The Michael Knowles Show - REAL Drinks And TOUGH Questions： YES or NO with Lauren Southern And Michael Knowles

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00:01:43.540 You know what's crazy about this?

00:01:45.160 I did this game with Mr. Destiny.

00:01:47.800 You never published it?

00:01:48.680 No, we were going to release it three days later or something. 0.89

00:01:51.160 Trump gets shot. 0.54

00:01:51.900 We're going to release it a day after that. 0.90

00:01:53.540 And he comes out and, like, defends Trump being murdered.

00:01:58.040 I was with him that day.

00:01:59.040 It was the first time I'd seen him in a year.

00:02:00.540 And then I see his tweet come up and I'm like,

00:02:02.380 I got to go get in an Uber.

00:02:03.540 He's tweeting on the couch and I open the door and I'm like,

00:02:05.460 what are you doing? Like, you're ruining your life right now.

00:02:07.380 We get into a physical fight over this man's phone.

00:02:09.800 I managed to delete a absolutely caustic tweet towards Matt Walsh

00:02:13.220 that no one saw.

00:02:14.020 Hold on. What was the tweet?

00:02:15.400 I kind of want to know the tweet.

00:02:23.540 Welcome to Yes or No, the bibulous battle to discover who knows whom better.

00:02:36.420 My guest today is Lauren Southern.

00:02:38.420 How do we play?

00:02:39.260 Lauren will ask me a yes or no question.

00:02:41.960 I will select my answer away from her prying eyes.

00:02:44.940 Then she will guess how I answer.

00:02:47.240 If she guesses correctly, she gets a point.

00:02:49.800 If she guesses incorrectly, she loses a point.

00:02:52.800 Then it's my turn. No matter what, I will probably end up drinking.

00:02:57.220 Neither of us has seen the questions beforehand.

00:02:59.620 Whoever has the most points at the end wins.

00:03:01.520 The stakes could be higher.

00:03:03.860 Lauren, delightful to see you, as always.

00:03:06.280 Thanks for having me.

00:03:07.400 Shall we make a wager?

00:03:09.200 All right, let's do it.

00:03:10.180 What do you want to bet?

00:03:11.880 What do I want to bet?

00:03:13.380 I don't know. Not money? Tweeting something terrible?

00:03:17.000 Hmm.

00:03:18.900 Yeah. You don't smoke cigars, so I can't even bet you a...

00:03:21.700 I do smoke cigars.

00:03:22.520 Well, there you go.

00:03:23.180 Okay.

00:03:23.460 Okay, I bet you a fistful of delicious Mayflower cigars if you win.

00:03:28.840 What do I get?

00:03:29.940 What do you get?

00:03:31.560 Well, we got some Elbows Up chocolate that I brought from Canada.

00:03:35.260 Nice.

00:03:36.080 Yeah, okay.

00:03:37.080 That's good.

00:03:37.180 No, no, no.

00:03:37.620 We don't want that.

00:03:38.320 We don't want that.

00:03:38.820 No, the Mark Carney.

00:03:39.820 What else?

00:03:40.600 What else in Canada?

00:03:41.200 Cuban cigars.

00:03:42.120 I'll get you some Cuban cigars from Canada.

00:03:43.580 In Canada, that sounds good.

00:03:44.580 Yeah, what else do you get?

00:03:45.460 You can get in Canada. 0.97

00:03:47.420 You can get Islam. 1.00

00:03:48.460 You can be killed by your government. 1.00

00:03:49.860 You can... 1.00

00:03:51.380 Or Cubans. 1.00

00:03:52.520 Okay, Cuban, that sounds good. 1.00

00:03:54.080 That sounds good, okay. 1.00

00:03:55.760 You know the rules.

00:03:57.360 So I take the card. 1.00

00:03:58.200 You go first, because you're a lady. 1.00

00:04:00.920 As we both know, the internet is rife with LARPing and fake news. 0.84

00:04:04.680 According to our IMDb pages, you're 5'10", and I'm 5'6".

00:04:09.120 Are you, Michael Knowles, the bigger fraud?

00:04:11.700 You're 5'6", according to your IMDb?

00:04:13.480 Allegedly.

00:04:14.700 Well, you were also a man, according to some legal document.

00:04:18.060 That's a real legal document.

00:04:19.640 That's a real one.

00:04:20.180 That's a real one.

00:04:20.760 How did they say you're 5'6"?

00:04:21.640 You're not 5'6".

00:04:22.440 Hold on, I guess we have to answer, hold on, I'm sorry, we have to answer, who's the bigger

00:04:26.080 fraud?

00:04:26.200 Are you trying to cheat?

00:04:26.760 I actually do know my own height, believe it or not, so I'm going to say, according

00:04:30.900 to our, are you, Michael Knowles, the bigger fraud, and you have to, you have to guess

00:04:36.460 how I would answer.

00:04:38.820 Yeah.

00:04:39.280 I lock in mine first?

00:04:40.240 Yes.

00:04:40.340 I'm guessing, um, okay, let's see.

00:04:44.480 Correct.

00:04:45.280 They say you're 5'6"?

00:04:46.440 Yeah, I guess so.

00:04:47.600 I'm at least 5'7".

00:04:48.820 Yeah, I would say you're at least 5'7".

00:04:50.080 Are you wearing heels right now?

00:04:50.980 I am wearing heels, I'm cheating.

00:04:51.980 So I guess I'm the bigger fraud here, but I still, correcto.

00:04:55.400 Where do I put this?

00:04:56.360 You can put that right there next to the best-selling yes or no game,

00:04:58.480 which is available at www.dellier.com slash shop.

00:05:00.200 Great.

00:05:01.540 Okay, I'm going to clear my answer.

00:05:05.040 Is looks-maxing just transgenderism for straight right-wing men?

00:05:10.460 What's your answer?

00:05:12.300 Do I click it in the thing here?

00:05:13.960 You click it.

00:05:14.540 You click your answer, yes.

00:05:15.820 I'm just going to drink just because. 0.95

00:05:17.380 they say it's 11 a.m. somewhere okay your answer is it just looks max is it just transgenderism

00:05:28.340 for straight right we mean yes i got it wrong what you say you say no why okay i think that

00:05:34.140 looks maxing is men finally being forced to compete on the same scale as women because we're

00:05:39.740 now in the workforce so we're not just marrying men because of their status or money or this kind

00:05:45.240 of stuff. Women have been looks maxing for hundreds of years, right? Just forced to do it. 0.97

00:05:49.340 Now we're all in materialism hell, where women are learning what it's like to just be a checkmark 0.65

00:05:55.520 on an Excel sheet for a corporation, and men are learning what it's like to be objectified.

00:05:59.720 Tinder made us equal, you know? Oh, that's interesting. Yeah. I hadn't considered it

00:06:04.560 from the perspective of working, like women in the workplace. Because there's a great essay

00:06:09.860 15, 20 years ago by Christopher Hitchens, who was wrong about almost everything, 0.85

00:06:14.280 but he had a very funny essay called Why Women Aren't Funny. And he points out, he says,

00:06:18.380 the only times women are funny is if they're hefty, dykey, or Jewish. He said, those are the 1.00

00:06:23.060 exceptions. And, but he said, it's not, no knock on women. Women have a great sense of humor,

00:06:27.860 but men need to be funny. Men being funny attracts women. And women are very pretty, 1.00

00:06:33.160 so they don't need to be funny to attract men. And you say, well, women are attracted to different 0.90

00:06:37.620 things. Maybe it's money, maybe it's confidence, maybe you're funny, maybe whatever, whatever it 1.00

00:06:42.320 You're not as visual as men are, I think.

00:06:46.540 I mean, I think so, but I think that's changing.

00:06:48.680 I think with the culture, it's shifting, right? 0.99

00:06:50.300 Because now the women are becoming more like men. 0.54

00:06:51.920 The women are, you know, we're getting the same hobbies, the same careers. 0.99

00:06:55.500 Women are getting more degrees than men at the moment. 1.00

00:06:58.080 So we get to just sit on Tinder and objectify them now, too. 1.00

00:07:01.300 But do you get the same thrill?

00:07:02.720 I don't think we get the same thrill.

00:07:04.540 You don't.

00:07:05.100 Now, I would have thought some years ago that basically only men look at porn and women don't look at porn.

00:07:10.120 there are all these studies that come out saying a large number of young women actually look at

00:07:15.080 porn, which confounds my view because it seems to me men are much more visually oriented and women 1.00

00:07:21.160 are totally nuts. I have no idea what actually motivates women. So for men, okay, the looks 0.99

00:07:28.260 really matter. Whereas when I see looks maxing, I wonder if it's for women or if it's just for 0.88

00:07:35.340 other men. Like I sat down with Mr. Ikeler, the king of all. Oh, right. I watched that. Thank you. 0.65

00:07:41.800 Fascinating guy. And I said, so what, this is about getting girls? And he goes, oh, not really.

00:07:47.580 He said, I'm actually, I'm impotent right now, or I'm infertile or something. You know, the chemicals,

00:07:52.380 it's not about getting girls. It's about mogging. Like it's about, it's about status with other 0.99

00:07:57.380 guys. I think it is, the one thing I appreciate about the looks maxers is I think they are more 1.00

00:08:02.280 honest than everyone in that we are entering such a stage of materialism and the looks maxer is the

00:08:07.060 only person that's saying, yes, this is all about mogging. This is all about sex. This is all about

00:08:11.380 status. Whereas everyone else is trying to do it in these like weird underhanded ways. Like

00:08:15.240 the guys who will read bell hooks and pretend like the performative male feminist or the girls that 0.91

00:08:20.000 jingle the keys. Women shouldn't vote. I'm baking pies on the internet, you know? Whereas the looks 1.00

00:08:24.120 maxer is just like, no, this is just about sex and status. That's it. The end result of total

00:08:30.180 materialism. But there's also this aspect, you know who androgenic is? No. He's like number five

00:08:35.100 on the Chad rankings. Are you not following the Chad rankings? I only follow the top four.

00:08:38.280 Okay. Oh, okay. I see. So he's the Terra Titan. And he just came out and he said,

00:08:44.180 becoming a looks maxer for the first time in my life has given me empathy for women 0.94

00:08:47.900 because my problems used to be feeling lonely and trying to get attention. And now my problems are

00:08:53.300 worrying about being murdered or stalked or killed. And it's like, it is only a very recent

00:08:59.340 phenomenon that the idea that attention and beauty is positive. Throughout all of history,

00:09:05.480 it was seen as socially dangerous. Every single great myth was about this. Cupid and Psyche,

00:09:10.680 or Rapunzel, Snow White. It's all about jealousy. Helen does start the most famous war in the world. 0.98

00:09:15.560 Yeah. It's like, you enjoy this, boys. It's not a great thing to be loved just for your appearance.

00:09:20.600 It ruins your life in a lot of ways. So it's very tough. I mean, for some of us who just

00:09:24.720 naturally, looks max. The way I find it similar to transgenderism, this is why I want my point 0.99

00:09:32.520 back, but I probably won't get it back. Transgenderism is a man doing a caricature 1.00

00:09:38.540 performance of femininity. So it's not, he doesn't really look like a man. He looks like some bimbo, 0.96

00:09:44.700 kind of slutty, kind of crazy caricature of a woman, right? None of them look like your grandma, 1.00

00:09:50.480 None of the transgenders. 1.00

00:09:52.400 It's always this skewed, perverted conception of what the opposite sex is. 1.00

00:09:56.520 Have you seen the people who do the hormone therapy before they go through puberty, though? 0.99

00:10:00.380 They look almost indistinguishable.

00:10:02.520 Really?

00:10:03.160 Absolutely.

00:10:03.440 If you don't go through puberty, and it's like the people who take the puberty blockers before,

00:10:07.700 they actually do full-on.

00:10:09.980 Well, maybe they physically look more like the person,

00:10:12.160 but I just mean they're usually not wearing a hoodie from The Gap.

00:10:15.500 They're usually wearing these kind of over-the-top glamorous outfits.

00:10:18.580 Christy Gnomes.

00:10:19.280 Yeah, except Mr. Gnome, for example. And the Luxemaxers, it seems to me they're doing the same thing, but it's just they're doing a caricature performance of their own sex. 1.00

00:10:28.220 Well, that's kind of the male-to-male transgender thing was when the manosphere came out and you had all these people doing like the just, yeah, the caricature of your own sex. 0.98

00:10:37.860 And it's all very, you know, it's the gender expression. None of it is about just your actual how you were born. 0.91

00:10:44.520 And that's always the thing I get confused with when talking to, like, very liberal people about the transgender stuff. 0.91

00:10:50.060 I'm like, I thought this was, shouldn't we be happy with people just being in the body they were born as?

00:10:54.340 And then you can express as any gender expression publicly.

00:10:58.320 That seems like the most body positive thing to me.

00:11:01.560 I always had a little affinity for the transgender idea.

00:11:06.280 In the sense, like, I disagreed with the conservatives who said, it's just about your chromosomes or whatever.

00:11:11.320 Because, like, there's obviously a performance to gender.

00:11:14.840 100%. 0.84

00:11:15.240 Right?

00:11:15.420 Exactly.

00:11:15.980 Yeah.

00:11:16.520 I mean, some of us come by our John Wayne virility more naturally than others, but there

00:11:22.320 is a thing.

00:11:24.000 I just, the answer to it to me was always, well, if you feel some discord, you should

00:11:27.420 just act more like what you really are.

00:11:29.580 Yeah.

00:11:29.740 Because you act like a man, to quote Vito Corleone.

00:11:31.920 And, but I still lose my point.

00:11:35.700 I do.

00:11:36.320 Okay.

00:11:36.580 That's fine.

00:11:36.880 I can't return it to you.

00:11:37.820 You made a strong argument.

00:11:39.440 Thank you.

00:11:39.820 But I still lose.

00:11:42.340 All right.

00:11:42.840 You're up, and Lauren has to clear her answer.

00:11:45.240 Yes, sir.

00:11:46.660 Do you think more bots interact with Gen Z on social media

00:11:50.200 than actual trans activists and neo-Nazis?

00:11:57.280 Ooh, deep in thought with this one.

00:11:58.880 I am deep in thought on this, because it's a precise answer.

00:12:03.580 Do I say no?

00:12:07.740 Yeah, give me that point.

00:12:08.940 There we go.

00:12:09.600 Okay, absolutely.

00:12:10.660 It's the and that says no.

00:12:12.840 Because I think a lot of the Nazi stuff is botted and is influence campaigns and all that stuff by lots of different groups.

00:12:22.700 You know, like, I can't tell, are the neo-Nazi accounts being run by, like, Russia or Israel?

00:12:27.380 I don't know.

00:12:27.740 You know, because there are political advantages to both.

00:12:30.220 But the trans thing, I don't think that was really a bot campaign as much.

00:12:36.560 I think that really was a social phenomenon.

00:12:38.580 It was reflected in demographic studies and things like that.

00:12:41.980 so i don't it's a there's a ton of bots and influence and paid campaigns and stuff

00:12:45.800 i don't think people would use x or most of the internet if they realized how much stuff is

00:12:51.120 botted yeah i don't think they even fathom and you kind of i i realized the bot stuff going on

00:12:56.180 early because i was terminally online so i could see the patterns but even in there's a guy an

00:13:02.260 indian guy from ottawa i think who was running 3 000 mega bot accounts just from his own computer

00:13:08.740 at home. An article came out a few months ago about it. I just, and it's so easy to buy them.

00:13:14.380 It's like a hundred bucks to buy thousands of these bots. I don't, I reckon 70% of access bots.

00:13:21.440 Yeah. At this point, I got it years and years ago, early on, I noticed I, and this was on

00:13:27.800 some domestic issue. I don't even remember what, but I got 10 replies, call it, of the exact same

00:13:33.620 reply all at once. And I pointed this out and one of the bot accounts sort of said like, okay,

00:13:39.480 you got me. Like, yeah, okay, this was a coordinated thing. But then I've noticed it,

00:13:43.460 you know, the only thing that Twitter wants to talk about now is Israel. And I now have gotten

00:13:50.360 maybe a unique perspective into it in that I get pilloried for being too pro-Israel because I'm at

00:13:57.600 the Daily Wire and I don't know, I don't like hate the Jews or whatever. So I get pilloried for that

00:14:01.720 from some entities.

00:14:04.420 But then because I have made,

00:14:05.980 I feel, temperate, moderate criticisms

00:14:08.120 of the state of Israel

00:14:09.300 and various theological views

00:14:11.180 that pertain to that,

00:14:13.120 I've also gotten hit

00:14:14.400 from the other side as well.

00:14:15.920 And you can see them.

00:14:17.280 And I could tell you the accounts,

00:14:19.520 some of which are real people

00:14:20.780 that are almost certainly being paid

00:14:22.820 to do this.

00:14:23.360 But also, there's real people

00:14:24.440 that just get astroturfed

00:14:26.140 and gaslit by the comment sections.

00:14:27.940 The bots, that's the point of them.

00:14:29.500 Like you have a thousand bots

00:14:30.700 and then you have one person that changes their opinion

00:14:32.740 because they're just influenced by the mob.

00:14:34.900 Yeah, I've seen it.

00:14:36.460 And I've seen people, people I know,

00:14:41.420 have their opinions changed by the bot campaigns.

00:14:44.440 You have to be very stubborn to not give way to it

00:14:48.540 because it's a very tempting phenomenon.

00:14:50.080 Have you ever seen, do you know who Joel Webin is?

00:14:52.860 Oh, yeah.

00:14:53.360 I think he's like the first grown man.

00:14:54.620 He's the other Matt Walsh.

00:14:56.220 Oh, okay.

00:14:56.860 I think he's the first grown man to get groomed by bots

00:14:59.440 and 14-year-olds on the internet, like, full-blown.

00:15:02.720 Have his views changed?

00:15:04.140 The first way I came to be aware of him

00:15:07.720 is because I looked and I said,

00:15:09.100 why does Matt look a little different today?

00:15:11.360 But it's like crazy.

00:15:12.940 They could be cousins.

00:15:13.720 They couldn't be brothers, but they could be cousins.

00:15:15.540 Have his views changed? 0.99

00:15:17.300 Joel, he's just a bit of an insane person.

00:15:19.660 He's like, okay, well, I'm going to say things 0.92

00:15:21.600 that you're not going to think are insane

00:15:22.860 because you're just in... 1.00

00:15:24.860 He's just like the full women shouldn't vote, you know? 1.00

00:15:28.500 Yeah.

00:15:28.800 But you're saying he also says insane things.

00:15:31.820 Does he? 0.99

00:15:32.160 I hate you people. 0.64

00:15:32.860 Hold on. 0.98

00:15:33.300 Yeah, no, I just. 1.00

00:15:34.120 This is, no, the women shouldn't vote thing. 1.00

00:15:36.140 The women shouldn't vote thing is the right-wing version of defund the police.

00:15:39.960 Like, this is not happening in reality. 0.99

00:15:41.920 It's jingling the keys for the audience.

00:15:43.900 Yeah, I agree.

00:15:44.240 And the problem with it is, it, well, let me ask you this. 0.98

00:15:48.960 If it were 1910, women were split on this issue.

00:15:55.700 In fact, that more women opposed suffrage than supported suffrage.

00:15:59.740 I will have to research this. 0.99

00:16:01.080 I don't know that I believe you.

00:16:03.020 Because here's my argument for it.

00:16:04.380 Look, today, I agree. 0.51

00:16:05.560 I don't want to get rid of the 19th Amendment. 0.61

00:16:06.860 I actively don't want to get rid of the 19th because you would disenfranchise married women. 0.99

00:16:13.260 Like, we need the married women to vote for us. 0.79

00:16:14.940 And the married women are Republican and the single young women are Democrats. 0.99

00:16:19.000 But Trump won 40% of women under 30. 0.98

00:16:21.080 And it's just politically impossible to get rid of it today. 0.92

00:16:23.680 and so you can't do it.

00:16:25.820 But the idea of the many brave and valiant

00:16:29.360 and intellectual women

00:16:30.300 who opposed the 19th Amendment, 1.00

00:16:32.480 the idea was that the basic political unit

00:16:35.320 is the family.

00:16:36.600 So you want, 1.00

00:16:37.560 and some women actually were able to vote 1.00

00:16:39.640 because of like different rules 1.00

00:16:40.920 around property and stuff,

00:16:42.000 but basically it was just one vote per household.

00:16:46.060 And isn't that more conducive

00:16:47.760 to conservative politics

00:16:49.420 than, you know, voting is this magical,

00:16:52.220 wonderful intrinsic thing that is a much stronger argument than the argument i see from other people

00:16:57.820 on the internet who just say well women are more likely to vote liberal or they're more emotional

00:17:01.440 because what i find from those people is they're doing this safe edgy thing where the majority of

00:17:05.640 people who consume political content are men so if you're constantly giving them ideological lap

00:17:09.580 dances you're going to get money yeah and when you actually look at the data you're more likely to

00:17:14.020 vote liberal actually if you're a minority so they won't and they won't do that so true their brand

00:17:19.860 of safe edgy

00:17:21.600 is anti-woman.

00:17:22.580 It's never going to be

00:17:23.100 anti-black.

00:17:23.720 It's never going to be

00:17:24.180 anti-minority.

00:17:25.200 So I don't take any

00:17:26.160 of these people seriously.

00:17:26.600 Yeah, no, this is such

00:17:27.600 a good point.

00:17:28.060 I saw this in the

00:17:29.080 recent Democrat,

00:17:30.320 like Mom Donnie elections

00:17:31.320 in New York.

00:17:32.580 New York Post

00:17:33.360 had this headline,

00:17:34.120 God love him,

00:17:34.620 it was the safe edgy.

00:17:36.100 It was, you know,

00:17:37.480 the 7% of eligible voters

00:17:39.300 voted in the primary

00:17:40.120 and these socialist candidates,

00:17:42.160 all of whom hate America

00:17:43.100 and where he jobs and stuff,

00:17:44.600 they were elected 0.99

00:17:45.760 by young white women. 0.87

00:17:48.580 Because it's so easy.

00:17:49.860 And you even hear this from the conservatives.

00:17:51.840 They say, well, you know, my least favorite group are the young white women. 0.71

00:17:54.560 And you say, yeah, you're allowed to say that. 0.72

00:17:56.900 But are you willing to say that actually the only reason any of those people got elected was because of migrants from the third world?

00:18:05.020 Can you say that?

00:18:06.180 Can you say it was because of poor migrants from outside of the West who have darker skin and wear hijabs in many cases? 1.00

00:18:15.420 They're the reason they got elected. 1.00

00:18:16.800 Are you willing to go that far?

00:18:17.780 They're not.

00:18:19.060 So it's all kind of performing.

00:18:20.360 Yeah, it's all the key jingling.

00:18:21.600 Yeah.

00:18:22.140 What is the safest edgy thing I can say?

00:18:24.540 But once someone else goes and pushes the Overton window in that direction, they'll say that too.

00:18:29.060 But you've got this group of people that are just waiting for the next.

00:18:32.480 But even, I think, if it just became socially popular to be left-wing again, half these people would be left-wing.

00:18:38.940 A lot of my friends that are super into the really edgy right-wing stuff right now or the really conspiratorial stuff,

00:18:47.800 Like, they're watching all the Candace Owens stuff.

00:18:49.780 Sorry, am I allowed?

00:18:50.320 Is that, like... 0.99

00:18:50.980 She goes into conspiracies?

00:18:52.940 I haven't watched her.

00:18:54.900 Well, they were, like, voting for Trudeau back in the day.

00:18:58.440 Yeah, no, I'm not surprised.

00:18:59.240 So, it's, like, you have all these people that joined politics post-COVID when the internet and reality kind of merged.

00:19:06.320 And they've got a total memoricide of the past 10 years.

00:19:09.420 And they instantly got one-shotted by, like, right-wing Instagram reels.

00:19:13.600 They were left-wing before because that was socially popular.

00:19:15.640 and now the right wing

00:19:16.780 because that's socially popular.

00:19:18.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:19:19.100 I've noticed, even myself,

00:19:20.600 I'm like pretty steeped

00:19:22.320 in political philosophy and history.

00:19:24.480 I've been a nerd about it for a long time.

00:19:27.060 And I realized, like with the moon thing,

00:19:29.980 the moon landing,

00:19:30.800 I don't, you know, what do I know?

00:19:31.800 I don't know that much about physics

00:19:32.760 or space or whatever.

00:19:34.180 So not that long ago,

00:19:37.020 I had consumed enough internet content

00:19:39.980 to be convinced we did not land on the moon.

00:19:44.120 Like I knew for certain,

00:19:45.000 I texted my wife.

00:19:46.480 I was like, you've got to watch this documentary I just watched.

00:19:49.100 I made her watch it.

00:19:49.940 I finished watching it with her.

00:19:51.740 And I was like, see, we didn't go to the moon.

00:19:53.380 And she was like, yeah, I mean, are you sure, though?

00:19:55.340 And then I said, let's watch it again.

00:19:57.620 Let's watch it again that night.

00:19:59.060 And I go back to the beginning because she hadn't seen the first part.

00:20:01.360 By the time I finished watching it again, I realized we had gone to the moon.

00:20:05.180 Yeah.

00:20:06.180 Infinite internet rabbit holes.

00:20:07.360 There was a year where I just went full Canada and was like waking and baking, you know?

00:20:11.880 Yeah.

00:20:12.200 And I became a full-blown flat earther.

00:20:14.260 just the internet rabbit holes and then like a year later i quit weed and i'm like whoa

00:20:18.520 yeah that was a crazy little side quest no even i one time were like totally digressing but it's

00:20:23.900 i'm getting ahead of myself all right all right all right all right all right fine get back to

00:20:29.820 all right fine i'm up having seen both sides firsthand do you think conservative circles

00:20:36.920 are wilder than liberal ones when the cameras are off that's a very uh having seen both sides

00:20:43.960 first hand do you think conservative circles are wilder than the liberal ones when the cameras are

00:20:47.340 off uh you're gonna say i'm not doing a good job here i think lauren is going to say yes

00:20:56.700 yeah now i would okay i actually i need your take on this yeah because back when when you and i both

00:21:04.520 were kind of coming up in politics yeah political media in the halcyon days of the mid-20 teens

00:21:10.160 there's this kind of wacky dissident alt-right tumultuous stuff going on but I had a serious

00:21:20.080 girlfriend at that time who then became my wife I my wild oats had been sown I was not I wasn't

00:21:27.320 really participating in the social life of that moment you were not married or seriously dating

00:21:33.800 anyone at that time you were a little and you were doing all these like amazing docs and you

00:21:38.580 know, you were like way more into it. So you have more insight into this than I do. Yes. I think

00:21:44.740 the Daily Wire, and I've always said this because when I talk to my friends who work here or

00:21:48.220 anything, they're kind of insulated. It's its own sphere. And when I ask people, they're like,

00:21:52.620 it's not crazy. Well, I'm like the Daily Wire isn't crazy. Everything outside of that, it is

00:21:57.620 the wild freaking West. And I think that the conservative movement runs on such extreme

00:22:02.160 levels of repressed horniness that it comes out every month in a new scandal, whether it be

00:22:06.340 Christy Noem's husband or like some, you know, grinder scandal or this or that, or my own

00:22:10.840 scandals, you know, it's like, there's just this level of, you have really transgressive people

00:22:17.180 that had to push this 10 years ago. You had to be a kind of out there, weird person to get into

00:22:21.540 right-wing political politics. You had to be willing to say things no one else would. And then,

00:22:26.280 you know, there's just the taboo culture when you're forced to put out this public image of

00:22:32.360 trad this that no one's perfect everyone has the same human inclinations this and that and also

00:22:37.140 like man do conservatives and right-wing media love their uppers yeah they love cocaine like

00:22:41.880 it's just plain and simple not the daily wire maybe i don't know you know what's funny i i've

00:22:46.780 been offered coke so many times thank you so many times and i've never done it actually and part of

00:22:52.740 it was because my mother said my mother when i was a kid she was like michael i think you're gonna

00:22:57.300 like booze so just watch out a little bit she goes and i think you'd really like cocaine so i'd i'd

00:23:01.640 I'd really be careful about that.

00:23:03.160 She goes, I don't think you're going to like pot.

00:23:04.440 It's true.

00:23:04.780 I don't really like pot.

00:23:05.980 But I've never done a hard drug. 0.95

00:23:08.560 And so for me, the Daily Wire version of doing a bunch of Coke is like Zins.

00:23:15.200 It's a mild upper. 0.99

00:23:15.960 At that point, like grow up, do a line of Coke.

00:23:19.000 It's Diet Coke.

00:23:19.440 They're popping a Zin, drinking a White Monster, putting in an Adderall.

00:23:23.720 Just be an adult and do cocaine. 0.99

00:23:25.060 Just bite the bullet.

00:23:25.700 But what I want to know, because before the Daily Wire, before I was like seriously dating my now wife again and all this, I guess I would have been back in college, you know.

00:23:37.580 And I was hanging around with some of the right wingers and I noticed the same dynamic, which is these are people who, especially when they're single and they're young and they're exploring sometimes radical ideas, which demarcated that period of time, I think, from other, from like the 90s.

00:23:52.880 it

00:23:54.400 yeah we are humans

00:23:56.700 and also right wingers

00:23:57.920 there are studies on this

00:23:59.480 are hotter

00:24:00.680 they're often hotter

00:24:01.860 than left wingers

00:24:02.720 and maybe that's natural

00:24:04.180 maybe it's because

00:24:04.860 we don't deform ourselves

00:24:06.220 with all sorts of weird

00:24:07.080 like piercings and stuff

00:24:07.880 but we are hotter

00:24:09.080 I mean it's like

00:24:09.720 demonstrably

00:24:10.720 the science and stuff 0.99

00:24:11.700 we have some sexual patriots 1.00

00:24:12.980 out here you know 1.00

00:24:13.660 yeah that's the thing

00:24:15.340 and so it's like

00:24:16.020 if you're in that environment

00:24:17.260 where you're like

00:24:17.720 a 25 year old

00:24:18.840 it's

00:24:20.060 politics is intoxicating

00:24:21.660 when you're

00:24:22.160 When you're at the highest levels of politics, even on the edge of it, it's intoxicating.

00:24:28.320 And you're there with a bunch of kind of brainy, agreeable, hot people who are apparently all doing a bunch of coke.

00:24:35.440 Is it any surprise?

00:24:37.640 So how do you – do the libs not have their own version of it? 0.94

00:24:41.620 They do, but they're so busy spending like 400 live streams arguing about whether Sock and the Polycule has cheated on so-and-so or sexually assaulted them.

00:24:51.580 and then, you know, they've got, like, the whole sex contracts that they do.

00:24:55.780 It's, like, so complicated to them.

00:24:58.020 Whereas I actually think, like, the conservative thing is they're more, in some ways, more just, like, okay, we're the jock, you're a woman, like, let's go.

00:25:07.320 Whereas the liberals are spending 400 years, like, psychoanalyzing every single interaction they're having.

00:25:11.760 That's a good point, because you hear about these polycules or whatever weird, like, orgy left-wing things there are. 0.75

00:25:18.800 I don't think anyone's actually having sex over there. 0.60

00:25:20.700 Yeah. The people who are doing it and the way that they're doing it is not what you would immediately think. And it's like if they're all, not to be too blunt after two sips of a martini, but if they're all kind of fat and ugly and depressed and gay, that's not an environment conducive to wild nights.

00:25:43.000 I mean, the gay community have some wild nights, so you got to give them that. 1.00

00:25:47.000 Yeah, yeah, that's true.

00:25:47.860 Yeah, maybe not the activist leftist version.

00:25:51.520 Here's a take I'm going to give that is kind of pushing back on the conservative stuff.

00:25:57.920 So I agree with a lot of the things you're saying, but when the conservatives start talking about trad,

00:26:03.960 you know, don't go to school, marry young, do things like the Christian conservative way,

00:26:08.500 it is more democrat states where marriages last longer the more educated you are and the older

00:26:14.720 you are when you get married the more likely your marriage is to be stable and you are to have like

00:26:18.960 a long-lasting family so there are some things we got to give the libs on that where if you

00:26:23.940 actually care about the nuclear family some of their arguments are correct in creating more

00:26:28.920 stability well are their arguments correct my i totally grant most of those observations

00:26:34.860 It just seems to me what the libs do is they don't preach what they practice.

00:26:38.220 So they dismiss the importance of marriage.

00:26:41.540 They talk about redefining marriage.

00:26:43.240 I think that's just the radicals.

00:26:44.520 I think the average lib is like living a pretty normal life and just.

00:26:49.860 I agree.

00:26:50.220 They are living a normal life.

00:26:51.480 I just think they don't promote that.

00:26:53.680 So if they were to write a Facebook post, if it's your like liberal aunt, they would say, no, no, the LGB stuff is great. 0.55

00:27:00.820 They'll go with their, the woman will go with her husband and their two children, their 2.1 children from their bourgeois neighborhood.

00:27:08.240 They'll go to the pride parade and like wave a little flag and then go have brunch afterward. 0.78

00:27:12.580 And so I agree, much of the way they're behaving, because they're richer and more elite and more brought into the kind of establishment of business and politics in the country, they are kind of the dominant class. 0.53

00:27:24.460 Their behavior, I think, doesn't match their purported ideology.

00:27:28.020 Whereas for the conservatives, because we have this weird dichotomy where we're both populist, but also like Tweety bow tie people, you have this kind of radically different cultural aesthetic.

00:27:39.940 And for the more populist elements, there's a little more social chaos there, you know, for all sorts of reasons, economic reasons, the decline of the outsourcing of jobs and, you know, decline of religion and all the rest.

00:27:53.620 But I just wonder, yeah, let's give the libs credit and say they are often in their personal lives behaving in a normal and traditional way, but they're kind of pulling up the ladder for other people. Is that fair?

00:28:08.700 I think so, but I'd rather, like I think a lot of their aversion is just because I've known libs that, and I talked to them like, why don't you want the trad life? They think it's not possible because they think it's all a show.

00:28:21.500 What do you mean by the trad life?

00:28:22.480 Okay, so a lot of people grew up in families where they had, like, the good public family that went to church, you know, took the autumn photo shoots that they put up on the wall, but then in the home, it was falling apart, you know, abuse, this and that.

00:28:35.440 And then they're like, this is a show.

00:28:37.340 And then you see over and over again. 1.00

00:28:39.000 You guys are hypocrites. 1.00

00:28:40.040 You guys are hypocrites. 1.00

00:28:40.520 And for the liberals, the only possible sin, because they deny an objective moral standard, just intellectually, the real sin is hypocrisy. 1.00

00:28:49.000 Yes. 1.00

00:28:49.180 You're a hypocrite. 1.00

00:28:49.960 Yes. 1.00

00:28:50.240 And they don't think it's actually possible to live that way.

00:28:53.300 So they'd rather be honest and say, actually, because this is one joke I always made when people got mad at me for some of my past dating decisions.

00:29:01.920 I wonder if they'll come up in any of these questions.

00:29:03.880 Yeah, we'll see.

00:29:05.140 But I met so many polyamorous conservative men, they just didn't tell their wives.

00:29:09.760 Yeah, right.

00:29:10.100 You know, it's like I'd rather have like the honesty publicly and then deal with that as it is, good or bad, than deal with the hypocrisy.

00:29:20.860 Because that destroys people's worldviews.

00:29:23.000 It destroys their perception.

00:29:24.380 It's scandalous.

00:29:24.880 And you think one of the, I think it was Leo Strauss's definition of liberalism is that it had a low but solid ground.

00:29:33.140 That political liberalism is, it's not, it doesn't really take into account the ideal very much.

00:29:40.040 It's not all that dignified.

00:29:41.720 It doesn't really even take metaphysics all that seriously.

00:29:45.160 But you'll all be kind of wealthy and stable.

00:29:48.900 So it's a low but solid ground.

00:29:50.500 And that seems like what you're describing, which is I want the low but solid ground.

00:29:53.200 These people are degenerates sometimes, but at least they're honest about it.

00:29:56.240 And I would say, well, what about the alternative?

00:29:58.880 Like, you know, trad life on Twitter, trad life on Instagram is a contradiction in terms. 0.55

00:30:04.880 You can't, a trad woman probably doesn't have an Instagram, much less post selfies on it. 0.83

00:30:10.500 So that's not real. 0.79

00:30:12.120 But I know a lot of trads.

00:30:13.680 I know the real trads.

00:30:14.820 You know, the ones who drive in the big sprinter vans for their 14 kids, and you've never heard their names, and they just, they really live it, you know.

00:30:24.980 And I think, I agree with you that the libs don't think that is possible, to really do that thing.

00:30:32.100 This is why they don't believe the crusades were undertaken for religious reasons.

00:30:37.180 This is why they believe that marriage is doomed to fail.

00:30:41.560 Because they can't imagine that people are actually motivated by religion or virtue or sanctity or what have you.

00:30:47.540 But I think they are.

00:30:48.240 I think we can't replicate what we haven't seen.

00:30:50.960 So if you've grown up in a broken family, how do you even know where to begin with creating a stable one?

00:30:56.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:30:56.300 You know?

00:30:57.040 And this is where I also think that trad, for the most part, doesn't even exist at all.

00:31:01.960 Because people in the 50s who we would consider, oh, traditional or whatever, they were just acquiescing to the culture of their time and what made sense at that time.

00:31:09.020 If those people were born today, every single one of them that was making apple pies and, you know, husband goes to work, they'd both be working.

00:31:15.380 They'd be watching, you know, Love Island when they got home.

00:31:18.420 They'd be acquiescing to what makes sense.

00:31:20.420 It doesn't make sense to have a husband only working. 0.91

00:31:23.500 You can't afford that in this economy. 0.91

00:31:25.140 You need both people to work.

00:31:26.820 Maybe for you, Michael, with your fancy little job and your cigars.

00:31:30.680 But let me tell you, look, I sell a lot of cigars, but I have friends like this is the point that you've hit on that I think is so right and important is you say people can't believe in a thing that they haven't seen.

00:31:43.460 Yeah. And look, I grew up in New York, pretty liberal place.

00:31:45.960 I lived in L.A., all this stuff.

00:31:47.640 And you're right.

00:31:48.280 I have a job where I sell a lot of cigars and I make a good chunk of change for it. 0.97

00:31:52.440 So I do have a privilege that my wife can stay home and watch the kids.

00:31:56.960 But I know people who don't sell a lot of cigars.

00:31:59.040 And I know people who don't have a lot of those privileges, who make a lot less money, maybe than your median lib or something, who have a ton of kids who maybe they have two cars.

00:32:13.700 Maybe they only have one car.

00:32:14.860 Maybe they don't go on vacation very much.

00:32:16.660 Maybe they don't buy nice new stuff.

00:32:18.340 Maybe they don't, you know, they shrink their lifestyle expectations.

00:32:23.960 But they really do the trad life and they really can do it.

00:32:27.280 And you just think about the amount of money that we have today is so much higher than what your grandparents had, just GDP.

00:32:33.000 I mean, I think we view like having an iPhone as wealth, but that's not really like we want, like owning property is a lot more difficult.

00:32:41.120 Real estate is more difficult, but part of the reason for that is the houses are like two or three times the size that they were back in the day.

00:32:47.900 These aren't shotgun shacks.

00:32:49.140 I'm from Canada, so it's a bit of a different situation.

00:32:51.860 I guess my point is that.

00:32:53.020 Crackhead house is like a million dollars.

00:32:54.400 Yes. Maybe though, I guess my question is, you see two options, the kind of fake hypocritical 0.97

00:33:01.680 Instagram trad life and the honest, messy, degenerate liberals who don't have any ideals 0.97

00:33:07.240 and don't have anything to aspire to. If it were the case that one could make do with less

00:33:14.920 financially, that a woman could actually tend home and raise children and find it fulfilling

00:33:20.240 with a husband who supported her and who wasn't abusive, but who was supportive.

00:33:26.320 If that were possible, if today we didn't merely go along with the times,

00:33:31.040 but actually chose the life typified by the 1950s, would that be preferable?

00:33:36.160 No.

00:33:36.700 No. That's really the heart of it.

00:33:38.760 The majority of men, when they've been polled, do not want a woman that is staying home. 1.00

00:33:43.280 This is the truth. They want a woman that has something going on. 1.00

00:33:44.940 But they're wrong.

00:33:46.000 They might be wrong, so maybe it's like a mimetic desire

00:33:48.640 that they just see other people doing that.

00:33:51.640 And I've noticed this in my own dating life.

00:33:54.620 When I've been like, I'll stay at home, I'll do this,

00:33:57.000 men lose interest in you. 0.98

00:33:58.560 They want a woman with something going on. 1.00

00:34:01.100 They want the crazy BPD chick. 0.99

00:34:02.660 I don't want that. 0.97

00:34:03.880 I do not want that.

00:34:04.580 You're different.

00:34:05.020 I know the BPD chick, so I've had close encounters with them.

00:34:08.260 I don't want it.

00:34:08.700 And maybe I am a little different.

00:34:10.100 But historically, I think I'm more the norm.

00:34:12.400 And we live in a kind of wacky time.

00:34:14.180 But most people are not the norm.

00:34:15.400 They're the norm for modern society.

00:34:17.080 They have acquiesced to the culture around them.

00:34:19.160 You're the norm for Daily Wire.

00:34:20.920 I'm the norm for the, not the 1950s, but the 1250s, perhaps.

00:34:24.300 Sure.

00:34:24.920 But nevertheless, that's where a lot of people, I think that's not only where a lot of people are historically.

00:34:29.700 Also, I have passions.

00:34:30.980 I want to work.

00:34:31.580 I want to do stuff.

00:34:32.220 But that's what I'm asking.

00:34:33.440 Because all this stuff, I said, what do you think?

00:34:35.760 What would you want?

00:34:36.500 And you said, well, if you poll most men, they would lose interest.

00:34:38.960 Forget about the men.

00:34:39.820 Forget about the modern culture and the degenerate low bar.

00:34:42.440 Would you, if it were possible, want that life?

00:34:46.460 I tried it.

00:34:48.440 It didn't go very well for me.

00:34:50.440 And I think that, you know, even when the Bible describes the ideal woman, 1.00

00:34:54.780 she's a woman that's managing the accounts and the farms for her husband.

00:34:57.840 She's got passion. 1.00

00:34:58.540 Yeah, the home economy. 1.00

00:34:59.360 Yeah.

00:35:00.420 There's like, I don't, this idea of like,

00:35:02.580 I'm just going to sit and bake sourdough all day and have no opinions.

00:35:05.240 That's a very boring life. 1.00

00:35:06.900 And women have internal monologues, despite popular belief. 1.00

00:35:11.640 We have passions and desires.

00:35:13.000 And also, there is this, you know, everything about being a man is promoted as being very cool, like the Faustian desire to go and conquer the world, the masculine Indiana Jones, this, that.

00:35:26.080 And then no guy would ever want to sit at home and be the housewife.

00:35:31.640 Like, that's very talked down upon when you actually, like men would say. 0.98

00:35:34.560 Yeah, no man wants to be a woman. 0.99

00:35:36.120 No man wants to be a woman. 0.99

00:35:36.620 But not that many women want to be the Faustian conqueror of the entire world or whatever, to my knowledge. 0.99

00:35:42.520 I don't know. 0.67

00:35:42.940 I think you can have both.

00:35:44.180 Why not both? 1.00

00:35:45.500 Because transgenderism is not real. 1.00

00:35:47.120 I mean, this is my point on it. 1.00

00:35:48.900 It's like the...

00:35:51.440 But it's like in a different way.

00:35:53.440 There's a different way that...

00:35:55.120 Yes, but this is my point.

00:35:56.320 When you say that, you know, 0.99

00:35:58.200 the trad wife is just baking bread 0.97

00:35:59.620 and not having opinions, 1.00

00:36:00.700 I say, well, she is baking bread.

00:36:01.900 That's true.

00:36:02.600 But she's having opinions.

00:36:03.860 You know, the old conception was at Blake

00:36:05.420 who said the hand that rocks the cradle

00:36:07.180 is the hand that rules the world.

00:36:08.980 If you look and you...

00:36:10.280 I mean, I've seen some of these up close.

00:36:12.060 The real trad families, it's not that the mother is dominating everything.

00:36:17.000 It's not, you know, it's not that the father's Homer Simpson.

00:36:18.800 Have you met Greek families?

00:36:21.260 Yes, in a very real sense, it's kind of matriarchal, you know, respectfully so.

00:36:29.420 Yes, but there is, the woman is doing something, you know, and it's like, I guess this is just my point. 0.83

00:36:34.100 If one rejects the trad life, not for practical problems, but in principle, one basically has to become trans. 0.62

00:36:42.880 Because the traditional view says, and the natural view says, men and women are different and complementary to one another. 0.91

00:36:49.980 They're yin and yang.

00:36:51.820 And the kind of modern feminist trans view says men and women are basically the same, and why not both?

00:36:59.160 Why can't they be both? 0.58

00:37:00.360 But I think because they're not both, because men and women are different. 0.99

00:37:03.360 I agree they're different,

00:37:05.220 but I also think that in the political discussion online

00:37:09.000 about women and men's desires,

00:37:10.300 they've all been flattened

00:37:11.400 into what is the best for talking points.

00:37:13.900 Yeah, some caricature.

00:37:15.000 Yeah, caricature.

00:37:15.900 Like look smashes.

00:37:16.740 Yeah.

00:37:17.240 Like, I agree.

00:37:17.800 Okay, all right.

00:37:19.140 Who's up?

00:37:19.720 Am I up?

00:37:21.040 Who's keeping track of this?

00:37:21.980 I don't know.

00:37:22.700 You get two sips of a martoonie and me,

00:37:24.800 and we're...

00:37:25.240 Lauren's up.

00:37:26.760 Okay, Lauren's up.

00:37:27.400 All right.

00:37:28.860 Oh, video or photoprompt?

00:37:30.980 Okay.

00:37:31.880 All right.

00:37:32.420 Lauren, thank you for being here.

00:37:33.940 Hi there.

00:37:34.460 Thanks for having me.

00:37:35.360 I'm really wanting that wine now.

00:37:36.640 What? 0.98

00:37:37.200 I'm going to punch it. 1.00

00:37:37.820 I'm crazy. 0.99

00:37:39.180 I'm going to call it Covfefe.

00:37:40.120 Now, Lauren, I have to say, you know, sometimes the audience gives me flack because they accuse me of flirting with my female guests or hitting on my female guests.

00:37:49.800 But you, this shouldn't be as big of an issue because you are officially a man.

00:37:55.580 Is that right? 0.81

00:37:56.020 You have officially changed your gender to a man. 0.78

00:37:59.460 Yes, I legally changed my gender in Canada.

00:38:02.040 So if you want to win over some of the progressive audience, you can throw a few lines my way.

00:38:06.360 Hubba hubba, be still my beating heart.

00:38:07.920 Look at that.

00:38:09.380 Whoa.

00:38:10.120 What is the prompt here?

00:38:12.360 Could you believe anyone would accuse me of flirting with my female guests?

00:38:15.560 I wasn't married at that time.

00:38:17.400 Okay.

00:38:18.680 Am I still legally a man?

00:38:21.640 Huh.

00:38:23.260 I mean, we filmed that.

00:38:24.440 That was about 47 years ago, I think.

00:38:26.200 Yeah, about 47.

00:38:27.320 Okay.

00:38:32.620 Yes.

00:38:33.780 You are.

00:38:34.680 You never changed it back.

00:38:36.020 Only in Ontario, though.

00:38:37.640 Only in Ontario. 0.54

00:38:38.280 You know what was great is there was a guy in Alberta who, after seeing me do that, went and changed his gender to female purely so he could get lower insurance rates on his car.

00:38:49.720 Did he get the lower insurance rates? 0.71

00:38:50.420 Yeah, he did.

00:38:51.540 This actually, this is what makes me mad.

00:38:53.200 Once again, I'm about to live out here.

00:38:54.780 Live out, live out.

00:38:55.800 It's a safe space. 1.00

00:38:56.560 You have all this stuff where it's like, oh, women are worse drivers. 1.00

00:38:59.460 I'm sorry, but capitalism disagrees with you. 0.99

00:39:01.940 Men are charged higher insurance rates for a reason.

00:39:05.180 In my town, a guy just drove a car off a cliff into the ocean.

00:39:10.500 I mean, great for them.

00:39:11.420 Okay, let me give a caveat.

00:39:13.100 Come on.

00:39:13.780 I have no data here whatsoever, but I think data and statistics are fake unless they support my argument.

00:39:19.800 Yeah, that checks out. 0.56

00:39:20.600 Maybe men are more aggressive drivers. 0.60

00:39:23.640 So basically I would say in my anecdotal experience, the plural of anecdote being data, men are obviously better drivers than women. 0.66

00:39:33.480 But when they are bad drivers, they are catastrophically bad drivers, whereas women are just more cautious drivers, which is sometimes bad because it leads them into perilous situations. 0.83

00:39:44.320 And let me ask you this. 1.00

00:39:46.300 Forget about driving off a cliff.

00:39:48.740 Who is more likely to get a scratch or a dent on your car, a male driver or a female driver? 0.88

00:39:56.420 Everyone knows the answer. 0.62

00:39:57.680 I kind of care more about who's going to total my car.

00:39:59.720 Yeah, okay, sure.

00:40:01.280 I'm just saying, no one's ever like...

00:40:03.980 Who's going to kill a family of six in a semi-truck?

00:40:07.860 Oh no, a scratch on my car.

00:40:09.440 Let me present this to you.

00:40:10.340 You just bought a new car.

00:40:11.840 You got a beautiful McLaren.

00:40:15.160 I'm not like a car guy.

00:40:16.140 You got a really nice car.

00:40:18.000 And your male friend comes to you and says,

00:40:20.140 hey, I got to go run, pick up a package.

00:40:22.460 I don't know the data on this.

00:40:23.400 I don't know the data on this.

00:40:23.720 Forget the data.

00:40:24.500 Your gut.

00:40:25.020 I'm going on your gut.

00:40:26.020 The male says, hey, can I go drive your car real quick?

00:40:27.720 I want to get a fact check.

00:40:29.560 Jamie?

00:40:30.180 No fact checks.

00:40:30.600 I want a fact check.

00:40:31.540 No fact checks.

00:40:32.880 No, this is a fact-free zone.

00:40:35.080 If you get, a man asks you, or your girlfriend asks you, can I borrow your car?

00:40:39.280 Who are you more nervous about picking up?

00:40:41.140 Well, I drive a manual, so of course I'm going to pick a man.

00:40:43.360 Like, it's not, but I drive a manual.

00:40:44.860 You're a man.

00:40:45.640 You're a man, according to Ontario.

00:40:48.300 This is, my wife, can I tell a tale?

00:40:50.820 I'm just trying to peacefully be a man hater over here, and you're just.

00:40:53.220 My wife comes to me.

00:40:55.300 Sheep does Uber or whatever, you know, she's getting an Uber. 1.00

00:40:58.360 For me, I get a female driver. 0.99

00:41:00.120 I say, whatever, it's going to take me longer to get to the airport, but it's fine. 1.00

00:41:03.340 My wife gets a female driver.

00:41:04.580 I'm not joking. 1.00

00:41:06.180 She will cancel it.

00:41:07.580 No.

00:41:08.040 Yes. 1.00

00:41:08.400 I am stoked when I get a female Uber driver because I'm not going to get murdered. 0.85

00:41:11.640 Okay? 0.60

00:41:12.220 You know? 0.99

00:41:12.720 Well, they have a new one now because women are afraid of being kidnapped or murdered or something.

00:41:17.940 So they have this new one where women can request female drivers. 1.00

00:41:21.060 And my wife, she actually goes, she's like, 1.00

00:41:22.400 are they going to do one where I can only request a male driver, please? 1.00

00:41:25.980 Is this what your wife sounds like? 1.00

00:41:27.660 Exactly. And it's an amazing, folks, if you want to learn, if you want to learn not just how my

00:41:33.340 wife sounds, but if you want to learn about public policy, you need to go to go.pepperdine.edu

00:41:39.360 slash dailywire. A lot of people look at what's happening in the country. They ask the same

00:41:43.200 question. Who's making these decisions? Better question is who's preparing to make the next

00:41:47.440 generation of decisions? Whether it's national security, local government, public policy, or

00:41:51.500 politics, someone will be in those rooms 20 years from now. Question is whether those people will

00:41:56.000 have been formed by serious ideas or fashionable ones.

00:41:58.860 Think of the young people.

00:42:00.200 Like when Lauren and I were on that show 50 years ago,

00:42:03.600 and we just had all of our lives in front of us.

00:42:05.940 Well, you've got to find those kids right now

00:42:08.120 at Pepperdine School of Public Policy.

00:42:09.660 It's worth looking at.

00:42:10.820 Students aren't simply learning how politics works.

00:42:13.780 They're studying history, philosophy, economics,

00:42:16.220 national security, and governance

00:42:18.320 to understand why institutions work.

00:42:20.100 So right now, I want you to go to go.pepperdine.edu.

00:42:25.220 Go.pepperdine.edu slash Daily Wire.

00:42:29.280 What is that URL?

00:42:30.840 One more time.

00:42:31.640 It's go.pepperdine.edu slash Daily Wire.

00:42:35.460 Now, Lauren, before we continue,

00:42:38.860 I want you to know that you can take this game home with you back,

00:42:43.320 even to Canada, even to America's Evil Topic.

00:42:45.260 I'm not going to get arrested on my way in.

00:42:46.500 You might still, but you can try to bring it.

00:42:48.380 Contrabond.

00:42:48.800 Yes.

00:42:49.500 The yes or no game.

00:42:51.000 You have the original game at dailywire.com slash shop.

00:42:53.220 You have the Conspiracy pack.

00:42:57.540 You have, which one did you just pull up?

00:42:58.660 These are cute.

00:42:59.740 The Politics, Philosophy, and Religion.

00:43:01.620 Actually, that box is really nice.

00:43:02.700 You have the Dating and Relationships pack,

00:43:06.340 apropos of men and women.

00:43:08.240 And now, for the first time today,

00:43:11.300 you have the Yes or No America 250 Limited Edition pack.

00:43:15.680 Get your copy now.

00:43:16.860 That's so pretty.

00:43:17.440 Wait, do I actually get to bring this home?

00:43:18.640 I'm actually hyped.

00:43:19.180 You might be able to bring that home.

00:43:21.440 I will steal it.

00:43:22.260 As long as the security here don't catch me while I'm leaving with all the boxes.

00:43:28.260 Now am I up?

00:43:30.260 I'm up. Here we go.

00:43:32.400 This question begins with a video prompt.

00:43:35.260 Uh-oh. 0.93

00:43:36.240 In a celebrity boxing match, Destiny would beat the living excrement. 1.00

00:43:41.420 These people have filthy mouths in my production. 1.00

00:43:43.800 In your world, that would be an illegal card. 0.94

00:43:46.000 There'd be a criminal charge attached to writing.

00:43:48.100 I would certainly expel Mr. Davies to St. Helena. 0.99

00:43:52.260 Destiny would be the living excrement out of Michael Knowles 0.97

00:43:55.080 due to Michael's inability to muster a modicum of discipline 0.99

00:43:59.180 to exercise his butter-soft body.

00:44:04.140 And I'm supposed to answer for you?

00:44:06.140 Apparently. 1.00

00:44:07.720 My lady just finished lifting up. 1.00

00:44:09.740 I will be torturing your producers, Ben and Nick, 1.00

00:44:12.720 in a shipping container for this.

00:44:13.860 Yes, as you should.

00:44:16.280 You know what's crazy about this?

00:44:17.940 I did this game with Mr. Destiny.

00:44:22.040 You never published it.

00:44:22.940 No, we were going to release it.

00:44:24.940 I don't remember when we did it, but let's say we did it on a Monday.

00:44:28.800 Then three days later or something, Trump gets shot.

00:44:31.460 We're going to release it a day after that.

00:44:33.600 And he comes out and defends Trump being murdered.

00:44:38.100 I was with him that day.

00:44:40.060 What?

00:44:40.780 Yes, in Ashley St. Clair's apartment, drinking Elon Musk's Tesla and Yeho.

00:44:47.140 And it was the first time I'd seen him in a year.

00:44:48.840 and we were I was at a wedding actually and then I see his tweet come up and I'm like I gotta go

00:44:54.380 get in an uber I get back to Ashley's place because he was just visiting in New York and

00:44:58.560 he's like can I stay here and work and I he's tweeting on the couch and I open the door and

00:45:02.660 I'm like what are you doing what are you doing like you're ruining your life right now why would

00:45:06.240 you do that we get into a physical fight over this man's phone I managed to delete a absolutely

00:45:11.020 caustic tweet towards Matt Walsh that no one saw that was like and we're literally fighting over

00:45:16.920 it flies across the room like can we what was the tweet i kind of want to know the tweet can we you

00:45:24.680 don't have it was something as bad as the guy deserved to be shot but no one ever saw so we

00:45:29.260 didn't talk for like a year after that because i was so mad it was nuts it was it was nuts it was

00:45:34.380 very annoying because the when i played the game with destiny we i had a very good time i thought

00:45:39.020 it was actually pretty good it was a good game and so we were about to publish it but then he

00:45:43.160 comes out and he's like, Trump, the president should be

00:45:45.240 murdered, or the former president, future president 1.00

00:45:47.280 should be murdered, and the conservatives should be murdered 1.00

00:45:49.160 and all that stuff. I said, well, I have this, we had this 1.00

00:45:51.260 nice interaction, and now

00:45:52.740 it's going to look horrible if I publish it, so

00:45:55.160 we had to kill the whole thing. Alright, so the question is,

00:45:57.780 there's two questions. Wow.

00:45:59.180 Oh boy. Mr. Nick and Mr.

00:46:01.140 Davey's really giving it to you good.

00:46:03.180 Do you think Destiny had more

00:46:05.080 fun having drinks with me

00:46:06.920 than with you?

00:46:09.660 Okay, come on, guys. This is a

00:46:11.180 family show. What are we doing?

00:46:12.180 If we fought on the White House lawn

00:46:16.000 I don't think me and you

00:46:16.940 I think me and Destiny

00:46:18.500 If we fought on the White House lawn

00:46:19.740 Would Destiny beat me 0.96

00:46:21.360 In a celebrity boxing game?

00:46:23.120 Wait, which one of these am I supposed to answer?

00:46:24.700 Let's do the first one first

00:46:25.900 Did Destiny have more fun having drinks with me than with you? 0.98

00:46:31.780 No

00:46:32.140 He did not

00:46:33.280 Did I click no enough times?

00:46:36.360 He did not

00:46:36.780 Is that correct?

00:46:37.600 Am I right on that?

00:46:38.240 That's probably correct

00:46:38.960 Do we need to go any further with that?

00:46:41.120 I don't think we do

00:46:41.840 No

00:46:42.100 Okay, now more interesting if...

00:46:45.620 Oh, wait, listen.

00:46:46.280 Actually, I have a comment to make on that.

00:46:47.660 I think everyone's mad at me for being a woman in a male-dominated field.

00:46:51.700 Okay. 1.00

00:46:53.060 Every conservative guy I know loses his shit over the BPD goth art hoe. 1.00

00:46:59.540 And then... 1.00

00:47:00.140 Oh, yeah, bipolar disorder. 1.00

00:47:01.440 You know, they all want the goth chick that's vote and lib. 1.00

00:47:04.860 They'll go to the march and wear the hat to go get the goth chick. 0.73

00:47:08.860 You know what's funny? 0.91

00:47:09.340 Okay, hold on.

00:47:09.440 And then I do it. 0.56

00:47:10.280 I go for the blue-haired, mentally ill lib side quest, and everyone gets mad at me. 0.94

00:47:14.960 Woman and male-dominated fields. 0.79

00:47:16.400 That's an amazing, the field being bad dating choices. 1.00

00:47:21.400 Yes.

00:47:21.540 Thank you.

00:47:21.900 That is an amazing observation, because I was just talking to Mr. Davies,

00:47:27.340 tell-and-tales out of school after a martoonie or two,

00:47:30.200 and he said, goth baddies are having a big comeback.

00:47:34.580 And I said, what are you talking about?

00:47:35.780 He said, oh, they're everywhere, all on my social media.

00:47:38.060 I said, they're not on my social media. 0.70

00:47:39.140 I don't know, it tells me more about you than about social media, and he's really into the goth baddies.

00:47:43.720 And then I was actually thinking, you know, for me, I do, yeah, I like the more kind of the artsy type, the graduate school type, whatever, you know, which is more lib-coded than conservative-coded.

00:47:59.360 And, but so what you're saying is, why is it that there is one standard for male behavior and another standard for female behavior?

00:48:06.920 It's almost as if men and women are different.

00:48:10.340 Clearly not.

00:48:11.180 That's an amazing observation.

00:48:13.020 So, okay, I'm not pressing on the destiny thing.

00:48:15.860 I have my thoughts.

00:48:17.480 Listen, when all of your private messages are released to the Internet and your...

00:48:21.060 How did that happen?

00:48:21.880 How did that happen?

00:48:22.600 Okay.

00:48:23.880 Do you have an hour?

00:48:24.760 Well, we eventually decided it's not going to work because I'm not polyamorous.

00:48:31.160 I can't make that work.

00:48:33.160 That was the breaking point.

00:48:35.700 Polyamory.

00:48:36.220 love arguing. I love arguing. I've never had more fun in my life than being in some hick-ass bar

00:48:41.760 screaming at Destiny while I've got all these people like four beers deep cheering me on like

00:48:47.700 so much fun. But I can't be polyamorous. I can't do it. You know we had the conversation. He

00:48:54.240 considered Christianity. Listen I've been deep. Really? Yes. I've been deep in the field doing

00:48:59.460 I'm out here really debating liberals. On the front lines. I'm on the front lines. He considered

00:49:05.160 changing his life up, but too much.

00:49:07.680 Too much.

00:49:08.160 Because that would have been

00:49:09.420 actual heroic virtue

00:49:13.700 had you done that.

00:49:15.100 That would be very good for him and for everybody.

00:49:16.700 I'm out here on the front lines.

00:49:17.320 No one's cheering me on.

00:49:18.280 But it didn't work.

00:49:19.060 It didn't work.

00:49:20.060 Okay.

00:49:21.340 And I guess during that phase

00:49:23.720 where we had decided to part ways,

00:49:27.200 he had sent all of our messages,

00:49:28.900 as people do when they're going through

00:49:31.240 a breakup or whatever,

00:49:32.760 to a 19-year-old sex worker on the internet.

00:49:35.160 who ended up being a grown man catfishing him who then used it against him to blackmail him or

00:49:44.840 whatever and then released them four years later as I was flying to go debate the parliament about

00:49:49.040 whether I was a Russian spy or not. I've been on a wild side quest the last few years, guys. If you

00:49:53.460 haven't seen me in a few years, I had feds on my doorstep trying to send me to jail. All my DMs

00:49:58.880 with destiny leaked. My life was just... I read a headline the other day that a female cop

00:50:04.820 shot a rabbi outside of a porn company and a guy named Muhammad got killed.

00:50:10.660 And that was supposed to be the craziest headline.

00:50:12.680 And what you just described is 10 times crazier than all. 1.00

00:50:17.520 So Destiny sends your private texts to some prostitute. 0.99

00:50:23.480 Yes. 1.00

00:50:23.860 And then it somehow gets to the government of Canada.

00:50:29.000 I genuinely think it was the feds that released it.

00:50:31.740 Because it was the day before I was to debate the parliament about whether I was a Russian asset or not.

00:50:38.220 I was trying to be off the internet, and I was forced into a public debate with the federal government, live stream, Twitch politics.

00:50:47.060 This, even down to, like, it's so crazy to think, poor Mr. Destiny, who I don't know very well.

00:50:54.060 I met him one time at this very table.

00:50:56.400 But we got along just fine.

00:50:58.580 We had a good time, actually.

00:51:00.240 And I just think it's actually a real pity, no flattery.

00:51:04.800 But, you know, if relative to the public appearance of the current state of his life, if he could have had some kind of stable thing with you, and maybe if he were then to consider Christianity and were to like get his life in order, that would have been really, really good.

00:51:22.700 And instead, he said the holdup was, I want to do weird stuff with other people. 0.56

00:51:29.780 And then the conclusion of it is, he sends intimate conversations to a hooker that ends up in the hands of some corrupt government.

00:51:40.980 It's just like, it's so easily preventable, I guess, is my conclusion.

00:51:45.420 You know, I think that there's something that happens to people when they grow up on the internet.

00:51:48.700 like I always people are like why is your dating life and personal life so crazy Lauren it's like

00:51:53.340 I have had millions of people commenting I have I have a video on YouTube with 20,000 views

00:51:58.640 that's just covering the flame war in my wiki feet comment section you know like there is nothing

00:52:05.320 about my life that is normal I'm banned from like three or four countries I just want to clarify

00:52:08.900 the flame war meaning an argument over I have a very controversial very controversial wiki feet

00:52:16.620 page, you know? Um, and one thing that would always happen in my dating life as well is men

00:52:22.640 believe everything they read about me on the internet. So like if I date, especially like a

00:52:26.280 normie guy, they'll read a headline. This actually happened to my marriage. There was a headline

00:52:30.260 that's like, Lauren's cheating on her husband. And it was clearly AI generated to get clicks,

00:52:33.960 like nonsense. And I get sent this by my husband and he's freaking out. And I'm like, this is AI.

00:52:39.180 Like, I need you to understand, like, let's go through it together. This is AI. Same with,

00:52:43.360 You know, I had an ex where there was an article calling me a fascist.

00:52:46.700 His mother finds it, screams at him on the phone, why are you dating a fascist?

00:52:49.980 And it's like to date someone that doesn't understand how the internet works and isn't seeped in like drama, it almost feels like a painful experience for me.

00:52:58.900 Because I know at some point you're going to find something on the internet about me.

00:53:03.020 You're going to believe it.

00:53:04.260 Because when you're in an argument with your spouse, like you go to your friends and you say, they said X, Y, Z, like give me comfort.

00:53:10.520 And you can tell which friends of yours are going to just glaze you and be like, yeah, F them, this, that, but you know that's the personality.

00:53:16.940 Whereas when you get in an argument with someone who's been an internet personality, you can go on infinite forums telling you they're a psychopath, they're a sociopath, they're this, they're that, and believe everything they say.

00:53:27.300 And so to be in a relationship with someone else who has experienced that felt a lot safer than to be in a relationship with someone who's going to infinitely use my online reputation against me.

00:53:35.980 Yeah, that actually weirdly, that's the closest thing to a defense of dating Mr. Destiny that I could possibly imagine.

00:53:43.940 And it actually is a good defense.

00:53:45.560 Okay, the second question, this is a more important question.

00:53:49.240 Okay.

00:53:50.280 If Destiny and I fought on the White House lawn, would Destiny beat me in a celebrity boxing match?

00:53:59.240 What's your answer going to be?

00:54:05.980 you're going to say...

00:54:07.940 You're right, okay.

00:54:08.880 Well, you're going to say...

00:54:10.860 I hope you're going to say no.

00:54:15.180 Correct, all right, okay.

00:54:17.080 I'm sorry, Stephen, one too many hours on our craters, okay?

00:54:20.420 You just, you got to get off.

00:54:22.620 He beat you in our craters, not in a physical boxing match.

00:54:25.980 That's great, because I don't, look, I'm not,

00:54:28.980 I'm more of a lover than a fighter, obviously,

00:54:31.000 but I did, at the behest of my friend and then employer,

00:54:35.980 jeremy he said you i want you to work out you got to work out and we were maybe going to do a project

00:54:41.500 and then he said no i want you to do fighting and he he had a buddy who ran uh he did a krav maga

00:54:48.140 thing so i said well i'll call it krav maga and that'll be really cool and it's it's apparently

00:54:52.540 an israeli thing not beating the allegations at daily wire and so then i called it jujitsu

00:54:58.860 i said i'm doing jujitsu and i was doing it multiple mornings a week and so i'm not saying

00:55:04.780 I could beat up Muhammad Ali.

00:55:08.680 But I'm glad you think I could take on destiny in the ring.

00:55:12.100 That's great. Thank you.

00:55:12.900 With that jiu-jitsu.

00:55:13.840 With that jiu-jitsu.

00:55:14.940 With that Sicilian jiu-jitsu.

00:55:15.540 Sorry, my mic is electrocuting me.

00:55:20.000 I'm clear. Okay. You're up.

00:55:23.000 All right. All right. Let's go.

00:55:24.380 I like that we're going to get through like four martinis.

00:55:26.780 I'm already drunk. I'm going to be real. I'm drunk.

00:55:28.920 right is the rise of socialism a greater threat to america than rising muslim immigration 0.99

00:55:36.120 is the rise of socialism a greater threat to america than rising muslim immigration

00:55:44.040 what would i say this is about what i would say yeah i know i got it okay i would say no 0.96

00:55:49.960 what you got it wrong it's not they're they're the same what they're they're indistinguishable

00:55:54.800 Really?

00:55:55.340 Is my real thought.

00:55:56.540 Let me see how it was phrased so I make sure I answered correctly.

00:55:59.080 Is the rise of socialism a greater threat? 0.99

00:56:01.000 There's way more socialists in America than there are Islamic fundamentalists. 0.94

00:56:05.200 Yeah, but the socialist thing, I mean, we had a socialist moment in the early 20th century,

00:56:09.800 which was Eugene Debs and the anarchists from Harvard and stuff.

00:56:13.760 But the socialism now is a product of migration.

00:56:18.120 So it's a product of...

00:56:19.400 I don't think I believe that. 0.99

00:56:20.440 All the big DSA people are foreign. 0.99

00:56:22.500 It's AOC, it's Ilhan Omar, it's that new chick in New York D.A.C.

00:56:26.180 Was AOC born outside America?

00:56:27.200 No, they're either second generation or she's second generation.

00:56:30.040 The new D.A.C. is second generation.

00:56:31.840 But it's all a migration thing.

00:56:33.640 And the socialism is, it's not like the old, it's not Karl Marx who is evil and probably was demonically possessed but had interesting insights. 0.89

00:56:42.840 It's what they call gay race communism. 0.94

00:56:44.820 Like it's all this, yeah, third world.

00:56:46.920 I think when it comes to Canada, anyway, when we're looking at, like, electoral, like, groups you're trying to pursue, a lot of the immigrant communities are very socially conservative. 0.83

00:56:59.340 So they get pursued massively.

00:57:01.580 And a lot of immigrant communities, if you include Eastern Europe, certainly are extraordinarily anti-communist. 0.88

00:57:07.280 Like, I send my kid to a school run by Eastern Europeans because they're not, you know, skeptical of the government because they fell down a YouTube rabbit hole. 0.92

00:57:15.440 They're skeptical because they were in bread lines in Poland. 0.95

00:57:17.860 No, look, we give the Poles a pass.

00:57:20.580 They're immigrants.

00:57:21.840 Yeah, they're immigrants. 1.00

00:57:22.940 But I'm talking about Third World. 0.70

00:57:26.740 You know, in America, there's a lot from Middle East and North Africa.

00:57:30.560 You've got Dearborn, Michigan and parts of Texas now. 0.93

00:57:33.960 But then even the Hispanic immigration is formed by this very communist-infused, liberation-theology-injected kind of thing. 0.98

00:57:42.920 So I don't think you can parse the two. 0.95

00:57:45.120 I think there's a lot of immigrants who are extraordinarily skeptical of socialism. 0.91

00:57:49.800 Like, I'm not, I think, like, my biggest problem, Cubans, yeah, Cuban immigrants. 1.00

00:57:52.560 Give me the Cubans. Bring on the Cubans. 1.00

00:57:54.500 You know, I don't, and I actually, when it comes to, like, the Islam stuff, I have friends of mine that are Islamic that are not so different from Christian friends when they practice it, you know, normally in their day-to-day life, and I don't have a problem with that. 0.99

00:58:09.380 But the Islamic fundamentalism, I think you see a lot more with, like, the mass immigration in Europe that has no real checks or balances.

00:58:17.160 I don't know how much you see the Islamic fundamentalism here in the U.S. 0.93

00:58:19.920 No, my fear is not—I have some trepidation of Islamic fundamentalism. 0.98

00:58:24.420 We have been in tension with this religion for 1,400 years, going back to—let's not forget the Battle of Tours was 150 miles outside of Paris, not outside of Mecca. 1.00

00:58:33.440 But, yeah, there's the Dearborn problem and all that. 1.00

00:58:36.500 My issue is more with the Mamdani stuff. 0.77

00:58:39.380 Is Mamdani a practicing Muslim? 0.83

00:58:41.400 I don't know, like I guess, probably not.

00:58:43.820 A lot of these people, these hijab people like Ilhan Omar,

00:58:47.320 is she the most practicing devout Muslim? 0.98

00:58:48.880 Probably not. 1.00

00:58:50.020 It's that marriage of Islam as used really just to attack Christendom in the West 1.00

00:58:58.480 rather than as a robust religion in itself. 0.99

00:59:01.580 Married to the economic version of that, which is socialism and communism.

00:59:05.700 To me, that's the threat. 0.77

00:59:07.340 Like, if you gave me a Samuel Gompers, Eugene Debs, socialist, actual, you know, kind of working class hero today, I think they're kind of wacky. 0.70

00:59:20.320 But to me, it's just so different.

00:59:22.800 But to me, the core problem there is the socialism, the too much government control, the taking away of individual freedoms and finances.

00:59:31.580 In my ideal world, I'm actually studying theology right now in school.

00:59:36.420 I've gone back. I'm just doing a course a semester. But in my ideal world, there are so many Islamic scholars, Christian scholars, Jewish scholars, that when they, you know, rationalists, when they work together, they have just fascinating insights about the world.

00:59:51.880 It's like the fundamental issue is when you get the government, the control, and the authoritarianism involved.

01:00:00.720 Like, that's the fundamental issue. 1.00

01:00:02.040 I don't care if someone is Muslim. 1.00

01:00:03.980 I don't. 1.00

01:00:05.420 Great, that's your journey.

01:00:06.640 If that brings you closer to God, and as a Christian, I can have a conversation with you about that.

01:00:11.720 I have a lot more in common with a Muslim than I do an atheist in a lot of ways.

01:00:15.800 I'll grant that very last part, but not the other parts. 1.00

01:00:18.060 Because they're different religions.

01:00:21.220 You know, and I fear in your comments, there's a touch of indifferentism.

01:00:26.360 You know, well, whatever gets you closer to God.

01:00:28.380 Some people think they're hugging a tree.

01:00:30.440 Some people think they have a water hose, but they're all touching an elephant, and it's just different parts. 1.00

01:00:35.140 And I think, like, no, the Muslims are wrong for a lot of reasons. 1.00

01:00:38.440 They deny the incarnation. 1.00

01:00:39.720 They deny the crucifixion, certainly, explicitly, and they, therefore, deny the resurrection.

01:00:45.060 They have a voluntarist conception of God, which is divorced from reason, the logos,

01:00:49.520 which is central to the Christian conception of God.

01:00:51.400 But it's the pursuit of something higher than self,

01:00:54.660 in my opinion, that matters.

01:00:56.700 It's the getting outside of the narcissism and ego

01:01:03.340 of I am my own God.

01:01:05.780 And I think I have a lot more conversation

01:01:08.020 that I can have with someone in that psychological mindset

01:01:10.540 than I can with someone who views themselves as their own God.

01:01:12.960 I agree.

01:01:13.400 Okay, so then let me ask you this question

01:01:15.120 to clarify the point.

01:01:17.960 You're Prime Minister of Canada.

01:01:19.520 Kearney, yes.

01:01:20.700 No, you are Kearney.

01:01:21.920 Oh, I am Prime Minister.

01:01:22.500 You are Prime Minister.

01:01:23.640 Oh, yeah, let's go.

01:01:24.320 Yeah, and there are two policies you can pursue, only two.

01:01:29.120 Oh, boy.

01:01:29.720 You can either take in half a million socialists from the Christian democratic tradition to the more hardcore socialist tradition of Europe, 0.99

01:01:40.940 or you can take in serious practicing Muslims 0.80

01:01:47.820 from Somalia, Iran, or Iraq, your children.

01:01:54.160 Okay, but when you say serious practicing Muslims 0.92

01:01:56.060 from these, okay. 0.98

01:01:57.340 I think you gave your answer.

01:01:58.260 I see what you're up to.

01:01:59.340 I see what, but the thing is they're like,

01:02:01.060 I don't, they stone women to death

01:02:03.240 for the crime of adultery in these countries.

01:02:06.160 Like the culture is fundamentally different. 0.99

01:02:08.420 If we're talking like a serious practicing Muslim. 0.99

01:02:09.760 Because they call it sharia law? 0.99

01:02:10.940 that grew up in like Canada,

01:02:12.500 that's going to be very different 0.98

01:02:13.860 than a serious practicing Muslim. 1.00

01:02:15.200 Like the cultural influence

01:02:16.580 on these religions matters.

01:02:19.440 Yeah, okay. 1.00

01:02:19.940 So a weaker, a weaker Muslim, 1.00

01:02:22.160 not a weaker Muslim, 1.00

01:02:23.180 that's in China, 1.00

01:02:23.760 but like a weaker one,

01:02:24.600 like it doesn't follow.

01:02:25.280 Okay, all right.

01:02:25.900 I think I got my answer.

01:02:26.960 Right now, go to expressvpn.com

01:02:28.460 slash Michael Knowles show.

01:02:30.120 Isn't that a mouthful?

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01:02:40.660 you open up Netflix or one of the other streaming services, suddenly the show you wanted to watch

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01:03:09.580 He loves watching these Indian shows.

01:03:11.640 I don't know.

01:03:11.900 He's not Indian, but he loves watching the Indian shows.

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01:03:33.520 or use the QR code on screen.

01:03:37.400 There's a link in the description box below.

01:03:38.900 you go to expressvpn.com

01:03:40.020 slash Michael Knowles show

01:03:41.160 expressvpn.com

01:03:42.400 slash Michael Knowles show

01:03:43.240 or use that QR code

01:03:44.320 on screen.

01:03:45.520 Lori, you're up.

01:03:47.380 Wait, no.

01:03:47.740 No, I'm up.

01:03:48.240 I'm up.

01:03:48.580 I'm up.

01:03:48.880 Okay.

01:03:49.760 You have to clear your ears.

01:03:50.500 Oh, okay.

01:03:50.900 Okay.

01:03:51.180 I'm on it.

01:03:52.100 Okay.

01:03:53.740 You gotta fix these buttons

01:03:55.440 for people with nails, okay?

01:03:56.680 Yeah, this is not...

01:03:58.480 Daily Wire. 0.73

01:03:59.320 Sexist as usual.

01:04:00.580 Classic.

01:04:00.920 Classic.

01:04:02.440 Do fantasy novels 1.00

01:04:04.160 give women 0.83

01:04:05.120 more unrealistic expectations 0.99

01:04:07.300 than an occasional

01:04:08.340 than an occasional trip to a gentleman's club gives men?

01:04:17.060 Hmm, hold on, that's actually, that's kind of a hard question.

01:04:19.620 Do fantasy novels give women more unrealistic expectations

01:04:23.000 than an occasional trip to a gentleman's club gives men?

01:04:27.040 Okay, no, that's not a hard question.

01:04:29.880 Yes, certainly, right? 1.00

01:04:31.700 No, but the hooker does love him. 1.00

01:04:33.300 Yeah, right, that's the thing. 0.87

01:04:34.300 She does love him.

01:04:34.560 Yeah, it's, so how many, that's what it hinges on.

01:04:37.540 How many men really believe that, you know, the hooker, she really likes him, he's the one?

01:04:43.560 No, very few.

01:04:44.680 Whereas when women read, I didn't know this. 0.99

01:04:47.260 I was talking about this yesterday to Mr. Davies. 1.00

01:04:50.540 Apparently, a lot of women in the office read these trash, chiclet porn novels. 1.00

01:04:56.140 I tried. 1.00

01:04:57.160 I really did try.

01:04:58.120 I went through, like, a two-year period of not dating at all, and I was like, okay.

01:05:02.320 Like, I'm a woman, so I'm just not into porn.

01:05:04.400 That's not going to do it for me. 0.99

01:05:05.580 So I'm like, I'll start reading the trash.

01:05:08.040 It was so badly written, I couldn't do it.

01:05:11.360 It's just like, you know, the way people write their LARP novels.

01:05:14.980 Like, I was an orphan who was somehow a magical princess.

01:05:17.700 And then I got kidnapped by the very sexy king who just needed to sleep with me every day.

01:05:22.340 Yeah.

01:05:23.140 Did you see the one?

01:05:24.200 There was one going around.

01:05:25.300 I don't know if it was real or if it was like a meme.

01:05:27.520 But it was like a lady romance novel.

01:05:32.120 But it was, the guy was a minotaur.

01:05:35.240 He was half animal or something.

01:05:37.720 I think I know what you're talking about. 0.93

01:05:39.340 I don't even want to say the name of the novel because of the fact that I know it.

01:05:42.920 You must.

01:05:44.760 Maybe I saw it.

01:05:45.640 I'm not going to.

01:05:46.900 Wow.

01:05:48.220 But it's real.

01:05:49.240 Yeah.

01:05:49.600 It's real.

01:05:51.940 I don't read as much as I should.

01:05:54.760 I should read much more.

01:05:56.200 At night, I try after the kids are in bed.

01:05:58.540 At least so often we'll be in bed.

01:06:00.300 And I'll sit outside.

01:06:01.560 I'll have a cigar.

01:06:02.340 And I'll try to read.

01:06:03.280 Nice.

01:06:03.500 And I say, let's say I get three hours a week to read sometimes, not more than that.

01:06:08.440 I want to make sure I'm reading something that's really going to edify me.

01:06:12.000 And I think if I'm going to indulge in a purely entertainment thing, I'll either watch baseball, 0.81

01:06:19.660 or if a woman wants to watch porn, I guess you say, why don't you just look at porn? 0.80

01:06:24.940 You shouldn't look at porn, but why, then you just, the idea.

01:06:28.140 Doesn't do the same thing for us.

01:06:28.820 The idea of reading, yeah, this is what I don't get.

01:06:31.040 It's like sitting down to read trash, I don't get. 0.84

01:06:35.760 Like, I would consume trash in another way. 0.95

01:06:38.260 Okay, for women, like, I think this is one thing men don't get, like, because they're very visual creatures. 0.98

01:06:43.180 It's like sex and romance for women is, like, 80% psychological. 0.94

01:06:47.320 It's like it's all in your head.

01:06:49.340 And, you know, I really, when I look back, it's not just believing in, like, the trad fantasy stuff that ruined a lot of my approach to relationships as well as becoming famous at 19.

01:07:00.220 and, you know, getting banned from countries and arrested

01:07:02.300 and becoming just like a lot of messed up from the internet. 0.99

01:07:04.840 But like, you know, I watched The Notebook and I believed that shit. 0.99

01:07:08.280 I watched the fantasy movies, the Disney princess movies, everything. 0.98

01:07:12.280 And the funny thing is, if you actually read the original versions

01:07:15.640 of like the Brothers Grimm, the story of Ariel, for example, Little Mermaid,

01:07:22.600 she actually gets rejected by the prince and she has a deal

01:07:25.800 where she's going to turn into seafoam if she doesn't marry him within a few days.

01:07:32.300 And the whole story is she gave up her voice for a man and dies at the end of the real story

01:07:38.520 because you're not supposed to give up your voice.

01:07:40.460 Or the story of Redbeard where, have you heard this one?

01:07:43.500 No.

01:07:44.380 Marries a handsome prince.

01:07:46.620 He goes off on a hunting trip.

01:07:47.940 She invites her sisters over.

01:07:49.660 She's been given all the keys to the castle.

01:07:51.580 and she's just been told there's one key you can't use

01:07:54.920 and one, you know, you just don't use this key.

01:07:57.140 That's the only thing.

01:07:57.840 So they decide, he's away, excuse my language.

01:07:59.920 For sure.

01:08:00.360 Let's open all the doors.

01:08:01.420 Of course.

01:08:01.760 And the one key that he told her,

01:08:03.460 you're not allowed to use, they open the last door

01:08:05.600 and it's a room full of dead bodies of his ex-wives.

01:08:09.200 And she tells all her brothers, he comes back, 0.81

01:08:12.100 discovers she's opened the room, goes to kill her as well.

01:08:14.600 But because she's told her family about the situation, 0.70

01:08:17.020 the brothers kill him and save her.

01:08:18.840 the old fantasy novels warned you about bad men they warned you about being open about your

01:08:24.960 relationships with your family not hiding things not whereas the newer fantasy is all the prince

01:08:30.260 is going to come and save you and he's going to be perfect and nothing's going to go wrong and

01:08:33.140 then you ride off into the sunset and women love that story because it's simple and actually 0.95

01:08:39.600 yeah you know but what i guess what changed did women become more simple is your implication or

01:08:45.360 Well, the delusion of just, I'm going to get married and everything in my life is going to be perfect is a lot more enticing than I have to keep trying every single day of my life to ensure this is a healthy relationship and I need to stay on my toes and read situations and be, I have to be intelligent.

01:09:00.540 What I wonder...

01:09:01.280 Like, we want to live life on autopilot.

01:09:03.240 But what, yes, yes.

01:09:05.520 But what was the cultural shift that led to that?

01:09:08.940 The same shift that's led to clickbait.

01:09:11.000 It's, we're going to just give people the ideological lap dance they want.

01:09:14.340 Oh, okay.

01:09:15.120 You know, no one wants hard lessons that gives you an internal locus of control where you have to actually put effort into life.

01:09:20.640 Yeah, yeah. 0.95

01:09:20.900 We want all women are at fault, all men are at fault.

01:09:23.240 You're going to find your prince and then life is going to be good.

01:09:25.240 We love those stories.

01:09:26.180 Just decadence, basically.

01:09:27.100 Decadence, yeah. 0.99

01:09:27.740 Because it could be, the other read on it would be that it could be feminism, that in the old days, before feminism, women kind of knew what was up. 0.99

01:09:35.640 You know, they were not laboring under different ideological pretenses.

01:09:41.800 So they kind of knew what men are like, and they knew the good parts of men and the bad parts of men, and so the literature reflected that.

01:09:47.620 And then in feminism, they tell you men and women are exactly the same, and they kind of jumble up a lot of anthropology, and that jumbles up the presentation of men in the romance novel.

01:09:55.480 I don't know that real feminism talks about how men and women are the same.

01:10:00.860 I think, like, if you were to read, you know, Andrea Dworkin, they're very honest about the differences.

01:10:08.740 I thought you were going to say Mary Wollstonecraft or something. 0.97

01:10:11.020 You're going full Dworkin, like, all sex is rape, kind of. 0.79

01:10:15.040 Well, no, I don't think that's what they're saying either. 0.94

01:10:16.900 Whereas I think it's more, oh, you're going to get mad at this,

01:10:19.220 but it's more capitalism that led to the Disneyfication of relationships.

01:10:24.120 It's, once again, what sells, not what is true and what's going to help you.

01:10:28.080 And I think that's the biggest problem that we have with materialist society.

01:10:31.180 It's not what is truth, what is going to make life better.

01:10:33.960 And this is what has happened as well with the political entertainment, infotainment sphere.

01:10:38.100 I actually think a lot of relationship advice.

01:10:39.960 Have you ever heard of AI model collapse?

01:10:42.120 No.

01:10:42.740 That's where AI is trained on other AIs.

01:10:45.060 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:10:45.700 It just becomes more and more delusional

01:10:47.580 because it's not pulling from the source, which is reality.

01:10:50.040 You have this with influencers as well.

01:10:51.960 They are all in their basement all day long

01:10:54.000 getting their information about relationships and life

01:10:55.860 from other influencers.

01:10:57.300 And it's like we're having journalist reality collapse.

01:11:00.580 Whereas I look at the relationship advice from people online

01:11:03.740 and I'm like, this has no correlation

01:11:05.800 with how people are actually dating

01:11:07.600 and relating to one another in real life.

01:11:09.840 but it's enticing. And if you're on your computer all day, it's what you want to hear.

01:11:13.600 This is what happened with the Disneyfication of movies, with all the romance novels. It's

01:11:18.120 what we want reality to be. And we escape into our fantasies when real life doesn't give us what

01:11:22.980 we want. Yes. I just think, especially to point to Andrea Dworkin, who is one of the most radical

01:11:29.520 of the feminists. I don't know that she has the tightest grip on reality, but your point is very

01:11:34.820 good, especially on, you know, capitalism absent a serious moral restraint can go off into all

01:11:43.000 sorts of crazy directions. But there's always been market dynamics. You know, there's always

01:11:48.560 been like, what, the thing that changed to me, I don't know, you find it, you're basically saying

01:11:53.300 I find more of the reality in the feminism. And I'm saying, I don't know, I think the feminism

01:11:58.240 that masked the reality. There are deeper realities, which is why pre-feminism, 0.91

01:12:03.940 All those stories you cited, which come pre-feminism, they presented reality more clearly.

01:12:08.200 We don't know what life was like pre-feminism.

01:12:11.320 I do. 0.63

01:12:11.840 We didn't live it.

01:12:12.400 You do?

01:12:13.120 I read books.

01:12:14.060 We make a lot of assumptions of what life was like before we were around, I think.

01:12:17.760 And we kind of see the ad, like we see the Norman Rockwell paintings.

01:12:21.500 We don't see what life was actually like then.

01:12:24.080 But Norman Rockwell comes after feminism, right? 1.00

01:12:27.160 Maybe. 0.94

01:12:27.480 You could see Caravaggio, Judith beheading Holofernes. 0.97

01:12:32.000 That was life pre-feminism. 0.77

01:12:33.180 Hell yeah. 1.00

01:12:33.600 All right, this is the rapid round.

01:12:37.200 It's time for the rapid fire round.

01:12:39.480 Three questions, 30 seconds.

01:12:40.860 No time to outthink each other.

01:12:42.060 Let's go.

01:12:42.940 Uh-oh, is it my turn?

01:12:43.860 You're up, you're up.

01:12:45.020 I'll take away my answer, okay.

01:12:47.420 Is being, oh wait, I ask it out loud now?

01:12:49.540 Yes.

01:12:49.760 I'm drunk, I'm lost.

01:12:50.600 Yes, yes.

01:12:51.040 Someone help me.

01:12:52.060 Is being a cocktail waitress more degrading

01:12:54.320 than being an online conspiracy theorist?

01:12:58.140 This is your answer?

01:12:59.220 Yeah.

01:13:00.580 Oops, sorry.

01:13:03.600 No, yeah. Cocktail waitress is a great profession. Honest profession, and yeah, good job. An important job. 1.00

01:13:11.200 Do flat earthers at least have some interesting points?

01:13:19.820 No, they don't. A lot of conspiracy theorists do. I'm like open. I would say most conspiracy theorists make good points.

01:13:26.840 One time, this is a brief story. I know I can't interrupt, but it is a brief story.

01:13:30.400 I was with a buddy of mine, I can say his name, Tim Gordon, is a Catholic writer and commentator.

01:13:38.140 And I saw him, he was in town, we were having a cigar with another guy who I won't name.

01:13:42.420 And Tim, who's like opened all sorts of wild, edgy, kind of crazy stuff, very nice guy.

01:13:49.420 But, you know, it's not like he's too restrained, he won't entertain some crazy idea.

01:13:56.020 This other guy says, Michael, you love Dante, do you believe in Dante's cosmology?

01:14:00.400 I said, what do you mean by that?

01:14:02.400 He said, well, that the earth is flat.

01:14:05.400 I said, well, actually...

01:14:06.400 Was Dante a flat earther?

01:14:07.400 I did a whole course on him.

01:14:08.400 No, no.

01:14:09.400 It's like very important to Dante's cosmology that the earth is not flat.

01:14:13.400 And so I said, well, that's not Dante's cosmology.

01:14:17.400 And this other guy, nice guy, but he said, yeah, the earth is flat.

01:14:21.400 And then Tim turns to us, he said, you know, man, just because we're Catholic doesn't mean we have to be retarded.

01:14:27.400 Like, this is, we're actually supposed to love pursuing the truth and, you know, science and, I don't know, natural science and all that. 0.91

01:14:35.100 So, anyway, no, the flat earth stuff does nothing for me.

01:14:38.220 There's nothing interesting about it.

01:14:39.180 But the story is so fun.

01:14:40.820 I love the idea of, like, the hidden continents.

01:14:43.120 Let's go to Hyperborea, you know.

01:14:44.560 No, yeah, that's like, that idea that there are hidden lands, that there's a glass dome or something, that there are crystal domes.

01:14:52.200 That's part of Dante's cosmology, that there are crystalline spheres and stuff.

01:14:55.500 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:14:55.820 But, like, the thing that's annoying to me about the flat earthing is that it's very modern.

01:15:00.920 Because it's not, like, their argument is that in the Middle Ages and in antiquity, people thought the Earth was flat.

01:15:07.620 That isn't true.

01:15:08.820 In antiquity and the Middle Ages, we knew the Earth was spherical or close to spherical.

01:15:13.200 So, like, it's not, it's like, I guess my problem with flat earthing is it's lib and modern.

01:15:17.900 I want it to be based and trad.

01:15:19.420 Wait, so you need right-wing flat earthers. 0.99

01:15:20.880 I need right-wing flat earthers.

01:15:21.460 Okay, based and trad, right-wing flat earthers. 0.94

01:15:24.460 Okay.

01:15:24.780 Okay, clearing my answer.

01:15:27.920 Can you ever really trust a Fed?

01:15:32.240 Really?

01:15:33.460 Really.

01:15:34.300 The answer's no.

01:15:35.300 No.

01:15:36.140 They lied to me so much, you wouldn't believe it.

01:15:38.240 My Fed lied to me.

01:15:39.420 They said I was never gonna be able to come to America

01:15:41.440 if I didn't work for them.

01:15:43.280 And here I am.

01:15:44.780 Here I am.

01:15:45.800 One time a Fed, an FBI agent.

01:15:47.300 Well, maybe I'm working for them.

01:15:48.700 Sorry.

01:15:50.620 An FBI agent comes to me after there was an Antifa attack

01:15:53.640 one of my speaking events. And my assistant said, Michael, the FBI wants to speak to you

01:15:59.200 because there happened to be an FBI agent at your speaking event. What are the odds? And they want

01:16:04.340 to speak to you to pursue charges against this person. This was at the time the FBI was spying

01:16:09.660 the Catholic churches, all this stuff. I said, oh yeah, the FBI wants to speak to me. They can send

01:16:13.420 me a subpoena. Otherwise I'm not speaking to the FBI. At that time, this is under Biden.

01:16:17.120 what do you know he was a he was a good agent and he actually did elevate it to the doj and he

01:16:23.640 actually got these people thrown in jail or one of them so he but to the point of the question

01:16:28.680 i couldn't it would have been crazy for me look what they did to mike flynn i could not have just

01:16:35.100 voluntarily at that time spoken to a federal agent well when i was in the tenant situation

01:16:39.680 what's funny is like i this was the russian the russian influence everyone thought i was a russian

01:16:44.300 spy blah blah blah i hired like super lib lawyers like they were through and through lib and the

01:16:49.300 first thing they said to me is they're like this is a political thing this is like full-on just

01:16:53.500 aware of it high-powered lawyers this is a political thing whatever you do any fed that

01:16:58.120 shows up to your door tell them to f off yeah and when i called them and i'm like the feds are at

01:17:01.520 my door they just started laughing they're like you tell them to f off yeah and it's just it's 0.57

01:17:06.980 it's like did you tell them to f off i did but they kept showing up and they said i was going

01:17:10.380 to go to jail if I didn't work for them. And they just, and then they tried like the honeypot thing.

01:17:14.820 You're so pretty. What's your dating profile like? Come for dinner with me. They sent this buff like.

01:17:19.880 It was a giga Chad fed. 1.00

01:17:21.120 Giga Chad fed.

01:17:22.000 Did it work? Oh, you don't need to.

01:17:23.200 No, it didn't work. I was on to them. Fool me once. Shame on you. Fool me twice. Shame on me.

01:17:31.100 Yes. To quote George W. Bush, the point is you're not going to fool me again. Next question.

01:17:35.560 Is selling a blank book for $12 more of a grift

01:17:38.900 than using Patreon money to shoot flare guns

01:17:41.600 near migrant boats?

01:17:44.840 I actually didn't...

01:17:46.720 Did you do that?

01:17:47.680 It was a torpedo, actually.

01:17:49.420 Okay, this is like so overblown.

01:17:51.200 There's like a million videos that say I shot flares.

01:17:53.240 I got an answer. Hold on.

01:17:54.760 Is it more of a grift? It's not a grift.

01:17:56.860 I don't want to give away the answer.

01:18:00.180 I give away the answer.

01:18:02.840 You got it wrong.

01:18:03.680 Give me my point. That's awesome.

01:18:05.560 Oh, you think I was grifting? You think it's a grift to ship flare guns at migrant boats? 0.73

01:18:10.040 No, I just think that the blank book was not at all a grift because it was totally forthright.

01:18:15.500 And so in any way in which the migrant boat thing deviated from not a grift at all, then it would be more so.

01:18:23.120 Okay, there was a protest against a ship that was going to, you know, Morocco to go pick up migrants.

01:18:31.300 And in order for the protest vote to be seen, because it left late, I had to light a flare to film it.

01:18:37.760 It wasn't a shooting flare.

01:18:39.660 But by the time it went through, like, the Chinese telephone game, in Italian press, they said I used a torpedo.

01:18:45.020 They literally said I used a torpedo on the boat.

01:18:47.800 I don't know how to—

01:18:48.800 And maybe you should—

01:18:49.900 You know, I did kill—I drowned baby puppies, actually, on that trip. 0.89

01:18:53.260 Wow, that's crazy.

01:18:54.520 I did. 1.00

01:18:54.680 Because of all of my provocations in the course of politics, which have been some, I've never started shooting migrants on the open sea.

01:19:05.460 It's not something I would do today, to be fair.

01:19:09.060 But maybe, was it so wrong?

01:19:12.200 Do you regret it?

01:19:14.000 I think that, okay, so this is a serious answer.

01:19:17.300 There was a lot of debate within the European Parliaments

01:19:20.980 about whether these boats were causing a pull factor

01:19:22.860 that was killing migrants at the time

01:19:24.720 because it was causing the human traffickers

01:19:27.000 to basically send more of these cheap boats out that would sink.

01:19:29.460 Apparently, the pull factor data was incorrect.

01:19:32.240 It wasn't actually causing a pull factor.

01:19:34.120 So it's not a protest I would do today.

01:19:36.040 Am I still against illegal immigration across the board?

01:19:38.780 Of course, but I don't think I would have done that protest today, no.

01:19:43.140 You wouldn't go sink the boats?

01:19:45.060 I would not go sink all the boats I sunk with people begging and crying and screaming, no.

01:19:49.220 Yeah, okay, all right.

01:19:51.040 Rapid fire.

01:19:53.080 Does smoking weed make people more liberal?

01:19:57.640 It does, obviously.

01:19:59.380 It made me more liberal.

01:20:00.680 Yeah.

01:20:01.340 I'm living out.

01:20:02.040 I'm living out.

01:20:02.440 You're living out.

01:20:02.980 You're saying I'm smoking the weed, and I don't regret it, but it's a little...

01:20:06.980 I quit weed, but it permanently made me more liberal.

01:20:09.360 It does.

01:20:09.840 Yeah.

01:20:10.520 It lives people out.

01:20:11.760 It does.

01:20:12.100 There's no...

01:20:13.380 It's like totally the opposite.

01:20:15.060 into twitter arguments with people when i was still like doing like the hardcore right wing

01:20:18.780 thing and then i'd smoke weed and i'd go back to the argument and i'd be like i'm so fucking wrong 0.94

01:20:22.340 i can't believe i said that shit it's like unreal yeah it's even i love when people when i've i'm 0.97

01:20:28.060 pretty harsh on the old haitian oregano the old you know jazz you've smoked weed on occasion i've 0.99

01:20:33.080 had a little peruvian parsley you know columbian cumin once twice yeah the old ganja i'm talking

01:20:38.400 about pot and i never loved it really uh i think in fact i could count on one finger the times i've

01:20:46.180 ever even thought i would like to have marijuana right now i don't really like it i love uh i did

01:20:50.260 this once it never got released but i did a political compass of drugs and it's like you

01:20:55.500 put for cocaine is like a very right-wing drug yeah and then weed is like i don't know it's like

01:21:01.120 left-wing what is like the left-wing authoritarian drug is my question though because like i feel

01:21:07.200 like you go to, like, ayahuasca and mushrooms.

01:21:09.960 Marxism, right?

01:21:10.500 Because he's offering...

01:21:11.220 No, but what is the actual drug that...

01:21:14.220 Crack.

01:21:18.020 No, I...

01:21:18.920 Gosh, I don't know.

01:21:20.140 Like, for Stalin or for...

01:21:22.160 Acid?

01:21:22.860 Who knows?

01:21:24.100 No, because the...

01:21:25.480 No, it's... 1.00

01:21:26.880 Like, coffee, Zins, all the uppers are all, like, 0.97

01:21:29.200 upper right-hand corner.

01:21:30.240 I don't want to sound like I'm squeezing out of this

01:21:32.820 because, yeah, Coke and amphetamines and whatever,

01:21:34.920 like, that's ultra-right-wing.

01:21:36.060 and pot is left libertarian

01:21:39.260 and right libertarian

01:21:40.880 is probably also kind of pot

01:21:42.040 but maybe like a little bit

01:21:43.100 like mushrooms or something.

01:21:45.320 Yeah, yeah.

01:21:45.880 But I'm not being cute

01:21:48.680 in the authoritarian left.

01:21:51.120 I think it is like the devil.

01:21:52.720 I think it's like the hard stuff. 0.73

01:21:54.440 I think it is like occult, crazy. 0.79

01:21:57.080 Satan, yeah.

01:21:57.680 I'm doing a line of Satan right now

01:21:59.380 and now I'm a Marxist.

01:22:00.200 I mean, Marx.

01:22:01.820 Marx was in contact with demons.

01:22:04.040 There's no question about it.

01:22:04.960 You read his poetry.

01:22:06.060 I'm guessing you've read That Hideous Strength.

01:22:09.880 Do you know I've never read That Hideous Strength?

01:22:11.580 You would love it.

01:22:12.180 Isn't that, yeah.

01:22:13.160 Everything you're saying right now.

01:22:14.600 So, like, you know, the idea of, like, microorganisms.

01:22:16.860 The whole idea is that these professors and scientists get in contact with macroorganisms,

01:22:21.140 and they're like, we're getting advice from macroorganisms, which are actually demons.

01:22:24.420 Yes.

01:22:24.920 Yeah, yeah.

01:22:25.800 But they make it all scientific.

01:22:27.380 There's a good book by Paul Kenger, The Devil and Karl Marx, which just, it's a spiritual biography of Marx.

01:22:33.040 It's crazy, and it's sort of undeniable.

01:22:35.920 So, yeah, anyway, I don't know what, because otherwise I don't know what the drug is.

01:22:39.280 Even, like, at a lower level.

01:22:42.000 I'm of the opinion that your drug of delusion can be anything, though.

01:22:46.240 So I had this debate on Piers Morgan with this guy named Andrew Wilson.

01:22:49.320 Have you heard of him before?

01:22:50.120 Yes, yeah, yeah.

01:22:50.840 I've never spoken to him.

01:22:52.060 We were debating trad, and I said, there's a bunch of trad LARPers on the Internet,

01:22:55.780 and he said, name one, name one, name one.

01:22:57.660 And he kept asking me to name one, and when I named people, he was like,

01:23:00.100 not real trad, not real trad, not real trad.

01:23:02.000 And I'm like, I feel like...

01:23:02.740 No true trads.

01:23:03.560 Exactly.

01:23:03.880 I feel like I could have had the same debate under communism and them saying, well, Stalin's not a real communist.

01:23:09.780 Well, that's not a real communist.

01:23:11.180 Well, of course not.

01:23:12.020 It's all a bastardized reincarnation of an ideology that was never going to work in the first place.

01:23:17.540 And you can say, but I think like everyone just finds their poison of ideology to get their authoritarian, you know, devilish ideas.

01:23:25.600 No, but the difference, look, I don't know Andrew Wilson.

01:23:29.900 He wanted to do some debate once, more than once, I think.

01:23:33.580 I've never done it.

01:23:34.540 I've never met him.

01:23:35.940 But you say it's like communism in the sense that trad life is never going to work.

01:23:42.880 We're not going back.

01:23:44.320 Listen, the cat's out of the bay.

01:23:45.980 You say all these, he said, am I a true trad?

01:23:49.680 That's what I'm asking.

01:23:50.300 There are communities.

01:23:51.440 Like, okay, so I live in a small community where we have, every other corner has a little bookshelf.

01:23:56.260 And you go and you put books in there and people take from it.

01:23:58.460 It's like a communist system.

01:23:59.780 My kids love it.

01:24:00.380 We have a high trust society.

01:24:02.380 Communism does work in, like, a small community where everyone is in agreement.

01:24:06.880 We're sharing, you know, you give me some eggs, I give you some vegetables.

01:24:10.900 Like, we have that.

01:24:11.580 That's just private community.

01:24:13.020 You have that in, that's not communism.

01:24:14.360 And trad works in the small, but you can't dictate it from a government down.

01:24:17.980 And you can't dictate it from an ideology on the internet down.

01:24:21.300 Not, the latter probably less effectively, but the law is a teacher.

01:24:25.020 I guess my only point on the distinction, how we got a field to Andrew Wilson from pot, we'll trace back.

01:24:32.380 I agree, communism never works in any case.

01:24:37.320 It just, it ultimately doesn't work because it makes some anthropological errors.

01:24:41.820 In tribes, it works fine, but it's just always going to be small,

01:24:44.980 like you just don't want the federal government dictating things down.

01:24:48.480 But is there any, but am I a true threat?

01:24:51.980 I don't know. I don't know you.

01:24:53.160 You don't know.

01:24:55.240 If you had to bet. 1.00

01:24:56.980 Gun to your head. Andrew Wilson put a gun to your head. 1.00

01:24:59.140 What does your wife do for work? Does she work? 1.00

01:25:00.840 She was a professor, but she doesn't work anymore.

01:25:03.800 You're not a true trad. 1.00

01:25:04.700 She doesn't work anymore. 1.00

01:25:05.460 She's a professor. 1.00

01:25:06.740 You like her because she's a smart woman. 1.00

01:25:08.200 No, but there are plenty. 1.00

01:25:08.860 You like her because she can think. 1.00

01:25:10.320 You would not like her if she was a dumbass. 1.00

01:25:12.300 Trads don't insist on dumb women. 1.00

01:25:14.580 They don't like their women. 1.00

01:25:15.540 The traditional life is that the woman tends to the home. 1.00

01:25:17.160 Shouldn't be able to be educated. 1.00

01:25:19.400 No, I don't think so.

01:25:19.560 Because like pre-70s, it was no credit card, no mortgage.

01:25:22.780 I don't think that's true.

01:25:23.560 I think Jane Austen was pretty educated.

01:25:25.460 Every?

01:25:26.340 Yeah.

01:25:27.140 I don't know.

01:25:27.720 I think that men esteemed women very highly.

01:25:30.860 We were talking about Dante earlier.

01:25:32.100 I think he thought quite highly of Beatrice.

01:25:34.140 I think in the history of the church, you have rather educated women.

01:25:37.580 St. Catherine of Siena would be at Teresa of Avila.

01:25:39.700 Okay, so I think you're closer to capital T-Trad, is what I'd call it.

01:25:44.440 There's lower T-Trad, which is like the online LARP version,

01:25:47.360 and then there's capital T-Trad, which is informed by the classics.

01:25:51.680 You know, I think Dante was extraordinarily respectful of women.

01:25:55.560 You know, the way that he elevated them in his work, like Beatrice, of course.

01:26:00.080 And then, you know...

01:26:01.820 Catholics are quite reverent to Mary.

01:26:04.020 The apocryphal scripts include Judith and all these very high-powered women that are respected and seen as powerful and able to enact their power onto the world.

01:26:13.380 There is a version of Trad that is a fully encompassed tradition that includes the whole ecclesiastical body of works and not just this narrow vision.

01:26:23.060 So hold on, you're telling me, Lauren, you're telling me I could beat up Destiny, you're

01:26:27.240 telling me I'm a capital T trad, I'm feeling great.

01:26:30.140 I've gone a little too far here.

01:26:30.920 I almost don't care if I...

01:26:32.120 I've fed this man's ego too much.

01:26:32.620 In vino veritas.

01:26:34.200 Okay, next rapid fire question.

01:26:35.840 In 2026, do Russia, China, and Qatar wield more influence in American political circles

01:26:41.380 than AIPAC?

01:26:43.800 Ah.

01:26:44.940 Ooh.

01:26:45.520 What would you answer?

01:26:46.440 I would say...

01:26:48.060 Do Russia, China, and Qatar wield more influence

01:26:55.360 in American political circles than AIPAC in 2026?

01:27:03.960 I say no.

01:27:05.720 I say no.

01:27:06.800 No, yeah.

01:27:07.980 In political media, they might.

01:27:10.360 So this is a big theory I have with the internet world

01:27:13.740 that I always try to get across.

01:27:15.320 If you saw recently, you know that rape gang inquiry that came out right before the election with Rupert Lowe, like Elon Musk was pushing it and everything.

01:27:23.460 There is this idea where people think X is real life, and they're like, okay, the rape gang report is going viral.

01:27:28.220 The numbers were very off in that, by the way, which I care about.

01:27:31.580 You think it was too high? 0.96

01:27:32.620 Quarter million women, right? 1.00

01:27:33.740 Well, they extrapolated from Telford and the other kind of Rothenberg and acted like every other town had those numbers.

01:27:41.140 And then you'll see people online say, oh, well, who cares if it was 250,000 or 50,000? 0.93

01:27:46.120 I agree.

01:27:46.940 So use the right numbers.

01:27:48.640 Because you look at where, with Canada, with the mass grave stuff, they were like, who cares if it's 1,000 dead bodies or one dead body?

01:27:54.900 I agree.

01:27:55.460 Use the right numbers.

01:27:56.280 Right.

01:27:56.420 It was totally made up.

01:27:57.120 Some odd churches were burned down.

01:27:58.720 Like, I apply the same standards to the right and the left.

01:28:00.980 I don't care who's using fake numbers.

01:28:02.480 But they think Twitter is real life.

01:28:04.680 And so they go, it's trending.

01:28:06.900 Rupert Lowe is going to win.

01:28:07.920 You got Sargon, a cat, all these characters that are like, yeah, Restore is going to win. 0.70

01:28:10.900 he gets what like three percent of the vote in reality yeah same thing with israel people will

01:28:15.520 say look at all the anti-israel sentiment on the internet like you would think that israel was like

01:28:20.360 done for you know apac was done for if you look at instagram reels everything like the youth are

01:28:25.620 very anti-israel but if you look at actual hard power real power israel has made more moves in

01:28:32.820 their favor in real politics than they have since the seven day war clobbered iran the clobbered

01:28:38.300 around the amount of territory they've gained in Gaza and the West Bank, everything. Hard power

01:28:43.760 is different than online power. And when people think, I think that online politics is a vacuum

01:28:50.160 for people's real like strength to influence society. Like if you were putting that into your

01:28:55.120 like communities, going and joining your local councils, instead of hitting like and subscribe

01:28:58.760 every day, the world would change like that. But instead we've got the bread and circuses of X

01:29:03.100 in which the people who are actually wielding hard power, like.

01:29:06.600 Yeah, I agree with that halfway, other than I don't think the alternative is they would be civically engaged and join the little cartoons.

01:29:13.680 They just watch baseball or porn or something.

01:29:17.260 But it's a great, we need another refill for Lawrence.

01:29:20.580 Nick!

01:29:21.180 Yeah.

01:29:22.140 I came here for free drinks.

01:29:23.860 I'm not coming here to do the show.

01:29:25.300 It is amazing, because you think, like, obviously, Russia, China, Qatar, they want more influence.

01:29:32.240 China especially keeps trying to send bio-agents into the U.S. to poison the crop.

01:29:36.980 Infinite honeypots. 0.97

01:29:37.640 Yeah, and infinite honeypots.

01:29:39.220 But you just think, no, believe it or not, I know you think everything is just abstract,

01:29:44.640 but there's this long-standing U.S.-Israel alliance.

01:29:48.420 There's this, there are lobbies, there are all this stuff.

01:29:51.820 And it's like, Qatar, yes, Qatar is investing a lot of money.

01:29:55.500 Yeah, China is sending a lot of spies.

01:29:57.540 Yeah, Russia is always up to tricks.

01:30:00.040 Like, they're always up to tricks. 1.00

01:30:01.800 Hidginx. 1.00

01:30:02.640 Yeah, they are. 0.99

01:30:04.020 But the internet isn't always real life.

01:30:05.720 I agree.

01:30:06.100 Okay, final one.

01:30:07.320 No, sorry, second, penultimate one. 0.85

01:30:09.100 Can someone be both a true trad wife and a full-time influencer?

01:30:11.560 We've already answered that.

01:30:12.520 This is your answer.

01:30:13.600 The answer is no.

01:30:14.780 Obviously.

01:30:15.560 Obviously not.

01:30:16.180 Obviously.

01:30:16.460 It's basically if you know a person's full name,

01:30:23.340 she kind of can't be a trad wife.

01:30:24.980 If the public knows. 1.00

01:30:25.900 I believe there are babushkas in Eastern Europe 1.00

01:30:29.340 sitting on the farm all day working you know being the matriarch of their families that are 0.99

01:30:33.980 quote-unquote capital p trad yeah um but this is where my thing comes in with the trad life online

01:30:40.620 if you are posting online you've already you've already banned it and i don't care i agree like i

01:30:46.340 don't care that's fine but like just admit you're larping and playing a fantasy and it's like a type

01:30:50.980 of porn too i agree i agree all the girls with the pies little dresses like this is it's the same 0.86

01:30:56.620 thing that women watch in their little novels and you know the notebook all of it it is porn it's 0.87

01:31:01.800 just porn it is it's just not like i'm not so harsh on it in that i i think speaking of hypocrisy

01:31:09.420 la rochefoucault says hypocrisy is the tribute vice pays to virtue i would rather people watch 0.77

01:31:15.360 trad porn than like actual you know whatever like people bumping uglies but the better version of 0.94

01:31:22.360 it is, get off Instagram and get the real thing. The real thing is a lot better. I disagree with

01:31:28.040 you. Okay. I would rather people accept their shadow. I think that's the biggest problem the

01:31:32.940 conservatives have is they don't accept their shadow. I assume given all of your respects to

01:31:37.100 Dante, you've read the Inferno. I have. And the biggest part of that is he goes into the Inferno

01:31:42.600 and every level of hell, he acknowledges the similarities he has with the people in that

01:31:47.900 level. He doesn't get mad at them or judge them. He sympathizes with them because he

01:31:51.820 understands how you ended up in the second, the third, the fourth.

01:31:54.700 No, he judges them. He sympathizes with them, but he fears. Like, for instance, there's

01:31:58.760 a famous line in Canto 5 when he's speaking to, I guess it was Francesca. Was it Francesca?

01:32:06.500 I forget. The famous line where she goes,

01:32:08.600 Final clear line is

01:32:20.340 Love led us to one death 0.73

01:32:27.840 and Kain awaits the guy who killed me.

01:32:30.580 And at the final line of it,

01:32:32.660 Dante falls like a dead body falls

01:32:34.820 because he sees in himself this fear

01:32:36.600 that literature and arousing erotic passion

01:32:40.780 can lead one to hell.

01:32:43.280 So he sees that he's a sinner.

01:32:45.040 He sees it in himself.

01:32:45.960 But he is harsh on the sinners. 0.99

01:32:48.740 He kicks them. 0.98

01:32:49.880 He's harsh on them because he wants to go to heaven. 0.98

01:32:51.440 But that's the difference between him and the sinners.

01:32:52.500 He recognizes the sin in himself.

01:32:55.520 He sees his capacity for that.

01:32:57.200 And how does he get out of hell?

01:32:58.440 He walks up the devil's back into a purgatorio or whatever.

01:33:03.140 What's the next level?

01:33:04.040 Yeah, purgatory.

01:33:04.920 Purgatorio.

01:33:05.760 And then he goes to the trials of going through fire to shed himself of these things.

01:33:10.520 But he has to get to that last level and see himself as the ultimate sinner, the betrayal, before he can walk up the devil's back to Paradisio.

01:33:17.200 But then when he sees, no, crucially though, crucially.

01:33:19.240 Whereas I see the trads and the online right-wing LARPers as not admitting they have the capacity for these things at all.

01:33:24.840 I'm an entirely different creature from these leftist degenerates that I reject.

01:33:28.120 No, you're not. 0.98

01:33:28.660 You're the same.

01:33:29.720 Just we're hiding it and we're not accepting our capacity.

01:33:32.920 When you accept your capacity for that evil, then you can overcome it, and you can sympathize, and you can truly walk people towards God.

01:33:40.160 Yes, with a crucial caveat, though.

01:33:42.620 The beginning of the Divine Comedy, in Canto 1, Dante wants to go up the mountain.

01:33:47.800 He finds it.

01:33:48.900 He's in a midlife crisis.

01:33:50.140 He says, I'm in the middle of my life's journey, and he tries to climb up the mountain out of this wood that he finds himself in, but he can't climb up, and he's stopped by three animals, and he realizes he can't do it on his own.

01:34:00.940 He needs something higher than himself.

01:34:02.140 He needs grace to pull him, yeah.

01:34:03.740 And so the shade of Virgil comes down.

01:34:05.720 Yeah, okay, right.

01:34:06.420 And St. Lucie helps him too later.

01:34:08.000 But the shade of Virgil comes down and he says,

01:34:10.260 Miserere me, have mercy on me.

01:34:13.080 And Virgil was sent down by Beatrice, his beloved,

01:34:17.280 who is looking at God.

01:34:19.500 And so he is brought up by grace.

01:34:22.940 And yes, the way he gets,

01:34:24.440 he goes all the way down to the pit of hell

01:34:25.780 and comes up the other side into Mount Purgatory,

01:34:28.640 goes up to heaven.

01:34:29.120 but the crucial problem is he doesn't save himself and he does judge the sinners he says

01:34:38.480 these sinners this is bad and he's harsh on them he kicks them and he's rough on them and he's mean

01:34:43.020 on them and i guess this is the point that the whole uh distinction here between the low but

01:34:50.880 solid ground of liberalism that says no we just should embrace our brokenness and we should just

01:34:55.280 embrace that we're all kind of messy and whatever versus no recognize that but strive for something

01:35:00.880 higher and you actually should judge the bad thing and you should try to aim for something

01:35:05.100 higher and that's why the trad porn but who are the lowest levels of hell it's not the second

01:35:09.260 level which is lust it's pride it's ego it's these sins that are less entertaining to acknowledge

01:35:15.480 which i think betrayal within the kind of uh right wing online larp sphere where people act

01:35:21.540 like they are so good and they're judging these degenerates they're yelling at the only fans girls

01:35:25.280 Yeah, yeah, I agree with that.

01:35:25.540 I see it as like the seventh and eighth layer of hell

01:35:27.540 yelling at the second, you know?

01:35:29.980 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:35:30.800 They're definitely, it's uncharitable.

01:35:34.660 And yeah, I agree. 0.93

01:35:36.860 You shouldn't yell at the OnlyFans girls. 1.00

01:35:38.220 I totally agree with that. 0.90

01:35:39.320 I saw you on the whatever podcast. 0.92

01:35:41.280 Were you yelling at the OnlyFans girls?

01:35:43.040 No, I was nice to the OnlyFans.

01:35:44.060 That was the subversion of the format.

01:35:45.680 Because there, you know, there actually is in Paradiso, 1.00

01:35:49.200 there is the level of hell for the sluts 1.00

01:35:50.920 or the level of heaven for the sluts 1.00

01:35:52.420 who are motivated by love. 0.99

01:35:53.660 Yeah, it's all, you know, when you go up through, when you go up through purgatory, it's all the sins and you're being expurgated of them.

01:36:01.440 Yeah, yeah.

01:36:01.940 And, but there is this, this is a, people like to point out that the sexual sins are not the most serious sins.

01:36:08.480 Yeah. 0.58

01:36:08.860 Which is true.

01:36:10.500 But.

01:36:11.960 Sorry, go ahead, finish.

01:36:12.960 According to Our Lady of Fatima, most people who go to hell, go to hell for sins of impurity.

01:36:20.040 So it's, they're not the worst sins by far.

01:36:21.780 but they ensnare the most people.

01:36:24.780 And this is why I think it's so important

01:36:26.040 to be clear about it.

01:36:27.180 It's like, on the one hand,

01:36:28.920 we have to have the mercy to not be mean

01:36:30.640 to the OnlyFans girls on the whatever podcast.

01:36:32.640 But on the other hand,

01:36:33.480 we have to have the clarity to say,

01:36:35.380 this stuff is really bad.

01:36:37.340 Don't do it.

01:36:38.440 You are made for something higher.

01:36:39.860 Do not settle for the low but solid ground of liberalism.

01:36:42.620 Look higher and aspire to something

01:36:44.060 that you are capable of with God's grace.

01:36:46.400 But how do you walk people there?

01:36:47.800 Because I think the majority of online Christianity

01:36:49.860 is performative right now.

01:36:51.140 I think it's people that prefer about the aesthetics of it rather than the depth.

01:36:55.500 I mentioned this in another interview recently that I have a professor of mine that has probably kept me more in touch with my, you know, pursuing of faith, which I don't even like to call myself a Christian on the Internet because I don't think it means anything.

01:37:07.160 Have you heard of 4chan, the word girl, what they mean when they say girl?

01:37:12.360 I don't know the word girl.

01:37:13.260 Back in the day, when people would get in arguments, someone would say, well, I'm a girl, so I have more authority on this opinion about relationships.

01:37:19.660 And people would go, okay, sure, you're a girl, because girl means guy in real life.

01:37:25.760 And then girls would complain, and they'd be like, but some of us are actually girls.

01:37:29.680 And the guys would go, it doesn't matter.

01:37:31.240 We're all effectively guys in real life here, because your argument has to stand on its own.

01:37:35.700 You're what you're saying.

01:37:37.400 And I believe this with online Christianity.

01:37:39.420 You have all of these politicians that are Christian signaling for votes and donations and, you know, accolades-based signaling on the internet. 0.68

01:37:46.380 But your behavior should stand on its own. 0.58

01:37:48.540 You shouldn't have to say you're a Christian on the internet.

01:37:51.840 So I have a professor of mine that I've worked with for 10 years.

01:37:55.080 I always go back and do class.

01:37:56.080 I did my Dante class with him, masters.

01:37:58.400 And he never asks me if I'm a Christian or not.

01:38:02.020 And he is a man of faith.

01:38:03.860 He always asks me, Lauren, how is the journey?

01:38:06.520 How is the journey?

01:38:07.360 Because he cares about my soul.

01:38:09.040 And I think this is the same thing that happened with Peterson.

01:38:11.280 Whenever people would ask him, are you a Christian or not?

01:38:13.140 He would say, well, what's the meaning of the word?

01:38:15.420 Well, you don't care if I'm a Christian or not.

01:38:17.240 You care that I'm on the same team as you because that makes you feel good.

01:38:20.340 That makes you feel like you're on the right direction.

01:38:23.860 It's an in-group signaling thing.

01:38:25.820 You don't care about where my soul or my heart is at.

01:38:27.660 And I'm speaking for Peterson.

01:38:28.640 I don't know if this is actually what he felt, but that's what I read from it.

01:38:31.420 People don't care about what is actually going on internally.

01:38:35.040 They care about the online social signaling.

01:38:37.660 And that has ruined so much of politics and depth and religion on the online sphere.

01:38:42.800 I agree there are a billion problems with online presentations of religion, no question.

01:38:48.460 But, and we should have a rich internal life and a relationship with God and we shouldn't get the applause of the multitude because we should try to, you know, win the rewards in heaven.

01:38:58.820 But you should say you're a Christian, right?

01:39:04.260 Because it's outside of you. 0.63

01:39:05.160 It doesn't mean anything on the internet.

01:39:06.420 It doesn't mean anything.

01:39:07.680 Everyone says they're a Christian.

01:39:08.760 They all put their verses.

01:39:10.640 I'm more likely to see someone with a verse in their bio or a cross in their bio calling someone a slur than I am seeing them repeat the Beatitudes, you know?

01:39:19.000 That's true.

01:39:20.360 That's true.

01:39:21.040 Most people don't repeat the Beatitudes.

01:39:21.680 And it's the actions.

01:39:22.860 You know the end of the last battle, C.S. Lewis.

01:39:25.840 They talk about the soldier who was fighting for Tosh, was it? 0.98

01:39:28.660 This is such a female-male coded thing. 0.61

01:39:31.680 I've read essentially everything C.S. Lewis ever wrote nonfiction. 0.97

01:39:35.480 I've not read any of his fictional works.

01:39:37.000 Is that embarrassing?

01:39:38.200 Sorry, two seconds.

01:39:38.860 The soldier goes to Aslan and he's like,

01:39:40.440 listen, I've fought for the bad guy my whole life,

01:39:42.520 but I've done so because I believed it was moral.

01:39:44.860 I believed it was right.

01:39:45.600 I believe it was truth.

01:39:46.540 I believe it was kindness and love.

01:39:48.320 And Aslan goes, even though you fought under another name,

01:39:51.320 you were fighting for me this entire time

01:39:53.060 because I am love.

01:39:54.220 I am truth.

01:39:54.960 I am goodness.

01:39:55.680 I am loyalty.

01:39:56.600 So it's the actions that mattered,

01:39:58.460 not the words that came out of your mouth

01:40:00.040 or the side that you were allegedly aligned to publicly.

01:40:04.120 It was, I am the embodiment of truth and kindness and loyalty and goodness.

01:40:08.840 That's true.

01:40:10.240 But there are external things like baptism, which now saves us, according to St. Peter,

01:40:15.520 like eating the flesh of the Son of Man and drinking his blood, without which we have no life in us, as says St. John.

01:40:20.620 My point is not, I agree with you, there's superficiality and we shouldn't have that.

01:40:24.420 But I think one should have the confidence to say, I believe in Jesus and I trust in him.

01:40:29.920 I believe in the message of Jesus.

01:40:31.400 I believe that the only way to fix the world is with repeating the self-sacrifice that he has made to undo the sin and the selfishness that all of us create through our own sin.

01:40:41.400 Well, you can't repeat it.

01:40:43.040 Well, attempting to.

01:40:44.480 Attempting to, in our own small ways, make those sacrifices where we see something higher than self.

01:40:49.220 And?

01:40:50.040 Of course we can't repeat it because we're not Christ.

01:40:51.700 And to do what he tells us to do.

01:40:53.660 Attempting to, yes.

01:40:55.080 Yeah.

01:40:55.420 But we fail.

01:40:57.300 We do.

01:40:58.120 And that's why we need his grace.

01:40:59.260 Yeah.

01:40:59.580 Yes.

01:40:59.900 Yeah, that's true.

01:41:00.620 This is my, like, the thing I'm actually trying to get at here, though, is it's not just an internal personal thing.

01:41:07.200 Like, there are external, like, there are sacraments.

01:41:09.540 There is an external life.

01:41:10.280 You're Catholic.

01:41:10.960 I grew up hyper, I grew up charismatic.

01:41:14.820 Much more, you know, exciting music.

01:41:17.200 This is where it goes, like, how do we communicate with a generation who we have no sympathy for, despite them growing up with no signs or even model of what a religious or traditional life looks like?

01:41:31.640 And we don't have sympathy for them.

01:41:33.320 We don't have, we, we, you have so many people online.

01:41:36.060 I see this with like the fake monks who it's like, okay, no one wants to sleep with you.

01:41:39.260 And you say you're a monk that's superior simply because you don't have the ability to sleep with people.

01:41:44.700 Yeah, join the cisterncy in order, you know.

01:41:48.140 Yeah, but like so many people just take for granted the childhoods they had.

01:41:52.200 They take for granted the environments they're in.

01:41:54.060 Like if you grew up in a trap house with a, you know, mom who is an OnlyFans model and this and that, you'd be acting in very different ways.

01:42:00.800 Yeah.

01:42:01.700 And I think the lack of sympathy for that on the right is disastrous.

01:42:06.200 Yeah, yeah.

01:42:06.500 Because everyone is growing up in a more liberalized modern world.

01:42:09.000 And this is where you see eternally all these people being canceled over and over and over again on the right for failing to live up to it.

01:42:14.700 Because it forces people to hide their true nature, to fit in with a group that most people simply don't have the tools to emulate.

01:42:22.380 Yeah, no, there is two good points from two great thinkers, C.S. Lewis and Shia LaBeouf.

01:42:28.540 C.S. Lewis, he says, when he gets to heaven, he'll say, he expects to say, of course.

01:42:34.940 That it all kind of, the things that didn't seem to make sense, did make sense from the vantage of heaven.

01:42:39.600 And then Shia LaBeouf, when he was asked, what would you say when you meet Christ in heaven?

01:42:43.200 And they said, I wouldn't say nothing.

01:42:45.760 I'd cry and kiss him.

01:42:47.640 That is actually what you would do.

01:42:49.780 You'd be overwhelmed with charity.

01:42:51.440 Okay.

01:42:52.820 Now, before we move on from the rapid fire round,

01:42:58.040 or from my rapid fire round,

01:42:59.580 do you still consider yourself a conservative?

01:43:04.240 What does that mean?

01:43:06.260 I think I got my point.

01:43:08.120 I think I just got, I'll take it.

01:43:10.160 That's great.

01:43:11.360 You would say no.

01:43:12.860 Yeah.

01:43:13.200 Why not?

01:43:15.200 I have conservative opinions on a lot of things still,

01:43:19.200 but I don't want to be a part of any club,

01:43:22.200 and I don't want to have any label,

01:43:23.200 because I've found myself over and over again

01:43:25.200 trying to find a social in-group where I'm like,

01:43:28.200 I'm a conservative, I'm a trad, I'm a this, I'm a that,

01:43:31.200 and failing to live up to those standards.

01:43:33.200 And I will eternally fail to live up to the standards

01:43:35.200 of the conservative movement.

01:43:36.200 I will eternally fail to live up to the standards

01:43:38.200 of the trad movement. 0.99

01:43:39.200 I will fail to live up to, you know, the Christian image, 0.99

01:43:42.200 I am a human being, and I'm a very flawed human being, and I also want to have the ability 0.79

01:43:47.660 to change my opinions on things without feeling beholden to a social group or audience capture.

01:43:53.300 Yes. There is a great line we were talking about, Dante, from his grandfather, Cachaguida,

01:43:59.400 in Paradise, where he says, Dante is getting his political journey, prophecy, from his grandpa,

01:44:07.420 because he's about to be betrayed by his political party and have an exile. It's a

01:44:11.900 It will go better for you to be a political party unto yourself.

01:44:21.000 I love that.

01:44:21.560 It's very tempting.

01:44:23.020 However, however, by what definition?

01:44:27.620 Conservative is not, it's a party in Canada, I guess.

01:44:29.980 It's not a party in America.

01:44:31.000 We have a Republican and Democrat party.

01:44:32.440 Conservative is something kind of ancillary to that.

01:44:36.900 What do you mean by conservative?

01:44:39.320 You don't have to be a member of a party or a club.

01:44:41.260 Well, what are they conserving anymore? Because to me, it seems like they're conserving social capital views, likes, money. I don't know that there's any real policy point that is being conserved. Like if a party comes about in Canada, I'm going to vote for it based on what individual statements they're making that line up with my real experience in the real world.

01:45:01.460 Sure, but forget about the party. Let's just say the lowercase c conservative, whatever that is, whether that's Joseph de Mestre, Bonald, Edmund Burke, all the way up to Donald Trump. Whatever that means, it seems to me Michael Oakeshott has a good definition of conservative, which is to prefer the tried to the untried.

01:45:22.000 the real, the actual to the possible, the present laughter to utopian bliss, that to quote Roger

01:45:30.060 Scruton, it's more an inclination than an idea, that it is a desire to conserve things, as it

01:45:37.380 were. Are you that? Are you that thing? Yes and no, because I am that thing when it, like I said

01:45:43.980 earlier, when I talked about the idea that when it comes to marriage, some more liberal opinions,

01:45:48.680 like being more educated or getting married later actually work better to preserve marriage,

01:45:53.680 I am a realist in the sense of if a liberal opinion lines up more with reality, I'm going

01:45:58.120 to take that. And if a conservative opinion lines up more with reality, I'm going to take that. But

01:46:01.700 I'm seeing utopianism on both sides because it sells. Once again, I'm going to bake breakfast

01:46:07.780 cereal from scratch at six in the morning for all my kids because this looks really aesthetic

01:46:12.120 on Instagram, even though my husband's the CEO of JetBlue, so that's the only reason I'm allowed

01:46:16.600 to do this? That is the conservative fantasy, the liberal fantasy. There's no difference between

01:46:21.740 men and women, and we're going to have a socialist utopia. Everyone wants a version of utopia. You 0.79

01:46:26.180 see the fascist, dark enlightenment LARPers. Everyone's playing Dungeons and Dragons on the 0.59

01:46:31.320 internet right now. Look, I'm sympathetic to that, because I think 85% of people are.

01:46:37.400 I woke up this morning, and I was working. I woke up. I snoozed. I was writing. My producers

01:46:42.900 were screaming at me, as they often are. And then I come out. My kids had already finished

01:46:46.760 breakfast. But then I see there's a nice ham, egg, and cheese sandwich, one of my most favorite

01:46:51.260 meals. And it's waiting for me on an English muffin that was made from scratch by my wife.

01:46:56.460 Not breakfast cereal, which I hate, but English muffin, an English muffin from scratch. It's real.

01:47:02.480 My wife is very educated. She's a very intelligent woman. It's all real. I'm not the CEO of JetBlue.

01:47:08.060 I'm not crying poverty, but I'm not the CEO of JetBlue either.

01:47:11.340 And that is real.

01:47:13.760 That can be real.

01:47:15.220 It can be, but it's very difficult to do, and it's very difficult to replicate for a lot of people.

01:47:20.140 It's kind of like the D.A.R.E. program.

01:47:21.520 I think that message your mother gave to you where she was saying you're really going to like nicotine and you're really going to like cocaine.

01:47:27.620 That should be the message of the D.A.R.E. program where they say, actually, cocaine is bad for you, but the reason it's really bad for you is because you're going to love it.

01:47:36.300 So you need to be warned about that.

01:47:37.780 And I think this is the biggest problem conservatives make is like, you know, they act like, okay, you get married and then you, that's life.

01:47:45.960 Whereas, and a lot of Christians too, you get married and it can never break.

01:47:49.000 You never leave that union.

01:47:50.000 No, actually that's like writing not fragile on a box of fine China and sending, you need to write fragile.

01:47:56.540 Actually, marriages are very easy to break.

01:47:58.980 Actually, you know, the trad life is very difficult to do.

01:48:02.100 It's not just, this is going to make you happy.

01:48:03.760 You shouldn't have kids because you think they're going to make you happy.

01:48:06.220 This is all like, I think.

01:48:07.680 You should do it because it's the good thing to do, but not to make you happy.

01:48:10.200 It's the eventual result of becoming the kind of human being that can raise children, right?

01:48:13.980 But these are all extraordinarily difficult things to do.

01:48:17.000 And writing it like a checklist of you liberals would be happy if you just did this.

01:48:21.580 No, this is a difficult path to take.

01:48:24.580 And I hope that you're able to exit the reality where you have given up on this path because it is difficult and you saw people fail.

01:48:31.880 of it. There's no sympathy for liberals who grew up in broken homes, which is the majority of

01:48:35.960 people, who saw this fail over and over and over again. Like, where is the acknowledging of their

01:48:42.040 reality that actually, yeah, a lot of conservative homes are actually really broken? You know, we

01:48:47.220 talk about transgenderism all day, and we say, we've got this massive transgender problem that's 1.00

01:48:51.540 breaking up families. I don't disagree that there's problems there, you know, the trans athletes in 1.00

01:48:55.700 sports. What about alcoholism in families where the husband's beating up the wife? That is way

01:48:59.560 more common than, you know, transgenderism. We don't talk about so many of these real issues

01:49:03.880 because they aren't exciting for the culture war. It's way more exciting to talk about the sexual 0.92

01:49:08.200 sin of the right-wing movement than it is to talk about the ego and pride, which is far more

01:49:12.560 insidious, you know? Yeah, I suppose so. I mean, the thing that was novel about, well, I'm sorry,

01:49:19.940 the thing that's interesting about transgenderism is that it's novel. Yes. Right, is that it's...

01:49:24.060 But we care more about novelty than what is actually... But it's also... Oh, that's just a

01:49:28.340 basic problem we don't talk about that anymore nobody would say we should be intemperate you

01:49:33.240 know as a as a principle so when it comes to like booze or drug i guess for the libs it would be

01:49:38.440 more drugs and for the conservatives it'd be more booze or something alcohol is more dangerous than

01:49:41.920 most of the hard drugs because most people are getting into that over you know at a as a population

01:49:47.280 level maybe but but you know fentanyl is a lot rougher on you than a glass of wine less people

01:49:52.520 struggling with that and sure yeah but i just mean that's that's all baked in that's been true

01:49:56.820 for all of human history, whereas the anthropological error is something that's kind of crazier and

01:50:01.200 indicative of greater errors. And so, yeah, like, yeah, of course, there's all this sort of

01:50:06.620 brokenness. But then the question then becomes, if we're going to try to fix it, well, sorry,

01:50:14.780 if we're going to respond to that reality, are we going to respond in a way that says, hey,

01:50:19.200 you know what? Most people are screwed up and that's just fine. Or are we going to say, hey, 0.94

01:50:25.240 Most people, actually everybody, is screwed up to some degree.

01:50:28.760 And there is an objective good. 0.86

01:50:31.640 There is bad, which is the privation of the good.

01:50:35.140 And we should order our society and our personal lives to pursue the good,

01:50:41.940 which we can know and we can tell people and we can be confident in.

01:50:45.840 We can only pursue the good if we acknowledge the shadow.

01:50:48.820 I agree with the ordering of society, but without acknowledging the shadow,

01:50:52.320 and when you deny the shadow,

01:50:53.720 you can't integrate it

01:50:54.720 and pursue the good

01:50:55.500 because it just comes out

01:50:56.640 in more and more ways

01:50:58.000 that you hide from the world,

01:51:00.120 which is where I think

01:51:00.960 the online world incentivizing

01:51:03.240 hiding one's shadow

01:51:04.140 incentivizes that.

01:51:05.440 You only show the good.

01:51:07.360 And because of that,

01:51:07.840 Yeah, I agree with that.

01:51:08.520 I agree with that.

01:51:08.960 Yeah, I totally agree with that.

01:51:09.960 Okay.

01:51:10.900 Now,

01:51:11.720 go check out Lauren Southern 1.00

01:51:14.120 on social media.

01:51:15.200 Where do you find her?

01:51:16.080 At Lauren underscore Southern.

01:51:18.400 You get her book,

01:51:19.220 This Is Not Real Life,

01:51:20.560 out now.

01:51:22.040 Lauren, excellent to see you.

01:51:24.000 We only had, was it three more drinks?

01:51:25.800 I think I finished three drinks.

01:51:27.320 I am wasted.

01:51:28.660 Perfect pre-drink.

01:51:29.420 Wait, who won?

01:51:31.000 Lauren, I hate this is going to be really rough for gender equality.

01:51:36.800 The score, this is... 0.97

01:51:38.880 Stop it.

01:51:39.840 Don't read it.

01:51:45.500 I'm going to throw my drink.

01:51:47.500 It's eight to one.

01:51:49.380 Wonderful to see you.

01:51:50.360 See you next time.

01:51:50.900 For you?

01:51:51.900 It was me. 1.00

01:51:52.900 Kill yourself. 1.00

01:51:53.900 I won. 1.00

01:51:54.900 That's the greatest victory I've ever had on this show.

01:51:59.900 I sort of forgot we were playing a game.

01:52:01.900 I did too.

01:52:02.900 That was very fun.

01:52:03.900 Wow.

The Michael Knowles Show - July 18, 2026

REAL Drinks And TOUGH Questions： YES or NO with Lauren Southern And Michael Knowles

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