000 As you said in my intro, conservationists.

00:05:25.000 Hunters are conservationists. 0.99

00:05:26.000 We're the one that's paying the money for habitat, for all these biologists to tell us exactly how many animals are out there.

00:05:33.000 They got boots on the ground and they're out there with the animals doing the number surveys, figuring out harvest numbers to try to achieve, carrying capacity.

00:05:43.000 The guys online who think that grizzly bears are almost extinct and like, how could you kill a bear?

00:05:49.000 You know, they want to kill me because I killed a bear.

00:05:52.000 In Alaska that they probably have no clue how many bear are running around Alaska, but somehow they know that I shouldn't have killed it.

00:06:00.000 They don't know how many are there.

00:06:02.000 They don't know what the bear with the bear population where I killed two brown bear, which are grizzly bear and a black bear.

00:06:08.000 They don't know that those bears need to be controlled.

00:06:11.000 Otherwise, they decimate the moose population.

00:06:13.000 It's it's all about moose everything.

00:06:15.000 Yeah, and part of that balance is humans.

00:06:18.000 So People always say, well, animals will take care of themselves.

00:06:24.000 It's worked out, predators kill, blah, blah, blah.

00:06:28.000 We're just interfering.

00:06:29.000 Well, yeah, we're interfering also because of your house.

00:06:33.000 We're taking habitat.

00:06:34.000 So we can't let the animals sort it out because we're the ones encroaching on habitat.

00:06:38.000 So we are in that process.

00:06:41.000 We are at the top of the food chain.

00:06:42.000 We require habitat too.

00:06:44.000 They require habitat.

00:06:45.000 So there's a balance.

00:06:45.000 It's all part of the equation.

00:06:47.000 It is.

00:06:48.000 And...

00:06:48.000 This balance, there's some parts of it that are set in place before you and I were born, and before a lot of these people that are arguing, everybody, before everybody that's arguing about this has been born.

00:06:58.000 The cities were already in place a long time ago.

00:07:01.000 The food chain has already been in place.

00:07:03.000 The market chain has been in place, as far as getting food to supermarkets.

00:07:07.000 Most of the supermarkets that are in existence were there long before you and I start shopping at them, and that's a part of this equation of human beings.

00:07:15.000 Another part of the equation of human beings is what you're talking about with predators.

00:07:19.000 And this is one of the things that I had a discussion about with the guys who I really like.

00:07:24.000 And there's some misconception I didn't like these guys.

00:07:26.000 The guys that made that movie Cowspiracy.

00:07:29.000 They're very good guys.

00:07:30.000 They're very smart guys.

00:07:31.000 They're vegans.

00:07:33.000 They became vegans.

00:07:34.000 Is this factory farming? 0.99

00:07:36.000 Well, it's a lot about factory farming, and a lot of it is about the amount of waste, methane, that gets into the atmosphere because of factory farming, the actual waste as far as their shit, the cows' shit, and the amount of devastation that does to our environment, 0.98

00:07:53.000 and how much... 0.97

00:07:54.000 Actual land these animals need to graze in order to feed them.

00:07:59.000 These are really complicated numbers and disputed.

00:08:03.000 They went with the extreme on one end.

00:08:07.000 And there's some other people I'm having tomorrow.

00:08:09.000 Doug Duren, my friend from Minnesota, Wisconsin.

00:08:13.000 My buddy from...

00:08:16.000 He's from the Steve Vernella show, Meat Eater.

00:08:19.000 He has that large ranch out in...

00:08:23.000 What is the name of this?

00:08:25.000 You hunted out there, right?

00:08:26.000 Yeah, I'm trying to figure the name of the town.

00:08:28.000 It's a very weird, small town.

00:08:30.000 Anyway, he's in Wisconsin in this really cool area where it's the...

00:08:36.000 You know they have, it's called the Driftless area, where the glacier's mist, so it's all hilly and gorgeous and beautiful, and that's where he lives, and he raises cows out there, and he's going to come in and give his perspective on a lot of this stuff as well.

00:08:49.000 But they had this really strange idea about wolves, and that I had to correct them, and this idea about, you know, that we've hunted the wolves to near extinction, and now they're reintroducing people and hunt them again, and, you know, they really have to stop that.

00:09:04.000 I'm like, man. 0.97

00:09:07.000 Wolves are fucking cool. 0.98

00:09:09.000 This is one of the things that I said to these guys. 0.99

00:09:10.000 Nobody wants to eliminate wolves, but throughout human history, long before we were around, people have had a problem with wolves.

00:09:18.000 And there's a reason for that. 0.99

00:09:20.000 All the big bad wolf stories, all the Little Red Riding Hood, all that shit. 1.00

00:09:24.000 It's because wolves are fucking terrifying. 1.00

00:09:26.000 They are very, very dangerous. 0.99

00:09:28.000 And I brought up the whole World War I incident where the Germans and the Russians had a fucking ceasefire because so many of them were getting killed by wolves. 0.98

00:09:36.000 They made an agreement. 0.97

00:09:37.000 They're like, look.

00:09:39.000 Obviously, we've got a real problem that's bigger than us.

00:09:41.000 Like, team people. 1.00

00:09:42.000 Let's stop killing each other for a little while and kill these fucking wolves. 1.00

00:09:45.000 And they killed the wolves and then went back to killing each other. 1.00

00:09:47.000 It's a crazy story.

00:09:48.000 It is.

00:09:49.000 And then there's the other story from the 1400s in Paris, where wolves killed more than 40 people in Paris.

00:09:56.000 The city of Paris was overrun with wolves.

00:09:59.000 It's insane.

00:10:00.000 Wolves are killing machines, and you have to keep their populations down.

00:10:04.000 And if you don't, you run into huge problems.

00:10:07.000 People bring up, there's this video that people bring up all the time, how wolves changed rivers.

00:10:13.000 And it's a fascinating video.

00:10:14.000 We played it on here before. 0.99

00:10:16.000 The problem with that video is the guy who made that video is fucking nuts, okay? 0.98

00:10:22.000 And he is romantic to the extreme in the idea of introducing keystone predators into these areas where they haven't been before. 0.99

00:10:30.000 His idea was that wolves are making things better for all these other animals by getting rid of the...

00:10:35.000 But they're not.

00:10:36.000 They're decimating the elk population.

00:10:38.000 And there was a thing written by scientists disputing all of his claims that were in that video.

00:10:44.000 So then I went, like, what's this guy's deal about?

00:10:47.000 So I listened to this NPR podcast on him. 0.99

00:10:51.000 This motherfucker wants to bring lions back to Europe. 1.00

00:10:55.000 He's like, there's parts of the UK that are empty, and we could reintroduce lions and hyenas. 1.00

00:11:00.000 Like, bitch, are you out of your fucking mind? 1.00

00:11:03.000 Good idea. 1.00

00:11:04.000 The UK's not that big!

00:11:05.000 No.

00:11:06.000 You're gonna bring lions?

00:11:07.000 Like, actual African lions?

00:11:08.000 And his idea is that they found these fossils of these lions that existed there thousands of years ago.

00:11:15.000 So they need to be back.

00:11:16.000 He wants to reintroduce them.

00:11:17.000 Yeah.

00:11:17.000 And by the way, this guy was suicidal and depressed, like to the extreme, ready to kill himself, and then decided to what he calls rewilding.

00:11:28.000 He reintroduced himself to the wild, started experiencing the wild, and fell in love with wildlife and nature, and that's what pulled him up out of this, and now it's his mission.

00:11:37.000 Hey, I'm in love with wildlife and nature, too.

00:11:40.000 Well, realistically, but realistically.

00:11:43.000 Right.

00:11:43.000 Yeah.

00:11:44.000 Well, I do want to say one thing, because we've talked about factory farming and the downside of it.

00:11:50.000 We're not lumping ranchers, regular ranchers that raise cattle.

00:11:54.000 I mean, my family is a cattle ranching family in eastern Oregon, so I'm not talking about cows that are out with enough pasture out there And then being killed, taking a mark and killed.

00:12:06.000 We're talking about that animals that don't leave the cage, that are standing in, you know, their own feces and just never move and never have a life and then have a bolt shove through their head and they're dead.

00:12:16.000 You know, we're talking that extreme.

00:12:18.000 That's not everybody.

00:12:19.000 I have a lot of respect for farmers and ranchers.

00:12:22.000 And I mean, so we don't want to lump everybody into the ranchers are all factory farmers, for sure.

00:12:27.000 No, there's certainly not.

00:12:28.000 And one of the things that I noticed when I was in Montana, when I first went hunting with Rinella, we went through the Missouri breaks, and there was all these cows wandering around.

00:12:37.000 And I was like, what is the deal with this?

00:12:39.000 Well, those cows literally wander free on public land. 1.00

00:12:44.000 And this is what this Oregon nutty shit is about, and what the Nevada nutty shit was about, with all these crazy ranchers that want to... 1.00

00:12:52.000 Fucking take over the government. 1.00

00:12:53.000 Like, yeah, that's not good. 1.00

00:12:55.000 But what do they call it?

00:12:57.000 Yal-Qaeda? 0.92

00:12:58.000 That's my favorite.

00:12:59.000 We don't even know.

00:13:00.000 We never even found out who came up with that description.

00:13:02.000 Someone was claiming that someone on the podcast came up with that description.

00:13:05.000 But when we were in Montana, that's when I first got introduced to this, these animals literally roam free and wild.

00:13:14.000 They sleep outside.

00:13:15.000 They eat outside.

00:13:16.000 They wander through.

00:13:17.000 And then they're corralled.

00:13:19.000 And when they're brought to slaughter, then they're corralled.

00:13:21.000 And so for the majority of their life, they live, you know, off the land.

00:13:26.000 Almost like an elk.

00:13:27.000 Yeah, like a wild animal, essentially.

00:13:29.000 Except they're someone's property.

00:13:32.000 Right.

00:13:33.000 Some people have a hard time with that.

00:13:35.000 They have a hard time with the idea of property, of an animal being property.

00:13:37.000 And I get that too, man.

00:13:39.000 Another thing I watched recently was this Penn& Teller from that... 0.98

00:13:43.000 Do you ever see that show Bullshit? 0.95

00:13:44.000 No. 0.99

00:13:45.000 It's a great show that they used to do on Showtime, but one of them they did was on PETA and the Animal Liberation Organization or whatever the fuck they call it. 0.93

00:13:55.000 Yeah, I've heard of that. 0.99

00:13:56.000 They're freaks, I think. 1.00

00:13:57.000 Holy shit! 1.00

00:13:58.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:13:59.000 Violent Arsonists burning down buildings, spray-painting vegan power. 1.00

00:14:04.000 I mean, just the nuttiest shit. 1.00

00:14:06.000 But they don't think that people should have pets. 1.00

00:14:09.000 Mm-hmm.

00:14:09.000 They don't think...

00:14:10.000 And here's one of the best parts about it.

00:14:11.000 One of the women that was in this program who works for PETA is also a diabetic.

00:14:18.000 Mm-hmm.

00:14:18.000 This is where you gotta buckle yourself in.

00:14:20.000 Because there's only one way you get that diabetes medicine.

00:14:23.000 It's from animals.

00:14:24.000 So it's an animal product.

00:14:26.000 And so she was saying that she didn't think that she was a hypocrite because that product saves her life so she could save more animals. 1.00

00:14:34.000 Well, guess what, fuckface? 1.00

00:14:35.000 That's what hunting is. 1.00

00:14:37.000 Exactly.

00:14:37.000 That's what hunting is.

00:14:38.000 Exactly.

00:14:38.000 I mean, if you go out and you hunt a wolf, and I'm not into hunting wolves, but they have to control their population.

00:14:44.000 I'm not into hunting anything I don't eat. 0.99

00:14:46.000 Somebody's got to kill them. 0.99

00:14:47.000 Somebody's got to do it. 1.00

00:14:47.000 And they're doing it, by the way. 1.00

00:14:50.000 And also, here's another thing about California.

00:14:52.000 California mountain lions are a giant issue.

00:14:55.000 There's an article that I posted up recently.

00:14:57.000 Pull it up, Jamie, that someone sent me yesterday.

00:15:02.000 You cannot hunt mountain lions in California.

00:15:05.000 The reason for it is not logical.

00:15:08.000 It's all based on people who are animal lovers, who got into a position of power or voted this in.

00:15:14.000 Well, the study they're finding, because they kill these mountain lions when they start moving into neighborhoods and killing pets.

00:15:20.000 And it's super common.

00:15:22.000 What's the number of mountain lions they've killed this year?

00:15:24.000 Because it's crazy.

00:15:26.000 Okay, here we are.

00:15:28.000 107 mountain lions were killed last year, legally, by the government.

00:15:32.000 So that's 107 mountain lions that people didn't get tags for, which means that's money that didn't go into the state coffers, and it didn't go to conservation.

00:15:40.000 It's just money.

00:15:41.000 It works the opposite.

00:15:43.000 The state is paying.

00:15:44.000 Exactly.

00:15:44.000 The state is paying for something to do.

00:15:45.000 So they're going in the hole.

00:15:46.000 They're going in the hole instead of going into the profit margin, which is what they normally did.

00:15:51.000 I'm in the black and red.

00:15:53.000 I'm a colorblind man.

00:15:54.000 Okay.

00:15:56.000 So they analyzed these mountain lions and they found that mostly what they're eating is pets.

00:16:01.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:16:02.000 They're eating, fucking, only 5% had eaten deer. 1.00

00:16:06.000 Right. 1.00

00:16:06.000 Well, they're going to go with the easiest target. 1.00

00:16:08.000 Yeah, but that's insane.

00:16:10.000 Only five, granted, a lot of these animals, what they're killing, they're already problem animals.

00:16:15.000 Well, and what happens with lions is they're so territorial.

00:16:18.000 So the younger lions come up and the more dominant lions have their area.

00:16:23.000 So the younger ones are forced to go somewhere else.

00:16:26.000 They can't really cross.

00:16:28.000 So they go somewhere else.

00:16:29.000 What's left is cities and neighborhoods and residential.

00:16:32.000 And that's where the pets are. 0.92

00:16:34.000 So, I mean, those are probably juvenile lions mostly.

00:16:37.000 And down in there.

00:16:38.000 And it's just a matter of time before a little kid gets snatched or whatever.

00:16:42.000 And people don't want to talk about that or think about that.

00:16:45.000 But that's the reality of it.

00:16:47.000 They're just predators. 1.00

00:16:48.000 They're killers. 1.00

00:16:49.000 They're going for the easiest target. 0.99

00:16:50.000 Right now, that's dogs and cats.

00:16:53.000 They don't care.

00:16:54.000 They don't care.

00:16:55.000 They're not hugging each other and crying like we've seen billboards of that either.

00:16:58.000 We're going to get into that in a moment.

00:17:00.000 But I think this is what I'm trying to get at.

00:17:04.000 This is where I think there's a dispute and a misconception.

00:17:07.000 And the misconception is that hunters are all these evil people that want to hunt these animals to kill them so they can put them on their wall.

00:17:15.000 Almost all of the money that goes to fish and game, fish and wildlife management organizations that protect wetlands, that protect public lands for camping and for people to use and people to enjoy and go hike,

00:17:31.000 the money to support those comes from hunting.

00:17:34.000 Yeah.

00:17:35.000 People hate that.

00:17:36.000 They hate it.

00:17:37.000 But by far, by far, the amount of money that comes from conservation comes from hunting, by far.

00:17:45.000 The amount of money that goes for conservation comes from hunting.

00:17:48.000 Yeah, for the animals.

00:17:49.000 For the animals, for habitat restoration.

00:17:51.000 You know, that show we were just at in Utah, they had a mule deer tag that was auctioned off.

00:17:56.000 They give, for an antelope island tag, they give two tags.

00:17:58.000 One is in the drawing, so you have a very small chance of getting it because there's huge bucks.

00:18:03.000 Where is antelope island?

00:18:05.000 I don't know.

00:18:05.000 Utah.

00:18:06.000 I'm not sure exactly where it is there.

00:18:08.000 Is it an actual island?

00:18:09.000 I don't know.

00:18:10.000 I don't know if it's just a place they call Antelope Island or if it's an actual island.

00:18:14.000 Jamie will find out.

00:18:15.000 It's a state park?

00:18:16.000 Yeah, I knew it was a park, but I didn't know if it was an actual island or not.

00:18:21.000 But anyway, so one is a drawing.

00:18:24.000 There it is.

00:18:25.000 Is that the Great Salt Lake there?

00:18:27.000 Yeah, so you see that?

00:18:30.000 It's out into the Great Salt Lake.

00:18:32.000 And it's not a detached island, it doesn't look like.

00:18:34.000 It's just a long peninsula.

00:18:36.000 Yeah.

00:18:36.000 So it's a peninsula they call Antelope Island.

00:18:38.000 And there's huge bucks, and I think there's sheep there also.

00:18:42.000 But the bucks are what draw the money.

00:18:44.000 So they auctioned one off, and it went for $410,000 for one deer tag.

00:18:51.000 And most of that money, 90%, 10% goes to funding the auction and doing all the things that's required there.

00:18:59.000 90% of that $410,000 goes right to habitat restoration on the island, building water sources, enhancing those, relocating animals off that peninsula there because the genetics are so good,

00:19:15.000 the bucks are big.

00:19:17.000 And the sheep are big.

00:19:19.000 So they relocate those superior genetics throughout Utah.

00:19:22.000 So then you might not draw that tag or you might not have $410,000, but those genetics are spread throughout Utah.

00:19:28.000 So they're spread in areas where general hunters have the access to.

00:19:32.000 And it's all positive.

00:19:34.000 It's all positive for the state park.

00:19:37.000 And anti-hunters will say, well, if you really cared about the animals, you just do the $410,000 and not go hunting.

00:19:45.000 Well, it's true.

00:19:47.000 Why doesn't an anti-hunter do that?

00:19:49.000 Well, here's a part of the problem.

00:19:52.000 There's a bunch of problems with all these discussions, and a big part of it is that the people that are arguing against the hunting, they don't regularly go into the wild, into these habitats, into these environments, and see how brutally hard they are for these animals to survive anyway.

00:20:10.000 It's not like, if you kill a buck, and that buck lived to be five years old, You might be taking a year off its life.

00:20:18.000 That's it.

00:20:19.000 Maybe.

00:20:20.000 There's no hundred-year-old deer out there that'll live a long, great life.

00:20:26.000 And this is the idea.

00:20:27.000 One of the parts of hunting that actually aids in conservation is when you get a mature buck and you harvest that mature buck...

00:20:35.000 You're allowing the younger deer to breed where they might not have gotten the opportunity.

00:20:40.000 And you're also, in a lot of cases, saving their lives because they get killed in fights with older deer.

00:20:46.000 Like a lot of deer die from fights.

00:20:48.000 People find them all the time.

00:20:50.000 They literally stab each other to death.

00:20:52.000 They don't have those antlers to look cool.

00:20:54.000 No.

00:20:54.000 They don't have those antlers.

00:20:55.000 They slam into each other.

00:20:57.000 That's what they do.

00:20:57.000 Same with elk.

00:20:58.000 Yeah, same with elk. 0.99

00:20:59.000 I mean, when you and I were in Colorado, it was one of the coolest fucking things we saw. 0.81

00:21:03.000 Remember when we went down near that little creek area, there was a huge herd of 20 elk together, and those elk were duking it out and slamming it into each other? 0.97

00:21:12.000 Oh, it's amazing!

00:21:14.000 Well...

00:21:15.000 Here's another thing that I don't think anti-hunters realize.

00:21:18.000 You know, you go out for an extended period, and the killing, the actual killing, is such a small part of the hunt.

00:21:25.000 You know, I mean, it's those experiences.

00:21:27.000 Like, when we saw those bulls fighting, and we saw, I think there were seven bulls, and there was one nice bull, a 350-class bull.

00:21:34.000 He was a herd bull.

00:21:34.000 But there's satellite bulls spread throughout.

00:21:37.000 He kept them pushed out.

00:21:39.000 And they were jostling around.

00:21:41.000 And we were there.

00:21:41.000 We didn't kill anything.

00:21:43.000 But the experience of that night was one I'll never forget.

00:21:47.000 We had a bull sneak in behind us to 15 yards.

00:21:51.000 And a nice bull. 1.00

00:21:52.000 A bull that would have been a great bull for you to kill. 0.99

00:21:54.000 And it didn't happen.

00:21:55.000 But it was just like the adrenaline of that experience.

00:21:59.000 I mean...

00:21:59.000 He was right there behind the bush.

00:22:01.000 I mean, right there.

00:22:02.000 He was so close.

00:22:03.000 Screaming.

00:22:04.000 But nothing died.

00:22:06.000 No.

00:22:06.000 But we were predators.

00:22:08.000 We were predators.

00:22:09.000 They were prey.

00:22:10.000 And that's...

00:22:12.000 That's life.

00:22:12.000 That's life in the mountains, right?

00:22:14.000 That's how it works.

00:22:15.000 Even if we didn't have a bow, even if we weren't there to kill anything, if we just had calls, if we were just calling them in, it would have been an amazing experience.

00:22:23.000 Because when you were there with essentially as wild an animal as you're ever going to get, I mean, a North American elk is a 1,000 pound, gigantic, wild animal with a tree grown out of its head, and it's living the way it's lived for thousands of years.

00:22:40.000 And you, you know, you as a person who lives in Oregon, and me as a person who lives in California, we travel onto their land, we hike in to where they're at, and we experience this wild existence that they live in.

00:22:53.000 And we don't want to stop that.

00:22:54.000 We're not trying to kill them off.

00:22:56.000 We want more of them. 1.00

00:22:57.000 And this is the idea of killing a mature one. 0.96

00:23:00.000 You want to take out an animal that does not have much time left, and you help the rest of the animal survive because of that.

00:23:10.000 You make it so that the younger bulls have a chance to thrive and breed.

00:23:14.000 Otherwise, they're pushed out.

00:23:15.000 Yeah, they're pushed out.

00:23:16.000 And they're not doing anything.

00:23:17.000 But I will say one thing.

00:23:19.000 So you said...

00:23:20.000 Even if we wouldn't have had weapons, it would still have been amazing.

00:23:23.000 But to me, it would have been different.

00:23:26.000 Yes.

00:23:26.000 It would have been different because if I'm just an observer, internally, I feel a lot different.

00:23:32.000 I feel like I'm a predator when I have a weapon.

00:23:36.000 So I don't know if I would have worked as hard, if I would have cared as much, if we were just...

00:23:43.000 You know what I mean?

00:23:44.000 Because if you remember that, we snuck down, we were sneaking, or I mean, we were on our butts, kind of scooting down, and the two bulls were jostling around right there, kind of sparring a little bit, and we had a small window through the brush, and I was like, you were right here, and I was looking at him like,

00:24:00.000 I said, Can you see that window?

00:24:02.000 Do you see that window where you can get that arrow through?

00:24:04.000 And it was just that and the intensity of that moment.

00:24:08.000 So you're a predator.

00:24:09.000 That's your prey.

00:24:10.000 How can you ethically kill it?

00:24:12.000 That's where all it comes down to.

00:24:14.000 I mean, that's why we're there.

00:24:16.000 To me, that's everything.

00:24:17.000 You know, it's just that crunch time moment. 0.91

00:24:19.000 Well, this is one of the most ridiculous things that you see when I look at your Instagram or even my Instagram. 0.82

00:24:24.000 I rarely post a picture of a dead animal just because of that. 0.99

00:24:28.000 I'll post fish all day long and nobody gives a shit. 0.99

00:24:31.000 Nobody gives a fuck about fish. 0.99

00:24:33.000 It's hilarious. 0.81

00:24:33.000 It's hilarious, the hierarchy. 0.81

00:24:36.000 Well, fish, they're not alive, are they?

00:24:38.000 I hear they are.

00:24:39.000 I believe they are. 1.00

00:24:40.000 But if you post a picture of an elk or, God forbid, a bear, people lose their fucking minds. 0.99

00:24:46.000 And one of the things that people love to say, as if it's an original thought, it's one of those things that... 0.99

00:24:50.000 It's usually not.

00:24:51.000 They usually say, yeah, you're such a big man.

00:24:54.000 How about you do that without a weapon?

00:24:55.000 I love that.

00:24:57.000 Without a...

00:24:57.000 What hunter has ever killed anything in the history of man...

00:25:01.000 We're still men, right? 1.00

00:25:03.000 That's why hunters are shit. 1.00

00:25:04.000 Tell me a hunter, even a caveman, that ever killed without a weapon of some sort. 1.00

00:25:10.000 What are they talking about?

00:25:11.000 They're not talking about anything.

00:25:13.000 They're just talking.

00:25:14.000 They're just trying to demean you. 0.99

00:25:15.000 And I go to their fucking page and one of them, this guy was feeding his animals meat. 1.00

00:25:21.000 And I'm like, did that shit come from a meat tree? 1.00

00:25:23.000 He's like, this guy was shitting all over you. 1.00

00:25:26.000 And then I go to his page and he's got dogs! 0.99

00:25:28.000 He's got dogs and he's feeding them meat! 0.99

00:25:30.000 I'm like, oh man, there's some fucking convenient thinking going on here. 0.99

00:25:34.000 It's so strange how many people have these convenient patterns of thought where they're self-righteous, they take the moral high ground. 0.98

00:25:41.000 Now look, the only person that has any say, the only person that has a leg to stand on is a person who's a vegan, who doesn't eat any animal products.

00:25:49.000 Any animal products, okay?

00:25:50.000 That's a small percentage of the population, but if they want to criticize it, and they have an argument, they have a very small leg to stand on.

00:25:58.000 Now, when you have a conversation with them, that's when that argument kind of falls apart.

00:26:03.000 It does.

00:26:03.000 Because, okay, if they're hardcore vegan, fine.

00:26:06.000 But are they growing their own vegetables?

00:26:09.000 Very few.

00:26:10.000 Because if they're not, they still are responsible for animals dying.

00:26:13.000 If you've ever driven by...

00:26:16.000 If you've ever been into farmland and, say, where a field's been harvested...

00:26:23.000 Once the field's harvested, you'll notice buzzards flying around that field.

00:26:27.000 Do you know why?

00:26:28.000 Because there's a bunch of dead animals out there.

00:26:30.000 There's rabbits that were killed during the harvest.

00:26:32.000 There's mice.

00:26:33.000 There's also...

00:26:34.000 Fawns.

00:26:36.000 Birds.

00:26:37.000 Big problem with deer.

00:26:38.000 Grouse.

00:26:39.000 Whatever.

00:26:39.000 I mean, those, you know, the combines or whatever they're using out there is just tearing everything up.

00:26:45.000 And animals are dying.

00:26:46.000 So you can...

00:26:47.000 Unless you're growing your own vegetables, unless you're a do-it-yourself vegan...

00:26:52.000 You're responsible for animals dying.

00:26:54.000 If your house isn't made of wood, because if it's made of wood, there's timber harvested, and when that timber was harvested, animals die.

00:27:00.000 So, I mean...

00:27:01.000 Well, also, their habitat's displaced.

00:27:02.000 Right.

00:27:03.000 So, I mean, people...

00:27:04.000 Well, I think with their ideas, they want to do the least harm possible.

00:27:08.000 Okay.

00:27:08.000 But a lot of them already came from a background where they eat meat.

00:27:13.000 Like, I had this one guy who was fucking arguing with me. 0.99

00:27:15.000 Well, he didn't argue with me. 0.99

00:27:16.000 He was giving me all this grief.

00:27:17.000 And then he admits that he was a meat-eater just seven months ago.

00:27:21.000 Right.

00:27:21.000 He's been a vegan for seven months.

00:27:22.000 He's fucking 40! 1.00

00:27:25.000 So for 39 years and three months, this motherfucker... 1.00

00:27:29.000 Five months. 1.00

00:27:30.000 Whatever it was.

00:27:31.000 How bad is my math?

00:27:33.000 So this guy, for all these...

00:27:35.000 You were very quick, though.

00:27:36.000 Your math is very quick.

00:27:37.000 But my point is... 0.99

00:27:39.000 For a brain dead hunter. 0.99

00:27:40.000 Come on, man. 0.77

00:27:41.000 You can't say that. 1.00

00:27:41.000 Seven months ago, you were a fucking vegan and you were a meat eater and you were shitting all over these people. 1.00

00:27:47.000 But it's a moral high ground. 1.00

00:27:49.000 It is.

00:27:50.000 They elevate themselves.

00:27:52.000 They're above us because we're redneck hunters, right?

00:27:55.000 Same thing.

00:27:56.000 I had this kid.

00:27:57.000 He looked like he was maybe younger, 20s, but he's very passionate about his stance on what's right and what's wrong.

00:28:05.000 And so I went to his page, same as you.

00:28:07.000 I see a bunch of hot dogs on the grill.

00:28:09.000 And I was like, dude, enjoy those hot dogs, but before you judge me or condemn me, why don't you live a little?

00:28:16.000 You're 20 years old. 0.83

00:28:17.000 What the hell do you know about anything?

00:28:20.000 And all of a sudden, you know what's right and wrong, and he's like, he says, I'm going to have to answer for this, or karma, or some crazy thing.

00:28:27.000 I'm like, what do you know?

00:28:29.000 You haven't even lived yet.

00:28:30.000 Well, not only that, hot dogs are probably the worst.

00:28:34.000 This is one of the worst. 1.00

00:28:35.000 I mean, that is ground assholes and cow dicks. 1.00

00:28:39.000 It's probably one of the worst things you can fucking eat, too. 1.00

00:28:41.000 Filled with nitrites and nitrates and whatever's bad for you. 0.99

00:28:46.000 I understand that they're trying to work it out for themselves.

00:28:49.000 And working it out for themselves, a lot of times people want to condemn people that are living a lifestyle that's outside of theirs.

00:28:54.000 They decide, hey, I'm going to live this small carbon footprint lifestyle where I'm going to be humane and I'm ethical and I'm going to be cruelty-free, hashtag cruelty-free, and I'm going to go on.

00:29:04.000 It's like hashtag cruelty-free.

00:29:06.000 It's like they want to tell you.

00:29:07.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:29:08.000 Half of them have fucking vegan in their names, which is hilarious. 1.00

00:29:12.000 Vegan this, vegan that, healthy happy, vegan fucking, vegan flower child. 1.00

00:29:17.000 But it's a part of their name. 0.99

00:29:20.000 It's a big part of their identity.

00:29:22.000 And it becomes like a cult. 0.99

00:29:25.000 And I don't mean it like, you know, you have to fucking initiation and pay dues. 0.99

00:29:28.000 But I mean, it's like you're a part of a gang. 0.97

00:29:30.000 And people have a tendency to do that, good or bad.

00:29:33.000 They have a tendency.

00:29:34.000 Hunters have a tendency to do it. 0.98

00:29:35.000 People who fucking use Windows have a tendency to do it. 0.99

00:29:38.000 I don't like Apple. 1.00

00:29:39.000 I like fucking Windows. 1.00

00:29:40.000 And if you use Apple, you're a piece of shit. 1.00

00:29:42.000 Well, but hunters don't have the hate that these anti-hunting vegans have. 1.00

00:29:47.000 They don't...

00:29:47.000 I mean, hunters don't go to their pages and...

00:29:50.000 And shit on them for eating vegetables? 0.99

00:29:51.000 No. 1.00

00:29:52.000 Who cares?

00:29:53.000 Live your life.

00:29:54.000 Yeah.

00:29:54.000 Well, I get where their thought process starts.

00:29:58.000 They think they're doing the right thing, I believe.

00:29:59.000 They think they're doing the right thing, yes.

00:30:01.000 And there's a lot...

00:30:02.000 This is another thing I want to point out.

00:30:03.000 And I went on this Twitter page discussion the other day.

00:30:08.000 I went on this rant.

00:30:09.000 I don't hate vegans.

00:30:10.000 I have vegans that are friends.

00:30:12.000 And I know I'm not lumping everybody in. 1.00

00:30:15.000 There's a small percentage of people that are assholes, that are arrogant and outspoken and really aggressive and mean and shitty. 1.00

00:30:23.000 And where's the cruelty-free there? 1.00

00:30:25.000 Why are you being cruel to other people that are living?

00:30:28.000 Look around the world.

00:30:29.000 Go outside and drive for 20 minutes, and I guarantee you, you're gonna pass 30, 40 places that have dead animals in them. 1.00

00:30:37.000 Every fucking supermarket you pass by, every fast food place, every restaurant, every gas station that has Slim Jims at the fucking counter, all of that is animals. 0.98

00:30:46.000 So for you to find a hunter, the one person that you could point to that probably kills animals in the most ethical and humane way possible, And contributes. 1.00

00:30:55.000 In the wild.

00:30:56.000 And contributes.

00:30:56.000 And pays money to play part of the conservation role.

00:31:00.000 And people will hear these podcasts, all you fucking guys do is justify what you do. 0.99

00:31:04.000 If you have to justify it, maybe there's something wrong. 0.99

00:31:06.000 No.

00:31:07.000 The arguments are tiresome.

00:31:09.000 There's a guy that's coming on next week.

00:31:11.000 His name is, how do you say his name?

00:31:12.000 Tovar?

00:31:13.000 Tovar.

00:31:13.000 Cerulli?

00:31:14.000 Tovar Cerulli?

00:31:16.000 Cerulli.

00:31:16.000 He's an author and a guy who used to be a vegan who's not a hunter.

00:31:20.000 And panties will be bunched. 0.74

00:31:23.000 They will get sandy and tweets will be tweeted.

00:31:27.000 It's gonna get crazy.

00:31:29.000 I just think that podcasts like this and conversations like this with a guy like you, like I think what you do is the best way to do it.

00:31:37.000 I mean I've said this time and time again. 0.90

00:31:39.000 What you do is the best way to do it because what you're doing, first of all, it's the most difficult way to do it and you prepare your body for it in a very fucking grueling fashion. 0.99

00:31:46.000 We worked out before we got here and you work out every day and one of the reasons why you work out every day is fucking going through the mountains is hard as shit. 0.99

00:31:54.000 It is. 0.99

00:31:54.000 It is hard, man. 0.99

00:31:55.000 Yeah.

00:31:56.000 I never knew.

00:31:57.000 Until I went with Ronella, the first time we went up to the Missouri Breaks, we were climbing the mountains for seven hours a day.

00:32:02.000 I was like, oh, okay.

00:32:04.000 This is not going to the gym and getting on the elliptical machine. 0.96

00:32:08.000 This is fucking constant, and it's all day. 0.99

00:32:10.000 And if you're packing shit, you have to be strong. 1.00

00:32:12.000 You have to be physically strong. 1.00

00:32:14.000 You do.

00:32:14.000 I mean, and you remember in Colorado when we were huffing it up that ridge, you know, we were at the bottom of the canyon, heard a bull bugling, is the bull you killed?

00:32:21.000 Yeah. 0.99

00:32:22.000 This dude takes off like a fucking mountain goat. 1.00

00:32:24.000 I'm in pretty goddamn good shape. 1.00

00:32:26.000 And I'm like... 0.83

00:32:27.000 And he's like... 0.99

00:32:29.000 He's not even breathing as fuck. 0.99

00:32:31.000 He gets to the top of the mountain. 0.99

00:32:32.000 That's how you saw the bull.

00:32:33.000 It's at the top of the mountain.

00:32:35.000 You spotted it.

00:32:35.000 Well, the sun was going down.

00:32:37.000 We had a lot of elements going.

00:32:38.000 I could tell the bull was a good bull just by his bugle.

00:32:42.000 And we'd been huffing it down there, trying to get on a bull that was bugling.

00:32:46.000 We never could get eyes on him.

00:32:47.000 But then I heard what sounded like a mature bull.

00:32:50.000 And then the sun going down.

00:32:52.000 And that's why you train.

00:32:53.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:32:54.000 That's the exact situation.

00:32:55.000 You're coming out of a hole.

00:32:57.000 You're climbing 9,000 feet.

00:32:59.000 The air's thin there.

00:33:00.000 And it's a race against time, essentially.

00:33:03.000 But, I mean, we made it work.

00:33:04.000 Yeah.

00:33:05.000 You are able to close the distance in a much more efficient way because of all your training.

00:33:10.000 And that was a good example.

00:33:12.000 Another good example of it was the pack-out. 0.99

00:33:14.000 I mean, we're packing out a lot of fucking weight, man. 0.99

00:33:17.000 Yeah, right. 1.00

00:33:17.000 This asshole has two fucking elk quarters in his backpack. 1.00

00:33:21.000 So it's like... 1.00

00:33:23.000 180 pounds?

00:33:24.000 I mean, how much is that?

00:33:25.000 Heavy.

00:33:25.000 I don't know.

00:33:26.000 Heavy as shit. 0.99

00:33:26.000 You basically have me on your back, and you're walking a mile with this, you know? 0.99

00:33:30.000 And there's one.

00:33:32.000 There's a photo.

00:33:33.000 I'm sure I have some photos of us from this very trip that we're talking about.

00:33:37.000 We're packing these things out.

00:33:38.000 But the point is, what you're doing to acquire, when you have an elk steak, and you sit down with this, and I had this conversation with Remy Warren about it, where he's like, it's almost like a religious experience.

00:33:48.000 He's like, this is a precious piece of meat.

00:33:50.000 I've gone into the wilderness.

00:33:51.000 Invested.

00:33:52.000 I've harvested this animal and I have a precious piece of meat.

00:33:55.000 He goes, and I treat it almost like a baby.

00:33:57.000 He goes, I season this and I cook it perfectly.

00:34:00.000 And he has this intensely intimate connection.

00:34:04.000 And I do with the animal that we killed.

00:34:06.000 That animal that you and I killed, when I eat that thing, I think of our time together.

00:34:11.000 I think of how difficult the hunt is.

00:34:13.000 I think of how crazy the environment is.

00:34:16.000 How beautiful the experience is.

00:34:18.000 There's so much more to it than going to a store and buying a squash.

00:34:22.000 Right.

00:34:22.000 You know, and this is what people need to understand.

00:34:25.000 Or even buying a steak.

00:34:25.000 Well, buying a steak, sure, but even a vegan or a vegetarian, but your vegetables, you're disconnected from these vegetables for the most part.

00:34:34.000 Most people are.

00:34:35.000 Yeah.

00:34:37.000 With the food that you eat, even if you grow it yourself.

00:34:40.000 Like, my wife gardens, and I do as well, and she does it more than I do, but we'll have salad from something that we grew in our garden, and it's awesome, man.

00:34:48.000 Right.

00:34:48.000 It's awesome.

00:34:49.000 Like, we're chopping tomatoes that we planted as seeds, and we fertilized the ground, and we watered it, and it came up, and we picked the tomato, and now we're slicing into it.

00:34:58.000 Right.

00:34:58.000 It's amazing.

00:34:59.000 The whole process.

00:35:00.000 And that's where the hunt, that's where the hunt, where the training and the preparation And the reverence for the animal and the harvest of the animal and the care of the meat.

00:35:09.000 And you get it to your house and you put it in your freezer and then you thawed.

00:35:12.000 That whole process is right.

00:35:15.000 I'll agree with Remy.

00:35:16.000 There is reverence to it.

00:35:17.000 And it means so much.

00:35:20.000 And for a hunter, I think just being a provider and just being, like I always say, self-sufficient and doing it is hard.

00:35:30.000 It's a lot easier to go to the store and say, hey, here's some of my money.

00:35:34.000 Can I have that meat?

00:35:35.000 Thank you.

00:35:35.000 Somebody else did all that.

00:35:37.000 All the stuff we just talked about, somebody else did that with no reverence.

00:35:40.000 And I'm eating it with no reverence.

00:35:42.000 So to do it on your own is...

00:35:46.000 I mean, it's...

00:35:48.000 It's what I prepare for every day, and it just means so much.

00:35:55.000 Well, it's enriching in a very strange way that I never experienced in my life until I started hunting.

00:36:02.000 I'd never had this kind of connection with my food, except for maybe going fishing.

00:36:06.000 You know, this last summer, I took my kids to Hawaii and my kids love fishing.

00:36:12.000 My little girls love it.

00:36:13.000 It's fun because, you know, they can put a line in the water and when they catch something and then we're cooking it and eating it later, they're like, we caught this!

00:36:21.000 And they keep saying, like, mommy, we caught this fish that you're eating.

00:36:24.000 Like, there's like a primal connection to this thing.

00:36:28.000 But other than that, I had never experienced this sort of primal connection to your food.

00:36:36.000 All, you know, nonsense aside, like, there's a difference between a fish and a mammal.

00:36:43.000 There just is.

00:36:43.000 And there's a big difference between the reverence that you have for, in my opinion, the most majestic of animals that you hunt, which is elk.

00:36:51.000 I think it's the most majestic.

00:36:53.000 They're mythical creatures, man. 0.65

00:36:55.000 They're crazy.

00:36:56.000 Sheep are up there, you know, where they live and the regalness.

00:37:01.000 But elk is a...

00:37:03.000 Just because they're so iconic throughout the West.

00:37:06.000 A big bull elk is just what, you know, when you envision the West, you envision mountains, you think of a big bull elk.

00:37:13.000 And then you say, I'm going to hunt this with my bow.

00:37:17.000 It's intense. 0.98

00:37:18.000 It's fucking hard to do, too. 1.00

00:37:19.000 And goddamn, you forget me addicted to this shit. 1.00

00:37:22.000 It's a real problem. 1.00

00:37:23.000 I'll text him every now and then.

00:37:24.000 Like, I'm in the middle of doing something.

00:37:25.000 I'm like, I wish I was bow hunting.

00:37:26.000 I swear to God.

00:37:27.000 This is boring.

00:37:28.000 I'd rather even just shoot, we shot at a rubber target today.

00:37:31.000 It was awesome.

00:37:32.000 I have a rubber elk that sits up on my hill, and we did a little FaceTime video where we were out there doing it, but just shooting at that rubber elk is cool.

00:37:40.000 That's what I would say.

00:37:41.000 You can take anybody.

00:37:43.000 You can take the coolest person you know.

00:37:45.000 Just sit here and think, who's the coolest person I know, or who's the coolest girl I know?

00:37:51.000 You take that person, you put a bow in their hand, and you get them shooting a bow, they're cooler.

00:37:58.000 I mean, shooting a bow makes you more of a badass.

00:38:01.000 I prefer girls that don't like to hunt. 1.00

00:38:04.000 That way they don't want to come with me.

00:38:05.000 No, I don't want them to hunt.

00:38:06.000 They don't complain while they're up there.

00:38:08.000 I don't want them to hunt.

00:38:09.000 I just want them to shoot a bow. 1.00

00:38:10.000 Don't screw up my hunt.

00:38:11.000 No, I'm kidding.

00:38:14.000 Sexism in hunting. 0.89

00:38:15.000 Does it exist?

00:38:16.000 It does.

00:38:17.000 Next on Oprah.

00:38:18.000 No, on Dr. Drew.

00:38:20.000 He would love that. 0.95

00:38:21.000 He would get me on there and just crucify me. 0.98

00:38:23.000 And he would get a bunch of girls who don't know anything about hunting to yell at you. 1.00

00:38:26.000 Like they did.

00:38:27.000 A lot of big opinions. 0.99

00:38:28.000 When we got back from Brazil, it was right when this whole Cecil the Lion shit was going down. 0.98

00:38:34.000 And these people wanted to have a hunter on to yell at, essentially. 0.98

00:38:38.000 And I was telling you, don't do it.

00:38:40.000 And the first time you didn't do it, I got you to leave.

00:38:43.000 I was in the green room.

00:38:44.000 I was.

00:38:45.000 I was in the green room and getting ready for hair and makeup.

00:38:50.000 And it just like wasn't feeling good.

00:38:53.000 Yeah, I'm glad you talked to me.

00:38:55.000 Right.

00:38:55.000 I'm glad we had a conversation.

00:38:56.000 So I left, but then I did go on.

00:38:58.000 Yes, you did go on later.

00:38:59.000 But it was after the smoke had settled.

00:39:01.000 A little bit.

00:39:02.000 And you went on with a conversation about ethical acquisition of meat.

00:39:07.000 And, you know, Dr. Drew eats meat.

00:39:09.000 A lot of those people on that show eat meat.

00:39:12.000 It's just bizarre.

00:39:14.000 It's a bizarre conversation.

00:39:15.000 It's bizarre.

00:39:16.000 I mean, that show, whatever.

00:39:18.000 The show is around because of controversy. 0.97

00:39:21.000 Well, one of the fucking hilarious things in the show was the woman who was saying that the reason why there's not so many grizzlies is because we've killed off all their predators. 0.97

00:39:28.000 That's right. 0.98

00:39:30.000 Which means dinosaurs, by the way.

00:39:33.000 Yeah, saber-toothed tigers. 0.99

00:39:34.000 What the fuck eats a grizzly?! 1.00

00:39:35.000 Jesus Christ, have you ever seen a grizzly lady? 1.00

00:39:38.000 Yeah.

00:39:38.000 There's nothing eating them.

00:39:40.000 Except other grizzlies.

00:39:41.000 They're pretty much the top of the food chain.

00:39:43.000 Yeah.

00:39:43.000 And, I mean, well, we are, but they're not really on the same page that we think we are, they think they are, so there's a little bit of a conflict there.

00:39:51.000 There's a huge conflict.

00:39:52.000 I mean, essentially it's like two different kingdoms.

00:39:55.000 Yeah.

00:39:55.000 They're on the top of the food chain in the wild kingdom.

00:39:57.000 We can get them in their world, but we gotta get the fuck out as quick as we can. 0.99

00:40:02.000 Yeah. 0.98

00:40:02.000 We can only exist in their world for a couple weeks at the most. 0.98

00:40:05.000 Yeah.

00:40:05.000 And then we're like, okay, we got to get back to an actual bed.

00:40:08.000 Yeah.

00:40:08.000 And I need to take some vitamins.

00:40:10.000 Right.

00:40:11.000 No, it's...

00:40:12.000 I don't know.

00:40:13.000 It's...

00:40:14.000 Well, according to the woman from... 0.98

00:40:18.000 Goddamn it, my brain is foggy today after working out. 0.97

00:40:20.000 What's her name from Life Below Zero? 0.98

00:40:23.000 Sue Akins.

00:40:24.000 Sue Akins said that she saw a bunch of wolves run down a young grizzly and kill it.

00:40:30.000 Oh, okay.

00:40:31.000 She said a young grizzly was coming out of its den, and when they come out of their den, they're kind of weak, and these wolves knew it.

00:40:37.000 So they chased after it, and they were biting its legs, and they're chasing down. 0.96

00:40:40.000 And it happened like a fucking hundred yards from her house. 0.96

00:40:43.000 A hundred yards from her house. 0.97

00:40:44.000 It's not like she lives in L.A. here, right?

00:40:46.000 No.

00:40:47.000 This lady is so badass. 1.00

00:40:49.000 Yeah, she's intense. 0.97

00:40:50.000 She is the most gangster woman on the planet. 1.00

00:40:52.000 She really is. 0.97

00:40:53.000 I have massive respect for her.

00:40:56.000 Yeah.

00:40:57.000 She's just so cool, too.

00:40:58.000 She came in, and it's not like she's some weird loner who hates people.

00:41:03.000 She loves people, but she prefers to live in one of the harshest climates on the planet, 200 miles above the Arctic Circle.

00:41:11.000 That's awesome.

00:41:11.000 She's so badass.

00:41:13.000 You know how much tougher she is than probably 99% of the men that live here in LA? She's tougher than me, I'll tell you that.

00:41:18.000 This is what this lady did. 1.00

00:41:19.000 She got attacked by a bear.

00:41:21.000 The bear tore her apart, okay?

00:41:22.000 Broke her leg, broke her hip, cracked her skull.

00:41:25.000 She had to crawl back to her house. 0.98

00:41:28.000 The bear was just fucking her up because she was in its territory. 0.97

00:41:31.000 This bear mauled her, right? 0.98

00:41:32.000 She lived.

00:41:33.000 She managed to live.

00:41:34.000 She got back to her house.

00:41:35.000 She was stuck for days.

00:41:37.000 She couldn't walk.

00:41:38.000 Her leg was broken.

00:41:38.000 She was stuck.

00:41:39.000 She couldn't get to the phone, okay?

00:41:41.000 She couldn't lift herself up.

00:41:42.000 She had to wait for someone to find her.

00:41:44.000 So these people found her.

00:41:45.000 I think it was seven days later.

00:41:47.000 She got healed up, went back, shot that bear, and ate it.

00:41:51.000 There you go. 1.00

00:41:52.000 That bitch is so gangster. 1.00

00:41:53.000 I say bitch with all due respect. 1.00

00:41:55.000 That is amazing. 1.00

00:41:56.000 She's so gangster. 0.92

00:41:58.000 Well, let me expand on something before I get people hating me for... 0.80

00:42:03.000 Women bowhunters. 1.00

00:42:05.000 I love you.

00:42:08.000 We're joking around, folks.

00:42:09.000 We are a little bit.

00:42:10.000 I love that women hunt. 1.00

00:42:11.000 I love that everybody hunt.

00:42:12.000 I do, too.

00:42:12.000 I'm taking Dana Lesh.

00:42:15.000 Bow hunting for bear this year.

00:42:19.000 Me and Eva have been talking about getting together for a hunt, so just all joking around.

00:42:24.000 I do just like people shooting bows.

00:42:27.000 Yes.

00:42:29.000 If you can envision this, if Obama shot a bow, I'd probably think he was cooler.

00:42:33.000 And that is amazing.

00:42:36.000 That is amazing.

00:42:37.000 Eva Shockey, you should say who Eva is too, by the way.

00:42:39.000 She's the daughter of Jim Shockey, who's been on the show, who's an amazing, fascinating guy, who has a show, even if you don't like hunting, there's an amazing show called Uncharted.

00:42:48.000 And it's barely about hunting.

00:42:51.000 It's really about different cultures.

00:42:52.000 Yeah.

00:42:53.000 And this guy goes to all these...

00:42:55.000 This guy, Jim Shockey, is as cool and interesting as it gets.

00:42:59.000 He is just a fascinating, fascinating guy.

00:43:01.000 He is.

00:43:01.000 And he travels to these remote places in the middle of Russia, and he went to Afghanistan, and he went to Africa to this remote village that has a massive problem with crocodiles.

00:43:15.000 And it was an incredible show.

00:43:16.000 It's an hour-long show.

00:43:18.000 I mean, it could be on the Discovery Channel...

00:43:20.000 It could be on HBO. It could be on anything.

00:43:23.000 It just so happens, it's on...

00:43:25.000 Is it on the Outdoorsman's channel?

00:43:27.000 Outdoor Channel.

00:43:28.000 Outdoor Channel.

00:43:30.000 And this guy goes to this place, and you're seeing these people, like half the people in the village have been mauled.

00:43:35.000 I mean, people are missing arms, they're missing legs, their faces have been cut open because they're getting killed by crocodiles left and right.

00:43:41.000 And while he was there filming, a woman got taken by a crocodile.

00:43:45.000 They've set up these sort of rudimentary fences that they've put in place to keep the crocodiles out of this area where these people gather water.

00:43:54.000 And he's there with these other hunters where they're trying to take out...

00:43:59.000 Once a crocodile apparently starts eating people, you've got to kill it.

00:44:04.000 They've got a taste for it.

00:44:05.000 Well, they got a taste for it, and they realize how easy it is.

00:44:07.000 Yeah. 0.98

00:44:07.000 Like, a wildebeest can fuck up a crocodile a little bit. 0.98

00:44:10.000 You know, you can throw a kick at it and break its jaw. 0.97

00:44:12.000 I mean, a crocodile is an incredibly tough and durable animal, but a wildebeest is a tough scrap.

00:44:18.000 It's a big animal.

00:44:19.000 You gotta work for that.

00:44:24.000 It might not work out.

00:44:25.000 A person?

00:44:25.000 God, man, we're made out of jello.

00:44:27.000 We're jello and popsicle sticks.

00:44:28.000 Nothing.

00:44:29.000 Well, and I hunted crocodile.

00:44:31.000 Did you really?

00:44:31.000 I mean, they are...

00:44:33.000 They're tough.

00:44:34.000 Where'd you hunt crocodile?

00:44:35.000 In Africa. 0.56

00:44:36.000 Whoa! 0.71

00:44:36.000 Yeah, in Tanzania. 0.71

00:44:37.000 I wanted to kill one. 0.99

00:44:39.000 And so to get within bow range, you have to build a blind. 0.99

00:44:43.000 And they come up, you know, their eyes are just above the water.

00:44:46.000 And for a bow, they have like two bumps.

00:44:49.000 They got a bump above their eye, then one back here.

00:44:51.000 You have to be like right below that or right in between.

00:44:53.000 You're shooting at about a 50 cent piece size.

00:44:55.000 You have to brain them.

00:44:57.000 Because if you hit them in the lungs, they're in the water and then they sink. 0.93

00:45:00.000 You don't get them. 0.99

00:45:01.000 So if you're going to hunt a crocodile with a bow, it has to be brain shot, drop them.

00:45:06.000 So to do that, you have to get them up off the shore, right?

00:45:10.000 Could never happen.

00:45:11.000 Built a blind, had the bait up.

00:45:13.000 It was just, like, so hard to do that.

00:45:16.000 But one of the guys I was with killed one with a rifle, and we ate it, and the meat is amazing.

00:45:22.000 Well, it's supposed to be the highest protein meat you can get.

00:45:25.000 Like, alligator and crocodile are supposed to be, like, ounce per ounce.

00:45:29.000 One of the highest in protein content.

00:45:31.000 Right.

00:45:31.000 Amazing.

00:45:32.000 I mean, it was so good, too.

00:45:34.000 But, yeah, they are...

00:45:36.000 They're smart.

00:45:37.000 They're tough.

00:45:38.000 I don't think they're smart. 1.00

00:45:39.000 I think they're stupid as fuck. 1.00

00:45:40.000 Well, try to kill them. 1.00

00:45:42.000 I just think they know how to not get killed. 1.00

00:45:44.000 They have a couple calculations they make in their brain.

00:45:47.000 Is that a person? 1.00

00:45:48.000 Yeah, fuck this dude. 1.00

00:45:48.000 I'm in the water. 1.00

00:45:49.000 Okay, their brain is very small.

00:45:51.000 I'll give you that because it's a small target.

00:45:53.000 But if you're trying to hunt them, you're going to think they're smart.

00:45:56.000 If you're going to do a crossword puzzle with them, probably not that smart.

00:46:00.000 They're fascinating though, man.

00:46:01.000 I want to give a shout out not only to Jim Shockey because he is the ultimate savage.

00:46:07.000 Love Jim and love Eva, but their son, Branlon.

00:46:12.000 Yeah, Branlon is the mastermind behind the shooting of that show.

00:46:15.000 Right.

00:46:15.000 As far as filming and the production value and what you see on TV, that's Branlon Shockey.

00:46:21.000 Amazing.

00:46:22.000 I think he could film the best Hollywood film Movie you've ever seen.

00:46:30.000 He could do that.

00:46:30.000 He has that talent and right now he's doing it on the Outdoor Channel So that's if nothing else go and watch his work Yeah on the on that show and the new show Uncharted Uncharted which is amazing in the new show Carter's war with Carter's war is all about this guy who's combating against poaching in Africa and And it's all about stopping poachers from killing rhinos and elephants and all these different animals that they're killing in Africa.

00:46:55.000 And so it's like not really a hunting show as much as it's just a pure conservation show about a guy who's trying to stop poaching in Africa.

00:47:03.000 And it's amazing and gritty and incredibly well documented and shot and just...

00:47:09.000 Man, the world of Africa, if you want to watch a documentary, and I've mentioned this before to people, so I'm sorry if you've heard it before, but our friend Louis Theroux, who's been on the show before, who's an amazing documentary guy, documentarian from the UK,

00:47:25.000 did a show on these hunting ranches in Africa, which is very different from what you did in Africa.

00:47:32.000 What you did in Africa, you went to the actual wild of Africa, not a high fence operation.

00:47:37.000 But these hunting ranches that they have set up in Africa, it's such a catch-22. 0.95

00:47:44.000 There's so much contradiction going on because on one hand, these animals are trapped in this...

00:47:49.000 It's usually enormous, like several thousand acre area.

00:47:52.000 It can be, yeah.

00:47:52.000 Where they're trapped in these areas and they're hunted.

00:47:55.000 And people call it a canned hunt.

00:47:57.000 And a lot of people have a lot of hate for it.

00:47:59.000 But on the other hand, the animals that they're hunting...

00:48:02.000 Have never been healthier in higher numbers, and a lot of them were on the verge of extinction until they started implementing these high-fence operations.

00:48:09.000 And it goes back to the same thing we were talking about.

00:48:11.000 The money for conservation, the real money that these people are getting in Africa, is coming from hunting.

00:48:16.000 That's what's paying for these animals to survive, because so many people are going over there to hunt.

00:48:21.000 And people say- Because the animals have value.

00:48:23.000 Exactly.

00:48:23.000 That's the key.

00:48:24.000 And that's a fucking weird concept for people. 0.99

00:48:27.000 If an animal doesn't have value, it's probably going to be extinct. 0.99

00:48:32.000 That's why hunters care, that's why conservationists care, because the animal is valuable.

00:48:38.000 Whether it's right, wrong, or indifferent, when there's value, people care.

00:48:42.000 And people have an understanding today that they didn't have this several hundred years ago.

00:48:47.000 Like when people look at the gigantic mounds of buffalo skulls, that's a perfect example why you need conservation.

00:48:53.000 You can't just have people run out and kill these animals that have value with no consequence or with no monitoring of the herd populations and health.

00:49:02.000 That's when you get these horrific mass extinction events like what happened with the buffalo.

00:49:09.000 And the buffalo were basically brought to the verge of extinction.

00:49:12.000 Now, they're in healthy populations to the point where you can actually, in some places, you can hunt wild ones.

00:49:17.000 And the same thing can be said of elk.

00:49:19.000 The Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation has done an amazing job of repopulating areas with elk where they were, at one point in time, completely eradicated.

00:49:27.000 Well, did you know that when you talk elk, deer, turkey...

00:49:31.000 When you talk, there's more of those species now than there's ever been.

00:49:36.000 Is that true with elk?

00:49:37.000 Because I know it is with whitetail deer.

00:49:39.000 There's more whitetail deer today than when Columbus landed.

00:49:42.000 But I don't know if that's the case with elk because there's more places where they don't exist.

00:49:47.000 I think like most of the area where, like Steve Rinella did a whole show on this recently, where most of the area where elk used to be, they're not.

00:49:55.000 But in the areas where they are, they're in healthy populations.

00:49:59.000 Well, Jamie, can you look this up?

00:50:02.000 Yeah, look this up.

00:50:03.000 Look it up about elk.

00:50:04.000 Elk populations.

00:50:05.000 Because I'm almost positive there's more now.

00:50:07.000 See, elk are...

00:50:09.000 And probably Rinello would know, so maybe you know if he's been on the show, but elk are, they're plains animals originally.

00:50:16.000 They're pushed into the mountains because the plains, that's where we live.

00:50:19.000 We live where there's water and in the valleys, that's where humans set up their cities and that's, you know, to get, use the rivers and we need water.

00:50:26.000 So they have been pushed and now they're mountain animals.

00:50:29.000 But now there's elk where there hasn't been elk before, Pennsylvania, Kentucky, you know, places like that.

00:50:36.000 So maybe they're Maybe there are more places than they've ever been, but I'm almost certain there's even more elk.

00:50:43.000 But whatever the case.

00:50:45.000 I don't even think there are more places than they've ever been.

00:50:47.000 I think it's the ones that are there are in healthier populations than they used to be.

00:50:52.000 But I think elk are a lot like buffalo in that at one point in time, like hundreds of years ago, they were just shooting the shit out of them.

00:50:59.000 They almost eradicated them.

00:51:01.000 Oh right, I know.

00:51:02.000 And now they're bounced back and they're healthy everywhere.

00:51:05.000 And where'd that money come from, Cameron Haynes?

00:51:08.000 I want to say hunters?

00:51:09.000 Yes.

00:51:09.000 Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.

00:51:11.000 They've done a fantastic job.

00:51:13.000 And they've been on the forefront of protecting habitat.

00:51:17.000 So I know they've been over 6 million acres protected.

00:51:19.000 I think maybe close to 7 million now or maybe even over.

00:51:22.000 I haven't kept track recently.

00:51:24.000 But that's 7 million acres that can never be used for anything else other than habitat for animals.

00:51:29.000 And that's not just elk.

00:51:30.000 That's deer too.

00:51:31.000 Elk numbers across six states.

00:51:33.000 So how are we looking there?

00:51:34.000 Yeah, see, this is across states, but I think maybe we could keep looking.

00:51:38.000 So it says, see that?

00:51:39.000 American elk populations dwindled to less than 100,000 by the early 1990s.

00:51:43.000 Wow.

00:51:44.000 That's insane.

00:51:45.000 And now, in 2009, grew to 1,031,000.

00:51:49.000 That's incredible.

00:51:50.000 So the 1990s?

00:51:53.000 That's insane.

00:51:54.000 It was down to 100,000 in the 1990s.

00:51:56.000 Wow, that's terrifying.

00:51:58.000 Like, that's the verge of extinction in our lifetime.

00:52:01.000 Not just in our lifetime, but when we were both men.

00:52:04.000 Yeah.

00:52:04.000 So, during that time...

00:52:06.000 Wait, no, that can't be right.

00:52:07.000 Is it?

00:52:08.000 No, the early 19...

00:52:10.000 No, that's got to be 1890s.

00:52:11.000 Where does it say that?

00:52:12.000 Doesn't it?

00:52:12.000 See the last word of the first paragraph?

00:52:16.000 By 1984, there was an estimated 715,000 elk in North America.

00:52:20.000 No, right above there.

00:52:21.000 The last word of the first paragraph.

00:52:24.000 Fortunately, uh, da-da-da-da-da-da-da.

00:52:25.000 American Elk Population.

00:52:27.000 Less than $100,000 in the early 1990s.

00:52:30.000 It says 1990s.

00:52:30.000 No, that can't be 1990s.

00:52:32.000 Is it incorrect?

00:52:33.000 I get what he's saying, but yeah, it might be a mistype.

00:52:35.000 I think that's 1890s.

00:52:37.000 Really?

00:52:37.000 Yeah.

00:52:38.000 Because it says...

00:52:40.000 By 1984. By 84, there's 750, so it wouldn't have went all the way back down.

00:52:45.000 Right, yeah, yeah, that must be a typo.

00:52:46.000 But anyway, so the point... 0.99

00:52:47.000 Well, that's a dumb typo. 0.99

00:52:49.000 Who's fucking Go... 0.99

00:52:51.000 What does it say? 0.99

00:52:52.000 Gohunt.com.

00:52:54.000 See, I don't necessarily trust a lot of these hunting sites for things like that.

00:52:59.000 Like, that's a...

00:53:00.000 I trust them when they support the point I'm trying to prove. 0.98

00:53:02.000 Yeah, but that's a fuck-up! 0.99

00:53:04.000 That's a giant fuck-up. 0.99

00:53:05.000 Somebody should email that site. 0.96

00:53:06.000 Somebody who's listening, please email that site and let them know.

00:53:08.000 Let's get that fixed.

00:53:09.000 I think it's supposed to be 1890s, and I would say less than 100,000, and now it's over a million.

00:53:15.000 So that's where I get the point that I was making.

00:53:19.000 I think before people really colonized the West, I think they were everywhere.

00:53:25.000 I think that's what Rinello was saying.

00:53:27.000 Maybe so.

00:53:27.000 I think what he was saying was that they're not in 90% of the places they used to be in.

00:53:33.000 But the places they're in...

00:53:35.000 They're thriving.

00:53:36.000 They're thriving, yeah.

00:53:37.000 And this is a really important point when it comes to...

00:53:40.000 We were talking about grizzly bears.

00:53:42.000 People say, like, the grizzly bears are almost extinct.

00:53:44.000 In Santa Monica, yes, you're right.

00:53:46.000 They're almost extinct.

00:53:47.000 In California, they only live in California anymore.

00:53:50.000 Not a ton in California. 1.00

00:53:51.000 Go to Alaska, they're fucking everywhere. 0.99

00:53:52.000 And there's a lot of them, folks. 0.99

00:53:54.000 In Alaska, which is twice the size of Texas, it's a goddamn enormous state, and they are big, and there's a lot of them.

00:54:02.000 And they decimate herds of caribou, elk, and they estimate that something around where John and Jen live in Alberta, more than 50% of the moose are killed at birth. 0.94

00:54:14.000 Right.

00:54:14.000 By bears.

00:54:15.000 That's where the bears, they follow, so a cow moose is pregnant. 1.00

00:54:20.000 It's going to drop the calf, right?

00:54:23.000 And so bears will know that moose is pregnant, know she's going to be dropping a calf, they follow her. 0.53

00:54:30.000 As soon as she drops a calf, right there. 0.99

00:54:32.000 Kill it and eat it. 1.00

00:54:33.000 That's how they get her. 1.00

00:54:34.000 They just follow the moose around.

00:54:35.000 And sometimes not even then.

00:54:36.000 A lot of times they're pulling it out of the cow's body.

00:54:39.000 Right.

00:54:40.000 No, they're brutal.

00:54:42.000 I mean, life in the wild, it's not a fairy tale out there.

00:54:45.000 It's a real deal.

00:54:46.000 It's life and death. 0.96

00:54:47.000 And so they're doing, they're just going to kill. 1.00

00:54:50.000 They're going to kill. 1.00

00:54:50.000 That's all they care about. 1.00

00:54:51.000 They're going to kill, eat. 0.99

00:54:52.000 That's how they survive. 0.77

00:54:53.000 And there's nothing wrong with that.

00:54:54.000 No.

00:54:55.000 That's what they do.

00:54:56.000 I'm not going to judge them.

00:55:00.000 But yeah, so where I was, I was in 16 in Alaska, and a non-resident can kill two brown bear, which are basically salmon-fed grizzly bear, and three black bear.

00:55:13.000 So you can go up there and kill five bear.

00:55:15.000 Which I wanted to do. 0.98

00:55:17.000 But don't think that I'm bloodthirsty.

00:55:19.000 Think that I want to help the moose and I like the bear meat.

00:55:22.000 So I didn't do it.

00:55:25.000 But I mean, that's...

00:55:25.000 Well, you killed three.

00:55:26.000 I killed three.

00:55:27.000 But that gives you an example of how many bears there are.

00:55:32.000 And this is by biologists who are paid and who have went to school and who have studied the carrying capacity of the land and how many animals...

00:55:39.000 They determine this.

00:55:40.000 This isn't hunters determining this.

00:55:43.000 This is Alaska fishing game.

00:55:45.000 So that's where I have a problem with the people who think they know better than people who, this is their passion, this is what they care about, they have boots on the ground, they're doing it, they're setting the bag limits.

00:55:54.000 So if you don't live there and study this and this has been your life mission, you don't know more than them.

00:56:01.000 Well, they're wildlife biologists.

00:56:03.000 And by the way, if those populations aren't kept at a healthy level, they send in people that they pay to kill these animals.

00:56:09.000 And this is an important factor.

00:56:11.000 And this is what we're talking about with California, because California doesn't have a hunting season for mountain lions.

00:56:16.000 So they have to pay people to go in and kill these mountain lions.

00:56:18.000 They're not just letting the mountain lions live.

00:56:20.000 They're not.

00:56:21.000 If they become a problem, they're taking them out.

00:56:23.000 They just don't want to deal with the backlash.

00:56:24.000 Exactly.

00:56:25.000 That's it.

00:56:25.000 So they're just avoiding the backlash.

00:56:27.000 Not doing it quietly.

00:56:28.000 It's not for the betterment of the animal or, you know, the ecosystem or anything like that.

00:56:34.000 It's just because they don't want to deal with the drama.

00:56:36.000 And then you get these people.

00:56:38.000 Well, they were here first.

00:56:40.000 Where were they are?

00:56:42.000 No, they weren't.

00:56:43.000 First of all, that mountain lion's five, okay? 1.00

00:56:45.000 I was here way before that fuck. 1.00

00:56:48.000 And they, as in they, come on, stop. 0.99

00:56:51.000 The whole place was covered in ice 10,000 years ago. 1.00

00:56:54.000 So shut up. 1.00

00:56:55.000 Like, what are you talking about? 1.00

00:56:56.000 Who is they?

00:56:57.000 What is this?

00:56:58.000 This is the world we're living in right now. 1.00

00:57:00.000 It's 2016 and a mountain lion ate this fucking dude's cat. 0.99

00:57:04.000 So what are we going to do? 1.00

00:57:05.000 Are we going to just let the mountain lion eat his kid now?

00:57:07.000 Because it would. 1.00

00:57:08.000 If you leave that kid on the swing and you go in to fucking answer your email real quick and you come back, your kid's not gone, you see that fucking tail hop over the fence. 1.00

00:57:15.000 That's how it works. 1.00

00:57:16.000 That's the wild.

00:57:17.000 Go to the barbecue to turn over your veggie burger, you know?

00:57:20.000 That kid's gone.

00:57:23.000 Cecil.

00:57:24.000 All right, so this is the billboard.

00:57:27.000 Who's that, your grandpa?

00:57:28.000 No, my grandpa's name was Joseph.

00:57:30.000 Oh. 1.00

00:57:30.000 Look at this fucking photograph. 1.00

00:57:31.000 There's a lion that is hugging a bear, and the lion has a tear rolling down his face, and the bear has a tear rolling down his face. 1.00

00:57:40.000 And it says, ban the bear hunt.

00:57:42.000 They are all Cecil.

00:57:45.000 SaveNewJerseyBears.com Oh my god. 0.99

00:57:47.000 That makes me want to punch somebody in the face. 1.00

00:57:49.000 What kind of fucking crazy person living in some weird bubble made this billboard and spent actual human money on it? 1.00

00:57:57.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:57:58.000 I don't know.

00:57:59.000 Just fantasy land.

00:58:00.000 If they haven't seen, they have a giant problem with bears in New Jersey.

00:58:04.000 And there's facts behind this. 0.99

00:58:07.000 First of all, a student from Rutgers was fucking killed by a bear right outside of Rutgers. 0.99

00:58:12.000 See that photograph? 0.99

00:58:13.000 A student took this photo of a bear just before it killed them.

00:58:16.000 I was talking to a guy who knows rangers out there, and they're telling people not to hike. 0.98

00:58:22.000 They have so many goddamn bear in New Jersey. 0.96

00:58:25.000 And why do they have so many bear? 0.99

00:58:26.000 Because they didn't have a hunt for them. 1.00

00:58:29.000 So these goddamn things, they got overpopulated. 0.99

00:58:31.000 And they have now, they're entering into residential neighborhoods, and these huge- They're hungry. 1.00

00:58:36.000 Look at this fucking video. 0.99

00:58:38.000 Bear fight, Far Rockaway, New Jersey, August 14th of 2014. These bears are duking it out. 1.00

00:58:44.000 These are big black bears, like seven-foot bears, 400-plus pound bears, and they are going to war in this guy's front lawn.

00:58:53.000 These are huge!

00:58:55.000 I mean, if you were in Alberta and you saw one of these bears coming in, you'd be like, ooh, boy.

00:58:58.000 That's a trophy bear.

00:58:59.000 That's a trophy bear.

00:59:00.000 That's a giant bear.

00:59:01.000 That's hundreds of pounds of meat for the grill. 0.99

00:59:04.000 Yeah, and these bears are in this guy's lawn.

00:59:06.000 I mean, this isn't a this isn't some crazy rural, you know, like Sue Akins living in the middle of the nowhere.

00:59:13.000 No, it's in New Jersey.

00:59:14.000 This thing just knocked over a lamppost and now it's colliding with these garbage pails.

00:59:20.000 Watch this. 0.98

00:59:21.000 They're fighting over territory, by the way, that's created by garbage. 0.99

00:59:25.000 That's what the territory is. 1.00

00:59:27.000 They attack people's garbage. 0.77

00:59:29.000 And these two bears, they bite each other, and then they duke it out.

00:59:33.000 Look at the size of these bears!

00:59:34.000 I know.

00:59:35.000 These are huge!

00:59:36.000 Right.

00:59:37.000 Well, that's why...

00:59:38.000 Okay, so maybe there was...

00:59:41.000 Before there was houses, that was perfect bear habitat.

00:59:43.000 But guess what?

00:59:44.000 There's houses now.

00:59:45.000 So that means we have to control the bear numbers.

00:59:48.000 That's hunting.

00:59:48.000 Well, here's another part of the problem.

00:59:50.000 These bears weren't here 30 years ago.

00:59:52.000 These bears are overpopulating and moving into these neighborhoods, and they're doing it because they know the people live there, and it's a steady supply of food. 0.99

01:00:00.000 Garbage.

01:00:01.000 Yeah, when you live in Colorado, and Colorado, they had a big issue with it in this area where I was, where bears would find out that people put their garbage in a certain area.

01:00:10.000 And once they eat there once, that's it.

01:00:13.000 They have to capture those bears, and they either relocate them to zoos or figure something out. 0.88

01:00:19.000 But when I was there, we went to this wildlife rescue place, and they had this gigantic grizzly bear that they had gotten because, look at the fucking giant chunks of further tearing off of each other. 0.89

01:00:30.000 Look at that. 0.98

01:00:31.000 It's insane.

01:00:32.000 Yeah.

01:00:32.000 These are huge bear!

01:00:33.000 They're beasts.

01:00:34.000 And now, I love this video because a car pulls up and the cars, they start taking selfies with the bears.

01:00:40.000 But they had to relocate this grizzly because it just started tearing apart people's cars. 0.88

01:00:45.000 It found food in someone's car once.

01:00:47.000 Was it grizzly or a black bear?

01:00:48.000 It was a brown bear.

01:00:50.000 It's one that they had had.

01:00:51.000 I don't know where they had gotten it.

01:00:53.000 But it happens with black bear.

01:00:55.000 It happens with brown bears.

01:00:56.000 Yeah, no.

01:00:57.000 It's just, you know, the numbers need to be controlled.

01:01:00.000 That's all there is to it.

01:01:00.000 In Colorado, it doesn't have a large brown bear population, right?

01:01:03.000 Well, it wouldn't be brown bear.

01:01:04.000 It'd be grizzly.

01:01:04.000 It's brown bear when they're near the coast and grizzly when they're inland?

01:01:07.000 Brown bear, they eat fish.

01:01:10.000 So they're on, you know...

01:01:11.000 Why do they call them different names?

01:01:13.000 Different species, I guess, is what they've determined.

01:01:15.000 You know, they're bigger because they eat fish, so they get all that protein.

01:01:18.000 So they, you know, they can be up 1,400 pounds, whereas a mountain grizzly, an average mountain grizzly might be 7 foot 500 pounds.

01:01:29.000 You know, I mean, life's tougher up in the mountains.

01:01:32.000 They're eating blueberries when the blueberries are on, you know, eating what they can, but...

01:01:39.000 The bears that eat the fish, they're gorging on fish.

01:01:42.000 They get big.

01:01:42.000 It's just a high-protein diet, kind of like what you're on right now.

01:01:45.000 I'm on a high-protein diet, folks.

01:01:47.000 So you're like a brown bear.

01:01:48.000 High-fat, too.

01:01:49.000 Yeah, this diet is kind of for the birds, but not really.

01:01:52.000 Birds eat grain.

01:01:55.000 I'm enjoying it.

01:01:56.000 I mean, it's not bad, but I've been on it for two weeks, and I would really like a bowl of pasta right now.

01:02:00.000 But it's going well.

01:02:01.000 I bet.

01:02:02.000 It's interesting.

01:02:03.000 Yeah.

01:02:03.000 Well, that whole Cecil and the bear-hugging thing...

01:02:08.000 It's insane.

01:02:10.000 Guarantee you a woman made that. 0.99

01:02:12.000 How about that, folks?

01:02:14.000 I'm done with that part.

01:02:17.000 I don't know. 0.99

01:02:18.000 It could be a gay guy. 1.00

01:02:19.000 It could be a weak dude. 1.00

01:02:21.000 All sex, gender, all that nonsense aside, we're joking around here, folks. 0.99

01:02:25.000 What that is is just someone who doesn't understand. 1.00

01:02:28.000 It's crazy ignorance. 1.00

01:02:29.000 And the idea that you want to let these things keep fucking and breeding and... 1.00

01:02:34.000 We're good to go. 0.99

01:02:57.000 You know, and Cecil has a brother, you know, who's protecting his family, Jericho.

01:03:01.000 Okay, go break up that bear fight. 0.99

01:03:03.000 Let me know how that goes.

01:03:04.000 What is this?

01:03:05.000 Samantha?

01:03:06.000 This is from their website, saveinjbears.com.

01:03:08.000 Oh, my God.

01:03:09.000 So this is another named...

01:03:10.000 You know, I think, you know, we're only facilitating this issue right here with naming the bears and humanizing them.

01:03:17.000 Because if you watch the Super Bowl, it seemed like every other commercial was...

01:03:22.000 Something, an animal singing or an animal talking.

01:03:26.000 I was like, I mean, I saw sheep singing like in an acapella group.

01:03:31.000 I'm like, what is going on?

01:03:34.000 Well, and so that's where hunters are fighting for our place right now because the kids are seeing that and weak people are seeing that and people that don't get, hey, I want to be part of the food chain are seeing that and they're like humanizing these animals.

01:03:48.000 The sheep don't They don't care about anything but eating. 0.99

01:03:54.000 Eating and fucking. 1.00

01:03:55.000 That's what they do. 1.00

01:03:55.000 They stay alive. 1.00

01:03:56.000 They're not talking about, oh, here comes a guy who's bringing us our food.

01:04:00.000 Let's sing.

01:04:03.000 It's not realistic, but that's the programming that's getting out there and just messing with the hardwire of these young people coming up.

01:04:13.000 Well, a lot of hunters attribute Bambi as being a turning point in the way Americans viewed hunting.

01:04:19.000 Yeah.

01:04:19.000 Because then, all of a sudden, you're seeing this beautiful animal getting chased down and killed by a hunter.

01:04:24.000 Yeah.

01:04:25.000 Well, we need to fight to change that.

01:04:28.000 I think we are.

01:04:29.000 We are.

01:04:31.000 Every time you see a hunter on a show or on a...

01:04:35.000 I don't even know what it's been on.

01:04:37.000 I think South Park's even had something.

01:04:38.000 But obviously it's some redneck, hillbilly, drinking beer, no respect for anything. 1.00

01:04:49.000 Even in all the Hollywood movies, that's what...

01:04:52.000 That's the image they portray.

01:04:54.000 We need to change that.

01:04:56.000 We're trying to.

01:05:22.000 Steve Rinell, Remy Warren, these really intelligent people that can talk about Tim Burnett, who can talk about these things in a way where they explain to you their perspective.

01:05:32.000 They grew up with this.

01:05:33.000 This is how they've lived their life.

01:05:35.000 And if you lived your life in a city, it doesn't make sense to you.

01:05:38.000 It seems alien.

01:05:39.000 You watch Bambi.

01:05:40.000 You see these...

01:05:41.000 Yogi talks to Boo Boo.

01:05:42.000 They have conversations. 0.94

01:05:43.000 Why would you want to shoot one of them?

01:05:46.000 Until you venture into that world, you don't understand it.

01:05:51.000 And we're insulated from it because of supermarkets, because of this bizarre world we live in where we've created these artificial structures that we think are normal.

01:06:01.000 These cities and this method of acquiring food where you just run a piece of plastic through a machine and you walk away with all this food.

01:06:10.000 It's not healthy.

01:06:11.000 No, it's not.

01:06:12.000 It's like if you could have sex...

01:06:16.000 With a faceless person where you didn't even get to see their face, like all you saw was like their body from the shoulder down, and that's what you had sex with, and you had a kid with that person, you didn't even know that kid, and you walk away. 0.60

01:06:26.000 But I got my needs met.

01:06:28.000 I mean, that's almost what's going on.

01:06:30.000 It is.

01:06:30.000 It's almost what's going on when you're acquiring food without ever growing it, without planting that seed.

01:06:35.000 And I'm not saying you should fucking plant all your food, and I'm not saying you should only hunt if you're going to eat meat, but what I'm saying is, if you could do it, It would bring you a little closer to understanding where that food comes from, and it'll give you just a broader view of this world we live in and what you're doing by consuming food.

01:06:56.000 You are consuming, whether you're consuming salad, and here's another thing, vegans. 0.84

01:06:59.000 I put this up the other day. 0.98

01:07:01.000 I was fucking with a bunch of people where I trolled.

01:07:04.000 People were sending me all this vegan stuff, so I just started trolling them by sending them all these scientific studies about plants and plant intelligence. 0.91

01:07:13.000 Which is a new form of study, or it's a new field of study, where they're finding out more and more each day that plants can do calculations, that they respond to being eaten, that they have different mechanisms to discourage predation.

01:07:30.000 That's where poison plants come from. 0.99

01:07:32.000 They're communicating with each other in some sort of strange way.

01:07:36.000 Mm-hmm.

01:07:58.000 What you're doing is you're making these bizarre moral judgments.

01:08:01.000 Right.

01:08:02.000 And they're based on convenience, and a lot of them are based on ignorance, and a lot of them, they don't hold up when you start looking at things objectively.

01:08:10.000 No.

01:08:10.000 And people say to you, like, why don't you eat your dog?

01:08:12.000 Well, I don't want to eat my dog, okay?

01:08:15.000 Jesus Christ.

01:08:16.000 But my dog is a pet, okay?

01:08:17.000 My dog was raised from the time it was a baby.

01:08:20.000 I've had it since it was young.

01:08:21.000 I'm not going to eat it.

01:08:22.000 Right.

01:08:23.000 If someone does hunt a wild dog and eat it, and it's between that wild dog eating them and them eating that wild dog, you know, that's an unfortunate situation.

01:08:33.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:08:33.000 But you gotta eat that fucking dog. 1.00

01:08:35.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:08:35.000 Manny Pacquiao, his parents, they ate their dog when he was starving, when they were a kid. 1.00

01:08:40.000 It was like a very traumatic moment for him.

01:08:43.000 I bet.

01:08:44.000 Where his family was so, they were starving, they were so poor, they had to eat their pet dog.

01:08:47.000 Yeah.

01:08:48.000 Well, and then the people would say, well, you're not starving.

01:08:50.000 Why are you killing animals?

01:08:51.000 Right?

01:08:52.000 For us.

01:08:52.000 Because I don't want to starve.

01:08:54.000 That's a good point.

01:08:57.000 Proactive.

01:08:57.000 What I like the most, we talked about changing the stereotype, is I like, you know, working, as we know, work out all the time.

01:09:04.000 I like when people ask me, why are you working out so hard?

01:09:08.000 For bow hunting.

01:09:09.000 And this is like, that gives the craziest look.

01:09:12.000 Yeah.

01:09:12.000 You know, but it's been the same answer for me for years is because I want to be the best in the mountains.

01:09:16.000 I think that...

01:09:17.000 The best that you can be.

01:09:18.000 The best I can be, yeah.

01:09:20.000 I understood that way more after I went with you.

01:09:22.000 You know, after I went hunting with you in Colorado, I get it.

01:09:25.000 I get it more because you're in better cardiovascular shape than me.

01:09:28.000 And I'm in good shape.

01:09:29.000 Take the average person, I'm in better shape than the average person.

01:09:31.000 Right.

01:09:31.000 And I'm not in better shape than you.

01:09:33.000 Right. 0.99

01:09:33.000 You're fucking running ahead of me. 0.99

01:09:34.000 I'm like, this motherfucker... 1.00

01:09:38.000 There's a certain pace that you can keep because you run mountains all the time that I'm just not capable of keeping right now. 0.99

01:09:45.000 It made me up my cardio in a big time way.

01:09:47.000 When I came back from that hunt, the first thing I started doing was really upping my cardio.

01:09:51.000 Well, and, you know, so we had a real, you know, real life example of that.

01:09:57.000 What I like as much as that, I mean, not as much as that, because I love being with somebody who's successful and who experiences a hunt, and I'm able to share in that.

01:10:06.000 And that's a whole other thing.

01:10:08.000 It's like, I didn't kill anything, but...

01:10:11.000 I was part of your hunt, and that meant as much to me as me getting my animal.

01:10:15.000 So, I mean, we have the whole camaraderie, and it's not every man for himself.

01:10:20.000 We're out there.

01:10:21.000 We're working together.

01:10:22.000 We want to be successful in harvest meat and take meat home to our families.

01:10:26.000 But what I like is people who are inspired.

01:10:30.000 They're not with me, but they see the training, and they're inspired to up their game.

01:10:35.000 Maybe they won't.

01:10:37.000 Run a 200-mile race or run 10 miles a day or do any of this, but maybe they'll run one mile.

01:10:43.000 My whole thing is, if you're not making a positive impact, what's your point?

01:10:50.000 What are you doing?

01:10:51.000 I want to make a positive impact on people, and that's why I love social media and sharing what I do, and hopefully it can inspire others to do more, and that's my motivation daily.

01:11:00.000 Well, there's a great time for that.

01:11:04.000 There's a great...

01:11:07.000 Venue or a great vehicle through social media that didn't exist before to inspire people.

01:11:13.000 And I am constantly inspired by it. 0.99

01:11:14.000 You know, and some people get upset like, oh, you fucking posting pictures so you're working out, you're fucking showing off. 0.97

01:11:20.000 I like when I read The Rock's Instagram, okay? 0.98

01:11:23.000 You too.

01:11:23.000 I do.

01:11:24.000 I think 40 million other people do also. 1.00

01:11:26.000 Yeah, that fucking guy is up every morning. 0.99

01:11:28.000 If he's got to work at 7, he's up at 4, and he's in the gym, and he'll show a photo of his alarm clock going off, and it'll show a photo of him in the gym making crazy faces where he's fucking full of sweat, and it makes me realize I'm a lazy bitch, and it makes me want to get up and work out. 1.00

01:11:43.000 Exactly. 0.98

01:11:43.000 You know, I mean, that's just... 0.98

01:11:45.000 There's a community.

01:11:46.000 People want to be inspired, I think.

01:11:48.000 They definitely do.

01:11:49.000 I know I do, and I know that you've created a community.

01:11:53.000 Your Instagram page, in a lot of ways, and I don't want to say it's your community, but you have spawned through your Instagram page a lot of inspirational communities as well.

01:12:04.000 I've looked at these other people's pages that follow you, and I'll see the hashtag, keep hammering, and they're out doing things, and I see people responding to their posts.

01:12:12.000 You know, I saw this, and it made me go to the gym, and I wasn't going to, so thank you for that.

01:12:16.000 And it branches off.

01:12:17.000 It feeds into everybody, and it's positive.

01:12:20.000 It's positive for all of us. 0.97

01:12:21.000 And at the end of the day, look, you know, you can make all your fucking angry videos, and you can make all your angry posts and shit on this and shit on that, and get angry about people you don't even meet, but what is the message that you're putting out? 0.99

01:12:34.000 This angry, shitty message that you're putting out? 0.99

01:12:37.000 This angry, negative thing. 0.99

01:12:40.000 Are you pumping yourself up?

01:12:42.000 You're standing on a moral high ground and espousing your superiority to the world?

01:12:48.000 What are you doing?

01:12:49.000 Are you broadcasting that?

01:12:50.000 And you know who's inspired by that?

01:12:52.000 Nobody. 0.98

01:12:53.000 Some people might be to also be cunts. 1.00

01:12:55.000 Like, this guy's a good cunt. 1.00

01:12:56.000 I want to be a cunt, too. 1.00

01:12:57.000 I know. 1.00

01:12:58.000 I guess I don't hang around those people because I never hear that.

01:13:01.000 Well, you don't see them.

01:13:02.000 I'll tell you what.

01:13:03.000 If you meet one of those people in real life, I guarantee you the conversation wouldn't be like it is in these one-sided debates or these one-sided broadcasts. 0.74

01:13:11.000 If someone makes a blog, this angry, shitty blog, have a conversation with that person.

01:13:15.000 Yeah. 0.95

01:13:16.000 Tweets and blogs, especially if they're negative, it's a very ineffective form of communication.

01:13:23.000 Negative videos, they're very ineffective because this is not a real conversation.

01:13:29.000 The way people are supposed to communicate is like you and I talking to each other. 0.95

01:13:33.000 You know, even fucking podcasts in a lot of ways. 0.91

01:13:36.000 It's one of the things why people get angry. 1.00

01:13:38.000 Because if someone listening to this right now, you're like, you motherfucker, I got something to say! 1.00

01:13:42.000 And I get it. 1.00

01:13:43.000 I understand.

01:13:44.000 But don't get mad at me.

01:13:45.000 If you were here, we would talk.

01:13:47.000 But you're not here.

01:13:48.000 Should we take a few calls?

01:13:49.000 Oh, wait.

01:13:50.000 We don't do call-ins, thank God.

01:13:52.000 No.

01:13:52.000 It's too hard.

01:13:53.000 You know, the beautiful thing about the internet is everybody has a voice.

01:13:56.000 You can text me.

01:13:57.000 The bad thing about the internet is everybody has a voice.

01:13:59.000 You got my number, text me.

01:14:00.000 So that'll eliminate a lot of people.

01:14:02.000 You can choose what message you put out there.

01:14:07.000 You can choose how you experience life.

01:14:11.000 You can choose how you interact with people.

01:14:13.000 And some people, I think, this is a new world we're living in, this world of social media, this world where anybody can start a blog or anybody can start putting things up on Twitter or Facebook or whatever.

01:14:26.000 It's a new world, and we've got to learn how to navigate it better.

01:14:30.000 Well, you know, people, like you said, people can choose.

01:14:32.000 I can choose.

01:14:33.000 I put up positive.

01:14:35.000 Yeah.

01:14:35.000 You don't think I have negative things happen in my life?

01:14:37.000 Of course.

01:14:38.000 Yeah.

01:14:38.000 I could put up negative probably as much as positive.

01:14:41.000 I'm overcoming all sorts of hurdles all the time.

01:14:43.000 But what's the point?

01:14:45.000 Like I said, I want to be positive.

01:14:47.000 I want to inspire people.

01:14:48.000 And, you know, at the show in Utah this weekend...

01:14:53.000 I was amazed at the number of people that waited a long time to come up and share their story.

01:15:00.000 Share their story about losing weight or the success they've had or the impact.

01:15:05.000 As a hunter, a bow hunter, how would a bow hunter make that much of an impact?

01:15:12.000 I have no idea, but it happened.

01:15:15.000 If you ever wonder what's your calling in life, because I've wondered, what am I doing when I was young?

01:15:23.000 Where am I going?

01:15:25.000 What's going to happen?

01:15:26.000 Well, weekends like this weekend where I saw all those people and talked to all those people and had that interaction, that really drives home I'm doing what I'm meant to do.

01:15:35.000 And that's making a positive impact.

01:15:37.000 And I mean, that's through bow hunting.

01:15:40.000 I mean, that's it.

01:15:41.000 That's what I do.

01:15:42.000 That's how I met you.

01:15:42.000 Yeah, yeah.

01:15:43.000 I mean, I met you through bowhunting and social media.

01:15:45.000 I mean, your positive message reached me.

01:15:48.000 And we talked about it on the Gritty Bowman podcast, which we just did.

01:15:52.000 We dropped in and did a podcast, an impromptu podcast with these guys.

01:15:55.000 They call themselves the Gritty Bowman.

01:15:58.000 And it's a good podcast, but good bowhunting podcast.

01:16:01.000 Right.

01:16:01.000 And we talked about it.

01:16:02.000 I was interested in hunting for a long time before I met Steve Rinella.

01:16:07.000 And then when I was going on different websites and looking at different YouTube videos, I saw your stuff and I'm like, well, okay.

01:16:17.000 Well, here's this guy that's really into fitness.

01:16:19.000 He's into fitness and preparing himself to be what you call the ultimate predator, to be your best at what you like to do, which is bowhunting.

01:16:28.000 I'm like, well, this is kind of crazy.

01:16:29.000 So then I started watching your videos.

01:16:30.000 I'm like, what a positive dude.

01:16:32.000 Look at this guy.

01:16:32.000 He's working out.

01:16:33.000 He's giving people great advice.

01:16:34.000 He's telling people how to use proper technique with archery and how to have a good attitude about this and how it's all good.

01:16:40.000 And you're like, it's a beautiful day.

01:16:42.000 We're out here.

01:16:42.000 We're enjoying the beautiful weather.

01:16:45.000 We're out here practicing.

01:16:46.000 This is what we do every day.

01:16:47.000 And I was like, This is inspirational, and this is positive, and through you, you meet me, I use my, what I've created, this vehicle of social media and podcasting to broadcast it more, and then all these new positive branches spread out from that.

01:17:03.000 It's awesome.

01:17:04.000 Amazing.

01:17:05.000 Yeah, I love it. 1.00

01:17:06.000 It's so much better than shitting on people. 0.99

01:17:08.000 It is. 0.99

01:17:08.000 It's so much better than negativity. 0.99

01:17:10.000 And like I said, when I had these guys from Cowspiracy, and these guys are vegans.

01:17:14.000 They're vegans who made a documentary about veganism and the powerful message that they had about the anti-factory farming message.

01:17:21.000 I had a great conversation with them.

01:17:23.000 And I believe, I truly believe that most of these people That are making angry posts on Twitter or angry videos.

01:17:31.000 If I sat down with them and had conversations with them, they'd be positive conversations.

01:17:35.000 Whether we agree or disagree, I have a very well thought out point.

01:17:39.000 I would imagine they have a very well thought out point too.

01:17:42.000 Where they're coming from is not a bad thing.

01:17:44.000 It's just something is lost in the broadcasting of this message.

01:17:50.000 I think that's a real problem that we're all sort of navigating in this world, is that somehow or another, the messages that get the most reaction are a lot of times the negative ones.

01:18:02.000 Yeah, I know.

01:18:03.000 Well, in regard to hunting, why do you like archery?

01:18:08.000 Do you like archery better than rifle hunting?

01:18:10.000 Definitely.

01:18:10.000 100%.

01:18:11.000 Why?

01:18:11.000 It's more challenging.

01:18:15.000 There's the book called Zen and the Art of Archery.

01:18:18.000 Yeah.

01:18:19.000 It's a book that I need to read.

01:18:21.000 Everybody tells me I need to read this book.

01:18:23.000 But there's something about archery itself.

01:18:26.000 Like today, when we're practicing shooting at that rubber elk, there's something about...

01:18:33.000 There's a moment when you're at full draw and you're about to release that arrow where everything is still.

01:18:44.000 Everything is calm and you're not thinking about anything else other than releasing the perfect arrow because it requires so much concentration and so much focus and it was completely unexpected to me.

01:18:57.000 When I first started practicing archery, I thought it was going to be like, like, shooting a rifle requires a lot of focus.

01:19:03.000 It requires trigger discipline, you have to, like, steady the gun on a rest, you have to, like, you know, really stay still and squeeze that trigger, and there's problems with that.

01:19:11.000 You know, you get the shakes, you know, you get nerves, and even at a target range, you know the gun's going to make that kick, and so you get a little flinchy.

01:19:20.000 It's nothing like archery.

01:19:21.000 Archery is that times 100. There's no resting.

01:19:25.000 There's no rifle rest.

01:19:26.000 You have to hold your arms steady.

01:19:28.000 And the amount of movement that you make, because the arrow's only going at the most 300 feet a second, 350 if you've got some super bow and a light arrow.

01:19:38.000 The difference between that and a rifle is so different.

01:19:42.000 So, any movement translates to a giant amount of movement at the end where the arrow hits.

01:19:50.000 And it's just, as a discipline, it's cleansing. 0.99

01:19:55.000 Like, for me, I love, after a long day, I do a lot of shit, man. 0.99

01:19:59.000 I got a lot of things going on in my mind. 0.99

01:20:01.000 You know, I have... 0.99

01:20:02.000 Between comedy and podcasting and the UFC and family and business bullshit and it's like so much bullshit going on. 0.96

01:20:10.000 There's so many different things in my mind that for me what archery is is like this is like ultimate meditation this ultimate focus point where I draw back and I see that target And then I release that arrow. 0.96

01:20:25.000 And then when that arrow goes right into that bullseye, like we were shooting that rubber elk today, and when you nail one, it gets right in that small circle.

01:20:35.000 It's a beautiful, satisfying feeling.

01:20:37.000 It is.

01:20:38.000 It's that moment in the impact and seeing where it hit.

01:20:43.000 So that's just a process of it.

01:20:45.000 But then when that happens...

01:20:47.000 Because why are we doing that?

01:20:49.000 We're doing that to prepare for the hunt.

01:20:50.000 So when all that work pays off on the hunt, it's just...

01:20:56.000 I don't know how to...

01:20:59.000 I see some videos and I see people running around and tackling each other and doing all that.

01:21:05.000 I never feel like that.

01:21:06.000 I always feel like...

01:21:08.000 I feel, I guess, blessed or thankful for the moment and mostly thankful that I made something that's very difficult happen.

01:21:18.000 You know, I achieved that goal and it's a...

01:21:22.000 I don't know.

01:21:23.000 It's so powerful.

01:21:24.000 And I just, that's what I, you know, I like people to shoot a bow because as you said, shooting a bow is centering and it's zen-like, I guess.

01:21:33.000 If I even know what zen means, I don't even know if I do, but it is relaxing.

01:21:37.000 It requires amazing focus.

01:21:40.000 So that's a good start.

01:21:41.000 But when you can block everything out, because you say you have to block everything out to make a good shot on that target, on the foam rubber, the Reinhardt elk today.

01:21:50.000 Well, on an animal, when the animal's moving, there's different factors that...

01:21:57.000 You know in line he's bugling your hearts going a million miles an hour and then when you can do it there and then Where you take that up another level is hunting the mounds like if you're sheep hunting and Then you have it's such a physical and then it could be dangerous also So you have so many things and when that happens on something like a sheep in the sheep mountains that is to me life-changing I mean experiences like that have made me who I am and people say You

01:22:27.000 know, bow hunting has made you who, yeah.

01:22:30.000 I mean, because coming through in crunch time like that is more pressure and more accomplishment than anything I'll ever do in normal life.

01:22:40.000 Because it's just that difficult.

01:22:42.000 Well, through difficult things our character gets challenged.

01:22:46.000 Our will and our focus get tested.

01:22:50.000 And through those tests and through this very difficult task, you learn more about yourself.

01:22:58.000 Right.

01:22:58.000 You learn more about your ability, you learn more about your faults, you learn about your weaknesses, you learn about your strengths, and you learn how to shore up those weaknesses and get stronger.

01:23:09.000 And that's why people who have never experienced it don't understand your dedication to fitness, don't understand your dedication to making sure you're in the best possible shape you can be, also that your archery practice is at the best it can be so that when that moment of truth arises, you can steady your nerves,

01:23:25.000 you can keep it all together, and you can execute.

01:23:27.000 And that execution, that is an insanely difficult test that very few people have to ever do anything in life that's remotely as difficult as shoot an arrow at an elk that's 50 yards away and watch that arrow sink right into the vitals and realize that you've done it and realize that now you have enough meat for a year for your family with one animal,

01:23:47.000 with one animal.

01:23:49.000 And are we quantifying life?

01:23:51.000 I mean, are we saying that all animals are worth something?

01:23:56.000 If that's the case, every pasta bowl that you eat, you eat a bowl of pasta, that pasta comes from grain.

01:24:03.000 That grain most likely was chopped from a field, from a combine that is 100 yards long, that it's indiscriminate, and it's running over everything, as we were talking about.

01:24:12.000 Running over mice and rabbits and fawns and ground nesting birds and anything else that might be in its path.

01:24:17.000 And there's a lot of death involved in that.

01:24:18.000 So every bowl of pasta that you eat, even though you feel like you're completely immune or completely free of any responsibility of death, it's not true.

01:24:28.000 But one elk with one arrow Feeds you for a year.

01:24:33.000 A year!

01:24:34.000 Right. 0.99

01:24:34.000 I have two fucking commercial freezers in the back. 0.99

01:24:36.000 They're filled with meat. 0.99

01:24:37.000 I gave Gary Clark, the musician, the other day, I gave him two pounds of elk.

01:24:40.000 I'm like, take this home and cook it.

01:24:42.000 Bill Burr, the other day, he sent me this text message.

01:24:44.000 He made elk chili.

01:24:45.000 I gave him some elk.

01:24:46.000 I give people meat.

01:24:47.000 I love it.

01:24:48.000 I love it.

01:24:48.000 Love providing.

01:24:49.000 Yeah, my friend Chris Ryan sent me this photograph, or Duncan actually sent me, Chris Ryan did too, but Duncan sent me this photograph of his girlfriend made meatballs, elk meatballs, and they were sitting there eating with their friends.

01:25:01.000 They had a friend over for dinner with some meat from an animal that I shot with a bow and arrow!

01:25:07.000 You provided.

01:25:07.000 I'm giving it to him.

01:25:08.000 It's fantastic.

01:25:09.000 It's a beautiful, warm feeling, and it connects you in some weird primal way that we're immune to.

01:25:16.000 We're not getting it anymore.

01:25:18.000 We're not getting it.

01:25:19.000 And for me, people ask, why?

01:25:22.000 Because I've always been drawn to wild places, big wild places.

01:25:27.000 And people ask, how did that start?

01:25:30.000 For me, how that started was I didn't come from anything.

01:25:34.000 I didn't have anything.

01:25:36.000 I was just a guy who couldn't even afford an elk license for a few, you know, it was $25.

01:25:41.000 I couldn't afford it.

01:25:42.000 But so I felt like...

01:25:46.000 I don't know.

01:25:47.000 I didn't feel special in any way.

01:25:49.000 I didn't feel like I had any advantage over anybody.

01:25:51.000 I felt lower class, essentially.

01:25:53.000 But in the wilderness, when I went, there could be the richest guy in the world.

01:25:58.000 There could be the most powerful businessman.

01:26:00.000 But if he was there and I was there, all of a sudden the playing field was equal.

01:26:03.000 And if I'm in better shape than him, I'm above him.

01:26:06.000 In the mountains, I can be somebody.

01:26:09.000 I can be special.

01:26:12.000 And that's how I prepare.

01:26:13.000 And that's why I liked it back there, is I didn't have to conform to society's, well, this guy is an A-lister, you are nothing.

01:26:22.000 You know what I mean?

01:26:22.000 That's what was always drawing me to that, because it was a level playing field for me.

01:26:26.000 And if I came in more of like a beast than somebody else, all of a sudden, I was the guy back there.

01:26:32.000 That's what I did.

01:26:33.000 And it was just like, I didn't have anything, and I thought, this is the only way I'm going to...

01:26:40.000 Achieve my dreams, you know, is get to where I can be in control.

01:26:44.000 Well, it gives you an understanding of that environment that this environment really doesn't care that you make six figures.

01:26:52.000 It doesn't care that you drive a BMW. It doesn't care that you have a nice house.

01:26:54.000 It doesn't care.

01:26:55.000 It doesn't care.

01:26:57.000 In a lot of ways, I gravitate towards absolutes.

01:27:01.000 That's one of the reasons why I like martial arts.

01:27:03.000 It's one of the reasons I like pool.

01:27:05.000 If that ball drops in the hole, it's because you made it drop in the hole.

01:27:08.000 If you miss, you miss.

01:27:10.000 And there's no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

01:27:11.000 It's an absolute thing.

01:27:12.000 And I think in a lot of ways, hunting is similar in that way.

01:27:16.000 It doesn't care. 0.96

01:27:18.000 If you're playing pool, and you're a millionaire, and you're playing against a guy who's $2 in his The balls don't know this. 0.75

01:27:24.000 They don't care.

01:27:26.000 And it's the same in the woods.

01:27:27.000 When you are out there and you're in that environment, that is an absolute environment. 0.99

01:27:31.000 And absolute also in the fact that if you fucking zig when you should have zagged and you run across a sow grizzly and her cubs and she just decides today's your day, they don't give a fuck if you host the UFC. That bear doesn't give a fuck if you're the CEO of your company and you're out there. 0.99

01:27:49.000 It doesn't care. 0.99

01:27:50.000 No.

01:27:51.000 The wilderness is its own world.

01:27:54.000 It has its own rules.

01:27:55.000 It's unforgiving.

01:27:55.000 It's unforgiving and it's absolute.

01:27:58.000 Yeah.

01:27:58.000 And like that arrow hitting the artery or hitting the vitals of an elk.

01:28:03.000 If it doesn't hit, it doesn't hit. 1.00

01:28:06.000 I mean, it's got to go where it's supposed to go or you fucked up. 0.99

01:28:10.000 You know, that is real. 0.98

01:28:13.000 I mean, that's not just talk.

01:28:15.000 That's not talk where you zig or you should have zagged.

01:28:19.000 And, you know, Roy, Roy's story is a perfect example of that.

01:28:23.000 With your friend, explain who Roy is.

01:28:27.000 Roy is...

01:28:28.000 He's who got me started in bow hunting, and he is the toughest man I've ever met.

01:28:33.000 I've shared more experiences with Roy in the mountains, these life-defining type experiences that we've talked about.

01:28:40.000 And, you know, the bond we've created together has been over a handful of experiences, you know?

01:28:46.000 And you realize when you're out of your comfort zone like that and when you're both so committed to a pursuit, those bonds form quickly, you know?

01:28:55.000 And so we've...

01:28:56.000 Formed a strong bond over a handful of experiences over a couple years.

01:28:59.000 Well, Roy and I, you know, we went to high school together.

01:29:03.000 We started bow hunting as, you know, I think 18, 19 years old and had hundreds of experiences, life-changing, life-defining experiences together over the years.

01:29:15.000 So our bond, naturally, was like brothers.

01:29:23.000 When everybody doubted me when I was growing up and doubted my dream of ever becoming anything, he never did.

01:29:30.000 He was always the guy that believed in me.

01:29:35.000 Well, this year, up sheep hunting.

01:29:37.000 He was up sheep hunting where we had sheep hunted before together, and I killed a ram.

01:29:42.000 And it was, you know, it's a tough, difficult, dangerous hunt.

01:29:47.000 But he's more prepared, or he was more prepared for hunts like that than anybody in the world.

01:29:52.000 He's done it.

01:29:53.000 He's done it as much as anyone that I know.

01:29:55.000 And I've been successful.

01:29:57.000 I think he had killed nine rams.

01:29:59.000 And he, one misstep, He fell and died.

01:30:04.000 Prime of his life, essentially, 49 years old.

01:30:09.000 Just, you know, a father, husband, three kids, somebody who even the toughest Alaska hunters looked up to.

01:30:20.000 One step.

01:30:22.000 Gone.

01:30:23.000 And that's, you know, that's, so it's not just talk when you say zig, you should have zagged, there's risk.

01:30:29.000 But that's, I mean, if you're gonna, it just puts everything in perspective.

01:30:34.000 That's the allure to it, because I can speak for Roy and I, because I know we always have known about the risk.

01:30:41.000 That was part of the draw, is we wanted to go with, I think?

01:31:08.000 We don't call the shots, the mountain calls the shots.

01:31:10.000 And on that hunt, the mountain won.

01:31:14.000 Roy fell, and he died.

01:31:17.000 He fell 700 feet, right?

01:31:19.000 Yeah.

01:31:20.000 Where he fell, just tough, unforgiving sheep country. 1.00

01:31:26.000 And once you start going there, you're not going to stop.

01:31:32.000 It's one of the most dangerous hunts.

01:31:35.000 Sheep, yeah.

01:31:37.000 On that hunt, specifically, they give 100 tags, and a lot of times there's just one sheep killed.

01:31:45.000 It's that difficult.

01:31:47.000 And I think 40% of the people never even go because of the weather, because of the conditions, because it's so hard.

01:31:53.000 So they draw the tag and don't even get up the hill.

01:31:56.000 Wasn't that the case with you when you went up there grizzly hunting?

01:32:00.000 You were supposed to go sheep hunting as well, right?

01:32:02.000 Yeah.

01:32:02.000 No, it was moose hunting.

01:32:04.000 Moose hunting, right.

01:32:04.000 We were going to do a moose-sheep combo, but there was so much snow, we couldn't even get to sheep country.

01:32:09.000 And that was the plan.

01:32:11.000 We were going to go sheep hunting.

01:32:12.000 And that was with Roy.

01:32:13.000 That was with Roy, right.

01:32:14.000 So we had an amazing moose hunt together, and I killed a nice big bull.

01:32:20.000 We just had just another epic adventure.

01:32:25.000 Something, you know, a hunt that maybe a handful of people would want to do because we were so far back.

01:32:31.000 You know miles back and had to haul a moose out over a mountain in the snow very very very difficult hunt but the ones it was just it was perfect because it was our last hunt together he died two weeks later and that hunt encapsulated everything about us it was just hard it was miserable and it was rewarding and and you know we achieved success where not very many people would have and we did it together and uh Yeah,

01:33:02.000 I mean, then two weeks later, it was his sheep hunting.

01:33:06.000 There's an iconic photo that I think was forever going to define you from that hunt.

01:33:11.000 It's with you with a big cut in your face and blood streaming down your face.

01:33:15.000 You sent it to me while you were out there.

01:33:17.000 Yeah.

01:33:17.000 You were saying, we haven't got one yet.

01:33:20.000 Yeah.

01:33:20.000 We're out here hustling.

01:33:21.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:33:22.000 And there's this photo of you looking grizzled as fuck. 1.00

01:33:26.000 Yeah. 1.00

01:33:26.000 With blood coming down your face, snow in the background. 1.00

01:33:29.000 Yeah.

01:33:30.000 And I'm like, yeah.

01:33:31.000 That's...

01:33:32.000 That's Cameron Haynes.

01:33:33.000 Yeah.

01:33:35.000 It is, because we would always say, we can make an easy hunt hard.

01:33:41.000 Because we want it to be hard.

01:33:43.000 Well, you went into an area where very few people were having success, and even with rifles.

01:33:48.000 Right.

01:33:48.000 You were going deep, deep into this area.

01:33:50.000 It was a rifle area, so that means you...

01:33:53.000 A bow hunter had a different size of animal that was legal.

01:33:57.000 So if you're hunting in this area, it was a rifle area.

01:34:00.000 It had to be a little bigger.

01:34:01.000 So it had to be 50 inches wide, but it had to have four brow tines.

01:34:04.000 So you're making it harder.

01:34:07.000 So we were there in the rifle area, and we got it done.

01:34:11.000 And it was a hunt that that's what we love.

01:34:15.000 We loved hard hunting.

01:34:17.000 We just love the test.

01:34:18.000 Now when you go out there, does a bow hunter have different standards than a rifle hunter?

01:34:22.000 Like if you were there with a rifle, would you have to have shot a bigger bull?

01:34:25.000 No, that was...

01:34:26.000 You went to the bigger area.

01:34:27.000 I went to the bigger area.

01:34:28.000 So in the bow area, it only has to have three brow tines, the moose.

01:34:32.000 In the rifle area, it had to have four.

01:34:34.000 So I had to find one with four.

01:34:35.000 Well, mine had five on one side, four on another.

01:34:37.000 So it was good.

01:34:37.000 And it was over 50 inches wide.

01:34:38.000 So it was legal all the way around.

01:34:40.000 But if I would have just focused on the bow area, it could have been a lesser bull in regard to brow tine.

01:34:46.000 But...

01:34:46.000 And they do this to make sure, again, that the mature animals are harvested so that the younger animals can breed.

01:34:52.000 And so this is all calculated by wildlife biologists to make sure that they have healthy populations of these animals.

01:34:58.000 Yeah, just that, you know, mature bull has served his purpose, so to speak.

01:35:03.000 He's bred the animals over the years.

01:35:05.000 He's probably on the decline.

01:35:07.000 So it's a perfect time to take him out. 0.97

01:35:08.000 That's not what people, you know, people associate it almost instantly with, oh, you're fucking trophy hunting, you know, like, oh, you just want a bigger rack?

01:35:16.000 Like, they do that specifically because it's for the health of the population of these animals.

01:35:21.000 Yeah, I mean, you know, we care about the animals, we care about, and...

01:35:27.000 We do like to kill a big animal, but it's dual purpose. 0.96

01:35:31.000 We want to kill a big animal because it's hard. 1.00

01:35:37.000 They're smart. 1.00

01:35:38.000 They're wiser.

01:35:38.000 An older, mature animal, especially with a bow.

01:35:41.000 So that's hard to do.

01:35:42.000 And then also, on the dual purpose side, it helps the health of the herd.

01:35:48.000 So we're doing the best we can.

01:35:50.000 But most of all, when you go back to bow hunting in general, it's just...

01:35:55.000 For me, it's just the test.

01:35:57.000 The ultimate test is something that's very hard, and that's the draw.

01:36:00.000 Yeah, and that hunt also really exemplifies why your hard work is so important.

01:36:07.000 First of all, you shot the moose at 90 yards, which is an incredible... 0.99

01:36:11.000 We were shooting today at 45 yards and as far as fuck. 0.99

01:36:14.000 I never said how far I shot that moose until right now. 0.99

01:36:16.000 I just told people, sorry.

01:36:18.000 Well, listen, I mean, you know, Tim Gillingham, we were talking about on the Gritty Bowman podcast, who is a world champion archer who was talking about routinely shooting animals over 100 yards.

01:36:27.000 And then he does this because he's a world champion archer and he can do that.

01:36:31.000 When you're shooting a moose, the distance that you can shoot a moose versus a guy like me who, by the way, I still shoot every day, but I just, I can't do that.

01:36:39.000 I'm not, it's not an ethical distance for me, but it is for you.

01:36:43.000 And to have to haul that animal out, sorry to blow up your spot about 90 yards.

01:36:47.000 I thought you already told people.

01:36:49.000 But it was a perfect shot.

01:36:51.000 Right.

01:36:51.000 I mean, but that's a funny area with shooting something.

01:36:56.000 A rifle shot at 90 yards.

01:36:58.000 First mule deer, that mule deer right there to your left, that was 200 yards.

01:37:02.000 That was the first time I ever pulled a trigger on anything.

01:37:03.000 Yeah.

01:37:04.000 Anything.

01:37:04.000 Right.

01:37:05.000 And that was 200 yards.

01:37:06.000 But with a rifle, that's normal.

01:37:08.000 You get a rest with a rifle.

01:37:09.000 Yeah.

01:37:10.000 You don't punch the trigger.

01:37:11.000 I was prone.

01:37:11.000 I was lying on my stomach.

01:37:13.000 The whole thing was perfect.

01:37:14.000 Yeah.

01:37:14.000 I mean, the rifle is a tool.

01:37:16.000 You just let it perform.

01:37:18.000 It's gonna work.

01:37:19.000 Yeah.

01:37:19.000 You know, with the bow, it's just a lot of variables.

01:37:23.000 So all of your preparation, the shooting every day for years and decades, really, and then also your physical fitness to be able to pack out.

01:37:32.000 I mean, a moose, how much pounds does that thing weigh?

01:37:36.000 We had about 600 pounds of meat.

01:37:39.000 That's just the meat.

01:37:41.000 Just the meat.

01:37:42.000 I mean, how much did the animal weigh?

01:37:43.000 Oh, I don't know.

01:37:45.000 Over, I mean, 1,200 pounds, probably 1,000 pounds.

01:37:47.000 I don't know.

01:37:48.000 It's an enormous, enormous animal.

01:37:50.000 Yeah.

01:37:50.000 Until you see one, like, and you're there physically next to it, you don't realize.

01:37:55.000 No.

01:37:55.000 It took us hours to break.

01:37:57.000 You know, I killed it. 0.60

01:37:58.000 It was in the evening.

01:38:00.000 And Roy and I, we had cameramen there, but they ended up just, they filmed a little bit of the process of breaking it down.

01:38:07.000 Then they headed back to the spike camp.

01:38:09.000 And uh, Roy and I stayed there, which we like just doing it by ourselves back there together, singing.

01:38:18.000 What were you singing?

01:38:20.000 He would always sing.

01:38:22.000 I don't know.

01:38:22.000 Really?

01:38:23.000 What kind of stuff did he sing?

01:38:25.000 You know, Country Girl, Shake It For Me, a little Luke Bryan, maybe.

01:38:28.000 Little Lady Gaga, I think.

01:38:31.000 Oh, God.

01:38:32.000 Yeah, he was a well-versed, terrible singer.

01:38:39.000 But it was just what we did.

01:38:41.000 Right.

01:38:42.000 Well, it's also...

01:38:42.000 Just part of the deal.

01:38:44.000 You were happy.

01:38:45.000 Oh.

01:38:46.000 Successful hunt.

01:38:47.000 It was, you know...

01:38:49.000 God.

01:38:50.000 You know, I'm just going to miss those times with him because it's just hard knowing the journey we'd been through together.

01:39:03.000 That's why it's so appreciated.

01:39:06.000 And, you know, who else...

01:39:08.000 You know, there's another example.

01:39:09.000 We hunted this year and hunted the brown bear together.

01:39:13.000 I killed this bear.

01:39:17.000 The sow went over and was attacking the corpse of the bear. 0.83

01:39:21.000 The bear died.

01:39:22.000 She didn't know what was going on.

01:39:24.000 She smelled blood, just went crazy.

01:39:26.000 These brown bear are, they're big predators.

01:39:30.000 And something goes in their head, it's going to have an issue.

01:39:33.000 So she heard, when I shot the boar, It made a noise.

01:39:38.000 It sort of ran towards her.

01:39:40.000 She stood up, didn't know what was going on, knew he had made this noise, so she ran towards where he was.

01:39:47.000 Well, as soon as she hit his path, she smelled the blood from where my arrow passed through him.

01:39:52.000 So she tracked him by the blood, just basically running, smelling blood, blood, blood.

01:39:56.000 She got to him and he had died already.

01:39:58.000 She started attacking him.

01:39:59.000 You know, this is just what they do.

01:40:01.000 These are, you know, these aren't crying, hugging bear.

01:40:04.000 And, uh, So she's going, and I'm with Roy, and I'm like, I said, she's tearing up my bear.

01:40:10.000 And I'm like, get off my bear!

01:40:12.000 And I'm yelling to her.

01:40:13.000 I'm like, you know, and so I tell Roy, I'm like, I said, shoot out there.

01:40:18.000 So he shoots.

01:40:19.000 Boom.

01:40:19.000 And she's like, didn't even...

01:40:22.000 He didn't shoot at her.

01:40:23.000 He just was making a noise.

01:40:25.000 Just a scare.

01:40:25.000 Nothing.

01:40:26.000 I'm like, hey, get off that bear!

01:40:28.000 And she looked up.

01:40:29.000 And then she saw us.

01:40:31.000 All of a sudden, here she comes sprinting. 0.97

01:40:33.000 And it was like, what is going on?

01:40:37.000 She's like a blood frenzy. 1.00

01:40:38.000 Yeah.

01:40:38.000 It was so much going on at one time.

01:40:41.000 And then it got something triggered in her head. 0.99

01:40:44.000 And she was just crazy. 0.98

01:40:47.000 So here she comes. 0.99

01:40:48.000 And I killed my bears in a creek. 0.99

01:40:50.000 She got to the creek, and Roy says, if she doesn't stop, I'm going to have to shoot her. 0.98

01:40:55.000 And I said, yeah. 0.80

01:40:56.000 So she comes up to our side of the creek, and I have an arrow knocked, and I don't know what I'm going to do with an arrow, but I never pack a gun.

01:41:04.000 So I just had my bow, and he had the gun.

01:41:07.000 She stands up at 20 yards away.

01:41:09.000 And we're just standing there, and it's a standoff.

01:41:13.000 And so we think, well, she stood up.

01:41:15.000 She's going to see what's going on.

01:41:18.000 There's three of us standing there, and she's going to say, okay, I'll drop down and leave.

01:41:22.000 So we're like, get out of here!

01:41:24.000 And she drops down.

01:41:27.000 Beeline right towards us. 0.97

01:41:28.000 At 20 yards.

01:41:29.000 Charging.

01:41:30.000 And so Roy, boom!

01:41:31.000 And he drops her, you know, one shot, made a good shot, he hit, like, missed her head, but hit, like, right here, and just folded her right there.

01:41:40.000 And what stands out for me is that...

01:41:45.000 You know, we were never worried about our lives were at stake.

01:41:53.000 We're never worried about, you know, like maybe a typical reaction would be like, oh my God, we could have died or something like that.

01:42:00.000 I was just like, I cussed because I'm like, I was mad she did that and required Roy to act.

01:42:09.000 You know, so I was just, I cussed and he's like, he's like, dude, I had to.

01:42:14.000 And so we weren't worried about ourselves.

01:42:17.000 We were just, we didn't want to have to kill another bear.

01:42:19.000 And we weren't nervous about the situation.

01:42:22.000 And I'm like, I said, I know.

01:42:24.000 And it was like, where else am I gonna have somebody that's on that same page with me that's calm in that situation and not see their life flash before their eyes?

01:42:32.000 Just do what you have to do to stop the risk.

01:42:37.000 That's never going to happen.

01:42:38.000 I'm never going to have somebody like that in my life again.

01:42:41.000 And I think about, we knew the risks, we're involved in everything that we did, and we embraced it, and we were fine with it, and it didn't consume us or anything.

01:42:53.000 And that's what I'm going to miss, is having somebody so...

01:42:57.000 On my same page that I can trust like that.

01:43:00.000 Roy was the best.

01:43:02.000 You would have to have someone who's experienced that as many times as Roy has had where he knew exactly what he had to do in that moment.

01:43:09.000 Yeah, he did.

01:43:10.000 And people know what they have to do.

01:43:13.000 It's executing that is what's hard.

01:43:17.000 So knowing what it takes, not panicking, being in control, and then getting the job done with one shot.

01:43:25.000 Very rare.

01:43:26.000 Very rare.

01:43:26.000 And he was...

01:43:27.000 So Roy in those situations was...

01:43:31.000 I don't know everybody.

01:43:33.000 I haven't been with everybody.

01:43:34.000 But I would say he's as good as anybody that I know of.

01:43:41.000 That's why when he fell and I got the news that he fell and died...

01:43:47.000 I mean I could I could believe it I guess but I was mad and I'm still mad and I know everything happens for a reason and I know you know he has he has a lot of faith and I know you know We want to think everything's gonna be okay and we'll see each other again.

01:44:04.000 I know all that but it still makes me mad Because you know We missed out on a lot of experiences we'd still love to have,

01:44:19.000 and we talked about, and we were just like, we had these big goals and big dreams, and I'm mad that that's gone.

01:44:31.000 It's completely...

01:44:32.000 It's not just understandable.

01:44:35.000 It's something that very few people could probably relate to the kind of intimate friendship that you would have with someone who's experienced those kind of hunts.

01:44:43.000 It's been in the wilderness that's done...

01:44:46.000 Like that moose hunt that you were talking about when you guys were deep, deep in the wilderness like that.

01:44:55.000 It's something that very few people will ever...

01:45:00.000 Very few people have ever experienced that kind of danger, that kind of intimate moment in the wilderness.

01:45:06.000 Just that connection to the wild that you guys had together.

01:45:10.000 Right.

01:45:11.000 And so the whole point, I guess, with all that is people say, well, you're murderous or you want to kill.

01:45:20.000 Such a small part of what me and Roy experienced together, the kills were...

01:45:27.000 I mean, we achieved our goal.

01:45:30.000 That was it.

01:45:31.000 It was the journey.

01:45:33.000 It was the brotherhood.

01:45:34.000 It was, you know, growing up.

01:45:36.000 And that's what hunting is.

01:45:40.000 It's not just you're out killing.

01:45:41.000 It's you're experiencing nature at its most brutal or its most rewarding or the entire gamut.

01:45:50.000 And when that makes you who you are, It's powerful.

01:45:55.000 And that's, you know, that's what hunting was to us.

01:45:59.000 Yeah, there's a lot of people that are listening to this, I'm sure, they're like, well, you know, why is that?

01:46:05.000 Why should you feel any worse for your friend than we should for the animals that you killed?

01:46:11.000 You know, there's a lot of people that they sort of connect animals almost with people in a way, or maybe even better than people in a way.

01:46:20.000 Maybe.

01:46:21.000 And I think that's a good part of this disconnect that we're talking about.

01:46:25.000 These people, they don't experience these moments.

01:46:28.000 They don't know anybody like that.

01:46:31.000 They don't have a friendship with someone like Roy.

01:46:34.000 They haven't had these experiences like you did with him.

01:46:38.000 Yeah, it's...

01:46:39.000 I mean, you sent me the text.

01:46:42.000 I'm sorry to interrupt you, but you sent me the text when he died, and I knew, you know, I knew that that had to be just devastating, too.

01:46:53.000 It still is.

01:46:57.000 Yeah.

01:46:58.000 I mean, I don't think there's...

01:47:00.000 There's very few men like Roy.

01:47:03.000 He was capable.

01:47:07.000 He was...

01:47:09.000 Just somebody you could count on.

01:47:10.000 Anybody could count on.

01:47:11.000 And...

01:47:14.000 It's just, you know, tough to replace.

01:47:16.000 Well, it's very easy to get by in this world today.

01:47:19.000 It's very easy to get by without being that kind of a person.

01:47:22.000 It's very difficult to become that kind of a person, to always make the right decisions, to always push ahead, to always show character, to always be someone that you can count on.

01:47:33.000 It's hard.

01:47:34.000 Yeah.

01:47:35.000 Society today is too easy, I believe.

01:47:38.000 And so...

01:47:40.000 That's why I think that's kind of the draw for me to pushing myself the way I do physically, mentally.

01:47:46.000 If something's easy, I'm not attracted to it.

01:47:50.000 I want to be hard.

01:47:52.000 I want it to be hard.

01:47:53.000 I want it to be difficult.

01:47:56.000 Because society makes us weak.

01:47:58.000 It makes us feel entitled.

01:48:01.000 And I don't like it.

01:48:05.000 Every day I feel, unless I'm beat down or tired or whatever, I don't feel like I achieved what I needed to achieve that day.

01:48:15.000 And it's just...

01:48:17.000 I can't expect anybody else to feel like that.

01:48:19.000 That's just me.

01:48:20.000 Everybody else is motivated by different things, have different priorities.

01:48:24.000 I'm just for me.

01:48:26.000 And so finding somebody who is of the same mindset as me can be tough.

01:48:34.000 It's very rare.

01:48:35.000 It's it's hard for people to gravitate towards challenge, but through challenge you get the greatest reward because through staying in bed like this there's that the call of the bed is strong the warm bed and just oh Let me just hit fucking snooze in this alarm clock and get nine more minutes or let me just shut it off and call in sick to work Let me just not do what I'm supposed to do.

01:48:57.000 Let me just sleep And there was an article that I posted recently where they were talking about the power that dopamine has and dopamine in memories.

01:49:07.000 And it's one of the reasons why people have such a hard time kicking bad habits is because we gravitate towards these like...

01:49:15.000 Reward experiences that we have in our head the reward of eating shitty food or of drinking too much or it's your your mind sort of carves these paths towards these Rewarding like almost self-destructive behaviors because those they give you dopamine whether it's eating shitty food or whatever but Yeah.

01:50:01.000 This weakness inside of you that wants you to quit.

01:50:03.000 Right.

01:50:04.000 That everybody experiences at some point in their life.

01:50:06.000 And it's a matter of how you react to that experience and how you react to that pull.

01:50:13.000 The pull towards the bed is strong.

01:50:15.000 Yeah.

01:50:16.000 The pull towards weakness is strong because it's so easy to do.

01:50:18.000 It's so easy to quit.

01:50:19.000 It's easy to quit.

01:50:20.000 It is.

01:50:21.000 You see it all the time.

01:50:22.000 It's one reason why, I mean, it seems minor, but, you know, when I get up at 4 or 5 in the morning, I have to be at work at 7. But when I get up early to do my fasted cardio runs, and I'm out, and so I have no fuel, I'm out there, there's nobody out at 4 or 5 in the morning.

01:50:39.000 And I'm running into the neighborhoods by my house.

01:50:41.000 All the lights are off.

01:50:43.000 I just envision people in there comfortable sleeping.

01:50:46.000 And I feel like, you know, it's...

01:50:49.000 I feel...

01:50:51.000 I feel the best then.

01:50:53.000 It's like when I run the mountain when it's sunny, I don't feel as good as when I run it when it's pouring rain.

01:50:58.000 Because it's easy to go out and do it when it's sunny.

01:51:01.000 If I run on a weekend in the middle of the day, lots of people out there.

01:51:06.000 I don't feel that accomplished.

01:51:08.000 When I do it at 4 or 5 in the morning when nobody's out there, it's just like that in my head.

01:51:13.000 My head might not be normal, but I just love...

01:51:17.000 And people always say...

01:51:20.000 You know, all that running, you're going to be in a wheelchair by the time you're 60. And I'm like, who's guaranteed to live to 60?

01:51:27.000 I mean, I might die tomorrow.

01:51:29.000 So what am I supposed to do?

01:51:31.000 Save myself for what?

01:51:32.000 I want to know that I gave all I have every day.

01:51:38.000 Because tomorrow's not guaranteed.

01:51:40.000 So, I mean, I just don't get...

01:51:42.000 I have a hard time with that mindset of the...

01:51:47.000 The moderation mindset.

01:51:49.000 Those people that are saying that, they're peering through the curtains while you're running by their house.

01:51:53.000 I think they're asleep.

01:51:55.000 He's going to wind up in a wheelchair, not me. 1.00

01:51:58.000 I'm here farting.

01:52:00.000 Yeah, I don't know.

01:52:02.000 So some people criticize, and maybe I will be on a wheelchair, but I'll know that I lived as hard as I could live and pushed as hard as I could when I could do it.

01:52:15.000 I'm not gonna regret it.

01:52:17.000 Yeah, the people that try to knock someone down for working hard and overcoming extreme obstacles, what they're doing is they're responding to their own insecurity.

01:52:28.000 I mean, there's logical things.

01:52:30.000 There's people that's, you know, there's people that look at certain types of extreme sports where, you know, there's that BMX guy, what's his name, Dave Mira, who just committed suicide.

01:52:40.000 Horrible, horrible tragedy, you know husband father the whole deal I gotta think it's connected to head trauma and I think you're talking about a completely different thing when you're talking about head trauma because You know these poor guys that do these extreme sports and they wind up getting really banged up Yeah,

01:52:58.000 and that causes some pretty severe depression so I think In circumstances like that, I think you're talking about a kind of a different animal, but people will criticize people who take chances in life.

01:53:10.000 People will criticize people who work hard.

01:53:12.000 You know, like, why do you have to lift weights?

01:53:14.000 Why do you... 1.00

01:53:14.000 Like, there was an article that we had talked about that some asshole had written in some bow hunting magazine about you. 1.00

01:53:20.000 No, it was online, yeah. 0.99

01:53:22.000 Yeah, whatever it was. 0.99

01:53:23.000 Yeah, it was just talking shit about, like, why does, you know, he have to, you know, you don't have to lift weights like this guy. 1.00

01:53:29.000 You don't have to, this is ridiculous. 1.00

01:53:30.000 Well, guess what? 0.98

01:53:31.000 Yeah, you do.

01:53:32.000 If you want to do what you can do, you have to.

01:53:35.000 Yeah.

01:53:36.000 What he's doing by writing that is looking at someone who works harder than him, accomplishes more than him, and he's trying to chop you down.

01:53:42.000 And that's crabs in a bucket, man.

01:53:44.000 That's what people do.

01:53:45.000 You ever see crabs in a bucket? 1.00

01:53:46.000 If you don't know what I'm talking about, folks, if you see crabs in a bucket, they never get out of that fucking bucket. 0.97

01:53:51.000 Because if they work together, one crab could stand on another crab, and the other crab could grab them on top, and then they could figure out a way to push that bucket over, and they could all get out. 0.99

01:53:58.000 But nope.

01:53:58.000 What happens is one crab tries to get to the top, and the other crabs pull them down.

01:54:02.000 And that's what a lot of people are.

01:54:04.000 A lot of people are crabs in a bucket.

01:54:06.000 And it's just a weakness and an insecurity and a lot of times it's because they don't know anybody like you.

01:54:12.000 They don't know anybody like Roy.

01:54:13.000 They don't know anybody that can push them. 1.00

01:54:16.000 They don't know anybody that they can look at their friend and they can say, you know, this motherfucker can do it. 1.00

01:54:22.000 I can do it too. 1.00

01:54:23.000 I know what he would do right now.

01:54:26.000 Here's a funny story.

01:54:27.000 I was in... 0.99

01:54:29.000 Texas with Aubrey, and we were pig hunting, and we were in this fucking miserable environment. 0.99

01:54:38.000 There were so many mosquitoes. 0.99

01:54:39.000 It was brutal.

01:54:41.000 I mean, we were just getting mauled.

01:54:42.000 By the end of the day, I mean, it looked like I had some kind of crazy disease, like my whole body was covered in mosquito bites. 0.96

01:54:48.000 And I thought to myself while I was out there, if Cam Haynes was out here, he would fucking keep going. 0.80

01:54:54.000 He would just deal with the fact that mosquitoes are biting him and he would keep going. 0.99

01:54:57.000 And Aubrey said, how the fuck did you get through all those mosquitoes? 0.98

01:55:01.000 And I said, I thought that if Cam Haynes was out here, he would keep going. 0.99

01:55:04.000 He goes, that's hilarious.

01:55:05.000 He goes, I thought if Joe Rogan can do it, I can do it.

01:55:10.000 So you, without even being there, pushed me, and me, because I kept going, it pushed him. 0.99

01:55:16.000 It was fucking miserable. 0.98

01:55:18.000 It was this cloud of mosquitoes we just swarmed on. 0.99

01:55:21.000 Well, you know, I mean, it is a funny story, but...

01:55:26.000 I do in some way feel responsibility to the people that follow me or look up to me to not give up.

01:55:35.000 I know people look to me for inspiration and it helps.

01:55:40.000 It's like when I don't feel like doing something, I think about all the people who expect me to.

01:55:45.000 I mean, I have a huge drive to do it myself, but it's just like sometimes those little things and thinking about this story with you or people who have lost 100 pounds thinking about, you know, the work I put in.

01:55:59.000 It's like all those things have made me who I am.

01:56:02.000 So it's not like I might think about specific stories, but I think about all the people who have been such a positive person.

01:56:10.000 They've made such a positive impact on me, because I guess I have it on them, you know, so in return.

01:56:16.000 And it makes me, you know, like the Bigfoot 200 that I'm doing, if I'm just on my own and nobody knows who I am, I'm much less...

01:56:35.000 Yeah.

01:56:46.000 That's a type of things we need to focus on, I believe.

01:56:50.000 Inspiration is a two-way street.

01:56:52.000 Yeah, definitely.

01:56:52.000 When you inspire people, I do these meet and greets after shows all the time.

01:56:57.000 And I can't tell you how many people I'll come up to after a show that say, I lost 100 pounds.

01:57:01.000 Once I started listening to your podcast, I started eating healthy.

01:57:04.000 I started looking at my body in a different way.

01:57:06.000 I started realizing I would be happier if I took care of myself.

01:57:09.000 And then I'm happier when I do force myself to exercise.

01:57:12.000 Right.

01:57:12.000 And now I do it every day and I'm drinking kale shakes and I'm eating healthy foods and I stop drinking and all this.

01:57:17.000 And it makes me feel better.

01:57:19.000 I mean, I think about it when I work out.

01:57:21.000 I think that's where inspiration is a two-way street.

01:57:25.000 And then it's also like we were talking about like you've created a community through your social media and through the positive posts that you make and through...

01:57:34.000 Through all your actions and all the different things you've done, you've created this sort of sense of community where all these other people, they feed off of that, and you feed off of them, and we all feed off of each other.

01:57:44.000 Yeah.

01:57:44.000 And through this podcast, too, man, this is an inspirational podcast.

01:57:48.000 I'm going to listen to this podcast when I work out tomorrow.

01:57:50.000 Yeah.

01:57:51.000 When I do my morning workout tomorrow, I'm going to put this on my headphones, and I'm going to listen to this.

01:57:55.000 I'm going to listen specifically to the story about you and Roy.

01:57:59.000 Yeah.

01:57:59.000 And that...

01:58:00.000 You know, people want to be that kind of person, you know? 1.00

01:58:04.000 People don't want to be a lazy fuck who criticizes people for no reason. 1.00

01:58:07.000 They don't want to be that guy that's weak and that talks shit about someone when they're not there because they feel bad that that person is out there working out. 1.00

01:58:14.000 Like, you don't have to do what Cam Haynes is doing. 1.00

01:58:16.000 Like, shut the fuck up. 1.00

01:58:17.000 You know what you're doing, bitch. 1.00

01:58:19.000 You know what you're doing when you're doing that. 1.00

01:58:20.000 While you're doing it, you know what you're doing.

01:58:21.000 While you're making those, you know, there's a little sneaky voice in the back of your head, unless you're completely obtuse, unless you're completely oblivious to the way you interact and interface with the world, you know what you're doing when you're saying those things.

01:58:32.000 You're trying to chop someone down because they make you feel weak.

01:58:35.000 Instead of saying, this guy is out there doing something awesome.

01:58:40.000 What's negative about someone working out and being healthy?

01:58:43.000 What's negative about someone who values physical fitness and accomplishing difficult goals?

01:58:49.000 That is the essence of character.

01:58:51.000 That's the essence of what's inspirational about a person.

01:58:54.000 I'm not inspired by someone who sleeps till 2. I'm not inspired by someone who can't not eat shitty food and loves to smoke. 0.98

01:59:01.000 I'm inspired by discipline. 0.95

01:59:03.000 Discipline.

01:59:03.000 I love discipline.

01:59:05.000 You talked about The Rock.

01:59:07.000 Guys like The Rock.

01:59:09.000 The Rock is out to 40 million.

01:59:12.000 You get out to...

01:59:13.000 How many will listen to this podcast?

01:59:15.000 I don't know.

01:59:16.000 It'd be more than a million, for sure.

01:59:18.000 Millions.

01:59:18.000 And over the course of how many years this is out there in the world?

01:59:21.000 Right.

01:59:22.000 So I'm inspired by you, The Rock.

01:59:24.000 And so in my own little bowhunting world, I just try to live up to that.

01:59:29.000 And, you know, I guess what I wanted, I want to thank you for giving me this platform, giving me access to all you've created here, because, you know, as we've talked about, that's what feels good, to reach people, inspire people,

01:59:44.000 and yeah, maybe they'll be inspired, maybe even a little by the heartbreak of losing a good buddy, you know, maybe to be...

01:59:51.000 A better friend or maybe to be somebody who, I don't know, that integral part of somebody else's life, maybe that'll inspire them, maybe the workout part, who knows?

02:00:00.000 Maybe to be a better, I don't know, more understanding to the vegans and be able to explain it better.

02:00:06.000 There's so much you can take from this podcast and without you giving me this microphone, it would never happen.

02:00:12.000 So I want to thank you and I'm so grateful.

02:00:16.000 I'm so happy I've met you and we've created this friendship.

02:00:19.000 I couldn't be more happy myself.

02:00:21.000 And again, that inspiration is a two-way street.

02:00:24.000 This podcast doesn't exist if it's not for other people.

02:00:26.000 I mean, all I am is like an antenna or something, just broadcasting my thoughts and other people's thoughts too.

02:00:33.000 And without a guy like you to introduce me to something like bowhunting, I would have no idea.

02:00:37.000 I would have gone to my grave without having any idea how rewarding it is to go and get my own meat Through archery in the woods, how difficult it is to pursue such an incredibly demanding discipline and what that's about.

02:00:53.000 And for you being inspirational and for you creating those videos, you reached me.

02:00:58.000 And you touched me with your positivity and with your inspiration and with your dedication and focus.

02:01:05.000 And I live for that, man.

02:01:07.000 I live for inspiration.

02:01:08.000 That's my fuel.

02:01:09.000 I love it.

02:01:10.000 I love inspiring people.

02:01:13.000 I love people that are inspiring me and I love inspiring other people.

02:01:16.000 I love inspiration.

02:01:17.000 I think it's one of the most powerful aspects about our newfound ability to communicate with each other.

02:01:23.000 Right.

02:01:24.000 Social media.

02:01:25.000 So you can be a negative anchor or you can inspire.

02:01:28.000 So maybe that's the message of the podcast today.

02:01:31.000 Get out there.

02:01:32.000 Like I say, make a positive difference.

02:01:34.000 Yes.

02:01:35.000 That's it.

02:01:35.000 We can all do it.

02:01:36.000 It doesn't have to be big.

02:01:37.000 It doesn't have to beat a 40 million or 10 million or a 1 million.

02:01:40.000 It can beat a one guy.

02:01:42.000 Yes.

02:01:42.000 Make a positive difference.

02:01:43.000 We can all do it.

02:01:44.000 And we can all do it in our own way.

02:01:46.000 And it's the better way to live.

02:01:49.000 It's the better way to live.

02:01:50.000 This...

02:01:52.000 The world that we're living in right now is essentially a global community that's coming to awaken.

02:01:58.000 It's aware of itself now in a way that's never been before.

02:02:01.000 We can communicate with each other. 1.00

02:02:04.000 There's this strange new time where you could seek out shit that pisses you off. 1.00

02:02:10.000 You could just fucking spend all day on Kanye West's Instagram page and get angry. 0.99

02:02:16.000 You can just scour through the worst aspects of all sorts of different people, or you can choose to be inspired. 0.97

02:02:24.000 You can choose to live your life in a powerful and dedicated way.

02:02:29.000 But there's only one way to do that, and it's through action.

02:02:32.000 Yeah, it's a choice.

02:02:34.000 Yeah, it is a choice, man.

02:02:35.000 But it's a good choice.

02:02:36.000 It's a great choice to make.

02:02:39.000 Through that choice, you enrich yourself, and you enrich the other people that you come in contact with.

02:02:45.000 And then we're stronger as a society, for sure.

02:02:49.000 No, we're not perfect people, folks.

02:02:51.000 No. 0.99

02:02:51.000 We all fuck up. 0.99

02:02:52.000 We all get mad when we shouldn't get mad. 1.00

02:02:55.000 We all falter.

02:02:56.000 And through those lessons of failure, sometimes the disappointment you have in yourself when you come up short is the fuel you need to make sure you never come up short that way again.

02:03:07.000 And maybe you'll come up short another way next week. 0.98

02:03:09.000 Well, that fucking thing's never going to happen again either. 0.99

02:03:12.000 And you're going to find a way. 0.99

02:03:14.000 It's a process, yeah.

02:03:14.000 Yeah, it is a process.

02:03:16.000 And that's one of the things that I really try to drill into people's heads.

02:03:19.000 They go, how have you done so many things? 0.84

02:03:21.000 I've done so many things because I've sucked at all of them.

02:03:24.000 Everything I've ever tried, I sucked at in the beginning. 0.73

02:03:28.000 Everything.

02:03:28.000 You fail, and then you learn how to not fail.

02:03:32.000 How do you do that? 0.99

02:03:34.000 Well, you take goddamn chances. 0.99

02:03:35.000 That's how you start bow hunting at 45. You gotta fucking take chances. 1.00

02:03:39.000 And if you don't take chances, if you stay within your comfort zone, man, that's not a fun life. 0.99

02:03:44.000 It's a cushiony life.

02:03:49.000 It's probably a little safer.

02:03:51.000 It's insulated.

02:03:52.000 And that's what I'd always respected about you is when you started bow hunting and, you know, it's because I know firsthand how difficult it is.

02:03:59.000 So you've been successful in so many different arenas, right?

02:04:03.000 And Ben, you're Joe Rogan. 0.98

02:04:06.000 All of a sudden, Joe Rogan is a new bowhunter who doesn't know shit about anything. 0.97

02:04:11.000 And it's like, for you to say, I'm okay with that, that's a big deal. 0.95

02:04:16.000 Most people who have been so successful don't want to be starting out on ground zero again.

02:04:21.000 So, I mean, for you to do that and then become so just disciplined and enamored with the discipline of bowhunting has been awesome.

02:04:31.000 And I love it.

02:04:33.000 I love doing things I suck at.

02:04:36.000 Most people don't.

02:04:37.000 That's why I like yoga, man.

02:04:39.000 I mean, it's why when we were working out today, you have that same sort of approach.

02:04:44.000 I was showing you all these crazy new exercises, and you were gravitating towards the ones you weren't good at.

02:04:49.000 Oh, yeah.

02:04:50.000 I mean, I love pushing myself.

02:04:54.000 It's like...

02:04:54.000 When I work out with new people, I love exposing them to...

02:04:59.000 I said, okay, this workout doesn't start until you're miserable.

02:05:03.000 And then once you're miserable, then it counts.

02:05:05.000 Because everybody can do it when it's easy.

02:05:09.000 Okay, now you can't do it.

02:05:11.000 Now we start.

02:05:12.000 Yeah.

02:05:12.000 And it's just like, you know, I had a good...

02:05:14.000 I just like exposing people.

02:05:16.000 And what I always say, you know, and other people have said it too, I had to invent this, but being comfortable from being uncomfortable.

02:05:23.000 Yes.

02:05:23.000 And just getting in that moment where, okay, now I'm here, now I want to start gaining.

02:05:28.000 Yes.

02:05:28.000 You know?

02:05:29.000 And that's just the journey.

02:05:32.000 Anything that has a big reward is going to require that.

02:05:35.000 Well, that's the essence of jiu-jitsu.

02:05:36.000 The essence of jiu-jitsu is being comfortable while you're uncomfortable.

02:05:40.000 Because...

02:05:41.000 Everybody gets tapped.

02:05:43.000 There's no way to get good at jujitsu unless you get mauled by another person.

02:05:46.000 It's the only way.

02:05:48.000 And, you know, for me, I started jujitsu as, you know, a former taekwondo champion who would spend my whole life...

02:05:55.000 I was successful at striking.

02:05:57.000 My whole life I had done, you know... 0.98

02:06:00.000 Different forms of striking competitions, and then all of a sudden I'm doing jujitsu and getting fucking crushed by people of my size or smaller, and they're just beating the piss out of me. 0.98

02:06:10.000 Like I'm a ragdoll, like I'm a grappling dummy. 0.72

02:06:13.000 And for me, I had to realize, first of all, I had to address the fact that I was nowhere near as competent in self-defense as I thought I was.

02:06:22.000 Like, as soon as these guys got a hold of me, they were just strangling me.

02:06:24.000 I was like, okay.

02:06:25.000 Like, my perception of what I could do versus the reality of what I could do, I had to just address it.

02:06:32.000 I had to figure it out. 1.00

02:06:33.000 And so, okay, now I gotta get fucking crazy and attached to this shit. 1.00

02:06:37.000 And then I became... 1.00

02:06:39.000 Completely obsessed with that, of training.

02:06:43.000 But that's one of the beautiful things about Jiu-Jitsu.

02:06:45.000 One of the things about Jiu-Jitsu that I admire most in the truly good practitioners is they have very healthy egos.

02:06:53.000 Because their egos get tested.

02:06:55.000 Yeah, they're in check all the time.

02:06:56.000 They're constantly tapping.

02:06:58.000 You tap all the time.

02:07:00.000 I mean, I don't think I've ever gone more than a few months of my whole life without tapping.

02:07:04.000 Well, and that's the same with bow hunting.

02:07:06.000 Don't start bowhunting unless you can deal with failure.

02:07:08.000 It's a humbling, just like the discipline you're talking about.

02:07:14.000 Bowhunting is a discipline just like that where it will humble you no matter how good you think you are.

02:07:18.000 I think all very difficult things Are good for you.

02:07:22.000 As long as it doesn't kill you, it's good for you. 1.00

02:07:25.000 I mean, these goddamn ultramarathons you're running, this crazy fuck, 100 miles is not enough. 1.00

02:07:32.000 You're like, well, I've already done that a couple of times, now I've got to do a 200. So here's the Bigfoot 200. Here's quick facts Jamie just pulled up. 1.00

02:07:39.000 Just under 50,000 feet.

02:07:42.000 Of ascent.

02:07:43.000 15,240 meters of ascent.

02:07:46.000 More than 96,000 feet of elevation change.

02:07:49.000 203.8 miles, nonstop, point to point.

02:07:54.000 Six sleep stations with full aid, hot food, medical and crew access.

02:07:58.000 16 full aid stations.

02:08:01.000 The race starts at Mount St. Helens in the Cascade Mountain Range of Washington State and finishes in Randall, Washington, traversing point-to-point the Cascade Mountains.

02:08:10.000 That's insane.

02:08:11.000 That's...

02:08:12.000 So my goal with it...

02:08:14.000 And I've never done a 200, obviously.

02:08:16.000 The furthest I've run is 106.5 miles in 24 hours.

02:08:19.000 So this will be a new test.

02:08:22.000 And my goal for this...

02:08:25.000 And I don't even know if it's possible.

02:08:26.000 I don't want to sleep.

02:08:27.000 I don't want to take advantage of any of those sleep stations.

02:08:29.000 I want to be able to push through and finish in 60 hours.

02:08:32.000 And last year, 64 hours won it.

02:08:35.000 And I'm trying to...

02:08:36.000 That's what I'm training.

02:08:37.000 You want to beat that?

02:08:38.000 I want to beat that.

02:08:39.000 I want to beat 64 and I just want to grind it out.

02:08:43.000 I want to be better than I've ever been And so that's, you know, right now I'm training, I haven't been training this hard this early in the year.

02:08:51.000 So I'm taking it, I'm doing a lot of miles but not hammering hard and trying to build up that base.

02:08:58.000 So come August, I hope to line up there for the Bigfoot 200 and I hope to run it faster than it's ever been run.

02:09:04.000 Jesus Christ.

02:09:06.000 Are you going to lose body mass before you do that?

02:09:09.000 Yeah.

02:09:09.000 Because you're always lifting weights.

02:09:10.000 Like what are you going to do differently?

02:09:11.000 Yeah.

02:09:12.000 I need to get lighter.

02:09:14.000 You weigh about, what, 177?

02:09:16.000 Yeah, right now I am, you know, and I was up 182 or 183, and so I'm trying to, I want to get down, I'd like to get 69 maybe, you know, and I think, I just really feel like I'd be efficient at that, and I just, you know, it's, it's, It's physical,

02:09:32.000 but it's a lot mental also.

02:09:35.000 So, I mean, I'll prepare my body for it, but it's just whether I can hydrate and fuel well enough, smart enough, and just do everything, keep my feet healthy, that's what's going to determine whether I can finish in 60 hours.

02:09:49.000 So, I think I believe I have what it takes, but a lot of people probably have what it takes, but to implement it is going to be difficult, but I'm...

02:10:00.000 I can't wait.

02:10:01.000 I wish it was tomorrow.

02:10:02.000 What's the percentage of people who start that thing versus complete it?

02:10:06.000 I don't know.

02:10:06.000 I think it's a pretty high percentage because if you line up for $200, you didn't just decide to do that.

02:10:12.000 Right.

02:10:13.000 You know what I mean? 1.00

02:10:13.000 These people are crazy. 1.00

02:10:16.000 They've put in a lot of training. 1.00

02:10:18.000 And so if they're crazy enough...

02:10:21.000 I mean, it's $1,000 to run it.

02:10:22.000 So if they're crazy enough to pay the entry fee, line up there, they didn't just...

02:10:28.000 It wasn't on a whim.

02:10:30.000 They've geared their life towards it.

02:10:32.000 It's crazy, too, because it's not a thousand miles.

02:10:34.000 I mean, it's not 200 miles on a flat track.

02:10:36.000 No, it's mountains.

02:10:37.000 Mountains.

02:10:38.000 I mean, you know that 50,000 feet of ascent?

02:10:41.000 Oh, my God.

02:10:42.000 What is that?

02:10:43.000 Two Mount Everest?

02:10:44.000 Jesus Christ.

02:10:45.000 What is Mount Everest?

02:10:46.000 30,000 feet?

02:10:47.000 I think it's 26. Jesus.

02:10:49.000 Something like that.

02:10:50.000 So, I mean, it's two of those.

02:10:53.000 I mean, but it has that same...

02:10:55.000 So, it's 96,000 feet of change.

02:10:57.000 So, what that means is you're grinding up as much as you're hammering down.

02:11:00.000 And that down...

02:11:02.000 Breaks your quads down as, you know.

02:11:04.000 Because you have to slow yourself down.

02:11:06.000 Is this it?

02:11:07.000 This is a video of it?

02:11:08.000 Yeah.

02:11:09.000 So that's the country that it's in.

02:11:11.000 What is this guy doing?

02:11:12.000 He's walking. 1.00

02:11:12.000 Run, bitch. 1.00

02:11:13.000 Yeah. 1.00

02:11:13.000 What are you doing? 1.00

02:11:14.000 Why are you walking?

02:11:14.000 Well, there's like this.

02:11:15.000 Oh my God.

02:11:16.000 This is the country?

02:11:17.000 Yeah.

02:11:17.000 This is it?

02:11:18.000 You can't run this.

02:11:19.000 Wait a minute.

02:11:19.000 Hold on a second.

02:11:20.000 Yeah.

02:11:20.000 It's like this?

02:11:21.000 Yes. 1.00

02:11:22.000 Oh, fuck, dude. 1.00

02:11:23.000 Hardest ultra in the USA. How do you know which way to go? 1.00

02:11:25.000 How do you go left or right?

02:11:26.000 There'll be ribbons.

02:11:27.000 So there's probably ribbons that'll mark.

02:11:29.000 But this isn't...

02:11:31.000 No, you're not on a bike trail.

02:11:32.000 This is the hardest ultra in the USA? We need to document this.

02:11:35.000 So this is 200 miles of this.

02:11:37.000 And if you try to run...

02:11:39.000 Here's what I learned with ultras.

02:11:40.000 If you try to run...

02:11:42.000 Where it's super steep, all you're doing is going to blow your legs out.

02:11:45.000 Right.

02:11:45.000 I mean, so you have to get good at hiking, too, because you hike the super steep stuff.

02:11:49.000 Or this isn't even runnable, really.

02:11:51.000 No.

02:11:51.000 But you don't even want to try.

02:11:53.000 So it's all about being efficient and managing.

02:11:56.000 Managing your resource.

02:11:57.000 But it's a test.

02:12:00.000 To put it mildly.

02:12:01.000 Yeah.

02:12:02.000 So, I mean...

02:12:03.000 I don't know.

02:12:05.000 This is what I live for.

02:12:06.000 But listen, dude, there's a problem, and that is that this is in August, and you need to be healthy in September, because we've got to go back.

02:12:12.000 We're bowhunting in September.

02:12:14.000 It's all mental.

02:12:15.000 It's not all mental, man.

02:12:17.000 There's definitely some physical involved in that.

02:12:20.000 Yeah.

02:12:20.000 How many people have completed it?

02:12:22.000 I don't know.

02:12:24.000 Jamie, what is that one nutty run that you told me about that very few people know about?

02:12:28.000 The Barclays, I believe is what it's called.

02:12:30.000 Have you heard about this?

02:12:30.000 Yeah, that's intense.

02:12:31.000 What is that?

02:12:32.000 That's like, I don't even know if there's really a course.

02:12:36.000 There's no course.

02:12:37.000 It's really loose.

02:12:39.000 It's not marked.

02:12:40.000 You can get lost.

02:12:40.000 You have to have your own map.

02:12:41.000 Oh, great.

02:12:42.000 Yeah.

02:12:42.000 And it's something like 64 miles, maybe.

02:12:46.000 But it's like, I mean, you're in swamps.

02:12:49.000 It's nasty.

02:12:50.000 I mean, I think, God, it seems like four people finish or something.

02:12:54.000 They only allow in...

02:12:56.000 It's a small number.

02:12:58.000 I don't know that much.

02:12:59.000 I've heard about it.

02:13:00.000 One to two people finish it each time.

02:13:02.000 Some people don't finish it.

02:13:04.000 If I remember correctly, it's one way up during the day and you come back down during night and then you switch and go the opposite way the next day up and down.

02:13:14.000 If you can make it to that fifth turn, it's also the same kind of way.

02:13:19.000 It's non-stop.

02:13:19.000 If you want to sleep, you sleep.

02:13:21.000 You only have, I think, a window of 36 hours total to finish the whole thing if you can make it.

02:13:25.000 Yeah, maybe 48 hours.

02:13:27.000 But yeah, it's... 0.99

02:13:28.000 You got your eye on that fucking thing? 0.99

02:13:30.000 I don't know. 1.00

02:13:31.000 I mean, to me, the navigation is a whole different animal.

02:13:37.000 You know, I want to be prepared.

02:13:39.000 I want to know where the course is, roughly.

02:13:41.000 You know what I mean?

02:13:42.000 I don't really want to waste time having to read a map and figure a compass.

02:13:45.000 That's a whole different challenge, which...

02:13:48.000 Maybe I'll get to that at some point.

02:13:49.000 Right now, I just want to run 200 miles.

02:13:51.000 I want to run that race as fast as it's been run.

02:13:55.000 I don't know what I'm going to do.

02:13:57.000 I don't know what my body is going to do, but I want to find out and I'm looking forward to it.

02:14:01.000 Wow.

02:14:02.000 That's intense, man.

02:14:03.000 I'll be ready by September.

02:14:04.000 We should document it.

02:14:05.000 I should be in a Range Rover next to you.

02:14:08.000 Air conditioning.

02:14:09.000 Sipping lemonade.

02:14:11.000 Control a drone.

02:14:12.000 Oh, a drone.

02:14:14.000 How does someone document that?

02:14:18.000 You would have to have GoPros on or something like that because someone would have to go with you.

02:14:21.000 People have talked about filming it.

02:14:22.000 Maybe Under Armour will.

02:14:23.000 I'm not sure.

02:14:24.000 How are they going to do that?

02:14:25.000 I don't know. 0.99

02:14:25.000 You'd have to have some fucking savage that's willing to run it with you. 0.99

02:14:29.000 I know my brother's going to run some of it with me. 1.00

02:14:31.000 And he's a beast.

02:14:33.000 Yeah? 0.53

02:14:33.000 Yeah. 0.53

02:14:34.000 So he's done 100 before.

02:14:38.000 Has he run?

02:14:38.000 Yeah.

02:14:39.000 Oh, so in your family?

02:14:40.000 Yeah, so he's tough.

02:14:41.000 Your dad was like...

02:14:42.000 Was your dad a track and field athlete as well?

02:14:45.000 Yeah, he was...

02:14:46.000 My dad was...

02:14:49.000 I'm not athletic.

02:14:50.000 My dad was a freak.

02:14:52.000 And he had full scholarships at Oregon, Oregon State for track and field and gymnastics, two different sports.

02:15:00.000 He was pretty tall for a gymnast.

02:15:01.000 He was around six foot tall, but just crazy ability.

02:15:08.000 He was an amazing athlete, so I didn't get that, but maybe I got enough of it to be tough.

02:15:15.000 Yeah, but see, when people say that, like, well, what have you attempted to do that's athletic where you failed at?

02:15:20.000 Like, people that say, oh, I'm not a really good athlete.

02:15:22.000 Like, what is a really good athlete?

02:15:24.000 It's someone who practices the techniques of whatever sport they're trying to do and gets really good at it.

02:15:28.000 Yeah.

02:15:29.000 I mean, you're really good at running and you're really good at bowhunting.

02:15:32.000 Bowhunting is absolutely athletic.

02:15:34.000 Right. 1.00

02:15:34.000 It's, like, if golf is a fucking sport... 1.00

02:15:37.000 What's bowhunting? 0.99

02:15:38.000 I mean, is a problem with calling hunting a sport a lot of people have?

02:15:42.000 Because I think it's best described as a discipline.

02:15:45.000 Right.

02:15:45.000 Because I don't like to think of it as something that you score points.

02:15:48.000 Yeah, me neither.

02:15:48.000 I don't.

02:15:49.000 It's too trivial.

02:15:50.000 No.

02:15:50.000 It's too much of life.

02:15:52.000 But I do think there is athleticism within bowhunting.

02:15:57.000 100%.

02:15:57.000 You know, especially out west, especially in the mountains in Alaska.

02:16:02.000 So yeah, I mean, I... When people think athlete, they think the general sports.

02:16:08.000 Track and field, football, basketball, things like that.

02:16:12.000 I didn't get that elite athleticism in those sports as my dad did.

02:16:17.000 I think he had the ability to make the Olympics.

02:16:21.000 But you know life happened I was born this or that so he was he was a freak in in what what you might Call normal athletic events maybe bow hunting, you know qualifies and it's a hundred percent qualifies I mean look at this fighting qualifies athletics I think it does but it's way more intense and regular athletics something way more Personal and dangerous about the goal of knocking someone unconscious while they're trying to knock you unconscious and if Fighting if that counts

02:16:51.000 if that's athletics bowhunting is most certainly athletics, but I think we both agree that it's It's a little bit more intense than a sport.

02:16:59.000 Yeah, definitely.

02:17:00.000 It's more it's almost disrespectful in a way not I mean if you consider it a sport you call it a sport that's fine, but in my view It's so much about the life and the reverence for this animal that you hunt and then take.

02:17:14.000 It's not, we won the Super Bowl, we scored the goal, the ball went in the hole.

02:17:19.000 It's the journey.

02:17:21.000 It's the journey.

02:17:22.000 It's not just the punch tag.

02:17:23.000 So the punch tag, you'd say, well, I won.

02:17:25.000 Yeah.

02:17:26.000 I won.

02:17:26.000 Yeah.

02:17:27.000 In a sport, there's a winner and a loser.

02:17:29.000 You kill the animal, you punch your tag, you won.

02:17:31.000 It's not it.

02:17:32.000 I mean, it's the whole journey that leads to that.

02:17:35.000 And then also we talk about getting the meat home and providing for your family.

02:17:39.000 How do you score that?

02:17:40.000 You can't.

02:17:41.000 So, I mean, yeah, it's not a sport in that regard, for sure.

02:17:45.000 It's a discipline.

02:17:46.000 And even that word is like, it's...

02:17:49.000 Bowhunting is bowhunting, man.

02:17:51.000 That's what it is.

02:17:52.000 Yeah, it's on its own.

02:17:53.000 It's on its own.

02:17:54.000 It's got its own thing.

02:17:55.000 And on that note, you've got to catch a flight, my brother.

02:17:57.000 I do.

02:17:58.000 Thank you again.

02:17:59.000 Oh, thanks.

02:17:59.000 So much fun to hang out, even just for a few hours.

02:18:01.000 It was great to hang out with you in Salt Lake and wander around all those freaks and dead animals.

02:18:06.000 All right, folks.

02:18:07.000 We'll be back tomorrow with my brother Doug Duren.

02:18:11.000 Wednesday, Bas Rutten and Marl Ranalla.

02:18:14.000 Woo! 0.99

02:18:15.000 That's going to be fun.

02:18:16.000 The original team, or one of the original teams from Pride Broadcasting, two great guys.

02:18:21.000 Mauro's an awesome dude.

02:18:22.000 And Boss is the best.

02:18:24.000 And of course, on Friday, Robin Black, who now works for the UFC. We got him a job.

02:18:29.000 Yes!

02:18:30.000 So we'll see you soon.

02:18:31.000 Thank you, everybody.

02:18:32.000 Much love.

02:18:33.000 Bye-bye.

02:18:33.000 Later.

The Joe Rogan Experience - February 15, 2016

Joe Rogan Experience #759 - Cameron Hanes

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript