The Joe Rogan Experience - Joe Rogan Experience #852 - John Anthony West

00:00:00.000 Two, one, and we're live.

00:00:03.000 Mr. West.

00:00:05.000 Mr. Rogan.

00:00:07.000 Pleasure to have you here in person.

00:00:08.000 Doing it on Skype was fun and it was nice.

00:00:11.000 You are, to this day, the only podcast I've ever done on Skype.

00:00:14.000 Really?

00:00:15.000 Yep.

00:00:15.000 Oh, wow.

00:00:16.000 But I just had to talk to you.

00:00:19.000 If you couldn't get down here, there's got to be a way, so it was nice to be able to do it that way, but much nicer to see you here in person.

00:00:25.000 I'm much better to be here in person.

00:00:27.000 And actually, what's responsible for me being here in person is that I wouldn't actually come all this huge distance even to be on your show.

00:00:37.000 Unless you paid me lots of money, of course, which you're not prepared to do.

00:00:41.000 But because I have this conference coming up at the end of the week...

00:00:45.000 Called CPAC, which I'm surprised you didn't know about, Conference on Precession and Ancient Knowledge, which is the end of this week.

00:00:53.000 For those living in Southern California, you might want to take a look at the website.

00:00:58.000 Yeah, tell everybody, where is that and what is it about?

00:01:01.000 It's Rancho Mirage, which is a great name.

00:01:04.000 It means there is no ranch, but Rancho Mirage, which is somewhere near Palm Springs, And it is about exactly what it says, a conference on precession and ancient knowledge, and it questions, to begin with, the whole scenario,

00:01:23.000 the standard scenario about what causes precession, which is supposedly a kind of a wobble of the earth caused by nobody knows exactly what.

00:01:33.000 And the counter theory is that it isn't that.

00:01:37.000 It's that there is a dwarf star of some sort orbiting the sun, upsetting the balance of the celestial mechanical balance of it.

00:01:45.000 And that makes a difference.

00:01:47.000 You say, well, what's the difference?

00:01:48.000 One way or another there's precession.

00:01:49.000 It does make a difference actually in the big picture because it means that our solar system It basically conforms with all of the other solar systems, which mostly are dual in nature.

00:02:02.000 Sirius, for example, has the dwarf star that circles around it, Sirius B, that's responsible for all sorts of measurable phenomena.

00:02:11.000 So it starts off from there, but then the ancient knowledge comes in because Precession, and this is a big mystery, precession seems to be a factor of virtually every ancient society, be it sophisticated,

00:02:27.000 a la China and India, South America, Mesoamerica, or so-called primitive, a word I hate to use.

00:02:34.000 It simply means unintellectualized or not expressed in coherent Western philosophy, for whatever that's worth.

00:02:46.000 But precession is a known fact discovered actually a long time ago.

00:02:52.000 You'd think by now it'd be common knowledge and everybody would teach it in school, which is sort of a joke.

00:02:56.000 It's kind of interesting that people don't teach it, right?

00:02:58.000 It is a very bizarre thing that it's so prominent in ancient cultures and ancient society that they literally mapped this out, this 26,000-year cycle, this wobble of the earth, and that we rarely talk about it, ever.

00:03:13.000 No, because it upsets the notion that there's a knowledge of this going back to ancient times presupposes that there's a very advanced observational astronomy dating at a time when supposedly people were still living in trees.

00:03:28.000 So this is actually a big deal, hence the Conference on Precession.

00:03:32.000 And the ancient knowledge comes into it because understanding that there is a highly sophisticated scientific knowledge This understanding that goes back not just to ancient Egypt itself but far thousands and thousand millennia beyond upsets what is effectively the reigning religion of today except it doesn't call itself a religion.

00:03:57.000 It calls itself science which is based supposedly on reason.

00:04:01.000 It's not.

00:04:02.000 None of those things are true.

00:04:03.000 It's not based on science and science is not based upon reason.

00:04:06.000 Maybe we'll get time to go.

00:04:07.000 Well, some science is, but archaeology in particular is very rigid in its ideas, and a lot of it is based on the professors that have written books and that teach these ideas, and they don't want to let them go.

00:04:17.000 And when new knowledge is discovered that challenges those ideas, they fight it rigorously, even if it's knowledge like the stuff that you exposed with Dr. Ron Schock, Robert Schock, rather, which was the water erosion on the Sphinx.

00:04:31.000 Which we were talking about before the podcast, which is one of the best pieces of evidence, because the last time there was rainfall, heavy rainfall in the Nile Valley was, what was it, 9000 BC? Is that what it was?

00:04:42.000 They debate it, but anyway, it's way before the beginning of...

00:04:47.000 Dynastic Egypt. 0.97

00:04:48.000 And then it's a question of how old or when those reigns fell.

00:04:53.000 Because an interesting bit of thing here that I'm now at liberty to relate publicly.

00:05:02.000 Originally, I wasn't...

00:05:03.000 When I first got shock over to Egypt, which is a... 1.00

00:05:07.000 Another two-hour podcast in itself, the history of getting Jacques interested in this stuff.

00:05:12.000 And when he finally agreed, very hesitantly and very skeptically, to come along because he had to see the evidence for himself, and I scraped together a bit of money to bring him over.

00:05:23.000 And we got into the Sphinx enclosure.

00:05:25.000 I don't think it got in legally.

00:05:27.000 I think we bribed our way in very early in the morning.

00:05:30.000 Well, in Egypt, everything is possible.

00:05:32.000 And bribed our way in and he walked into the Sphinx enclosure.

00:05:36.000 Actually, when we get that up on the screen, you'll see the level of the water or the extent of the weathering of the water weathering.

00:05:46.000 And Schock looked at it, and everybody else walks into the Sphinx enclosure and has this, actually, this shock of recognition in the presence of this fabulous work of sacred sculpture, in fact, of sacred sculpture.

00:06:01.000 And Schock looked, but Schock is a, no, that's not, it was way back, Jamie, right to the beginning, first slides.

00:06:10.000 And Schock Everybody else sees the Sphinx as a work of art.

00:06:15.000 Schach sees the rocks.

00:06:17.000 He's a geologist.

00:06:20.000 Back like this.

00:06:21.000 And he said, wow, these rocks look like they're hundreds of thousands of years old.

00:06:26.000 And he said, don't quote me on that.

00:06:28.000 Because that's, of course, absolute heresy, that the most spectacular sculpture on earth should be tens of thousands of years.

00:06:36.000 Actually, even the 4,500 years that it's associated with Do not conform with anybody's idea of how civilization developed.

00:06:47.000 This goes back to your—of why the academic, I call it the quackademic establishment, is so— It passionately defends the old paradigm the way that it does because the reigning paradigm,

00:07:06.000 the reigning religion today, which is not acknowledged as religion, is that this is the church of progress.

00:07:13.000 And it's credo, just like the virgin birth is the credo of early Christianity or present-day Christianity, not that they know what they're talking about.

00:07:25.000 The credo of the Church of Progress is, A, we are the most sophisticated human beings that have ever lived on the face of the planet with our hydrogen bombs and our nerve gas and our striped toothpaste and our Disney lands.

00:07:38.000 We're the best that ever was.

00:07:40.000 And secondly, that progress, as it's called, goes in a straight line from primitive cavemen up to ourselves.

00:07:48.000 And when it becomes self-evident, That in very, very ancient times, they had knowledge of precession, which is an incredible thing too.

00:08:00.000 It's almost unimaginable that it happens through Careful observation because the Sun, I don't know if all of the audience will know what this is, so maybe it's worth talking about.

00:08:15.000 The Sun, if you look at the spring equinox now, the Sun is rising against the last bits of Pisces.

00:08:27.000 It may even be in the earliest stages of Aquarius.

00:08:32.000 And gradually the Sun precesses, that's to say it goes backwards around the zodiac in a cycle that takes 25,000 canonically, 25,920 years to make a complete circle.

00:08:45.000 What this means is that it actually takes 72 years, precisely, for the Sun to precess one degree.

00:08:54.000 So this is nothing.

00:08:55.000 Who's going to be sitting there for 72 years watching the track of the sun in a cycle that takes 26,000 years to go around?

00:09:05.000 And observe that there's a discrepancy enough to write it down and pass that information down?

00:09:08.000 And then why should they care?

00:09:10.000 It's somehow or another deeply connected with the civilization of that time and with our civilization.

00:09:17.000 When you look at the numbers involved, this is another hours of conversation actually.

00:09:23.000 The 72 and the 73 are significant numbers in practically all of the developed numerologically based societies.

00:09:31.000 So, in Egypt, Seth, who's the bad guy, derivative probably Satan is derived from Seth.

00:09:39.000 He's the bad guy, but he's also a great god.

00:09:41.000 That is to say, the gods are not gods in any superstitious fashion.

00:09:45.000 They represent the embodiments of cosmic principles.

00:09:49.000 So, excuse me, set is he who fixes spirit and matter.

00:09:55.000 And the whole basis of any esoteric doctrine, including most of the religions that are around even today in their depraved forms, The objective of any esoteric discipline is to free ourselves individually and collectively from our imprisonment in matter.

00:10:13.000 This is the quest for immortality.

00:10:16.000 And so in some sense or another, That processional cycle is very important and the numbers are important in the myth, which again we don't have time for, but Osiris is the good king.

00:10:30.000 Actually, this is all very carefully expounded, very brilliantly in fact, in the Hamlet myth, which becomes Shakespeare's Hamlet, and then in the Lion King, in Disney's Lion King, the movie especially, which is really pretty brilliant.

00:10:45.000 Anyway, Set is the good king who is beloved by his people, and Set is his wicked brother, his evil brother, who is determined to unseat him and steal his sister wife Isis while he's at it.

00:10:59.000 Anyway, Set sets a trap for Osiris, and it's Set and his 72 followers.

00:11:06.000 So 72 is this number associated with time, and the 72 to 73 is a very significant Ratio, actually, which pervades the philosophies of, as I said, of all of the esoteric civilizations.

00:11:21.000 So all of this stuff, instead of being the kind of...

00:11:29.000 Ask a quackademic, the same guy you were talking about earlier who still thinks the six is weathered by sand.

00:11:35.000 Ask one of those what ancient myth is about.

00:11:38.000 They say, oh, well, it's just a fabrication written by primitive people who are trying to explain the mysteries of the universe. 0.95

00:11:44.000 It's the other way around.

00:11:45.000 The primitive people are the ones with the PhDs. 1.00

00:11:48.000 And back then, not only did they understand these scientific, these astronomical facts, but they...

00:11:59.000 They orchestrated their whole civilization around those facts, and the deeper you get into this, the more miraculous the extent of ancient knowledge becomes.

00:12:11.000 Now, what is the mainstream explanation when they talk about the prevalence of the number 72 and their understanding of the procession of the equinoxes?

00:12:18.000 Do they address it at all?

00:12:19.000 Like, how do they sort of explain how they knew about this 26,000-year cycle?

00:12:25.000 There's a very quick answer to that, actually, for a change.

00:12:28.000 No, they don't explain.

00:12:31.000 They just ignore it.

00:12:32.000 Is it sort of like the Parthenon, the Acropolis?

00:12:35.000 The Acropolis is the building and the Parthenon is the structure, right?

00:12:39.000 Is that what it is?

00:12:39.000 No, both are temples, both are buildings.

00:12:42.000 But what's the base?

00:12:44.000 The base is the one that they don't explain, right?

00:12:47.000 They just go, well, we don't really exactly...

00:12:49.000 That's the gigantic, enormous base, the huge stones that the Acropolis is built on, right?

00:12:56.000 No, I don't know.

00:12:57.000 Which one is the Acropolis?

00:12:58.000 I always screw those up.

00:12:59.000 I don't know.

00:12:59.000 Acropolis is the one on top.

00:13:01.000 Right, okay.

00:13:01.000 See, the Parthenon is what they're built on.

00:13:03.000 The base structure, or whatever it is, the bottom area.

00:13:08.000 I don't know, actually.

00:13:10.000 I've never really looked that deeply into it other than that there's a friend of mine who's worked with the proportions and the sophisticated proportions of the Parthenon and it shows actually that it's as minutely orchestrated as anything in Egypt,

00:13:29.000 even though it's much later than Egypt.

00:13:31.000 Much later than Egypt, but no one knows who built it and no one knows why they built it.

00:13:34.000 It's one of those weird ones where it's not really described in the text and the Acropolis is built upon it.

00:13:41.000 At least that's not explained to me by Greek historians, by people who understand Greek history.

00:13:45.000 They just really don't understand where it came from.

00:13:47.000 Well, I believe that's true, except that I think it's pretty certain that it's not of Egyptian age, although if you're talking about gigantic paving stones at the bottom of it, I don't know.

00:13:59.000 But whenever you see those gigantic stones, that's a pretty good indication of an earlier period of construction.

00:14:07.000 As at Baalbek, they have these monolithic 1,200-ton blocks that they think the Romans put in there. 0.64

00:14:15.000 And that's in Lebanon, right?

00:14:16.000 That's Lebanon, yeah.

00:14:17.000 So there's a ton of this kind of...

00:14:21.000 Indirect evidence, and when you put it all together, you get, there's enough of a picture there so that it overthrows the basis.

00:14:31.000 As I said, what's important about it is, in one sense, who cares?

00:14:34.000 In another sense, it overthrows The supposed scientific basis of the Church of Progress, that we're the most sophisticated people that ever were and we can do whatever we please with this once glorious planet of ours without worrying about it because we're the best and everyone before us was primitive.

00:14:52.000 Well, there's a lot of new evidence now since you started your work.

00:14:56.000 Particularly all that nuclear glass that they're finding that corresponds with meteor impacts throughout Europe and Asia and that that's somewhere around the end of the ice age really in the same sort of Time period when they do core samples and they find this nuclear glass.

00:15:12.000 It's all at around 10,000 plus years ago That kind of stuff really starts to indicate that we're looking at Possibly an event that might have shaped human history or a reset of a large percentage of the people on this planet where civilization in many areas was all but wiped out and then they had to rebuild again.

00:15:33.000 Yeah, this is, I mean, actually this is coming to the fore now.

00:15:36.000 There's a lot of evidence for these, I think it's the tektites they're called. 1.00

00:15:41.000 Shock thinks that they are the result of a gigantic CME, a coronal mass ejection, giant solar flares.

00:15:50.000 And there's a lot of evidence for this.

00:15:51.000 Actually, I don't know if we get into talking about it here.

00:15:54.000 I will at CPAC for sure.

00:15:55.000 Shock will be at CPAC. Anyway, the...

00:16:01.000 But it's unlikely that it's actually a nuclear blast because it would be inconceivable, well, at least by our standards, a man-made nuclear blast.

00:16:12.000 Although, when you go into the Hindu texts, and I think it's the Upanishads where they describe...

00:16:19.000 What sounds like, I mean it's described as a battle of the gods, but for all the world it does sound like a nuclear conflagration, a human-made nuclear conflagration.

00:16:31.000 I don't think anybody knows enough to say what it is other than that that story is in there.

00:16:38.000 In fact, because I'm a writer by trade, I'm very interested in the way that That language is used, and so myth is one of the principal misleading words that,

00:16:55.000 if you look in the dictionary, the first meaning that it gives for myth is a lie.

00:17:02.000 You would talk about the myth busters, that myth is a lie, but the ancients didn't see myth as a lie.

00:17:10.000 What myth actually is, when you get into it fairly deeply, It is the interplay of cosmic principles Described as drama rather than in mathematics.

00:17:24.000 So once you get a good look at this, this is an extraordinary but opaque book called Hamlet's Mill by Giorgio de Santillana and Hertha von Deccant, who are historians of science at MIT, which is about as respectable as credentials can be.

00:17:40.000 So as soon as myth is understood as having both a rigorous scientific As well as philosophical and spiritual base, the whole understanding of myth turns around.

00:17:59.000 And you see, for example, in Shakespeare's Hamlet, which is based upon a Danish folk tale, Which then becomes, quite brilliantly actually, the Lion King in the Disney film.

00:18:14.000 You see how the myth, I mean in other words you could decode the Osiris Isis Horus myth as pure science and You might call it as spiritual or as sacred science,

00:18:32.000 and at the same time it's a ripping good story when you put it that way, a story, because then everybody can understand it, even if they don't understand it.

00:18:43.000 Even if they can't articulate what they've understood, the power of the story soaks through.

00:18:50.000 So myth is actually, the more you know about it, my case is not that much, but at least it's better than nothing.

00:18:56.000 The more you know about it, the more amazing mythology becomes that they should have been able to put together.

00:19:04.000 These complex hierarchical Esoteric concepts in a way that resonates as a story.

00:19:15.000 Otherwise, insofar as, I mean, our own cosmology is next to impossible to understand unless you're a cosmologist and schooled in the abstract mathematics that make the thing work.

00:19:27.000 I mean, the mathematics is absolutely beyond me, but some of my astrophysicist friends can explain it to me in such a way that I understand.

00:19:37.000 But it still doesn't have any emotional impact.

00:19:39.000 So essentially what you're saying is that they didn't have the sort of scientific discipline that we have today.

00:19:45.000 They didn't understand a lot of the things that we know today as far as the way academics or scientists relay information about space or about cosmology.

00:19:56.000 So what they did is they combined theater and story with the actual facts That they knew so that was the way they would relay this stuff and that's the way that stuff would be passed on that information be passed on through these stories but in those stories was an actual history of the world itself as far as they knew.

00:20:15.000 Through that and through symbolism and this is an infinitely superior way of communicating knowledge because you don't have to be an expert It soaks into your bones in such a way that it directs personally and collectively people's behaviors.

00:20:39.000 And it's my firm conviction that this is why Egypt lasted as a coherent civilization even in its dynastic form for 3,500 years and our lunatic societies coming apart at the seams in front of our eyes at 300 years. 0.94

00:20:54.000 I wanted to talk to you about the written history of Egypt and the hieroglyphic history of the pharaohs.

00:21:02.000 Because I remember, I think it was from Magical Egypt 1, you were talking about the historical record, like what they have written down in the hieroglyphs about the pharaohs, that it goes back far beyond what we think of as the birth of Egypt, you know, with the construction,

00:21:18.000 the Great Pyramid, I believe they put it, modern academics put it at 2500 BC, correct?

00:21:23.000 Yes.

00:21:23.000 And you believe that it's possible that Egypt existed as far back as, I think you said, 34,000 years?

00:21:31.000 Well, that's their own.

00:21:33.000 That's the Egyptians' account, not mine.

00:21:35.000 Right.

00:21:35.000 Of course.

00:21:36.000 As expressed in a couple of...

00:21:40.000 In a stone tablet called the Palermo stone, because it's now in Palermo, Italy, and in a very fragmentary papyrus called the Turin papyrus, which is now in Turin.

00:21:53.000 And both of these documents, one is a stone stela and the other is a papyrus, tell or recount Long periods when Egypt was ruled first by the Necheru, which means the gods themselves,

00:22:10.000 which I take to mean fully realized divine human beings.

00:22:15.000 In other words, human beings that have attained, that have passed the test of the quest for immortality, who are in effect, they've outsmarted death, or they've outdeveloped death.

00:22:29.000 Why do you believe this?

00:22:34.000 Because their works speak for themselves, as it were, and the level of the, now we're talking, going back even to dynastic Egypt, because the temples themselves and the level of art involved particularly in the sculpture is such that Standard,

00:22:58.000 I'd say genius is rare enough, but standard human genius doesn't seem to apply to these incredible constructions.

00:23:07.000 And the quackademics simply dismiss it out of hand as really very talented exponents of a barbaric and primitive concept.

00:23:21.000 I'm leading my trips there, which I do, as you know, a few times a year.

00:23:25.000 Next one coming up, by the way, anybody listening in?

00:23:28.000 How can people go on one of those trips with you?

00:23:30.000 Oh, it's very easy to pay.

00:23:31.000 Okay.

00:23:32.000 Where do they find you, though?

00:23:34.000 On my website.

00:23:37.000 JohnAnthonyWest.com?

00:23:38.000 Yeah, on the website or my email, J-A-W-Sphinx at AOL.com.

00:23:43.000 Oh, you messed up.

00:23:44.000 You gave out your email.

00:23:45.000 That's a disaster.

00:23:46.000 Is it?

00:23:47.000 My people, horrible people. 0.99

00:23:49.000 They're going to send you naked pictures, for sure. 0.99

00:23:51.000 Oh! 0.60

00:23:51.000 Not of themselves, I hope, but I... I'm familiar with the term dick pic. 0.60

00:23:59.000 I am now. 0.99

00:24:00.000 Yeah, there you go.

00:24:01.000 So your thoughts are that these people that lived 34,000 years ago were incredibly advanced, like much further advanced than we are today.

00:24:12.000 Which doesn't take much, but when you understand what's involved.

00:24:15.000 I know what you're saying, but I mean, we're pretty damn advanced compared to a few hundred years ago, correct?

00:24:20.000 In certain ways we are, but we still can't.

00:24:23.000 We couldn't and wouldn't build the Cathedral of Chartres.

00:24:29.000 There's nobody alive, to the best of my knowledge, who could produce a building That is based upon sacred principles that even comes close to...

00:24:40.000 You mean sacred geometry?

00:24:41.000 Even that.

00:24:42.000 I mean, a few people really know quite a bit about this, but they couldn't design Chatra.

00:24:47.000 And that's, well, that's, you know, 12th century.

00:24:49.000 What was it about Egypt in that time in particular that...

00:24:55.000 In your opinion, I mean obviously there's a lot of speculation going on here because there's so little evidence from 34,000 years ago, but what is it about that area that you think developed people at such an incredibly high level?

00:25:06.000 Because unless there's more evidence to be found, there doesn't seem to be any parallels anywhere else in the world.

00:25:13.000 Actually, there's a fairly simple explanation for that, for a change, because most of this stuff is so complicated.

00:25:22.000 But just to go back a bit to the rule by the Neceru, the gods themselves, and the names of those rulers are given in the length of time that they reigned.

00:25:31.000 And then there's another group of The line of time is incredible, right?

00:25:35.000 Well, this is where we're getting the 34,000, 36,000 BC from.

00:25:39.000 Yeah.

00:25:40.000 Because you add the times up, the Turin papyrus has a similar thing of the reign, rule of the Netzeru, and the rule that's called the Shem Suhor, the followers or the...

00:25:52.000 The followers are the companions of Horus.

00:25:54.000 And again, the names are given and the regnal years.

00:25:57.000 And when you add those all up together, you get around 34, 36,000 BC. I'm sorry to interrupt you, but weren't some of the pharaohs, didn't they live hundreds of years?

00:26:08.000 There's no evidence for that.

00:26:10.000 But wasn't it written that they did?

00:26:12.000 I'm not sure.

00:26:12.000 I'm not sure what those dates are actually.

00:26:15.000 I've not actually deeply researched them.

00:26:17.000 I get those figures from Schwaller de Lubix, the great genius with the unpronounceable name, who put together the whole interpretation of Symbolist Egypt, from which my work is derived.

00:26:31.000 I mean, I regard myself as Schwaller's Boswell, making his... 0.99

00:26:38.000 Basically, impenetrable work.

00:26:41.000 Accessible?

00:26:42.000 Accessible to... 0.70

00:26:42.000 Dummies like me? 0.70

00:26:44.000 No, smart guys like you, not dummies like politicians and quackademics, no. 0.97

00:26:50.000 But when you're talking about 34,000 years, I mean the average person today lives to be about 80 years, you're talking about an incredible number of pharaohs then. 0.50

00:26:59.000 Yeah, you are.

00:27:00.000 And so all that is depicted?

00:27:02.000 Apparently.

00:27:03.000 Apparently the names are given.

00:27:05.000 I get that from Schwaller.

00:27:07.000 From the one long chapter he wrote called the chronology, choreography he called it, not the word for it, but the chronology of Egypt where he's looking to back up.

00:27:25.000 From a scholarly point of view, from the scholarly argument, that the Egyptians knew what they were talking about when they were assigning these long reins, that these are not fictitious.

00:27:36.000 This is not made-up history in order to fool the people who couldn't read the hieroglyphs anyway.

00:27:43.000 Only the scribes could read the hieroglyphs.

00:27:45.000 So...

00:27:47.000 Schwaller wrote this very long and thoughtful and scholarly lecture.

00:27:52.000 Sorry, not lecture, but chapter.

00:27:54.000 And then at the very end of it, this throwaway line, and as of course the Great Sphinx of Giza has been weathered, shows unmistakable signs of aquatic erosion.

00:28:03.000 And that was my little epiphany, because I picked up on that and said, wow, the rest of this isn't science, but that's geology.

00:28:10.000 And if the geologists...

00:28:15.000 I think?

00:28:30.000 We'll have to be rethought.

00:28:31.000 And that's began this long, long, now four-decade-long quest to find somebody to back it up.

00:28:38.000 And we're now, my sense of it is, closing in on beating down the opposition.

00:28:46.000 And this will be another thing, actually, in fact, I'll probably be talking about at CPAC, but probably it would...

00:28:55.000 A little bit more politely than I feel it's necessary to talk about here.

00:28:59.000 I'm here with you.

00:29:01.000 And that is riffing on a line that probably everybody who tunes into this is familiar with.

00:29:08.000 Victor Hugo, the French poet, novelist, dramatist of the 19th century.

00:29:17.000 Actually, France's most popular poet of the 19th century was Victor Hugo.

00:29:24.000 And it was Victor Hugo who wrote the famous line, there's one thing stronger than all the armies in the world, and that is an idea whose time has come.

00:29:32.000 You know that line, right?

00:29:34.000 Everybody knows that line.

00:29:35.000 But what Victor Hugo didn't think of, or if he did, he didn't express it, Was that the second strongest thing in the world is an idea whose time has not yet gone.

00:29:45.000 And since it is a matter of record that all of the armies in the world, be they military, economic, financial, cultural, agricultural even, wherever there's a paradigm, there's an army.

00:30:01.000 Devoted to protecting that paradigm.

00:30:03.000 And this is where we stand now, that the idea whose time has come only comes when the second strongest, the armies of the second strongest thing in the world are beaten down, are beaten into the ground,

00:30:18.000 and somebody breaches the portcullis to the ivory tower where all of these guys live.

00:30:23.000 And this is of particular interest to me because I am a scholar by default, but a satirist by nature.

00:30:31.000 And really, my whole adult life has been devoted to proving a vision that I had at the age of 13 or so, that I was born into a lunatic asylum.

00:30:47.000 And at the age of about 19, it was a very uncomfortable place to live where everybody called it progress, and I thought it was crazy.

00:30:55.000 And at age about 19 or so, I knew what I wanted to do, which was to be the little boy who said the emperor has no clothes and to prove to everybody's satisfaction that indeed the emperor has no clothes and it's a lunatic asylum.

00:31:10.000 The end result took me a couple of decades to realize that.

00:31:14.000 It was that in real life what happens is that, no, the people all don't say, whoa, look, the emperor has no clothes and everybody lives happily ever after.

00:31:24.000 What happens is that the disgraced emperor goes back to his palace and regroups the empire and at the end all of the forces of empire conspire to prove to everyone that the emperor's clothes are real but it's the child who's imaginary.

00:31:43.000 We were talking about this before the podcast, and this is a really fascinating aspect of this discussion.

00:31:49.000 When I first became aware of your work was that Charlton Heston narrated documentary about the aging of the Sphinx, the mystery of the Sphinx, which I believe was on NBC. What I thought was shocking Was when Dr. Shock was speaking to that Egyptologist who was saying,

00:32:11.000 what evidence is there of a culture that existed 7,000 years before ancient Egypt?

00:32:18.000 There's no evidence.

00:32:19.000 He's like, there is no, and he was laughing.

00:32:21.000 And the way he was doing it, there was so much ego involved in what he was saying.

00:32:24.000 I was like, wow, this is not how I would picture an Egyptologist laughing.

00:32:29.000 Well, that got me curious.

00:32:30.000 I started getting into it.

00:32:31.000 Why would anybody think like that?

00:32:32.000 And then I realized, oh, these guys write books and they teach lectures and they teach classes based on this information that they're teaching.

00:32:41.000 And now this information has been shown to be not true anymore.

00:32:44.000 When Dr. Schock was showing this water erosion and he was saying that, this was all before the discovery of Gobekli Tepe.

00:32:50.000 And once they discovered Gobekli Tepe, now they know that there is a sophisticated structure capable of massive stone circles that was 12,000 years ago, at least, when it was intentionally buried.

00:33:02.000 So it could have easily been several thousand years old then.

00:33:06.000 We don't know.

00:33:07.000 But we know at least 12,000 years ago someone was capable of incredible design and incredible stone structures with three-dimensional animals carved into these stone structures, which is very sophisticated.

00:33:20.000 Now, has that guy been talked to since then?

00:33:23.000 And has he amended his position on it?

00:33:26.000 As far as I know, he hasn't.

00:33:28.000 And I know Lehner reasonably well.

00:33:29.000 We're civil to each other.

00:33:31.000 And it won't be long now.

00:33:35.000 I mean, he's one of the generals in the army of the idea whose time has not yet gone.

00:33:45.000 And his time is coming up.

00:33:48.000 Does he address Gobekli Tepe?

00:33:51.000 Because his whole position was there was no civilization.

00:33:54.000 What evidence is there?

00:33:55.000 Well, now that you have this evidence, what does he say?

00:33:57.000 Well, maybe.

00:33:58.000 I haven't actually spoken to him, and I don't know if anyone has.

00:34:02.000 I see him in Egypt every once in a while.

00:34:04.000 I don't know if anyone has.

00:34:07.000 And I ran into him fairly recently.

00:34:09.000 He just said hello.

00:34:11.000 And I don't think I'd really necessarily want to bring it up with him Off the record, I'd rather have him with the cameras on us and just see what happens. 0.90

00:34:27.000 Otherwise, he's a dead duck.

00:34:31.000 But he seems to be just clinging to this idea because he can.

00:34:36.000 Like, mainstream academia hasn't accepted this predating of the Sphinx, or also the difference in the structures, like the difference in the construction methods that were used.

00:34:47.000 One of the more fascinating things that you sort of highlighted in your ancient Egypt series, Magical Egypt, which is fantastic, and I highly recommend it to anybody who is even remotely curious of this, you will be sucked in in an incredible way.

00:35:00.000 It got to the point where my wife was walking by the TV, she's like, Jesus Christ, you watching Egypt again?

00:35:05.000 And I'm like, It's like six discs.

00:35:07.000 It goes on forever.

00:35:08.000 Eight.

00:35:10.000 So there's a clear distinction between the older methods of construction and the newer methods.

00:35:17.000 They use different methods.

00:35:18.000 And it's really obvious to someone like me, I don't know anything about it, but you could see the difference.

00:35:23.000 And also that these older structures were below the newer structures.

00:35:28.000 Like you had to dig down to get them.

00:35:30.000 That's right, yes.

00:35:31.000 But the fact that they don't address that, the fact that they want to lump this all into the same people, is kind of crazy.

00:35:38.000 It is, but as long as they can get away with it, they will continue to get away with it.

00:35:43.000 As I said, the second strongest thing in the world is the idea whose time has not yet gone, and anybody who doesn't Let's say among myself and my colleagues who are all in this, let's say, the quest to prove,

00:36:01.000 to demonstrate that the advanced civilization existed in the very distant past, which is In my case, in other cases, not necessarily.

00:36:12.000 But in mine, it's because that opens the door in and of itself.

00:36:16.000 It doesn't affect the price of eggs.

00:36:19.000 But on a much more profound philosophical level, once it's understood that that...

00:36:24.000 Understanding that civilization goes back much, much further leads to the understanding and the acceptance that our role, our destiny as human beings is to achieve immortality.

00:36:40.000 This is as simple as that.

00:36:42.000 Otherwise, it's just a head trip.

00:36:44.000 In other words, if it's not understood that we have a role to play in this grand cosmic scheme, there's no civilization possible.

00:36:51.000 What do you mean by that?

00:36:52.000 Our goal is to achieve immortality.

00:36:54.000 Do you mean as individuals, or do you mean in what way?

00:36:59.000 That we arrive at a level of consciousness that is not subject to the death of the physical body.

00:37:07.000 All of religion is based upon that.

00:37:10.000 All of the stories of the saints and the rishis and the masters and so on is based upon, all of it, is based upon their experiences that have led them to this understanding.

00:37:22.000 If it's just a head trip, it's no good.

00:37:23.000 It has to be part of your very being.

00:37:26.000 The purpose of sacred art and of sacred music, when it works, is to communicate Even if only momentarily and fragmentarily, this understanding that there's something else,

00:37:42.000 and speaking from my own personal experiences, I've never gone through a full-blown mystical experience, but I've had lots of these moments, particularly in Egypt, in a long study, and these moments in Egypt where there's this sudden realization that The world as it manifests to our faculties,

00:38:08.000 our normal faculties, is not the only world there is.

00:38:12.000 There's something else beyond that which was understood a lot better in those days than now.

00:38:19.000 And actually, funnily enough, I forgot to mention this, but I don't know if you know this.

00:38:24.000 I've spent the last couple of years sort of sidetracked from my regular work Working on a book written by a friend of mine, a good friend, who was not a writer, so I helped him with the editing and contributed to it.

00:38:40.000 And this is maybe the definitive book on NDEs.

00:38:44.000 You know what those are, right?

00:38:45.000 Near-death experiences.

00:38:46.000 Near-death experiences.

00:38:47.000 He was a Christian pastor, a rare guy who actually lived what he preached, named David Solomon.

00:38:52.000 And he had collected all of this material, a huge amount of material, That he was trying to systematize because this is now, it's certainly not a common experience, but there are 5,000 verifiable accounts of people who have been clinically dead and who have been revived,

00:39:11.000 usually through modern methods, because now one of the reasons why it's now so common and before it was reserved for the saints, the great saints and the mystics.

00:39:22.000 That modern medicine has improved to such an extent that if you get to these people quickly enough, any number of people who are clinically dead for X number of minutes, you know, not two days, but minutes, sometimes more extended period than that,

00:39:39.000 come back with these tales of This realm beyond that of the senses, the realm of higher consciousness, basically what it is, what they've experienced is grace.

00:39:53.000 In Christian terms, it's grace.

00:39:55.000 It's a moment, and they come back transformed.

00:39:58.000 They come back convinced that everything that they were doing before is either nonsense or unimportant, and they often come back with a mission, even though they don't have the schooling, let's say.

00:40:08.000 They don't understand philosophically Or spiritually, what they've experienced, they know what they've experienced, and they laugh at the debunkers who are saying it's all hallucination of the brain, dying brain. 0.99

00:40:20.000 This is all garbage.

00:40:21.000 What they've experienced, they've experienced, and David put these together in a systematic fashion. 0.94

00:40:27.000 And then, as he was just, he collected all this material, and I was telling him that he's a good friend.

00:40:33.000 He financed our trip to Gobekli Tepe five, six years ago.

00:40:37.000 And he started losing his balance and he was a Tai Chi guy who knows a lot about balance.

00:40:42.000 Also a bonsai master and a Christian pastor.

00:40:46.000 Unusual guy.

00:40:47.000 And he started losing his balance and it wasn't going away and the doctors finally figured out what was wrong with him.

00:40:54.000 And he had a glioma, a glioblastoma of something, I forget.

00:40:58.000 Do you know what a glioma is?

00:41:01.000 It's a form of brain cancer that is 100% fatal.

00:41:05.000 The only thing you have is that you can't determine the timeline.

00:41:09.000 And they gave him something like 10 months to 12 months to live.

00:41:13.000 He actually lived three years.

00:41:15.000 And at that point he had all of this material and I told him when he was telling me about it, I said, I should write a book.

00:41:21.000 This is really good stuff.

00:41:23.000 The way you're doing it is not like anybody else has ever done.

00:41:26.000 And he said, no, no, I'm not a writer.

00:41:28.000 I'm just doing this.

00:41:29.000 And then when he found out the diagnosis, then he had a mission, which was to get the book out.

00:41:33.000 But he wasn't a writer, so he drafted me in to put the words in right order.

00:41:39.000 And he lasted just long enough to get the book finished and get it published.

00:41:43.000 And it's really...

00:41:45.000 If this went viral, it could make a difference.

00:41:48.000 He was very good at titles, David.

00:41:51.000 It's called The Dead Saints Chronicles, subtitled A Zen Journey Through the Christian Afterlife.

00:42:01.000 And it really is an absolutely extraordinary book.

00:42:06.000 And it becomes quite clear when you go through this that what people have experienced is a state of grace that's not all the same.

00:42:13.000 I mean, some people it's more profound and some people less so.

00:42:16.000 But all of these people are unprepared for what they've experienced and all of them come back Transformed, and of course the quackademics, this is one of the ways they protect themselves. 0.86

00:42:27.000 Peer review is one way, and the other is their insistence.

00:42:31.000 Who the hell gave them the right to make the rules from science that apply to science?

00:42:37.000 Are they scientists so that gives them the right to make the rules?

00:42:40.000 No, the rules are the rules.

00:42:42.000 And one of the chief ways in which they protect themselves Is to insist that anecdotal evidence, personal experience, doesn't count.

00:42:55.000 I don't know about you, but I wouldn't buy a cookbook by someone who's never fried an egg.

00:42:59.000 So these are guys who've never fried a spiritual egg, and these 5,000 accounts are people who've actually been there to this superior realm and come back To talk about it.

00:43:12.000 No, but you say you haven't had a mystical experience.

00:43:14.000 You mean a psychedelic experience?

00:43:16.000 No, that I've had, yes.

00:43:17.000 You've had psychedelic experience.

00:43:18.000 Oh, yeah, yeah.

00:43:18.000 Which kind of psychedelic experiences have you had?

00:43:20.000 Oh, I've done ayahuasca, and I've done, you know, you name it.

00:43:25.000 Right.

00:43:25.000 So you've done DMT? Yes, and I've done, not mescaline, but the other one, acid.

00:43:34.000 Okay.

00:43:34.000 All of those.

00:43:35.000 No, the experiences come actually from me, as I said, they're not a major, it's not the state of grace that these people are talking about.

00:43:43.000 You didn't experience the state of grace when you did DMT? Not quite, no.

00:43:47.000 Not compared to what the NDEs.

00:43:52.000 Can I ask how many times you've done it?

00:43:53.000 One.

00:43:54.000 One time.

00:43:54.000 Okay, did you do a lot of it?

00:43:56.000 I don't know.

00:43:57.000 You've got to do a lot of it.

00:43:58.000 Yeah, maybe.

00:43:58.000 Did you just dissolve?

00:43:59.000 Did you go to this crazy, geometric, infinite universe?

00:44:03.000 No, I didn't.

00:44:04.000 You didn't get in there then?

00:44:04.000 I didn't get in there then.

00:44:06.000 How long are you in town for?

00:44:07.000 Pardon?

00:44:08.000 How long are you in town for?

00:44:09.000 Only till tomorrow.

00:44:11.000 We're going to have to make something happen.

00:44:12.000 You've got to go deeper.

00:44:14.000 Yeah, maybe.

00:44:15.000 That experience that people are having, a near-death experience, is mirrored by the same experience.

00:44:20.000 I'm sure you're aware of Dr. Rick Strassman.

00:44:22.000 Oh, yeah, sure.

00:44:23.000 Sure.

00:44:24.000 I believe, actually, he's in...

00:44:25.000 He's on the...

00:44:25.000 That's right.

00:44:26.000 I never met him when Chance was doing the...

00:44:28.000 Brilliant guy, and so important.

00:44:29.000 I gather.

00:44:30.000 What he has created by his book, DMT, the spirit molecule, they did these clinical tests giving people DMT in a clinical setting at the University of New Mexico.

00:44:41.000 And what they found was these people achieved this incredible state of understanding, a more relaxed vision of the future.

00:44:52.000 They're more confident.

00:44:53.000 This is also mirrored by some of the John Hopkins tests that they've done with people with psilocybin, where people have They have just a much better outlook about the future.

00:45:04.000 They don't think that this is it, and that whatever happens to them when they're having these trips, and the way Strassman did it is much more intense than most people do it because they did intravenous doses, which last longer.

00:45:16.000 A typical DMT trip lasts only about 15 minutes, unless you just jump right back in, which is what I usually do.

00:45:22.000 But he gave these people intravenous doses which take them just very deep for more than a half an hour, and they all have very similar stories, and similar stories to people that have had near-death experiences.

00:45:34.000 I've had friends that have had near-death experiences, and when they talk about it, it's very similar to the way I've talked to other people that have had DMT trips, where they are in the presence of this divine greatness, this something.

00:45:46.000 That's right.

00:45:47.000 But that is also a chemical that's produced by the brain.

00:45:49.000 Now, this is where neuroscientists step in and say, well, your experience is experiencing as some sort of a hallucination.

00:45:58.000 And they might be right, but it also might be some sort of a chemical gateway that your brain produces.

00:46:04.000 We really don't know.

00:46:05.000 And that might be the way the soul, quote-unquote, air quotes, whatever, but for lack of a better word, transitions to this next stage of life.

00:46:14.000 Now...

00:46:14.000 When the anecdotal evidence that you're talking about is measured up, what's interesting about it is similar accounts over and over and over and over again.

00:46:22.000 That's right.

00:46:22.000 The people that can remember things, they remember this incredibly divine experience.

00:46:26.000 But, you know, the question becomes, is that experience, and this is something that I've been bouncing around in my head a lot lately, is that experience a hallucination?

00:46:36.000 Or is that experience an actual real experience in a divine presence?

00:46:39.000 And does it matter?

00:46:41.000 Because...

00:46:43.000 Is it the same thing no matter what?

00:46:44.000 If you just think you're experiencing God and divine greatness because you're creating it in your mind versus actually experiencing God and divine greatness, isn't the experience the exact same thing?

00:46:56.000 And is our mind locked into the idea of a physical thing like this laptop?

00:47:01.000 I can pick it up.

00:47:02.000 I can drop it.

00:47:03.000 I know it has weight.

00:47:04.000 I can touch it.

00:47:04.000 I can measure the width.

00:47:06.000 We can't do that with psychedelic experiences.

00:47:09.000 We can't do that with transcendent experiences.

00:47:11.000 We can't do that with mystical experiences.

00:47:13.000 You can't measure them.

00:47:14.000 You can't put them in a bag and take it home with you.

00:47:16.000 But it might be the same thing.

00:47:18.000 It's entirely possible that this is what many, many ancient cultures experienced as well.

00:47:23.000 They found the use of psychedelics very early on.

00:47:27.000 And this is also something that you documented in your work.

00:47:30.000 And they documented it very clearly in a lot of the Egyptian work.

00:47:35.000 They had deep understanding and knowledge.

00:47:38.000 Exactly, Joe.

00:47:39.000 This is one of the important things about the drugs and the NDE experiences.

00:47:44.000 In my view, the NDE experiences more so because there's nothing in the way.

00:47:50.000 There's nothing obstructing it.

00:47:52.000 They're dead!

00:47:53.000 And this is where they go with the drugs.

00:47:57.000 You know you're you in these experiences.

00:48:01.000 And the problem...

00:48:02.000 Interesting, the problem...

00:48:04.000 It's not a problem, it's the wrong word.

00:48:07.000 But with the NDE experiences, I mean, absolutely...

00:48:12.000 Joe Sixpack, everybody, ordinary people, many of them, some of them even atheists, go through this and come back, literally transform their whole lives.

00:48:24.000 It changed by it.

00:48:24.000 With the drugs...

00:48:26.000 It really is.

00:48:26.000 For the most part, it's a trip.

00:48:28.000 It doesn't have this, let's say, this lasting transformational value.

00:48:33.000 It does on some people.

00:48:34.000 It does sometimes, yes.

00:48:35.000 The John Hopkins study showed that a lot of people, decades later, had a vastly improved quality of life, different outlook on things, and especially when you're dealing with terminally ill patients.

00:48:46.000 Oh, well.

00:48:46.000 And they've given it to terminally ill patients, significant lessening of anxiety and fear of death.

00:48:52.000 Oh sure, it would be.

00:48:54.000 But the hallucination, this is another scam by the so-called rationalists, who in fact are not, they're this idea that it's a hallucination.

00:49:02.000 And what's a hallucination?

00:49:03.000 And what's its evolutionary value?

00:49:06.000 Why should there be a, where's the hallucination gene? 0.98

00:49:09.000 This is all bullshit, actually, and what it actually is. 0.99

00:49:12.000 It's not based upon reason as they promote themselves. 0.99

00:49:19.000 What it is actually is the rationalization of their own inner emptiness.

00:49:23.000 They can't handle the fact that there might be something else, and in fact their whole intellectual lives are consecrated to the To proving that life is indeed as meaningless as their own.

00:49:37.000 But is that what it is?

00:49:38.000 Or is it they're just trying to look at some sort of, give it a critical, objective view and go over all the possibilities?

00:49:46.000 We know that drugs do affect the mind in very strange ways.

00:49:49.000 We know some people take drugs and it completely distorts their reality.

00:49:53.000 Alcohol is a perfect example of that, right?

00:49:55.000 It's a great drug for distorting reality.

00:49:57.000 You can watch someone get drunk and have a very bizarre version of what they're looking at.

00:50:02.000 There's many drugs that change the way people look at things, like physically, the way they see things.

00:50:07.000 They will hallucinate.

00:50:09.000 So we know that drugs have an effect on people.

00:50:12.000 It seems rational, though, that a scientist would look at those things and try to find some sort of a scientific perspective.

00:50:18.000 Explanation for the chemical process that's going on in the mind, the way it's affecting the visual cortex, and the things that the person is quote-unquote hallucinating.

00:50:26.000 Underlying that contention, which is not science in and of itself.

00:50:30.000 That is just a hypothesis.

00:50:32.000 That is speculation.

00:50:33.000 And I said what it's based upon is protecting their own vision of the world Which is that the universe is an accident and anything that is mystical or so-called spiritual is hallucinatory and they have the answers.

00:50:50.000 And these people, as far as I'm concerned, are more dangerous even than politicians.

00:50:55.000 They are, put it this way, the Church of Progress is the religion of the emotionally defective, the spiritually dyslexic, and the philosophically depraved.

00:51:10.000 But to put it into other terms, you actually, martial arts master I studied with briefly, used to say in his Japanese accent, if you want happiness in this crazy world, you do not talk about moonbeams to the blind or moonbeams to the blind,

00:51:30.000 music to the deaf, and you absolutely do not talk about sex to eunuchs. 1.00

00:51:35.000 They just get angry.

00:51:37.000 And this is what you're dealing with when you're dealing with these intellectually based scientists.

00:51:43.000 These are spiritual, emotional, and philosophical eunuchs. 0.98

00:51:50.000 And it's no surprise when they behave the way they do who's surprised when the eunuchs snigger behind the Sultan's back and deride his passions. 1.00

00:52:03.000 The problem is that with our Church of Progress, When the eunuchs take over the palace and call their terrible disability reason, then the empire's cooked.

00:52:13.000 You sound like a person who's been deeply in the trenches against academics for a year.

00:52:18.000 You sound like a bitter man, John Anthony West.

00:52:20.000 No, I'm not bitter.

00:52:21.000 I'm not bitter.

00:52:22.000 I'm just realistic.

00:52:23.000 And I know what's involved from being in the trenches.

00:52:27.000 I know what's involved in fighting this particular battle, which I've been engaged in all of these events.

00:52:34.000 All of these decades.

00:52:36.000 Particularly yours, because you've been dealing with archaeologists that are trying to refute evidence.

00:52:39.000 They're all just as bad as each other.

00:52:41.000 What I bring to the table that my colleague Graham Hancock was an excellent writer and some of the others who are very brilliant people.

00:52:48.000 Rupert Sheldrake is also a very good friend and a very good scientist.

00:52:52.000 What they are not is satirists by nature, and I am.

00:52:57.000 Now, let's go back to this idea that human beings need to fulfill immortality, or that there is our ultimate destiny to fulfill immortality.

00:53:07.000 What do you mean by that exactly?

00:53:09.000 Because if there is an afterlife, right, if we do die and then we go to this other place that people are seeing in these near-death experiences, why do we have to do anything?

00:53:18.000 Why can't we just sit around and wait for our physical meat body to stop working and then transcend?

00:53:25.000 Well, again, this gets addressed in David's book, in the Dead Saints Chronicles, because it's our job to transcend.

00:53:34.000 In other words, if we don't do anything, well, something happens to us.

00:53:38.000 And again, here's where the near-death experience is.

00:53:42.000 Get interesting because almost none of them are negative.

00:53:45.000 What happens to the real evil monster people that are out there in this world?

00:53:50.000 I mean, does Dick Cheney go to heaven?

00:53:52.000 Gee, if he dies, I don't want to be there.

00:53:55.000 That would be hilarious. 1.00

00:53:56.000 Imagine if you get to heaven, you're like, Dick fucking Cheney's up here. 0.99

00:53:59.000 You've got to be kidding me, man. 0.99

00:54:01.000 I could have done so much more.

00:54:04.000 I mean, he's in the special waterboarding division.

00:54:08.000 Well, maybe he just, you know, realizes it.

00:54:11.000 No, but seriously, this is the purpose.

00:54:13.000 You'd never know it from listening to these guys.

00:54:15.000 This is the purpose of religion.

00:54:17.000 It's a practice.

00:54:19.000 It's not something you believe in.

00:54:21.000 It's something that you do.

00:54:22.000 And if you don't do it, you don't, unless you go through an NDE, then you come back and you start doing it in one way or another.

00:54:30.000 But it's...

00:54:32.000 My own personal conviction is that unless enough people are doing this and getting somewhere with it, it's not as though everyone's going to become enlightened.

00:54:41.000 They probably aren't.

00:54:42.000 Again, going deep into the whole theories of reincarnation and return and so on, which is part of Egypt and part of all of the Eastern cultures of reincarnation.

00:54:52.000 No, chances are you don't make it in one lifetime.

00:54:55.000 But these things...

00:54:58.000 Let's say there's a report card.

00:55:01.000 There's a divine report card where these things are measured.

00:55:06.000 Jesus says insofar as the Bible is a scholarly morass and I usually try to avoid using it as evidence for things because it's so open to interpretation and it's so convoluted to begin with and who knows what's original to it and what isn't.

00:55:23.000 But, you know, many are called, few are chosen.

00:55:25.000 But those who are called, who do their work or who try to do their work, reap the benefit of that on an internal level that the quackademics can't measure and don't want to measure and don't believe can be measured.

00:55:39.000 But somebody with a presence is very different from somebody without any presence at all.

00:55:44.000 You see that in the world around you as you go.

00:55:47.000 Yeah, I want to bring you back around, though, because I'm still confused.

00:55:50.000 What do you mean by it's our goal to achieve immortality?

00:55:54.000 Like, what do you mean by that?

00:55:55.000 Do you mean, like, the physical body no longer dies?

00:55:58.000 And do you believe that, like, whatever I read, I do not remember what I read, but what I read about the earliest depictions of the pharaohs, That was that they lived an extraordinary length of time similar to like Noah.

00:56:13.000 Like Noah in the Bible was 600 years old when he built the ark, correct?

00:56:19.000 Something like that.

00:56:20.000 Something like that.

00:56:21.000 And that this is a common thing.

00:56:23.000 Now, is this because...

00:56:25.000 The way we think of time, they had a different interpretation of it.

00:56:29.000 And what 600 years is to us is not 600 years to them.

00:56:33.000 Is it like in the Quran when they talk about 72 virgins?

00:56:37.000 You know when the expression 72 virgins is not really 72. What 72 virgins means, it's interesting because it's 72 again.

00:56:45.000 What it means is a large, it's like a shitload.

00:56:48.000 Like someone saying a shitload, you'll have 72 virgins in heaven, like, oh, whoa, what am I going to do with all them?

00:56:53.000 You know, it's just a large number.

00:56:55.000 It's not the actual number 72, it's just sort of a euphemism for a large number.

00:57:02.000 That's one of the theories of all of those different strange numbers in the Bible, and I don't know any better than anyone else.

00:57:08.000 As far as I know, the pharaohs lived ordinary lifespans, and of course there's no evidence.

00:57:13.000 Physical evidence of the pharaohs, the Necheru, when the divine rulers ruled, and Shem Suhor, when they ruled.

00:57:21.000 There's none of that.

00:57:22.000 And we simply don't know.

00:57:25.000 The Tibetans have accounts, if you want to believe the Tibetans, and I tend to, I don't see why they should lie, of great lamas who live several hundred years and go when they choose to.

00:57:36.000 I don't know.

00:57:37.000 Simple as that.

00:57:38.000 And actually...

00:57:42.000 You might say it's no more than a kind of mental...

00:57:47.000 It's an interesting hypothesis like Bigfoot, but who cares?

00:57:52.000 The only thing that actually counts is the inner work.

00:57:55.000 And if you're doing it, you're doing it.

00:57:57.000 And if you're not doing it, and you don't measure yourself either, as soon as you're looking for results, that's already a way of not getting them.

00:58:06.000 It's a very delicate...

00:58:08.000 And yet profound subject.

00:58:10.000 And if you go to a good Zen master, this stuff is still around.

00:58:14.000 There are masters.

00:58:16.000 My own focus, as you probably know, or maybe you don't, is the Gurdjieff work.

00:58:21.000 Because when I came across Gurdjieff, an extraordinary character, he was the first person I'd ever encountered posthumously.

00:58:28.000 He died in 49, and I found out about his work in the 60s.

00:58:32.000 Who was as contemptuous of Western civilization as I was.

00:58:36.000 The difference was that he knew how to live in it, and I didn't.

00:58:40.000 And at a certain point, I figured out, particularly what you're talking about before, that my life in the trenches, good subtitle for something.

00:58:48.000 I still don't understand what you mean about achieving immortality.

00:58:53.000 So if you're not talking about physical immortality, you're not talking about someone living a thousand years and plus?

00:58:58.000 No, absolutely not.

00:58:59.000 What are you talking about?

00:59:00.000 You're talking about the ideas that they promote, transcending and moving on?

00:59:06.000 No, I'm talking about a level of consciousness That transcends death.

00:59:10.000 The body dies, and that understanding is where you are.

00:59:19.000 I mean, the drugs do that.

00:59:20.000 You have these moments that with the body, you come back because you get out of the trip.

00:59:25.000 Let's say it's an eternal trip, and the ancients talk about that all the time, even in their mythology, which is always taken as fanciful, let's say, in the pyramid texts.

00:59:38.000 The script reads that when the Pharaoh dies, and the Pharaoh being, let's say, the embodiment of the realized and enlightened soul, when the Pharaoh dies, his ba unites with his ka, his spirit unites with his essence, becomes a star,

00:59:56.000 A star.

00:59:57.000 And traveled with Ra across the sky in his boat of millions of years.

01:00:04.000 This is, and in fact, I've often wondered if the Egyptians actually knew what he was being, what they were talking about, and the stars themselves are the realizations of enlightened souls.

01:00:15.000 It's as good as any other explanation that they're simply balls of gas.

01:00:20.000 How did that get there?

01:00:21.000 That automatically, at some point, accidentally coalesce into galaxies and nebulae and universes, and the whole thing goes on meaninglessly.

01:00:32.000 Well, I don't think anybody thinks it's meaningless, but it is kind of fascinating that stars themselves are the only reason why people are alive.

01:00:38.000 That's right.

01:00:38.000 Like, we are made of stardust, which is just incredible to think that the seeds of human life and all carbon life, in fact, come from a star exploding.

01:00:48.000 Like, wow.

01:00:49.000 Like, everything that you see, like the sun, the sun is a seed for future life.

01:00:54.000 That's right.

01:00:55.000 That's bananas.

01:00:55.000 Exactly, yeah.

01:00:57.000 Well, you've answered your own question, as it were.

01:01:01.000 That...

01:01:02.000 That understanding, and I wouldn't even call it a philosophy, it's an understanding by people who understand more than we do, certainly more than I do.

01:01:10.000 But if you say that's our goal, to achieve immortality, it sounds like we're going to get it anyway, no matter what.

01:01:17.000 Well, no, actually, with the NDEs, no, what happens?

01:01:22.000 Not really, no.

01:01:24.000 They've had their experience, they've had their X number of minutes of grace, and come back, and come back, Transformed and realize that they have to live their lives differently.

01:01:36.000 They don't even talk about, you know, about the future or anything like that.

01:01:40.000 I mean, this is obviously a very big thing that not many people evidently achieve.

01:01:48.000 But the effort, like everything else, the effort is the effort, and it's on the scorecard.

01:01:56.000 It's not so different from everybody who picks up a violin isn't going to end up in Carnegie Hall, and everyone who picks up a baseball bat isn't going to play center field for the Mets or any other team.

01:02:09.000 But it's the effort that counts.

01:02:11.000 And it's a certain kind of directed and intelligent effort that is painful in its own way, but carries its own reward.

01:02:20.000 And it manifests in a kind of presence.

01:02:25.000 And just in our daily lives, even with people who are not consciously doing it, but they're doing it They have a different level of presence and you notice it when you meet them.

01:02:41.000 Now, what is it that you think these ancient Egyptians, when you talk about the earliest Egyptians that you believe had achieved this incredible state of mind or consciousness, what is it that you think that they did to achieve that?

01:02:56.000 Like, why were they so advanced?

01:02:57.000 Why were they so beyond what we think of when we think of even the possibility of a human being living 34 plus thousand years ago?

01:03:06.000 How did they achieve that?

01:03:09.000 We don't know.

01:03:11.000 All we can see is the manifestation of what they did.

01:03:17.000 Actually, when you really understand Egypt, even to the extent that I do, you regard it as miraculous.

01:03:26.000 You don't see how beings ostensibly like ourselves should even imagine such things, much less be able to do it. 0.96

01:03:34.000 And this is what—I'll pitch my trip— I often start a lecture off by saying that Egypt is like sex. 0.93

01:03:41.000 That gets everybody's attention. 0.99

01:03:43.000 Why is it like sex?

01:03:45.000 Because you can read books about it, and that's informational of sorts.

01:03:51.000 You can look at pictures.

01:03:52.000 That's a different kind or a different level of information.

01:03:55.000 But until you've experienced it, you do not and cannot understand it.

01:04:00.000 And Egypt is like that. 0.97

01:04:03.000 That Magical Egypt series is as close as anyone has ever come to communicating the wonder and the magic that is Egypt as anyone has ever...

01:04:14.000 It's way head and shoulders above what anybody else has done, and that's my genius partner Chance is doing in its entirety.

01:04:21.000 It's, you know, simplest ideas, and I play a big role in it, but it's really Chance's baby.

01:04:32.000 But at the visit to Egypt, at the end of a couple of weeks there, I can talk from Adel Doomsday, which I'm about in the process of doing, And nothing that I say can come even remotely close to what it's like to be two weeks in Egypt,

01:04:52.000 day after day after day after day, in the presence of sacred art of this Of this quality.

01:05:01.000 And there's nowhere else on the left.

01:05:03.000 I mean, I'm sure that China and India and all of these places had not pyramids and not that kind of structure.

01:05:09.000 The nature of Egypt, it's a kind of freak of nature, as it were. 1.00

01:05:14.000 All desert except this little strip of Nile.

01:05:17.000 And then the delta that until recently was impenetrable swamp.

01:05:21.000 So it's practically unattackable.

01:05:24.000 And the food denial floods, and the food jumps out of the ground, and with a series of genuinely enlightened rulers, or at least pretty close to enlightened rulers,

01:05:42.000 ruling them, it all lasts for 3,500 years, And how did they live?

01:05:47.000 You see, everything that they did.

01:05:48.000 In fact, until quite recently, there were no such things as jobs.

01:05:52.000 There were trades and crafts and skills and arts.

01:05:56.000 And everybody, I mean, yes, in Europe, the combination of a repressive church and an oppressive nobility kept everybody...

01:06:07.000 You know, immersed in serfdom in one way or another. 0.79

01:06:10.000 But what people actually did with their lives was in some sense or another transformational.

01:06:16.000 All of it.

01:06:16.000 It takes a lot of smarts to be a good peasant.

01:06:19.000 All of these things that people used to do as a matter of course.

01:06:22.000 And in Egypt, you see it.

01:06:24.000 You see it carved into the walls, and everyone thinks these are the scenes of daily life.

01:06:29.000 Well, they are scenes of daily life, but they're decodable as transformational activities.

01:06:34.000 So anything that you do, and boy, you're doing martial arts.

01:06:39.000 This is a highly developed skill.

01:06:41.000 You are...

01:06:43.000 Somebody that you wouldn't be if you didn't have that skill.

01:06:46.000 If you were doing a podcast and what you did for a living was flipping burgers at McDonald's, you wouldn't be Joe Rogan.

01:06:55.000 You've been doing your homework without maybe even thinking that it was homework.

01:07:00.000 Because anything that you're involved in that...

01:07:05.000 That you go at with a quest for perfection of whatever it is, has this transformational value.

01:07:13.000 And when you know it intellectually, when you can articulate it, it implements actually the activity itself.

01:07:24.000 So it's possible even to do that.

01:07:26.000 You could be an enlightened burger flipper.

01:07:30.000 And the Sufis are very good at it. 1.00

01:07:35.000 In life, but not of it.

01:07:40.000 In other words, you can practice waking up, as it were, in the midst of the most mundane thing. 0.95

01:07:47.000 You could be an enlightened garbage collector.

01:07:52.000 As long as you knew what you were doing. 0.98

01:07:54.000 It's a totally different thing.

01:07:56.000 I would imagine I'm not a garbage collector.

01:07:58.000 It's a totally different thing to collect the garbage consciously than it is to just do it resentfully because that's the only job that you can get.

01:08:08.000 So when we're talking, it's not as though this is...

01:08:15.000 Anything actually new, it's the oldest idea that ever was, and it's something that people have been doing for thousands and thousands of years.

01:08:23.000 That said, going into the whole thing of precession and the ages, particularly as expressed Plato, they have a golden age and a silver age, a bronze age and an iron age.

01:08:36.000 The Hindus do it in rather more sophisticated fashion.

01:08:40.000 I forget exactly the names are on the tip of my tongue.

01:08:43.000 Of those ages, but if they are, let's say, analogous to our seasons, particularly if you live where I do and not in California where it's all one season, but the seasons...

01:08:57.000 The yugas, is that it?

01:08:58.000 The yugas?

01:08:59.000 The yugas, that's right.

01:09:02.000 If they're compared to the seasons, it's a very different thing to grow roses in June than it is in January.

01:09:11.000 It's the same effort when you're talking about people, you know, waking up and all of the rest of it.

01:09:17.000 This is a dark age.

01:09:19.000 I mean, this is the Kali Yuga as far as I'm concerned.

01:09:23.000 To do anything Of a spiritual nature now with all of these forces, with all of these forces lined up against you, not consciously of course, but unconsciously, it's an incredibly difficult thing to actually practice a genuine A genuine spiritual doctrine.

01:09:44.000 First of all, you have to get interested in it, and that's only a small chunk of us, and then you have to try to do it.

01:09:50.000 And you have to have the time, you have to have the focus.

01:09:52.000 Or make the time and the focus.

01:09:54.000 Don't be distracted.

01:09:54.000 That's right, the focus and the will and all the rest of the things.

01:09:59.000 So growing roses in January takes a lot more effort to get to the same rose than it takes In June, when they're jumping out of the ground.

01:10:09.000 So my guess is, and it's only a guess, it's speculation, that in these higher levels of these higher periods of, you know, gold and silver, bronze, and so on, it's just much easier.

01:10:23.000 It is much easier for people to recognize what's Well,

01:10:43.000 if you look at the influence that Egypt had clearly on Greece and clearly on a lot of other civilizations where people literally came to Egypt to learn, If Egypt wasn't there, what would civilization be like?

01:10:58.000 I mean, it's such a unique place in that there's really nowhere that you can compare that has the level of sophistication as far as the structures in the ancient world.

01:11:10.000 I mean, it's almost like what they created was undeniable.

01:11:13.000 Like, I think Giza, the Great Pyramid of Giza has 2,300,000 stones that weigh between 2 and 80 tons.

01:11:21.000 Like, what?

01:11:24.000 That's insane.

01:11:25.000 It is.

01:11:25.000 There's the level of sophistication in creating something like that.

01:11:29.000 I mean, I've only seen it in photographs, but one of the greatest photographs I've ever seen is from someone with a GoPro standing on the top of it.

01:11:36.000 So you get a sense of how immense it really truly is.

01:11:42.000 You just think about how incredible that must have been, especially when it was covered with smooth limestone before they cut it all off.

01:11:50.000 I mean, what you're seeing is it's an undeniable mastery of physical things to the point where it makes your head spin.

01:12:01.000 I mean, people say we can do that today.

01:12:04.000 Well, okay, maybe.

01:12:06.000 We kind of understand that it's been done and that we can do pretty immense things.

01:12:10.000 We have some pretty incredible tractors and machines and everything like that, but they didn't have those.

01:12:16.000 As far as we know.

01:12:17.000 They didn't have those.

01:12:18.000 They might have had something else.

01:12:20.000 What do you think they had?

01:12:21.000 I don't know.

01:12:22.000 Do you have some hypothesis, some theories in your head about the construction methods?

01:12:30.000 Some, a bit, that actually from Tibet, there's actually a funny little book.

01:12:36.000 I've done some lectures out at, what is it called, in Joshua Tree.

01:12:43.000 You know about that?

01:12:45.000 It's a contact in the desert.

01:12:47.000 They're mostly interested in the UFO phenomenon and stuff like that.

01:12:51.000 But the place itself, Joshua Retreat Center, is founded by a very interesting guy who is sort of the Tibetan Krishnamurti.

01:13:00.000 In other words, it's an interesting little book he wrote, terribly written, but his studies in Tibet.

01:13:06.000 And at the end of his little book, he's talking about, he's studying with the lamas, he describes certain of the Certain of the things he has seen them do.

01:13:17.000 And I see no particular reason to dismiss what he says.

01:13:20.000 He's talking from experience and has the ring of veracity to it.

01:13:24.000 He talks about going into an underground chamber that has no lights or electricity or anything like that.

01:13:31.000 That's all lit up.

01:13:33.000 When you go to Egypt, you have these deep, deep shaft tombs that go down and around and all like this.

01:13:38.000 And people say, well, how did they light the thing up?

01:13:41.000 It can't have had torches.

01:13:42.000 It would have used up all of the oxygen and it would have smoked up the ceilings and all the rest of it.

01:13:47.000 And people say, well, mirrors.

01:13:49.000 No, mirrors will do...

01:13:50.000 And you need silvered mirrors for it to go around corners.

01:13:53.000 There are the gypsy caves in Seville that are four or five rooms and that are lit with mirrors from on top.

01:14:00.000 But no, somehow, and I used to joke and say, well, you know, they had an inner light.

01:14:05.000 I'm joking.

01:14:06.000 But maybe that's what it was.

01:14:09.000 They produced this, and he talks about other lamas he's witnessed doing incredible feats that you couldn't do, you know, that you just couldn't do in your ordinary state.

01:14:21.000 Probably you as a martial artist have had moments or witnessed people who can do things that are, for anybody else, impossible.

01:14:29.000 Yeah, but they don't light up tunnels.

01:14:30.000 No, they don't light up tunnels, but they can do physical things that are...

01:14:36.000 They're extraordinary.

01:14:38.000 They're almost miraculous.

01:14:41.000 Nobody else could do them.

01:14:42.000 Yeah, but it's a really important point, what you're saying, about the construction methods that they used where they did have these long tunnels and these passages and these places, but...

01:14:54.000 Somehow or another, they managed to navigate these things without leaving any marks or soot from torches, which are everywhere else where people used candles or anywhere else.

01:15:06.000 Even the Sistine Chapel, the entire ceiling is covered with soot.

01:15:10.000 They had to clean it to prepare it so people could see it again.

01:15:15.000 But that's really fascinating to think that they had some other method of illumination that we just haven't discovered yet.

01:15:21.000 We don't know what they did or how they did it.

01:15:23.000 That's one thing.

01:15:24.000 But you look at a jillion other things.

01:15:27.000 Particularly, this is, again, one of the reasons why the Sphinx theory is so contentious, so dangerous to these guys.

01:15:35.000 Because carving the Sphinx is one thing.

01:15:38.000 But, okay, limestones are relatively...

01:15:41.000 Resilient stones, relatively soft stone, enough guys with chisels, even if their copper chisels could do that given enough time and enough genius.

01:15:50.000 But the temples either side of it are built of stones half the size of this room, slotted into place like pieces of a jigsaw puzzle.

01:16:02.000 This is unbelievable.

01:16:04.000 And again, what you just said is really important.

01:16:06.000 Copper.

01:16:07.000 Copper tools.

01:16:07.000 That's what they think.

01:16:08.000 Copper tempered with arsenic.

01:16:10.000 I mean, but those same copper tools are supposedly used for carving the granite.

01:16:18.000 If you go to Egypt, actually, you're a huge audience.

01:16:21.000 Get a Joe Rogan trip together and come on to Egypt.

01:16:24.000 I'm not going with people listening to this podcast.

01:16:26.000 We'll have a test.

01:16:28.000 Too many freaks.

01:16:30.000 90% of them would be great, the 10%.

01:16:33.000 We'll keep out the 10%. 1.00

01:16:35.000 Prepare a filter.

01:16:38.000 Have a conversation with them.

01:16:39.000 Prepare a filter.

01:16:40.000 Get them in a room.

01:16:41.000 Prepare a filter.

01:16:44.000 How many people would you take at a time?

01:16:46.000 I have a max of 24. Interesting.

01:16:48.000 Because more than that is unmanageable.

01:16:50.000 Right.

01:16:51.000 And when you see it, I mean, one thing after the other...

01:16:54.000 And it's totally safe to go to Egypt right now?

01:16:57.000 Well, it's as safe as Los Angeles. 0.99

01:16:59.000 I mean, or anywhere else here in dumbfuckistan. 0.99

01:17:04.000 You know, this is... 0.99

01:17:05.000 Dumbfuckistan. 0.99

01:17:06.000 For Americans to... 0.99

01:17:09.000 Of all people, to be afraid of going somewhere.

01:17:12.000 We're worried about Islamic terrorism more than anything. 1.00

01:17:15.000 Because we've been...

01:17:16.000 It's here.

01:17:16.000 It's already here.

01:17:18.000 And Islamic terrorism is itself a tiny little bit of the terrorism that goes on on a daily basis. 0.74

01:17:25.000 You pick up, you open the internet, and there's some nutcase kid somewhere or another shooting down a mall. 0.93

01:17:32.000 I mean, the terrorists...

01:17:36.000 The known terrorists have accounted for, it's not even a statistic.

01:17:41.000 It's an X number of people that they've gone after.

01:17:44.000 But, you know, here in this crazy, violent country, you're never safe anywhere.

01:17:51.000 Schools aren't safe.

01:17:52.000 Malls aren't safe.

01:17:53.000 What's safe?

01:17:54.000 Right.

01:17:54.000 Cairo has some nice hotels, too, right?

01:17:56.000 Oh, great hotels.

01:17:57.000 Yeah, we stay at a place actually right across a stone's throw from the pyramids itself.

01:18:02.000 So you can look at the pyramid out your window?

01:18:03.000 Yeah, you can.

01:18:04.000 Wow.

01:18:04.000 That's right.

01:18:05.000 You can do that.

01:18:07.000 When I look at the Great Pyramid or I look at the structures I've seen online or in your videos or things along those lines, what's shocking to me is how, and this is going to be a weird thing to say, how Egyptian it looks and how Egypt stands alone in this very distinctive way.

01:18:27.000 In that the construction methods, just the intricacy of the building, and these pyramids.

01:18:33.000 I mean, people talk about the Mayan pyramids, and I've been to Chichen Itza, and it's an amazing place, and it's really beautiful and crazy to look at, but it pales in comparison to the structures of Egypt.

01:18:43.000 Yeah, everything pales in comparison with Egypt.

01:18:46.000 So what happened?

01:18:47.000 How did that happen?

01:18:48.000 Well, as I said, because it was in a kind of a blessed One, it had a philosophy, you know, it had a spiritual philosophy underpinning it that had the...

01:19:00.000 that had, you might say, that had the...

01:19:05.000 that united the people in their entirety.

01:19:08.000 It doesn't mean that there weren't, you know, criminals and murderers and stuff like that, but basically the people were united in their...

01:19:16.000 In their faith, enlightened in their belief.

01:19:18.000 Herodotus, when Egypt was 6th century BC, Herodotus and Egypt is already in steep decline, says the Egyptians are the happiest, healthiest, and most religious of people.

01:19:31.000 And it wasn't the Egyptian Chamber of Commerce that was telling him to say that.

01:19:34.000 He was a patriotic Greek.

01:19:36.000 But it was like that, and it was a combination of the philosophy wedded to in a society that was protected on all four sides and almost impregnable.

01:19:49.000 It was conquered a couple of times over the course of 3,000 years for a relatively brief period of time.

01:19:55.000 And the food jumped out of the ground.

01:19:58.000 The Nile flooded and took practically no work, and that made a quite substantial population It gave them months of free time every year.

01:20:09.000 So how did it all go wrong?

01:20:10.000 Now we're talking about the Kali Yugas.

01:20:14.000 Whatever period Egypt is assigned to is on a downhill slope. 0.60

01:20:20.000 It just plain was on a downhill slope.

01:20:22.000 And you can watch it transform in front of your eyes.

01:20:26.000 It disintegrates as a coherent religion, rises In another form that we call Christianity, actually, and you can see it happening in front of your nose with Coptic Christianity arising. 0.97

01:20:40.000 All the rest of the stuff gets completely decadent under the Romans.

01:20:43.000 I mean Rome, what's his name?

01:20:46.000 Gibbon, Edward Gibbon, in Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire talks about the grandeur The glory of Greece, which is absolute nonsense, or near total nonsense, and the grandeur of Rome.

01:21:00.000 Yeah, they were building coliseums in order to torture, in order to let gladiators kill each other, and they built good roads.

01:21:09.000 But Rome was a three-ring bureaucracy, actually, and that's the beginning of the end.

01:21:15.000 In Europe, anyway, it's very traceable.

01:21:18.000 The Asian countries less so, but they too have high civilizations that decline, and in Europe you see kind of a turnaround in the Renaissance, very impossible to actually date, and then you have it leading in a sort of In a very one-sided development in which technology advances by leaps and bounds and everything else is arguably a lot worse 0.85

01:21:48.000 than it was a couple of hundred years ago.

01:21:50.000 From every spiritual, psychological point of view, we're a lot worse off than, let's say, the colonial Americans. 0.87

01:21:58.000 You really think so?

01:21:59.000 But the depictions of the colonial Americans by the ancient people, when you, who was it that described the atrocities that Columbus and his crew had done?

01:22:11.000 What preacher, what priest?

01:22:13.000 Oh yeah, no, loads of them, sure.

01:22:15.000 They had done horrific, horrific things.

01:22:17.000 Oh, those are the conquerors, yeah.

01:22:18.000 I'm not talking about the settlers who murdered all the Indians.

01:22:22.000 Also the Aztecs, right?

01:22:22.000 Cortez, and all that stuff.

01:22:25.000 Montezuma was a piece of shit. 1.00

01:22:27.000 Oh, yeah. 1.00

01:22:28.000 Slaughter of 80,000 slaves after they built Teotihuacan.

01:22:31.000 How do you say that?

01:22:34.000 Teotihuacan.

01:22:35.000 This I don't know about and I don't know again.

01:22:38.000 But they seem like bad people too, right?

01:22:41.000 Oh, loads of bad people around.

01:22:42.000 They just didn't have the internet.

01:22:43.000 No, but I'm talking about they certainly didn't have the internet and lots of other goodies they didn't have.

01:22:50.000 No, but there was a certain...

01:22:54.000 Let's say, about the populace in general in America, a certain gravitas about them.

01:23:01.000 There's a certain presence that is of our great-great-grandfathers.

01:23:05.000 Well, not mine, because they were in Hungary at that time, my great-great-grandfather.

01:23:08.000 But there's a certain Sort of like Emerson self-reliance.

01:23:14.000 I mean, this is a piece of it.

01:23:16.000 Meanwhile, of course, they weapon all the slaves in the South and they're murdering all the Indians and the billionaires, as is their fashion, are beating up on their Irish immigrant workers because why have slaves when they can mistreat their workers and build all of their railroads across the country. 0.64

01:23:35.000 But nevertheless, there's a sense of Gravitas is almost the only word I can think of because it's not as though it's intellectually advanced or anything like that.

01:23:47.000 But there's a certain seeming solidity to 19th century America than there is now in this crazy chaos that we live in.

01:23:58.000 Don't you think that there's always this tendency in human beings that long for nostalgia?

01:24:03.000 They look back to the past, to a moment when things made sense?

01:24:07.000 It seems to me that there's always that. 0.99

01:24:08.000 And even when people are full of shit about it, like they look back on high school days, man, those are the good old days. 0.99

01:24:13.000 Like, what are you talking about? 1.00

01:24:14.000 You had pimples, you were out of your fucking mind, insecure, you're terrified of the future. 0.99

01:24:18.000 That wasn't the good old days. 1.00

01:24:19.000 This is true.

01:24:20.000 Yeah, Trump, make America great again.

01:24:22.000 Yeah, bring back slavery. 0.94

01:24:25.000 Find some more.

01:24:26.000 We run out of Indians. 1.00

01:24:27.000 Murder the Muslims. 1.00

01:24:28.000 Yeah, let's go to the Arab nations. 1.00

01:24:30.000 Or let's go to the Amazon. 1.00

01:24:32.000 Yeah, let's import them and murder them. 0.99

01:24:34.000 And let's bring back all of that stuff. 1.00

01:24:36.000 No, it was never great.

01:24:37.000 But, as I said, there's just...

01:24:39.000 There is a kind of...

01:24:43.000 Maybe I'm more optimistic.

01:24:44.000 I think there's an awakening going on right now with human beings that's unprecedented.

01:24:48.000 And I think it's because of the internet.

01:24:50.000 I think because of the fact that we're combining our thoughts in some sort of a strange way and sharing ideas and information in a way that no one's ever been able to do before.

01:24:58.000 I don't think people have ever been this aware of how crazy things are.

01:25:03.000 But at the same time, look at the lunacy of last night's presidential debate.

01:25:08.000 You realize, I guess we really haven't...

01:25:11.000 I mean, we might be aware of things, but actual progress is not really being made.

01:25:15.000 We have the ability to be aware of things, but we are not at least in sufficient numbers.

01:25:24.000 We are not doing anything about it.

01:25:28.000 And that's the crux of the matter.

01:25:29.000 It's one thing.

01:25:30.000 This is why intellectual, spiritual, you know, intellectual mysticism is a total waste of time.

01:25:37.000 Only that it's like intellectual violin playing.

01:25:40.000 No!

01:25:41.000 You've got to play the violin.

01:25:42.000 Or it's not music.

01:25:44.000 Right.

01:25:44.000 So thinking about Egypt is not good enough.

01:25:46.000 You've got to go.

01:25:47.000 The ability, well, that, yes.

01:25:49.000 The ability to...

01:25:53.000 To get information is now absolutely unparalleled.

01:25:57.000 As far as we know, there's never been anything remotely like this.

01:26:01.000 At the same time, there's never been that much static.

01:26:04.000 So as we were talking about earlier, the crystal sniffers and the unicorns and the...

01:26:11.000 Ancient aliens.

01:26:12.000 This is all a vast amount of static, so you have to be able to find your way through the static to the music.

01:26:21.000 How much does ancient aliens frustrate you?

01:26:24.000 Not much, because I watched a couple of programs.

01:26:26.000 But if you did, are you throwing things at the TV and screaming?

01:26:30.000 I have low expectations, so it's TV. It's entertainment, and the people who are putting it together don't know what they're doing, except they see that it works and they want to make money.

01:26:42.000 Is it possible that the aliens made the pyramids?

01:26:46.000 When they have all these experts, everything it is.

01:26:48.000 Is it possible that extraterrestrials?

01:26:51.000 I guess it's possible.

01:26:52.000 That's right.

01:26:53.000 Well, it is possible.

01:26:54.000 And Giorgio, of course, pushed into a corner, says, yeah, all of this and that and so on.

01:26:59.000 Still it's aliens.

01:27:00.000 Giorgio Tsoukalos?

01:27:01.000 Yeah.

01:27:01.000 He's beautiful.

01:27:03.000 I love that guy.

01:27:03.000 He's a funny guy.

01:27:04.000 He's a funny guy.

01:27:06.000 When you think of ancient Egypt and you think of the public's understanding and awareness of it, what do you think the average person is missing?

01:27:18.000 All of it.

01:27:19.000 All of it.

01:27:20.000 Basically.

01:27:22.000 So you think it's like right before our fate, in front of our eyes, and most people just have no idea the majesty and how intensely unique it is?

01:27:29.000 No, look, Our Mystery of the Sphinx, which was at that time one of the most watched TV documentaries of all time, and it really had a massive audience and people who saw it Remember it, I mean, even to this day.

01:27:43.000 Got me.

01:27:44.000 You saw it?

01:27:45.000 Oh, you did?

01:27:46.000 I have a VHS cassette tape of it, sir.

01:27:49.000 Really?

01:27:50.000 Wait, I brought it.

01:27:51.000 Wait, did I bring it?

01:27:52.000 I forget if I brought you.

01:27:53.000 I think you can get it online now.

01:27:54.000 I think it might be on YouTube.

01:27:56.000 It's on DVD. I was going to bring you a DVD of it, actually.

01:27:58.000 Oh, beautiful.

01:27:59.000 I've almost memorized it.

01:28:01.000 Well, that's good.

01:28:01.000 Yeah, I've seen it quite a few times.

01:28:03.000 But anyway, that had a certain impact.

01:28:05.000 For sure.

01:28:06.000 But even if 30 million people saw it, 300 million didn't.

01:28:11.000 Right.

01:28:12.000 And then going there is really what's up.

01:28:14.000 And well, that's the big crunch.

01:28:16.000 And only X number of people can go there.

01:28:19.000 I went to the Vatican last summer, this past summer.

01:28:22.000 My first time ever in Italy.

01:28:24.000 And I had seen it on television before, obviously.

01:28:27.000 I'd seen videos and stuff.

01:28:28.000 I've seen photos.

01:28:30.000 Boy, when you're there, and you're like in, what is it, St. Peter's Basilica?

01:28:35.000 Yeah.

01:28:35.000 St. Paul's?

01:28:37.000 Paul's?

01:28:37.000 No.

01:28:38.000 Paul's?

01:28:38.000 St. Paul's?

01:28:39.000 Wait.

01:28:39.000 One of those guys.

01:28:40.000 One of those old dudes. 1.00

01:28:42.000 Now you've mistook it.

01:28:43.000 It's St. Peter's.

01:28:44.000 Is it?

01:28:44.000 St. Peter's.

01:28:45.000 With the dome where the boat always comes out.

01:28:46.000 And you look at it and you go, when you're inside of it and you realize the insane magnitude of the construction, the fact that it took hundreds of years to complete and they did it all without saws, without power tools, rather.

01:28:58.000 They did it all without any modern equipment.

01:29:00.000 And it's unbelievably beautiful.

01:29:04.000 Incredible work of art.

01:29:05.000 And it pales in comparison to what they did in Egypt.

01:29:08.000 Yes, it does.

01:29:09.000 Which is like...

01:29:10.000 I think I've got to go.

01:29:13.000 Because it's one of those...

01:29:13.000 Well, they also have an obelisk.

01:29:15.000 That's a 4,000-year-old obelisk.

01:29:16.000 They stole it from Egypt. 0.99

01:29:18.000 Yeah, they stole it from Egypt. 0.95

01:29:19.000 And you just look at that. 0.99

01:29:21.000 And when you're there physically and you look at it in person, you just go, how the fuck did they make this? 0.99

01:29:26.000 Wait a minute now. 0.99

01:29:27.000 Wait.

01:29:28.000 The cathedral is...

01:29:30.000 The basilica is very interesting and all that.

01:29:32.000 But...

01:29:32.000 How did they move?

01:29:34.000 How did they get this?

01:29:35.000 Actually, it's an interesting book by...

01:29:37.000 My now deceased friend Peter Tompkins on the magic of the obelisks where he's talking about, you know, ripping them out of context and bringing them to Rome and New York and England.

01:29:47.000 And it was interesting because they were brought over in the 19th century and it's already, you know, technology is pretty advanced.

01:29:54.000 I mean, you have huge cranes and all the rest of it and it strained the Victorian technology to the utmost to get these things over.

01:30:03.000 And then you realize that the Egyptians did it With none of those tools. 1.00

01:30:08.000 Yeah.

01:30:08.000 At all.

01:30:09.000 They somehow got them ripped out of the bedrock, brought down the river, taken offloaded from the rafts or boats or whatever, which is a big job, transported across the ground.

01:30:22.000 That's doable.

01:30:25.000 Erected in place precisely to the millimeter on the base.

01:30:29.000 That's a big mystery.

01:30:30.000 Did they have levels?

01:30:32.000 What?

01:30:33.000 Did they have levels, like bubble levels?

01:30:35.000 Not bubble levels, but they had other kinds.

01:30:37.000 They did it with water somehow or another.

01:30:40.000 That's, I think, reasonably well established, but I forget exactly how it was on how they leveled, for example, the base of the pyramid to a millimeter or something like that.

01:30:51.000 I mean, everything that you look at in Egypt when you go there, the deeper you look, the more mysterious it becomes, and you marvel at it.

01:31:00.000 Well, the King's Chamber is one of the most bizarre ones, right?

01:31:04.000 Well, no more bizarre than other things.

01:31:09.000 But just the enormity of the stones, the way they're set up, that it's such a complex system.

01:31:16.000 The way they've set them in place is so incredible.

01:31:19.000 I think you're talking about the ones, the so-called relieving chambers, which are really resonating chambers.

01:31:25.000 Resonating chambers.

01:31:27.000 Yeah, that's another thing.

01:31:29.000 Yeah, they don't relieve anything.

01:31:33.000 Architecturally, completely unnecessary to relieve the stresses from above.

01:31:38.000 Directly below the king's chamber is the so-called queen's chamber, which doesn't have that at all.

01:31:43.000 It has a simple gabled roof, and that protects it from anything that it needs.

01:31:47.000 The other chambers, when you're in the king's chamber...

01:31:51.000 It's like being, it's an echo chamber.

01:31:53.000 You can't, it's really a miraculous place, and of course everything is precision cut and all of that, but it doesn't look that fantastic.

01:32:01.000 It's the levels above that are the most amazing things, because these are the 70-ton blocks of stone, I think that's what you're talking about.

01:32:08.000 How they got those into place, no one knows, but they're responsible for the resonance of that particular chamber, and it's my belief that resonance plays Even not necessarily resonance with the human voice,

01:32:24.000 but when you're in there, I forget the acoustic term, feedback or whatever, that you can't, for example, if we're in the King's Chamber and we go, we rent the pyramid for a couple of hours for a meditation session on my trips, and when you're in there,

01:32:42.000 you can't have a conversation the way we're having it now.

01:32:45.000 You have to talk Like this, otherwise the reverberation is such that it scrambles your voice.

01:32:52.000 This can only be deliberate, and you can hear from the King's Chamber, if you do set up and you do a chant in the King's Chamber, if you go all the way down the Grand Gallery, And then there's a place below where you have to make a turn,

01:33:08.000 and then there's a descending passage that goes as deep below the ground as the pyramid, as the king's chamber is above the ground.

01:33:17.000 It's about a 12-story shaft that you go down.

01:33:20.000 Below the ground, 12 stories.

01:33:21.000 12 stories down below, and then 12 stories built up above.

01:33:24.000 Wow, look at that.

01:33:26.000 Oh, right.

01:33:27.000 Very good.

01:33:28.000 And I... And if you set up a chant in the King's Chamber, you can hear it down in the pit below.

01:33:40.000 Twelve stories below.

01:33:41.000 Yeah, but you shouldn't be able to hear it at all because the sound has to go down and then turn around and then go down the other shaft.

01:33:47.000 By the way, I should say, because people are always asking me now, it's a function of age, how long are you going to keep doing these trips?

01:33:55.000 Yeah.

01:33:55.000 And...

01:33:57.000 I say, well, you know, unless and until I can't get up and down the King's Chamber, up to the King's Chamber, I'll be doing trips unless some media thing takes over.

01:34:08.000 But, as they say in Texas, if you can do it, it ain't bragging.

01:34:12.000 That's a good line.

01:34:14.000 So, I was in Egypt recently on a research recce trip, but that may lead to something and I may not.

01:34:21.000 Recce trip?

01:34:22.000 Reconnaissance.

01:34:23.000 Oh.

01:34:24.000 Film lingo for reconnaissance.

01:34:27.000 I thought it was like...

01:34:28.000 Like a meditation?

01:34:30.000 No, not Reiki.

01:34:32.000 And actually, so normally you go with the group up to the King's Chamber, but I don't bother to go.

01:34:39.000 It gets opened up and you go down into the pits.

01:34:41.000 I said, ah, it's my 84th birthday.

01:34:44.000 I happen to be in Egypt.

01:34:45.000 So I said, okay, I'll I'll test it.

01:34:48.000 So I went up to the King of Chamber and down the shaft.

01:34:51.000 So that's 12 stories up and 12 stories down.

01:34:53.000 And I went down to the pit.

01:34:54.000 It was 12 stories down and 12 stories up.

01:34:57.000 And I figured that was pretty good for 84. That's pretty good.

01:35:02.000 So I'll be doing the trips for a while.

01:35:05.000 Nice.

01:35:06.000 Well, that's good.

01:35:06.000 Because, I mean, I don't think anybody's capable of doing the same kind of experience that you would provide.

01:35:13.000 Like, your knowledge of Egypt is pretty rare in this day and age.

01:35:16.000 Well, I was hoping when I had this idea to do my own trips, I thought, oh, finally, I'll make a living out of this stuff.

01:35:23.000 But what happened was that no sooner had my guidebook come out.

01:35:26.000 You probably don't have a copy of that.

01:35:28.000 And it's out of print now, but I have copies.

01:35:34.000 That back in 85, the first of the terrorist things happened and these guys hijacked the cruise ship off Alexandria and pushed this poor old guy in a wheelchair over the side of the cruise ship and he drowned.

01:35:51.000 And my book had just come out and instantly the tourist trade was killed, talking about people being afraid for a whole year it took for it to develop.

01:36:00.000 And it did develop again, but the book had disappeared from the shelves by that time.

01:36:04.000 Anyway, still available, of course.

01:36:07.000 But, wait, I lost my thread.

01:36:11.000 With the trips, like, what did you say?

01:36:14.000 With Egypt? 0.98

01:36:17.000 Oh, someone doing it.

01:36:19.000 My plan was I wanted to train a number of people up who are familiar, you know, steeped in symbolist Egypt to spread the word, as it were.

01:36:29.000 And while I was at it, get a commission from the trips to, you know, provide some useful wolf repellent.

01:36:36.000 So you can have some nice passive income.

01:36:39.000 Right.

01:36:40.000 But it never happened because, you know, one thing led to another and it was hard enough getting my own trips filled up.

01:36:46.000 But yeah, unfortunately, as it now stands, I'm the only one, only a handful of people, no symbolist Egypt well enough to communicate it.

01:36:57.000 As it just so happens, I'm the only one who does trips.

01:37:00.000 I really am the only wheel in town in that regard.

01:37:03.000 Well, you brought us a bunch of slides.

01:37:05.000 So why don't you tell me what do you want to show us and what did you bring here?

01:37:09.000 Well, that's my whole long lecture.

01:37:14.000 You want to go to the geology of the Sphinx, the water weathering.

01:37:21.000 And then other slides related to that, the gigantic blocks, paving blocks, particularly around the Second Pyramid.

01:37:32.000 And yeah, mostly around the Second Pyramid.

01:37:41.000 And then, I mean all of that stuff relates to the geological evidence.

01:37:48.000 Then I wanted to get into, I didn't want to touch the symbolist, the quest for immortality, because that's a whole big subsequent thing.

01:37:59.000 I did want to get into, and we didn't even talk about it, yeah, the map of Dhamfakistan, and what I call the, and I've got a great graphic for it actually, everybody you know certainly,

01:38:16.000 and everybody probably most of your audience will know, About the four horsemen of the apocalypse, right?

01:38:21.000 From Revelation, who are actually an interesting study in its own right.

01:38:25.000 The four horsemen are war, War, famine, pestilence, and death.

01:38:37.000 And what's interesting about the Four Horsemen is that only war is really under human control, at least in theory.

01:38:45.000 Famine, pestilence, plague, as it were, and death comes to us all.

01:38:50.000 It's a peculiar choice, actually, for the Four Horsemen.

01:38:53.000 But I invented the five cowboys of Apocalypse 2.0.

01:38:58.000 And they are capitalism, patriotism, democracy, technology, and entertainment.

01:39:09.000 All the stuff I love.

01:39:11.000 Well...

01:39:11.000 That's the end?

01:39:14.000 Well...

01:39:15.000 No, it's just another way of looking at things, actually.

01:39:19.000 It's really human folly, all of it, right?

01:39:22.000 Call it democracy, call it capitalism, call it technology.

01:39:27.000 It's none of those things.

01:39:28.000 It's human folly.

01:39:29.000 It's the error in human use.

01:39:35.000 Capitalism is really based upon the philosophy, everything for me, nothing for you.

01:39:41.000 You see, everybody's fighting for market share.

01:39:43.000 Why can't you live with a guy and stay alive?

01:39:46.000 It's competition.

01:39:47.000 But if it wasn't for that competition, we wouldn't be here.

01:39:50.000 We wouldn't have planes that shoot across the sky.

01:39:52.000 We wouldn't have laptops that work so well.

01:39:54.000 We wouldn't have internet that's so fast.

01:39:56.000 I don't know.

01:39:57.000 We might, but we might not.

01:39:58.000 It's very possible that we wouldn't.

01:40:00.000 And there's a downside to all of those things, as a matter of fact.

01:40:02.000 But there's an upside, too.

01:40:03.000 There is an upside.

01:40:04.000 I'm a glass-half-full kind of guy, John Anthony West.

01:40:06.000 That's the technology side of it.

01:40:08.000 I haven't got to that yet.

01:40:10.000 Capitalism is based upon everything for me, nothing for you.

01:40:14.000 Patriotism is based upon everything for us, nothing for them.

01:40:18.000 The bumper sticker says, God bless America. 1.00

01:40:21.000 The hidden sticky side says, and fuck everyone else. 1.00

01:40:24.000 That's patriotism. 1.00

01:40:26.000 Democracy is that, the idea is that the dishwashers elect the chef and tell them what to do.

01:40:34.000 I don't know about you, I don't eat in a restaurant where the dishwashers elect the chef and tell them what to do.

01:40:40.000 It's flawed, it's hopelessly flawed to begin with, which Plato recognized perfectly.

01:40:46.000 Churchill said, democracy looks like the worst of all possible political systems until you look at all the others.

01:40:54.000 At the same time, this is fun and it's not necessarily untrue.

01:40:58.000 At the same time, he also said, contradicting himself, the best argument against democracy is ten minutes of conversation with an average voter.

01:41:06.000 How about you?

01:41:07.000 I don't want my leaders elected numerically by the average voter.

01:41:14.000 Actually, if they had a test, which is probably next to impossible to even conceive, if voting were a privilege, I mean, when the country started off, it was a privilege, but you had to be a white male who owned property, 0.78

01:41:30.000 which is not as...

01:41:32.000 Elitist as it actually looks now because in those days They were the only ones who were substantial enough and probably had some sort of an education.

01:41:42.000 It doesn't mean necessarily that they understand the principles.

01:41:45.000 And they, you know, they were, you might say, the solid citizens who at least could read.

01:41:52.000 I mean, nobody else could read except people with an education of some sort.

01:41:56.000 So that was the rule.

01:41:57.000 And it wasn't a terribly good rule, but it might have been in its own way.

01:42:02.000 Anyway, that's as a principle that It shouldn't be a privilege to vote.

01:42:11.000 Why shouldn't anybody be able to do brain surgery?

01:42:15.000 Or design engineer, design a bridge.

01:42:19.000 I'm as good as the next guy.

01:42:20.000 I've never designed a bridge.

01:42:21.000 I don't have any training, but it's a democracy.

01:42:24.000 Why can't I do that?

01:42:25.000 Or play center field for the Mets.

01:42:29.000 And that's what the president is.

01:42:30.000 Really, essentially, anybody.

01:42:31.000 You just have to say, I want to do it.

01:42:34.000 Step up, this is my plan, and get people to vote for you.

01:42:36.000 Well, it's a contest.

01:42:38.000 Anyway, put it this way.

01:42:40.000 In its current form, and in fact, as far back as you could go in America, it's been a disaster democracy.

01:42:46.000 Technology is certainly a mixed bag.

01:42:49.000 The problem, two big problems with technology.

01:42:52.000 The main one, and we touched upon this earlier, is that technology...

01:42:59.000 It deprives the average, the normal human being of making a living out of his own productivity.

01:43:07.000 It deprives them?

01:43:08.000 Technology does?

01:43:09.000 How so?

01:43:10.000 The only people who are creative in technology are the people who are creating the technology.

01:43:16.000 Everybody else serves the technology.

01:43:18.000 They work in the offices that serve the technology.

01:43:23.000 They're basically slaves to the technology.

01:43:25.000 But what about the people that use the technology to separate themselves from slave jobs?

01:43:30.000 There's a lot of people that have started their own businesses online.

01:43:33.000 Yeah.

01:43:34.000 Because they could use technology now.

01:43:36.000 Crafts, people create things.

01:43:38.000 That's the upside, but it's a relatively small part compared to the number of people.

01:43:44.000 They talk about all these good jobs going out to China. 0.99

01:43:48.000 Those are shitty jobs. 0.97

01:43:49.000 Nobody in their right mind would want to work in a factory. 0.96

01:43:52.000 Have you ever worked in a factory?

01:43:53.000 No.

01:43:54.000 Or been in a factory, really?

01:43:55.000 Yes, I've been in factories.

01:43:56.000 Because I went to schools, as seldom as I possibly could, in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, which is where the Bethlehem Steel Center was, and we used to go there on field drives.

01:44:07.000 Holy mackerel, this was like working in Dante's Inferno, these blackened figures jumping up and down in the blinded heat of the Bessemer converters. 1.00

01:44:17.000 And the other kinds of jobs of robots stuffing things into boxes or flipping burgers, the vast majority of people, yeah, they have their television sets and their internet and stuff like that,

01:44:32.000 but the vast majority of people do not and cannot make their living out of their own creativity.

01:44:39.000 And before, however terrible things may have been in medieval times, People did creative transformational things.

01:44:45.000 That's the downside of technology.

01:44:48.000 And the other bad side of technology, you talked about the good side.

01:44:51.000 The bad side is that it's not immoral necessarily, but it's amoral.

01:44:58.000 So as long as they can do it, they do it.

01:45:02.000 What do you mean by that?

01:45:03.000 Well, hydrogen bomb, why not?

01:45:05.000 We don't invent it, somebody else will do it.

01:45:07.000 Nerve gas, well, that's a very good way of getting away with, you know, around stuff.

01:45:11.000 Striped toothpaste, well, it's a waste of time and effort and stuff like that, but maybe we can sell more striped toothpaste than unstriped toothpaste.

01:45:20.000 And the rest of it is, in other words, a percentage of it, yeah, the medicine is very good until it gets into the hands of big pharma, and then make sure that people are ripped off to get at the medicine that they need and the medicine that they have available.

01:45:40.000 It's not usually a cure.

01:45:42.000 It's a way of keeping people alive and buying more medicine.

01:45:45.000 Anything that's actually a cure that comes from alternative sources is fought to the death by the big pharmaceutical companies.

01:45:53.000 So technology is certainly a mixed bag.

01:45:56.000 And entertainment, depending on how you define it, is what you do to kill time before it kills you.

01:46:03.000 For the most part, it's an absolute waste of time.

01:46:09.000 It takes your mind off the boringness of your own life.

01:46:14.000 Art is different.

01:46:15.000 Art is not entertainment.

01:46:16.000 There's a broad line in between that, at least in theory, could or should be filled by comedy, which is not exactly entertainment.

01:46:28.000 But it's not exactly sacred science either, but it plays, at least theoretically, it can play a kind of a transformational role.

01:46:40.000 Real high-level comedy is enlightening.

01:46:46.000 It points out, and comedy is based upon, you can't laugh.

01:46:51.000 Comedy is based upon What's wrong?

01:46:57.000 You can't laugh at what's right.

01:46:58.000 You can't make fun of good sex or good food.

01:47:01.000 You can make fun of attitudes toward good sex or good food.

01:47:04.000 But you can't laugh at what's right.

01:47:07.000 Not easily, but you can laugh, but you can and do laugh at what's wrong.

01:47:12.000 And so, let's say at some inner level, by laughing at what's wrong, Inadvertently, it's a recognition we have within us, let's say, a moral, we have a moral Compass is the wrong word.

01:47:32.000 We have a moral thermometer or something of the sort that recognizes, by recognizing what's wrong, we're assenting, giving assent to what's right.

01:47:42.000 It is too cultural.

01:47:43.000 Of course, what's funny to an Eskimo is not necessarily funny to an African. 1.00

01:47:47.000 What's funny to an African is not necessarily funny to a Chinese. 1.00

01:47:52.000 But comedy has this Potential to play, at least in my view, a transformational role.

01:47:58.000 But anyway, mostly it doesn't.

01:48:01.000 And entertainment, at the American level, turn on your television set.

01:48:05.000 Is that entertainment?

01:48:07.000 It's certainly not art.

01:48:08.000 It's a deadening...

01:48:10.000 It's an anodyne.

01:48:12.000 It's sort of...

01:48:13.000 Most of it is a kind of...

01:48:19.000 What's it that you take to go?

01:48:21.000 Sedative.

01:48:22.000 It's basically a kind of sedative or the opposite.

01:48:27.000 It's like a Benny.

01:48:29.000 Stimulant?

01:48:29.000 It's a stimulant, actually, with the Terminator and all the horrible, vicious things that they do.

01:48:38.000 Let's get to the slides, because we're already two hours in here.

01:48:41.000 Let's take a look at some of the slides.

01:48:44.000 What do you want to start?

01:48:45.000 Let's start with the geology.

01:48:47.000 Start right at the beginning.

01:48:48.000 And I'll just whip you past.

01:48:50.000 This is a really confusing thing to me.

01:48:54.000 Why do they continue to rebuild that thing?

01:48:57.000 Because when they're rebuilding it, they're rebuilding the feet and the paws of the Sphinx, and I understand there's considerable erosion that they have to mitigate, but it's not the Sphinx anymore.

01:49:08.000 Well, it's bringing the Sphinx back to supposedly what it was originally.

01:49:12.000 The problem really is an engineering problem.

01:49:16.000 They don't know themselves, and at least a few of them acknowledge it.

01:49:19.000 Schock thinks this.

01:49:21.000 He's not in charge of doing the repairs, that it may be doing more damage because it's still weathering on the inside, and by covering it over with these usually very badly done stuff, that they're actually doing more damage than that.

01:49:36.000 Well, the Department of Antiquities is the one.

01:49:37.000 Is this Zowie? 1.00

01:49:38.000 He's no longer in charge.

01:49:40.000 Is he in the pokey?

01:49:41.000 Did they lock him up?

01:49:42.000 No, no, no.

01:49:43.000 I know he was in trouble for a while, right?

01:49:44.000 Well, he was in trouble, but they couldn't pin it on him. 1.00

01:49:47.000 Oh, the slippery bastard. 0.98

01:49:49.000 No, listen, Zahi, on a personal level, that's another long story, and we've already gone on for two hours, but on a personal level, I can get on with Zahi. 0.99

01:50:01.000 And he's now back in, not formally in a position of power.

01:50:05.000 He's not head of the department.

01:50:07.000 And he's got his problems.

01:50:09.000 Did you see the debate that he had with Graham Hancock who walked out right away?

01:50:13.000 Yeah, he was a disaster.

01:50:14.000 And all of his friends even, I mean, the guy who runs my trip, Mohammed Nazmi, I mean, I called a surgeon because he really knows how to operate.

01:50:22.000 He's a wonderful guy.

01:50:23.000 And he's a good personal friend of Zahi's.

01:50:26.000 And he said, you know, Zahi, this is a disaster.

01:50:29.000 But, you know, he lived through it.

01:50:31.000 And he's back on the scene, as it were.

01:50:35.000 Anyway...

01:50:35.000 So, we're looking at the Sphinx enclosure here.

01:50:38.000 And this massive, massive structure with all this erosion around it.

01:50:43.000 Right, all this erosion to it.

01:50:45.000 People see this on YouTube.

01:50:48.000 Yeah, you'll see as we go through a few slides, you'll see the sense of that erosion.

01:50:53.000 This is just a wonderful picture of it taken by a good friend of mine.

01:50:57.000 Keep going.

01:50:57.000 This is why the Sphinx could not have been weathered by sand.

01:51:03.000 What we're looking at right now, for the people that are just listening, is it buried in sand, which it has been many, many times when Napoleon found that it was buried in sand, correct?

01:51:13.000 Right.

01:51:13.000 Completely buried in sand and probably for a few thousand years.

01:51:16.000 This is taken, photograph taken about 2000, when it had already been excavated and filled up with sand again, which happens pretty quickly.

01:51:25.000 So basically you can say, give or take a few hundred years, that since its supposed construction around 2500 B.C., It's been buried in sand about 3,000 of those 4,500 years.

01:51:38.000 That's insane.

01:51:38.000 So that's the proof.

01:51:39.000 Yeah, there's the evidence.

01:51:40.000 And still the geologists go on ranting about sand.

01:51:43.000 When you're talking about this friend of yours who's going through the trees, okay, how did it weather by sand?

01:51:49.000 Wind and sand, right?

01:51:51.000 How did it get exposed?

01:51:52.000 The wind can't affect it that way.

01:51:54.000 Wasn't that the original text of whoever, who do they attribute to the construction of the pyramid?

01:51:59.000 Thutmose?

01:52:00.000 No, no, no.

01:52:01.000 Pharaoh Khafra.

01:52:02.000 Khafra. 0.91

01:52:02.000 The successor of Khufu, who supposedly built the Great Pyramid. 0.91

01:52:07.000 Which is not true in its entirety.

01:52:10.000 The pyramids, this is another complex argument, which as you see, everything's complex.

01:52:15.000 They're almost certainly built in stages, and the earliest stages probably date from whenever the Sphinx was originally built.

01:52:23.000 And the argument for Khafre building, it wasn't a text that said that he had a dream that if he uncovered the Sphinx, that he would become Pharaoh.

01:52:31.000 No, that's Thutmose IV, a thousand years later.

01:52:35.000 They attribute it to Khafre because the causeway that leads from the Sphinx, as you go behind it, you see the beginning?

01:52:44.000 Not really, you see it just back in the Sphinx.

01:52:46.000 The causeway The causeway leads up to, right to the middle of the Pyramid, of the Khafra Pyramid, which he almost certainly did build or anyway superimposed upon something that was there before because you can prove that.

01:53:00.000 Okay, keep going.

01:53:00.000 Did they used to think it was Tutmosis?

01:53:02.000 No, no, no.

01:53:03.000 They always thought it was Khafra because...

01:53:07.000 Well, again...

01:53:09.000 What is this right here?

01:53:10.000 That's not the Rosetta Stone, is it?

01:53:12.000 No, no, no.

01:53:12.000 That's the stela of Thutmose that talks about how in a dream it's covered with sand.

01:53:19.000 Oh, that's it right there, then.

01:53:21.000 That's in 1450 B.C. So that means in 1450 B.C. it was covered in sand.

01:53:26.000 Exactly.

01:53:26.000 And with a certain number of other evidences of that sort, you can put together the timeline that tells you...

01:53:32.000 I swear I've read online someone attributing Tutmosis to the creation of it, but there's a lot of erroneous...

01:53:38.000 There's a lot of junk on it.

01:53:39.000 Now, the face of the Sphinx, this is a really controversial thing, right? 0.90

01:53:42.000 Because the face of the Sphinx is clearly newer than the body, it's less eroded, and it's also a very African-looking face.

01:53:49.000 Do they think that...

01:53:50.000 Which, obviously, it's the continent of Africa, but do they think...

01:53:53.000 The Nubians had conquered Egypt at one point in time, right? 0.57

01:53:56.000 Wasn't the speculation that one of the Nubian pharaohs had created this?

01:54:01.000 Yeah, well...

01:54:02.000 Some said that.

01:54:03.000 19th century travelers, lots of them noted that this was really an African face.

01:54:08.000 But what they meant is that it's a sub-Sahara African face.

01:54:11.000 It's a real African African face.

01:54:13.000 The Nubians are very black, but have more or less finer features. 1.00

01:54:20.000 They don't have the... 0.98

01:54:21.000 Jaw like that.

01:54:22.000 I mean, that looks more like an NBA basketball player than an Egyptian. 0.83

01:54:27.000 Anyway, the headdress is all redone.

01:54:30.000 The picture before, covered with sand, you see how weathered the headdress was?

01:54:35.000 Yeah, they redid the bottom of it, right?

01:54:36.000 They redid the headdress in its entirety.

01:54:38.000 The face itself is a much harder outcrop of limestone, so it hasn't weathered to the same extent that the body of the Sphinx has weathered.

01:54:49.000 So you think it's of the same era?

01:54:51.000 We don't know. 0.82

01:54:52.000 Actually, you see, the African face is a real problem, actually. 1.00

01:54:58.000 Of course, the Egyptians are as prejudiced as everyone else, and they don't want to actually believe that the Sphinx itself could be a sub-Saharan African, maybe from an earlier period when the Africans were pharaohs.

01:55:10.000 I don't know.

01:55:10.000 Wasn't there some speculation that initially it was an actual lion's face and that the lion's face was cut down to create this pharaoh's face?

01:55:18.000 That's us speculating that way because the head is way too small for the body.

01:55:24.000 And we had the NYPD. We did this big study.

01:55:28.000 I think that's the next slide coming up.

01:55:31.000 Yeah, there it is.

01:55:32.000 There you see Frank Domingo, who was the...

01:55:37.000 Sketch artist?

01:55:38.000 Well, he was a forensic, a senior forensic artist for the NYPD. He's a guy who knows about, you know, physiognomy.

01:55:46.000 So he did a study of the comparative faces of the Sphinx and the, of the Sphinx, that's the one on the right, and Pharaoh Khafra and his conclusion was that no No competent artist or sculptor could possibly have used the same model for the face of the Sphinx as for the Kafra face.

01:56:09.000 And there's a few Kafra faces floating around. 1.00

01:56:11.000 So my criminal partner, when Frank gave us that study, his comparative study, Boris, Said said, for the academic establishment, this is bad news and worse news. 0.85

01:56:28.000 The bad news is that there wasn't Atlantis, and the worst news is they were black. 1.00

01:56:35.000 My black friends like that phrase. 0.82

01:56:38.000 But anyway, in the 90s, I did an op-ed piece for the New York Times, and I carefully left that part out.

01:56:47.000 I just compared, used the Frank Domingo's drawing versus the Sphinx.

01:56:54.000 But a couple of weeks later, a letter was published from an orthodontist, who also knows about faces, saying, hey, hey, that Sphinx is actually a sub-Saharan African face.

01:57:05.000 I didn't say it.

01:57:06.000 He said it, so I'm not in trouble for that.

01:57:08.000 But anyway, until something better is discovered, it's a sub-Saharan African face, and it was re-carved, and we don't know when.

01:57:18.000 So it's entirely possible that it used to be a lion and then some pharaoh came along and said, I don't like that lion, make it my face.

01:57:25.000 No, it may have been that the head was so weathered over time that they said, well, we can't repair the face the way that we can repair the body.

01:57:36.000 And so they re-carved the head.

01:57:38.000 And of course the face...

01:57:40.000 Was most likely still above ground while the rest of the body was covered, so it was subject to more erosion?

01:57:47.000 Well, it's also a harder limestone, so probably, again, this is speculation, but we reckon that an outcrop of stone was sticking above the sand level to begin with, and somebody at some point A jillion years ago,

01:58:03.000 decided to carve the Sphinx by cutting around it, cutting the bedrock away from around it, leaving the outcrop above and carving that into whatever it may have been originally.

01:58:18.000 It could have been an African queen. 1.00

01:58:20.000 How much information did they lose when the Library of Alexandria was burned?

01:58:24.000 Well, since it was burned, we don't know.

01:58:26.000 It's amazing though, really?

01:58:28.000 Could you imagine?

01:58:29.000 A million scrolls.

01:58:30.000 It was bragged that they had a million scrolls.

01:58:32.000 Who knows what was on them?

01:58:33.000 One of my dreams, not dreams, but sort of...

01:58:46.000 Vision, whatever, but hope is that one of these days somebody turns over a spade in Damascus or somewhere up there and discovers a cache of hidden...

01:59:03.000 Of hidden scrolls from the Library of Alexandria.

01:59:07.000 It's quite probable that the so-called maps of the Sea Kings, you know, the Piri Reis map and some of those other things, are copies of maps that were originally part of the library.

01:59:19.000 And I have a whole film script, actually.

01:59:22.000 What's the latest on this supposed chamber that they found under the paws of the Sphinx?

01:59:27.000 There's been some radio...

01:59:28.000 Oh, us.

01:59:29.000 That's us.

01:59:30.000 It's the seismograph.

01:59:31.000 It says that there's a chamber there.

01:59:33.000 The seismograph doesn't channel.

01:59:37.000 And the geophysicist who did it said, yeah, there's a void down there.

01:59:41.000 Does that mean that it's...

01:59:43.000 It could be a natural void that's certain kinds of limestone that's riddled with those kinds of voids, but this isn't that kind of limestone.

01:59:52.000 So more stuff.

01:59:55.000 When the opposition finally caves in and says, they never say they're wrong, and says, well, this deserves further study, then maybe we get permission to go and really look back in...

02:00:08.000 Into that.

02:00:08.000 Stick a probe down to something like that and see if there is indeed something in there.

02:00:13.000 We don't know.

02:00:14.000 God, that seems like an important thing.

02:00:16.000 Could be.

02:00:17.000 I mean, just to find that there's something there.

02:00:19.000 Just to find there's something there is important, yes.

02:00:22.000 Now, has there ever been any discussion whatsoever about...

02:00:27.000 I mean, I know they've done all this repair work on the Sphinx.

02:00:31.000 Has there ever been any discussion of taking the limestone that was pulled from the Great Pyramid and somehow or another putting new limestone back up there to recreate its original look?

02:00:44.000 No, nobody has ever talked about that as far as I know.

02:00:47.000 But it would be a nightmarish job because all of those core blocks are all crumbly and uneven and damaged and stuff like that.

02:00:57.000 And besides, they have other fish to fry.

02:00:59.000 You know, they've got technology to worry about.

02:01:02.000 I know, but I mean, just if people could see what it used to look like.

02:01:05.000 I mean, whoever did that when they raided it to build Cairo, like what?

02:01:10.000 That's what they say.

02:01:12.000 I've never seen a study that actually has documented where those stones are.

02:01:18.000 And they're big, massive stones, and they slope like this.

02:01:21.000 You can't build a bridge out of those stones.

02:01:23.000 You'd have to cut the edge off, which is almost as much work as quarrying the stuff out of the raw quarry rock, which is closer to Cairo.

02:01:32.000 What do you think happened?

02:01:33.000 I don't know.

02:01:34.000 I don't know, but I'm not 100% happy with that explanation.

02:01:38.000 I don't have a better one, but that one is subject to, let's say, subject to question.

02:01:46.000 Now, has it been firmly established that it was covered in smooth limestone?

02:01:50.000 Pretty much, yeah.

02:01:51.000 Pretty much?

02:01:52.000 Yes, actually the Roman, Greco-Roman writers who were there at the time studying talked about it being absolutely perfect and unpenetrable.

02:02:03.000 In fact, one of them said there's a rumor that there was a hinged block at the entrance that if you pushed it or did something with it, it opened.

02:02:13.000 And I've often thought that I wonder if that's the origin of Open Sesame.

02:02:18.000 In the Thousand and One Nights.

02:02:21.000 Because there are certain of those Thousand and One Nights tales that have their origins in ancient Egypt.

02:02:27.000 Wow.

02:02:27.000 That would be a good study.

02:02:29.000 Go ahead.

02:02:30.000 Keep going.

02:02:31.000 What else we got here?

02:02:32.000 That's the head of Khafra with the falcon. 1.00

02:02:36.000 Wow, very different face.

02:02:37.000 Totally different face.

02:02:38.000 I mean, you can't miss that.

02:02:40.000 And there's a more long story, but we're already going over here and I won't go into it.

02:02:45.000 Okay, here's this water weathering that when Schott took one look at it said, wow, this looks like they're hundreds of thousands of years old.

02:02:53.000 Just keep going.

02:02:54.000 Hundreds of thousands of years.

02:02:55.000 That was his...

02:02:56.000 You know, when the geologist...

02:02:58.000 He wasn't thinking what he was saying.

02:03:00.000 He was just saying it.

02:03:01.000 He was just saying it.

02:03:02.000 But it was...

02:03:03.000 Massive water erosion.

02:03:05.000 It was massive water erosion by a guy whose expertise is in that field.

02:03:11.000 Right.

02:03:11.000 So if he thought about it...

02:03:13.000 You know, we can't document that until we get a bunch of guys there really looking seriously into it.

02:03:18.000 How old do you think it is, if you had a guess?

02:03:21.000 I don't know.

02:03:23.000 Because of the way it's oriented, one of the reasons they come out with the date, Hancock and Boval originally came out with this 11,500, because it was a processional marker, because that would be the time as a lion, that would be the time when it lasts.

02:03:40.000 Saw its own image in the sky, Leo the Lion, the constellation of Leo.

02:03:44.000 That would have been the last time, I think, not that there's too much that's going on, it's in too chaotic a stage to have been done then.

02:03:53.000 I think it may be the age before that, which would be about 36,000 BC, which would correspond with the Egyptian texts themselves.

02:04:02.000 However, that said, it wouldn't surprise me if we were older still.

02:04:05.000 Wow.

02:04:06.000 Until we get a bunch of geologists and experts in their various fields to see if they can put a fix on it, and they might not be able to, but that's one of the things we look What are we looking forward to doing if we get permission to go back in there,

02:04:22.000 get the funding, important, and the permissions to go there and actually get this done?

02:04:28.000 And this is where actually we were just in Egypt when I climbed up and down the pyramid myself at 84. It's a complicated story, but we did get to meet the new Minister of Antiquities,

02:04:46.000 who was very cordial and listed the things that we had to do in order to get formal position.

02:04:55.000 But in any way, we established a personal contact with him, which was very useful.

02:05:00.000 And then we also met up with the director of this new gigantic museum that they're building and that is going to open in a year or two ago.

02:05:09.000 And he was very open to anything even controversial that they could apply science to.

02:05:17.000 So if some of the other pieces of this trip didn't go as planned, we couldn't get to see some of the things we wanted to see for complicated reasons.

02:05:25.000 But anyway, we established...

02:05:29.000 The potential foothold for getting the next stage of work accomplished.

02:05:32.000 That's very, very promising.

02:05:34.000 That's promising.

02:05:34.000 Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but they think that people in this form, the form of you and I, have only been around for somewhere around 300,000 to 500,000 years.

02:05:43.000 Is that right?

02:05:44.000 Well, that's the current thinking.

02:05:45.000 Yeah, well, then it changes all the time.

02:05:47.000 Yeah, it changes.

02:05:47.000 So let's bring it back.

02:05:49.000 Let's go crazy and say it's a million years old.

02:05:51.000 When you're looking at something like this and you're talking about 36,000 years, boy, that's... 0.78

02:05:56.000 It's just crazy to think that there's this period where people are just throwing shit at each other and throwing pointed sticks at animals and kind of barely getting by, and then something like this...

02:06:13.000 It just sort of erupts out of the imagination and the ingenuity of people that lived tens of thousands of years ago.

02:06:22.000 Yeah, but it shouldn't be that difficult because as you keep going through the slides, you'll get to the Paleolithic caves.

02:06:28.000 Now, that's more evidence of water erosion, correct?

02:06:31.000 No.

02:06:31.000 What you're looking at right there?

02:06:32.000 No, no, I'm talking about the painting cave.

02:06:34.000 But right there, with this image.

02:06:35.000 Well, right there, same image.

02:06:37.000 No, well, that's the same water weathering.

02:06:40.000 It's just another view of it.

02:06:41.000 That's the back end of the Sphinx.

02:06:42.000 Okay.

02:06:43.000 And that's interesting.

02:06:45.000 Anyway, part of Mark Lehner's theory is that it flaked away over time, and that's what's responsible for the curved profile.

02:06:56.000 But this is a tomb that's been cut in.

02:06:59.000 It's not Old Kingdom.

02:07:01.000 It's what's called Late Kingdom, but it dates from about 600 or 700 B.C., and those are the Mason's marks still as original.

02:07:12.000 2,500 years later, still perfectly visible.

02:07:18.000 No.

02:07:20.000 Theory exploded.

02:07:22.000 Well, that definitely puts a damper on the wind and sand erosion theory.

02:07:26.000 Well, that too.

02:07:26.000 Absolutely.

02:07:28.000 Especially considering that they still think the Sphinx is 2500 BC. Yeah, yeah, well, this is, remember, as I said, the second strongest thing in the world.

02:07:39.000 Yes.

02:07:39.000 And this is not, you don't trifle with them.

02:07:42.000 If you think that just because the evidence is good enough, they're going to accept it.

02:07:47.000 No, they're only going to accept it when you beat them into the ground sufficiently so that they can't get up.

02:07:54.000 Well, as long as their reputation is staked on their original assumptions being correct, there's going to be a problem.

02:08:01.000 Oh, and so there is.

02:08:03.000 Yeah.

02:08:03.000 So what are we looking at here?

02:08:04.000 This is the corner of Khafra Pyramid, and you see the two very different styles of architecture.

02:08:09.000 The huge blocks below, very finely dressed, and the much cruder This is evidence of two separate stages of construction.

02:08:18.000 It's like if you bought a Victorian house with an Ikea kitchen in it, you wouldn't say, oh well, they just decided to build this Victorian house and put this cool new kitchen in.

02:08:29.000 No.

02:08:30.000 You'd know in two seconds that it's two different stages of construction.

02:08:34.000 Anyway, we've got a lot of tough stuff to cover here.

02:08:38.000 Ah, they're here.

02:08:39.000 We'll stop.

02:08:40.000 You see where these people are walking?

02:08:43.000 Mm-hmm.

02:08:43.000 Do you see that this one block?

02:08:45.000 You see those people?

02:08:46.000 Yes.

02:08:46.000 There, and then all the way down where the third guy down there is walking, there's another.

02:08:50.000 It goes down to there, and then it goes...

02:08:52.000 It's like a 20-foot-plus block.

02:08:53.000 It's about a 20-by-30-foot block.

02:08:55.000 Wow.

02:08:56.000 And then next slide.

02:08:58.000 That's what it is edge-on.

02:09:00.000 Those are the blocks.

02:09:00.000 People walking on top, that's what we were just looking at.

02:09:03.000 So those blocks are about between 6 and 8 feet thick.

02:09:07.000 Go back to the bottom one so not only they're six and eight feet thick but they're stacked on top of each other.

02:09:11.000 That's right to build it up to that level.

02:09:13.000 Wow yeah six and eight feet thick and then stacked on top of another one that's of a similar height.

02:09:19.000 And if you go poking back into it it's all you see the joints between them are pretty rough but in fact if you poke back in there you see that they fit together that you can't you can barely get a credit card between them it's just that's that's you know lots and lots of weather over lots and lots of years.

02:09:34.000 Then those are the blocks of the Great Pyramid, which are much smaller and almost presuppose a later state of construction.

02:09:47.000 Yeah, those are the same.

02:09:49.000 Okay, that's the Red Pyramid.

02:09:50.000 You know, we're going to take up too much time here.

02:09:52.000 Keep going.

02:09:53.000 Okay, that's the interior of the Red Pyramid.

02:09:56.000 And you see, that's a megalithic construction.

02:09:57.000 It's always called a plundered tomb chamber.

02:10:00.000 A, it's not a tomb chamber because nobody was ever found in it.

02:10:03.000 It doesn't look like any Egyptian tomb chamber.

02:10:05.000 And B, it's not plundered.

02:10:07.000 It's simply ruinous.

02:10:09.000 This is an earlier...

02:10:12.000 This is an earlier construction that, for whatever reason, the builder of the Red Pyramid decided to incorporate that into his pyramid.

02:10:22.000 It's not like an IKEA kitchen incorporated into the Victorian house.

02:10:26.000 It's something that was there before and that they built the pyramid on top of.

02:10:30.000 So there's some older construction and then a better...

02:10:34.000 Stay up there, Jamie.

02:10:35.000 Stop moving.

02:10:36.000 So what you're seeing, the lower, cruder level, is an older method of construction, and then above it you see really smooth...

02:10:46.000 Yeah, much more.

02:10:47.000 And also, you see, really smooth because it's in perfect shape.

02:10:51.000 It's the inside of the pyramid.

02:10:53.000 It's like it was done yesterday.

02:10:55.000 Whereas the bottom has been out in the weather for a long time.

02:10:58.000 That's the secret.

02:10:59.000 It's weathered.

02:11:00.000 It's weathered, not like the exterior of the Sphinx, but its style is typically It's typically megalithic.

02:11:11.000 It looks like certain of the constructions in Ireland and Scotland and Wales, the megalithic constructions there.

02:11:17.000 So you mean like a cruder cutting?

02:11:19.000 Much cruder, but dating from an earlier period, 6,000-7,000 B.C., something like that.

02:11:25.000 So much like when they go and do excavations in Mexico City, they're building buildings down there and they have to stop construction because they find some ancient pyramid or something along those lines.

02:11:35.000 Exactly.

02:11:36.000 So what this is, is they had an old structure and they built the new stuff on top of it.

02:11:40.000 The new stuff is what we think of as the original structure, but there's evidence to the point that there was some ancient stuff below that.

02:11:47.000 Exactly.

02:11:47.000 Okay.

02:11:49.000 Interesting.

02:11:49.000 Okay, and what do we got here?

02:11:50.000 More, that's more.

02:11:51.000 More of the same?

02:11:52.000 Just shots of shocking myself in there.

02:11:55.000 Okay, this is another piece of the puzzle.

02:11:57.000 This is part of Abydos behind the temple itself.

02:12:01.000 The temple is off to the right.

02:12:02.000 And this is, again, a good friend of mine has just done an elaborate book on this.

02:12:08.000 And even though he's not an Egyptologist, it's being academically published.

02:12:13.000 But it's going into all sorts of things having to do with this strange structure, which is one of the most resonating, powerful places in all of Egypt.

02:12:23.000 We are convinced, Shock and myself, that those central pillars date from a much earlier period, and then the rest of the temple is Seti I, which is about 1300 BC. But this is too elaborate to get into here, and I'm running out of words.

02:12:37.000 Why do you think that it's older?

02:12:40.000 The construction method?

02:12:41.000 Style of construction, mostly style of construction, and the way that it's cited...

02:12:48.000 Sort of buried into the ground which is almost unheard of for an Egyptian temple to be constructed as a subterranean structure.

02:13:00.000 It would have had a roof over it and so on at some point or another.

02:13:03.000 But anyway, it's a complicated issue.

02:13:06.000 There it is, it fills up with water sometimes and now they won't let you in.

02:13:14.000 Scuba divers.

02:13:16.000 This is us, actually, at Yonaguni.

02:13:18.000 Oh, in Japan.

02:13:19.000 Shonk and myself in Hancock.

02:13:21.000 And Graham still, now he's getting a bit more cautious about it.

02:13:29.000 But we went there, financed by this mega-millionaire Japanese industrialist, Really, I mean, he wanted to prove the existence of Lemuria.

02:13:42.000 And as you see, I mean, all of those geometric looks there.

02:13:47.000 And Chuck and I came to the conclusion after a week of diving there that seductive as it looks, it really is a natural, entirely a natural way.

02:13:58.000 And we could even see, we don't have the pictures of it because it was the last day we were there, you could even see the way that it was formed by the nature of the rock and the action of the waves And the terrific tides that prevail there.

02:14:11.000 So that's me, you can tell.

02:14:16.000 So you actually did the diving down there.

02:14:18.000 How old were you when you did that?

02:14:20.000 Oh, what was that?

02:14:22.000 10, 12 years ago?

02:14:24.000 That's pretty gangster.

02:14:25.000 In my 70s, what?

02:14:26.000 That's pretty gangster.

02:14:28.000 Get down to the bottom of the ocean when you're 70, checking out rocks.

02:14:32.000 And I don't like being underwater either, but for archaeology I'll do it.

02:14:37.000 Okay, keep going.

02:14:42.000 Oh, well, this is the famous cartouche that some people think is here.

02:14:48.000 Now, these are the Paleolithic caves.

02:14:50.000 This is the best of them, called Chauvet.

02:14:52.000 This is dated...

02:14:53.000 This is in France, right?

02:14:54.000 This is in France.

02:14:55.000 And this they date, they date, not us, they date to 31,000 BC or older.

02:15:01.000 This is genius stuff.

02:15:06.000 Great artists did this.

02:15:08.000 Great artists are not primitive.

02:15:10.000 They might be shooting arrows at rhinoceroses to eat, and why not?

02:15:15.000 It's a lot better than going to the supermarket.

02:15:18.000 Organic.

02:15:18.000 You've never heard of a GMO rhinoceros.

02:15:23.000 But this is fabulous work.

02:15:26.000 And who knows what was going on the rest of the time when they're doing this in the dark, hidden away in these caves.

02:15:32.000 And this is 31,000 B.C. So the date for us of 36,000 or thereabouts for the Sphinx and all of that is not as out of the question as you think because they date this to 31,000.

02:15:49.000 And this presupposes A, an extremely sophisticated artistry and supremely sophisticated artistry is not done by morons or by primitives. 0.97

02:16:07.000 It just isn't. 1.00

02:16:09.000 Keep going.

02:16:11.000 Look at this great stuff.

02:16:14.000 Yeah, they definitely had a very good sense of how to capture what these animals that they worshipped and went after looked like.

02:16:23.000 But it was crazy here.

02:16:24.000 You see, that looks like a rhino down there and horses.

02:16:27.000 It is.

02:16:28.000 And the horses, yeah.

02:16:29.000 Wild horses.

02:16:30.000 Wow.

02:16:31.000 So this is Gobekli Tepe, right?

02:16:33.000 That's the artist's study of Gobekli Tepe.

02:16:36.000 Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they've only uncovered less than 10% of Gobekli Tepe.

02:16:40.000 Yeah, much less.

02:16:41.000 I think it's 5%, something like that.

02:16:43.000 Well, now it's near the Syrian border, so God knows what they're doing, but they're covering it over because once they started excavating it, it's been protected by the fill for all of these thousands of years, and it started deteriorating.

02:16:56.000 So now they've Unfortunately, you can no longer see it the way that Chuck and I saw it six, seven years ago.

02:17:02.000 So what are they covering it with?

02:17:03.000 Oh, they've got sheds and roofs over it, and it's completely destroyed.

02:17:07.000 It's magic, but I can't blame them if the weather is getting at it.

02:17:11.000 Well, when did they discover this?

02:17:14.000 It was actually discovered in the 90s, 94 or so, and they've been working on it ever since, and it only came into public view around 2004 or thereabouts.

02:17:26.000 And here's some of the detail, and this is why Schock is fascinated by this, because that kind of thing of the anthropomorphic, of the hands grasping around the corner, Doing that was something almost identical to that in Easter Island.

02:17:42.000 We think Easter Island plays a role in this whole lost civilization hypothesis.

02:17:50.000 That's more.

02:17:50.000 Again, this is raised relief.

02:17:52.000 You have to chop the stone, cut or abrade the stone away from the figures.

02:17:56.000 This is tough to do.

02:17:58.000 It's 3D stuff.

02:17:59.000 And also, aren't there animals depicted on these things that aren't even local?

02:18:03.000 They're not even available on that continent, nor do they think there's a history of these animals?

02:18:07.000 I am not sure.

02:18:09.000 This one there is a kind of a feline of some sort.

02:18:13.000 Mm-hmm.

02:18:14.000 It's hard to tell exactly what it is because it's stylized, but it's a pretty brilliant piece of sculpture and you have to carve away the whole stone surface in order to get at that.

02:18:25.000 I'm not sure if they know or surmise what that is.

02:18:29.000 Yeah, it definitely looks like some sort of a cat.

02:18:31.000 Sort of like a puma, some sort of a puma.

02:18:34.000 This is interesting.

02:18:36.000 That's a bead that they found there from Gobekli Tepe.

02:18:40.000 And this is a big mystery in a small bead, because how did they drill that hole?

02:18:46.000 It's a very, very hard stone.

02:18:49.000 Very hard stone, a very small stone, too, because this is sitting in your hand.

02:18:52.000 That's about the size of the last digit of your thumb.

02:18:56.000 Yeah, it's tiny.

02:18:58.000 It's tiny and it's thin.

02:18:59.000 And so there's a tiny little hole in that.

02:19:01.000 And again, we're talking about a time where there was no steel.

02:19:04.000 That's right.

02:19:05.000 So how did they do that?

02:19:06.000 Exactly.

02:19:07.000 There's a bunch of pottery in Egypt in terms of carved stone pottery where they have zero idea how they constructed it with a very thin lip and then it goes inside contoured.

02:19:19.000 Yeah, I think we have one of those there.

02:19:21.000 This is a bracelet found recently in Turkey, made of obsidian, which is an almost impossible stone to work with.

02:19:29.000 And the ridges on it, they, again, not us, have found by doing a careful study of it geometrically, that it's very sophisticated geometry at work.

02:19:39.000 I forget exactly what it is that's at At issue here, but it's not just a couple cavemen saying, well, you know, my wife is pissed off at me, so I better give her something nice for our anniversary.

02:19:49.000 So I said, well, here's a nice chunk of obsidian.

02:19:52.000 I think I'll do a little bracelet for her.

02:19:55.000 Do they know how old this is?

02:19:57.000 Yeah.

02:19:58.000 It's dated by the strata that it's found in around 8000 BC. Wow.

02:20:03.000 Wow.

02:20:04.000 Okay, this is Sardinia, which is a treasure of megalithic, misunderstood...

02:20:12.000 Look at these extreme, fantastic structures.

02:20:15.000 We think, shockin' myself, that this may be, a lot of this may be in answer to this massive coronal mass ejection that happened maybe thousands of years earlier even, and people are still building things to keep them safe from another one of these.

02:20:32.000 Now, what would be the effect of a coronal mass ejection?

02:20:36.000 Right now?

02:20:37.000 Yeah.

02:20:37.000 A catastrophe.

02:20:39.000 Right, as far as, I mean, now it would.

02:20:40.000 It would kill the satellites and there would be a lot of issues.

02:20:42.000 It would freeze the grid.

02:20:44.000 It would fry the grid.

02:20:46.000 Right.

02:20:47.000 I mean, instantly the only people who would hang, the only people who would survive are the survivalists.

02:20:53.000 You know, we're off the grid to begin with. 1.00

02:20:55.000 Those are all assholes. 1.00

02:20:56.000 Those kinds of survivalists. 1.00

02:20:58.000 The real problem.

02:20:58.000 Yeah, those kinds of survivors.

02:21:00.000 Preppers.

02:21:00.000 But other people are off the grid, you know, doing...

02:21:04.000 My pal Clay, who's here, is buying 10 extra acres that I have that I'm not doing anything with and is planning.

02:21:12.000 To, in fact, do exactly that, to go off the grid and build a permaculture, 10-acre self-sustaining, self-sustaining little farm.

02:21:21.000 That's a great way to do it, to have like a farm and if you could afford the land and have solar power and all that jazz and well water.

02:21:28.000 Few people are doing that.

02:21:29.000 It's a great way to do it if it's possible.

02:21:31.000 There are some people, but, you know, when the world is overpopulated, to the extent that it is, it's not going to get to an awful lot of people very quickly.

02:21:42.000 It's difficult to do.

02:21:43.000 Yeah, these are the interior of those extraordinary, Nuragyi they're called.

02:21:47.000 Sardinia is an incredible place, actually.

02:21:49.000 And that's in Italy, right?

02:21:51.000 Island off the coast of Italy.

02:21:55.000 Wow.

02:21:55.000 And what do they date these to?

02:21:58.000 Well, they date it to 2600 or so, 2600 BC. And Chuck and I question that, but we don't have any data that tells us otherwise.

02:22:08.000 What is that?

02:22:09.000 This is the stone circle in Egypt, in Nabda Playa, as it's called, that looks completely fragmented and rough.

02:22:16.000 But in fact, even this, the academics, the archaeoastronomers acknowledge is astronomically oriented, and there's a physicist, an archaeoastronomer named Tom Brophy, who studied it much more carefully and has found much more sophisticated alignments than just solstices and equinoxes.

02:22:40.000 That's a common thread in ancient architecture, which is really fascinating, is the alignment with celestial bodies.

02:22:50.000 Always.

02:22:50.000 The Mayans are big on that.

02:22:52.000 Always.

02:22:53.000 Well, what they're doing, back to procession, for whatever reason that we don't understand, but with the evidences there, festivals and all sorts of things like that are attuned.

02:23:04.000 Take place at these critical, let's call them energy points.

02:23:10.000 And what they're doing, and it's quite clear that they're doing it, is that they're orchestrating their entire civilization.

02:23:19.000 They're tuning their entire civilization to the movements of the heavens.

02:23:23.000 This is quite clear.

02:23:25.000 And this can kind of demonstrate what they're achieving by that.

02:23:29.000 We don't know.

02:23:31.000 But it's very important to them.

02:23:34.000 What do we got here?

02:23:35.000 More of the same. 1.00

02:23:37.000 That's the devil's dick. 1.00

02:23:39.000 Well, close. 1.00

02:23:40.000 Looks like it.

02:23:41.000 Yeah, that's Nabda Playa.

02:23:45.000 And that's just the drawing of Nabda Playa.

02:23:48.000 And this gets into complications of the cosmology of it.

02:23:52.000 This is the dogan.

02:23:53.000 This is the work of my good friend, Laird Scranton, who you may know of, I think.

02:23:59.000 Yes?

02:23:59.000 Yes.

02:24:00.000 And the Dogan tribe, that's the tribe that thinks that they come from the constellation Sirius?

02:24:04.000 Well, or who think they got their knowledge, yes, that it comes to them directly from Sirius.

02:24:09.000 I don't think they think they come from Sirius.

02:24:11.000 They might.

02:24:11.000 I'm not sure.

02:24:12.000 But anyway, Laird work started out just as a sort of...

02:24:20.000 Amateur thing.

02:24:22.000 Looking into the cosmology of the Dogen and at a certain point he decides to see how that matched current technology.

02:24:30.000 He's a techie guy.

02:24:31.000 He's an expert in computer languages and things like that.

02:24:35.000 So he's He's very good at this kind of work, and he finds that in the first book of his called Science of the Dogen, that this Dogen cosmology of this rather simple tribe in Western Africa,

02:24:53.000 Mali? 0.63

02:24:53.000 Mali, I think it is. 0.63

02:24:56.000 Has their cosmology, which they know about, they can transmit it, is in fact consistent with the latest wrinkles and string theory and torsion theory and high-energy physics and all that sort of stuff.

02:25:11.000 And then that led him to the study of other civilizations.

02:25:15.000 And he's now six or seven books into it.

02:25:18.000 And really what he's doing is it's unrecognized except by a handful of people.

02:25:24.000 You know, they're not bestsellers.

02:25:25.000 And they're written very well.

02:25:26.000 It's very simple and easy to follow.

02:25:31.000 He's showing that this...

02:25:33.000 This complex cosmology is understood and expressed by every society, virtually every society that he's looked into, including the Chinese.

02:25:45.000 That was a relatively recent book and he's ending up with a master picture puzzle of all of these ancient civilizations and there's no dating them exactly, but it's become quite clear through this body of work that the ancients had this The same,

02:26:05.000 effectively, the same cosmology and the same understanding of it.

02:26:09.000 We think that this is a hand-me-down from the ancient civilization that we're busy trying to validate.

02:26:22.000 Meaning the survivors of this coronal mass.

02:26:25.000 The survivors of the...

02:26:26.000 The people that existed before the coronal mass that had achieved some sort of a high level of sophistication, and then these people with whatever knowledge was left over, whatever they had managed to save.

02:26:36.000 Something of that sort, or they were the same people who were everywhere and had it to begin with.

02:26:41.000 What you're seeing up here, figure 12.4, the quantum frenzy can cause a string-anti-string pair to erupt and annihilate, yielding a more complicated interaction.

02:26:50.000 What is that?

02:26:51.000 Well, that's from, again, that's from the physics lab.

02:26:54.000 Actually, they're talking about, I'm not sure.

02:26:56.000 So this is like some sort of a geometry thing, and, or...

02:27:01.000 It's a physics thing.

02:27:02.000 And they're looking at, this is Dogen art?

02:27:04.000 Is that what this is?

02:27:05.000 No, but Dogen art has that figure in it.

02:27:08.000 Keep going.

02:27:10.000 No, down.

02:27:11.000 Down, I think.

02:27:12.000 Let's see.

02:27:13.000 Somewhere, the Dogan have that.

02:27:16.000 Where is it, Jamie?

02:27:17.000 Okay.

02:27:21.000 No.

02:27:24.000 I think it's the one right after it.

02:27:27.000 Well, very close.

02:27:29.000 Let's see.

02:27:29.000 Anyway, you have to read Laird's book, Science of the Dogen.

02:27:34.000 It's really all there.

02:27:35.000 And then it's the same in all of the civilizations all over the place.

02:27:39.000 And as I said earlier, I don't...

02:27:42.000 I dislike...

02:27:46.000 Using the Old Testament, the Bible, for scholarship because it's a minefield.

02:27:51.000 You just don't know.

02:27:52.000 You can select from it.

02:27:53.000 I mean, the Inquisitors found a way to justify the Inquisition from the Bible, and you can justify just about anything.

02:28:00.000 There's so much craziness in there.

02:28:02.000 There's so much craziness going on in there.

02:28:04.000 But one thing that did strike me in our correspondence is one of the intriguing bits of the I forget where it is, Tower of Babel.

02:28:19.000 If it's Exodus?

02:28:20.000 No, it can't be Exodus.

02:28:22.000 Genesis, maybe?

02:28:23.000 Anyway, one of the early books of the Bible, where they talk about the Tower of Babel.

02:28:27.000 And one of the lines that's very suggestive is, Or before the tower was built, all of humanity spoke in one tongue.

02:28:40.000 The Eskimos spoke the same as the Polynesians.

02:28:43.000 What is this?

02:28:44.000 And the Polynesians spoke Chinese?

02:28:46.000 No, it doesn't seem logical.

02:28:48.000 I mean, the linguists don't find that sort of thing.

02:28:50.000 But if the common language that they spoke was the cosmology, And Laird finds the same cosmology wherever he looks.

02:28:58.000 That's interesting.

02:28:59.000 It's not anything that you can base, you know, you can't be sure of it, but suddenly that strange line does have some corroboration.

02:29:10.000 I think it's very hard for us to put into perspective what it would be like if there was some sort of a high level of sophistication involved in the society back then and then they experienced whatever it was, whether it was meteor showers, super volcanoes, asteroid impacts,

02:29:26.000 whatever it is, and then trying to retain a certain amount of it and pass it on to your children, how things would get so convoluted and distorted, and there would be very little left.

02:29:37.000 Yes.

02:29:38.000 Something like that.

02:29:40.000 But the people would be of the same sophistication in terms of the same kind of minds, the same sized brains, the same capability.

02:29:51.000 They would just have to relearn everything all over again.

02:29:53.000 Well, I think there's a good case that can be made for that because stuff gets, after this catastrophe, Things really do go into a tailspin, and then around 3000 BC,

02:30:11.000 4000 BC, all of a sudden, all over the place, very sophisticated Civilizations arise, but based upon this ancient knowledge, the mythology is all there to begin with, but suddenly there's Sumeria, and around the same time there's Egypt,

02:30:28.000 there's China, for sure, there's India, and all of these seem to arrive at a very high level of understanding around that 4000 or so date.

02:30:40.000 Especially Sumer, when they go over some of the ancient, those clay tablets, when they see the depictions of the solar system, that's where it gets really confusing.

02:30:49.000 It's like, how the hell did they know this?

02:30:51.000 How did they know that there was a sun in the center and that all these planets were in the correct size?

02:30:56.000 I mean, they had Jupiter in the correct size, in the correct position, Mars in the correct position.

02:31:01.000 It was very, very strange stuff.

02:31:03.000 I didn't know that, actually.

02:31:04.000 Have you ever seen those?

02:31:05.000 No, no.

02:31:05.000 Have you ever followed Zacharias Hitchin's stuff?

02:31:08.000 He's got some really wacky shit. 1.00

02:31:10.000 Well, it is wacky shit. 1.00

02:31:12.000 Fun to read if you're hot. 1.00

02:31:14.000 Yeah, but it's...

02:31:14.000 But the Anunnaki and those from heaven to earth came and created people out of monkeys and alien DNA. He's a galactic Darwinian.

02:31:25.000 Well, he was.

02:31:26.000 Now he's dead.

02:31:27.000 Now he's worm food. 0.95

02:31:28.000 And I call his followers Sitchininis. 1.00

02:31:32.000 Sitchininis? 0.97

02:31:34.000 Well, I've read The Twelfth Planet.

02:31:37.000 I think that was called The Twelfth Planet.

02:31:39.000 Horrible stuff, yes.

02:31:40.000 But when you don't know anything, it's awesome.

02:31:44.000 But pull up an image, Jamie, just to show it.

02:31:49.000 John, of the solar system depiction in the clay tablets.

02:31:54.000 Because it's really fascinating stuff.

02:31:55.000 I mean, it clearly shows the sun with what we, you know, our standard sort of image of a sun where it's a circle and the radiating sort of lines outside of it.

02:32:04.000 And then it has all these planets circling around it.

02:32:08.000 Yeah, there it is right there.

02:32:09.000 Look at that.

02:32:10.000 Oh! 0.60

02:32:12.000 The sun is a star.

02:32:14.000 No, it's not a drawing.

02:32:15.000 It's just outlined.

02:32:16.000 That's the actual original clay tablet, but they drew on it as an outline.

02:32:21.000 Isn't that amazing?

02:32:22.000 You can find the actual tablet, Jamie, too, and you can zoom in on it so you can see it better.

02:32:27.000 But really, really incredible stuff when you consider the fact that they made this somewhere around...

02:32:34.000 What was this?

02:32:35.000 5,000 B.C.? 4,000 B.C.? I don't know if it's that early, but it's somewhere in that neighborhood.

02:32:43.000 See if you can find a better full version of it there, young Jimmy.

02:32:47.000 But incredible stuff and weird stuff.

02:32:51.000 I mean, there are depictions of people with tails sitting on the laps of giants.

02:32:56.000 That tends to decode symbolically, actually.

02:33:02.000 Those hybrid creatures and stuff like that.

02:33:06.000 Most of those things, I think, should not be taken literally.

02:33:11.000 Right.

02:33:13.000 Like you were talking about myths?

02:33:15.000 Yeah, myths, because things change shape, and one thing becomes another, and when those are shown pictorially, it doesn't mean that it's to be taken literally.

02:33:26.000 There's the original, so you can see it there in the background.

02:33:32.000 Pretty interesting stuff, huh?

02:33:35.000 But where are the, in the background, where?

02:33:38.000 See it right there?

02:33:38.000 Oh, there!

02:33:39.000 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

02:33:40.000 And...

02:33:42.000 But the stars, that's the original.

02:33:44.000 So you have the sun in the middle of the stars.

02:33:48.000 Actually, that's a motif that you see in Egypt often, where you have a star with a solar disk in the middle of it.

02:34:01.000 Often they're just stars.

02:34:03.000 They're five-pointed stars.

02:34:04.000 And then it's with a solar disk in it.

02:34:07.000 And what they're talking about, I think the Egyptologists talk about a stellar cult and a solar cult.

02:34:13.000 And that as soon as you call anything a cult, it becomes, you can talk about it because it's somebody else's religion and therefore superstition.

02:34:22.000 But what it's talking about, and probably this too, It's two levels.

02:34:29.000 In other words, it's the solar sky, our solar system, and the star around it is the zodiacal sky, is the constellational sky.

02:34:39.000 So it's two levels of the hierarchy simultaneously.

02:34:45.000 But it's just amazing that you're talking about such a long, long time ago and they had all the little planets there.

02:34:53.000 But they don't have Uranus.

02:34:56.000 We'll see what they have there.

02:34:58.000 Pull it back up again, Jamie.

02:35:00.000 I'm finding a couple different versions, too.

02:35:01.000 Oh, yeah?

02:35:02.000 Yeah.

02:35:03.000 So there's more than one version of it?

02:35:04.000 Yeah, one only had seven planets.

02:35:05.000 They have another one that has nine.

02:35:07.000 Ah, that's interesting if they have nine.

02:35:08.000 This one only has seven.

02:35:10.000 Right, but that was a different one where that shows a star and then it has a bunch of planets off to the side.

02:35:14.000 Who knows what that means?

02:35:15.000 Go full view on that one, Jamie.

02:35:18.000 Yeah, look at that one.

02:35:21.000 It's just so cool to look at something that someone made, you know, whatever, 5,000, 6,000 years ago and see their attempt.

02:35:31.000 Go back to that, please.

02:35:33.000 Their attempt at trying to show...

02:35:37.000 And convey what they knew about the world, or what their thoughts were about the world.

02:35:42.000 Like, what are we seeing here?

02:35:43.000 It looks like war.

02:35:45.000 That one is not, well, that's a common theme in Egypt, too.

02:35:51.000 The Pharaoh smiting in the heads of his enemies.

02:35:58.000 It's the conquest of the forces of light over the forces of darkness.

02:36:02.000 In this one, the seven There it is.

02:36:07.000 You have that, as I said, often in Egypt, or very similar.

02:36:13.000 But the other one, the star and the seven planets, could be planets, but see, it's a different looking star, too.

02:36:20.000 It's many, one, two, three...

02:36:22.000 Yeah, it's a different one.

02:36:23.000 The other one was six.

02:36:24.000 It might be a number symbolism thing, with the thing and the numbers.

02:36:32.000 Do seven, not as circles like that, but as dots.

02:36:37.000 It has a numerical validity, rather than necessarily, than an astronomical one, that one.

02:36:44.000 The other one...

02:36:45.000 Go back to the other one, Jeremy?

02:36:48.000 Yeah, no, that one's really interesting.

02:36:52.000 Yeah.

02:36:54.000 All this stuff is interesting to me.

02:36:55.000 Yeah, the relative sizes, that's pretty mind-boggling.

02:36:59.000 And the two on the outer edge is really those two.

02:37:06.000 Yeah, that's interesting.

02:37:09.000 Yeah, very.

02:37:10.000 That's interesting indeed.

02:37:11.000 I'd like to see that explained any other way than...

02:37:14.000 They knew something.

02:37:16.000 They sure as hell knew something.

02:37:18.000 I mean, or it's an amazing lucky guess.

02:37:20.000 No, this is not guesswork.

02:37:24.000 No, it's just unraveling ancient civilization.

02:37:28.000 It's like putting together a puzzle when you only have five, six pieces.

02:37:32.000 Yeah, well, this is the thing.

02:37:34.000 When we started out, there were few pieces.

02:37:39.000 A lot of pieces have been added to the puzzle.

02:37:42.000 Right, like the nuclear glass, the coronal mass ejection stuff.

02:37:46.000 Gobekli Tepe is a big chunk of...

02:37:49.000 Gunung Padang in Indonesia is another one.

02:37:53.000 I don't have any photos of that, but Chak has been to that and is absolutely convinced that it's very, very...

02:38:00.000 A, that it's human-made and that it's very, very old.

02:38:04.000 So things are showing up all over the place.

02:38:07.000 So go back to the slides.

02:38:08.000 And, um, it's just, it's such a, uh, emerging thing as far as, like, uh, people talking about it, too.

02:38:17.000 The slides?

02:38:17.000 Mm-hmm.

02:38:18.000 Oh, I'm sorry.

02:38:18.000 Um, this is something that's being discussed over and over again now.

02:38:22.000 It's much more mainstream.

02:38:23.000 And now that Graham Hancock has got a lot of, uh, traction on his work and his new book, Magicians of the Gods, and Randall Carlson, who's an expert on asteroidal impacts, has sort of impacted his work as well, and really, uh, uh, sort of, Made it more interesting because he's provided a context with some historical,

02:38:45.000 like actual scientific evidence of impacts.

02:38:48.000 Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

02:38:50.000 So what are we looking at here?

02:38:52.000 That's Gobekli Tepe again.

02:38:54.000 I'm not, yeah, sorry, not Gobekli Tepe, that's Nob de Playa, but that's one of Schock's slides, I think, and I'm not sure what he's driving at there.

02:39:05.000 Some sort of constellation in the background.

02:39:07.000 That's Brophy's, I think.

02:39:09.000 That's Brophy's slides, where he's looking for much more sophisticated information in Nob de Playa.

02:39:17.000 And even if his more far-out speculations are just speculation, I think there could be Just the basic the basic premise is already of great significance that that this is because this is dated to five six thousand B.C. That makes it the oldest dateable stone circle now one of the things I was going to I forgot when we were talking earlier about this idea of the precession of equinoxes,

02:39:44.000 the wobble of the Earth being caused perhaps by a dwarf star that we don't know exactly where it is.

02:39:50.000 That was one of the theories about whatever it is outside of the Kuiper Belt.

02:39:56.000 That there's this object out there now that their 90% plus sure exists, and they're calling it, you know, Planet X or whatever it is.

02:40:05.000 They think that it's at least four times larger than the Earth, and it's somewhere outside of the Kuiper Belt, which is now what they believe Pluto's a part of, right?

02:40:15.000 Oh, okay.

02:40:16.000 When Pluto's no longer a planet, it got listed as an asteroid.

02:40:19.000 Oh, poor old Pluto, yeah.

02:40:20.000 It got downgraded.

02:40:22.000 Got the shaft.

02:40:22.000 But they think there's something out there.

02:40:24.000 And one of the theories that I had read was that it could be some sort of a dwarf star that exists so far out there that we can't see it.

02:40:35.000 A brown dwarf.

02:40:37.000 Walter Cruttenden, who started CPAC, I don't know if he knows about that.

02:40:44.000 I'll be seeing him in a few days.

02:40:46.000 Some interesting stuff going on at CPAC. It's strange you didn't know about it.

02:40:51.000 Well, you know about the planet that they're pretty sure of, right?

02:40:54.000 Do you know about that?

02:40:56.000 I think.

02:40:56.000 Well, see if you can find that.

02:40:58.000 They think that somewhere outside of Pluto that there is a large body.

02:41:04.000 They don't know what it is.

02:41:05.000 They don't know exactly how big it is, but they think it's far larger than the Earth.

02:41:09.000 At least four times larger than the Earth.

02:41:11.000 Mm-hmm.

02:41:12.000 And that it exists, and its gravitational effect is having a response.

02:41:17.000 Here it is.

02:41:18.000 New dwarf planet discovered far beyond Pluto's orbit.

02:41:21.000 No, Jamie, that's not it, I don't think.

02:41:23.000 That's a dwarf planet.

02:41:25.000 This is something that's much larger.

02:41:27.000 This is like, they think it's larger than Earth.

02:41:30.000 Just look at a planet four times larger than Earth, believed to be outside of the solar system.

02:41:36.000 They think it's a part of the solar system, but it's on this gigantic orbit, like way, way, way out there.

02:41:43.000 So most of them are binary star systems, right?

02:41:45.000 Most of them?

02:41:46.000 I think so, yeah.

02:41:47.000 Yeah.

02:41:48.000 Chuck would know that.

02:41:49.000 He knows his astronomy a lot better than I do.

02:41:52.000 But it's interesting, if there is some sort of a star or a dead star out there, way out there, then it's affecting us.

02:42:01.000 It's causing our Earth to wobble.

02:42:03.000 Maybe, yeah.

02:42:05.000 I mean...

02:42:06.000 Here it is.

02:42:07.000 Astronomers say a Neptune...

02:42:09.000 No.

02:42:10.000 No, no, no.

02:42:10.000 Not Neptune.

02:42:11.000 Neptune.

02:42:11.000 Is that it?

02:42:12.000 It looks...

02:42:13.000 Is that it?

02:42:14.000 Well, Neptune's big.

02:42:16.000 Yeah, it might be.

02:42:17.000 It's January 20th.

02:42:18.000 Yeah, okay, that's right.

02:42:20.000 I didn't see that one.

02:42:22.000 The claim is the strongest yet in the centuries-long search for Planet X beyond Neptune.

02:42:27.000 The quest has been plagued by far-fetched claims and even outright quackery.

02:42:31.000 But the new evidence comes from a pair of respected planetary scientists...

02:42:36.000 I don't want to say that guy's name.

02:42:37.000 Yeah, look at the language.

02:42:38.000 Look at the language.

02:42:39.000 It's quackery if they don't agree and if it's not one of their own.

02:42:43.000 And if it's one of their own, it's respected until somebody comes along and shows that they're wrong.

02:42:48.000 Right, but their language is tempered by guys like Zacharias Hitchin, isn't it?

02:42:52.000 Well, yeah, he brings it on himself, that's right.

02:42:54.000 But some of their stuff is equal.

02:42:58.000 That's why I call them the quackademics. 1.00

02:43:00.000 Because every week there's something coming along disproving stuff that they've been insisting has been right for the last 10 or 15 or 20 years.

02:43:08.000 Look at this thing.

02:43:09.000 But they're never quacks. 1.00

02:43:10.000 They think it orbits the sun every 15,000 years.

02:43:13.000 Right.

02:43:14.000 Wow.

02:43:16.000 That's awesome.

02:43:17.000 I mean, it's just, it's so interesting.

02:43:19.000 We know so much, but so little at the same time.

02:43:24.000 You know, I think it was Dennis McKenna had this great saying that when the bonfire of understanding grows, it illuminates the surface area of ignorance.

02:43:39.000 Well, good line.

02:43:40.000 Yeah, that you realize, like, the brighter the light, like, wow, there's so much you don't know.

02:43:46.000 And then also, you have to distinguish between knowledge and understanding.

02:43:50.000 For example, with the quackademic, Egyptologists, they have a lot of facts at their disposal that they do not understand at all.

02:43:59.000 And that's why, I mean, my own work, Schwaller's own work, Couldn't have been done without all of that careful factual work by the Egyptologists.

02:44:07.000 And what I do, or what we do, I mean, those of us who are looking into this, we take that factual material and schwallerize it. 0.97

02:44:15.000 And that gives us a certain degree of understanding, which those jerks don't have at all. 1.00

02:44:19.000 Those jerks. 1.00

02:44:20.000 Let's go back to the slides. 1.00

02:44:24.000 What else you got here that you want to show us?

02:44:25.000 I don't know.

02:44:26.000 There's a lot, but some stuff I want to skip.

02:44:28.000 Okay.

02:44:29.000 Keep going.

02:44:29.000 I want to skip stuff now because I'm running out of words, which is hard to do.

02:44:34.000 That's one of those very hard stone vase.

02:44:40.000 With this thin lip and the walls of the vase are about as thick as the rim of the lip.

02:44:45.000 And this is all made out of one piece of a very hard stone called Green Shift.

02:44:52.000 And we think, actually, shocking myself, and an idea by another friend of mine, a very good writer named Paul William Roberts, was his suggestion that, hey, maybe these stone things, there's quite a few of them, Date from the earlier period and were kept as sacred objects all of those years.

02:45:11.000 And of course, if they were kept and guarded and not broken, and a hammer breaks it, but were kept in one piece, you know, X number of thousand years, they wouldn't be weathered or anything.

02:45:23.000 They'd be fine as long as they were protected.

02:45:26.000 Now, is there any speculation whatsoever as to the method that they use to create something like this? 1.00

02:45:31.000 Well, there's some stupid ones. 1.00

02:45:33.000 Let's hear the stupid ones. 1.00

02:45:35.000 Well, they're shown with bow drills that go like you light a fire with sticks like this. 1.00

02:45:43.000 Well, it's a kind of a drill technique.

02:45:45.000 That they put in there with balls of some kind of, you know, hard stone.

02:45:49.000 And once you get the drill thing down, you can kind of work your way around and gradually, gradually, gradually hollow out the inside.

02:45:59.000 This seems insane to me and that it would take...

02:46:03.000 I mean, one of those guys should devote his life to taking a block of...

02:46:08.000 Green shift and trying that method and see how far he gets in 10 or 15 years.

02:46:13.000 It's very hard to imagine that they could do that with a method like that, but otherwise no one knows.

02:46:19.000 But isn't that like sort of, doesn't it balance out with the insanity of building a pyramid in the first place?

02:46:26.000 I mean, building a pyramid is just an incredible undertaking.

02:46:29.000 Didn't they say that, like, if you cut and place 10 stones a day, it would take you 664 years to...

02:46:34.000 Yeah, it is mind-boggling.

02:46:36.000 Yeah.

02:46:36.000 But, in fact...

02:46:40.000 It's quite clear that they did it.

02:46:42.000 It's not at all clear that they did it in the allotted 25 years or something of the sort.

02:46:47.000 Why they did it, I mean, again, to an academic, the only possible explanation is that they were tombs, even though there's no evidence whatsoever that they were tombs.

02:46:57.000 But if they say they were tombs, they don't need evidence.

02:46:59.000 What do you think they were?

02:47:00.000 I don't know, except what I'm pretty sure is that there weren't tombs and there weren't tombs only.

02:47:06.000 My general sense of it is that since everything in Egypt has its focus, the quest for immortality in some way, shape or form, they enhance That quest.

02:47:21.000 They make it possible to do things that you wouldn't otherwise do.

02:47:25.000 I can tell you, you get enough people together and come on a trip or come on your own.

02:47:29.000 When we do our two-hour meditation in the pyramid, you come out of there knowing that you've not been just in a quiet bathroom.

02:47:39.000 This place It surges with power.

02:47:43.000 You get a group of people in there, all of whom are, especially if they're some who have practiced some meditation.

02:47:50.000 It's really, it's something.

02:47:53.000 I mean, you come out of there.

02:47:56.000 Knowing that you've experienced something that you've not experienced before.

02:48:00.000 So how they were used and to what end, I don't know.

02:48:04.000 I mean, this is a quite common theory that there were sites of high initiation.

02:48:09.000 Well, there are sites of high initiation, and when you understand what initiation involves...

02:48:15.000 That's not a dumb theory. 0.89

02:48:17.000 It is a dumb theory if you don't think there's such a thing as initiation. 0.96

02:48:21.000 And if you think that illumination is dependent upon electricity, well, you'll not be able to think Egyptian. 0.74

02:48:28.000 But if you've been to the places and have experienced for yourself the power of these places, then explanations of that sort, even though they don't count as I mean, they're speculative, for sure,

02:48:43.000 but when you don't have any evidence for them being tombs, that's pretty speculative, too.

02:48:47.000 Right.

02:48:48.000 And building them is incredible beyond belief.

02:48:51.000 Lighting them up is only slightly less incredible.

02:48:54.000 Yeah, yeah.

02:48:54.000 The whole thing is mind-boggling.

02:48:55.000 Now, do you have any theories at all as how they could build some sort of a stone thing like this?

02:48:59.000 No.

02:49:00.000 No.

02:49:01.000 I don't.

02:49:01.000 Pretty incredible stuff.

02:49:03.000 Let's go, because we've got a lot of stuff, and I don't want to take that.

02:49:06.000 Okay, that's us and my criminal partner, Boris, swinging the digital sledgehammer, looking for underground caverns.

02:49:12.000 So you hit that thing and it makes a sound?

02:49:16.000 Yes, the seismograph.

02:49:17.000 The sound goes into the earth.

02:49:19.000 Interesting.

02:49:19.000 The next slide is what we found.

02:49:21.000 And there it is.

02:49:22.000 See, A. That is a cavern or a chamber or of some sort.

02:49:28.000 It's a void.

02:49:29.000 Underneath the bedrock, and that's the so-called Hall of Records.

02:49:33.000 People think that's what Edgar Cayce is talking about.

02:49:36.000 We're iffy about it other than that the seismograph does not know how to channel.

02:49:42.000 So it just says what's there and what's there.

02:49:45.000 It knows there's a void, and at the very back, it's a little bit, you don't see, it's the edge of the sea.

02:49:50.000 See, at the very end, by the rump, that is also a chamber, and that's absolutely, it's known that it's there, and this gives you the same profile, seismologically.

02:49:59.000 But there's no known way to get into these things?

02:50:01.000 Yeah, the back one, there's a way, it's a very rough cut chamber, and there's a, just behind there, one of those stones, if you pull it away, And you can get in and it's a room, rough, it's very rough, but about the size of the room that we're in here, the studio.

02:50:14.000 And that's a room.

02:50:15.000 So if that's a room, then it stands to reason, seismographical reason anyway, that A is also a cavern or a grotto or a construction or something.

02:50:27.000 So what we're looking at with A, when you see all those circles around it and the rough shape of it, that's the shape that they believe the room is.

02:50:34.000 So it would be similar to the one that's at the rump, where it would be like kind of a rough room?

02:50:38.000 Sort of.

02:50:38.000 Well, the seismographic, those are the...

02:50:42.000 Topo lines are something that give you the depth that the thing is at.

02:50:47.000 But it's not like a square, 90 degree angle cut?

02:50:50.000 Well, it's roughly rectangular, says Tom Dobecky, who is our geophysicist who was doing that work.

02:50:58.000 So what's the holdup as far as examining that?

02:51:00.000 Well, two.

02:51:01.000 One, they don't want to be wrong.

02:51:03.000 Two, that it's very difficult to do.

02:51:06.000 It's under about 15 feet of bedrock that happened.

02:51:10.000 The Sphinx is, A, probably the most...

02:51:16.000 Let's say the archaeological hotspot of the universe.

02:51:20.000 I mean, nothing is more open to, you know, excitement and all the rest of it than the Sphinx.

02:51:29.000 Secondly, the water level has risen, so that whole chamber is probably filled with water now.

02:51:36.000 So anything that isn't stone would have been obliterated long ago.

02:51:40.000 Imagine if you got down there and you found wet scrolls.

02:51:43.000 Well, maybe.

02:51:44.000 Or stone something or another.

02:51:46.000 But in theory, you could put a little fiber optic something down there and study it.

02:51:51.000 But they don't want to be wrong about this.

02:51:54.000 And anything invasive, the Sphinx is really in disastrous condition.

02:51:58.000 So any little vibration or something like that could conceivably damage it.

02:52:06.000 I don't worry about these things.

02:52:07.000 The geology is much more important as far as I'm concerned.

02:52:11.000 And my guess is that when we finally break open the portcullis and capture all of the quackademics that it protects at the moment, which I don't know. 0.96

02:52:28.000 Maybe we'll waterboard them.

02:52:29.000 But anyway, we capture all of the quackademics and get them the hell out of there. 1.00

02:52:34.000 At that point, when it is accepted, and these things do happen.

02:52:40.000 This is this idea whose time has come.

02:52:42.000 When it has come, things change.

02:52:44.000 And at that point, maybe then the funding shows up and the...

02:52:50.000 And the determination comes up to actually look into that void or chamber and see if it is indeed a void or chamber and if there's something in there.

02:52:59.000 Is it possible that there's some other things in Egypt that haven't been discovered yet?

02:53:03.000 Oh, loads.

02:53:03.000 They even know where they are, a lot of them.

02:53:05.000 Really?

02:53:06.000 Yeah, but what do you call it?

02:53:10.000 Landsat, infrared, something, you know, when you can photograph underground, they have, yeah, there are hundreds of sites that they know are there, graves and tombs and stuff like that, but most of them, I don't think that kind of photography, I thought there's a name for it,

02:53:26.000 I don't think that kind of photography goes deep enough for us to establish the lost civilization.

02:53:34.000 It'll be under the sand level.

02:53:36.000 It'll be at the bottom of the sand level.

02:53:38.000 And so far, at any rate, it doesn't get down that deeply.

02:53:41.000 But they have lots of places to excavate if they had the money.

02:53:45.000 Let's keep going here.

02:53:46.000 Keep going.

02:53:48.000 Okay, well this is now, this is Shock's book, and he'll be at CPAC. Is this a recent book?

02:53:53.000 That's his last book, yeah, that's a recent book.

02:53:55.000 The Role of Solar Outbursts in Our Past and Future, Forgotten Civilizations, the title.

02:54:01.000 Yeah, very interesting thesis, and backed up by a lot of solid scholarship.

02:54:10.000 And Shock will be at the CPAC, this particular CPAC. So he thinks it was a solar outburst more than they think it was an asteroidal impact.

02:54:20.000 He thinks, although they're not necessarily antithetical.

02:54:23.000 The dates, in other words, it could have been...

02:54:26.000 Either or both.

02:54:27.000 I mean, Shock thinks that it's an impact in the earlier...

02:54:44.000 Whoa.

02:54:48.000 Wow.

02:54:51.000 Northern Lights.

02:54:52.000 What else we got?

02:54:53.000 Well, keep going.

02:54:54.000 Let's go whisk by here, because this is Anthony Peratt, who's a physicist.

02:54:58.000 It's his thing.

02:55:00.000 And here, these are these figures that show up through the electron microscope and that are mirrored by those strange, dancing, multi-headed, multi-armed Figures at the petroglyphs at the top,

02:55:17.000 usually at the upper registers of the petroglyph facade.

02:55:23.000 Hmm.

02:55:24.000 Which also mirrors, that's the Rongo Rongo script.

02:55:27.000 Shock is fascinated by the so far untranslatable Rongo Rongo script.

02:55:32.000 Where's that from?

02:55:34.000 Easter Island, which shows as letters, presumably, those kinds of weird humanoid figures.

02:55:43.000 Hmm.

02:55:45.000 One of the great mysteries of linguists.

02:55:47.000 Oh, yeah.

02:55:49.000 Huh.

02:55:50.000 Keep going.

02:55:51.000 That's the end of it.

02:55:52.000 Is it?

02:55:53.000 Yeah, it's the bottom.

02:55:54.000 Of the whole thing?

02:55:55.000 Mm-hmm.

02:55:56.000 Of my whole show?

02:55:57.000 Yep.

02:55:57.000 Really?

02:55:58.000 Yeah.

02:55:58.000 There was a whole bunch of other stuff that I wanted on.

02:56:01.000 Well, some stuff I wanted to whisk through, but what was up there, maybe I'll send it to you, is the map of Dhamfakistan, of greater and lesser Dhamfakistan, which is very useful.

02:56:15.000 And my five cowboys and the graphic of the five cowboys.

02:56:19.000 It's a very graphic.

02:56:20.000 My stepson found it somewhere online.

02:56:23.000 But it really shows the fun of the cowboys in action.

02:56:27.000 Which is, as I said, you pick up the daily newspaper or turn on the internet and you see the cowboys at work.

02:56:34.000 You've been at this for a long time now.

02:56:37.000 You've been at this for many years.

02:56:38.000 Late 60s, I think.

02:56:40.000 So, when I was born.

02:56:42.000 Yeah, okay.

02:56:43.000 I was born in 67. Well, it's around...

02:56:47.000 That's around the time I came across Swala de Lubitsch, yes.

02:56:52.000 Around then.

02:56:53.000 Do you feel like people are slowly but surely starting to come around at the concepts of these ancient civilizations being not the primitive people that we've been told, but maybe perhaps really complex...

02:57:08.000 Oh, yeah.

02:57:09.000 Well, a lot of people, the trouble is that the picture is muddied.

02:57:14.000 I mean, the academics are almost as staunch as ever in their delusion.

02:57:21.000 But the trouble is that the whole scenario is muddied and it's almost unavoidable by...

02:57:28.000 Ancient aliens and Zechariah Sitchin and a whole bunch of nutcases that think that aliens built the pyramids and all of that sort of stuff.

02:57:35.000 So, yes, more people are interested, but the percentage of those that are actually capable of...

02:57:46.000 Of sifting the evidence and intellectually honest enough to accept what stands up to scrutiny and not.

02:57:57.000 Numerically, there are lots more of them than there were, but statistically, they're a very, very small percentage of A very small percentage of the populace that actually care or understand it.

02:58:12.000 But it only takes a certain small percentage.

02:58:15.000 Have you ever tried to get your Magical Egypt series on Netflix?

02:58:19.000 No, not on Netflix, but they probably wouldn't take it because they'd have to make, A, you'd have to cut a really lousy deal with them, and B, the numbers probably wouldn't justify it.

02:58:35.000 I don't know about that.

02:58:36.000 Well, they love documentaries, and why would you think that they would want to cut a lousy deal?

02:58:41.000 They do.

02:58:41.000 I mean, they really don't give you much.

02:58:47.000 I mean, the mystery of the Sphinx is on there, but it's the guy who does the reproduction of it that negotiated with him.

02:59:00.000 The downside of Chance is that he's a bit paranoid about letting stuff out of his control.

02:59:07.000 So I've told him, you know, it's got that thing on Netflix.

02:59:11.000 I mean, people have stolen it and it's on YouTube.

02:59:14.000 Yeah.

02:59:14.000 In a very, you know, in a very, you know, the reproduction, you really don't see it unless you actually own the DVD. Right.

02:59:23.000 But it's Chance's baby as far as pitching it.

02:59:27.000 And he doesn't.

02:59:28.000 And it's not...

02:59:29.000 So he hasn't even brought it up to Netflix?

02:59:31.000 I don't know if he has or not.

02:59:32.000 It seems like it would be right up their alley.

02:59:34.000 You would think, but I've given up sort of arguing the case.

02:59:38.000 It's his baby.

02:59:41.000 Yeah, but it's not.

02:59:42.000 I mean, it is and it's not, but it's a big part of your work.

02:59:44.000 I mean, I just think that that would be a great venue for it.

02:59:47.000 I think it would be too, but you write him and tell him that.

02:59:50.000 Okay.

02:59:51.000 Well, I have a Netflix comedy special coming out.

02:59:53.000 He's been trying to get on your show for a while.

02:59:55.000 Has he been?

02:59:56.000 Well, he's been emailing you a couple of times.

02:59:58.000 Probably emailing the wrong address.

02:59:59.000 Well, nobody responded, so he gives up.

03:00:04.000 Anyway.

03:00:05.000 I never got any emails from the dude.

03:00:07.000 We'll talk about that after the show.

03:00:08.000 We'll try to figure that out.

03:00:09.000 But I got a comedy special coming out on Netflix in October.

03:00:13.000 I'd be happy to talk to them and say, hey, this is something you guys should look at.

03:00:19.000 I don't have any idea what kind of deals they cut in terms of documentaries, but what I do know is that what you did is amazing.

03:00:25.000 And I think that it would be great for everybody to have that, have more access.

03:00:31.000 I agree.

03:00:32.000 Just the sheer depth of the information when you go over, like, the temple and man and all the different – just the different incredible structures that exist in Egypt that most people don't even discuss.

03:00:45.000 Oh, they don't know about and they don't want to discuss it.

03:00:48.000 But chances – I mean, that's – You know, the way to really watch, people have told me this, me too.

03:00:54.000 I mean, I'm not much into...

03:00:56.000 Even dope, I casually smoke it once in a while, but I'm not much...

03:01:00.000 Vodka's my vice, such as it is.

03:01:03.000 I don't even consider it vicious.

03:01:05.000 But watching that...

03:01:09.000 A couple of tokes to watch Phantical Egypt with a couple of tokes because it slows things down.

03:01:14.000 The editing on that is breathtaking.

03:01:17.000 Yeah.

03:01:17.000 And there's a hypnotic quality to it.

03:01:19.000 It's really, I mean, it's an extraordinary achievement.

03:01:22.000 And Shock did it on, sorry, Shock, I mean, Chance did it on a zero budget, you know, and doing all of the photography.

03:01:29.000 I mean, everything single-handed on nothing.

03:01:32.000 It's really the heroic production.

03:01:35.000 And, you know, and we made nothing out of it.

03:01:38.000 Let's try to get it on Netflix.

03:01:40.000 I'm going to try to make an attempt.

03:01:42.000 You'll attempt.

03:01:43.000 I'm going to try to make an attempt.

03:01:45.000 I'm going to bring it to them and have a conversation with them.

03:01:47.000 Yeah.

03:01:48.000 Give them a copy.

03:01:51.000 They might not even know.

03:01:52.000 I guarantee they don't.

03:01:54.000 They probably don't know.

03:01:55.000 I really think it's one of the great works.

03:01:58.000 I do too.

03:01:59.000 And it's so in-depth.

03:02:01.000 It's so in-depth that the only way you could do it was to self-produce it.

03:02:04.000 Yeah, oh yeah, you couldn't get anyone to do that.

03:02:06.000 Nobody would go, you're going to do eight DVDs?

03:02:09.000 I know.

03:02:10.000 What are you, out of your mind?

03:02:11.000 Nobody's going to watch all that.

03:02:12.000 I watched it.

03:02:12.000 I watched it like three or four times.

03:02:13.000 Lots of people do.

03:02:15.000 And you have a Magical Egypt 2, right?

03:02:16.000 Well, we're working on it, except we don't have the funding.

03:02:19.000 And actually, this is Chance's baby now, because I'm...

03:02:24.000 Any time he wants me, I'm there for him, but I'm not in any position to really help with it because I'm so swamped with my own stuff.

03:02:32.000 Right.

03:02:32.000 And what would be covered in Magically Egypt 2?

03:02:34.000 I don't know.

03:02:35.000 I don't know.

03:02:36.000 We've got the first one semi-done, but I don't know what he's got in mind.

03:02:40.000 And he's in Australia, so I don't get to see him at all.

03:02:42.000 Even Skype is not good for in-depth, evening-long conversations.

03:02:48.000 No, no.

03:02:48.000 So I don't know, but I'll bet if you showed it to Netflix and they expressed an interest, he'd be interested.

03:02:54.000 Well, I'm going to do that.

03:02:55.000 I'm going to do that.

03:02:56.000 I'm going to bring them a copy, and we're going to see what we can do.

03:02:58.000 Okay.

03:02:58.000 I think it's one of those things that I really believe that people should see.

03:03:02.000 Well, that would be great.

03:03:02.000 And I think that if you could get it on Netflix, and I could tweet it and let the world know and try to get people to spread the word.

03:03:08.000 I think once people see it, they just start...

03:03:10.000 Like that making of a murderer thing, you know, that caught all that traction entirely because it was on Netflix and word of mouth, mostly.

03:03:17.000 I really think that Magical Egypt is one of those things.

03:03:21.000 Yeah, yeah.

03:03:21.000 Well, what I would like to do, actually, and I hope my pal Clay and some other people are going to help me with this, I'd like to get some of my other, when I'm wearing my other hat, my writers, my Bohemian beret instead of my Egyptological pith helmet,

03:03:38.000 because I've got a whole lifetime's worth of work, much of which has been produced But none of it really commercially successful and it's just sitting there waiting to get done and Netflix would be the perfect venue for it if I had something to show them,

03:03:56.000 you know, because they do production.

03:03:59.000 They're producers now, too.

03:04:00.000 Yeah, it's an interesting time.

03:04:02.000 I mean, that's one of the best things about the Internet is that something like that can kind of spring up and become a bigger network than any of the networks on television.

03:04:10.000 Yeah, that's the upside.

03:04:11.000 Well, the networks are about to die in good riddance.

03:04:14.000 Well, it's a silly idea, but it was good back when there was no other ideas.

03:04:19.000 You had to sit through those commercials and wait for the next segment, and then you watch ten minutes and the commercials popped on again, you rolled your eyes and waited for the commercials again. 0.82

03:04:27.000 All that stuff's nonsense now. 0.74

03:04:29.000 You watch a commercial now, you're like, what is this silly thing?

03:04:32.000 Well, the internet's full of commercials, too.

03:04:34.000 It is.

03:04:35.000 It is.

03:04:35.000 But at least they're usually at the beginning of a video.

03:04:39.000 No, they come in the middle sometimes, too, and things.

03:04:42.000 They're there.

03:04:43.000 Anyway.

03:04:44.000 Anyway.

03:04:45.000 Magical Egypt is awesome.

03:04:46.000 You're awesome.

03:04:47.000 Appreciate you coming on here.

03:04:48.000 Glad we got a chance to meet in person.

03:04:51.000 Me too.

03:04:51.000 It's a big difference, even though Skype is the next best thing to three-dimensional meeting.

03:04:57.000 It isn't three-dimensional meeting.

03:04:59.000 It is not.

03:05:00.000 It's fun to be here, and thanks for inviting me.

03:05:02.000 Well, thank you, and thank you for all of your work, because I think you've done a great service to the world to sort of shine light on this amazing civilization.

03:05:10.000 Thank you.

03:05:11.000 Much appreciated.

03:05:12.000 All right, ladies and gentlemen, is it.

03:05:14.000 Thank you very much, John Anthony West.

03:05:16.000 Go seek out his work and definitely go buy Magical Egypt. 0.99

03:05:20.000 Don't pirate it, you fucks. 1.00

03:05:21.000 Go buy it. 0.99

03:05:22.000 It's awesome.

03:05:23.000 Exactly.

03:05:24.000 And if you have the wherewithal and the will, get on an Egypt trip.

03:05:31.000 Get on an Egypt trip with this man.

03:05:32.000 Because I'm good enough to get up and down the pyramid, but who knows for how long.

03:05:38.000 Exactly.

03:05:38.000 So, strike while the iron's hot.

The Joe Rogan Experience - September 27, 2016

Joe Rogan Experience #852 - John Anthony West

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript