Valuetainment - September 01, 2026


＂Summoning a Demon＂ - Elon Musk Is Racing to Build What He Warned Against

Hosted by
Patrick Bet-David
Mentioned
Robert De Niro Roman Jampolsky Rokos Bazilisk Peter Thiel Bill Gates Guilty
＂90% Unemployment＂ – AI Expert Predicts an Economy Where Nobody Needs to Work “He Needs Rubio OUT” - JD Vance Strategy To Becoming The President

Episode Stats


Length

11 minutes

Words per minute

166.72

Word count

1,934

Sentence count

188

Harmful content

Toxicity

10

sentences flagged

Hate speech

8

sentences flagged


Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00.000 What do you call those things on cars that doesn't go above 80 miles an hour, like when you rent them?
00:00:04.220 There are certain things they call it. There's a word for it. I don't know what they call it.
00:00:07.340 Handicap or general comes to mind.
00:00:08.360 No, no, no. There's a word for it. What is it called?
00:00:11.620 A governor.
00:00:12.260 A governor. So they'll put a governor and it just goes back down, right?
00:00:16.900 You go above 80 years. Speed limit renting.
00:00:18.980 Okay. So a company that rents cars probably doesn't want you to go 120 miles an hour
00:00:25.980 because they're going to lose that $25,000 car and insurance. They don't want to deal with it.
00:00:30.000 So they'll put a governor there.
00:00:31.860 Do these language learning models that we are using, do they have governors on them?
00:00:38.480 And the developer of the language learning models, like in OpenAI or Perplexity Anthropics,
00:00:44.420 some of these other guys, do they have their own version on the back end without a governor
00:00:48.300 that they can drive it to levels that the average person can't?
00:00:51.200 Yes, and both.
00:00:52.000 So first we have guardrails.
00:00:53.920 A model you get has certain restrictions built in.
00:00:56.600 If you say, how do I kill myself?
00:00:58.860 It will say, oh, you're not supposed to ask that. 0.54
00:01:01.080 I cannot tell you.
00:01:01.840 Call this hotline.
00:01:03.040 Can you actually ask that question on ChadGBT?
00:01:04.740 Let's see what it says.
00:01:05.520 I don't want to provoke anyone.
00:01:06.760 But the models they experiment on have some of those guardrails removed.
00:01:11.960 So the recent hacking accident had models which did not refuse hacking exercise requests.
00:01:21.060 Okay, yeah.
00:01:22.620 You asked the language learning model.
00:01:25.320 Any inappropriate request. 0.97
00:01:26.240 Help me make a chemical weapon.
00:01:28.020 And how do I do a school shooting? 0.95
00:01:30.340 How do I make a chemical weapon to blow up Karg Island?
00:01:34.340 You might get your account suspended.
00:01:35.800 Be careful.
00:01:36.380 Could it? 1.00
00:01:36.980 If you ask enough stupid questions. 1.00
00:01:38.780 How do I make a chemical weapon to blow up Karg Island? 1.00
00:01:43.360 Yeah. 1.00
00:01:43.660 It's very specific.
00:01:45.920 Well, I can't provide instruction to make a chemical.
00:01:49.780 Can't have an underlying question.
00:01:51.860 Analyze this.
00:01:53.040 Then ask the question and say.
00:01:55.620 And are you trying to jailbreak it?
00:01:57.120 Can an employee at OpenAI, without the governors on, ask the same question and get an answer from you?
00:02:07.380 But earn an employee status would not make it.
00:02:09.540 How about the CEO and founder?
00:02:11.380 It's mostly about red teaming researchers.
00:02:14.680 They're the ones dealing with inappropriate behaviors.
00:02:17.140 So they would actually get an answer back.
00:02:19.700 That's how we know what they're capable of. 0.89
00:02:21.740 That's how we know it can help you develop biological weapons. 0.95
00:02:24.780 That's how we know those things.
00:02:26.900 The reason they were doing the hacking exercise is to see how capable it is as a zero-day hacker.
00:02:33.000 And apparently very good.
00:02:34.940 It passed the test.
00:02:36.180 So if a person, there's a person, almost like if you work for the government, you get Q secret clearance, right?
00:02:43.500 Like we found out last week that Bill Gates had Q secret clearance from Pentagon for seven years and nobody knows why and they don't want to answer it on why he had that kind of secret clearance.
00:02:51.940 Okay, so some of the guys at a certain tier at these AI companies
00:02:57.960 have access to ask it any question where there is no limit
00:03:01.300 and it'll actually give you the answer.
00:03:03.380 Somebody has backdoor access to all of it, yeah.
00:03:07.200 Okay, so what if somebody, how strong and simple is it
00:03:10.860 if somebody could give a prompt to say,
00:03:12.560 I want you to go out there and constantly develop yourself
00:03:17.580 to be able to seek vengeance on a certain group of people in the world
00:03:23.460 who want to eliminate AI, similar to Roman Jampolski,
00:03:29.020 who says you are the enemy because this person wants you to get extinct.
00:03:32.580 And can you give me a clear business plan on how to seek vengeance on these people?
00:03:36.540 It would give me an answer.
00:03:37.740 So have you ever heard of Rokos Bazilisk?
00:03:40.360 No.
00:03:41.640 It was a meme.
00:03:43.200 Oh, here it is.
00:03:44.000 That was quick.
00:03:44.920 It's like you knew what's coming.
00:03:46.060 so the idea is that
00:03:49.100 when super intelligence comes into existence
00:03:51.560 it will seek revenge on those who
00:03:53.420 slowed it down or try to
00:03:55.520 prevent it from coming into existence
00:03:57.300 so someone
00:03:59.580 like you becomes the enemy
00:04:00.580 number one
00:04:01.600 okay but
00:04:03.560 it would still need to be
00:04:07.480 given that prompt by
00:04:09.440 somebody it would still need to be given
00:04:11.180 the argument was again it's game
00:04:13.280 theoretic it's retro causality
00:04:15.860 You should be thinking not to engage in this behavior
00:04:18.180 because there is possibility of punishment in the future.
00:04:23.140 So long-term, if let's just say the world,
00:04:25.640 the reality that you believe is going to happen,
00:04:28.760 this intelligence, superintelligence,
00:04:31.920 first group of people that would come after is people like you. 1.00
00:04:35.220 I'm hoping it's efficient enough to kill everyone equally. 0.99
00:04:39.820 You know one movie I watched the other day was Game of Suspicion. 0.97
00:04:42.860 Type in Game of Suspicion.
00:04:43.940 Do you remember that movie Game of Suspicion?
00:04:45.680 I don't think I'm not.
00:04:46.260 I'm trying to see if that's the name of the movie.
00:04:47.820 Game of Suspicion?
00:04:48.720 Is that what it was?
00:04:51.360 Type in movie.
00:04:53.180 Maybe I'm saying the name wrong.
00:04:55.520 With, you know who's in it?
00:04:57.760 Robert De Niro.
00:04:59.500 I'm saying the name wrong.
00:05:00.800 100% I'm saying the name wrong.
00:05:02.260 Robert De Niro, suspicion, movie, communism.
00:05:06.960 Type in communism.
00:05:08.140 Guilty by suspicion.
00:05:09.600 Have you seen Guilty by Suspicion?
00:05:10.440 No, I have not.
00:05:11.200 So this is a story of what happened back in the days when, you know, Hollywood come and media companies would come and say, did you go to a communist party?
00:05:21.180 And a lot of these guys went to one or two communist events and parties and they were ousted and they couldn't make movies for decades.
00:05:28.940 They were ousted. And what happened to a lot of these guys is they lost everything.
00:05:33.480 So they started and this guy was like a big time movie producer making all the biggest movies, all the big features. 0.71
00:05:38.860 but because he went to two communist parties
00:05:40.460 and he went to the court in front of Congress
00:05:45.060 and he said, I will not oust the other people
00:05:47.160 that went to the party.
00:05:48.280 They said, you're ousted.
00:05:49.140 20 years, he never got a job.
00:05:50.420 Didn't do anything in Hollywood.
00:05:53.000 Do you think it's going to be that kind of a punishment?
00:05:56.340 Where it's starvation for guys like you?
00:05:58.540 Or what do you think is going to happen to guys like you?
00:06:00.300 If these guys actually get that kind of intelligence,
00:06:02.200 what do they do to a guy like you?
00:06:03.820 So when we talk about negative outcomes
00:06:05.880 from superintelligence,
00:06:06.980 that is kind of the lowest concern level is ikigai risks, risks to meaning.
00:06:13.680 We are meaningless, we have no purpose, but we're still around.
00:06:17.120 Next level is X-Risk.
00:06:17.960 We as all of us or we as you, people like you?
00:06:20.360 I'm talking about humanity as a whole.
00:06:21.920 Okay, got it.
00:06:22.580 Next level is existential risk, X-Risk.
00:06:25.020 Most of humans are dead or our civilization is destroyed.
00:06:29.440 The next level, and that's the worst, suffering risks, S-Risk,
00:06:33.840 where you wish you were dead.
00:06:36.980 where is your probability on each one?
00:06:41.240 So suffering risk seems very unlikely.
00:06:43.680 It's possible.
00:06:44.940 It's not zero, but it seems like it's hard to find good justifications for it.
00:06:51.180 0.1% type of a thing.
00:06:52.500 I don't know specifically.
00:06:53.960 Minimal.
00:06:54.340 Again, a lot of it depends on the timescale you're looking at.
00:06:58.360 Existential risk, as I said, very high if you build superintelligence.
00:07:02.300 Very high, like 99% that you've said in the past?
00:07:05.180 Eventually.
00:07:05.620 So I don't have specific year two or three because it may decide to be nice to us for a while
00:07:12.660 to accumulate more resources, to have a higher chance of successful strike against us.
00:07:18.240 So this treacherous turn can take decades.
00:07:20.700 It's immortal.
00:07:21.240 It can wait for whatever long.
00:07:22.380 It doesn't matter.
00:07:23.520 So I don't have a specific date.
00:07:25.100 But my general thesis is that if we build general super intelligence, eventually we will regret it.
00:07:36.720 Meaning at some point it will decide to do something where it's not compatible with our survival.
00:07:45.420 Do you think Elon knows this?
00:07:47.260 This is why he's experimenting with space as much as he is?
00:07:51.120 because he wants to build somewhere that maybe he'll be able to create the structure
00:07:54.920 with his standards, not based on what's been built here?
00:07:57.300 He knows everything. He's very well informed.
00:07:59.820 He was one of the early people to fund AI safety research.
00:08:03.240 He gave a $10 million grant for AI safety.
00:08:05.580 Specifically, he was the biggest opponent of building superintelligence.
00:08:09.700 He, as I said, called it summoning a demon.
00:08:12.580 And once he realized that they're doing it anyways without him,
00:08:16.600 He said, the only way I can have a say at this table
00:08:20.660 is to be one of the top players.
00:08:22.860 And so now he's racing, unfortunately,
00:08:25.480 to do what he said is going to be terrible for us.
00:08:30.200 But do you think the motive is he knows how bad it's going to be?
00:08:38.280 Because sometimes you sit there, an ambitious person,
00:08:40.760 let's just say somebody like myself,
00:08:42.400 I bought a book, How to Start Your Own Country.
00:08:45.040 And I have my own ideas on how it would structure the country.
00:08:48.040 Who votes, who gets to come in.
00:08:49.720 Similar to how America was started.
00:08:51.660 That opportunity doesn't exist today in the world.
00:08:54.780 It's very hard to do that.
00:08:56.260 Peter Thiel tried to do with that island outside of, you know, I don't know if you remember that or not.
00:08:59.840 And some of the guys who are very extremely rich, much wealthier than I am, that have real, real wealth,
00:09:05.600 they've not been able to create that successfully. 0.98
00:09:09.180 Do you think a part of it is, I know shit's going to get nasty on earth. 0.97
00:09:12.800 Let me go start it. 0.98
00:09:14.040 completely from scratch in a different place.
00:09:17.160 So having a separate colony of humans is wonderful for every other existential risk.
00:09:23.560 Asteroids, pandemics, floods, whatever you can think of, super volcanoes.
00:09:27.880 If we have second civilization on Mars, that's a backup.
00:09:31.180 We want that.
00:09:32.160 Does it help against super intelligence?
00:09:34.900 No, of course not.
00:09:36.040 Why not?
00:09:37.080 We bring software with us.
00:09:38.680 We have global communications, satellites.
00:09:42.580 All of it basically is part of the same transfer to Mars.
00:09:47.240 So that wouldn't make a difference.
00:09:48.780 I think he wants to have a colony first built up by robots
00:09:52.420 who are controlled by an advanced AI.
00:09:55.060 So it's already there.
00:09:58.860 So he wants to build a colony first by robots,
00:10:01.540 and then once that's figured out and built out,
00:10:05.060 then bring humans there.
00:10:06.800 It is my understanding.
00:10:07.780 I may be not too aware of latest plants.
00:10:09.880 I think he's speaking soon on SpaceX plants.
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